OverDrive - OverDrive - September 8, 2025 - Hour 2 - Luke Willson/Tim Kurkjian

Episode Date: September 8, 2025

Join Bryan Hayes, Jeff O'Neill and Jamie McLennan for Hour 2 on OverDrive! TSN NFL Analyst Luke Willson joins to discuss the biggest storylines from Week 1 of the NFL season, the Bills' big win against the Ravens and Aaron Rodgers' debut with the Steelers in the spotlight. ESPN MLB Analyst Tim Kurkjian joins to discuss the Blue Jays' placement in the AL East, Max Scherzer tipping pitches against the Yankees and the race in the division and Bryan gives his FanDuel Best Bets on the Monday Night Football matchup.

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Conditions apply. Sea dealer for details. Hey, uh, seriously. Can I get one? If you smell What the When Wilson is cooking Well, the dynasty continued last night

Man, there's so much support for Hayes and Broads Oh, sure. Just incredible to have the NFL back. There's Luke Wilson back with us in studio. Pro athletes. Noodles. Nudles toss one up just for pro athletes. All right, well, I will.

You know what? I'm going to even it out because on Friday, Hayes, I did that weird thing that you and have. Yeah, good man. I love it. So I'm going to hand out a pro-athlete salute just to even if I'll be Peter Schroger. I'll shregor. It's now called the Ryan Clark Salute.

The Ryan Clark Salute. What did you make of that party? The Ryan Clark comment. Honestly, the guy's unhinged, and I don't mean that in a fun way. Like, it's one thing if he's unhinged and it's funny. Right. You know, it's just ridiculous. It's a wild profit.

And it's like week after week after week after week after week. and you're just like, this has gotten to a point. It's almost like he keeps doubling and tripling down. Calling Peyton Manning, not a generational talent. What about Brady? Brady? Outrageous. And it's outrageous.

Like, what is your definition? And then all of a sudden from there, now of a sudden, Peter Schrager, who is like an extremely respected NFL guy. Like, even when I was playing, this guy is extremely respected. Yeah. To be like, no, no, no, you can't, I mean, have an opinion. in like, that's the non-player in you talking? A wild comment. It's a wild comment.

And then the craziest part was when he tweeted the apology. I don't know if you saw this. Yeah. It was in the middle of your live tweeting. Yeah. Try to like slide in in my home. Sorry, Pete. Wow, what a cat.

It was the greatest little slide-in I've ever seen. I actually appreciate that greatly. Oh, man. Because now you can point to the tweet and just say, well, I, I apologize. Yeah. I apologize. Hayes, have you seen them like together on a panel yet? They're in Chicago right now.

They're on the Monday night football panel. But have they done the old, those two alone and? No, I don't think. I guess they did a little dapp to start the show. And I don't know. We'll see what comes. It's all going to blow over. And the NFL's back.

And look what we've already had. Outrage. Between the opener and then the Friday night game. Blew my mind. And then like last night, okay, I'm going to make a statement here. You guys can all tell me if I'm right or wrong. Yeah. Josh Allen is the most entertained.

entertaining athlete in pro sports, period. That includes McDavid, Otani, Alcarez, thinner, Lamar. I think he's the most entertaining athlete, period, in pro sports. I'm not putting him ahead of McDavid. McDavid is the only guy that I'm putting behind. I was going to say Otani, because Otani was throwing like 97 the other day. I'm going to say yes. Dude, he's so fun.

I would say, though, that my two is Lamar. The scramble Lamar had That was absurd Both side and Russo These are two World-class athletes chasing him down But I would say yes I would say Josh is one

He's that good man He's that much fun And he's a one-man show And Josh doesn't He's got good players around him Don't remember I think the bills have a lot of good players But he doesn't have a Derek Henry

Like Derek Henry is from a different planet That guy's not a human He's not Was outrageous I couldn't believe him fumbling I couldn't believe it either I don't think I've ever seen him do it with the game he had for him to be on the wrong

side of that fumble and like Ed Oliver had himself a night last night even though they gave up 40 that's what's crazy well how can you not like if this is what I think if Baltimore we talked a bit about this on Jay last night is for me I tip my cap to the bills

you got to you got to tip your cap to Josh Allen Ed Oliver like the whole thing and I'm not trying to take anything away from Buffalo. I'm saying if you were in Baltimore's locker room, you're sick to your stomach. I mean, you're up 15 with four minutes to go and you scored 40 points and you lose 41 to 40. And again, it kind of goes back. This is what Baltimore will be saying, but you go back to how they got knocked out last year. You have the really bad turnovers by Lamar and you had the drop by Andrews on the two-pointer late in the game. And it's just like, hey, we're in

cruise control we're up 15 we've ran for 10 million yards we've thrown for a bunch and if we needed it lamars cooked everybody as well and it's like pretty much all we got to do here is not fumble yeah and then we yeah exactly but then the crazier one to mean was okay it's a bad bounce henry fumbles you stop the two-pointer it's like get a couple first downs and this thing's it don't matter what the fumble is irrelevant now and you get stopped here's another statement. I'm curious your answer on this because these guys responded. I think they're in agreement with me.

