OverDrive - OverDrive - November 19, 2025 - Hour 1 - Steve Phillips

Episode Date: November 19, 2025

Join Bryan Hayes, Jeff O'Neill and Jamie McLennan for Hour 1 on OverDrive! The guys discuss the Maple Leafs snapping their losing streak against the Blues, William Nylander's strong performance and his profound goal, Auston Matthews' persisting injury concerns, the team's injury bug and it's only 20 games but in the NHL. TSN Baseball Insider Steve Phillips joins to discuss the headlines around the offseason in MLB, Bo Bichette's next steps with the Blue Jays and Kyle Tucker's sweepstakes in the league.

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But it's so worth it. Visit bell.ca for more details and to check availability. Bell, Connection is everything. This hour of overdrive is powered by Fandul. Fanduil, bringing you everything from the opening line to the final score. All right, here we go, Overdrive, Off and Running, TSN 1050 on the TSN app, your home smart speaker, and up on TSN4, Brian Hayes, the O'Dog, Jeff O'Neill, Jamie Noodles-McKennan.

What's going on, guys? What's going on? How are we feeling today? Jamie, great to see you. The other guy? You have a troll of goon fan base that drive me insane. Oh, yeah. Really?

I have minions. Is that what you're telling me? No, the Hayes followers, and with no disrespect to you, they're the same guy. It's like a 60-year-old guy who's a nerd, and they always come up to me, and they're like, you should take what he says more seriously. And I'm like, who? Hayes. And I just say, well, why do I not take, and they have no.

don't know what they're talking of it they're just like because i always called them out i'm like what does he say that i don't take seriously and they're just like well it's just he his opinions are all you know valid and this and i'm just like it's great i think his opinions are great and then they scatter away it's the same guy every time they don't scatter they don't scatter it's your uncle it's not my uncle it's it could be you have the the nerdiest following maybe we all do who knows we all do but you're following following i got a great following i got a great following i have an intelligent following that's what i have no i don't because your following bothers me in public all them it's it's the same guy well then i love you can have a different

colored hat on a different pair of jeet's the same guy every time it's like he's following around to make my noodles do you have the same experience or people bothering you out there i hope not i don't have your i don't have your uncle chasing me around or whatever it is but don't i don't All I can picture is the guy from Happy Gilmore. That's what it is. Like, Jackass, that's what it is. It's not, that guy. It's not like badgering.

It's just always like, hey, love overdrive. Maybe you should take AIDS more seriously. I love that guy. I love those. Those are my people. You know, there's a movement happening. But then the follow-up is, well, what do I not take seriously about him? Well, I don't know.

It just seems like something. It's funny. No one's ever done that to me. Like, no one's ever come up to me. It said you've got to take Jeff O'Neil more seriously. Maybe there's no such thing. Maybe I'm not a serious guy and it's not necessary. Well, or maybe I take you seriously.

Maybe I show you a level of respect. It's not necessary for your minions to express that type of opinion. So what your pigeon nerds are saying is I don't show you enough respect. I guess, and I'd call them an army. I wouldn't call them pigeon nerds. You don't have the right to call me a group of gentlemen and army. Because if I put them all together, they're weasels that got their lunch stolen every day. That's who they are.

This is a Hayes Army, and they watched that guy on the panel last night. He was high stepping, you know, by the end. We were asleep. We were asleep until all the overtime. Any word? Any word? I haven't been called in. I'm like Brendan Little sitting in the bullpen.

The game's on TSN tomorrow night. I said, I'm around. If you want the Leafs to get a win tomorrow against Columbus, right? Whenever we're there, they win, whenever the overdrive crew. Now, noodles is at Anaheim, so you're going to be calling a Sends game tomorrow. so that's obviously out of the question but yeah i guess whenever whenever we're kicking around as a three-pack it seems to work out for the lease and their credit they got a way to win goodness they needed two points hey they got two points but got it done this this wasn't the

post game question but what is your takeaway from the game one of mine is shame on the st louis blues. Wasn't that kind of a full roster for them? Yeah, they're in a really weird, bad place. I don't know what happened there. But, yeah, listen, the Leafs, obviously the Willie own goal was really strange. And noodles, I was telling you during the game last night, and I looked it up again today, they did not register that as a shot on goal against Joseph Wall.

It's really weird. I don't know what happened there or why they didn't. But, you know, I thought. but the Leafs responded really well and through 30 minutes of the game the Leaves were in control. Then I thought St. Louis took control. I thought both teams probably looked at each other like

we expected they would, saying well, we can get these guys. If we're going to beat anyone, it's going to be this team tonight. The least are so depleted. Like there's so many injury problems. But yeah, the Blues are in a really weird place and they're both

probably happy. They got a point, like you said last night, noodles. And then someone had to fight for the extra one, and it happened to turn into one of the nicest goals you're ever going to see, you know? Like, it was just a beautiful, beautiful goal set up by John Tavares, just battling and grinding and, you know, finding a way to win that puck, and Morgan Riley comes in, like, the third tenor. Like, he's on the game sheet. No one's even paying attention to Riley. He was in the right place at the right time and makes a great pass to Neelander. and, you know, Neelander, this backhanded toe drag is so nasty.

