OverDrive - OverDrive - January 16, 2025 - Hour 2

Episode Date: January 16, 2025

Join Bryan Hayes, Jeff O'Neill and Dave Feschuk for Hour 2 on OverDrive! TSN Director of Scouting Craig Button joins to discuss the Maple Leafs' stars in the spotlight, Elias Pettersson and J.T. Miller's conundrum and the Bruins' possible retool on the team. The guys discuss the Blue Jays' significant offseason decisions, Vladimir Guerrero Jr.'s contract and the interest from the Mets, Roki Sasaki's sweepstakes and Pete Alonso's next steps.

Metallica's M72 World Tour is blazing through Toronto. And iHeart Heavy Rock is your exclusive in... Two nights, two unique sets. One win. Download the free iHeart Radio app and rock out with iHeart Heavy Rock. Ten minutes of daily streaming enters you to win an epic Metallica iHeart Radio experience. Four nights of hotel, 500 bucks and tickets to see Metallica at the Roger Center. The more iHeart Heavy Rock you stream, the more chances to win.

Details at iHeartRadio.ca Man, you love a good Jake Forbes tip. That boogie nights meme is flying. The thing is, when I think of Duthie and I think of his Jake Forbes, it's gotta be a clean look. Like, you can't have Ron Jeremy with that mustache, that greasy hair. You can't have that. You gotta have a clean looking dude.

That's right. Man of integrity, Jake Forbes. We won't stand for anything less than that. Yeah, James Duthie will be a big part of the panel tonight, aka Jake Forbes. And I got Leafs Devils tonight on TSN, on TSN radio as well. Joe Bowen, Jimmy Ralph in about an hour. Craig Button coming up here in a moment. You see Craig's list.

He's moving some pieces around. That Schaeffer kid, he's got it number one now. Oh, man. I would have him at zero. He looked great, man. He did look good. Too bad he got hurt. That was a big issue for Canada.

He did get hurt. He was driving off us. Because that guy could have just, they could have have said you got the cage you're young but you are literally gonna be the guy on this team him and that McKenna yeah then he went down but some team is gonna get a guy for 15 years first up on the penalty kill first up on the power play moves the puck up the ice, has great vision, makes plays like I don't see anybody. There's some other the the Mahagans, the American kids a good player but I don't see how anybody takes that guy down from the number one spot. Well here I'll give you a team that won't take them. The Buffalo Sabres.

They got two guys. You've got Dahlene, you've got Power and now you've got Byrom. You're not gonna, you can't take take Schaefer to I mean, oh they might but yeah You do take Schaefer and you do other things with other people Well, that's what you could you're at a shit You believe he's that much better if you believe the Schaefer kids the best player It maybe you do take him and you move off Oh one power. You're not moving off Dahlene. He's your captain You've paid him. I think he's got a full no trade full new mo full full no move I don't know a lot of people bring up Dahlene like he seems to get a hall pass because he's like gritty

And it's like dude you signed for 11 sheets, man Yeah, he's one of the highest paid players in the league and and and they gave him the captaincy They said you're the guy like you're you're the one we tanked, you know, not for McDavid. We tank for you, Rossman, Stalin. You're our guy and you have to drag us out of this. They actually beat Carolina in the afternoon yesterday, yeah, which was pretty crazy. But, you know, as of right now, Chicago, the Blackhawks feel like it's it's a formality that they're going to be the last place team,

but it doesn't mean you're going to win the lottery. But what does that mean? If I'm the owner, I go right to the GM and say, remember when you fired the coach and you didn't think we were a last place team? What do you think now? What are you exactly? Like if Luke Richardson's probably like, guys like do you really think I was the problem? And by the way thanks for making me look bad for and dealing with this mess and it's actually your fault giving me that team. Yes, like you look at their roster even the moves that they made

work tally but you see the better recently in terms of point production yeah but he did he was he's not a star player duties doesn't matter how it now how it should look it could look i looked at it on paper on like maybe they went a bunch of games this year they're awful they're not they're terrible to be a legitimately the worst in the league and they deserve to be dead last in the league that's where they are. San Jose is not for, like San Jose had a decent start. They're back to reality. Like they, they, they are bringing it down to the

studs in San Jose. Like I think Mike Greer has made some really smart plays and he's gotten out from some, from some contracts and they've got young kids there. Like I, I think Greer's got that going in the right direction. I know both, both to get to a fix. But they're not close. It's a long way to go. And every organization and shows like ours will talk about it and it's rightfully so the way athletes are these days. You better get it on track because Celebrini and Bedard they don't want to be associated with a gong show for too long. They take it personally they're like I don't want to deal with this. You better get it right sooner or

later. Well and here's another thing. There have been many times we said that in Edmonton where it's like, they better figure this out. Absolutely. And there's no, there's no bridge deals anymore. Like if this is who Celebrini is, in two years, he's going to say, I want, I want 11 million a year or so, you know, whatever it is, it's going to cost you a lot of money. Like young players, they get out of that entry level deal. If they're, if they're legit they get well They could also scare you and say I'm not saying nothing long-term. Sorry. Well, that's possible

