P1 with Matt and Tommy - Our reaction to Daniel Ricciardo's mistreatment at RB

Episode Date: September 26, 2024

The worst-kept secret in recent weeks is finally out: RB have dropped Daniel Ricciardo and Liam Lawson will drive for the team for the rest of the season. We wonder if this is the end for Danny and despair at how poorly a legend of the sport has been treated over the past few weeks. Tickets for our end of season UK tour are now on sale! Click here to grab yours before they're gone.Sign up to our Patreon here! You'll get access to bonus episodes, our classic race series, every P1 episode ad-free and access to our Discord server where you can chat with other F1 fans!Follow us on socials! You can find us on Twitter, Instagram, Twitch, YouTube and TikTok. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello everybody and welcome back to an emergency podcast. That's right, myself and Tommy are here. Tommy is in a forest somewhere in something that I can only describe as, I don't know, it's some sort of lodge. Yeah, I'm in a lodge. Never question my commitment to this podcast ever. I've got my laptop on a frying pan to be a complaint. I never questioned my commitment either. I've been in a car for five hours in massive traffic because the M25 was closed, literally walked in. I'm covered in champagne. come from a secret shoot, which I'm sure you'll see at some point. I've not eaten. I've seen that Daniel Ricardo has lost his seat and is no longer in Formula One. This could be the most off the rails non-PG podcast yet. How are you feeling about that, Tommy?

Because I think you're going to have to be a bit quieter because Grace is probably somewhere close. But I will happily bring the decibels, no problem. Yeah, you bring the decibels. I nearly joked, actually, when you message me to say, I'm out for the day doing this. and we were chatting and I was like, oh yeah, I'm away doing this. And I was like, this will be the day that they just finally decide to actually announce the announcement that we all knew anyway. Yeah, the worst kept secret ever.

So, of course, if you're living under a rock. I know, like Kimmy Antonelli and whatever. Anyway, this one I think was, yeah, just the weirdest strangest last week or so. So if you've been living under a rock, Daniel Ricardo has officially left R.B. And Liam Lawson will join the team for the final six races. Uh Before we get into some questions I just want

I want to share Let's should we just share some first thoughts Share some first emotions from this It's not Did it even feel like an announcement He was leaving? I don't know I can't believe

That after all of this After all of the fairy tale That this was supposed to be With Daniel Ricardo Going back to Red Bull Will he eventually get the main seat All this sort of stuff to now be in a situation where you just feel as though

Daniel Ricardo has not been treated fairly at all. Now, I'm not talking about whether he deserves his seat. Liam Lawson absolutely deserves a shot in Formula One. But I'm talking about the question marks that surrounded Singapore. Everybody knew. So why are we pretending like we don't know here? I actually don't care if it's constantly. tracks at this stage. This is an absolute disgrace. Not for just Daniel Ricardo, but all of his

diehard fans. And I think the overall sentiment, the outpouring of emotion on social media, shows just how much of a disaster class this has been from Red Bull. Daniel Ricardo, his eight wins, very successful, very popular. He does deserve, everybody deserves to know when it was his final Grand Prix weekend. I would be, I mean, I am heartbroken. We spent a lot of time with Daniel. We know just how much an amazing bloke is. He's the most genuine, fun character,

and not just that, a very successful Formula One driver. So why, oh, why? Are we, we just, what are we doing here? I just don't get it, Tommy, please. I'm going to pop off for about half an hour. I'm angry. I'm angry because it doesn't feel like he's left. I feel like he's going to turn up in Austin on a horse,

but he's not going to, and I'm sad about it. It is absolutely ridiculous. You know, we shared our thoughts in, we had a bit of an initial pop-off, didn't we, in our drive ratings about the situation saying it's a joke, and I couldn't agree more, and my position on it hasn't changed at all. I don't understand why this couldn't have been done before Singapore.

