OverDrive - OverDrive - May 29, 2025 - Hour 3

Episode Date: May 29, 2025

Join Bryan Hayes, Jamie McLennan and Jonas Siegel for Hour 3 on OverDrive! TSN Hockey Insider Pierre LeBrun joins to discuss Brad Treliving's direction with the Maple Leafs and the press conference viewpoints, the DNA of the team and the future of the players on the team. TSN Hockey Analyst Cheryl Pounder dives into Mitch Marner's next steps on the horizon, the potential suitors on the roster and the Panthers creating a dynasty back to the final and Hayes gives his FanDuel Best Bets.

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Some restrictions and exclusions may apply. See participating stores for details. Final Hour Overdrive continues powered by Fandual, bringing you everything from the opening line to the final score. Brian Hayes, Jamie Noodles, McClennan, Jonas Siegel of The Athletic. We got game five Dallas Edmonton tonight. Game five Knicks Pacers tonight. Got the Jays back home facing Sacramento. I think that's who they're playing. The Sacramento Athletics. Soon to be Vegas.

Is that what they're called, the Sacramento Athletics? I think they're just- They actually don't use Sacramento. They just call it the Athletics. Just the Athletics. Yeah, they're just Athletics. It's like we don't know where they're playing. The opposite of football club.

Right. Like you know, it was like Washington Football Club. Yeah. Utah Hockey Club. This is just athletics. Now it's the Utah Mammoth Utah Mammoth getting used to that or no, you're not even having used it enough You know what story we haven't brought up today is this Alex Ovechkin Washington Capitol story. It was a fake email

Wasn't it? Well, I don't know if people are falling for it or not because like you tell me your interpretation because the story was that someone from the team sent out an email to long-standing ticket holders that this upcoming season would be Alex Ovechkin's final season right and then the team came out I believe an issued official statement saying like nothing has been decided this is completely erroneous blah blah blah it wasn't a fake email no it was like the Capitals are not responding to it if it's just completely fake because again, they tweeted out here it is up on the screen. No decision has been made on Alex Ovechkin's future following the 2025-26 NHL season. An email was sent from an individual with the corporate sales department that mistakenly

alluded to next year being Alex Ovechkin's final year. You should have said corporate sales department that used to work here. Yeah, formally of the, because. That guy got gassed. My guess is there's a very good chance that next year's his last year. Oh yeah.

And they're prepping for it, and it's gonna be a big, you know, you're sending it, you're gonna send it out, blast it out, make sure you come see Alex for the last time. Yeah, the Jeter send off. Yes yes because now he's past Gretzky he's won his cup I believe it's the last year in his contract most people that I have read that cover him believe he's always going back to Russia they're

probably on a KHL team probably play for them for four or five years and that's what's coming type of thing just forever But what is he at for goal? Cause he's gonna try and get a thousand goals. That's on his dock. He's not doing that in one year. Right. Like he said, he just passed 894, he's at 895. Like he'd have to stick around for probably three years,

three or four years. Yeah, I guess he's not gonna. I don't think a thousand goals is gonna happen. I don't think it's in their reach, eh? I mean, listen, based on what he's done this year and think a thousand goals is gonna happen. It's in there in the reach. I mean Listen based on what he's done this year and what he does every year of his career I think Ovechkin could continue to play and score for the next four or five years Not at the same club. Yeah, 41. Yeah with a bad injury The broken leg like I think this guy could be 43 44 wheeling out there and score 20 or 25

But what like 1,000 is an arbitrary number. The chase was Gretzky. Yeah that's he got him. So I think this personally I think it's damage control because I think they might be prepping for it to be his last year. They may know it's his last year. They may want to move past him at some point too. Like we talked about you put your business hat on yes he is the Washington Capitals but there is times where you're trying to go at some point the wheels are gonna fall off and he's gonna get 12 goals. You got to get ahead of that too right? Gretzky scored what nine in his last year? Like

that you know that's not Wayne Gretzky that's it used to be Wayne Gretzky. That's, it used to be Wayne Gretzky. That's, you know, it's a shell. Yeah, and Gretzky took it upon himself to walk away. Check, please. I would think Ovechkin will do the same thing. Like, I just feel like guys at that level, they don't have to be dragged away from the game. They don't want to be embarrassed. Right, right.

They see the writing on the wall and he's done it all. He's accomplished everything. And if you're in Washington, this guy has given you 20 years Yeah Of production and sales and tickets. Yeah, obviously he's won Yeah, so I don't know I just That that's got to be somebody got in trouble for that dude You got to be losing your mind if that's on your if that's your on your watch like your email account

