Page 7 - Pop History: Young Frankenstein

Episode Date: May 19, 2020

It's a WizBru-Pop History double feature! We explore the making of Mel Brooks' "Young Frankenstein" Subscribe to SiriusXM Podcasts+ to listen to new episodes of Page 7 ad-free.Start a free trial now on Apple Podcasts or by visiting siriusxm.com/podcastsplus. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Fashion sets. Oh my God, guys. What a pleasure to do. Put the candle back. It is just one of the most quotable movies. I am sure I think that all three of us grew up with this movie in our repertoire. I didn't actually. Other Mel Brooks movies were by far more prevalent, including spaceballs,

which this other podcast did, I guess. Yeah, yeah. Another wonderful podcast. Brother sister podcast episodes this week, Young Frankenstein and Spaceballs, super fun week. And there's so much other Mel Brooks I want to cover in the future

and we will do that. So if you're worried about, oh, skimping, I don't know, say, pass the entire life of Mel Brooks or not talking about men in tights or getting into blazing saddles. I mean, these are things we will eventually get to because I think this entire network

has such a major affinity for Mel Brooks. How do you not? Such a hard on for him. You know what? Still an eloquent, amazing man. Every time I see clips of Mel Brooks, I just, man, do I want to put him in my pocket? Definitely.

I want to carry him around with me. I say, make him, make me laugh. He's a very old man, but he's still sharp, sharp-witted. Oh, yeah, no, I'd jump on it if I could. You know what? I'm saying it right now. So I think for this movie thinking about with my childhood,

I actually remember like I have weird sense memory of being on the couch in my home I grew up in watching this film for the first time and absolutely loving it because it really did a great job of mixing together the classic monster film with the great humor and performance of Mel Brooks and Gene Wilder. And I think for me it's like this was my favorite Mel Brooks movie as a young kid. And then that would later be probably become space balls. And into older age, it becomes more like blazing saddles because of, I think, the cultural importance and things like that and just how risky that movie was in so many ways. And the accolades that Mel Brooks got as a comedic writer and

director. It, there, that is something that really doesn't exist very often because unfortunately, a lot of the entertainment world, I feel like between that and horror, it is finally starting to come more to light of getting the accolades that it deserves because it is another art form. It's difficult to do. It's hard. It's hard being a funny. Ouch, ouch, ouch, outch, out, out, out.

She's in pain. She's on the coals of humor. The coals of humor. I remember when men in tights came out, I was old enough to, I was probably like, I don't know, 10 when I came out. And it was a thing that all of my friends

and I were so excited about. It was like Comedy Central specials about the making of it. And like we went to the theater and saw that movie. It was like a big ass deal to us in the 90s. I saw in the theater with my dad. And, you know, I watched a lot of these, you know, Mel Brooks makes a lot of movies that you see with your dad. This is one of the only movies.

This an airplane were the only movies we would watch with our father. Young Frankenstein had an airplane. Absolutely a bonding thing with my dad. And that was definitely true for Young Frankenstein as well. And I think for me at the time, I wasn't a big horror person growing up, but the classic monsters were definitely always a fascination for me growing up. You know, UFOs, all these sorts of things are really fun as a kid. But they're safe enough that you're not going to, it's not going to like,

you're not going to lose sleep over it probably. No, and also the jokes are usually a little too raunchy and in the gutter for, because now especially, man, you watch this as a kid, I didn't get half of this movie. No, definitely. Yeah. Totally. I think that's why Mel Brooks works for kids and their parents is because it's very stupid humor, but also smart humor on a different level. Yes.

I mean, the whole ending line with like, well, he got your brain. What did you get from him? And then the whole singing the song again, oh, sweet mystery of life I found you. And I'm trying to remember. I was like, I don't think I got this at all this. I don't think I did either. The other funny thing is much like Spaceballs growing up, because I was talking about on that episode,

how I saw that film, I think probably well before I saw a Star Wars movie or Alien or any of those movies. Like Mike Lawrence says, who used to be on our network, our friend Mike Lawrence, he says that he always just calls Star Wars unfunny space balls because the space balls was the thing in our childhood.

This was definitely the first Frankenstein movie I had ever seen. And that's the thing. And I think here as well, it was, it was, I wasn't even realizing so much of what was being parodied and what was being given a send up because this probably was my first like full on monster movie. And so it both was a thrilling film in terms of the secret passages and the, and the mad scientist element and the monster stuff that was actually in a way taken almost half seriously for me while then also having these great laughs throughout.

And it just combines that so well. And I mean, Mel Brooks talks about how this movie won out in terms of the more highly regarded films he's made a lot in a lot of ways because it does have an emotional core. Because Gene Wilder is a character that is both someone you can in a way relate to or at least go on the ride with emotionally. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And that is really fascinating and fun to see his character arc and everything. You know, playing it super dead serious. I mean, Wilder, and I didn't even realize, by the way, that Gene Wilder,

and Mel Brooks co-wrote this film and we'll talk about that obviously. Which is awesome. And also I feel like in watching it where before it's time where they had these cutouts of prototypes of what female characters were at this time. And yet they were the ones

that held the power of every scene. Like these are such strong. Oh yes. Walking women that Mel Brooks and Gene Wilder showed that yes, you can write a quote unquote bimbo character that also is weirdly in charge of everything. You can write these strong characters for women

and have them lead this entire movie, even though technically it's quote unquote not about them. Yeah, and they really, using that bimbo caricature are actually embracing the power of that in this, which is so fun. It's not like they're just being dumb-dums. They're being clever dumb-dums. They're in charge of the stupidity.

They're in charge of the stupidity. Yes. And it definitely shows. And for sure, absolutely. So I just love the mixture of what this is. This is a film I've gone back and rewatched and rewatched so many times. And it's just such a great film. I mean, you know, again, I had the puzzle going.

I threw on the movie yesterday in the middle of the afternoon. And it was just like I felt like I was on vacation. Like, and that's the way that movie makes me feel. And that's the way you got to do it because you know what? I had a dream last night. I was on vacation. in Florida. And then you woke up in hell.

Oh, no, that's a different. It was just the most mundane, normal movie dream of just got on a plane, went to a beach and a hotel, and it was nice. So you guys remember all we used to smile? That's not why we smile when we watch the screen. You put on the movie and you smile. I had an awesome dream last night about going to roam with Taylor Swift. Oh, God.

And I woke up so sad. We literally, right before I woke up, I said to Roma, and she went to Roma. And we were like on the boat or something going to Rome. And so excited about to be going on vacation with her and all her friends. Man, taking a boat from New York, though, that's going to be a long, I mean, have you seen Titanic? Don't do it, man.

I love that there was a child's version. Like, it's not even like you're having a sexy dream about Taylor's. No, you're just like, you guys are just hanging out. We were just friends. I was so excited to get to just hang out with her on this fun vacation in a completely platonic way. It was like amazing. And I would do the same thing with any single person that is

in this movie. If they had called me up, posthumously, they call me on the phone and say, Jackie, let's go on an adventure. I'd say, okay. Where do I have to be? Jackie, my skeleton would like to visit you. Is it Peter Boyle's skeleton?

Sure. Because he would take a lot longer to really fall apart. So you know what? I'm going to tape him back together. He's going to be my own little Jackenstein monster and we're going on a goddamn vacation. Jockenstein. I love Peter Boyle. Oh my God.

So I will say that when I first saw this movie, I definitely was so obsessed with it. Also because at the same point in time, I was obsessed with Beauty and the Beast. And so a little bit like Mike Lawrence, I was like, oh, it's a lot like that except it's in black and white instead, even though there's no similarities, but that's around the time that I would watch Young Frankenstein and I would also. also watch Beauty in the Beast. Black and White Beauty in the Beast. Yeah.

