Page 7 - Pop History: Scrooged

Episode Date: December 24, 2019

Happy Holidays from Page 7 to you! To celebrate the season we talk about the making of our favorite holiday movie, Scrooged.    Chicago, Pontiac and Milwaukee, get your tickets for Page 7 and Wizard and the Bruiser LIVE!  Subscribe to SiriusXM Podcasts+ to listen to new episodes of Page 7 ad-free.Start a free trial now on Apple Podcasts or by visiting siriusxm.com/podcastsplus. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

I'm Jackie the first I am. I am Jackie the first I am Jackie Zabrowski. Here to tell you about the page 7 and Wizard and the Bruiser live show in January. It's going to be a hoot of a time. We're going to be partying down in Chicago, Pontiac, Michigan, Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Hello? You can get your tickets at lastpodcast network.com slash P7 live. I think you might like it.

Bell noise. Bell noise, bell noise, bell noise. It's the holidays. And can you say holidays without Scrooge? Why are you just saying, Give me a bill, That's what we're talking about today. Guys, we are talking about apparently the cult a version of a Christmas Carol,

the movie Scrooge, starring Bill Murray. I don't understand in doing all of this research how many people were like the unsung hero of the Christmas West as if the movie has never been heard of it is my favorite Christmas movie outside of Up a Christmas Carol So yeah this was my curiosity

because you were like first Jackie by the way that's Jackie I'm holding Natalie Oh hey! Welcome to our holiday edition of pop history We are doing the history of the movie Scroo And when you first brought this up I was like oh okay and I remember because you like it so much.

I was like, that's kind of a weird one. Because, like, I've always seen Scrooge the way that I think people have talked about it where it's like, it's this really uneven, bizarre, dark Christmas tale. I mean, it's great, but it's chaos. Dare you. I mean, I'm right.

Look at the making of it. They were contentious the entire time. Here. I think they're out of your mind. I think that Frank Cross's promo for a Christmas Carol says everything. Acid Rain. Drug addiction.

International Terrorism. Freeway killers. Now more than ever, it's important to remember the true meaning of Christmas. Your life might just depend on it. That's awesome. I think that Scrooge is the rock and roll Christmas movie, and I thought everyone watched it 10 times every year. I did too.

Right? Since I was a child, we have in my home. I'm going to say, I like the movie. I appreciate it. It's just, you know. Sounds like you don't like the movie. In terms of Staples, it sounds like you don't appreciate the movie. In terms of Christmas Staples, it is a,

select audience Christmas staple. I just, I honestly didn't know this, and I'm not even being overdramatic. I didn't know that. Star cast. All star cast. All star cast. It's dark.

What's not to love about it? It is definitely, it is definitely lopsided. It's not, you know. It's weird. It's weird. I think you are shattering my life. I'm like seeing shards of glass falling in front of my eyes. You're saying these things.

Natalie, you know how we feel. In our house, we watch it after things. Thanksgiving dinner, which we've already watched Scrooge once this year as a host of Zabowski. Right. And we are going to watch it at least two or three more times. I hope so. Yeah. Well, okay, let's talk about it.

I think we need, I think this is connected, though, in a way to a nostalgia. So what was your personal situation with Scrooge as a child, as a child? I think for me, just because of being so obsessed with Ghostbusters as a kid, just having Bill Murray in that role made me interested. And it was also ghost-like. Yes. So that was- Oh, it's super.

Well, I mean, I was going to say, as it, for me as a kid, I really, like, it was that movie that I could only watch, like, part of, because once we got to death, I was out. I was so scared. It was terrifying.

It was scary. It was genuinely scary, but I remember as a kid, we were also a, we were children that were also obsessed with a princess bride. So having Carol Kane in it, which would made me so excited as a kid. And I thought,

that it was so funny, but also Henry and I grew up watching scary movies all the time. We had never seen a Wizard of Oz until we were adults, but we had seen it five times. You know what I mean? So I think maybe that's really what it was, that we were more in tune to scary things,

and I liked that I couldn't sleep afterwards. It's not just that it's scary, but it's also like incredibly nihilistic and very, and it makes sense, because it's written by Michael O'Donohue, and we'll get into that. He was one of the early, like, bad boys, writers of Esenel.

He was the first head writer of Esenel. But he was also like crazy in the best way. He was you know, one of my favorite

stories of his was when he got really pissed with the cast and crew at one point like a few years. And I think it was when Dick Ebersol

took over for Lauren Michaels for like a very short time to keep the show alive. And he literally was like this is what the show lacks and he just spray

painted the word danger on the wall. And like, he was like, and he was really he wrote all the show of the really like, anything that you saw in those early years that was like, that's fucked

up, that was probably Michael O'Donohue. And so, of course, this makes so much sense that this would be like the brainchild of him, because this whole movie, when it's not there's elements of horror, there's also just heavy physical abuse. There's this, it's just an absolute meltdown. There's a fucking

madman storming an office. You can barely see them. With a gun? You can barely see the Nubles. I would really look at it. It's something I still say five times a month at least. You can barely see them nipples.

And he's really looking. I think that's also another thing that it is a quotable movie that my family quotes all year long. Right. My family only talks about nipples because of that movie. I'm sorry.

But it's like the whole movie is like a dirty old man joke in a lot of ways. What you guys are revealing to me is that I have been a dark, disturbed child. Sure. Since I was little tiny baby now.

I mean, to be fair, I have no, like my context for what is supposed to be appropriate as just so askew at this point. I don't even know. I mean, to be fair, Natalie, you in this room right now look like a member of the Adams family. And I didn't even know, see? Right. I just, I just think I'm wearing a normal outfit. I look like I'm from a Marilyn Manson video.

I think you're beautiful. Schmigelda or whatever. You know what I mean? Come in town. She could take her head off at will. You know, that kind of thing. Schmigelda is schmigelda. Jesus.

Hold it. What's wrong with Schmigelda? She doesn't look like a schmigelda. Okay. It does sound like schmigma a little bit. Yeah, it does. It's Christmas. She's made out of goo.

But anyways, but I always like Scrooge. I'm not sitting here. I'm just saying that I wasn't shocked. I swore by the, I fall swam. I wasn't shocked by the contentious relationship of the director and our lead actor throughout the filming. And I was not shocked by the fact that it was like critically panned at first. It did well.

I was shocked at everything that I read about the cult status and how. much no one likes this. What? No, people do like this movie. Now they love it. Yeah, it took a little time. Now they love it because, but I hate that it's like,

the cult pony of the movie forest. I don't understand the cult thing just because it was also that one of those movies that was like always on HBO. It has everybody in it. Abundantly mainstream. There's nothing cults about it. It's had a huge budget. Like one of the biggest stars in the world is the lead actor in it.

But this also was his comeback to acting that it was see which we will get into it is just I I don't know I still think it still creeps me out and in fact I even said this right after when we were watching it this year I always it's the reason why I don't eat turkey legs at Thanksgiving anymore is because when Frank Cross is being held out of the window by the ghosts of Christmas past and he's ripping at his arm yeah and as he's about to fall to his death it makes me think of a turkey leg the way The skin falls away from the bone. It looks like a turkey.

