OverDrive - OverDrive - July 3, 2025 - Hour 2

Episode Date: July 3, 2025

Join Aaron Korolnek and Dave Feschuk for Hour 2 on OverDrive! TSN Hockey Analyst Mike Johnson joins to discuss Nikolaj Ehlers signing with the Hurricanes, Connor Bedard's potential contract with the Blackhawks and Connor McDavid's impending deal in Edmonton. In the latest edition of AK's List, Korolnek lists the most polarizing athletes in Toronto sports.

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The station that champions Canadian music. Loud, proud, and all yours. No passports required. Just press play. Tap into Made in Canada now on iHeartRadio.ca or the free iHeartRadio app. It's hour two of Overdrive. We are brought to you by FanDuel, bringing you everything from the opening line to the final score. I'm Aaron Kharulnik, that's Dave Festrack from the Toronto Star. You're watching on TSN2, TSN 1050, and on TSN's youtube channel until seven o'clock

love mike johnson join us about five minutes big news in the nch l the neck eeler sweepstakes dave are over he signs with carolina a six-year deal worth eight point five million dollars so we're going to use thoughts on that i can ask him to about what connor bidart could be looking for in his next deal because chicago chicago Blackhawks GM Kyle Davidson came out and said there are extension talks

and Bedard's been in the mid 60s with regards to his point production. A lot of people thought he would come in and just tear up the NHL, which has not been the case at all in Chicago. Well, what would you be comfortable with if you were Chicago for Bedard? I mean, it's such a tough negotiation because you're right, like he hasn't

overwhelmed anybody. 61 points in his rookie year, 22 goals, 23 goals and 67 points last year. Those aren't the numbers we expected from the kid that dominated the World Juniors and was the consensus number one pick, right? On the other hand, if you're kind of making the case for why those numbers are the way they are he's been playing on a terrible team but not particularly you know eye-popping teammates and so maybe it's to be expected that the numbers have been off the charts because he just hasn't been in the environment that would read those types of numbers that maybe we would expect so we'll get to that with MJ when he joins us coming up

here in a moment but we finally heard missayu Jiri speak to the media nearly a week after being relieved of his duties as vice chairman and president of the Toronto Raptors. And he was on Good Morning America talking about Giants of Africa, a charity that he is extremely passionate about. Everybody in Toronto knows how passionate Masayu is for the Giants of Africa and he's the founder and he does a ton of incredible things for that organization and he was asked at the end of the interview about his time in Toronto and here's how he answered it. It's been 12 incredible years incredible years with the Toronto Raptors and I'm so grateful and thankful for the opportunity. Fans, my family, colleagues, coaches, players, the owners, everybody has been

they've been incredible to me and Toronto, I love you Toronto. I love you Toronto. And it's a great part, great journey in my life and it's time, you know, and great things come to an end. Very diplomatic was Masai Ujiri. And I wouldn't expect him to come out and just start tearing people apart. I don't think he was happy about being relieved of his duties

in Toronto. Obviously no one is when it ends, but I think when you're a guy like Masai who has, I'm sure, something lined up in the not too distant future and there's speculation about Atlanta perhaps being a destination. Also they have two new NBA teams coming into the league in the next couple of years, so Masai could very well wait to run one of those, but were you surprised at all the way that Miss I answered the question, or is that pretty much par for the course? Well, I mean, I'm a little bit surprised by the venue.

I mean, kind of big-timing Toronto a little bit by going on good morning America. I sit down with the Toronto Star call, Miss, would it be a good idea? I mean, hey, I was... Were you trying to make that happen? I was hoping, I was hoping, but you know, and we also did hear, if I'm, hey, I was open. I was open. But, you know, and we also did hear,

if I'm not mistaken, AKA, from the CEO of Maple Leaf Sports Entertainment, Keith Pelly, that Messiah was going to be speaking. You know, that's what Keith inferred in his. Was that him speaking? Is that what he was talking about? No, it's not what he was talking about. I wouldn't think so, no.

He was talking about a press conference in Toronto in MLSC headquarters, or thereabouts, I would assume. And I wonder if maybe that's not going to happen. Why would it? Because if you point out, there's lots of gratitude and there's many good memories, but I'm not sure there's a lot of good feelings in the moment about how it all went down. Yeah, and I think there's still a lot of questions surrounding how it all went down and why it went down.

I mean, this is a team that seems to be pointed in the right direction. Of course, it's been an ugly couple years for this Raptors team, but they just went out and spent a bunch of money on Pertle, and they're spending a bunch of money on their roster, and it looks like they've got a chance to be a playoff team next year if this stars the line.

