P1 with Matt and Tommy - Our 2024 mid-season F1 Driver Ratings: P20 to P11

Episode Date: August 9, 2024

It's the summer break, which can only mean one thing: it's time to do away with all the recency bias and work out who's having a good season - and who's having a shocker...P1 Live is heading to North America this Fall and tickets are now on sale! Click here to get your tickets, which are already close to selling out!Sign up to our Patreon here! You'll get access to bonus episodes, our classic race series, every P1 episode ad-free and access to our Discord server where you can chat with other F1 fans!Follow us on socials! You can find us on Twitter, Instagram, Twitch, YouTube and TikTok. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello everybody and welcome back to the P1 podcast with Matt and Tommy, summer break edition. Oh, Tommy, it's felt like so long since we sat here chatting about Formula One. The summer break is, of course, well and truly underway. And we are here to bring you, bring everybody at our averages over the course of the season so far, which I'm sure will appease and please everybody. Yeah, it's a well-known series that everyone agrees with. So to have basically our order is very good. And the best thing about it is that we do it in a way where it is unbiased,

no recency bias here. We actually grade all the averages. So it's very easy to look at a driver that may be doing terribly now or really good now and forget they had a stinker or a really good. start to the season and then you look at our ranking go, why on earth is that person there? It's because they were really good in the first like half of the season that everyone forgot and things like that. So it's always always a good laugh. Exactly. That's the thing, right? Because I'm sure there are some drivers that have had an absolute worldy three or four, five last

races, but this is taken into account the whole season. So we've got to remember when for I were good, right? Great. How long are we doing that? How we're recording for only a minute? so. Thank you so much for that. Anyway, let's dive straight into it, shall we, and begin with 20th position. Is it 20th? Technically, 21st, no? Well, what are we doing about that? I'd left it for the end, but we can, we can mention it now. Olly Beerman will give him his, let's give him his props, yeah, because he would have won, because of course he did one race, and we both gave him a 10. So he technically has the best average grade of the entire thing. So Congratulations, Ollie Berman.

Well done, Ollie Berman. 10 out of 10. Let's get into our full grid, full-time drivers, starting with 20th position. And the driver coming out in 20th for myself is Logan Sargent with a score of 4.0. Am I surprised to see this? No.

His best score from myself was a 7 out of 10 at Silverstone where he got a P-11 and he did navigate pretty well around tricky conditions and his worst was in Canada where he got a one from me where he went off

and crashed out later as well DNFed but generally obviously with the 4.0 it's not been the best of seasons and what I would say from here on in second half of the season just enjoy it Logan because Williams quite sadly if you're looking at it from an emotional side

have turned their back on him now, you're pretty much done. They've not announced he's leaving, but they've signed two drivers, so he's gone sadly. So just enjoy the second half of the season, Logan, is what I'd say. So P20 for me is also Logan Sargent. I have been much more generous than giving him 4.1 out of 10 average. Yes, he has not had the best season. This was his opportunity, of course, to turn things around, which he hasn't done. I think the problem was not only has he still not had the better of Alex Albin in any race. He maybe has done less so now, but still spent a lot of the first half of the year crashing,

and that's why there's been a lot of discussions of was he going to get replaced mid-season. We now know that's very unlikely with the fact that they've signed Carlos, so there's no point. they're signing Carlos for next year so there's no point just having someone random for half a year but yeah I gave him a seven as well at Silverstone which is his best performance

when he finished P11 but then even in that race you know the Williams was quite good and Alex got a P9 but you can argue that's where he should be compared to Alex Albin you know just a couple of places down and he's not been that he's still been quite accident prone

and just not had a standout moment. And the only positive is he is P20 in the championship, so not last. Head of Valtry Bottas. Let's go to 19th position. So P19 for me is Jo Guanyu with 4.6. So not a great score, but quite a big step up from Logan, which maybe shows kind of how disastrous Logan season's been. His best score was a nine out of ten from me in Bahrain.