Dude, I think it adds insults. Like, it's not like I tow dragged you. It's, I tow dragged you in that little spice with putting it under the backhand part of the blade is so disgusting and dirty that it's just incredible move. Like, to pull that off in the NHL, a lot of guys try that around the pylons, the McDavid plastic sticks and stuff. but that's just, that's as good as a goal as you're going to score in the league. There's just no other way around. It is, too. He added in, like, here's the other thing.

If they poke that, if he tries that move and it gets poked and they go three on one the other way and score, what are we talking about? This guy's dinking around on the ice, right? Like, it's an unbelievably skilled move that he pulled off, and it was awesome and like a highlight real. Like you say, one of the best goals of the season for sure already, like unbelievable. but all you can think about is like to have the confidence to do that because I don't think he did much during the game like none of them really did it was kind of a quiet day wasn't the Rilly and John show last night yeah but they did a great job they did a great job and that's the difference remember I was talking about in our pregame saying you know last year's identity

you know two two game and then somebody's a difference maker right like that's that's what showed up last night is a difference maker was Willie and John, right? The elite talent showed up because they didn't have much during the regular, you know, during the game type of thing, the 60-minute game. It was a dog's breakfast of a game,

but you don't criticize a win and top talent grabbed you an extra points. That's really what happened. Yeah, it's a separator. What it allowed Willie to do was have fun, you know, about that own goal. You know, he could have great lines. Yeah, I got two tonight.

That guy doesn't have a pulse. First of all, he got interviewed maybe the morning of the game or the day before Brian, and he was like, wow, we keep doing this for a month, and we got a serious problem. I was like, this guy just doesn't, like, not that he doesn't care, but he doesn't get stressed over anything. And then when he bunted the goal at, you see him go back to the goaltender, and he's like, sorry, pal, I was just a mistake. And he just skates back, and that's part of what makes him William Neelander, where he just brushes it off and away he goes, man. that's how he's wired and like there's a part of me that thinks even if they lost one nothing

he'd still joke about it because that's how he rolls you know yeah he'd be like i got a screw there i tried to bat the puck out of the year and it went in our own net yeah but it's a double-sided with him because in the playoffs when he charges in the corner and then bales out on a hit everyone's like well that's just the casual attitude of william neelander and who knows if you're ever going to win that because he never wants to pay the the price. And then you see that there he is talking to the goaltender. It's, ah, sorry, pal, nothing to see here.

And then he scores a goal like that, and you're like, that's just William Nylander. That's just the way, that's how cool and good he is. So it's like there's, it's the... It's a roller coaster, but it's a fun one. The good and bad, right? The good and bad. And the high... Six, seven, possibly? Oh, a little six, seven. Okay, there you go. Look at you.

Catching up with the times, even though I'm not sure. His brother taught me well. It's still a thing anymore but what like willie did there in overtime there's like you know point one percent of the league can do that you know like point one percent that's exactly him or jesus 20 guys maybe yeah 15 guys in the league 20 guys that have the ability the confidence to pull it off and he shook off bittington too like that's the thing like he got bittington off that post with that jimmy into the middle of the ice which is pretty incredible yeah um But, yeah, listen, it wasn't the greatest game in the world.

But if you're the Leafs, what stuck out to me, he asked off the top there, obviously Willie's rolling it all on how crazy it was. But Joseph Wall being back is very significant. Like, very – and I got to give him full credit because I didn't know what to expect, and it's only two games, but he has looked really good. He's looked really good through two games. And missing training camp, missing the first six weeks of the season, that may catch up to him at some point.

not having Stolars. I don't know when Stolos is returning. No one has a clue. So let me ask you this, Brian. So everybody gets back and do they just start cooking like they were in the playoffs? Like was it just Joseph Wall missing from the equation? Because I'm not buying into that either. No, I don't think they've earned that level of expectation.

And I'm not going to go nuclear today. It's like they got to win. It's positive day, but it's not all like, I don't know if everybody gets healthy. and it just, Joseph Wall was the missing piece, and that's why things went to, you know what. And that's not necessarily what I'm saying. I just, I'm pointing out an individual player last night where the blues went out of them in the third period.

Like, they went out of them, and he made some really good saves. And listen, they're 9-9-2. It's been ugly. They have not played well. The stats would indicate all that. We've talked about it endlessly for weeks. But 9-9-2, if that is your rock bottom, and it has to be like we've established.