But it's still gonna be a high cap hit right like that's another thing and it obviously Chicago and in San Jose knew they weren't gonna get The best of the entry-level deal because the teams just weren't that good right like they you knew Bedard It was gonna be a struggle for a bit, Sulebriani for sure, but it is a huge advantage to win games with guys making 900 grand or whatever. Because you got three years of that, then they're going to make a lot more money. But I'll tell you what, you can get a stud on your team. If you're Connor Badard and you get the number one overall pick and he's a stud, suddenly you start to feel a little

better about your lot in life. Absolutely. Here's Craig Button, our TSN director of scouting joining us here on the Maple Toyota Hotline. Craig, we're just talking about your list, your midseason draft list. You got Schaefer now at one. You know, if you're Chicago and you end up with that first pick and you get Schaefer, how does that sound? But Darden Schaefer moving forward. Sounds good. I mean, I think Matt Schaefer is a defenseman like Drew Doughty. They control the game and he's a true number one. I mean, how many true number one defensemen are there in the league? 12? 13? He's not 32. And you know, they drafted with Shunoff last year in the first round and good player, but he's not a number one.

He's not a guy that's gonna control the game for you. And the Chicago Blackhawks, it's not like, they're not like San Jose. San Jose to me, like if they have a chance to draft a player at one, it's Schaeffer, because they don't have a guy like that. And if they're drafted two, they should draft Puerto Marton in my view, because they don't have a player like that.

They have centers, they don't need centers. And to me, Chicago needs a lot of everything. So take the guy that can control the game, and I think that Matt Schaeffer is that guy. What, Hayes brought up an interesting scenario Craig and I know what I would do. What if Buffalo gets it? Are you still drafting them? I just heard Dave talk about it's a good start if you can get these top players like the Darden Salabrini but isn't there a caveat to that? Isn't that what Buffalo's had for 14 years?

Right. You know, so it's not just, you're right, Dave. It like to be able to have the ability to draft these players and to set the course for your franchise with a franchise player, it's really important, but it's also what you do after that. So Jeff, to your question about Buffalo, you know, Buffalo just seems to me to be in a place where they, they're like the Detroit lions, like they had top kicks, they had good players and they could never win. And you know, to me,

what's the identity of the Buffalo Sabres? Do they have one? I don't know what it is. I don't know if they even know what it is. So to me, you got to, like Dan Campbell went into Detroit and he just said, here's what we're gonna be. And there were some growing pains, but they knew what they wanted to be, they knew who they were. I don't think Buffalo knows who they wanna be

or what they wanna be. So to your question, you know, like it's one of those, I guess it's an existential question, what do the Buffalo Sabres do? Because I'll tell you this, I don't think they know what to do. That seems to be the case. It really does seem to be the case.

That down in Buffalo, it's just constant turnover, constant finger pointing, constant, I don't know. I mean, it's just year after year after year. They haven't been in the playoffs in what, 13 years, 14 years, and they're not even close. It sucks for the fan base. And yet, to your point point Craig, it's one thing if you accept, okay we're not going to be that good but here's the plan. Like I was saying that

prior to you coming on, like if I'm in San Jose I'm looking at what my career is doing. I get this, I think I know where we're going here. Like it might take some times and there's going to be some misses but you had to shed contracts, then you you're gonna load up on young players, you're gonna try to get top picks. All right, we got a plan here. Buffalo, I don't know. I mean, I really, and even Chicago, I wonder what you think their plan is. Like, clearly it was to bottom out and get Bidard.

They did that, now what? Because they fired Luke Richardson as if they considered this a legitimate team this year, and they're not, they're awful. Well, they are awful and Kyle Davidson at the end of the year talked about trying to fast forward the rebuild fast forward the rebuild are you kidding me like you're hearing everything going on in Chicago right now the players spirits are broken they're not high they're losing they're getting beat up bad their fans are

booing they're going to stop showing up they can't't get their games on TV. I mean, it's a mess in Chicago. And to your point about San Jose, you think about like Mike Greer said, you know what, we're going to have to move off of hurdles. So, you know, we took on a little bit of salary and he makes a trade. He moves off of Carlson, you know, take, holds on a little bit of salary, but says we're moving on. And then when he sees a chance to get a number one goal, turn on his car up. Boom.

Yeah. He's got a real good defenseman in Dickinson. They got real good players in Will Smith and and and Sala Brini, obviously, but they got Quinton Mustaine, they got Casper Holton and and and William Atland who already there. Some really good players and what you can see to me, Mike Greer, it was a competitor big time. He knew he played on good teams, he understands you've got to have different players in different spots. You can't just collect players. You can't just collect players and select picks and everything.

