OverDrive - Phillips on the Blue Jays leaping in the AL, Bichette making a statement and the trade deadline priorities

Episode Date: July 22, 2025

TSN Baseball Insider Steve Phillips joined OverDrive to discuss the Blue Jays' winning statement in the AL East, the depth of the roster, the pitching options at the trade deadline, the managerial perspective of the team, Bo Bichette's top notch stretch, the Phillies walk-off on catcher interference and more.

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The station that champions Canadian music. Loud, proud, and all yours. No passports required. Just press play. Tap into Made in Canada now on iHeartRadio.ca or the free iHeartRadio app Here's Steve Phillips Steve. Who was the guy that Pedro threw to the ground in that Yankee Red Sox fight? Yeah, Uncle Fester

No, Don Zimmer Yes, well that's what we're hoping for tonight we want to see the benches clear we want to see i don't know don maddingley go out there i'd be interested in maddely went out there just started laying a beating on someone from the yankees but uh... all yeah it's uber positive up here in toronto steve i'm sure you can imagine uh... i can't even look here's the thing guys I fixed them now it's up to you guys to continue this run like I got them here to 11 straight wins right now it's up to you guys to make sure

that they don't lose another game at home. I think we can find a way to make that work I don't think that's gonna be an issue for people because when you consider you know the clutch gene that they've found here like last night was a significant I guess representation of that Steve we're in the fifth inning they're down a run Springer gets on Vladdy gets on and Bichette who has been the most clutch hitter in baseball you know ropes one down the left field line, laddie goes first to home. It just, everything is working for them right now. And I think the fundamentals seemingly

are a big part of that. Oh yeah, they're doing a lot right. And you know, what happens is that when you're not playing well, if you're not hitting, you made an error, then you sometimes get overzealous. You try to do too much. You try to, you know, you try to, you know, get a three run home run with nobody on base. And, you know, when you start trying too hard in this game, instead of letting it come to you, you end up making mistakes. And, and, and so, you know, there's,

they've got such confidence right now. We may have lost them there. That sounded like his phone, basically. We're not doing this anymore. It was that's on Zimmer. He got his phone got done. Zimmer. Yeah, someone someone done Zimmer that that phone. And that was a direct drop. Like we're not here anymore.

So we'll call Steve back. We'll get him back in. But yeah, Phillips is coming around on the Jays too. Who isn't? Dude, of all the dust ups you've seen in the MLB, like that's got to be the most bizarre one, right? Like Pedro roughing up Don Zimmer like that. Yeah, that was really weird because like in Zimmer, like remember the next day he was like crying, which is really tough to watch because he looked like everyone's grandfather and he had been a yankee like legend and been around forever and he was on tory's

staff forever and Pedro probably took it a little far but what the hell was Don Zimmer doing throwing running rushing someone rushing a guy like what are you doing don zimmer rushing them smarten up man like naturally like Pedro just kind of gave him the like they push them to the side Like a bullfighter type move like just go over here at Don Zimmer. Anyway, we got you back Steve. Go ahead We lost you there, but yeah They just they've got so much going right at this point and you know They've got the confidence level that they need and what's interesting is the starting pitchers are 31 and 28 on the season. There's just three games over 500. But the bullpen is 28 and 13. There are 15 games over

500 right now. And so that tells you, because I'm trying to understand how their record is what it is, and they've got the fourth best run differential in the division. And you know what the story is that effectively you know they are winning because they come back in games. The starters don't throw clunkers but you know they'll give up a run or two or three in the first five innings or so and then they come back later in the game. They beat up on the other team's bullpen, the Blue Jays bullpen comes in, they hold the lead, but what they also do, and this is a key for good bullpens, they also hold the deficit.

That if they fall behind, they come in and then they allow the offense to come back without allowing those tack on runs for the other team. It's an odd formula, you know, it's not the most conventional formula where your bullpen is out pitching your rotation in many regards uh... but the offense is coming around and uh... and listen to run don simmer man. no that time was nolan ryan got a hold of him. you think that's what that was? someone was rushing them out. right over the top of the dome. yeah that one stung too man cause nolan r Ryan was old in that fight

Like he was old not like like athlete, but he was in his 40s Yeah, but that's different because in your 40s, don't you get like start to get like old man strength? That's what they said old man strength like grizzly bear type stuff Yeah, you're supposed to but that was not a smart play. That was another, now I'm forgetting who ran out on the field there, because he became a manager for a long time too.

