OverDrive - OverDrive - July 22, 2025 - Hour 2

Episode Date: July 22, 2025

Join Bryan Hayes, Frank Corrado and Jonas Siegel for Hour 2 on OverDrive! TSN Baseball Insider Steve Phillips joins to discuss the Blue Jays' jumping up the standings in the AL, Bo Bichette's strong performances and the trade deadline approach for the team. The guys discuss the into the Toronto Sports Quarter Century Bracket for the Most Valuable Athletes and Jonas gives his list on the most intriguing Maple Leafs going into the 2025-26 season.

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The station that champions Canadian music. Loud, proud, and all yours. No passports required. Just press play. Tap into Made in Canada now on iHeartRadio.ca or the free iHeartRadio app Our to overdrive continues powered by Fanduil bringing you everything from the opening line of the final score Brian Hayes Frankie Corrado Jonas Segal in here Steve Phillips later in the hour

Get a little confirmed with deny later in the hour Jonas. You've put a list together as well That I think we might have to dive into. Oh yeah, we could spend an hour on it. Yeah, you got a good list today? Controversial Leafs list? No, no, it's a good list. Yeah, very even keeled. Oh, that's all I know. Uber positive, numbers driven. No, purely no numbers. I like that. Gut Jonas. Gut feel Jonas. I love that. I test. I test Jonas. You're gonna I test a list. See, I support that greatly. Okay, so we'll get to that a little bit later on. We're gonna talk some NFL later this afternoon. Jerry Jones. I'm very curious how much more like the rest of the Jones family is going to allow him to keep representing the team publicly. Like, at Jones, like, what is his role?

Is he like, he's number two, like he's, he's the number two guy. He's mini me, basically. And like Jerry just comes out and lights a fire and talks about negotiations and we shouldn't have done this. Or even if we pay that guy might get hurt anyway and then you can see Stephen Jones is like okay that's great stuff and then he's got to come out like try to basically smooth it all over. You can't do anything you can't say anything to the guy. It's his team and it's been his team for 35 years. His team has got more money than

anyone like he runs the show. He's 82 Yeah exactly. Yeah Like and that's it like Jerry Jones is he's he's owned it for 35. It's been his team He's the face of he is more synonymous with his team than any other owner in sports And I don't think there's anybody close and any player on his team like who's who's been a bigger Name or face than Jerry Jones over the last however many years that have played for the Cowboys? Who's a bigger name, Prescott or Jerry Jones? Jerry. Probably Jerry.

Right. Tony Romo or Jerry? Jerry. I still think it's Jerry. It's only like Emmett Smith maybe. Yeah, like Troy Aikman, Michael Irvin. Aikman probably, yeah, Aikman. But I think like Jerry's the guy.

Yeah, Jerry's the guy. How do you think that ends? Like how do you think he, because he's probably not just going to step aside, right? No, exactly. I mean, it's going to be like a 90 year old owner talking after he's in GM. Yeah, that's I guess what I'm anticipating.

I don't see any other reason to believe it's going to be different unless again, his family and his kids get to him and go, Jerry, you just got to take a step back here please. He's like the opposite of Lou Lamarello where they were both. No he is Lou Lamarello. No but he doesn't he owns it. He is but he doesn't act like Lou. Lou doesn't he's not out there. No. No. He's very. He's not putting on fires. Yeah Lou does some goofy things. He signs some weird contracts but Jerry's like he kind of telegraphs everything before it happens, whereas Lou is like this weird cone of

silence. They're the same guy, same age kind of category, but very different. Yeah, okay, so exactly the same age, but very different in how they operate. Yes, big time. But, like you said, Lou didn't own any of the teams. He kind of worked with full autonomy everywhere he walked. I don't think Lou cared if he owned it or not. He was going to do what he wanted to do. How will it end nicely? It probably won't, right?

Yeah, ultimately you hope that they have team success. If you're a Cowboy fan, that maybe in spite of Jerry Jones, they're finally going to win. But he's not going to step aside. No I know that. I don't have an answer for you. Was something going to happen where he says something you shouldn't say and then it's just like oh that's it. I'm not even sure that would stop him. Like we're talking about Texas, we're talking about Dallas. He's had some controversies. He's had some stuff away from the field or away from the front office that have not taken him down. Wouldn't you want to know what a couple of the group chats are like? Not the big group chat for

the Cowboys, but like the off, you know, like let's say, no, let's say there's like a Parsons Prescott and a couple other guys in a group chat and it's like Jerry's doing his thing spouting off again. Do they talk about it? Do they vent about it? Are they just like, yeah, you know what, Jerry does that stuff, but he's actually good to us. So we can't really complain. I would be so curious to know how they actually felt about all this stuff that happens because it always seems to happen every, every so often. That there is a difference between, you know,

whatever he's portraying publicly and you know, he's got a, uh, an operational mode that he, that's just the way he works and he speaks his mind and he wants to talk and all this kind Of stuff yet. Maybe you know if he treats the players like a million bucks, that's all that matters That's all they care about the coaches He's been very loyal But he has this reputation of being a gunslinger and just a guy that just wakes up one day and goes you fire That's not how he operates Jason Garrett was there for years. Mike McCarthy is still there. You know, like that's, that's the way it's worked.