I'm going through this with the Montreal now in different media. Oh no, keep getting pitched. All these picks and all these prospects are not going to play for the Montreal Canadians. So you better recognize at some point in time, we better help our current group. We better help them taste a little bit of success. And if they don't start tasting success good luck having success. With Craig Button and in terms of where the Leafs are at going into this game tonight you got John Tavares now week to week he's been placed on the IR they've lost

three games in a row in regulation Craig is there a player in particular on the Leafs that you have circled tonight that you believe Has got to leave the charge and have a big night Yeah, I would put it on on on the captain and and and three of them like Neil Andrew Marner and Matthews I mean, they're top players, you know, you're facing the crux of it I don't think you can ask, you know other players to start trying to show the way I mean it would be different if different if you had that catalyst type player. In Detroit, I just go back to Detroit, Scottie Bowman could run out McCarty, Draper and Maltby to set a tone, but Toronto doesn't have that. So I think you have to look at

the top players and just say, hey, if I'm Craig Bruby, hey listen, give us your best tonight. Just give it everything you got tonight you got tomorrow often you know what will make sure but but those are the guys that i'd be just trying to just out on the back and the right to tonight get out there to be playing lots we talk about yesterday right that like they need they need

either a line or a power play they need something they can look at things that goli in a line up our play and a player they need to have something because they got nothing they don't have its its flat more or less across the board right now another thing they don't have craig is production on the offensive side from the back end and you talk off the top of how hard it is that get a number one defense in this league and a lot of teams don't have one the guy the leafs of traditionally thought of as their number one defense and morgan riley A lot of teams don't have one the guy the Leafs have traditionally thought of as their number one defenseman Morgan Riley

Is going through his worst offensive season I believe since 2016-17 In terms of points per game. What do you make a Riley's inability to really be the offensive force? He has been in the past. I Think he you know the way they played in the past days I think afforded him a lot more of those opportunities. Fred Ruby and this coaching staff has asked him Morgan to play a little bit differently. I mean, yeah, Jake McCabe, yeah, Chris Taniff, yeah, all of Reckman-Larsen.

So I think there's been a shift in the focus. And so Morgan Riley is not being asked to, you know, contribute offensively in the same manner. Now, what I will say is this. I think the key is not always about points, it's about can you get out of your zone quickly and can you get the puck onto the sticks of your good offensive players?

I think the trauma at least have enough good offensive players and it's not so much about do they get the points, but can they get the offense moving in the right direction? Can they get the play moving in the right direction? I think that that's the next step for this blue line. And I think they've made some strides, but I think on the power play, they got to switch up the power play. When I say switch it up, we're going to play the distributor, he's a puck transporter, and

he can get the puck into the right places. But now he becomes a little bit easier to defend if you're the penalty killing team. He's not really that threat to thread the pass or to make that big shot. So I think there has to be a change there, but I think where the least find themselves with respect to how they want to play, it's about, it's about moving up the puck to the offensive players. I think they're doing a better job of that this year, but I think that's the, that's the difference that I think that Morgan and the rest of the blue line have to become Acclimated to in terms of how they how the offensive push starts from real good defensive play Greg. How would you?

Handle the situation out in Vancouver because when it first happened I was like maybe that Miller and Pederson had a pissing match and it's not that big a deal But clearly there's an issue and the team struggling and i think something needs to be done sooner than later because who wants this to linger on infester and you know the performance on the ice continues to to go downward like how would you handle this

you know jeff i'm a big believer is when you have a problem identified and look at the solutions. And I use the term often and it is problems that go away by themselves come back by themselves. No player, nobody wants to be asked daily, what do you think about JT Miller? What do you think about Elias Patterson? And you know, when you get ready to play the game, everybody's going to dig in and play. I think that that's the case. But it's a distraction.

And you don't need the games hard enough as it is, you don't need distractions. So I think when you're looking at this from from internally and me externally, like you got to say, okay, what are the solutions? What can you do? How do you deal with it? And then you got to act because back to what I just said, you got a problem. If you want to move your move forward individually and collectively, you got to find. If you want to move forward individually and collectively, you got to find solutions. That's true of any walk of life. And I think that that's where Jimmy Rutherford

and Patrick Alveen find themselves right now. And the solution may not be easy. Like don't get me wrong here, it's not like you just wave a magic wand. And you have to identify, is this something that can be resolved internally through our own or do we have to make a move? something that can be resolved internally through our own, or do we have to make a move? But if you don't address the problem and you're not ready to

deal with it, the problem will linger. And I don't think that's good for the team. So whatever that turns out to be, Jeff, if you got to get the players in and say, hey, what's going on here? You guys got to sort it out because I'm not moving either one of you. Okay, you resign yourself. You got to move somebody. Whatever it is, you got to do it, you got to commit to it. Yeah, it's got to be awkward in that room right now. Like, the elephant in the room. How would you want to deal with it? That's where I would get to the point as a teammate. I would look at them and say, nobody wants to deal with this nonsense.

No, exactly. But the issue is, and again, we don't have the answers, it could be just one of them that's the problem. Yes. You know really it may not be collectively or equal. Well, it's likely it is one It's not generally not two guys that are a pain in the ass like towards each other, right? That's exclusive to that like it's just you two guys and then when you're with everyone else, everything's all good So they know and they've known the issue and The conundrum is, as you know Craig, we all know, prior to last year the Canucks have not had any success in quite some time. And it's a market that is volatile, it's a market that's not happy right now and everything broke their way last year. They had a magical season, everything was

incredible. They almost won the President's Trophy, they beat Nashville in just a remarkable fashion. Remember all the comebacks and late goals and overtime heroics and then they almost at edmonton with a third string goalie and you show up at camp this year you think in this is that man i get scope time in vancouver and we're halfway through the season and they may not make the playoffs and it won't hate everyone

it's a pure disaster is like it's a disaster and i gotta be thinking as a fan base we can have nice things that would happen here what what how did this happen that the jobs point the players no they always know and they always know first they can't deal with the issue so it's not up to the players to deal with it they don't want to be bothered and and make him back in the media walking in

every day to go on to the can ask me they gonna ask me, please don't ask me? Please don't ask me. It's lingering. It's like a bad smell that keeps lingering. And one of the things that, I'm not saying they should do it, but if they're not gonna do anything, or they, I shouldn't say do nothing.