And I think it's pretty clear what the true story is. It's a financial decision made by the new owners of MLSE and Rogers Communications. They don't want to pay Misai Ujiri who's making I would imagine as much money if not more than any other executive in the NBA, right? Yeah, he's for sure by a lot of measures the highest paid executive. I mean you can count Greg Popovich as an executive because he's a coach and well before he retired from coaching he was a coach and an executive kind of in the same title but yeah he's right up there in the upper echelon. Yeah and deservedly so. Yeah. He brought an NBA championship to Toronto and was

rewarded handsomely for that and it's been an ugly couple years for the Raptors. I don't know how much of the shine has worn off on Masai Ujiri. I wouldn't think much. I would think he'd be highly sought after by other organizations around the NBA. But I guess MLSC, Keith Peli didn't see it the same way and they're looking for a new president and we'll have to wait and find out who that is. We know they have a search group but CAA is... CAA executive search. CAA executive search is looking for a new president for the Raptors and I don't know

who it'll be but I mean they've made their big offseason moves I would think unless there's some kind of trade that's going on. They got resigning Pertle was the move that they made and I don't really know what else they could be doing but I'm sure they're exploring any and all options when it comes to improving their roster. They already have. Yeah well CAA runs the Knicks essentially and it took them a long and winding road to find a new coach. So let's hope the MLSC Raptors president search goes a little better for CAA.

I would look at Mike Johnson personally as a strong candidate for the Raptors presidency, but that would mean we would lose him here at TSN. So I do not support that. Mike Johnson is on the line, the Maple Toyota hotline. I would guess from the dock up in Muskoka. MJ how we doing? I am well listening. For you AK I would be the president and continue to do my hits with you every week. Really? Wow. That's what I'm willing to do put my hat in the ring for the Raptors presidency. I can make it happen. I have a great vision for how they should play the basketball club. Yes, I wouldn't doubt that for a second.

What did your vision tell you, Mike, about Nick Ehlers? Did you see him landing in Carolina and for the money he ultimately received, which is a six year deal, $8.5 million a season. That announced about an hour ago. So it seemed like all signs pointed to him going to Carolina. That's what the chatter was on July 1. It seemed like he wanted to play for a good team.

Check. Seemed like he wanted to get a good contract. Check. And he wanted to play in a place that was pretty low profile away from the rink. And I guess Carolina is that as well. And we can ask, oh, he played in Carolina, but even Winnipeg, which is a smaller town, but certainly the Jets are extremely popular there,

was maybe a little bit too much limelight for him. So for whatever reason, personality-wise, he wanted to get away from that sort of idea that would prevent him from going to the Rangers or the Flyers or the Leafs or somewhere like that. So Carolina made sense. But my question is, AK. You're Nick Ealers you are Far in a way the best player in this pre-agent class after martyr time with Vegas. Why just six years?

Where's the seventh year? I I guess that part maybe he doesn't care. Maybe he wants flexibility I would have thought given the demand for his services, that salary seems about right. You know, he's a better offensive player than Brock Bester who should get paid a million dollars more than Brock Bester or whatever it is. But I'm surprised he didn't get a seventh year because that seems like, you know,

leaving eight and a half million dollars on the table, you might only make three or four by that point in your career when you resign that next year. So that part surprised me a little bit. Yeah, no, interesting point, MJ, for sure. Now, if you look at the competitive balance of the Eastern Conference here, MJ, this Carolina Hurricane team has been to two of the past three Eastern Finals, and they've been among the best teams in the regular season for a long time now under Rod Bridenmore but they haven't been able to get over the hump and especially this year where they were really outclassed by the Panthers. Do you think what the what the hurricanes have done here in the offseason headlined by the Ehlers signing and obviously getting Keandre Miller on the back end in another

big deal. Do you like any of that in terms of making their case to be unseating the Panthers any better? I like their team. Do I think they are demonstrably better than last year? They probably are. They probably are a little bit better. They needed an offensive weapon. They got a really good one.

And last year, Brad Burns wasn't quite the same player. He's been in the past and Orlov also on the back end. So maybe a Kay Andre Miller replacing some version of those guys makes them a bit better. I don't think fast that they are in Florida's league right now, just yet if I, if you had to handicap it. But if you had to look at the Metro right now today and Darren see that one

team would make the playoffs from that group you'd pick Carolina for sure you know like you a hundred percent you the Devils will probably be pretty good you'd think and you know Washington you know they have quite the same year probably not the one team you will say confidently in the regular season is likely to get home ice likely to probably even win the division. Is Carolina, you know, the same sort of questions a lot like Toronto will come up during the playoffs because they haven't gotten over the hump.

They've gotten further more often than the Leafs certainly have, but they haven't gotten that last one. But I still like their team as one of the better teams in the league. Certainly one of the best teams in the East. And you know, if they run into Florida in the third round, I would pick Florida to win if Florida was healthy, but that's probably the case for every team in the Eastern Conference.

Mike Johnson, our guest here on Hour Two of Overdrive. The Chicago Blackhawks have opened extension talks with Connor Bedard per General Manager Kyle Davidson. And Feshek and I were trying to figure out what that deal is going to look like. He's 19 years old, had two 60 plus point seasons. How do you come to a number if you're Bedard's agent and Kyle Davidson, Mike?

So I guess what Davidson is saying is like, listen, we obviously want to extend him for as long as possible. We're going to pitch you on eight years, which you probably won't be able to get after next summer because of the new CBA kicking in. So we'll get to that eighth year. We and David think quietly would be saying, well, maybe we'll buy some years coming off good seasons, but not great. Not for the club and not necessarily for Connor Bed Badaard where he wasn't you know as Dominant in year two as maybe people thought he might be

So if you can get him on a deal that becomes a pretty good value deal in short order if he hits his potential And if he hits his ceiling which you know is 40 goals and 90 or 100 points if he does that then all of a sudden You got him at eight or nine million dollars. That's this field with the cap going where it is If you're Badaards agent, this is the problem, AK. I got two issues. One, I know that as well, that my guy, under different circumstance, could get way more points and look way better than he has, so I don't wanna give him too much of a discount.

