Pablo Torre Finds Out - Sex, Lies, and Longevity with TV Legend Maury Povich

Episode Date: December 26, 2023

You may remember him as the paternity-test king of fever-pitch daytime television. But this renaissance man has seen it all — the JFK assassination, Waco, a woman who's afraid of aluminum foil — and he has emerged an optimist. Climb into your TV for wisdom on courage, vulnerability, and reassurance from the OG who held up Pro Bowlers at practice... and introduced the world to Cotton Ball Man. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Okay, so it's December 26th day after Christmas. You've been surrounded by family, hopefully. Hope that was good for you. If it wasn't, and you find yourself, like, wondering, am I really related to these people? Fair question? And I have an episode for you today. Because I sometimes get concerned that the episodes we make three times a week, relentlessly, forever. Don't get consumed by everybody on the planet.

Also, just in our own feed on our YouTube channel, because there's some real good shit, man. Every episode is kind of like my kid to continue this theme of paternity. This one, I want you to meet. I have a feeling that some people missed it. But this is a visit from the man who, I would say, is the face of genetic testing. Okay? Also, the longest running daytime hosts in American television history. He is a legend, an icon.

None of these things are exaggerations. He also made me as happy as I've been in the years. 2003 because of this episode. So without further ado, welcome to the stage, Mr. Moripovich. Welcome to Pablo Toray finds out. I am Pablo Torre, and today we're going to find out what this sound is. You want to own up and tell everybody what you are deathly afraid of? Aluminum foil. Is it the noise? It's the look? The look and the noise. Yeah.

Right after this ad. You're listening to Draft King's Network. Mori Povich, it's a thrill. It's just a thrill to hear you laugh across this table from me. Well, it's nice to be with you. I've watched you a lot. Oh, well, I believe that I win that competition. Who has seen more of the other?

And it's not close. Yeah, well, when you appear with that miscreant, Cornheiser I tune in. And Cornheiser says the only reason I have Pablo on is he's smarter than I am.

Yeah, he says he likes to self-deprecate in a way that is always so flattering to me and makes me suspicious. It's a little too kind that man when it comes to this stuff. There are many reasons why

I am legitimately like sort of deliriously happy that you're here. One of them is that it's like I climbed into my television. There are only a few people who made you feel that way. You are one of them. But the second reason is that you have the blood of truly,

like sports writing, sports writing greatness inside of you. So for people who don't understand your lineage, explain who your father is. Okay, so my father's name, Shirley Povich. He was a kid in Baharbor, Maine, growing up as a towny kid that didn't come from a wealthy family or any, but the millionaires who summered in Bar Harbor, Maine, the Rockefellers, the Vanderbilts, the Morgans, all these people built their own golf course called Kibo Valley. And my father was a caddy at the course,

and he was thrown together one time with a man when he was about 15 years old. And he caddied so well for this man that this man said my carriage because there weren't even any there weren't any cars on Mount Desert Island at the time and so he picked my father up in his carriage every day in the summer for three straight years went to my grandmother and said I want to take your son with me I own my own golf course in Washington D.C. And he'll be my caddy and I also own a newspaper called The Washington Post and I will give him a job And my father arrived in Washington in 1922. My father died in 1998, 75 plus years later,

working for the Washington Post as the sports writer, sports editor, the youngest sports editor in the country at the age of 21. One of the greatest columnists as well, of all time. Shirley Povich is, I mean, the name in the world that me and the aforementioned miscreant, Tony Kornheiser inhabit. and have it. This is, we are dealing with royalty. I just want to make clear, too, that the reason I had your phone number in the first place is because of Kornheiser. Right. And you guys, he gave it out, huh? He should not have betrayed him in this way, but I, but I, in the sake of, for the sake of

journalistic transparency, I make clear that you guys, you and Tony are actually, you know each other because of this way. Forever. I mean, my father was very instrumental in hiring not only two, Tony, but Michael Wilbon. You know, it's very interesting. When Tony was first hired, Tony, as everyone knows, has a great sense of humor. And he used to write humorously a lot.

