OverDrive - OverDrive - July 4, 2025 - Hour 3

Episode Date: July 4, 2025

Join Jim Tatti, Dave Feschuk and Michael DiStefano for Hour 3 on OverDrive! GriffsThePitch.com Columnist Richard Griffin joins to discuss the Blue Jays' leap in the AL East standings, George Springer's elite stretch and the trade deadline approach for the team. TSN Hockey Analyst Bruce Boudreau joins to discuss the Maple Leafs' roster outline, the DNA of the team in Toronto and Brock Boeser re-signing with the Canucks and Al's Brother gives his FanDuel Best Bets.

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Sundays at 5pm on Newstalk 1010 and the iHeartRadio app. The show that makes sense of the ever-changing world of technology, and you don't need a computer degree to listen. Brought to you by LG celebrating 10 years of OLED innovation. Visit LG.ca Fallon and Friday, Jim Taddy, Dave Festchuk and Al's brother Mike DiStefano with you. Overdrivers brought to you by FanDuel bringing you everything from the opening line to the final score, which would be the Met 6.5 over the Yankees. That is done. Jay's getting set to take on the angels at the dome and what's going on with the race they are minnesota two to one that's the top of the seventh in minnesota so

that's what's on the table jays have the uh... bogeyman athlete now over the yankees but you know come at the night's game and uh... would still they'd be a half game up on the Rays if the Rays won. I mean the fact that it's July 4th and we're talking about the Jays being atop of the AL East is still remarkable to me. Where this team was at one point not even that long ago like mid-May we're talking about this team you know potentially being sellers at the deadline all right should you move on from Beau Bichette? What could you get for, you know, could Chris Bassett get you a haul? Do you consider moving on from Kevin

Gossman who's only got one year left on the deal? And now it's all alright. The Jays can be one of the most aggressive teams at the trade deadline and they could add some decent pieces. A nice bat, probably get one more arm in there, maybe a starter, definitely a bullpen guy I think that the Jays have set themselves up with this great stretch 33 games 23 and 10 in that stretch They got themselves top the division They were once eight games back of the Yankees and now one and a half up and they closed that gap pretty darn quick It's theirs to lose, right?

It's amazing. Like you think about it, like we were talking about how this team was lucky that the Maple Leafs were in the second round of the playoffs because nobody was really paying attention. Because nobody for a few years. Yeah. Because at one stretch they lost like,

I think it was eight or nine. They were just. Yeah, they lost like 16-nothing, 11-nothing. Like they were getting skunked 16 nothing 11 not like I'm getting Skunked in a lot of those early games. It was absolutely ugly and now well right before this stretch They got crushed by the Rays and everyone kind of remembers that Rays That that 13 of the series. Yeah, nothing cry a 25th and then they started they played the Texans and there were some low-scoring games But they won that series but since that they played the Texans and there were some low scoring games but they won that series.

But since that last game, the Texan series, they've gone on and they've won 23- Texans are a football team by the way, but that's not the nitpick. Sorry, the Texas Rangers. They're Texans though. They were Texas, you were technically correct. They were Texans. Texas Rangers, but they've been on fire ever since. You guys notice apparently not a single blue j

Despite being the hottest team in baseball they're getting contributions all up and down the lineup Not a single blue j was named to the American League team of the month How can that even be that's what I they are the team of the blood not a single Player named to the AL team of the month for for the month of June this is back total disrespect How many Yankees are on that team? Good question. I could look that up in a moment, but I'd imagine Judge would be there for sure at the very least.

But maybe it goes to the point that the Jays are the team of the month by committee. There could be a lot of Tigers on that team. Which is true. It is kind of by committee of what that team has been able to do. The Springers had a hell of a month, Kirk's had a hell of a month. Yeah, I mean obviously those guys must be playing better than them, but that seems like a stretch. I don't know about you Dave or AB, but I love, we do narratives, that's what we do.

And when the narrative changes, I love that moment because I just felt that, you know, to AB's point when we're talking about in mid May, we're talking about the same narrative that we've talked about for the last two years. And the line was, you said 2025 was going to be the year and it's a complete dud so far, but now it is. Yeah.