I don't remember that one. You don't remember where Nolan Ryan hit a guy and he ran towards the mound and Ryan put him in a headlock and beat the hell out of the guy. You've seen that a million times, Jonas. I don't know. Robin Ventura. Robin Ventura, that's who I was.

Robin Ventura. Man, I'm losing my mind here, I can't remember names. Robin Ventura. Robin Ventura, that's who I was. Robin Ventura. Man, I'm losing my mind here. I can't remember names. Robin Ventura. But that's an all-time clip. Yes, because Ventura was young. Like he was mid-20s, and he thought I'm gonna go out there

and just ate up on this old guy. How dare you? Nowhere even close to it. Like Ryan brings him in. Ventura doesn't get anything off. He brings him in right away, headlock, and just starts peppering him right over the head. That's gotta be the worst feeling in the world

in front of 40,000 people, an old guy's got you in a headlock, and he's throwing off the top of your head. He might as well have given him a noogie. Yes, like look at this, Jonas. So Ventura plays it cool, he's like, I'm going to lay a beating on this old guy, and Ryan's like, come here, you little snot.

No chance. Just starts laying a beating on the guy. Oh! I love that. We need more of that in baseball. We need way more. P. Alonso was advocating for that at the All-Star game. Was he? Yeah, he said it should be like hockey. Go get in a fight you don't get kicked out of the game. The crazy thing about those like fights where you're not on skates it's basically a street fight. Yeah that's exactly what it is. It's a it's a street fight with a uniform on. That's

right. It's like lacrosse man they'll take their helmets off and you're in a bar, basically, just fighting. All right, we're gonna try this one more time, Steve. You're down 0-2 in the count here with that phone of yours, but you got us or what? Yeah, I got you, I got you. I'm gonna actually charge them out on the phone call right now.

Yeah, good man. But yeah, it's all coming together. And you look at Last night like to start by Gosman and this has been a big topic of discussion leading up to the trade deadline Like what are we what are they gonna do with the rotation? Is it possible for them to find anyone that's gonna give you more confidence than Gosman Bassett or Burrios? He had extra rest coming out of the All-Star game, but man did he look good last night He challenged the Yankees he challenged judge multiple times you know is

if they're at their best is gosman your game one starter like if he's if he's in a position where you feel like you can pitch the way was gonna pitch last night yeah i think i mean he can be there's no question we've seen him be an ace we've seen a bs Cy Young candidate. So we know that that's in him. But what happens is that you don't have a chance

to do anything else starting August 1st. And so how confident are you that you're gonna get the premium performance from your starting pitchers for the rest of the year? And I don't feel confident about that, even with guys that have been consistently dominating all season long. So my view is that they still need to try to tack on, this is the year to go for it.

You're not going to get enough front end starting pitching and you know what, if you get a fourth guy and you go four deep for the playoffs and everybody's fresh and ready to go and maybe you could do somebody in the bullpen if you need them. I think you've got to go for it that way. I don't hedge my bet in any way. There's nothing that's going to happen over the next couple days, you know, leading in nine days leading to the deadline that's going to cause me to pull back. I'm going for it if I'm Ross Atkins and Mark Shapiro and that includes getting a pitcher that is as good or better than the front end of

the rotation. Steve, I'm sure you've seen the visual of Vladdy flying through the air going into home last night. I mean what does that do for the players in the clubhouse and the dugout seeing a guy like Vladdy really kind of laying it out there doing a little bit extra where you know we've seen Vladdy in the past you know whether it's a couple years ago we've been at second base trying to get a challenge in in that was just looks it looks totally different looks blue-collar like it's lunch pail like in i have to think that that kind of stuff really permeates through the rest of the

rest of the dougo yeah i think it does for sure i think also for organizational point of view uh... when your superstar is busting it, it doesn't just impact the major league team, it impacts your minor leagues. It's an opportunity to show everybody these are our expectations when you play for our major league team, that our superstar is hustling. He does run out ground balls too, generally, and hustles down the line.