I would implement a new rule as of today. If I'm a team owner in the NFL, I'd send an email to my coaches and I'd say, if you are in a scenario where it's fourth and short, I don't care where it is on the field. I said this, I think I know you're going. And you punt to either

Josh Allen, Patrick Mahomes, or Lamar Jackson, you're fired. You're fired. I agree. You're fired. And Harbaugh does it every single year. I honestly, I sat there and I was like, okay, so D. Hop caught the little shallow route and it was like fourth and two. And I had lightly brought it up last night on Jay Show as well where I'm like, anybody else you punt there. If it's not one of those guys, you punt. Sure. But I'm like Josh was doing whatever he wanted to your defense all night. The only reason

you were up was because your offense was scoring at will. Josh was having to manufacture which gives you more reason to think you can get two yards. Bingo. I'm like, dude, here you're options. It's fourth and two and you have Derek Henry and you have Lamar Jackson and you can rest the game. You get a first time and the game's over. Or you punt the ball and you say, hey guys, stop Josh Allen, who by the way has put 38 up against you right now. Right. I think you had like it was just like punt. You had to go for it, man. You had to. And I think there was a, was there a timeout too or an injury or something? Like he had time to think on it and he still sent the punter out. The other trippy one for me was when Jaya

Alexander at a tough night. You can't make that tackle, man. You can't make that tackle. Like, you've got to be on the back end, like, hey, if we get burned here, let him score. And Coleman's a second year guy. I wonder if he was running that in, dude. He was running that in. He was Forrest Gump on his way to that. He would have kept running through the tunnel. I agree. With the drops last year from the tight end, who was it, Andrews? Yes. And that last night, and I know everyone's been heavy on Baltimore being the Super Bowl favorite, does that kind of

to take away a little. I know it's only the first game of the season, but last year, this year, like the clutch gene, does it kind of get into your head a little bit? I think so, and that's where it's just such a strange phenomenon, and it happens across all leagues for me, but you look at Baltimore and you're just like, get out of your own way. Even the idea that if, you know, that situation where it's like, hey, let's say Henry gets stopped and they don't get a first down, at least you punt it and Josh has to drive the field, you get the ball back on a tie game, you know, because it was eight points at that point. You're in

control here. Like if you ask Baltimore, hey, Lamar's going to have the ball with some time left in a tie game. You're feeling good about that? Yes. Like, Lamar's in one of the three. Exactly. He's one of the three guys. Yes, but it's just like, parts of you said it, I'm like, these guys, they just can't get out of their own way. And the

dude was boom and kicks, but here's the other one. Loop missed the extra point. That's right. Like, that extra point turned out to be a pretty big point. It was one of the craziest games. I've ever seen. They've just got to get out of their own way. It was amazing last night.

And even the whole two-point conversion thing started because of a... It went early on it. Yeah, an offside. They're like, all right, let's go for two when they didn't have to. And then that threw the whole calibration of the game out of whack. All right, something to chew on brought to you by Boston Pizza, Canada's favorite sports bar. Enjoy $15 lunch at BP where you get an entree, a side, and a drink. And you'll get it all in 20 minutes or less.

A fast lunch doesn't have to be fast food. See you for a $15 fast lunch at your local Boston Pizza. asking people online will or can Josh Allen and or Lamar Jackson do they still have enough time in their careers to surpass the greatness of Patrick Mahomes

you think there's still enough time for them by the end of their careers to say they had a better career they were greater than Mahomes I don't know man to me now we're talking about definitions and I'll ask you this who had who like when you say a better career are you talking about entertainment or rings

I'm talking a greater career career. I'm talking like, you know, we're talking goat conversation. That's what I'm talking here. Do you think they can... Like, Mahomes is clearly still the guy of this generation. Clearly still the guy. Here's one. And I am on, just so you know, don't smoke me for this. I'm on the Brady side of this. But if you were to ask who had a better career between Peyton and Tom Brady, like, Peyton's got a lot of records now. Best offense statistically ever. Five MVP's most ever. Correct. Like who... So that's where it's like, it depends on... Like, to me, I would take Brady's career.

But I guess that's what we're talking about. Like, there still was a conversation. Now, I think once Brady got, like, the last three Super Bowls, it was kind of over. Certainly when he went to Tampa without Belichick, it was like Trump car. That was the one. But, like, right now, Mahomes is still, in my opinion, the best player. I think you're forgetting too quickly, Hayes. Like, you're a Super Bowl shalacking in a poor performance in Brazil.

And now all of a sudden, we're bringing other guys into the equation saying, you're going to have a better career than that. how quickly we forget how that it used to be this guy's automatic he always wins that game and a shalacking and a poor game in Brazil and we're like, can these guys be better? I guess

let me lay it out for you. I'm going to answer no because I think Mahomes has too much of a head start. Yeah. And he's still got 10 years and I think they're going to be great but if these guys are playing for 10 years let's say Alan wins two Super Bowls in Buffalo with this roster and two more MVPs

is it conceivable in 10 years we say he was greater? I think that's possible. I think right now but he's got to win. He's got to win. In the playoffs. Like if Buffalo goes and has a,

let's say they're 15-2 this year. I don't care. I mean, I care because they're going to have the one seed. Like, sure, it's great. But like if he goes and they go 15-2 and they lose to Kansas City in the playoffs, crushing. It's going to be.

