Painkiller Already - PKA 555 Derek (MPMD): Kyle's Transformation, Food Tips, Lock and Load Update

Episode Date: August 7, 2021

pka 555 with our guest derrick taylor me the fucking god of thunder kyle over there taylor this episode of pk is brought to you by blue chew and lucy we'll talk more about them later but we've had we've had someone reveal their power level this past and that's coming out of the closet you might say it has been great i love it well thank you thank you for the kind words i don't know about i don't like god of thunder or anything but uh but yeah definitely upped the anime power level a little bit as chocolate thunder put it earlier um so yeah it's it's it's been a long arduous process and i know you two have been wanting to talk about it forever so oh forever this is for people who don't know this has been a secret with us for so long.

Yeah. Like there were times where like on my Twitch stream, people will be like, ah, fucking pile, pile, piece of shit. Just big pile of blubber and pork. And I just have to sit there and be like, he sure is fat. Meanwhile, he had just sent me a picture like starting to see abs, bro. sent me a picture like starting to see abs bro like taking it on the chin for six months now for sending shirtless pictures to our whatsapp chat meanwhile it is a back and forth conversation and i'm telling nobody they're all like what a fucking weirdo old man sending pictures to guys who clearly don't want it it's like you assholes have no idea i'm sending dick root all day every

day every time. Every time I get back from the gym and get out of the shower, I'm just like, check out the dick root, boys. It's vascular. That's what I was curious about. It's like people, they would be like, so Kyle and Woody, they're sending shirtless pictures and nobody knew Kyle was working out. And so I was like, do people

really think Kyle's just getting fatter, boy? What would be his purpose in sending us photos if he wasn't working? To motivate Woody. I am looking pretty good. Look what could happen. Look what could happen. We're all so excited about this, clearly.

Derek, thank you so much for coming on. You facilitated this entire transformation. I can't praise Derek enough. He's definitely been, I guess, coach, mentor throughout this whole thing. He's really kept me going throughout it. And Derek's a hard laugh. You know what I mean? When somebody's a hard laugh, you really got to come up with a good joke to get a laugh out of them.

If you send Derek a picture and you're like, what do you think, man? He was like, all right, we're doing okay. I'm just like fuck i really thought i really thought i'd get something that time but you really got to like get in the gym and make something happen for derrick's like all right all right i see what you're doing now so like when you when you get that out of derrick it's it feels really good no some of your photos i thought i was like dude your head looks photoshopped onto the screen. Is Kyle saying that?

I'm like, yeah, I watched him do a Natty or Not on Superman. Superman in the film. And he's like, he's just fat. I don't know what. Look at this piece of shit. Why would they cast him? I was watching the video you did on Kyle on your channel today, this afternoon. And you would bring the picture up. And you brought one up where I'm like, man, he's starting to look jacked there, looking big.

And your comment was like, no, he looks okay. Now, this is nothing that you would notice in public. And it's like, no, no, no. This is nothing that you would notice in public. Because you have no periphery over the delts. That's how you take Derek down from behind. The mind warp perception in the fitness industry is next level. Like you see a guy who's easily a top 0.01% physique.

And you're like, you're comparing it to some genetic, like hyper elite outlier. Your brain's just so fried that you're like you're comparing it to some genetic like hyper elite outlier your brain's just so fried that you're like oh you know visible abs i see that every day on instagram or whatever and then you don't realize that how many guys in your gym even have any size on their frame at all plus abs simultaneously like zero yeah it's it's almost zero like like um the guys that i work out with um I go to the same time slot every night. Most of them are like older than me, but they're all like really big guys. Like they all lift heavy.

But none of them are like lean. Like nobody is like dick skin lean at all. And they're like nobody has abs. There's a different group of guys that are like like high school athletes or college athletes or something you can tell they're coming in and kind of horsing around like getting like their second workout of the day in and those guys have abs but those guys aren't that big and so there's just not that many guys who are both big and lean it's super rare yeah transformation was wild dude like as much as you guys are saying i wasn't impressed

like i thought i did a pretty good job of showing my enthusiasm about the whole process. At the end, absolutely. I thought it was fucking incredible, dude. I was very happy with the outcome. More than anything, I was glad you got to see what you're capable of because I imagine you had no conception at the start of this. You exceeded Rob Mclehenny body fat percentage easily yeah yeah you make mac looks like a bitch that was the goal like you know that

was the whole goal like for the beginning was to do the fat mac and uh and i i would guesstimate his body fat percentage like at his leanest when he's like on tv in that episode to be like 10 something like that and uh we hit 8.4 at the end. We hit 8.4 and I was super stoked. I was super stoked to hit 8.4 because I had no idea. I think I had skipped the DEXA scan. I've been getting them monthly, but like the previous DEXA scan, I think I was like low, like 12%, something like that.

13% like very visible abs. Like my, my forearms were just like road maps but i didn't think i was in single digits and then like when we got in there on may 4th or whatever it was to the dexa she was like she's like what do you think you are i'm like maybe 10 she's like oh no honey you're about three points away from our the bodybuilders that come in here like like show ready and i because they'll get down like five and a half percent or something like that and uh yeah 8.4 percent does your current water impact your body fat percent measurement

yeah like the fat-free mass thing is going to be heavily altered by your like water retention and whatnot because at the end of the day it can't it's just monitoring fat-free mass which encompasses so many different things in your body other than fat you know so when you're doing the dexa it can be you know fairly off to be honest but at the end of the day it's it's a metric to track your progress consistently which at the end of the day like what you look like in the mirror matters and when you look at you know kyle at the end of the transformation i don't think anyone would argue he wasn't easily single digits and had definitely yeah it might have been nine and a half percent but i'm like what the fucking decks yeah and what i liked was the trend you

know the trend where where we started at 34 and uh like if you want to say, no, Dex's make you leaner than you actually are, or make you seem leaner. It's like, all right, so what I started at 37% body fat, and I got down to 10. You're just making me sound better than what I was saying. So because we started at 33.8, I believe roughly and got down to 8.4. So according to them, when you when you texted me, Kyle, like a year and a few months ago being like i'm intentionally eating five guys three times a day to get as fat as possible and then i'm gonna do fat mac like you're the only friend of mine that i believe was setting something like like if i told that tale i'd be like i'm doing a five-year plan where i just stayed fat like but i was like yeah

i truly believe it but derrick you don't know kyle as well as as i do but like uh what was your thought when he approached you was it like this guy's gonna do it for a couple months and phase out i have no confidence that he'll stick with like my full like bodybuilder plan or how yeah so i had no idea about the whole fat mac idea i just thought he was out of shape and wanted to get you know ripped i didn't want to tell derrick about that because i was afraid that i had hurt I had no idea about the whole Fat Mac idea. I just thought he was out of shape and wanted to get ripped. I didn't want to tell Derek about that because I was afraid that I had hurt myself on health markers. He was going to be like, oh, this is super unhealthy what you've done. I don't think I can help someone like you.

You're an idiot. I told Taylor. I told Mitty, I think. I told Chiz. I told a couple of people in my club. This doesn't prove you're not an idiot this but for the bit i had to commit i felt like it was so goddamn funny and uh just to be clear because like like someone was like why didn't you tell woody i didn't tell woody because woody is

such an honest good-hearted man that deception does not come naturally to him. And he will just accidentally let things slip. He would never reveal a secret on purpose, but he will always reveal one on accident. That reminds me. We do conspiracy theories, and I did this thing where we're all on steroids. Were you on TRT at the time I did that? Yeah, I believe I was. Dude, you're part in that.

I just found a Photoshop version of you on like a Greek God or something. You were in a chubby phase at the time. Yeah. And I just wanted to like touch on you and change the topic. That's how I handled your aspect of it. I didn't know at the time that you were literally on TRT. Yeah, he Photoshopped

me onto like a Cholo gangster. Yeah. And like I ended up more ripped than the guy you fucking Yeah, he photoshopped me onto like a Cholo gangster. And like I ended up more ripped than the guy you fucking photoshopped me onto. Yeah, it was wild. So what was the whole process like? Did the beginning, at any point in the beginning, Kyle, were you like, this is way harder than I thought it would be, this kind of blows? Or were you so excited?

No, man. What's hard about this is like when you're in sort of, when you don't, when you have this ignorance factor about something and you don't know if you, if the steps that you're making are the right steps, even though they're hard, right? Like you can go in the gym and bust your ass. But if you're doing it with like some with ignorantly, like you don't know what you're actually doing, you might get home and be like super sore. But in the back of your head, you're like, did I even do the right things? Did I do too much? Did I do too little that I you don't know if you've done the right thing. And it's hard to like, believe in yourself that things are going to pan out. But having Derek there and having this like tried and true method with not only the diet like program, but also the, um, the, uh, the workout program right down to like, you know, do this many reps, do this many, uh, this much rest, et cetera, et cetera. Like having all of that, um, mapped out for me and being able to just trust in that 100% gave me like so much like confidence to like, just keep doing it. Cause I would just keep telling myself if we just keep going down the road that he's laid out for us we can't fail and like forging

your own path is hard you know if that i think that's the the uh the metaphor that i would use it's the difference between like hacking your way through a jungle that you and you don't know what's on the other side versus having a nice trail like cut and like following a leader your starting diet was fucking wild dude you were eating like girl calories i was shocked yeah that ties into something i've been i've cultivated questions and stuff from my twitter to ask you guys this whole concept of eating more to raise his metabolism before he cuts is a trust fall I've never been willing to take. Like if I somehow eat more, that is long-term the key to cutting fat. It sounds like bullshit. So like I want to touch on that. And then vertical diet. I've watched a couple hours

worth of vertical diet videos. I still don't know what it means No one has been able to keep my attention span, which is a challenge throughout a vertical diet explanation Can we talk about the increase in calories and the diet? Yeah, yes I touch on a little bit first because like what was interesting to me was like but I got that had that raw data as Well by going to the the DEXA scan place and getting an RMR right away. So I immediately got my rest RMR, resting metabolic rate. So they put this oxygen mask on you. And they measure exactly how much

oxygen you're intaking, and how much CO2 you're expelling for several minutes, and you sort of sit very still in a dark room, it may be 510 minutes, it's a long time. And they're able to like, precisely more or less as closely as you're going to ever get, gauge your metabolism. And because I had like, been doing that crazy crash diet that he referred to the girl calories, that's literally what he's like, my girlfriend eats more than you broke. Like, this ain't gonna work. I was my my RMR was 2100 calories a day. And I'm walking at that point. I'm like two twenty or something like that. Six foot two.

And it's like the fuck. How are you ever going to like lose any weight or gain any muscle like at like maintenance calories at twenty one hundred calories? You just can't like you either starve yourself. There was no there was no getting around it. We had to like boost the metabolism. And I'll let Derek jump in like right after this point but a month of the vertical diet the l-carnitine the trt all the supplements and like a steady like workout regimen and we were up to 2900 calories a day maintenance

yeah so like in general the uh like the low calorie thing when you start out it's not like you have the infrastructure to really cut off of to begin with. I'm sure you've heard of skinny fat physique before. If you're relatively untrained and you try and go balls deep into a cut, maybe you end up leaner, but you strip off so much. Well, you have no muscle to begin with to really support, have an infrastructure to even show what you're working with to begin with. So when you end up lean, it doesn't really look impressive anyways. And above and beyond that, maybe not entirely significant, but the more you build lean tissue on, the more energy you expend at rest, just like sitting here doing nothing. So a lot of that was factored in with like achieving the look you wanted. He obviously had to pack on some muscle and actually get in the gym and do something it's not just about you know cutting your calories because if

that was the case we would all just like sit on our ass and just like starve ourselves and take adderall like it doesn't work like that so what is the vertical diet it sounds like a way to arrange your food on the plate i thought it was for mountain climbers like when i first heard about the vertical diet i'm like that's probably, you know, people who go high up and they need more oxygen. I was like, do I put the potato on top of the chicken? Look how much food it looks like. Vertical diet is not descriptive at all. So basically, it's like a methodology for approaching diet that was designed by a Stan Efferding. He's like the world's strongest IFBB pro, or at least he was up in, I don't know if anyone's exceeded his, you know,

power lifting totals and whatnot while concurrently being an IFBB pro bodybuilder, which is like, you know, a professional bodybuilder for anyone who doesn't know what the IFBB is. But anyways, he is a bit more intelligent than the average, you know, meathead bodybuilder and he has you know sort of integrated meathead meats like actual science and design a diet that hits not just macro nutrient needs because everyone knows macros like protein fats carbs most influencers who are in the fitness industry who take steroids and you know sell you know cookie cutter training programs and shit they'll just tell you you know hit your protein and fill your calories with whatever the fuck. And as long as you hit your calorie goal,

like you're good and you hit your protein, that's like the optimal way to go about everything. It's like calories and calories. Oh, you can't argue with science. It obviously makes sense. However, a lot of people don't realize micronutrients are like signaling molecules in your body at the end of the day. So if you don't have enough zinc, if you don't have enough copper, if you don't have enough iodine, these are all precursors to different physiologic functions in your body that if you're deficient in them, you're going to have piss-poor muscle building, piss-poor recovery. All these things are going to be suboptimal and down the line, even though your calorie allotment might be the same, you're not going to build muscle as effectively or burn fat as effectively. Especially when you start depriving yourself of calories, the micronutrient density of your foods

become so much more critical because it's like you're literally depriving yourself below what you need to maintain. Your body thinks you're starving. When you're starving and you're getting less than you need to maintain, you have to make sure in that deprived amount, you're hitting as many of those micronutrient needs as possible. So the vertical diet, a lot of people think it's just like red meat and rice. And that's all it is when in reality, there's like a lot of random little things in there that hit your micronutrients. So like, you know, a bit of carrots, a bit of, you know, iodine from fill in the blank, there's so many different ways to, it's basically just about backfilling micronutrient needs whilst being mindful of sports performance muscle building blah blah blah and a lot of people just think it's like eat a fucking steak and that's it and

that's just kind of like i don't know the the selling point of the diet it seems like it's just based around red meat and the importance of it and stuff but it's actually you know a pretty diverse diet given the constraints of like what is micronutrient dense and there are tweaks and shit you make accordingly based on your own needs like for example i don't eat like fully vertical i'll add in you know things here and there based on my needs and you know obviously as you get really deep into a diet maybe you have to pull out some of the diet hacks and like alternate some of the foods and whatnot but like the general framework is just like what i built especially his muscle building some of the diet hacks and like alternate some of the foods and whatnot. But like the general framework is just like what I built, especially his muscle building part of the diet on when we were adding calories. That's how you like really stroke your metabolism and

get everything up and firing how we wanted it. And then implementing these 10 minute walks after the meals to helps with nutrient partitioning helps with glucose tolerance helps with all this kind of stuff that ultimately built up his physique to a point where we could still maintain like reasonable body composition getting up to like 3500 calorie maintenance essentially from down at 1200 when he was not 1200 isn't his maintenance but i'm saying he was eating 1200 to get like shitty results before i was like you're not going to build any muscle eating this much food let's like ramp up and titrate up to 3500 get you you know build some strength up build a foundation of muscle and then once we've like maintained your i don't know ability to

tolerate that much food it's going to make the cut way easier too because you're grilling and leptin which is like the things that signal you to be hungry or you can't you know you don't have the willpower to avoid cravings and stuff like after you diet for a while i'm sure you notice your willpower goes down the toilet that kind of thing you have to sort of reset because a lot of these are like chemical signaling things in your body like ghrelin and leptin sensitivity and whatnot so we had to sort of like reset that to make sure he could tolerate like an aggressive deficit more easily and have the foundation of muscle to not end up like skinny fat at the end of it so so anyway built him up to 3500 on the basis the foundational principles of the vertical

diet you know i tweaked and modified the diet a little bit based on his needs and whatnot and then designed a training split for him and then kind of once he had built up a decent amount of muscle i was like okay let's start peeling down. And then I started slowly like pulling calories out here and there. Mostly from carbohydrates or wherever he felt like his cumbersome. On the vertical diet, what goes on the plate? Is it just – I'll tell you what I ate.

