Page 7 - Second Helpings - It's Just a Death Cult, Guys

Episode Date: January 16, 2026

This week on Second Helpings, Jackie and MJ announce the "Cats" curse has been broken after taking off 2025 and damning humanity, P7 was back at giving "CATS" (the movie) the eyeball views it rightfully deserves. TWICE. Now that the curse has been broken, it's time to dive into a 26 minute breakdown of how it's more about the souls they suck than the milk they drink, and expose a potential disturbing death cult within the Catsverse. Jennifer Lawrence has another day in the headlines because people can't get jokes, then there's a KJ KORNER, cause KJ APA hung out with some Riverdale castmates including Cole Sprouse, and more importantly MR FANTASY AND ROBERT IRVINE MADE CONTENT TOGETHER! The first 3 episodes of "Traitors" dropped last week featuring Mama Kelce, and finally a special guest shows up cause they were talkin' shit on Rumpleteazer! All that and SO MUCH MORE on this weeks Second Helpings!Want even more Page 7? Support us on Patreon! Patreon.com/Page7Podcast  Subscribe to SiriusXM Podcasts+ to listen to new episodes of Page 7 ad-free.Start a free trial now on Apple Podcasts or by visiting siriusxm.com/podcastsplus. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

I'm sorry. Why are we singing that song when we could be singing, Oh, well, ever was there ever a cat's so clever as magical. Mr. Mastomastafalli's. It is now in your brain. It's in your brain. And I don't apologize because we are going to be talking about cats today because MJ and I had, and Holden had an insane experience yesterday. What a journey we went on.

And I dare say, I can't wait for more. Yeah. So you guys, any long time listener since December 2019, we'll know that we here at page seven, we worship the altar of the movie cats. Yes, we also cower in fear of the movie cats. It's kind of Christ-like figure where it's like it rules our daily choices, but also like we live in complete fear. of it. We believe that it caused the pandemic and that we have been kind of living under its curse ever since. Our 2020, 2022, 2023 national tour was an effort to lift that curse. So fast forward to 2025. Holden said, can we watch cats? And Jackie and I said, we're too busy. We're too busy. We don't have the time. We can't do this. And what happened? And what happened? 2025 was one of the worst years I have ever experienced, not only personally, but I think if everybody remembers that everything from last year, can we realize, recognize? We did not watch

the movie Cats last year. Right. Okay. And so while yes, at first, it created the curse with which gave us COVID-19. Yeah. It did do that to us. But what we have to recognize, is that now it is, like MJ said, we have to go to the altar every year. We have to give ourselves to Katz. And we have done this every year except for 2025 for the record. We watch it every year. This was last year was the one we did it. And yeah, I mean, obviously 2024 was in the election happened, but really a lot of bad things at 2025. We don't need to re-redigate that. Oh, yeah, yeah, no, no, it was real bad. And so what we decided to do. And yeah, maybe the idea came from Holden and I being drunk on Jack. last week, yes. But we had wanted to watch it together, the three of us, but then we realized we need to watch last years as well to make sure that this year is coded in positive goodness.

And Lord knows it needs it deeply already. Oh, we need it, guys. Off to a bad start. No, it's not a bad start. It's the ass of the snake. We are just getting the rest of the snake off so that we can move it. Into the Lunar New Year, which is going to be next month. So right now it's just, we're just any ass part of the snake, okay? You're right. We haven't started it because last night, we watched it twice in a row, and we learned, and we grew, and we covered, we did it for everyone.

And I will say Holden did record both versions, and they are two separate versions, including the movie, and we will be posting them on the page 7 Patreon. So if you missed it live, don't worry, you're going to be able to watch it. So we're, again, we are talking about a group of people, the three of us, Jackie Holden and I have, have. And, and the, our amazing chat that I want to say. And chat, yes. The like 150 of you that stayed with us for both. Stayed for both.

Yes. But I'm talking about we have seen, we have watched this movie, sat down. and watched it at least. So 2019, December 2019 was when Holden and I and some friends saw it in the theaters for the first time. And so we have seen it 2019, 2020, 2020, 21, 22, 23, 24. That's six. And then we skipped 25.

And then last night was two more. So that's eight times at least that we've seen it. Not to mention, we did a lot of cats watching in preparation for our tour because we wrote the show around cats and we pulled a lot of clips. And so we've seen this movie a lot and then, but we've never seen it back to back. And the reason we are going to put both viewings on Patreon for people is because watching cats the first time, very different experience than watching it the second time and the same sitting. We had a completely, for the eight times in, and we are now just now, Jackie and I think that we've reached a new level of understanding of what this musical has going for it. because you guys, again, you probably already know it is a very confusing film.

It's a confusing text as an original Broadway play. It is an even more confusing film. A lot of questions about why is this happening? Yes. What is happening? Yes. What is there a plot here? Well, you know, I think that a lot of people felt this way.

In fact, I'm going to pull this quote from a longtime worker with Andrew Lloyd Weber and he said, I listened to it all and I said, Andrew, is this something I don't get? Is this about Queen Victoria? She's the main cat, and Disraeli and Gladstone or other cats. I don't even know those cats. And then there are, you know, poor cats. And am I missing this? And he took a terrible, painful long pause and said, how?

It's about cats. It's about cats. And we never discussed it again. And that's really all you could do. Okay, guys, I had to come here today to unpack this because in the second watch, I will also throw it out there. We were not drinking through these and you're like, how could you not? Because we were instead smoking insane amounts of weed. So by the time we got to the second, I'm saying version because it's new to me now.

All right, I was seeing it in a different way and I started seeing things. and also understanding the plot in ways that I never did before. Right. Because the experience of watching, to watch Cats is to ask questions. You know, and so I think that that's really what happened for us last night was that we, we, for the first time in eight watches in six years, got answers to some of our questions. Because the biggest question, the most guiding light question of the movie Cats, 2019, I think, is, is this a universe of humans where cats live, like our universe, or is this a universe of only cats?

Because in the overture, the opening scene, we see like a Times Square area. But in the, all the lights for the signs are advertising cat things like Havana Brown. We also see the legs of people at the very top because they do put the cat in a bag and throw the cat into the alleyway. and is that alleyway a portal into a different dimension? Now, I have really, if you want to watch us watching it for the second time, I've recognized and realized what has to happen with cats and what needs to be written for it. Yeah.

And I now understand what my life's purpose is, and that is to explain that in actuality, the rapture happened right at the top of the movie. All of the humans have been, but she is actually. actually also transported far into the future when all they have supped upon any body, any human body that they have found. And while supping upon those bodies, they do eat their souls. And then they take on their memories like a plurb. That's the thing. We have to, yeah, you finish your thought. And then I think we have to go a little slower just to make sure that.

What do you mean? Old Deuteronomy is his fucking prophet. Because of course, in the future, when there's only cats left and only the cats have become sentient. because they've eaten the human beings and absorbed their souls. And now this Old Deuteronomy is the prophet with which they murder. And then they use Mr. Mistopheles to bring her back to life, which is actually what happens in the musical. It is one of the only pieces of plot. Because here's the thing.

After I watched both versions of this movie, I went on and watched Lindsay Ellis's YouTube, called Why is Cats? And it went into the creation of Cats, into why the Cats movie did not work. And that was because it tried in any capacity to force any kind of plot on this musical that is just about Cats. So the musical is just about Cats, Andrew Lloyd-Weber obviously didn't have any bigger ideas for it.

