Painkiller Already - Painkiller Already #408

Episode Date: October 19, 2018

On this week's PKA, we've got professional poker player and YouTube, Doug Polk joining us on the podcast this week. The guys spend A LOT of time talking about the poker and the complexities involved with playing it at such a high level. Then everyone finally gives their 2 cents on UFC 229 and the events that followed post Conor/Khabib fight and then things are capped off with some silly videos.

pka 408 sans woody for now kyle yeah a couple ads tonight we got casper stitch fix uh smart mouth chegg audible and uh monster energy espresso we'll talk about those guys later on in the show but yeah this is new and improved woody this is young woody right this is he goes by doug now no no this is young woody that's what we. No, this is young Woody. That's what we're going with. I'm a big fan of Doug. Doug's got a poker YouTube channel that I watch a lot.

I played a ton of poker when I was maybe, I guess, like 22 and 25 or something. That's kind of what I did for a living. I played a bunch of cash games. And like in my area, there was two or three cash games that kind of what I did for a living. I played a bunch of cash games. And like in my area, there was a ton of,

there was two or three cash games that kind of rotated. And it was one and $2 blinds, which is kind of small, but it was no limit because everybody was obsessed with no limit. So the pots would get up to two or $3,000 sometimes. And that's sort of what I did and what I loved for a long time. And I used the money that I won from that to kind of finance everything that I've done since then. Really, it all started with

you know, 10 or 15 grand that I won. Do you feel lame as shit going like yeah, $1, $2 blinds and you're talking to a guy who's like nodding along as he made his millions in that game. It's like if I was like, yeah, wait, Mr. Gretzky, before you continue, I played a mean goalie in street

hockey. It's a good introduction. And frankly, everyone has to start somewhere, right? Unless you're from money, you're going to have to start playing at the low stakes. That's kind of the standard journey that everyone goes on when they play poker. They start at the low stakes, move on up, find better games, try to improve, try to learn, try and refine their skills. So I think it's a cool story. It's a story that a lot of people have.

They get involved in poker in some capacity, find a way to make money from it by, you know, outwitting the other players. And then that kind of leads them down the road to other avenues if they want to or stay in poker. But yeah, it's a great game, man. You were really, really good at this. Like, were you really young when you figured out you're like outsmarting your dad and his friends or how'd that get going? There are some people that are much more like natural poker talents. I don't think I'm one of those guys. They're the guys who just they put 10 bucks on and they just crush from the get go. And they always really got it.

I just generally outworked people. I'm not saying that I was bad at the game by any stretch when I started playing. But, you know, I had a background kind of in video games and playing at a competitive level in, uh, this game called Warcraft three was the one that I played a lot of. So, uh, I worked my way towards the top in that game. And then someone was like, dude, you spent all these hours grinding video games for no reason, like play poker, man. Like this is the clear play. So I was like, oh, it's gambling, right? You can't, you can't gamble. And then I looked it up and it's against people, not against the house. The house just takes a cut. So I realized that by, you know, you can play this game against people and if you're better than them

you make money and from that like that moment right out of the gate I was hooked just the fact that you could play strategy games for money against people um that concept I mean it's an amazing concept it's so great that game exists know, you can't have this in chess. You can't have chess for high stakes, you know, high stakes chess matches because you just know who's better. You each have an ELO rating, right? So you know your exact rating. And if you're an 1800 and that guy's a 1900, you're not going to be like, oh, yeah, I'll bet you 50K. I'll bet you're not going to do that.

And correctly, correct me if I'm wrong here, but like I've heard of like I know guys who play chess. I don't play chess. I know the rules of chess, but I would never call myself a chess player. And I've played them online and I know they're very good. No, no. Well, it's a complex game. It's very difficult. And so what I would do to troll them is I just set up an AI game and I'd mirror their movements and I, you know, play on very hard. And they're just like, this guy's ridiculous. You just started playing. I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah. And they're just like, this guy's ridiculous. You just started playing. I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Move, move, move, move, move.

And I'm just cheating. So I would think that that would be a concern if you were actually playing for money in chess, whereas poker, it seems. Oh, there was nothing worse. I was in chess club in middle school, and there was nothing worse than the mirror move guy, the guy who just did exactly what you did. No, no, no. That's not what I was doing, Taylor. guy. The guy who just did exactly what you did. No, no, no. That's not what I was doing, Taylor. Like I said, like I'm playing against a person on one window and on the other window, I have an AI game going and I just... Oh, so you just mimicked the moves of the good guy on a different game. That's hilarious. I take the good guy's moves and I throw them against a hard AI and now they're

playing against the hard ass AI that they probably can't beat. It's incredibly frustrating. When the good guy actually beat you, were you like, well, it's all my guesses from here. No more moves. That never happened. I think a lot of the high-end play, and I could be totally wrong because I'm not in the high-end chess scene, but I bet you it has moved over to rapid games where it's just like two or three minute long games to minimize people doing that, because I don't think that idea is like a particularly crazy one. Right. That, you know, you have another screen. You're inputting your opponent's moves to see what happens. So, yeah, I imagine it shifted. But, you know, poker poker is really great at masking your true ability because like let's just take, you know the the best example of poker is the main event right ten thousand dollar buy-in thousands of people play the winner makes like

seven to twelve million depending on which year you wanted in crazy crazy shit wait the actual player makes that much yeah the player wins twelve million yeah so you buy over ten thousand and you win seven to twelve million depending on what year it is, basically, if you win the tournament. And so you look at those winners and you're like, man, thousands of players, like every year it probably gets like 7,000 is 7,000 ish entries. That guy's got to be really good, right? No, that guy doesn't have to be good. There are many years. That guy is terrible. There are many years. That guy is like, like maybe bottom 10% of the people, maybe not bomb 10, but you know, bomb 25% of people, maybe not bottom 10, but bottom 25% of people that even played that tournament.

But you just can get lucky, man. There's a lot of luck in poker. If we played poker, right, and your strategy every hand was, I'm all in, and you just did that over and over again, I would only have something between 55% to 75% chance to beat you

depending on how many chips we had. So there's no way for me to just beat you every time. It's not like basketball, right? If you decided to take on LeBron and some one-on-one, you're going to win 0% of the time. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter how he's going to beat me at least six out of 10 times away from you, right? Like if you had one hand, you'd never win. It doesn't matter. Poker is not like that. Really, world-class players will lose to total scrubs quite often. And that's beautiful because that makes people want to actually play. They're willing to gamble money. You've always got a fighting shot in poker no matter how bad you are.

I always thought that when it said – I've never really watched poker, but I'd see it on ESPN, like during dinner, like between other sports games. And it'd be like, so-and-so Nganou in for 10, you know, could win 10 million. And I always thought like, all right, there's clearly this dude in the baseball cap and glasses and the $6 Amazon t-shirt is not about to win 10 million. There's some chic or Saudi dude or some Chinese guy who runs a big warehouse that's like backing all this. And this is like their hobby. Instead of buying a nice Arabian racehorse, this is what they do.

I didn't know that it was actually the players winning all this shit. That's insane. The players actually win. The players actually win, yeah. But they have to fight a little harder than Naganu did in his last fight, but that's a little bit of a different story. I'm glad you caught that. Yes.

Oh, yeah. That's a fighter's name, isn't it? Yes. Nganou beats people up. Negreanu plays poker. He's a Canadian fella. That was pretty close. Don't you?

I went to your channel like an hour ago, and I saw there was a little montage of Negreanu saying things. Do you have some sort of a beef with him or some sort of maybe an issue with how he does things? Tell me about that. For those who don't know, Daniel Negreanu is a very famous professional poker player. Seems like a really nice guy. At least that's his image, that he's sort of a fun-loving, sort of smiling and talkative kind of. He's not the blow-up-in-your-face-and-get-angry kind of poker player.

He's not like Phil Hellmuth or Mike Bass or some of those guys. So to understand the story, you have to understand some context, which is online poker is in kind of a weird place right now in that there's one company that controls a very large majority of all online poker being played. They're named PokerStars. They probably have 65, 70% of all online poker revenue, if I just had to kind of ballpark. And so what happened basically was seven or eight years ago, there was a day called Black Friday, which is the US government, the DOJ, enforced one of its rules and essentially took a bunch of money from these online poker sites and said, you can't offer poker in America to American citizens. It's against our laws. So the overall market consolidated down to just mainly one company, which was PokerStars. They're now the largest operator worldwide by quite a margin.

Dan LeGranu is the head spokesman for that company. Now, what this company started to do, they changed hands. Someone bought them out, a company called Amaya bought them out for like $5 billion or something, something reasonable, right? $5 billion. And they started to make changes because now no longer was it owned by someone who loved poker, prior guy's name, Isaiah Sheinberg. It was now owned by this gambling company that, prior guy's name, Isaiah Sheinberg.

It was now owned by this gambling company that's like, we've got to grind these people down for every last cent they got because that's what we're here to do. We're here to grind people down. People love slot machines, and we're going to grind them down like the slot machine grinders that they are, right? Which sucks. If you're a poker player, what you love about the game is kind of what I talked about earlier.

There's strategy, and you're outwitting people, and it's a really cool, well-put-together game. But no, now we're going to treat you like you're some gambling addict degenerates. And you could see this through the practices they started to put in the site. They started to increase the amount of money they took from the players, the rake. They started to take away game types where good players had a lot of edge, right? Because you can't have people winning. That's not what we're here for. They started to – they had a lot of edge, right? Because you can't have people winning. That's not what we're here for.

They started to – they did a lot of shady stuff. Essentially, there were these rewards that they offered players to play. If you play here all year, you play a certain amount of hands, we're going to give you a bunch of money. People played there all year. October came. They said, actually, we're not going to give you that money that we promised you. Oh, shit. What are you going to do about it, right?

What are you going to do? We're poker stars. Where are you going to play? We know you've you gotta play here they did another really shady thing with affiliates where basically um they had all these affiliate deals where if you run a player you get a cut of their uh rake for the rest of their life and they told all the affiliates we're not going to honor that shit anymore because a new owner and like frankly what are you guys going to do about lots of like these like power like power moves on on people that didn't deserve it. And just slowly started to fuck over more and more people in the community until, until, you know, it's like, what's left, where are the morals that

we want stood for? And Negronu was the head guy. He was like the, he was the guy that's the face of the site. And I, and so when this started to happen, he said, Oh, I'm going to talk to them. My resignation's in play. Okay. A couple months go by. Turns out everything was okay. Turns out all this bad stuff's going on. And he says, actually, guys, we've got some exciting stuff coming up this year.

We've got some stuff you're really going to like. And nothing happened. It was just more and more money being taken from the players. More and more games being removed. And no one was even sticking up for the players. No one was like, basically, because the thing is this. If you take a stance against this site, who's going to like, you're not going to get sponsored. You risk making money. You're risking, you know, basically being attacked by the majority player in this community. Poker is a fairly small space in terms of how

many big names there are. They're all going to, a lot of them are going to hate you. This is career suicide for most people, but luckily I don't really need any of that stuff. I have my own company. I don't need anyone to say that I can and can't do things. So I was like, someone's got to step in and stand up for the players here. So Negron did this interview where he's on his couch, and he's trying to explain why it's actually better for the house to take your money. It's actually better, Because here's the theory.

It's a solid argument. I can see. Solid argument, right? Solid argument. It's actually better because if they take your money, more of your money, well, the good players can't play anymore. Ah, now that makes sense. Yeah, perfect sense. It doesn't make any fucking sense.

How dumb does he think his fans are if he's spouting stuff like that? So anyway, I turned that into a huge, like, basically meme that more rake is actually better. And yeah, I just tried to, like, joke about it as many places as possible. And then this summer, so the World Series of Poker is played at the Rio, which is, you know, a big casino in Las Vegas. And I realized that they had a billboard for sale for the summer in front of the Rio, which is a big casino in Las Vegas. And I realized that they had a billboard for sale for the summer in front of the Rio. And I rented

out the billboard and just had it say WarRakeIsBetter.com with a video to that montage you're referencing. And I just had it for the whole summer in front of the Rio. Ah, so Daniel DeGrawi hates you. What a troll purchase. I love that. Man, nothing better than a good old-fashioned fuck you billboard yeah oh so good so so tangible so that's great no real and like this is revealing

how little i know about gambling or anything it does rake just mean like the percentage that is taken from you that's like it's like oh you win 100 grand the rake used to be five percent but you know it's actually better if it's 18%. Is that kind of what it is? You hit the nail right on the head. Succinctly put, it's exactly what it is. The rake is the cut the house takes. So these companies, they're just doing whatever it takes to make money.

And what's the sad thing about poker in some ways, or probably one of the most sad things, is that there aren't really that many people left just trying to stick up for the game and trying to protect the integrity of it and the future of it and people getting involved. And one thing that I see as a content creator, I can see the demographics for the people that are watching my content. And there is a noticeable lack of young people getting involved in the game. And it's a variety of factors. Obviously, the U.S. government stepping in probably had something to do with that. But if we keep treating people, poker players, like they're just random gambling degenerates,

then what's going to happen is eventually that's what it will become. And I'm afraid of where that leaves the game in the future. So I'm basically just trying to stand up for the community. And this game gave me everything, man. Like I started poker with nothing, like legitimately nothing. And I made millions and millions of dollars from that game. And so I just feel like it's something that I feel like it's the right thing to do. And it just makes me sad to see someone like Negrreanu, who used to be one of the voices of reason, one of the guys who stuck up for the players. Well, it's all – it's fine to do that until it's like, oh, yeah, we're going to pay you millions of dollars to say the other thing. It's like, eh, I'll take the money.

It's just kind of sad. Do a lot of the pros and guys, like the high-level guys like yourself, Negreanu and all of them, like is there a problem at all at that level of people who genuinely have gambling problems and they just happen to be really good? Or is it like at that high of a level? No, this is a business like, like it's a tough question to answer because you have to quantify what, what constitutes a gambling problem. Like, let me give you an example. Let's say you're a doctor, right? And you just couldn't stop helping people. Like, let me give you an example. Let's say you're a doctor, right?

And you just couldn't stop helping people. Do you have a doctoring problem? I wouldn't know if you're just like, because it's your job and you're good at it. So, so if you play poker and you make money and you're good at it, is it a problem or not? And I would say no, it wouldn't be a problem. It would only be a problem similar with like drinking or smoking or something where like it starts to negatively impact other aspects. So if you're a professional poker player and you were gambling so much, you're making dumb risks and losing your money and like not reflecting well on your brand and everything.

Then, yeah, I would say that was a problem. But if you're just really fucking good and you know when to stop and like how much how to do it, like, no, that's not a problem. For example, like like it's been a couple years now but but like i was following mike madisal's career you know you never i never know like what's actually going on in these people's real bank accounts because there are a lot of situations where the players are being staked and i'm sure there's a lot of drama put up for the cameras but watching mike madisal's hair fall out rapidly watching him basically watching him go from like rage to just look like he was going to cry so many times and and you know he would he would be like you know sammy farha's at

the other end of the table he's like sammy can you can you stake me 50 can you give me 50 you know they're playing the big cash game that's televised i wanted to ask about that later how legit that is because you know i i honestly i don't know. Does stake mean somebody else has to, like, pay for you? He's borrowing money or he's borrowing money with the idea that he's only taking a percentage of what he wins. And, you know, the guy, he's basically backing his loss. But him in particular, I would feel bad watching him play, especially cash games, because I felt like this is money that he needed. And a lot of times maybe it was money he did. He was losing money they didn't have.

Yeah. So Mike, Mike specifically, again, you never know what's going on with someone and all their finances. I do know that Mike had some health problems that were unrelated to, to gambling. Um, and so I, I don't want to get too much into it, but you know, he definitely had some, some things that he had to go through,

which, which kind of sucked for him. Awkward moment, by the way, who's this guy? We don't know this guy. This is a private Skype call. What the fuck are you doing?

We're recording an episode of our podcast. What's going on? Is this your friend, Doug? She has some elderly man has wandered into our into our skype chat can you get him out here he's hiding but we know he's there we know he's there i can see his reflection and his play button as he is wanted to bring up oh wow that's framed that looks nice back there yeah i i i've got i've got like the shitty one it's like the busto version over here

i hit a hundred thousand subscribers i think six years ago and i've never never never never applied oh yeah mic check mic check yeah you sound good buddy all right man hey i'm learning lots about gambling and professional gambling. Well, I mean, I've learned a lot. Kyle probably already knew quite a bit. I didn't know anything. I'm asking basic bitch questions. Yeah, we're talking about a player that I was wondering, like, what's going on with him?

Because I've always felt bad. It seemed like when he lost, it really meant like he lost. So what were you saying about Mike Matusow? I was just saying that I think he went through some health stuff. So I don't really, I wouldn't really say that's related to, to any of the gambling, but let me tell you, let me tell you a good story here. Okay. So when you're talking about gambling and losing, I remember playing in this game, uh, in the game very vividly, it was like 2011 and it was a fairly high stakes game. The buy-in was something like 10 or $20,000.

And it was in LA and I don't really play in LA often. I was in the area. I was like, I'll stop by and play this game. Stop by, I'm playing and there's this middle-aged guy at the table and he ends up all in on the turn and the other guy ends up having a beat and he loses every dollar in front of him

and he bursts out crying, tears sobbing down his face and I was like, oh my God, this guy just lost everything. Like this is over. Sobbing and no one even moves. No one even acts. The guy's just taking his money.

And I'm like, this is like, this is really sad. And then he pulls out $15,000 out of his pocket, puts it back on the table. And the guy on my other side goes, he does that every time. I'm like, what? What a cunt.

He just will go is it a hail mary that maybe the guy lets him keep it i don't know oh i see what you did oh that was great right just every time i lose start the waterworks to see if maybe you let me win and then then you know i've only gambled twice in my whole life and that might even be a lie it might have only been once i've been to a casino twice and walking around in there like and i've heard this from friends who gamble way more and in other places in vegas and whatnot there is an insanely high percentage of asians in every single casino what is that like is that just a bigger part of their culture? No, you have to tell me.

What am I, what am I suspicious racism is? Hey, nothing wrong with noticing patterns, but you just walk around and you're like, man, if I went to the subway right over there, there would not be this higher percentage of Asian people. This is a very Asian- What you're saying is they like math and that's why they're doing the gambling. Cause maybe they just, maybe they just beat our asses in it so bad. They're like,

Oh, I go take more money from Whitey today. I think it's a more cultural thing. I think gambling is a bigger part of their culture. I also think that, um, showing that you have money and power is a bigger thing in their culture. I think – I don't really know for sure, but –

Never let being unsure stop you from making declarative statements. There you go. You certainly don't. I think in some areas, there are a lot more Asian people than other places. Like in Vegas, it's not really like that. It's mainly white people or it's a mixture of everything. But in some areas like in Vancouver, for example, where it's like, you know, or something like that, then yeah, or California or LA or areas like that tends to be, to be much more Asian. I think it's a little

bit culture, but mainly just the demographics, the location you're in. So I don't know where the casino you were in was, but yeah. St. Louis, which is why I noticed it. Cause we don't have a super high percentage of asian people here so it was interesting but that makes sense if you were recommending to me someone who doesn't know anything about gambling i definitely couldn't go play poker without getting smashed i don't even know all the hands and everything what are the other fun games that you played not seriously just kind of dabbling or if you're talking about gambling specific like like

craps or like the other game when i say gambling i just mean the games at casinos any serious poker player uh doesn't really do any other form of gambling like major form of gambling the the exception might be might be sports betting because there is some room to have edge there but most of the games you're just guaranteed gonna lose like when you put money on the craps table, you know, it's actually kind of a funny way of looking at it. When you, let's just say you bet $10 on a roulette wheel and it spins, right. And something happens, but whatever happens is just a distraction. What actually happened was your $10 is now worth $9 and 50 cents. Okay. That's what, that's what really happened. Sure. Maybe you doubled up or you hit

a number or you bricked or you lost it, or, but that's all just a distraction. You lost 50 cents and every time you bet you lose 50 cents and there are 5% of your bet. And so like, uh, what, what casinos do is they try and make the, the payout structure. It's like interval payout structure for the name of the exact term for it. But basically they try to make it as addictive as possible by varying the payout scale to keep you like hooked, like, you know, slot machines. So slot machines are, are always the biggest, the most common game on a casino floor. And the reason is simple. Uh, it's, it's got the best dollar per square foot on that location. They make the most dollars per square foot of space. Uh, and also it's the most addictive

because they can really tailor that, like the, the, that like the payouts to really get you that fix. Yeah, just enough of a taste to keep you coming back. And so what it does is every time you pull a slot machine, you're turning a dollar into like 97 cents. It depends on wherever you're at. But that's what's happening. You're turning a dollar into 97 cents every time. It's just – it's like confusing. Like you mainly just lose the dollar. But sometimes you're at. But that's what's happening. You're turning a dollar into 97 cents every time. It's just, it's, it's like confusing. Like you mainly just lose the dollar, but sometimes you win five. And this one time you can tell the story when you hit a hundred and, and, and they're

creating that kind of experience, but that's all a distraction. This is called EV or expected value and a poker player's job is to find plus EV scenarios, right? Let me give you an example. Let's say we're flipping a coin, and if it's heads, I win 100, but if it's tails, you win 200. Well, hopefully you would take that deal because you just make money over time. You have a positive expected value.

But if we're both 100, it's zero EV. We're equal. It doesn't really matter if we do it or not. Like, you're not going to make money. And then vice versa, if it's 100, you lose 200 and you win 100, you wouldn't want to do it because it's negative EVV. So a poker player's job is to find positive EVV, and most casino games don't offer that. Non-gambler here.

On the coin flip scenario, is there no money management system which could enable you to come out ahead more often than behind? So you're kind of referring to martingale um yeah i know obviously yeah yeah so i actually remember this okay i was the renowned uh money manager the frederick martingale yeah as if i don't know who that is when i was uh when i was in high school, I remember thinking about this. I was taking a math class. We were talking about gambling.

And I was like, what if you just always double your bet? You can't lose. And the teacher was like, but then you have to have infinite money. And I was like, no, you don't get it. What if you double the bet? Imagine what that teacher nowadays is like. That kid went on to be a famous professional gambler so so you you're right there's the double your money thing right and i've um i've watched tv

shows about like these whales at a time when gambling was bad like maybe during the recession getting the rules changed so they were more advantageous and one of them was to take the limit off so that he could you know double and So, yeah, but you have to have imminent money. But what if – I don't know. I haven't thought this through like you probably have. But there's the whole like when you're up ahead, you only bet in the house money or you – none of that would save you. I think what you were saying was like you were making an equivalency to the strategy the casino is using to make money slowly over time, right? Where the casino is like, well, in this coin clip scenario, they win 100, we win $105. And so over time, we give them just

enough of a taste intermittently, but we know for a fact we are winning in the end. Is that kind of what you're saying? And you always want to think about bets as individual instances. So a big mistake that poker players make, they go play a session and at the end they have a result from that session. And rather than trying to isolate individual decisions they made, they think about the net and they think about the overall session. Taking that and then going to the casino, taking that perspective. Anytime you bet at the casino, all you're doing is taking X dollars and turning it into Y dollars. And all of their games are set up so that Y is lower than X. So the bigger your X number is, then the bigger Y is, but the more you lose. That's all that matters. They're all

individual bets. You're always losing. The house will win. The exceptions are if you knew how to count cards back in the day, and they eventually did change the rules. Or if you're a really good sports better, then maybe you know how to get an edge. But that's getting a lot tougher these days. And poker. I don't think I'm forgetting. I think those are the only ones you can really have an edge in. Okay. How did they change rules to prevent card counting?

They added in decks. Because it used to be one deck, right? So it was very easy to know how many cards were left. Then it was two decks. Still pretty easy to know how many cards were left. Then it was two decks, still pretty easy to know how many cards. Now it's like six decks, and there are continuous shufflers and all kinds of things. As good a card counter as you are, what you know is only a slight advantage. It's a little 10 heavy or something. It doesn't get you far.

I see. So if there are like six decks in there, and if this is a retarded question, I was just joking. There's like six decks in there. And if this is a retarded question, I was just joking. Like, how do you make sure like five ace of spades don't come out or something if there's six? This is blackjack we're talking about. Oh, it's just blackjack. Okay, so it's all just numbers assigned to the cards.