That's a good rock bottom to start at. You know, it could be 5, 12, and, you know, whatever. And then you're really in trouble. Like, at least from a point perspective, guys will return. I don't think they can play worse than they played through 20 games. No, that's impossible. So that's the glass to have full. It's not swinging it into, okay, now they're going to launch into this juggernaut team.

They don't deserve that level of, I think, confidence and expectation right now. But guys are going to return, like the nice stuff. We did the show expecting them to play. We got to the pregame four minutes later, and he was hurt. Guys are dropping like flies right now. It's crazy. That's a weird one, too. And I don't know.

Again, I was on a plane this morning, but any reports coming out? Like, anybody skating? What's going on? Well, nothing that I've seen. Like, Matthews now, I believe, Chris Johnston. in reporting it's another week you know and oh so there's no chance of him

playing Saturday I don't get that impression based on what I'm sorry I just find his injury is so weird it's like it just it's just so tight lift that's my fear two noodles and if he missed a month no one should be surprised if it's two months like you just

unfortunately with this player and with the way this organization operates with his injuries in particular you just can't trust anything like it you You hope he's back. Obviously, you hope he's great and feeling great. But if he missed two months, would you be shocked?

No. Like, I wouldn't be. No, because this is always how it always starts, where it's like, yeah, you know, he could play Saturday. Well, I think Dregs said that, that there's maybe an outside chance Saturday. And then it just turns into, yeah, it's going to be a week after that. And then it's how it always goes. I wouldn't shock me if it's a month. Would not shock me.

Yeah. Like, I hope not. That's my biggest concern, again, we talk about it daily. So you're concerned that he's missing a game here, a game there, and that. My concern is that he's re-agravated or something has shown up again that was here last year and, you know, off to Germany, all that type of stuff. I hope it's something different, which is weird, that you're hoping an injury is something different, but I think you see where I'm going.

It's like if he's re-agervated something that he's been dealing with for months, like then then it just says this guy's going to have to live with it and play with it you know by all accounts from what you hear you know out of other leaves you know the the small amount of information you get is he battled through all last season and was a warrior about it if something is creeped up again that's concerning because you never you know you never feel 100% and I get it oh you know we never you start training camp you never feel 100% you feel close you're like okay I feel good whatever there's always something ailing you but if this is something that's chronic

that concerns me just for him the player austin matthews and obviously for the leaves yeah the trickle-down effect changes everything ultimately i mean again it's yeah that that um without the problem with having this conversation is they don't tell you anything exactly so it feels somewhat unfair to him and to the team to go to those extremes but they could quiet it immediately if they just said it's this and it's not that and this is what it was last year and it's not that but they're not doing that and then i can say anything um and i could tell you if it is a reaggravation of last year's injury i'm sure it is nuclear behind the scenes it would have to be like from his standpoint his camp the team they'd have to be freaking out

like maybe they always expected it would be reagravated like maybe there's a chance that that's just the reality i don't know but like you said noodles they made it very clear he was never close to 100% last year and if there's a reaggravation and you're bracing for that again that's very concerning and would be a daunting task physically mentally it's tough man like it would be tough for him you know it's a big year he's the captain he's the they're going to the Olympics he's the captain of the Olympic team yeah just the idea of playing like I don't know what the injury was last year, whether it was his back, whether it was his shoulder, whatever it was, but the idea of that just nagging along the rest of the year where you think you're 100% healthy, and I don't know if he'll ever be 100% healthy playing this game the way how big he is and who knows. But the idea of just that thing nagging, it would just be so annoying.

There's nothing worse than a nagging injury. Well, like Lee fans have been through it. Like Wendell suffered from that, right? Like Wendell had the back issues and he just, it was tough. for him like everyone had their fingers crossed every time wendell hammered somebody you're like man is that is he going to be okay is he going to be all right you know and like later in your career i played with him yeah i played with him on the island like there were times he sat at the end of the bench i don't know how he got his gear on like flat out like how he got his gear on and could play because he couldn't

walk to the rink from the bus like it would be that type of stuff joe newindyke was the same way i played with him in florida right the end of his career like his back was so bad he had to carry a cushion around we'd go on the bus this guy to sit on a special cushion he's 36 years old he looked like he was 80 i felt bad these guys with these chronic injuries i again i'm not trying to start anything i don't start anything because they they could they could they could you know the leaves could matthews could but they don't they don't say anything and you just get updates every once in a while while it's another week it's this it's that he's progressing it's always he's progressing but you know anyway he's not available tomorrow and he's

not going to be sounds like available on saturday at the bell center against montreal like these are two big games you know these are these are big games and uh we'll see what happens with nyes and waugh and we'll see if carlo returns and stole us and you know the the list of it but that lineup last night you know i i thought um they gave all you could expect them to give you know and if wall is going to start and this will be an interesting conversation If Stolars is out, does he just play every single game? Or are they going to be careful with him? That's the thing.