If they've examined the problem and they've looked at solutions, then somebody's gotta come out, the manager, and say, listen, we If they've examined the problem and they've looked at solutions, then somebody's gotta come out, the manager, and say, listen, we've dealt with this internally, we're satisfied that we're moving forward, no more questions, and you guys get going. And you gotta say that privately and publicly. I haven't heard that yet, I haven't heard that yet.

No, I haven't heard that yet either. And it's not the only sideshow in town, right? You've got, last week we had the bruins stuff in the reporting on that and whether or not it's you know what it leads to or what have you but i'm sure you saw a cam nealy came out today and spoke with the media and said that as of now their management group we have to have to paths to move forward with one were were a buyer at the deadline and one were were

a seller at the deadline he said that we're a seller at the deadline Like he's saying that on the record. They're in a playoff spot in the playoffs and it's Boston. It's the Bruins That's trying to get a spark. Do you think that's yeah about a mess? Is that you? You're even thinking about being a seller I know because Boston has established that standard right because we go back we go back We're just talking about the that standard, right? Because we go back, we go back, we're just talking about the Knucks, right? And so we talk about, do they deserve good things?

Well, the Bruins don't think that way. We're a playoff team and whatnot. So I do think there's a dual message there, one to the players and one that says, hey, like, I guess there's a disguised message, cannily, to the players. Yeah, is this what we really become? Is this what you want? I guess there's a, uh, a disguise message, can nearly to the players. Yeah. Is this what we really become?

You use this, what you want them. And I love what Paschal Nick and Marshaan did after those comments. And then it's great to come out and deny it. And I believe the players don't get me wrong, but then they went out and performed that they, they squashed that in a big way through their performance. And, and I think that cam right now, he's, he's looking at it and I can sit here and go well you got to be realistic maybe they should be sellers or whatnot but that's not the mentality in Boston and I agree with Jeff I think that that's that's just a little bit of a

smoke screen and probably a pretty strong message to the players yeah it's pretty good one I mean when cam nearly speaks I would think people certainly listen in Boston for sure. All right, Craig, we'll leave it there. Good catching up with you, we'll do it again soon. Yeah, great catching up with you guys too. Have a great day. There's Craig Butner, TSN director of scouting

joining us here on the Maple Toyota Hotline. Count on Maple Toyota for the right winter tire package for your Toyota. Trade in your old tires, buy a new set and get $40 back. Visit mapletoyota.com.com yeah that probably is a bit of a message that if they don't snap out of it and get going well might have to sell might have to be a seller but I still think the Bruins are gonna make the playoffs it's what happens beyond that that is very debatable at this point Columbus like they're in a plaspar right now they've won five games in a row

i'd never felt like any threat from owner to like when the owner came down like peter carmonas didn't come down a locker room with time but we didn't give it to the guys or whatever it is didn't affect me like it's just such a focus i thought of it as a folk i'm like I gotta go out there and I gotta get five hits and five shots on net and if this guy's telling me he's

gonna blow this thing up and really like I was like what am I gonna do yeah I guess so you know what I mean like the threats are like oh we're gonna be a seller or a buyer it's like I'm just dying to get five shots on net and five hits and play well and if you're gonna do that there's nothing I can really do about it especially back then no salary cap. Anytime it's like the players go out and do their thing and they give it their all and sometimes the team just stinks like this. That's the thing they've already fired the coach they've already blamed the coach now they're now Cam Neely is pointing to the personnel

saying some of you guys aren't gonna be here so I hope you know if you if you like Boston shape up. Yeah but when your team's not that good do they consider that a threat some of you guys aren't to be here that might be like, okay, then get rid of, put me somewhere else. Wow, listen, Bruins, they're 22-19 and five. You got a minus 22 goal difference. That's the thing. Not very good.

Not very good. Like they haven't been that good. Like they're 36. But the thing is, they'd won six in a row recently or something, haven't they? Well, they've won a couple. They got the coach bump when Sacco took over. Yes, they did, yes. So that's twice now, but do you think like the third, the last third of the season, they're

going to like turn it on and be different than what they are? Sometimes like what you are is what you are. Like, do you think they're going to morph into some offensive dynamo and be some threat in the playoffs now? Well, and the thing is they played more games than anyone in the East outside of Pittsburgh. So they played 46 games, all these young hungry teams like Ottawa and Montreal and Columbus, they've all got games in hand. That's the thing, man. I mean, it's not a guarantee. It just, history would suggest they'll find a way to get in there and they'll play better down the stretch. But they played 46 games and

they've been mediocre that's what the Bruins are right now they're a mediocre team well at best and the goalie they gave all that money to has been a mediocre goaltender yes way more struggled for sure yes and you wonder like that whole that guy would piss me off too if i handed him the money and he said he's this and that and then you give him the money but wait i thought that like that whole back and forth between swayainman and management that became public, didn't that sort of set this team up for a tough year? It set Swainman up to be in a regression year. It was like when you talk that big and you demand that much, a lot of pressure there.