A meat, a potato, and then a mixed veggies? And we're vertical? Breakfast for me off the top of my head was usually some cranberry juice, some orange slices, a couple of eggs, a bunch of egg whites, white rice, which when you're eating white rice

out of the refrigerator for breakfast, you do that for a year. I have egg whites and water. Do that for a year. It's not my favorite um in that rice i would usually have uh like like spinach like steamed spinach and uh like like like maybe a a whole bell pepper and uh that would be like a breakfast for me and then like um i would usually i had 10 almonds i could eat a day and uh and I would usually either like have those for breakfast. If I was like, just about to go do my workout, 10, 10, like, this is why I like, whenever you

talk about getting your whole can of smokehouse almonds, I'm like a whole can of last you three months, buddy. Oh no, not for me. That's three episodes of sunny. Cause I, cause I ate 10 a fucking day. And, um, and so I would usually like either eat those almonds for breakfast. Cause I felt like getting that fat and those extra calories in might be helpful, like kind of to fuel the workout a little bit. Or, uh, I would usually try to make that like my part of my pre-workout meal. And I had a slice of cheese I could eat every day. And I would, I would move that slice of cheese around and I'd be like, Oh, just cheddar cheese. Like, like just regular, like slice of cheddar cheese, like, but a slice of cheddar cheese like but a thin

slice of cheese right but you move it around as your little treat throughout where we're gonna move our slice of cheese today i need to know honestly did you ever get to the end of a tough day and you got a little excited because you still had your slice of cheese you forgot about yeah absolutely i'd be like that is dedication man i didn't eat my slice of cheese yet today and i just i just like eat it really slowly i would just nibble it straight out of the the refrigerator like like savoring every little morsel of this fucking slice of goddamn cheese that's like 60 calories or something like that what is the benefit of oh i'm sorry go ahead and then lunch um like you said lots of red meat uh i went back and forth between bison and super lean ground beef,

both of which are really expensive. Someone asked me in my live stream yesterday on Twitch, they were like, what's the most expensive part about this? And I'm like, I think the most expensive part is either the supplements, like the over-the-counter stuff, or the diet. Because at one point I was eating two pounds of beef a day, the or the diet, because at one point I was eating two pounds of beef a day and it was like. I think it's like ten dollars a pound, you know, so you're eating twenty twenty dollars of meat.

And then there's that's just part of the diet. You know, there's plenty of other shit that you're eating, too. That's like a moderate drug addiction. It's like two pounds of red meat every day. It's time for a colonoscopy, Kyle. I'm like two pounds of red meat every day. It's time for a colonoscopy, Kyle. Yeah. What is the benefit of the red meat over like ground turkey or something? Like there must be a micronutrient. Like B vitamin density, the iron, like all this kind of stuff that ultimately backfills those micronutrient

needs. Like if you have a slight, I don't know, a big slab of boneless skinless chicken breast versus the equivalent calorie intake of like ground bison for example the content of vitamins is like vastly different to a point where it's like well how can i justify eating other than money or you know taste or whatever and like when you get deep into a diet sometimes you make those kind of changes based on what you can actually stick to your diet with but assuming willpower is like under control optimal circumstances you would probably choose the calories that have the most micronutrients

in it relative to the thing that's you know just hitting like protein and very basic mineral needs and whatnot derek if you were to stack rank the meats beef and we'll just say cow chicken and pig what's your order and like what's the preference um like typically at the top of the pyramid i would put like bison as that's my go-to personally bison huh how's the rank in there it's like i don't know at walmart yeah but basically it's like relative to the fat content too like bison's relatively lean compared to other cuts of red meat so you can get a shit ton of micronutrients in with it's not like you know the fattiest cut of your crap like ground beef that you get in like a log at a grocery store you're getting way more micronutrient bang for your buck with less of the fat intake. And it's just,

I don't think that's typically my go-to personally. And I don't really deviate too much because I actually like the taste too. And ultimately some of this comes down to personal preference though, too. If you have it, I do want you to try and stack rank the big three. Also the cow, chicken,

pig, fish that's in there. That's in the big four. My mistake. Um, what was it? Cow? Would you say cow, chicken, fish? You know, there. Oh, yeah. Big four. My mistake. What was it? Cow? What did you say? Cow, chicken, fish.

I'll write it down. Cow, chicken, pig, fish. You can remember it. Going by taste, beef is at the top also. Yeah. Ultimately, most of the red meats are going to be, in general, more micronutrient dense, but it also is going to come down to, you have to keep in mind the quantity you're eating like he was eating so much of this that you might want to pick what you can tolerate for a long span of time because if you can't adhere to the diet

you're not gonna you know succeed at all so um for me personally like to be honest off the top of my head i don't even know what the micronutrient comparison is of like some of those but for me like i would typically go for the leaner cuts of red meat and then kind of deviate away from the stuff like the bacons and whatnot at like the bottom of the totem pole so yeah yeah and do you eat fish much a lot it seems like a lot of huge guys eat a lot of fish um not i don't personally but i supplement with omega-3s to kind of like make up for my lack of it i try to get it once or twice a week but in general it's not my favorite so i know this isn't about me i started having tuna as like a snack i'll just freaking open the can and eat it straight with a fork but kyle pointed out the mercury issue

and i googled it and he was right so you can't just pound tuna as a snack there's been quite a few people i know who've ended up with issues with that from eating a shit ton of fish so something to be cognizant of too if you're eating it like if that's your preferred source of protein you got to be a little bit careful with that i just find it was like 10 p.m and i hadn't hit my protein yet and had calories. It's like this is the answer. This is practically a protein shake, but in food that makes you not hungry. And you can't do tuna every day. Yeah, I would occasionally eat tuna, like very occasionally, like maybe twice a month or something like that.

And like I might have a piece of tilapia maybe once a week. But for the most part, it was bison and ground beef uh like 90 of the time and the other 10 was either uh tilapia or uh like chicken does this uh does this diet cause any you said like taking the omega-3s for fish does this vertical diet cause anything that you have to resupplement to make sure you're not missing out on does it cover most bases no like in general it advises you eat fish a couple times a week it's just like your preference too is going to dictate what you need to kind of like backfill with you know supplemental stuff so if you're not like i like salmon i like tilapia so um in my in my like local

butcher has like really good salmon so every now and then i would just grab a big like whole fillet of salmon and uh and i'd eat that bad boy that was always nice so before you contacted me did you know you were like what what was your plan to just diet on 1200 calories until you got shredded pretty much or what was the foolish foolish man it was like i was i was trying to like as quickly as possible, lose as much fat as I could and then start something else. I needed you for like the fitness part of things. And,

and I was, I just, I wanted like whatever help I could get in that regard. And like the more we spoke, the more, the more you were like interested in the whole thing. And I was like, Oh,

so he'll just do it all. Great. Thank God. Thank God. Because it was going to be so hard to do it on my own. I would have I would have I would have definitely gotten like fit ish. But like I would have been nowhere near like what we were able to get to. Yeah.

I remember asking you because you would show these incredible progress pictures and you'd say like, I need to and I'm injecting the l is with l carnitine right and i would ask like so what's the reason behind that and i don't know why i would always expect an answer because the answer was always i just do what derrick tells me to do what's the benefit here i don't know taylor i'm doing what derrick tells me to do and it's clearly working yeah for a lot of the things that's how it was like like um like like if derrick was like yeah yeah how about this much selenium i was like how about it selenium i've heard of this yeah that's one of the that's one of the x-men right i don't even know the first letter see here it asks a good who knows yes you know ubiquinol you say oh 33 a month now for this I don't even know the first letter. C or an S. Who knows?

Ubiquinol, you say. Oh, $33 a month now for this little purple pill that you think I should take. Well, here we go. And like, I have like, so that's the second most expensive part. That's what I was kind of getting at. Like the diet is expensive, but my supplements are so goddamn expensive. Like everybody thinks the TRT is expensive. They're like, they're like, how much is testosterone?

We're talking like two, three grand a month. I'm like, all right, we're not talking about HTH here or something like, like this is just testosterone. It's really, really,

really fucking cheap. Uh, but when you get into start take, when you're taking Thorne multivitamins, uh, every day that are like 50, $60 a month. And you're taking like,

like the selenium is like 12, 15 a month. And then, uh, the ubiquinol is like 30 $60 a month. And you're taking like, like the selenium is like 12, 15 a month. And then, uh, the ubiquinol is like 30, 35 a month. And then, uh, like, like the vitamin K, like, like with all the different kinds of K is like another 30. And I'm just scratching the surface because they're all in my coffee table in there. When people come to my house, they're like, the fuck do you have there? What is this giant pile of pills you have because i've got like not only like the i take about almost 30 pills a day right with the uh when you combine that load stack i'm taking 30 fucking pills a day so like if someone's ever around when i'm taking them i have to get this big glass of water and i'm just like i put them all in a pile and i'm

just taking five six at a time just fucking handfuls up it's absurd does it matter when you take those pills like you just pound them all at once or is it like well you need to take the selenium late at night because it'll interact with your bubble um the the thorn multivitamin is an am pm mixture so you take three in the morning three at night and um but everything else i usually take like with breakfast or whenever I wake up and just I try to get everything done at the same time. I do my L-carnitine an hour before cardio or whatever is like the most strenuous thing of the day. If I'm not doing cardio, it's obviously lifting. But so so I'll usually inject like both my testosterone and my L-carnitine at the same time an hour before whenever that workout's coming. Not that the testosterone is that it matters when I take it exactly during the day.

Just if I'm going to be injecting one thing, I might as well inject the other, I feel. Just get it all done. Yeah. Yeah. Got a bunch of questions for Derek. All right. Average dude comes to you. He's totally out of puberty.

He's like 25 or something like that. He's skinny fat. He wants totally out of puberty. He's like 25 or something like that. He's skinny fat. He wants to start killing it on Grindr. So what's the next move here, right? It starts with blood tests, right? How much is that? Depends how elaborate of a panel you want to get, but like at basic, 250 bucks. Okay. 250 bucks. We look at that and you say, all right, you are not extraordinary in any way, right? You don't have teenage level T you don't have like 75 year old level T what's the next move here. We need to get this guy. Like I said, killing it on grinder, Tinder, take your pick. Um, do you, do you put them on TRT do and how much does that cost? Do you put

them on a workout program? Do you do maybe steps? Walk me through the process of what happens if a regular dude who needs help contacts you. Well, in general, they don't contact me, obviously. They would contact my clinic. And from there, they would start off with a blood test that would typically be facilitated through. You want to say something plug your clinic how do people find it oh it's a merrick health m-a-r-e-k health.com and basically step

step one is uh you would request a consultation with a patient care coordinator who would basically determine what kind of blood work you should be getting or because ultimately it's going to be based on what you want how elaborate you want to get to because some people actually want to check above and beyond like do i have low t they want to see you know how prone am i to cancer do i have you know a thyroid deficiency do i have this do i have that so you know ultimately that will dictate your panel but like a basic panel let's just say i don't know you spend 250 bucks you end up with a you know consultation slash interpretation follow-up with the physician if you want it you don't have to go that far but if you want it you can talk to them and from there

they can kind of go over your results your biomarkers and see if you have any imbalances or deficiencies that require addressing and at that point if it's like medically warranted then trt is on the table and it's but the difference with us is we don't like try to push you to get on trt if you come to us and you're like naturally high t and you're like i'm gonna get fucking huge we're not gonna put you on trt like that's we're not a testosterone mill which is what a lot of these companies are at the end of the day so you know if you're looking for that that's ultimately not what we are like we want individuals who actually like there's some sort of there's actually a semblance of like a medical necessity for intervention rather than just like

i want to get the sickest grinder pics you know yeah we've all been there though kyle you those pictures you would kill it on grind oh oh i don't know i think straight men like those pictures so like let's just hypothetically say the guy has you know it's it's justified based on because again even if you have natural test levels if you have high sex hormone binding globulin you have low free testosterone or you're symptomatic it's not like you aren't qualified for TRT simply based on like a total testosterone number. Like a lot of this comes up to the interpretation of the doctor too. So if you have like erectile dysfunction, poor quality of life, like a bunch of flagship markers of some issue, just as your total T is, you know, 500, it doesn't necessarily mean you're not a candidate. So anyways, you know,

some of this is interpretation at the end of the day but ultimately if you end up on trt like what's that gonna do like i'm sure you guys i think we talked about it briefly the last time of this year like the difference between a guy on like 125 megs a test or whatever it is for your trt the difference between that and a guy who's taking nothing could be like six to seven pounds you know in you know 12 to 20 weeks or something doing absolutely no change whatsoever so like that kind of thing it's a no-brainer that obviously is going to help support more muscle you know help you burn more fat help you have higher you know um stress resilience a bunch of shit like that and then if you want to

get like what the next step would be i guess it depends on how lean do you want to get do you want to pull like a you know fat to fit transformation or you just want to get like you know build a bit of muscle or what's the deal like with kyle i was like i want to see how far like he wanted to get shredded and i was like i wasn't sure if he had an idea in his head of how like actually shredded he could get like i'm like dude we're gonna be looking like an actual fitness model by the end and i can only imagine in my head at the time he was like okay bro like fuck no i swear to god like that's i believed every every every bit of it and i couldn't tell anyone because it sounded so absurd but but like i don't think i told anybody i think i told my dad i was like i was like us well i yeah i did tell you that's true that's known for a long time yeah yeah yeah that's true and you

figured it out on your own that's that that's I'll say that what before I told you I figured it out I knew but I don't want to interrupt the story right boy so yeah I told my dad I was like I was like first of all here's a picture of this dude I'm working with he will oh god damn what they do to that boy

he's like even slightly know slightly less muscular guys fused together he's like he's like you working with he-man son and i was like yeah yeah i'm working with he-man and uh and uh i was i was like we're gonna we're gonna take this thing until i look like a fucking superhero i was i like, he thinks that in eight months, a year, or something like that, I'm going to be super, super lean. And I remember showing the Adonis lines. My dad didn't know what Adonis lines were. And he was just like, what is this?

What is this thing you got going on right here? And I'm just like, that's what you look like when you have no fat left on your fucking body anymore. That's a cum gutter, and I'm killing it on Grindr. All the gay guys blowing loads on me. No cleanup. They love it. Slide away. Right in the sheets.

Yeah, right in the sheets. Yeah, the Adonis lines are sick. And I think that some parts of like my physique there are just like and correct me or help me here derek but like i think like i think genetically like i don't think everybody's abs are i think my abs are pretty symmetrical and i was pretty happy with that you got lucky dude yeah you never know until you actually get shredded like what you're working with which is like like, it's just surprise. You never, you find out and it's like, Oh, like good for me. You know, most people's not symmetrical.

Uh, it depends. Like it varies wildly. Like with the rock, I'm actually about to put out a video on his, like, it's weird how this was picked up as a top story, but I have no idea if I had any influence on people Googling this term, but I did a video on why his abs are like, not good. Like he has, even though he he's jacked, he's 270 plus lean. He got shredded for his last role. His abs are essentially non-existent. Now, it's not to

say his physique isn't ridiculously impressive and he's one of the most jacked movie stars on the planet. He's absolutely killing it. But no matter what he does, his abs will never look even as good as 165 pound zach efron from baywatch like when they stand next to each other whose abs look better zach efron even though nobody's abs look as good as zach zach looks so fucking good in that movie they're absurd they're absurd yeah so it's like but ultimately it's just like you can't do anything about your muscle insertions really you can only just build off of what you have so with the rock for example he it was kind of

interesting because he did an interview and they were doing like the the most googled terms or something like the rock you know fill in the blank whatever google pops up with and it was like it was like what's wrong with the rocks abs is like one of the most googled terms he was like what a fucked up question and i was like i was like it's a pretty prominent you know like aberration from his like the rest of his structure like everything's so perfect and then it's like his abs are just like non-existent i think it's a reasonable question and he had this big excuse about how he like tore his uh he tore his like quad as well as had like a brutal hernia when he was uh you know at wrestlemania 29 i believe in 2013 but if you look at him pre-2013

his abs never looked like different than this so you know this is just an example of like kyle's abs look better than this and he's you know how many like 80 pounds less muscle in the rock or something you know so yeah i think kyle got lucky in that regard obviously everyone has their genetic shortcomings like kyle's chest obviously you know need some work as does mine you know yeah i was and like i i was i was like maybe maybe i'm using derrick's workout program because we both i tell everybody this is my way of like shitting on you a little i'm like yeah i'm like derrick's got a weak chest and yeah i've got one too and and like but they're like your shoulders though i'm like, Derek's got a weak chest and I've got one too. They're like, your shoulders though. I'm like, I know.

My delts are really big. Derek's delts are really big. I think I'm just using his workout program. We're going to have to add some flat bench in here. I don't think he knows what he's talking about. That's probably it. That's probably it. He could make it up. He'd be like,

the problem there is the flabberglobin is coming coming up yeah you're absolutely right it's just a i think it's just a genetic shortcoming of mine with the chest and it is something like the last um like three months or for whatever it is like i've been trying to focus more on building my chest like um i added like like an extra chest exercise on push days like like like like one extra thing like um like just add like some flat bench dumbbell stuff uh on one day and added some uh uh some some cable stuff and i don't know i and i uh actually the pec deck uh that's i've been like really being able to get a connect like a mind muscle connection with the pec deck a lot more than some other stuff so hopefully and obviously next when you do the next bulk if we work together the next game gaining muscle phase you know a lot of your volume will be allocated more towards

chest than your like genetically superior body parts to then kind of like bring them up to where everything else is that kind of thing yeah like if you have a genetic shortcoming, you know, you have a certain weekly amount of volume you can tolerate in the gym and you would allocate it accordingly based on like, he had no foundation to even see what he was working with before this transformation. So now that he's like gotten lean, he's built some muscle up.

We can actually see like, okay, where's the shortcomings now? And then build off of that and, you know, make the changes accordingly. But it's like before that you have no fucking idea what's going on. You're just like a skinny fat, you know, disaster. and then build off of that and make the changes accordingly. But it's like before that, you have no fucking idea what's going on.

