OverDrive - Phillips on the Blue Jays' overall cold stretch, the bats issues and the management perspective of the team

Episode Date: April 30, 2025

TSN Baseball Insider Steve Phillips joined OverDrive to discuss the headlines around the Blue Jays, the batting issues on the lineup and how to fix the cold run for the team, Vladimir Guerrero Jr. and Bo Bichette's persistent struggles, Anthony Santander inability to find his stride, the rotation choices, the management perspective of a reeling team and more.

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Join today and be part of something amazing. Here's Steve Phillips, our TSM baseball insider. Spin this positively for us. We need some positivity up here in Toronto, Steve. What can you tell us about this Blue Jays recent run that would suggest it's an outlier and everything's gonna be all good? Well, sooner or later the Leafs have to win a close out game. Sooner or later they've got a score and a power play, my gosh, don't they?

Yeah, you would think so. You would think. And sooner or later, Bichette's gonna hit a home run, you think. And so, yeah, I wish there was a better way to spin it, but they played pretty decent baseball for a little while and now the offense is just, the pitching's not there, they're trying to be perfect. And by trying to be perfect, it makes you more imperfect. It makes you find the heart of the plate

because you fall behind nibbling off the corners and then you lay one in there and they hit on the ballpark. And five home runs yesterday to the Red Sox. Red Sox are actually really good offensive team. You better bring your a-game pitching against them Now maybe tonight you got Lucas G Alito making his first start back coming back from Tommy John surgery They come back from injuries and spring training and so, you know Maybe there's a way they jump on a guy like the Yankees jumped all over Kyle Gibson yesterday down at Baltimore But you know that would that would mean that, uh, the first three hitters would hit home runs and that would mean for show what

happened to hit his first. So, um, I wish there was a better way to spin it. Hoffman's been good at the end of the game, uh, to close him out. There's haven't been any saves to get, uh, these days. And so, um, you know, I, you know, the pitching looked like it took a step backwards, the pitching's looked like it took a step backwards. The offense is struggling, and it's not a great sign because the Yankees and Red Sox

aren't gonna wait around for anybody, and they're not gonna feel sorry for anybody. Now, you know, I saw Scherzer through a bullpen. He's working his way back, but again, I think right now, that's icing on the cake. Whatever you get is on top of everything. You can't count on it. They're going to need the guys that are there to do it. Somehow, Flattie's got to put the team on his shoulders and start to really carry them.

Steve, that's the optimistic, I guess you would say, spin on this. I just don't see it. Are we not going into year three of an abysmal offense where we're looking at it and just saying they can't hit They can't hit like for anybody to think that these guys are gonna turn it around offensively. I'm sorry Like when is the time limit on saying the offense is gonna come we had Ross on Right after Vlad. He signed and he said I'm really excited about this offense. It's about to pop That was ten games ago. When does someone just look at this and say, sorry, this doesn't work? Yeah I think we're there.

I mean it's the same story over and over again. I know that you guys have beyond, you probably get sick of hearing the same same you ask the same questions. I give you the same answer every time see the one thing about it is It's not it's not even like entertaining like there if you're watching these guys travel around The division and like just that they don't even cut like they can't hit they don't even compete that you don't even say I can't wait to come back and watch them launch homers or run or whatever. It's just not an entertaining brand, which is the worst thing of all. You can't even entertain people. Yeah.

I mean, to your point, so yesterday, the Cubs reached a point where they have 40 home runs and 40 stolen bases, the Cubs do so far this year. 42 home runs and 44 stolen bases. They're the quickest team to ever get to that and that power and speed dynamic makes it a fun, interesting, exciting, you know, really fun games available to watch and play. The Blue Jays have 16 home runs and 20 stolen bases. Not even half the home runs and fewer than half the stolen bases in the same amount of time. So you think about how much less action that is, how much less movement

that is. The Cubs have 60 doubles, the Blue Jays have 51. And so it's not like they're just not hitting home runs and they're doubles. They're not really hitting that many doubles either. and their doubles, they're not really hitting that many doubles either. And, you know, we're talking about the second fewest home runs and, you know, the second lowest OPS. And so there's no pitching good enough to be able to overcome that little offense as you can get. And so, you know, I think that something's going to have to change and guys are going to have to get hot, stay hot.