And my father went to George Solomon and then the sports editor of the Post and said, I don't know if this is going to work out. I don't know if he's that funny. And then he came back about a year later and said to Solomon, you know, I have to admit,

I was wrong. He's terrific. And so from then on, they have been best buds. He has, Tony has that way of winning you over despite maybe your skepticisms. And I, of course, say this in the context of knowing that you and Tony were also business partners. Yeah, well, that's another reason why I'm a little leery of him. He, you know, I have invested in some, you know, glorious businesses like the clothing business, never worked out. I invested, I started a newspaper in the

middle of when newspapers were going down in the great state of Montana, which I still have, not a great idea. And then Kornheiser tries to convince me to invest in his goddamn restaurant in Washington. Chatter. Yeah, chatter. And that was another failing adventure of mine. All of that stands in contrast to a remarkable bit of longevity, which is that, and you own this title, and this is an incredible title. You were the longest running daytime host in television history. Right. Yeah. I never expected it. You never expected it? No, no. I mean, first of all, I always thought when I was growing up in this business doing news, sports, talk shows, that if I, this is what I said.

to myself, if I could make $50,000 a year the rest of my career, I would be so excited and so happy. And secondly, if I could still stay in this business at the age of 50, I would be, I would consider that a victory. Well, I think I set the bar too low. Yeah, yeah, I would have taken the over on that one. Okay, so you should know that there is an alternate universe, a miserable, alternate universe, where Mori Popovich is not this Mori Povich. Now, age 84. Because for the first 25 years or so of Mori's professional life, he worked in local news. He did some sports.

He did a lot of hard news. He hosted a talk show. He anchored the evening news. He mostly hopped from job to job to job all across the country. But then, this insane Australian guy named Rupert, Murphiard. Murdoch, summoned Mori to New York to host a new tabloid-style news show called A Current Affair. And this was 1986. And a current affair went on to take so many viewers from its direct competitor, Entertainment

Tonight, that the company that owned Entertainment Tonight went out and hired Mori to launch his own daytime talk show, the Mori Popvich Show, which was just one entrant among many in the super crowded field of daytime TV in 1991. So what you're saying is that your entry into daytime television, which, again, when I was growing up, I was born 85, right? 80s and 90s, daytime television. Huge. And not just the economic machine, but a golden age and institution that shaped American life. There were at least 10 of us on the air.

When I say that, I mean, there was Phil Donahue and there was Oprah. There was Geraldo Rivera and there was me, and there was Sally Jesse Raphael and Joan Rivers and Jenny Jones and Montel Williams. I mean, I could go. Jerry Springer. And so it was so funny one time because for their 25th anniversary, NBC gave Phil Donahue

a primetime show and he asked all of his competitors to be in a skit on the show. And we all showed up at the green room. All of us, eight or nine of them. The Avengers of Daytime Television. They're all in the green room. Talk show hosts in the green room. Not one of us would talk to each other.

I mean, our egos were so big that we couldn't even converse with each other. But it was like that, though. It was. Doggy dog. Right, right. That reminds me a bit of just the competitiveness of sports. Same thing. Keeping track of what the other person's stat line might be that night.

Exactly. Or clickbait now. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The metrics. the numbers were the race to be great, the greatest. I'm genuinely curious. This is a show about finding out stuff. And I say that now and smile because your show, of course,

is the ultimate show about finding out stuff. Yeah. Mori Popovich finds out is a good alternate title for your shows. But how good is your memory of your show over decades upon decades upon decades? Well, I mean, it's difficult. because there were two great themes for the last 24 years, and it was, of course, paternity tests and lie detector tests. So those things kind of merge.

Oh, my golly. I'm getting a silly phone calls here. Not only that, it was spam. How's that? I was hoping for Connie Chum. No. Oh, God, Almighty. Let me get this off.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's all good. I'll call her, though, if you want me to. Well, we might need to. If she's not writing her. I was going to say, but she's not writing her memoirs. Allow me to be the millionth Asian American young person to just use you as a way to getting to your life. Do you know when Connie saw you on pardon the interruption, she immediately looked you up to find out your heritage.