Now it is the year. Hey man, all that, you know, we used to, we were mocking Ross Atkins for all that stuff about internal improvement and is you know we still we were mocking ross ackens for all that stuff about internal improvement and you know the idea that they they felt like they're on this on the cusp of something big here and that there was just no evidence of that right there's just there was just no evidence there they were on the cusp of something big

uh... but what they've done in in these last thirty one thirty two days is just they've reversed that thinking yeah they've made you believe that this is a team you know, they've reversed that thinking. They've made you believe that this is a team you can believe in. And, you know, maybe, hey, we all know, you know, trends come and go, you know, there's, when there's progression, there's regression in baseball and that's coming. Six weeks is a nice sample size. It is. And six weeks is pretty well what, how long this stretch has been 33 games it is a nice

little sample size that the Maple Leafs have here the Blue Jays have here. All over the place here. But like you run down the stat pack since that May 28th date 282 batting average which is first in baseball 808 OPS second in baseball they have 46 home runs seventh in baseball 194 runsPS second in baseball. They have 46 home runs, seventh in baseball, 194 runs scored, second in baseball, 9.7 wins above replacement, first in baseball, and they have the lowest strikeout rate in the majors, 15.3%. That's impressive. Like that's really impressive. And it's the most by like 3%. Like the next is I think

the Royals that are raised, and it's at like 18%. So this is a team, the most by like three percent. Like the next is I think the Royals that are raised and it's like eighteen percent. So this is a team, the approach by everyone on the roster from top to bottom has been outstanding. You keep pointing to that Nathan Lucas, 14 pitch at bat. Like these guys are hard outs. Every single one of these players over the last six weeks, it has been impossible to get these guys out.

Sort of everything you didn't think they could be but they are let's get further context than this richard griffith is here grips the pitch dot com is where you find his work agref welcome how are you today i'm good guys how are you that were just that we are brimming with with optimism here so i guess the only question is how legitimate is this in house sustainable is it

for me in uh... we gotta wait until the All-Star game the All-Star break You know, it's tremendous four game sweep of the Yankees, but now You've got a chance for a letdown you've got the Angels for three then the White Sox and Then finally the Athletics before the All-Star break and So that's three teams that are 48 games under 500. And don't forget that in this 23 and 10 stretch, the Jays did have a three and six, nine game series that ended with two out of three losses to the White Sox.

So I'm reserving my unbridled optimism for the All-Star break. And you know that that is two weeks before the trade deadline so we'll hear the the rumor mills out of New York with the Yankees who you know they're always looking to make a make a deal especially after being embarrassed at Rogers Center so we'll see us it is a time for optimism something that happened that nobody would have believed at the end of May and here we are.

But I'm still holding back until the All-Star break. Despite that though, I mean a massive series, a sweep of the Yankees, the first time in Jay's history they've completed a home four game sweep of the team from New York. And just like how big of a statement was that for this Jays team, kind of telling the world and maybe even, you know, Michael K specifically, we are the class of this division. Yeah, it's a huge step forward and a huge slap in the face for the most celebrated cheering hometown media in baseball.

You know, that's the New York Yankees media. It's the biggest, it's the biggest small town media in North America. And it, it just, to see Michael K go on about run differential and these aren't a true chat, and then be, finish the sweep was really sweet. you know like I like individual in fact I love individual players on the Blue Jays because I worked with them for four years but the team you know the team let's just reserve judgment for now but it was really nice to see because I also do not like the Yankees. It's a good way to put it Griff. Well let's talk about the guy who's sort of been leading

the charge here, Griff. And it's an unexpected charge from George Springer, given he's coming off last season, which was by a lot of statistics the worst season of his career, age 35. It looked like it wasn't going to be a nice forecast for the remainder of his career in Toronto, and yet there he is at the top of the standings with 15 home runs leading the team, 891 OPS leading the team. What do you make of it? Yeah, I felt the need. We recorded an Exit Philosophy podcast this morning,

and I felt the need to apologize publicly to George Springer for saying he was washed, that he was done. We did say specifically that he should be moved out of the leadoff spot, which he has been. I heard your guys' discussion earlier about the MVP of the Blue Jays thus far, and I would go Kirk, Bichette, and then Springer. Because he was being carried through the first little while.

The player who would be the hardest to replace is Alejandro Kirk. When you go wins above replacement, well, if the replacement is Tyler Heineman, then his wins above shoots up because you can't afford to lose Alejandro Kirk out of that lineup. Meanwhile, you can afford, especially as you guys were mentioning the performance of that lineup. Meanwhile, you can afford, especially as you guys were mentioning, the performance of Nathan Lucas. And then they've had other outfielders come up and do a job briefly, albeit, but they've done a job. So you can credit the injury list early in the season for discovering who could play, for discovering who could step up. Addison Barger didn't make the opening day roster and here he is leading the way as much as George

Springer is. And you know, you've got Ernie Clement who I think his supreme role is as a super sub at third, short and second. He doesn't play first base, he plays first base but not very well. And I think his optimum is 120, 130 games with someone else starting at those positions and him just playing the field. But you found out, you discovered all of this because of injuries to Santander and Andres Jimenez and others. And in the past few years when there's been an injury they've been bewitched, bothered and bewildered and not been able to do that. And that's the key to me is the ability of some guys that already existed in this clubhouse on this roster to step up. Yeah, Griff, I like the way you described that because that's really what we're seeing in the past.

