OverDrive - Phillips on the Blue Jays' winning culture, the series identity and the Game 5 viewpoints

Episode Date: October 29, 2025

TSN Baseball Insider Steve Phillips joined OverDrive to discuss the headlines around the Blue Jays' win in Game 4 against the Dodgers, the identity of the team, George Springer's injury status and how to shape the lineup with Bo Bichette, Trey Yesavage's view, Ernie Clement's heroic series, the approach to Shohei Ohtani and more.

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Here's Steve Phillips. Steve, how would you describe that win by the Blue Jays last night? Well, absolutely gutsy effort on their part. And, you know, once again, they show tremendous resiliency. When you think that, you know, you're not going to come back from something, that this will be the thing that caused them to lose the series. They bounced back. And I think it was important for, you know, with Springer going out,

for Vladdy to come up with the home run, I think was critical, that, you know, it's Lucas who took Springer spot in the leadoff position, getting on base, and Vladdy hit in the home run because it sent a message that the most predictable player was playing predictably, so we're still okay. Like, this is who we are. And we just put the next man up there getting the job done. And the batts came to life from there. That seventh inning, breaking it open was huge. Beaver was terrific. You know, I was very. I was very. You know, I was very. worried about him early. He could command his fastball. He couldn't command the secondary pitches.

I don't like those early walks. You know, he walked Otani, and then he walked Muncie in the second, and but, you know, they were able to find a way to limit what the Dodgers did, and Mukhi Beth's struggles continue. O'Tonni didn't do much, and

and then the, you know, the lineup just kept churning for the Blue Jays, so it was a big, big win for them. And now a whole field advantage back in their court, and that series tied at two. Steve, what did you hear on Springer? Like, do you think he can possibly come back and play in this series,

or do you think that's game over for him? My sense of it is, I mean, when, you know, I've seen a lot of these obliques. When a hitter swings, it immediately calls out the trainer and then walks in the dugout and up the tunnel, that's one of those ones where he felt the pop. You know, he felt something really give on him there. And so, you know, you can get injections,

to try to numb things. You've got to get the right spot. But, you know, inevitably he'll swing and feel something or he'll change the swing so as not to feel something. And the risk you run is that if he's going to DH, then Bichette's going to have to play second, which means that if Springer has an bat or in his first at bat, he takes a swing and feels that he comes out of the game, then you're already, you know, digging in with somebody else leading off in your lineup, right? somebody lesser is now in the lead-off spot in the lineup. And so I don't know how you put him in there and take the shot unless he's taking a full-blower batting practice.

And I can't even imagine that he can do that. So I'll be surprised. I mean, I know they're saying hour-to-hour day to day, but, you know, my experience is that guys don't, this look like a six-to-eight-week sort of oblique, not a little tweak that, you know, you take a day and you come back and play. With Steve Phillips, so we don't have the lineup. be yet for game five you know we believe they'll go back to schneider straw in the lineup with

snell on the mound if springer doesn't play who bats leadoff for you tonight so um you know i would consider beset leading off myself um i don't want beset behind vladdie it it came back again in in game three for them you know they when you make moves that you do it because you somebody who can run a little bit better, but he doesn't hit the same. You want somebody who can defend a little bit better, but he doesn't swing the same. Then you end up with three guys in your lineup through our lesser offensive players, and they got caught in extra innings in game three. Would that be in the case? And so, you know, and I definitely don't want that behind Vladdy. So I might lead off Bichette in the game and go out there with some

swag to start with. His at Batson, but it's been pretty good. And that's where I would go. The Davis-Snyder does, you know, there have been times that Davis-Snyder looks really locked in. He works to count. He could take a walk and get on base. He doesn't look like that right now. And he's got a lot of swing and miss on the high-velocity fastball. And so I personally wouldn't mind seeing putting Bichette in that lead-off spot and then sort of going from there to Vladdy. There's nobody they're going to bring out of the bullpen That's going to make me think Oh, geez, I'm worried about that right-handed reliever

Facing, you know, two righties in a row There's nobody they're bringing in and scared me out of that bullpen Other than Sasaki late And his split more served to the left-handers So I would lead off a shot So it'll be, I'm with you I think it'll be very interesting to see what John Snyder does Steve, what are your expectations from the kid you Savage?