Oh, Maure. This is, oh, oh, that's, that is, that is, um, I'm serious. Put it on, put it on the epitaph stuff. Just like Connie Chung wanted to know, where is this kid from? is all I mean, now we're in the gravy phase of the proceedings today. That makes my, that makes a month, a year for me. So what happened was when I, the first seven years, when I worked at Paramount for the show, it was like, I mean, it was like Oprah and Donahue. It was just, for instance, we went to Waco, Texas for the Branch Davidians. We would go to Nashville to do a country.

music week. I mean, it's the same kind of motif that Today's show had or Oprah had or Phil had. And then after seven years, I left, became a free agent, and then I went to NBC Universal for the last 24 years. And the first couple of years were the same thing. And then my producers came to me and said, we have this idea. Okay, what's the idea? We want to do paternity tests. You know, we see on the soap operas all these themes about who's the father of these children and it takes about six months to play out the theme on soap operas we think we can do it in about 12 minutes oh boy this is going this is going to be good and and you know obviously just the way particularly daytime television is or tabloid television is you just want to push the envelope

as far as you can. Right. Again, you're in competition. Right, exactly. So we come down to the first show, and I think this was a crucial moment for everything. And I'm getting debriefed about the story, and I've read up on the story and read up on the characters involved. And the producer says, and so, Mari, the result, and I said, you know, I don't want to know the result. I don't want to know the result of a paternity test.

I don't want to know the result of a lie to detect. I don't want to know anything my guest doesn't know. The reason why I have those signature lines of you are the father, you are not the father, is because I didn't know. You are authentically finding out that very moment with us, the audience. Because to me, the only way in daytime talk you have to connect. The way you connect is you're part of the. them. You're part of the audience. You're the extension of the audience. You, and the way I

questioned was the same questions the audience would ask if they had a chance. Yes. And so that's the way it went down. Oh, you were an avatar for our curiosity. Right. You were, and I just want to, there are so many, I'm sure you get this all of the time now, just people being like, you remember that time? Right. I am going to do a self-indulgent thing. Right. I want to watch a couple of things from your show with you. Can we do that? Sure. I'm curious, Maury, if you remember this one.

What happens if this is your child? Then I'll step up and take care of it. You will? Yes, I will. For free? Yes, absolutely. You won't charge? No.

You won't be charging if it's yours. No. Okay, well, let's find out then, all right? Oh, boy. When it comes to one-year-old Ashland, Jeremy, you are not. Yeah! Yeah!

So for people who aren't watching along on YouTube at the Drap King's Network, that dude just backflipped, Maury. Yeah. And a white dude, too. A white dude backflipping with incredible alacrity. But you remember that backflip? That's not lost. I mean, you're not numb to the backflip.

You don't think it was the only backflip I ever saw? Wait, there are more? Of course. Are you kidding? I have backflips from the rainbow coalition, every color in the world you can imagine. Let me pause you for a second there. I can tell you, I can't tell you the number of NFL players who have said to me, we're in the locker room before the, before practice,

and the coaches are asking us to come out, and we're not coming out until we find out who the father is. And I'm telling you, this is from stars. Oh, I believe this. Oh, no, because I was that way when I was, like, you know, sick at home from school. Sure. And were you really sick? I mean, sometimes you had to stay home.

You had to gin it up because you might see this. When it comes to four-month-old Danya, Andrew, you are not the fire. You know that gentleman. I mean, he's like maybe the most iconic of all, yes? Would you rank him number one in terms of just the most viral most? Yeah, I mean, there were very, there were several different clips that millions on YouTube. Oh, still today.

Oh, yeah. Yes. I mean, it's... That guy dancing and essentially just becoming the host of your show as you go to console, the would-be mother of his child who was not. It is an incredible contrast in just like untrammeled delirium, utter delight. And you, you have the bedside manner. I mean, that's the thing in these clips.

that people need to appreciate, you were maybe the best handholder. And I mean that figurative and literal when it came to just people on your show. I think that's one of the reasons for the success was that the connection you make with the audience. And the connection is that they thought of me as part of their family. And I don't think a host can ask for anything more than that. I mean, you know, it's very interesting. When I first started, I had some negatives on the Q ratings and things like that. So Paramount hired a guy I had known years and years before named Roger Ailes,

who at that time, this was before Fox News, was a research consultant. And so Roger gets to me and says, we have to show you as a vulnerable person. we have to show you as one of those people who the audience would welcome into their homes. And the early promotional announcements for me was I went on and said, it's a classic Oprah showing vulnerability. I've been fired. I'm divorced. I've worked a lot of places.

Some people, some management liked me, some people didn't like me. And so I had to show all of this vulnerability. Right. Because as a talk show host, you have to be vulnerable. Yes, you need to show that you also can hurt. Right.