And I do have a memory, too, of going into the film as a kid being like, this isn't black and white. And then very quickly not having a problem with that on any level because of how entertained I was. I always thought it was a really old movie. And we will get into why Mel Brooks not only wanted it in black and white, but made sure that it was in black and white. And that is, it's so cool because I really thought it was, I don't know, especially when you're a kid.

You're like, that must be from a hundred years ago. Is this from the middle age? Yes, was this written on stone? Yeah, and also, I think it really, they sold it as far as the scenery. Just rewatching it now, I was like, I could buy that they were out in the countryside on this. But it was a lot in Hollywood, the whole movie. I mean, it was all built. With all the original set and scenery from one of the OG Frankenstein productions.

Let's get into it. the reason largely why it's black and white is of course because of the universal classic monsters, which is the name given to the horror fantasy, thriller and science fiction films made by universal pictures from the 1920s to the 1950s. And I'd never thought about it like

this before, but it is the first shared universe in the movie industry around the world. This is the precursor to the Marvel Cinematic Universe, to the Star Wars. Well, yeah, because they would all get together. That's why the universal monsters are such a huge part, which I never understood really why horror wasn't getting the accolades

that it really truly deserved, because this is groundbreaking. Yeah, but this was also the superhero movie of Yore, and they don't get a lot of, you know, besides effects awards, they don't get a lot of recognition either. The first film can be traced back to the Phantom of the Opera, which was a silent film starring Lon Cheney. He also started it. He also started in the hunchback of Notre Dame. a couple years before that.

I feel like that also kicked it off. After this came, the talkie, this is how far back we're talking, that the first one was the silent film. The first talkie in the universal classic monster universe was Dracula, starring Bella Lagosie, who of course would become synonymous with the role, followed by Frankenstein starring Boris Karloff.

And the latter was based on the novel by Mary Shelley of the same name about a young scientist who creates a monster out of parts of the dead. Now this led to such sequels as bride of Frankenstein, son of Frankenstein, the ghost of Frankenstein, Frankenstein meets the wolfman, house of Frankenstein, and Abbott and Costello meet Frankenstein. There's a good amount of friends. But also, you know what?

Check out Monster Squad. We're going to jump ahead because Monster Squad. So talk about what, let's, I'm putting a pin in it. We're doing Monster Squad at some point. I'm afraid there won't be enough to cover on it, but I'm willing to go that road with you. We could do like kids Halloween movies. I love it. Let's do it.

I want to do an episode on just the part in the Wolfman's got Nads part though. All right. We can do it. We can do an hour and a half on it. I'm, I think that would be fantastic. I'm going to chalk that up right up there with the idea to just do an episode on the guy that dances in Mighty Boston. You don't understand. I bet his life is very full.

How dare you? I bet we could get him on the horn. We should get an interview with that guy. Anywho, let's now talk. talk about Mel Brooks. Melvin Kaminsky, born and raised in Brooklyn, has three younger brothers. The father died of kidney disease when he was just two years old, which he attributes a lot to both in anger at God and for the world, but also a lot of the comedy being based in that anger and hostility. It's like you need some trigger in order to become a super funny person,

and it usually dwells in tragedy. When Brooks was just five years old in 1931, he watches Boris Karloff in Frankenstein, which scared. him so badly, he asked his mother if he could sleep with the window by the fire escape clothes because he was afraid the monster would get him and eat him. I love this quote from his mother. His mother responded

because he was so scary. He said the monster lives in Romania. Romania is not near the ocean. He's going to have to go a long way to get a boat. Then he has to have money to pay for his passage. He may not have any money if he's just a monster.

He may not have pockets. Let's Let's say, let's say he gets a boat to America, right? The boat may go to Miami. But if it goes to New York and he gets off, he doesn't know the subway system. Let's say he gets to Brooklyn. He doesn't know our street. Let's say he does find our street. The people on the first floor have their window open.

If he's hungry, he's going to eat whoever's on the first floor. Which I love this. It makes me immediately think of all. I mean, that's why I think I've said this before on this show of why I slept with socks. on until I was about 10 years old because the opposite of that, Henry told me if I didn't sleep with socks on, that gnomes were going to come in through the window that live inside of the tree that was out of my childhood bedroom window and drag me into the tree and bring me underground I'd never get back out. So I wore socks as I slept until I was about 10 years old.

So that's another fun story of abuse that your brother wrought on you as a child. Oh my god, no wonder I'm funny. Also he, Mel Brooks, that is, had the comedian creating trait of being very sickly as a child which led to bullying but he does go see a Broadway show at the age of nine and declares he's going to be in show business. And he does it. At the age of 14 he learned how to play the drums which

would cause him to change his name to Mel Brooks because there was another Max Kaminsky he at the time was Mel Kamensky. And another comedian making trade, artist making trade, he's drafted into the army in 1944. He went on to diffuse landmines to oppose

the Nazi forces. He's just like, Hawkeye was Hawkeye was in that one and then when they sent him in with the bombs remember that one with the bomb bomb men Hawkeye Jeremy Renner

Are you talking about G.I. Joe When he sent it you had to go diffuse the bombs I I'm blank blank face currently but it's a very scary job to have to be the one to diffuse the lame

I imagine I would just presume that would be a scary job to have absolutely And after the war, which was very scary. Very spooky. He ends up working in the cat skills. At first, is a drummer and pianist, except for one night when the comedian called out

and he started doing stand-up to replace him and worked his way up the ranks, becoming the tumbler. Now, the tumbler, Jake goes into this in great detail because it's such a, like, a culturally relevant thing for him. But the tumbler was a big deal. You're like the guy that's charming, whole establishment all night,

you're front and center. It's this incredibly, was this incredibly coveted. I mean, it's an MC, but it's like a master's super duper MC that was really a hard spot to get. And that is really where he starts owning his comedy, which leads to his friend Sid Caesar, hiring him to write jokes for a TV show in 1949, which led to work on your show of shows, a variety comedy series. This probably is the oldest sketch comedy series that inspired folks like myself and

Henry and people as we were first starting sketch comedy. I don't think I could trace back an inspiration to an earlier show. And it's really fun to go back and watch your show of shows. Also, don't forget this time period. He was the original Mel B from the Spice Girls. Oh, I mean, that's where the platform shoes came in. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because he was shorter.

He was Shorter Spice. He started a music group called The Salty Men. They went around. He, of course, performed as Mel B. Yeah, they put a salt lick around their balls. just around their balls. It was very, very uncomfortable for them. It did not go over well.

Instead of sporty spice, he was snorty spice because he had a bit of a flim issue. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Not because of drugs. Not cocaine. Absolutely not. No, no. But the one who replaced him, the new snorty spice when he went on to make movies, that guy had a big ass cocaine problem.

Yeah. So with Carl Reiner, by the way, who we worked with on your show of shows, they came up with classic two men routines, most especially the 2000-year-old man bit, and that gets him much more exposure throughout the world. They even release a comedy album to great success, and this leads him to the film world because he has a crazy idea about a musical comedy

based on Adolf Hitler that would eventually be called the producers in 1997. 1960s, yep. However, it is blazing saddles that cemented his career in film, and that is what he is making all. the way up to and even during kind of young Frankenstein. So I'll leave Mel Brooks right there for a second and move on to Gene Wilder, who is such, it just has such an important, to me it was always, oh, Gene Wilder stars in Mel Brooks's

Young Frankenstein, but it's like, no, no, no, Gene's jeans are flowing all through the backbone of this film. Well, it's his baby, young Frankenstein. That's why I was so excited to do this episode. When you look and see that not only the star and the writer and also the director of a movie that Young Frankenstein, the Mel Brooks and Gene Wilder have both said that this was their favorite movie to create, to work on, still to this day, I think that that is very important. Because think of how many projects you work on that by the time it's over, you're like, I'd rather never talk about it ever again. And this is not that for them. I've never had that happen.