Yeah, crushing. You know, and even Mahomes that further your point, O'Dog, you know, you look at last season, and I hated this narrative. These guys went into the last week of the season, and they were 15 and one. And they didn't start. They didn't start Mahomes and lost to Denver. It was a meaningless game.

So it's like, and they're like, oh, well, they're all close games. They're all close games. Every game is a close game. That's not a knock of anything that even proves more greatness. They found a way to get it done. So I do think that right now, because they got blown out in the Super Bowl, and you lose a tough opener in Brazil, which Mahomes made some ridiculous plays in that.

Like now all of a sudden everyone's cold on Patty Mahomes. I don't think we've seen the last of Patty Mahomes this year. Let's put it that way. Partsie, it's only one game, but if you had to put one person on notice after yesterday in a horrific effort, like who would you tap on the shoulder and say, it's only one game, but you're on notice? Player or coach?

Coach, anything. Brian Dable. I was just going to say Dable. Brian Dable. And is that part of me because of my man? Danny Dimes? Yes, and Danny, I mean, yeah. No, Danny Dimes makes Dable look like a turkey.

Yeah, and he deserves it. I would argue that Dable makes Dable look like a turkey, but Danny Dimes is the gravy now on top of that. Well, Dable gets so angry, so quickly. Do you see neighbors yelling at him? Oh, yeah, neighbor. And then he went up for the high five, the neighbors goes, get out of here. Yeah. Well, dude, see how smart he acts when he's, like, he's doing the interviews with quarterbacks and stuff?

And he's, like, putting them down. And he's like, why would you do that? And he just makes himself look like such a hero. And in actuality, his team's been a joke ever since he got there. Honestly, you just said it, and that's what annoys me about the guy, is you see these videos, and he acts like he's like a quarterback guru. And I'm like, okay, at this point, I'm not just trying to say this, but it doesn't take much to coach Josh Allen.

You know, he's the guy who was involved in Josh Allen. That's kind of what happens in this league sometimes. Well, since he's left, Josh Allen has gotten exponentially better. He's gone to New York. He's had all these ideas, none of which have worked. They looked awful yesterday. Awful. Horrendous.

Like, it's hard to watch. And I sit there and they're like, what's weird to me is they're like right away, like Russ won the spot. Russ is the guy. Russ, Russ, Russ, Russ, Russ, Russ. Why? And I'm like, this looks like the rust we saw in Denver. This looks like the same rust we saw in Pittsburgh.

like what what has gone on to give you like you can't tell me they wouldn't have been better without James Winston out there I was thinking forget Jackson Dart correct Winston out there not alone playing the next

why did you need to get him at all it's ridiculous and then again you've got a guy neighbors is in what year two yeah and he's got Uber talent and he's sitting there

like screaming at the head coach already I can't fathom like a year two DK Metcalf coming in and ripping Pete on the sideline somebody would went nuts on our team.

Right. You know? Someone would have grabbed a player. Correct. I don't even think about doing that. Like the year we won the Super Bowl, I'm trying to think like somebody who was in year two being like, yo, man, I'm going to go rip Pete a new one. Okay?

Cam Chancer might have came over there and killed the guy. Right. Like, this is wild. This is the operation you're running in New York. Not a good scene. And they would be hot today because of it. I mean, you know, it's New York, but it's the Giants. They suck.

Here's the thing, noodles. Yeah. And the Jets lost. New York's stank. The defense played well. That's where I was going to go, Luke, is, you know, what about your boy, Aaron Rogers? Oh, let's go. Noodles, you're just team me up, lady, man.

You're teaming me up, look pretty good. He looked pretty good. No, it's the Jets. Four Tuddies. Four Tuddies. That one is a bit cheap. The little, like, pop pass, it's like, that's really a handoff. They needed everything out of him yesterday.

He looked great. His defense did nothing yesterday. And I'll tell you this, three of his touchdowns were on the move. And I'm not saying he's a burner, but. that was the whole thing last year oh man he's got no more mobility because one of the things when we played Aaron I remember this back in the day

he's like was unbelievable and we used to prep this and practice it all the time of okay there's the play and then he just basically moved the pocket and then he has the most electric arm in the NFL I'm not saying that now but back in the day it was like hey he's not scrambling like Russ or some of these other quarterbacks

but it is still an off-schedule play and I don't know if you guys heard Tom Brady talk about I think he was on Collinsworth podcast and he was like, Aaron is the best thrower of the football, in his opinion, the history of the NFL. Everybody, every quarterback that I talk to marvels at his arm strength.

And I do I think he has the exact same zip? No, but he can still sling that pill now. And the precision is outrageous. It's incredible. Yeah, he's got moxie. Like when he gets dancing back there, he's a little, uh, little, yeah, well, he loves the little jump up arm up.

Wow. All those improv throws like off the back foot where he can just like, like sidearm it, and it's a missile, and somebody said, like, those are impressive. O'Dong, it's like, he's not really set. Like, the one touchdown he's rolling out, I think it was the third one. Might have been to Calvin Austin. And he, like, didn't even really have his foot in the ground, just flicks his wrists. And you're expecting, like, the ball to come out at a certain pace.

But then it's, like, 3X on TV. You're like, oh, my God. Yeah. Right at the dude's chest. He looked good. I don't want to put the cart before the horse because it was the Jets, but he did look pretty good. He looked good. He looked really good.