You know, it's same idea with Dak. He would have had opportunities to walk away from Dak. He's doubled down on him. Yeah. Believed in him. Yeah. Like it's not just the coach. No, exactly. Guys like guy. I could tell you you firsthand guys would have said about Lou, you know Lou is kind of crazy intimidates us scares us but loose pretty fair and he's pretty good to us I just I wonder if guys would have the same thing to say about Jerry. Yeah, it's it's an interesting question I mean, we'd have to have to ask players, you know how they how they ultimately feel about all that All right, Jay's back in action tonight tonight they've won 11 in a row at home

they've beaten the yankees five times in two weeks that's way better than 11 wasn't that like the Pedro line the yankees did he say the yankees are my daddy yeah i believe it was Pedro that said that yeah and then uh remember he got in that dust up and yeah it was the bench coach's name. Steve would know. Yeah. What the hell was that guy's name? He was a life or two. It's great. He was Joe Torre's guy. The bald guy. Yeah. The older guy.

And he don't, what was his name? Well, let's just bring in Steve. Steve will remember here's Steve Phillips. Steve, who was the guy that Pedro threw to the ground in that Yankee Red Sox fight? Yeah. Uncle Fester. Yes. No, Don Zimmer. Don Zimmer. Don Zimmer. yankee red sox fight yeah uncle faster uh... that that that that that that that dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot that's a uh... yes well that's what we're hoping for tonight we want to see the bench is clear we want to see i don't don maddingley go out that i'd be interested in madeline went out there

just started laying a beating on someone from the yankees but uh... all yeah it's over positive up here up here in Toronto Steve I'm sure you can imagine oh I can't even look here's the thing guys I fixed them now it's up to you guys to continue this run like I got them here to 11 straight wins right now it's up to you guys to make sure that they don't lose another game at home I think we can find a way to make that work I don't think that's at home. I think we can find a way to make that work. I don't think that's going to be an issue for people because when you consider, you know, the clutch gene that they've found here, like last night was a significant, I guess,

representation of that, Steve. We're in the fifth inning, they're down a run, Springer gets on, Vlade gets on, and Bichette, who has been the most clutch hitter in baseball, you know, ropes one down the left field line, Vlade goes first to home, it just, everything is working for them right now and I think the fundamentals seemingly are a big part of that. Oh yeah, they're doing a lot right and you know what happens is that when you're not playing well, if you're not hitting, you made an error, then you sometimes get overzealous. You try to do too much.

You try to, you know, you try to, you know, get a three run home run with nobody on base and you know, when you start trying too hard in this game, instead of letting it come to you, you end up making mistakes and so, you know, they've got such confidence right now. We may have lost them there. That sounded like his phone basically. Yeah. We're not doing this anymore. We're done here.

It was Don Zimmer. He got his phone, Don Zimmer. Yeah. Someone, someone Don Zimmered that, that phone and that was a direct drop. Yeah. Like we're not here anymore. So we'll call Steve back. We'll get him back in. But yeah, Phillips is coming around on the Jays too. Who isn't? Dude, of all the dust-ups you've seen in the MLB, that's got to be the most bizarre one, right? Like Pedro roughing up Don Zimmer like that. Yeah, that was really weird because like in Zimmer like remember the next day

He was like crying which is really tough to watch because he looked like everyone's grandfather And he had been a Yankee like a legend and been around forever And he was on Torrey's staff forever and Pedro probably took it a little far But what the hell was Don Zimmer doing throwing? little far but what the hell was Don Zimmer doing? Can't rush it. Like what are you doing Don Zimmer? You're rushing them. Smarten up man.

Like natural, like Pedro just kind of gave them the like the... Yeah he pushed them to the side. Yeah like a bullfighter type move. Like just go over here Don Zimmer. Anyway we got you back Steve. Go ahead. We lost you there but... Yeah.

Go ahead. They just got so much going right at this point and you know, they've got the confidence level that they need. And what's interesting is the starting pitchers are 31 and 28 on the season. There's just three games over 500, but the bullpen is 28 and 13. There are 15 games over 500 right now. And so that tells you, cause I'm trying to understand how their record is what it is and they've got the fourth best run differential in the division

and you know what the story is that effectively you know they are winning because they come back in games the starters don't throw clunkers but you know they'll give up a run or two or three in the first five innings or so and then they come back later in the game. They beat up on the other team's bullpen. The Blue Jays bullpen comes in. They hold the lead, but what they also do, and this is a key for good bullpens, they also hold the deficit.

That if they fall behind, they come in and then they allow the offense to come back without allowing those tack on runs for the other team. It's an odd formula. You know, it's not the most conventional formula where you know, your bullpen is out pitching your rotation in many regards. Uh, but the offense is coming around and, uh, and listen to run. Don Zimmer, man. No, that time was Nolan Ryan got ahold of him.

