P1 with Matt and Tommy - BREAKING: Carlos Sainz to join Williams next season!

Episode Date: July 29, 2024

Silly season continues! We react to the breaking news that Carlos Sainz will join Williams next season on a multi-year contract. How will get on? What does this mean for Alex Albon? And what took him so long to decide? P1 Live is heading to North America this Fall and tickets are now on sale! Click here to get your tickets, which are already close to selling out!Sign up to our Patreon here! You'll get access to bonus episodes, our classic race series, every P1 episode ad-free and access to our Discord server where you can chat with other F1 fans!Follow us on socials! You can find us on Twitter, Instagram, Twitch, YouTube and TikTok. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello everybody and welcome back to the P1 podcast with Matt and Tommy, emergency edition. Serious emergency. How dare Williams and Carlos Signs announced now? I was halfway through a gym workout. Think of Tommy. I was like, I just want to be half of Tommy. And then I get the blooming notification. I'm like, oh my God.

So I run back. It's a hot day. Tommy, what were you doing when Carlos Sines signed to Williams? I was literally about to. Well, I'd left the house and you saw you calling me and I was like, oh God, has Sir Jopera's been fired. And no, it was Carlos Sainz being confirmed. B.S. Classic summer break and disappointed that we've, of all the days to do it. I mean, I was really looking forward to diving into show Gwainu's drive rating and now it's just delayed it.

I know. Driver ratings has been delayed. I'm sorry, everybody. I know you'll be crying yourself to sleep. But we've got enough time to slot that all in this week. Do not worry. but we have to jump onto this because Carlos Signs going to Williams. I mean, let's just go with first thoughts. Of course, he is pairing with Alex Albon in 2025. My first thoughts are, okay, Williams have finally got a pairing that are decent. We haven't just got Albon carrying that blooming team on his shoulders. He's got a race winner in Carlos Signs who is,

you have to say, near the form of his life. He's been performing incredibly well. and yeah, Williams, when you look at them, wow, okay, only forward is what I'm seeing there. But with Carlos actually going there, my immediate sort of emotion and reaction is a bit of sadness for him, just purely because the fact that he's going there means he didn't have the options that we may be dreamed of that he had, or at least they weren't there in the final decision. because going to Williams, they're not exactly a front-runner, but maybe 2026, the Williams domination arc begins.

You never know. Yeah, my thoughts were a similar one that is a shame for Carlos to be in that team because his talent is above that. Of course, when it was announced that Lewis Hamilton was leaving and, sorry, well, joining Ferrari and that Carlos Sainz would be without a drive, Carlos put in probably the best form of his entire career at the start of the season and was doing unbelievably well. And my reaction was, I guess, my first thoughts were, wow, James Vows, he can convince anyone for anything because I don't think there's been a better driver lineup for a ninth-placed

team in the constructors that only have four points and one of the worst teams on the grid. because Alex Halbin has done a brilliant job He's one of the drivers of the season last year Carlos Seitz is in great form as well and is a fantastic driver I genuinely think this might be one of the biggest kind of separation between a performance of a team

and how good their driver lineup is that we may be ever seen because they are on four points in the Constructors Championship in 9th nowhere near, you know, anywhere near even seventh in the championship. And they have bagged two very competent drivers, one of them in Carlos being a race winner as well. So well done James Fowles is all I'd say.

He must have talked a good talk. I mean, that guy's got vocabulary for days. He would win every single episode of countdown, that man. He's got every word in his locker. Now, the thing that I'm really excited to see moving into 2025 and beyond, because it's worth mentioning this contract, as Formula One contracts go, is for 25, 26 and beyond. So it's right now putting the message that Carlos is there for a while. We'll see if that actually happens. But I'm really excited to see how these two stack up. Where is Alex Albonne in the grand

scheme of this grid? Is he the next Ayrton Senna? And he has been just, outperforming a tractor all this time with the likes of Latifian sergeant as his teammate. Or has that Williams actually been all right? We will find out with Carlos going alongside him, what a benchmark we're going to see there for Alex to see. Has he clawed back after that such a difficult time at Red Bull? He was highly rated before then, of course, had to then rebuild the confidence.