Well, countless examples of that. Guys who miss camp, guys who are focused on the on their contracts, guys who who put that spotlight on them because someone else had to leave for you to stay in a market like that. Yeah he set himself up possibly for failure and it's a one-off but they're committed to him like he's he's going to be there throughout his career I would I would presume but it hasn't been good enough for Swainman. So yeah I mean I guess it's another example where yeah the Leafs have lost three in a row, not good, not acceptable, gotta be better but it could be worse certainly in the East. And the Leafs and Devils playing tonight on TSN. All right little panel night tonight, good stuff, we'll catch you tomorrow. Bring your A game tomorrow.

Yeah, I got an emergency Hazy B to maybe lead off the show. Dear Hazy B, a guy's going to the Habs game with a bunch of different people. We might have to do it first. A dear Hazy B to start the show tomorrow on a Friday. I love that. I love that. Set the tone for the weekend, right? Oh yeah. Okay. Dear Hazy B, maybe out of the gate tomorrow. I like it. Okay. And we'll go through some Brock for what's our guy's name? Jake for Jake Forbes. Yeah. Give us some details on what this guy's all about and what his action is. We'll break him down tomorrow. Yep. Full breakdown. All right. Leaves devils on TSN four and on TSN radio tonight. Yeah, boys. Thanks.

There's the old dog, Jeff O'Neill, Dave Festruck sticking around around on Brian Hayes overdrive continues TSN 1050 and on TSN for all right overdrive continues powered by Fanduul get to our best bets brought to you by Fanduul a little bit later this afternoon heading down to the Leaf game tonight going to see a lot of our friends from Fanduul a lot of TSN people down there. We got Leafs Devils tonight and be close to the Rogers Center as well where I'm sure they are working around the clock down there. Ross Atkins and Mark Shapiro are trying to figure this out because it's starting to get a little bit louder around you know offseason acquisitions as we get closer to spring training. There's still a lot of big names out there. Roki Suzuki who is you know a young stud starting

pitcher coming out of Japan. Very unique situation because the posting there's only so much money he can get right because of his age and because of his tenure on you know playing pro in Japan. So this isn't a scenario where he's going to be making a fortune. He will make a decision in the next eight days I believe it is. The window is open and he has, I want to say, until the 24th, I believe it is, to make a decision. So we're going to know soon if he's going to the Dodgers, the Padres, or the Blue Jays.

And if the Blue Jays land him, and I know a lot of people roll their eyes, and I'm skeptical too, if you land them, that would be very significant. Huge. Hugely significant. And they need a win like that. Like I can still paint a picture here

for a positive off season where you brought in Hoffman. I know it felt strange and you're worried about the physical and you're worried about the shoulder, but the last two years he's been an elite bullpen arm. Oh yeah. Right, elite. You brought Jimmy Garcia back. You know who he is.

Garcia is what he is. He's an innings filler more or less. But still, he's a guy that is somewhat reliable, will stay healthy, you know what you're getting. You're banking on Swanson returning to where he was a couple of years ago. It was a disastrous season for him. Chad Green, you got him for a full year.

You're trying to piece together a bullpen. You bring in Suzuki, maybe you can piece together with Suzuki, Bowden Francis, if he is down the street again this is all glass half full and this is internal improvement on overdrive here in terms of what the J's will be promoting we also made the Jimenez deal the bat is what it is but defensively he's a he's a superstar A plus plus

plus defensive player at second base if you get Suzuki if you find a way to sign Vladdy long term is it a grand slam offseason maybe not does it guarantee they make the playoffs no i don't think it does but is it a disaster no it wouldn't be at that point like it would i think you'd look back and say okay you signed Vladdy you got Suzuki you brought in Hoffman you made a him and as deal. Not about offseason. If those things went to plan. Yes. Hoffman was healthy. Not about offseason. You're right. I mean the Suzuki thing would be would be a grand slam on its own, right? Because you have the opportunity to get a guy who would be your ace, who's a young guy, who is essentially making a big financial sacrifice coming to Major League Baseball

at this juncture of his career. And it's because he's told his agent that he wants to be a Hall of Famer. This guy's got big ambitions. You're going to get him for something in the range of 10 million bucks, maybe less. Team control for a long time. Yeah. In an era where aces are making 40 million, you're going to get him for 10ish. I mean, it's an absolute grand slam and yeah look I mean if you don't sign Vlad E like the

alternative to not signing to signing Vlad E is not signing Vlad E and what's that gonna do to the coming season if he's a pending free agent and so is Bo Bichette yes these two guys who've been the most identifiable players in your organization for most of the past decade are essentially in walk years. After you were last place in the AL East a year ago and now you're Vegas over under 71 and a half. Right. Not exactly a great advertisement.

Come on down to the ballpark. Listen, there's I gave you the glass half full. Yeah. There's a glass half empty in front of us here too. Yeah. Suzuki picks the Dodgers. Ladi says, I'm testing free agent. See, you know, appreciate it.