You think that's what that was? Someone was rushing the right over the top of the dome. Yeah that one stung too man because Nolan Ryan was old in that fight. Like he was old not like like for athlete purposes. I think he was in his 40s. Yeah, but that's different because in your 40s don't you get like start to get like old man strength? That's what they say. Like dad old strength, like grizzly bear type stuff. Yeah, you're supposed to, but that was not a smart play. That was another, now I'm forgetting who ran out on the field there, because he became a manager

for a long time too. I don't remember that one. You don't remember the, where Nolan Ryan hit a guy and he ran towards the mound, and Ryan put him in a headlock and beat the hell out of the guy but you've seen that a million times jonas and rob robin vintra robin venture that's who i was for a while i'm losing my mind i can remember names

robin vintra that's an all-time clip yes because i sure was young like he was mid twenties and he thought i'm gonna go out there just aid up on the sold out of area even close to it like ryan brings a man venture doesn't get anything off. He brings a man right away headlock and just starts peppering him right over the head. That's got to be the worst feeling in the world in front of 40,000 people and old guys got you in a headlock like throwing off the top of your mind as well.

I've given him a noogie. Yes. Like look at this Jonah. So Ventura plays it cool. He's like, I'm going to lay a beating on this old guy. And Ryan's like, come here. You little like no just starts laying a beating on All I love that we need more of that in baseball You need way more and Peter Lanzer was advocating for that at the All-Star game was see yeah

He said it should be like hockey go get in a fight You don't get kicked out of the crazy thing about those like fights where you're not on skates. It's basically a street fight Yeah, that's exactly what it's a it's a street fight with a uniform on that's right it's like lacrosse man they'll take their helmets off and you're in a bar basically just fighting yeah um all right we're gonna try this one more time steve you're down oh two in the count here with that phone of yours but uh you got us or what yeah i got you i got you i'm gonna i'm gonna actually charge the moan on the phone. Yeah, good man. But yeah, it's all coming together and you know you look at

last night like the start by Gosman and this has been a big topic of discussion leading up to the trade deadline like what are we what are they gonna do with the rotation is it possible for them to find anyone that's gonna give you more confidence than Gosman, Bassett or Barrios. He had extra rest coming out of the All-Star game, but man did he look good last night. He challenged the Yankees, he challenged Judge multiple times. You know, if they're at their best, is Gosman your game one starter? Like if he's in a position where you feel like he can pitch the way he was going to pitch last night? Yeah, I think Yeah I think I mean he can be there's no question we've seen him be an ace we've seen him be a Cy Young candidate so we know that that

that's in him but you know what happens is that you don't have a chance to do anything else you know starting August 1st and so how confident are you that you know you're gonna get the premium performance from your starting pitchers for the rest of the year? And I don't feel confident about that, even with guys that have been consistently dominating all season long. So my view is that they still need to try to tack on. This is the year to go for it.

You're not going to get enough front end starting pitching. And you know what? If you get a fourth guy and you go four deep for the playoffs and everybody's fresh and ready to go and maybe you could do somebody in the bullpen if you need them, I think you've got to go for it that way. I don't hedge my bet in any way. There's nothing that's going to happen over the next couple days, you know, leading in nine days leading to this deadline that's going to cause me to pull back.

I'm going for it if I'm Ross Atkins and Mark Shapiro and that includes getting a picture that is as good or better than the front end of the rotation. Steve, I'm sure you've seen the visual of Vladdy flying through the air going into home last night. I mean, what does that do for the players in the clubhouse and the dugout seeing a guy like Vladdy really kind of laying it out there Doing a little bit extra where you know, we've seen Vlad E in the past You know whether it was a couple years ago waving at second base trying to get a challenge and that was just looks it looks totally

Different it looks blue-collar like it's lunch pail like and I have to think that that kind of stuff really permeates through the rest of the rest of the dugout Yeah, I think it does for sure. I think also from an organizational point of view, when your superstar is busting it, it doesn't just impact the major league team. It impacts your minor leagues. It's an opportunity to show everybody, these are our expectations when you play for our major league team team that our superstar is hustling. You know he does run out ground balls too generally and hustles down the line and so I mean look on occasion I don't mind a guy pulling up a little bit 162 games and he's gonna be out there every day and I'd rather you

know him stay healthy than you know pull a hamstring but I think it's great I do I think that you know and even as a GM, it reinforces to you and to ownership that, you know, what he's taken responsibility for his role on this team and we've given him a lot of money. And with that money has come a lot of responsibility and he's owning that responsibility. I think it's a special thing. Steve, if I could go back to your point about starting pitching, let's say the best you can do short of like going crazy and getting Mitch Keller, Joe Ryan, is someone like Seth Lugo, free agent after this year.

Is that like, would you do that or do you just kind of say, you know what, this is what we got, we're not going to go in for someone like that? I would do that. I would. I think that you have to protect Lauer and Scherzer, you know, and look, I know Scherzer is going to pitch today. I know that, you know, he's made what, four or five starts in a row, but that thumb is a continuous thing he has to manage. And for me, I just can't assume that he's going to be able to stay healthy the last two months of the season. And if I don't protect him now, then August 2nd rolls around his next start.