Again, a drive with no points. That was a P-11 finish. But we've been, I think in particular, the most recent races where he's got a lot of three, I've given him a lot of three out of tens. And it's just mainly just the fact that he's just not doing anything and he's consistently, I know the Salba is terrible, but he is consistently so poor in qualifying in particular. And he's just not having a good season,

and it's not going to be enough for him, you know, to be considered. Even with the financial backing that he's got, it's not going to be enough for him to be considered for a seat next year either. So not a good season for Joe. Not at all. For me, 19th position is also Joe Guan Yu, with a whopping 4.7 out of 10, so 0.1 more generous than Tommy. The worst score I gave him was a two in Canada, where, I mean, it just was a race to forget

or race weekend to forget for him. Similar to you, Tommy, you know, I give a lot of threes, a lot of fours for Joe, obviously, it is a step up from Logan, like a 0.6.7 step up. It's actually, as you will see as we go up, these rankings, a big step from that. but I mean it's just been a poor season for Joe. I think I gave him a nine as well in Bahrain where he finished 11th. I gave him sevens in China and Spain where he finished 14th and 13th. So that's Salba's level sadly. Yeah.

But there's been enough crazy races in order for him to have snuck another nine or a 10 out of 10 where he's finished in a ninth or 10th place. But sadly for Salba they've not scored any points whatsoever. So, yeah, disappointing for Joe, and that's why I've got him in 19th position. 18th. Now, this is wild to me, but also not in some ways. Sergio Perez is in 18th with 4.7, tied with Joe, but he places higher because he's been given two 9 out of 10s from me. I'm not going to get into it.

I'm not going to get into his season because we've spoken about it so much, but some, I guess, highlights and low lights from what I've picked out through my ratings throughout the year. He's got a 4.7 and yet had a really strong start to the season. I gave him an 8 in Bahrain, a 9 in Saudi and Japan, where he finished second in both of them, sevens in China and Miami, and yet he's got an average of a 4.7, which just shows you just how low we've scored him after that because that's when the dip kicked in with Imala,

getting a three there, he got a zero in Canada from me. Hungary, obviously, he redeemed himself slightly and finished seventh, which was a decent drive from 16th on the grid, but still is one of the worst drivers of the season, sadly, even with that strong start. And there's no more to say about Perez. P18 for me is also,

Sergio Perez with the same. A 4.7, no surprise that it looks very similar to you. Yeah, you look at the start of the season and it's strange to, because it feels so long ago that he had that form. There's obviously a lot of argument that even with that form, that was when Max was winning races by 25 seconds and Perez was finishing second.

And now with Perez finishing 25, 30 seconds behind Max, that, of course, equates to a very, poor points tally which he's got. You look at the start of the season and from me he got 8, 9, 5, 977 and then it goes 32033 what like his form has just hit a cliff and Frank agrees. Frank has basically gone

we don't need to hear about Peres again. Let's go to 17th position then, shall we? So P17, I have gone four, well I say I've gone. The grades are Kevin Magnuson with a 5.2. Now, Kevin Magnuson is a funny one because he, middle of this season, we thought it was a complete slam dunk that he was going to get banned at some point.

I actually gave him two zeros, one in Miami and one in Monaco. Monaco, I was particularly sort of angered by the fact that he got away with penalty points. and while there was a place to play for other people, you know, when the whole point of penalty points, like I said at the time, is that it's to make you think twice before sticking your nose in at Monaco alongside another car. So Magnuson, yeah, had a very poor kind of few races where it really did look like he was going to get a race ban.

But then he has had some strong performances and with Hass, we've been able to see a much better season from them because they haven't had that complete calamitous car that just falls back in the races. So that is why he has been able to bag, you know, five points is not a huge amount, but obviously there's not been many points dished out because of the top drivers.