No, no, no. I mean, everything I work on is perfect. but, you know, I've heard other people have that problem. Yeah, me too. Sad for them. So Jerome Silberman is his name at birth. Also had a completely different name. And in 1933 is when he's born in Milwaukee.

And it's a doctor who had actually could be attributed to his comedic abilities because his mother is diagnosed with rheumatic fever and suffered from a heart attack. And the doctor told him, don't argue with your mother. It might kill her. just try and make her laugh. So literally Gene Wilder thought that his... This does sound like something my mother told to me as a kid, but she had nothing wrong with her.

Yeah, did she even have a heart attack or is this something she just said happened to her? I mean, if you want to create a funny person, make him feel like his comedy is a matter of life and death. Yep. It's so crazy. So he would do these different accents and stuff to make her laugh. he would do scenes for her. And she, I mean, it said it was like, she was like wet her pants from laughing so hard

because he was just killing. He said, yeah, it was the first time I ever tried consciously to make someone else laugh. And when I was successful, after peeing in her pants, she'd say, oh, Jerry, now look what you've made me do. And he said that a lot of his confidence came from being able to do this because he said, when your mother gives you confidence about anything that you do, you carry that confidence with you. She made me believe that I could make someone laugh.

It's also really tragic to read about it. And I just want to say this, by the way, we're actually trying to briefly go through his life because we do want to do a future episode on Gene Wilder at some point. So I'm trying to brush past some things. But I do have to say how tragic it was to read that for the longest time, because he was around his mother's suffering so much with her health issues, he literally felt guilty whenever he felt happiness.

And that is so sad to hear. mixed with the terror that he would kill his mother if he didn't always make her laugh and smile is just very, very morbid and sad and I think fed into all of his later work. He's a sad, intense dude. Yeah, he's, I mean, there is a sadness to so many of the roles he plays. Right, but he probably is. But he's so funny, man. And it is something that he goes on to say too later on, which I know that we'll get to,

but it's like he wanted to act, but he never wanted necessarily to be. in comedy. He said I'd make choices, but I try to just make it real. Actually, the more real you are in a comedy, the funnier the comedy is. So that's what I devoted my career to. We, you know, was the Ruzid an episode on Leslie Nielsen and we talk all about how, you know, every time he played it straight, it was, and a dude, you know, not to call out. Dude, that creep show, the part and creep show. It is the scariest part of creep show. I know we're not talking about this, but I just, you just rewatched all the naked guns. And he's so, good in those moves so good and it's all because he's deadpan you know and it reminds me of in college we would do these

improv shows at like the murder fist group and the the best game i guess you could call it that we played by far was called serious scene and it was literally just us trying to legitimately improvise a very serious scene and it would always be the funniest thing of the night by far it's because it's fun to do that It's just committing is so much better than just being like a goofball when it comes to that kind of stuff. And if you look at Gene Wilder's characters too, all of them are, none of them are like, blah, blah, he's never done that. They all have an emotional core and everything. And that's because he pursued acting very seriously from a very young age. At the age of 11, he sees his older sister perform on stage and wanted for himself again, very sad this quote.

He wanted the chance to be someone else. and so he asked her teacher if he could study under him as well. The teacher responded, come back to me when you're 13, which he did and studied under him for two years. And he also ends up going off to military boarding school in L.A. where he gets super bullied and sexually assaulted, adding even more tragedy to his childhood story.

Man, reading through all that stuff, I don't well on it, but it was rough. He had a very rough time in boarding school. Yeah, we'll get more into it when we focus more on an episode on Gene Wilder. But it is just to say he was the only Jewish kid at this school. He was mercilessly bullied. And his father ignored it because he didn't want to upset his mother until he came home, covered in bruises. And then he never had to go back.

So his aunt also, by the way, this other crazy thing. You guys are just like trickling in these incredibly interesting facts and being like, we're not going to talk about this. Well, because that's why we're supposed to be a mini. It's a mini bio. I want to know about this. We have to talk about the movie. We have to talk about the funny parts. we will eventually do a full on gene.

Yeah, we have to now. Because listen to this factoid. His aunt was a theosophist, which was a religious cult established by a Russian immigrant named Helena Blavatsky that seemed completely badshin crazy from the sounds of it.

And his aunt introduced Gene Wilder to other members of this cult who convinced him that he was an angel receiving messages from God, which led him to have their teens of session. Which we don't know that he's not. Yeah, we don't know. We don't know that he's not.

But he ended up having this like a crazy obsession with praying at the age of 17. Are you saying that fucked him up? Yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no. It gave him wings. It was just like red bull for him. He referred to this uncontrollable urge to pray

for hours on end, many times in public as the demon. And he would be talking out loud, pranged on buses and parks. And he would later self-diagnosed this as a form of OCD, of course, and just sounded like a nightmare. Also, this led to him avoiding sex for, very long time. He finally purchased a condom at the age of 23 a month after his mother died and lost his virginity a month later. Wow, there's a lot to unpack here. There's a lot going on there.

And I mean, we... Also, what I think is kind of fun is that when he ended up changing his name, this is how much that he had to unpack that he wasn't even dealing with, that he changed his name to Jerry Silberman, or he changed from Jerry Silverman to Gene Wilder. And when he was in therapy, he was like, I was telling my analyst and she said, by the way, what was your mother's name again? dot dot dot dot dot and I said jean jean j and I had never thought about that it's like oh mommy mommy problems I think things start going a bit better for him

once he hits college he goes to the University of Iowa gets a degree in communication in theater arts and then to Bristol Old Vic Theater School in England And the old Vic is I saw, I believe I saw a play at the old Vic. It's like an incredible theater program for actors. And it is no surprise that he was able to get in there. Then he goes to drama school at the HB Studio. And the HB Studio is actually going to be a focal point for many of the players involved in this situation.

I think a lot of people met here, a lot of actors. He went to study the Stanislavski method of acting. and it is in NYC that he meets his first wife actress Mary Mercier. Their marriage lasts five years. Two years later, he marries the second wife. Mary Joan Shuts two years later adopting her seven-year-old daughter. That lasts for seven years. That's before the Gilda marriage.

Just for the people who enjoyed the Gilda part, I just wanted to give that as a little bit of background. And then Gilda was the third, I believe, wife was his. And then he ends up having a fourth wife that I think they grew into old age together. essentially. In 1956, he's drafted to the Army and assigned to the Medical Corps. He's posted as a paramedic in the Department of Psychiatry and Neurology at Valley Forge Army Hospital in Pennsylvania, which I think maybe gave him a decent background on mental illness and things that actually would play in to young Frankenstein. And I cannot believe his mother dies of ovarian cancer as well in 1957.

Which is part of the reason why let's, yeah, let's, yeah, I mean, you know. That's why you start, Gildes Club, we'll get into that in the episode about him. But more importantly, for this episode, at the HB. Studio, he's studying under Lee Strasbourg. He, that was a different studio, he's studying under Uda Hogan. These are major acting teachers. Uda Hogan's book on acting is probably my favorite book on acting I've ever read. Oh, yeah. It's incredible.