He comes out with a sore thumb and I've got nowhere else to go. And so I think you have to buy your insurance now. If you don't need it, then you've got depth and a little too much, then so be it. Find a way to manage that. But I don't wanna get caught in my pants now

that I assumed that my 40 year old pitcher was going to stay healthy when he's had injuries over the last three years and then have it go wrong because the obvious question will be well like would I be shocked if something happened none of us wanted to but would I be shocked? No I wouldn't and if I'm not going to be shocked by it then I better protect it. With Steve Phillips and yeah and I I was saying earlier, Steve, like the history of this front office is they invest in their in their rotation. Like that is just always the way that they've

operated. That's their philosophy is like build the rotation and the rest can be figured out. And then when you compound that with what you just said about Scherzer, the Eric Lauer story has been uber positive positive it's just been an unbelievable run the wheels fell off on him in two weeks with anyone be shocked i don't think you could be and that you always mention it like managerial malpractice if you get to the end of the run and you miss the playoffs

by a game because sure is is bum flared up in lauer you know return to where he was maybe a year or two ago and you just simply don't have options, it's indefensible. And then again, with their philosophy of really investing in that, including just the capital that they have, not just the money, but I would think the prospects they have if they can find somebody that maybe does have some term and they can build that rotation out beyond the next two months, everything Ross Atkins has said and done in the past would indicate that that's likely going to happen in the

next eight days. Yeah, I would think so. It's going to come down to, you know, are there pitchers available with control? Who are they? And then, you know, I mean, the reality is that's the first choice for everybody is if I'm going to give up premium talent Then I want to get more than just a rental player for the rest of the year And and everybody's going to have that same thinking so the price is going to go up and it's going to come down to you know

You know, what are you willing to pay to do it? And what are you willing to pay for your benefit of getting the player and for your benefit of the other team? Not getting the player because some part of this is a game of keep away you know I want them but I also don't want you to get them you know I don't want the Yankees to get the starting pitcher that they're both competing to try to get and so it's one thing if that guy ends up going to San Diego and joins their rotation it's another one if you lose out on the same guy and he goes to the Yankees and so for me I'm willing to pay a premium. And you know, you don't say

this as a general manager to run the price up on yourself, but the reality is, if I want the guy, I'm going to get him and I can keep him away and he's the best guy. Then I've got a chance to not only help myself, but I've got a chance to damage my closest opposition. I've got to go down that road and pay the price. Steve Phillips. So Boba Shad had the biggest hit of the game last night and yet it's been very routine for him to do that throughout this season. Like we talked a lot over the last year and a half but a lack of clutch hitting, lack of performance with runners in scoring position to put into

perspective where Bichette currently ranks. Runners in scoring position according to MLB.com. Bichette ranks first and average, he's hitting 400 with runners in scoring position, 400. He's ninth in on base percentage, tenth in slugging. He never strikes out. How much of this is because of where he's hitting in the lineup, in your opinion,

now that they've moved him to the clean up role, which was a big issue for them last year. Remember how much of a black hole that was for them and they've tried to push him into being a leadoff guy they've moved they've he's at second he's at third he's now they've just got him hit behind Vladi and seemingly Vladi's on a lot Springer's been on a lot whoever's hitting cleanup or whoever's hitting leadoff it changes every night it's done a pretty good job of getting on base as well like what what do you see out of Bichette and how comfortable does this role seem to be for him?

Yeah, you know, he's just a hitter. I mean, generally, he just comes out to play and I've always thought it's like a summer league team. Like, he's just that guy that comes out, hat backwards, batting gloves dangling out of his back pocket, double wristbands on, he's got the eye black comes out that hat backwards batting gloves dangling out of his back pocket double wristbands I've got the eye black on he gets out of the van carrying his bat bag. Where do we play? All right that field over there is like oh who we playing today? Like he just shows up

He's just the baseball player and he shows up to play and I don't know necessarily that it really matters that much to him Where he hits and but I do think that the way he is with honors and scoring system, to slow that heartbeat right now. And you watch, he's the best Jays hitter at going the other way. How many times do we see him flare one down the right field line,

slice one just inside the bag down the line over there. And that ability to let the ball travel and have confidence that you can let it get deeper into the zone and still put a good swing on it drive it the other way gives him the ability to hit the fastball and the breaking stuff and so he's not going to take a walk but with runners on base, you know, like I love Joey Votto but Joey Votto would have a 420 on base percentage and drive in 79 runs because that 3-1 pitch He was taking it with runners in scoring position, but you know this, Bichette's gonna be up there hacking

He's gonna be up there trying to slice it into the outfield find a gap try to drive in the runs And so on this team with traffic on base in front of him. He's the right guy batting fourth How do you explain the difference in George Springer from last year to this year, Steve, where last year he has an OPS under 700 and now he leads the team in home runs? Well, he has simplified things a little bit with his swing. He used to have a little bit of a leg kick,

and now it's not nearly the same starting mechanism that he had before, which I, you know, a lot of times when hitters aren't you know hitting the ball well they think to themselves or they're swinging at a pitch out of the zone they think I need to wait longer but the reality is you've got to get that front foot down earlier and getting to the hitting position and I think he found himself late on so many pitches last year, particularly the fast ball. And so he's gotten himself back on the fast ball and now, you know,

he can keep his hands back for the breaking stuff. But I think a lot of it too is just that rejuvenated confidence in himself. You know, he, he had injuries, you struggle a little bit and even, you know, guys who have been all star players for years, those voices creep into your head of doubt. I don't know if I can still do it the way I did it before.