You're just like a skinny fat disaster. So you got to build up the infrastructure and then get peeled and then you figure it out. I love some of your- I got this thing, Taren, that half the people viewing this are wondering how they can do it too. They're inspired and we got off the topic of how this happens, right? And $250 in blood work. And then we shifted, what does it cost for the consultation? And what would they get from

that? How would they be set on their direction? Like what are the next steps after blood work? And what does it cost? Yeah. So we typically have like a $250 deposit for a doctor's visit. And like, sometimes I'm just saying these numbers, like, to be honest, I don't even deal with the backend with the actual pricing of stuff. Like I have a business partner who mainly monitors that, but so it would be,

I don't want to like step out and say exactly, this is the dollar amount you will expect. Cause by the time people watch this episode, you know, however long in the future, I have no idea if the prices will change. And I would be like cautious to say, expect this. And then maybe you don't get that.

But like in general, you're looking at, you know, you know, half a grand in totality for blood work, you know, talking with a doctor. And if you want to proceed with like a protocol based on your individual needs. And again, this is designed on individual needs specifically, as well as, you know, your blood work. Like maybe you need thyroid medication. Maybe you need, you know, fill in the blank, maybe you want Viagra or Cialis, like whatever it is, these things obviously add to the cost overall and above and beyond like a vial of testosterone kind of thing. It also depends on your dose of testosterone, what it's going to cost and whatnot. But like in general, you know, you're looking at, it's a reasonable investment but it's for multiple months so even though your upfront cost is i don't know 500 to a thousand dollars or

whatever it is like this is for multiple months and when you factor in you know trying to figure this all out yourself and like fucking yourself up potentially or using underground gear and like getting infection or whatever it is like ultimately you're better off getting the doctor oversight and like we pride ourselves in the high quality medical consultations like providing information education rather than like we don't actually care if you get on tests like our markups on medications are irrelevant to what we're making off of the actual informing people about their health status interpreting the biomarkers, determining, you know, explaining why this is where it is, what you could do accordingly, how to mitigate the risks when you go on testosterone, that kind of stuff. But ultimately, to answer your question, like,

at least $500 minimum upwards of, you know, 1000 plus, depending on what you're getting into. I have a little insight with that. Because, you know, my cousin Scott, like last time I visited him four months ago or something like that. He was I had been sending in progress pictures and stuff. And when he saw me, he was just like, all right, dude, how do I how who's your friend? Who's perfect? Who's Mr. More plates? The guy with the date, the pussy man. More plates is a first name.

More dates is his last name. Yeah. Like, how do I get in touch with this guy? i'm like and like i i set him up and everything and uh and he went and got it he went through all the steps that derrick just laid out for you and i think they found that his uh he had a lot of the hallmark signs of low testosterone they found that um for one or more of his markers was low. He also had high cholesterol and he had another thing or two then. So they were able to get him prescribed several medications, not only to deal with like the testosterone thing, but also his cholesterol and just better, you know, wellness in general. And I think he was like with like all of that and maybe three months of meds, he was like out the door, like 700 to $800, somewhere in that range. And like I said, that's including quite a bit of medicine. Uh, but that includes L-carnitine, which is, uh, not cheap. Um, it's not like wildly

expensive, but it's more expensive than tea. Yeah. He's, I forget if we doxed him or not. Kyle's associate, super happy. I've seen his progress pictures. Scott. Yeah. He looks great. Okay. I didn't want to dox him. I forgot. No, I feel you. I feel you. Yeah. Yeah. No, Scott is looking, I don't think I've sent you any progress pictures of Scott yet, Derek, but he already has like a visible, like change in his physique. He,

I sent him the diet program that I was on, the workout program that I was on, the whole split. And and he has just stuck to it like like he goes to his job and he'll be like, he's like, dude, I get off work and I'm tired as fuck. He welds in a nuclear power plant and he'll sweat out like 10 pounds in a night sometimes because he's wearing all this protective gear for the radiation and he's like in these compact situations like welding and it's all hot so he's just drenched drenching himself with sweat he's like get off i just want to get in the shower and get in the bed but i think about what derrick said it's like and i'm like what did i tell him derrick said yeah i don't even know what i said i don't know i need to hear it but but like i'm like whatever

i told him derrick said is motivational so i'm just gonna whatever just agree i clearly told him some lie like get him jacked up you know like derrick said sleep is for the week yeah i remember when derrick said just to conquer and that's all i think about and uh and he's in the gym at you know two in the morning whatever it takes and uh and he's like visibly changed like like like just big he's already he's always been like uh predisposed to having big traps. And his traps are bigger than mine already. He's already losing his fucking neck over there. And it's cool to see.

He's super pumped. And he's been, like I said, sticking to the vertical diet. He'll hack it a little bit. I got him on that Greg Doucette French toast every now and then when he's really craving something sweet. But otherwise, just sticking to the vertical diet, sticking to your split and loving his experience with Merrick. So maybe for Kyle and Derek, this is from my Twitter alternative universe, Kyle, that makes no changes except the TRT. How's it work out? There's,

there's not only the muscle response to the exercise, but the motivation response. I don't know what kind of psych effects it talked to me about. Alternative universe, no TRT. So his ability to recover would obviously be lower. So he would probably be doing less intensive of exercise. He wouldn't be doing as many sets. He wouldn't be doing as much volume um he would be probably changing his workouts a little bit to be more focused on less on like when you're it's kind of hard to explain

but sometimes when you're on gear you can get away with more like volume work and less like progressive overload style like although it is still important it's you can get away with less less taxing stuff on your joints because ultimately you can facilitate growth with just more volume that you otherwise may not be able to tolerate as a natural it's a little bit hard to explain because it's like ultimately you could do like high intensity really fucking heavy with like less overall sets or you could do more sets with you know lower weights but still induce a similar hypertrophy hypertrophy response or better and in general the higher the volume you can tolerate when you're on exogenous tasks

the better so his like how he would respond not on gear gear it would be like his training would be a bit different everything would be like slightly different but in general i he still would have been able to get shredded he just would have been like probably 15 pounds lighter i would imagine what about ultimately what would have happened do you think that and maybe this one's for kyle if you hadn't had the same response to the exercise or maybe some sort of like i don't know trt glow just infusing you with enthusiasm like how did that do you think you think that how did that play into it i don't know, TRT glow, just infusing you with enthusiasm. Like how did that, do you think, do you think the, how did that play into it? I don't know, stop there. It played a lot into it. Just like the placebo effect, if nothing else.

And I used to talk about the way that we would get ourselves motivated to like get into a fitness kick when I was younger. We do like these six month spurts where I get pretty muscular, like obviously nothing like what I've done this time around, but like six months of working out hard as a natural um and like getting like visible like um like muscle definition and maybe like seeing the top of an ab like when you're in bed and you're like sitting up just right or something i remember my girlfriend was like oh starting to get a little bit of an ab there and i was like that's a terrible compliment you're not fat as fuck anymore starting to get a little bit of an ab there. And I was like, that's a terrible compliment.

You're not fat as fuck anymore. You're top 40%. But, but what we would do back then is we would go and like blow as much money as we could at GNC on like fucking cell tech and, and, and protein. And there was something about having just blown 250 dollars um that was like a there was like this sort of placebo thing or not really placebo

this motivational factor where it's like you just spent 300 on nonsense get in there and lift those weights like just you can't like you can't let that shit sit on the counter like nothing else work out until it's gone, you know, like there's a little bit of an effect that comes from that. So like, um, there was just a, there was a lot of things that like motivated me to keep going along the way. One, I really didn't want to let Derek down at all. Um, two, I, I just didn't like the idea of failure. I don't like that at all. I had set out to do a thing and I wanted to get it done. And, um, and like I said, that, that little metaphor earlier about, I've got someone in front of me cutting that path through the jungle for me. Uh, I know that he knows the way out. And as long as I just

stay right behind him, we're going to get there. So like it was, it was easy for me to stay motivated because of things like that. Um, far as like, obviously, I've worked out without testosterone, I've worked out with testosterone. And I would say like the biggest difference is the recovery. At first, I got I got really sore, right? You know, like the first few workouts. But after like a few weeks, maybe even a month and a half, six weeks, I didn't get sore really anymore. Like not any like serious so't get sore really anymore. Um, like, like not any like serious soreness and certainly not that sort of like, Oh, it hurts to get out of bed kind of soreness. Not like, like you're walking weird after a hard leg day, just never

happened for a day for a day. And then it would sort of be gone. And I think, and that, that is probably, um, could be attributed to a number of things that I was doing. I don't know if I told you, Derek, but I take those 105 degree Epsom salt baths for an hour every night while letting that shampoo you sent me soak in for an hour. Like every little thing that I could do because I read that those baths at that temperature for an hour burn as many calories as a 30 minute walk. And I was like, well, I'm already walking 45 minutes a day doing an hour's worth of cardio a day. Let's just sit. Let's just use part of the time where we're sitting on our ass to just sit in boiling hot water with Epsom salt. And like, I think that maybe helped with some of the muscle soreness as well. And I always use a foam roller and shit like every day. So I did everything I could to like be able to get

back in the gym the next day and just go as hard as I could. And you did of course, like push, pull legs, rest, push, pull legs, rest, just in a cycle the entire time. Yeah. Yeah. Um, even when, um, even when I dropped that knife on my foot, um, remember I sent you guys that video in the hot, I'm in the emergency room at uh like two three in the morning or something like that because i was i was literally drinking my pre-workout and i hit the knife and the knife went into my foot and now there's blood everywhere so i go to the er and uh when i got out of the er i drove straight to the the gym i just went straight to the gym and like limped in with like a boot on my leg and like a bloody sock and they're just like dude what

what happened i'm just like i had a little accident they're like when i was like ah like 30 minutes ago like what are you doing here i'm like what i'm gonna miss pull day it doesn't matter this is pull two this is the rough one i gotta get this out of the way i this question's mine and it's a social one there are a couple guys like four guys in my universe who are like you know sort of working on getting fit and such and trying to clean things up and i look at them and think you know what would really benefit you finasteride did i pronounce it right yep how do you say that don't know finasteride is the generic for Propecia, I think, and it's a hair loss medication.

And it's hard to be like, bro, look, that's your problem area. Abs will help you a little, but that'll help you a lot. What do you say? Do you just shut the fuck up? I'll tell you what I said. You just get like, oh, my grandpa was bald. I told Scott straight up. I was like, look, Scott, you're going to was bald. I told Scott straight up. I was like, look, Scott.

You're going to go bald. Your dad went bald and we know how he handled it. Poorly. Did he have that unicorn patch in front? He refused to retreat. He refused. He's still refusing to give up.

That man wore hats for years. This is a 60-year-old man, still coloring his hair, still swirling it just right. He's had Rogaine on the countertop for decades and covering it with ball caps and stuff. And I'm like, dude, you're going to go bald. And I, my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong here, Derek, if you have a genetic predisposition to middle pattern baldness, in other words, if you, if you're 30 and you were gonna lose your hair at 50 going on TRT can exacerbate that and make that begin now in your thirties rather than your fifties. Right? Yeah. It'll definitely expedite it significantly. So anyone who's like, anyone who's thinking like, Oh, you know, I, everything's fine now. I'll probably

just be fine. It's kind of wild how when you actually wrap your head around it, how many guys do you see walking around at 65 plus who have a perfect head of hair? Zero? My dad's pretty good. That's all I could think about. My dad was good at 60. Now it's 70. He's got

a thing where he can slick it back and it looks now at 70 he's got he's got like a thing where you can like you can slick it back and it looks good but like he's definitely losing some a good father's part it seems back a little bit i don't know if it's decades of combing but it's otherwise pretty good okay well anyway carry on but yeah it's rare no one this only one reagan yeah most people are not going to maintain like their perfect hairline forever it's pretty fucking difficult and ultimately you know there's a lot of science that goes into whether it's dht or if it's stuff caused by like downstream cascade of dht leading to you know a bunch of random shit but ultimately the most effective way to halt it if you catch it early enough is with something like finasteride which

inhibits the production of dht so like in general whenever i'm talking to guys and they're worried about hair loss or they're not worried about it i just tell them like dude look at your dad look at your grandpa look at you know the grandpa on the other side of the family how's their hair like do you you think you're immune right now because you'll look great but like you're gonna get fucked at some point so if you want to prevent yourself from having to play catch up which is a million times harder than trying to just prevent loss in the first place, then just get on it now and,

you know, don't have to worry about it. You know, that's, and it's not going to halt it entirely, but it slows it down so significantly that you can go pretty much a way longer duration of your lifespan without having to deal with it. So it might give you another 20 years, 30 years, having to deal with it so it might give you

another 20 years 30 years maybe with does it reverse it you get a little bit of regrowth but in general it's just going to halt further loss so that's why the earlier you catch it the easier it is if you're trying to play catch up with like lost like dead zones on your temples very fucking difficult to regain like a perfection hairline and then maintain it but if you've if you get it when everything is solid a lot more difficult to regain than it is to just prevent you from losing in the first place yeah minoxidil minoxidil it regains it yeah okay yeah it's a growth stimulant and it works well but it's like ideally you want to use less drugs you know like who wants to be on more drugs?

If you can prevent yourself from losing it in the first place, you don't need the minoxidil. Here's the situation. These are the people in my universe. We've observed that things have already retreated to less than perfect. Do you get on fin, get on minoxidil

for six months, four months, three months three months and then it's the grow this kind of stuff is like lifelong commitment because it's like when you come off of it you're just going to keep progressing at the rate you were so it's like whatever your baseline state is if you're not happy with it if you come off like things are just going to keep progressing it's not like you can come off and somehow just maintain your progress yeah i think i might have something wrong and i want you to say it plainly for me i had this idea you could take minoxidil for like six months get the regrowth then stay on the fin and keep it no it doesn't work like that i think

i think what you're thinking about is like the results people get from the beards yeah i just made it up out of logic you and i've had that discussion before about how like you could use the minoxidil thing to grow the beard. And then once you got it, you got it. Because there's no male pattern beard baldness, fortunately, I guess. It works like that on beards? Yeah. Yeah.

It's pretty permanent. Hypothetically, you could go from... I've seen Asian guys who can't even grow facial hair get full beards within six to 12 months with minoxidil microneedling. It's pretty wild. I was going to say with the microneedling. Yeah. What a funny thing for the Asian guy to explain it like his family reunion. The only guy with the beard.

Just saw they coming in. Yeah. At 28, sometimes you get another puberty. Originally one in a billion. you know at 28 sometimes you get another puberty originally one in a billion that's another one of the questions that i got a lot um on my on my twitch stream that i did by the way it's fps kyle on twitch if you guys want to want to follow i think we're at like almost 20 000 followers uh hopefully we get that affiliate and partnership taken care of this month um they were asking like what's the difference like what do you feel like when you're on TRT?

Like, when does it kick in? And like, what is that kick in like feeling? I'm always really careful about placebo effects with anything. But I'll say this, like, I think it took about six weeks. And like six weeks in, I felt like I was going through like puberty again. I was so goddamn horny. Like, that was like the main thing that was like a feeling or like something that it wasn't like, oh, I feel I feel powerful now. Like that doesn't happen. Like it's not like, oh, I just, you know, I went to grab the milk out of the fridge and it just exploded in my hand because I'm so powerful now.

Like get out of here. The best way I can describe it is it feels like you just hit puberty like a second time yeah yeah exactly it felt like i hit puberty again um i i got a little bit of acne on my shoulders and i got um uh just just super super fucking horny like i felt like i felt like i hadn't felt since i was like 14 years old or something like that just like in bed thinking about titties 35 years old great like it's great if you can get some titties at 14 not all of us could get titties readily at 14 right you're just like man i wish i could get some titties you're thinking about like that ugly girl i bet she'd let me touch her titty oh she doesn't let me touch her titty though Oh, that's going to be so humiliating. I can't even touch an ugly titty,

you know, like, like, but it was, it was, it was that level of horny horniness at 34 years old. Was the, like,

was the acne horrible because you, you dealt with acne as a teenager. So I imagine if you already have, you know, predisposition. Yeah. This time around, I didn't get it on my face. I, um, I, I got it like, um, on my,

on the tops of my shoulders a little bit, uh, and, uh, on my back a little bit. And, um, you know, I talked to Derek a little bit about that, but he's like you, he cheated the world of acne, right? Like he did Accutane. So, um, that might be the only avenue in the world that I feel like I know a little bit more than him on. Because like I think the Epsom salt baths help like dry a lot of it out. Tea tree oil helps a ton. Regular exfoliation, but not going overboard with it. Because if you go overboard with exfoliation, you get really inflamed. And like 10% benzoyl peroxide.