Who sent that out? Oh, it was Brian Hayes. It's an intern. What if you got the renewal? Then you're good. That's a good point. What if ticket holders were like, take my money, here's my card, charge me whatever you want, and you go in and say, listen, maybe I jumped a gun,

but hey, we're really making some scratch here. So you think it's somebody that was innovative, was like, hey, I'm gonna do this. Possibly. Because he's working on commission. Exactly. Hey, I'm gonna double down. Like, I get 10% of everything I bring in the week here I'm gonna yeah I'm not letting someone else see it's a month end he wants to hit his month-end sales I could be making stuff up that could be it that may actually be brilliant maybe he's playing 40 chess we're all out here

playing check Alex thinking old me himself yeah he's done brilliant that's where that's where Ovi has to maybe make like a statement on Instagram like he'll do it knows where Ovi I'm playing and look I I guarantee you he's not ripped he hasn't been working out since the end of the scene no chance you see those videos of him in the summer midsummer that guy's workout routine halfway through the year is a disaster in month if In May if he's not not still playing, it's not good. Here's Pierre LeBrun, our TSN hockey insider. Pierre, is Alex Ovechkin playing hockey beyond next year in the National

Hockey League? Yeah I don't think he's made that decision but I think more likely than not he is not. So I saw what happened there today obviously the marketing side got tripped up with the hockey side there, but you know, he's got a year left on his deal and he's up there. As you guys just talked about, so if I had to guess, I would say probably is, but I honestly don't think he decides that.

I can tell you that I think the team is pretty embarrassed at what happened today, from my understanding is. team is pretty embarrassed at what happened today, from my understanding is. You know, my sense of it is that it was an employee kind of acting on their own, with good intentions of course, but that was not a message from the hockey side for them to do that. So, not a great day for the Caps, but everyone's turned the page. But you know, listen, I get what you guys are saying, and he's built like a tank, and

he can still keep playing. I just kind of wonder about the motivation past next season, in my opinion. That's fair. What about the motivation of a guy named Jonathan Taze? Oh, good segue. I thought you were going to go to O'Dogs 64. No, that's fake news anyway. He didn't really shoot that. There's a lot of people shooting it down right now. Oh good segue. I thought you were gonna go to Oh dog 64. No There's a lot of people shooting it down right yeah

84 Okay, cuz I once shot a 64 myself, but on the front nine. Okay. All right. All right me too, buddy me too No, yeah Johnson pays You know, I love hearing good news stories like this and Taze, as I reported, reached out to his agent, Pat Bresson, yesterday at Noodles and said, I'm a go. I want to come back 100%. And, you know, I was just talking with the team that reached out to me after I put out the tweet. They were wondering where Tej was at. And what I told his team is the same thing I would say right now.

You guys have been around Jonathan Tej. If he says he's 100% committed to come back next year, he's 100% committed. The way that he is wired suggests to me that he would not want to waste anyone's time. That would embarrass him. He's been, it's been, he's been gone two years. This is a big challenge here, but he's been working out, uh, since the middle of winter, uh, the routine is actually calling Pat Brisson before the March 7th trade deadline checking on him as a late season ad, but you know,

Tate wasn't ready for that. He wanted to make sure he was 100% ready for the fall and made the decision yesterday that he likes where he's at physically. And and Pat Brisson has indicated he's going to start talking to teams are at the combine Buffalo coming up. So what an interesting pick up for a team. I mean, you know, this isn't a bank breaker here because he's 37. And with two years away from the game

this can be one of those bonus fields that barely touches your cap and so you can put this guy in your third or fourth line if you're a contender and just I think reap the benefits. Yeah championship DNA he's got that championship DNA Pierre and apparently that is what Brad Tre-living is looking for he said the DNA of the Maple Leafs has got to change what is your interpretation of that in terms of players leaving in terms of players coming in I tell you what there's a lot of crushing Jonas next because the segues between you noodles right now Brian. Crushing it. These guys are professionals one of these guys is

nominated for a Canadian Screen Award. I hate when we bring that up. He's a favorite. Yeah. Thank you. I mean, that's the only mention that every time I talk to him. Right. But, you know, yeah, no, I mean, I was at the news conference today along with Jonas and CJ and everyone else. And obviously the money quote is the DNA quote. And you know, let's see what that means in action. But I think that was set on purpose and it came for context. It came right after you talked about his disappointment in June 5 and gave him seven.

I also think that he's in a position now to actually do something about it, not just because obviously Marner may force the issue anyway, terms of changing the DNA, but because Shanahan's gone. And listen, on the one hand, Tree Living was crushed when Brendan Shanahan was let go. Those two forged a really close relationship. And it took, I think it took Brad Trewling a few days to get his head space in the right place because of that. But after meeting with Keith Pelley, and the one thing about where Tree Living is now

is that this is his team more than ever. And he does not have the loyalty factor to the Santa plan or to anyone involved in the past. He can make this team whatever he wants. And forcibly he's gonna have to anyway. Well, so Pierre, perfect segue. Don Tavares, we talked about him earlier in the show, and we all kind of noted that it was a little interesting that when Bradshaw living was asked

about it, he didn't like definitively say really anything like we want him back. We're gonna like, did you find that interesting? Or do you just think he is kind of keeping his options and cards, think he is kind of keeping his options and cards, I guess, open? So yeah, and it's a good question, Jonas. I actually clarified that with Brad Truling after the news conference, and he did not mean that he wasn't interested in signing John DeVarious. What he meant to say, and I guess they come across clearly, is that he does not and will not comment on the contract negotiations. So I think he got misconstrued. Uh, and I clarified that with him after he was not commenting either way on

where this was headed with Taveras and Marner. So, uh, I, I think, I think, I think Taveras ends up back as a leaf. Um, but you know, what's happening right now in the office, the beliefs there at, at Pro Performance Center is will have a huge impact on where this all goes. They've been in pro scouting meetings every day or for a few days and he's truly been one of those meetings before today's Leafs conference. He went back in them after today's and they're looking at every single possibility around the League. They're putting up trade targets on the whiteboard they're looking at life after