Oddly, it makes Henry more hungry. You know, and that's where we differ as siblings. Yeah, there's for the best. There's some terrifying special effects stuff going on, which is... So good. Such good special effects. You know what I refer to it in my head now as jump behind the couch moments? Because when Large Marge hit the screen and Pee We Large...

Pewee's Big Adventure, my move was to literally leap behind the couch and hide. That also used to scare the shit out of music. And Scrooge has a few jump behind the couch moments for a kid where you're just like, nope, no, no, no, I'm out. But man, watching it now with an appreciation of makeup and special effects, I'm like, man, there's some good stuff in there. I believe, didn't it? I will say it did win an Oscar for makeup, right? Yeah, it was nominated a lot to Beetlejuice.

That's right. Okay, fair. And the fact that those two came out the same year, I'm actually surprised that it didn't get more critical acclaim when it came out because people were begging for creepy mainstream movies. And for tongue-and-cheek satire. rich people and stuff. That's very much beetle juice as well. I know. It's like so many like sociopolitical statements in that movie that are so fun and poignant. Oh yeah.

And this time. Now a good little description of Scrooge, if you guys have not seen it, is an updated version of a Christmas carol. Where Ebenezer Scrooge is now Frank Cross, a workaholic ill-tempered television executive, who, in a clever meta-touch, is overseeing a production of a Christmas carol. He makes life difficult for his quietly suffering. secretary Grace played by Alphrey Woodard who my god I was completely in love with her growing up I was just like I wanted to I wanted her to be my mom yeah growing up even though I'm glad that my father was not killed in front of me and thus making me mute right Frank doesn't have time to spend

Frank doesn't have time to spend with his younger brother who was played by his actual younger brother and a chance to reconnect with an old girlfriend Claire played by Karen Allen yeah also growing up because I still have never seen an Indiana Jones. Didn't realize she was from Indiana Jones. I won't give you shit for that. I hate that now. I can't believe you haven't seen it. I'm gonna see Indiana Jones.

You will want sex with her if you see her in Writers-Bel-Log. Really? She's a fox. And she's just like a hard drinking badass too. Ooh, that is the opposite of what she plays in this movie. Yes. Because her life is ruined when Frank Cross blittles her job at a homeless shelter. A late night visit from his long-dead mentor, Lou, played by John Forsyth,

sets off a frantic day of ghostly encounters for Frank, as he struggles to keep his show from being taken over by an officious coworker, which is also, I also forget now that you can't, you wouldn't make a movie where Bobcat Goldwood, in a joking manner, comes in after being fired on Christmas Eve with a shotgun with an intent to kill everyone on the set. Well, yeah, that was back in the time when Matt shootings were more of a, you know, quaint, cute idea. It was still the same year. It was 1988 when the term going postal became, like, that was when everyone started

because when post office worker when it came in and shot up a bunch of people. And so it, and yet still, it actually wasn't okay. No, of course not. No, absolutely not. I don't think you were saying it was okay, but you know what I mean? I feel it was like kind of okay, right? Mass shootings have sort of become like a culture. of sorts, which is horrified.

Back then it was just a fun novelty. Yes. Sadly, yes. Holden. Did you ever have the computer game postal? Yes. I did as well. Yeah, actually, have it now. A fan sent me a copy of it on my PC. There was, there was a, like a old shooter game

where you were a post office worker. That was back when everybody was, every game was like edgy and whatever, yeah, you're like, had little taglines, like, oh, but I did own that. We had it in our house as, you know, like an 11-year-old, and I didn't think anything about it. Exactly.

This goes back to our whole situation. We were of a different time. Yeah, it was of a different time. Well, speaking of being of a different time. Oh, good segue. Why don't we take a little trip back into time all the way to the year 1843 with... Oh, that's my favorite year.

Charles Dickens. Charles Dickens, my lud. Wrote a novella called A Christmas Carol in prose being a ghost story of Christmas, which is actually the full title of A Christmas Carol. So Charles Diggins, his childhood was pretty idyllic, actually, up until the family

suffered a lot of debt, and his father had to go to debtor's prison, and he was forced... Thank God they don't have that now. I know, right? I saw that phrase, and I was like, what? Yikes. I think my life is debtor's present. Thank you. So Charles Diggins was forced at the age of

12 to pay his own way in life by working at a shoe polish warehouse, and he had to deal with all these tough working conditions and it had a major impact on his writing. He was always writing about the poor. Of course, you've got like Oliver Twist, things like that. And he also had this incredible ability to remember people, places, and events like incredibly well, very vividly. And this would aid his writing later in life. So after he gets success with Oliver Twist and things like that, he ends up setting out to write a few Christmas stories. So actually when he wrote a Christmas

Carol, he was 31, he was a father of four. His wife, Catherine, was pregnant with the couple's fifth child while he was writing it. And he was himself up to his eyeballs in debt. And everything rested on a Christmas Carol. He needed this book to be great. He ended up paying for the entire creation of the book with his own money, which is insane, especially at the time when he had nothing, he could barely feed his own children. And he's like, well, I'm just going to put all my fucking eggs into this basket.

I bet his wife was super psyched about that. Oh, I bet she was wet for it. Get a job. The book, the story rather, was based on a trip to Manchester and the conditions of the manufacturing workers there. He set out to, quote, strike a sledgehammer blow for the poor that while writing the book,

he wept and laughed and wept again. Oh, that is a lot. It's like, just keep writing. You know, at this point, just, oh, my God. But apparently a Christmas Carol arrived right at the time when Britain was beginning to experience a mid-Victorian revival of the festive season.

And the book went one further. It helped popularize the term Merry Christmas and it also gave us bah humbug. And now let's jitterbug all the way to the 1930s and a man named Richard Donner was being born in the Bronx.

Wow, this is actually almost like a Christmas because we're going to the past. Yeah, you're just like Gonzo. I'm just like Gonzo in the movie. That's the other one. That's my other favorite Christmas movie. And they're both, I love how they're both based on a Christmas car. Right.

Your two favorite Christmas films. Mine's Christmas vacation. Mine is probably also Christmas vacation. Oh my God. Well, maybe next year we'll do that, but I won this year. So Richard Donner, born in the Bronx, as I said, in 1930s, started out as an actor getting a bit part on a TV show directed by Martin Ritt, who did films such as The Great White Hope and Nuts, starring Barbara Streisand. Nuts. I don't know that one.

Do you know, you're not a big Barber Stricean. I'm into a bad. I'm more of like Mirror Has Two Faces version of Barber Streisand. Is nuts that's not a Christmas movie? Nats. No, just, I just wanted to, I just love the fact that Barbara Strysand was in a movie called Nuts. Also, did we say that? Sometimes I just write down the facts that I just think are dumb and funny sounding.