Yeah. That whatever sympathies, whatever emotions you display are real. What you're saying, though, in this sort of like familial metaphor here of like you're part of the audience, they welcome you in, as if you, Mory, were the father all along. Yeah. Well, I think a lot of people, the reason they come on the show is because they've always felt that they could unburden themselves in my presence. Absolutely. Rather than doing it at home in a rather difficult atmosphere at home and they could feel safe. I mean, can you imagine that? Well, that's what I cannot imagine, but now I'm beginning to make sense of is the idea that in that Coliseum, right, in Connecticut, right? in that studio in Connecticut. What felt insanely hostile from afar to them.

Which, by the way, the audience, the live audience, talk about, you know, the Romans and the Christians here. Win the crowd, win your freedom, that daunting aspect of like the arena. Right. Because of you, they felt it was a safe space. Exactly. Which is incredibly funny because my favorite genre, subgenre of your show, as much as I love the paternity. stuff and a lie detectors. It was the phobias.

Oh, my gosh. Do you know still today, they garner the largest population on YouTube? Oh, I am in that population. I want to play for you. Okay. My favorite one of my favorites,

and it's this one. You want to own up and tell everybody what you are deathly afraid of? Aluminum foil. Oh boy, I can't wait. It's the noise? It's the look and the noise. Oh gosh.

Yeah. Heggie, I'm telling you by the... You're going to away my name! Get away with me! I mean, aluminum, yeah. And at times, we unfortunately would take the poor intern. I was going to say, who did you task with the... The interns had to bring out the barrel of pickles or at one time,

time there was a woman who was scared of cotton balls. Well, Mori, I have good news for you. Well, this intern is an all-American. She's afraid of cotton. Cotton absolutely makes me 100%

terrified. The way it feels and what happens when I think about it, it gets to the point where I feel like I'm having a panic attack. Okay, you know you've got to confront your phobia now. This is the famous Mari show Cotton Ball Man. I think that's the greatest thing in television history.

That poor intern. So take me behind the scenes as to how the Cotton Man came to be. Well, you know, once the phobia shows became popular, we used to get all these requests. And we would take, I mean, what are we going to do? Put somebody on who has a phobia against snake. I mean, we all have that. Right. But cotton, aluminum, pickles.

Mustard. Mustard. I mean, it's unreal. And so, the poor intern. You visually describe for people again who are just listening to us, giggle over, again, the greatest moment in the history. Explain what happened there. What did we see? What we did on the phobia shows, whoever had a phobia, in order to over, over.

overcome it, according to our expert who in the back works on them for a couple of hours, and then we come back and show how they've overcome this. In order to overcome this, you have to confront it. And, I mean, I got a little squeamish because, I mean, I hate to see these people, you know, and they're just catatonic. I mean, they're just... Oh, you become vicariously afraid because they are running. They're always...

They're always... worry. They're always running backstage. They run backstage. They run through the audience. They run everywhere. And by the way, at times, we run after them. Oh, yeah. Oftentimes. You get the camera, the shaky handheld, following them around the back maze of your studio. And so in this clip, it was something I'd never seen before, but I'd never forgot it. up of a person full of cotton balls coming out like, you know, like one of those old-time class-see horror movies. Yes, a creature from the Black Lagoon, if the lagoon was just cotton balls. Exactly. And so, I mean, it was... That was an intern?

As an intern. Yeah. Oh, yeah. I wonder what job that guy got next. What part of the, of all of the things we've watched and beyond, what part surprised you the most? How often were you genuinely, like, because I imagine you see enough things.

There was, it happened twice on the show, and I was at a loss. And a woman comes on and accuses a fellow of being the father of her twins. And, okay. And so, since I've told you before, I don't know the result. I open up the envelope and the guy is the father of one, but not the other.

In the case of two-year-old Nikolai, Eric, you are not the father. In the case of two-year-old Darian, Eric, you are the father. I never had that on my show. And the first time it happened, I'm looking around. my staff, yeah, yeah.

And how does that happen? Fraternal twins, a lady could be quite active over a small period of time. Yes. You know, separate eggs. This is a thing that happens. Happened.

Million to one shot, according to scientists, it came on twice on my show. Twice. And the and the woman was disbelieving. I said, look, I was disbelieving until 30 seconds ago. But I know that our DNA testing is correct. And so therefore, you're looking for another father.