Injuries have happened and not only the J's have had this issue, but others, and they go south. And for whatever reason, and we don't know what it is, this year, the pieces that have had to step up have done that, and I think that's what really draws people into this story. Kirk's a great example. I don't know what you would expect out of him, but he's just done a really great job in him and really engaging to watch. And some of

these other people that we've talked about, Barger, Lucas, and some of the others that you didn't know were going to do it have done it. Springer, who's been injured in the past, Bichette has been injured, have done it. You know, you thought Vlad was going to carry the gravy train here, but he's, you know, he's finding his way carry the the gravy train here but he's you know he's finding his way and Santander well he's injured so that's that's really the intrigue in this team is you don't know who's going to do it but you're pretty confident somebody is. Well Tappman I remember being on your show earlier in the season in April or early May and we're talking about Alejandro Kirk who was struggling at the plate at the time

and I reminded you that the reason he made the team originally was back to ball skills, was his offense. It wasn't his defense. And there was a lot of the fan base saying, wow, we need a catcher who can hit. We do a, what about Danny Jansen? Why'd they let Danny Jansen go? But this, he has returned to what

earned him a spot on this team in the first place. And I think that's a great thing. The one thing that I'm not sure you guys discussed it, but that trade deadline that I really believe they have to go out and get is an experienced veteran starting pitcher. And it doesn't have to be somebody who's locked in for extra seasons after this one. It has to be someone who can help them down the stretch because they're just rolling the dice with Max Scherzer going out every fifth day.

And Eric Lauer is not going to maintain the statistics that he's got right now. Today they brought up Lazaro Estrada, who's a right-hander that a lot of people haven't heard of. But he can eat innings if Lowers slows down or if if Max Scherzer is injured again and keeps flexing that hand and it's after 50-60 pitches and you go uh-oh and and so they need at the deadline and that's a month from now less than a month from now they need to find another starter and I think they'll be fine.

At the deadline is a replacement for Anthony Santander something they're going to have to think about? He was just placed on the 60-day IL. Like is he someone that the Jays can rely upon for once he gets back into the fold that he can be a contributor to this ball club or are they going to need to go out and get another kind of power bat to kind of supplement what Santander might not be able to bring? No I think that they can you know retro they can you know the 60 days is going to expire when he's ready to play so that's not an issue it's just getting a roster spot for Estrada but they've locked him in for five years and I think they're gonna roll the dice and stay with him And I think I've seen so many times that there were injuries there were extra

Twists and turns injuries that affected a player's performance early in a season that that nobody talks about And when they come back there a're 100% to what they were. Because this guy hit 44 home runs a year ago, and you're expecting the power that you didn't see early in the season. They're committed to him. I do not believe that they will go out and get another experienced power RBI bat.

I think that they'll roll it. I mean, one of the depths of this Blue Jays team is the outfielders, and we talked about Nathan Lucas. And there's other guys who have been up and down and proved that as a fourth or fifth outfielder, they can do the job. And Miles Straw that everybody made fun of because he was like an expensive throw in so they could get money to sign Roki Suzuki and that didn't happen. But he's been contributing and he's been a defensive, an adequate defensive replacement for Dalton Varsho who's a gold blubber. So yeah, I don't think they need to go out and get another outfielder and to me George Springer is

going to take up the bulk of the DH spot when down the stretch just to continue his good health and keep him in the middle of that order at the bottom of the top the graveyard your mvp that team mvp rankings today to go over the again aloha no kirk number one bo beshet number two springer number three this panel had springer's unanimous mvp so we'll disagree on that but talk to me about why you put the shed at number two he's been nicked up you'll be back in

the lineup tonight he pinch hit last night in this contract year he had a lost season last year to injury what has impressed you so much about Bo bashed well when they moved springer out of the leadoff spot they needed somebody there and I didn't think the shirt was the right guy because he swinged it anything that is close to the plate and you want a guy working the count at that point but he's done the job batting leadoff. The only games that he's missed are the last four, the only starts that he's missed are the last four and only one of those previous was as a DH and this guy was among the top three in base hits. He's been playing probably some of his best defense which was a low bar to begin with but it's

still nevertheless. And I just think that for the first 87- 88 games that he has been more valuable to me, to this team than a hot and cold George Springer. So what does that say about Vladimir Guerrero Jr.? Does it make your top three? And he's the one who got paid this past off season. And I was looking to see over this stretch since May 28th, that's kind of that date we look at, he's not of that date we look at. He's not even in the top five of the Blue Jays.