The same thing was going on with Stolars when the other guy was out. It's like how much is too much for this guy. Okay, so remind me of the schedule here. They got Columbus tomorrow in Montreal Saturday, correct? And then what? Not until Wednesday. Yeah. They go on the road, right?

So he's playing both games. I think so, too. I would play in both games for sure. But you know what we're saying, noodles. It was like Stolar's, it was like, you've got to play, and then he just couldn't do it anymore. You know, whether, I don't know if it was because he played too much or because of the comments. Everything. Because of everything.

He just could not handle the workload, period. So I'm looking at it right now. I think he's playing Thursday, Saturday, Wednesday, Friday, and then there is a Saturday game that's a three and four nights. That's Toronto at Pittsburgh the Saturday. So that would be, now we're hoping Stolars would be back. Maybe Stoller shows up by next Saturday. That's 10 days from now. So, you know, again, like, I don't want to put the card before the horse because I think we're looking at the next couple games.

It's Joel Wall's net, and he can handle it because it's spaced out. You rest your body on Friday, you play. You play Thursday, you play Saturday here. So it's every couple days for this week. You don't play again until the following Wednesday, so you'll get your rest again on Sunday, Monday, Tuesday. So he's going to be fine for it. It's what you guys are saying. If he has to do six weeks of it, then you're looking at, go, okay, what is this?

Because you're not used to it. And neither was Stolar. So we saw his game erode because of it, right? Yep, absolutely. All right, Ray Ferraro coming up today. Ray will join us. It's only 20 games, but we got that banked. We'll get to that.

We do have our baseball primer. We called it yesterday. Steve will join us, Phillips, later this hour. I had a rough morning this morning. I'll explain what I went through. It was, uh, It was quite the experience. It's one that I think every parent dreads and every sports guy definitely dreads.

I'll tell you a little bit about that, although there was a great upside at the end. And just some crazy stories in sports, including what Bill Belichick is doing with his free time. We'll get into that a little bit later this afternoon. Overdrive continues. TSN 1050 and on the TSNM. All right, Overdrive continues. Brought to you by Fandor. We'll bring any more ways to play your game, Your Way.

Phillips in about 15 minutes Ray coming up, roll play level of concern in just over an hour. Man, these kids in the league, there is a lot going on right now in the NHL. A lot going on in the NBA too. LeBron was back. He got to 11 points, right?

That's what he does every game. He gets to double digits. Played about 29 minutes. And Luca's off to an unbelievable start. Like, unbelievable. Almost 35, 9 and 9 is his stat line across the board. So it's crazy.

Like, finally in year 23, LeBron, it's acceptable. Like, just go ride some other guys' coattels. Like, just show up, play, do what you can. It doesn't have to be your team, right? It's Lucas' team now. You really think that he has that mentality? I'm not sure he does, but he should. Year 23.

And yet, what you just pointed out speaks to how great his career has been, that it's still somewhat of a debate, like, whose team is it? Oh. You know, it's... Like, you could just... Just the idea, not physically playing, but in his mind, he's like, I'm LeBron James, and I'm Mr. L.A. I have been, and this is my team. You're just a visitor here. You might be better than me right now, but it's my team, and it's my operation here. Yeah, we'll see. They got Lakers got a win. They're off to a good start. Raptors are off their great start there in Philly tonight.

So, yeah, we've got Steve coming up, Ray coming up, role play. it's only 20 games but right we've all banked you we got to get this in we should do this right now because are we doing that are we doing that now I think we should do it now because we had our five observations that sat in the tank for a week and they just went up and smoke just never happened we never ever got to it we went to Winnipeg and back and never got to it so this is something we established last year it's only 20 games but one leaf observation one league wide observation all right oh do you want to start this party off then noodles you can go and i'll fire one up too i will start with my leaf observation and it's very simple um they put the squad

together and ever since training camp it's not working and i truly believe that something needs to change as far as the personnel they've got to get some kind of different players in there and i know the challenges that present i know you can't trade guys and i know there's a bunch of guys in there that a lot of teams probably don't want but for this team for anybody to think that there's going to be something successful or like really great down the road that i don't i don't see it with this bunch of guys like they they could rally here and get it back on the tracks and be some type of positive team and crack the playoffs but as far as like being anybody that's anyone else in the league is is afraid of that's that's that's not going to be this year unless

there's some kind of drastic changes which probably can't happen so that's what you're going to get it's a tough observation but it's the truth so i don't know there's nowhere else to go with that all right like i said they couldn't get back on track and they could be a positive story where they get into the playoffs but i would i would say that's probably unlikely with that group of players it's just it's been a tough watch it really has been yeah listen they they they've nine nine and two but it's been tough. Like it is through 20 games, I think them winning nine is kind of shocking. Our own GM admitted some of their wins have been horrible.