Am I ever going to be able to bounce back again? Can I be the player I once was? And then when you find a way to get back into that success and confidence circle, it reminds you of who you were as a player. He's locked back in right now. I think as much as maybe an adjustment offensively is sort of the bat in his approach, I think it's also just a high level of confidence.

Well, Steve Phillips, so the Red Sox lost last night on catcher interference with the bases loaded against the Phillies. It had happened one other time someone referenced it was like in the 70s or 80s or something like that. 1971, 54 years ago. Oh man. Johnny Bench was, Manny Moda and the Dodgers, Manny Moda was on third, he was trying to

steal home. And Johnny Bench came out of his crouch behind the plate to come up and catch the ball. And Harry Wendelstadt, the umpire, called catcher's interference on Johnny Bench. 54 years ago was the last time a game was walked off on a catchers interference Wow like what are you possibly saying to yourselves in the clubhouse after that like what what is Cora do you even address the team like what do you do in a scenario like that yeah I think you just hang with them boys. We'll get them tomorrow. You know, and think about the Phillies, you know, and Rob

Thompson, their manager, who is so understated, like he is, he never gets excited. He goes, well, you know, I thought I've seen everything in my 40 years, but over the last two weeks I saw things, two things I'd never seen before. Remember the Phillies lost that game in San Francisco on the inside the park walk-off home run. And inside the park walk-off three run homer and hit off the bricks and right field and rickshade back towards center field. Andrew Bailey the catcher for uh Patrick Bailey the catcher for the Giants and then they were the they were unfortunately uh the the you know they got they lost that game but this one they were the beneficiary of the, you know, they got, they lost that game, but this one, they

were the beneficiary of the catcher's interference. I was kind of a check swing anyway, but he didn't really look like, but it was, he offered so late that he got in our vows his gloves. So it's, that is the thing about this game. When you think you've seen everything, something else happens. And it's like, man, like you thought that you've seen every potential thing that can happen in the game. And then something like this happened. Yep very true well we'll see what comes of it tonight. Bunch of ballgames

including Jays Yankees tonight. Enjoy it tonight Steve we'll do it again soon. Thank you for this. You got it guys thanks for working through the phones with me. You got it buddy there he is Steve Phillips joining us on the Maple Toyota Hotline. Drive the built-in Canada fuel-efficient fun to drive Toyota RAV4 gas or hybrid models available visit mapletoyota.com. Dave Simms, voice of the Yankees in just over half an hour. More on the NFL camps opening up. I guess Micah Parsons, who did actually report to camp in Dallas, just responded to some Jerry Jones comments. We'll come back and play those at some point this afternoon.

Jonas, you have a list. And we'll get into, I guess we're into the Elite Eight, or the most valuable athletes in Toronto sports over the last 25 years. We'll do that as well. We'll obviously vote it down ourselves to a final four as we continue to move forward with that this week. Overdrive continues, TSN 1050N on TSN2.

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All right, Dave Sims coming up on Jay's Yankees tonight. That's in about a half an hour. Steve Weich of the NFL Network as well in an hour will play michael parsons who was responded to jerry jones speaking about his perspective contract extension although we did report there's a number of guys in the nfl that did not report tray hendrickson

not in cincinnati today terry mccormick not in washington today so there are some big names who are looking for new deals that aren't going to report But we'll get into that with Steve Weitz in about an hour So the most valuable Toronto athlete of the past 25 years we posted the 1 through 16 yesterday I don't think any surprises in terms of who got through to the elite 8 But why don't we run through these quickly? Okay, Jonas will begin with one versus nine kawaii Leonard versus Josh Donaldson This is a crazy elite eight

Like these are these would be two of my five most valuable players of the last 25 agree, but it has to be kawaii I agree. It has to be kawaii. I agree. It's in yeah, it's like kawaii I think is gonna be my guy at the end He's a one seed and I don't think anyone has been more valuable even though he's only been here for one year. But the term valuable, yes it's arbitrary in terms of what you view it and all that kind of stuff. But the fact is the only team that won a championship over the last 25 years of the Raptors, Leafs

and Jays, I know Toronto FC and the Argos have won. But they simply don't win unless Kawhi's on the team. It it's just that easy. Like without Kawhi, you're just not winning. And what's so strange for his career, I kind of think that that was his team, like his iconic team. Like obviously like when he goes in the Hall of Fame, it's not going to be with the Raptors. But if you look at like the other championships, he was kind of the young guy on those Duncan teams. And then like, that's kind of been it. Like that was the high point of his career. That was the biggest year of his career. It was awesome. And there was just like a vibe in the city, the shot against Philly, the finals, like the parade, the parade, the memes.