It wins above replacement. What have you made of Laddie's season since getting that big contract? Well, it's like arguing whether the Mona Lisa is the MVP of the Louvre. It doesn't move, doesn't do anything. But still, it's the face of the franchise. And he is the face of the franchise. When he signed the contract, fans turned and paid attention and said,

hey, you know, these guys are serious. Even the clubhouse turned and paid attention and said, hey, these guys are serious. So last year around the same time, he had 10 to 12 home runs and he ended up with 30. I believe that that is a trend that we're going to see again. He's still by the end of the season probably won't be the team MVP, but if he is the team MVP they will not have won the division.

They may make the playoffs if they played 500 ball the rest of the way they'd have 87 wins, which will be enough in sort of a mediocre middle of the pack in the American League But they want to win the division and if he is the MVP of this team at the end of the season given The three month head start he's given to Kirk and some of the others then this team's not going to win Griff in terms of what the Jays would part with at the deadline, where are you on that and is there any possibility Manoa reappears? Yes, yes for Manoa.

I think that also Tre Sabitz, the guy that they drafted first round last season, I think that he started in Dunedin, he started at low A, went to Vancouver where he learned what it felt like to have loonies and toonies in your pocket. And now he's in New Hampshire. And he's just tearing it up. The only thing he's not doing is pitching deep in the ball games. But at 22 years old, it's not like he's 19 or just turning 20. He's been around. He's a college junior. I think he may help. Manoa may help. And if they get somebody at the deadline, they'll be covered because I really don't think that Max Scherz is gonna take the ball 14 more times the rest of the season. But what do you think they're gonna move out? Well, they've got that surplus of outfielders we talked about. There are

teams, if you look through MLB trade rumors, there are teams that are looking for outfielders. There are arms at some of the lower levels that they'd be willing to part with. Not Cal Steven, who was another right-hander from the draft last year. Not Johnny King, who's a left-hander. High schooler just turned 19, pitched him to Eden

the other day. And not Yosavage, and not Ricky Tiedemann. But there's arms down there that would tempt teams that are looking to restock their farm system. So I'd say surplus arms and outfielders would be enough to get a veteran starter with no years beyond 2025. I think that that would be the case. So, Griff, you're not ready to get too excited about this pennant race just yet. You're the old

head. You're saying wait till the All-Star break, wait to see if this is real. But if we're jumping ahead, like if you have to handicap the other two teams that are apparently going to be the threat to beat the Blue Jays out for the American League East Who do you like between the Rays and the Yankees? well Dave the the Rays have had the advantage of playing Probably two-thirds of their games at home because they don't want them playing in the stinking hot middle of the summer in Tampa where it rains every day. I rented a convertible one time for a trip to Miami. I wondered why there were so many in the parking lot available.

It rained every day when I drove to the stadium in Miami. So I know that as a factor was never any BP. So I think that the rays have had the advantage, the scheduling advantage, so I don't believe they can do it. I don't like them anyway. And the only team they really dominate is the Blue Jays, which is the only way that they can win. The Yankees are the ones that I worry about. Red Sox, that clubhouse went into a spiral

when they traded Devers, and the GM and the manager are not where they were a year ago even. And so I'm looking at the Yankees, I'm looking at the Yankees at the All-Star break, watching them reload, watching them line themselves up for the second half and then at the trade deadline making a significant move. So they're the team that I worry about and probably historically rightly so. Griff, I think we're done. I think we've exhausted the question supply. Is there anything we didn't ask you? Yeah, that's an old journalism trick and I don't do that anymore.

Hey, how's it, by the was here you have your manager's career going all men we play it all the ballpark coming on the perfect game collegiate summer league and we're not very good but i'm managing my act off so we're just not good but but it's fun going on the ballpark in the new york penalty james had what i used to write about with that the next post here guy, our team was there, Batavia, Newark, Auburn, it's great.

Ballparks that I've written about and never been to and now I'm there and I'm managing and I love it. Griff, I was told to say go Ironbacks, go. Perfect, I appreciate it. Plenty of tickets still available. Griff, thanks very much, appreciate it. Plenty of tickets still available. Griff, thanks very much. Appreciate it. All right, guys. Anytime. Richard Griffin, griffsthepitch.com and The Exit Philosophy is the podcast. Always great to talk to Griff.