That Richard Donner directed Scrooge, which is why we're directing. Yes, Richard Donner is the director of Scrooge. Well, because his performance was in such a way on that, TV show that Martin Ritt convinces him to get into directing and hires him as his assistant. Donner's own directing work started out in commercials and then TV dramas in the late 50s such as wanted

dead or alive starring Steve McQueen. He directed over 25 TV series including episodes of Tales from the Crypt and the Twilight Zone which makes a lot of sense because Scrooge really does feel like a Twilight Zone or even a Tales from the Crypt episode. Oh yeah. Episode. He actually oh I forgot about this fucking awesome fact. He directed the William Shack.

headner helmed nightmare 20,000 feet episode of the Toiletown the wing. And did he also direct the Goonies? Yes, he totally did. I mean this is, yeah, he's got like a ludicrously prolific career. He did Superman? He did Superman the movie. He did the toy. He did Lady Hawk. He loved the toy. He did lethal weapon. Oh, yeah. But he didn't get his first big break until the omen. That was his first big one in 1976 starring Gregory Peck. This was a supernatural horror that capitalized on the whole, you know, success of The Exorcist around that time.

I didn't realize that that is who directed Scrooge. I know what you. Giantly prolific. Insane. But it makes sense because I don't think an up-and-coming director could get away with a movie with starring this cast with that big of a budget. That is this weird of a movie. Yes.

And to be able to capture the tone correctly and stuff because it could have easily slid into complete chaos. Which, and I will say, I think it is surprising because the reason why he did attach himself to this project is because Bill Murray was attached to it as well. And he had said, I jumped on the bandwagon when they said it was Bill. It was a wonderful screenplay on top of it to have Bill Murray and the

opportunity to work with Bill, which is funny because later on, they really fucking hate each other. Yeah, they really didn't like working each other. But so, speaking of which, Bill Murray, born and raised in Illinois just outside of Chicago, he spent his teen years working as a golf caddy to pay for schooling, and he played

in a rock band called the Dutch Masters while also performing in high school and community theater. It's his older brother Brian, and Brian, does Brian appear in this film? All of his brothers do. All of them, right? Well, no, he does have, I think he's got, he's one of eight. Yeah. Oh, yeah? Other ones, yeah. Well, he has at least what, three brothers

that show up in there? There are three different brothers in it, which is nuts. So, Brian. Nuts with Barbara Streisand. We got to do an episode on Nuts. I don't know if we do. I don't know. It is his older brother, Brian, that invites him to come and perform at the second city in an improv comedy

Troop under the tutelage of the legendary teacher del close. Which I was also from SCTV, which I loved to watch. I was always more of an SCTV. We watch a lot of those tapes growing up. SCV is amazing. And everyone should watch SCTV if you like especially if you like sketch comedy. He performed as a featured player on the National Lampoon Radio Hour before getting cast on Saturday Night Live. And has, of course, the career he has on SNL. After that, he gets into movies. His first film is Meatballs, the horny summer comedy, followed by several box office hits, such

as, of course, Caddyshack, Stripes, and his first dramatic film comes after all of that, and he co-writes this movie. It's probably, I think it was him really trying to get to the career he got to later in life with The Razor's Edge. Have you guys seen No. I have never, I've never even heard of the Razor's Edge. I really want to see this movie. And apparently the Razors Edge flopped.

Yeah. And I mean, it doesn't make me, I still want to watch it, though. Yeah, me too. Which is why he ended up having a four-year hiatus afterwards. Well, this is the thing. That same year, Ghostbusters comes out. The same year is Razor's Edge. Yes.

Yeah. So, and this is the whole thing about it is he feels, as he put it, radioactive. He's like in the biggest summer blockbuster, like, kind of ever, but whatever. I don't know numbers-wise, but it's amazing. And then also has this giant bomb. And I think he's just like, I don't know how to have a career, right? now because I'm so confused by how all this banned out. I'm going to take a break and retires from acting,

studying philosophy at a college in Paris, although he does make a tiny, yeah, although he does make it. He studied philosophy and history at Sorbonne University in Paris. Yeah. And it's also as part of this. That is not the thing I envisioned Bill Murray doing. Well, I mean, think about him now, though. You know, I mean, I could kind of see him doing it now.

Really? This was this big transition. He just drinks all the time now, doesn't he? No, he's all fancy, too, though, in those. Wes Anderson movies, he's like both. He's like the party guy and then he's also like the art museum guy. Totally. Yeah. This was also the time period when I think that he was

dallying with being a family man because he moved from Hollywood to Paris with his wife and his children and he was also taking care of his mother that had a long illness. In Paris? Yeah, and he was just hanging out. And he said that he was ready to return to film after two of the years and was actually offered the script of Scrooge's

two years into his four-year hiatus. But at the time, he just didn't want the script and didn't like it. He says, I don't think I missed anything. I should show you the scripts I didn't do. It's like the stories police don't tell you about. So I will say, to be fair, he does do a tiny cameo in Little Shop of Horrors, of course, the guy that loves the dentist. And he does make an allusion to that in the film itself.

Feed me, Seymour. She says, feed me Seymour near the end, which it just comes out of nowhere, And it is so weird, but I absolutely like. But we will definitely get into the whole final monologue. I mean, that is, I want to hear you guys. I mean, that whole thing is so weird. Yes. I don't know.

But anyways, he's coming back into the film game, and he just didn't find anything, you know, very great, and ends up picking Scrooge to backup, or at least the idea of a comedy take on the classic tale. Well, he was very into it because Michael O'Donohue, who was the head writer of Esenel at the time, was the one that was working on the script. He's like, well, if you guys are doing this,

then I guess also they paid him $6 million to play Frank Cross, and it's hard to turn that down. But it is interesting because I didn't even think about this is one of his biggest apprehensions is that he had never been the lead of a movie by himself before. It was always, it was always... Oh, yeah, he's always like an ensemble cast kind of guy. Even Stripes was an ensemble situation.

And, I mean, SNL, majorly ensemble, right? Oh, yeah. And he said, quote, Scrooge was. harder than Ghostbusters because I was by myself, really. Even though there are a number of people in the movie, they only had cameos. They would stroll in for a day or two and split. I was there every day and it was like flunking grade school again and again. No way.

He nailed it. This whole thing. I was so surprised by all of this stuff. Yeah, but it makes sense. I never thought about that before, but that's probably, yeah, that must be intimidating at that point. But he at least also gets to make the demand that he's going to super rework the script with his writers.

Let's talk about these writers, Mitch Glazer and Michael O'Donohue. You've got Mitch Glazer being raised in Miami before eventually ending up at NYU, after which he works for Rolling Stone and a music publication called Crawl Daddy as a reporter. And that's when he started getting into the hanging out with the SNL crew because he had had a cover story that was of John Belushi. So Mitch Glazer became good friends with John Belushi. He started hanging out at Studio 8H, and that's where he met Bill. and he said about meeting Bill, there was something intense about him.

He could be insanely funny at will. Literally, for hours at a time, he was just insanely on. It was dazzling, actually, to be around him. But also, he was this big, imposing guy. O'Donohue started out in the theater, creating his own works, which were generally found to be disturbing by most audiences.