The laugh, the kawaii laugh, and just throws it all away for the Clippers, who are now the oldest team in the history of pro sports. What's interesting is, I think there was a story that came out maybe this year or last that him and Paul George actually talked about coming here together. I know that was, you don't believe that? Well, no, I think there was some truth in that, but I think ultimately,

Messiah sniffed it out that it was probably, it was bogus by Oklahoma city to make sure that the Clippers paid more to make sure they got they wanted to go to LA. They're both from LA. That's what they wanted to do. Okay. But it was it had been reported that that was floated out to the Raptors to like, you

know, Kawhi wanted to play with Paul George. Now, who knows what that deal would have looked like. It was probably a Siaka man and OB and a bunch of picks to keep Kauai and you bring in Paul George. In retrospect, probably worth it to give it a shot and bring the band back together possibly. And imagine that the NBA changes considerably, like Shea doesn't go to LA. Yeah, everything's different. Or sorry, doesn't go to OKC.

They're like, anyway. Exactly. And the Clippers are in a much better position today than they ever were. Paul George is in Philly and he's hurt already. Yeah. All right. Jose Bautista, Roy Halliday, four versus five. That's so hard. But I was thinking about this. If we're just talking about like most valuable, the bat flip is so iconic and Roy Halliday, unfortunately, was a victim of the teams that he played on. Yes.

He just never got to play on a team that had the firepower to make the playoffs or do anything of any kind of significance But the bat flip has been one of the most iconic pictures videos Moments so as much as Roy Halliday is one of the best pitchers of all time I think in Toronto sports and that scene I think I have to say Jose Bautista just based on the bat flip alone. Yeah, I think so too. I go Halliday. I think Halliday like might be the best Jay. I mean, people say Alomar, but like he was like we talked about this yesterday. He was the best pitcher in baseball for like five years. Yeah. And again, it comes down to the definition

of valuable. How valuable can you be if your team isn't in the playoffs? Again, not his fault, but also shouldn't be held against Bautista, where he factored in in 15 and 16. Also most home runs in Jay's history, 54, that one season where he came alive and really revitalized the team after Halliday had left. And a cool story, like he was nothing in Pittsburgh.

Yeah, well that trade was, no one paid any attention to it when they picked it was I think Bautista for future considerations. No one paid attention to it. And all of a sudden he hits 54 home runs and does what he does. But the bat flip alone, playoff performances, I'd go Bautista. Austin Matthews, Vince Carter. No question.

Matthews. Yeah, I don't think Vince should have got through Joe Vinko and I said that yesterday personally but it's not even close. Joe Vinko delivered a champion. Yeah exactly Vince didn't do that. Now Austin hasn't done it either I mean you got to be consistent on that but and even putting bygones aside bygones be bygones Vince was here for three years four years of the you know century Austin's been here for nine like he's going into his tenth year and as great as Carter was he was not as great at his sport as Austin

Matthews has been at his I would not argue you on that but I think people would take the stance that Vince Carter helped put the Raptors on the map a hundred percent he was iconic he put them on the map when no one was paying attention and there's obviously significance to that but I think Austin Matthews performance 60 goals 69 goals heart trophy. Rookie of the year. Yeah that is that is worth more than Vince being an icon on a poster. Yes and he's still here moving into the next 25 years the fact that he arrived and they made the playoffs and they only done

that once in the previous like 14 years or whatever. All right final one this one's tough Kyle Lowry, Matt Sundin. Kyle Lowry or Matt Sundin to wrap up the elite eight of the Toronto Sports Quarter Century bracket challenge most valuable athletes since 2000. That is a tough one man. I'm going Kyle. I'm on Lowry because of the championship. Yeah. Because of the championship and yes he was not the man and Sundin was the man back in the early 2000s. No taking anything away from that. It's a really difficult matchup. There's no taking anything away from Josh Donaldson. He lost too. But Lowry being the longest standing Raptor,

you know, again, representing a new era prior to Kawhi, putting it over the top, but he was a big part of that with him and Demar and Casey and when Messiah arrived. He was like the heartbeat of the team. Yeah, he was the emotional leader. Yeah, it's gotta be Kyle. And he was great in game six in particular.

Remember that closeout game? He was phenomenal at the Oracle. Like he was great in game six in particular. Remember that close out game? He was phenomenal at the Oracle. Like he was great that night. That was like the mic drop game of his career. Yeah, I'm going Matt. Close one. I'm going Matt. You're going Matt?

Yeah, and I just had to look this up. He's the all time leader in Maple Leaf Point. Yes, absolutely. I think for an organization that's been around that long to hold that kind of standing. And goals. Right. Or now. I'm gonna say I'm gonna say mass just based on that okay I can reason with that I'm on Larry but still okay you can vote online at

overdrive 1050 at TSN 1050 radio on Twitter you can find it on Instagram as well okay Jonas you have what do we have here you got on hazy's list hazy's list courtesy of Jonah Siegel. So I wanted to think ahead to the 20, what year is this? 25, 26, Maple Leaf season. And I presenting to you guys my most intriguing Leafs, the five most intriguing Leafs. Okay, starting at five?

Starting at five. You may disagree with this. I have not actually included any of the new Leafs. Mathias Michelli's not on your list. He did not crack the top five. Okay. I'm intrigued because they're making bets on him and Joshua. We'll see how those work. Number five I'm gonna go with Riley. I think it's an interesting time for him. He's I believe he's 31 he'll be 32 I guess next spring. Second year under Craig Borube. It didn't work great, obviously, first year.

