P1 with Matt and Tommy - Will Sergio Perez REALLY be at Red Bull in 2024?

Episode Date: October 16, 2023

A wild rumour concerning Sergio Pérez and his seat has been doing the rounds. And, with his poor performances of late, we wonder whether there might be some truth to it. So will he be a Red Bull driver next year?You can grab our new merch right here!We're now on Patreon! Sign up HERE for ad-free episodes, bonus content, exclusive early access and loads more!Follow us on socials! You can find us on Twitter, Instagram, Twitch, YouTube and TikTok. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello everybody and welcome back to the P-1 podcast with Matt and Tommy. God, it's felt a while, Tom Bellingham. We've had a few days off, how dare we? And we're now back in front of a microphone, in front of a camera. And it feels like I've never done this before. How do you feel in your new Matt P1 Tommy merchandise? Yes, I feel exactly the same. It's quite funny, really, isn't it?

that there's nothing like multiple triple-headers and a stacked calendar this year that makes you feel like a two-week break is like the summer break or something. When there's just a normal week gap between races, I don't know, for me, because there's so many now, it feels like a long break, do you know what I mean?

Yeah, well, you know, you're going to have to go and report to your boss, which is, oh wait, you. How does that feel? Good? I bet that does. I'll let him know. Yeah, well, you know, I am your daddy,

so you need to tell me as well. Anyway, before we dive into Sergio Perez chat, I need to share with you a five-star review. And if you want yours to be read out, please do leave us a five-star review. We read every single one of them. Thank you so much for everybody that has submitted them.

It helps us massively. This one comes in from Matak in France. I must say this Formula One podcast hosted by Matt and Tommy is quite the delight. It's like a croissant and coffee for my ears, served with a side of laughter. Matt and Tommy's ban. make me feel like I'm with them, chatting with some friends.

Trey amuson, mes ami. Keep pushing Mathieu from France. Is that, wait. Coffee emoji. No, no, I thought that Mathieu was like them just making my name French, but I assume this is actually their name. Matea and Tomé. Anyway, thank you so much, Matak or Mathieu.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Lovely, lovely message. Right, we're talking about Sergio Perreux's future. mainly stemmed not only around his performances this season, but also a wildfire rumour that we spoke a little bit about over on our Patreon. We did a little after-dark podcast, didn't we, Tommy?

We mentioned it briefly. But it did do the rounds, didn't it, Tommy? It did. We're going to this later, but it did the round so much that it's gone massive over all social media and to the point where Sergio Perez's camp kind of responded to it. it. That's how kind of big it went. Let's dive into it then. So there were rumours, and that's what we're going to say they

definitely are now. And it was spread on Reddit a few days ago where someone posted something saying that the Oskuderea, East Scuderia, something like that, Telmex, high-ranking employee, had told them at a dinner party that Sergio Perez would announce his retirement

at the Mexican Grand Prix, which, I mean, wow, that would have been a bombshell and a half, would it have not? I mean, of all places as well. Not only losing the seat, but the rumour was retirement. Yeah.

Yeah, the rumor being that essentially, like, Red Bull had told him that he was going to leave and then that's kind of triggered him to announce his retirement of the Mexican Grand Prix, which would have been quite the bombshell and, yeah,

and doing it, you know, at his home race, what a time to do it when it should be this, you know, celebration of him, it's mad to think this narrative of Sergio apparently second in the championship is absolutely insane but he's having an awful season and it just shows that yeah it's crazy to think

but yeah Mexican Grand Prix would be pretty wild if he decided to call it quits then and so close to the end of the season as well normally drivers maybe go this is my last season or whatever but to kind of very quickly do it would be mad It wasn't like too far out of the realms of possibility, though, was it, with how we've been speaking about his performances this year, as you say, second in the championship,

but clinging on for dear life, had Hamilton not gone out in Qatar, that might well have looked a little bit more possible that he may not finish second in one of the most dominant cars in Formula One history. Let's finish the rumour very quickly. So the rumour said that Red Bull had told Perez at the Japanese Grand Prix that he didn't have a seat, and in turn he chose to retire due to the lack of seats available.

and also his fourth child recently being born, which, look, if he lost his seat, for next year he would literally have to take a William's seat or nothing. So then it would have had to have been some, unless obviously he would have been jostled around, gone to Alpha Tauri maybe. I highly doubt it, but we've seen it before. Yeah, I don't know, yeah.

The rumour did actually kind of, it was a very believable rumor, I think, in terms of like, you know, the source, the fact that it was Mexico, he wanted to announce it, and then, you know, kind of alluding to the fact that because he was told in Japan, that's why he's actually stinker in Japan. You mean not like, not the actual source, but the source that was claimed. Yeah, the claim source, sorry. I really took that.