So on occasion, I don't mind a guy pulling line. And so, I mean, look, on occasion, I don't mind a guy pulling up a little bit, 162 games and he's gonna be out there every day, and I'd rather him stay healthy than pull a hamstring, but I think it's great, I do. I think that, and even as a GM, it reinforces to you and to ownership that he's taken responsibility for his role on this team, and we given him a lot of money and with that money has come a lot of

responsibility and he's owning that responsibility. I think it's a special thing. Steve, if I could go back to your point about starting pitching, let's say the best you can do short of like going crazy and getting Mitch Keller, Joe Ryan, is someone like Seth Lugo, free agent after this year, is that like, would you do that or you just kind of say, you know what, this is what we got, we're not going to go in for someone like that? I would do that. I would. I think that you have to protect Lauer and Scherzer. You know, and look, I know Scherzer is going to pitch today. I know that, uh, you know, he's made what four or five starts in a row, but that thumb is a continuous thing he has to manage. And for me,

I just can't assume that he's going to be able to stay healthy in the last two months of the season. And if I don't protect him now, then, you know, August second rolls around his next start. He comes out with a sore thumb and I've got nowhere else to go. And so I think you have to ensure, you know, buy your insurance now. If you don't need it, then you've got depth and a little too much, then so be it. Find a way to manage that. But I don't want to get caught in my pants down. That, you know, I assumed that my 40-year-old picture was going to stay

healthy when he's had injuries over the last three years and then have it go wrong because the obvious question will be well like would I be shocked if something happened none of us wanted to but when I'd be shocked it's your no I wouldn't and if I'm if I'm not gonna be shocked by it then I better protect it. With Steve Phillips and yeah and I was saying earlier Steve like the history of this front office is they invest in their in their rotation like that is just always the way that they've operated. That's their philosophy, is like build the rotation and the rest can be figured out. And then when you compound that with what you just said about Scherzer, the Eric Lauer story has been uber positive. It's just been an

unbelievable run. The wheels fell off on him in two weeks. Would anyone be shocked? I don't think you could be. And that you always mentioned it like managerial malpractice if you get to the end of the run and you miss the playoffs by a game because Scherzer's thumb flared up and Lauer you know returned to where he was maybe a year or two ago and you just simply don't have options it's indefensible and then again with their philosophy of really investing in that, including just the capital that they have, not just the money, but I would think the prospects they have if they can find somebody that maybe does have

some term and they can build that rotation out beyond the next two months, everything Ross Atkins has said and done in the past would indicate that that's likely going to happen in the next eight days? Yeah, I would think so. And it's going to come down to, you know, are there pitchers available with control? Who are they? And then, you know, I mean, the reality is that's the first choice for everybody is if I'm going to give up premium talent, then I want to get more than just a rental player

for the rest of the year. And everybody's going to have that same thinking. So the price is going to go up and it's going to come down to, you know, what are you willing to pay to do it? And what are you willing to pay for your benefit of getting the player and for your benefit of the other team, not getting the player? Because some part of this is a game of keep away. You know, I want them, but I also don't want you to get them. You know, I don't want the Yankees to get the starting pitcher that they're both competing to try to get. And so it's one thing if that guy ends up going to San Diego

and joins their rotation, it's another one if you lose out on the same guy and he goes to the Yankees. And so for me, I'm willing to pay a premium. And you know, you don't say this as a general manager to run the price up on yourself, but reality is if I want the guy I'm gonna get him and I can keep him away and he's the best guy then I've got a chance to not only help myself but I've got a chance to damage my closest opposition I've got to go down that road and pay the price. With Steve Phillips so Boba

Shadid the biggest hit of the game last night and yet it's been very routine for him to do that throughout this season. We talked a lot over the last year and a half about a lack of clutch hitting, lack of performance with runners in scoring position. To put it into perspective where Bichette currently ranks, runners in scoring position according to MLB.com, Bichette ranks first and average, he's hitting 400 with runners in scoring position, 400. He's ninth in on-base percentage, tenth in slugging, he never strikes out.

How much of this is because of where he's hitting in the lineup, in your opinion, now that they've moved him to the cleanup role, which was a big issue for them last year, remember how much of a black hole that was for them? And they've tried to push him into being a lead-off guy, they've moved, he's hit second, he's hit third he's now they've just got him hit behind Vlad E and seemingly Vlad he's on a lot Springer's been on a lot whoever's sitting clean up or whoever's hit lead off it changes every night it's done a pretty good job of getting on bite bass as well like what what do you see out of

a shed and how comfortable does this role seem to be for him? Yeah, you know, he's just a hitter. I mean, generally, he just comes out to play and I've always thought it's like a summer league team. Like he's just that guy that comes out that hat backwards batting gloves dangling out of his back pocket double wristbands on. Got the eye black on. He gets out of the van carrying his bat bag.