I think it should be more comfortable for him this year. He has a partner now. We're not going to be, well, I think, unless he gets traded. But he has someone in Brandon Karlo that we know he's going to play with, we knew he fits with. And I think the way he's been judged in Toronto is really interesting because he is the one guy I guess him and in the under who have had some playoff success individually It hasn't bought him any benefit of the doubt which I think is really interesting His regular seasons have been uneven, but he's always had the playoffs and even last playoff

He was perfect, but he scored four times. Yeah, there's more than a lot of players Yeah, so I'm interested to see what year two under Craig Borubay for him looks like yeah Yeah, the adjustment period being over is gonna help Morgan Riley and I think He like he gets it. He's not one of those guys that yes, he's kind of like, you know, he's not head in the clouds He's not like oblivious to things like he would know he would have a pretty good gauge on where his game is at And with that being said he would probably be the first one to tell you that being a defense first guy Even though he's a defenseman not just not his strength It's not what he's he's good at if you put him in a position to just be up and go and just attack

Then you probably get the best version of him. You have to live with whatever comes with that but I think there will be less resistance well moving forward and I think I realized probably midway through last year I can't stop being me basically and I think that's what he was trying to do he's trying to like rein himself in to play like a Craig Brubay style and that just doesn't work and i think something for the team like he's yeah very two oriented by that way and i think one thing that could help in this year is it will see what happens with anyone else they bring in

he could be back on the point of their first power play unit which has its limitations but it's gonna mean opportunities for him to have more puck touches yeah but i got points to and gain some confidence and i wasn't happening and not feel like he has to defer mean more opportunities for him to have more puck touches. Yeah. Put up more points too. And gain some confidence because that wasn't happening. And not feel like he has to defer to Mitch Marner. Right. Because I would imagine, like I never played the power play with those two guys, but if

you're on the blue line and you look to your left, there's 34. You look to your right, there's 16. You're like- And then there's 88. And you're like, well, I'm not going to take a floating wrist or I'm not going to heat up a one-timer because I got it Like those are the guys that need the touches right? So you're wrestling with that the whole time you're out there There's one I know the power play is gonna look different and Martin is a great powerful player, but there's one

Factor there that's eliminated that you don't feel like you have to defer to there's also, you know been some reporting or speculation Like if they talked to him about his no movement clause you know been some reporting or speculation like if they talked to him about his no movement clause no trade clause that adds to the element of intrigue if you sure don't play well enough does that become more of a pressure tactic for the lease yeah i could see riley being higher on this list actually so you got him at five

who do you have it for i had nines at four and i'd be curious haze like and and frankie as well obviously what you think the ceiling for him is because I think he's a really unique type of player. Like if you try to find, and I did this after he signed, players who kind of score at that rate and also are as physical as he is and also kill penalties

and also are quick and big and play big, there just aren't a lot of guys like that. And so I wonder what the next level for him looks like. Maybe it's similar. Maybe he's like, maybe this is what he is 29, 30 goals, 60 points. I think there's more there. And I think they need more there losing Marner.

Well, and that's, I think the more intriguing element to it all. Like now he's the number two guy on that line where he was clear cut number three. Yeah. Like for the last year, year and a half, it's like, if you the number two guy on that line where he was clear-cut number three yeah like for the last year year and a half it's like if you're playing with Matthews and Marner you know your role go in there crushing bank go to the net you know be prepared to make a play but what he proved throughout last season but I think even more so in the playoffs is he has the ability to to supply a lot of skill like a couple of those breakaway goals he scored the plus were unbelievable.

Like unbelievable hands and instincts and burners, like he said, like he's not flying out there, but he's capable of breaking down a defense with his legs. So, and now that he's been paid, like that's over with, with Marner gone gone like he's your fourth best forward now maybe your third might be your best yeah he's any any problem he has to be he has to follow suit on that I think there's more than 60 points like in in Matthew Nyes his career year when it's all said and done I

have to think he's a 75 point player because of what you guys just talked about but the fact that like he's a force in front player because of what you guys just talked about the but the fact that like he's a force in front of the net and below the net like he is hard to handle he's got good hands he can finish uh... but it will be intriguing to see like there's no mitch marner now so there's no camping out at the at the back door and sniffing around so he's gonna have to be a little more of a self-starter the same way that austin

matthews is okay we'll come back with your top three right the three most intriguing players going into the next season for the Maple Leafs. Overdrive continues. TSN 1050N on TSN 2. The biggest songs in the world. You've heard them countless times. Now, learn the details of how they came to be. Join Ruby Carr for Encore, the stories behind the songs you love new interviews and newly on earth archive footage make for a fascinating weekly deep dive stream on court the stories behind the songs you love on i

heard radio or wherever you get your podcasts i don't know if there's a list here. The five most intriguing Maple Leaf players going into the next season. You have Morgan Riley at five, you had Matthew Nyes at four. Continue your list, who do you have at three? This is where it gets interesting, and this might be a bit controversial,

what I've done for two and three. Number three is Joseph Wall. So this is the year that his contract, his new, I guess it's the contract he signed last summer. Six and three point six, seven million dollar cap it. He had a solid year last year. I think the fact that he played as many games as he did, I think he played 42.