So yeah, for Magnuson, he's kind of that whole narrative around him getting banned as kind of simmered now and he's being a bit more sensible-ish. My 17th position is Lance Stroll with a 5.1. I think it's pretty fair that he's in this region of drivers. It's not been a great season for Stroll. He's had a few decent drives. I gave him an 8 out of 10 in places like Bahrain, Canada and Silverstone,

where he finished in the points in all of those, especially the last two with seventh places. And yeah, I'd say, more recently he's had better drives for sure. Like he's been around where Alonzo's been. Alonzo's maybe had a bit of a dip, I would say, at the same time. But he also had some pretty massive stinkers in the earlier parts of the season. The lowest grade I gave him was in China,

where I gave him a one out of ten where he just drove into the back of Ricardo. I'm sure that feels like 50 years ago now. But that is what happened. So, yep, Stroll is my 17th place driver. Let's go to 16th then. for me Kevin Magnuson with a 5.4 rating

the best rating I gave for him was a 9 in Austria where he finished in 8th I gave him a zero as well in Monaco because it was I know Perez did have a part to play in that but I'm very much still on the

of the opinion that KMAG was at fault for that and how he did not get penalty points he didn't get any did he for that it was deemed a racing incident right? Yes he got a, he got none despite all needing just a few to push him over the edge but also i should have given

him a 10 because that allowed for charloucler to easily win the monoco grompre so um i feel a bit harsh actually do like just biased driver racing just forgot all comments and just made our own ridiculous reasons and just went yolo in the comments and just watched all the hate rolling we'd need like uh we need a race to fall on april falls day or something and then and then we'd be able to do it uh Magnus and I also gave him a one in Miami, which is quite funny because obviously that was one of the, probably, what did you call it dirty, dangerous or just pure, didn't care about the rules? Probably the latest of those three. And I gave a one. He sacrificed himself for Hulk.

That was a very divisive one. I think I remember, you know, the fans gave, you know, some were giving him a 10 because it's like he's done everything for the team and then others going up at zero because you're basically like using your F-1 car as a weapon and being absolutely ridiculous. Exactly. I gave him one because there was a bit of entertainment there that I just, you know, I was like, come on, you can't give him a zero. It was the thing that made Miami quite interesting. And then I've given him a few sevens across the season as well. But yeah, I mean, despite those few standouts, yeah, he's had a few stinkers as well, which has caused him to be 16th. So 16th for me is Lance Stroll on a 5.3. He had, similar to Perez, but the other way in the fact that, For me, a lot of his bad grades were at the start of the season, where I think a lot of the grades are, you know, more just their frustration and fed up.

When actually, bizarrely, and this does seem to happen with Stroll, when Alonzo's doing a brilliant job, Stroll is having an absolute nightmare. And for instance, you know, the Saudi crash and slamming into the back of Ricardo in China, like you mentioned, and then blaming Ricardo. and just being absolutely ridiculous. But as the Aston Martin, ironically, has got worse, Lance Stroll's performances have got better, and whether that's because Fernando Alonzo's getting worse

or the car's now more suited to where Stroll likes it, of course, because he is the driver they build the car around, of course. He's the reason they are existing. Exactly. and yeah so he's got a few eight grades and sevens recently for better performances but it's more the kind of really poor races that's made him down like all the way down in 16th 15th position Tommy I've gone for Valtry Bottas with a 5.5 he's P15 and he's last in the championship but he's 15th in our hearts.

No, he's a very difficult driver to grade because... I mean, that is mad, by the way, that he's 15th. When I look at his results, which are 19th, 17th, 14th, 14th, retired 16th, 18, 13, 13, 13, 16, 16, 15, 15, 15, 15, 15. Exactly. And he's always... It is ridiculous, but, you know, he's normally... For the most part, higher than his teammate,

he does a brilliant job in qualifying, which you know he's very good at. but unfortunately in the races and this this is the part of Formula One when for the majority not all teams that you can have a brilliant performance in qualifying but over a 60-70 lap race

or whatever the performance kind of levels itself a bit more and you get a bit closer but but it's only last in the championship because he's not been able to have a standout strong result and that's why he's behind Logan

from I believe having less 14th, is it 14th place? So yeah, sorry, Logan's 11th place is what actually and Joe's 11th place as well. So Bottas hasn't even got close to the points but is P15 and not actually driving that badly, but that is Formula 1.