So it was really cool to see that he did that. and yeah he changes his name to Wilder was the last name of a character in the play Our Town. Gene came from the character Eugene Grant from the book Look Homeward Angel, which is my parents' favorite book. And yeah, and then his early career consisted of off-Broadway plays, including the part of Billy Bibbitt, opposite Kirk Douglas in One Floor of the Cuckoo's Nest. And this was around the time that he was in Mother Courage and her children by Brecht. And it's said to be one of the greatest anti-war plays of all time. Now, he truly believes that he was miscast in this production. Now, I remember I did a big study on this show.

It is a very intense, although it comes off as a kind of a comedy, but it's not really supposed to be. And he was in this production with Anne Bancroft, whose boyfriend at the time was Mel Brooks. And Gene Wilder had said, and that made my, well, I can't say it made my day. it made my life in a way. Mel Brooks had said that Gene Wilder played the chaplain in the play. He kept saying, this is Mel Brooks talking about Gene Wilder, he kept saying, why are they laughing?

Because the chaplain is a great part. It's sad and funny, it's touching, and it can be amusing. So he said, they're always laughing at me. Why are they laughing at me? And I said, look in the mirror, blame it on God. Which is great. So they met backstage in Ann Bancroft's dressing room. and apparently Mel Brooks was wearing one of those pea coats

that were made famous by the merchant marines and Jean admired it and he said you know they used to call this a urine jacket but it didn't sell and because it's a pea coat it's a pee coat I laughed I laughed and he laughed and after we saw each other several times

he said Mel Brooks said would you like to come to Fire Island and spend the weekend with Anne and me I'd like to read the first 30 pages of this I'd like you to read the first 30 pages of this movie I'm writing called Springtime for Hitler. Nobody ever asked me to go to their island and re-script. I mean, we have to start hanging out with more people that have islands. Yeah, that's a problem.

I said, I'd like that very much. And I went there one June weekend, and he read me the first 30 pages of what was later called the producers. This kind, I do want to get into the producers at some point, because especially with the resurgence, they turned it into the musical as well. If there's one thing, Mel Brooks. Which would lead to the Young Frankenstein musical.

happening as well. It makes so Mel Brooks is so good at it. The fact that he can fluidly bring a movie from the screen onto the Broadway stage and do whatever he wants. And also is writing all of this music, writing all of these. Like he could do

absolutely anything. I will say too though I forgot until I watched the movie how inherent music is to the film, not just putting on the ritz. You also have the violin whole element. There's so many different little music things. All the classical, yeah, classical music, which is also a touch upon the actual Frankenstein.

And same with, but also same with blazing saddles. Totally. There is like a light, like he was so good at fusing the musical and the comedy aspect, but not making it just a musical. Yeah. Which that's not really different. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

We're men in tites. We're men in tight. Tites. So at that point in time, Mel Brooks had said, I love you, but Zero Mostel doesn't know you. and he is the right of approval of whoever's going to play Leo Bloom. So come to the office and you'll do a reading with him. So Gene Wilder goes to the office on Thursday or Friday morning. He knocks on the door and Mel Brooks opens it and I saw Zero Mostel in the background.

He said, come in, come in, Gene, this is Z, Z, this is Gene. And I put out my hand to shake hands with him. And he took my hand and he pulled me up to his face and he gave me a kiss on the lips. And all my nervouses went out the window. I think he must have done it on purpose because he understood actors and how I would naturally be a little nervous doing this. and I gave a very good reading and I got the part. I was a very shy person in those days

and working with Zero Mostel who was bigger than life helped me grow. So this is really the beginning of the relationship between Mel Brooks and Gene Wilder. And so this, you know, leads to other movies, leads to other producers

that we got Blazing Saddles and while they are shooting Blazing Saddles. But I will say Blazing Saddles, he wasn't just a shoe-in for that role. He actually was a last-minute replacement because he who was the original acting, the original actor, I forget his name, I didn't write it down.

The first day of shooting, he just collapsed because he was going through alcohol withdrawal. And so they brought him Wilder super last minute, but still it is during the filming of Blazing Saddles that the beginnings of young Frankenstein happened. And so when he first started, and just getting the idea before he even started writing it, when asked about why Frankenstein?

He said, at the time, I didn't know why. But I know now that when I was a little boy, I was scared to death of the Frankenstein films. And in all these years later, I wanted it to come out with a happy ending. And I think it was my fear of the Frankenstein movies when I was eight and nine and ten years old that made me want to rewrite that story. And so he's toying with this for a while. He had tried his hand at writing screenplays early on in his career. Nothing really stuck. And he, I think, felt like he needed a co-writer to really put all of his ideas in place.

And so while he is doing blazing saddles, he starts toying with this idea. And he ends up calling up Mel Brooks about it, who told him it seemed like a cute idea. But that was it. And it takes a little bit of courting Brooks to get involved in the film. Meanwhile, Gene Wilder's agent, a guy named Mark Metavoy, he went to Wilder to try to get him to work with his newest clients, Peter Boyle and Marty Feldman. And about that, Gene Wilder said, well, that's a wonderful artistic. reason to make a movie. He said he sent them the scene of Frankenstein's grandson meeting a servant named Igor at

Transylvania Station. The agent liked it and said Mel Brooks would be the perfect director. Wilder said Brooks might not go for it. But the agent had contacted him anyway. So this is also what is fun is that that scene was the first thing that was written for the movie and it didn't change. Isn't that? What movie is like that?

What show is like that? I didn't know much about Marty Feldman, and so it was interesting to learn about him. Yes. Because I knew that his face wasn't makeup, but I never really thought about the fact that his face actually, his eyes really are like that. He's an interesting looking person. He's an interesting looking person. But I love how he embraces it. I've got some good stuff on that.

Oh, my God. Yeah, I guess, yeah, we'll talk about it. We'll talk about when we get to the cast. But, yeah, it is, he is, that was one of the joys of doing this episode, was learning more about him because he's got a fascinating. career for sure and died while filming a death scene so that's interesting oh i didn't know that yes he did very young because apparently as belbrooks put it he smoked like five packs of cigarettes a day and only ate like eggs man he must have smelled great i probably smelled like my grandpa because he also said that he drank like a pot of black coffee a day and smoked five packs of cigarettes a day which is what my

grandfather did hell yeah so medavoy finally pushes Wilder back to Mel Brooks as he was now in Blazing Saddles. And Wilder again walks up to Mel Brooks on set about the movie. Brooks says, by the way, everything you hear from Mel Brooks, every quote for Mel Brooks that is like a fun story, plenty of this could be embellished. He spends a great yarn, but like it's always like half true or at least slightly exaggerated.

The lot of the biggest people, like the biggest personalities we've talked about on the show, half of their stories are probably fake. B-S, but that's because it makes the myth so much more fun. We're telling their myth story. Yeah, which is way more fun to tell. Brooks said, I was in the middle of shooting the last few scenes of Blazing Saddles, somewhere in the Antelope Valley, and Gene Wilder and I were having a cup of coffee, and he said, I have this idea that there could be another Frankenstein.

I said, not another, we've had the son of, the cousin of, the brother-in-law. We don't need another Frankenstein. His idea was very simple. What if the grandson of Dr. Frankenstein wanted nothing to do with the family whatsoever? he was ashamed of those wackos. I said, that's funny. That's funny. Oh, you know what?