There's no, there's no, it's not about class. He likes Cats. It's not about income inequality or anything. But then, but also what you need to know, if you have in the movie, seen it is that the plot, quote unquote, is just, it's just each cat introduces themselves and is making a case for why they should be the one to die and go to the heavyside layer, which is like heaven. And so about halfway through the first viewing of cats last night, I realized that this is, in fact, a movie about a death cult. And so I started calling it Cats Midsomar.

Which is awesome. And also I think Ari Oster is very upset somewhere just by you saying. I think it's Cats Midsomar. But then, somewhere in between the first and the second watching, Jackie said, what if it's not cats in Midsomar? What if it's cat's pluribus? And our central question, which is, is this a human world or a cat world? The answer is kind of both. Both. Because the humans live inside of them.

It was once a human world. But some sort of apocalyptic event has happened, a rapture has happened, and the humans have all promptly disappeared, leaving the cats to be. Except for the bad ones and all the bad ones will obviously die from sin and then the cats will eat them. And then when we realize that Old Deuteronomy is kind of the cat medium between the cats here on Earth and the Heaviside layer, which again is like heaven, we realize that basically Old Deuteronomy is a prophet like a Joseph Smith-esque figure. I'm reading. With a bunch of young wives. I'm reading. You know she's got kittens on the side.

And Lord, help her what she's doing with those kittens. I don't know if Joseph Smith is the prophet to which we should compare Old Deuteronomy, but I am currently reading the book under the banner of heaven, which is fan. fascinating, really good book about Mormonism. Is it about cats and soul-insorption? It's not. It is about Mormonism. But so I, right now I'm a hammer and everything is a nail. Like everything is Joseph Smith.

And I think Old Deuteronomy is Joseph Smith. Well, because then I got upset because we have seen this movie so many times. Didn't know, which for those of you that have also seen a million times, did you know that old Deuteronomy gets dust it, like turned into dust? And then that Mr. Mistophily song is the right. raising of the dead cat. I just want to throw that out there. But then I got upset in the second viewing

because I thought, oh, God, is this all like a Jesus? Christ thing. Is Chrysabella supposed to be Mary Magdalene? Because, of course, we are stone to the bone. But again, that had nothing, because he was not doing that. It is just about cats. It's just about cats.

If you want an Andrew Lloyd Weber musical about Jesus, I can point you towards two, which is Jesus Christ. They're both very different. for the amazing technical dream coat. And so you might think is that this man like symbolism. Is there any symbolism going out here? No.

No, there's not. And anything that you see in it is shit that Hooper sprinkled on top of it. And he doesn't want it. It's supposed to be about cats. When I watched Why is Cats, it also explained, which also makes so much sense. Andrew Lloyd Weber loves cats. And we know that. But this was completely, he put a bunch of his own.

money into this. He had to sell like a portion of his castle or whatever he had. Like he literally lived in like a castle and he's like, oh, auction off a section. So all, I can I have my cats. And then he made cats. And he was just like, guys, everybody cats. And I think people just were like, I mean, it's Angeloyed Weaver. So I guess we're just going to go on with that. I think I hadn't really put together the timeline of his work because most of the good things he made was way before. Like Joseph Avina, Jesus Christ Superstar.

This is his passion project. This is what he wanted. This is what he saved everything up for. Was to make cats. Yeah. Yeah, that's wild. It precedes Starlight Express, which is wild. But then it also precedes Phantom.

So like one last burst of good, you know, came from him. But right in the middle of a, of a, and you know, I know people have a lot of Felix by Andrew. Lid Weber. Not everybody loves Andrew Lid Weber's other work the way I do. But like the fact that you make Jesus Christ Superstar, which I think is a fantastic musical and then several other pretty beloved musicals and then you sync it all into Cats. But again, Cats as a Broadway musical, it's a different thing than the movie. I think everyone agrees both are bad. But like, but I think there's a lot of like 80s,

Coke, New York City, time, Gritty Times Square, doing a lot of heavy lifting. I know we always bring up Starlight Express, but it's like really hard not to. You know,

it's like you think about how much Zooten they were to, baby, and they were like, yeah, gotta be our train, got to be out trying, gotta be out of train, gotta roll a skate,

Adam, what you got. I hate to interrupt. Please, what do you have? No, I actually don't really have anything. It's just the fact that you said what you said, and I was literally Googling. Did Andrew Lloyd Weber

do a bunch of cocaine while he was writing cats? Did he? It appeared, I mean, everybody seems to be like, you know, it's a gay man in the 80s. He, I imagine, in the 80s, you know, socialite in the 80s. He was doing a ton of cocaine, so. He's got to be doing it. Also, Adam, you're hearing our pitch about the future of cats and the soul absorption. Does this make sense to you as someone that has seen the movie Cats?

I know you've seen it a couple times. I've seen it a couple times, yeah. Yeah, there is some kind of weird. There's something else going on, right? There's some kind of, that does make sense to me. There's something freaky going on. And I feel like I know that I bring up the movie Onyara too often. And maybe that's too often in my personal life.

But it is not so much on microphone because the movie Onyara broke me the second week of COVID. And I think about it all the time. And it is about this like, it's supposed to be just like a regular. It's almost like a bus trip that they're going. to Mars, like it's a big, big ship that it's as if it's like a, like a pleasure cruise going back and forth between Earth and Mars, and it gets hit by an asteroid, just gets hit by something, and it goes off course and it hit their gas tank. So all of the gas had come out, so they're just going in the wrong direction, and nothing

can stop them until they find, get into an orbit of another planet so they can turn around. And so they just know that they're going to go on. They have no idea how they're going to go, how long they're going to go on for. and what would happen inside of a ship. That's what happened in cats. They have been left alone for too long. Now they've got milk bars, but they don't even know how to make the milk bars the size for cats.

Because they're trying to outfit a life that was made for humans, but they ate them a long time ago. You think it was a long time ago? You don't think it was... Oh, this is far in the future. Oh, yeah. This is far in the future. All right.

I think what we need is like a vision board. And Adam, you would be great at this. because I haven't seen enough movies to like collect all of the different like it's really grounding me to be like is this cat's midsumar is this cat's pluribus is this cat's leftovers like I need I need kind of a pastiche of all of the different you know apocalypse or rapture texts with which we could you know that we can use as a framework to understand because I I again this many viewings and I had never once thought realized that this is a about a death cult and an apocop But it makes the whole movie make much more sense. Much more sense. Much more sense. But Adam, it does make sense, though, right? Far in the future?

No, I think so, too. I like a weird movie where it's supposed to technically be a future movie, but they don't explain that it anyway. It was like the, oh, God, the Noah movie that Darren Aronovsky made. Oh, my God. I haven't, I have never seen that movie, but I feel like I know so many people that, like, either reference it. I think Natalie worked on it. I remember Ed had a Noah hat for a while. And we talked about that movie, but all the time on Roundtable, I feel like. It's interesting because it's a movie

that you watch and you, and the whole time I was thinking kind of the same thoughts you guys were thinking about cats is like, this is not the original like Bible story. I feel like a whole world happened and this is something after that. Yeah, it's all like torqued up. Yeah. Which cats, I think, you know, the Anyara thing you said. What were the other? references you said MJ. Plurb. You know, throwing a,

yeah, we're throwing a... I think those weirdly do actually all really work. Yeah. Right? Because that's what I try it. Like,

what's the log line? What's the pitch? It's cats as if, you know, it's like, it's not Mad Max cats, although would watch. I would watch.