It makes absolutely no sense that they couldn't have just announced it. You know, we'll talk about his replacement, and whether we think that's a good idea. I've already made my feelings known on that. But the guy deserves some respect for everything he's done in Formula One. And I know there's not a written rule in Formula One, but when you are a loved character of Formula One,

you're a race winner, a multiple race winner, and I've achieved so much and had so many memorable moments in the sport, you deserve a proper goodbye. you know whether it's right or not there's some drivers have left the sport and it's been like they've been maybe blindsided or it's left and things like that but when you are when you've got like this kind of yeah like aura about you and you've you've had like this amazing time in formula one and you're a race winner and you've got like an amazing fan base and you've done so much for the sport

you deserve a proper goodbye and it's it's absolutely. absolutely ridiculous. The whole statement, even now, as we've like finally been announced, it's kind of pathetic how it's been announced where they're not, you know, Formula One have done a graphic of departs RB. Like it's not, it's, there's, there's, and then even the, the V-carb official statement just says, thank you, Daniel. I know. There's no, like, we have dropped Daniel Ricardo. He's been a, do you know what I mean? There's no owning of it from their side, is it? Yeah, it shows that they're scared to, like, they want to drop him, but they're not going to own it.

But then it's just weird, like, they don't need to say they fired him, but they could have just said, they could have, they just had to say this before Singapore. We didn't need to have this ridiculous situation. In Singapore, where he's pretty much crying in the paddock, and we don't know that he's officially gone yet. It's ridiculous. Let's get into the questions, because I feel as though this short rant could turn into an hour. podcast. P1 Patreon member Katie asks, how should have this been handled differently? Daniel deserves better than this given his stellar career. How this should have been handled was transparency. Now, it is very clear they'd made the decision. There was no, oh, maybe, maybe if Daniel wins the race, we'll save his.

No, no, no, no. No. Yeah, exactly. And that didn't save him. That Daniel was gone in my eyes. That was my opinion. I think that Red Bull had made the decision. He was gone. Liam was coming into the car in Austin. How it should have been handled is as we were just saying. The team owns it and says we have made a very difficult decision to put Liam Lawson in the car for the next six races. And that's it. And people go, okay, fair enough. They've done it because Daniel hasn't performed maybe as Red Bull would have liked. And they're giving Liam a chance. And then everybody can process it and go, oh okay so this is going to be Daniel's last race. Now I've seen some people go, oh, but they haven't announced his, he hasn't announced

his retirement, Matt. He's 35 years old. Next year is a write-off, unless he's going to Salba, which I absolutely do not think would happen, which means 2026, and you've got this whole host of youngsters coming in as well. Do we realistically think that Daniel Ricardo is going to have almost a third return? No. No.

So in my eyes, this is. or was his final race we've just seen in Singapore. And all we have for it, and to remember it by, is confusion, is watching it all unfold in the paddock with the little guard of honour by his friends going, but is this his last race or not? It's just a big middle finger up, not just to Daniel Ricardo, I would say, but also to everybody that watches Formula One that lives for the storylines and how things unfold. it's just

it just wasn't good enough no it wasn't I mean how many you know Singapore is very close I say very close but close to Australia there's a lot of Australians

that come over for the Singapore Grand Prix because it's kind of another race that's near them how many people might have made even like thought about making the journey over to witness Ricardo's last race

and things like that you know like you say he deserved that send-off and it's ridiculous. I don't understand why they couldn't have announced it before Singapore. You know, yes, they'd have had a lot of questions in the press conference and they'd be like, why are you doing this? But they need to own it. Like they're a Formula One team.

And it made it worse because you can't say that Daniel Ricardo wasn't bombarded with questions about it. And if anything, it was more awkward because he couldn't say, yes, I've been dropped or yes, I've been fired or whatever, he had to basically like, kind of do this really flaky answers where he was kind of like, oh, yeah, while all the media were going, thank you for everything you've done

for Formula One, Daniel, and all this kind of stuff. Yeah, he was going, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You never know, though. Yeah, exactly. It's absolutely insane. One of the most bizarre unfolding of events I think I've ever seen. And there's obviously the argument as well,

oh, well, you know, Nick DeVries didn't get this treatment. You know, I see people throwing it around. This is so different. The man has 257 race starts. He is one of, if not, well, let's not say the, but one of the most popular drivers on the grid. And you can just see by the amount of people that have been like, this is wrong,

that he deserves to say much better. personality is the spot has ever seen. Drive to survive. Think of that and how massive that has got. And I think he played a very key part in showing a lighter, more fun side of Formula One. It was him about him. Netflix are a bunch of sea bombs as well and things like that. Yeah, it was the Danny Rick show, like Netflix, that first episode.