Right. Oh, my God. I didn't. This is a show full of revelations. Well, I thought you would know that coming from the family you come from. I know. My parents are doctors. Mori, of course, has seen enough PTI to know that I get made fun of for not knowing anything

about science or medicine. And so no, Maury, I did not know that a woman could fuck two different dudes and have them both be the father of their twins. Your fathers are urologist. Is that correct? That's right. And your mothers are what, dermatologist?

How do you know this? Well, I do my research. I feel like I'm about to watch you take an envelope out and inside of it is going to be a card that says you are the disappointment to your parents. And by the way, I always thought these women were very brave and very courageous

because they would come time after time. and first it was three and then four different guys, and then six, and then eight, nine, maybe even ten. Yeah. And they would be ridiculed by the audience. But also they knew what they were in for. Yeah. I mean, it's not like...

And they didn't care. They just wanted to have their child. You know, and that's why I've always justified that theme because, I mean, Lord knows I've had plenty of criticism over the years. Of course. Not only from media critics, but a lot of people. Yeah. Yeah, who's saying this is destructive to the American ideal.

And I'm saying, look, I know this. A child has a better chance at life if they have two parents in their life instead of one. I just know that. I know that. So if I can get a significant amount of men who are proved to be the fathers of these kids into these kids' lives. And fortunately, the show lasted so long. I used to bring back these families when there were adults. right and so i would see this father not only got into the life of that child but they had other

children the child in question ends up in college is off on her on her his own and it's i know it's gratifying the idea the idea i mean first off like if you have ever seen a second of of your show you know what you're in for what you're signing up for you're consenting to this in all of the ways so to me, I am unscandalized by that dynamic. But I am fascinated as to, again, let's bring it full circle here with the parental through line of our conversation. What did your dad think of what you were doing? Well, it was very interesting.

There was a Pulitzer Prize-winning television critic named Tom Shales. Of course. At the Washington Post. At the Washington Post. And Shales writes this scathing article about me. uses every S word there is, smarmy, uh, uh, sorted. Salacious.

Salacious. Every S word in the world. So I called up my father and I said, Dad, don't read Tom Shales today. You really don't really want to read Tom Shales. And please do not show mom the article. No, don't worry about it, son. Just go about your business.

And that was his attitude. Just go about your business. You do fine. I mean, he says, I'll tell you. you this son i i had a i had a role in hiring tom shales here and good writers are hard to find did he ever pull you aside tug you at your sleeve and say look the paternity stuff the phobia stuff the no he never he never did he really didn't he he always worried about me and it wasn't he worried about me because for a long time

I didn't have much money and whatever money I had was gone and he says you know you it really bothers me that that money just burns a hole in your pocket and you never have any money and so when I got to be successful and the money started coming in and how he's in his 90s

and he always went back to his boyhood home in Maine every summer. And so I sent a plane for him and my mother to Washington to pick us up in New York and go on to Maine. And I walked in the plane and there is all his newspapers spread out on a table like this. And he says, I'm not going to worry about you anymore. I will say this to everyone, you know. It makes sure your parents know you're okay before they go. That was a huge part. No, Maury, that was a huge part.

I'm just seeing very eerie, you know, small parallels in my life because, of course, when my parents saw me on ESPN, they were like, okay, this whole thing where you decided not to go to law school, even when you took the LSAT twice, where we sent you, we sent you out of our noses. Came to America to pay out of our noses, sent you to Harvard. Like, we're okay because it seems like this is, you have something going here. Right. And that mattered. I want to tell you something. All these years later, it's been 25 years since my father died, I was so happy to be able to show that to him while he was alive. And I just say that to everybody. If you can, please make sure they know you're okay. Yeah, yeah. We mentioned, of course,

your better half, Connie Chung before. And it's just remarkable how surrounded you are, how infused your life is with objective journalism. Like capital, the most capital J journalism. Connie Chung embodies that, truly embodies that. This is the CBS Evening News with Dan Ratham and Connie Chung. Good evening. Nine days after the explosion in Oklahoma City, the danger there is far from over. She pointed out in some interview that, you know, Mori Povich reads