Yeah, it's not, it's not, it is what it is. It's a difficult watch. Yeah, they could turn it around, but. Well, now the injuries, again, not the reason they're here, but it's a reality. Go ahead, Nurtles, if you want to fire your leaf one out there. Well, I was just going to say, no, I wanted to jump on, oh, and just say, you're right, like, until something changes. Now, whether the players that are there get healthy and play better, then you can judge. But right now, all we're doing is talking about what we've seen for 20 games, right?

We had that conversation yesterday. Just to say, it was like that when they were all healthy. There was no different when they were all healthy. That's fair. Yeah. No, they, yeah, a lot of these guys have been healthy for the whole year. Matthew Nyes missed the game. You know, it's, yeah, Matthew's been out for a week now.

But Carlos played the majority of the games. Tanev is a big miss. You know, like, you can really feel the absence of Chris Tannave. Like, that's a really significant loss, and it sucks for him, and you don't know when he's going to return. All right, noodles. It's only 20 games, but what is your leaf observation? Well, it kind of ties into this, but I just put weird year slash health.

So this has a little bit of, again, after 20 games, it's got a little bit of Boston Bruins vibe from last year, but that's why I said weird year. And I'm looking at the whole league, too, but I'm also just looking at the Leafs. This is just a – this is uncharted territory for our group. Yeah, we can yell and scream as we have in past years about their October, but in November it was like nails, you know, and they just cruised to the playoffs. This is a weird year.

This feels weird. Again, can change. But I put, you know, right there, health, it's – you can't argue that. That's seven regulars that are missing. You know, you take seven players out of any roster, they're decimated. They look different. So that's what I've gotten after 20 games. It's a weird year, and health has not helped it.

Yeah, and, you know, we'll see how much the health factors into the rest of the year. I mean, it's weird what's going on. We've just got to know Charlie McAvoy who had facial surgery and has no timeline on return. So he's out again. Luis de Rinen, I always butcher his name, had a barbecue. injury that he suffered in Florida had surgery is out like had burns and is out for weeks so it's excuse me yeah lusterinen down at a barbecue injury a barbecue injury you know what i'm not going to say anything because i think scotty sheffler missed months because he was making ravioli yes he did

and it's just jack hughes we just went through it like apparently cut his hand at a team party or something and I don't know what he was doing but it's just there's a lot of injuries going on like there's a lot of crazy injuries going on a barbecue man can get in the way a barbecue is a wild one I I lit myself on fire one time on a barbecue I had to stop drop and roll no way I'm not lying I'm not lying I was my this I was hung over and I was wearing my house coat still at like two o'clock in the afternoon and my mom said go out and start the barbecue for your dad to put some steaks on or whatever i i had one of those frilly housecoats went out was opened it up and was pressing the starter wasn't starting i'm leaning my face over i can smell the gas i press it and boom and and my housecoat just went up i stopped dropped and rolled my mom was yelling from the kitchen window what the hell's wrong with you because i was rolling around the deck and I came in.

My house coat had almost burned right off of my body. No way. Like I had to, all I remember is stop, drop, and roll. I stopped, drop, and roll. My house coat was on her. Hugh Heffner in St. Albert. Wow. What a scene.

It was a barbed shoe injury. That would really be a scene if you had nothing underneath. No, I'm just my gone. Oh, yeah. It's my god. You're just running around with your stick and berries flying everywhere. Barbecue's ready, Dad. Burning to death.

But throw the stakes on. Medium rare, please. Neighbors, you want to come over for some dogs? Yeah, that's ridiculous. Wow. But you can't, I mean, you could think, I guarantee you there are people out there with stories of like, yeah, barbecue is a dangerous thing. It is. It can't mess around with those things.

It is, it can, it is dangerous, of course. I mean, the whole nature of the thing is wild. It's gas and ignition and, you know, like it's, you know, it's. And you're right. You get out there and you get one that's just not working properly. And naturally, like you did, you put your face in, which is the last thing you should ever do. And every dummy does it. They're like, I got to give this one more click and have a peek in there to see what's up.

Yeah. And they blow their face right off. That's exactly. Well, it's nerve-wracking when you get one of those old-school barbecues where it's like, well, you just got to light it with a barbecue lighter or, you know, stick something in there and get like a spark. Crank that to the right and then grab a zippo lighter and light that little. little thing on the side and it's like no way. Dude, this thing, there are multiple propane tanks here. I don't think I'm doing that, you know, it's, and you just see like old school, whoever,

mom's dads are like, wow, get out of the way, then I'll do it. I'm like, you do this all the time. Then you see the old uncle with that's half pissed. He'll grab a piece of paper, light it on fire and chuck it in and it lights. And then he's like, where's the food? I'll cook it. And just, it looks at you with such disgust, too. like you're so soft and you're such a loser you're such a loser all right through it's only 20