I may stay, but I may not. I'm this close. I'm going to, I'm going to test it out. And you know, they don't sign Pete Alonso. They don't sign a Bregman. They don't sign Santander. And it's like, like okay you got Hoffman because he had to take your offer because the other teams wouldn't give him what he wanted anymore.

Him and S can't hit. Like listen there's a glass half empty, don't get me wrong. What I'm saying is there's so much negativity driven towards the Blue Jays right now, all of it warranted based on what happened last year and what's happened the last two off seasons. I'm driving force in a lot of that I'm cynical myself. Yeah, but there still is time here to pull it out of you pull something out here Where if Suzuki chooses your program that is very significant because of what you just said If you find a way to get pen to paper on For Vlad E long term and you commit to him and you say we're committed to him and we're committed to winning and building with him that I think would be very significant because I think it would allow a fan base to breathe a little bit

like there's a lot of anxiety that this team cannot land anybody and that if they can't land their own guy what the hell is what is out there in the future right the only option at that point would seemingly be you have to go scorched earth and build from the bottom up You have to bottom has nothing on it right? No, exactly But that's the point like you're you're starting basically at stage one of scorched earth Which means it's a minimum five years and you're talking 20 30 before you're competitive again Yeah, like that that is which is not possibly yeah, which is not the profile of the game

It's not the profile of a team that just dumped 400 million bucks into renovating their ballpark. Right. They're in a come see us now mode. And it's had a top ten payroll pretty consistently for years. Exactly. It has a young superstar that they could have signed many times in Vladie Guerrero who they've neglected to sign until now and may want to walk at this point. Well and this is where you know Vlad is name is out there. There

were multiple reports Hector Gomez reporting I think Andy Martino from I want to say SNN, SNY in New York I believe covers the Mets reported that the Mets checked in on Vlad's availability and take that for what it's worth but now Buster only VSPN who's on first up weekly he tweeted out a couple hours ago this to me reads like a very substantial tweet Buster tweeting in the Mets perfect world they'd love to find a deal for Vladimir Gurev Jr. who like Juan Soto is a slugger who makes contact 199 hits and 96 strikeouts last year if they pulled off a trade for him they

could sign him before he hit the market just like they did with Francisco Lindor where they acquired him from Cleveland then signed him going into his final season. Now that reads as a report to me. Like that reads as Buster is saying, this is what the Mets hope happens. And again, what that means to me me if I'm the Blue Jays and

it could be a smokescreen it could be maybe this is Vladys camp leaking that out who knows but if if the report if you're the Blue Jays what I read out of that is Steve Cohen's willing to pay him. Yeah. That's that's what I'm reading out of this and if I'm Vladys Gros Jr. I love that that's out there. Of course. Because now you're like listen it's 450 whether you give it to me or Steve Cohen i'm reading out of this and if i'm bloody grow junior i love that that's out there court because now you're like listen it's four fifty whether you give it to me or steve cohen gives it to me i'll just wait i can wait it out

because cohen's he doesn't care about a luxury tax or penalties or punitive measures for major league baseball he just gave a guy's my boy six hundred seventy five million dollars on soto he gave my boy francisco lindor three Francisco Lindor 365 million or whatever was and he's going to give me 450 and we're all going to go down there and we're all friends and we're going to take our talents to Queens. Right. And if you're Ross Atkins, if you're Mark Shapiro, but more importantly, if you're Rogers, you have to read that and you got to figure

out if it's accurate or not. And what I am curious about, because this, this was a big part of the reporting with Soto, Edward Rogers flew out to meet him. Is Edward meeting with Vladdy? Because you would think it's the same thing. Is it not? Like, is it just red alert? If it's red alert and the big thing for agents and players, the proof that you're really committed is the owner actually puts in his own time right I'm curious to see if that's the case yeah like you're the one call like not calling directly maybe but hey let's set up a meeting and come by my house right and then and by the way if you're Vladimir Junior who at times we have pointed out on this show and others has struggled with the fact that he hasn't had

a lot of protection in the lineup around him as a hitter. How many pitches has Vladdy seen in some years? Because guess what? He's the only guy that can really hurt you in the Blue Jays lineup at certain times, given what they've gone through these past handful of years. How good does life sound hitting beside Wonsoto, either in front of or behind Wonsoto? Yeah, with Lindor mixed in. Slightly changed picture. Oh, it's massively

significant. And I also think like Wonsoto would love to hear that too because guess what? Hitting in front of Aaron Judge was pretty good life last year. No kidding. Made him look pretty darn good to the point where it made him an awful lot of money. I'm not saying that's the only reason he got the money. I'm not saying he's not a great hitter but he was a much better hitter because of the fact that he was beside Aaron Judge in a lineup. Glad he's not Aaron Judge. Glad he's not Soto but he's a reasonable facsimile. Yeah. He's a contact power hitter. Absolutely. Absolutely. And you know there are reports coming out, Ken Rosenthal reporting

and others that it sounds like Pete Alonso and the Mets likely will be parting ways. And that's where the Vladi connection comes in. And again, trying to read the tea leaves are the Mets willing to move off Alonso because they feel good about their chances of getting Vladi. Yeah. Again, and this the power is still in the hands of the Blue Jays for this year. You've got you don't have to trade them. You don't have to move off them You know, it may be an option for the Blue Jays though, like they they they may have that on the table as well We're in Alonzo. Well, well a get Alonzo but B if the Mets are so so, you know Ambitious to acquire Vlad E if you sign Alonzo and you determine you're not paying Vladi,

