OverDrive - Phillips on the Blue Jays landing Gimenez, Juan Soto's signing with the Mets and Guerrero Jr.'s contract status

Episode Date: December 11, 2024

TSN Baseball Insider Steve Phillips joined OverDrive to discuss the headlines around the MLB Winter Meetings, the Blue Jays acquiring Andres Gimenez and his role with the team, Juan Soto signing with the Mets, Vladimir Guerrero Jr.'s contract status, Bo Bichette's next steps and more.

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or visit askkelvin.ca let's get some reaction on this trade that is being reported by jeff passon from our baseball insider steve phillips who now joins us steve great timing on your part it's like you saw all this happening um i was first going to lead with max freed but let's put that off to the side for a moment because it appears the Toronto Blue Jays just got a whole lot better at the second base position, especially defensively, when Andreas Jimenez, it looks like, is coming to Toronto from Cleveland. What's your first reactions to this deal?

Well, I tell you what, I don't know what they're giving up in return with it yet, but Jimenez is a tremendous player. I love him. He's a platinum glove winner, an outstanding defender, and he's a guy that has shown the ability to put the ball in play and make productive outs when he does make outs, and to get on base, and he has some speed speed and so it's a really nice pickup for the blue jays as you guys are just informing me about it i just got off the air of doing some interviews so that is a good pickup really good pickup for the toronto blue jays you know i was wondering what they were going to do at second base and third base i think this is fantastic he's a great defender i think and on that side of the infield with vlad j at first base really covers Vladdy a little bit with maybe the range not being right.

Vladdy catches everything he gets to, but the range factor is not necessarily his strength, and so Jimenez really benefits the Jays in that way. How much would you like the fact that he's under contract until 2029 with a club option for 2030? Yeah, I think it's fantastic, right? I mean, to be able to get that cost certainty, having him under contract, having that controllability,

it allows you to sort of plan around that. Now, he's not going to break the bank either, which is the other thing, right? He's not a big-time, massive contract financially, so it's going to give them flexibility to maybe sign the bigger contract. Now, whether that's going to be Vladimir Guerrero Jr. or not remains to be seen.

But it also is a statement about continuing looking to win, right? This is, I mean, you have a guy like this under control for five years. It is a statement that you expect to be a winning team over the next five years. Now, certainly he's a talent. He could be traded. But I think it's a statement that this is not just, you know, Vladdy and Bo for this year, and then they're going to go in a different direction.

This is a commitment, another statement of commitment to winning for the long term. Well, no doubt about it, Steve. I mean, defensively, this team has strived to prevent runs, and they've done an awfully good job of it, and this only takes them further in that direction. But as for producing runs, you know, that's been a problem, and it's no secret. We all know that. Soto would have runs, that's been a problem and it's no secret. We all know that.

Soto would have been a great solution. Where do you see them going in the wake of the Soto news as you get deeper into free agency here and things shake out? There are other competitors in the market looking for a lot of the same things they're looking for. How do you think they might approach this beyond today?

Well, I will tell you that the Yankees losing out on Soto may be the worst thing that could happen for everybody because now the pivot to Max Freed to go to eight years and $218

million is an extraordinary contract where I think most everybody thoughts now we get five years, three, six years and Corbin Burns seven. The starting pitching market is just exploded right now. And so, you know, we know the Jays were dabbling on the Burns and Freed category. This, this price point is significant,

but the Yankees looked at it and thought we didn't do, we didn't get Soto. We now got to be aggressive to improve our team, and this is a major statement. And so whether it's Anthony Santander, which is a guy I think could be a nice fit for the Blue Jays, whether it could potentially be Pete Alonso at first base or Alex Bregman, who I think would be a great fit for the Blue Jays at third base. You know, I think the Yankees are going all in,

and so I think the prices for even the other non-soto players are all sort of going to ride the wave uh to cost a little bit more i was wondering what your opinion was on the fallout in new york and and specifically with the yankees um without getting juan soto not only do they miss out on getting him like the blue jays and the red Sox, but it's also a subtraction to their lineup and a very big one. So there's that part of it, but also how much does it affect the mystique of being a New York Yankee when they're offering over $700 million and they still can't land a big player like him?