Listen, he wasn't alone. There were a bunch of teams that look good, and then some teams that look bad. And I think the Packers' Lions game was a perfect example of two teams in two different spots. Parts you would have called, though, a lot of people in here. You know I was going to hammer the Packers. I would have hammered the Packers.

And I thought they looked great on both sides of the ball. And I think what sticks out is like they were selective with using Parsons, but they knew what they had. Like you don't acquire a guy with like Micah Parsons unless you know, you got guys that the average fan isn't aware of. I'll tell you what, to kind of further what you're saying, what jumped out at me, and obviously he's going to have a bigger package

as he continues to be there longer, but he looked fresh, you know, and one of the things I would say is that in Dallas, when you're the main guy, and now of a sudden you're playing every snap, and it's like, and this is how you prep for this guy, hey, every third down, we're going to chip up with a tight end on you. Hey, early in this game,

we're going to take the tight end and make sure we do a divide zone and someone's going to try and saw him in half. Like you're always trying to wear him down throughout the game. Now of a sudden, when you've got a great defense like Green Bay has, and you don't even necessarily need him on certain downs, they stopped the run without him yesterday. Gave up 2.1 yards for carry to a very good run team. And then be like, oh, it's third and seven.

Go chase. Here's Micah Parsons for you boys. Did you see how fast he looked when he had Jared Goff in his sights? Somebody had the best tweet there is. This is like a National Geographic video where, like, the cheetah has got like the the old buffalo like the bum leg and he's got him in his sights he's outrageous man you know what I loved about that too is

he didn't have to be on the field no it was 276 no game was over and they said go get go get one this has been it's the lions go get him there's Matt Lafleur needs to he needs to kind of be on top of this I think we see here the if you're watching right now that kind of effort. When he's playing with that kind of effort and he's bought in, it's so good. I mean,

it's incredible. But there's been times in Dallas where you haven't seen that. And again, I'm not saying it's he's checked out mentally, but when you get beat up all game, when you're the only real guy on defense and you walk in on Wednesday, whoever is playing you, and it's like, every chance we get, we're taking a shot at Michael Parsons.

It's clean, nothing dirty. It's a lot tougher than, hey, we got Rashah Gary here, Quay Walker, we got a lot of good DBs. Like, it's not just Micah, he's going to flourish. I think LaFleurdo needs to make sure that he's in a mental, he being, Micah, is in a very good

mental space, so you get more effort like that. Big time. It was a great tweet last night. Someone posted Jared Goff without Ben Johnson and they had a picture of Dan Orlovsky because you know, the Lions man, like both coordinators gone, Ragnow out.

That's a big loss. Are you reading into that parts? Is that like a thing? It seems like everyone's piggybacked off that one comment. It's obviously a fact, everybody knows it, but one person said it, all the coordinators are gone. Like, is that that much of a big deal? Yes and no.

I don't think it's going to be that much of a big deal on offense. It'll take, there's some bumps and bruises. They got behind the eight ball, and it is what it is. It was a really tough showing for them. And I think also Lions fans have been very fortunate the last couple years because they've had success at Lambo. I'm telling you from first-hand experience,

going into Lambo at any time of the year is not an easy. place to play. Right. So, and the Lions have done well there, as of recent. Three years in a row prior to this. But like prior to those three years, it was 40 years of them. Of course. So there's a lot of facts.

And Green Bay was ready to play. Yes. Now, I'll say this. The Lions, I still believe in Jared Gough. I still believe in their weapons. They're incredible. So I do think that they'll figure it out. Their new O.C. John Morton will figure it out.

Where I get nervous for them, and again, the other thing we're talking about in Jay yesterday, I personally don't think their defense is all it's cracked up to be. Even last year, they'd be like, that's the injuries, the injuries, the injuries. And I'm like, okay, they are injured, and that obviously hurt them a lot. But even when they're not injured, like, is this an elite defensive unit? I would say they're kind of middle of the road. Well, here's another thing that would

possibly concern me. They got the Bears at home next week. That becomes a must win. You can't start Owen, too. Then they're at the Ravens, at home to the Browns, but at Bengals, at Chiefs, and then bucks in town. They got a really tough schedules. He's got an absolute bear. Really tough schedule. And what's tough about that is that in this division, I mean, they could beat each other up, but like

you're going to have to win a lot. Look at last year. Right. Them in Minnesota went down to week 18. Well, and it's a perfect segue into the game tonight. Where Vikings Bears, you got Ben Johnson making his debut at home, Soldier Field in Chicago. Vikings are minus one and a half. Yeah. J.J. McCarthy

also making his debut as the quarterback of the Vikings tonight. It's a big swing game because Hazenbro took care of business yesterday. That was so, I could not. Partsy, I'm sitting there last night. We call the pack game. We're all good.

And I'm like, Ravens are out 15. We're going to win tomorrow. And we're going to develop the big lead early. And now our backs against the wall. I was nervous. Outrageous. Al's brother was leaning Ravens. And I talked him off the cliff and picked bills.

And he was sending me messages early. Oh, God. We're cooked, we're done. Ravens look unreal. I'm like, here we go. And I know, I'm waiting for, or a suit he came in and called your fraud again. Exactly.