Mad Max cats. Maybe that's what we do. We put them in that world where they have to compete for milk. And then you still have the same bitches with all their milk breasts, although we can't have humans. So we'll have cats.

with milk breasts and then that's what they're coveting. Yeah, I think that what this has really done for me and Jackie is after spending the last six years thinking about cats more than the average person, but never really getting our answers. I think now it's, believe it or not, time for us to engage with this text even further. I want to write another show. I think we have to go on tour again. I don't know what that.

I feel like the show has to be us in the original conversation. I think we need to go get them made for us. I think we need to create our own concept of what cat, you know, if you had a cat, like I wanted to ask MJ, I almost texted MJ at 1 a.m. their time to ask them if they thought cats was far in the future. And if their cats ate them in the night, how do you think your cats would become sentient? And what qualities of you do you think that they would take on when they absorb your soul? I think the fact that you think that the cats are all living on.

on the dead bodies of the people. We talked, our show, our tour was called Release the Butthole Cut under the premise that there is a edit of cats where the cat's same movie, but the cats all have butholes. I also think that a potential project that could be fun here is the corpse cut where it's the same exact movie,

but there's just like rotting corpses of humans in the background the entire time. All this, all the like, Jellicle cats, it's jellicle cats. But there's just rotting corpses and skeletons everywhere. Oh my God, just turned it into a horror. moving. I think that there's, and it's just like old Deuteronomy, just this

creep ass prophet that she's like, I'm sorry, bring the saucer here. I'm fine with my cats and she's still licking up her crotch. Because again, the fact that they made Dame Judy Dench take off

her skin shell coat and then she's laying on her skin shell inside of a basket and then they make her pull her leg all the way up as if she's showing her chooch to Sir Ian McKellon? She is showing her cooch to Sir Ian McKellon.

Yes. Yes. After he drinks out of a sauce for her milk and goes, me, may, may, me. I got so many flashbacks last night, but a lot of it was very nostalgic because it reminded me of pulling clips for when we were writing our show.

And there was this part where Jackie was just like, find the clip of Ian McKellan drinking the milk. And like, you can't Google that. I'm like, I'm in the process of telling my kids what you can and can't Google. You know, my kids will be like, there's a hawk that lives in the neighborhood and I'll be like, I wonder where the hawk is. And they'll be like, Google it. I'm like, you can't Google that. Can't Google that.

You know, and you really can't Google like Ian McAllen drinking the milk in cats. Wait, so I, sorry, to go back to your question, you asked, you almost texted me at 1 a.m. But you stopped yourself. Do you think cats is going to be our future? And if so, what do you think your cats would become after they ate me? Do you think that's the, are you asking what character in cats they would become? Oh, I think they would become their own character. They would become their own jellicle.

Also, he did explain that all cats are jellical cats. It is just that. Not just the homeless cats. No, that is just in their world, they are jellical cats. And then in this same, I should have pulled this quote too. And he's like, and all the dogs are pookles. So like he said something like that where it's like, what the hell are you? What are you?

Except for that one dog, which I saw. swear to God, that dog has never been in the movie Cats. There is a scene where fucking Mistophiles saves the bleed bitch. Yeah, we still don't know her name eight times. Veronica. For Victoria. Victoria. Victoria.

And he saves her front. And then there's this dog in the other room. But the dog doesn't talk. The dog's just barking. So is that a dog's slave? And are they keeping the other animals that haven't become sentient? as slaves. Yeah, I think that the cats became sentient when they ate the humans. Right. And so the other... The dogs didn't because the dogs are loyal. And that's how we know

that the dogs wouldn't do that and they wouldn't absorb our souls. Yeah. Yeah. I, man... I know the dogs would eventually eat us too. I know that. I just don't think they become sentient. I think there's something with the cats and that like it's the certain magic within them. Maybe it's the toe beans. I don't know what they've got. I'm kind of living this life, I just realized, because I, uh, I live above a bodega and the bodega cat has been out for a few days. And so we're speculating in my family like, where could he be? And there's a cat colony close by. And I was like, he might have ran away into joy in the cat colony. They're always riving. They're always, apparently, according to the movie version of cats, at all times, they are twitching at each other and looking

at each other because you remember guys, they all went to cat school. And so they have to use their cat abilities. Well, the actors went to cat school. Did the cats go to cat school? Well, you guys... They should have said them all to fucking cat school. They all needed more of it. I just, now, if you listened or walk by, like, if you notice a cat colony, a place where people leave out food and have, like, the outdoor shelters, and you need you to stop,

take a moment and picture that just under the surface of that cat colony are a bunch of stray cats who are all singing, gelical cats with... Cellical cats! And evangelicals will angelical. And also, the whole... song is about gelicles. And during our watchalong, so many people are like, but what are gelical cats? And it's literally the chorus is, gelacles can and genitals do and gelicles do. And it's like,

that's what do they can. What can they do? Explain a little bit more. But it is just that all cats are gelical cats. And we didn't know what that meant until last night. And now we realized it's a death cult, guys. It's just a death cult. It's an apocalyptic. It's a film that's about an apocalyptic death cult. But I also need everyone to know. Not only do I think that the curse was lifted. I know that the curse was lifted. Tell me about this because I need good news right now.

While we were watching it twice in a row, I've been waiting for this box because I have to do an unboxing because Natalie and I are going to the Dreamers and Readers Festival in March. And you should totally check it out. It's in Texas. And we're going to have a big all fay ball. of a time, and it's really awesome and fantastique, is the creator of the Dreamers and Readers Festival.

They also have a collection of clothes. And so they were sending something for Natalie and I to wear, and it's part of their opening of their line. And I'm very excited about it. And I've been very excited about this package. But Natalie received her package two weeks ago. And I was like, okay, I guess my package got lost in the mail. While we were watching cats, Jeff got a notification that.

We got a package at the UPS store. He went to the UBS store. It was that box. All right. And I came downstairs from watching Gats twice high off my gourd. And I went, the curse has been lifted. So you know what?

It might. And said, how? It's about cats. It's about cats. And we never discussed it again. But you know what? The curse has been lifted. And I hope that the curse is lifted for you

because we did it. guys, this is going to be a better year than the last one, okay? Let's hope, let's work, let's sprint towards lifting the curse together. But you know, we're talking a lot about cats, but what about dogs and what about Jennifer Lawrence, Jackie, and what she said about dogs? Wow. Oh, J-law. J-law, you know, she's one of those.

she's not like the other girls. She's not media trained and everybody can tell. It is still interesting that that is still so much of the rhetoric around J-law because she's been a mega movie star for quite some time. I think at this point, we can start being like, I think she's getting the training. I know. I love this. This reminds me, my brother always repeats this.

This is an extremely niche reference. But in like 2012 in the 2012 presidential campaign, there was like a just of news. clip of Mitt Romney walking onto it trying to get on a plane and there was like a presser. People were trying to ask him questions and one of the reporters just went, what about your gaffs? And my brother repeats this phrase a lot. Like, what about your gaffes? You know, just like, what about your mistakes? And I do feel like that every story about J-law is like, what about your gaffes? Like everything she says, people are like this bitch. And at this point, I mean, okay, so what she said about the dogs is that she had a chihuahua. She had a little chihuahua and then she had a baby

and the dog bit the baby. And she, this is severe. Yes, she's not like the other girls and sometimes she does that in an annoying way, but this is like very severe. A woman can't be hot and funny at the same time syndrome because she made what is obviously a joke. A joke. Talking about her dog bit her baby. And she was like, ooh, it made me so mad. It made me want to obliterate every dog. And everyone was like, Jennifer Lawrence wants to do a dog genocide. Oh my God. She hates dogs and she's coming into my home and she's going to take my raffy. She's going to take the guitar strings even though he doesn't know how to play the guitar

and he's going to wrap around his little neck until it pops off like a gusher. This random comment that page six pulled, and I hate the way that stories are constructed by tweets. Like I don't think that just because you can construct a story in page six based on tweets and comments that that means real things are happening. But, like, that is just how news stories are written because nobody gets paid to report so they just find tweets. And they're like, everyone thinks Jennifer Lopez is doing a dog genocide. But this like-

Or Jennifer Lawrence. Jennifer Lawrence. Uh-oh. Oh, you're Jennifer washing right now. Sorry, Jay-Lo. You're not a dog killer. I can't imagine that Jay-Lo, like, I can't imagine her cuddling with a big old fluffy dog.