I've never played blackjack. I just know you try and get to 21. Yeah, that's how you do it. Yeah, so nowadays maybe rather than every time you bet, you only get 97 cents in your dollar. Maybe if you're good, you get 98 or 99, right? And people are always trying to find that place where you can get a buck and a cent where they're making money, but, um, you're still losing. And if it seems like you're not, eventually the house will step in and they'll ask you to leave. Like you, you can just get banned. It's not like back in the day where they take you in the back and they beat you up or something like it's all it's all corporate

now you know no one's getting buried now we've all seen the kevin spacey movie where they go back there and they smash that kid's hand with a hammer because he used his math class to make money did you do you watch movies like that and you're like man this is dumb oh it's it's something else it's whenever you're an expert in something and then you see hollywood just like do like this is our version of it you're like oh my god this is so stupid there was a there was a scene there was a scene from some really bad movie with justin timberlake called like in time or something like that and there's a scene where like he puts so you only have a certain amount of years to live and you can gamble with those years what a great premise by the way but anyway you can gamble with those years. What a great premise, by the way.

But anyway, you can gamble with those years. And he goes all in on the turn with a gut shot. So he's like 92% to lose for his life, right? All of the years he can live. And he hits the right card in the river. And then they're like, how'd you do that? And he's playing it all smooth. He's like, what?

You just put your entire life on the line with 8% chance to win. What are you doing? And that's the lesson they're trying to impart to the viewers. It's so bad. I just remember the gambling scene. I don't know what the movie was called, but it's that one where John Malkovich has a terrible Russian accent. And he sits there with like, he'll like intentionally have terrible Russian accent. And he like slowly open Oreo and eat it while he's bad.

I like that accent. Like I don't know anything about gambling that's been very apparent to you through my questions. And even I knew enough watching that where I'm like, you know, it doesn't seem right. It doesn't seem like this is how gambling works. That is the best poker movie. In fact, if you ask a poker player what their favorite movie is, I'd say you're going to get 80 or 90 percent are going to say Rounders. Because it's actually – it's still not very accurate. But it's the most accurate of what we got, man.

It's the most accurate of what we got. There's a scene in that movie that's particularly bad where he's talking about playing with another famous poker player. And he's like, yeah. And then I raised him again. And he folded and he said, what do you got? I said, I'm sorry, Johnnyny i don't remember or whatever like some famous scene um but like that scene is especially dumb because in the game that they were playing you would never fold pre-flop your odds would be too good you know basically like you'd have a hand

that's like 30 to win and you would need 10 to call the bet so there's no hand you'd ever fold and then he's like and i folded you know and it's like that no everyone knows that that didn't happen because that isn't possible to happen no one would ever do that but but pick up on that no yeah okay i love that movie i love that they got johnny can't in the movie yeah like the the whole thing that's a great movie and you know matt damon and malkovich it's and uh edward norton Edward Norton. Is that the one where they're screaming at us? Like with guns? Like in that room when they're like, give me your fucking money.

Is that the one where they rob them in the beginning? No. I'm getting multiple gambling videos. I've heard Rounders is loved by professional poker players because it made poker more popular and it put chumps like us into the bet, into the pool, you know? So now you're in there, sharks in the water, and us guppies are trying our hand at poker giving you money The thing is about rounders is part of what was great about it is it didn't really? Glamorize a lot of aspects of it

It was kind of real in that like the guys like serious girlfriend left him and like he lost everything he had the start of the movie and they had to work real jobs and his like friend got like caught cheating and like got kind of like got beat up by people. Like that stuff doesn't really happen that much anymore either. But it was kind of real. You know, like if you viewed Rounders as glamorizing it, like, oh, my God, I would love to lose everything and have no one. Then, yeah, it was basically just that. Do you play online a lot? Like is that part of your thing did you go online and just

play like six hands at a time and grind away profits i used to play a lot online but uh you know they really they really made it illegal in in america to play online do you hypothetically play online very much not not anymore i actually don't play that much these days anymore i'm more focused on uh content and running some businesses and stuff but um yeah just for just for woody and like i guess the audience you started playing the uh penny penny games right like like one one one cent and two cent blinds and didn't you turn like twenty dollars into ten thousand so i originally started in poker. I think I lost my first number of deposits. I forget exactly how many, but then I eventually turned

$20 into everything I have today. Uh, but recently, cause people were saying like, oh, you can't do it anymore. You can't turn, you can't turn a hundred bucks into 10,000 anymore. Um, or there are a lot of people that believe that I was like, you definitely still can. So I did my own challenge on Twitch where I streamed the whole thing of me playing. And we took $100 and we turned it into $10,000. Nice. I think that's what you're talking about, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

That's super impressive. I never enjoyed playing online. I really like the in-person, everything about being there at the table. I want to feel the felt. I want to touch the chips. And a lot of times there will about being there at the table. I want to feel the felt. I want to touch the chips. And a lot of times there will be actual cash on the table. I want to see the money, and I really want to see the other guy. And it's not like I'm necessarily getting a read off of him.

I'm not trying to say that. But I want to see him and kind of know his demeanor because I'm not nearly as good, or I never was nearly as good, at looking at, like, Dragon Slayer 309 and remembering, oh, he's really loose, Dragon Slayer 309. But I know Carl. Carl over there owns eight barbecue restaurants, and he just don't give a fuck. He absolutely will throw another

500 in on a gut shot or something. Carl's in it for an evening of fun. He's not counting anything. Carl could have anything, and that's a real-life guy that I knew. He just didn't give a fuck. He was 65 years old, and he was very wealthy, and he was just having fun. And then there'd be another guy who was always drunk. He's always

drunk. A drunk betting? That doesn't seem responsible. And the later the night goes on, the drunker he'd be and the looser he'd be. And then there's certainly guys that's like, I really don't even want to play with him. I don't want to be in a hand with this guy. It seems like he's playing so tight all the time that if he's in there after we all raised $50 pre-flop, then he's got something scary. And I know that

on the turn, there's going to be a $200 or $300 bet, and I'm not ready to go there. I liked being in person a lot more than on the turn. Well, the data that you get is just different. So, for example, if I'm at a table with someone, there are things I can see, right? I can see the way he moves, how he touches his chips, when he's in a hand, what his posture is like, where he looks. Yeah, basically all these mannerisms, all these things are visible. So you get to know a lot about your opponent. Like if they're an older guy, and this is just generally true, older guys don't bluff as much.

It's kind of like a known thing. They're more conservative. Young kids, if some kid sits down at your table, he's 22 years old, he's got a hoodie and headphones on, you know that kid's going to be aggro as fuck. Because they're aggressive. Kids learn. If you want to be good at poker out of the gate, you have to be aggressive. Like you have the wind pot, you have to go after it. And so how did a 22 year old end up here? He probably won his money playing poker and he's probably really aggressive, right? Also, he might be used to playing 10 tables online. So he's bored and he's like trying to be really aggressive. Um, and so you have, you have all these things you can take away when you're sitting at the table with someone online there

are things you can take away but it's different it's funny you bring up screen names you actually can tell some stuff about screen names for example if someone's if someone's screen name is like two words capitalized correctly and kind of witty you know that's a regular player you know it's because a lot of thought went into that right if like the screen name is i'm all in, you know that's a regular player. You know, because a lot of thought went into that, right? If like the screen name is like... I'm all in for 2069. That's my name. That's a fish. If you see that guy, that's where you want to be.

I'm all in with seven numbers at the end. That's the game is running around that guy. So you can get some stuff. But what's cool is that you can get more quantifiable data. You can see the numbers on things rather than carl can have any two hand any two cards it's carl plays 71 of his holdings what does that look like so you get data that's in my opinion maybe even more accurate like over time is more accurate because you get these averages with numbers. But maybe initially is much worse because you can't actually just see Carl there with barbecue stamps or whatever he's got on.

Do you ever use fake games to trick people? Like, whenever I want to be anonymous, I'm like just a dude 2002. So they think I'm some 16-year-old idiot. Is that a play you do or no? That's definitely a play that people do for sure. But then it becomes a game. Like, if it's too stupid, maybe, like, it's clearly. But the thing is, the jig can only go on for so long because if you play against someone and they're good,

and after 30 or 50 hands that you see that they're playing good, you're like, okay, this guy's not an idiot, you know? One thing I used to do back in the day, this is actually quite funny. So my former poker I always liked to play was heads up, just one-on-one poker basically. And so that's the form I think most people know me from basically. That was the one I got the best at. And I did this thing where I knew no one would ever play me if they knew who I was. I knew a lot of people wouldn't play me if I was just playing good. So I developed some really weird strategies that if I played another really good player, I couldn't do because I would lose.

It would be, it would be a bad strategy, but just like kind of crazy enough strategies that people couldn't tell if I was bad or not. Right. Cause they just, I can't tell. So like maybe overall playing pretty good, but a pre-flop, usually you want to open to two and a half big blinds, kind of the standard. It's like just a poker thing, like to know what to raise to. Sometimes I might raise like six, right? Sometimes I might just call. Sometimes I might raise one or whatever. Like I was like throwing it all over the place. And, and the logic was, I would think about what makes sense in that range. Like if I was going to raise really big, well, I put some really bad hands in there as a bluff and I put some good hands in there in case they get crazy. Right. And so I was like thinking about all these different ranges and

trying to create stuff that actually made sense. But if you just looked at it and eyeballed it, you're like, this guy's a crazy fish. He's putting a ton of money in, doesn't know what's going to come out. Like no one plays like that. The guy's an idiot. But I actually managed to like fool a lot of people into playing me for long periods of time just by doing crazy shit like that i actually have a trick i've done with online poker like that too where i make all my screen names uh so it sounds like an underage girl and then as soon as you've paid the blind i get very sexual in the chat and then they will leave inevitably and i get i slowly have garnered my fortune, you know, ante after ante after ante.

And if they do decide to stay in and beat me, I report them to the FBI. I've got a whole Google Doc. So that's worked. But something I did want to ask, like a real... How do you lose to that strat? Yeah, it's hard to lose to that strat. You know, when I'm Susie Q09, you know,

or whatever the hell it is, I'm nine years old. I'm just slaughtering people like uh i've wondered about like sun sunglasses and hoodies and things like that that i see in that world where like somebody will be sitting there totally normal like you are now and then some other dude will come in with a hoodie and sunglasses and like an antifa you know bandana and like oh you know is that like among poker players like pros is that like you look down on it a little bit like that's like the training wheels of it like oh you're so not confident in your mannerisms you're wearing sunglasses and listening to music like really or is it kind of understood i feel like people would rip on them for that like

i'm sitting here totally you know face to the world and you're sitting there totally shrouded. Like it doesn't seem fair. That's a really good question. There are two different, there are two different reasons people do it. The first, the first is not what you would expect, but tables. It's ugly. No, some players, but no, it's, it's really bright at the table. The lights are extremely bright to show all the chips and cards and everything.

So it can be a little bit unsettling just how bright the lights are coming in at you. And some people just don't want to have that right in their eyes. It's just too much for them. So some people do it because of that. A lot of people do it because there are certain things that you can't control. A good example of this, there's a kind of a thing that's going on in poker for the last few years. A lot of guys wear scarves, which is just why you're doing this. But your neck, the way that it's – I'm not super into this stuff,

so I'm not the best guy to explain it, I guess. But your neck apparently, when you gulp or you're just breathing, whatever it is, it looks different depending on what your motives are. And so there's a bunch of guys who always protect their neck with like scarves and stuff. So no one can see that. Your eyes are like that too. You know, so I had a big hand in TV poker like four or five years ago where I ran a really big bluff on like a fairly well-known TV poker game. And the guy is like, you know, he's a serious dude. He's like staring me down.

Like I'm sitting, I'm sitting here and he's sitting right here and he's just staring me down, like right in my grill, just like staring me down. And I have nothing. I'm just like staring at the table or whatever. And I'm like, this is really uncomfortable. Like I'm risking several hundred thousand dollars to try and bluff this guy out of pot. And he's just like like staring me down like trying to figure out like like is there any little bit of weakness there

and that's just uncomfortable man a lot of people just don't want to have to deal with that so um that bluff by the way didn't work but anyway the point is uh the thing is like you know i think in general it's not looked down upon too much i think a lot of players tend to be like, come on, dude. But certainly some great players do that, and I think it's a reasonable strategy. No one fakes it. No one tries to act it. You're maybe adding apprehension that's not really there when you're confident and throwing them off the trail. Dude, the best – mark my words.

Five years from now, the best poker player on earth is going to have cerebral palsy. You can't read what they're doing. All their moves are a little erratic, just enough that you can't read it. Josh Blue showed that you can do it in stand-up, and I swear to God, he's going to leave that, come over here and dominate. This is a good idea. If you see someone with cerebral palsy, bet on them. Gamble on them. They're going to do great.

I don't even know what to say everywhere i would have had four of a kind if i hadn't dropped it into the fucking table so um shit what was the question again oh yeah acting different so this is actually basic human psychology the number one human tell by the way is weak means strong and strong means weak. OK, and I'll give you like a really a really good example. Let's just say that your girlfriend is cheating on you and she is suspicious of you and she comes up really aggressive. Like, what have you what do you do? It's like she's strong because she's acting strong because her position is weak.

Right. This is like basic human stuff. When we're weak, we don't want to seem weak, so we puff up a little bit and we do things to seem strong. So the most common one at low-level poker games is if someone's like, I don't really care. I guess we can go all in. You should be really scared because that's a really good hand, right? If you had a bad hand, you're not going to be like, oh, my hand sucks. I guess we'll go with it.

No, you're not going to do that because you're just giving away what you have. Or if someone says, this is a classic one, oh, it's the end of the night. I guess I'll go. I guess I gotta go home. Very strong. But if someone's really intimidatingly trying to scare you and stuff, they usually don't have anything. So that's kind of like the level one thing. Then you can go level

two, which is I'm going to seem strong when I'm strong. But the problem is this. You keep playing this game, you're going to go in circles. So what really good players do is they just do the same. Like, for example, one thing I do, if I have a really big hand and I'm going all in on the river, if I have a good hand, I'll gulp like kind of loudly or just like very noticeably gulp because I know when I'm bluffing, it sucks having to gulp.

And so I'll do it like obnoxiously large gulp because I know when I'm bluffing, it sucks having to gulp. And so I'll do it like obnoxiously large gulp either way because then when I'm bluffing, I'm like, I'm going to do the same thing when I got a good hand. And when I have a good hand, I'm like, maybe he'll think I'm weak. But you just do the same and to protect yourself. Okay. How about if you did something like more subtle, like every time they give you a card, no matter what, you go, hell yeah. They actually have a term that

poker it's called being annoying it's called being grating and frustrating to play with yeah what's uh what's the closest because i mean and this is probably just my perception of of poker coming from movies and whatnot but i'm sure you played lots and lots of games before you became a pro what's like has a game ever gotten really close or gotten to violence of people getting like mad at another person of like, you just stole 10 grand from me and they get in a fight? Or have you never seen that unfurl?

In poker, there's a very weird correlation, which is as the stakes become higher, people are less like that. You think of the other way. But when people play for a few hundred bucks that 300 bucks usually really matters to them but when you're playing with someone for a hundred thousand bucks that hundred thousand bucks probably doesn't mean a lot to them which is which is counterintuitive but i have i've never seen that happen at the higher stakes games

i have on occasion i've never seen a fight but i've seen stuff get kind of close back when i used to play much smaller stakes. The closest that I ever got was I was playing some underground games in North Carolina when I was, I don't know, 18 or whatever. And I went to this one game, and this guy was really drunk, really, really drunk. He was a banker some way or whatever. This is some rich guy. And I went all in, and basically the board had four cards in a row on it. So if you had to have the straight, you should have one card.

But I had two cards. So I had like a much higher straight than the board – than the person with one card. So he went all in, and I went all in, and he's like, I got the straight. And he shows the one card. And I was like, I have the higher straight. And I show the two cards. And he's real drunk, and he looks at me, and he's like drunk and he looks at me and he's like i have a he's like confused and then the dealer's getting his chips to give to me he's like but

and and then people are explaining to him why he loses right and then like it slowly dawns on him that he loses this pot and he looks at me and his wife's sitting next to him he's like you you gave my wife the finger you gave her the finger and like the wife is like and i'm like and i'm like wait not that night no i'm just kidding where did this come from like and then he just started screaming he stood up and he was like people had to hold him back and he was like he was like yelling at me and like man like that that's the he like what he was trying to come over my side of the table and like fight me or some shit i don't know and you're 18 at the time.

Something like that. I was something like that, yeah. God damn. But no, in general, people don't get into fights much, man. Poker has changed. It's not about Wild West gamblers and Texas hats, or they probably have a name, or any of this West gambling world stuff. It's like the best guys are math guys.

They're nerds. Nerds rule poker because it's a game about theory and game theory and pot odds and calculating equity. It's really what poker is is how to calculate and manage your equity. This whole time I thought it was making sure your cards are the same color. That does help. That does help. Have you ever seen a cheater get caught oh that's a good question go there must be i bet there's tons of cheaters in poker i uh i saw a cheater get caught one night and he was banned from the establishment there was no violence or anything there was some yelling but there was no violence and uh he tried to come back maybe a month later and then there were threats of violence they're like no no

you can never come back where was this at like uh georgia this is like a vfw uh game what was the context of it like how was he cheating do you know i honestly don't know what he was doing i think he had a card that, like, hidden. The most common form of cheating in poker is to mark a card so that you know what it is. And you always mark, like, the aces. Or, like, if you're a slightly better cheater, you might mark the tens because tens make straights.

But generally speaking, you know, I know of people having got caught. Like, there was this guy in the World Series of Pok poker a few years ago who played the heads up tournament. And whenever it was his turn, he'd get, he would act real slow and like do things with his hands and shit. And like, it's alleged he was marking cards. He eventually got like, I think banned from the property, but no one ever for sure knew that he was cheating. So, you know, it's tough.

Like there aren't that many people in the game anymore that behave like that. There certainly still are people. So you should always be careful. And it's why I recommend people, if you're going to play, play in like a casino or play something like a public place. Like don't play anywhere risky.

And, you know, poker is gambling. So you have to have your wits about you and understand that sometimes you're going to get into bad spots. And I'm not saying you need a ton of street sense, but like a little bit. Like don't put yourself in bad spots. I was thinking about joining the East St. Louis Train Track League, but given your tip, I will not go. I will not join that league. Great games there, though.

Great games, I'm sure. Home of the 24-hour strip club. Yeah. home of the 24 hour strip club yeah yeah poker is just one of those things that i've never considered enough to even have that many opinions on it but it really is like so much more complex than than you think on the outside looking in yeah i i don't wrap my mind around like all of the math you're doing in the moment. Like, I feel like so many variables are unknown. Like what's in their hand, what's in their hand.

Like, like how, how do you even have enough to like solve anything? Or is it all just kind of educated inference? Like, Oh, that guy, you know,

he, he made a face right there. I, I, okay. I kind of garner from that, that he's got something or doesn't have it. Or so you want to try to avoid doing too much,

like looking at a guy thinking he's weak or strong uh there are these things in poker called ranges and it's like when you make an action it can be one of many different hands and you try and then deduce what that range consists of so like for example if i play a hand pre-flop and i want to play i raise that raise doesn't tell you shit all it tells you is that i have um a hand that i want to play, I raise. That raise doesn't tell you shit. All it tells you is that I have a hand that I want to play. So it could be like an okay hand. It could be a pretty good hand. It could be a great hand.

It's not going to be a really bad hand because I would just fold that. I wouldn't play that. But you don't know if I've got aces or if I have like 9-7 suited. I could have either one of those things. You disguise it. You blend them together. So good players are very, very strong at blending things together so that you don't know what they have. That's like how good players play. Bad players

are very bad at that. They view things in like a good player views as ranges, which are all kinds of hands together. Bad players view it as just a hand. I've got pocket jacks. What do I do? Okay. Well, I don't like it when people see flop, you know, and they started doing stuff like that. So that's the difference. You want to start viewing it in ranges and then learning what actions mean and then trying to figure out how to play good poker. And then when it comes to using tells and stuff, like how someone looks or what they do, maybe if you're like on the edge between a couple of decisions, then you use the fact that the guy blinked twice or whatever, you know, if you think that means something. But only when it's close, though. And then as far as calculating odds,

I think maybe this is what you were talking about, Taylor. You know what cards you have. You know those two cards. And then you know what cards are on the board. And based on what's on the board, you can figure out what the nuts are, what the best possible hand that can be made is. And based on what you have and what's on the board,

you can come up with some pretty accurate odds for your odds of hitting the nuts in many situations. It's a lot of plates to spin at once for a game that people don't realize how complex it is. Like, this is probably also super basic. When you said marking cards, how are they... I feel like poker players playing with fellow poker players would be like, oh, you clearly marked that card.

You did something. Like, what does that mean? Does that mean, like, oh, you clearly marked that card. You did something. Like, what does that mean? Does that mean like bending a corner or some shit? It could be all kinds of stuff. But the thing is, the people who are good at it and thus not getting caught have developed different ways. I don't know, man. Like, it's like talking to you, Mark.

It's like a little bend of the corner, a little mark. I don't know. Like, I've heard that people have some people have ink they put on it and then they have glasses that can see that ink that the human eye gets duplicitous as shit i love it that's really duplicitous good for them you know if you're bringing lemon juice and marking your cards and you've got your own goofy glasses you deserve a win yeah I don't think so. That's not how you earn wins. That's pretty funny. The lemon juice bandit.

People long wondered why these tables smelled of citrus, and now we know. You're licking all the cards. Mr. Polk had stolen $130 million before we caught him. Hey, didn't Phil Ivey get caught up in some sort of baccarat thing like yeah last time i i remember watching this little like maybe it was an espn thing or something but they were following phil ivy around phil ivy's a professional poker player who's very successful um and uh they were following him around he was like going to these chinese casinos in his private jet like one to from one to the other. And I want to say

he won like $9 million, like in, in like a very short amount of time. And he'd like win all that he could win. And then, and they would like cut him off and then he'd just go to another casino and win a couple million more. But it seemed like he got caught. I don't want to say cheating, but they said he cheated, didn't he? This is the, so you're very, you're very accurate with your, with your, with your facts that that's what happened. There's, there's two major incidents. There's one, I believe with the Borgata for 9 million. And then there was one at Crockford, which is a big casino in the UK for like 8 million pounds, which is actually like 1.1 or 1.2 million or whatever, or sorry, 11 or 12 million. I mean, um, so yeah, so, so this case, there's a lot of poker players that have different

opinions on this, but basically, and there are some facts that we don't know 100% for sure, but, but basically he gambled at these establishments and found a way to know what cards were coming up through some kind of marking on the back of the card. I think he may have been bringing his own decks and asking them to use them. Uh, I think maybe he might have known the manufacturers. That would be like my first move to cheat. Like, well, maybe I'll bring my own deck and tell them. These are all aces and they say property of Taylor.

Yeah, I know. Can we use my deck? This die has all threes and this one has all four. You want me to use these? You know, like all i can do is report the news so um so that some something was agreed upon in terms of the deck they were using to where he knew the deck so the deck the deck was fine in terms of the right cards in it but there were markings on some of the backs of the cards that uh he could tell when certain cards

were coming uh and he had like anice too, which was some girl. I forget what her exact role was. But anyway, they went from casino to casino in the high roller rooms. And essentially, when they knew the card coming up was bad for them, they'd bet small. And when the card coming up was good for them, all of a sudden they would bet massive, like $100,000 bets, $200,000 bets. My understanding, it was in this vicinity. So they went to at least these two casinos, if bets, $200,000 bets. My understanding, it was in this vicinity. So they went to at least

these two casinos, if not a bunch more, and used this method to win money out of the casinos. So then afterwards, when the casinos realized what had happened, I think one of them hadn't paid him yet. They held the money and then the other one paid him and then went to court. But they both ended up in court, one in the UK, one in the US. And in both countries, uh, in both countries, he lost the case. Like he had to either pay back the money or they didn't have to pay him out. And in fact, the Borgata, the Borgata, they even tried to sue him for like his player comps while he was there. And like, um, his like, uh, they tried to sue him for like everything. And there was recently another countersuit where they're trying to sue him for 30 million dollars more or something i know less about this but saying that this is like they need to stop fraud and

in order to prevent fraud they need to sue him for another 30 million but i think i got thrown out of some court somewhere but anyway yeah he ended up not getting paid out from that it was for it was for many millions of dollars and the question the poker community is like was phil ivy in the wrong i i tend to think that the answer to that is yes. I think trying to exploit a deck, whether it means... Yeah, it seems like that's cut and dry trading. The question is whether or not bringing in your own deck full of marked cards is wrong.