Marlin if that's what happens they're looking at what number works for Tiberius or if they can't sign them higher place in they're going through all those machinations as we speak well ball the you know the four of us around this hit here yeah so I guess you know, ultimately the DNA conversation, in your opinion, or based on what you just said, is that simply Marner then? Like if Tavares is going to come back, then the way the DNA changes is Mitch Marner, and it may not even be their decision, it's that Mitch just wants to leave. So what does that accomplish in the end if you know Marner's the only guy that goes and Tavares returns and a lot of the core

players are back I believe you said earlier today Morgan Riley's not going anywhere. He's not gonna wave. He's not gonna wave so I guess they're not even gonna bother asking him. So you know listen Marner leaving is significant I'm not downplaying that if that happens if he walks that's huge has been here for nine years he's a big part of the culture that they built here but in your opinion here with that is that enough like with that basically uh...

without allow you to look back on what you're living said today and and give them that check in the box and said he accomplished that i would say a lot we's re-examine this in September when we're all back from shooting 64s every day in our golf case because you know I think that I think by the end of the scouting meetings I think the Leafs are going to have a pretty aggressive game plan. I don't know what it looks like yet because they don't know. They're going through all the machinations right now. I don't think Marner's potentially leading

is the only thing. I think the least are getting involved in a lot of trade discussions to try and impact what they have here is my thought. And again, I think a lot of that is because there's an acknowledgement from Brad Treelifting that as improved as this team was this year from last year, I think it really was under Clint Brewer Bay. It's still not good enough.

And, and it's, you know, one of the acknowledgements from tree living today, and I gotta be careful. I'm not reading too much into it, but I don't know what you guys think. He can't live in the fact that he's only been here two years and Craig Brewer Bay has only been here one year. Like in fact, he leaves it to seven to Florida. Heck, the least might have ended up giving Florida the puck of stuff by the time this is all done, these playoffs, let's see.

But that's not what this is about. If that was good enough, ownership wouldn't have fired Brendan Janis. This is about nine years of DNA to get back to DNA. And I think what Tree Living talked about today, to me, was the strongest I've heard him yet, acknowledging the playoff scarring and what transpired before he got here.

I think he was worried about going there before because he was new and was trying to gain the trust of these players and so on. I think today he's basically saying, okay, I get it, I'm with you guys on this now. Do you think it was weird that Keith Peli wasn't there? I mean he did tell you did warn everyone that the last Friday that that was their shot at him So I guess it wasn't weird to me if you're paying attention, you know, he's gonna have about one a year though He's not gonna be a lot of Keith Kelly news conferences

You know, so I guess I'm not perspective noodles, I didn't think it was strange. They wanted to do it together last week and as Trillind explained, he was back home for his daughter's graduation which we all understand. They should have done it together but the timing of all this wasn't in control. It brings me by the way, speaking of timing, to another point that is interesting with all this. If you go back to the start of Shanahan is that you know Shanahan comes in and then his one of his first big things he hires Mike Batcock then he hires Luam Morello and then if you keep looking at the lineage of all this it's interesting that the hires between GM and coaches never quite line up so like like

Trea Living now has two years left on the deal, and Craig Barubei has three years left on the deal. So dating right back to Shanahan, then Babcock, then Lamarello, then Dubas, and then Dubas of course fired Babcock, promoted Keefe. All these things have never quite lined up, and Keefe lasts a year past Dubas, which is strange in some ways, right. So there's actually an interesting line to, you know, to put through all of this in terms of not quite lining up the hires throughout the organization, which doesn't mean they can't figure this out. It's just

interesting. Can I ask all you guys a question? Is their setup now better? Because because like I I Understood and agree with the time had come for Brendan Shanahan, but now you just remove him They're weaker because they don't have a that's what I mean like rock hockey not sure that this is better It's what like he's a he's a regardless of what you believe about Brendan Shanahan his vision all of that He's still a darn good hockey mind right and someone for Brad tree living about he's not there so now you're gonna call Keith Pelly and go well I'm gonna sign this guy or I'm gonna do that and he's gonna go go ahead I trust you but Keith Pelly can't weigh in on the pros and cons of

signing that guy in the playoffs yeah no hockey right like you know like Brandon Shanahan does so I would be the first answer the organization is technically weaker today without Brandon Shanahan at least So I would be the first answer. The organization is technically weaker today without Brandon Shanahan at least being a sounding board for Brad Tree Living. Well, and that's why my question to Tree Living today was how he felt now that he's met with Pelly a bunch of times, how he felt his day to day was going to change. And, and you know, he was careful in his answers, as you might might suspect but I think he probably still wasn't going No, it's my guess like I think like is he is he going to Kelly every day for updates? Well here like, you know, you were at the skates like every single morning skate every practice

Who was standing there together? Pelly like her and she like hell he's not gonna be there. They were very close. Absolutely And well, actually the comment of the week I read, I might have been underneath one of your stories, Jonas, but one of our athletic readers suggested that the Overdrive trio of hosts, Lit by Noodle's Hayes and O'Dogs should be the new president of Rock in Toronto.