I am so excited to see this driver pairing next year. me too i think that is another really interesting side to it not just how carlos will do at williams but like you say we now finally get to see how good alex albin is because williams gave him his opportunity and he joined alongside nicholas latifi who was you know having a poor run of form and not the greatest driver in the world despite the goat memes and then logan sergeant hasn't done a very good job either. So not that you can compare from season to season, but when we see Carlos against Albin, we'll maybe get an understanding of particularly last year, was Alex Albin actually the goat and was doing unbelievable things in that Williams? Or was that Williams actually genuinely

really good? And he just, all he had to do was beat Logan Sargent and whatever and Sergeant wasn't delivering. So now you've got a really nice benchmark to compare the two. And for Williams, yeah, they're going to should be able to push that team forward because it's really a really strong lineup. P1 Patreon member Mark AFCB comes in with, why do you think he took so long? Was he holding out for Merck? And he was holding out for anything that was potentially a little bit more of a lucrative offer. Literally any other team. that might have been further up the grid because what were his options realistically?

Alpine that appear to be falling apart at the seams. You've got, of course, where he's going, Williams, and Audi, who are the only team behind Williams in the constructors. Then, of course, you have the Merck, whatever situation's going on there. Then you have Red Bull as well. But it's clear that with this signing, one, he probably wasn't allowed to hold on for too much longer without teams having to start making decisions.

But two, the option probably wasn't there at Red Bull or Mercedes. We think that Kimmy Antonelli is still going to go to Merck. And then at Red Bull, there's the whole love story with Daniel Ricardo that realistically can Carlos go back into the family that he left and take the Red Bull seat away from Danny Rick, who's already back in the family? Well, clearly not. But it was, in my opinion, him just holding out to see if anything crazy happened

and he could take advantage. But sadly he couldn't. He couldn't. He was always going to wait for as long as possible because the Red Bull thing didn't seem to be happening. And Sergio Perez, his form has obviously dropped off quite a lot. There's all the rumours now, but it's clear those rumours are going to be Daniel Ricardo

and there never was a place for Carlos Sites. So the interesting thing is that it was always about Mercedes and how Antonelli would do because there was all this talk if he'd just jumped straight in. but then he was maybe a bit slower to be as good as people thought. And then the narratives kind of came of him having a few crashes and then going, oh, it's too much pressure, it's too early. So then Carlos will go, well, you know, one year at Mercedes,

even if I am going to get moved on, is probably a better option than driving the dustbins at the back. But unfortunately, he was left with the dustbins at the back once, once everything had shaken out. So Williams was his best bet. And I wonder how much this, not just that narrative, but also Alpine and all their drama

because they had a nice little run of form where they got a bit better. And I thought, actually, maybe Carlos will kind of think about this now, but now there's all talk of are they maybe going to have a different engine and it's all a bit chaotic again and they've just got rid of Bruno Fam.

So there's that side of it as well that he probably thought, I trust Williams to be the best option here. Which is such a shame. It's such a shame. I don't want to slander Williams because they're a very good team, but even James Vows himself has said that it's going to take a long time for them to be at the front.

And Carlos has shown that he can be a front-running driver. So for us to be talking about him driving for Williams, I do think it's such a, it's not right really, but that's F1. Yeah, it's no disrespect to Williams. The fact is they are a likable team. They were a great team. They're not really now, but they're trying to get back.