My 15th place is also Valtry Bottas with a 5.6. The lowest grade I gave him was a 4. I think he just had a very quiet season apart from maybe in like China where I gave him a nine. But then even that I think that was he retired, didn't he? But he was running really well. Yes. And then I think, yeah, he's just had such a quiet season where I'm giving him

fives, maybe six is when he's beaten Zhou by an absolute country mile. But that that is all that he can do in that salber. And I think going about his job quite quietly and not being involved in too many incidents or that sort of stuff, he's being placed higher than the ones that are having these peaks and troughs, mainly troughs at this stage of the rankings, and that's why he's 15th. And I think he deserves to be there. I don't think he's driving badly. And it's really hard to judge whether he's having the season of his life because he's in a dustbin.

Let's got a 14th position then. And mine is Daniel Ricardo with a 5.8. Oh, Danny, Danny, Danny. I think he's had a tale of two halves, I'd say, with this season. The first half, pretty shocking. Lowest grades I gave him were a series of threes in Saudi Arabia, Australia, Japan. And the highest grades I gave him were in Miami, where I gave him an eight.

Same for Canada, same for Austria and Belgium. Miami had that sprint race worldly. Didn't follow it up in the race, though, sadly, because he messed up the qualifying for the main one. So yeah, he's, I don't know, it's a difficult one. And I think had he just put together what he's done in the last few races across the season, he may well be sat in a red ball seat right now. We don't know.

I mean, Helmut Marco literally said if he was outperforming Yuki, which he hasn't, then he may well have got that call up. But yeah, 14th position, I think, is fair because he hasn't been as good as Yuki Sonoda over the course of this season. He's had some highlights. but not enough of them. Daniel Ricardo is also 14th for me with 5.6. Yeah, I think Daniel's season,

it all comes to that kind of point at the start of the season, quite early in the season. If you look at Yuki Sonoda where he was bagging points, finishing best of the rest constantly, and Daniel Ricardo was finishing races in 12th, 15th, 13th, 12th. Of course, had that amazing sprint result, but then didn't deliver in the main race like you say. And he kind of had that Red Bull seat,

what felt like destined for him that all he had to do was beat Yuki Sonoda, and he hasn't. And he's definitely doing a lot better now. There's obviously, there's all so many factors in Formula One that you can't, tell from from the outside but of course there was all that talk of a chassis that he wanted a new

chassis and since then he has done better um not wiping the floor with with yuki and yuki's got um still scoring um good points there they're definitely a lot more uh even now um but unfortunately for him it was just not not enough uh for to essentially drive the championship construction Instructors Championship winning car for now, as it's falling further back into the pack. 13th position, Tommy? 13th is Alex Albon with 6.1. Albin is a funny old driver because he's not scored many points. He's got a couple of P-9s.

That is the only points he's got on the board. Williams haven't had those high, high. like they did last year he was of course I want to say top definitely in a lot of people's top fives of driver of the year last year and he hasn't had those moments this year

now whether that the car's not as good it's going to be certainly a lot more interesting when we see science alongside him to see just how good he is but he hasn't really had those incredibly like incredible moments like he was delivering last year where he was able to put that

Williams into like a P7 or something. So he's had a fairly quiet season, but certainly not a bad one. My 13th position is Esteban Ockon with a 5.9. He had some high grades from me in Miami and Spa with some nine out of tens, where he scored points in both of those. Spar especially was incredibly impressive with all of those overtakes that he made. And then sadly for him, I think this is where it's, impacted him quite heavily, I think, for both of our grades when we eventually get to

Ocon for you, is that that zero that he got in Monaco, because of how close these ratings are now in this pack of drivers, it's put him towards the rear of this midfield for me. Because, yeah, he's not had, I'd say he's had on par the same kind of season as Gasly, but he's had that one massive dip, which has affected his grade quite a lot. they've both had four points scoring finishes, if I'm not mistaken. And they've, you know, they kind of had it sit. I think two was in Canada and Spain. And then Ocon scored in Miami and then also scored it in Belgium recently.