Yeah. Yes, Reddit is a believable place. The claimed source rather than, you know, rather than being like, like, oh, mate down the pub told me that Perez is retiring. It was, you know, this whole like, I mean, it was just a dinner party. It was a posh version of my friend that works an F1 down the pub told me this. So, yeah, and obviously, the internet, being the internet, everyone lost their minds and were like, oh, God, is this happening?

And it doesn't look like it's going to be happening. as the rumours were addressed. Perez's social media and PR representative, Louis Alberto Aguil, he posted a series of laughing emojis the day of the post. It was a litter of laughing emojis, and that was it. And you can take of that what you will. One, he might be actually laughing

because it's hilarious, like wildfire rumour. Or two, he's laughing and it's one of those memes where he's got the mask in front of him and it's actually crying behind the laughter because the whole plans have been scuppered, one or the other. And he doesn't have a job for nature. No, yeah, it was quite funny, the timing of it.

Yeah, it's always funny when, I love this on Twitter now is people find these things, don't they? And they dissect it like detectives. We've seen it many times where, like, we've seen it for ourselves. Charler's mum tweeted this. Have we not seen it for ourselves as well, Tom? I've seen the amount of rumors of why we left our previous venture and this, that and the other and all of these.

And I'm like, oh my God, we were the talking point for a little bit. And it's quite funny to just imagine Perez sitting back, having his drink, knowing full well he's got a contract next year. And everyone's like, ah! It's quite funny, actually, because that old video about us leaving our job, Katie sent me a link. And then one of the comments was like, Tommy said that this happened or whatever. and I was like, what I did it and who is this person that thinks that I've spoken to him about this? And it is just funny. And then, yeah, just think of that on that scale.

Imagine, you know, you're an F1 driver and all these rumors appearing. And we love a little detective bit of work on Twitter, don't we all? We certainly do. Now, that wasn't the only thing or way of the rumor being addressed. But also, Sergio Perez had a Zoom session with the media. So it went that big that Perez's team thought, we should probably clarify this. And he went and said, I have a contract for next year. It is important to have a good year.

I am motivated to continue. So read of that what you will. I mean, he has a contract. That's not to say that he doesn't have a contract. We know he has a contract. It is important to have a good year. What does he mean the rest of the year? Or does he mean for next year to have a good year?

Again, make of that what you will. And then I am motivated to continue. I'm sure he is. He then continued to say, I want to continue for more years because I think I still have a lot to give in Formula One. I want to stay in F1

for at least another three to four years. I mean, I'm not disputing any of that, but I know Red Bull can just set that alight and be like, see you later, mate, if they wanted to. And that's why we're talking about it today, Tommy. How safe is Perez's seat? This is the thing. It's Red Bull.

And it's not even been a case of like, well we've literally seen it already this year with Red Bull because they got rid of DeVries and mid-season Sergio Perez is arguably performing worse than DeVries in terms of like the team he's in when you compare him to his teammate really

which is why there's so much pressure on Perez but of course this team has been known to make brutal if not a lot of the time comes to be correct decisions but and that's why they're successful but they're no doubt I've made some brutal decisions before and yeah I know this this is the thing that Sergio Perez always mentions and it gets said all the time where it's like I have a contract I have a contract it's like

Nick DeVries had a contract yeah yeah I think it was just before gasley left it was like Gasly's seat is safe and then two weeks later. Red Bull have put Albin in instead and demoted Gasly back to Toroce. Contracts can be broken like we have seen many times in Formula One. Look at the whole Piastri situation. Things have happened and yeah, it can happen, particularly if his form continues the way it does. I find it fascinating this whole Red Bull second driver situation.

because it just keeps happening. Over and over and over, they have this problem with the second driver. And I don't think it's the talent that is the issue here. We know that Gazley, Albon and Perez on their day are very, very talented drivers. And you just think, you look back across the whole of the Red Bull history of the team,

which obviously isn't massive, but can you name me one driver that has had a slump against their teammate and then pick themselves back up. It's always been a snowball effect which leads to their termination of their contract. And the mad thing about the Perez one is that, you know, obviously, Gassley and Albin lasted a fairly short time

and didn't start off particularly great and you thought they're going to improve. Perez did all right. You know, he started off and he has been there, you know, three years now and he is so much worse that he did already. started. It feels a lifetime ago to think they were on, you know, pretty much equal points and had got two wins each to start to start the season. It's absolutely maddening to think.

And of course, yeah, there'll be rumours about, oh, it's a one car team and stuff. And I don't deny that the car is, you know, gone towards more Max's driving style and stuff. And you can't really blame them for it because the guys won 10 races in a row and going to have one of the greatest seasons in the history of the sport. So, um, and then, you know, you can't really use that excuse too much because the great, the thing we say about the greats is adaptability. Um, and clearly, uh, Perez has just like lost all confidence in that car. It's gone away from him. I've heard even talks that he wanted to literally drive an old spec car, um, which is impossible because teams don't bring two different cars to Grand Prix anymore.