Like, I feel like, okay, you can get away from now. But, like, yeah, people, you know, the comments they're pulling. are like, this is so disappointing. This is not normal. It's also because she rehomes the dog. She rehomes the dog. She rehomes the dog. To her parents.

To her, this is the thing. They're talking about as if like, then she set the dog on fire and she put him out into the forest. So it would also set the forest on fire. Like, she gave the dog to her parents. Yeah. Like, the dog's okay. The dog's fine.

She didn't throw it in the trash. She even, there was a different interview she gave there where she was like, I lived in New York City. It wasn't really, like the dog didn't even really like taking walks on the sidewalk. Like some dogs love living in New York City and some are happier in like a, you know, more grassy place. And she was like, the dog is happier where he is now. And everyone's like, you're a monster.

And again, it's because she makes jokes and she's hot and everyone is like, who does this bitch think she is? And it's just a joke, but it is fun. You even just saying that I specifically had a flashback of Natalie and Henry adopted Wendy in L.A. And I'll never forget when I, because it was like right when I, I was about to move from New York to L.A. And they brought Wendy out. And you could just tell Wendy was just like, what is this place?

It is too dirty for me here. Like she wouldn't even like, she went outside, like even seeing like the rats and everything. She was like, oh, oh, I don't like it out here. It's too dirty. It's too loud. She hated it. And so that's why they were like, oh, she's an L.A. dog.

She wants to be, she wants to be in her house. It's tough, yeah. She doesn't really want to be on the streets of New York. She's just, she's just, she's a little. Putunity baby. She can't handle the big streets. Yeah, if you have a dog in Manhattan, your dog's not seeing grass on their walk.

But yeah, like, you know. She needs a grass on her paws. I, for one, understand. Yeah, you liked it, Adam. I understand that our animals are like family members. And I definitely remember thinking when I was pregnant with my first child that if my child was born and then was allergic to cats, I was like, well, I won't give up my cats.

No, shove the kid back inside until it's not allergic to cats. Isn't that how you're supposed to do it? Can I give up the child so they don't have to give up the cats? I was like actively anxious about this. And thankfully, I got to keep everybody. That's good because those kids were first on the chopping block and they didn't even know it. It's like, you better not be allergic or else this is getting bad. And what's funny is that they now love cats that much that if I told them that, they would

understand. They'd be like, yeah, I also would do anything. I do love to when they were like, you're watching a movie about cats. Why can we watch it? I want to watch it. And it's so funny between your kids and also Holden's daughter, Winnie, also, of course, no matter how much Holden hates cats, Winnie loves cats and she wants a cat so bad and she wants a cat, and I just love it for his sins.

he's going to get a cat and it's going to be great. But now also Winnie wants to watch cats as well. What are you, how are you going to get around this? Like, are you going to show it to the kids? And do you have to explain to them if we watch it again? If you open the door, you got to close the door. So you have to watch it in even numbers. Do you think that that's what's happening?

Because I'll watch it with them. I've seen it eight to ten times. What's another one to two? But all right, I'll watch. I mean, that's- You open the door. You got to close the door. We all know this.

I'll watch it with. I am trying to raise musical theater kids. So if this is... Those kind. You want Weberhead daughters? I don't want Weberheads. Is that what you need? Show them good.

I mean, not that... Of course, Jesus Christ, I'm not saying that it's not... Yeah, they're not old enough for Jesus. I'm not saying it's... I know Andrew Lloyd Weber is obviously very good. I could never do it. I can't write cats. It's okay.

You can say he's bad. I know we want Rodgerson-Hamerstine musical theater kids. Yeah, you know. Yes. Or just something a little, you know, I guess, like then make it edgy. But I guess or are you more excited because it is just about cats? I've seen.

I've shown them scenes from lay miss, but I just don't know if the part where the child is killed. Which scenes are the government is going to go again? I've shown them like look down. When she's dying and his arms and they sing the love song. Fontines death and Garoches death. Everybody dies. Yeah, that's my pitch to the.

Do you want to watch a movie where every. Everybody dies, including all the children. But so that's why I'll show them cats because, you know, I guess everybody dies in cats too. Yeah, well, at least that's their hope. Honestly, they don't all die in cats and that's what the problem is. But in Waias' cats, not to throw it back to the Lindsay Ellis YouTube that I watched after watching this, after watching the two versions of cats, she did explain too how, like, everyone thought because Hooper had made Le Miz, that he was going to be a shoe win of like, of course.

And this is going to be great because he's going to make cats. And he also won't all these Oscars. So they gave him so much money. And it lost, what was it, $95 million? I think it was a $95 million loss. It lost. Yeah. $95 million.

Yeah. And that is, what a flop to an extent that this, Why is Katz posited? Was it the death of the big musical? Is that what finally put the death now? Like, are we not going to? Because even in the YouTube video, she was like, because honestly, I don't want to see a Hades Town done like this.

I don't want to see Hamilton done. Right. Because especially with Les Mis, it's like, it's such a rich text. Like, it is a fool. So there is a lot to work with. That's the thing. People didn't even love 2012's Laymiz, but it's such a rich...

No, I didn't. I love Le Miz and I didn't love it. Yeah, but it's like such a rich text. And it's pretty straightforward. Again, it's not, we're not, we don't have problems of scale about humans and cat world. So it's pretty easy to just make it look fine, you know? That's the craziest part is that in this video, too, explaining that Hooper needed all of the sets to be practical. He needed everything.

All the sets were practical. And this is the retconning where it really doing. of cats 2019 is last night we were like, well, it's all practical and it's all CGI and it's not AI. Does that make cats 2019 good? Because it's not AI and it's practical. Do we have to now root for 2019's cats? I feel like it's like, is this the underdog story? I don't know. That we need to champion, that we need to rewrite to bring it back into the forefront of everybody's brains. He has not made anything since cats. Was he like run out of town? Like, it's also just so crazy because in watching some of the back, like the behind the scene stuff too, because Hooper was just like,

and I don't want them in the full cat suits because I don't want them to be encumbered, but I don't want them in mocap either because I don't want them to be encumbered. So instead, they have these hybrid other versions and they kept saying fur technology and they just kept saying fur technology, but what does that mean? Like, what is fur technology? So he just wanted what he wanted. And then And thusly got such shit because of it. It's what a, like, he fucked this up. And how dare them, because there was also a clip of James Corden and stupid Jenny any dots on stage and they were making jokes about the visual effects because like they

both came out in bad costumes and they're like, oh, obviously you need good visual effects. Like throwing all the visual effects people under the bus. Who should be thrown on the fucking bus? Hooper. Throw them under the bus. It's his fault. It's not the VFX people's fault. I'm going to read this.