I just love how he publicly hates every other team in the AL East. Just like, I hate the Yankees, I hate the Rays, screw the Red Sox. Griff's the best. He really is. He really is. He was a great colleague at the Toronto Star. He was by far the best PR guy the Blue Jays ever had. And now I'm sure he's an outstanding manager even though his team's not doing so well in the perfect game collegiate league. I will say this, he brings up a very solid point when he talks about Alejandro Kirk being the team's MVP. Like when you, I guess you put together offense and defense, what Kirk has been able to do behind the plate,

pitch framing, I think he leads the league in thrown outs as well. Like Kirk probably is this team's MVP. I'm gonna revert to what I said earlier and I'm gonna jump on Griff's train on that one because even if you look at like the underlying numbers from Alejandro Kirk this season like the offense is clearly there. He's in the 96th percentile in expected batting average. He's in the 97th percentile in hard hit rate. He never chases. You know, this guy never strikes out the 98th percentile in strikeouts this year and that's to go with him being the best pitcher in baseball when it comes to the actual catching position. 100 percentile in blocks

above average, 100 percentile in pitch framing and oh yeah he's in the 97 percentile and caught stealing above average. So the guys getting it done on both sides of the plate I think Kirk you need to get that love. I believe I said I'd like to give it to Kirk, but then I, you know, sort of. You should have stuck to your guns, man. I should have. I should have. I should have.

This is what happens when you try to get along with people. Yeah. Yeah. You don't have to get along with us. We don't take it personally. Go your own way, Tapp, man. Okay, I am. I'm going my own way now.

That's a commercial break. Coming up next, Bruce Boudreau, the TSN hockey analyst, former coach, former player. He'll be with us. Going to revert back to Ice Talk, but on the way out, thanks for joining us and stay with us on Overdrive, TSN 1050, TSN 2. Given five days or less to accept a severance offer, you need EmploymentLawyer.ca. You actually have two years to file a claim for a severance package, which can total as much as 24 months pay.

Call your Sam Firou and get what you're owed. Employmentlawyer.ca. Mail It In Friday on Overdrive. Jim Taddy, Dave Fest, Chuck Inhales, brother Mike DiStefano here to officially mail it in. Mail It In Friday is brought to you by Boston Pizza, Canada's favorite sports bar. Enjoy a $15 lunch

at BP where you get an entree, a side and a drink and you get it all in 20 minutes or less. A fast lunch doesn't have to be fast food. So see you at the $15 fast lunch at your local Boston Pizza. So a couple of things on the way into Bruce Boudreaux. Uh, Scherzer, I don't think we mentioned this earlier, will start for the Jays tomorrow. And uh, Taves back with Winnipeg spoke today and he was speaking about it actually one of our listeners and viewers wanted some Winnipeg talk so I think we fulfill that quota right here. Taves back in the NHL with the Winnipeg Jets and here he is talking about his return.

I've gotten to a point where I pretty much needed to let myself completely get off a timeline to return. So in my mind I'd kind of accepted in a way that I might not play again. And I think that was a challenging thing to do, but at the same time a very healthy thing to do to just like wake up every day and not think of, you know, this is where we're going so But I'd say probably as the year went along I got stronger every month and I was working out taking care of myself but also just enjoying life and I'd say these last five or six months things have really trended in a direction since I started

skating back in February and March Those are the moments where I'm like, okay, still got the hands. The hands are still there, the feet will catch up and things have slowly gotten better since then. So I'm really happy about where I'm at. Jonathan Taves getting set to return to the NHL with Winnipeg. You saw him with the number 19, the Winnipeg Jets jersey. Let's bring in Bruce Boudreau, TSN hockey analyst, former NHL player, coach, and has

done a lot of things in hockey in his entire life. Bruce, welcome. How are you today? I'm good. Good. It's a good day. In terms of the Taves comeback, just a fascinating story where everybody wishes this guy well. He was such a great player.

What are your thoughts on that? Yeah. Like, I mean, if you think of Jonathan think of jonathan page you gotta think of a winner and uh... that's what i think of them uh... you know like i wouldn't say single-handedly but we played chicago in the conference final few years ago and every time they got down they put him on the ice and he'd

seem to do something magical to get them back in it and they eventually beat us in seven games and they won the cup And I think he was the essential guy that the reason that they won that so hey when I think of him I think of just a winner and that's to me what he was Yes, so Bruce when you think about you know, just the reality of what he's going through here where he's 37 years old last played a game two years ago it'll be two and a half years by the time the season starts the last

touch the n h l i swit what are the odds in your mind that that he can actually rekindle that sort of pedigree as as a a winner who can actually help the team compete in this league yeah you know what uh... when you when you pay his age and you sit there and you think he's missed two years, it's hard to come back. But I mean, this is what makes great stories.