But Perez wanted to literally, say, get me what the RB19 was like in Baku or whatever. Yeah, he wants the salary. I don't care if it's meant to be better. Yeah, I don't care if it's meant to be better. I will drive that one, which you might even argue if he was driving that one, he might finish second, third, fourth in races rather than going out in Q3 all the time. Sorry, Q1 all the time and having these issues. so yeah it's not it's not going well for him to say the least it certainly isn't and even though

the rumor that we've spoken about we all kind of both of us we spoke about it we were like oh it's probably absolute tripe but but it starts that sort of whirring in your brain about what could happen if Perez's seat isn't safe for next year because if Perez there's a vacancy at Red Bull all of a sudden, what on earth happens then? The entire universe implodes, probably, because you then wonder, oh, would it be Daniel Ricardo that then takes into that seat in 2024? I would say, maybe. And then you've got plenty of other drivers that are waiting in line, not only for the Red Bull seat, but the sort of domino effect that would then cause in the driver market. And all of a sudden, there is a seat free, and a lot of drivers that are all looming down like some sort of eagle

ready to pounce. Yeah, so are they going to be the greatest thing ever, like not for Sergio Perez, of course, but in terms of excitement of silly season craziness, where it kickstarts this absolute chaos, and we know, and we said this many, many times in our predictions and things, that at the end of 2024, there are a lot of contracts at the end of it. So it does make you wonder that if Perez does manage to keep his seat till the end of 2024, still doesn't work out and then they get rid of him, that could, like you say, start this crazy chain reaction where maybe like they did with Perez in the first place, choose someone outside the Red Bull stable.

Maybe Daniel Ricardo isn't performing in Alpha Tauri and they don't think he is the right person to step up and they go with someone different and then that seat and then that seat's free. And then someone else moves into that seat and then that seat and that seat. And that's what we saw during that COVID period where Wemper, Vettel announced his retirement. Carlos Sight just jumped in and then it was just this knock-on effect of everyone moving. Or we just get the simple option that Perez loses his seat. And then it would be a case of Danny Ricardo jumps up and then maybe Lawson goes, well, now I can have the Alfatari seat. But then I guess Red Bull have to weigh up.

Perez was, continues on this form, are they in the situation where they just flat out go, you're gone? Or does he have the same thing that we've seen before where you get demoted to Alphi Tauri? I personally can't see that happening. Just Perez in an Alphotari just doesn't, he's too much of an elder statement. I think, I think with Gassley and Albin it made sense because they could go back and learn. Do you know what I mean? Which is kind of what they wanted. They were giving them some kind of lifeline in that sort of Red Bull Academy,

whereas Perez, as you say, has kind of come from the outside of that and is now in the Red Bull seat. It's absolutely fascinating to think what could happen. And I don't think it's out of the realms of possibility that we might see it in some form. You ask the question, you know, Daniel Ricardo, does he deserve to go to Red Bull straight away? Has he even proved himself to say that he's got enough time? Barely had a chance. Back in this car.

Or would it, you know, Yuki Sonoda, could he have just stroll into a Red Bull seat? Would he be more apt to get into that role? And then I think as well, if we didn't have these last sort of five, six, seven races, however many it's been, where McLaren have been good, I think Lando Norris is that at the top of that list, if this all sort of starts kicking off. And we are talking about if sputs and maybes right now, but we did a poll. where he said, if Perez's current form continues for the rest of the year, do you think he'd still drive for Red Bull in 2024?

6,000 of you voted and 84% of you said no. So a lot of you think if this continues. That question was worded even with a contract, which says it all really. It's absolutely maddening, isn't it? It's maddening to think that. But clearly a lot of people believe this might actually happen. So who do you think? would genuinely be the right person to go into that Red Bull state, should Perez be vacated?

I'd say Daniel Ricardo, but the interesting thing, and I do wonder how much Red Bull have thought this themselves, is his injury has really scuppered their plan. And, you know, because Ricardo was coming in to put the pressure on Perez, whereas now Perez is still underperforming, and you'd argue that maybe if Daniel Ricardo had not got injured, carried out. on and was maybe good, then I think Perez's seat would be under a lot more pressure for them to even just do it in 2024. But Dan Ricardo still hasn't had a chance to really prove himself yet. It's only felt like he's had one real race to, or a couple of races to do it. And then one of them, you know, he got punted at the first corner. So there's not been a huge amount

for him to really have like a normal weekend yet. so yeah it's going to be fascinating because even with that that contract and I just go back to this every time but it is absolutely mental that Perez could lose his seat whilst finishing second in the driver's championship when that is literally his job that's what he's there to do you know and but but then it comes back to the thing again doesn't it that it's all right now max is racing on his own and doesn't need help as soon as he does. Perez is clearly not going to be that right person that when we did get a 20-21 season, that there was many races that that season.