Right, Adam. They pay them nothing. They pay them nothing. They give them no time to do anything. I want to read this section from the Wikipedia because this actually does shut a lot of light on what went wrong with cats. Cats VFX accusations. Following the release of Cats, reports came from the film's visual effects department of Hooper's hurtful, horrible, disrespectful, and demeaning attitude towards them and their work. The VFX team reportedly were forced to work upwards of 90-hour working weeks, with some employees staying at the,

offices for two to three days at a time just to finish the film. One member of the team said Hooper's treatment was, quote, pure almost slavery for us, with six months to complete the trailer, only four months to complete the film. So that is, it is, I feel bad for those guys because everyone's like, wow, the visual effects on this movie are so atrocious. You guys suck. And it's like, these people were like, we nearly killed ourselves for this film. Yeah, no.

And he does appear to kind of been run out of town on a rail. It looks like he has a project coming out in 2026. Have you heard anything, Adam, about what is Hooperin out there? No, I kind of, you know, I was never totally down with his vibe. And then I just, you know, Katz was a good jumping, you know, off point of never having to pay attention to him. Ever again, yeah. Yeah, he did the Danish girl. The Danish girl was brutal.

Yeah. I think that's where I really got off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, I never watched the Danish girl. Well, he has Henry's favorite actor in it. I know. And something tells me, he ain't eating pastries. But I would.

I guess I'd watch him eat pastries, but I don't know what's happening. And everyone hated the His Dark Materials adaptation. And that was also him. Oh, my God. That was also him? Yeah. And we, Gideon loves his Dark Materials. He's had two different cats named after characters of His Dark Materials and has several

tattoos from His Dark Materials. And, yeah, everybody was like heartbroken by how much they disliked his dark materials adaptation. Yeah, that was him. Although I know that in our chat, there's some still love for it, even though I really disliked it as well. But, you know, I do hear the cries of like, some people did like it. And I know, but I was not one of them.

But I also, to be fair, the second they started veering and interplaying stuff from the second book into the first season, I was just like, no, I can't. Well, like the book so much, can't. And my brain just couldn't process it. So, you know, maybe that's more on me. Yeah. Yeah. And similarly, I didn't hate 2012's lay miss.

I was like, I'm just so thrilled to see this brilliant text brought to the masses in a big blockbuster film. I was fine with it. But even down to the fact that like they kept talking about, sorry, I keep bringing up this YouTube video, but they were talking about this with the lay miss. Like with Tom Hooper where it's like he kept being so like sucking his own cock because he's like, I'm letting all. the singers have their singing while they're acting rather than giving them time to properly sing it out. And so there's a clip of, you know, singing, like Fantine's singing, I Dream to Dream. And it's, she can't hit the note because you can tell that she's like bent over and she is acting. But also it's like they could have dubbed over sections of.

You could have given her better. But he's like, no, because then it's better this way. It's like there's a reason why they don't do musicals like that. And it's not because it's never been done before. It's because it makes a worse product. And it also goes to show that like, oh, well, Broadway actors sing and act at the same time. Well, yeah, that's a very special skill. There is a reason.

This goes back to like Natalie saying that Whitney shouldn't be, you know, Whitney from dancing from Mormon wives shouldn't just be put on to Broadway because people spend their lives mastering the skill of being able to sing and act and dance at the same time. And to take up a whole theater. Right. Because like that's what they don't understand. And this is part of what this person was ripping Dom Hooper about. It's like someone that's making musicals that doesn't understand fundamentally the way musicals are made.

Or it's like the person that made the producers who also did the stage show. And then it was too much the opposite because then it was so much just the stage show. But it wasn't translated properly into the movie vibe. I never saw the movie because I was afraid I wouldn't like it. And I understand. And I hadn't thought about that since. And like this YouTube video that I was just like, that makes a lot of sense. Like even with Le Miz, like Le Miz is supposed to be a war that takes place in just a, like,

you're supposed to encapsulate all of that in one space. And so that makes it such a special thing. But then when you expand the world, but you still have like all. of the men saying like the man you know it's like the sound the bang great man and they're all just like standing at each other singing at each other where it doesn't make sense necessarily in the way that it's done and so it feels a lot more stilted because that's not how we usually see movies meet man i'm sorry is this a boring thing to say i find this very interesting i also find it very interesting um you know what else is there sean pen was smoking cigarettes the Golden Globes. I know, but I also know, MJ, we have to, have to, have to. We watch

the pit this week. We watch three episodes of the traders this week. Also, completely apropos of nothing, I said to Jeff that I would like to watch more Alfred Hitchcock because I've never really watched a lot of Hitchcock before, honestly ever. I think I've seen Psycho, but that's really it. I've seen the birds, but not really watching it. And Jeff was like, you know my I think one of my favorite movies of all time is North by Northwest. And I was like, okay, slow it on. I knew nothing about North by Northwest. And then at the end, I was just like, so, fuck, good.

You know, it's like one of those Godfather moments. Or it's like, wow. And he's, like, he's, of course, explaining to me because, like, and he was explaining to me about, like, and I was like, oh, it's like James Bond before James Bond, even though they had the movies or the books. But then Jeff was explaining to me that are JFK, helped make James Bond because JFK said that he liked the book so much. And like because North by Northwest was such like so good that everyone's like, yeah,

it's North by Northwest, but he's got gadgets. But it is so good. And it's nonstop. The second it is a, and so MJ specifically, Jeff was like, I'm sure MJ loves North by Northwest. Is this true? So I actually don't know North by Northwest. I was going to recommend my favorite Alfred Hitchcock movie, which is also a Jimmy Stewart movie, which is Rope, which is like one of his lesser, like, beloved movies. But it was one of the first, it was, it was like, they couldn't do single shots at the time because the film wasn't long enough.

But each shot is 10 continuous minutes. And then each cut is done like on a close up of Jimmy's. Stewart's suit or something. So then it looks like a one shot. So it feels like a play. And it's cool. It's cool. But yeah, I,

I'm like a, you know, a rear window, a rope. But yeah, I also, I'm a thriller boy. I know you love thrillers.

Yeah. And I, I want to get into all. So, all right, I'll check out rope. Yeah, do rope.

Rope is just like, because you guys are such movie, again, it's like a, I think a bit of a deep cut, but since you're such a, since you guys are such a movie buff, I think you would enjoy rope.

Well, also, you know, of course, because Jeff's got all of his factoid and his beautiful, beautiful brain. And he was explaining to me, of course, like, with the long shots and how also the cut-to-cut shots that he does and how difficult, because obviously they're working with actual film cutting and physically doing this. And Adam, hit me with a fact toy. You know, I know you got, you're full of Hitchcock factoid. Oh, I don't know.

What should I? Or what's, I would just recommend. Strangers on a train. Oh, okay. Is it, are there zombies on it? It's just about two. That's train abuse on. Yeah.

Not that exciting. It's just two gentlemen who run into each other on the train and basically kind of lightly agree to like murder people for each other. Yeah. It's great. And also apparently Farley Granger and I don't know who that is is in both rope and in Strangers on a train. So there you go.

I guess Farley Granger was the it boy. I love this. You have said that you want to start watching more old movies, so I got to make a list of my favorite old movies to recommend to you. Get them at me. Hitchcock is a great place to start. But, yes, I need my education. I need to be educated on older movies because it is,

I didn't grow up watching older movies. So I think that, and we were so obsessed, Henry, we're so into what was on the television at the time. and we weren't brought up in like a nurtured of old movies, and which my mom is always surprised by. She's like, I love all those movies. I was like, you never show, like we never had that interaction with, you know, so I'm trying to add some stuff because it's like sound to music, like all that kind of Casablanca.