Uh, and especially great athletes is, is the guys that are capable of doing that. Uh, I really believe that, uh, there's not a lot of guys that could do it, but watching him over all the years I do believe that he wouldn't come back if he didn't think he had a chance to be a real viable player I don't think he'd come back if Chevy or somebody from Winnipeg wasn't watching him skate somewhere privately in Winnipeg and he came up and said hey you can do it so I think he's gonna be fine I don't know if he could do it for more than a year or two but I mean listen Mars think he's going to be fine. I don't know if he could do it for more than a year or two, but I mean, listen,

March and 37, he seems to be getting better. I mean, Corey Perry scored 19 goals last year and 10 in the playoffs and he's what? 60. Like, I mean, nearly, I mean, yeah, it doesn't happen all the time, but there are these great feel-good stories, and I think, and I'm hoping, Jonathan Taze is one of those feel-good stories. Brucey, here in Toronto, everybody obviously following the Mitch Marner saga, and I'm sure that you followed it quite closely as well, but I'm just curious, you look back on what

Brad True Living has done in the last week. It's still an incomplete offseason, but to point worry out with the Maple Leafs you know on their quest to try and get over the hump. Yeah it's interesting obviously follow the Leafs quite closely or I think I do anyway but they're not better today than they were a month ago. I mean that's just you know Nick Roy is a good they they were a month ago. And I mean, that's just, you know, uh, uh, Nick Roy is a good, they've wanted a third line center. Uh, I think he can fill the bill between third and, and, but he played a lot of fourth line, um, center when Vegas was a really, really good balance team.

So I think he's a good player, but, uh, uh, losing Mitch Marner, they haven't, and they probably won't, and it's hard to do, replace somebody, A, that's going to be that good a penalty killer, that good on the power play, that good setting up your number one scorer in Austin, who will probably be, hopefully be healthy by the time the season starts and and stuff so they haven't you know the other little things they've they've done for example Mattelli you know what for whatever reason I followed him in Arizona because he I think you because his first year he did pretty good and he was an American league guy getting called up a smaller type guy that did okay. I just don't see him moving any needle to be quite frankly. I don't think

Pizzetta, I don't think he got a point in Montreal last year. He's a tough guy, but I don't and he grew up I guess right around the corner from where I lived. So, but, so you like them to do good, but I don't think that's a real big, real big improvement or help for the team. So it's going to be interesting where they go. I think Matthew Nyes is going to be closing in on 40 goals next year. I think if Stolarz can stay healthy, I think they got a real good goaltending tandem.

But as far as them being better right now, they're not in my mind. I really trust Brad Trelliving to also know this and he's going to do what it takes to make them better. But right now, they're not better than they were when they lost in seven games to Florida. Yeah I totally agree. I mean even if they'd re-signed Marner they still had to be better right? Yeah and they would have and if they had to re-sign Marner they're still not better than Florida. But I mean like I think that if they stay the same they'll be hard pressed to be in first place if they stay the same, they'll be hard pressed to be in first place, quite frankly, at the end of next year.

And Marner means so much. I don't care what you say about the playoffs. He still averaged a point of game, I think, in the playoffs. But at the same time, they had to change something. They couldn't go with the same group next year after losing basically for all the years that those guys have been together. So they had to do something. I just don't think they've done enough right now.

And I hope that somewhere down the road there's another trade to get a top six forward because Nick Robertson's not going gonna do it either. I think be able to do the job, but We don't know we'll see I still think It's a long summer yet and teams will be talking right up till the end of September before they before they start So we'll see hey Bruce. I'm sure you've heard a lot of unconventional ideas about how to help a team get over the hump. What did you make of the Maple Leafs decision to bring in a horse trainer and apparently an unwieldy cult to show their prospects this week? I guess with an eye, Haley Wickenheiser said the assistant general manager of player development said that it was an eye toward helping the players understand how to control emotion and some leadership aspect as well. What did you make of all that?

Okay, well evidently, I'm not in Toronto and I didn't hear that, but first upon hearing that I'm thinking that's the biggest crock of you know what I've ever heard. You know what we can talk analytics and I believe in them and that but I mean the bottom line is hockey you tell me what you want it's still won by winning battles one-on-one battles outwilling the other team and playing together. And you know what? I got to dig into this horse thing because I've never heard anything like that. And the minute those horses put on skates, I guarantee all four legs are going in different directions. Kind of a visual, isn't it?

Yeah. Yeah, I'm with you, Bruce. But I guess when the player development department starts grasping at straws for different ideas, have you been involved in those conversations where someone thinks they're creative and wants to try something outside the box with the hockey team? Not that far outside the box, I don't think. I mean, you know, we have different ideas. I mean, at development camp and such, but you know what? If it works, hey, listen, I'm all for it. But I mean, I don't know where the idea came from and I really haven't studied the idea. So I really am not a good person to believe in it or not.