I think it's his first start on the road, is it not? Like it's pretty big, deal for the kid what are your expectations so i expected to be much better than he was in game one uh you know he you know it was a big it was a big ask you know having them start game one yet i understood why they did it uh but you know he got away from being who he is and he hardly used his splitter at all in that game he kept going fastball

slider and i couldn't understand what like what are they doing uh and his split is good enough to throw the right hand of batterers gosman using it to right he's the lefties and his is as good or better with a different release point so i would really like to see him get back to being who he is don't give into the opposition because you think you need to be something different because they're you know tony and bets and those guys forget that go be your best self pitch your best game and and if they beat you that way i can live with it so i i do look for him to be much better i think that he'll make an adjustment and he's shown the ability to learn I think he's got good people around him between Gosman and Scher and Bassett and guys like that talking to him about, you know, himself and what he can do and how he can go about it.

But I expect it to be much better in the game tonight. Did you see this type of play from Ernie Clement? I mean, you know, I was talking before he came on. I felt like he was like an unsung hero. Do you see it that way or is there something different there? Oh, he's definitely an unsung hero. I mean, but when you're an unsung hero, it's because we didn't expect it from you. And, you know, he's a good little ball player.

There's no question about that. But, you know, who hits 460 or 400 in the playoffs? And, you know, here's a guy that's been outrighted a couple times, you know, signed a minor league deal to come in. And he's just finally figured it out. And, you know, credit the organization for creating an environment where guys can figure it out. But he is such a solid player, offensively and defensively. He does just about everything right.

quality at bat's an easy natural swing doesn't overdo it and so I love them in the lineup you know and I think about him and the contributions they've gotten and from Nathan Lucas and Barger and for me I don't want Miles Straw on the lineup I great guy love him on my team but I want Barger in the lineup I understand that it's a lefty versus lefty matchup I'll take my chances even if he strikes out a couple times that he might run into one and hit it out of the ballpark, where I don't think straw has got the ability to impact the game in that way.

You know, in the playoffs, give me people who can hit it out of the yard. So I would love to see Barger in there. I don't want him to see him coming out for defense. I don't want to see him coming out for base running. He's a guy for me that stays in the lineup. He's a regular for me now. And a guy that I would not in any way look for places to take him out because of the situation. Yeah.

Well, and that Grant Slammy here was off a leftie. game one. And that's not something Miles Straw is ever going to do. They had straw bunting with two strikes in the count the other nights. And here's the thing, he better get that down because that's what he is. He has to do the little things right. He has to take the extra base. He has to get the bunting down. That's his value. Defense and doing little things right. And so I was disappointed in him not getting that bun. One, it was a horrible pitch to punt. It was up in his and not the kind of pitch, you've got to take that one anyways, but even earlier in the county, jabbed at the ball,

and, you know, that's one just catch it on your bat and get it down on the ground. So, you know, I'm okay, you know, late, late in ninth inning, and you've got to lead then at that point. Maybe you make a move. I don't start doing defense in the sixth inning because so many things change, and you've got a pitching staff that sometimes can't keep the ball in the ballpark,

and so you're going to make a defensive change on a ball that's hit over the head and out of the park, I need that guy that can hit home run still in my lineup until it's the ninth inning or trying to get those final outs. Then I'm okay with making defensive moves. Otani was quiet last night. Struck him out a couple of times. I got lucky with the second care.

I think it was a bad call. The Ump was not, in my opinion, great last night for either team. But what do you expect out of Otani tonight? Yeah, so I think that, I mean, I think he's going to be locked in. He's a great talent. any situation that is anything other than him leading off an inning, I'm walking him. I mean, if there's any, I just, I'm going to put him on base. I am not going to, because Mookie Betts doesn't scare me.

Now, it'll basically see the Dodger lineup because Doc Roberts did suggest that he's going to make some changes. I don't know if that means bets, but give me 100 times over, I'm not going to throw a pitch to Otani that I can throw to bets with Will Otani on first. And so I think that's something to keep an eye on there. And you have to hope that maybe the cramping that Otani's gone through limits his ability for stealing bases. You know, I mean, he was cramping yesterday, pitching. He was cramping the day before.

You know, obviously he's asking his body. You know, and I've said it before, I think it's his body rejecting being a two-way player. I get he wants to, but his body is saying that it's too much. And, you know, we're winding it down. And, you know, he remember he was the most protected guy all season of all. He came back, one inning here, two innings there. But, you know, you wonder whether or not he's going to be able to run the way that he's been able to in the past. It should be a blast tonight.

We're guaranteed to be coming back to Toronto for at least game six. Enjoy it this evening, Steve. We'll do it again soon. Fantastic, guys. Look forward to it. Steve Phillips, our baseball insider. Seasoned gamer or just video game curious, this weekend gaming is the podcast for you. We break down the latest in the world.

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