Yeah. You know, it's like things like that. And not that long ago, remember when I watched Gone with the Wind? And I was like, whoa. Wow. This is great. Well, also, don't sleep on the comedies like his girl Friday. But also the, like, the Marks Brothers.

It really is like. And Jevry were just getting into, were you a Marks Brothers or Three Stooges? Oh, Marks Brothers. Marks Brothers. You're a Marks Brothers. I think that that's a little bit of like comparing apples and something that's not food. It is apples and something else because it is, because like, but if you think about it, it is still lots of physical comedy.

It's two different takes on physical comedy. Yes. That's true. Adam. Oh, I weirdly, I was more into like Chaplin and Harrowly. I wasn't as much of a Three Stooges or I mean, I still like them. Obviously, you can't not. But I would also recommend after you finish Hitchcock, you should do Powell and Pressburger

because they're like a little bit off to the side. It's a writer-director team. They're amazing. They did a movie called, well, actually it kind of caused the downfall of their relationship called Peeping Tom. Oh. Like predated Psycho by a tiny bit?

Ooh. Oh, this guy looks creepy. But they make really weird different movies. They have a movie called Black Narcissa. That's about a bunch of nuns like. And I mean, it's kind of racist here and there, of course, because it's very early on. Right. But that's kind of the.

Yeah. But anyways. I'm not going to blame it. Adam. Yeah. Why are you letting me watch these movies? But the story is. I'll recommend Charlie Chaplin, but he did marry a child.

So, you know, you can cancel him while also recommending him at the same time. That's okay. But Black Narcissa, particularly, you have to check it out because it is about a bunch of nuns in like a, you know, in a convent like far out in the jungle. And a man shows up in short shorts. A man. And they just all go insane. And that's the story. That's, I mean, this is where I'm starting.

I need that. Oh, that's what I need. It makes me think of White oleander Yeah, that's what I said It makes me think of white oleander And I won't take it back No, I was thinking of the suicide sisters

Oh, Virgin Suicide Virgins Suicides Wow, I haven't heard that That's not I was thinking of quite a while Yeah, but I would highly recommend Powell and Pressburger If you're looking for like an old movie Where you'll occasionally see stuff like, whoa, this is like way crazier

and way more interesting than someone would You know, especially in 1947. That's what I mean. Their stuff is pretty early on. And they're doing like really interesting, kind of strange stuff. The Red Shoes as well. All of their stuff is...

But not the Red Shoe Diaries. No, unfortunately not. No, they didn't get that deep into it. They began it back in 1947. That would be a very different version of the Red Shoe Diaries. I'm actually reading a 700-page book about them right now. Really? So that's why they're at the forefront of your brain.

And actually, Scorsese's main. editor, Thelma Shoonmaker. She was married to one of them for quite a while. Whoa. Scorsese, like, basically, like, saved and preserved all their movies. He's, like, a big Powell and Pressburger. Like, champion? Yes.

Oh, that's so cool. Okay. You know, and that's so, God, it's got to be such a fun place to get into because even, bringing it back to cats, that it was, you know, it was Spielberg. Was it, that's the Amblin bit, right? Yeah, Amblin. Spilberg's company. That is, like, Spielberg made cats that it's like, yeah, you know, make that movie about the cat. You know what? Everybody's screaming for it. And I can't imagine

having the money that you're just like, I'd like to, you know, preserve all of these very important movies. Or I have the money to, why don't we throw a hundred million dollars at this cat's movie? How about we just really lose a bunch in one fell swoop? It's just, Has there been a big Blackbuster musical movie since Cats? No, because he had done the greatest showman before. Right. Because the greatest showman was before Cats. Yeah.

I believe, right? I mean, look, greatest showman. That was another one of that. I mean, honestly, wicked. That's about it. Yes, yeah. Of course. But that's it.

Of course. I think. And song sung glue. What am I looking for? No, 2017. 2017. Yeah. So it is, so there, I mean,

Obviously, yeah, Wicked. And Wicked did do it well, but then there is so much still, as someone that, like, I enjoyed the movies, I had fun because I really love the musical. I'm never going to watch them ever again. Like, this is, they didn't become, you know, cats for me. Like, I don't think I'm going to watch it and find more. I don't think. I wonder, yeah, it does seem like young people really like musicals now. Like, it seems like tweens and teens really like Hamilton and they really.

and they really like, what's that other one? Sing Street. Or is that what it's called? Sing Street, yeah, with the band. Yeah. The boys band. It does seem like, like, thanks in part to Lynn Manuel Miranda, like musicals are in. And obviously, yeah, of course, of course, Wicked, the biggest blockbuster musical.

But, but, yeah, even it does feel, there's something that feels so kind of like, since it feels like Katz does feel like the end of an era, of a different era, like a big, sincere blockbuster musical. Even Wicked feels like somehow more cynical than that. I'm not sure how to explain it. It is more tongue in cheek. I feel like there is more of a, well, especially because the whole movie is shrouded in a secrecy and an upsetting overture, you know.

Right. Right. But I want to make sure before we change to talking about either the pit or traitors, I just want to make sure that we give a little shout out to the little friend reunion that happened on Instagram. Well, it happened in real life, but it was captured on Instagram, which was KJ. Epa and Cole Sprauss, hanging out together. I'm sorry. Yeah, and he was KJ.

Appa, so I didn't give a shit. Did you see the Mr. Fantasy and Robert Irwin? Yes, that's all. I know. There's a lot of KJ app. We can call this the KJ Corner because, yes, he did hang out with not only Cole, but some of the other Riviel cast was there. They looked like they were just hanging out.

And it was really cute. And I know that Cole Spouse is a bit of a baddie. But I don't think he's such a baddie that we can't. like talk about him anymore. I think he's just kind of a dirty dog who broke Lily Reinhard's heart. Yeah. He's just annoying. You know, it honestly, he gives Sean Penn, but not as bad. Yes. Not as bad. Not as bad. I guess it's more I'm thinking of the fact that Sean Penn was smoking cigarettes inside of the Golden Globes. I feel like that, that section of Sean Penn is what Cole Spouse gives. Totally. If we could bisect like the domestic abuse out of Sean Penn and he would just be like a nasty,

disgusting actor. Which would be great if we could shock that out of him. Is there a way, you know, to really just give him just a tiny lobotomy just to take it away? But, but, yeah, KJ. Appa was out as himself, which most of the comments are, oh, my God, it's you. It's not Mr. Fantasy. It's not Mr. Fantasy. I don't know who this is. Who is K.J. Appa anymore? I'm not thinking about him. And then he does a fun little romp with Robert Irwin, which was also a great time. We've got to root for both Mr. Fantasy and Robert Irwin deeply.

I just couldn't root for both of them more. I am just over the moon. I loved the content of them together. Can I just say thank you to everybody who sent us the content of them together? Now that we're talking about this and you're listening to this, it is also going to show up on your feed. So I hope you enjoy it as well. Yes. And that I just, I know that there's that, like, I did get some messages of people being like,

are you going to talk about Timothy Busfield and or Busfeld? And I just don't think I have anything to say about it. No. I was kind of fun when everyone thought he was on the run. And then he was like, I wasn't on the run. I was driving. It's like, okay. Okay.

Okay, so you and Melissa Gilbert, oh yeah, you just knew? Okay, great. All right, everybody knew there were multiple quiet things from years past. Okay, great. Oh, good. I mean, he's fucking ran at children's theater. So, yeah, I don't, I all, yeah, that's just, you know, that's, I got nothing to say about that. And also, I didn't know that guy's name.