Yeah, well, look, I think that it's a statement for sure that in New York uh the Mets are now the Yankees and the Yankees are now the Mets I mean I mean the reality is that Steve Cohen is the new George Steinbrenner in New York uh now I will say that Hellsteinbrenner is not going to lay down and go away uh but you know I mean and he there's nothing to be ashamed of when you offer 760 billion and the other guy takes $765 million. I mean, they went way out there beyond any comfort level for any owner on that offer. But, you know, I think it's a statement. It's probably more about the Mets than it is about the Yankees

because the Yankees are still going to be major players. But this showdown, this was something that never happened. When I was Mets general manager, there was always an understanding. We didn't go after their free agents. They didn't go after ours. Nobody said it, but you understood what the ramification could be. And this is it. That two guys stood there toe to toe. And these were owners just saying, all right, they raised their paddle at an auction, trying to outdo the other. And now, you know, look, they're both going to be in on Pete Alonso. And they could show down again on that one.

And the reality is there will always be one more Met dollar than Yankee dollar. And so if Steve Cohen wants them, he's going to get it. I mean, look, Steve Cohen has a $92 million sterling silver rabbit on his front lawn. Like, why is it worth $92 million? And why would you buy it? And he bought it because he wanted it. And you know what? Juan Soto became a piece of art, and he wanted it,

and the price was whatever he thought he was willing to pay for it. There wasn't a value determined in the market. He just said, I want it. I'm going to keep going until I get it. And that's the thing owners have been worried about when he first came in. That's what they were worried about. And in New York, this didn't happen. They never would show down against each other because all they would do is run the price up,

and Steve Cohen doesn't care. I did the math on it. $750 million to somebody with $18 billion is the same as $4,166 to somebody with $100,000. Wow. That's wild. Let that sink in.000. Wow. That's wild. Let that sink in. Must be nice. It's nothing.

It's the ocean. Where is this going to leave Vladdy in the grand scheme of things? Because you bring up Steve Cohen, and it feels like, okay, the price has obviously gone up for a player like Juan Soto. Now we know what that is. Is there going to be a big market of people that are still trying to push that price up for a guy like Vlade or is it safe to say that it's still attainable for the Blue Jays when it comes to, is Vlade going to test the market and how high is that number going to be?

Yeah. So I think the price has gone up from what it might've been in November to where it is right now. But I think most everybody looks at Soto as a bit of a standalone, like Otani was. Like, this was the perfect storm, the two Mets owners going at it, and so it ran the price up on Soto. He played for the Yankees, and so the Mets were going to steal him away. But I will say that, you know, the, I mean, Vladimir Guerrero Jr. is going to look at it and say,

well, I'm at least half as good as Juan Soto. So half of 300 or half of 765 is going to get me, you know, 380 million. So I'm at least half as good as he is. And so, you know, look, it's, there will be, they'll use the argument for sure. But, you know, it will come down to how much does Vlade want to stay in Toronto? And I've actually heard that if he had his druthers, he would want to stay. Now, he doesn't want to do it for less, but he wants to stay. But the other factor in all of this right now is they just told him that we want Soto over you

because they didn't offer any of that money to Vladdy. And Soto, they said he's our preference because they weren't going to be able to afford both of them. And so I don't know whether that is how Vladimir Grote Jr. will feel about that, right? That I wasn't their first choice. They would have preferred the other guy. And now they're coming to me wanting to extend me. Now, for the right amount of money you put those things aside but you wonder if there is some emotional impact on that pursuit as well here's our baseball insider steve phillips uh if you're just joining us the breaking news is uh andreas jimenez has been traded to the blue jays

pending a physical still don't know uh what it costs the Blue Jays to acquire the second baseman who's won a gold glove the last three seasons. Going back to one of the big players who's already here, Steve, and understandably we're not talking as much about Bo Bichette as we are about Vladimir Guerrero Jr., but in a GM's position, how difficult is it to have those discussions when it comes to a contract extension when he's coming off of the year that he has?

Yeah, well, I think one of the big challenges all along for both Bichette and Guerrero has been they've had some peaks and valleys. And so when they've had the down years, the players don't want to talk about the extension. They want to wait until they have a good year, and then they want to negotiate. From the club side, there's not really a benefit

when the guy's had his best season to negotiate. That being said, you don't have a good year, and then they want to negotiate. From the club side, there's not really a benefit when the guy's had his best season to negotiate. That being said, you don't have a choice right now because they go to free agency if you don't sign them right now. So I think that you've got to find some common ground. I don't see a way that they make a deal with Bichette right now. I think he's got to play because he wants to have a bounce-back season and then say, this is who I am. I want you to pay me for this.