Brilliant. I didn't like that. I should have retweeted that somehow. I don't know how to do it from a technology point of view. Just tell Tree Living to call these guys when he wants to do something. Yeah, that's the way I would tell Tree. That's right. He can't afford us.

But they closed the loop on Shannon. I guess I would say this about, A, 11 years is a long time, but B, if the Leafs take that next step, and I don't think Brad Shielding is gonna be scared to be aggressive here, at the very least, and I said this at the onset, but I think this is an important nuance. He's gonna miss Shanahan for all the reasons you just said, Little, founding board and all, but he's also now freed of Shanahan's vision.

Like say what you want, but Shanahan hired tree living. And from that moment on two years ago, tree living to some degree is beholden to completing Shanahan's mission statement. That's just the reality. And so now he's freed of it. Now freedom is, uh, you know, that's a, that can go a lot of different ways. I mean, it's, it's, you know, yes, you're out of your company that uh... you know yet you freedom make make it your own team but now what what what you have i guess well that's what it comes down to i mean if if uh... again marna and savoris

they're the ones that are going to be highlighted between now and july first but matthew knives will be a part of this conversation as well as he's a restricted free agent and i i don't think this has come up enough either with the DNA of the organization we're focused on the players in the room and games and all that the organization needs to change their DNA also when it comes to propping up their own players and just paying them and overpaying them and never winning any negotiations like that's something that i think right really being

has to reflect upon again you talk about the shana hand shackles may be being removed that's this is an area where it should start right like we love you matthew nice we want to get something done we're not paying you a penny more than you get anywhere else it don't expect it because you're a maple leaf and because the other guys did. It's got to stop. It has to stop. Well and he doesn't have arbitration this summer so they can... Right....squeeze. But there is the one

thing that's looming. Offer sheet? Yeah. Yeah but they can just match right? You're right but that's overpaying because somebody will overpay on an offer sheet. Yeah you're right. Yeah and I feel like I'm the lone voice in the wilderness on that old subject noodles but the player have to be complicit in our future i don't i don't think any of any evidence of mapping eyes and i have to point blank on the block they are and the clean-up you know you have to be complicit in that scenario

i think about the boss in all of the complicit with an agent jerry johnson that they were going to do that contract with the Hab just so that Carolina can map it. I mean, it's... Yeah, you don't just say, Akrashid, and then... I get it, but my counter to that is, and I don't know who his agent is, and I'm just going to blanket this statement. I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but if the agent wants to be a dink and go, all right, well, you're going to, you know, tree your...

You're locking it down. well, we might have to look at other avenues. Because the agent could get in the year and go, okay, they wanna pay you four million a year on a bridge deal, two years at four on a bridge. I've got a team that wants to offer you eight on a seven year deal or whatever. Would you sign that?

Would you, again, this is an agent that's getting in the player's ear and believe me, agents do get into players ear regardless of what the player wants to do. The player can say, I want to stay, I want to do all this, let's just work it out. But when it comes to business, there could be some stupidity here. That's what I'm saying. And then it comes down to, I mean, I think that's completely in as a week. I don't know the young man well enough that I'm wrong about that. But I'll give you an example. When Ajo did that offer sheet with his agent, the same agent represented Braden Point who was also RFA that summer.

And I can guarantee you that Mark Bergevin, who was GM of the half of the time, actually went to Braden Point first and tried to see if that was an opposite situation for Montreal and and players like no I got a good thing going here in Tampa. I'm not messing with that even if it was just a for Tampa to match Braiden Point won no part of it and So this is my point about It's fine and dandy as an agent to say I got leverage and don't worry. You're not leaving the lease I'm just doing this to get you money. You still got to get in the mental place as a player where you're willing to take that risk and they'll relate to fan base.

And I don't know that Max United is, but the final point I'll make, because I thought, right, you bang on about future negotiations here. I will say like, Tree's, Brad Tree Living's first contract, major contract negotiation, if I got my dates right, was Neilander, which took a while. And it took a while because Tree Living actually did go pretty hard on that one. That was nasty at first between him and Lewis Gross in that negotiation. And I will tell you now that even maybe

if the number didn't end up where you want it, Brian, that's not a bad contract today, given whereelander is in this production and where the cap is going so I guess I would say is I think that tree living right out of the gates tried to go down that route in terms of we're not just giving you what you want yeah although I actually think his first one was Austin and it was blank paid blank check what do you want it's four years never ate you know it was Matthews and Matthews took them to the cleaners but boy good boy but you know leverage with your franchise well well or you

could say you know do you really want to be here do you really want to win DNA culture you know you could do that but well dry settle did it and McDavid did it anyway it doesn't matter doesn't matter we're moving on better at all no not moving on moving on all right Pierre good stuff buddy we'll do it again soon Pierre Lebrun our TSN hockey insider yeah it is a tough deal to walk right into though You got to do Matthews coming off of what 70 or heart I can't know it was the year before He didn't have a great year that year based on his standards. He had like 41 goals 42 goals