I feel like he's one of those. Oh, it's that guy. Definitely. That guy from West Wing. And now that guy is going to be, I'm going to mix him up with the other red-haired pedophile of our youth. And I'm going to also call it. Maybe I'm going to call them both. I think I say the name wrong. I have to think about it. It's Jeffrey Jones is the other one. Also, I just think, I know that the West Wing. Not our comedian friend, Jeffrey Joseph. The Westwick, I know was like a very important show to many people. It was like their comfort show. Oh yeah. And they walk and they talk. And I love Allison Janie. And I love Bradley. Whitford. And I have seen many seasons of West Wing.

You have. Oh, interesting. Also say, I don't remember anything. Like, I just remember CJ. And I, I think, I think the earnest admiration, between the earnest admiration for the, like, institutions of government and the petos and stuff. I think West Wing might be one that we put on the shelf for a little while. But I never had a big attachment to the West Wing. I just have a lot of strong feelings about Aaron Sorkin. And they are negative. But I know, again, I know a lot of people love West Wing. And I don't want to take that away from you. I love a overwrought network drama as well. But I'm just, it is a bit of a blow to the West Wing is all I'm going to say, this guy. But that's all I got

to say about that. But again, like you said, or I feel like I don't really want to watch a government show right now. I don't think any West Wing. And like maybe seriously nostalgic liberals are like, let's watch what the government used to be noble. But I'm not. sure if that is happening. If that's your comfort show, sound off. I would love to hear about it. Yeah. Let us pitch it to us. Be like, no, you guys are so wrong. They don't just walk fast and talk fast. There's more than walking and talking. And I know there's more. I know there's more. I know there's more than that. But traitors. Traders. MJ. We, I know we probably shouldn't spoil it, but I will say the first three episodes came out last week. And I am watching it. You should be

watching it. I am. If you, if you don't want to be spoiled, I will say this might. be the last time. We're not going to spoil it because I think that we should be talking about this openly because it is, I can't believe, can't just say out the gate, this spoils nothing. Rob from Love Island from a couple of years ago, Snake Boy, who I loved on Love Island because I tell you, I really thought the guy didn't have two sticks in that beautiful head of his to rub together to make any kind of flame. I thought there was nothing happening.

He's covered in big snake tattoos. He is a snake wrangler. And I remember him on Love Island that it would just be these like big titty girls and they're just like bouncing on him. And he's like, like, ah, oh, my God. He's like, I like snakes. You know, there was a lot,

you could tell his brain was usually on snakes and not about the woman that was sitting on his lap, which is fine. But... I did it. When he first showed up on traitors, I was like, oh, Jeff, this guy is. I was like, he's got, he's dumber than a bag of rocks. And he's chosen as a traitor.

Again, is up top, we're not spoiling anything. And I'm, is he the Dillenephron of this season? I think that I have weirdly, I'm like, oh my God, is he doing a great job? Oh my God, am I going to fall in love with the snake wrangler from Love Island? Yeah. No, I'm liking him. I still have to say that this, for me, this is a lift. I find the challenges to be so stupid.

And I don't know why I can tolerate the dumb challenges on like love is blind. And these challenges on the traders, I'm just like, this show is so long. And there's so many people. And I, again, I have no problem keeping track of every last person on love is blind or, you know, the other one, perfect match or whatever. But then with this, I'm like, there are 30 people sitting at this roundtable right now. How am I supposed to keep track? You don't have to care about all of them. You don't have to care about all of them.

And then you will start to care about, you pick your faves. Mama Kelsey. And you start championing them. You know, it's like Mama Kelsey. I really, it was fun to watch her. I love that she openly, Mama Kelsey is on. She watched the other season. Like she was a genuine fan of traders before coming on the show.

and I do love that for her. Do you think she... I love that. Everybody's scared of her. Everyone's scared of her because they don't want the Swifties to be mad at her, but she comes off as very earnest,

sincere mom. And I think the question is, under that earnest sincere mom, is there somebody who's a bitch who's willing to weaponize the fact that she looks like an older lady to be, you know, conniving and because people

will always underestimate an older woman. We know this. And so she is really in a very advantageous position and because everyone's terrified of her because no one wants Swifties to be mad at her. And, you know, we understand that here at page seven because the Swifties, they don't like it

when you say anything bad about anyone in that orbit. No. But yeah, she is an interesting, she's an interesting one. And what's keeping me coming back, if you're skeptical on starting traitors, is Alan coming. He's perfect in every way. Yes. And so you can just watch it for him.

And I do love that Lala's a part of the show, which is just him bringing his dog with him because he has to shoot. And then everybody loves Lala so much that now Lala's kind of. of a mascot of the show. Yeah. But it is, it's like, yeah, it's, it's, I know you love it and I am going in with my whole heart,

but it's like there's, it is the, it's the Olympics of reality television because it's like there's, there's the gamers they call them, which is like the big brother and survival. There's the reality stars. Yeah. The athletes. You know. Yeah. Also, Ken, we just, it's like, Michael Rappaport is doing such a wonderful job of being Michael

Rapaport. Just did this fucking guy every time you see him. This fucking God. But there is, they are giving him the worst edits. You can tell that everyone in that editing room

hates Michael. And the cast all hates. Everyone who's been eliminated so far is like he's awful. Like, he's either, he's either a very bad trader or he's a very bad

hope. What's that what they call? Faithful. Faithful. And I love that they just keep saying that to his face because he's just so selfish. And he's just such a big fucking shitty baby.

What did Porsche call him a big overblown toddler? Yes, which is a very nice way of saying it. I, because I feel like she could have gotten a lot meaner. He even kept screaming. At one point, he's like, and I'm the most attractive, faithful. I am the most attractive one. He said that multiple times in his defense. Yeah.

That he's an attractive, faithful. My only concern is that I don't, because he is, he does, because he's so obnoxious, it makes for good reality TV. But I'm like, no, I literally want you out of here. You know, like, I don't want you to be working. How do you feel about Kristen from Top Chef though? I don't mind seeing more. I like seeing more. Chris, I do.

I don't know that out there. I was like, I forgot her name, but I like looking at her. She's great. We stopped watching Top Chef because it was like, no, I think she is a she, she pronouns. It was like, we lost Bravo at some point. point in the mid, in the teens, me and Gideon and I like lost everything with cable. I lost everything. We used to always, we used to never miss a season of Top Chef, and it was before, before her.

But like, I'll just, if you've been on Top Chef, I like you. Wow. And I mean, not, you know, some of the chefs are bitches. I don't like Brooke Williamson, who's Bobby Flay's new girlfriend. I hate her. Oh, my God. I hate her. And I hate how much in the freaking headlines they are.

and they're dancing and kissing. Ugh, they're gross. But yes, Kristen. Oh, no, don't say this to me. And now it's going to be in my feed. I don't want to see it. It's, she was, I hate, you know, the whole, I love Top Chef, but like many cooking shows, it suffers from.

I see your cat trying to eat you right now. Literally, the cat is in front of the screen. The cat never does this. The cat is planning on absorbing your soul. Sparkle Darth is looking you up and down right now being like, I can't wait to sup upon your skin. Yeah, the algorithm is listening. but so are the cats.

I see their butthole. Anyway, Brooke. And I know that cat has a butthole. Brooke Williamson was one of these people where it's like, oh, good, the white woman who like does ethnic recipes well won as opposed to like, I think she was, I don't even remember the details of the season.

I just remember I was rooting for like so many people besides her. And then she won. Top Chef suffers a little bit from the like, oh, can you like do other people's cultures better than them? You know, the Bobby Flay problem. But that's probably why they're together. Because he loves to do other people's Cultures claim to do them better.