So it's not been a bad season by any stretch for Ocon. But yeah, he's 13th for me. And as the Alpine improves, I'm sure he will continue to score more points in the second half of the season. But it's not been a bad season for him, but 13th for me. 12th position I have his teammate Pierre Gazley with a 6.2 The worst grade I gave him was a four in Bahrain

where he qualified 20th and finished 18th a few fives and then some standouts in Monaco and Canada where I gave him eights and his best grade that I gave him was a nine in Spain where he finished P9

after qualifying in a sensational seventh place. He's had a lot of bad luck as well though, which obviously has impacted, not his grade, because he didn't give him a zero, but it hasn't affected his average, has it, the ones where he's had some really bad luck. Yeah. So, yeah, he's not had the chance to maybe further increase his average,

but 12th place, I think is about right. It's been hard to really assess the Alpine drivers, especially at the start of the year when they were awful. But I'm hoping for the case of both of them, that they have a better car in the second half. because I want to see these two fighting for points all the time because they deserve to be there. P12 for me is Esteban Okon with 6.1 which is exactly the same score as Albon. He got the same number of nines from me as Albin, the same number of eights,

but had more seven grades. That's how close it was between Ockon and Albon for me. But I completely agree with you that with these, especially when you're looking at, it's over half the season but we've obviously still got a few races to go 1-0 can really knock your grade now and I think Ockon has delivered a very good season he's taken

what is an awful car same with his teammate Gasley and delivered points from it when I don't think maybe some of the other drivers in the lower half of Formula One might not have got what those guys would have got out of that alpine so done a very good job there but monaco of course and and it is a fair grade to give him the zero in monaco because he was told don't race your

teammate you don't go for a crazy move on lap one he did you know there's the reputation that he's got he's got whether fairly or unfairly but that obviously just gave people an excuse to pile that pressure on even more. So it's right that he got a zero, but he's shown quite a few times this year why someone like has, despite what people on social media think of him being washed and terrible. And I think a lot of it is banter,

but that he does deserve to be there because he is a very capable and quick driver. And that's why he's got some nines and eights as well, because he has got everything out of an absolute terrible Alpine tractor. Absolutely, completely agree. Let's go to 11th place now. 11th for me is Pierre Gassley with 6.2.

I think like a lot of their lives, these two are, can't separate them too much. And Gassley has been very similar to Ocon. He's not had the low low that Ocon had at Monaco. But his drive, I gave him a 10 in Spain, actually, for that drive, which I believe was the P9 where he finished, you know, brilliantly and did a really good qualifying as well. So, yeah, it's very, very, very similar to Ocon.

You can say all the things you said about Ocon with Pierre Gasly that, unfortunately, him, Ocon and Gassley are two much more capable drivers than what they, than that car. They deserve a lot better. And it's difficult to kind of grade them a lot of the time because they are just not doing much. But I think the fact that Gassley and Ockon consistently are almost always together shows that they are maximizing what they are doing in that car. my 11th place is Alex Albon with a 6.2 tied with Gassley but placed higher because I've given Albon two nine out of tens and they were in Monaco and Silverstone where he finished ninth my worst grade for him was a four out of ten in Spain and then a lot of fives and sixes

the Williams again not being particularly great for most of the season and I think Albon is still driving very well I think he deserves to be in the this sort of 11th place that I've given him with the averages. It's just hard to, for him to do much more. Like he beats his teammate every single race weekend. And I know that, oh, it's Logan Sargent. He's not that great. But you can't compare him to anything else. So that's why I've given him a lot of six out of tens. And when he's put half a minute on his teammate, you can't just ignore that and give him a five or a four. So yeah, six point two out of ten for me with Albon. Right. That's it for Part one of our mid-season driver ratings podcast.

Next time we'll be getting through to the juicy 10th to first. So we'll see you next time. Bye. Bye. P1 is a Stack production and part of the ACAST creator network.