Everything in the film that's like, oh, that's going to be O'Donahue. Which I also didn't realize that he would occasionally appear on S&L doing impersonations of people, which I was trying to find clips, but I only saw... I don't know if it was actual S&L episodes. I think it was just something funny he would do. Do? Because he said that he would pretend to be Tony Orlando and what he would sound like with needles stuck in his eyes. He had horrible migraines. Agonizing chronic migraines. Yeah, he had horrible migraine. He ends up dying of a brain aneurysm in like his 50s. Yeah. His whole life he suffered

intense migraines, which I think would add to why he had such a dark, mean sense of humor. So, yeah, he starts out writing for humor magazines. He's known as one of the co-founders of National Lampoon magazine. He then moves on to being the first head writer of Saturday Night Live. He appears in the show's opening sketch as an English language teacher, making John Belushi say crazy shit like, we are out of badgers, would you accept a Wolverine in its place, and classically refused to write for Jim Henson's segments saying, I won't write for

Felt, which I remember all of them. this stuff from like the oral history of S&L, the live from New York book, like all of these stories. How dare you also just describe a muppet like that? Why is he so mad at Jimenez? He's mad at a lot, bigs. He's got the cost of migrates. He has no joy. He has no joy in his life. And so with

Glazer, O'Donohue and some others write a like weird sketch movie thing called Mr. Mike's Mondo video, which was a series of vignettes originally intended for TV in place of an S&L episode, but NBC yanked it for being too vulgar.

So they turned it into like a sketch movie that was heavily panned, but this is what solidifies O'Donohue and Glazer as script buddy writing partners. Oh, hell yeah. Yeah. And I want to go back and watch it. Apparently it's this incredibly uneven Kentucky Fried Movie type of a movie. It's just all over the place. So they get together to rework the script.

Bill Murray said, we tore up the script so badly that we had parts all over the long. He mainly wanted to strengthen the romantic subplot, which does feel still in the movie. I'm sorry to criticize this movie at all, Natalie. Okay, I apologize to you. Jackie, I apologize to you. You're about to be Christmas canceled. Jackie, I apologize to you. You are this close to being Christmas canceled.

And if anyone, I know you guys can't see. It's not a lot. I want to be a Hanukkah boy. You're not allowed to do that either. I'll convert. Go ahead. I'd like to see you try. You're right.

I can't learn the language. Be too crazy. Yeah, you're too. No, you're not dumb. I was about to call you dumb. I was about to call you dumb. Just because I don't, just because I don't as much love a movie that you love. Christmas showdown here.

I, by the way, I like the movie. It seems like you don't like a movie. I'm just able. It sounds like you're really criticizing it. Well, anyways, I will say the romantic subplot does feel at times kind of to act on. But I will, I will go ahead and agree with you with this. Okay. Well, also, he makes out with that.

That is the weirdest part of the movie. Can we just get to it? I was going to wait until we got to the final monologue. But the part where he makes out with a woman, like a hot dancer woman, and then just goes... It's just a long kid. And everyone's like, yeah.

And then he's like, but that's nothing compared to the woman. She was like, and she's like watching the whole time. This is really more an example of how women were looked at in the 80s, which is like, she just... The girlfriend just gets dragged around to whatever he needs her for. She's just happy. But that's just society. That's not the movie's fault.

It's just that it is, you nailed it then, Alex. I was going to bring that. It's this weird. horny, funny boy moment that you see in so many movies during that time period where you're just like that wouldn't ever

ever work in a real situation if you wouldn't just make out with a woman right in front of the person like knowing that the... I mean in the same vein if someone that sounded like they had been just doing a bunch of drugs called me after not talking to me

for 10 years after breaking my heart and being like I have to see you shows up at my homeless sheltered job and they immediately And then pisses me up again? Stop helping these poor animals. Hell no. And then when you say, you say, oh, but could you please just give me but a moment?

And then he goes, no, fine. And then he just leaves. No abuse. That's, I don't understand why she deals with it. It's abuse. You know what else that be is ghost of Christmas present? Also, a bit of abuse happening. Okay.

He deserves it. Mitch Glazer said one time we had a ghost of Christmas present, who was a huge biker guy with a big white beard. We had realized that Santa Claus always wears biker boots, which is a huge epiphany. In the movie that that's what they had originally wanted. So going back to the script, there's always this weird. Carol Kane describes it as a bit like a tennis match or volleyball or something like that,

when she's referring to the war that's happening between sticking to the script and majorly improvising like everything. So Bill Murray is constantly changing things up, which is not necessarily a bad thing, but I do think that also Michael O'Donohue is like, They used like 40% of my script in the movie. And he was furious about the treatment of the script. And I think that that is what makes this movie feel so bizarre and not in a negative way. But so it's got a weird vibe to it.

I think that's why. Well, and Karen Allen, it also said that Bill Murray refused to rehearse. He wanted things to stay very, quote, for the first time. Which I get that, but you can't really do that on a movie set or else you lose control. which is why later on Richard Donner, the director, had said about working with Murray that it was like standing on 42nd Street and Broadway and the lights are out and you're the traffic cop

because Bill Murray was nervous. He'd do anything to avoid getting in front of the camera. He'd tell stories. One minute he's got his wardrobe on. Next, he's running around the set without any clothes on. So he was just manic through it because he was so... He's a fun boy. He's a fun boy, but also, can you imagine working with that?

I'd just be like, I don't know. Yeah. I wouldn't want to come working. You don't direct Murray. You pull him back. And at the same time, I'm kind of like, but you really, do you pull him back? I don't know.

You don't. I think the manic energy works for this movie because it's a very kind of like rock and roll metal movie. Yes. I agree with that. I don't think it should be completely controlled. I like that a lot of the scenes seem improvised and. And just chaotic because really that and I believe does help

promote how chaotic this man's life has become. Yes. and why he needs to be grounded back into the love of the holiday, you know? Oh, yeah. All that good stuff. But he also wasn't for a lack, he wasn't in him being lazy where he didn't want to learn the lines, where I feel like you hear this from some people where it's like, well, they obviously just didn't want to put the work in.

He would still learn all of the lines and knew where the scene needed to get, but thought it was more interesting if things came from a more organic place, which it does. We'll also put this in time as well. He also even said before he went on hiatus, I feel like I'm radio. I think in a lot of ways what you're describing as someone who is is at this at the same time both insanely confident in his abilities and at the same time as that super freaked out and worried about the success of the film because he had that bomb. I think they're both happening at once like because he made those two movies in the same year

he's he's both on all cylinders, you know what I mean? Unsure and totally sure. And if only he had a ghost of Christmas future. to understand that everybody would remember Ghostbusters and nobody would really forget. Everyone would forget the other one. Yeah, I don't even, Razors actually, no one talks about it.

No, no, it's not a classic. It's not a famous bomb. It's not a famous bomb. You know, career either. Let's talk about this amazing cast. I think one of the best things about this movie is its all-star cast. It's insane.

John Forsyth as Lou Hayward, is his old partner or boss? It's his boss technically, right? The ghost of his old boss. His first film gig was in 1943 and Scrooge was one of his last. You may actually know him best as Charlie in the TV series and movies Charlie's Angels,

which I did not realize. Oh, yeah. He's that guy. Oh, yeah. I recognize the voice now. I love that David Johansson is the Ghost of Christmas Past. First of all, Jackie, I was reading your notes. Isn't it great?