Claim to do the better. Yeah, in their own establishments, in fact. Yes. But anyway, yes. Mommy Filet, you drive me quicker. But Kristen from Top Chef is great, and I love her. And she's, she's also, can I even, cat, get out of here.

What is the cat? Oh, the cat is planning the takeover. It's happening today. Be careful, MJ. They're watching you while you sleep. They're waiting for their time to shine, and they can't wait to be, just, oh, slucking at milk bars in 15 years' time.

Well, you know, I'll do anything for them. And if they want to kill me and eat me, I'll allow it. Wow. I, you know, I guess I'm impressed by your love for them. I'd be scared. But I'm not scared for Donna because I think that I want Donna to just be, I want her to be a bitch. Yeah. Yeah.

That's the thing. Can she be a bitch? And honestly, it'll be fun even if she doesn't become a bitch just because everyone is like, who's this old lady? Oh, she's Taylor Swift's mother-in-law. Also, I can't help but notice Tara Lipinski is like really serving. She's really, you know, I feel like everybody tries to show up with fun outfits on. But Tara Lipinski is like, you don't remember that I'm an ice skater. And I'm going to remember. I'm going to remember. I'm going to remember. for you. And I'm going to tell you because every time they show Johnny, she's like, and we are both ice skaters. It's like to remind you, I am an ice skates. It's like I remember Tara Lipinski from our youth. I remember Johnny We are. I remember them as ice skaters. But she's benefiting from the fact that nobody knows who she is. Because even her and Johnny are like, yeah, nobody really knows we're friends because nobody really knows ice skating. That's that we're ice skaters. That's to their benefit. They're like, nobody will see us as an alliance because nobody cares enough about ice skating. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But we do here. We know who you are and you really are, wow, talk about advanced hats. She's been living advanced hat game and it is impressive. That's your theme for 2026, advanced hats?

Well, technically it's live in moss. I am just trying to as a whole live more moss. Yeah. And I think that everyone could really add that into their lives as long as they are watching cats in numbers. And, you know, before we go, I don't know, all I could say about the pit is that so far season two is delivering. There's only one episode that has come out as of the time we are recording left on a big old cliffhanger that I scream texted to Jackie about. It's so funny because it's like you could hear the scream through the country. What's wrong.

Yeah, yeah. But also it is so upsetting. Every time I watch it, I'm like, why am I watching this? Like I'm too old. So upsetting. Like, like, I think that ER may have given me like a life's long anxiety of something terrible happening. Like, I think that ER shaped me cognitively.

Like, I was so afraid of like traumatic accidents happening when I was a kid. Like, deeply afraid. And then now I'm watching this. And I'm like, now I've like, like, I don't have a lot of medical trauma, but I've like, you know, I've had a couple of surgeries and a couple of. when bad things happen. I'm like, watch it. I'm like, do what? Can I? Can I? But then, you know, you just watch Dr. Robbie take care of it and it gives you this like primal comfort that you can't explain. But it is, it is, I, even watching the first episode, I was like, I don't know if I've got,

if my mental health can, can handle this. But yet I, but yet I can't stop. We persist. Yes, yeah, no, I have to. I need to know. It is funny because my, I think I had said this, but my mom had just watched the first full season. And she's like, I can't watch it week to week. She's like, I can't do it. I just can't do it. And I was like, Mom, that's crazy. How are you not going to watch it?

And then I watched that first episode. I'm just like, God, how could I wait? Yeah. Till next week. Yeah. But you do. You know, this is part of it. It's part of the excitement.

I love a cliffhanger. This is great. Yeah. Yeah. No, I'm, I'm pro. And yeah, and Noah Wiley, again, has just become America's most outspoken health care reform advocate and, you know, I guess that's good. I guess, but then it's like, yeah, is he going to fall in love with this woman in one day? Who knows? You think you're going to try and force? You think they're

going to jackhammer a little dick action? Oh, God. I hope not. I didn't even, honestly, I didn't even think of that. I view Dr. Robby as deeply sexless despite, not about dreams. Despite me wanting to kiss him. Yeah. So I don't know. But I just, I just love, I love all the little Nepo babies in it. I love Brian Cranston's daughter. I love that Catherine Lanasa, the charge nurse is back. She's back. You know they couldn't keep her away. And who's the other NEPO? The other one with bangs. Fiona Douriff. Brad Duref's daughter. Yes, Brad Duref's daughter. Which and her having to deal with that guy that like is definitely scary who got hit in that like probably got hit in the head or something. That's every scene between the two of them just like, oh God. That's the thing. What is?

What is this doing to my chest? What is, like, my heart health is, as a person who's about to turn 40, can my heart health handle this television show? Yes, you can because we put it into the show. You know, it's like COVID-19, when it first happened, we were trying to watch stuff that was more upsetting than our current life. Right, right, right, right. Sometimes you just need something that's more upsetting that you can funnel it all into. Yeah. And that is the beauty of binge watching television or watching it week to week.

Yeah. Yeah, no, you're right. That's why the traders knows what they're doing because they give us three episodes every week. That's great. And Traders is one of these two where it's like, oh, do you have six hours on your hands? Because that's how much time you're going to need. I will say every time it does the like, and there's blood in the fire. Like every time they do that, we usually will like skip at least a couple of 10 second chunks, you know.

Oh, I'm skipping a little bit. I'm like, okay, I get the gist of this beach challenge. Let's get to the good stuff, you know. Mm-hmm. Because it's all about the interplay, and that's what we're here for. And also, I hope you were here today to talk about cats as much as we did. I bet you didn't expect it. Or maybe it did because you joined us during cats.

And I hope that this unpacking conversation was something you needed as well because, like, like I said, I had to go watch an hour-long YouTube about cats after I watched it twice because I could have watched it again. And I do think that in the future, I want to go further. Yeah, yeah. I want to watch it multiples of two, and I want to see how many pairings we can do. Yeah, yeah. No, this is just the beginning, which is wild because it's not the beginning. It's the middle, but it's also the beginning.

It's not the end. But it is the end of this episode. It is the end of this episode. And we love you guys very much. You have made it there. And we thank you for going on these journeys with us. Yes. We need you guys.

Thank you so much for joining us every week. definitely go check out on the page 7 Patreon. We're going to pop up both movies, and you can watch it with us. You don't even have to give HBO your money. Just come give it to us instead over on the Patreon directly to the creators, because Tom Hooper doesn't fucking need it. And my name is Jackie Zabrowski. You can follow me and Jack That Worm over on Instagram.

You can come hang out over at Who's the Bitch? Oh my God, with Kara Klank, who was on our episode yesterday. And also LPN, deep dives are romantic see. We are soon going to be finishing up the second book of Crescent City. But we're also going to be starting a bunch of new fun stuff here in the studio because stuff is moving. Stuff is changing. Stuff is going to be all on video soon. And everything is getting a facelift.

And hopefully it's more like a Chris Jenner facelift than like any other facelifts. Because I want to look like I'm. blinking my lips and I'm 16 years old. You can also join our Patreon. Patreon. Patreon.com slash page seven podcast. We're having a great time over there. You can email us at page seven podcast at gmail.com.

We really love hearing from you. We know that it is a difficult time out there, guys, and we appreciate you. And we are really striving to, you know, be safe. Yeah, be a community here and make you guys feel like you're not alone, wherever you are. And yes, be safe and all love to Minneapolis. And we will see you guys next week. Bye, everybody. Bye.

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