shouldn't you trade Vladi to the Mets between now and spring training? And get a windfall. Absolutely. Like restart whatever you're trying to start. Right, because if the alternative is he's just gonna play it out and leave, and you're not gonna win anything this year anyway,

although maybe they're delusional enough to think that they will. But you know what, there is some logic to that because normally in the beginning of a walk year you might not get much back, but because the Mets are in win-now mode after dumping all that money into Juan Soto's pickup truck, I mean they need it to work now. And Vlad would help it work now quicker than anything they could get. Well certainly more than Pete Alonso. Anything else on the market right now,

he is the number one piece that would help ensure that Wants Soda's a massive success as a New York Mets. Big time, and if there's some collusion there, which I would assume there would be, if it's an understanding when we acquire you, we also are going to pay you this, then there's probably more, well, there would be more willingness from the Mets

to basically open up the doors and the coffers and say, tell us what you're looking for here. Now what makes this complicated is Ross Atkins also has to be in win now mode. Whether you believe he can win now or not is a different story. He's going on a decade as a GM who doesn't want a playoff game. And you know, Shapiron Atkins are public enemy number one in this market. Yes. You know, no one takes more heat than those two. So you're coming off a bad season, a lost season.

Are you going to trade Vladdy for futures? Are you going to trade him for, you know, the number one and three prospect in the Mets? And I don't even know who those players are. Yeah, you're right. You know, what if they're in single A and double A and it's like a little joining twenty seven you know twenty twenty seven of the house is that something ross akins can

even entertain right now it's a tough sell because then every city in the revisionist and rightly so the revisionist history of well if you were never gonna sign a whitey trade-off earlier when he had way more value ready to make this decision one year ago two years ago when the value of lati, because he was under team control for multiple years,

would have been far higher, right? I mean, that would be a reasonable criticism of a deal like that. On top of that, Hayes, like, we all kind of know this is a bit of a PR situation they're in right now. Like, their PR's really bad. Like, nobody believes they're to win anything next year. No.

Right? So that's kind of out the window. They're a 71 and a half win team in the Vegas over-unders right now. Yeah, which is staggeringly low. Staggeringly low. Like that's not far from- They're not winning, but they got to win a press conference. They got to win the opening spring training conference where they can at least spin some

sort of a tale of legitimacy because right now to your point like I can't think of a management group that's been Really more hated than this one like there's visceral hate. Yeah, it's it's bad oil's over Like in my community of blue jay fans. Yes. I mean, there's disdain. No, there's legitimate anger and like kind of disgust with the whole operation and the way it all operates. Yeah, and there's not a lot of faith that they're gonna make it any better,

but maybe their best PR move would be just throw some money at Vladdy. If it gets to Saki, it'd be huge. Maybe they make an offer to Bregman. That's, listen, at some point though, they don't have that much money, right? Why not? There's no cap.

There isn't a cap. There is budgets. Perfect World, they would do that. But at some point, it's probably gonna come to an end. But you can paint that picture as a win, a big win. If you get Sasaki to buy into you and your program and you sign Vlade that to me I think would gain a majority of Blue J fans back on the side of the Blue J's maybe not individually Atkins Shapiro collectively the two of them the

front office and what their future is but it would be a feel-good story right like all of a sudden you've got your star, the face of the franchise is Vladi. He's been the face of the franchise effectively since he signed here, certainly since he arrived. And then you bring in Sasaki, who I believe they would have team control of for like six years.

So if you have a stud arm, a stud bat, then you can kind of work through everything else. In 25, I still don't think you're going to win enough ball games to put you over the top, but you can maybe start planting seeds for what it could be in 26, right? Like they're not going to put that's a PR disaster and marketing disaster. You're not going to come out and say we're not going to win anything in 25, but I'm telling you in 26, we will because no one's going to buy that. And they're not going to do that in 25 but I'm telling you in 26 we will because no one's gonna buy that and they're not gonna do that but I think if you're a smart baseball fan and you buy into what the future could

be you could read into that sales pitch and believe that it's it possibly could work. Yeah it starts to turn around properly. Like for a kid with the talent of Sasaki to choose you would would legitimize you in a way that almost nothing else could right you know if you if this kid said hey i looked at the dodgers looked at san diego which beautiful place to live as well

i chose ronan very unlikely right so that would be you know the underdog win of the century big time free agency yeah so but beyond that you know when your most popular player is hanging in this limbo like Vlad is right now you're in a very dangerous place it is yeah and it's a conundrum they put themselves in right like Bo Bichette does no one even talks about Bichette and he was one of the most popular players for a long time absolutely there were moments where

it looked like this was his team yeah but doing what he did last year well and the injuries and his performance he just he wiped himself off the map yeah like he can return and return quickly with a hot you know hot spring you hit the ground running but you know I don't know what his future is gonna be. I don't feel great about his future in Toronto. It feels like these two parties are moving towards a breakup by the end of next year. And again, you know, revisionist history and all, but likely gonna get very little for him.