Well, I know. So if you guys don't know, he's Buster Poindexter, who's saying, hot, hot, hot. But he would actually be furious at you for only bringing that up as his credit. Sorry, buddy. He's also New York Dolls. He was like the first punk band New York Dolls. After that fell apart, he started doing this character Buster Poindexer in Nightclubs.

And he's called Hot Hot Hot, Hot, Quote, the Bane of My Existence. Of course. Because he just was doing this avant-garde nightclub character guy. He ends up with this insane hit out of nowhere. And then he's just haunted by it for the rest of his life. You're the hot, hot, hot guy. Yeah, just fucking. You give you a bunch of money.

It's an annoying song. And it's a terrible. It's a terrible song. But apparently, David Johansson, he was a really good friend of Bill Murray's, and he got the role just barely over Sam Kennison, who was supposed to be it. And Sam Keneson, which would have been great. Sam Kenison was publicly displeased about losing the role, went on Howard Stern and complained about it, and it made him even more furious because apparently, which I would love to do

another pop history just on this. I didn't know this, but Sam Kenison and Bobcat Goldway hated each other. And the fact that Bobcat was in the movie drove him insane. Well, it's the two weird voiced men. That probably went head to head forever. I'm the weird voice. Yeah. I'm the weird voice guy.

That's me. I'm the weird voice guy. Exactly. Let's get to Bobcat Goldthwaite in just a second, but really quick, I just want to give a shout out to this movie, let it ride, because David Johansson's also in that. I believe also as a cab driver. and Let It Rides like one of my other It's another like watch it with your dad movie

Like I feel like Scrooge does And it's about it's a horse racing comedy How dare you say it's gonna watch it with your dad? Scrooge is totally a watch it with your dad My Wants and Christmas Vacation All y'all's favorite Christmas movies I watch that with my dad every year But check out Let It's Starring Richard Dreyfus

It's got a crazy good cast I used to watch it all the time And he's also in that movie And I weirdly got to bring it up In an episode of Wizard of The Bruiser And I forget why now But it keeps coming up lately and it's like a hidden gym.

Ooh, okay. Let it ride, check it out. So let's talk about old Bobcat Goldthwaite as Elliot Loudermilk. Which is so good. It's a great name. And the fact that I have to say in the movie, he goes from being fired,

we were making jokes about this while watching it this year. He goes from being fired and kicked out and then immediately in one day, his whole life is over. He's just like, but at the same time... He looks like he's been wearing the same clothes for five weeks. Five weeks.

He's to a point of having a mental breakdown that usually it takes at least a couple of days to get to. It's also interesting that he is, I forgot how long, like, I think this is one of the late at last points that he was doing that character that you see in the movie. And it's such an anomaly because he created this character he started doing for stand-up. And then he just, they just cast him as that character. Like, that's not his natural voice or whatever, right? No. So he's just doing this character he made up. It's like the character is an actor performing parts in different.

movies because he's in police academy doing that character. He's in this now doing that character. So it's almost as if he created a character and that character is an actor in these films. And it's so bizarre to be. Yeah, he actually, he was a good friend of KB's. They worked together. So we met him multiple times and he's actually very like reserved and quiet.

Yes. And very sweet. So he started out as a stand-up comic at the age of 15 alongside Tom Kinney, voice of SpongeBob. And they were doing sketch comedy together and he developed this high. pitched maniac character that he was obsessed with Bigfoot originally. And they would go on stage and start screaming about Bigfoot. Which is why he probably made that the Bigfoot movie, which is delightful.

So he decides to take this character to different comedy clubs and perform as him. And he's doing this and he gets incredibly successful doing this crazy screaming nutback character. And after a while, he just got sick of doing it. He said, I started out making fun of comedy. Then I became the thing I was making fun of. So he had to turn his back on that character in the early 90s. It was probably one of the last times it was captured in film. And he even speaks about doing it.

He was like, one day I just walked out and I just didn't do the thing. And it was so terrifying to have to do that. And people all the time, even still, do the voice, do the voice. And he's just like, no, I'm done, not don't do that anymore. And yeah, now he's the quiet reserve. Phenomenal director, by the way. I love his directing. He's got such an interesting take on everything.

Oh, world's greatest dad still up. It is. Another shoot-em-up movie. Yeah, yeah. Which is kind of, yeah. So, oh my God, Carol Kane. She's so good. Oh, no, wait, red, white and, wait.

What was the one with the shooter? It's not World's Greatest Dad. That was, that was an... Well, don't give it away. I didn't know anything about World's Greatest Dad before I saw it. God bless America, right? God bless America, I think maybe it's called... Yeah, is the shooter one, which I loved, by the way.

Carol Kane, Ghost of Christmas Present. She made her professional theater debut at just 14 years old. She ends up performing in films like, Danny Hall, we mentioned the Princess Bride already, as well as the iconic role of Simca, the love interest of Andy Kaufman's Latka character on the TV show Taxi. I love Carol Kane

so much. And Adam's family values. Yes. Come on. So good. And Jackie, I believe it is time for you to regale us with a tale of... Well, how is Carol Kane offered the role? Richard Donner, the director. Jackie Gold, tell you.

Told Kane, how would Would you like to be Billy Burke when he called her up on the phone to offer her the role? Now, Burke played Glenda the Good Witch in the Wizard of Oz. I'm a little muddled. That is the direct quote from Glenda the Good Witch, which is the first line that Carol Kane comes in with from the Wizard of Oz when she meets Dorothy in Munchkinland. So that's, I didn't realize it like, so it is directly correlated to Glenda the Good Witch. That's funny.

So Kane had to be fairly physically abusive towards Bill Murray on set, and it actually affected her mentally. That's the only parts I play. She was affected by that. I do nothing else on camera. No, it's like both daughter and Murray said that Kane would often break down on the set and spend 20 minutes or so simply crying. She was very affected. She didn't like... I think that I'm disturbed. I mean, that would we, I think we all are definitely there for sure. And what's fun is that her dance was actually a choreographed dance that was very hard to perfect and she worked for a very long time in trying to perfect this dance. And she was, She worked with a ballet teacher, and when she walked in and showed it to Jay Michael Riva,

who was Scrooge's art director, and she put her whole heart into it, and immediately, she says, quote, and Dick Donner gave me a tremendous amount of support and freedom, and Jay Michael Riva, who designed the sets, he was the one that convinced Dick Donner that I shouldn't have a ballet double, that I should do my own ballet dance in the beginning. But then he came to watch me do it in rehearsal, and I thought I was doing such a good job, but it was bad. And it made him laugh so hard to see me trying to be so good. He said to Dick, we have to use her. She's doing it, which I thought was great because I thought I was doing pretty good. But no, it was because I was horrible and they thought it was funny. Well, you know what though? I actually, she, okay, so they do a tiny little

ballet dance at the beginning of her. And they were going to have a ballet double. And she's on point. I actually would have believed she had some ballet training because it's, she does a good job. It's a very brief thing that she does. Yeah. But it's not, what she does doesn't make me laugh. I've seen far worse people pretending to do ballet for sure. But she was really trying to do a good job too. I think she did a good job. And I'm very critical. I will be very mean to people who don't do ballet correctly.