Like I found a nice. Is this a daily thing you did to oh yeah acne away okay it would have been an issue if you weren't on top of it yeah um i don't know how big of an issue like like i'm you know me i'm always you like to be perfect yeah you know your administration frequency also helped reduce the potential for breakouts too because he was keeping his blood levels like really stable with daily administrations versus a lot of trt clinics will prescribe one shot like here's a shot every one to two weeks and your levels go like fucking this and then they go down and then they go like this and they go down so you get like way higher spikes in estrogen and dht and

just everything that could go wrong from taking your test is exacerbated when you introduce just a ridiculous amount to your system at one time and ultimately when you pin daily i'm not saying you should do that or everyone does that because it's a nuisance to deal with after a while but the more stable your blood serum concentrations are the less aberrations you have the more representative it would be if you had like natural testosterone like pulse out of your balls you know what i mean so yeah that's like replicating more natural production you get less side effects in general that's another one of those things where i like i don't know i wanted to like squeeze that last tenth of a percentage of like uh you

know growth or or efficacy yeah what he's getting the getting there you go i've watched a lot of more plates more dates i was it was it was like you know obviously you don't want uh any of the like hallmark side drinking a bang energy at 7 p.m hell yeah i wish i had one um it's 5 12 here but okay oh yeah well then that's okay so like uh i just felt like pinning every single day would help me keep like the most consistent, like stable blood serum that is possible. I mean, I guess you could do twice a day, but now you're just in crazy town, right? But like, because almost nobody does every day. Almost everyone who's like super serious about it does like every other day. And then like, and the vast majority is doing twice a week or something like that but i'm already pinning the carnitine every single day and compared to pinning a milliliter of carnitine

into your ass every day shooting a few units into your into your delt is nothing yeah from kyle's twitch someone said hey is there a way to do tests other than a needle which kyle's calling pinning and kyle answered quickly said not a good one but now that we have derrick here if someone didn't want to pin would you tell them stop being a pussy or would you talk about alternatives or talk to um yeah so like the only other viable alternative really would be like there's like nasal testosterone but those are going to be like in and out of your system very quickly and not to you're not going to be able to build up enough of a serum concentration to get the same kind of an

effect there's also that like the transdermals like you can apply cream or gels but who wants like how many people want to apply cream to their like the best way to absorb it to be honest it sounds fucking ridiculous is applying it to your scrotum so like who wants to literally like slap a goddamn thing of cream under your ball sack like every single day potentially twice a day too and then have to avoid getting that on your kids, on your wife, on your whatever. Wait, wait, wait. What do you have kids? You know how it is. Oh, Colin touched my sputum again. Sometimes I just drag my ball sack across the whole family.

Fatherhood, am I right? Not again. In like three or four minutes, I'm going to have to tell you to stop. Yeah, you're absolutely right. I'm stealing to have to tell you to stop. Yeah, you're absolutely right. I'm stealing my tea. I'm sure it's happened to somebody who's putting that cream on their balls and then forgets about it. And their girlfriend is licking their balls.

And she's getting a fat dose of tea every goddamn night. She comes up with a mustache when she's blowing it. And all of a sudden. She comes back with Kyle's sex drive. It'd be a good thing. Yeah, sure. Like I just imagine she's just like, I don't know honey, my clit is just enormous. I'm getting hot flashes

all the time and I'm angry and I'm like, damn, and your opinions are starting to make sense. Yeah, and there's also like they can uh those pellets i think that they inject right yeah that's like the worst way to do it though because it's like you can't really control like it's basically like it's like the same thing with girls and birth control getting jabbed into their arm and then it's you know slowly bleed it out over the course of months or whatever it is you can't really control the proportion of release,

and you're not going to easily be able to manipulate your dose because it's like if you're starting a new protocol of test, you might need to tweak some things. Maybe you have excessive aromatization estrogen. You need to dial it back or maybe, I don't know, whatever the reason is that you need to reach your optimal dose. Maybe you need more to achieve symptom relief. But if you have a fucking pellet stuck in you, what do you do?

You can't really do anything at that point. What if you're deep into it, right? Let's fast forward and make it to 2023 Kyle, who knows exactly what dosage he wants. You wouldn't know the pellet dose compared to the injection dose. It's like a totally different thing. Oh, you can't just use your prior experience and get it right like like his dose applied to his balls would not be the same for example it would be totally different yeah okay and it would be experimental like we would be like rubbing different amounts on my balls for like months to be clear i was talking about the pellet though like same thing yeah same thing you'd have

to like literally put a pellet into you and then go get your blood tested multiple times and see you know where it's at see if you have symptom relief during these points with these blood levels and ultimately if you want to manipulate it it's like what do you do like on on implants the thing you know this was me uh going on my own thought, which can sometimes be wildly off, but it's like if pinning three times a week is good and daily is even better than a pellet must be the ultimate constant level release. This is where you would use like the ester. It's like, it's like a, basically like a molecular chain attached to the testosterone

molecule that your body cleaves off to then like release the testosterone into circulation. The longer that ester chain is, the more stable it'll like bleed into your system over a certain amount of time. So that's why with prescriptions, you typically will get prescribed testosterone enanthate or testosterone cypionate. These are long esters that last in your body for like a month. So it's more optimal still to have, you you know daily administrations because you're still going to get those little spikes every time you pin but ultimately if you wanted to do like once a week you might be able to get away with it i understand what you're saying though with a pellet it's like self-regulated you would think where it just slowly bleeds

like over six months or a year like some long period no like ultimate it's widely viewed as like the least like effective treatment option yeah okay what is uh i guess there's the science isn't there yet to to effectively do it just with a pill like is there a reason for that yeah it gets like mostly broken down when you ingest it so a a lot of these hormones, like a lot of the oral steroids there, they have something called 17 alpha alkylation, which basically makes them liver toxic. And the reason they're liver toxic is because if you don't make them liver toxic, your liver will literally break it down into nothingness, and it won't actually survive ingestion to then do something. So when you're using oral, especially like even birth control, people don't realize that it's not really good for your liver. Like it's not good for your body necessarily to be ingesting these like, you know, oral compounds. So I'm not saying estrogen or birth control is, you know, as liver toxic as an oral steroid necessarily, but ultimately with testosterone, when you ingest it orally, it doesn't survive significantly enough to really get to levels that would give you symptom relief.

Comparatively, like with L-carnitine, for example, I think that's a good comparison, right? So I inject that milliliter of L-carnitine every day. It's 500 milligrams. That's the potency of the carnitine I have, I would have to ingest something like six grams, seven grams of it orally. And now you're having to deal with a situation where I believe it caused cancer in rats when they dosed at super high dosages. So not only. You were just battling cancer. So you sent it.

And I just got over one bout of cancer, cancer warrior here. All right. Survivor. Yeah. Cancer warrior here. All right. Survivor. Yeah. I should not mock cancer. This is not a good place to stand on. Round two, it'll be liver cancer.

It's kind of harder than that. They took my liver. Derek's next video will be like, Kyle flew a little too close to the sun here. And I'll explain why. For new viewers, Kyle had skin cancer near his eyelid. It's on my goddamn eyelid. I want that to be known. They cut a chunk out of my fucking eyelid.

And it was the most painful shit I've ever been through in my life. And I've broken some bones. And I've had some third-degree burns. But you haven't felt pain until a doc sticks a fucking – people are talking about being needles that's one of the biggest things we got we're like guys want to get on board but they're afraid of needles the needle they stuck in my eyelid is way bigger than the needle that you would actually pin your testosterone with i went and grabbed a needle or a syringe

so i use a 29 gauge uh and it takes a a little bit longer to, uh, to like get the, get it in because, um, testosterone is in an oil. It's, uh, they use a bunch of different oils, MCT oil, linseed oil, different stuff like that, but that's the base. So it's not like you're injecting water. The carnitine is more watery or water-based. And if you were to like fucking, and by the way, a milliliter is this whole fucking syringe it's the whole thing full like that's how much like that's the 29 how big of a tip is that like a normal shot tip bigger like let me see if i can like get the camera to focus for you this conversation by the way is the day that i I was so confident Kyle was on steroids or TRT or whatever

that I asked him about it after the show. One of the giveaways is being super knowledgeable about it, right? There's a couple like trap development, Dell development. There's the guy. No, like Derek does.

Derek knows. But one of the giveaways is a guy who's just like an expert in these things. And I think we were talking about self-administering COVID vaccinations because we all want to wait too much about it, but couldn't get it. And he's like, yeah, you know, like a 27 gauge pins. Really? It's kind of sucked. But a 29 gauge, but I could totally do that by myself. It's no big deal.

Maybe have it. And like, I was like, dude, this guy. 29 gauge pen. I could totally do that by myself. It's no big deal. Maybe have it. I was like, dude, this guy. No, he's just interested in needles. This guy has some kind of a needle fetish. That's what I should have told you. I'm going to be honest with you, Woody. I really like when women

inject my balls with this stuff. It's humiliating. Please don't tell anyone about my syringe fetish. Yeah yeah um detailed syringe knowledge i was like yeah he's he's but yeah like it's an insulin pin if anybody like knows somebody's diabetic that's what i use um and i use a 29 gauge off i came off amazon like 100 at a time they're pretty fucking cheap this shit don't hurt at all like i said it takes a minute to to push the whole thing in slowly i spend a minute pushing the l-carnitine in because i want to avoid any potential like hazards i like already a couple times so at this point i've pinned 300 times or something like that um and maybe five times i've had like a bad shot, I'll call it.

And what happened was I went too fast, right? So like normally when I'm putting it in, I'm literally going like this speed, like so almost imperceptibly slow to the human eye. I'm going so slow. But at one point maybe I did like this. And you do that and that's enough to like make a lump and a bruise, and it hurts. It's not the end of the world or anything, but it did hurt. It didn't feel good, and it made a little bruise on the top of my ass cheek.

The first time you pinned, were you – I'm looking for the right word. Squeamish, squirmish, nervous, hesitant. Really, even the number – the follow-up was how long were you i'm looking for the right word squeamish squirmish nervous hesitant really even number the follow-up was how long were you nervous but i was so jazzed i was so jazzed as soon as it got here i was just like fucking kid under a christmas tree i was like getting that shit out i already had all my like alcohol swabs and my syringes ready to go and i was just like i had already watched plenty of youtube videos on like how to draw and, uh, draw, I mean like draw the medicine from the vial. There's a little bit of a technique you push air in first and then you draw out so you have, you don't have a vacuum going on or you do have a vacuum going on.

And, uh, you know, back filling syringes is a thing. So you're not like wasting huge amounts of medicine. So what I do is I pull the back out, I take a larger syringe, and I fill this up to where I want to be. But you never get it just right, because it's oil, and it's sticking to the inside of the barrel. So then, you know, get all the air out, and then do the opposite, take the big syringe, pop the back out of it. And careful, like not to contaminate anything, right? Like I'm not sticking plungers on tables and stuff everything's staying clean and i just get the excess out until i have the exact amount i want

in here and uh and yeah it's uh it's super easy super easy process that would have seemed like one of the hard bits to me is the first couple times injecting yourself i would i would hate it's a lot less uh daunting when you're using a tiny insulin pin though like if you're doing it as frequently as kyle as you can get away with the small you know little diabetic style pin versus most of us well like you know me and other individuals who took gear the first time we were using like a fucking harpoon that's way more daunting and it's you know that is actually you know kind of sketch You know, that's what Wings does. He does? Yeah. Wings puts like – I don't want to get the – he's putting like a 25 gauge,

something like that, maybe a 23, like into the top of his – Thigh? Not calf. Not calf. In the top of his thigh for testosterone. Oh. Yeah. Did I – I think I heard it from you. Is he doing it once every two weeks?

I think he's doing we I just remember the administration wasn't, you know, we just talked about like why I feel and, you know, based on my knowledge and obviously like Derek's recommendations that every other every day or at least every other day is like a really good way to do things. I remember like hearing what he was doing and thinking that's not ideal but it's none of my fucking business you know what I mean I think he was doing set every seven days or maybe every ten something like that and I my opinion is that's not ideal and it's none of my fucking business where does good start Derek as an administration frequency well it, on your own individual response, because some people I do know that can get away with once a week just fine. And you have to keep in mind, too, without getting too bogged down in the science, if you have a high sex hormone binding globulin, sometimes you might actually benefit more from infrequent shots. infrequent shots because you might want to drive it down by having a more aggressive like influx of androgens at once which then drives down the shbg which then frees up more testosterone from the binding protein to be you know get to target tissues and whatnot but ultimately the

most like basic protocol is like monday thursday you know like twice a week kind of thing and that's sort of where you know incremental increases with diminishing return starts to come in so it's like you know three times a week you know decent amount better every other day you know a little bit better and then the difference between every other day and every day is like fucking fairly minuscule but it's some people i know it's the difference between them like having gyno symptoms and them not so for those individuals it's necessary but for some individuals it makes like almost no difference at all yeah i don't want to run an aromatase inhibitor and ai or anything like that i didn't want to get

into anything like that um and obviously wanted to avoid as many side effects as possible so like again like anybody's like afraid of the needle like i hate to say it like this but don't be a bitch i tell you what you can buy like like really small packs of these 29 gauge needles get get one of these syringes and and some alcohol pads sterilize your delt and stick one in you don't inject yourself with air or anything retarded but like get an idea of how much this hurts because i don't guys you like practice with b12 we'll get like vitamin b12 injection to like you know practice with that yeah it's it's there's nothing to it and like um like i know i know fish was was fish only has one testicle uh and uh or maybe oh he's gonna be mad

accident or birth uh i think it's just birth i i want to say he's got like one big testicle. Or maybe... Oh, he's going to be mad. Accident or birth? I think it's just birth. I want to say he's got one big testicle and one little one. I choose to believe that's true. The big testicle ate the smaller one in the womb. Yeah. It's like a Pac-Man situation. I didn't know that.

I don't know. We were discussing whether maybe testicle size might have something to do with the amount of tea he had. And he was interested in getting his testosterone checked. But the real holdup for him isn't even the injection. It's the blood testing. And I can almost – I do not like giving blood. I don't like – I did not like going to LabCorp. I always try to put on a good face when I'm going in there.

I'm like, hey, it's time to do the thing. I bet you're a professional at this, huh? I'm trying to make small talk with this lady. I'm trying, I always try to like talk them up. I'm like, oh, you must do this all the time. I bet you're real good at it. I'm hoping that she's like. Nope, day one, sweetheart.

Oh, I've been doing it for six, six, six, 67 years. They can't fire me because I'm in the union. Yeah, like, but I really dislike getting that vein popped. And I've also like,

you know, they do this one in the hospital a lot. I don't like that either. I don't like intravenous stuff. I could never be an intravenous drug user. No hammer. It's just I don't I don't dig it at all.

But that's one of the holdbacks for him is like being afraid of like that. But you do that like a few times a year, you know, like this is what you're doing every day. And there's nothing to this. I'm the opposite on blood tests. I just wanted to jump in. Dude, blood tests are one of them. I'm in the hands of a professional, and I feel good. I always tell the same lame joke.

I ask them if they've done it before when clearly they have. And they spot my vein from across the room. It doesn't even look that visible to me. But you're going to be easy. From six feet away, they say that. And they get it first time every time. When you work out, you go in, they're like, you made this easy for me, didn't you?

You just have a fucking huge vein climbing up your arm, don't you? Kyle had a roadmap. I can't compare to that. But they do spot that one vein from six feet away, and they think it's easy. When I get blood. There are medical professionals that one of the most difficult things is when someone morbidly obese comes in to get blood drawn, and then they get mad at them where it's like, you had to stick me six times, and they want to be like, I don't know what I'm looking for.

I'm fishing in the dark here. I don't know. What's that device called? It's valuable in Tarkov. Kyle, help me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Ledex. Ledex, yeah.

They do one of those. It tells you where the veins are underneath your skin. Yeah, but not even the world's most powerful Ledex could delve that deeply sometimes. You know what I mean? If you've got eight inches of fat, they're boring in there at that point they're getting out a giant syringe i don't know uh yeah when i gave blood they said the same they were like oh well this will be easy and then of course i passed out 15 minutes later so wait is that part true yeah i told you that right when i gave blood i passed out i always didn't you might have told do. How long does it take to give blood?

Usually it's just in and out, I feel like. Time dilates when you're that unconscious. I just remember looking down and seeing that big purple bag of blood. This is giving blood, not a blood test. Yeah, this is giving blood. This is taking a pint or something out of me.

Yeah, I got super lightheaded. She's like's like oh i may have taken it out too fast i'm like you think like i think there's turning gray would your body fat really low what would you estimate your body fat was when i was probably like 15 at that point like like yeah it's pretty like like it was really easy to get the vein like like when i wasn't eight it was yeah no like but when i met like I made the fist or whatever and pumped up, my vein just popped up and super easily found. You could see it without doing that, honestly.

No, I passed out not because she was digging around, just from the blood loss. Yeah, I can't relate to that. Oh, maybe that's – yeah. I think I hit 15% before my trip. i'm a little higher right now but i was something like that 15 definitely not more than 17 and uh i could give blood without trouble yeah i think i've gotten pretty good at like doing the eye test and uh like looking at your shirtless pictures i think that's what i told you is that you were right around 15

yeah i don't know i always thought i was fat enough that I could easily give blood. Maybe I just made up that correlation. It's the size of you. We didn't fall off of plan or anything, but it's just like we kind of just stopped monitoring your shit after you got peaked. So what have you been up to since? I've been adding like 100 calories a week and continuing with the workout program.