That is a toughie. The situation is... I'm serious. My understanding isn't that they're marked, it's that there is a manufacturer issue where on the backs of the cards, they're not all 100% identical. So it would be like – That's marked, by the way. That's marked.

Anything that indicates to you that other people don't understand that a card is coming would be marked, right? Even if you didn't physically put a big X on it. I understand what Kyle is saying. It's not that he marked it. It's that he's aware of something subtle that happens in manufacturing. He has a deck expertise it would be like if if major league baseball said these kinds of bats are all a-okay but you found out that this one bat manufacturer and that this isn't how bats are made in mlb but

let's pretend they are it would be like if you found out oh well this one's got a lot more pop to it especially if you hold it like this and you only brought that kind of bat you hit some extra home runs and they're like oh how you? You knew that there was a problem with this bat. You said I could use the bat. I think a more fair comparison would be that they say, all right, you can buy from one of our 10 verified bat making companies, an MLB. And you go, hey, this little company that nobody's buying from in Honduras, all their bats are corked. Like, all of them. Yeah, that's just like a stock thing for them.

That's their selling point. We do cork. Yeah, so I'm going to buy one of those. And then you just hit with that, and they go at the end of the year, what the fuck? What are you doing? You've been hitting with a corked bat this whole year. And you go, yeah, but you said we could use this. And I knew it was against the rules, but I'm now going to play ignorant.

It's like, no, it's totally cheating. And that's how you met Mark McGuire. No, I'm kidding. He's a hometown hero. We will hear no. Yeah, he used steroids, not corks. Get it right. Oh, sorry.

Sorry. No, it was Barry Bonds. Barry Bonds. Barry Bonds. All of them would have to max. Bonds is a cork bat. Yeah, Sosa was the cork bat guy. So, yeah, the argument is if they allowed it should it stand

or not uh i i tend to lean towards no i i think it is kind of close but i tend to lean towards no just because it's like you know you're obviously using something that they don't know about to get advantage advantage on them that's not confined within the rules if it's within the rules of the game that's fine right like if you're no like know what cards are left or whatever, that's part of the game. Advantages like that are fine because they're fair. But when you have an unfair advantage in that you know what cards are coming, I don't know. I don't think that that's too... Well, let me ask you about this.

What if the dealer flashes a card and only you see it do you now i suppose the the the moral thing to to do is say hey everyone i saw a nine of spades there but is i mean where's that line do you know but that's not a moral thing that's just you observing something like it would be like if you're playing baseball and you looked back and you happen to catch and know the sign that the catcher was giving to the pitcher and you're like you're not going to go sir i know you're throwing a fastball it wouldn't be fair of me to swing at like you're not going to do that but you would you would garner that information and use it to be helpful it's in the same way you'll use that info but you're not going to have a whole deck set up where you're like, I'm the only one who knows the patterns, bitch. I'll tell you what, though. If you and a dealer

were in cahoots and he was showing you all the cards so you could bet and win, I'm guaranteeing you, you lose in court 100%. Oh, no. I'm in an accidental flash. He accidentally flourishes the card a little bit and you catch it, but no one else did. When I would play and the cards are being

dealt, I'd... Oh, you mean other players in poker? Yeah. at you but no one else did when i when i would play uh and the cards are being dealt i oh you mean other players in poker yeah like i would always sit very low when the cards are being dealt because we don't have a professional dealer we're rotating the deal and i'm looking i'm looking to see if any card gets flashed when now i'm not like getting like like like like being obvious about it but i'm sitting you know what are you doing with that information um well i'm remembering it so so let's say that you're basically like angling ish there i suppose i suppose i mean i'm not i'm not like here's what you should do here's what you should do if you see a card when someone's dealing like it's fucked up to the player to know their card they don't know that you know right so you

should you should say something another example of something that happens at poker sometimes is especially with new players when they look at their cards like new players always look at their cards like i got a king and a jack or like they just go like up like this like the whole world can see right um so like good players and they look they'll keep it like this and they'll cut and they'll look under so only they can see it so sometimes the guy next to you will be bad at this and he'll be showing you his cards so like i always have the same policy which is the first time they do it i say i can see your cards you need to protect them better and then they keep doing it then you're just like your hands are tied like you can't keep now now that i would do now i've definitely done that where like if the

guy next to me is is picking his cards and it's usually a drunk guy or an older person whose eyesight isn't so great yeah i would say hey i i'm not trying to look at your cards but i definitely know they're black i definitely know both your cards at the main event a few years ago there was a guy on my right some european dude and and he looked at his hand i could clearly see it and i said oh hey man i know you had these cards he's like okay yeah yeah they kind of blew me off i'm like all right did it again and i said i'm here i know you're this he's like stop stop like stop telling like he like got mad at me. And I was like, OK. And then he just kept looking at his hand like that.

So it was just like, I'm like, now I'm in a spot where it's like, what do I do for the other players at the table? You're like forcing me into seating. Technically, you need to be like, everyone, King Jack of Spades over here. That in mind. Just so we're all on this. And now he's going to go insane. But I don't even know what's like the correct thing that this is the thing about about poker there are many things that are ambiguous as to what is the correct thing

there's clear cheating and then there's angling which is like trying to use the rules to your advantage in kind of a misleading way and then there are things that are like probably acceptable but kind of not cool and then there are things that you should definitely use within the rules to your advantage. And, and people have different opinions about all of them. There was something that happened a couple of years ago where a player that has a YouTube channel makes videos. He got into a hand against another poker player and it was on a TV cash game. So you got to see like everyone, what they're doing.

And what he did was he basically had like his chips up front and he had his really big chips in the back. So you couldn't see that he had a lot of money behind. Right. And he gets into this hand and then the guy goes, I'm all in. And then he immediately takes the big chips and puts them out front. And now the guy sees he's got $10,000 more behind. And he's like, he's like, I didn't like, I, how was I supposed to know that? And then anyway, they like awkwardly go back and forth. And the guy's like, I didn't – how was I supposed to know that? And then anyway, they awkwardly go back and forth. And the guy is like, yeah – the guy with the chip was hidden was like, I guess we have to go with it, right? Because they're in play. And it's like –

That's tricky as shit. Technically, you kind of – like from a rule standpoint, you kind of have to play with – as if those chips were there because like they were on the table. have to play with as if those chips were there because like they were on the table but from like a like a community standpoint from like a like as as we're all poker players if i did that to somebody on accident i'd be like okay let's not play for those because like you didn't know that i had them and like that was my mistake i should keep my big ships up front and keep them visible but what the guy did was i guess we gotta do it and then he wins all the guy's money and then he makes a youtube video like laughing about it and telling his fans, like, Toad, you've got to protect yourselves, guys.

And he's in this jean vest by the ocean. And there's seals chirping in the background. He's giving some eyebrow raises. And I'm like, this is just too funny, right? What an asshole. I hide my money like an asshole when I play Monopoly. All of them in the same deck, small bills on top. It's hard to know how much I have.

Fuck you too, then! I will not abide by this trickery. Just gotta line up. That can't be that hard. I can see your point about the rules, but that's totally cheating. No, it's not!

You can ask for a chip count and that's a very common thing to do maybe not it's very manipulative and it takes advantage it's like kyle if i was like hey i'm gonna teach you how to skate today i'm gonna teach you like the first steps to learn how to play hockey and then you show up with like your little figure skating trainer skates and you're like my best and i come out in full regalia with a mouth guard. Like, it's full hit. You know, I start hitting. Like, I tricked you into getting out on the ice. That's better.

Poker's weird, though. In some places, you're not allowed to – like, a player does not have to count his chips for you. Really? And so what most good players do, if someone asks for chips, they'll just like show you – they have to show you the chips. And they are required in most places to keep the bigger ones up front, but you don't have to say shit.

In fact, some people won't even move. They're like, how many chips do you have? And they're just like, you know, they just don't even move. They just like, cause you're not required to. And in some places dealers are also not allowed to count them. So how many chips do you have is really just like uh i hope you got good vision because you don't even have the attention yeah yeah what's one thing you would change about the poker scene not the game itself but the poker scene like you know a ton about it

that's a really good question i think that i think if i could change something about the poker scene, it would be people need to embrace newer players better, I think. I think that people tend to be too mean or disrespectful or make fun of the bad players at the table. And it's just like, you need new people, man. The real problem for poker right now is that poker is kind of steady for the time being. But I'm very worried that young people are not going to get involved in the game. And that's fine for, like, a few decades. But eventually that's going to be pretty bad for poker if there aren't new people playing. There needs to be another poker boom, right?

Like, there needs to be another Chris Moneymaker situation. Like, for those who don't know, in 2003, Chris Moneymaker, this unknown accountant. With a great name. With an amazing poker name. That was his actual name? Chris Moneymaker won. For real. He won the main event.

That's dope. And it was like $2.5 million that he took home. And everybody watched it on ESPN. It was massive. And then all of a sudden, poker chip sets are like $150, $200 or something. Go look what they're costing right now for a set of good poker chips, like $30 or something. They were $150. I was like, I can't afford that. I just want to get started. And poker exploded. And then of course, the online community was the

wild, wild west. So they were like half a dozen big sites and then a dozen more smaller ones. And everybody was playing online because they wanted to be like chris moneymaker they wanted to go from oh well i i mean i work with numbers every day i can become a multi-millionaire and and become world famous like this guy and poker exploded i think he was an accountant right yeah that's what i said and that's oh i didn't catch it and that's 15 years ago now though so we're definitely that's kind of over. I think, yeah, totally true. I think a lot of poker players, they are holding out for that quote next boom. And I just don't really think it's going to be like that. There are certain things that could happen that could help poker.

If some of the bigger countries not currently in the market internationally got involved, it could be good. Like, I don't know, let's just say like the US, which is completely ridiculous that we're one of the only countries in the world that can't have worldwide poker. But taking that to the side, there are other countries that could get involved more too, like China. I think Brazil has been getting more in the mix lately, which is good. But there are other problems in poker that aren't just new people getting involved or

some guy winning being exciting i think the whole like hearing about a big winner being exciting i don't think that works again the second time around the same people it has to be kind of new people right you're not like oh i saw the moneymaker thing happen 10 years later 15 years later some other guy wins like last year the guy who won it um it was this guy who was definitely not a professional player uh named i think qui win i think it was last year maybe no it was two years ago and he not a professional player named, I think, Kui Nguyen. I think it was last year. No, it was two years ago. And he always wore like a raccoon hat, right?

He's an Asian dude with a raccoon hat. This like really unique guy. And people, that's it. Like every raccoon is getting into poker now. Like, no, nothing's happening. You know what I'm saying? It doesn't have that same impact again. And then, go for it.

I'm sorry. I thought it was a break. When you play online online do people just use calculators it just occurred to me like i it seems like there'd be a program where i could pump in the knowns and it would tell me whether i was you know what'd you call it the ev plus or minus like whether i should bet more or less so so there are basic calculators that can do that for sure but you have to know what rate their range is or what their range should be. And that's very hard to calculate. But those things do now exist. And some people are using them live. Yeah,

I'm sure they are. They're not technically supposed to be. But that's a big problem with online poker right now. Are people using bots? People using software? That problem is not going to get better. It's not going to get better. It's going to get worse. It seems like you could just make the best decisions based on available data 100% of the time and beat humans. Yeah. Calculating the odds of certain cards coming up are pretty easy. It's 52 cards in the deck,

so there's not a whole lot of math going on, but it's about 2% per card, right? Per draw of the card, depending on how many more cards are left to come out but but what you're talking about is is calculating um the percentage the percentages right and and for that you there are some unknowns to calculate and the only ways the only way to get a a knowledge about that is really knowing the player a little bit having played a couple hundred hands with him right yeah you need a lot of information to be able to make judges as to ranges

of hands. But as far as humans versus AI, I know that society is super into, let's put computers up against people on this, let's do computers against people on that. That whole phase happened with poker a few years ago, where for the first time, Carnegie Mellon University, which

they specialize in all the AI stuff, they created a bot to play against people in poker, a no-limit hold'em. The first time around, it was in 2015, I was one of the contestants because it was one-on-one poker. It was like my specialty. And so we beat the bot, right? We were still better than the bot.

Afterwards was some bullshit, though. These scientists said it was a statistical tie. I'm like, some bullshit it was. We won 750,000 play chips or whatever, and they're calling it a tie. Anyway, whatever. They're nice guys, but, you know, scientists. And then two years later, last year, they played the humans again, and they crushed the humans. Were you one of them?

I wasn't one of them. It was too grueling, you play all day every day i went nuts the first time around but i looked at the data afterwards and went through how it played right try and compare it to how humans play the first time around it had some clear weaknesses that it did that just couldn't possibly be right second time around it played really good i was actually helping the human team i flew to pittsburgh and like tried to like help coach them and analyze some stuff for them so So they have bear shot to win. And, uh, I was looking through it and seeing all of like the way that it played. And I was like,

man, this thing is playing really tough. Like it is like re like I knew the, it started to look a little bad. Um, the, the first four or five days, it had some weaknesses that it was doing that I was like, I think we can exploit these things. And then as it went on, it kind of fixed those. And by the end, man, it was just straight crushing humans. Like it was just it wasn't like the humans were just not nearly as good. So we've definitely Carnegie Mellon guys are now playing online as their day job with bots just making money. They in theory could.

Yeah. In theory. Did theory did the did the ai vary its range of hands like like did it sometimes go in with with you know small suited connectors or was it always playing you know like like ace king what was it doing as far as the starting hands that it would go in well one thing that it did that was very different than human players so humans tend to use the same bet sizes. So let's say there's $100 in the middle. We might bet $50.

Maybe we'll bet $100. Maybe once in a while we'll bet more than what's in the middle. I overbet the pot. But we tend to use kind of consistent numbers like that. This thing used all kinds of different numbers. It had some really – it had some insanely big bets. There were hands where it would be like $800 in the middle and it would all in for like 20,000. Right. It would just do stuff like that. So, um, I saw some of that. I saw the opposite. I saw like, it'd be 8,000 in the

middle and it would bet like 500. It's like, what the hell is this? This is such a small bet. Why would you even do this? So it had all of these strategies that it had calculated and come up with that the humans didn't even know about right um so i think that was probably the biggest difference i saw and it was really good at mixing all of its play up you never knew what it was up to all over the place it it was just strong man it played really good it played it played really good poker that's really cool i'm always interested in that ai stuff like especially chess like like because it's it's interesting to see you know the best in the world take on this ai and see what happens.

Because you like to believe, you know, we're all Team Human. You like to believe that there's a guy out there who's just innately better than someone can even make a machine be. But that's really interesting. Eventually the robots win. They're just better. Judgment day, it's coming. Let me do an advertisement here.

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The ice cream of the future. Do you guys remember when that was a big thing? Yes. When you'd go to sporting events and they'd be like. It still is, man. It still is a thing. But you only see it at Six Flags and at sporting events. You can't buy it anywhere else because I think it needs to be freeze dried.

And even as a kid, I I was like this is a sneaky way because I was thinking of all the space between the balls of ice cream I was like all that space could be more ice cream these sneaky fucks are short changing us with giving us I bet you it costs them more to produce the less quantity

so I don't really think it's I don't really think it's like doesn't it have to be on dry ice as well? For sure. I hear your argument, Doug, but my mind is made up. It's true because I say it's true, Doug. And the first thing in your mind is those fucking cheap bastards. Just goddamn ice cream balls.

Ice cream balls. This is a scheme put on by Big Dippin' Dot to rob me of ice cream this is a scheme put on by Big Dippin' Dot to rob me of ice cream the thing you need to understand about this is people are never talking about Big Dippin' Dot they're Fortune 500 company people right behind fucking

one of the other big ones I don't know you can't name a Fortune 500 company and then i was like i need to think of a lower fortune 500 company i couldn't think of a lower one damn you know you do your best but you would need a higher one you said they were right behind them anyway yeah anyway i thought about poker. All right. So you're a crypto guy, right? And one of your claims to fame is the fact that you like sort of brought to light crypto scams. Now, how is cryptocurrency different than cryptocurrency scams? Because they seem kind of related. All right. Well, so that's that so there's a lot to unpackage there. But to start off with, scams can be all sorts of different things. They're not even creating a

token. All they do is take the money and run. They could create some kind of shit token that doesn't do anything that it's promising to do. They can promise they're going to develop it in a certain way that they end up not developing. There are all kinds of scams out there that can exist, right? How specific you want to be with the word scam, I guess, will change your opinion on which ones are what. But generally speaking, I view scam to be they say they're going to do something that they don't do. That's a scam to me. So if they say we're creating this currency based on this technology and we're going to be developing it, and then they take your money and say, actually, we're not, that's a scam. But if they take your money, develop the currency that

they're saying according to the protocols that they set forth and issue that currency, and it goes down in value a lot, that's not a scam. You gave them money. They did the thing they said they were going to do. It doesn't make it a scam just because it went badly, right? I have my own idea for a Woody coin, right? You give me money, and then in exchange, I will hit my forehead on the keyboard between six and ten times and give you a string of text. Huh? No one would buy this, right? Pretty convincing.

I would not purchase it. It's not a lot different than crypto. I sense you're a big Bitcoin fan. I made $4,000 in Bitcoin. I just bought it because it seemed hot and I got out because it seemed too hot. Let me just give my take on it and then I'm interested in what your opinion is too. So here, here's the thing. I don't think it's good that the government controls the money supply because they don't have your best interest at heart. Have you ever seen a graph of what happens to the, to the dollar every year? It goes down every year because they print more, right? They can print as much as they want. There

are no rules on that. They can, they can, um, manipulate it in whatever way they see fit. And you're the person that pays the price for that. Why should that happen with our money supply? Shouldn't we have money that's ruled by math and algorithms rather than just like a powerful entity in the world deciding what's best for it? I think that that makes much more sense. And then you also have just the utility of it and the fact that you can digitally transfer it. No intermediaries, no banks, lower fees. It's faster than most things. You know, there's just a lot of, there's a lot of reasons why digital money makes sense to me. Now that doesn't mean that. The fees are outrageous though. Maybe you're avoiding fees that I'm not, but I exchanged cash for free. You're talking about in January?

In January? Yeah, I don't know. It might have been last year. So they actually rolled out new technology in the last, like, it was probably around eight months-ish ago called the Lightning Network, as well as Segwit, which has dramatically decreased fees.

If you look at fees now, they're like nothing. But what happened was so many people tried to use the network in that, like that two-month period of time, and they were still developing a lot of the technology, that the fees became astronomical, and eventually that was solved. So that's no longer an issue. But it was bad during that period of time. Yeah, it was. It was more than buying and selling stocks, if I recall, as a percentage. It sucked. I like your argument about the Federal Reserve.

It was it sucked. I like your argument about the Federal Reserve. That makes a lot of sense. Only if you like assume that all his like now he laid out a bunch of things that are debatable. Right. Like, you know, like, oh, they're not managing the money supply for your behalf. They absolutely are. Right. They're absolutely trying to keep the economy smooth and on an upright course. That's their motivation. So the idea that it just becomes unmanaged.

Well, that's how we got the Great Depression in the 1920s. And back when it was on the gold standard, they didn't have the ability to sort of control the money supply. That's how we got 08, lack of home loan regulation. Well, do you want people or math to control the money? I'm more of a math guy. I hear you. And I'm not setting stone on either one. But when people control it, they can smooth it a little bit. That's the idea, to have a gentle rise in the economy. And I'm not set in stone on either one. But when people control it, they can smooth it a little bit. That's the idea to have a gentle rise in the economy. And that's more or less what they've been achieving for the last 100 years. Back when it was, say, set to the gold standard and inflexible, we had drops that were never seen before or since then.

If we were on an algorithm that didn't adjust to current conditions, then we could have that again. Isn't like fiat currency as a whole always inherently a bubble? Like that will eventually burst? I don't know. The word bubble is – you have to give it some context because you've got bubbles in that like something drops 20% or 30% and then you've got bubbles where things drop 99%. People call both bubbles. So like, they're not they're not equivalent. Like, one of the major trade offs to Bitcoin is that it's inherently more volatile, more volatile, because it's not based as much around actual revenue. It's not based around that it's based

on speculation. So it's not as safe as the US dollar in what its range of prices can be and what it might be down the road, whereas the US dollar is very safe. You know every year it's just going to lose 2% of its value, roughly. You know that. Every year, your dollar will be worth $0.98 or like $0.97 or $0.99, depending on what the inflation was that year. So it is much less safe, but also, at least historically so far, over like an eight or nine-year run, tends to be a better

hold, but that doesn't mean every year is good. You know, I, so I originally got into Bitcoin because it was, because it had a lot of utility for me as someone that gambles professionally had to move money around. Um, so it had utility for me. I was able to move money without having to go through bank systems and all of this stuff this stuff. So I got involved because of that. And then it just like, as I was doing it, I was like, this has been going up for some time. And so I bought like first probably when it was around a hundred and something dollars and then have been lucky to kind of be in there from an early time period. But I'm not one of those guys who went like all in and held and has everything in Bitcoin or whatever. Like I have a diversified strategy because I think that as you become more successful, there's

no reason to risk everything on just believing in one thing. Even if I loved the stock market and I have a decent amount of money in the stock market, mainly index funds and ETFs, but I don't have everything in there. What if there's a crash? Or maybe I love certain tech stocks. I wouldn't have everything in there. Or maybe I love real estate, although real estate seems kind of, you know, it's been propped up lately. It's getting to some kind of some peaks that we haven't seen since 2009. I wouldn't go all in on real

estate. You want to have a diversified strategy that allows you to succeed. I just think that it kind of boils down to this. I just believe in the premise of Bitcoin. It has been around for eight or nine years now. It's continued to increase in value. And I see that it has a lot of utility. And I just think that long run, that premise eventually will win out. I don't know if that means it's going to be 50, 100, 200 years. I don't know what that all ends up looking like. I don't know if it's going to be more next year. You know, people always want price predictions. No fucking clue. Anyone tells you, I know what the price is going to be next year. I'll show you a liar, you know, like they just, no one knows. Um, but that doesn't mean that it's not something that doesn't have

value. Yeah. Yeah. That's a really interesting way to look at it. You're clearly very well versed in this. Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, talking about the scams though, for a moment, the scammers are ridiculous. So there was this one cryptocurrency called BitConnect. And I was fortunate because about the time I started making videos, it was like January this year, there were all these rampant YouTube channels just scamming people basically by being affiliates. Like if you take Bitcoin and buy into this currency using my link, I'm going to get a cut of your money. And now you have this coin that's eventually going to implode because it's not actually, it doesn't actually, it's not being developed. They're making all these promises they're never going to keep. And where the money is coming from is not real. They basically said, if you buy BitConnect, you get 1% daily returns every day. And if you know what a scam looks like, that's like the first sign promise daily returns.

And you don't even know where they're coming from. And what they said was we had this, we had this computer program that every day it just trades and makes the money. You might want to think, well, why do they need my money then? Right. But that's just the way that it works. It just needs your money so they can, it can work and do the thing and make you some money. Right. It does the thing. It does the thing. It does the thing. So, uh, they were these big YouTube channels. Like, you know, they had a couple hundred thousand subscribers all in the last couple of months. We're like, yeah, use my affiliate link and sign up. And, and, you know, you, you can do the same thing. Then you can sign people up and then you can have your affiliate link, you know, not, it's not, it's not a pyramid

scheme. It just looks like, it's like, it's like this and like, I'm here and like, you're, it was ridiculous. It was some of the most ridiculous shit I've seen uh and they had of course that like big that seminar with uh the guy carlos mateos or whatever his name was b connect the guy like everything everyone knows um i don't know that that sounds funny you haven't seen that no he yells bit connect yeah bit connect you look it up man you'll enjoy it so that was some of the stuff i did i did i guess like some of my better work and then i saw these like kids like this one channel jr garage they were like they were trying to make like financial recommendations to people and the way that they were saying about like these currencies it was ridiculous like bro it's so hot

bro it's like gone up and then it's gone down. And bro, right back up, bro. This is hot. And I took this video that they did because they were like growing really quickly. A lot of people were watching their channel. And I found a five minute segment where at one point they said, it's gone down a lot.