And also, Carol Kane, which even though she was so, it makes sense of why she was crying so much, when she grabbed Bill Murray's lip, she did it with such force that she injured him. That did look painful. Bill Murray says there's a piece of skin that connects your lip with your gums and it was actually pulled away. I'm feeling it right now.

I know. I know. She said he said about it She really hurt me, but it was my idea to be physical, and it was her idea to just hit me as opposed to pulling the punches. So the entire set was shut down for four days. Oh, God.

And last but not least, because there's too many people to name in this movie. Karen Allen, we spoke about, she made her film debut in 1978 with Animal House, and her career really hit its stride when she played Harrison Ford's love interest in Raiders of the Lost Ark. This was her

returned to film as well. She went off to Broadway for a little bit. Alan said, I think both my character and the film are about love. The key to playing Claire, for me, is not to make her treakly sweet or too much like a goody two shoes. And that's why I was completely

fine with my man, like, making out with some chick right before he was like telling me he's all still in love with me a chick. I think she's a little bit of a goody two shoes. Yeah, wow. But I will say among all of the people in the cast, I did want to bring up Lee Majors and Robert Mitchum which apparently, now Robert Mitchum played Preston Rhinelander,

and Robert Mitchell, who was a old-time, old-school Hollywood actor from Cape Fear, United of the Hunter, and Lee Majors, was Lee Majors in the very beginning. And both of them were convinced to do the movie because Bill Murray was a part of it. In fact, Robert Mitchum, Richard Donner actually had Bill Murray come in and have a sit-down with Robert Mitchum, and by the time they were done having their conversation, Robert Mitchum was like, all right, I'm in. Richard Donner said about it, we didn't get a word in edgewise.

The minute you get around Bill, you're swooning. Everybody is. And it's a, it's, I honestly, I mean, I feel like as Vankman,

I do get it, but imagining him being that charming that he could convince anyone to just do what he wanted them to do is, um, terrifying. Oh yeah,

that's like what a, yeah, that's what sociopaths do for sure. Yeah. But, you know, They get a lot of stuff done. Yeah.

And when Lee Majors was called up, he said, in a Bill Murray movie, sure. He said, I didn't know it was going to open the movie. I just got this gun they gave me and the gun they gave me. I mean, it was so heavy. It was a lot stronger then, and I could barely hold it up. It was so heavy.

It was a real thing. Usually you think they'll give you a rubber one or a plastic one. Some kind of thing they've mocked up, but this was an actual gun. And it was also the actual gun that was used by Jesse Ventura's Blaine in Predator. We recently did Wizard of the Bruiser on The Predator. Oh, really? Just to give you a little more of a heads up on this gun,

Jazzy Ventura had a hell of a time trying to wield it. That is a gun that's normally mounted to like a tank. So both of them have to hold. That's great. That is not meant for a human being to just carry around and use. It is like only meant to be welded to something and a person's like, you know, like, yeah. I'm trying to picture right now. It's like a giant gatling gun.

It's like this massive tank gatling gun. It is ludicry. So it's so funny that he was complained about it because Jesuita have very similar issues. That's great. So also there were these like wild cool cameos from musicians and dancers throughout. You've got what, like Paul Schaefer. Miles Davis?

Oh yeah, that's right. Paul Schaefer's in it for a second. I have to go back and rewatch and look for Miles Davis. They're the, like as he's walking by with his younger brother, like they're the ones that like they look down upon because they're just like street performers, but they're actually all highly acclaimed musicians. Yeah. Yeah, it was session musician Larry Carlton, sax man, David Sandborn, jazz icon Miles Davis,

and David Letterman's old band leader buddy, Paul Schaefer. Yeah, that's wild. And also the dancer that he kisses in the end, from 1980 to 1988, there was a group of women that performed in risque costumes to the day's top hits on national television under the title of the Solid Gold Dancers. Now, when they're introduced in the movie, I didn't realize that they're a real thing. The solid gold music program was like soul train. It was very popular and still maintains a place in pop culture jokes today.

But after the show's cancellation in July of 88, however, the dances were disbanded. In fact, their final performance as a group was in Scrooge. Oh, really? I didn't know that. And they get a kiss from Bill Murray. And their ariolas are showing. Yeah, and then it's just like, and then he's just like, hey, I know I just kiss this full-grown woman on national television, but now baby, can we get back together? And she falls right into his own.

I'm just saying it's illogical. That's all I'm saying. So Scrooge. Scrooge, done. Made on a budget of $32 million, filmed over a period of three and a half months, which is actually a pretty tight schedule for a movie. But a pretty big budget for one as well,

especially around that time for a comedy. Donner and Murray clashing on set, as we mentioned before. Murray's improvising a ton of his lines. Donner is just making him play super broad. said he kept telling me to do things louder, louder, louder. I think he was deaf. And honestly, that note makes a lot of sense because you do get a lot of screaming Murray. And then Murray's doing a bit of a Pacino in this movie, I would say.

Well, even Bill Murray says about it, we shot a big, long, sloppy movie. So there's a great deal of material that didn't even end up in the film. It just didn't work. You tend to forget what was wrong. It's hard. I just figured that anyone who's good could step into this part and have a lot of fun with it. It's sort of a wicked character. The idea of making a funny Scrooge was an inspired touch.

That's what was appealing to me about it. So they just kept shooting, which I think why, even though it was a three-month-long shoot, everyone in it said that it seemed to go by lightning fast, and it's because they were all over the place. Murray described the experience as, quote, a fair amount of misery. He described the set as, quote, dusty, smelly and smoky. We mentioned before he felt very alone,

essentially with such a giant amount of people in this film, such a huge cast. He's getting to work with people for like two days at a time and then they go away and he's still there. And he felt very lonely. He also claimed to have coughed up blood due to the fake snow they were using. Yikes.

Yikes. Why would that make him cough up blood? I don't know. Maybe because of whatever was in the atmosphere or maybe it was just so dry, especially because I feel like there was a lot of fog. What is it, like a fog machine running? Yeah.

Which does really screw up your throat. But Richard Donner had this to say about the final scene of the movie. He said, on the last take, I saw something happened to Billy. He became an actor. It's just, I mean, that was a little much, but I did like right before Ian said that, that he had always had, he said, I always had my car parked facing the gate because he was ready. He said, when Bill Murray played off that last scene in the way he did, I felt confident and slightly insecure, but I felt confident that we had accomplished what we wanted

because he was joking as if like he was always ready to just run out of there. Yeah. Yeah. I wanted to find more on the special effects makeup because I think my favorite thing about this film in hindsight now besides Carol Kane, I think she might be like my favorite thing about the movie.

But that awesome ass makeup. Especially death when he opens the thing and the pulsing bodies. That also was terrifying as like that. Yes. Well, like I said, when death guy, I only ever watched the first two-thirds of that movie because of death. That and the forward, too, with the scrape them off, Claire. You're going to save somebody?

Save yourself. And then being in the coffin, too, is very frightening to me. It is still frightening. Existential? Existential dread. Follow me class. Existential dread. As much in kindergarten is existential dread.