The very first one that got, you know, any screen time. It was all about Daniel Ricardo and how many people that have bought, come into this sport and just gone oh formula one's really boring it's just cars driving around in circles and then they watched that episode of danio ricardo and went oh wow this is quite cool and and are now hooked on the sport um he's a great ambassador for the sport he's done so much for it and we'll get into his results and everything that happened and like regardless of whether you think um it's not it's not an issue um to of whether like how well he's performing now like there's there's there's There's certain moments and certain drivers that have pedigree and have credit in the bank that deserve a proper send-off.

Not saying he doesn't deserve to be dropped, and we'll get into that now, but he deserves a proper goodbye. He certainly does. Let's go to the next question, because I'm going to continue to pop off if I don't move on. Question from Patrick, I think that is going to be. Would you have given Daniel to the end of the season, then given him? him a proper send-off. Now this is where I think people will maybe be more split with this, because this is where you get more into the emotion of it and wanting it to be a perfect send-off.

And Formula One's not perfect. We know that harsh decisions can be made by teams. For me, if Red Bull have made that decision that Liam Lawson needs to be in that seat, and also he showed last year that Liam does deserve to be at least given a shot, would I have given him to the end of the season. Now that's a completely different question. V-carb need points, drastically. I'm not completely against. They're making the decision. It's the way in which they did it. We've seen many times Red Bull have made cut-throat decisions. Daniel's actual results hampered quite a bit, I would say, by V-carb's not, a bit inability to actually make a race strategy that isn't just spin the wheel.

But he hadn't done enough, I don't think, Daniel, to not only get to the main red bull seat, but to also argue that he deserves another year in the sport. So for me, if everything else had been done tidily, I'm not against Daniel being dropped at this point, but in the right way. Completely agree. I saw a tweet that went kind of viral about, I think it was about Will Buxton and him talking and someone had basically said that he was sort of saying that it was a good thing that Dono Ricardo is going to be dropped and then that it's ridiculous that Will Buxton was then sort of being sad that Daniel Ricardo left and I think that's completely unfair

because the two can coexist together. You can think that Daniel Ricardo has had his time in Formula One and it's a good decision for Red Bull to make now because they need to with Serserleum Lawson against Sonoda, but you can still be sad that he's going. Like those two can exist together, and I am of that opinion myself personally. Dona Ricardo, even himself, I think, put it brilliantly,

where he himself, in the interviews, could acknowledge, he was like, at the end of the day, I came back because the ultimate dream was to come to Red Bull. It wasn't to be in a midfield car and just stay out my career forever, and just be one of those drivers that doesn't retire for ages and just sits in the midfield and just clogging up a seat basically. And he himself has said this.

So I personally think the mistreatment aside, which is we've popped off enough about, I think it is the right time to assess Sonoda and Lawson against each other because there's and whole other there's other drivers that can do it and you've also got you know you could argue that maybe it's those two going up for Perez's seat as well so

sonoda or not sonoda yeah but but look Daniel Ricardo I wouldn't have given him to the end of the season he was there he came back to basically he got a really easy not an easy

but an opportunity to go back to the best team in Formula One at the time Red Bull. And unfortunately, and it's sad because we would have all loved to have seen him there, he didn't deliver. And he himself can admit that. He's got less points than Sonoda, I think, no, almost half. And if he's not doing that, then surely it has to be Sonoda is good enough for Red Bull. Not, you know, if he's not good enough to beat Sonoda, then,

what's he doing there? That's the sad reality of Formula One. He himself could admit that. So it is time to give a new person a chance. It certainly is. And I think you make a very good point. And that's something that I believe the internet failed to understand. And social media in particular is that things can coexist.

Just because you think Daniel Ricardo isn't good enough to be at the top level of Formula One does not mean you hate his existence and want him to never be anywhere near the There's, it's a very good point to me. So, well eloquently put, as I tried to pronounce eloquently bad. Next question, El Cramer 2001. Is this the end of Daniel Ricardo in Formula One? Or could he possibly move to Audi, Sauba, or even Red Bull win 25-26? Categorically, I think this is the end for Daniel Ricardo, as much as I don't want it to be.