games but john tovaras has boosted his stock in this town and i got to give him full credit and he did it again last night and overtime like that is such a meat and potatoes like just battling out three guys he uses his skate like happy gilmore to make a play and um you know i don't know where this is going to go for the least i i hope it ends positively for for john you know like it's this is year eight ultimately i think it's been more of a positive than negative but it's been tough for him at times because the contract has been so big the playoff losing he wears that like everyone else the captaincy now he's not the captain but for him to sign a very team friendly deal come back in battle and grind and you can rely on

them every single night other guys are coming and going with injuries other guys are coming and going with their, you know, status and level of play, he is just continuing to plug along. And to his credit, you know, he's turning into this kind of like, it's not, it's weird to call it an underdog story, but it's kind of the nature of the way the sport works. Like, what's your contract? Oh, it's that high? Well, you're supposed to do this. Every goal he scores, there's a tweet.

God, this guy's a legend, so underpaid. Yeah. Every goal. And honestly, there's, there's a lesson there. If you could go back, just play your cards a little bit differently, everyone, and you probably have a little bit more breathing room in this market. But, you know, Say-L-Vee, it happened, it's over, and you move on. But John Tavares had a great start.

All right, it's only 20 games, but what do you have all league-wide? I'm going to say, Baddard and Salabrini. I have two, okay? They're both on the Olympic team. I don't know how you leave them off. I really don't. like did you see some but badard is doing what he did at the world juniors because i remember i pumped his tires and i came home and told you guys i was like this guy is the real deal and i said he was

going to score 40 goals in his rookie year didn't happen didn't happen the second year but when i got home last night i caught the tail end the second half of the calgary game and this guy's doing some stuff like he's doing some serious stuff where he's like the no chancers where he's slinging it like this goal right here if you're watching on like that that's a no doubt outer where it's like the goaltender. I don't care if the goalie's 6-6, 5-8, 5-10. They're not stopping that. It's just that's the kind of stuff he's doing.

And the other guy, he's been one of the best players in the league, if not the best, out in San Jose. I don't know how you look at those. Like if you really want to make them, if they got a different role, you've got to play a defensive role. I don't know. Tell them to do it and figure it out. Yeah, both them, 13 goals.

Both of them, what, 29 for Bedard points, 30 points for Celebrini. Unbelievable. Yeah, they've both been great. Yep. All right, Nils, what do you have? It's only 20 games but league-wide. From the league-wide standpoint, I've got to go back to it. Oh, terrible product so far.

And that's a blanket statement, and I know that sounds weird, but how many times, how many games, you guys know, I watch two games a night at least, maybe, you know, I totally agree with this, man. There's been, there has not been the level of play. that we expect as fans nightly. Now, the game ended. We did the panel last night.

The game ended in an exciting fashion. It was a dog's breakfast of a game for 50 minutes up, to be honest. There's highlights in every game you can find. Highlights in every game. I see, you're right, but I see the product as being weaker for some reason to start this season. Maybe it's because some of the good teams are struggling. Maybe there is a transition. I get it.

Or maybe that's just a parody, but the games haven't been, there's been some charging games, you know, the Tampa, Florida game, all of that type of stuff. You know, Detroit Rangers ends in a little dumb brawl there, that type of stuff. And I'm not saying fighting, but I'm just saying, like, I look at it, there's nights where you're watching it and going, these guys have no interest in laying a hit or having their intensity level goes through. Oh, my God, J.T. San Jose, enjoy your young, exciting team while you can. Because what happens is, and why it's so terrible, is the good players, they want to get paid and they deserve it, and they start signing $10 million contracts, and then everybody else has to get. We've seen it here in Toronto.

Everyone gets punted overboard, and then all of a sudden you've got five good players and a bunch of stiffs. And when the good players leave the ice, you're watching an HL hockey game. Yeah, well, and that's my observation. The observation was it's a young man's game. You know, like Bedard Celebrini. Leo Carlson, if you don't know him, get used to him. Dude, he's dry-sidal part too. Dude, he looks, yeah, he looks to me.

That's kind of what he looks like. He kind of has a, he just battles and grinds. And, but, like, you look at it, it's McKinnon, McDavid, but then it's Bedard, Celebrini, Carlson. You know, it's these young guys. It's Schaefer, who's been unbelievable for New York. And it's a young, fast league early in the season. And that's very, very clear right now.

And the Leafs are an example of that they're old and slow. Edmonton's an old team outside of McDavid and Dry Settle. They kind of look old and slower. They'll get going, but through 20 games, the young teams and the young players are flying. Let me ask you this. If there was an All-Star game, much like the Young Guns team at the World Cup, like if there was Young Guns, 22 and Under versus McDavid's and McKinnon. The older guys would still win

it. There's still, like there's Celebrini, Baddard, Carlson, Schaefer, but there's not a team full, you know, there's not a team full. Ray and 20, we've got to get to Steve here. We got role play coming up, overdrive continues. TSN 1050 and on TSN4. We've got roleplay coming up, best bets.