books. He knows stuff about history and war and and pilot, all of this stuff. Has she ever tried to nudge you towards, hey, I know you as the brilliant son of a brilliant man who traffics in the highbrow. Yeah. And yet you're doing this stuff. And I say to her all the time and she appreciates it. I said, look, as long as you know, I'm fine. and that's it i mean i don't i mean it's kind of my secret i mean people most people don't know my past i mean uh i did uh newsy talk shows and i were reported on the air and i was there i was there at john kennedy's assassination looking at uh jacky kennedy coming off that plane in that bloodied suit and i covered the martin luther king's march on washington and i covered

the riots in washington after the death of martin luther king's march on washington and i covered the riots in washington after the death of Martin Luther King. And I covered all of Watergate. And, you know, I had my fix. I was always, I was always, I was always kind of ill at ease with the way news and storytelling went because there was never enough time when you were covering news. It was always a minute 30. If you were anchoring, it was always a 30-second intro.

there was always all these constraints. And so when the talk show gave me the ability to be a long-form storyteller, and I don't care whether it's tabloid or not, but it's a long-form storytelling position. And I felt free. I felt the bridle was off. And I...

the way I've kind of looked at it ever since. What are you most proud of when you take the sweep of all of this, right? You've traced an arc that's, again, without exaggeration, singular in the history of media. Right. What are you proudest of when you look back now? Two things. The one thing that Shales said to me, I mean, wrote years before he excoriated me on a current affair. and he liked my talk show. And he said, you're a Renaissance man.

You know, you got a little knowledge about a lot of things. And I think that plus the longevity, I'll take it. I mean, that's fine with me. And there are some funny things. I just saw something on Instagram that was so funny but true. a black comic named Josh Johnson is doing his stand-up and he's got in a club

and he says you know I think the black community owes a lot to Maury Popovich. I don't think Mory gets enough credit. I really don't. Mori is such an ally to the black community.

He really is. In all the years he's been on the show, Mori has never fucked him black name. Mari would say Don Tavius, full chested. I'm going, I wouldn't

name my baby Don Tavius. And then I saw the most amazing thing when I saw the name of the baby underneath the picture, and there was a two. They'll put the baby on the screen, and I'll see the screen below the name, and I'll be like,

is that a two in that nip's name? And then Mory, without even missing a beat with like when it comes to the case of six-month-old Tawain. I'm like, wow! When it comes to baby Tewain, I could, I just couldn't, I couldn't take it. In my talk show, every single, every single name on my talk show I say to the producers, how does, how do they well, I don't know. Well, I'm going to go, where is that person for the show? I'm going to go find out and I did that for 30 years. I had never thought about that ingredient and why everybody deserves

the respect of the correct pronunciation of their name yes and and it also provides that ballast of we on some level despite the absurdity of the proceedings you're about to undergo we're going to take you seriously in a way exactly that is fundamental right to who you are I can pronounce your you know that you can be sure that you have a space here. Do you consider yourself? I'm not thinking about this in the context again of the episodes you did. Do you consider yourself an optimist about human nature? Yeah, I do.

I mean, I do. I think... You've seen it all, and you emerge an optimist. Yeah, because of the successes I've seen people go from, I am not the father that child, a woman would never ever, to, I'll be there. I'll be there for that child.

And some are obviously never going to be there. Oh, no, backflip guy's gone. Yeah, I mean, but, yeah. He's backflipping still today. Exactly. Yeah. But there are others who really take it seriously. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Do you, Mory, have regrets? Do you have a regret, whether it's in the realm of work or life or the intersection between them? Are you a guy who has that thought? No, no. There was a time in my life when I left Washington because I wanted to find out I wanted to be the next Walter Cronkite.

And so in a seven-year period between 1977 and 1983, I worked in Chicago, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Philadelphia, and then back to Washington. Five cities in seven. years. Management didn't like me in some. I got fired one time. I didn't like management in another. I got thrown around here. I did that. I mean, this. In fact, there was a great New York Times columnist

who wrote for Esquire named Richard Reeves, and he was a friend of mine. And he wrote his entire Esquire column in the back page of Esquire. And it said, my friend, the anchorman, Maury Povich, I have seen him anchor the news on four successive St. Patty's Day in four different cities. The man is trying to go nationwide city by city. Yeah. In NBA parlance, you were a journeyman. There's an alternate life in which you are a nomad. Absolutely. Absolutely. And so, I mean, but, I mean, look, I can almost tell you that the reason why my life settled down and then became in the ascent in 1984 is because this woman who I had dated for seven and a half years finally agreed to marry me. And that marriage in 1984 really changed

everything for me. And by the way, not because I thought I was going to be anything, because at the time I wasn't. In fact, we had a marriage for the first two years. She lived in New York, working then at ADN. D.C. I was in Washington doing local news, and we would communicate. And we would commute and I would come up and there was a dormant at her apartment and he would say and who are you here to see. I said, my name is Mari Povich. I'm here to see my wife, Connie Chung. And he would call up and say, Mr. Chung is downstairs.