I did want to bring them. up because I really, this blew my mind because I had no idea. Then apparently it's like, a Jackie, where have you been kind of thing? When Bill Murray is hallucinating that the waiters on fire in the restaurant scene, he runs up to him, he dumps a bucket of water on him. And then he says, I'm sorry, you know, I thought you were Richard Pryor. I didn't know what that meant, which apparently I am the dumb one. You know, because in 1980, I kind of, that was, I even knew this and that was kind of lost on me

in that moment. And after, so Richard. Richard Pryor had been free basing and he poured 151 proof rum all over his body and he lit himself on fire and he ran through his neighborhood. Pryor suffered second and third degree burns. The L.A. Times Review points out how cruel the line is because director Richard Donner worked with Pryor after the incident in the toy. While it's a mean joke, poking fun at the horrific incident wasn't uncommon in the 80s. Well, he also made fun of himself about it. That's a thing. I mean, he also had a whole bit about it, like making fun of it.

of himself, it's Bill Murray, and this was years before. I don't think Richard Pryor would care. Not at all. He would love it. No. Yeah, also, I think that right after that when he's leaving that scene, I think that fall he has in the water is real. It looks great. It is real. It was real, and that's why they

kept it in because it looked so good. It's very funny. So the special effects makeup was created by a married couple. Oh, my God. And I love marriage. Barry and Thomas Berman. They both got into the biz separately with Barry starting out on such films as I love this, the cult classic,

The Adventures of Buccaroo Bonsi across the Eighth Dimension. That's a movie I would love to find out about. And Thomas, having done Halloween 3 season of the witch, oh my God, I love it. Among others, it looks like, just based on what I could glean from IMDB, that maybe they met on a horror film called Cat People in 1982, and that after that they did Howard the Duck,

they did the Goonies. And these are some really good, really good ones, right? And they did those together before doing Scrooge. That's probably how they got in with Donner was through the Goonies. And most notably are the makeup jobs on the boss, Lou Hayward, as well as, of course, the tortured torso of the gross of Christmas future. Then we already mentioned that they lost two Beetlejuice for the Academy Awards. But speaking of Beetlejuice, the soundtrack, or at least the film score, was done by Danny Elfman.

and I was like, oh, I'll give a little overview of Danny Elfman. And then I'm like, that'll never happen because he's done over 100 feature film scores. Everyone knows Danny. Yeah, everyone knows Danny. It started out on Oingo, Boingo. But I forget until you look at his IMDB and everything, like, just how prolific of a career he's asked. It's insane. But also the soundtrack for Scrooge wasn't released until 2011, which makes so much sense because Ed was so excited.

Ed Larson of the Brighter Side because he had found a vinyl copy of the Scrooge soundtrack. But it didn't have the, la la la la la la la la la. All of the things that are quintessential Scrooge. And it's because the soundtrack wasn't released until 2011. So the album, when it was released, it was limited to just 3,000 copies, and it had all 34 of the tracks from the film. Very cool. Did you guys ever see The Forbidden Zone?

Yes. Boingo. Yeah. That's one of Danny Alphamins' first scores. So good. It's fucking weird. Also shows of why we love Scrooge so much. Yeah, don't watch that movie sober.

No. Be prepared that it's a little uncomfortable. Oh, yeah. But I do love, and I love this for a couple of reasons. Put a little love in your heart is a great song. And I also love that in the lyrics there's nothing about the holidays, and yet now it's synonymous with holidays because of Scrooge. That was originally recorded by Jackie DeShannon.

That's my name. Who composed it with her brother, Randy Myers. Back in 1968, it was a big hit for her. She also, her other big hit was what the world needs now is love. But this was not performed by her in Scrooge. She was done by, I didn't know this, Al Green of, of course, tired of being alone and all those other fame. And Annie Lennox, walking on broken glass ass, Annie Lennox.

So I thought that was fun. Yes, boy, no. All right, that's, now we're done with Music Corner. Music Corner's over. Good. What are we entering into now? Well, all I have left is just a little bit about its release and its criticism and it's called success. Oh, that we should talk at least a little bit.

We touched on this earlier. So just another little, a couple tidbits that I wanted to share about the movie. So three of Bill Murray's eight siblings are in the film. So John plays Frank's brother, James, Joel, who plays a guest at the party, and Brian Doyle Murray, who I just, he's in a million. thinks. He's amazing, who plays young Frank's disgruntled father. You're only four. You're only four. Which, again, I would also love to grab that piece of veal.

Now, Joel Murray said about the experience, yeah, that was a weird weekday one February. February 29th, in fact, where all four Murray brothers worked on the same picture. Brian was the father and a flashback. Johnny played a brother, and I'd auditioned for it and got the little part at the party, which I think is kind of funny because he still had to audition to be the almost unspeaking part at the party. And it was kind of funny because Johnny and I are doing a scene with our brother Bill, but none of us can acknowledge each other

because he's a ghost. So that was kind of weird. It was nice to get to work with Billy, but I can't see or hear him and he can see and hear me, but can't communicate with me. And well, yeah, it was just awkward, which I imagine was they were probably so excited to be in something with their now very famous brother, but they couldn't talk to each other in the scene,

so they couldn't even bounce off each other and use the sibling bounce off, which is, I imagine that would probably hurt me as well. But very endearing to know in the age that we know all facts about movies now to know that all of his brothers are in it. You're like, this is brother. That's cute.

And something that I actually didn't realize until last year is that I kept seeing the free South Africa posters. And it's in it, so Keith Herring's free South Africa posters is in it a couple of things. times. Herring was one of the 80s most famous artists and created the art to protest apartheid in South Africa, which was a cause-growing concern in America. Director Richard Donner included the artwork in his next film, Lethal Weapon 2, another film

that takes place at Christmas. So Richard Donner, it was a big thing that Richard Donner believed in, and so he wanted to be able to get the message across, and he used the medium that he could. And I thought that was really fucking cool. Guys, I'm going to go ahead and put this out there. I also think apartheid's bad. Yes. I mean, I saw 90-day fiancé.

It's like kind of okay, right? Yeah, you know, it just depends. It just depends on how you feel about it. And what I do love is that the last monologue, which we didn't get into too hard, but it was very upsetting because it was supposed to be very short. And Bill Murray kept talking. And while he kept talking, it goes so long.

I love it. I love it. But now. And he just sounds like he does sound like Bill Berry, the man is become on hinged. So Bill Murray was worried he wouldn't be able to pull it off, so he wound up improvising most of it. The final scene is Frank Cross going off on an impassioned rant about the holiday season, which verges on the hysterical. After the take, Michael O'Donohue, which we know is the writer, snarled, what the fuck was that? The Reverend Jim Jones hour? And then he punches Mitch

glazer in the arm really hard. He was so angry and then he just walks out and almost wouldn't come back on the set. He was so mad about it and so he at least hoped that it was going to be cut down in post and this is what we will get to in the reception and the criticism of it.

It was not. And that is part of the reason why Michael O'Donohue refers to Scrooge's final project as a piece of unadulterated unmitigated shit. I've seen that picture once and I'll never see it again.