Raptors in action tonight. You got the Oilers playing the caps tonight. Games in the NHL, NBA. You got the NFL tomorrow. You got Shadur Sanders making a start, his first start. in the NFL this week against Vegas, so we'll get to that. And Steve Phillips coming up here in a moment because we were throwing it out.

Like, what is reasonable for Bo Bichette? Now there's rumors he's going to Boston. Maybe the Yankees would be kicking tires. And how does Kyle Tucker can continue to play a role in this? And are we going to fall into this trap? And is it easier to fall into this trap because of the season they just had? You know, I think it is. Because I think after 74 wins, no one wants to hear it.

Oh, yeah, of course. Tucker's coming here. course. Game 7 World Series, you're like, I'll buy into that if it doesn't happen, so be it. We had a great ride. You know what I mean? It's like so much easier to accept defeat after the season they just had.

Here's our baseball insider Steve Phillips. Steve, we're trying to brace for impact here in Toronto and figure out exactly where this is going to take us in the off season. We're hook, line, and sinker again, man, Kyle Tucker, right? It was Juan Soto and it was Otani. Now it's Tucker that's coming

up here and it's a lock. do you see that happening or what so here's the thing if it's Tucker then it's not Bichette I mean I think that's the one thing that is clear is that Kyle Tucker's probably going to get the biggest

free agent contract in the marketplace this hot scope season so there's been speculation it could get as high as $400 million do the Blue Jays really want to have a $500 million investment and a $400 million investment into players Bichette will be much less than that

the other thing about it is put Tucker and right field. It moves Santander to left, Springer DHS, and it means that Barger becomes your everyday third basement. Clement goes to second. It's a lot of moving pieces. Now, I personally prefer Barger in the outfield than I do at third. I like him at third, but I don't love him at third.

I love Clement at third with his defense there. I would rather have Bichette at second and go with the same outfield configuration that you had, and Barger and right and Santander left and Varsho and center, the idea of Tucker would bring another left-hand at bat in, so you'd be able to go Springer, Tucker, Vlad, Barger, you'd be able to go left-right and have balance throughout the lineup. They've got enough balance for me. I think Barger and Varsho and Santander as a switch hitter should give them enough balance of left-right to be able to get through it did this year. So I keep hearing Tucker. I don't see them as the biggest player on Tucker.

And then balancing the timing of all that's going to be interesting, too. So I keep hearing that. I'm not sure I buy that Tucker is Plan A over Bichette being Plan A. So, Steve, you mentioned Beshette, and you talked about it coming in lower. We were talking yesterday, what do you think a fair contract for him is, either term or the actual financial amount. Yeah, so, right. So the years are going to be the challenge,

and that's where, as an agent, you really make your money not on how much per year, you know, the extra money. You make it on how many years you can get somebody to commit to. And, you know, I think that health is a question. Pichette's knees on the turf is a question. It's a legitimate question to have to consider. And if the doctor sign off that the need's going to be,

be okay and certainly the injury wasn't turf related anyway it was a slide at home plate then i wouldn't be shocked if he gets an eight to ten year contract uh we saw danesby swanson as a shortstop get a seven year deal about 187 million uh we saw willie adamas get a seven year contract uh and buchette's you know in the age range even a little bit younger than them so i could see an eight to 10 year deal for him and i think you're looking at a number starting with the two, $200 plus million for him when it's all said and done. But it's not $400 million in Kyle Tucker. And it's a guy you know, it's a guy who likes the team that fits in with the team.

Tucker is, he's not the most dynamic personality. I like Bichette on this team. I like his energy on the team. I like his swag on this team. Tucker, when things don't go right, Tucker sometimes disappears. internally. He just sort of, he loses, he gets quiet, he sort of keeps to himself. I don't want that. This team needs energy. It needs connection. And so I'd prefer Bichette to Tucker. And I think there's more, there are a lot of teams in on Tucker. And I think that for Bichette, the Tigers, one of the

brakes for the Blue Jays is Detroit, Glaver Torres taking the qualifying offer for $22 million, kind of gets in the way of Bichet a little bit. I guess they could sign them to play. third, but they've got the young kid, Colt Keith there to play third base, and they've got some McKinthry and others that can do it. And so, and I think Atlanta, they need a shortstop, but I don't, Alex Anthopoulos in Atlanta has not been the big spender. He's not spent the most money in free agency. They've not done it at all since he's been there. So I don't know that he's completely in. I think they'd rather have Hassan Kim at a lesser price point. So the Red Sox, the Red Sox, if they don't get Bregman, but I think they might get Bregman.