I just think it sounds like the stupidest thing I ever heard so far. Well, you spent a long time in the NHL, obviously, behind many, spent many years on the coaches bench, many different franchises. And I'm just curious to get your, pick your brain a little bit, like maybe get us in the headspace of where Berube might be at and all the other coaches around the NHL. Like, what is that timeline between, you know, when the season ends, all leading up to July 1 free agency where your team is going under a transformation? Like, what's it like for the head coach in that situation?

Like, does the coach have some say in the matter? Are they involved in those types of discussions? Like, what was that experience like for you in that really wild week that most NHL teams transform? Well, I think with Craig it's a little bit different because since they got rid of Shanahan, then him and Brad are working much closer together, he might have some some say like I mean I think it all depends on the relationship with the GM if you've got a good relationship with the GM he will ask you or you know and he you know some and like for example when I was with Chuck Fletcher or George McPhee I would be in on meetings and that and so my voice could be heard but a lot of times

It's it's not but and in the summer I had nothing to do with I could give my ideas on hey listen We were not strong at this position or that position and then they go out and do it but There's really not a lot for coaches to do in the summer even though their mind never really completely uh... winds down because soon as they might have a little bit of july off but but once they start uh... once august starts up there they're coming again and they're probably getting back ready to get back

into town get the coaches together and prepare for the next year so there's not a lot of downtime anymore. Bruce, I hate to nail Mr. Tree Living on this statement about changing the DNA, but based on what you know about the leafs, when the general manager says changing the DNA, what does that mean to you? To be quite honest, when I first thought of it, I thought get bigger and tougher tougher and I don't know if that's what they need or or if that's the case is just thinking right now and not that I'm I'm just go answering your question I would think that it thinks you know change the the heart of the team and I don't know if they need that change.

I'm not there, but that's the first thing that I thought of when I first heard that statement of talking about the DNA. Okay, so I mean, everybody understands how Florida plays. This is a really, really good, gritty, tough, just any word that you would associate with truculence, Florida has an overabundance. If you're not built that way, how do you transition to that or do you even try to do that?

You know what? You can't change the players' spots a lot of times. You can make them a little more defensive. You can't make them tougher. You can't make them want to get into the corners more. I think, I mean, you've got to find those players somewhere. If you want to change the DNA and you've got a player or change, if the DNA is even the right word, if you want to change the type of player you want, you're going to have to change some of the guys you have on your team to other teams and to get that kind of player. That's the way you change it. I mean, if you, like I would have thought that they might have really wanted a guy like

Bennett or Marchand, even though once Marchand signed his contract, I didn't think anybody had signed him for six years, but in Florida they get away with an awful lot of things. But I think a guy like Sam Bennett would have been somebody that boy I would have really liked to have gone after but when you're happy in one situation it's hard to pluck those guys out of a great situation and they weren't given the time because they weren't allowed to talk to them until July 1 and Bill Zito did a great job in getting them all done before then. Bruce, you spent time a couple years in Vancouver, you know the group pretty well.

How surprised you to see Brock Besser, you know, go to market but then ultimately decide to just circle back and resign in Vancouver on July 1st? I was shocked, like everybody else. I mean, I think everybody was shocked because they've been talking about for two years about trading them. They didn't you know from what I gather I know when I was there they had asked the agent even they said hey listen if you can make a trader facilitate a trade with Brock go ahead and do it and then at the trade deadline this year they said they got no good offers and so I don't know whether it was Brock's love for Vancouver that wanted him to bring

him back or whether he didn't get, his agent didn't get the offers that he thought he would be getting somewhere else and decided to come back to Vancouver. So I mean, I'm surprised. But when you look at what they've lost as offensive scoring power in the last couple of years, it's hard to lose a potential 40 goal scorer and not get anything back in return. So I'm glad he came back.

I hope he has a great year, but pretty surprised that it happened. Rose, thanks very much. Really appreciate it. Enjoy your weekend. Hey, and you guys enjoy your summer. summer and there's not much more left i don't think that so i mean as far as we talk for a hockey talk for a little while so

uh... enjoy it hopefully we'll get a chance to talk again next year absolutely least talk is like ross did never sleep that will find a way to have to tell you sometime mid-august doesn't matter okay sounds great thanks for talking about it later market first broderot that he has been hockey analyst former coach play with the leaves they with the open the least farm system

he's been around that's for sure i i i like what he said i mean everybody wants to chase florida you can't become the Panthers. I mean, that would take years. You can't do that. I mean, it's, you have to sort of let it run its course. Years and you'd have to change your tax codes, which probably not going to happen. But I'm thinking back to, because they remind me a lot of the Islanders, and I know that goes back a lot of decades.