I am sad that it, I'm sad that he's not going to be on the grid. Have we actually seen the happy, buzzy, smiley Daniel Ricardo? bits and bobs for sure but I don't think he's anywhere near the happy Daniel Ricardo that we used to see when he was up fighting at the front and had a lot of confidence and you know just was just pumping in podiums and victories I don't think we've quite seen the same Danny Rick there but for me I think it's I think it's done sadly I do as well I mean he my last point about Danny Rick himself saying that he doesn't want to there be in the midfield.

He doesn't want to drive that green wheelie bin. And so why would you want to go there for a starter? He doesn't want to just be there for the sake of it. And it's quite clear that the ship at Red Bull has sailed. You know, it would be, Red Bull have made some very strange decisions in their time, but to drop someone from the junior team to then promote them a year later to the team. to the team, the big team, when they've kind of alluded to the fact that he's not done the job would be one of their strangest decisions yet.

So I don't think that the Red Bull thing is happening. And, you know, when we go back to the whole thing that can coexist, you can be sad about it, but I don't think he deserves to be at Red Bull. And I think he himself has admitted that because he had to beat Sonoda. Like all he had to do was beat Lee to Snowder and he's got the seat and he didn't. Next question, and it's kind of tied in with this, Brian underscore sign. What happens if Lawson struggles in the next six races? I don't think anything changes in the Daniel Ricardo scenario, sadly.

I think that one, I think Red Bull realistically don't think that Lawson is going to struggle. If you look at the evidence that we've already seen of him jumping into the car and performing pretty well, give him some more time. Is he going to be much worse than perhaps what Daniel Ricardo was putting on the table? I don't think so. I think Lawson has shown potential.

If he does struggle, if he bins it in the next six races continuously, that's a conversation to be had. But I still, in my gut of guts when you especially look at the main Red Bull seats and go, well, they're committed to Perez and he's not exactly performed in the last few seasons,

if Lawson struggles, are they going to give him more time? time, I would lean more on yes than no. I think Red Bull themselves and Helmut Marco in particular kind of have said a few things in the, you know, not too long ago that V-Carb or whatever they're going to be these days need to go back to being a junior team. And they're not a junior team if they've got a guy that used to be in Red Bull in them. So, Red Bull, sorry, V-Carb, formerly Toroso, formerly Alphotari, traditionally were two young drivers going up against each other to see if they're good enough for a Red Bull.

And that's exactly what they're going to be now with Lawson and Sonoda together. If Lawson's first point I'll make is I would be absolutely flabbergasted if he does struggle because he's literally already kind of. driven for the team and done a very, very good job, very good job indeed. So I'd be amazed if he did, but it depends how much we're talking struggling. If he doesn't beat Sonoda, but he's near or thereabouts, I think they'd probably give some more leniency. And I think you do have to give him more leniency. You know, the reason Daniel Ricardo, even if Lawson is the same as Daniel Ricardo, I don't think it's fair to go, oh, well, Daniel Ricardo should be in. Like, no, we go right back to the point that I've said

a thousand times that he's not there to be in a midfield car, like it's about beating Sonoda. But if Lawson did struggle again, Yuki Snowda is the goat, and I'm sure Christian Horner will still ignore the fact that he exists. It's interesting, though, as well, when you say about Vicar becoming this junior team again that we all used to know Toro Rosso as being, whether it does open the door to other Red Bull Juniors are the had jars of this world that are doing reasonably well in Formula 2. And you think that would it be more of a revolving door again

where they're just like, oh, let's chuck this one in, let's chuck this driver in, let's see, let's basically do auditions throughout 2025 for the main seat in 26. Who knows? But for me, I see it as Lawson. It's an audition to not just smash Sonoda. and if that happens, you're going straight to the main seat. That's how I see it.