And I was waiting for, I was going to have to send him the text at the end. Sorry, my bad, bad pick. Yeah. And the win, and then he gets online. Dynasty never a tell. So, of course. He's the best.

All right, you guys are on the clock here. Vikings minus one and a half in Chicago tonight. Partsy, I'm going to tell you where my head's at, but I'm telling you, if you want the other way, you can take it. Okay, I've gone back and forth on this, and what's unfortunate is there's so many unknowns. What is Ben Johnson going to be like with Caleb Williams? I don't know, okay, but there's a button here. Do you even want to know? There's an element of that.

Do you even want to know? I don't. You see this article that's out about Caleb Williams and, like, people that have left the bears from last year, basically painting a picture that this guy was a disaster as a rookie? Yeah, I could see that. Yes. Don't try to, don't. I know what you just did it.

Nah, no. Like a disaster how like a pain in the ass doesn't matter i shouldn't have piped it no just tell me a disaster how yeah yeah well a disaster how what do you this is like joe pesci what am i funny a disaster how i asked you question henry um i don't know he said like work ethic wasn't great you know wasn't necessarily listening to coaches that's how when i budged that film i kind of think that he's one of those guys who like hey, I'm just going to do this my own way. It kind of jumps out to me, and I'm like,

yeah, that's not really how the NFL works. Right. Now, all those coaches are gone, and he does have a new staff, and Ben Johnson in particular. Anyway, my bad, I shouldn't have chimed in. You guys are on the clock. Brian Flores, obviously, de-coordinator for Minnesota.

He's known for his crazy looks. You know, he's known for very exotic packages. I mean, Ben Johnson has a lot of familiarity with him, but does Caleb Williams? Is Caleb going to go out there and execute? it. I don't know. I really don't know. And then the flip side is JJ. And I'll be honest, we haven't seen much of JJ. Obviously, there's going to be some learning

curves there. But the fact that Kevin O'Connell has basically decided to stick with JJ over keeping Sam Donald, he obviously likes him. The guy's a quarterback guru. You know, outside of Sam Darnold late last year, Minnesota was pretty electric. I got to go. I got to go with my lean, I should say, not got to go, is definitely to take the bike. but if you've if you have an inkling to take the bears hayes just sold me with the comment like i don't know if that was the motivation i don't even know if it was true but i just i i chewed it up

i love it i don't know now i'm concerned because if you guys lose you're going to blame hayes pampering like that little hamper like i'm worried about j j mccarthy like what the hell's he all about i agree like dear this isn't a headline yeah like this isn't michigan man no man but like again, when we sit here, even Friday, I know we missed the pick Friday, but I'm like, opening day in Brazil, like it's very hard for me to not. Very tough.

Yeah, very tough. I don't call out a brutal pick. No. But it's like this one, I don't know, like, I'm an anti-Kalb Williams guy right now. I'm not a huge fan of the way he plays.

And I have no idea about J.J. McCarthy. And now we go into head coaches. And one of them has never been a head coach before. So that's why I'm going with Oklahoma. All right. You guys are, you're locking that in. You're taking the Vikings?

Bartsey? Bike up. All right. Goal. It's goal. All right. Al's brother has already chimed in. What is he saying?

Rookie quarterback making his debut on the road on Monday night football in a divisional game. Tough Bears defense. What a brutal pick. The Al's brother loves that we're on the Bears tonight. The guy's won the Natty. He can handle a big moment. Lock it in. Big swing early, man.

I don't want to be down too early. It's a big, big swing. All right. Owen Wilson on the Vikings laying the points one and a half in Chicago tonight, Monday night football. All right, buddy. We'll catch you on the panel TV tonight. Jay, the whole nine.

Can't wait. All right, there he is. Luke Wilson. Owen Wilson, the pick is in. Pro-athletes salute. Tim Kirchon on tipping pitches and why the Yankees are so good at it and who can stop them. We'll get to that next.

Something to chew on is brought to you by Boston Pizza, Canada's favorite sports bar. Enjoy $15 lunch at BP where you get an entree of sight and a drink and you'll get it all in 20 minutes. minutes or less. A fast lunch doesn't have to be fast food. See you for a $15 fast lunch at your local Boston pizza. All right, Best Vets powered by Fandu

later in the hour on the Monday nighter. Jay's off today, back in action tomorrow. So, Ben Rice hit a three-run, home runoff Scher early in the game yesterday and, you know,

kind of set the tone for the game. And afterwards, you know, during the game, people realized, okay, what's going on here? The Yankees have a reputation of, you know, relaying pitches and, you know, they're obviously the Jays are tipping them and it's been an issue with Scherzer in particular. When their pitching coach is pointing thumbs up to go upstairs in the dugout, that's not a good start to begin with. No, right.