Fuck you, dude. That's what he had to say about. Also, Roger Ebert had this to say, Jackie, about your favorite Christmas movie. It was one of the most disquieting, unsettling films to come along in quite some time. Fuck you, Roger. Yeah.

Saying that it portrays pain and anger more than comedy. And what I love is that so Bill Murray was so upset about Roger Ebert's one-star review of Scrooge. That's stupid. That he got an interview with him. And Bill Murray says, well, how do you plan to explain your one-star review of Scrooge? And Roger Ebert replies, I was hoping it wouldn't come up. Bill Murray says, it wasn't that bad.

It had some good stuff in it. Watch it on video and you'll see. And he says, it just didn't work for me. And then Bill Murray says, I thought maybe had some inside information, you know, about an unhappy set or something. And then Roger Eber said, no, it just didn't seem that funny. Fuck you. I mean, yes, that one star is bullshit. But also, you can't ask your critics that tell you, demand why they didn't like it.

No, he didn't like the movie. And he's the biggest critic. That's just how it is. So we talk about this like it's, uh, was some big disaster. But it was the highest earning film the weekend of its release over Thanksgiving in 1980. It made 60 million. Yeah. It beat out land before time.

It beat out Oliver and company. Fuck Oliver. Although they did. I hope he's still an orphan. They came out the week before. Well, then the parents died. That's a lot of dead parents. It's a lot of dead parents.

And, uh, those two cartoons. movies and yeah but yes over time it becomes a cult classic it's now staple for television not I love it I but I think what is very interesting so in an attempt to recapture the attention

of Ghostbussers fans the studio referenced the movie in Scrooge's marketing materials most notably with its tagline Bill Murray is back among the ghosts only this time it's three against one which fuck Jesus the tactic probably didn't get the

studio the exact results it was looking for. While Ghostbusters was the second highest grossing film of 1984, Scrooge made about a quarter of that, and it was only the 13th highest grossing film of 1988. So if they eventually changed the line to Frank Cross's line, now more than ever, it's time to remember the true meaning of Christmas. That's also not a good time. No, it's not. So can I throw this out as maybe a possible reason for why you do love it as much as you do and why it is indeed a fantastic Christmas movie Jackie. Because it's furkin ursum-sum. This is what Whitney and Pastorak.

I hurt that hurt me. That hurt me to say more than hurt you to hear. Because it's Asherm-Ur-Sim-Ursum-Sers. Let me try it. Because it's A-sha-sha-sha. No, you need more R in it. More R-Sum-sum-Sers. There it is.

Natalie? Oh, my God. Say, oh my God, I'm in the Adams family. Oh my god. I'm in the herbs, Firmiegge. Oh, it's Smegma. What are you doing in here?

No, no, you go there's Shaggaly. Yeah. Maybe that's smegba. Smegma. Whitney Pasturek. I'm doing the entertainment. Whitney Pasture of Entertainment Weekly had this to say it. I think that's maybe just say true or false at the end if this is what I think is why you love it so much.

Scrooge is the perfect holiday movie for the bitter, reluctant closet Christmas lovers. Ouch. False. What? Actually I think that's perfect. I think it is true. Because I think as much, you know, in a lot of ways, Jackie's like, you know, the Zabrowski siblings are very much like...

False of Zabrowski. Are like, fuck Christmas in a lot of ways. But I think deep down they truly do love the holiday. And this is the kind of movie that makes it palatable. I didn't know it was deep down a secret that you liked Christmas. I mean, I wrestle. I wrestle with it.

They wrestle with it. Yeah, well, okay, I would say, okay, I would agree that I'm also somebody who wrestles with it. Right. I like certain aspects of Christmas. Also, very traumatized by Christmas in many ways. So, okay, all right, all right, fine. That's like in between true and false. Right.

Yeah, so that's why. It's a trals. It was another, another criticism. Oh, my God, you got you like my quote? I like, another criticism or another review I read it said, the film initially drew criticism for its bitter and sardonic interpretation of a genre, which usually demonstrated nothing. less than total earnestness and wholehearted joy.

In many ways, Scrooge is a Christmas film for people who hate Christmas films. And that is another, it's like, you're right. And so if you haven't seen Scroogeed, please give it a watch. I really think, I mean, I hope that you like it. And I understand if you don't, I guess. But I don't. I don't understand. I think even if you don't like it, it's still a fascinating watch, if that makes sense.

Like, you're still going to have a good time. It's a time capsule. You're not going to be bored. I love this movie so much. I don't grasp not like people not liking it I don't I get it I get it it but it is it is a little rushed and I do think a lot of the criticism say it says that it's a rush towards the end but it's because they had filmed so much and that they were going up against like the directors of the writers the studio guys are pushing me into a corner pushing me in a corner

you know what happens you start to kick yeah ow ow ow ow oh oh oh oh you can hardly see the nipples oh um was that good acting No, don't. It's a bad movie. You're my sister. Also, Jack McGee, adlib that line. You can hardly see that. I don't want any more.

I don't need any more screens back. That was my fact. That was my last fact. That was an adle. See, all the best catch lines of movies are always adlibs. That also, too, where I remember my mom used to joke around about stapling things to the guinea pig because of the movie. Because when he's trying to put the antlers on the mouse and he's like, I don't know, staple them all. And then, oh, Karen Allen, you're better than him.

You can't. Oh, she definitely was better than him. Yeah. So much better. That was all we got as women in the 80s. Right. That's all we got is women in the 80s. That's all we got.

But you know what? I do want to, I remember that is where I heard about, this movie is where I heard about, now I can't think of it. The fuck positions. Harry Carrey. Carrey. Harry Carrey.

It would be a very exciting sex position. That's where I heard about Kama Sutra for the first time. And also, how great is that now is an adult looking at that, man, that Christmas Eve where you guys, you're in a bath surrounded by candles, smoking a joint, and then you get out, you give a dumb little presents, and then you fuck for the rest of the night. Merry fucking Christmas.

I mean, that is the one you can never beat. Yeah, the one for all the stupid kids show up. That is the thing. Oh, Lumpy. I think Lumpy is still very cute. Wow, here, people call him Mr. Cross. Oh, you're scary. We packed her into a quarter.

Oh, oh. This was great. I love this Christmas movie. Fantastic. And I hope that you guys enjoy your holiday week this week. And watch Scrooge. Let us know what you think about it. And if you love it as much as we love it,

and if you agree with us that it is all of us, all three of us and our stance here at page seven that it is the best Christmas movie of all time. And yeah, and it is a little, if you have kids, you might want to watch it before you show the kids because there's some stuff in it. Oh, yeah. Don't show kids at all of the movie ever.

But at the same time, I watched it as a job. Let them sneak it. Let them find it. But my parents didn't like monitor me at all. No, I wasn't monitored either. We were fine. Yeah, we were scared. We were fine. Well, because I don't have a sign-off catchphrase. I'll just say screescraw. I'm holding. Scree-Skraw. Oh, that's cute. Yeah.

Natalie? I'm smeggall there. You realize you have to do this for the rest every sign-off now. Every single time. And I'm Jackie's Brassie. I hope you guys have a great holiday. We love you and we'll talk to you soon. May, bye. Bye, steebles.

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