That's funny. So as Mel Brooks put it, little by little, every night, Jean and I met at his bungalow at the Bel Air Hotel. We ordered a pot of Earl Grey tea coupled with a container of cream and a small kettle of brown sugar cubes. To go with it, we had a pack of British digestive biscuits. And step by side, I love how he lays out every detail of the food thing. And step by step, ever so cautiously, we proceeded on a dark, narrow twist.

to the eventual screenplay in which good sense and caution are thrown out of the window and madness ensues. It really reminds me of the origin story of Ghostbusters, which I really enjoy because those stories, I like to romanticize those creations because it is, they've made magical things. And it's like, he does, the way he does describe, it does make me feel like, ooh, like this is part of the story. Well, especially in, you know, that you can tell and that they all admit that a lot of this came from improv and it came from just letting the camera go and just letting them be them, which is where the magic, I think that's why we see it as magic, is because we were watching magic. We were watching truly talented people just giving characters, they make it their own, and then they just go. And that is something that not every person can do. I also love it too when Gene Wilder said, I love creating a character in a fantastical situation,

like Dr. Frankenstein, like Leo Bloom, a little caterpillar who blossoms into a butterfly. I love that. I love the art of acting and I love film because you always have another chance if you want it, which he definitely is going to need many times because, as everyone in this cast said, Gene Wilder was always the first one to break.

Yes. Which is great. But then you look at it. And it's very funny because I definitely, I know, I would say I look down on Jimmy Fallon, but of course it is one of the kind of things. Everyone knows Jimmy Fallon is the one that always breaks in the sketches, always breaks and sketches. Always breaks and sketches. But when you are working with this caliber of people, not to say that he wasn't working with it,

but I mean, these are the greats. These are the classics. How do you not break? Well, that's the, I mean, the Jimmy Fallon seems, sometimes it feels a little bit forced. And I love watching bloopers and breaks. Like I'll watch the end of Anchorman and the credits and like laugh my fucking ass off every time. So good.

They're trying to not laugh. Jimmy Fallon isn't trying. Right, right. And this is why I'm starting. I hate Jimmy Fallon podcast. Whoa. Another beef. We'll have another one.

All right. All right. Let's do it. Throw them under the bus. Can you add that Jackie to the beef list? Yay. I got a beef list. I just got a big side of.

I got a steak nails in the wall. She chiseled it into a big side of the dish. I said, that's my beef list. You got to lick the beef. I can smell it through this Zoom call. All right, let's talk about this incredible cast. It is just fantastic through and through with some little surprises in there as well. I didn't even realize Gene Hackman was the blind guy.

I didn't either. Yeah. Before they even get into the casting of everything. Now, in making this deal with work. working together that Gene Wilder is writing it with Mel Brooks and Mel Brooks is directing it. Gene, Gene's going to be the lead in it. He said that Mel Brooks said, I wasn't allowed to be in it. That was the deal Gene Wilder and I had. He said, if you're not in it, I'll do it. Brooks revealed in a 2012 interview. Why, though? And he said, am I such a bad actor? Says Brooks. And Gene says,

no, but you're always breaking the fourth wall and you're always surprising. And there's a lot of anarchy in you. I don't want it to be a crazy comedy. I wanted to be a real movie with natural comedy, says Brooks. I said, you're absolutely right. That's the way we'll do it. So they ended up, so of course, the cast is amazing. It's a lot of people that they work with in the past. Yeah. But I do love that they made that deal before even getting into everything. I love the Mel Brooks cameos, but it does add a cartoonish element. Yes. Yes. Always. And I will say, yeah, like a sketchiness that your show of shows bigness. Which is great.

It is fun, but that's not what he wanted. More of a theater actor at heart almost. Oh yeah. Totally. Totally. Cometic actors. So, but Brooks himself does do voices throughout the film such as the werewolf, the cat hit by a dart, and Victor Frankenstein himself. And he

says, I did them for real, though. I didn't try to make them funny. I tried to mimic the guys that originally did Frankenstein. So, yeah, Peter Boyle, let's start with him, the monster. He grew up in an entertainment family as his father was a Philadelphia TV personality that did things like host and Uncle Pete presents the Little Rascals blogging. That sounds fun.

Yeah, you come here. Uncle Pete wants to meet you little rascals. That doesn't, but does he, wait, I'm just confused. Is he, this not the real little rascals. No, he would be like, and here's another little rascals clip for ya, kiddies. Like he was that guy. Hop on pop. Yeah.

He would like host the clip show essentially. Yeah. So, but enough about Peter Boyle's weird father. Peter Boyle himself would end up, wouldn't you know it, going to study in NYC under Uda Hagen at HB Studio. And he got his first big break starring in the violent drama film Joe as a hippie hating title character. That it was kind of a nutty movie. I was looking into it.

I don't want to spend too much time talking about Joe. But it actually led him to turn down. the role that would go to Gene Hackman and French Connection because he didn't like the violent nature of that film. And, yeah, Young Frankenstein was his second big breakout role after Joe, and he had this to say about playing the character. The Frankenstein monster I play is a baby. He's big and ugly and scary, but he's just been born, remember,

and it's been traumatic. And to him, the whole world is a brand new alien environment. That's how I'm playing it, which again just goes to show that thought, was put into it. He's not just like, I'm gonna play a big crazy monster. You know what I mean? Like, no, he's got an approach. He's got given circumstances that he's working with. He's, he's going method. Also, you got to remember, you're on this set with everyone that is making these amazing choices. Everything that he did was a choice. They had no idea during the putting on the

Ritz scene. They had no idea how he was going to play it. They just said, you're gonna go on stage. You're gonna do putting on the Ritz. And then he was, the one when he did because he wanted, like that was a choice. It wasn't that he was told how to do it. Right, right. And that was actually, it's interestingly enough, Mel Brooks was actually fighting with Gene Wilder

about whether that scene should go into the movie. And it was Brooks who felt it was too over the top and silly to be in this, in that movie. But I'm glad they kept it. Yeah, I'm glad too. It does sort of step out of the, the, I guess, tone of the movie.

Yeah. But it just works because it's so absurd. It's so wonderful. But also barely Gene Wilder fought with him for 40 minutes about keeping. And then finally, Mel Brooks was like, I mean, if you're going to fight this hard, I guess we'll leave it in. 40 minutes they fought about it. So next is, let's talk about a Marty Feldman as Igor. He hails from London's East End, and he suffered from thyroid disease as a kid and developed graves ophthalmopathy.

Graves ophthalmopathy. Graves ophthalmopathy. Fun eyes is what we call it. Yeah, fun eyes, which causes his eyes to protrude and become misaligned, which he would come to embrace in his acting career. I love this quote. If I aspire to be Robert Redford, I'd have my eyes straightened and my nose fixed and end up like every other lousy actor with two lines on Kojak, which is a reference to a popular TV show at the time. Some might not know of. But this way, I'm a novelty.

Please look up the Madeline Khan, Marty Feldman, blooper reel of when she first gets out of the car. I sent it to Holden and Natalie. It's so good. Because we can't even play a clip because it's so physical because she's got the mink stole around her neck and he just keeps attacking it. And she's desperately trying to not break. The whole scene too, he's peering up over top of her shoulder. So it's just his eyes like going back and forth right behind her. And I really love, I think it's so cool that he decided his unique look was like, I'm just doing this because he could have gotten some more surgery. Use what you got.

And he's just like, nah, this is me. And it was wildly successful because of it, for sure. Also, I love he started out as a jazz trumpeter. And I glossed over this a little bit in the Mel Brooks part, but he started out as a jazz drummer. And there was a really good quote I found from Mel Brooks talking about how it taught him a lot actually about rhythm and comedy, about doing the joke on the offbeat, about, you know, these different technical terms that he learned through playing music, that he applied to comedy.

and I bet Marty Feldman got a little bit of inspiration as well, learning music signatures, learning about rhythm and timing. Oh, yeah. In a musical way. And it really shows. I do love that there's those backgrounds. And it again goes to show every comic wants to be a musician,

every musician wants to be a comic. And I think that's because of a rhythm. It harkens back, too, of like, when we were talking about Mariah Carey and things like that, when you know every aspect of the writing, the producing, the editing, when you know all of it, it's so much, you could create so much more solidly because you know what needs to be done in the future.