I believe that Perez, we don't think he's going to get kicked before the end of the season, but moving into the next seasons, this is Lawson's to absolutely win. Just to throw something into the mix there, obviously we could go on forever about this subject, but it's very interesting, actually, that you wonder how much the Vestappen situation now,

And they're safeguarding in some ways, maybe. Yeah, like Vastappen was locked in at Red Bull forever, and they didn't need to promote these young drivers anymore because they had Vestappen. He was young. He was brilliant. He was winning. But it seems like that relationship is nowhere near as good,

and there are a lot of rumors that he could leave, and you wouldn't put it past him leaving. And what's absolutely crazy is they've gone from a situation where they kind of didn't really need anyone, If a Stappan left tomorrow, they've got Perez who's underperforming. They're five Daniel Ricardo. They've got Yuki Snowda who they don't seem to trust to promote. And they've got Liam Lawson who's not proved himself.

And then you've got young junior drivers. Like, they're kind of screwed. They kind of screwed to be able to. They have to do this. Like, this whole situation has forced their hand. They need to assess Lawson and Snowder, and they need to get one of them into the Red Bull team ASAP because they need a predecessor of Stappen.

That's a really good point, actually. Yeah, the Vastappen situation has forced V-Kalb to be this junior team that maybe they didn't need, as you say. That's a fantastic way. If you look at Sebastian Vetter when that was the big surprise that he left, they were caught short again, and they were exactly the same situation happened where it was like, oh God, we need to start promoting people.

What are we going to do with the team? And you can argue they've kind of never, like not really recovered from that. Like it's been a bit of a. since really. It's been a bit all over the place. So yeah, it's going to be, I do think that we'll see like that those two fighting out, see what happens with Perez. And then obviously if one of them does get promoted, then surely that other seat at

V-Cab would go to a Hadjar or something if he finishes the season strongly in F2. And they need to be that team again. well wow goodness gracious me i thought there's just going to be a 10 minute pop-off we've gone 25 minutes and come up with about 27 different scenarios of what could happen but that's just formula one at the moment isn't it really tommy what are your final thoughts please sir final thoughts are i guess from red bull's side um the cynic in me goes well they've treated him really badly and we've got now a month until they have to face the press so people will have like the storm will have calmed down maybe they'll be other than the news out when it was 2 a.m in australia i think as well very

very interesting cheeky cheaky australia i'm sure they're probably waking up by now and seeing the news and yes um sorry i know there are quite a few australian listeners out there uh not the nicest thing to uh wake up to but i hope we've made our feelings clear uh because my final thoughts are it was not the right way to do that. You kind of feel like it's just not, just can't process it really because such a big, such a big figure,

Daniel Ricardo was in Formula One. And it's, it leaves a sour taste, doesn't it? To not have that proper send-off for him and for him to have a little donut or whatever it might have been. Yeah, I agree. These things really help Formula One fans, I think.

And probably for him as well, it would be nice to celebrate in a good way. But anyway, to get into that again because we've made our feelings very clear so thank you and i will have one i'll have one extra final thought actually oh a rare this is such a my god you can never give me one thoughts who like clearly like you know being in this this cabin i'm i'm rejuvenated i can think of things um the um the uh leum lorson i think you you put it brilliantly on on twitter actually and i will echo the thing you say because we've not really mentioned in the podcast but do not take your

anger out on the Red Bull situation on Liam Lawson. He absolutely deserves to be in Formula One. He was brilliant last year. He deserves the seat and your annoyance at Daniel Ricardo's situation were annoyed by it and how he's been treated. But that shouldn't be, you know, don't take it out on Lawson and basically like have a go at him. And he's just basically getting the opportunity that he's deserved.

And he absolutely deserves it. And yeah, I'm looking forward to seeing how he does. Absolutely. Well, there you go. Thank you for watching and listening. Sorry for it being a little bit late. We would have jumped on this pretty much straight away, but I was stuck in traffic and Tommy's on holiday.

And yeah, we will see you very soon. Sorry, again, that we've got another like three weeks till anything's actually happening, but we'll keep you updated. We'll fly into America soon. So there's tickets available for that and all that good stuff. We'll see you very soon, lots of love. I'm going to go have some food now and have a shower because I smell so much of alcohol.

after it being sprayed in my eyeballs. So look forward to seeing whatever I'm talking about at some point. Bye, everybody. Lots of love, sweet dreams. Keep pushing in the gym. Keep eating your dinner. Daniel Ricardo to treat unfairly. Do better Red Bull.

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