Right now I'm eating like 2800 calories a day something like that 2900 um and uh i think i weigh like 194 something like that right now so definitely added some fluff back on but i finally i'm getting like results again in the gym because throughout our whole like weight cut we're really stagnant almost everything i didn't really lose any strength like occasionally i'd have like a day where it's like ah i was a rep short here or like i had to take a i had to take 2.5 pounds off there like there was a little like tiny bits of strength loss here and there but you'd make it up the next week it would be right back so your lifts like mostly during the huge cut kind of plateaued and it was more just maintaining your existing muscle

make sure you don't lose it while cutting all the fat. Yeah. Like, like in those pictures when I'm like the, like the black and white one, like the, the final pictures when I'm like, like super duper lean,

that's the muscle that I built over, um, you know, eight months, that's eight months of like muscle growth and followed by three months roughly of cutting, uh, more or less.

And that's one of the main differences between the trt versus not circling back to your earlier question woody too is during that point where he's just like maintaining strength he's like holding all of his muscle despite doing like upwards of at the end of it you know like an hour of cardio an hour you doing like you know 2400 2500 calories um out hard, losing essentially like very minimal amounts of muscle. Whereas a natural guy, you know, you're,

you're losing a decent amount in both areas, which is like, that's the biggest disparity between the two things. But anyway, one thing Derek doesn't know, like, so Kyle would, um,

check in with Derek on his progress and Derek would give him feedback on like what to change, what to do differently and stuff. And he's like, if I don't weigh this amount by Monday, Derek's going to make me do more cardio. I have to fast. Yeah. I don't think I talked about it on my live stream. That's another part of the weight cut that I just completely forgot to talk about on the live stream. So like we're taking like calories out of my diet every week or every two weeks or something like that. That's another part of the weight cut that I just completely forgot to talk about in the live stream. We're taking calories out of my diet every week or every two weeks or something like that.

A few more calories are falling off. Basically, what we're doing is like, all right, if we go from 3,500 calories a day to 3,400 calories a day, let's see what happens after a week. It's like, oh, shit, we lost a pound and a half. Just everything else stayed the same. Let's see what happens next week. Well, next week, if we only lose half a pound, we probably need to pull a few more calories out. So slowly over like months, more and more calories are falling off and more and more cardio is happening. So fewer calories, more cardio. And like if the results aren't there after that next week of weigh-ins, it's time to change one of those numbers and it's a lot like for like

maintaining that muscle and maintaining the strength gains and stuff the cardio adding more cardio seems to make more sense than lowering calories plus it's a lot easier like i i'd rather run an hour than eat a hundred less calories today like a lot of people don't realize how much food matters like they think okay it's the exact same thing between lowering calories or increasing cardio. Like why would I do cardio when I can just lower my food more because I don't want to do more exercise. Fuck that. In reality, the food, again, the micronutrient like components of it are like signaling molecules to then help you retain more muscle. more muscle. So even though you're, you know, expending potentially the net same amount of calories, having, you know, that zinc intake or having this intake or having, you know,

enough iodine or whatever it is, these things are going to help you build or, you know, retain more muscle in a deficit potentially than like when you're doing more cardio versus just like killing your food intake. So that's why you would do like a careful titration of both accordingly based on your results. But it's not just like drop food to fucking nothingness and just keep cardio at zero. It's not really going to work. Yeah, I don't love cardio. I don't think anybody really does. But after a while, you kind of get into a groove with it.

And like toward the end there, I'd send these two like photos of like the, the digital readout on my exercise bike. And I'm, I'm biking like 20 miles every day. I'm like, I'm knocking out 20, 25 miles sometimes like, like in my living room and just, I'm just sitting there drenched in sweat. Just like, just a few more miles and Derek says I can stop.

I would always reply with something encouraging because I want to be a good friend. But it's a photo of an LCD readout that I've never seen. It means nothing to me. The time meant something. I can tell what that meant. I'd send a photo back of deli meats or something. I mostly did elliptical. did elliptical um for the first

two months i'm gonna say and then that last month when it when it got up to like 45 minutes and then an hour a day of cardio all of a sudden it just made more sense to like like like my music wasn't enough to take my brain off of the torture anymore. And I really needed a TV to like, like watch a TV program and zone out into it while I kept like pedaling and kept my heart rate where I wanted it. So I just like took my exercise bike and just sat in front of the TV in my living room and just pedaled. I just get, I'd wake up, get on that motherfucker and get it done. I did not enjoy it enjoy it twitter question this might be hard to answer i don't know what you'll do with it where is he going with this whole thing is there an end goal

is he entering competitions so it's grinder success like what are we doing with with the transformation you do know grinder is the gay one right i just want to clarify yeah it's funnier than tinder it is i feel like uh you know there might be people in your universe who hear is this how people found out is the tinder pictures getting leaked or was it yeah yeah why is it yeah it was because the tinder pictures got leaked because like i was i was really trying to get my youtube passwords all sorted so that i could do uh some stuff on youtube about this uh And, but, and I'm hoping that we get that worked out. I just got another contact sent to me.

We'll see if this guy can work on it, but all that aside, where am I going with this? So I think I look pretty fucking good right now. Everybody in my life thinks I look pretty fucking good right now. Like, you know, girls think I look good. My family thinks I look good. My friends think I look good. But and I don't think this is like body dysmorphia at all. I have like different goals in mind. And I think my goals, I have a couple

of goals. One of them is I want my chest to be bigger and more symmetrical. I don't know if I do anything about the symmetry, but I can definitely make it bigger over the course of the next year. I have, I really don't give a shit about strength. I, I, I think I maxed out. Like,

I don't think I ever maxed out. Right. Like, like there was that one time I sat down and did three Oh five for reps, but that was just cause there was, there's no reason to risk injury. Yeah. Like,

like, because I work out alone. Maxing's not cool. I work out alone and I don't have safety stops on the bench that I use. So if I throw 340 on there and fail alone, I'm going to die. You know, it's not like you post videos of your PRS or anything.

So it's like literally for your own ego, not for anyone to see or anything. So like, what's the fuck? My gym does have a leaderboard and the heaviest bench at my gym, I think is three 365 or 375. And we're going to take that fucking number by the time next year. 100% we're taking that number.

So I would like to hit a 400-pound bench in my life. That is like the one little thing that I think would be cool. I think I could probably hit that number in another year if I went hard enough in the paint. But if I don't, it's not a huge deal. Mostly, my goals are aesthetic. And I think just I don't want to walk around at eight fucking percent body fat. I think 10 or 12% is is kind of ideal for like the aesthetic that I want to walk around that I think that's low as fuck and like, pretty fucking elite for the average human being walking down the street. And I think it's pretty easily maintainable for me, like, because

I like the diet. I really do like the vertical diet. I don't have any problem with it. Now that I can eat like a full bowl of rice again, I'm like, rice is so good. Like when people were like, what was the one food you really wanted when you were cutting weight and i'm like a bowl of fucking rice a full one i wanted a full bowl of rice not that not because like we were pulling calories from my carbs so i i still have like my ground beef 10 almonds and 10 grains of rice kyle what do you think were you doing anything to make the rice tastier or just a bowl of white rice? When I first started cooking the meals that Derek laid out for me, it was like, all right, here's my spinach on this side, and here's my peppers on this side, and here's my meat, and here's my rice. And they were all sectioned on a plate. By the end, everything is in a bowl.

bowl. Everything's in a bowl mixed together. Put some salsa or some sriracha on top and just eat it over the sink and then go about my day and then do that four times a day. Everything just goes in a bowl and gets mixed together now. Eat it over the sink? I'm just kidding. It's such a small amount of food when you're

only eating. It's 600 calories. It's like a 600 calorie meal. It's like gone. Doing the dishes. I got a question. This might be better for the Ask Women subreddit, but I'll ask you guys anyway. It seems like if I think of

the ideal male physique, it's kind of those fitness competitors type guy or physique competition, sort of like the smallest level of bodybuilding, to me is the most aesthetic. But when Pete Connor Murphy goes to the streets and asks girls, which one's the hottest, they pick a less impressive physique.

So now my theory is that the reason they don't go for the hottest guy is that they're, they can't be bothered to be the female equivalent. They're like, let's just lower our sights a little bit. And then maybe I can match this guy in terms of like desirability this fitness model is too much for painting the ass to be the female equivalent do you think that's it or am i i don't know because like every woman i've ever spoken to acquaintances friends family like like if that topic ever

comes up and they see like one of those guys who's five percent body fat jacked to the gills and just roadmaps and just derrick's done it no five percent we're talking about like kyle's models right like i think those girls on camera a lot of them know this video is going on youtube so they're not going to answer necessarily what they actually think they're going to have like the publicly acceptable answer above and beyond that when they see a guy if they see kyle water depleted fucking photo shoot ready slice that of his goddamn mind that's not the same as kyle like walking around in a shirt or at the beach even in natural lighting like this is like peak circumstances for like one moment with perfect lighting you just nared all the fucking hair off like everything is goddamn perfect that circumstance even the exact same guy literally a day later looks entirely different

walking around in clothes and they see you know the vascularity when he's just in a t-shirt or whatever they're like oh that's you know that's great that guy looks amazing it's a totally different scenario to a chick seeing a guy literally doing like a chest fly and his striations are going all over the map they think that looks gross but then when he's walking around in a shirt you know they're into it you don't need to be five percent because then you look like you're malnourished and like dying but if you're like 10 which is like shredded to most people's standards that is great you know and if you're muscular yeah maybe you might have some chick on youtube saying oh it's just too much it's like it's like come on like what what happens have some chick on YouTube saying, oh, it's just too much. It's like, come on.

What happens on fucking Tinder? Who's getting the results? It's like the dudes who look good at the end of the day. I would say my results with women, it's just the women who are really into like – as my pictures on Tinder maybe got more and more intensified. They were pretty intense. They were pretty intense as everybody saw um you know it started to being more it was it would be a lot of chicks who were like uh like doing fucking squats in the gym themselves like like lots of chicks who were like super duper into fitness themselves and uh because like i don't know i i and i and you know i I got no problem with that at all. But it stopped being a lot of skinny, fat girls and started being a lot more like super fit chicks who were into like sports or into lifting a lot.

Like I showed I showed you guys that chick who was benching like shit. What was it like one one forty or something like that? Like something crazy. She was bunch that like like something crazy she was bunch of bitching something crazy for a girl she was like she's a um just stuck work for a major movie uh um this is supporting my theory that the girls who are going for the fit guys are the ones who are willing to maintain the the parallel female equivalent so Does that make sense? Sort of, but I think also it depends how you present your package too. Like Kyle's pictures are like blatantly posing in like perfect lighting that are like only a fitness model would do.

I can guarantee you if you like, I don't know how much you actually go out, but if you had pictures like with your buddies at the beach and you're the same body fat percentage, you would get a more diverse pool, I would think, that would want to match with you than the hyper specific fitness chick. It's widely appealing to everyone to be in shape. Yeah.

I guess Zach's not here. There's just different levels of in shape. I think that's what you're getting at, Woody. Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. Some of those pictures I'm just looking completely ridiculous. They're literally me water depleted. One of them

is literally me just completely water depleted. That's absurd. He's perfect. He's perfect, right? This guy to me is like... I'm sorry. I cut Taylor off and I apologize for it, but he was describing 5% total jack, like IFBB Pro.

This guy is not 5% body fat. He's something north of that. Maybe 8? Who coincides? This was like the first year men's physique was a category in the Mr. Olympia competitions and the standards were a bit lower back then. As ridiculous

as that sounds, because this is like perfection in front of you already. Put a number on it for me what's that put a body fat number use your laser eyes greg fuck i don't know like seven eight percent maybe like i don't know but um but yeah like for this like this is you don't need to be this lean obviously like this guy could easily pack on 10 to 15 pounds and still have visible abs and look great but when girls are like ew i love the he looks great under underneath sexy sexy gay man all right you know let's not click the sexy gay man tab click it but yeah this to me i'm like the only reason chicks aren't going for this sometimes is that i don't know they don't want to be that hot too it's a pain in the ass to be that i think they if they

see a picture like this they're like oh this guy is a douchebag he's whatever it's because he's he's standing on a stage like look at my fucking physique i'm perfect right a lot of girls get turned off by that if he's just like with his friends smiling or at like, you know, some normal event and has some sort of social interaction that looks attractive to everyone and isn't like blatantly try hard. I think he would attract the majority of people's interests who aren't intimidated by it,

which, you know, maybe some people are intimidated, but a lot of chicks who are under, you know, your league will still shoot for you on Tinder, even if they're never going to get it. That you know but it's like what what is it like five percent of guys get like 95 of the girls or some shit like that's definitely how it works yeah

tinder is like like a total argument against equality like it's like it's something like that it's like the top like 15 of guys getting like 95 of the girls and then there's like like i think they did like a study where they had like men and women rate each other by body and looks and what they found is like one through ten the male one was like mostly kind of like bell like kind of like that meanwhile the women rated like the eights as like oh that's like the average one and like six and below are absolute ghouls yeah i would never touch yeah yeah what i can say for sure too just from my experience on tinder with like experimenting with physique versus not physique pics and stuff like that is

i you know tried to avoid using my main picture as me shirt shirtless because i thought like oh this is a douchebag thing girls are getting turned turned off by it. And maybe, you know, times have changed a bit since, you know, the inception of Tinder, when you just like slam as many like perfect photos of your, you know, shredded physique as possible and just kill it. So I was like, okay, I'm going to put like a picture of me, you know, in a suit here at like with my friends and whatever. And you know, you do good. But then I put this one picture of me at like a, I think it was like a Halloween party or something. And I had an excuse to be shirtless. I was in like, like a genie costume with like, you know, a Sultan thing. I had like this vest on with nothing underneath and I'm having a good

time. And it's just like a normal setting to be shirtless rather than me in the mirror. Like, fuck, look at my shit. So like in that picture, you know, my results like tripled, even though the rest of my pictures are the same. So as long as you make it in a way that girls don't feel to themselves like, oh, I'm going for the douchebag or this guy is a douchebag. They can justify it to themselves to swipe right. And they're like, this guy seems cool. That's that's how I perceive it. I mean, I'm saying that Derek applies the same like hypothesis, observe results, a process to Tinder that he does to testosterone.

If you look at my pussy getting calendar, you'll see I was absolutely slaying in April. It's just like X-ing off the days. It's all, every single one of them has an X on it. Yeah, that's

really funny to make a Tinder and be like, yeah, I'm getting pussy. But why? Tinder's cool now because Tinder has that thing where it'll show you which of your pictures are most effective. And it'll shift those pictures toward the front. So I did a lot of experimentation. People gave me shit because of that one picture where I'm wearing the blazer or whatever, second most effective. Second most effective picture.

That's the second most effective picture that got the most swipes. I think the most effective picture was maybe me wearing the yellow and black. Then it sort of went downhill from there. It does that for you. I don't remember what that feature is called.

It's like smart photo or something like that but it slides whichever your best photos the ones that girls I pay for the I think it's just like part of Tinder but like whatever you can pay for on Tinder I pay for you'd be fucking stupid to not pay for it

like I can't believe any guy wouldn't you know you pay a lot lots of girls who don't but I I don't think many guys do. It was only $5 a month years ago when I was using it for the premium or gold. Is it still that? Times have changed. It's like gold and then platinum

now or something, but it's like the amount of time you save too, it more than pays for itself. It makes no sense why you would not upgrade, in my opinion. I just do the platinum thing because you're able to see when people like you and it's

better. It's better that way. You want to be able to see if someone's liking you and you don't want to be limited on how many likes you get and all that shit. You don't want to be like, oh, you ran out of swipes today. That's bullshit. You can run out? On Bumble, you can absolutely run out. Or maybe it's Hinge.

I don't know. I've always had the expensive version of Tinder. What's your experience with Tinder versus Bumble versus the other ones? I would put them in that order. Like Tinder, Bumble, Hinge. Hinge seems to be like a lot of single single moms and a lot of like older ladies who are looking for like their third relationship in life like i don't mean the third ever but like the third real relationship and like they've already had one husband they've had their second

husband they had some kids with and now they're like like 45 years old and like like that the fuck how many times can you retread a tire they've been retread several fucking times and then Bumble seems to be more like ladies who are looking for a little bit more something stable and then we all know what Tinder is

Tinder is just everybody's seen them Zach so Tinder is a hook up non relationship for the most part it's more like the wild west over there I've seen actual nudity in chicks Everybody's seen them, Zach. Tinder is a hookup non-relationship app. For the most part, it's more like the Wild West over there. I've seen actual nudity in chicks' profile pictures on Tinder. I've seen chicks' profile pictures on Tinder where their tit is out. One of the fucked up things about Tinder now is a lot of girls use it to advertise their OnlyFans and stuff.