I want him to get paid like a top off as a player, even if he hasn't produced it like one yet. And the other thing is, well, yes, eight years is amazing. I am, me personally, I'm not one to ever scoff at somebody saying, I'll take the $80 million. Does he wanna commit added potential UFA years to Chicago? That team feels like they're not very good still, right? Like it feels like they're just, you know,

they're not gonna be very good. They're just gonna hope that all their draft picks and their prospects Maybe just turn into star players at the same time, but they haven't really taken strides They don't think to get significantly better than even they were last year So can you get him to commit if I'm but ours Asian? I didn't have to have a conversation with Connor Bidart about you know Do you want to lock yourself in until you're until you're 28, 29 years old with Chicago or do you want to wait till you're 25 see where they're at, see where you're at, you're still gonna be a great player

and get lots of money but maybe you want to get it somewhere else? That's the issue for me. If Chicago can get them for eight years that would be that would be a coup for the Blackhawks. Yeah I don't know how like if I'm Bedard there's no way I'm going eight years after this. I can't think so right I don't know how like if I'm Bidard, there's no way I'm going eight years after this. I can't think so, right? There's just no way and I'm not even sure I would negotiate anything this summer either. I mean there's no rush. You don't have to do it this summer. Yeah, but AK, look at their team. If you're Bidard, if you're being honest, like okay, you're going to get better. You look at that team. They didn't do anything. Anything in the offseason, nothing.

Right. Is the infrastructure going to be so much stronger that I'll look better I won't be minus 35. I'll have a ton of support We'll have a fuck a lot like do you add a 90-point season for him? Not because he can't do it But maybe because the team around him isn't putting him in the right spots to be able to do it So whether you wait it now or next year, I'm looking at the team saying So whether you wait it now or next year, I'm looking at the team saying, no, we have been told no turnovers. So whatever they think of you and your potential now, they'll think of it again.

And in fact, if you do a third year, let's say to the two of you, Boudard goes for 33 goals and gets 74 points next year. Would you be super impressed by that by Connor Boudard? Or would it be like, I eh, it's not bad, but it's not what we think he can do. So yeah, right, so he kind of would be underwhelmed by that. So where's the impetus for him to not do it now, to whatever the extension might be,

whether it's three years, four years, two years, whatever it is, because I don't see him blowing the roof off it next year, largely because the team once again will not be that competitive. The MJ been a couple days now since Mitch Marder lands in Vegas and the Leafs are kind of left trying to fill the big hole on their wing. If the season had to start today, you just looked at what they've done so far

getting back Nick Waa in the in the deal with The Golden Knights bringing in Matthias Michelli as a playmaking player How would you feel about it like did like how much more does tree-living have to do to make you feel at ease? Or at least you know feel better about you know them being a you know feel better about you know them being a you know an equivalent and hopefully slightly better team going into next season he's got to do a little bit more obviously he's acknowledged that there is a top six forward missing

and for all the DNA discussion there hasn't been there's been a massive or minute removal but there hasn't been a real injection of anything different than what was there Previously respectful to Michelle Ian wall like they're not gonna come in and shake up the room And this is gonna we're doing it different here boys. So Yeah, I mean I think I Think it was always gonna be really tough to Face what the least were facing this summer, which was the departure of Marner the contract of Marner,

the contract with Tavares and Knives, and this desire to significantly alter the way the team looks and feels. To do all that in six weeks, eight weeks, whatever it was, and they did a good job with the contracts, Marner left, they haven't necessarily filled his void, and they haven't necessarily changed the DNA, they will probably work through that through time. But I guess what you're hoping for is one good health from both goalies will

help you a second year under Craig Barube will help you. And maybe most importantly, I can't overstate this. Like the, and maybe there's a problem in the pressure. St. Matthew's to be one of the top four players in NHL next year. He's paid like it. He's talented enough to be that. And he has to do it without his running mate, Mitch Marner. You want to know where the new office is coming from, where are they going to make up the goals? That's the guy. There has to be 20 to 30 more goals off Austin Matthews stick next year. And if that's the case

then you know you can have that conversation as the year goes on what else you need but the Leafs should be in really good shape you know spotlight will shine on him he's the captain as it should he's gonna have to be really good for the Leafs to absorb the changes and the departure of Mitch Marner. Mike Johnson our guest with Ehlers off the and jay press we look at it is some of the contract extensions that can now be offered by and a child teams names like jack i call capri saw in minnesota kyle connor in winnipeg are temi paneran

in new york of course connor mcdavid would fall into that camp as well how soon if at all are you expecting some of those decisions to come down and in new york of course connor mcdavid would fall into that camp as well how soon if at all you expecting some of those decisions to come down and what's the number you think that would surprise us the most with any of those guys i mean i would imagine for any of those clubs and you just mentioned some of the most important players and every one of their teams would be desperate to extend those guys