So you should buy because it's cheap. Another segment where they said, it's been breaking even a lot. So it could probably go up soon. So you should buy because it's been breaking even. And then another section where they're like, it's gone up a lot, and it's really hot, so you should buy. It's like, well, then at what point are you not buying? It's just you buy no matter what?

It's ridiculous. I kind of feel that way about Bitcoin in general or any of these cryptocurrencies. And so I get – the other argument is all currency only has value because people agree it has value right you can say that about the dollar the pound you know the canadian whatever they deal in probably probably lumas or something loonies yeah i know it's dollars but no they're dealing pucks the canadian puck 10 pucks for eight bucks yeah they just they just keep buckets of vulcanized rubber. Old Canadians saying, 10 bucks, 8 bucks, that's how they do it in the night. So all currency only has value because we collectively agree that it has value. It's better than a bartering system.

It's more convenient. But there are more people involved. And there's a general societal agreement that's lasted for 1,000 years with regular currencies. With these cryptocurrencies, it's lasted for, what did you say, nine years? And the pocket of people who are willing to accept that they have value is way smaller. It's tiny. It's minuscule. There's no one around here, I think, that accepts that. I can't give it to people or businesses. It all needs to be converted to cash. It's a thing that hasn't gained traction yet i would consider it a very

risky investment yeah what is bitcoin worth right now six thousand five hundred ish yes since i decided not to buy bitcoin in uh in december of 2016 no 17 i've i have not lost twelve thousand dollars pulled per bitcoin so that's a good investment it's true because it was at 18 then wasn't it like it got insanely high at one point i remember because i went to a bar nearby and this like it was at the peak it was worth like eighteen thousand dollars at this point probably like 17 a ton. And there's this bartender. And I was talking to someone I was there with, and she overheard. And she was like, oh, you're talking about Bitcoin? I'm like, yeah, I really don't get it or anything about it yet.

I'm trying to understand a little bit more, but apparently it's hot as fuck right now. And she's like, yeah, I have 35 Bitcoins, but I'm just going to keep holding on to them. Going to keep holding on to them. Going to keep holding on to them. When your bartender is telling you to buy Bitcoin, then it's probably a bad sign. But we'll see. Yeah. Oh, sorry. No, no, go ahead.

Okay. So, you know, here's the thing. Like, it comes and goes. And it's just like a natural part of the growth of it is that you have these, you know, insane bull runs. Lots of people hear about and get involved. And then you have these, these sell-offs where people realize like this is overvalued and I'm not really like, it was fun while I was in it, but now it's like losing. I don't want to be part of that. And they get out, but it just keeps doing that. And over time

growing, the same thing happened when it went from 200 to 1200. I remember the exact same thing happening. It was pandemonium, not nearly as much today, but then it fell down to 400, had a couple of years where it broke even, and then eventually rose again. And it's just cyclical. It keeps following the same pattern over and over and over again. Bitcoin will eventually be $18,000 again. It will be. It might not be for years. I'm not saying it's going to be $18,000 like next year or the year after or whatever. Eventually, we'll get there. It could go down to $3,000 from here. But, you know, do you have fear about like government regulations stepping in and like stomping on that, that, you know, potential profitability for you?

Like, I would imagine that's a fear that people in crypto, deep in crypto have where they're like a new regulation could roll out any day that really fucks me? Well, a lot of people in crypto are delusional, which is clear in the space. And they think that like, oh, that'll be good for Bitcoin. Bitcoin will show them who's boss. It's like, guys, if the US government bans Bitcoin, it's going to be a real bad day. It doesn't mean long run it won't succeed, but it would lose a lot of its value. So yeah, I think that's something that you're always worried about. But most of the conversations with cryptocurrency that I've seen, I saw the head of the SEC talking about it with Congress, they're generally on the pro side and we should get in front of it and help regulate it and get rid of all these scams. And I think

overall, they're generally for it. Now, there's definitely people who aren't. But who's the senator? Mark, not Mark. What's that guy's name? God damn it. There's a senator who supports it. Yeah, Mike Hunt.

Yeah. Yeah, I don't think it's him. The Honorable Mike Hunt of Rhode Island. It's a dangerous, crazy world with lots of swings. But over time, it will continue to gain value. It just will. It's going to gain value. There's only a limited number of them.

There's only ever going to be a little under 21 million Bitcoin. It's not like there's a bunch coming out of nowhere. How many are left? If that's not a dumb question. It probably is. That's a good probably is when will it hit that limit if there's only 21 million like there's a finite number like are they at 1 million are out there right now are they at 10 million are out there like i think it's not like 16 to 17 million are currently in circulation uh i want to say it's in that vicinity but i could be off by a little bit and i forget when the final date is that they'll all be mine.

But it's something in that vicinity. Also, there's a good chance that a guy that owns a lot of them is dead. So Satoshi, the people that were like, I'm Satoshi, or they had to accuse who's Satoshi. There's a very good chance that Satoshi... Can you say who Satoshi is for people who might not know? He's the founder of Bitcoin. He's the guy who originally who created the currency

It could even be a few different people all together There are a lot of different theories as to who it is. There's a guy who likes to pretend it's him named Craig Wright I saw these funny t-shirts where it said, we're all Satoshi except Craig Wright for the season of Vaughn, it was kind of funny but there's a good chance that man uh, man, I'm like forgetting this guy's name.

I should know these names more off the top of my head, but regardless, one of the, one of the guys who was around during the starting times of Bitcoin for sure, um, passed away and, uh, it's likely, or it's at least a decent chance that he was Satoshi. All of those coins could be lost forever. And that's and that's kind of the thing too like we know there's 17 million coins in circulation but you don't really know how many are in addresses that will never move ever you just don't know that could make the circulation even smaller and that number seems like it will always grow right people will always

lose their dollars and yeah they won't get put back into circulation that's true with bitcoin too right they'll just be gone yeah except it's much worse with bitcoin because they're not gonna there's not they don't come back yeah like you fast forward far enough and that 17 million supply drops to 3 million as people's like usb drives fail them and shit and now they're just fucked i heard now all their little safes are ruined like they just drop it in the water a million dollars gone i heard a story in their attic it's not air conditioned i heard a story that some guy in the uk had like 10 000 bitcoin on like a usb stick and he realized he threw it out and it's in like a landfill somewhere in the uk

and he he was starting like a fundraising effort to like go through the landfill like you are never gonna find that usb stick it is over on the like list of things that would make you want to kill yourself how high does throwing away 10 000 bitcoin in 2016 or whatever it was like how high is that on the list like when you throw away the rest of your life, finances secured. If he was just like, I'm done with the cryptocurrency game, not going to speculate, not going to do shit, all of it sell. Like he would have been set for life. Like that's got to make you want to kill yourself, right? Well, I think- Grab the wrong thumb drive and it's only dick pics. Yeah, damn it, I found the wrong one.

That would be a terrible troll. That'd be some seriously life-changing trolling right there. He starts to GoFundMe to search England's trash piles just to find his dick pics. Like, I'm not going to get that angle again. You know, like, I need that. My head wasn't in it. I looked in shape. I think that he lost it several years before that, though. And whenever I hear these stories, I think to myself, OK, if you're the kind of guy who lost like 100 bucks worth of Bitcoin and didn't think about it and then didn't buy more, you weren't really that into it anyway.

Like if it got to 10 bucks or five bucks, you were selling that shit in a heartbeat. If it got thrown out in your trash and you didn't bother to get more you're not holding all the way up to seven thousand or ten thousand or whatever you know or five that you're not you're not getting there you're selling it anyway so it's kind of a moot point it's just people of the what if story the what if stories are like what make people like really get like all riled up yeah yeah i mean that's how it always is like they have that same thing like little psychological exercises they'll have with people where they'll be like hey uh talking to some normal person be like how do you feel about suzy q who just won 510 million dollars in the lottery be like yeah i think that's great good

good for her well done all right how would you feel if your neighbor john q suddenly won 510 million dollars and then people's responses are more like, well, I don't think I like that one bit. And it's like, because proximity breeds resentment in regard to that kind of thing. Like the closer you are, where you get a kind of a visual of the quality of life changes they're experiencing, that makes you more upset. That's interesting to me. That's a really good point. And studies have proven when you see like who people are friends with, it's actually kind of hard to be friends with people that are way above or way below you in terms of like stature or net worth or anything like that because there's like a clear gap. Stature particularly. I don't have a single midget friend and I've tried hard.

All right. You know what? I was like that's a really good point i'm glad you brought that up then you're like yeah and midgets i always tag loser on the end uh yeah but like for example if you got to hang out with bill gates it probably wouldn't be that fun for either of you you guys hung out i mean at first it'd be sweet for you because you're learning about bill gates but like you know i've just like on tuesday like bill gates like yeah i lost another 200 million in the stock market you know how it goes and you're like yeah yeah i'd just be like dude bill you're a fucking prick dude like talking about your 200 million dollar loss i bet you i bet you can't even jump over that rolly chair like you did on that video to show you were cool in the 90s.

I bet you can't, fat idiot. A couple of my buddies went to a coffee shop in Seattle, and they got a coffee and it came out. And one of my friends said to the other friend, he's like, yeah, can you believe that? Bill Gates. And my other friend was like, what? He's like, yeah, Bill Gates is lying. Did you see him? He's like, Bill Gates was in line?

And he's like, you didn't tell me that Bill fucking Gates was in line for coffee i'm never gonna get that chance again dude if i were bill gates i would make like huge guffaws and scenes in public places where i'd be like six dollars for a cup of coffee like making big proclamations about how much i didn't like like get a whole bunch of shit at whole foods and then just make a stink as you're checking it out, man. I've talked about it before. If I were a billionaire,

I'd be the most spiteful motherfucker. I would drive a shit to your car just so I could rub it in the faces of people where it'd be like, man, that's old billionaire. Taylor still drives a 57 Lincoln, even though he was born in the early nineties. And it's like, what you want to do, drives a 57 Lincoln, even though he was born in the early nineties.

What you want to do, I think is make a big deal out of good, but not very good tips, right? Like $5 tip on $12 burger. Just saying. Not enough to be a big deal. Just like you go 28%. You're not going to go 30 cause you're not crazy, you know, but Bill Gates tips 28%. 50% tip here. That's right.

$6 tip. If you went out to eat with Bill Gates and like in a nice place and let's say his cup, him and his wife, if he's married or whatever, like their totals like $200 and you saw him put down like a $20 tip, would you say something? Would you be like, Bill, really? No, you can't say it. Like really, Bill? Or would you ignore it?

Because I know he's not going to give me any money. And so I would love to take glee in live periscoping me insulting Bill Gates for his tip. I don't even have a Periscope account. Is that a thing anymore? I like that you changed it from, would you say something to, yeah, I'm periscoping it. Like, what?

There was a little bit of a jump there that you didn't even acknowledge. If you know anything about me, if it's in public, I'm going to make a scene. I see. You can't give your friends money. It ruins it. You know? You don't even know if they're your friends or not they might just be hangers-on you can't tell if there's an income

disparity you gotta ignore that yeah especially with someone like that would be probably the hardest thing about being as wealthy as like warren buffett or bill gates or one of those saudi guys who sell all the all the gas. You wouldn't ever, ever know. Even your loved ones, like a wife or something, you'd never have any idea if they actually gave a fuck about you or if they just wanted you for money. They could say it all day, every day, but you'd never really know. If it was like, if I wasn't worth $130 million,

would you have even spoken to me? You'd be questioning everything. And so I get that bit of rich people anxiety as far as guarding themselves off. 130 million dollars would you have even spoken to me like you'd be questioning everything and so i get that bit of like rich people anxiety as far as like guarding themselves off and the gap between what he can do what other people can do must severely limit it like you know what i have a hankering for french pastries you want to go right you're either funding that whole thing or you're not going because no one else is like yeah let's both get in our jets i'll race you hey guys we're we're having our 40 year high school anniversary and uh i was thinking each

of us could just purchase an island in the philippines like have a nice little archipelago party i already bought mine anybody want to like like it would be prohibitive but this stuff happens even on a less like super rich people level because obviously that stuff's ridiculous but uh you know even like if you want to go to like a nice restaurant and you know let's just say you're doing well and your friend isn't then all of a sudden it's like kind of awkward like or you this stuff happens and it's why it's why people almost always find that their best friends fall within their like a very similar social class as they do and when and when those social classes change they tend to not be friends anymore it's just it's just the way that it's just

the way it is yeah that's like how every study about relationships they do shows that the old adage of opposites attract is not true at all it's birds of a feather fly together like that's way more similar than opposites attract. Like, and it kind of permeates to everything. But yeah, if I were a super billionaire, I'd be, I'd be a douche about it.

Like I'd buy multiple sports teams in the same division. They won't let you do that. Not after I buy out Gary Goodell or whatever his name is. And then I own the NFL. Roger, Roger Goodell. Roger Goodell. I don't know. I only I only I only watch hockey so I have no idea you wouldn't want to do that Kyle if you if you had 20 billion wait wait wait wait wait where are you from St. Louis and you only watch hockey

yeah isn't that kind of weird he's a masist. Midwest is, hockey's way bigger than like basketball around here. Football's still the king, but we lost the Rams two years ago, and I didn't watch them anyway. Oh my God, that's right. You guys have to pretend you don't like football now. Oh, I've never liked football. We never liked football anyway. People here now will be like, you know, I loved the Rams for 20 years, and now fuck that. And I'm like, you know, I loved the Rams for 20 years, and now fuck that. And I'm like, you liar.

Do you know the NFL did like a – like they released their TV analysis from the first year the Rams left St. Louis. And despite the fact that L.A. is way bigger, the St. Louis ratings were higher for the L.A. Rams than L.A. was as far as number of people. So it's like all you fucking liars out there saying, I'm done with the NFL. It's like, I know you're sitting

at home and your PJ's watching. I know you are. At least the Rams suck, though, so you got that. I thought they were good. I genuinely don't know anything about football. They're the best. They're the best. Oh, they are good, okay.

Actually, so I live in Las Vegas, and we're getting a football team. The Raiders are moving to Las Vegas. It's kind of sick. Oh, I saw that. And I saw quite a few of your pictures. You've got Golden Knights shit on. Did you go to any of their games for their inaugural season? Yeah, yeah.

I went to like 10 or 12 games or something. Nice. I went to a lot of games. And I thought it was really funny. People were like, oh, nice, jumping on the bandwagon. I went to a lot of games. And I thought it was really funny. People were like, oh, nice, jumping on the bandwagon.

It's like, okay, it's their first season in my hometown where I live. That's not, quote, jumping on the bandwagon. That's just like. It's just you finally got a team. You're allowed to root for the home team. That's okay. Yeah, that's the time to get in. Oh, you jump on the Golden Knights just because it's their first year and they happen to make the stanley cup it's like yeah absolutely i was a little bit on their team until they got

really far in and because the blues have never won the stanley cup and they've been around since 67 then my like kind of cheering turned to just hate where i was like these fucking assholes in the stanley cup and we're not gonna if they would have won their stanley cup in the Stanley Cup and we're not going to... If they would have won their Stanley Cup in the first year of existence, I... I went to a couple of those Stanley Cup games. Oh, that's awesome. Have the Blues ever been to a Cup? Yeah, they made the Cup in 68, 69, and 70.

All those years. I was six, Taylor. That's a long time ago. I wasn't born. Yeah, I wasn't around either. My dad was a child. The best part of that was how proud you were when you were saying it. Three times! Three times!

67, 68, and 70. Yeah, suck on that. Now we look stupid. And I will never brag about those appearances because they got swept every single time. They made the Stanley Cup Finals three times. They've never won a game in the final. And the reason for it is because it used to be the original six teams, and then they had the expansion six teams,

and the first expansion team was St. Louis. And then they added the other five, and they're like, you know, it'll be fun if we just have these six that have existed for 100 years over here in this league, and this one over here with brand new ones. And so St. Louis beat the shit out of all the other expansion leagues and then they'd end up against boston or montreal and just get like a rape that would put jk simmons in the first episode of oz to shame like they raped brutally on the ass ain't this picture in hockey history is fucking like bobby or scoring and then

jumping through the air as like there's a sad blues player in that the worst part about that picture is the entire hockey universe seems to be in denial that he jumped afterwards and it had nothing to do with the play right he scored and then afterwards he just jumps through the air and everyone's like, did you see that jumping shot he made? No, I saw a dick shit fucking jump in the air after the puck went in the net. What's special about that? I'll also stand by you in this unpopular opinion. He's a prick.

I don't care. All right, I have a question about hockey, okay? Because I just don't get this about hockey. I like sports. I'm a pretty big sports guy. I just don't understand this about hockey. I like sports. I'm a pretty big sports guy. I just don't understand the season in hockey. It doesn't seem like it matters at all. Over half the league makes the playoffs.

And hockey, more than almost any other sport, the teams are usually close. You had that year a few years ago where the Kings won it. And they were the worst team to make the playoffs. And they just beat people. And it just seems like the regular team to make the playoffs. And they just like beat people. And like it just seems like the regular season doesn't mean anything at all. Why am I wrong? Tell me why I'm wrong.

First of all, let's go football. What percentage of the teams make the playoffs in football? Am I crazy or is it 40%? No, it's very hard in baseball. Baseball's the hardest. Baseball's tricky. I think it's like 38% or something. Is it 38%?

And in hockey, what is it? 16 of 31. So like 50%-ish. So basketball and hockey. It's more than half. Hockey and basketball work the same structure where they both do 82 games a year and i totally agree with you i don't think that many teams should make the playoffs i like that that many make it because i get to watch more like playoff hockey is when i watch more teams

in the blues like i enjoy it yeah but like you're totally right when it's like halfway through the season and you're like yeah we've sucked cock so, but if we're just middling until the end, we can probably make it because like, you don't want that. That's something that baseball has gotten, right. Baseball has gotten a lot wrong, but they've made it very hard to make the playoffs. And so it's just hard to, I kind of, I kind of agree with you. 60 games or so.

That one game crapshoot though is terrible. The one game crapshoot, though, is terrible. The one game crapshoot needs to get rid of. They need to get rid of. In baseball? You couldn't be more wrong. Okay, okay. First of all, that one game crapshoot is one of the most interesting things in all of baseball. It's something they do incredibly light.

Right. When there's a tie, when they play their, I think baseball plays maybe 732 games. When they finish playing all those goddamn games in a season and it's a tie still and they have one game to decide which team makes the playoffs i think that's awesome i think it's too hard to make the playoffs in baseball because with two months left you know your team is fucked and it's over the same thing is true in college football they have four teams make the playoffs in college football if they extended that to eight then there would be like 10 or 12 teams all interested in those last couple of games

in a way that doesn't happen now. Now, there's four teams. There's maybe five who might make the playoffs with one or two weeks left. And it's just too selective. You're not in it. You don't have a chance. I think they should stretch.

I think basketball and hockey do it kind of right. I root for teams that tend to exist on the playoff bubble. And that's why I like it. College basketball does a good too. I totally agree about college football, by the way. But the one game, the one game thing in baseball, here's the problem. You get situations where you have like this season where the Cubs tied for the second best team in the national league and then have to play this. And then they lose the tiebreaker game. And so now, now they're not even in the playoffs anymore. Now they have to play a one game playoffs thing and they lose that.

And it's like, you have the team with the second best record or at the end of the season tied for best record, the national league, not even in the fucking playoffs. That's ridiculous to me. That shouldn't be a thing. But going back to college football, and actually, this is my theory on sports, okay? My theory is that sports where games matter a lot tend to be much more entertaining to watch.

And a good example of that, I think, is MMA. MMA is extremely entertaining to watch. And it's because it is all on the line. You fight a few times a year. If you lose, you are fucked. You get your ass beat and now you're headed down to pack. It'd be two more guys get their shot for the title or whatever it is. It's so intense.

And that intensity is what's good. That's why football is my favorite sport to watch college NFL, because every game matters. You can't just like, oh yeah, we lost a couple, but you know, like those couple could be everything. You can't take a game off. You can't take a quarter off. You get shit for taking a playoff,

you know, a single playoff. It's a big deal. I should, unless you're, unless you're Eli Manning, then, then it's just apparently it's almost that time.

Do you guys think that it looks like Eli Manning? The vibe I get from him when I see his face is that he doesn't know how to read. Yeah. Did you see the picture? He looks like he's got an extra chromosome. That's giving him that throwing arm. Did you see the picture where Peyton won the Super Bowl like three years ago, and he was up in the booth and

he had like a face like he was looking down oh yeah yeah and like you're like man that it's hard to describe what that face was but it was like this like I can't it was like he was like he was like upset that his brother won the Super Bowl or something he was almost grimacing at him in like his awkward goofy faced way yeah I liked It showed a good, healthy spirit of competition. Where he's like, god damn, my brother's so good at this. I'm also pretty good at it, but I'm never going to be as good. It's almost the time of year for me

to hop on the bandwagon, by the way. I'm in Georgia. UGA, rank number two, of course. If we win for the people listening to this, today against LSU, I'm full on the bandwagon. It's go time. We'll be, I think, 6 or 7 and 0. It's fully

engaged bandwagon mode. I don't even look. I mean, I look at the scores, but I refuse to watch a game until we get to about this point in the season where they're on unbeaten record. If they lose a single game, I hate them. There's only one team that I really hate in college football and it's Georgia.

But it's for this reason. It's a good reason. So, the I really hate in college football, and it's Georgia. But it's for this reason. It's a good reason. So the team I like in college football is USC. I was born in L.A. My dad went to USC. It's the team I've always rooted for. And another guy I know, and he's a big Georgia fan. And so we basically have this exchange where every week I'll bet on USC with him so there's no casinos or VIG, no house take.

I'll always bet on USC with him so there's no casinos or VIG, no house take. I'll always bet on USC with him and in exchange I have to bet against Georgia with him. So every week I've got against Georgia on the spread and so I'm always rooting for whatever shitty team and Georgia just pummels people into the ground. I'm like, oh my

God, it's so brutal. It's time to watch. Yeah. And, man. And college football is one of those things, unlike professional sports and a lot of sports, where if you're doing well, chances, you know, you can start getting recruitment. You know, like the kids who are in high school, if they're doing, if you're a high school football star, what are you doing but watching every game of college football? It's a feedback loop. That's how Alabama stays a fucking Titan.

And Georgia is riding a serious feedback back loop after the last couple of seasons. And this is the first, I want to say, I think they're 6-0, I could be wrong. This is like the first time in their history they've been back-to-back year 6-0. Like, the feedback loop is coming. It's going to be very strong.

They're going to start a fucking dynasty here if they're not careful. Their recruits are leaving them? I don't know why. dynasty here if they're not careful. Are the recruits leaving them? I don't know why. They lost two recruits to their top recruits uncommitted. I don't even know how normal that is. They've got so many recruits, so many five-star

QBs and stuff. Their running game is outrageous. They've got lots of young guys, lots of reds. They have a great team. It's going to continue to be great. I think the only kind of tough thing for Georgia is that when you're more or less the second or third best team in the country, something like that, the fact that the number one team is just regionally so close to you, it's got to hurt your pull. Because if you look at a lot of the top teams, they generally pull locally or they pull like regionally, right? And so when you've got Alabama, which is better than Georgia, and they they're right there that's got to hurt their recruitment i at least i imagine

at least somewhat yeah i mean it's the sec right like like like florida is perennially perennially perennially perennially why that's pretty close i'll count it god damn it i've i've had a small stroke perennially uh you know really good really good. And Tennessee used to be great. Every state around us has sort of a storied football program. NC State. If you say so. Did you go to NC State? I got my masses there.

Okay. I actually went to high school in Raleigh. Oh, okay. Yeah, and I went to a bunch of parties at NC State back in the day. I had some friends there and stuff. There are no parties at NC State. The story's not true. We just study. Let me rephrase that. We were drinking in someone's apartment.