So there's a lot of girls who are on there not for the right reasons. And it's like back in the day, all had to worry about was like fake like bots and shit like fake hot girls that are not actual real accounts that are trying to like fish your information or like whatever it is but now there's girls that are actually like go to my instagram and follow me and like pretend they're interested or whatever and they're trying to like promote services like it's not just like escorts or something. It's actual go watch me get pounded on OnlyFans or some shit

while advertising on Tinder. It's insane. Yeah, I've had chicks try to recruit me to pound them on their OnlyFans. I've had plenty of that. Looking for a co-star. I can do that. Maybe we have a trial period where we see if it's

gonna work out first and then i never talk to you again afterwards can we do that do you guys do much stretching and mobility work no but i should uh no but i should he follows your plane to the t that's a lot of people's answers but it's like for me i know what i should be doing a lot of the time i just don't for me i get like the bare minimum in to maintain my physique and that's kind of it and that's just because i'm so involved with my work that i i don't allocate as much time as i could to, you know, bodybuilding slash, you know, sports related shit. Like I used to, you've talked about that in your, Oh, go ahead, Kyle. I was just gonna say the closest I come to stretching is like using a roller. Um, like I I'll roll out my quads

and, uh, I'll roll out my back sometimes. Like sometimes, um, if like a overhead press or like something like that, it'll like compress my spine a little bit. I feel like, and I start feeling a little wonky in my back and just getting on that uh roller and like cracking my back out they have rollers at the gym so i i usually use them like mid-workout like two or three times it's not enough but i always stretch in the shower that's when i notice that i'm not flexible like when i'm soaping up and uh it's like oh fuck i need to you know to start using all the walls and shit when i get home from like a pull day i can't i have a hard time i can't wash my hair without bending over like i can't do you have those cramps in your forearm after pull day too i i've gotten them in my

in my triceps like like like at like lately i've been adding a lot of tricep cables and just really like taking that to failure on the last um i like shifted that to like the end of that workout it shows that's one of your most impressive body parts the tricep thank you um and and just really like taking those to failure uh initially i did that with um with my delts with lots of um with lots of delt stuff just lots of super sets where I'd start with like 45s and do my three sets of 12. And then just doing multiple angles. I'm like twisting my wrists on the end and like start with 45s and then 40s and 35s and 30s and just go all the way down until I'm at five pounds. And I'm just like burned out, just completely burned out.

just like just burned out just completely burned out and uh and then resting for 10 minutes and trying to like and then like going back at it like really hurting myself in there and i think that's another one of those areas where like if you do that natural you probably don't go back to the gym the next day yeah but but yeah i i get uh i've gotten cramps in my triceps before um and anytime that starts happening if it happens twice in a row, I'll add like a banana before my like a workout or something like that. Cause I feel like that helps with cramps. But, but I've definitely had like pull days where I get in the shower and I'm like,

this is all we got. Like my biceps are so pumped up from like Derek's sick ass pre-workout that I'm just like, cause I do two scoops ofass pre-workout that I'm just like, fuck. Because I do two scoops of your pre-workout every single workout, and then I do a big scoop of that, was it glycerol? Yeah, a big scoop of that glycerol, and then I drink

a quart of water with it. I have it in my head that if we're trying to pump some water and nutrients into our muscles, might as well pump some water and nutrients into our muscles. Yeah as well pump some water and nutrients into our muscles. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I get some crazy pumps, and I can't wash my goddamn hair without bending over.

You mentioned in your videos, Derek, that your passions have kind of changed from fitness to entrepreneurship. You do a podcast with two other guys. You talked about it there a couple times. Yeah. I don't know. I'm trying to ask like how's that going without prying too much taking in a direction that might be private but like you're gonna ask

whatever you want i'll just say if it's you know too personal or whatever yeah oh i imagine you're in a tax bracket you've never seen before that must be nice how's that it's uh yeah it's uh it gets complicated with me being a canadian too and i have to deal with the u.s like my companies are in the states so i have like a really weird corporate structure where i have to like own companies that own companies that then own companies and it's a fucking nightmare to deal with taxes but yeah the tax uh burden is pretty uh significant and um it's a good problem to deal with obviously and uh i don't know like everything's going fucking great man like i can't complain gorilla mine's exploding since we talked last time it's probably literally

20x in size like 20x good god yeah yeah wow well i mean your channel does such a big job promoting it too because like you'll explain not only like you won't just do a self-promotion of you know look at how great mine is it's like here's the most popular one on the market and i'm gonna tear it to shreds this is bullshit i i love your intro like i'll watch it and you're just like how about you just drag your balls on my face and fuck me in my mouth how about you just pin me over how about you just put your dick in my ass that'd be your troblast said which is like don't sue me 3,000 milligrams of

L-citrulline don't you know you need and it's like and like by the end of the video I've got like an air of like yeah don't you know don't you know you need 5,000 to 10,000 yeah it's like you think your customers can't even read fucking labels and i'm like well i

don't actually know that one milligram was not enough yeah i didn't know either like the efficacious dose thing is really interesting and like i want to ask this like kyle you said you were taking a multivitamin do multivitamins work like is there good evidence that that those work derek or because you hear so much negativity so i hope so they're fucking expensive yeah they definitely work by the way i'm actually making an equivalent multivitamin to the one we both use so soon we both won't have to pay for that shit so nice because it's so fucking expensive it's the most expensive thing i take yeah but one thing that's cool is like those videos where i dismantle pre-workouts and stuff like that. I've had people message me saying they've gotten jobs

at supplement stores because of their crazy knowledge that they learned from my channel and guys coming up to me saying they're the most impressive employee at their GNC or whatever it is. That kind of shit's cool. Get out of here. Go home and go to GrowMo.com. I had a lot of questions like that on Twitch and I'm like, look, home and go to girl mode.com. That's what I like.

I had, I had a lot of questions like that on, on Twitch. And I'm like, look, nobody's paying me to promote this shit right now. Like, I know we're going to keep certain I'm going to have the same answer a lot

tonight. And it's go to Derek's website and order X, Y, and Z. And, and it's because like, they're like, well,

what do you take for like, uh, for fast cardio? And I'm like, I take as much caffeine as it takes to get my heart rate to 130 easily. And I take this shit that Derek sells, this Raulcine Ayo Hembine shit. There's like three bottles in my house right now. And I would take it every single time before cardio. And they're like, well, what kind of pre-workout? I'm like,

the only pre-workout you ever need is Derek pre-workout. Like, like I don't, if I, if I got any more pumped up, I'd fucking explode. That's the question. Kyle pre-workout question.

Do you prefer no stim and some other stim method of getting that? Or do you prefer the stim pre-workout? Yeah, definitely no stim for me i could see where maybe somebody like might want stim like maybe if you're not like i think i think stim in pre-workout is good for people who maybe don't work out five days a week like i do uh but it but in my case like i want to be able to really tailor exactly how much stim I'm getting. I want some sometimes. I want a lot some other times.

And I want none sometimes. When I was doing those cardio sessions, I'm already like hitting myself so hard with caffeine to do this big hour-long cardio session first thing in the morning. My workout is eight hours later, right? I don't want to like eight hours later, pump myself up with another big fat dose of caffeine and like, like mess with not only my tolerance, but like tax my adrenal system and all that shit. Like it's going to do some bad stuff to my body. Does stim just mean caffeine? Yeah.

Stimulating. Yeah. Yeah. So you like no stim pre-workout so you can select your own stim levels. I can tailor it for a number of reasons, not only for the fasted cardio that I'm doing in conjunction with like lifting on the set, you know, on the same days during the cut, but also, you know, when your, your, your tolerance goes up.

So like some pre-workouts are like going to put like 400 milligrams of scoop in there. That'd be a fat ass dose. Some of them are, most of them are like two or something like that i've seen 275 stuff like that that ain't enough when i'm like at my max tolerance like i need 500 milligrams of fucking caffeine which is probably not safe i i wouldn't if i were a doctor i certainly wouldn't recommend you take that much but if when i when my cousin asked me how much caffeine to take i'm like however fucking much it takes to get your heart rate to 130 dude like like does it take a gram don't tell me yeah does it take a gram don't fucking tell me about that and drink a lot of water because your kidneys are gonna fall out of your asshole but uh i i would take uh I started off with 200 milligrams. And I think by at one point I was taking like 600, 700 milligrams at a time. And but but I mean, I would I use my Samsung smartwatch and I would send you guys some pictures sometimes of like my peak heart rate and it would get to 170 you know like sometimes most of the times i would do my steady my steady state cardio at 130 beats per minute and i would maintain that for an hour but when

i was really feeling motivated i'd make the last 10 or 20 minutes of that workout just go as hard as i could you know i tried i tried it i'm like well let's keep it at 150 for the last 15 minutes or something you'd send those send those workout summations on the bike with your heart rate, and I'm like, I hope he's going to be okay. I see Kyle's had a cardiac event. And the part that I don't show you there is when I get off the bike, I don't quit. Or when I get off the elliptical, I don't quit.

I'm not like, all right, time to get in the shower. It's like, let's soak up as much of this after burn as we can so i start like doing a brisk walk until my heart rate comes down to below like fat burning levels until my heart rate's like 110 again or something like that what is that burning level 130 you said about 130 is it is like it's where i'm at but you're burning fat with every heartbeat no matter no matter what but like you're being pretty effective at 130. Um, so like I would get off, you know, after 45 minutes of doing that, that cardio. And then I just do laps around the gym, like, like inside the gym, just doing like brisk, like fast walking and like keeping an eye on my heart rate. And I'm like, shit, I can, I can get an extra 10 minutes of cardio out of this almost. Like if I just like

keep doing this and part of me, the bitch part of me would be like well then you could just do 30 on the bike and then 10 around the gym and i'm like no you can't pussy he said 45 he meant 45 he didn't say do 35 and then walk around for 10 minutes did he so you start having these like internal debates with yourself like while you're doing the shit. Oh, yeah. Oh, I had many internal debates. And there's always that, as Wings of Redemption would say, that bitch in your blood that'll start coming up with like, hey, maybe instead of cardio, you just go for an extra long walk after every meal of the day. That'll add up, right? No.

You know what? We're going to do that anyway. And the cardio. See how you like that, bitch? And that part of like i won't do all right i'll stay quiet i'll stay quiet shut up i'm bigger than you now boss me around yeah yeah like i like the people in my neighborhood like um would see me walking every single fucking day because you know i'm doing those 10 minute walks after every meal. But then after a while, like when we were doing the cardio, I would just go out and just walk for miles and miles during the day

cause I wanted to make sure I hit 15,000 steps a day. So I'd hit 15,000 steps a day in addition to cardio. Uh, they're, they're at the end of the weight cut and uh and so i'm just like walking around my neighborhood every day for like a fucking hour or something like that in the morning i would send you guys those guys those pic that's what i was sending you guys pictures of my fucking shadow i was like i was like my shadow looks jacked that's a new level yeah derrick what happens if teenagers like during puberty take test or trt like i see guys on sarms and i i guess i think i'm talking about high school kids probably making bad decisions like what goes on there do you know um yeah well i guess it depends on how far they

push it because they're already going through puberty with their testosterone peaking anyway so if they shut themselves down but they're on like a replacement amount of tests, it might just be the equivalent outcome realistically. However, if you have like dysregulated estrogen, like you have a tightly regulated amount of estrogenic conversion in your body. And when you have like your brain and your balls are determining how much you get, it's a bit different than when you're injecting something and you're kind of like ballparking manually. manually. There's an argument to be made that if you have too much estrogenic signaling in your bones, you might prematurely stunt your growth, especially when you try and come off the gear, you end up in a low T state while you try and post-cycle therapy recover back to baseline.

You might hinder some sort of growth in your actual bone formation to some extent i'm not saying that's definitely going to happen because there are a lot of guys who took gear very young that still got taller but it's like in general too i just wouldn't fuck with anything that hasn't really completed maturation like especially brain development signaling with a bunch of androgens like it's different i'm not gonna say it's different when you use tests versus like other steroids when you're a teen but it's like ultimately when you're fucking with the actual tightly regulated mechanisms that determine how much you know stimulation your brain gets how much you know spitting out of your balls how much is getting to these bones you're starting to manually cause changes or lack of development in certain areas

of your brain potentially that i am certain there's guys who've used steroids too young, who've permanently altered their brain chemistry and permanently act different because of it. And they just don't realize it. So what's too young? Like, so like you're what do they say? Your frontal cortex finishes at 25. Yeah. For some reason, I was like, like, 21 is fully out of puberty. But yeah, so too young in general if you were to really put a cut off on like you probably shouldn't use anything

like really synthetic and you know like not bioidentical as a not like just plain testosterone like a you know something crazy like a fucking trend balloon or something there's an argument to be made that you wait until you're 25 because your brain is not going to be as easily manipulated slash altered in some permanent aspect that's gonna fuck with your like forever potentially however like the general rule of thumb is wait until you're fully grown like stature wise which could be you know 19 i don't know 20 whatever but in general like my my recommendation because i know a lot of guys aren't going to wait till they're 25 is at least have a couple years under your belt of like training and diet or understand it thoroughly and educate

yourself because a lot of people that go into it without understanding this without the proper guidance without the proper whatever and if you go in haphazardly to hormone assistance like especially it's different if you like actually medically require trt like versus a guy who's like a teenager trying to just like blast super physiological amounts of hormones if you're if you're exposing yourself to like dangerous amounts of hormones and you don't have your diet dialed in your training you're like wasting your organ stress essentially to expose yourself to this shit so it's like make sure everything is dialed in so you can actually take advantage of the organ stress while you're under you know that

burden essentially so like to answer your question i would say once you've reached full stature development which how are you going to determine that like i guess you could get like an x-ray of like your bones and like see if shit has closed or not like the uh growth plates and whatnot but um above and beyond that too just like having a comprehensive understanding of how hormones work or at at least a reasonable one given that you if you don't have it depends if you have a doctor overseeing your care or not because a teenager is not going to get prescribed trt unless they have you know some sort of i don't know they got kicked in the nuts by a fucking horse now their balls don't work like i don't know some weird situation like that maybe you need trt but for guys who are like 17 or like i just want to get on trt to get jacked

you know those individuals probably shouldn't be touching it regardless like i'd wait until you're ready to dive into hormones because you understand them you've reached full stature development and you actually understand it to a point where you can do it without like you're not going to have a doctor overseeing your care if you're like 19 and you have perfect hormones so it sounds like if you're 23 you're kind of thumbs up on a bioidentical i'm not thumbs up but i mean like okay yeah you know what i mean you know what I mean? Right. Like, yeah, it's just different for everyone. Yeah. So like ultimately if you've educated yourself and you have everything dialed

in and you want to explore that, like that would be a time where sure. You're not in like a high risk state. Let's put it that way. If you buy tea out of some random locker room at the gym, are you getting tea or are they just selling you Wesson oil in a fancy bottle? How often do they fuck with you? Well, now it's so cheap to synthesize it and to sell it that it's most often,

you're not going to get totally bunk shit a lot of the time. The problem is the sterility of it. You literally have some goddamn, literally a meathead chemist in his kitchen making this shit and who knows like if he has like cleaned his equipment properly if he's done whatever that's horrifying do you ever go to the steroids subreddit no see those guys synthesizing their own shit oh are they doing it safely i think this is how a lot of people get popped in professional sports too. They use like, for example, if you're trying to get a designer drug made

and the equipment is still tainted with something that is detectable, like a Terinda ball or like something like that. And then you pot for something and it's like, oh, I wasn't even taking that. It's like, well, maybe it didn't come from your supplement you took that you claim it did. Maybe it came from your underground gear that you were trying to get around tests with, and you got something that you didn't know was in there. There's a lot of circumstances that you might get.

Not what you think it is. In general, the more exotic compounds are going to be faked with shit. Like, primobolin is a very expensive and refined steroid. You might just get testosterone instead of primo. But test itself, very cheap, other than the sterility and the period of it. Like maybe they'll, you know, cheap out and give you like 50 milligrams less or whatever.

But in general, when you buy tests, you'll get tests. I've seen people on, on, online talking about trying to get Oxandrolone and ending up with Winstraw. Yeah.

And then a chick, you have a chick thinks she's getting Anabar and then she gets like, you know, whatever compound that the, the, you know, chemist chick thinks she's getting Anivar, then she gets whatever compound that the chemist decides to put in place because it's cheaper, end up with the fat clit, all the androgenic side effects, whatever it is.

She's taking her 5mg of Anivar and she's really taking just a fat dose of some real shit. And like you said, now she has a penis. Now she has a penis. And she looks like Chris Cyborg. Yeah. And she's going to now she has a penis. Now she has a penis. And she looks like Chris Cyborg. Yeah. And she's going to kill it on Grindr. That's awesome.