desperate often not hopeful, desperate. And I think the one that might surprise us is Kaprizov in Minnesota. Because before he was hurt last year, he was playing at an MVP level. There is no player, maybe not even Connor McDavid, who means more to his team offensively

than Kaprizov does, right? Like, you know, he's got Boldy there, but he doesn't have Drisdell there. And Minnesota has been in cap purgatory because of the buyouts of Farise and Suter, which are finally over. So they have all this extra money with the cap going up. And Minnesota is a great passionate hockey market,

but maybe not the biggest bustling metropolis if you wanted that kind of thing, like aeran when he left Columbus for New York and If Capri's off wanted a New York a Toronto of South Florida and LA He could get a ton of money there So I almost think there might be a bit of Minnesota tax on top of his contract. It wouldn't surprise me if he becomes when he signs his the highest paid player in the league and maybe even by a bit of a margin over top of dry settle. Until McDavid signs his extension, it would not surprise me if he pushes 15 or more for

Capri's off when he gets his deal done for all the reasons I just sort of outlined. That's an interesting one, MJ. Now, AK and I were having this conversation yesterday about McDavid. Like, obviously, it makes a lot of sense to take an eight-year deal for security and for any number of reasons to help lower your AAV and being a teammate.

But if you were being cutthroat, like an NBA guy, you know, if you're, we're talking about you running the Raptors, if you're running Connor McDavid's career with an NBA lens and you say, you're ready we're talking about you running the raptors if if if if you're running conor mcdavid's career with an nba lens and you say you're the lebron of this league you should take a shorter term deal a because you can get a you know you can get a really good deal and b you can keep pressure on management to make sure they build the roster around you that you need to win your cup. Is there anything to that in your mind?

For sure. And the NBA example is, I guess, an obvious one. And the NBA players are more willing to go short term, more willing to switch teams. If I'm Connor McDavid and you want to go down that road, and it makes a lot of sense because the money's going to heath. there's not as much risk other than catastrophic injury for him to not be the best player in two years, right? It's not like he's coming off a hot year and like, oh, you gotta get it now because what if you don't score a hundred points?

Like he's going to, no matter what, dry settle is gonna be there, he's going to. If I'm his representative, could you walk in and say, all right, we'll give you an extension, two years, 32 million. Right. That's what you get. Job's going up, percentage of the cap is still a very manageable and appropriate number, and we're gonna put it on you for two more years

to make sure he's got a great team around him. And we're being fair, and he produces every year, he brings it every year, he's the best player every year. You gotta bring it in the off season. You gotta put together a team. That is your job as management to put together a team that is capable of winning Stanley Cups and all the pieces without my guy taking a massive discount.

That's not his responsibility. It's your responsibility to figure out around him who you're gonna give you then. That would be what, fear entry level deal, eight year extension, two year extension. That's 13 years of his career he's gonna give you. That's more than enough time and plenty of loyalty from him. Who are you 32?

Make it happen. If we're good, you get to have him for seven years after that. Yeah, I love it, MJ. Makes a lot of sense to me. That's a man that could be a president of an MJ. Makes a lot of sense to me. That's a man that could be a president of an organization. I should be an agent. I love that. I love that pitch. That was a very good pitch. Mike, great stuff. The best part about it guys though, is Edmonton can't say anything about it. What's that mean? They can't say no.

We prefer you go longer. We prefer you have less money. McDavid calls the shots. You could prefer to watch me walk next summer. Yeah. You're basically beholden to his good graces to not do anything you don't want him to do because if you wanted to you're going to do it anyways. Mike thank you for doing this. Can you take us through what's going on up at the cottage tonight? Campfire, barbecue, fill us in.

I'm here. It is quiet. The waves are rustling. I literally set my alarm for 455 because I had a little nap in the Muskoka room with the breeze rolling through and the sun will set, I will watch it go down, I got me and my dog and it is blissfully quiet with nothing going on. It's amazing. That sounds very nice. Sounds good.

Yeah, we're here at TSN. It's really clean in the studio here, so. Well, I was watching you as I, before I, with Wit, Yeah. Before I drifted off, so I was watching. All right, we appreciate that. Yeah, well once Wimbledon coverage wrapped up, which you know I'm always into, and then, yeah, this is it.

Like, this is me for the next two and a half months, basically, just kind of chilling and relaxing and recharging for next fall, which will be here, sadly almost, that's before we know it. That's good living. Coleacoe is making his way up north, I've heard, so the blissful quiet is about to end. You'll be hearing, bang! Very soon, so get ready for it. Tom, we don't bring fishing rods to the golf course.

No, well, you might see it on Tuesday. Thank you, Mike. All right, boys, have a great week. That's Mike Johnson, TSN hockey analyst. Yeah, I used to have a cottage. My parents used to have a cottage, and I remember the conversation that my dad had with me and my brother were talking about,

and he's like, would you want to help me keep it going you know contribute more to the upkeep and my brother and I were like yeah you should just sell it and he did and now immense regrets from both of us. You dummies. Yeah we are very stupid people that will surprise nobody. Yeah. The Kronix, the kids not very smart. Were you afraid of a little manual labor? Apparently, listen, I don't know what was going through my mind at the time, but it clearly was not very well thought out because having a cottage, man, I mean, I'm never, now I'm never going to own another one, so it's over.