So there was some injury in that remember he wasn't yeah Yeah, but I guess was it after they beat floor they got to the floor Yeah, they've been tapped or and they got Listen, Austin was always gonna write his own ticket, I get it. And ultimately, the player is gonna make that call, and he made that call. But I'm always curious, like how much can you entice them? Are you comfortable in really trying to push them

in a direction, or is it, hey, you guys just tell us whatever you want. I think you can, if you have a good relationship with the agent, you tell them what you want and then you find out what he wants and you try and find common ground and you push the envelope. I mean, I'm sure the Leafs are like eight years, whatever the number, let's figure this out and they're like, well, hold on here, we want to go shorter. Okay, well, let's do six, you know, like, who knows?

It ended up at four. It ended up at four, yes. Which I'm guessing is exactly what Austin wanted. Of course. And I don't think the Leafs got anything out of that deal. But they got Austin Matthews. They got Matthews. Met to the organization.

Who's a player. For four more years, on top of the year that he was on. So it was really a five year deal. Yeah, it was an extension. Right. Yes, you still got three years left. Yeah. And Austin's not going anywhere.

Willie's not. Obviously, it doesn, and Austin's not going anywhere Willie's not Obviously doesn't sound like Riley's going anywhere. So if those three guys are coming back, those are three guys who've been here for a long time What does Morgan have left five? Yeah five years at seven and a half million per year What do you think the best contract that they've gotten in this era is? Like it's hard off the top of your head, but'm trying to think. It's probably Nozom like his first year like. Four and a half years. Brilliant deal.

Six years four and a half even I think Riley's was six at five wasn't it like the first one? That was pretty good. That was a good deal. That's a good question. Yeah they haven't gotten a ton. Yeah like they haven't had brutal deals because they've had good players. What's the worst then? You know what I mean?

Like they had David Clarkson. Clarkson. Clarkson was a bad one. Clarkson was the bad one. They haven't gotten a ton. Yeah, like they haven't had brutal deals because they've had good players. What's the worst then? You know what I mean? Like they had David Clarkson. Clarkson. Clarkson was the previous administration. Marlowe is in the conversation. Marlowe's in the conversation.

That was what, three years at seven? Zaitsev is the top of the mountain and I would say Marlowe would be in contention. Wasn't Zaitsev like four million a year though? Seven years, I think it was four and a half. Yeah, it was like four and a half, but like there was no need for a long-term deal. It was totally unnecessary.

Yeah, he went to Ottawa and then Chicago. Well, they had to flip him with Dion and Connor Brown. Yeah. Right? Wasn't it, did Dion go on that deal? Maybe Dion didn't go on that deal. Connor Brown went in that deal. Connor Brown, Dion went maybe a little bit earlier than that. Anyway, all right, best bets coming up later in the hour. Cheryl Pounder will join us around the table. Overdrive continues. TSN 1050N

on TSN 2. All right, we'll get to our best bets later in the hour. We've got a hockey game tonight, a basketball game tonight. The Jays are playing the athletics. Should be the Sacramento athletics. It should be. Soon to be Vegas athletics. Are they terrible too? No, actually. Actually, they're better. Well well it's relative. They're almost as good as the J's. Okay. I know but what does that mean? Well they've been really bad for a long time. I understand. The J's are supposed to be good. Are they? And they're not. No they're not. Cheryl Pounder's with us. What's up Cheryl? Not much just got back from the PWHL you know the finals. So I was running around going back and forth eating a lot of snacks every

single game went overtime so that was nuts. I saw that my boy Rob Pizzo who I love. Oh Rob's awesome. He was bringing me snacks. No pickle juice or mustard but we managed to get something. Voice would go like you're triple overtime right? We had a triple, three singles but in the semis we went almost the distance on a full four. So I wonder whether they'll table a different format going forward. We might be for it. Three on three or something? I don't know maybe five on five one then four on four and maybe three on three. I mean as an athlete I kind of you know I want to say five on five, but then I do understand, you know. It's a lot. It's a lot. It's a lot.

So, Minnesota's won now back-to-back years. How do we frame this in terms of dynasties and stuff? Like, the league is growing, but it's so early into the process here. How would you describe, like, have they clearly been the best team, you know, through the two years in your opinion? Well, they've clearly been the best when the time has mattered, right? So, because they've limped in. Yeah, I was going to say, I thought I heard they weren't the best team, they just happened to win at the right time.

Exactly, but that's when you're supposed to win. Well, I mean, if you look at it, so there was a Super Saturday, and I call it Super Saturday because the three and four seed, which wind up clinching Ottawa and Minnesota, they got in on that last day. And then they were able to knock off the 1 and 2 and get to the final and then Minnesota going back to back. But depth was critical for them. I think when you play that many over times, your depth is fresh. You're a fresher, shall I say.