Yeah. I don't remember what Chris Cyborg popped for. I think it was like some sort of like some agent to remove, you know, like evidence of a steroid like uh something like that a diuretic of some kind um i think that's what she popped for i don't i don't remember if she ever got popped for like x compound or y compound you know something like that i don't recall but like looking at her bone structure i would like to see pictures of her when she's 18, 19 years old or something like that. It looks like she revealed that she tested positive

for... Winstrel. In 2012, she tested positive for Winstrel. Literally what I said. Okay. That doesn't say Winstrel. Did you translate it? Is that what it's spironic? Well, the spironolactone is l-dactone that's a diuretic but in the wikipedia doping violations and suspensions on uh in 2012 january

6 2012 it was announced that cyborg had tested positive for stenozolol an anabolic steroid which is the chemical name for winstroll glad we had had you here. I wouldn't have known. I would have thought the spine of Bifida, whatever the fuck that says. But this is a, like I'm interested in this. So I assume some people will also like, if you don't want to get on gear and you really enjoy lifting,

what's kind of the stack you would recommend for people to use? Creatine, obviously no brainer, five grams of creatine a day. There's a lot of random stuff. A lot of it in pre-workouts, you can take that help performance. They're not necessarily like potent muscle building agents, though, like betaine, anhydrous, you know, L-citrulline helps with pumps and whatnot. And, you know, if you can squeeze out another couple of reps, maybe you can get more muscle growth out of it. That kind of stuff is kind of negligible at the end of the day, though. But what like hitting your micronutrients is huge. If you're natural, a lot of people don't realize how heavily impacted their testosterone production is by like basic deficiencies.

So again, that's where a multivitamin might be useful for individuals whose diets aren't like dialed in. But like the vertical diet, for example, ensures that you are hitting all those needs. So then you have peaked out testosterone, getting your rest, getting your everything compounds you can add on top. Like, um, like I'm hesitant to just like plug shit that we sell as be like,

Oh, you'll get to use it. But like I came up with something recently called terkesterone, which is like an ecdy steroid. It's like, it's like a plant hormone, essentially, that sort of sort of acts like an anabolic in the wild to some extent. And when you put it in humans, it activates a receptor that causes some muscle building. And it's like at best, it's equivalent. What we've determined is it's probably like two and a half to five milligrams of Anivar when you use it without any testosterone suppression.

No anything, no kidney stress, no liver toxicity. And it's not banned by WADA either. So you can use it even in competition. Is that amount of Anivar impact? I don't know the amount. Yeah. It's like five milligrams of Anivar. I'm like, how many shroop Bucks is that?

Unicorns, leprechauns. It's not as effective as an Anivar, but it's like... It's as effective as a small dose of it. So then hypothetically, if you're a girl who's trying to avoid getting masculinized, you could use something like this plus creatine plus

other natural stuff to then lower your necessity for shit over here that is masculinizing and maybe you don't need that at all. I bought three bottles worth and I enjoyed it. Turquestrone? Yeah. I told you I'd send you some, bro. I was happy to give

you the business. You made the video and you're like, all right, we have Turquestrone now. give you the business like like like you made the video and you're like all right we have turkester own now all right soon we will not like this isn't a gimmick it's about to all go and i was like i'm not gonna ask him for some free shit like i'm just gonna order like it it's not cheap it's you know i just sent joe rogan 10 bottles of it. Did you? Did he ask for it? Yeah, him and Huberman made a video. I'm pretty sure Andrew Huberman, I'm not certain,

but he follows my stuff. I follow his stuff. We talk infrequently. We've kind of gone back and forth once or twice. I'm pretty fucking sure he got the idea of Trichesterone from my initial introduction to it last year because then he did a deep dive on it in one of his podcasts. And when he was on Rogangan recently they started talking about it huberman was a little bit off on some of his claims he's like it's that strongest deca and this and that rogan's

like holy shit like where do i get it so then i just you know dm rogan i was like we sell it you know if you want some i'll send you some so i'm sending him some and i don't know if he'll take it i don't know if you like it but are you sold out of it right now? Yeah, we're actually restocking next week, but it'll sell out in like two seconds. So you're talking about... I don't mind whenever I'm low on pre-workout. I didn't mind being like, hey, I'm low on pre-workout.

Or like this Raul scene stuff, because a bottle lasts me so long. This is an unopened bottle. I'm still on one of my other bottles. I just got in here because I always forget the goddamn name of this shit. It's so hard to pronounce. With the Tricastro, I was just like, I'm just going to get into business.

I just ordered three bottles quickly. I didn't follow the manufacturer's suggested dosage. I felt like there was a little wink, wink, nod, nod. Like, hey, we tell you to take three a day. That's what we tell you. It sure is. And I was just like, I think what he means is 12 a day. I'm pretty sure he means 12.

And so I was taking it right at the part of the whole program where I was really seeing results. And I was like, every little bit helps. And so I was just taking three at a time, four times a day. I'm pretty good at maintaining. I just set timers on my phone. I'm just like,

time to take some pills. I'll just get up and do that shit. I'm absolutely going to try this terkestron. It's really interesting. Send me your address after and I'll just ship you some. I think I said the other day on Twitch um you know on twitch i was like this is easy and it's easy if like you make it your lifestyle it's what i should have said because like i literally

made it my goddamn lifestyle like like there was no time for anything else i didn't do anything last year but this like like this is what i did. Um, every, every waking moment. And, uh, like, like I would wake up and do that cardio and you might think, all right, you did an hour. You still got the rest of the day. Well, shit. Like, like now there's an hour bath after the cardio. Right. So now, and there's the like driving to and from the gym. So now we're like two and a half hours deep in the day. And, but there's like a thing to do every few hours when you're eating that regularly, when you're eating four meals and a snack every day or whatever it was. And yeah, protein shakes. So like every day, there's like every two hours, there's another fucking thing to do. Like I couldn't go anywhere. Like when I went to see my dad, I brought a box of shit with me. Like I've got, I've got like a

big cardboard box with like pre-workout protein powders. I've i've like done i've had to do meal prep there's like eight meals in boxes like there's a giant pile of pills there's a fucking like there's syringes and and vials and stuff and i'm just like discipline was unreal throughout to anybody getting intimidated by this like elaborate protocol by the way like this stuff a lot of it is to maintain his health it's not like you need it necessarily for the muscle building so just keep in mind when he's saying i had like a million fucking pills a lot of this is like health stuff rather than like trt plus diet is like 99 of the results here you're absolutely right i don't want to give anybody the impression that like this is what you have to do to like get into moderately good shape like i was trying to squeeze those tenths of a percentage out you know like when i talk about

as possible as like and stay as yeah longevity based like like like throughout the whole thing i don't want to like hurt myself to help myself um like like but like any anywhere in the like the diet or the workout regimen or the cardio that I felt like I could squeeze this extra little 10th of a percentage. And I had this idea that like, if I can get a 10th of a percentage on 10 different things, I've got an extra percentage. And if I can do that every single day for a year, that's a huge fucking difference.

Like those baths I talk about that, like it's this hour long bath I take every day. If it really does burn as much as 30 minutes of walking, like being in that hot ass bath for an hour, I took 300 of those baths. You know, that that's a lot of extra walking that I was tacked on for like taking a goddamn bath that was probably helping me with muscle soreness anyway. But like when I, when I lift, I, um, I, I do a set and I, my, my watch has a three minute timer on it. I just, I tap it and that's my three minutes of rest.

But I look at the rest of the douchebags at the gym sitting on machines on their phones, and I'm like, no, no, no. We're going to get some steps in. I get 4,000 steps in every lifting session because I'm doing laps around the gym. I pace around the gym in circles the whole time I work out. You don't lose your machine when you do that? What's that? You don't lose your machine when you do that? You leave your bag on it or like how do you make sure your shit doesn't get no one's gonna steal his machine i actually trained late right yeah

yeah like throughout because of the pandemic that's the other thing i had to do all this through the pandemic um so like there was no way i could work out during the day so i just upended my whole sleep schedule and maintain it as much as we joke around on the show about having a fucked up sleep schedule. What I meant was, I'm nocturnal now because I work out at three in the morning every night. You know, I'm in the gym at three in the morning lifting until four 430am because my workouts are about an hour, hour and a half long each depending on like, like some days I'll go for two hours if I'm really just trying to hurt myself, I guess I don't know if I just keep just keep feeling good and i'm not like sometimes sometimes like on pull day too when i'm doing like um like bent rows and uh and chainsaws and pull-ups and uh like something

about like all those compound motions like just like my blood my blood sugar will kind of drop by the end of it i've started like drinking a good bit of orange juice before those workouts to try to just fuel through that workout a little bit extra. I don't know, but like on push days, sometimes I just feel super good and I'll stay there for two hours. Is that your favorite day? Push, push. Uh, yeah, I like, I like push a lot more than pull, um, pull just, I don't know. It's, it's when I'm, when I'm doing like lap pull downs or, or seated rows, um, seated, like, um, like, like pulls on the machine or something like that. It's a little torturous. Cause I'm, I've lived pretty heavy at this point. Like I, and I'm doing, you know, I'm doing three sets of 12 or three sets of 15 on everything. So like, I don't know, I've like, 200 pounds on the machine. And after a while, like, by that last set, it's not fun.

It's not fun. I'm doing my best not to be that douchebag that groans at the gym. That's the other thing I like. Wait, groaning with effort? What's wrong with you? Oh, there's a guy at my gym. I make sex noises. Personal gym, bitch.

Nobody ever takes your spot if you do that what are you the best here i i couldn't uh i couldn't have this i couldn't tell this story um you know earlier because um i need to reset something what's up we will have kyle reset when we do ads do i need to like refresh is that what you're saying we're just getting okay i'll refresh right, I think I'll be able to fix it in post, but your volume and Derek's volume are going up and down like crazy. Then I'll, I'll do the ads right now. Okay.

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Have you had that issue? I'm like, how would I fucking know? I take Blue Chew. I take Blue Chew every fucking day. I think you said, like, my dick could have stopped working last August. I'd have no idea. Yeah, my dick could have stopped working a year ago, and I'd have no idea because I take Cialis every single day. I don't care. I don't care.

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Derek, but does help me with the pronunciation on turkestone turkestrone does it impact fertility not at all so we actually did quite a few before and after blood tests um and it had no effect yeah that uh it had no effect on testosterone at all it had no suppression of luteinizing hormone or follicle stimulating hormone, which are the things that signal to your testes to produce testosterone, had no liver toxicity, no kidney toxicity,

no aberrations to lipids, no anything. It was just like super benign, super innocuous. And it was, uh, no, essentially you don't even realize you're on it,

except you just get a bit stronger in the gym and you know, you gain, you know, a couple of pounds. That's what I'm looking for. Not even though I'm on it except you just get a bit stronger in the gym and you know you gain you know a couple pounds that's what i'm looking for not even though i'm on it just i'm stronger that's perfect yeah it's really individual response it seems like like some people just like any drug like i don't think people realize when they think of steroid response they assume everyone gets jacked but ultimately like i'm sure you've taken even like viagra

versalice versus whatever some people respond way better to one than the other and they get a way better hard-on or some guys when they try to get rid of a headache with tylenol versus ibuprofen some guys it's like wow tylenol just doesn't cut it i need to use ibuprofen so the same shit can happen with steroids where it's like you might be a hypo responder and not do that well, or a hyper responder respond really well. And with terkesterone, even though it's a natural thing, you might get absolutely nothing out of it.

Some people, they spend a lot of money and they end up not really getting anything, but then some individuals, they take it and they end up gaining 20 to 30 pounds on their bench. Like it can be pretty significant. So it's ultimately a bit individual at the end of the day, but I've never seen any impact on blood work like at all across the board to me about like those uh oh kyle i was just gonna say about l-carnitine like like like

that's one of those things that like if you google like the the positives of l-carnitine injectable l-carnitine it's a goddamn laundry list of things that that there are claimants to say that you know it does this it does that it does the other i i found that like um like if i was going to have sex that night i'd i'd get a syringe of l-carnitine in my ass an hour before you know like like i would always add that to the the the uh the load stack as it were yeah what impact are you going for loads actually too it helps with everything i felt like uh i had like as if the tadalafil isn't enough but like you would get i would be harder um it would be um like like quicker like refresh rate and uh and i felt like it was just a performance enhancer all the way around the

l-carnitine i problem with the carnitine is the dose like you said earlier for orally it has to be so high to get enough to actually yield the effect you want. So when I was making the load stack with you guys, I was like, you know, carnitine would be a good addition, but it would take it from a nine capsule dose to a fucking 16 capsule dose, which is like, who's going to, it's already enough to ask to take nine capsules a day. You know what I mean? take nine capsules a day you know what i mean so yeah that was one of those things if you want to add it on top like we sell carnitine orally which you have to use like six caps a day to get the effect you want out of it or you can inject it like kyle did every single day from like the mitrt clinic but like there are there is no way to fit it in the load stack but it does help pretty significantly yeah i i highly recommend the L-carnitine.

I love it so fucking much. You were saying that people don't want to pin it every day, and I'm just like, why not? Why not? Come on. Come on. Why don't you take a minute? Take a minute out of your day, a little pinch in your butt. Come on. I think you prepare your syringe every time you take it, or do you do a week's worth at once?

I prepare it every time. I'm really do you do like a week's worth at once i prepare it every time um i i'm really careful about so the biggest fear to me because of the everyday injections to a day would be an infection right like like getting some sort of an infection uh in like in my glute or uh in my uh in my shoulder man if they have to take like a walnut sized chunk out of me like not going to be looking so good in the progress pictures after that right i'm going to have like a taylor like lump in my ass or something like a divot yeah that they've had to carve out of the necrotic flesh you know when i get when i get some sort of an awful like because like you're not talking about like just a staph infection on the surface like you just shoved a needle deep into your ass

that was dirty and you've got some deep seeded infection in there. That's a fucking problem. How many times can you reuse a needle before you throw it away? Did you have to put it in the middle or was that personal preference? Microwave for 30 seconds. It's clean. This is actually

the only syringe I own. This is it. This is actually the only syringe I own. This is it. This is old faithful here. Old faithful. One for a year. This thing has pumped so many grams. 300 injections. I've used seven different products

through this same guy. After a while, she gets a little bit. You can get around that. You just go in from the side. I pulled him out of my ass like that before, by the way. Are you a little scared? Like, oh, man, if that would have tipped a little bit more, it would have come off in my ass. Like, I'm going to push it on the desk right now.

It's pretty hard to get it to come out of the thing. Oh, really? Like, I'm going to use my hand. Oh, okay. that's not as as but still imagine pulling that like hooked out of you and like the scar tissue that makes yeah i've i've had i've pulled them out bent as fuck before because like you know you're injecting back there and yeah uh like like maybe you're not paying attention i have to keep my eye on what i'm doing it's like riding a motorcycle or something like that i take my eyes off it my hand starts doing other stuff and next thing i look and i've done this number but uh it's crazy

you don't even feel it when you're bending it you're literally bending a needle in your ass and you don't even notice until you pull it out you're like huh that doesn't look good doesn't look good at all yeah um i highly recommend the l-carnitine and it's like look i i'm certainly not a fucking doctor and i'm that's something naturals can by the way, Taylor, is the L-carnitine. It can make a difference. You definitely grow leaner when you use it, and it's easier time to. I Googled L-carnitine, and I even tried it for a while. And Google will be like, it does all these wonderful things, but none of it's proven.

The science is in the. What are your thoughts around that um so one of the main reasons why we use it is it up regulates androgen receptor content in the muscle so basically it doesn't matter how much testosterone you have if the actual thing it binds to the androgen receptor if there's less of it or it doesn't express and cause the effects you want you could have infinite amounts of testosterone in your bloodstream. But if it doesn't bind to the androgen receptor and do what it's supposed to do, and cause like the gene expression that causes, you know, muscle protein synthesis and whatnot, you're not getting anything out of it. And L-carnitine is clinically proven to upregulate

androgen receptor content in the muscle, as well as it improves fertility, as well as it improves fatty acid mobilization, like there's a lot of things it does and maybe it's fairly not that potent where it's like it's just another little thing though so it's like a natural thing that's if anything is going to improve a lot of your natural functions like it doesn't have to inject you're saying right like the no like nines aren't as useful we have so we have the oral preparation through Gorilla Mind because it's legal to sell over-the-counter as an oral. So if you use it orally, you have to use like six capsules a day, which is not ideal.