Yeah. Unless I marry into one. Hello ladies. There you go. Good idea. I like that strategy. Use the national TV platform. Any girls with cottages out there?

Yeah. Interested in a date. Yes I'd be nice. Hems will be flooded. Yeah, I would highly highly doubt that but you never know They will be flooded after I reveal a case list. That's for sure a case list on the other side The most polarizing Toronto athletes in history This is my version of it and there's a lot of guys that you could pick on You know a very illustrious Seasoned gamer or just video game curious? This Week in Gaming is the podcast for you. We break down the latest in the world of video games, from basics to beyond. The hottest gaming news, insight and industry leaders and more, weekly.

Join me, Naomi Kyle, and stay ahead of the game with all the latest updates. Even if you're a total newbie. Stream This Week in Gaming on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. YouTube channels or just channel I don't believe we have multiple yet. Bar Down is its own YouTube channel which I watch very frequently. There's two. There's two. There's two. Maybe First Up can be on Bar Down's YouTube channel. Would they accept us?

But why doesn't First Up just start their own YouTube channel? We could do that too. We're very resourceful in the morning. Although you guys really don't do video much. Yeah, there's some stuff that goes on behind the scenes on morning radio that the audience should not want to be privy to. Let's just put it that way. Shirtless Cole Acavo, number one. Does he show up? No, he doesn't. He doesn't. He doesn't. I have done it. Because you have the internal zoom. Yes, internal zoom. You've been a part of the show. Yeah, it's always fun. The internal zoom reveals all kinds of interesting tidbits

about the co-host. Yes, there's some stuff that goes on that probably isn't best to discuss on national television. Maybe you put that on YouTube, but you might have a show. Could be. Here's one thing we're putting on YouTube today. AK's List. Of course, everyone knows Hayes' List. Is that what it's called?

Hayes' List? Hayes' List. Hayes' List. This is AK's List. And today we're discussing the most polarizing athletes to come from a Toronto team. And this, of course, in lieu of Mitch Marner's departure. He is on the list people. He is highly ranking on said list.

But we're gonna start at number five on AK's list. And I wanted to include a Toronto Argonaut on this list. It is not Rocket Ishmael, who I think could have very well been on this list. In fact, it is Ricky Williams. Remember him, The cannabis loving Ricky Williams who was suspended for the entire 2006 NFL season. The Argos acquires rights. They give him a one year deal at big money, $340,000 to play with the Toronto Argonauts.

All those number 27 jerseys, Dave. Oh yeah. Joe Theismann, Argo's legend, said this back in 2006 upon Ricky Williams signing. He said that he was disgraced to be associated with a team that would knowingly sign an addict such as Williams. Joe Theismann was talking about weed, how far we've come as a society in the nearly 20 years since, but it was a very controversial signing and frankly it was a bust. Some of it had to do with injuries and some of it had to do with the reality that those coming over from the NFL think it's a joke. Ah, the CFL, I'll just come

over and dominate and Ricky Williams learned the hard way that that is not the case and he did go back to the NFL, got suspended a bunch more times for smoking weed, and that was the end. But those 27 jerseys, number 27 jerseys for the Toronto Argonauts and Ricky Williams, they still live. You go down to BMO Field tomorrow night and I'm heading down to the Argos and the Ticats,

you will see Ricky Williams jerseys because at the time, that was the biggest story in Toronto sports. And it was pretty underwhelming when it was all said and done. Oh, it was incredibly underwhelming. And Pinball Clemens went to the wall talking about how they needed to give players a second chance even though he was suspended.

There were a lot of people, Joe Theismann among them, saying it was incredibly hypocritical to take a guy who was suspended in one league and let him play in your league. But in the end to your point like that was polarizing and there was a lot of arguments at the time I remember well but the bottom line was the arguments kind of fell on deaf ears in the end because there was no argument about the really important thing was that he wasn't very good in the south. No he wasn't he cut he was coming off some awesome seasons with Miami and

he just never really had it again. They got hurt. The wheels could fall off really quick as they're running back and we learned that with Ricky Williams and they also created a new rule in the CFL that if you're suspending the NFL it's not as seamless as just coming over and signing with the CFL. There's a whole procedure. We saw it with like Johnny Manziel in the years to come. So that's number five. Number four, a man who you covered extensively with the Toronto Raptors is Chris Bosch. And I think the way that it went down back in 2010, Bosch leaving Toronto for Miami, joining Wade and LeBron and the tweet, you remember the tweet from Chris Bosch that really drew the ire of the Toronto sports fan. Bosch had an amazing final season with the Raptors. 24 points a game, 11 rebounds, top 10 in both

categories. That team was trash aside from Chris Bosch. It was him and Marco Bellinelli and Sonny Weems and Hayto Turculew, not an impressive collection. Bosch held his end of the bargain. But the tweet, should I stay or should I go? Bosch held his end of the bargain but the tweet should I stay or should I go Bosch wrote that on Twitter in 2010 which is a long time ago no one crazy and that was not well received and there was definitely some vitriol in his direction but as Raptors fans tend to do they forgive they forget very easily and we'll get to Vince Carter a little bit later what do you remember about the end of the Bosch era, Dave?