Uh, Pichette's going to have to start hitting for power. And Shantandar is better than what he's doing. And you know, even if he gets to who he is, which is a lower on base percentage guy, he'll be like a three 10 on base percentage, but you hope he slugs 540, which is going to make him a really functional player and hitting home runs and driving him runs. And they've got this malaise that has sort of been contagious that everybody has. And they don't even have any guys that are really excelling.

Springer did early, but he's not hitting home runs either, but he's getting some hits. And I like the energy with it he's playing. But Varsho is going to bring circus catches, but he's not going to bring offensive production. And, you know, the idea of the offense is going to pop. You know, the only way it pops is if the first four guys in the lineup really deliver. And you think really the first three, which means that if you think about a third of your

lineup is what you can count on, then that gives you three innings a game where you have a chance to score, right? A third of your lineup, a third of the game. And that's not giving yourself a lot of chances to try to do it. Then you're hoping a Kirk runs into one. You're hoping that Rodin hits one. You're hoping that Varsho can get on and steal a base and do something. So, you know, I don't, you you know the reality is you can change hitting coaches and they did but if it's the same hitters and you've changed coaches and it's the same answer for three years then maybe you need to change the hitters. Well and that's the thing now that you got Varshow back I mean

they're committed to Bichette leading off. I'm curious where you stand on that because you know, Springer's hit and clean up tonight. They had Jimenez hit and clean up for a while. They finally got off it because they had to. I mean, Jimenez looks like he did in Cleveland the last couple of years. You have Varsho hitting fifth and Kirk,

Alejandro Kirk's killing them at the plate. Like just killing them at the plate. But do you just keep, are you just committed to Bichette leading off, Steve? Does that appear to be the way Schneider is going to approach it or what? I think so you know he hits his on-base percentage but he does get his hits you know yep and you know you can put Springer back up there but I you know having Springer down below where maybe he can drive in some runs and hit a home run at least gives you a chance to put a crooked number up on the scoreboard

with Bichette on base in front of him. Because you can bat Bichette down there, but a man on first, if it's Vlady, he hits a double. Vlady might not score on the double because he's not hitting it on the ballpark. And so, yeah, I think they're probably locked in on Bichette. It's just, they've gotta find a way to unleash a Santander. Cause if they can get him going, then it at least changes the dynamic for

Vladdy a little bit and, and, uh, and then Springer's got some traffic on the bases in front of them. And then, you know, then maybe you can get some traffic for the guys behind them to where the pitcher has to throw it over the plate. Cause right now, when nobody's on pitchers can start the ball in the zone, break it out of the zone, and the J's hitters chase. They don't have the sort of team discipline to lay off of that pitch.

And so, you know, the only answer is to start getting men on base, and then have somebody run into one. And even if it's only Santander that starts to get the power going, that would at least feel better the what it does right now yeah his numbers are are staggering man and i i get it he always has a bad april he doesn't have a

great september is generally waits for the warm weather and i'm sure that's coming but in terms of first impression on a market it's it's been it's been dreadful really for some time there and you know we mentioned the starters i don't know if you've ever seen some of the fifty in an inning the way Gosman did the other day and then Francis last night gives up five home runs and I just I look at Schneider and I'm like I don't I don't know what he's I don't know how he's supposed to get away from this because Gosman was pitching you know

it was going to be a double header and you knew the bullpen was going to be taxed you're playing a lot of games here you mentioned Hoffman's been great beyond that they're still trying to figure out exactly how everything's gonna play out but it does that feels like deja vu that last year Gosman was speaking out Bassett was speaking out you know I'm curious how far you think we are away from their starters Sam man I don't know what we're supposed to do here yeah it's a tough situation because you don't ever want to point fingers at a team. And, you know, if you're not getting run production, the guys go out there trying to be perfect and it

makes you more imperfect. It just, you know, you think I'm going to nibble the corners, oh, it's ball one. And, you know, then you come in, okay, then I'm going to work off the plate, and the guy doesn't chase, next thing you know, you're three and one, you got thrown over the plate. And then they, because you feel like I've got to be perfect because we're not scoring anything. So I'm going to work off the plate and the guy doesn't chase next year you know you're three and one you got thrown over the plate and then they because you feel like I've got to be perfect because we're not scoring anything so I've got to get strikeouts I've got to try to miss bats I can't let them put it in play and it becomes this confounding problem compounding problem so you know listen you can't leave a pitcher in for 53 pitches in an inning I I I think that that's such a setup for an injury.