No, exactly. And what's amazing, though, is how, you know, outward the Yankees are about this. Like, Bellinger, who was on first, saw the sign, sent the message to judge. who then sent it back to Rice like this is what's common. He's throwing a change-up, I believe it was. And he was asked, Belanger was asked about it by the Daily News after the game, you know, why

don't you bother hiding your pitch tipping? And he said, quote, I have no idea. And he admitted that the Yankees are so obvious about it while a lot of other teams try to be discreet. And he did confirm exactly what the video showed that it was Bellinger, the judge, to Rice, and the ball left

the field. The chat about this, you know, somewhat gray area in baseball. We're joined now by ESPN analyst Tim Kirchard. Tim, where do you stand on, you know, the Yankees' proficiency in this area and why they're so blatant about, you know, pitch tipping? Well, I think I have a slightly different view on this. If you do it properly, meaning without any sort of technological help, like camera or something like that, I believe that's your responsibility to relay to your teammates what's going on. Ted Simmons was the best at this when he's with the Brewers,

and he taught it to Paul Moliter, who then taught it to all the Blue Jays in a year in which they won the World Series. It's great gamesmanship. That's how I view it. Now, should you be blatant about it? Should you let everyone know this is what? what we're doing. Maybe that's not a great idea, but it's the responsibility of the defense to make sure

that the signs are not being stolen. Because if they are, then it, you know, it's the fault of the defense, not the offense. If the Blue Jays were doing the same thing, I would say the exact same thing. It's your responsibility to hide the signs so they don't steal it. How are they getting them? I've also done. I don't know the answer to that. If it's something other than they're peaking and seeing on the bases what's going on,

then shame on the team that is getting the signs stolen. Again, I'm a big believer in this, and yet, Cal Ripkin, Tony Gwynne told me along the way in a story I wrote just about this topic a long time ago, I don't want anybody telling me what's coming because I don't trust anyone other than myself. What if they're wrong? And we've had a lot of people wrong doing this. My point is this is gamesmanship. This is what

this is part of the game and it's up to the offense. It's their responsibility to try to figure out what he's doing if he's tippet or not. And it's their responsibility to pass along to their teammates if they want it. Yeah, that's the flip side of it. That's a great point.

You know, like another analogy I would use is golf. Sometimes you don't want to read another guy's put because you don't trust that, you know, he actually hit the put the way he wanted to or he misread it and the same kind of thing. Like, what if you're waiting on information? And they're saying, change up, insures or

throws one 97 on the black. You know, then who do you blame? You know, you look at your teammates and say, thanks. Maybe I didn't need that information. Right. George Bell, again, another Blue Jay. He was really good at this, was one of the best at relaying

stolen signs to his teammates. And yet George Bell didn't want anybody telling him what was coming next because he got crossed up once he got hit because he expected something else to come and he said no more of that. So this is a fascinating discussion. This just happens to be the Yankees and the Blue Jays over the weekend. But it goes on every single night at every single ballpark. And when the people involved that I've talked to you about, Paul Motter, Ted Simmons, Cal Ripkin, Tony Gwyn, George Bell, guys are all really, really good players who know exactly what they're doing.

And the really smart players know how to deal with this. Tim, how would you describe the state of the Jays right now? Are they leaking oil? Should they still be confident? Just where do you think they're at? I think they're the best team in the division. I think they're going to win the division. I love their starting pitching, even though Max Schurzer wasn't great.

last couple times out. I still love their six-man rotation. I love that depth. Jeff Hoffman at the end, forget his ERA for the moment. He is a quality closer on a championship caliber team. And this is a really good offensive club when the boys in the middle are swinging it, and they really are. Starting with the guy at the top, which I'm just amazed how many people wondered if he still got it.

and not only if he still have it, he's a terrific player. And Bobachette's great. And Flaggero just got eight hits in three games at Yankee Stadium. So I really like where the Blue Jays are. Does that mean they're a great team that's going to run away with it and win the American League for sure? Absolutely not. There is no such team in the American League like that.

But I like them better than any team in the division. And that's saying something because the Red Sox have been pretty darn good. since the beginning of July, and the Yankees have a big run left in them, and I think the Blue Jays hold them both off. Yeah, and as of today, the Jays have a two-game lead on the Yankees, three and a half up on the Red Sox. They still play Boston in a three-game series upcoming, yet they have the tie break on both teams.

So they really are in the driver's seat, and the guy you were talking about at the top would be George Springer. And, you know, we got into this yesterday because in Toronto, you know, we understand the MVP is either judge, or Raleigh, clearly. It's one of those two guys in the American League, and whoever doesn't win it is going to finish second. The odds makers would suggest Terrick Scoobles

probably number three. I'm curious if you think Springer's got a shot at that, considering how great he's played this year. Could he be the third most valuable player in the American League? I would say no. I would say he's going to get a bunch of MVP votes. When I

say that, he'll get third, fourth, fifth, six, all the way up to 10th. And again, two years ago, I don't think anyone thought he'd get another MVP vote that high, but this is the turnaround that he's made. He's a freakish athlete, and we're starting to see it again. But I think you could make a case that Boveshett and Blattie Jr. are just as valuable to the Blue Jays as Springer is, but he's been so good at the most important times. Yes, he's going to get some really nice support. He's going to get some MVP votes, and he's going to deserve them.