Yeah, it was really disappointing, obviously, because there was some reasons for hope there in the Bosch era. You know, Brian Colangelo brought in a lot of those European guys, the Garba hoses and the Garba hoses of the world, Anthony Parker coming over from the Israeli league to play for the Raptors

They had that one season where they won the Atlantic With Basha's the centerpiece of the team and TJ Ford obviously was a really promising player back in those days And then it all just kind of it was just anti climactic like they couldn't kind of repeat it and they had some really tough years Really didn't you know they didn't make the playoffs there for a handful of years including his last year and then he complained you know there was there was complaints about Toronto. Stuff afterwards that's the one thing that Toronto sports fan hates more than anything complaining about Toronto about Canada about customs there was stuff that aren't American. I remember covering the Heat's first game with those three guys or was one of their

first games and he'd Complained about his cable package at Toronto people did not like that not being very good too much curling and blah blah blah It's like you never have enough Vic router. Come on. Come on before get it together I mean, yes So I thought that was a little beneath Chris Bosh at the time and kind of shallow stuff for a guy who's very deep I mean, yes, is a very thoughtful guy. He worked with us here at TSN during the NBA Finals when him and Duthie, James Duthie, best friends. I think they still talk all the time. Probably not. I bet. Probably not. No, but Chris Bush was, you know, he was an incredibly interesting

guy to talk to. You know, he was always, you know, we'd have a book in his locker. You could ask him about what he was reading, and he was incredibly tapped into stuff well beyond basketball, but that doesn't change the fact that he ticked off a lot of people in the way he exited, not unlike the way LeBron ticked off a lot of people in the way he exited Cleveland, not as dramatic, he didn't make it a big TV show or anything, but he did put it on social media to not particularly

beloved effect in Toronto, and I understand why. Let's look to number three on the most polarizing athletes in Toronto sports history and I was considering going with Phil Kessel here Dave I opted to go with a guy who was viewed as his sidekick in many respects and that is Dion Faneuf the former captain of the Toronto Maple East we remember how it went down the trade Brian Burke brings him over from the flames on that January night. Still remember waking up and seeing that deal on TSN.ca and being exceptionally excited for what was to come. And Vanuff was a good player with the Leafs. He was named the captain in the summertime following the trade, succeeding Matt Sundeen, which is no small feat and no small role,

he just was miscast for all those years. Got a big ticket, did Dion Faneuf, eventually traded to Ottawa, but he was a guy who was probably more of a three-four, who was paid as a one or a two and just wasn't able to live up to the lofty expectations. He, in many respects, set for himself in the early part of his career with the Flames, where he was a beast. He was scoring a ton of goals. He was hitting like a

freight train, which he did in Toronto. We should give him credit for that, but he just wasn't able to sustain that type of play as a Maple Leaf. And I think he and Kessel had their fair share of success, no doubt, but maybe miscast as the centerpieces of a franchise. Yeah, that's a great way to put it. I think you know they were polarizing they did take a lot of the heat that those teams a lot of those teams got thrown at the loot gate we all remember that I was going to say that that really you know D look Dion did a really good job at times trying to you know sort of maybe overachieve like I don't he probably wasn't captain material you know in the ideal situation

He definitely wasn't number one defensive material. That's not a knock on him That's just like in the grand scheme of the league at the time There were better guys in those roles right by far and so Brian Burke, you know I think made a mistake in making him captain too soon Made him obviously didn't have the team to avoid him being the number one defenseman because that's all they had and then And so they got so that's not really on the players salute gates on the players because that was about The players getting tired of the criticism from the fans tired of being booed occasionally tired of the whatever it was

there was there was various signs of displeasure from the Maple Leaf fan base at the time and you know to do what they did and then to sort of deny it was so they did that was ready to be in the Shannon Planner right Shanahan had just shown up and he was sort of watching it all I think that that among other episodes was one of the reasons why Shanahan ended up making wholesale changes and you know for all Phil Kessels talent and we know he was a talented enough got to be a you know for all Phil Kessels talent and we know he was a Talented enough got to be a you know a regular player a third-liner on a Stanley Cup winning team Shanahan just decided he didn't want that influence around here is the way I interpreted

Either from Faneuil or from Kessel. So that's one era of the Toronto Maple Leafs We'll be looking at today in a case list Let's look to another in number two on the list and it's a recent one and it's Mitch Marner who just this past week departed Toronto for the Vegas Golden Knights and I think when we consider the preponderance of the evidence with Mitch Marner this will go down as almost a tragic situation and that everything was set up for Mitch Marner to go down as one of the great icons in the history of the Toronto Maple Leaf. Toronto Kid was playing in London in the O, was drafted to the Leafs and everything just seemed to be on a silver

platter for this guy to be as beloved a player as his franchise has ever had and it just didn't go right for him. All the playoff failures and he's not alone in that. And of course we know what he documented himself, the chronology of events that led to his departure. A couple years ago, trade rumors, the Leafs could have traded him then. We know they were looking to move him potentially before the trade deadline as well. We know they were looking to sign him, but Mitch Marner just didn't want to be a Toronto Maple Leaf anymore. That ship had sailed. And it's a sad story.