So I don't know. I think the Bichette market, I think the Jays can stay in it and compete, but you'll lose Tucker if you wait for Bichette. What about losing them both, Steve? I'm sure Bo Bichette's not exactly jacked up hearing these Tucker rumors, and you see Nailer going to the Mariners right away, and he's probably thinking, why isn't the same thing happening with myself? Is there a chance that Jays get screwed here, and they end up with nothing, just the way

these things play out? Yeah, it's possible. I think that, I mean, Bregman was a guy that could be an answer at third base as well. I mean, the one good thing about the Jays, they could add a second baseman, and it works, because you can move the pieces around, and Jimenez can play shortstop, and you can add the second basement. They could add the shortstop in Bichet and move everybody around and leave them short for now if they want to. If that's a big deal to them, you can make the deal for a few years and do it. Atlanta has shortstop available for a couple of years to Ozzy Albi's moves.

If the Js need to sign a third basin, okay, Clement goes over to second base. It works. If they can sign an outfielder, it works. So they can pivot in a lot of different ways. You know, it could end up being A. Eugenio-Svarez, if they don't get any of the guys they want. A. E. O'Henio-Hawres at 48-9 home runs last year. He's streaky, but he's got legit power. And so there's a place to really keep this team very strong, even if they don't get Tucker or Bichette.

with Steve Phillips, or baseball insider, and, you know, based on reports, naturally, the Jays are connected in all types of different areas, like a lot of elite teams are right now. But the history of this front office would tell you, when in doubt, look to starting pitching. Like, that is what they have invested in. That was the first thing, like the big splash they made, Hujin Ryu. They're like, give them $80 million, bring them in. They've signed guys like Gosman. They took the flyer on Shurzer, it obviously popped and worked for them. they have spent money and allocated money to the rotation first and foremost flaty notwithstanding with that in mind i i get the impression like that's kind of where their instincts go steve i don't know if you see it that way but if so you know how deep is this starting rotation market and what do you think that attack plant could look like

yeah so i think that that clearly they know that if they don't have a shot they need to supplement the offense i think that over the last couple years running production. They recognized that that was an issue. And Bichette coming back and being productive was very important to how good they were this year. But to your point, I think that they understand pitching is important. Losing Scherzer and Bassett are, you know, older guys, veteran guys, pitching at an older age. But I think the other thing they have to consider now, that Yosevich is a guy that you can count on, I think, to be a, you know, I wouldn't say number one starter right now, just for next year. I'd say I'd want to hedge my bet, call him a number two behind Gosman just to protect the kid as he grows. But I think that they have to remember that after 26, Gosman is a free agent,

Lauer is a free agent, Burrios has an opt-out. And so the notion of, for me, looking at an impact starter that you can sign with some controllability for a four-year deal or a five-year deal or a six-year deal makes a lot of sense. Because you don't want to be left after the 26th season, bear have there be a work stoppage and then at some point there will be 250 free agents because nobody will have signed and then you're going to have to go out there and try to snatch everyone to try to rebuild the rotation for the 27th season you don't want to do that and so I think signing somebody to a multi-year deal in the rotation makes a ton of sense yeah I'm with you on that I mean beaver will be likely done after this year too and free after this year too right like

The Barrios one is sneaky for me, Steve. Like, I saw him there against the Yankee series. I saw him, you know, around the clubhouse. I think it was after game one or game two. But he left the team at some point during the run. And I'm not convinced that relationship is in the greatest position ever. So I don't know what happens with him going into next season. You know, like that's a guy.

He's a reliable arm, but I don't know if that's going to work out for either part. You mean he wasn't anywhere around for like not even the- counts by the end he wasn't even around so that's a spicy one you know in terms of what could happen there with burrios and i'll tell you you know he is he is he is guys he he is such a good guy he is such a good dude like he is as good a guy a spiritual guy that he's been hurt obviously the elbow was what flared up on him he won't opt out after next year he's got two years at 48 million dollars you know two at 24 each year. He's not going to walk away from $48 million guaranteed. I don't care how well he pitches

next year. I can't imagine it'll be well enough to say, you know what, I'm going to do better than $48 million for two years. So I suspect he's going to be there. Now, you know, if he proves he's healthy, then maybe they could consider a trade if that works for him and for them at some point. But I think that if he's healthy, he's going to be part of that rotation. The question is how healthy is he? Steve, it's a great primer. We can't wait to see what happens here the rest of the way. There's going to be activity. that happens, we'll circle back and we'll catch up with you again. Great to see

anybody. Thank you for doing this. It's my pleasure, guys. Good to see you, too. There he is, Steve Phillips, or a TSN Baseball Insider. Yeah, we'll see. You know, he's right. Burrios, that's a lot of guaranteed money. It's a lot of guaranteed money. But, you know, ego gets in play,

and he didn't pitch well, and he got moved to the bullpen, and, you know, it's, I don't know, that can get ugly. You know, there's, something's got be ironed out there between now and the spring. All right, Ray Ferraro coming up. Roll play coming up, Overdrive continues.

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