With Tim Kirchard. Yeah, he's been outstanding. You mentioned Vladia Yankee Stadium. He's made a career in that park, man. His numbers are off the charts. He loves playing in New York. And it sets up possibly, you know, for what we could see come the playoffs if these two teams run into each other. And you mentioned the starting rotation, which you're bullish on them. You're not alone. A lot of people are. But Scher, in particular, has been somewhat of a conundrum all year because of the injuries early in the season. He strikes out a million guys. He did it over the weekend again. But where do you stand on the trust level you would still have with Scher come October? Well, I got to see how the next three weeks go, and then a very difficult decision will have to be made because somebody good is going to get left out of the playoff situation in the first round and if they advance after that. And it could be Scherzer that gets left off. However, if he's great the next three weeks, and I have no doubt he's going to be good,

at least good, the next three weeks. And he's got all that postseason experience, I think he would get a start in a postseason game. Now, again, it's all dependent on the next three weeks. And I'll take experience at that time of year over almost anything else, although when you have spectacular stuff like some of the Mets do on a day, different level. They're going to take these young kids with spectacular stuff and say, go get them. Let's see. Forget about the inexperience. We'll take stuff over inexperience any day. I understand that. But when you have an experienced pitcher who still has very good

stuff like Max Scherzer, I would want him starting for me in the posties. Well, I think we're fairly confident. Again, Jay's, Yankees, Tigers, Houston are going to make it. But all of a we got a race for that third wild card spot. Seattle, Texas, Kansas City, Cleveland. As of today, if you had to pick one to make the playoffs, which team's going to make it? I think the Red Sox are going to make the playoffs. And, well, we get two wild cards, and I think Seattle's going to make the playoffs, meaning I'm not betting on Kansas City or Texas. I would love to say Texas because the way they've played lately, but without my Marcus Simeon, without Corey Seeger, their health up in the air at the moment.

I don't see Cleveland, Kansas City, or the Rangers overtaking the Red Sox or the Rays or the Mariners for another wildcard spot. Always great catching up with you, Tim. We'll do it again soon. Thank you for this. Okay, fellas, take care. See it. Tim Kirchon of ESPN, joining us on the Maple Toyota Hotline, Drive the Built-in Canada Fuel Efficient

Funded Drive Toyota Route 4. gasser hybrid models available visit maple toota.com. How the hell the Cleveland crawl back into the race? All the nonsense that's going on there. They got a minus 48 run differential. And Tampa's four games out. Now they've lost three in a row.

They get swept over the weekend. But they're in it. Cleveland, Kansas City, Texas. Seattle's melting. You know, we'll see what comes of it. But, you know, New York was the epicenter yesterday because you had the Yankees Jays and then you had Alcarus Center.

and like Alcarez just put on a clinic yesterday and those two. He's 22, sinners 24. What the hell are, like the next 10 years, that's those two. Yeah. It's going to be those two in the majors. Do you think that's good for men's tennis, that it's just a formality? These two are always in the final. I don't know.

Like French Open, Wimbled, then U.S. Open. It was like, what's the point of watching? You're just going to see, they just spank everybody. I'd like to see somebody push into their making it. Well, obviously, they're Canadian. the Canadian, Felix. He had everybody, he had the crowd kind of on his side to break through, but it was a different class, man.

Nobody's even, it looks like nobody's close. Like, it doesn't seem like anybody's close. Who did Sinner beat the other day? And the guy went up to him at the net and was like, you're so good. He's like, you're ridiculous how good you are. Yeah. That's what he was saying to him as he was shaking hands after Sinner just rinsed him.

Crazy, crazy. Crazy. But Djokovic saying the same thing. Like, someone pointed it out that, like, Djokovic, it goes thinner in Alcarez, then Djokovic, and then a big gap to whoever's for. Djokovic is still way better than everyone else. And he admits, I just can't play with these guys anymore. I can't do it anymore.

I can't, like, 10 years ago I could. Dude, they're so fast and quick and strong. It's impossible. It's impossible. Like, Alcares is an animal on the court. Like, he is so fast, and, like, Sinner is tall and lanky, and he just gets to everything. It's incredible. to watch.

I just, I don't know. I know we went through it with Nadal and Jokovic and Federer, where those three guys seemingly won every single slam, but it was three of them, and every once in a while, like Murray would show up or someone else might show up right now. It just might be an overreaction, but it seems like a formality.

These two guys are going to be in the final of every single slam. I think if you're a tennis fan or any kind of fan that just tunes in in the fight, you take it. Yeah, you're right. You just mentioned the drop-off. I mean, if a Canadian, obviously, Canadians would be excited. if Felix can make something happen or someone else, but you take the best two guys

and watch it happen every time. Why not? It is incredible theater to see them once you get there. They are that much better than everyone else. So just take it. Yeah. Yeah, I guess you lock it in. I guess we'll see in Australia,

and it's probably going to be the two of those guys. Yeah. Crazy. Which, again, you look at like the different eras. I was thinking about it with quarterbacks last night where we just went through for the first 20 years of the century, Brady and Manning and Breeze and Rogers.

and Rathlisberger. And now we've just transitioned into this next wave of just unbelievable generational talent quarterbacks. And it's the same thing in tennis, where it was Federer and Djokovic and Nandel. Now these two freaks have shown up. And you're like, these two might be better than the other guys. Yeah.

You know, like we might be 15 years away from saying Alcarez is better than all of them. You know, or sinners better than all of them. That's how good these guys are. Scary. All right, Best Betts, Powered by Fandul coming up. Overdrive continues TSN 1050 and on TSNF. All right, best feds powered by Fanduel. Make your picks and assemble a same game parlay in seconds on the Fanduals Sportsbook app.