It's something that we sort of mentioned about Botas, particularly say like the finale in Abu Dhabi, like, where was Bottas for that finale in Abu Dhabi? And that's kind of what potentially lost Bottas' seat when he wasn't there delivering. So they're not there to beat the number one drivers. they don't need someone like that. And you've got to think that Daniel Ricardo has, while it was a very long time ago, is one of the only drivers that has gone up against Maxis Hapen in that seat and not been dreadful, you know, and actually pretty good.

And even when, I think in end of 2018, when it was clear, and this is why Dona Ricardo would have decided to leave in the first place, is that when that car, it was clear that the team was going more towards Max, the car was going more towards Max, and Max's form, there was a reason why it was going that way. His form was amazing at the end of 2018, he was finishing on the podium, he was getting race wins and things like that. But Dono Riccardo was finishing those races in fourths and fifths.

That's exactly what Paris needs to be doing, not 15th, not crashing into Magnuson, not getting 6,000 track limit penalties. They just need someone that can drive that car and not, you know, not be a complete disaster. They don't need to beat Maxa Stappen. That's not what, if anything, they don't want that because then they end up with a Mercedes situation. A Rossburg-Hamilton situation. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, you know, you say about, oh, Perez is doing everything that's needed to be done with him,

finishing second, helping, I guess, helping Red Bull to seal the Constructors title, although he literally didn't need to turn off the whole season for that to have happened. But it's whether you look at it at the near term or you future-proof the team.

And in my opinion, Christian Horner is not stupid and knows that if he wants to have the best team possible moving forward, he has to think about what the future will look like. And Perez and Estappen right now, comparably that Perez is doing no better than Gazley, Albon, that came before him.

Now, I don't think Gasley or Albon showed the potential that Perez has shown on the odd occasion where he's been as fast as Max slightly faster in the very rare occasions that I'm talking about here, but at least he's done that, which might be a slight saving grace

for him when it comes to next year because they know there is in there somewhere they've just lost the key and now they're scrambling around trying to find the key to Perres' performances and whether they'll decide to stay with them or not, I'm not sure.

I think if he has an absolute shocker for the rest of the year and lose his second place, I think his seat will be gone but if he doesn't lose second place and he just finishes like third or even fourth, maybe fifth and doesn't embarrass the team.

Yeah, in races. I think that's probably where they'll, maybe decide. Yeah, I think so. Like, as long as he secures that, that P2 and doesn't have a complete meltdown, he really does just need to have a weekend where, like you say, he finishes fourth, fifth, whatever, bag some points, have a solid weekend without any errors or silly mistakes

or having a crash or penalties and things like that. And then it would just be like, right, we'll give you a chance because, like you said, they've seen at the start of the year that Perez can deliver and then as the car gets developed he just disappears and that that is what's happened for

it happened in 2022 happened this year in even more extreme sense and I feel like that would just be enough for them to go well it is worth another try we don't need to worry yet because Max is winning the title

by many, many points. And then, and then, if they go into next year and suddenly McLaren are, you know, within Red Bulls, or Rasp's or whatever, or Mercedes or Ferrari or whatever, and Perez is then not delivering, and you're getting Max winning every race, but McLaren are finishing second and third, they're not going to win the Constructors Championship

because Max literally won't be able to do it on his own then. So that's where Peres will start swaying. I personally think he will be safe for 2024 just. But I think this is now got to the point where he really, and maybe this is what he means himself, where it's like it is important to have a good year. Yes, it is this year. But next year, he really has to start delivering

because my God, if his form is the same going into the first few races, and he's, imagine we get his first race of the season and he gets knocked out in Q1 again. It would be like, what on earth? And then, yeah, I can see it. And we might see a mid-season driver swap. Or the quickest driver swap ever in the history of F1. Yeah, maybe.

Okay, well, that is it. Thank you, everybody, for watching and listening to this Sergio Peres chat about his future. What will happen? Let us know in the comments what you think, because we want to hear your opinions. We've seen a lot of poll results, but we want to see some explanations as well. So be sure to get involved with that.

Tommy, what are your final thoughts? My final thoughts are, we're just being honest about Perez and like we've said many times, he is a very good driver on his day and can deliver. And I do think there's something there that he can turn, turn his form around

and I do think that he has it in him. It's just whether he can do it in time because, boy, this run's been crazy recently. Certainly has, the clock is ticking and hopefully Perez manages to sort it out. And if you don't think he will, then we're about to have the craziest driver transfers

potentially in a long, long time. That is it. See you very soon. Bye. Nice. P1 is a stack production and part of the Acast creator network.