And it's a what if story as well. What if they were able to break through just one time collectively. But it never happened. It never will happen, obviously. And there's a new era of Maple Leaf hockey. And now we look at his legacy. And I think it's pretty obvious who number one is. And there are comparisons

which I don't believe are apt at all between Marner and Carter who we'll get to in just a second but the debates will rage and when Vegas comes to town in this NHL season that will be some fun radio to do because there will be a lot of yelling and a lot of screaming about Mitch Marner the past, the present, and the future, and I can't wait. You know what, AK, that's a great summation of the Mitch Marner story arc here in Toronto, and of course the story hasn't ended, but I've been talking to so many people about this in the last week or so, and the one thing that stood out to me, I was talking to an

agent in the game, and he said, the thing these guys didn't realize in this Shana plan era is that the bar was so low. People weren't asking for a dynasty. They weren't even asking for a champion, although it would be, it would be nice if the Leafs could win one, you know, you know, when since the league has expanded from six teams into, you know, soon to be 34. But the bar was low, like to your point, one run, one really good run to a cup final and coming close to winning it probably would have changed everything. Right.

It probably would have changed the way everybody looked at these guys, changed the way these guys were dealt with in terms of their long-term futures here. And they couldn't even give them that. Like they couldn't even get that done and and that's to me a big part of the really sad if only part of this story is that if only they had one run in them everything could have changed they couldn't even give you that well if anyone can prove that a fan base's perception of a player can change it is number one on the list

and it's an easy one. It's Vince Carter by a mile. I don't even think anyone's close when it comes to the polarizing discussions that a fan base has even today where I think you and I are very much aligned. I am NOT a fan of Vince Carter. I remember 2004 very well, how it all went down. I know you were covering the team at the time, you remember it very well. Some people can forgive and forget and I'm just not one of them. I'm a really, I don't know, petulant individual, I suppose, in that respect. No, you just, you got standards.

Well, I do and I always thought that the concept of retiring as Jersey was an abhorrent one and I still maintain that to be the case. At this point in time, what are you going to do? The number's up there and you just have to accept it. Don't agree with it, but there's also a large part of Raptors fans who are over it and choose to look back at the positives that Vince Carter contributed, which are fair. I mean, the contributions to the growth of the sport, the growth of the Raptors brand are undeniable. The dunk contest, the incredible highlights that we were privy to for a short period of time,

it was incredible, but in my opinion, they do not outweigh everything else that came with it. The writhing in pain on the ground, the quitting on the Raptors, which is what happened at the end. That was real. And it was real and it's undeniable the 15 a game he was averaging with the Raptors, turned to 27 with New Jersey. What happened? Remember he told averaging with the Raptors, turned to 27 with New Jersey. What happened? Remember he told John Thompson in that interview, well, I just didn't really give it my all.

And as an athlete, there is no lower thing you can do than admit you didn't give it your all. That's what Vince Carter did with Toronto. I haven't forgiven him. A lot of people have. That's totally fine if you want to do that, but he is a clear number one on the most polarizing athletes in the history of Toronto sports. Yeah, it's an amazing polarization, AK, because there's guys like you and me who sit here and go, no, you retire a number for the player you were, not for the man you became.

Vince is a very good man, he's a good analyst, everybody likes Vince. That's not the point. The point was the stuff you laid out his actions as a Raptor were disgusting and as much as oh he put us on the map he actively tried to wipe you off the map and he actually kind of succeeded for quite a few years decade until DeRosa and Lowry were doing their thing and I guess the early parts of the Masai Ujiri era in 13 14 15 franchise was a joke around the NBA. And a lot of that was on the departure of Vince Carter.

And look, the mismanagement of Vince Carter was also very real. The guys running this franchise at the time were not particularly adept at NBA team running. But look, I mean, ultimately, it's an amazing debate to me that people can be so far apart on how they feel about this. There are people who will, people who've tried to get at me physically.

Because, oh yeah, I've had a few of those in, I mean, not anything really crazy, but people that get really agitated when you make the points that we're making here because they just love the guy and loves love and affection, especially when it's from your childhood I think a lot of people that make these arguments were kids so young people when Vince was in his prime and he was a dunk contest winner and he's almost like a cartoon character of

A player and they just have this incredible attachment that you and you can't speak ill of the man or they get really upset Well, and I think that's another reason again. I'm in my mid thirties when Vince Carter was in his prime drafted in 98. We like, I remember it so vividly because that's like the formative years of me being a sports fan in Toronto and I loved Vince Carter, like more so than any other athlete in history, Vince Carter was my favorite. I think that's why I have become so disgusted by him in the years since because when someone you love tears your heart out, it's not easy to forget that. It's like a really, really bad breakup. And I couldn't have possibly been a bigger fan of Vince in

those days and the dunks and the dunk contest. I still remember it. I was like 13, 14 years old. I was there. It was just so it was so spectacular We had in our city the best athlete on the planet one of the best players in on the planet and he was so Much fun to watch and then I remember the series Iverson Against like if there was that was as good as a 50s Yeah, like so good and it's just so sad that it ended that way and now, you know He's revered in this city city guys the only player to have His number retired by the Toronto Raptors. I mean I agree I agree But at this point you kind of just need to shrug it off and accept that it happened