You know how to have that conversation. You know how to yell at different people. And say, not right. And is it right? I need it to be higher. Yep. But I will say Marty Feldman even himself admits he was an awful jazz trumpeter. So he quickly moved over to being a comedian. And with his partner, Barry took, they were early comedian colleagues.

He got into writing, doing several scripts for TV. series and sketch comedy shows too many to name. I'm shocked at how much work he did in Britain on sketch comedy. He worked with a bunch of future money Python members such as John Kleece and he had his own he had multiple of his own sketch shows Marty and then it's Marty and then later the Marty Feldman comedy machine followed by Marty back together again. And it was actually Wild had Wilder had him in mind when he wrote the role of Igor this whole time because he was, it's one of those interesting ones where you read about his career and you're like, oh, he was such a household name back in the day. And you always wonder why those household, those certain household names don't continue to be household names.

Well, I think he was more of a household name in England. In England, right? Yeah. Yeah, I think people probably still refer to him. Kind of like probably in England, there's not as many people who know, you know, Mr. Show as, as prominently as we know it as a household name. Whereas I think that was what this was here. but also that he was a part of the early, early work of so many Monty Python people, I thought was very fascinating as well. So anyways, moving along, ride along to Cloris Leachman, who plays Frau Bluquer. Which also fun because I read so many things that, you know.

I love every time the horses say that movie, by the way. So everyone assumes, so every time she says her name, the horse is nay, and a lot of people said that Bluker translates to a horse going to a factory and being turned into glue, which is why the horse is nay every time. But apparently, Gene Wilder said, that is not why her name was that. He said, when I was writing the first draft, I said, I wonder if anybody would get it when someone said, Frow Bulker and the horse's nay. Melbrook said, keep it in. Well, the audience loved it in previews. I just chose the name because I wanted an authentic German name. I took out some of the books I had the letters to. I

had of the letters to and from Sigmund Freud. I saw someone named Bluker had written to him and I said, well, that's the name. Later on I heard about two or three sources who said Bluke refers to a horse going to a factory and being turned to glue. I just thought it was a funny name. And so he wanted to do it

that it was like that the horses were so scared of her that she's a terrible and like, more harkens back to like the scream and like that kind of stuff that it's just supposed to be a scary character, not the horse and the glue thing. So funny. I just, I love her performance in this movie.

It's so good. I love it too. Jean Wilder said, Lord only knows what she does to them when no one's around. Laura Leachman's just, she's such a badass. She's so good. So let's get into Leachman.

She started out having success in the 1946 Miss America page. Dude, we are going to do Cloris Leachman. We are definitely doing Gloria Leachman at some point. She gets a scholarship. This actually doing the pageant led to her getting a scholarship to study at the actors studio in New York City. Her first big acting gig was in the musical South Pacific, and she went on to work in television and film not too long after appearing in small roles such as in films like

Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, shows like Raw Hyde, but it was 1971's, I still need to see this movie. I've never seen this, and I always try to remind myself to- You're going to love it. The last picture show. It's so good. What's the deal? Can you give me a summary of the last picture show?

It's kind of hard to glean that. I mean, it's a slice of life. Just watch it. It's a slice of life, right? It is a very well-acted, very well-done movie. Yeah. And, well, it earns her an Oscar for Best Supporting Actors, so that would make a lot of sense. And also, it set a record by winning eight, oh, she set a record by winning eight Primetime Emmy Awards,

including the part of Phyllis Lindstrom on the Mary Tyler Moore Show. And, yeah, she would go on to appear in future Brooks production. She was, like, part of his stable, essentially, including, a pun, pun, including high anxiety and history of the world part one. She makes that character. There's a great interview between Cloris Leachman and Mel Brooks where they're talking about their favorite scenes. And when she was offering him the brandy and then offering him milk.

And she didn't know how he was going to respond. And he responded in different intonations to the no thank you. So she's like, so you could see the look on my face of just like of bracing myself for what he's going to do because there were some takes where he'd be like, no, thank you. But then he would reel it back in. But he created a world in that scene and every scene that they did together, which is like, you never knew how it was going to come out of this. I think I also read that she improvised a lot of those. Oh, yeah. Like the Ovalteen and stuff. Yeah, she would get mad at Wilder a lot because he would ruin what she referred to as some of her

best takes with his laughter. With his laughter. I think it also, it's good to remember in times like this, that some of the casting, sometimes it's how you go into the room. So Mel Brooks hired Kenneth Mars, who plays Inspector Kemp. He hired him on the spot when he came into audition. And it's because he had pitched an eccentric wardrobe gimmick. He said, Mars later reminisced, let me ask you this. If you're wearing an eye patch and you've got a monocle on top of the eye patch, is that too much? And Mel Brooks said, of course not. And he said, oh no, I said, Of course, Melwick said, good, you're hired. It's because they were talking about all these dumb, like, costume choices.

And it just, he was just in the room and immediately hired because of it. Wow. That's amazing. I'm going to go ahead and say, maybe my first ever, um, I have sex feelings, moments, had a lot to do with Terry Gar in this film. Wow. She is a. She's so hot in a smoke show.

Smoke show in this movie. And that holds up, boys and girls. Yeah, dog. There's a lot of really funny boob jokes. Uh-huh. A lot of really nice knockers. Yeah. Thank you.

Would she like to take a roll in the head? It's important. And her accent is so funny, and I love where her dialect came from. It is so funny, though. She's so good. Her, just the accent alone is just hilarious. Kind of like the German police officer guy as well. Yeah, she just nails this character incredibly so.

and makes her, like you guys said, elevates her above just like, oh, I'm just the dumb blonde, you know, assistant. Also, that's a very funny line in the movie, elevate me, right? You want me. Oh, oh, I see. I'll just say about Terry Gar

that she grew up in a showbiz family. She ended up starting out also at the actor's studio and the Lee Strasbourg Theater. She ends up being a go-go, uncredited go-go dancer in a lot of Elvis Presley movie. early on in her career. Which I can see why. Pachy-Machi. And she ended up basing her dialect on the German wig stylist at the Sunny and

Cher Comedy Hour on which she appeared several times and just sat with her for a few hours and walked out of the room with that dialect, which I think is amazing. I love it too. My favorite is that Melbrook said, well, Terry Garlack too, well, three things Inga had to have. A German accent and a pneumatic bosom. So apparently the day before her audition, the actress was filming the Sunny and Cher show, as luck would have it, the wig lady was German. Gar made small

talk with her for about an hour and left the dressing room saying, mind got, this week weighs 40 pounds. Then she showed up for the young Frankenstein audition in a fuzzy pink sweater and a bra stuffed with several pairs of socks. Brooks castor on the spot.

Next you have Madeline Khan, which we, yes, are going to breeze through as well a little bit, but that's also because we want to give her her own episode as well. But either way, she pursued acting at Hofster University. She ends up as a chorus girl early on in a revival of Kiss Me, Kate. And she also was doing a lot of singing in things. You can hear how great her voices in the film itself.