That's how... I hadn't heard this before, but there's a school here called RALA, R-O-L-L-A. And it's a really good tech and engineering school, but it's like one of the highest percentage male schools in the country because it's engineering. And a buddy of mine who I've been friends with for my entire life is probably the only person who's like truly a bonafide genius. Like IQ is like 160 something. He he's so smart it's like uncomfortable we're like he'll

just know shit and he went there and i was visiting him once and he was like like just unironically was like yeah you know what they say about you know rolla boys i was like no and he's like you know the odds are good but the goods are odd yeah that's totally true because if you there, you're like, man, this guy is doing great in his classes. I don't like how he counts everything. But overall, a winner. That's a cliche about Alaska, too. I always remember in college, because a big thing people talked about when I was debating what college I wanted to go to, a lot of people went to NC State for my high school. And they were like, oh, NC State's got too many men.

They show the demographics of more men than women, and Chapel Hill is way more women than men, and you see all these different things. And it's like... I remember just thinking to myself, this is just an excuse that all guys use for why they suck at getting laid, right? Yeah, I would be crushing with the ladies,

but it's 52% men, so we're fucked. Maybe it was the fact that you didn't talk to any girls or go outside or leave your computer. No, no. It's the 52% men. I've been sitting in my apartment playing video games and smoking weed for almost four years now, and I've had no luck. It's like, no shit, buddy. That was like, you went to NC State.

I guarantee that's an archetype of person you saw there right where like people who get like i'm not against marijuana use at all like similar with alcohol like as long as you do it it doesn't impact your life negatively but like in some ways marijuana was even more dangerous to some of my friends because they were totally sold on the bill of it being like oh no it's totally harmless in fact it's not just harmless it's actively good for you it's a good thing to do it's healthy it's not bad at all and then you become like a lazy introverted piece of shit who doesn't socialize and gets depressed and you wonder why it's like because you're overeating and smoking pot all day every day like did you see that quite a bit going

through college uh doug i'm asking oh did he go to nc state i didn't i didn't go to nc state it was just confusion i i went i went to uncw um for one semester great actually it wasn't even a good semester no it's um yeah it's a university north carolina at wilmington so it's like like one of the state schools or whatever in North Carolina. But I mean, like, so, man, we are really moving topics. Like if we start talking about weed, we're going to have jumped from like sports to like college sports to college to weed. Welcome to the show. Yeah. I guess we're going to segue into Haley.

I wanted to talk about sports betting a little bit. How much sports betting do you do? And do you do it for fun or is there ever sort of a system to it so 99 of my my sports betting is essentially i got some buddies who like to bet sports but what we do is we just flip for sides so like let's say the spread is like someone like cowboys plus three and a half like it was on sunday then we flip for sides if you get texans you kept texans minus three and a half you get how ways you get cowboys plus three and a half like it was on Sunday. Then we flip for sides. If you get Texans, you get Texans minus three and a half. If you get Cowboys, you get Cowboys plus three and a half.

So there's no skill. And the thing is I like sports. I like watching sports and I like betting sports. But I'm not going to do it if it's negative EV. And when you bet with the house, it's negative EV. They're taking your money to take the bet. So I just do it with friends. And we're basically like flipping a coin to see what side you get.

But it's a fair side and then you watch the game which is great um betting betting for edge you know you it's something that people can do but the vast majority of people who are betting sports and think that they have an edge they don't they're just idiots and they just like oh well i really know football do you like because the people that are beating it have a formula set up to to interpret data and output like based on all the factors of the game from like a from like a data standpoint? What should money ball type thing? Yeah, they're not like plus three and a half looks a little big to me. Like that's not what they're doing. You know, they're like they're actually calculating it using using data.

It's all nerds and math people. The guy who really knows football isn't beating sports betting. He's just not. It's the guy who really knows quantitative analysis. That's the guy who's beating it. So I know some people that will occasionally bet on certain sides. A lot of smart people had Khabib in this last fight against Conor McGregor. A lot of smart people did because they felt like there were too many people trying to bet Conor's side and that Khabib should have been a little bit more like minus 250 or minus 300 or whatever.

But he just has such an audience or fan base that it drove the line down. Kind of the same thing that happened when he fought against Mayweather where the line towards the close was insane. He just started going massively towards McGregor in the last few hours before the lines closed because people just wanted to bet on McGregor, right? And it was moving the line towards McGregor. So, you know, there can be some spots. I tweeted a joke because I knew like a bunch of poker players.

Everyone was all in on Mayweather against McGregor. People were betting irresponsibly huge amounts of their bankroll because everyone knew the only reason that Floyd is like a three to one favorite or four to one favorite is because people love McGregor. Like this guy has never boxed anyone his entire life and he's going up against like debatably but probably the best boxer of all time. And it's a four to one line that doesn't make any sense at all. Like it should be much bigger than that and i tweeted during it and i was like if mcgregor wins this fight the

high stakes poker community is about to become is about to become the mid stakes poker community everyone was all in it was ridiculous i i came up with i i i came up with my own sports betting system this past weekend i came to to a realization on the day of the Conner fight that I'd been thinking about it all wrong my entire life, betting on every sport. Because what I've always done is bet on the team or the person that I want to win. And I came to this realization that, holy shit, if he loses, I'm going to feel bad even if there's no money on the line. But if he wins, the money's not going to make me feel that much better. I'm not going to go to an eight on the happiness scale because he wins and then get up to a nine because I won a few bucks.

So what you're saying is you set up a consolation prize. I set up a consolation prize. I bet very heavily on Habib. So on the fight night, I felt terrible, right? Because Conor had lost. But then the next day, I was paid my winnings. I felt a good bit better. How much did you win, if you don't mind me asking? I'd rather, I'll write how much. You don't have to say. No, no, no worries. I was just asking.

Nothing crazy, but that was the number that I felt would be a consolation prize for, because I really like Conor. That's a pretty solid consolation prize. It didn't get me on the happiness scale. Him losing bumps me down to like a two, but that money gets me right back up to a five, which is where I like to ride in life. And so I was very happy with the way things went. I lost $5 to Woody. Actually, the pay-per-view numbers are in. It's over $2 million.

Are they? Yep, you owe me $5. What was your bet? I won $10, lost $5. We had three bets. One bet was 2-1 odds, but Kyle thought Conor would knock him out in the second. Any other result and I win. That was a terrible bet. I didn't want to hurt his feelings feelings but he was very enthusiastic about it

how did you what do you the other is i had khabib straight up yeah i pretty much scared him on that the other was i had khabib straight up hey and uh the third bet was i thought it would do less than two million pay-per-views because uh i don't know i thought i had my pulse on just like the general excitement and vibe around it but i guess not it sold more than i thought we do uh the betting we do here is nine times out of ten just for the uh you know the enjoyment of the fans and in this case like the the silly bet from knocking out knocking uh connor getting the knockout in round two we needed to add about three minutes on to the end of the show we were at three hours and 57 minutes. And someone wrote, we need three more minutes.

And so I'm like, we should make another bet. We could bet on this. We could bet on that. We could bet on whether they wear polka dots or not. And I'm just like, 60 seconds, 67 seconds, 68 seconds. And what do you think, Woody? That was kind of the genesis of that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Like, if I were to pick, that's not a bad, it's not a good bet. But if I were to, like, had to pick a round and an ending, Connor's second by knockout would be one of my top ones. You know, the fact that it was that versus every other outcome makes it not a good bet. But if I had to pick one outcome, that wasn't crazy. I could be wrong, but I kind of assume that first round knockout outcome makes it not a good bet but if i had to pick one outcome that wasn't crazy yeah i i could be wrong but i kind of assume that first round knockout is always the most likely in mma just

because players or fighters are the least tired and so i imagine if you look at it on like a graph i imagine that it drops slightly from one to two and then it drops more as you go towards five i've not looked at the data i could be wrong so if someone knows more than me but i imagine that knockout round one's more likely but my thought sounds right my thought process was that connor if he's going to get the ko probably needs a round to not only because he's got ring rust which has got to be a thing but also because his part of his game is like timing the other fighter and maybe he needed a round to get that timing because he likes to throw feints and then see what you do right throw feints and see what you do and the next round we come out and you maybe you forgot maybe you're thinking oh i need to go for the the high crotch or the

single leg i need to get him up for the fence and then get my hands connected around his ass but he's thinking i'm gonna throw that feint again and he's gonna move to the left and then he's gonna catch my left you know maybe maybe, maybe that was my thought process there. Of course it was wrong. Watching the fight. So round two, I almost felt like was a moral victory for Conor towards the end when he was just surviving. Well, just hear me out. So he was surviving that like vicious ground and pound, right? And I flipped for sides and I had McGregor.

And I was like, this is really bad. Because he was just like, Khabib was just like unleashing and Conor's just like standing above him. Just like, I know we didn't really land huge, like clean shots to him. Like he, he survived that and got back on his feet. Round three was, I mean, easily the closest round of the fight. Conor started to establish some standup game. He like denied a couple takedown, like round three. I was like, man, maybe Conor's turning this thing.

And then Khabib just takes him down and then just destroys him, obviously. But round three, for a brief moment there, it looked like Conor could pull it off. If people don't know, Conor won on all three scorecards for round three. Khabib has never lost a round in his career until Conor got one round off him. I didn't even know that. Yeah, there's there's a bit of a moral victory to be had there. But anytime you're talking about moral victories, you got your ass kicked, right? Like no one talks about moral victories after actual victories. This is something I wanted to ask about it because I don't know nearly as much about UFC as as Woody and Kyle, but I was watching the post-fight debacle, that whole brawl that happened, and I saw everybody being like,

this is totally Khabib's fault. This is like his team jumping in. And then somebody sent me a GIF that showed Conor throwing a punch that seemed pretty early on, but I couldn't tell based on that clip if that was prior to any instigating or if that was the initial strike. I'm totally up to date on this. Yeah, I couldn't tell based on that clip if that was prior to any instigating or if that was the initial strike. I'm totally up to date on this. I don't know. I even have a video we could watch if we wanted to.

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but I just want to say, that was one of the best UFC cards I've ever seen. That's definitely top five UFC cards in general. The prelims, the early FS1 fights, all of that stuff were very good. Lots of great, just crazy KOs. Oh. Yeah? Yeah, where we were is I wanted to get the skinny

on what the actual situation was after the fight. Was it Khabib's team that instigated? Was it Conor that threw a punch and something happened like what laid out so let me lay this out because i've spent a lot of time looking at this the very very beginning um you might even say started weeks before during the build-up connor and his team were talking trash at a level that khabib isn't used to right he's more of a i guess you could call it selling the fight or you could call it disrespectful as they insulted his religion,

his family, his country, et cetera. And they were saying things to Khabib like, you got to watch where you sleep. My team is going to find you guys while you're sleeping. We're going to catch you at night. This isn't over. Then he's really just going after this guy on a very personal level. Khabib didn't like it.

He's not used to that kind of attack. As the fight wraps up and Khabib had finished his sort of He's not used to that kind of attack. As the fight wraps up, and Khabib had finished his sort of choke neck crank thing on Conor McGregor, he immediately gets the attention of a guy named Dylan Danis. Something very close to that. Kyle, did you want to jump in? Just right after he finishes

the choke, and right before he gets Dylan's attention, he spits in Conor's face. Go ahead. Oh, I didn't catch that. Okay. So anyway, he... What an asshole. It's been in the guy's face go ahead oh i didn't catch that okay so um so anyway what an asshole it's been in the guy's general direction it's part of it i don't even 100 i haven't seen that but um i don't know if it's a thing he threw his uh mouth guard in dylan danis's general direction i might have his name close but uh it's through the cage and stuff it's not like he hit him with it it was just a level of

i'm still upset with you type thing now dylan dennis is not a non-fighter this is a multiple world-time brazilian jiu-jitsu champion and an mma fighter in bellator right so don't anyone get it twisted that he like attacks somebody's cousin or dad and you know who's the non-fighter um dylan dennis is telling him to come at me come at me right you know like i dare you to which khabib says i accept your terms he jumps over the fence and does some sort of jump at dylan dennis and then that guy throws the first punch so you might say well there's two arguments on this part of the fight. Some would say a fight begins when the aggressor is with arm's reach, right? And if you're on that side, then Khabib started the fight.

You might also say a fight begins when someone throws the first punch, right? Because Conor McGregor did the exact same thing to Jose Aldo. Conor McGregor won his fight, jumped over the side of his cage, got like four inches from Jose Aldo's face and started screaming at him. Jose Aldo just laughed in return and there was no fight. So who knows how this would have played out had that guy not thrown the first punch. Maybe it would have been a screaming match. Maybe it could be what hit him. Having seen

that clip real quick, he does spit on his face. Does he? It's pretty clear that he does the disgust. Like that kind of spit. It'll take a second to get there on my screen. So anyway, he jumps in the game, and while he jumps into this, I'll call it a 20v1 type situation, right? He's jumping in the crowd in the middle of Conor's team.

Khabib's cousin is going to climb the fence, presumably to make it a 20 v 2 or something like that. Conor sees this and he punches his cousin in the face. Right. So in the ring, in the octagon, like that melee, Conor was the first aggressor. Conor went after a guy who wasn't giving Conor any attention. He punched the guy in the face and Conor goes to jump down there and join in the melee. But the security grabs Conor and prevents him from going over the side of the cage. They pull Conor in and another guy in a black shirt comes up to Conor. And again, just quickly rehash it. Does the fight start when the aggressor gets an arm reach or when you throw the

first punch? You can decide. But Conor throws the first punch at this guy in the black shirt and uh when that happens like around when like when when does connor get punched in the back of the head like that's after this right so first connor hits the guy in the black shirt and then a guy in a red shirt who's a real fighter he's like a professional boxer he might be khabib striking coach something like that starts lighting up connor like in the back of the head and body shots and you can tell by his form that you know he's just hitting him too much and then it all gets dispersed so khabib throws the mouth guard jumps into the crowd gets hit gets separated and then sort of simultaneously connor catches a guy who's also going to jump in the crowd by punching him, punches another guy, and then starts getting hit.

That's how it went down. I think almost certainly jumping out of the ring, throwing your mouth guard at someone and then jumping out of the ring presumably to attack them is the biggest mistake of anything anyone's made in this incident. I know people like to talk about the Dolly incident with the bus and shit. Totally ridiculous, and obviously that's going through the legal system there. But when you're a trained fighter and you get in an argument with someone, throw something at them, and then jump the cage to go after them, you are inciting essentially a riot. Because now you have a fighter out of the cage fighting somebody.

But it's not like the Ron Artest thing where six foot nine professional athletes are beating up like fat guys watching the game, right? No, no. That was – This guy was a current Bellator fighter, right? So he's also an elite fighter. Yeah, but the thing is like it really is – I know MMA is like, oh, this is a bad look, but like it's not bad for us or whatever. I think it is bad for you because you're really trying to say that this is a sport of men, but we abide by rules. There are rules to the game.

Otherwise – It's an honor code. There is sort of an honor code. And when you're jumping the side of the octagon to attack people, then everyone else now is like all highly – is like super emotional and like they want to fight or like they want this guy's back and then this other guy jumps in. And then, yeah, maybe the first guy is a seasoned, trained veteran. No doubt about that. Like this guy is a fighter. But what about when like the seventh guy is getting involved or what about when like someone's friend is like you know kind of a strong dude but like like you can't be like oh well it's okay to jump the ring and fight fighters it has to be you can't jump the ring and fight people

you can't incite violence which is what you're doing here i think it was way out of line what if you jumped the ring and got hit right if jose aldo hit con, this scenario would have been a mirror. But instead, Jose Aldo diffused it, and it was just a great fight hype. Yeah, I see what you're saying. But it's still McGregor's fault. If you jump outside of a ring and

aggressively approach somebody, I think that they're well within their right to protect themselves at that point. That's a reasonable sign. I'm going to wait until the guy for sure hits me in the face. By the way, one of the best fighters in the entire – yeah, I know he did. That was – it was a ballsy move too. But I think a lot of people might in that – maybe Jose thought in that exact spot, there's no way I'm going to get hit.

There's no way he's actually going to do that. No one's that stupid. There was no bad blood between them. Jose's watching the fight and they don't have bad blood, he and Conor. Conor hasn't even begun his world tour of shit-talking yet, which is what's made the sport so big as Conor's not. Are you sure about that? Was that the Mendes fight?

Yeah, right? Which fight was that? So Conor had been bad-mouthing Jose for a year before the Mendes fight because he was a last-minute replacement. I'd like to get Kyle's point of view of the whole post-fight thing because I anticipated that you and Woody might not see eye-to-eye on things. I don't know enough to know either way.

I think it comes down to— I'm curious what you're thinking because I totally am on Doug's team of leaping out of the ring like that. You're effectively inciting a riot. You know your team is amped to the max and something's going to happen I think what it comes down to is two different mindsets about what mixed martial arts and mixed martial arts promotion should be about Connors is definitely the most effective one in that it's the one that makes the most money for everyone involved whether you're anheuser bush or you're the guy who gets to fight connor and enjoy red panty night or you're on the under

card or you're dating away yeah connor's way is the way that makes the most money and grows the sport the most habib's way is we're here for punches and kicks and to be respectful of each other though he didn't show a lot of respect that night. I think the punches and kicks aren't enough, and they haven't been enough for a long time, to quote Chael Sonnen. And Conor's way is definitely the way of the future and the way of the superstar and the way that, like I said, helps everybody.

He's on the top of the pyramid, you could say. He's probably the individual who's making the most that night. I don't know about the ownership, how much they make individually, but Conor might be the one making the most individually from that night. I don't know about the ownership, how much they make individually, but Conor might be the one making the most individually from that night. But everyone down the line is profiting from Conor's mouth and the crazy shit that he said. If Conor doesn't exist and Habib is the guy who's the champion, everybody else makes less money. Nobody cares. Nobody cares.

Nobody cares. Nobody cares. Well, people care about fighting the economy. They's it's first of all people care about fewer people care much many fewer people care the thing about connor's promotion though records is connor wins the promotion and everybody else is the victim right connor talks trash he looks up he makes up lies about his dad and his cousin and his trainer and all this crazy stuff some of that stuff a little stretched maybe perhaps the other guy's not a terrorist he had five passports on him i don't know why but

that doesn't make him a terrorist that doesn't make it passports he was taken off the flight by you know he wasn't allowed to continue mcgregor has said so many things so many things that trying to be like you know what was true or not true like we could we could all well be all talking about different aspects of things that were said. There were certainly some things he said that were true, some that were questionable, and some that were just flat out false lies. There was a whole grab bag of everything. Yeah, sure. And he's not a politician, so we're not, you know, throwing this on the truth. What I'm saying is this.

If Conor's promoting against you, you're just taking shit. This is not your forte, right? Conor's a rare guy who has two talents. But all these other fighters have one. All they do is fight, right? Everyone Conor goes up against looks like a fool during the pre-fight run-up as he just mouths off and makes you look stupid because you don't have the kind of – you're not good at it like he is. So I can see why post-fight you want to do the part you're good at the best example of that by the way is the one where he's like who the fuck is that guy and like it was his opponent

in the fight who was that no i hated that because i so i follow mma really closely and i have seen connor go down the entire roster and talk about how he would do against these guys, how much they weigh, how long their arms are, what their style is. This guy, Jeremy Stevens, who was like the number four, three ranked guy in his weight class, he pretends he doesn't know him. Who is that guy is the to me a very recycled, overused insult that I hear everywhere from music to sports, right? It worked, clearly. There's tons of people who still associate Jeremy Stevens with who the fuck is that guy. I mean, it's because, believe it or not,

these people aren't the best fighters and also super quick-witted. What do you mean? Usually they have some fallbacks, but it does seem to me like there's an overarching theme here of khabib failing to either understand or accept the fact that all of this is just bants it's just banter it's just trying to amp up the fight like like of course there are personal insults like that's how

fighting has always been you want to amp up the fight get the energy high and khabib takes or seemed to take all of this as personal affronts and assaults when really it was like we're amping up a fight here like that's what we're doing at the end of the day like they they hire them they like me conor mcgregor because i'm a great striker and i'm good at fighting and i know how to play the the pr game like and you're not playing the PR game with me. You're going, oh, this is all messed up shit you're talking. It's like, no shit. It's called shit talk.

Like, maybe that wasn't allowed back in Dagestan, but that's what we do here. It's all about building the show. There's consequences for running your mouth in Dagestan, and I'm a bigger fan of Khabib for it. What do you guys think about this? The only people who have that mindset are, like, fake tough guys and children.

The consequences end up being legal consequences because you can't just, oh, he talks shit to me, Your Honor, so I beat him down. Okay, well, that's called aggravated assault. Well, you're going to prison. No, he's a child. What do you guys think about how...

He got his feelings hurt. I think about this with Brock Lesnar. Not a child either. Mentally, yes. Let me hear for a second. What do you I think about this with Brock Lesnar. Not a child either. I think about this. Mentally, yes. Yeah, let's let Doug in. Let's let Doug in. Let me hear it for a second. What do you guys think about the general direction of the UFC? Because I feel like there's like a thin line, which is like when you have

Conor talking shit, it seems okay. It seems okay as we should allow it. But did you guys see the end of the Stipe-Cromier fight where um where brock lesnar like hit the camera and was like doing like this too and i'm like this is the worst this is like very fake wwe type shit they're pulling and i'm i really hope that it doesn't go that direction because what what what's great about it you know all the trash talk should decide

it's like really world-class fighters duking it out with like some different styles. That's amazing, right? But like are we okay with just like whatever publicity is good publicity here and like making it seem super fake and cheesy and like over the top and stuff? Or do you just think it doesn't matter? I don't like it. So I think one of the things is nobody likes the sport being contaminated by like a Logan Paul or something like that. And a lot of people kind of felt that to some extent about CM Punk, right? You don't love to see that. But at the end of the day, it's still a virgining sport.

I think it's 25 years old at this point. I think it started at like 94. So like whatever it takes to get more eyeballs on it, I think is a good thing for the UFC and the business of the UFC, as long as you're not just poisoning the waters for fight fans. When you get to that level, you've gone too far. And I think the Brock thing can do that to some extent. I saw him come in there with that fake shove and everything.

Oh, it felt really bad. It felt bad, but I feel like it wouldn't have even been necessary if DC were maybe better at that area of his game. DC is a nice guy. He's just a little too nice. I wish he was a little better at the trash talk aspect of the thing. And, you know, that's why I want to see him fight fucking Jon Jones again so much. Obviously, you want to see the trilogy, and you want to see if he can beat an unenhanced John Jones. But you know the trash talk's going to be real

because they actually hate each other, and that's the only guy you'll get DC out there saying actual mean shit about. He'll go in there, and he'll call him a cokehead, and he'll say he runs pregnant women over, and he's a cheater, and he hides under the ring from US USADA and a whole list of things. And he'll mean it. And that's kind of John Jones is kind of a scumbag.

He is. He is. He's come back. No, he should be punished for it. Yeah. I like it when people suffer consequences like the college is like only people are fake tough guys and children. I'm like the only people who like to be able to talk shit with no consequences are assholes, right? People who want to run their mouth and not have anything happen to them. That shouldn't be the way it is. There should be a line that you can cross.

It has to be like that. You have to be able to have your opinion without having to step into the ring or whatever. Otherwise, how would you... If your opinion is insulting the guy's family and religion and his father, caveman do that strongest caveman get his opinions heard you little caveman i don't think you gotta shut your mouth or or it'll come back at you i i don't think it should be you're gonna talk trash to khabib about his religion and his family you know what did he say about his religion because Because I never caught that. I don't even know.

I just keep reading online. I never caught that one. Even if he said it. He's putting in the... I never saw him. I saw him make fun of his dad and his country and his country's relationship with Russia and his standing in the world and his standing in Russia

and everything under the sun. But I saw him do all that stuff to Jose Aldo. And then after the fight, Conor picks him up and hugs him. And Conor clearly feels bad that he finished Jose that fast. And they make up all over again. Conor's pretty good post-fight, win or lose. That's because he knows what's... I like that in him a lot.