Fading Owen Wilson here, Bears Money Line, Romo Donzee to score a touchdown, anytime touchdown score tonight. Justin Jefferson, 80 plus yards, alternate receiving yards, prop paying plus 700. Like Jefferson's going to catch. It doesn't matter who's throwing to him. Darnold didn't look great yesterday either in St. Seattle. We should point that out. Sammy Darnold, he's out of Minnesota.

McCarthy, I'm a little bit scared of him, but I think he's going to get the ball in the air, and Jefferson's going to make plays, and he'll have yards after the catch and all that. O'Donzee, I think, is going to break out this year. Top 10 pick last year. I think the Bears at home, Ben Johnson, that's paying big plus money.

Best bets powered by Fandwell. Same game parlay as this NFL season now include passing touchdowns and receptions on the Fandual Sportsbook app. Please play responsibly 19 plus, physically located in Ontario. So, yeah, we get the Monday nighter tonight. We've got Jay's back in action tomorrow. We've got the NHL doing their media tour down in Vegas. We'll see what else comes out of that.

I'm sure a lot of players being asked about their memories of Ken Dryden, as well condolences to the Dryden family, of course, so the great Ken Dryden passing away over the weekend. Man, he was such a good guy. Like, how many times did you stand and hold your stick like Dryden as a goalie? He was like 6'4, so I'm obviously, my career was number 29. Like, that was, Ken Dryden was one of my favorites. I read his book, The Game.

like the weirdest part about this and I think I've told you guys when when you cross paths with like legends like this guy called my house one time my mom was like yeah this ken dryden called she didn't it didn't put two and two together he was like advocating for cornell university and like they were you know whatever trying to try to get going to go there isn't that an ivy league school well i did have stopped you too i actually was oh's claimed you's going to harvard you're claiming you're You're going to Cornell now. Full letter. I've told you guys this.

I've told you guys this story before. Yes. I had good grades and yes, colleges called me. I just didn't go his direction or whatever. All right. Yes. Ken Dryden and Joe Neuendike called,

like advocating for those school. So anyways, I've talked to him on the phone. Like obviously legend here too. Yeah. President of the Maple Leafs. Absolutely. That's a big job.

Huge. I loved him, though. I loved him as a goaltender. only got to know him again a little bit as a person, but condolences. Yes, condolences on just, yeah, the passing of Ken Dryden and just an incredible life, incredible career. His story about coming up late in the season, he ends up winning the Kahn-Smith. I know.

Wins the Cup Kahn-Smite before he's even eligible for the rookie of the year, the 72 series, of course, he was a huge part of that. That's the crazy thing. Like all the things written yesterday, everyone was like, he didn't play that long, but won six Stanley Cups. It was like, holy crap. And, like, packed it in, like, early. in his career.

Like, could have played a lot longer, but that's the, yeah, he was a legend and, you know, big loss. And that was sad news to come out. Yeah, it was, again, I guess very private, a guy, a very private man. A lot of people said that they were close to him, unaware that he was as sick as he was. But you're right. Whenever you see, you know, the Havs legends, like when Gila Fleur passed away, you look at their, like the win-loss percentages of those teams in the 70s and 80s.

It's outrageous. There's nothing like it. There's nothing like it in the 70s. And to say nothing, clearly in the 50s when, like, Richard was there and 60s with, you know, Bellevaux and Richard. And, I mean, that 70s dynasty, though, by the Habs, that very well could be the greatest team ever put together. You know what people will say. Was there only six teams or whatever, and now there's 32? Like, I get it, but it's still back then the amount of legends came out of Hall of Famers, all of that type of stuff.

Outrageous. Incredible. Yep, that's story to history. At some point here in the next couple weeks, we'll be going over teams. What are they going to look like? You know, standings, what we feel like, all of our gut instinct.

Yeah, the gut instinct's coming, man. And maybe that's going to be a big part of the tagline, right? Like the tagline, we're still asking for people to send in their suggestions on what the tagline of the show should be moving forward. And a lot of people are texting and emailing in, sending in DMs. There's got to be some other good one.

that just encapsulates us. I don't know what it is. There's been so many that I've been reading and I'm trying to like archive them all and I got to go over tonight find out exactly what's going on, but we're going to whittle this thing down. There's going to be one in there.

Yeah, there's some good ones in there. It's going to be something self-deprecating. It's just the nature of the way things go. Yeah. Right. Like it's going to be something about our looks or the way we sound or. Well, maybe solid six out of ten still comes back at it, right?

It does kind of ring out pretty well. I mean, that's kind of the nature. nature, the looks, the show, the takes, the vibe, six out of ten, right? That's all we're looking to, you know, that's six out of ten. That's pretty damn good. That's not too bad. That's what Struddy's claims he is all the time. Six out of ten. Well, he thinks he's a ten or an eight or something, buddy. He's a six. Six out of ten. That's fine. Yeah. Nothing wrong with being a six out of ten. All right, boys. Good stuff. Good stuff to everyone behind the scenes for helping out. We appreciate it. everyone for tuning in today. TV radio

podcast web up on YouTube live on TSN's YouTube channel. Every show up there on YouTube live. We're out of here. Enjoy your evenings. Enjoy the games tonight. We're back tomorrow, acts. Noodles, great job today. 4 p.m. We'll chat then. Seasoned gamer

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