That was a decision they made and I don't know how much influence Messiah Ujiri had in that decision Sure a lot would be my well Messiah, but I think the marketing department got the best of my I think that's it was shrewd marketing Because this was a season for the Raptors that had nothing going for it. I think everybody knew is the ugly one So let's build it around Vince Carter and we could sell some tickets and make it a mark event And they did a very good job of that. That's a great point Like if they were a championship team this year, no way That's not they wouldn't put a dog and pony show like that 30th anniversary Vince Carter

Yeah, they wouldn't have done that but because they were grasping at straws for Giving people a good news story in a season filled with bad news and tanking and all the rest of it they did it and and the number stays up but although I guess there's you know Drake's threatened to pull Demar DeRozan's number down if it ever goes up so maybe somebody will pull Vince's down maybe it'll be you hey I don't think it'll be me I don't think I don't think but Drake's got bigger things to worry about than DeRozan. He's posting pictures on social media of fake abs

that he has, you see that? Yeah, it was a really peculiar thing that he's doing. Drake making some questionable decisions on social media as per usual. Well, he's still got a billion followers. DeRozan's going up there, I think Lowry's going up there. If Vince is up there, it's a long list of guys who should go up there.

Lowry should have been the first man. I really feel like that. DeRozan's right up there, I long list of guys who should go up. Larry should have been the first man I really felt that. The Rosens right up there mean obviously didn't win the title but a beloved figure and look they don't win the title without Kawhi so I consider number two as a very real possibility even though he's only here for one year. That's AK's list Ricky Williams at five Chris Bosh at four, Dion Faneuf at three, Mitch Marner at two, Vince Carter at number one the most polarizing Toronto athletes Shane Corson was number six for me. No just kidding I love Shane Corson. He's going to join us in about 20 minutes looking forward to catching up with the former

Leaf who's doing some great charitable work Ryan Dempster to come as well in hour three ahead of Jay's Yankees game four live from the dome. Seasoned gamer or just video game curious? This Week in Gaming is the podcast for you. We break down the latest in the world of video games from basics to beyond. The hottest gaming news, insight and industry leaders and more weekly. Join me, Naomi Kyle and stay ahead of the game with all the latest updates. Even if you're a total newbie.

Stream This Week in Gaming on the free iHeartRadio app, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hour two continues here on Overdrive. Jay's Yankees tonight, and Toronto even more shorthanded than they've been the first three games, Dave. Andres Jimenez will not play tonight. He has an ankle problem. Bo Bichette also out of the lineup tonight. Dalton Varsho seems like he's on the path to recovery

but he's not playing tonight either nor is Santander. So the Jays and I think the most impressive part of this stretch has been how well they performed offensively in spite of being without a bunch of their best players and that will continue tonight. Andres Jimenez is not an incredible hitter but he had a big night last night and the Jays could use him again but he will be out of the lineup so we'll see what they've got if they get sweet the Yanks that'll be quite the environment down there at the dome. It'll be great man this these man. These are the nights you live for. You know, if you're a downtowner, the dome's open, the weather's perfect,

the Yankees are in town, and by the way, you're in first place for the first time since 2016, and you can take sole possession of first place with a win tonight, like, you have to love it. Serious business, man. Could go do 11 games over 500, the Jays, with a win over the Bronx Bombers tonight. And I would love to see that, for obvious reasons.

Not a fan of the Yankees, in the slightest. But you talked about earlier in the show about how there's been so many guys who've been instrumental in getting this run going because it hasn't been the high-priced Santander who's been so many guys who've been instrumental in getting this run going because it hasn't been you know The high-priced Santander who's been hurt. It hasn't hasn't been Varsha who's been hurt It hasn't been Bobuchet of late because he's been hurt Well, we're gonna need more of that tonight, right? Because you get the likes of Nathan Luke's hitting leadoff playing centerfield

With him and as out now and you know, it's you got it You got to keep next man up mentality going here. I mean it's a Vladdy night. Like Vladdy go yard and have five RBI's tonight. Like why not? I think we're long overdue for a big massive Guerrero evening. Well what was Rich Griffin was on the morning show today you were absent obviously because you're here. But I think Griff called him what? The most expensive singles hitter on the planet yeah and he's an impressive single city like they're hard singles like they're 105 mile an hour singles you know but yeah you're right like let's let's change the launch angle and get a few of those out of the park tonight. We've got Ryan Dempster joining us

at 6 30 we're looking forward to that again Shane Corson coming up in less than 10 minutes. Hour two of Overdrive in the books, hour three is next. Unmistakably Canadian. It's the music that raised you. The artists raising the bar. Hi this is Brian Adams. Hey my name is Brett Emmons, I'm from the glorious Suns. Hi I'm Nellie Furtado. Made in Canada, the station that champions Canadian music. Loud, proud, and all yours. No passports required, just press play. Tap into Made in Canada now on iHeartRadio.ca or the free iHeart Radio app.