Yeah, well, I mean, I just like a world where you can't do and say anything. You know, where like, oh, so long as I do everything short of actually touching you, there's no consequences. It's First Amendment. There's no consequences. I can say anything I want. I can do anything I want. I can enter and almost touch you. You know, like, no.

You're being kind of romantic about it, though. Maybe so. no at some point you're being kind of romantic about it though maybe maybe so like you get you get to have an opinion or else you guys couldn't have a podcast it was a huge difference between like a mile away talking about stuff in general you know accents and like literally attacking a guy's father i i don't think there is i think i should be able to say whatever i want about anyone and if they attack me they are definitely in the wrong because yeah that's that's yeah oh i'm in the minority in this crowd probably in the world but i definitely don't agree i definitely like i prefer a world where you know like you just go up and say too much and they feel like you've opened a door in real life that happens like you go up and say too much and they feel like you've opened a door.

In real life, that happens. Like you go and you say too much and you'll get popped in the mouth. Like in the context of professional fighters who know what they're doing and they know they're marketing a product at the end of the day, unless Khabib is truly that retarded that he thinks he's not marketing a product that people will buy. You know, like Khabib, I know you're a long-time listener. You're not interesting. You're a fucking boring person. You're boring as shit. Thank God Conor was there to drag

that interest rate up. You should be on your knees thanking Conor McGregor that you have the life that you have right now. On your fucking knees, Khabib. You're so awesome. Thank him. Khabib's going to come assault me now. you have right now on your on your fucking knees could be anyway guys time to run up between him and tony he's gonna come assault me now because i insulted him you have a lot of excitement too

and and khabib and tony ferguson i think are about a pair in terms of uh they would have done a 750 to a million pay-per-views i'm guessing what do you think kyle you think that's high i think that's real high i I think we'll get a... You gotta run, Doug, right? Yeah, I gotta run here. Well, everybody check out Doug's YouTube channel. It'll be linked down below in the description. He does some really good videos. It's often poker related. I

really enjoyed when you break down the hands from movies and stuff and you point out why like, well, I mean, you wouldn't make this decision in real life. I really enjoyed that because I love anything with movies and I like you breaking down the hijinks and silly stuff that poker pros and poker amateurs do at the table. It's good stuff. Thanks, man. I appreciate that. And I want to say thanks for having me on the podcast today. Yeah, yeah, sure, man. You got to come back. That was, you know, I don't feel any smarter about gambling, but you definitely

told me some things. I think you learned a few things. I'm sure I did. You definitely know what your screen name is going to be next time around. You got your play ready to go. Yeah. 2ZQ08. Everyone be on the watch.

Anyway, guys, I'll see you later. Thanks again. Later, Doug. Thanks for coming, man. Yeah. I like him. He's great. Thanks again. Later, man. Later, Doug. Thanks for coming, man. Yeah. I like him. Man, he's great. We got to have Doug back. Doug's a smart guy. It made me upset when I Wikipedia'd Doug and realized I was like, oh, he's like a year

and a half older than I am. And I've barely won any millions of dollars on the poker tour. Yeah, yeah. He's got three bracelets. I wanted to get to the bracelets. I kept forgetting And I've barely won any millions of dollars on the poker tour. Yeah. Yeah. He's got three bracelets. I should, I wanted to get to the bracelets. I kept forgetting.

I want to see them. Right. Those things are usually really cool. Is that what you win in poker bracelets? Uh, aside from money. Yeah. That's like the ring,

uh, you know, from, yeah, honestly, that's pretty lame. Like if we're being for real, like a bracelet that I would much rather get a ring or maybe a tiara.

Yeah. be in for real like a bracelet that i would much rather get a ring or maybe a tiara yeah you can walk around as like the as the crowd as the duke of of poker whatever the fuck you'd be they're pretty legit let me try to find a picture of one um yeah oh nice and blurry thank you are they they nearly as impressive as the four major sport rings? Yes. Really? Yeah, they're all diamond-encrusted and shit, and platinum or gold, depending on the event or whatever. This is a pretty nice bracelet. I'll give that to you. What would you want? I think I'd want a trophy.

No, I like the jewelry. You'd rather have a bracelet than a trophy? Really? the jewelry because okay if you show a bracelet than a trophy really let me let me let me let me run this by first of all i do think it'd be silly to go to any poker event wearing your bracelet uh especially if you're not a guy like who's who's who everybody's gonna recognize like like if you're phil ivy wear your fucking bracelet everybody knows you got like eight or nine of them or whatever he's got now but if you're just jimmy what's the name of the guy you just said phil ivy okay um he's he's uh he's the one who got caught uh cheating at a baccarat but uh he's also like incredibly accomplished at uh at texas hold'em in any case like like you can wear the thing and uh you know i i think it looks nice and the trophy what's

what are you gonna do with the trophy right it's it's gonna sit in a room somewhere like that's what i'll do with it here's here's where my uh head space is i would never wear a bracelet right because i'm a boy i would never wear a ring um because i don't know i get degloved and i'm just not into like big fancy fat rings like like a high school ring i never bought a high school or any of my college, uh, colleges rings that when I graduated, um, I don't know. I don't do jewelry. I have a watch.

I have a one watch. Um, so all it's going to do is sit in a box, sit in a safe. A trophy is actually like more on display than jewelry is for me. So I think we're both coming at it from the same place. You're like, Hey,

I could wear this to a place and have a thing to display. I would never do that. So a trophy, I would. It's also worth a whole lot of money, right? The trophy's worth... I mean, who's going to buy your trophy, though? I guess the same people that would be interested in a bracelet. No.

I bet it'd be a lot easier to sell a diamond-encrusted platinum bracelet than it would to be a trophy. Well, because there's value inherent in the diamonds. What if the trophy had equal meltdown value? I don't know what you want to call it. The trophy doesn't have to be a plastic piece of shit that they also gave to the softball

winner in Raleigh. What do you want your name to say? Nine years old and under, right? If the trophy had some real gold content, it was encrusted with something, and that where and it like that would to me would have uh i want to be a pro poker player who's who has a bunch of self uh self-commissioned participation trophies yeah i'm a 10-time participator in the World Series of Poker. I was just looking through this guy.

I was looking through Phil Ivey's Wikipedia page. That's why I asked you the name. I wanted to kind of get a feel for him. Like, a lot of the wins aren't a ton of money in the list until you look at how many tournaments he's playing per year and it's like you know sure he makes 15 grand here 10 grand here but then he's got two tournaments where he makes 145 000 or 315 000 or some shit like i had no idea first of all that all this money actually went to them i thought that like like, like I said, some Chinese billionaire

was like, oh yeah, this fund for me and like, just, just like funded the whole thing. But no, like that's crazy. I had no idea there was a real career. I thought it was like a Dan was Zarian kind of thing where it's like, all right, I started with a lot of money and now I have even more. Let me lay out the counter argument because I'm not sure where the truth is, but we're seeing people's wins, right? Look, you won 10 grand here, 140 grand there, etc. Don't they lose sometimes?

Like, no one's Wikipedia page talks about when they lost 140 grand. Well, you have to also separate the cash gains from the tournaments. We're talking about tournament poker right now where you buy in for a flat fee. They give you chips and you're playing until for for a placement right first second third fourth fifth and on down the line and like the big

tournaments they're they're paying out like the top 100 players or something like that but phil ivy's really well known for his cash game play and you can watch hours and hours of that on tv and if you add it all up he is definitely definitely coming out the winner in that regard. And like some of these tournaments, you win 150,000. I've seen him win half a million in a hand, you know, like how is a cash game from the tournament play? We we sit down with cash money with two hundred thousand dollars worth of money and some of it. And you have that money, or in your account you can wire whatever. You have it ready to spend. When you walk into the room,

you buy the chips, and they give you $200,000 worth of chips. And in the ones that are televised, oftentimes they'll also have cash, like hard cash on the table, like a big thing of $25,000 cash. And you're playing for face value. And at any point you can be like,

all right, I'm up to 1.3 million. Cash me out, and you give them the chips, and they give you $1.3 million, and you leave. Those are the really fun games to watch where six or eight guys are sitting around, and there's $4 or $5 million on the table, and people get wiped the fuck out because it's no limit.

See, the way the tournament works, if I, correct me if I have this wrong, everyone buys in, and I think it's fairly limit. See, the way the tournament works, if I correct me, I've had this wrong. Everyone buys in. I think it's fairly expensive, like 10 grand to get into these bigger tournaments. And everyone loses. Everyone loses all their chips except for the winner at one point or another. So it's not like. But if you finish in the top 10, you still win.

Right. Yeah. Oh, yeah. But if you just if you pretended those chips you bought in in a tournament were real, then only one guy would win the tournament all the time. So you go in, and it's literally like at the end of the night, all of that money is aggregated to one guy. That's how cash – Make-believe.

In the tournament, that's how it works, but make-believe, right? Because they're not actually playing for the chips. They're playing for the place. In cash games, it's regular. Cash games, okay. Yeah, in the cash game, I can buy more chips. You can't're playing for the place. In cash games, it's regular. Cash games, okay. Yeah, in the cash game, I can buy more chips. You can't make me leave the table. I can just pull out my wallet and buy more

chips, right? And I can just keep playing with you and try to win my money back because we're gambling for real money every hand. If I put $50 in the pot, it's not a chip that says 50 on it. It's $50 US. Whereas in the tournament system, we're going for a placement.

First, second, third, fourth. And when you lose your chips, you're out in that place. Sometimes there's simultaneous hands going on and you wonder, I think if I burn a little time here, I might make an extra $100,000. Maybe Larry will get knocked out right now.

It's that kind of situation. And at the end, it ends up with two players sitting at the table with enormous... And what they do, and this has got to lay the pressure on them, when they get to the final table, the heads up, two players are left, and all of the chips that began with a field of 1,000, 2,000, 5,000 players are in play now. I have like 80 million, and you have 57 million chips.

They bring out these hot chicks with barrels of money the actual prize money for first place and they lay three four five six eight million dollars cash on the fucking table and then the trophy and then the bracelet and it's sitting there right i've seen that that's really cool yeah it's just like piles of money like i don't want to burst your bubble but all those uh all those barrels and containers you see are false bottoms there's not actually that much cash in there absolutely is it's a casino they've got it on hand they just roll it right out and put eight million dollars on the table i don't think eight million looks like that much. There's a lot of tens. Put it in fives. Yeah, yeah.

This is a lot of fucking Lincolns on the table. Does a million dollars fit in a brown paper bag? I don't even know. That might be too small. It definitely fits in a grocery bag. That's $10,100 bills. What money weighs a gram per bill? That's 10,000 grams. How much would that weigh? That's $10,100 bills and what money weighs a gram per bill. So that's 10,000 grams.

How much would that weigh? That's more telling, right? The stack is 100, right? 10,000 grams to pounds. A million dollars is 22 pounds of money. So in $100 bills, $50,000 stacked up is 2.15 inches tall. So that's, what's 2.15 inches? I don't know, like that maybe? Well, I know that eight inches is about this. that's fucking good that's funny yeah like like i looked it up a million dollars about

fit in a grocery bag so eight million dollars actually bigger than i envisioned it in my head that was good, Kyle. Taylor really liked that one. Every once in a while, a fucking winner. Yeah, I really enjoy watching poker on TV, but the tournaments get a little tedious because you never know what the money's worth to each individual player. It's their buy-in, of course, but how much is their position worth to them?

What are their goals in the tournament? But in the cash game, it's something we can all... There's a bit of a gold standard going on there. You bet $10,000. That's $10,000 fucking dollars. Are the cash players also the high-level poker pros, or do the poker pros just play in the tournament league? There's a lot of overlap. In the cash game, usually what they do is they'll have six pros

that I'll recognize and names that I know, and everybody likes to watch those guys play. Some of them are cash game specialists. That's mostly what they do. And then they'll have usually like two rich guys like like two just really rich motherfuckers who clearly ten thousand dollars isn't quite ten thousand dollars to them and it's really fun to see see that go down because that guy will be a little and oftentimes this guy get cleaned the fuck out and they don't really mind that much

it seems it's it's it's really entertaining to watch this cash game. They're just paying to be at Fantasy Camp. How rich would you have to be for just a novice at poker to show up at one of those tournaments? Like if Bill Gates or Warren Buffett or one of those, Bezos, one of those guys shows up, and it's just a cash game. And he goes, all right, I'll raise you, let's keep this small, guys, $7 million.

Like on the first hand, no cards have been flipped or anything. Like, he could win just by having an enormous amount of money, right? No, they just keep taking his money. They'd love that. Because it's about those percentages that our boy talked about, you know? Like, everybody's just going to fold until they have a high pocket pair. They've got ace-king, and they're happy to race you. Like, a lot of those guys would be, if you just came up to them and said,

hey, I'll give you aces, and you won't know my hand, seven million? And they're like, absolutely, all day, every day. Yes, let's go. Yeah, it's that coin flip scenario where I win 200 if I win, and you only win 100. They'll flip that coin all day with you. Man, I wonder how much the average pro poker player is worth. Because most of them aren't like Polk, the guy we had on who's very successful, does very well for himself.

I imagine most of these guys burn out in a flame that probably devolves in gambling addiction, right? One of the things that keeps them afloat and has made a lot of them super wealthy is the sponsorship money. A lot of those guys went together. Like Doyle Brunson. Who sponsors poker tournaments? Poker websites and poker training academies and ways to teach you to be better.

Poker training academies. Yeah, absolutely. And they sell books, of course. I don't know how many poker books I own, like half a dozen or something like that. This kind of reminds me of those get-rich-quick industries Absolutely. And they sell books, of course. And I don't know how many poker books I own, like half a dozen or something like that. This kind of reminds me of those like get rich quick industries where like, oh, look, I can make so much money in real estate. Pay me a thousand dollars and I'll teach you how to make money in real estate. Like, why aren't you in the real estate business? Why are you in the seminar business? Are they really making that much in poker if the sponsorships are where the money comes from?

Are they really making that much in poker if the sponsorships are where the money comes from? The answer is yes to both, right? Especially the big names, like the ones I could rattle off, like Phil Ivey. Phil Hellmuth, despite his antics and stuff, is a very wealthy guy. Mike Matusow, I think. Nganu, whatever his name is. Yeah, Nagranu. Nganu is a guy, too. He's a heavyweight yeah yeah i know i fucked that one up already i'm coming sammy farha like phil lock all those guys a couple n's handful

of g's you know the name like a lot of the bigger names were in very early and they were getting ridiculous uh sponsorship deals from the bigger poker sites because when they sit at the table on ESPN, they're wearing the hat and the shirt, right? And they're driving enormous amounts of traffic to those websites because every commercial on ESPN or on whatever they show the World Poker Tour on, I can't remember that, the Game Show Network or whatever it is, every commercial is PokerStars.net Come and play for free. Get a $100 credit. And they're just driving

so much traffic to those websites. How about instead of professional poker, it's professional stroker and it's just seeing who can get off first in a circle of men under bright lights while a lot of people watch. Well, that's some high-level gamesmanship right there.

You want to come first. Is that what you're going for? I think you want to be edgy. You don't want to be the last one to... I mean, Professional Stroker is an intense game. You want to be the first one to come. Here's the game. You want to be not the first and not the last.

Yeah, yeah. So I think that they used to have that game that was a that was a very high stakes endeavor but then you had the uh the electro rectal ejaculators that came in and just ruined it for everybody right that's a pd in my in my view yeah the the eres uh came in and they just they just ruined everything. They had those electronic butt plugs and they just zapped the prostate. Now, Kyle, you're in a professional stroker tournament. You worked your ass off.

Your cock's tender, but willing. Raw. And the competition starts. You can't come first. You can't come last. What's your strategy? Remain flaccid for a while? I've been edging for days. My penis has stayed in a constant state of lubrication.

There is a shiny film on everything that I touch throughout my day because I'm constantly moved up. And I'm just edging constantly, just constantly pulling. Just in the DMV, at the office, in the car, everywhere. Normal places, yeah. I've got my electro rectal ejaculating suppository in, alright? It's wired to Big Phil over there. Phil's, Phil and I are on, in communications. Give it to a

man, okay. It can't even be Phyllis in this situation. I don't want a woman's silly fingers ruining this. I need a man. You need an expert. Women ruin everything, that's a fact. Absolutely. I need someone who's gonna hit the button right at the moment after Slick Willie over there blows his load. So I want to come in a very close second in this game.

Do you have the confidence in your penal rigidity that you'll be able to get it off there in front of that many people? After that much abuse, it's gonna come soft or hard. It's not gonna matter. Won't even have to get a full erection. Have you ever come not all the way hard? Yes, it's infuriating because you start really masturbating. It's so depressing. You're masturbating like an angry

dice player. Rule of seven. You're really pulling hard and just trying. It's very depressing. It's and and you're really pulling hard and just trying it's it's very depressing it's very it's like when you're like too wasted to fuck but you end up fucking and like halfway through you realize you can like feel the dick bend like your dick bend as you're putting it in them you know what i mean where it's like all right i've gone from 80 hard to 60 hard and i've got to keep like a perfect geometrical angle to keep it hard enough.

Otherwise, it's going to fold in half. And so that's something none of us want. We've all been there, right? Absolutely. Yes, of course. At first, I'm like, what is he talking about? But it's probably the drinking thing, because I'm just not there. Oh, yeah, like whiskey dick, that kind of thing. But then you have to forge ahead and try to finish while you're at like, picture it like the nuclear war clock, except ticking downward.

It's like you're at 100%. You're hard. You're rigid. You're good to go. But then you're drunk, so you're at 80% to start. And then in the middle of it, you're at 60%. And you realize, my cock's folding like rope every time I try and push it in. Like, this isn't going to work.

And then you have to forge ahead, though, and come, even though your dick's only 50% or 60% hard. And there is nothing more frustrating than ejaculating with a half-hard dick. And I know Kyle— Does it ruin the orgasm? I mean, clearly there's performance scare here it does would you go from 80 to 60? you go to 40 and everybody knows

there's an issue here yeah if you go to 40 you're not even pushing it but she dare not mention it where you like grab the base of your dick and squeeze really hard to like keep it keep it going you're just like pulling up constantly come on

come on you're just pulling up constantly. Come on! Come on! You're just tugging, just trying to milk that shit. That's what it's like. It does somewhat ruin the orgasm, I would say. I think Kyle, from his facial expressions, agrees that when you come at 50%, when you're pushing rope,

you may have orgasm, but it's not the kind of orgasm where afterward where you're like oh i just feel good i feel relaxed i feel satiated it's the kind of orgasm where you're like i wasn't at my best and i feel bad right absolutely yeah that's no good never feel bad says chiz it was yes yes you know what sometimes i think i'm not misogynistic enough and then chiz comes in and gives me a boost always comes in yeah how's uh i know you meant and i'm sure most of it's secretive and whatnot. You mentioned a while back that Hope was doing really well at school.

Is that still going on? Or you had to step in with any parental, like, you know, get your fucking shit in order and stuff. So I need to talk to her more recently. She probably, I've heard about several good grades this semester. She says she's doing fine. I guess I'm a bad person because I'm always a little suspicious, right? Like I'll buy it when the report card comes in. You should be.

That's a good sign. So I know that she's gotten a couple of grades where she celebrates with us and tell us how excited she is. But much like poker players and stock market players, no one celebrates their losses. Right. No, no one's like. Yeah. So right under. Yeah, I'm I'm very I'm always suspicious. I guess that just makes me a dick. But yeah, she seems to be doing well. She's in a sorority this term. So I know that she's spending some time with that. She went to some like getaway. She's like mountain pictures andity this term. So I know that she's spending some time with that. She went to some getaway. She sent

mountain pictures and stuff of all the girls doing their thing on some sort of retreat vacation-ish type thing. But yeah, she seems to be doing well. But I'll know for sure when the report card is issued. Yeah, don't put that confidence up. Mandy was a joke, right?

That was a prank you guys were playing wait are you wait are you being serious right now are you joking i thought you guys were joking i really liked mandy i genuinely liked it a lot kyle did you also gen this was not a prank i genuinely liked it it's the best movie i've seen in a really long time i felt like i disliked mandy so much i went to rotten tomatoes to see what other people were saying and it was highly rated and i went to imdb and it was highly rated and i'm like is this like an internet meme that everyone's in on but me kyle said that the movie makes a turn for the positive when the main character is wronged right i don't want to

spoil it for people and uh i'm like all right all right that happens about two-thirds into the movie i'm exaggerating a little bit maybe 60 something like that it's beyond the halfway point it's two hours it happens like 30 minutes in i disagree with that definitely uh it's definitely before the halfway point ah i almost want to pull it up again. How long does a rental last? Like 30 days, right? I could still do it. I was like, I think they just tricked me out of $7.

I honestly thought. No, this was not a trick. We thought you'd like the movie. No, I couldn't have liked it less. What did you not like? Okay, what leapt out at you that you were like, fuck this? No. Like, what did you not like okay what what leapt out at you that you were like fuck this no like what did you hate okay there's very little dialogue and character building right it was just nicholas cage being over the top that was like this the beginning middle and end of this movie

uh if people don't i'm trying to lay it out without spoiling it because i think people might be interested but uh nicholas cage is married to someone things take a twist and he goes on revenge and uh um the the filmography right was praised online people thought it was wonderful i thought it was distracting and low budget i disliked it what uh what about it did you not like just uh the use of colors like there was there were scenes where things were like all red you, and it was just like glaringly red where they only used red lights in the room and they only use it. You didn't like that. Like that was really like them feeling the effects of the drug,

like kind of sort of being sucked into the energy of the cult. Like it really set the tone for it. Yeah. That wasn't lost on me, but it was wasted on me because I just, I didn't like it. And I, I, it was a on me because I didn't like it. It was a chore for me to get through that movie.

And Amazon has like a 10-second plus thing because it would take like 90 seconds for nothing to happen. Like, oh, he's forging his weapon. You got bored during that? That was like a 90-second clip. Yes. And it was cool. 10-second advance thing like seven times. Iron Man never showed up. There were no rockets or explosions. I didn't see one superhero.

There wasn't one Superman in this whole thing. There were a lot of areas where he would just basically sit still and look silly at the camera. I can watch 40 seconds in 30, in 10. You know, and I just, I and by the way, I didn't do that for the first hour and 10 minutes or so. I just, the movie

lost me hard. I just, I don't even, that doesn't even compute with me. You just have bad taste. I guess so, because Mandy's highly rated on Rotten Tomatoes. Yeah, Ebert loved it. I hate it.

He's dead. He came back from the dead. He rated it. No, that was a good movie. Like, I'll stand by that. That was a good fucking movie. Like, Nicolas Cage was a good actor in that movie. I didn't think that his over-the-top theatric nonsense was theatric nonsense. I think that he did a

very good job, especially in the scene we're all familiar with after the twist happens where he's in his bathroom and he shows the wild fluctuation between different emotions in a way that's pretty compelling, I think. It was incredible. I think he did really well in that movie. I didn't think he was over-the-top

at all. I thought he was pretty even-keeled for what happened to him and he was a perfect actor for that that was so the scene that they're talking about i didn't enjoy at all i was bored and out of it and it seemed to me stupid and i don't know if it was that scene or scenes coming up they use like a voice modulator uh to make him sound like demonic ish type thing and uh yeah i I was just like, oh my God, this is gay. This is awful. And I honestly thought you guys were playing a prank on me. I thought this was like a thing you do to people.

Like, you know, cow tipping? There's no such thing as cow tipping. Oh, yeah, you tell city folks. You tell city folk that you're going to go cow tipping and then you leave them in the field. That's what cow tipping is. There's no cow tipping. That's not a thing.

I thought this was like you guys cow tipped me. Like you both tricked me into watching a movie that you knew was like the worst movie to come out in the last decade. No, no. I genuinely liked it. I'll end up rewatching that because I liked it so much. Yeah, same here. Same here. I loved it.

It's one of my – it's probably one of my favorite – I don't know if it fits into horror. end up re-watching that because I liked it so much. Yeah, same here. I loved it. It's probably one of my favorite. I don't know if it fits into horror. Taylor talked about this. It's more of a thriller, I guess, but there's some horror elements. It's one of my favorite movies now. I would put it in my top 100 for sure. I loved the cinematography. I loved the music

so much. The music was so tone setting. the colors were excellent it was everything was you you viscerally sort of got into the mindset the the corrupted mindset in every instance right and you you felt the doom and gloom and despair of this character and and nick cage like we've talked about it has made some real stinkers you know but but this was definitely not one of them. I fucking loved it. This made me think I've been way too hard on that dude in the past for his stuff. Like, he was really good in this movie.