And they're an underdog. And I think everybody loves them for that. And we want to see them back at the front because of their heritage. But yes, it's going to be really interesting to see how those two push forward. And there's a question actually from one Pablo SF1. Do Williams now have two great drivers to push the team forward, or do they still need some money to back them? up. Well, yes, I don't think money is a problem now for Williams, and it hasn't been for a little

while since Doralton, I think that's their name, came in, and they've had an injection of money. So they're not a small time, oh, please, can I have some pennies kind of team? It's more just, they're trying to get the infrastructure sorted. That's why James Vowles has come in. He's basically had to rip the whole thing apart and start again. And he said that this is a five-year plan, a 10-year plan. Look, James Vowls, whatever he says, he could lead me onto the M-25, blindfolded, and I would trust him.

I'd be like, James take me there. Yeah, happily. You know, I would just walk straight on. If James said it's safe, I'd like, fine, James, take me there. And that's obviously how he's convinced Carlos, not literally putting him on the M-25, but just with his great words and speech. Yeah, they do have great drivers.

they don't need to worry about money as much now like they used to back in the day when you saw that car where they had no sponsors on it. Interesting, you know, we've not mentioned Paul Legisage yet, who we all knew who was going. But it does just show for Williams that even despite all that what would have been great publicity to have an American driver when America, Formula One is booming in America showed that even with all that and what he bought, it was not worth. that particularly when you can get a Carlos Sites. And yeah, James Vowles, now I kind of look back and remember it,

he was openly flirting with Carlos Sainz and sort of not hiding the fact that they really, really wanted Sainz, even more so than Toto Wolfe has been with Max Sassan, that James Vowse wasn't scared even though he had Logan still driving and there could have been other drivers to go there, maybe Bottas or someone else,

that James Vals is just like, yeah, we want Carlos. And maybe Carlos just wanted a team to actually have a lot of faith in him. So from that side, it's good for him. Yes. Because he needs to stop jumping around, doesn't he? He does need to stop jumping around, but I don't think he's going to stop jumping around. And I think that Williams will be a stop gap for him

when he finds, unless Williams have a massive leap forward, I do see this as a bit of a stop gap. But let's see. Next question from Joe Joey Lolo. What do you see is the biggest challenge transitioning from Ferrari to Williams? I don't think it, well, I mean, if we're talking logistically. Very true, yeah. If we're talking logistically, I think maybe it will be a bit easier with Williams.

I think it'll be a bit more chill, a bit more relaxed. I'm sure that cars can do whatever he wants at Williams, and they're just happy to have him there. But when you're talking about car, I think it's the expectations. it's mentally just adjusting to what you should be doing in that Williams. And I'm sure Carlos has been in a midfield car before. He knows what it's like to be fighting for points and scraps of points. So I think it's just that.

He's got used to Ferrari. He's got used to being at the front. But now he has to take a different role where he needs to try and push a whole team forward. Not that he doesn't try it with Ferrari, but it is a different kettle of fish when you're at Williams because they are one of the lowest teams and pushing them to fifth or sixth fastest by helping them develop the car

is should be seen as an achievement when maybe it won't when he's got race wins and podiums under his belt now. Yeah, he's got to think about the long game with Williams and how he basically takes them from where they are at the moment. You know, me saying they're ninth in the constructors and have very little points. So the expectation will be,

so low. But to sign him now and then you have that year where he goes into 2026 with the new regs and they have a good driver lineup, Carlos has been in the sport, despite still being quite young. He's been in the sport for a long time, been with quite a few different teams, so he's got a lot of experience, a lot of knowledge, and that's going to be great for Williams. So yeah, it is just managing that expectation because, you know, some. sixth or seventh in a Ferrari. We're all saying, oh, that's a bit of a disappointing weekend.