And so Minnesota's depth got it done for them in game three and four in the overtime to win it. But great goaltending, back and forth goaltending, good pace. I don't know how they had their legs, especially in game number four in the opening period. But they did. So good for them. Yeah, it was great. It was great. Do you agree with, and we talked about it on our show, there was one, you know, series where the team chose the team. Montreal chose Ottawa instead of Minnesota. Yeah, so basically with the PWHL, they say they've kind of written their own rule book. I actually like it, guys, because they're saying, listen, we want to be entertaining.

We want to recognize year by year, you know, what kind of changes we need to make. And so they decided, yeah, the number one seed gets to choose three or four. And so there's a little bit of bulletin board material there, right? A little bit of, you chose us. I mean, Ottawa charge, the fans were chanting that when they won. You chose us. It was actually hilarious. But yeah, whether it's the jailbreak, you know, you get out of the box, you know, if your team score is short-handed.

And then they also had a no escape rule this year, which they implemented, which basically was trying to generate a little more offense on power place. So the offending team had to stay on the ice. So the group that was on the ice. So let's say you have, you know, it's your center that takes the penalty. Well, who's going to go in the dot? Or it's usually, you know, it could be a defender. So now you've got three forwards and a D on the ice and so you know at least to start so it's kind of

changes you know the dynamic of the specialty teams and sort of the approach you know if you're in a delayed penalty give it to them you know you want those players to stay on the ice do you not where are you on the ice so there's just so much to kind of lean into. How long do you think they'll they'll test these things out before the PWHL and maybe filters throughout the women's game in general? They go, okay, we've hit it, we got it, we like this formula, we're going with it. Well, I think it'll stay within the professional ranks. I think the only thing that would be up for discussion potentially would be sort of the

contact and the physicality within the game because all of a sudden you get there and you learn it on the fly a little bit. So I think that that could be something that gets broached at the highest levels underneath if they do decide to go to that. But in terms of all of these other things, jail breaks, I think they'll be housed in the PWHL because they've kind of got their own constitution. They can do whatever they want. But yeah, especially with expansion, we'll see what happens.

But they've always said they don't necessarily want to play it safe. If they get it wrong, they can claw back. Yeah, exactly. Which I like. Yeah, it's your league. Exactly. It's their league.

And the first jailbreak was Emma Malté last year. And I had to remind myself, right? Because you're like, wait a second, she's out of the box. Yeah, what's going on here? Right? This is this, you know, and everyone's going nuts. And it's just a different approach now all of a sudden on the pk it's a little more aggressive depending on where you are in the game

so maybe it's like a power kill mentality so yeah just just changes the dynamic of who you play on a pk too if you need a goal absolutely sure pounder with us around the table you and noodles and dregs and dothi will be on the panel tonight game five Oilers stars we haven't mentioned Thomas Harley coming out basically saying I'm happy Hyman's out not playing but he's just being honest I mean why wouldn't you be like I get that it's uncomfortable because the guy's injured now he's gonna be out and he's likely done for the year but if you're Dallas that clearly is a massive advantage that Hyman's not playing tonight. 100% I mean don't you this is a top-tier players got the most hits in the playoffs like

he is a guy that is an engine that drives a line i mean the comments i don't we play the comments on the plane let's let's let's play these do this was thomas harley earlier today on hymen not plan he's a great player he's playing very physically which i think the defenseman noticed And even when he's not scoring he'd be affecting the game in that way. So You know, I'm happy he's not playing obviously injuries suck But you know, he's a good player and he's not on their team. They're a little bit worse. Yeah 100% accurate everyone's thinking what's right?

He says it out loud right I mean, you know, they're not a better team without them. So if you're Harley and you're paying the price down low because he's consistently hitting in the game, you know, he's thinking he just said it. That's really the difference. Jess Ginard who's replacing him, not gonna run him over. Guess what they'd also like? McDavid to get hurt. In warm-up tonight, not play. And then dry-le, and then, like, that's what you want. Like, I get it. It sounds weird, but it's a massive competitive advantage.

And they need it because they're down 3-1 in the series. Well, yeah, and, you know, depending on, you know, Dallas, right, they're such a good team. They're so fast, they can play off the rush, and Edmonton's done such a good job negating that. But when you look at the physicality I mean you don't just replace as that kind of right, you know whether Corey Perry plays up there or not, you know, you can get net front but you're not Zach Hyman, right? You're not you're not bringing that game. They're not then he's not wrong. It's just and you I just didn't hear Edmonton You know when hints were about

Probably playing though. Game time decision that he didn't get a chance on the quote. He took warm-up and then didn't play but you know and then Bouchard gave him a whack on the laces last game. That's right. So you're right it's a competitive. They won game three when Hintz didn't play. It was good for them. It worked out in the end. And they're trying. Listen they're trying. We were talking about it off air. Like selfishly we want Edmonton to get through so we can have a night off in the end i mean i think i was gonna be pushed tonight and and why would they in their own but it'd be nice to get the good first goal though and not chase the game i think that's been a big thing for them right chasing the game in every single game so

so we'll see if it the net right they've got a long way thirty nine shot attempts fifteen miss net in the first period yet in the first period alone Yeah, in the first period alone. There's the analytics guy. You'd be, I'm not. Yeah, I'm not. I just, I'm not an, you're not an analytics guy. Is this with you guys?