Yeah. I liked him. I especially like the bathroom scene where he's like, you know, just screaming and sobbing. And he's chugging that bottle of vodka and treating his wounds with the bottle of vodka. And, and, and then, you know, he, he sets out on his mission. And it was so. And it wasn't an over the top, like, ah, like scream of vengeance, like, of like, you know, some, some 1950s, you know, movie.

Like it was like when you would scream, it would be like a raspy, almost voice-cracking thing. The sound you would expect from someone who's truly distraught. I really liked that a lot. I thought this was a great movie, and I'm... I'm surprised, Woody, that not only did you dislike

it, that you thought it was so bad that you thought we were pranking you. Yes. Yeah. Kyle and I both dislike it that you thought it was so bad that you thought we were pranking you yes yeah you i kyle and i both 20 seconds ago i'm like all right i'm still five percent on the edge like when kyle recommended it to me i watched it loved it i thought it was fantastic like like all the like the red scenes you're talking about that built intensity like it made you like really understand like what was at stake like the the cult there and everything and uh i won't give away anything uh the her laughing in that situation

uh like and his subsequent fury. It felt real. I did like that she laughed. I wasn't sure how this was going to play out. And that was the right reaction. It was absolutely the wrong reaction. She should have said, yes, me lord,

let me suck that tiny cock. She was right in that it was a really small dick. He wasn't at full capacity he was uh you know there were a lot of people around all right you can't judge a flaccid fetus he was in a straight it was cold is that small you can judge i i saw a um a documentary maybe i forget they showed that wow it sounds so sick as I listen to it in hindsight. But I want to say they showed a bunch of high school girls.

This was a British like well-done, high-production value thing, a bunch of penises. And one of them was like the dude in the movie. And they all kind of like evaluated – A bunch of high school kids' penises? Maybe they were in college. But they were young and unaware of like evaluated a bunch of high school kids penises maybe they were in college but they were young and unaware of like penis dynamics and they were like these are flaccid penises and then they showed

them the hard penises and they could barely believe which ones matched up to which the biggest flaccid penis they expected to be the biggest hard penis but that's not how penises go you should see this Taylor now you know link me that and I'll learn much more as hard penis, but that's not how penises go. You should see this, Taylor. Now, you know,

link me that and I'll learn much more about penises. You know, I won't promise I'll watch it. But I promise I'll comment on it as though I have. I don't know if they should. How's the cinematography? It's good. They put them in a white room with proper lighting. There's, like, you know, no backdrop. And

they covered everything but the junk so you didn't get to see like anything about the guy you wouldn't be able to accurately gauge his age and stuff so they were like fucking like having their dick through a hole in the sheet the way hasidic jews do they weren't having sex they were standing upright and yet there was like a almost like a police lineup of dudes and uh and and just picture like a like a white high production cardboard that came up to mid-thigh and then started again at the belly button so uh did you guys know that was a way that hasidic uh jewish people fucked there's uh there's an episode through a sheet yeah they cut a hole in the sheet

yeah that's i'm pretty sure like there's an episode they're like eating ass through sheets like doing everything there's an episode of curve your enthusiasm where uh um larry is gonna hook up with this with his hasidic uh dry cleaner she's very attractive and uh and so he goes to the hotel room and he's got his sheet and she's like what the fuck is that he's like uh you know it's the uh it's the sheet she's like why is there a hole in it you know so we can uh you know through the through the hole that's bullshit larry you fucking believe that you believe it was gonna you thought i was gonna fuck you through that sheet larry what the fuck's wrong with you so i don't i don't know if modern his seeds are into that but that is a thing it definitely but that's a hasidic jew who was already gonna cheat on her husband and so you can can't trust her word as law for Jewish law.

I'm almost positive that's a thing in Hasidic communities. So let me read this. No, it's a widespread myth. The Talmud mandates that all sex must be done completely naked. The myth may originate from the Talit Katan. I don't know what that is. A very wide rectangular sheet with a four-pattern knotted string hanging from the corner.

They wear a small talit under their shirts the entire day with the stringing out the sides. It gets more interesting. Cleanliness is a big thing. The sheet had a hole in the Middle East and active imaginations made up the rest. Interesting.

I hear you, understand you, and I wholly reject that. It's true because I say it's true. I mean, they have those crazy curls on the side of their head. That is true, yeah. That's verifiable. That is verifiable. Yeah.

Do you... You know, that's verifiable. That is verifiable. Yeah. Do you... You know, that's not a good fashion choice. No. Having giant sideburns that you curl. I think they should do, like, regular 1970s mutton chops. Like, do something, like, dope like that. Don't do, like do the curly thing. The thing is...

Go ahead, Kyle. You go first. It's naturally curly. I don't think they're getting the curling iron out. If you don't think that those curls... If you think those curls are natural, I have a bridge in Gaza to sell you. I think I'm right about this.

I think I'm right about this. I feel like having in new jersey i think there's more jewish people and i believe that the curls could be true i have naturally very i have i have naturally curlier hair than either one of you by an order of magnitude but you're not a jew i mean i'm close enough oh yeah big bulky hockey playing taylor steen no i don't think so no goldman sacks i couldn't add a gold a silver or a steen to my name and you wouldn't believe me absolutely not you're why you're pale as a ghost and you're fucking enormous that's why well i i don't approve of any of this no there there are oh i was just trying to come up with a jewish professional athlete and i couldn't think of one there are some though they seem weak right like i feel like i if

taylor had those curls his toughness level in my eyes would drop two points. Right? Because they do that to you. Yeah, but you would really know that I had great credit. Like that guy, I don't know if he can win in a fight, but god damn, his credit's good. I bet his portfolio is properly diversified.

You know, I gotta get engaged i wonder if he's got a hookup yeah that's interesting like all of those like more inculcated religious groups in the country are fascinating like uh jews in new york in certain areas like the hasidic area uh amish in pennsylvania uh too, the Amish and the Mennonites are, but in Pennsylvania is like one of their strongholds. Like seeing those groups like persist to exist. Have you seen the shit that Hasidic Jews do to make sure that they don't violate the Sabbath? Because on the Sabbath in Judaism, you're not allowed to use any sort of power,

any sort of electric, any sort of anything. And so they have like, you know, Rube Goldberg machines, Goldberg, that's funny. And it'll basically be like, all right, well, you know, we can't possibly, you know, press the elevator door. God would be upset by this but if i put a bean in this basket and it happens to pull a lever down that goes around and and presses the elevator door then god's not looking and it's like it's like do you really think god would be like if god's real and he's up there looking do you think he's like these sons of bitches figured out a loophole or do you think he's going asshole you're not obeying my law fuck you you're circumventing what i what the the edict that i gave to you because it sounded like you were describing amish to me at first you know and their rules about not being able to use certain automated stuff i've never met a jew who did that no it's only uh it's only Hasidic and some more extreme Orthodox Jews.

The average Orthodox Jew does not do this. Hasidic Jews do this. And they're not as dedicated as the Amish, I guess, because the Amish are like all day, every day, like fucking no, no, no. The only way to use the internet is to post is job postings like that's the one thing the amish allowed the internet for is like job posting and putting yourself out there because they even the amish were like you know we got to get online like even they realized it even the amish find ways one day a week they do that yeah the amish even find ways around it though because like like they you they do that. Yeah, the Amish even find ways around it, though, because they're very letter of the law

when it comes to a lot of that stuff. So I've been to Amish country and worked with some of those people before, and I was asking them about it, and he's like, yeah, yeah, I have a tractor. And I was like, how do you get around that? Because I watched that Tim Allen movie. Nobody had a tractor.

They were all fucking shoveling out there. And he's like, ah, well, I don't own it. I let the John Deere place hold the note. I paid it off, except for a dollar. So technically, I don't own a tractor. I just use one. And I was like, ah, that's interesting. And he's like, well, and I've got a phone.

And it's like, well, how can you have a phone? Well, it's not on my property. So do they not understand equity in the Amish community? No, they will not enjoy any equity. He owned a phone. It wasn't on his property, though. It was at the end of the driveway, like a mailbox. It looked like an outhouse or something. He had a little phone out there.

You're talking about a Mennonite, not an Amish. No, this guy was Amish. His kids were out there in prairie garb. Yeah, Mennonites do that, too. The Mennonites in Georgia don't. This guy was Amish. That was made clear. The Mennonites are pretty middle of the road.

They're out there making blankets. They have cars. And jam and stuff like that. But the Amish are fucking hardcore with that stuff. I wouldn't want to live like that. I don't know. That would be awful. I've seen those documentaries about the Amish young.

When you're a kid, they get this period of time where they can go into the real world and see what that's all about. And then they come back and make their decision. And they had this one Amish kid they were following, and he had shacked up with a bunch of other Amish cast-outs, and they were all living in a trailer. And he's in there fucking playing PlayStation 2 and drinking mountain dew and shit and loving it well he gets into crystal meth and he starts owing some crystal meth dealer a lot of money so he has to go back to the amish place and live on the farm to hide from the meth dealer so he's got two car batteries set up in his bedroom and he's got the ps2 hooked up to him somehow and he's in there fucking playing ps2 off of dc power it was absurd that but all the amish kids were like having these like

all single player games single player games no connectivity no but they were playing they they would have these barn parties which sound pretty lame but they're like raves they're in they're all they're all doing drugs and and there's techno music and flashing lights. It's a perfect example of if you take someone, any kid, and you really hold them back. You don't let them experience anything, whether it's alcohol or seeing a titty or whatever, and then all of a sudden you turn them loose,

they were just going buck wild. I mean, the guy was into crystal meth. He was a young kid it's like also an argument against that because the overwhelming majority of amish kids who go on rumspringa come back i've heard like that's their point to say no i'm leaving but you can also attribute some of that to the fact that it's like am i gonna abandon my family everyone i've known my entire life like no I can't just leave and no longer be a part of their existence. Do you think they're having a lot of sex? Yes. Do you know how many kids those fuckers have?

No. During Rumspringa. Do you think they're slutting around? I would imagine so. Probably. Yeah. Everyone says lots. Okay.

Yeah, it might be my, you know, out-of-date mind or something. But I'm like, if you went out and played PlayStation and drank Mountain Dew and fuck, even did crystal meth or something, then that would just be a thing you did. But if you fuck 19 guys that year, then came back like, ah,

you put that on your permanent record. You know, what'd be funny is to like have a documentary crew film them and see how they react to non-white people because they've only hung out with white people their entire lives you know like like the first time they come across an asian or a mexican or a black person or whatever like that's got to be kind of weird for them right like that was their whole life you know they're like oh shit you you are a son of ham you think they lead with that when they talk to black people stand back son of ham do not corrupt me what the fuck did he say do not corrupt me she's in her bonnet and you know uh hoop dress or whatever the fuck they did back then.

Yeah. I feel like Amish people are probably happier than we are. Oh, for sure. Like, at the end of the day. Like, living with their family, living off the land, only doing shit on the internet when they absolutely have to. Like, they've got to be way happier than us. I guarantee they are. They absolutely have to be They've got to be way happier than us. I guarantee they are. They absolutely have to be. And you know what?

That's one of the very few groups that I feel like deserve that religious tax exemption. Don't fucking tax them. When I see these, everybody else pretty much, every other religious group, in Atlanta,

I drive past these megachurches all the time. Dude, I cannot... We would need to Google the pictures for you to even understand what I'm talking about. I'm sure we've all driven past a nice country club or been to one and we've seen the extravagance that can be spent there by 50 millionaires who want a playground.

Nothing like these megachurches. I used to go to a megachurch. Yeah, I know. There were like 15,000 members. Yeah, it's absurd what they have. The parking lot has buses, it's absurd what they have. The parking lot has buses like it's Six Flags to get you into the place. You're parking so far away. There's this fountain at one near me.

And when I say fountain, I mean a lake that has geysers of water coming out of it out front. It's ridiculous. The thing is, I don't know how tall. You can't measure it in floors because it's not an office building. It's like a goddamn cathedral. Forgive me, Lurk. And it's just huge. It looks like the Sydney Opera House or something, like that kind of construction that's just overly extravagant and ridiculous. Yeah.

Oh, it's so over the top. That was one of the first things that even as a child turned me off to religion where i was like i remember i was sitting i was in a it was it wasn't a sunday service it was like a thursday night service or some shit and i was there with my mom and dad and and family and they had they like live streamed and like not actually live stream like they used like they watched on some like closed circuit television shit like some debate between between a Christian and an atheist. And of course, the whole time, everybody's like, woohoo, and every Christian point and everything. And in between, in between, in the middle of the debate was like, all right, we're going to have a little, a little break here.

Let, let the debaters could do whatever the fuck. little break here let let the debaters could do whatever the fuck and then they did something where they were like and we also are going to pass something around just because uh uh we really need a new projector for for our our youth room we need a brand new projector which is about 7 000 and even at like the age of a young fucking age i was like are you shitting me are you shitting me this is the nicest building i've been in my entire life and you need a new projector the one that you were just showing the powerpoint on not good enough you need a new projector so you can do this it's like there are actual people struggling in the world and you're doing this like that someone that really opened my eyes a bit to that shit convinced me to be an atheist right so i was like agnostic pretty

much atheist for a long time right and like so many people in my position we just say like yeah well you know i'm just waiting for a little evidence a little something that wouldn't be explained some other way right if you pray that it rains tomorrow and it rains tomorrow i'm not calling god in on you know as conclusive proof proof. Give me something. So this guy says this. He says, what if I put a quarter in my hand, right? I had a quarter in my hand and I'm going to turn it upside down and hope it doesn't fall, right? So for starters, I pray it doesn't. How do you think it's going to work out? You think that quarter is still going to fall? You think it'll obey the laws of gravity? What if we all pray? What if everyone in this room prays we get 300 people praying together

and then i turn my hand over will the quarter still fall what if there's 15 000 people what if the entire planet gets together and prays in sync that that quarter won't fall everyone listening to that just we know that fucking quarter is going to fall you know there's no chance that your prayer is going to stop a quarter from falling in the air. Do you want to know the Christian answer to that? God willed it to fall? Go ahead. No, no, no, no. The Christian answer would be Luke 4.12, which is do not put the Lord your God to the test. Well, you know what? Don't set any sort of boundaries that are possibly quantifiable. Like don't put anything in there's possibly quantifiable, because that would be putting the Lord your God to the test. Well, there's a whole lot when you

view it through a suspicious lens that doesn't quite add up, right? Oh, yeah, for sure. Never test me. Give me your money. Don't tax me. It just goes on and on and on. And the standard of proof for religion is so low.

And the standard of proof for disproving it is so high. It's called faith for a reason, right? What would the point be if God made quarters not fall? Everybody would sign up. That's a quandary I have with the entire thing, is that faith is named as a gift that God gives to people. And so if God gave Woody's dad or mom faith and did not give me faith, he's setting the board. He's playing the game. He's manipulating the outcome by his own.

The same point that is made with hardening of Pharaoh's heart. Over and over, he actively hardens Pharaoh's heart because any rational person, like any Pharaoh, would have been like, honestly, we don't need you that much. 2,000 years from now, they're going to look back and go, hey, looks like there weren't actually any Jewish slaves in Egypt because the fun fact that never happened. There's no evidence that ever fucking happened. You don't build the greatest fucking achievement of all time with slave labor. It's skilled artisans that you pay well and feed well. Certainly not Jewish slaves. They're not good at manual labor.

Yeah, even slaves in the American South set back the average farmer because they were like, well, I can't afford any slaves, and that guy's got 1,000, so I'm pretty fucked. For the average person slavery does not work out beneficially like it works in like an oligarchic setup but regardless the whole biblical thing of uh of faith is is totally a construct that god has to give you in order for you to have it in a high enough level to to accept accept what he says without, without questioning it. Like that, that's what, that's the biggest thing that put me against religion. It was like, oh, so he gives the gift of faith to certain people. Like he actively will

like intervene and like do little fucked up things. And then also be like, nah, nah, I'm going to cause that typhoon in Haiti, but I'm not going to do shit about, uh, kids with AIDS. typhoon in haiti but i'm not gonna do shit about uh kids with aids i i yeah i just they religion makes me feel like an asshole for looking for like even the smallest bit of proof you know the smallest bit of proof that can't easily be explained in some other way you know and uh yeah that just sums it up i I mean, it's been said before. No proof, none, no evidence. And people who buy it are just like, oh, you're just denying all the evidence you do see. No, you are. Yeah, I understand why people do.

Because like I would rather be religious than agnostic about everything. For sure. Like I would play better if I could. But like this is a thing that I've said that is like caused a lot of religious people I've talked to about this to question it for a second, is that belief isn't a choice. You can't choose to believe something. If you think God is a retard, you can lie and pretend to believe something, but God probably isn't a retard if he knew you in the womb before he formed you. That's probably not a thing. That's the most compelling argument against religion, I think, is that you can't choose

to believe this. No matter how hard I try, day in and day out, I can't believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. I don't believe it. I can't force myself to. Yeah, and even if he is real, he seems like a real piece of shit. Well, Jesus was pretty dope. The Old Testament God was pretty shit, though. Yeah, I'm talking about that guy. Yeah, the old testament god was pretty shit though yeah i'm talking about that guy yeah the old testament god was a real cunt uh he's he's the epitome of a bronze age tribal god yep and vengeful jealous all that vengeful jealous very possessive compare him to the the contemporaneous gods of the Hittites, the Ammonites, any other group back then, and you'll see the exact

same thing. The Egyptians were around back then. They had fucking Amun-Ra and Osiris. Very similar tale. So is Baal. The whole thing is absurd to get into when you're...

It's fine if you want to. And look, I've said it before. I think it's a really good way to live your life for the most part until you start being one of these mega preachers who's just milking your congregation. You become a scam artist, essentially, to get your private jet. I'll never forget the guy who came to our car dealership, and he was a mega church preacher, and he was trading in his hummer

to get like something equally extravagant this is when hummers were cool and it had like big fucking chrome rims it had alligator skin on the dash which was so cool and the seats were some other kind of maybe ostrich skin and then like this was a time when plasma screens were fucking crazy expensive and they were everywhere the seat backs all had them there was a big flip down one like it was just this ridiculous extravagant car that i i can almost understand the private jet thing like like i've heard those guys explain it and it's like look if jesus were alive today he probably wouldn't be on a donkey he'd need a g6 right G6, right? He'd want to get around. Yeah, he'd want a dope-ass jet.

Right? I mean, he would. But he wouldn't want an alligator skin Hummer, I don't think. He'd be an electric car guy. Those disgusting, despicable priests and pastors who do that shit and make that much money, despicable priests and pastors who do that shit and make that much money they are like the living embodiment of the pharisees who jesus roundly rebuked because the pharisees were the the the huge uh at the time in that region it was judaism that was dominating and the pharisees were the big you know the head honchos of that movement and they were all about you know making a big scene

in public oh the lord and everything and jesus came out and said you know, making a big scene in public. Oh, the Lord and everything. And Jesus came out and said, you know, when you pray, enter into your inner chamber and shut your door and do it in private. He said that in Matthew. Like he said that and he used them as the big example. So all these fucking fakers that are out there pretending to speak the truth, Like, even them, they know enough about the Bible to know they're misleading people. They do. Like, I do not accept the ignorant,

they're just doing their best nonsense. No, they fucking know exactly what they're doing. There's a pop-off, P-O-P-O-F-F. There was a preacher who used to have something pop off. He used to be one of those big preachers who'd go up there and spread the word of the Lord. And he had his wife with an earpiece in and he had an earpiece in and she would talk to people who were going to go up to him and she would relay to him what their issue was so he could better and more appropriately respond to it. No, no, no.

It looks like you're wanting to jump in, Kyle. Yeah, yeah. What would happen was, this was one of those churches where the guy heals you. The preacher's gonna heal you, and when you walk in, you write down your name and what's wrong with you, and that corresponds to your seat. So she'd be in his ear telling him who to pick and then what was wrong with them and their name. And with that information off the cuff, you seem like Jesus Christ himself, right? That person is, if a guy downstage picked you out of a crowd of 10,000 people,

knew your name and what was wrong with you, and you're already there believing, of course, looking for salvation, you would instantly, you're already there believing of course looking for salvation you would instantly you'd instantly start believing then he comes over slaps you on the head and says you're cured you're gonna start fucking dancing whether you got arthritis or not yeah what a big rip-off and you could hear her in his ear they have the recordings they have the recordings of her she goes i can't remember his first name but she's like are, Tim? You better hope you can hear me. Because our scam ain't going to work if you don't. Yeah, it's profoundly manipulative what these fucking scumbags do to people. And they always, like, there's one clip of a guy, like, swinging his own suit jacket at other people.

Yes, I love it. And, like, big swaths of people go out. It's not just, yeah, it's not just the guy who gets touched. Yeah. It's like when Sauron has the mace and he's boom, like not just the one guy in front of him, the seven people behind him. Like that's what he was doing.

And even after he finished swinging the coat, if I recall correctly, he did things like Kamehameha waves from a Dragon Ball Z where he was like, and there's whole waves of people that would fall back. Okay, here we go. Hang on, hang on. Chiss stepped away, so I'll do these two ads and then he'll play the video because he's running the show.

Big thanks to Chiss for running the show tonight. Very appreciative of his hard work and labors. Yeah, tell everyone about Audible. This episode of PK is brought to you by Audible. What would it look like if we all listened more? Listening to audiobooks motivates us, inspires us, even brings us closer together.

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I also listened to it on Audible. And he reads it himself. And he does a great job. Yeah, I like that. It's really big for me. Like who's reading, who's doing the narration is super important to me. That's why I love those

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big fan six shots of espresso yeah that sounds i won i haven't tried it yet to be honest but i'm down for it i mean i looked for it before the ufc fight and they didn't have it at my quickie mart your quickie mart i got regular monster does an indian actually is he is an indian the proprietor of your local quickie mart or no uh you know i don't know who the proprietor is but the cashier is just some black chick oh which somehow sounds bad to say that's not very culturally no that's not insulting that's just a thing right if it was some white dude i would i don't know what he hurts the truth

saying someone is a black chick is not offensive. It's incredibly offensive. I've become way too sensitive to this kind of thing. Not only are you assuming their race, you're assuming their gender. You fucking piece of trash. I identify as a black chick and I simply won't have that kind of

purpose in my presence. If you want to troll people if you want to troll people online what you have to identify as is a trans lesbian because that's just a straight man but you get two words in there to like up your victim complex so people take you more seriously and especially you want to act outraged like if they say like boobs in this show are offensive you have to be like hey trans lesbians like myself appreciate breasts as well

so you trying to say this is just a dude bro cis normative thing is a little offensive and then undoubtedly they'll be like I'm sorry I didn't consider that and it's like you idiot like how could you do you not realize you're so ridiculous? What I said made sense to you?

That should be a wake-up call. Given that I was born in New Jersey, I feel like I should identify as a Native American. Right? That seems true. I was born here natively. Yeah, identify as Native American on every college application. That's what you've got to do. They get the best deals on college of anyone native americans

oh yeah yeah yeah they they get a a sweet deal i watched uh i watched an hbo thing it's called i left my heart at wounded knee and it's about the atrocities that we did to the western indians and i think it's supposed to tug at your little heartstrings you're feeling bad for the native peoples i was cheering the whole fucking time when those blue coats would arrive with their fucking hotchkiss guns and surround the camp. Oh!

It's an inch and a half diameter cannon. Oh, Jesus Christ. That they would use to pacify a group of natives. Yes, it was highly effective. This is forceful calming. The funniest thing is every year on Columbus Day, a bunch of douchebags come out of the woodwork and are like, hey, this Columbus guy wasn't that great. And it's like, yeah, you're right. He wasn't like there's no safer take on anything

than taking our standards in the 21st century and applying it to someone half a millennia ago where you're like hey this guy who did something i'm better than him i would i wouldn't have done it that way it's like dude like and it also like embodies the whole noble savage thing, which is kind of racist in its own way, where they're like, all these tribes were just existing peacefully. It's like, really? Really? When the Aztecs sacrificed tens of thousands of people ritualistically and everyone who lived under them hated them? That's what they were doing? Ritual cannibalism throughout much of the north america like it really like like at least to be honest with this like they didn't show up at some peaceful you know hippie commune and then start wrecking shit it's like no oh okay you know no we need to give this land back to the cherokee okay but the cherokee need to give it back to the sioux oh and the sioux need to give it back to the black feet oh but the blacket need to give it back. Are Blackfeet even a thing or are they just a hockey team?