She, her first feature role was the Screwball Comedy, What's Up Doc, starring Barbara Streisand. And she ends up getting an Oscar for her supporting role in Paper, Moon, and Oscar Nam, that is. And that's pretty much all you need to know leading up to getting blazing saddles. And Mel Brooks had said about Madeline Khan, intellectually and mentally, she was probably superior to anyone and everyone she worked with and actually probably had to hide her brilliance a little, which is rough at that point in time.

But the more I started, that's why I can't wait to do an episode on her. She's so good. Oh, my God. She's brilliant. We've been watching Clue, so I mean, she's very in the front of my mind right now. circling back really quickly to Gene Hackman before we move into the filming portion of the episode. Gene Hackman was already a giant success. He won an Oscar for French Connection, but it was actually, this was him just wanting to try comedy as a lark.

And he was tennis partners with Gene Wilder. And he was just like, can you get me in there? I love that. They were playing tennis. And he's like, hey, I want to try comedy. And he's like, sure, because the blind man that he plays in it wasn't the original Frankenstein as well. But he doesn't spill super. all over his crotch.

He doesn't do the funny. Yeah. I had no growing up, I had no idea. And that was something that, like, I mean, I know I've talked about near Birdcage is one of our favorite movies. And I had no idea that that was Gene Hackney. I think I read that he was only there. He did it for free.

He's there for four days. And they didn't even credit him originally when the movie came out. No, they didn't even need to. Especially with all of the other names on it, which is also why I love everything about this. This is something that they started off with that apparently Mel Brooks had done in other movies during filming that they had every

single person on set had white handkerchiefs. He said that I wrote that line when Gene Wilder, he was never better, I think. Gene Wilder says to Marty Feldman, to Igor, let's get the bags and I gore says, okay, you take the blonde and I'll take the one in the turban. It was very hard to

shoot that because the minute he said it, everybody broke up. Madeline broke up. Gene broke up and it was very hard to shoot scenes with Chloris, she would say things slowly and steely and you had to hold on, you know, bite your lip. I mean, she was penetrating and crazy. But anyway, that was the first time I used the white handkerchief. He said, I knew there was going to be laughing. The first time I used it was during the 12 chairs. There was too much laughter. I couldn't shoot. So I went out and bought 100 white handkerchiefs and said, stick this in your mouth. And then with Young Frankenstein,

I bought 200. It was a bigger crew, a lot of people. I said, if you're not in the scene, take this handkerchief and when you feel you're going to laugh, shove this in your mouth. And every once in a while I'd be shooting a scene and I would turn and I could see a sea of white handkerchiefs. So I said, all right, this is going to be funny. This is good. I love it. So good. So good.

So going back to the whole universal classic monsters situation, of course, because of those films, Brooks wants to shoot the whole thing in black and white, which is pretty unheard of at the time in terms of a successful film. And, of course, he's initially working with Columbia Pictures on the movie. and Brooks said, they said, okay, we'll make it black and white, but on color stock so that we can show it in Peru, which just got color. And I said, no, no, because you'll screw me. You will say this. And then in order to save the company, you will risk a lawsuit and you will print everything in color. It's got to be on black and white thick film. Which it makes it look, I think it makes it look better.

Way better. Yes. It looks more traditional. And it looks like the universal classic monsters. It's also why Mel Brooks didn't want it in black and white. is Brooks says that if they had made the movie in color, they would have to make the monster green. We said, if we make the monster green,

it'll be like a Halloween mask. It will not have the gravity. It won't have the depth. It won't have the power of the James Whale movie. Because this is heavily based on specifically the James Whale version of Frankenstein. He originally did Frankenstein and the bride of Frankenstein. He used many wide shots, almost never zoomed in,

and chose only to move the camera with minimal effect. Brooks also used techniques from German expressionist directors, Fritz Lang, and F.W. Mernia. Oh, by the way, the monster's face had to be green because that was the way to make it look super pale in black and white. So it was still green, but if it was in color, it would have looked ridiculous. Right, which is why he has that green face on, like, the color cover of the movie. So anyways, Columbia Pictures, like, totally is whatever anyways. because Brooks wanted $2.3 million for his budget, but they only wanted to give him 1.7.

So Brooks makes a deal with 20th century Fox. And this is what leads to them, both Wilder and Brooks getting a five-year contract with the studio and starting off a really healthy relationship with them. And also, this is where we talk about the props. They found a man named Kenneth Strickfaden who built the electrical equipment used in the original Frankenstein film and got all of them.

Awesome. So badass. He still had it. It was just in his garage. So they just excavated all of that equipment and got to use the original science tific equipment stuff for the film, which is so amazing. Also Mel Brooks, because he knows the depth of how much this man obviously cared for what he'd originally built. Because when he dusted them off, plugged him in, they all still worked. Wow. And Mel Brooks made a deal to rent them all from Strickfaden and also to give him screen credit for creating them. Strick Faden had never even gotten full recognition for his work. So it was actually a very sweet thing for Mel Brooks to do.

Was that just commonplace back then? I mean, it's 1931. So I imagine they- What about the IMDB page though? Where is his IMDB page? I will say, oh, also they got that really cool light-up effect on the Frankenstein face during the lightning scene because they took a mold of Peter Boyle's face

and stuck a light bulb in it and then controlled the brightness using like a machine. Oh, cool. I was wondering how they did that. That was cool looking. It's crazy. Now, Brooks insisted that Gene Wilder got top billing as the writer because he came up with the idea to make the film during the production of Blazing Saddles.

Walder was also responsible for many of the running gags in the film, including the mispronunciation of Frankenstein's name. Now, this is on top of, I love, I just love the idea of this. Mel Brooks says his favorite time during the making of the movie was lunch. It's not because he was hungry. It's because he would sit around with Gene Wilder, Terry Gar, Madeline Khan, Peter Boyle and Marty Feldman, and they would all share stories about their lives. He remembers Con talking about how she originally wanted to be an opera singer, and then

someone thought she was funny and gave her a comedic role. She then became a comic actress instead. So just imagine sitting with them, and all of them are fairly, like, far on in their careers, especially the bigger names. So just throwing that kind of stuff around, I can't even imagine sitting at that table. And he also, Bell Brooks, which I love that he doesn't, you know, he's the director. of this movie, but he also makes it very clear that he definitely gave them all space to do whatever they wanted to do naturally. He said, play it like a play. I'm not going to chop it up. I'm not going to

say cut. You're going to talk for 10 minutes and I'm not going to interfere. Just keep doing it. Some fun scenes that resulted when Gar remarks to Wilder that he hasn't touched his food yet and then he begins to jam his hands into it. That made me laugh at it. I rewatched it. Which was all improv. It's so stupid. But it's like one of those things that will make you laugh as a kid. But it's also really funny as an adult because you see somebody just like having a nervous breakdown in front of somebody. And also my favorite, which is my favorite part, is when Marty Feldman says, I'll never forget what my father said to me at times like this. And he just pauses it. But they didn't know he was going to do that unset.

And Wilder finally's like, what? What do they say? And it was just that long of a response. that he just, I love that Mel Brooks would just let him go. But also the line after that is great where he says something like, why do you spend an old day in the bathroom, huh? Let somebody else use it with no explanation as to why he says it. And Brooks also calls the scene in which Madeline Con arrives at the castle,

one of the best and worst days of his life. He thought it was great because the cast was delivering comedy gold. He thought it was terrible because practically every line caused the actors to start laughing. I just, how much fucking fun. They must have had to do this. I also loved hearing that Mel Brooks would really take Gene Wilder under his wing in terms of directing tips because he knew Wilder wanted to take his turn in directing at some point. Wilder recalled, Mel would say, do you know the trouble I'm in because I didn't shoot that close up? Don't do that.