Where do we play? All right, that field over there is like, oh who we playing today? Like he just shows up, he's just a baseball player and he shows up to play and I don't know necessarily that it really matters that much to him where he hits and but I do think that the way he is with Hunter's and Scoram's just to slow that heartbeat right now and you watch you know he's the best Jays hitter at going the other way. How many times do we see him flare one down the right field line, you know, slice one just inside the bag down the line over there. Uh,

and that ability to let the ball travel, uh, and have confidence that you can let it get deeper into the zone and still put a good swing on it, drive it the other way. Gives him the ability to hit the fastball and the breaking stuff. And so, you know, he's not gonna take a walk, but with runners on base, you know, like I love Joey Votto,

but Joey Votto would have a 420 on base percentage and drive in 79 runs because that 3-1 pitch, he was taking it with runners in scoring position but you know this, Bichette's gonna be up there hacking. He's gonna be up there trying to slice it into the outfield, find a gap, try to drive in the runs and so on this team with traffic on base in front of him he's the right guy batting fourth. How do you explain the difference in George Springer from last year to this year Steve where last year he has an OPS under 700 and now he leads the team in home runs. Well he has simplified

things a little bit with his swing. He used to have a little bit of a leg kick and now it's not nearly the same starting mechanism that he had before which I you know a lot of times when hitters aren't you know hitting the ball well they think to themselves or they're swinging at a pitch out of the zone they think I need to wait longer but the reality is you've got to get that front foot down earlier and getting to the hitting position and I think he found himself late on so many pitches last year particularly the fastball and so he's gotten himself back on the fastball and

now you know he can keep his hands back for the breaking stuff But I think a lot of it too is just that rejuvenated confidence in himself, you know He he had injuries you struggle a little bit and even you know guys who have been all-star players for years Those voices creep into your head of doubt that you know I don't know if I can still do it the way I did it before am I ever gonna be able to bounce back again can I be the player I once was and and and then when you find a way to get back into that success in confidence circle it reminds you of who you were as a player and he's locked back in right now and I think as much as maybe an adjustment offensively is sort of the

bat in his in his approach I think it's also just a high level of confidence. Well, Steve Phillips, so the Red Sox lost last night on catcher interference with the bases loaded against the Phillies. It had happened one other time, someone referenced it, it was like in the 70s or 80s or something like that. 1971, 54 years ago. Johnny Bench was, Manny Moda and the Dodgers. Manny Moda was on third. He was trying to steal home and Johnny Bench came out of his crouch behind the plate to come up and catch the ball. And in Harry Wendelstadt, the umpire called catchers interference on Johnny Bench 54 years ago was the last time a game was walked off on a catcher's interference. time a game was walked off on a catcher's interference. Wow like what are you possibly saying to yourselves in the clubhouse after that? Like what what is

Cora do you even address the team? Like what do you do in a scenario like that? Yeah I think you just hang with them boys we'll get them tomorrow. Yeah. You know and think about the Phillies you know and Rob Thompson their manager who is so understated like he is he never gets excited heies, you know, and Rob Thompson, their manager, who is so understated, like he never gets excited. He goes, well, you know, I thought I'd seen everything in my 40 years, but over the last two weeks, I saw two things I'd never seen before.

Remember, the Phillies lost that game in San Francisco on the inside the park walk-off home run. And inside the park, walk-off three-run homer and hit off the bricks in right field and Rick shade back towards centerfield Andrew Bailey the catcher for a Patrick Bailey the catcher for the Giants and then they were the they were unfortunately the the you know they got they lost that game but this one they were the beneficiary of the catchers interference on what was kind of a check swing anyway, that he didn't really look like,

but it was, he offered so late that he got Narvaez's glove. So that is the thing about this game. When you think you've seen everything, something else happens and it's like, man, like you thought that you've seen every potential thing that could happen in the game and then something like this happened.

Yep, very true. Well, we'll see what comes of it tonight. Bunch of ball games, including Jay's Yankees tonight. Enjoy it tonight, Steve. We'll do it again soon. Thank you for this. You got it, guys. Thanks for working through the phones with me. You got it, buddy. There he is, Steve Phillips joining us on the Maple Toyota Hotline. Drive the built-in, Canada, fuel-efficient, fun-to-drive Toyota RAV4, gas or hybrid models. Available visit mapletoyota.com. Loud, proud, and all yours. No passports required. Just press play. Tap into Made in Canada now on iHeartRadio.ca or the free iHeart Radio app.