One of us, Maury. Yeah. So I have been Mr. Chung. I have gladly been known as Mr. Chung for the rest of my life. that would be fine with me. How it ever came about that I was decoupled into being Marie Povich is beyond me. Unconsciously uncoupled, as it were. Yes.

Wait. So what are Mr. and Mrs. Chung like in retirement? Well, it's interesting. I am sitting on the sidelines watching my wife complete about a three or four year effort to write her memoirs. and this is some task, and it's going to be a very, very big book because many publishers wanted to publish it. No doubt. And she has just turned in her first draft. It's probably going to be out a year from now.

And there are a lot of personages who should be taking notice of this in the news business. They might find out some. stuff. Because I don't know, I don't know if there's going to be a filter or not. Oh, I hope there isn't. So anyway, I think she would agree that she is so happy not to be in the business these days. And you feel the same way? Yeah. I mean, you were in the business for as long as literally humanly possible. I mean, everybody says, everybody says my show was canceled. I tried to leave my show four years before it ended. And then I tried to try to leave my show four years before it ended. And then I tried to leave it two years before it ended. And NBC just came. No, no, no, Maury, it's still going on. Oh, I've seen the YouTube traffic is unrelenting. And my repeats, 3,500 of them, I mean,

are on the same stations. And I look at, believe it or not, I'm still a creature of the goddamn business. I'm still looking at the ratings. And they, how is the ghost of Mori Popat's ratings these days? They're really good. Yeah. Yeah, I bet. Kids will be playing hooky from Cool. Decades into the future. Can you imagine that I'm still looking at the ratings? I love that. 84 years old.

You're still trying to box out. Sally Jesse Raphael. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And not even though he's gone, Jerry's in repeat still. And I'm looking at his ratings. It's in my ratings. We are such TV creatures.

Oh, I love that. I love that. You've described a number of, and I know you love golf and you play golf. and Cornheiser can't stop talking about how good a golfer you are. So there's that. I mean, we should just say that for the record. Well, all I can say is Cornheiser is better than Wilbon.

I think. But indulge the existentialism here at the end, though, because I'm honored that you sat down and walked me through an unparalleled life and career. How do you want people, the kids, generations from now, to remember what you did here on this planet? You know, I've never really thought about that. I mean, you know, I grew up in the Jewish religion, and they had one thing in the Jewish religion that I really find that I can admire.

And that is, we don't know whether there's an afterlife or not in the Jewish religion. It might be, there might not be where we don't know. but our journey is to be written into the book of life and you have to lead your life in such a way where you can be written into the book of life and so therefore I mean that's that's how I look upon myself I mean and and I think I've done a good job at that

I mean I I mean there were a lot of hiccups along the way but I think I've lived my life in a way that I could be penciled in. Mori Popovich, this was a genuine, genuine honor. Thank you so much. It's my pleasure, Pablo. I mean, I've watched you for a long time, and I know of your background,

and just make sure that everything is okay with the lebertard because he asked me on the show before you did, and I rejected him. You know, a journalist never stops going after the scoop. Exactly. You can tell him. that I scooped you. That's right. Dan, yeah, try that one on it. Yeah, exactly. Wear that one,

you sweaty bastard. So today's just going to be one of those episodes that'll always have a special place in my heart. And I don't know if you watched as much morey as I did in the 90s. I don't know if you thought that it was a stain upon American morality, as certainly some critics out there have said over the years. I get it. And for what it's worth, Mori himself does not even necessarily count on their being and afterlife, as I found out today.

But what I personally like to imagine is our creator standing there in front of whatever heaven that might exist. Let's call it a metaphysical television studio with an envelope in his hand. And no, Mori Povich does not know the result ahead of time. He never does, as he said. But inside this envelope, as the tension is rising,

I strongly suspect is the good news that Mori Povich has been waiting for. This has been Pablo Torre finds out a Metal Arc Media production. I'll talk to you next time.