I would say, to whom are you talking? You, when you're directing. And I would always just be throwing little tips out to him and things like. like that. But yeah, they hold a test screening for this film, which went horribly,

which is probably, the reason being was probably that the film was over two hours long. I don't think I'd won a version of Youngstrandt. It was two hours and 22 minutes long. No comedy should be that long.

I agree. And I'll attribute my not enjoying 20 or 40 year old virgin to the fact that I accidentally rented the extended cut. Oh yeah. It's ruined the movie for me. That sucks because that movie is very funny.

It is a very funny movie, but the extended cut was way too long-winded. Yeah, definitely. I feel like there are a lot of funny movies, honestly, where it's hard for a comedy to stick the landing sometimes. It's like old school. I think old school is one of the funniest movies still, even though I mean, I know that that's, I think because I saw it at the, I was like 14 at the time. I love it too, though. I love it. But I still shut it off when there's 25 minutes left because I don't give a fuck about the end.

It's not one of my favorites, but it's funny. The first part of it, I always shut it off. I really do. I find it like fizzles out by the end of that movie. That's why I love this too. Like Brooks said, ladies and gentlemen, you've just seen a two hour and 22 minute failure. In less than three weeks, I want you back here to see a 95-minute smash hit movie. Hell yeah.

So the director locked himself in the editing room and pared every scene down until the movie clocked in at 90 minutes. and then the audience loved it. But can you, like, that's difficult. That is so hard to, like, cut your... As someone's like, you know, in us, we wrote comedy for so many years, it's hard to cut up your baby. It's because every second is golden. Yes.

Exactly. Or the other problem that happens is you see everything so many times you get numb to it and you can't figure out what the funnier bits are. That's the thing. And also what Mel Brooks had said, he said, for every joke that worked, there were three that fell flat. And apparently that there was cut material that included a clip in which Frederick's relatives

listened to a recording which was left by his great-grandfather Beauvert von Frankenstein whose message starts skipping and nonchalantly repeats the phrase up yours, up yours, up yours. I will give a shout out too to the editor John C. Howard.

I can't believe I'm bringing this movie up again and I really want to see it again because I brought it up twice today. He was the editor on Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, a movie that I love. He also edited Blazing Sack. I've never seen Butch Cassidy.

You'll enjoy the hell out of it. Yeah? I think you'll, yeah, I think you will absolutely love it. It is, it's like a hippie western movie with, uh, what's, what's their puts? Robert Redford and, um, it's definitely, I think it'll definitely get your ovaries. Ooh, I'll lick. I'll have a lick, one lick or two. Not our ovaries.

It's your G spot. Yeah, it's my G's my G's. It's my great spot. Yeah. Was it Paul Newman and Robert Redford as to young? handsome men. Wait, who? Wait, Robert and whom?

Yeah, you need to watch this movie, Jackie. You will absolutely love it. It is really good. I have some. So on just over a $2 million budget, the film grosses $86.2 million dollars, which is insane. Yeah, Natalie, get it.

Yep, yep. Woo-woo-woo-woo-woo-woo. I love a profit. I just need to clip it. that every time I want every time money goes into my account I love a profit also also for mr. Mel Brooks 1974 was a pretty huge year because both Blazing Saddles and young Transylvania were released that year which meant he ended up with the number one and number three highest grossing films of that year insane which is crazy like could you imagine that

no and also that was a big I forget what other movies came out at that time no I can't I can't imagine it. I can never imagine it. Well, can you imagine a future musical being made out of it? Because it happened. Oh, my God. I mean, you know what? If you can do it with Shrek, you could do it with anything.

Oh, Ken, I don't know. Did they do it with Shrek? They did. They did. So this was really mainly due to the precursor, incredibly financially successful Broadway version of the producers that came out. I remember that was just such a huge. That was the Hamilton of that time, essentially.

Oh, yeah, definitely, like, won everything. Yeah, that was that back in 2001. I still get springtime for Hitler stuck in my head just randomly, and you can't sing it allowed. It's so good. So, of course, a no-brainer is moving on to Young Frankenstein, especially with how inherent music is to that film, as we mentioned before. He works with the same guy he worked with on the producers, a guy named Thomas Mehan, who wrote the books for Annie, Hairspray, and Crybaby. A little crossover. A little crossover to the episode.

John Walters. Yes, thank you. God, I almost blanked out for a second there. And it was directed by Susan Stroman, who did a bunch of really good stuff, featured among others in the Broadway cast was Megan Malawi as Elizabeth. My favorite. And Sutton Foster as Inga.

I'm sure that it was great. I love Sutton Foster. Megan Mulauley and Sutton Foster. Jesus Christ. I would have watched the book out of it. I have a friend who got to see it. and she was in, she was working for the, in some PR area and actually got to like hang out with Mel Brooks and stuff and watch that musical.

Oh, well, isn't that great for her? I want to be her. Is that good for her? Can I be inside of her skin? One kind of sad thing is that Cloris Leachman really wanted to reprise her role in the musical and Brooks turned her down saying, I didn't want her to die on stage. I don't want her to die on stage. I mean, she was fairly old.

She was old at the time. I thought it was because she couldn't do it. I thought it was because she was busy. No, he wanted her. He didn't, he turned her down. She wanted to do it. And then she goes on dancing with the stars. Is awesome on it.

And then Mel Brooks hit her up later. Was like, actually no, after seeing her on that, was like, oh, you totally can do this. Of course. Let me, you know, let's do it. But unfortunately, the production closed before she had a chance to perform the role. That's what he gets for his sexism. Yes.

Yeah. And he's old. I feel like. in his brain, he probably was like, I couldn't do it right now. How could she do it? I don't think it was sexist. It's very, no, because it's, you know, they're, what do they do? Six, seven performances a week. Right. That's, uh, but my favorite though, except now, who knows with what's going on in the world? I was so excited because in January, they'd come out that apparently in the fall, they were going to do a live on musical version of it on ABC of Young Frankenstein. And the,

the broadcast supposed to be produced by Mel Brooks, who obviously originally directed the movie, who penned the original score, did the musical adaptation for it. But now who knows what's going to happen, but I was very excited to see it. Well, what bitches were going to be in that one? We don't know yet.

It wasn't released because it wasn't supposed to be until October. And now who fucking knows anymore? Well, either way, I do know that that I think about wraps it up for our episode on Youngfield. Frankenstein, it's always fun. Keep making me watch my favorite movies for my childhood, guys, because I like these episodes.

And it wasn't a cry one, which is fun. I didn't cry at all watching young Frankenstein, which is good, because then I think I'd need some time away. I have to be sent away. Yeah, you cry during. The press was so beautiful. Watching space balls, just crying. I did maybe think of you because I do,

our Roomba's named Dot because of Space. baseballs. In case you guys were wondering what my Roomba was called. That's what it's called. And that's Joan Rivers. Yeah, Joan Rivers. John Rivers. All right, guys, thank you so much for joining us for Young Frankenstein.

I loved doing this. Fashion sets. Now, see, putting on the wrist, it's been stuck in the dead. But only that version of it with that monster noise. We love you guys Check us out Patreon.com 4 slash page 7 podcast

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and all the other stuff is the Natty Jean and I guess I can just say here first. I have a new P-cast coming out pretty soon. Hell, yeah, what's it called? It's called someplace underneath, and it's about missing women. Ooh, creepy skin.

Larry. And my name is Jackie Sprouse. You follow me on Instagram at Jack That Worm. We love you guys so much, and thank you for joining us. We'll be back next week. Bye. Bye-bye. This show is made possible by listeners like you.

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