Well, yeah, exactly. I mean, that, the bow play in terms of moving off him, if they decide to do that is he has a great April great May great June They're on pace for 70 wins. They you trade them. Yeah. Yeah, I mean that And listen that could be a possibility with Vladimir Like it could be a scenario where they just they get to camp they break camp. He plays you get into July You're not going anywhere Vladimir's playing well And they decide we got a we got a trade and there you get something you get a lot for Vlad He you can get as much as you would during an offseason and during a sweepstakes league wide

But someone would pay a lot clearly yeah the team that a desperate team that yeah feels they need that piece Sure, you may be able to strike something there But that that's the worst case scenario for Atkins and Shapiro is you get to this trade deadline and you have to flip Vladimir Andor Bo and put the white flag up. Like at that point you might as well just say we're leaving too. Like there's no way you can survive that. You have to wonder because I mean the other the other scenario there is you got the guy that owns that club and controls that club he's about to become the czar of Toronto sports. He's about to own everything.

You know, and so he's got a bit of a PR problem because no one knows who he is. No one's really seen his face, but for brief glimpses. And he's got to make a statement about how he's going to run not just the Blue Jays, but the Raptors and the Leafs and the Argos and TFC, because he's going to control it all in very short order here. And so if the Blue Jays are a dumpster fire when he takes over as

the major Domo of the entire Toronto sports scene, that's not gonna be a good position to be in. No. Wizard of Oz type vibes. Like you gotta you gotta get it done man. You gotta make a statement about how you're gonna run things. Big time. And that you actually are in control and you know what you're doing. Right. Yeah, we'll see. I mean, again, we're less than a month away now from pitchers and catchers reporting. And if you believe in what Vlad is saying, that he's not going to negotiate beyond that, then you got about a month to figure this out. Here at Atkins and Shapiro. And again, Ken Rosenthal reporting that they haven't had any contract negotiations since before Christmas.

And yet there are conflicting reports that they're actively negotiating. Exactly. So who knows? It is difficult to know at this point. Joe Bowen, Jim Rolfe coming up in about 20 minutes. Least Devils tonight. Overdrive continues. TSN 1050 and on the TSN app.

All right. We have sent Al's brother out into the world with a pair of Leaf tickets and you have to guess where he's hiding for your chance to win them. He's already given three clues this week, Dave, and this is the fourth and final. I am quite curious. I think I know where he is by now, but if you don't know where he is and you want a pair of Leaf tickets, you better tune in. You better find out here because this is the fourth and final clue of the week. in you better find out here because this is the fourth and final clue of the week. Hey Overdrive fans, it's Thursday which means it's time for your final clue to find out where is Al's brother and get you one step closer to those Leafs and Lightning tickets on January 20th. And look, my car almost broke down on my way here, but luckily there are a ton of new and used cars

at the place that I am at. Perhaps a new Ford could be in my future. Oh, that was brother, very sneaky. I like it. All right. When you hear the cue to call tomorrow, the first caller through with the correct location will win a pair of tickets again to see the Leafs play the lightning on Monday.

Fine Owls Brothers brought to you by McAlpine Ford in Aurora. Our family, the Ford family and you full details at TSN 1050 dot CA you got Devils in town tonight Leafs in Montreal tomorrow Montreal is in Dallas tonight. I won't be an easy game and Then you got the Leafs and Lightning on Mondays, so do you think wall Joseph wall play all three games I Don't think so. I think they're worried about a man I mean that I think putting hill to be in the other night tells you that, right? It tells you that they understand that this guy has never played this kind of workload before in his career and he's got a very extensive injury history throughout his

pro career and they cannot afford for Joseph Wall to get injured at this particular moment. No they can't because I don't I'm not holding my breath Anthony Stolar's returns before the four nations face-off you know I know it just feels like that's what's gonna happen here like you're gonna give him the month and he's gonna get the break and then he'll come back and be ready which means you get a lot of games between now and then including a Western trip where they go through Western Canada they go through Seattle but even if they like a lot of people point out they don't have back-to-back until from now until the

four nations but as you point out they have a lot of games yeah every other night is a lot of workload man a lot of workload for and especially for a guy who, you know, really hasn't done this. He's on pace for 40 plus and he's never done more than 20 plus. It is it is just confounding to me that like it's even a discussion that a 26 year old can't play games every other night. Well, you look at his numbers. No, I know that. I know that.

The splits with one day's rest are not good. Two days rest he's better and three days rest he's even better. But he's not a starting pitcher. I know what the numbers are. Athletic position. I get it. You guys are like gymnasts. But like and I guess Halibuck's different but he plays all the time. There's one Halibuck I understand that but Vas's the last the involved like they play and and listen maybe just he's been capable of that and maybe they already have that answer and this is just going to be the reality

i just i would be i would want to keep pushing the envelope can you give us more can you give us more but i'd i sense that the reluctant to do that that coxley syria do it he would plan for sure it would uh... final our coming up job on jimmy ralph was here he'd do it. He would play him for sure he would. Final hour coming up Joe Bowen, Jimmy Ralph

will join us. Overdrive continues TSN 1050 soon to be up on TSN 2. TSN plus is taking game day to a whole new level with NFL Red Zone. Absolutely incredible. Subscribe now for every touchdown from every game every Sunday afternoon. NFL Red Zone available on TSM plus.