I'm, we're such cavemen. Everybody's an analytics guy compared to us. Yes. I'd like us to, oh, the guy who sits next to us. Oh, in particular. Okay, but there is a time though, right, when you're like, oh, that was a miss, oh, that was a miss, oh oh that was a miss, oh that was a miss, oh that was a miss. And then you kind of look at it and you're like, okay, the eye test matches. A lot of the time you'll look at it and you'll be like, yeah, whatever,

or you'll be looking for a trend. But in that scenario when they continue to miss, especially when they're in high danger spots and had some good high danger looks. Well, that might be the Skinner effect because he he's a monster. Yeah. Right. Like you've talked about it with big goalies when they're in the when they're in rhythm and they're playing well and they're that big. Yeah. You feel like you got to be perfect and when you're shooting to be perfect it generally doesn't work a lot. Like yeah. You do have to like sometimes I would rather and at DeBork kind of came out and almost stopped short of it the other night, the 15 missed shots, if they get seven more shots on goal, even if they

don't score, that's rebounds, that's drawing penalties, that's creating havoc right down at the net. Instead of missing the net and going off the glass and now you're chasing it and you're worried about 97 and 29 going the other way, speed, maybe picking up something off the glass. So, you know, I think that will be their focus There's slight adjustments. It's these games haven't been six one. I mean on the score sheet They have been but they from a chance standpoint. They haven't been they've been a lot closer than you think

Yeah, like a lot closer. Yeah, and Skinner's been a big part of that. Yeah, dude. It's been huge. Absolutely He's been huge Cheryl Pounder with us So another truth is that Florida wants Dallas to win tonight, you would think, right? Just extend the series. Extend it. Where are you at with Florida like this year compared to last or even the year before? I mean, three straight cup finals. It's incredibly impressive. Recency bias, but it feels like they're better than ever. And they're almost unstoppable. Up and down the lineup, right? I mean, up and down the lineup. just watching them against Keynes, just the

pressure they apply on their opponent. I mean it's not just the first guy that pays the price, it's the second guy in and then it's the third guy in and I mean imagine a young guy playing against that team just going what is coming at me right now and I find that that's the thing, right? It's up and down the lineup. It's not just one or two guys. They've all kind of bought into what it takes and fighting for those spots on the ice, trying to win those puck battles. But it's that disruption right away.

So that second quick, that second guy comes in, next thing you know, he's hit too. And then the next one, and he's down. So I just find it's just a wave. But it's up and down the lineup, guys. Yeah, they are so good. I mean, that third line, like it's absolutely incredible in the timing of the goals, even if it was, you know, the fourth line contributing, you know, just when you have a connected lineup like that, it's just saying something and they're going to be a tough tough out.

I agree. And they're mean too. That's the one thing. There was a, they had a, the broadcast had a, you know, kind of a video montage of every player that came off the bench would just take a piece of somebody. You know, even at a whistle, like a little shot here, a little punch there. It's just, Florida's got this mindset, and it is, to a man. Doesn't matter if you're Marshan Kachak or even a guy like Barkov, Given Push or Reinhardt, they're all in there. They've got that pack, and I know it's such a cliche, that wolf mentality,

the pack mentality, they have it. And they're in on everything. Yeah, crazy. Yeah, they are. And, you know, this is where you need the combination of that and the skill and the talent, right? It's their DNA tangibles and tangible. Oh, God.

I think I'm gonna be really tired of DNA in like two weeks. Yeah, there was a lot of that chatter today. What are you bracing for this offseason with the Maple Leafs? I think there's gonna be change. If you're making comment about DNA, that's like fabric. Yes, you cannot change. And again, I'm not him, it's not coming out of my mouth, but if you were to interpret it, when I interpret it, DNA, like when you're talking about a team, it's like

the fabric of your team. And so I go right to, you know, sort of the bullets. And so, you know, your core, your core DNA, your core fabric, which would lead you to believe there's going to be some significant change. Because yeah, that's what it is, right? Like it's, it's, it's not necessarily, I don't think it's a mindset. That's, that's completely different is right like it's it's it's not necessary and I don't think it's a mindset that's that's completely different to me yeah it's it's yeah it's your DNA it's how you ticket I would just be worried like that you swing too far the other way and you just go too intangibly which isn't a word but you

know yeah no I understand what you're saying and that's on true living to make sure that there's balance I mean again you're gonna have a lot of players still returning. You're not turning most of the team over Yeah, exactly. There's like 70 80 percent of your team is probably gonna return So with that in mind, you know, how much can you really change? But it does it does seem like with what the Marner stuff is where we're going. We've been talking about it for weeks We're gonna talk about it for another month you know the idea of where he could end up next like let's presume he leaves Toronto you guys have anywhere in a ranking actually you have a ranking no I did this the other day we were

talking about it internally okay just batten around just let me just bring it down what I had in my thing. All right. What do you have, a five pack? I had five teams. I'm trying to remember what the fifth team was. Go ahead. The five teams that I had, and this is just me.