That's about what you're probably expecting from him. Like the results were fine, like not amazing, not great. He ended up being the number two by the time the playoffs come around and then obviously he plays I Wonder like if there's an old world now where he steps into more and like maybe he asserts himself and he takes The number one job. I kind of don't think so I kind of think it's going to be a split between the two of them, but he's being paid more now I think the expectation should continue to go up. It's now, like he still needs to be healthy. That's always gonna be the thing with him

until proven otherwise over a long period of time. But I'm curious to see if there's another level where he can give them 50 games. And like maybe he's, I think he was 909 or 907 last year, which is like just above the average. Is there a world where he can go higher than that? I think there is a world where that can happen. I think if you're wall at a minimum you're looking at this thing that it's open for you to take that opportunity. Like Storrs was very good last year,

it was one year, he's got one year left on his deal. I think it's an even race. Like you show up the camp, if I'm Craig Barube I go to both guys and say you're both going to play, you're both going to be given opportunity. Whoever's better at the camp, if I'm Craig Barube, I go to both guys and say you're both gonna play, you're both gonna be given opportunity. Whoever's better at the end is gonna play for us. Yeah, it's simple. It's pretty much as even of a split as you can get to start the season. We're gonna go back and forth, maybe someone's gonna get another repeat start. If you guys both play well, then you'll force our hand. We'll keep you going and at some point we'll narrow it down. That's great. But if someone fumbles it, it's the other guy can take it and run with it.

Yeah. And that would be Joseph Wall. He's got to stay healthy though. You got to stay healthy the same way that Stolarz does. Well, and I think if you were going, I haven't thought this far ahead, but if you're going to rank like the biggest questions about the team going into next year, obviously like there's Matthews, there's like what happens post-marner. I think goaltending is like, it might be number one because always high on the list. Right. It's always going to be high. But with this particular tandem, it's like the goaltending was really good last year. Can it be that good again? Are they going to be as good? Like defensively, they

weren't as good as I think the perception is what happens now when you lose Marner you bring in some different types of players Maybe not as good defensively maybe like different types of players can the goaltending be as good which is why? Number two is Anthony stole you guys stole us at two and I think it's interesting for a lot of different reasons one It's a contract here. He can be a unrestricted free agent next summer This was the idea signed to two years two and a half million dollar cap it. Good value. Didn't play a ton last year. I think 30 odd games, 33. 34. 34. Like it's not a lot. I don't know what to expect in terms of how many games he plays next year. I would probably guess 30 to 40, like max 40. Yeah. but he was the number

one by the time the playoffs came around and he had earned it like he pulled away from Joseph Wall and like the stakes now are higher for him with the contract and like they need him to be as good as he was last year and it's gonna be really hard to be that good again because he was basically it's a small sample size but one of the best goals in the school is only that's what he was basically, it's a small sample size, but one of the best goals in the league. That's what he was. He was phenomenal. His main percentage was unbelievable.

926. Here's why I'm not as concerned about the goal-tining maybe as you guys, because even if you think Stolarz is pulling back a bit, like he's a 914, 915, that's still really good. And if Wall jumps up from 909 to that range, you're still in pretty good shape with both guys. I think health, I'm not worried about performance, I'm more worried about health with both of those guys, even if Stolarz doesn't have the repeat

kind of performance. Okay Morgan Reilly at five, Matthew Nizet at four, Joseph Wall at three, Anthony Stolarz at two. Who do you have as number one? I think you can guess who number one is. But Austen Matthews? It's Matthews. And I think we've talked a lot about it and about our expectations. I think we're all in agreement he's gonna have a better year than he had last year. But the health question like until we know and until he knows and until we see it, you can see it with him when he's right. Like when he's powering through the middle of the ice with speed and like powering he's got the puck. You can even see in his stick handling it's really tight and like controlled.

There's ferocity to it. There's ferocity to it. And it's like a- It's McKinnon light sometimes when he's really chugging. You know, McKinnon is like, he's angry at the puck and he's angry at the ice. It's not like that for Matthews, but it has a little bit of that. When he's coming through the middle, it's kind of like that too. It's not as fast, it's not as powerful, but they, he has to be back to a heart contender. Yeah. Top 10 player in

the league. They just can't afford it. Like they're not, they're not going to be good enough. Yeah. Like, and I, and one of the guys, and maybe we can talk about this later, they don't have as many guys who like, you're sure are going to give them 20 goals. It's like for sure I know Matthews, Nylander, Nyes, Taveras. After that like maybe McMahon, I don't know, and then it's like is there anyone else is going to score 20? I don't really know. I don't know. So they really need him to be back to what he can be. Yes I think that's reasonable. I think Matthews have won considering the season he had Marner leaving You know how he looks with Barube in year two There's a lot that is going to go into his upcoming season like he's always talked about anyway more so than any other athlete in The city, but I think it's gonna go to a new level next year

Like I think he might be facing even more especially in the playoffs Yes next year. Like I think he might be facing even more. Especially in the playoffs. Yes, as it should be. Sure. And, and if his health flares up, he gets to camp and something's not feeling right, all hell is going to break loose here. Final hour coming up, Overdrive continues, TSN 1050 and on TSN 2.

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