Now, what Jimenez does, though, is he protects them at shortstop. He is a guy that was originally a shortstop. He can still play shortstop. And so by getting him as a gold-glove second baseman for right now, it does protect them moving forward that if they don't sign Bichette, you could always consider moving Jimenez to short and then going out and finding another second baseman. Hey Steve, you've been in these

negotiating situations many times. I always love your stories about negotiating with A-Rod when he would ask for extras and you had to sort of draw the line there on merchandising tables and all those things. What did you make of the detail about Soto getting a suite thrown into his

deal with the Mets where the Yankees said, no, we can't do a suite because we made Judge and Jeter pay for theirs. Yeah. I, I think that, that I used to get a heck. I gave suites out back when I was a GM 20, I mean 24 years ago here in Dallas was when Alex Rodriguez signed with the Texas Rangers. It's been 24 years, and it was at that press conference when he said he hopes he and 24 of his Texas Ranger teammates run into me in a dark alley somewhere.

And he never talked to me after that. Again, Alex Rodriguez never talked to me. And so I think that those extra perks, Alex Rodriguez never talked to me. I think that those extra perks, you can say no to them, but that would not be a reason. I would not let that be the reason I didn't get a star player. Now, there are also some

other reports that there was a Yankee security guard who didn't let Soto's, a family member for Soto and his driver, come into a certain area that they kicked him out of the stadium. And then another one where I think his mom and the driver were there, and he also sent them outside in the rain, same security guard.

Now, I'm not sure that's best for the job security for the security guard, but I think that, because George Steinbrenner, remember, he would fire the parking lot attendants. security guard but but i you know i think that that because george steinbrenner remember he would always he would fire the parking lot attendants he would go out there and there were times he was in charge of the parking lot steinbrenner himself would fire the parking lot attendants and he would guide the cars in the parking lot so you know the security people it's yeah there's some crazy stories from back then but i think ultimately you know for soto uh you know there were a number of things why.

And what the Mets did is the Mets pulled their traveling secretary in. They pulled their security people in. They explained what they do to take care of families and everything else because they knew that it happened with the Yankees and it bothered them. And it was one of the things that clinched the deal for Soto to go to the Mets. Steve, are you surprised that the Jays are bringing back Jimmy Garcia in a two-year deal? No, I'm not surprised at all.

I think he was nails for them last year. They need to rebuild that bullpen. So he's a guy you know can pitch to Toronto. You know his mentality, his makeup, his character. You know he's a good teammate. You know his durability. You know his bounce-back ability. And so I think it makes a lot of sense to me.

And the fact they only got him on a-year deal, I think is even better. Steve, when we hear anything about the Blue Jays adding a second baseman, we think of the name or Elvis Martinez, who could have been the heir apparent to that position. Of course, his season was marred by a suspension for a positive test for a PED. He could be part of this trade for all we know,

so we're reacting kind of minute by minute here. But if he is still a Blue Jay in the next couple hours, what does today's move mean for his future? Well, it could be that he shifts over to third base because I think that that's something else they've got to figure out what they're going to do at third base. You know, I like Ernie Clement, but I don't see him as an everyday third baseman.

And, you know, Schneider is not an everyday third baseman. Horowitz is not an everyday second baseman or third baseman. And so I think that, you know, Aurelius Martinez could make that move to third. You know, their thought was he's going to develop into a big power bat. Maybe they give him a crack at that opportunity there. But, you know, he's going to have to earn his way back into it.

And so, you know, one of the things about, you know, the winter meetings and the offseason is that it's fluid, right? You know, we could always, we never want to evaluate things just on a snapshot alone because there's always something else.

There's, you know, this move sets up another move, sets up another move. And so I do think it's good to get off the schneid a little bit and do something if you're the blue jays that you know to get some action some movement to start to fill some of those holes and i think we're going to start to see some other things unravel here at the meetings as well over the next 24 hours yeah i was going to say maybe the next

six hours you might be pretty busy uh in dallas there as things are starting to move pretty quickly uh great to have you on uh on any day but especially when we have news breaking like we do. So thanks for doing that, Steve, and all the best throughout the offseason. All right, terrific. Thanks for having me on, guys. Appreciate it. There you have it, our baseball insider, Steve Phillips.