They make the most sense from order in which way? Because you make the most money, because you'd have a bigger role, because they can win. Like what? Combination of all of those things. Okay. What do you have? So should I rank them in order? No, go from...

All right, I'll just give you five. Vegas. Okay, what do you have? So should I rank them in order? No, go for... All right, I'll just give you five. Vegas. Okay, yeah. Tampa. Florida. Colorado. Carolina. What do you think of those? Oh, and the other team was LA. Yes, see LA, I feel... See, it's interesting you say that because I don't see how he walks into a room in Florida. Like everything you just said. Why? They'll be like, you can just be one of us. This is not Toronto. He's not one of us. He's not one of them.

And your head's going to pop off. The only way he ends up in Florida is either low double digits, like 10 million a year, or something under that. Yeah. Exactly. They're not, that will kill you if that happens. A question though, you got a winning formula there. Yep. And we talked about DNA. They clearly have a specific DNA. But, that, so you want to just, but remember what did people

say about Seth Jones before he went there? It's like this guy, analytics are terrible. And then he goes there and it's like, oh my God, this guy's amazing. Whose spot is he taking there? I don't know. That would my question I do net I'll never underestimate that front office because we look at them and like they can't do that and they're like yeah actually we can do that we'll just trade for bad March and it's like oh yeah but that's you're right but the rest of the league was stupid not to jump in on you're right including this the team in this town unless March and just told Boston yeah and that is very possible that is very possible but one thing i would say is if barner goes to florida

and takes less that will blow open this the state tax conversation in this week people and deservedly so because there's a split conversation is it a story is it not a story what about all those years were didn't work with florida if margaret goes in in, I'll go to Florida for 10 because it's actually more money, then there's just no hiding it anymore.

I mean the other way where he goes, I know I can't win here, but I think I can win there. Now if that's the argument, then okay, that is something that also people up here would be disappointed with because, well why did you show up in the big moments to help them win? You've had ample opportunity, but it would go again.

Then why did you demand all that money six years ago? Why did you hold out if it wasn't about money and winning all of a sudden it's about winning when you leave? I feel like it's more like an Anaheim. That's what I know. Yes. Why? Because they're an up and coming team.

Joel Grinvold just got there. Grinvold's a great coach. You've got some young talent. You've got to get to the playoffs. As far away from Toronto as you can get. Then sign in LA at least. Well maybe he will. Maybe ready to. Maybe he will. Maybe LA. What about Utah? Exactly. Why? I see Utah. I think Utah is up and coming. If you actually look at their roster they've got some good young players. They do. Yeah. And they've got some draft picks coming. Again, we're looking at the team now.

Bill Armstrong could have a really good summer and go, I want Marner and because they've got money to spend and they've got currency drafts. What about this team? Nashville. Yeah. They trade Marsh or so. I could see Barry's drawing stumbling down. I mean, I guess it's what's important.

Brian O'Reilly's there. They're not winning. They come like. I hear you. Maybe that's not. I mean, I guess it's what's important to him. Brian O'Reilly's there. They're not winning. I hear you. Maybe that's not important. Like, I don't know. I don't know. If it is winning, then those teams you mentioned

make a ton of sense. Like Colorado to me would make a ton of sense. Like play with McKinnon. They have that money. But they weren't willing to pay Ranton. Why would they pay him? That's a good question. Anyway.

Yeah, you're exactly right on that. I'm like, I'm going bingo. Anyway. Overdrive after hours. After hours. We'll pick this up next. Good seeing you, Cheryl. Thanks for coming in.

Thanks, guys. There's Cheryl Pounder, your catcher on the panel tonight. The Hot Zone, right? You guys rocking the Hot Zone on YouTube. We're up on YouTube live right now on the TSN YouTube channel. Overdrive continues.

TSN 1050 and on TSN 2 All right today's best bets are powered by Fando make your picks and assemble a same game parlay in seconds on the fan dual sportsbook app I Was on Florida last night, I thought I would just come to an end I hit that parlay last night, too Did you yes Panthers win at Barkov and Reinhardt to record points? They needed that for Hagee goal to do that. They ended up with multiple points in the end Because Bennett's going the OT winner or in the empty net. Yeah tonight though I'm going the opposite way I'm going Dallas wins to keep the series alive tonight and Miko Rantanen's got a snap out of it

Yeah, any time point tonight for Rantanen. That's paying like plus 110 It's basically a pick them but I'm on the stars and ranted in to record a point today's best bets powered by Fandel live same game parlays are now available for every Stanley Cup playoff game on the Fandel sportsbook app please play responsibly 19 plus physically located in Ontario alright thanks to everyone behind the scenes for helping out we appreciate it everyone for tuning in today TV radio podcast web and of course up on YouTube live every show up on YouTube on the TSA comments every YouTube channel comments everything is posted afterwards you can go watch the whole show you can

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