And really the Islanders just had to wear out. Right. Well, and the Islanders funny never the last thing to go To four cup finals in a row right? Yeah, I know but the last is yeah I mean I did it five times but Florida of course has a chance to go to four in a row Yeah, the first time since that right or that that Islanders team. Yeah, you can't write There's a lot of similarities there and ultimately you're right like this team They've built it on some veteran guys that you see you soon will

Ultimately, you're right. This team, they've built it on some veteran guys that you assume will peter out, run out of steam eventually. It just hasn't happened yet. We were all thinking last year that maybe the Stanley Cup hangover. It started the playoffs. Somebody said that. At least several people did. Well, it's a great theory that had really no basis in reality.

Yeah. You just think eventually. They've played so much hockey. So much hockey. But they got... I mean, lucky much hockey so much hockey, but they got I mean lucky He's probably not the word but like Maca chuck didn't have to play hockey down the stretch. He was injured granted So it's you never want that to happen But then Aaron act blad had a little 20 game hiatus to Rest his legs and be ready to go for the playoffs

So they had a couple of guys who were like horses for that team even Brad Marshawn missed some time They had a couple of guys who were like horses for that team. Even Brad Marshawn missed some time when he first got there and maybe allowed him to recharge those legs a little bit. Don't say horses around Bruce Brewdrop. He wasn't high on that idea. I like how he summed it up though. We'll step out. Coming up next, best bets.

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Jim Taddy, Dave Fest, Chuck In, Al's brother Mike DiStefano with you. Just updating AB before we get to the best bets. Rays and Twins are tied at three going to the bottom of the ninth, the game in Minnesota. So an opportunity there for the Jays to maintain if the Twins can come up with something. It would be nice. It would be nice to go up a full two games on both the Rays and the Yankees. Could be. Could be if they

can get the dub tonight. You have the best bets? Ah yes today's best bets powered by FanDuel, MakerPix and assemble the same game parlay in seconds on the FanDuel Sportsbook app. Let's ride the hot bat with a two-leg Springer parlay. He's been on fire coming off a generational series against the Yankees. I have him getting two plus bases again tonight and recording a run for the Blue Jays. He's hitting second in the lineup, Bichette Barger behind him. They've been swinging the bat really well lately. You can get that at plus 125. So Springer, two plus bases and a run tonight. Today's best bet powered by FanDuel.

The first inning means as much as the ninth. When you bet baseball on the FanDuel Sportsbook app, please play responsibly 19 plus and physically located in Ontario. So do we do we think the winning streak continues? Do they win the series? Do they sweep the angels? I mean Griff brought up the possibility of a letdown against a perceived weaker opponent You know that had some know some letdowns against the White Sox are in this yeah They've had they've had some moments where they haven't played the teams. They should be though. They did sweep the athletics So I sort of see where he's coming from after the euphoria of sweeping the Yankees You could see them taking the foot off the gas a little bit here

So I'm not I'm not penciling in the sweep against the angels But you got to think they keep it rolling to a large degree Yeah, you know Lauer going tonight Scherzer tomorrow And then what roll into Bureaus Bureaus be next after that or Gosman one of the two Well, we'll take the ball in the third game So, you know, you like the pitching matchup and let's hope that the bats can stay alive That's that's all they need as long as the bats can keep swinging the way that they have been They're gonna be in ball games and be able to win ball games. Slightly less

than 60 seconds so of the people that you didn't think that would contribute that are who's your favorite Blue J that way? Well it's got you know it's got to be Springer I mean it's by far like you know Griff Griff is publicly apologizing to George Springer on his podcast for saying he was washed I mean I think a lot of us were saying the exact same thing. Like, what can you expect? Very little. Can he stay healthy? Probably not. And here he is leading the team. Yeah, I mean, there's two guys that come to mind for me. Ernie Clement, who's been unbelievable over the last month, third in the entire league in

Wins Above Replacement. And Addison Barger wasn't on the roster opening night and he's been unbelievable so I like Berger, Barger and Clement as well. I would go with Barger I just I like those stories where the guy comes out of nowhere so ten seconds left AB have a great weekend you're with us a couple days next week and me and Dave are gonna drive this thing into the ground every day next week. It'll be a mail it in Monday through Friday. Absolutely. So we'll chat then. The biggest songs in the world. Come on. You've heard them countless times.

Now learn the details of how they came to be. I'm calling rockers in the house tonight. Join Ruby Carr for Encore, the stories behind the songs you love. New interviews and newly unearthed archive footage make for a fascinating weekly deep dive. Stream Encore, the stories behind the songs you love, on I Heart Radio or wherever you get your podcasts.