But eighth or ninth in a Williams is like a world championship to them. So he's going to have to just get used to the expectation being very different. But it could still be a chance to prove himself because if he goes into Williams and absolutely smashes Alex Alburn, maybe I'd say the other big teams come knocking but they didn't they didn't do that when he was doing really well at Ferrari it's just the unfortunate position he found found him in it's timing isn't it it's all timing it's being at the right place at the right time and unfortunately he was in the wrong the wrong seat when Lewis Hamilton wanted his wanted to wear some red overalls basically Exactly. There's nothing that he did wrong. He would have kept that seat every single day of the week had Lewis not wanted to come along to Ferrari because Mercedes didn't want to commit to him. But yes, Ferrari to Williams is a big old culture shock as well, I'm sure for him. But he's signed there and he's ready to take the risk. Final question from P1 patron member Savage Monkey 3.0. Will he regret not going to Audi in 2026? Well, only time will tell with this one. I think it was a roll of the dice, to be honest with you. Do you go with

Williams that are a, well, they've been in the sport for many, many, many years. They know how to win. They have won a lot in the past. Or do you go with Audi, who, which we all thought was a potential because of his father's ties with Aldi and, you know, it's a big manufacturer as well, Aldi coming in. But I think when you look at what steak currently are or Salba, they're in tatters at the moment and just because Audi are going to be plastering their badge on the team name from 26 does not guarantee by any stretch them being competitive on the grid straight out the blocks and also

what's he going to do in 2025 drive around at the back the car breaking down after four laps or qualifying P18 P19 I think he just went you know what I'll have P15 instead yeah with the occasional P9 P10 yeah true I mean but that's the thing of course you're going to go you're going to try and aim as far up the grid as possible, even if it is only a small step with Williams. But as we've already mentioned, that is all there was available to him. So, no, I don't think he will regret it,

because the more and more I think about it, the more and more I believe that Audi won't be quick in 26. But, hey, Carlos has also thought the same way, clearly. Well, I think that is the most interesting thing about this whole story, that if Carlos Sites is choosing Williams over Al, over Audi, what does that say about the Audi project

when his dad has so many ties in that team and works closely with them? I... Yeah, it makes me wonder just how... Not bad, maybe it's not as alarm bells, but clearly it's more than just the fact that the salber at the moment is a bit of a dustbin. He's obviously seen something more into 2026,

you know, Lewis Hamilton, know Mercedes was still a pretty good team then before they launched up to be this mighty dominant team. But obviously Hamilton was convinced because it was a, the engine regs are coming in. We're building our own engine. It's going to be super. Like, that is not, clearly, Audi have not convinced Carla Science. That's going to be the case. And that is a bit of a worry for them because Audi should have been that team that could have, with a big name like that, they wanted a big name in that team. They could have been a team for a driver to take a risk and go there and, you know, they can

say, we're going to be really good in, in 2026, but no one wants to go there. They've got Holkenberg, which is a sideways step. I'm less enthused about Holcombberg, maybe getting that podium after all. now I'll say as well that he's going to to Audi. It's certainly looking a lot less exciting than it did based on the fact that they seem to be getting shunned by a lot of thing and there's not really been much talk

and look at how bad stake are doing at the moment. So yeah, will he live to regret it? Only time will tell, cliche. Exactly. And maybe Carlos has also seen that Holcombberg's going to go to Audi and thought, well, he's never going to get a podium, which means the car's probably going to be

pretty bad, so therefore I'm not going to go there because he doesn't want to be dealing with any more curses. So yeah, interesting stuff. All right, well, that is it. We have reacted to Carlos Sons, going to Williams. Let us know your thoughts, whether that's on social media or in the comments below if you're over on YouTube. Tommy, what are your final thoughts? My final thoughts are that I feel like this could be quite the crazy summer break now. Carlos has made his move. I feel like the pieces of the puzzles are now going to start falling into place. So, oh, so you're telling me this.

going to be lots more P1 content. So I'm telling you, there will be no summer break. It is all podcast, baby. Okay. I'll just sit here until the next piece of news. Yeah, just sit in that chair and I'll stop recording and then I'll press record when the next fit news comes in. Perfect.

Thanks. Thanks, Dad. All right. See you soon, everybody. Lots of love. Bye. Bye. P1 is a stack production and part of the ACAST creator network.