It's one thing to throw 100 pitches in a game over six innings where you're throwing, you're sitting down, your arm's recovering. You're throwing 53 pitches without any recovery time with a pitch timer. It is such a setup for an injury. And, uh, we fortunately, you know, it doesn't seem like he's, he got hurt, but it is a real setup. And, and, uh, you know, I know that they felt like it got away from them. They had nine pitch at bats. They didn't anticipate it went from 35 to 44 to 53 pitches and two at bats. And, and, you know, next thing you know, he's up over 50, but, uh, I,

I just, that's really risky. Really risky. And I would have had a conversation with my manager if that happened. We can't afford to leave people out there for 50 pitches. Now, if somebody else, I saw another player, young player out there for 39 pitches, and I'm like, what are we doing? And finally, they took him out. And Will Warren, I think it was, threw 39 pitches and they cut them out of the game.

Like we can't do this to our kids. So I didn't like it, but you've got to protect them. Steve, where would your mindset be if you assembled the squad? I mean, Mark and Ross put this together. Where do you think their headspace is watching this? Is it just like, well, they're going to get us sooner or later? I don't know.

They can't be optimistic or happy watching this. I wonder where they're at. Where would you be at? I got there. I was in this place where it wasn't playing out the way I sort of hoped it might, even though I went in with some doubts about guys, I thought, geez, everything goes right and it'll go our way. It just doesn't always go right, you know? And the more questions you have

coming in, some of them work out, some of them don't, and some of them just are neutral, but then other questions pop up with guys. That's not even the ones you were worried about. And so I've been down that road and wasn't shortly thereafter got fired. And you can hope, you can keep trying to pray, you keep trying to spin, you keep trying to be optimistic, you keep trying to say, you know, we're about to pop, it's about to happen, we know we're close. Uh, and in some ways you're convincing yourself, uh, and you know, because what are you going to say?

Uh, Nope, you're right. We suck. You're right. You know what? We're not going to turn it around. You can't, you're not. We suck. You're right. You know what? We're not going to turn it around. You can't you're not going to do that So you continue this to preach optimism and you talk to the players pat them in the back Tell the managers there you support everybody

It's it's all you can do as a general manager But you know when you're in some trouble and and they have to feel it right now that it's slipping away a little bit It's a horrible feeling and You know and then the clamoring starts getting louder. I mean, for me, I remember going to my owner when somebody wrote at one point, Mets fans want Phillips's head on a pike on the Triborough Bridge.

One of the writers wrote that. Wow. Yeah, and here's the thing. I actually at the time had a restraining order from a fan who was making threats. I had another guy calling, leaving me messages that were threatening. I had another guy call and say that if he saw me

on the road, he'd run me off the road and hope that me and my family died a slow, painful death. I had another person's psychiatrist call up and say that the patient was a threat to my life, that they'd threatened against me. So this guy wrote, you know, Mets fans went to Philly to set up a pike on the Triborough Bridge, and I knew we were struggling.

I knew that my days were numbered. But then it starts getting ugly, right? And then it starts getting personal. And then, so I at one point went to with ownership and I said listen I said I understand Where where things are and where you are and I just want you to know like I get it And so, you know, he goes now we'll give it a little more time So we can't get things to turn but like he acknowledged that you know The reality was that if things didn't turn I was out and I knew the reality was that if things didn't turn I was out and you know when you're

in these positions you hold on to hope but you also are realistic and you know when things are going poorly the snowballs rolling down the mountain turning into an avalanche that it's going to take a Herculean effort of some sort to turn it around that becomes a very remote possibility and so I'm sure they're feeling that right now in the Jays front office right now. Yeah well and you got a bullpen opener tonight trying to get you over the top against this Boston Red Sox juggernaut offense so we'll see what comes of it they need one tonight that is for sure always appreciated Steve thank you for

doing this we'll do it again soon. You got guys my pleasure anytime Steve Phillips our TSM baseball insider Hip-hop and when it comes to country. It's the true north all the way Loud and proud an all-new digital radio station from coast to coast made in Canada played in Canada on the free I heart radio app and at I heart radio.ca