The Columbus thing, too. It's like, you know what? Columbus was a bad guy. Lighten up, Francis. We're all just celebrating Monday off. It's not about Columbus anyway. I've said many times that I'm fine with eliminating the name of any holiday.

But as long as we still get the day off they could have adolf hitler thursdays every thursday and if it meant i got off i'd be like good hell i'd settle for getting off at 3 p.m right hitler thursdays you get out early and then we got fucking we got stalin mondays we got zid dang we got mao tuesdays you know we we got pol pot wednesdays like that like wouldn't you be fine with that if we just like if we had a day off that glorified like dictator wednesday and that was once a year where we honored all the dictators that have ever existed like i would be fine with that day i don't i don't think anyone would stand up to that day and say, I want to go to work.

Yeah, I'm with you. Yeah, you're on your own here. I have two videos. One, we mentioned it a little while ago, it's a Star Wars preacher. It's a preacher healing people violently, and they've inserted a lightsaber into his hand. And, of course, the effects I find hilarious. When I went to click it, when I searched for it, I could see I'd already watched it. There was a red line at the bottom. And the other

is some real... I guess white trash doesn't fit because there's white people and black people. What do you call black people? Is the first one you linked called Star Wars Preacher? Yes. Yeah. So it's... I don't know what you call black... What do you call black people that what oh the black

equivalent of white trash i don't know if there's a word for that black trash okay um but you can't say that is there something more concise like how what's the synonym of white trash and black people black trash no white trash is okay. Black trash is offensive, Taylor. Well, anyway, these people are having some kind of a parking lot dispute, and they keep amping things up for like three minutes or something like that, and things get real out of hand. So I think we should watch both of them, but I will let you guys decide. I definitely got to watch the second one. I'm ready on Star Wars Preacher.

I'm ready on both. All right, Star Wars Preacher. Anytime. I'm ready on both. Alright, Star Wars Preacher first then. I call it off all the time. I'm just out of habit. I'll do it. Cheers, are you ready? Yes. Alright. Three, two, one, play. In order to ensure the security

of the continuing stability, the Republic will be reorganized into the first... It took me three, five seconds to realize that this was from Star Wars. This is hilarious. He's going to get forced. There is a preacher on stage wielding

a video into his hand. As he makes these big passes at the audience nearby, they all fall down and hit their feet. That's when he's singing his suit, like I was saying. Yeah.

I love shit like that. That's hilarious. You would think he would use those powers to, you know, start some sort of mixed martial arts career, right? Well, you saw one video of a guy who tried that. The guy who thought he was, like, magical and had force powers and then was like, I'm going to fight. I will fight the real boxer. magical and had force powers and was like, I'm going to fight the real boxer.

And then he got his ass kicked because it turns out he doesn't actually have magical powers. How would Superman actually play out in the UFC? Obviously he'd win his fights, right? But it would take like one fight, maybe two before people realized like, wait a minute

this isn't even a human. I broke my hand punching his deltoid, right? I think they would quickly ban Kryptonians. I think they would quickly ban Kryptonians from major sports. The trick is, and I've thought about this as a kid, like if I had superpowers, is to not fucking put it on full display. When you hit a homer, you don't hit a three-mile home run. You hit a 500-footer.

And then everybody's blown away. Maybe you strike out a case. You don't bat 1,000. You bat 400, and you're just the best baseball player ever, but not by a factor of two. Yeah, I've literally thought that before. Oh, me too. I've been like, if I was going to be a superhero,

and I had the ability to stop time or some ridiculous shit, I'd be an NHL goalie, and I would have a save percentage of 0.93. The highest of all time, but not obscene. I would let the goal land occasionally just to be certain nobody suspected anything. Taylor, I think you want to start your career with a couple shutouts, right?

Because you're not going to be a starter, right you want to be a starter so so long as you get some shutouts you'll steal that job that's what i'd want to do i i'd i'd start my career with 11 shutouts 11 is the same number i had of like 11 shutouts is good yeah you'll you'll be um you'll have more praise than who's the next guy lynn sanity right taylor sanity will be out of this world like figure reference kyle like 11 shutouts would be like all right i'm gonna be the best baseball hitter of all time i'm gonna hit i'm gonna hit two to three home runs in my first 11 games each that level of impressive. Like, a shutout just means you don't allow anything past you.

I know what a shutout is. I was going to say I figured, but I wasn't sure. We have shutouts in baseball. We. Us baseball folk. It has a lot of weird terms, right? There's no hitters. I guess shutout, yeah.

They get hits off you, but no runs. It's the same thing as no hitter, right? No, no, because a no hitter is a shutout. But a guy can get a hit off you, get to, like, second base and never score. So you can have a shutout that's not a no hitter. It's a perfect game as well. It's a perfect game. Nobody gets on base.

No one gets on base. Nobody gets on base. Has that ever happened? Absolutely. That, to me, isn't that perfect, right? Wait, that's happened? A perfect game. Yeah, it happened. A perfect game. Yeah, it happened.

A perfect game should be 27 pitches, 27 strikes. Jesus, you can't even throw a single ball? That's a perfect game. What if they foul a couple off? Well, they should have never got a bat on it. We're talking about perfect here. Well, Kyle, we didn't consider that externality, and so we ignore it. Hitting for the

cycle. That's a cool one. Really, that's a thing where a whole baseball game will go and no one will get on base. Yeah, perfect game. How often do they happen? And you also have to pitch for the whole fucking game which is in itself a very rare thing.

That kind of makes it an old timey record right no because if you're playing a perfect game for like seven innings you get to stay in right in case you get like they never pull a perfect game out in the eighth and be like ah who knows you might have got it that's a that's some fucked up thing they did to a player on i think the senators or someone else they in the nhl they have like Ironman streaks where they're like, uh, this dude has played 700 NHL games without missing one. And a dude was on like 682 games and they made him a healthy scratch.

That sucks. What's the biggest fuck you. It's like, Hey, I know you're about to, like, your career's not that great, but you're about to enter the top ten in Iron Man Streaks, so we just thought we'd say fuck you and you're a healthy scratch. Was it a super critical game? Oh, no. It's so early in the season, nothing's a critical game.

It was early in the season? Yeah, it was early in the season. They made him a healthy scratch. I thought maybe it was game, like, 77 and they're one out of the playoffs. No, honestly, I thought I was going to make it to 700. You know, I'm healthy. They fucking scratched me. That's what it was, a healthy scratch.

There have been 23 perfect games, 21 since 1900, and the last one was 2012. Who was it? It was Felix Hernandez of the Marinersers never heard of him who's the best pitcher of all time isn't it randy johnson i was gonna say nolan ryan who you got kyle uh i don't know it depends what era you're gonna go in just the all-time era go with all time which means you kind of have to pick someone in recent eras because they were better than

back then i don't know i don't know did any uh any braves pitcher that you look oh yeah oh absolutely yeah yeah in the 90s we had uh maddox glavin and smalls and it was an absolute dream team uh pitching squad it was they're all in the hall of fame now um uh glavin was uh incredible at like picking the corner maddox was had an amazing change up and smolts uh like he had to have tommy john surgery late in his career and uh you didn't know nobody knew what was if he's gonna have a career anymore and he came back as a fucking closer and i was and he made the all-star game as a closer he's like the he's one of the very few i think maybe the only one that had like a certain number of starting uh games that he started and won and a certain number of like closes when you know when you close out

prevent their runs you have to pitch at least one inning and prevent any runs from scoring but it was like i don't know like 300 i'm gonna get i'm definitely wrong about this it was like, I don't know, like 300, I'm definitely wrong about this. It was like a couple hundred wins from starting games and then like maybe a hundred closing wins or something like that. So I liked those guys. Those were the guys that I cared about. As a kid, was that

what you were really into? Yeah, totally. Like you tracked that shit kind of religiously, I would say. Yeah, I watched a bunch of games. Yeah, yeah. Big fan. Was your dad or your mom really into baseball, or did you do it independently?

Independently, no. Who did Kyle pick? Did he pick a guy? I didn't pick a guy. I really don't know. I looked it up on two sites. The first site would be totally unsatisfying. It was like Christian Matthews from like 1907 to 1911,

and he didn't even look that athletic. The top recent guy was Randy Johnson. But 538, which measures in a different way, has Pedro Martinez, Randy Jackson. I'm sorry, Johnson and Greg Maddox. Oh, there you go. Well, I'm a big Greg Maddox fan. Yeah, I've never even heard of Greg Maddox. Oh, then you're really not a baseball guy. No, I'm not. I get I get castigated by st lewison's all the time where they're like what are you thinking about the cards and like like people think i'm joking like around here if you don't know anything about the cardinals

people judge you hard like it it's the the team town and i'll be like yeah you know i i hope pitching is good or like i'll just say like something, you know, I hope pitching is good. I'll just say something like that that I think is what baseball people say. And then they'll not understand it and say something else. Baseball is a statistician's dream. There are so many stats they use to try and garner who is truly good and who is not good and so many more like compound stats where it'll be like well this happened when he pitched but this is the uh the ancillary thing that happened otherwise like it's really interesting how

into it baseball gets two things i think greg maddox's level of fame is about chris chelios's right you know not the best that ever played but one of them up there yeah yeah and uh um the other thing what i don't like about baseball stats is there's so many differences in the fields they're non-uniform right so you could play in a is it the rockies who have thin air and people tend to hit more home runs there so if half your games are there, that helps a lot. Is it Fenway? I don't know my baseball that well. That has the big green monster.

And maybe that's Chicago. I don't know. But there are certain fields where it's tougher to hit home runs. And these are going to favor pitchers and not favor batters. And if every field is a different size and shape, then elevation matters. Yeah, and one league has designated hitters and the other doesn't. Can you explain what that means for me the in the american league you have a designated hitter so what is the american league is that west or east it's neither

it's it's mixed it's mixed so um the yankees are american league the braves are national league but the red the red socks are american What are the Cardinals? National League. Okay. I'm pretty sure. I can check it. You explain. But in the American League, the pitcher doesn't hit. When it's his time to hit, they have another guy whose only job on the team is to fucking hit baseball.

So he doesn't play the field. In the National League, the pitchers have to hit, which I think is the way to go. Well, that makes sense. Why would you not have a player on your team that doesn't hit? I know that pitchers tend to suck at hitting, but still, that's something you should have to overcome, not something you can dip out on. Babe Ruth was a pitcher.

Wait, how does the playoffs work? Do the playoffs go that the pitchers have to hit? Home field. it goes by who is home. Yeah. Right. So you play where I am. Jesus Christ.

That's retarded. Yeah. So these American like so the National League pitchers suck at hitting because they're it's really important that they're good at pitching. So you can overlook they're hitting a lot. But the American League pitchers really suck at hitting. Like they don't even practice that like they're there before the playoffs like well shit i guess i better try this it's been three years since i swung a bat all i do is pitch they're like one of us going in like this is

pretty scary on the other end of the barrel this sucks but but you've never heard a crowd cheer so much as when there's two on, you're down by a run, and your pitcher fucking leans way out over the plate and dings one into right field. The crowd goes fucking wild because, holy shit, that guy hits 123, and he just batted in two runs to give us the lead. Fuck yes. You know, it's a big deal. I like that.

I'm a fan of that. Although the designated hitter, obviously, you get more action. You get more offense. A home run savant is up there. And that's exciting in its own way. So, yeah. You can pick which one you like more. Let's watch these ruffians here in this parking lot have a good time.

I'm ready. I'm going to look for Chiz. Chiz, you queued up yep three two one play camera work is shoddy i can tell it's real and vertical what am i seeing here is a guy beating up a girl? Looks like two girls are fighting. Oh, he batted him! Does he have a baseball bat? Shoot!

Are there guns involved? Yup. Are you hearing guns? Not yet. I bet there will be. Get the fuck out of here! Shut the fuck up! Bitch! Shut the fuck up! Bitch! Get the fuck out of here! Woo! He should be speeding away right now.

Do I see police? No. No, that's just something. What am I seeing? You see something, right? No. It's his own lights. Maybe taillights.

That would be neat. Ugh. What an ugly fucking car. I'm having a hard time following the engine. I'm going to go get the car. Maybe taillights would be a good idea. What an ugly fucking car. I'm having a hard time following the action here. You got a black couple fighting a white couple. Okay, and the white couple is in the car that's still in the scene, right? Yeah.

Alright. The white couple did not fare well. Uh oh! White guy kicked black guy's car. Now black guy's car. Now black guy is going to try to run him over. Black guy is trying to run him over but that's kind of hard to do. This is not PUBG. Uh oh. Now he's standing on his car.

That's not a bad move. No that's a pretty smart move. This happens all the time in PUBG where neither player has a gun but one's got a car. Yeah, he's kind of elated like a bullfighter for a little bit. And this guy's just whippin' around his fuckin' Ford Taurus or whatever trying to hit someone. Black guy's came out of the car and I think there's a 2-1-1 situation about to unfold. I think the black guy's got a gun. Nope, white guy's got a gun.

Oh, now someone's got a gun. The white guy has a gun and the black guys are begging him to shoot. Uh oh, black... Oh, she shot him! The white guy was holding the gun at him and the black guy started swinging. He closed the distance and started swinging so the white guy was holding the junk at him, and the black guy started swinging. He closed the distance and started swinging, so the white guy pulled the trigger. It looked like he shot at the ground. He shot at the ground. Oh, did he?

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I didn't see that. He was like Yosemite Sam making him dance. I thought it was a good shot. I just saw it wrongly. Maybe you're right. I thought he shot at the ground.

He shot at the ground. Did he? Okay. Which still would have stung because it's going to shoot asphalt all over him. That would be my preference, though. Oh, yeah.

I'd rather get asphalt than a bullet. Yeah. There's definitely cameras. I think the cameraman just said there's definitely cameras. I'm just... There's definitely cameras.

There's definitely cameras. What am I seeing? Is this a terrible exhaust job on the white car? Oh, it's over. Yeah, that's that. Well, probably what happened is one of these parties talked too much, and the natural outcome was

gunfire. Was a few felonies. You know, this is a controversial take, but I don't think either side handled it well. No, no. I'm sure they were having a nice political discussion over some white wine. And, you know, maybe they were talking about, you know, the Fed raising rates a little bit

and maybe the sell-off of tech stocks recently. Well, they were clearly talking about how much they were bitching about their mortgages, their homes that they own, and the taxes that they definitely pay. I'm on the second viewing now. So what happened was a white girl was seemingly upset with this black couple. The black girl started to beat up the white girl in an overwhelming way. So the white guy came in to break it up and the black guy brought a bat to the fight. So it looks like the white guy goes in the car and reengages with a gun in the fight. And then the next minute is spent with the white guy damaging the black guy's car, knowing that he has a gun in his hand.

Eventually the black guy's gotten fed up. He comes out, and then there's a gunshot, and they separate. That white guy's going to be in prison. That's going to happen. You know what? My money's on most of them spending a little time in prison before their day is done.

Yeah, maybe. I don't think any of them are folks I would care to hang out with. There wasn't a good decision maker in the crowd. That's what I'm getting at. I'm not saying that this event will land them all in prison, although it's possible. I'm saying they will find one way or another to get in there.

Whoa, you're saying that those black guys have prior convictions? That's a little racist, and I don't care for it. The ones that brought the bat to the fight could be why do they be they're just very into baseball that is possible it was an aluminum bat maybe he's maybe he's really into baseball yeah he really wants to hit it hard he was probably driving around searching for random pickup games of baseball and, uh, and Stan got into this scuffle instead. This is really just, uh,

you know what, if this all comes down to his white privilege, I didn't see it like that. No, I totally disagree. You're, I'm, uh,

I'm communist Taylor right now. Are you really, are you denying, I'm communist Taylor right now I can't see my privilege are you denying that that white man doesn't have a ton of privilege and that you know that black man seized a bat from his from his car in self defense

black guy had a better car who's the privileged guy in this situation Woody trying to introduce facts into a privilege discussion that's a trigger so i'm gonna have to give i'm gonna put the kibosh on that i know kyle agrees with me entirely because kyle and i are both woke as fuck woke as fuck yeah like i was telling woody this is entirely a case of white privilege. Like he's white and therefore has privilege.

And if you ask me to expound on that explanation anymore, you're a bigot. I had a Reddit topic I wanted to bring up to you guys, but Kyle in particular. This guy theorizes that Amazon is going to buy Steam. How would you feel about that? Would you care? Is it, you think it'd get better, worse? I don't know. It depends what they do, right? You know, like, like, like Amazon, which Amazon is, um, they streamline everything. They seem to make things cheaper. Uh, they, they certainly do with everyday goods and they're really good at customer service. These are all things I would really value in the place I go for my games. So if they bring that to Steam, I would love it. You know, as soon as we get off here, like I didn't want to do it during the show, but I got to remember to pre-order Call of Duty. And I don't know where to do that.

I don't know if I go to Battle.net or some shit. Like, I don't know. It would be great if Amazon was just a juggernaut in that field and I could just go straight to them. I guess I'd be fine with it. They seem to make everything better. I don't know. I hear you. I buy so much from Amazon. I will Google something, find it for sale

on a random website, and then see if Amazon has it. It's because my experiences with them are always so positive you know i'm lackey but uh i i do worry about them taking over the world right prime is a good example i pay 120 a year for prime now that creeped up when i wasn't looking you know oh yeah oh it's worth it it's so it's totally worth it but another thing like to woody's point like you do have to be on guard. This is what's funny to me, is the same people who rip on Walmart and say,

Hey, Walmart employees have to get public subsidies for their wages sometimes because they're paid so poorly. And it's like, yeah, that's terrible. That shouldn't happen. That happens on a way larger scale with Amazon. And you use Amazon every day. People who rip on Walmart and use Amazon, you're a fucking hypocrite. It's the exact same shit. You know who the only person in the world that Walmart sees as a competitor? Amazon. That's it. You think Walmart looks at Target and goes, man, we got to really shape up our game. No, Walmart beats the shit out of Target. They beat the shit out of CVS. They beat the shit out of Walgreens. They beat the shit out of a Rite Aid. They beat the shit out of all big five retailers and the rest. And so when people are so against Walmart and so for Amazon, it's like, you just like staying at home. Stop pretending this is some bigger game.

It's the same fucking shit. I'm not against Walmart. Well, I feel better because I don't pretend at all. I absolutely like not shopping. And hey, let me say, I love Walmart and I love Amazon. They both provide quality products at a cheap price walmart is the shit i love well it's because well no you live in the sec area of the country like all of us like that's where walmart's biggest acc town right here um yeah

no i never have a good shopping experience there one i think i'm just naturally bad at shopping i don't do a lot of it. So if you ask me to walk into Walmart and find a cooler, my most recent task, I really struggle. I don't just intuitively know the layouts of stores like that. Back there by automotive. Come on. Yeah, I love Walmart. Outdoors.

Yeah. Yeah, I love Walmart. I know where everything is already. They all have a pretty similar layout. I had to ask for help. Yeah. Well, you don't. I had to ask for help. Yeah. Well, you don't want to ask Walmart employees for help. Yeah, that doesn't go that well, right?

And by the way, it's not like you can stand near, like, outboards and hope for help. You have to go to electronics and, of course, they don't know where the cooler is. But she helped. She tried. But it kind of sucked. And I don't know. Of of course you get the people there that's like a meme almost but my walmart experience pales in comparison to my amazon

experience there are some real dark people at walmart i i went there just really recently i had to get but here's the thing i needed such an odd shopping list right i needed new sheets, a candle, soda. What else did I get? Motor oil. This is a Walmart list. It was this weird list that looked absurd in my cart. I remember when I was checking out, I was like, this is some weird shit. This is a weird cart.

Salsa. It was just this bizarre mix of things that if Walmart didn't exist, I'd have had to have gone to three different stores for at least to get they don't have motor and you just know that someone at like tostitos corporate is looking at their market basket analysis and being like well we did have someone in georgia buy mild Tostitos dip as well as chips and motor oil and in a sex gag. Well, how can we parlay this market basket information to our next marketing scheme? Like, that's exactly what they're doing. What's he doing with all those dog collars? Before we wrap, I want to pimp a YouTube channel.

I have no connection to this or anything. It's just been a guilty pleasure of mine. Excaponed. Excaponed. Check that out. It's called Gas Station Encounters. I don't know how YouTube figured out that. You know it.

Oh, yeah. The guy owns a quickie mart of some sort, and people steal from him seemingly all the time. But he's an expert at detecting that they're stealing right without the cameras i wouldn't even know some of them run good scams um sometimes they'll buy something and then they get their change and be like no dude i gave you a 50 and he's like get the fuck out get the fuck get the get the walk right out the fucking door with that. And he's like, no, I gave you a 50. Why are you? I would be like, did you?

Huh? Like, I'm not a hundred percent sure. This guy has a policy that if you steal from him, you have to pay triple for that item. I love that. I don't know. What a champ. I love that guy. Yeah.

Yeah. And, and, and by the way, like, like, so the guy's fit ish but not such a hulk that like he can obviously beat up all of these thieves but he doesn't seem to give a fuck at all like he's just completely confident this is gonna work out his way and you know like yeah guy i'll steal a sandwich or something and and then he's like all right you know i'm sorry i'm sorry i'll pay for it he gives him a 20 he's like like, all right, get the fuck out. And he's just like, but I gave you a 20. Yeah, cost triple if you try to steal.

Yeah, he's like, I'm charging for all those nachos in your purse. And I just, it blows me away. Yeah, so anyway, gas station encounters has become a guilty pleasure of mine. And he's got lots of security cameras, and he does like voiceover forover for the dumb thieves like all right i guess i'm gonna check the counter nobody's looking good good good gonna check the counter again because you always want to be sure all right into the pocket into the pocket into the pocket did you see nope we're all good let's go i gotta gotta buy something because that looks suspicious bottle of water 69 cents let's go and they get up there and he and he and they're like he's like

eight dollars and 20 cents he's like well but i just got a bottle of water well i'm charging for all those candy bars in your pocket get get them out of your pocket get the fuck out of here it's fun yeah the guy lays it on the line for like a dollar 19 yeah super petty uh arguments over like pennies oftentimes and but the people who are stealing from them are just garbage people garbage garbage terrible people and and by the like i get baffled by both sides of it why is this guy the sole proprietor of this the quickie mark gas station place so willing to lay it on the line for like a dollar. And why is this other person coming in the store running a scam? Like,

like he goes in, he gets some beef jerky. And then he tries to return the beef jerky. He's hoping to make like $2 and 19 cents. And I'm like, did you really come in here trying to pull off a $2 scam? That's ridiculous. But there it is.

Yeah. Guilty. I've been watching him for a while. I really enjoy those. I think I caught it first on Reddit or something. And then once you watch a few YouTubes, like blowing you up with it. Yeah, it's good watching him for a while. I really enjoy those. I think I caught it first on Reddit or something. And then once you watch a few YouTubes, like blowing you up with it. Yeah, it's good stuff. He's funny. Yeah. Subscriptions hardly matter on YouTube anymore. I know. You say they don't. Yeah, they don't. They don't seem to. I agree. Search engine optimization

works a lot. But, you know, I'm like I'm like one of those holdouts who used my subscriptions even after they buried it. And even I am tend to watch most of my videos on whatever YouTube thinks I like. No, it's working. Yeah. I get a lot of, uh, PUBG and like gaming content sent to me, but it's cool because like it, it introduces you to a whole bunch of people. Like I, I started out watching shroud and he's gotten burned out on PUBG,

so he's been playing a lot of Fortnite. But YouTube's like, maybe you'd like Choco Taco. And I'm like, I do like Choco Taco. Yeah. Can I call it a show? Yeah, I got a post-it all here. When you need energy on the go

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