You know, you can do it. Why not? Like some people don't want to inject every day. So like for me even, if I don't feel like pinning that day, because to be honest, I'm way less strict than Kyle is. I don't want to pin it. So I will typically take, you know, five to six a day day if i can deal with the pin then i'll pin but it's like you don't have to pin but if you pin you only need 500 milligrams versus 3 000 to 4 000 if you're using oral so it's just like the

disparity in how much you need depends on how you administer it but both things ultimately equate to the same outcome and there's no negative to the oral versus the injection just that's the thing that he was mentioning with the cancer and the in the rodents okay so there's this thing there's a thing called tmao which is like it's linked to cancer and like rodents no one really knows for sure what this does in humans or if it's bad for you or what but l-carnitine orally ingested and this is where a lot of the argument with like oh red meat is cancer causing comes from this like the l-carnitine content turning into like tmao which then might be cancerous compared to like a fucking i don't know some

vegan like burger alternative or something so that kind of thing no one can say for certain it's going to do anything wrong to you it's's just if you're more risk averse, you would actually be healthier by injecting it, as paradoxical as that sounds. Yeah, that's one of the reasons why, like, Derek and I have discussed exactly what he laid out there before in the past, over the past years. He's like, you know, what I do is, you know, I pin it sometimes and I take the pills sometimes. But he mentioned the cancer thing, and I had just had the cancer thing already. And it was just like, shit don't hurt that bad.'s go like just send me that how many bottles do i need you know to be able to shoot this stuff every single fucking day and uh you know i i i fill that syringe until it's 110 units or something like that like i always fill that syringe all the way

to the fucking tippy tippy top and i use as much as i can um i've done two shots a day sometimes if i'm gonna do if i would do my fast cardio in the morning and then i was gonna lift that night and go yeah two shots a day wow that's fucking wild i didn't even know that there's plenty of times when i did two shots a day like if i was like like there toward the end when we were trying to when i'm 183 pounds and i'm trying to get to 182 and it's like, God, I'm, I'm barely eating. I'm running an hour a day. I'm like, just like walking 45 minutes or an hour a day.

Like I'm taking a hot, I'm taking extra baths. I'm doing everything I can to like burn calories. I'm sitting here in my chair, like during the show, like, like squeezing my glutes. Like, I'm just trying to burn an extra goddamn calorie over here.

I'm on so much fucking caffeine. I'm doing my Kegels over here. Kyle, you're doing your hummingbirds. My hublips that are imperceptible to the human eye. And it's just like, let's just shoot another. It's not that expensive.

I told people, I was like, it's pretty expensive expensive it's more expensive than testosterone but like everything's relative right like it depends who you're talking to if you're talking to a guy that makes thirty thousand dollars a year it's expensive bro like this might not be something that you want to like i don't you know skip out on rent for or something like that if you make a hundred thousand dollars a year you got this you're not even gonna miss this this is this is like like this is like coffee this is as cheap as coffee you know or starbucks coffee anyway i don't i i never look at the cost of of my drugs like like roughly speaking i think i do but off the top of my head i think testosterone costs like

what like 40 50 60 a month somewhere in there and now carnitine might be 90 a month like just off the top of my head like like like i'm thinking about what it would take to sort of do what you did and that's it's like you pin it every single day like kyle did like most people aren't going to adhere to his schedule yeah that's like the full cost of doing it like full board every single day on point never missing a shot but over 11 months it's probably like 1500 and 1000 hours do that and you'll look like kyle yeah maybe if you have good genetics also i i um i think i responded fairly well to the drugs um i i don't think i was an under responder or anything like that um but but yeah it's it's a real fucking commitment to do what I did in the timeframe that I did it. I'll say that like,

like there was just lots of times when I wanted to like part of being, being on probation helps some, um, someone asked me yesterday if I, if I felt like I could have done this while working a nine to five job, I don't think so. Like, like not to the level that I did it. Uh, because like I w it would be hard to get the workouts in. It'd hard to get the cardio in it'd be hard to get the meals in um you know it would have caused a lot of complications and like especially like how do you work out at three in the morning and work a nine to five right like that would have been so weird and difficult like it would have been hard to maintain that for for 11 months what was your dating life like during this because it's like i remember back when i used to prep for bodybuilding shit and i'd be like my dates would be comprised

of like one just like diet coke with rum in it or something i would never be able to eat out with chicks like nothing really exciting at all because i was so limited yeah i had to find ways to like have like date meals that like fit my macros right one of them that's really good is hibachi because they do like white rice and uh and like filet mignon and it's and everything's pretty lean so and vegetables so i could if i was gonna eat out i would usually do like something like that or i'd get fajitas and just not eat the beans and the uh and the tortillas so i just eat like the chicken and the steak and the rice or something like that i found a bunch of ways to like eat out while like sticking to the diet thing uh and and they'd be looking at me and i'd be like sliding i'd be counting pieces of steak like sliding them to one or i'd be like looking at my steak and i'd like bring a food scale with you to each day

like i i was tempted to but mostly i was tempted to you would have been stirred like i pull out the fucking digital scale uh i i did what someone asked me do you weigh your food that's kind of crazy do you weigh it and i'm like yeah you fucking weigh it dude i wait you wait i weighed every like gram of food i ate for the last year like like i still weigh just about every gram of food i eat like i can kind of eyeball some things like i'm not weighing orange slices you know but like if i'm eating meat and rice like it's getting weighed to the gram i do that too i want to know exactly what i'm what i'm eating and like like if i look fluffy one day i want to know what caused it right like i want to know what happened um but but like mostly like i usually like have girls come to my house if i'm going to do some

sort of a date night or something like that and i'll just cook and i would cook them something good and then i'd have my awful meal yeah yeah like here's your baked potato and like i showed you that valentine's day meal uh that i cooked and it was like i had to cook a valentine's day meal for this girl while like sticking to my diet program and i found a way to like make this like chocolate souffle that had i thought i'd done such a good job i was like she's gonna love this shit i had found like these uh these like microwave brownies on amazon they're like all protein the beginning of any high quality souffle but it's more like a like a lava cake type thing and uh and to me they're so good it's like that lava cake from like morton's you get that's like

that 30 molten thing they're like you have to order at the beginning of the meal so it'll be ready in time to me they're delicious and i had found a way to use that like that walden's chocolate sauce and uh and that powdered peanut butter, like not PB fit because that's got too many calories in it. I found not PB two, still too many calories. I found some generic shit. That's like smell a container of peanut butter nearby. I found some generic powdered peanut butter.

That's like 20% fewer calories than the, like the name brand shit. So like I would use that stuff. And, uh, I ate so much of that. And, uh, but I would, I had made like this chocolate peanut butter sauce and i'm like here's dessert and she's just like one bite and i'm like can i eat yours because they're like 180 calories yeah girls that don't do

this shit they can't appreciate anything that's not like real sugar food so when you give them anything diet related they're like this is trash i'm like real sugar food so when you give them anything diet related they're like this is trash i'm like what are you talking about this is amazing i made uh and like for like mashed potatoes like i'm like doing the math in my head like like how much like how many carbs are in the mashed potatoes that i'm making and then i'm like separating that in half and i'm like oh my god that's a tiny serving like this isn't even enough so i'm like now i'm making cauliflower that's a tiny serving. Like this isn't even enough. So I'm like, now I'm making cauliflower, like mashed potatoes. So I'm adding cauliflower in and trying to hide it with like feta cheese. Cause there's like no calories in feta cheese and just like

Greek yogurt and stuff like that. So yeah, maintaining the diet model while like, like cooking for a girl or like a family members. Like you remember, like we talked about this. I skipped Thanksgiving and Christmas last year. You were like, what are you doing for Thanksgiving? I'm like, working out. I'm going to inject myself and then I'm going to work out again.

You're like, oh, that was one of the times I got praise from Derek and I was like, yeah, we're doing good. You're like, oh, that's great because most people they do a big Thanksgiving thing. Friends and family just drag you down, Kyle. Yeah, pretty much. They'll never understand what we need. You're like, Derek was like,

it would have taken you a week to recover from a big Thanksgiving dinner. He literally said it. And I was like, you're goddamn right. We're a week ahead. We just scooted a week ahead in the foot race here. So like, nothing for Thanksgiving. My Thanksgiving dinner was ground bison and fucking rice and i loved every minute of it because i got to eat a lot of it that night because that that would have been november

you know 25th or whatever so we're up at like 32 3300 calories by that point or maybe even a little bit more so i was eating a lot right there i was proud of you watching it go down like it was like watching someone go to college almost like day after day making progress making progress sort of working at it there's a don't quit aspect to it and then at the end there was this graduation ceremony where he was like he was sending pictures of his way in you know we were getting pictures of him literally like, you know, like this, this is the water loss I've had over the last three or four hours. And you could see it.

And it was just like, he's accomplished something that most people never do. Right. Everyone would like to see this version of themselves, but who has like almost nobody. And I was proud of you. It wasn't, it's something that's hard to do and you can't do it in the

short term. It's a long term stick to it kind of thing. It was cool. It's the hardest thing I've ever done. Uh, it's, it's the most ridiculous accomplishment I've ever made yet. Like I'm looking at, I pulled up pictures from that day, May 4th. Um, and, uh, like I woke up that morning, um, already water depleted cause I didn't drink any water the day before uh and the day before that i had drank like gallons and gallons of water like maybe three gallons something this is stupid shut up i'll give a fuck if my left nut falls off if we get a little extra grainy that day um so like i woke up like uh like may 3rd i'm like 182 pounds or something like that like lean as fuck and uh water deplete that day wake up and i woke up at 179.4 and i was like oh shit we've gone we're in the 170s now like like this is crazy and i wasn't even thirsty

i was i was like we can do this and uh and so did did a bunch of cardio um and uh got into like a hot ass bath for an hour sweated the fuck out of myself and i weighed myself right after that 178.6 after the cardio before you feel nause being that dehydrated. I got a little lightheaded by the end of the day, but like I, I spent an entire day water depleting and doing cardio in and out of the salt bath and cardio. So like just a little cardio and I sweated out eight tenths of a pound, like just in one cardio session,

then into the bath I went and I dropped down to another pound. Another pound got dropped off just in the bath. And we're getting these updates. And it's like, you've already won. You look amazing. Why are you still playing? Yeah. We can win more.

And it's at that point at like noon when I turned the heat in my house up to 81 degrees. And I put on, I had ordered a sweat vest off amazon months before because i knew i was going to do this it's like it's like uh vinyl and it's just like you it just makes you sweat like crazy so i put the sweat vest on i put like a hoodie on like a real nice thermal hoodie and i'm on the i'm on the treadmill just pumping away pumping away and after the next cardio session i'm down another pound I'm 176.4. And then back into the bath. And that's the point where I'm like, I've got that picture where I'm like this.

It's the one where you're like, oh, your delt looks like a textbook. And it looks like a medical textbook. So then more cardio, another bath, and I'm at 174.2. And then more cardio, and I'm down to 173 pounds. And that's where I stopped. I stopped at 173 pounds. And that's when I started like doing some other little things to like make myself look a little bit better. Like I had read this bodybuilders like hour by hour account of what he did

for show prep. And like, like on his final day. And it was little things like, like eating lots of carbs and eating, eating, eating a big dose of sugary shit. Like candy bar.

I did a Reese's. I did a Reese's candy bar. And it was the, it was, it had been a year since I'd had anything even approaching a Reese's candy bar. And it was just so good. It was so goddamn good.

It was so goddamn good. It was god and I ate I ate a sub sandwich because that's what he said he ate like he said he ate a sub sandwich like two hours before uh he like went in front of the camera so I got a Jimmy John's sub I ate a six inch sub and I was just like every bite was so fucking fatty and there was mayonnaise on it it was just so fucking good it's to improve your food like it it raises your standards for what's good you know when i'm on my strictest diet tuna fish from a can tastes pretty good to me but uh you have tostitos three days in a row and suddenly tuna fish from a can seems like tuna fish on a can yeah it's easy to ruin your palate with delicious foods yeah my my palate

likes really shitty stuff my palate likes really shitty stuff go to the grocery store that's why it's all there and it's interesting your body kind of craves the things that you're depriving it of because like when i was really cutting a lot of weight there that last few weeks few months uh last month or so what i really wanted was a big bowl of white rice with butter in it. That's my body saying, you need fat and carbs. You need fat and carbs, bro. What are you doing? You're eating lean

beef and barely anything else. It's just vegetables. You know who eats fat and carbs? Henry Cavill, that fat guy. What I find interesting is Kyle's perception slowly like shifting the goalpost on what is like impressive to him now because he's actually achieved what is comparable to what have a lot of these celebrities look like. So like when you see no one's ever fucking said Captain America or Henry Cavill weren't impressive. You got you always take my like worst comments and you're like, it's fun had to justify myself but anyway when kyle sees this stuff like i think he's sort

of on the same page i am when i see this stuff now from like the fitness perspective i see it too like yeah when you say he's like look he looks good by any normal measure but like captain america could have easily peeled down a bit more. He was not that lean. You know what I mean? I think Superman's a better example of not hot. Especially in The Witcher.

Just fucking fluffy and no visible hair. Yeah. No reason for Superman to be peeled. And he water depleted for that scene too. And he complained about it. That shows how little he really put into it. When he had depleted for that scene too. And he complained about it. That shows how little he really put into it when he had to water deplete and still looking

flubby when he's sitting. And he's getting paid millions of dollars. Zach, grab a Witcher picture. I did this shit as a joke. God damn it. This is for fun. I did this because I thought it was a funny fucking thing to do. He did this shit. He's getting paid millions of dollars and it's his resume. I did this because I thought it was a funny fucking thing to do.

He did this shit. He's getting paid millions of dollars, and it's his resume. I got no respect now for any mixed martial arts fighter who misses weight. You're a punk. You deserve to get cut. How are you going to possibly miss weight? I don't fucking get it. That's so unprofessional.

And yeah, look, he's an incredibly handsome man. I'll say that. But I definitely see what Derek's talking about here. He's just not very lean there at all. And so you could argue maybe he wanted to have a more commanding presence by being huskier, and maybe he wasn't trying to go for a lean look. But he's definitely capable of looking like he was there on the left. Yeah, I think he looks very good on the left. Exactly.

He looks awesome there too. Yeah, I mean, it's hard to tell with the fake bruises or the real bruises, whichever is going on there. I don't know if that's makeup or like – Yeah, like the Gerard Butler, like, fake ab shit. Like, how do we know what's even going on? Yeah, yeah. The Gerard Butler thing is a good example of just lots of CGI and fakery,

which I'm fine with. He's gotten actually lean when he was younger but never like this since yeah that's a really strong uh physique that he's got there like like he's he's he's real that i mean that's discipline you're saying right to get to where he is there he looks great there in the gym when he's got a pump it's almost like he didn't get a pump for the fucking bath scene i don't know why would you not get a pump for a bath or maybe he was just maybe just flat from like water depleting too much when he's already like too high of body fat so he just looks like deflated almost yeah yeah it's not a it's not a look and i and i know

this is kind of weird because like there's plenty of people out there who are like 40 pounds overweight and they're like god i wish i looked like henry cavill in a bathtub but it's what we're talking about here is like someone getting paid millions of dollars with a seemingly infinite resources, like, like, you know, teams of people. And I kind of had a similar situation, right? Where I've got all the, all the free time that I could have in the world. I've got, you know, professionals helping me, doctors, people like Derek coaching me. I'm in virtually the exact same situation as someone like Henry Cavill is and I think that I would have if I'm driving the

Henry Cavill body I think I look better in the bathtub but by the time it's bathtub time because I make it I'm a little more professional about that I don't know I just I think he could have looked better uh and he doesn't but he did look at a Superman. He looks sick as Superman. Yeah. I think he looked good as Superman, but not great. Like, yeah,

I think, I think he could have done better and all of his stuff. But yeah, that was like his peak in my opinion of like, yeah, I mean, Chris Hemsworth, like the,

the fucking pinnacle to me of like guys who have like, who weren't fitness guys who are movie stars who became fit like like obviously schwarzenegger like nobody brought a better physique to like film and like combined being a movie star with with physique than schwarzenegger i don't think ever but like hemsworth didn't used to look like that like he wouldn't look like that if you weren't in film uh he looks he looks gnarly him and andreani have made like the most ridiculous before and afters that consistently like maintain it they don't just fall apart after yeah and he gets bigger he's getting bigger and andreani loves the fucking

sauce he just loves the process for sure because he he doesn't lose like any progress he like peaks and then he keeps going he finds a higher peak afterwards yeah okay too welcome to mount everest yeah yeah that's what uh that's what um that's what hemsworth's done like like every film he's a bigger version of thor like it's if you go back to the first thor when uh when he's like walking around shirtless kind of in the desert a little of this right he leaves like the stock market where he goes up but not every day is better than the day before. That Indian guy, I can't say his name, just goes up in a straight line. Yeah, he looks absolutely ridiculous.

Honestly, darker skin tone helps a lot too, I think. But I'm not taking anything away from the way the man looks. He looks insane. But it does help. There's a reason those bodybuilders tan and then paint themselves. Did you do the Milano tan too? I think you did at one point yeah i tried the milana tan but i got like a like tiny freckles like from it like like like got like two tiny freckles and i like uh let's cut this out low threshold tolerance yeah freckles

derek you're talking to a guy that said that if he lost an eye he would kill himself what was like the lowest level of maiming like losing your left hand two fingers, he would kill himself. I would kill myself. What was the lowest level of maiming? Two fingers. Two fingers and he would kill himself. You can genuinely get robotic fingers now. They're not good, but they're there. Nobody wants their finger banged by RoboCop.

Get out of here. They won't have a choice. No, it's the melanotan, for anybody asking, it's a peptide that you inject subcutaneously that means like not into a muscle group but into your fat and uh you you pin it with the insulin syringe small doses and uh and then like 30 minutes later or something like that you hop in the tanning bed and it makes the tanning much more effective and uh drick put it this way he's like you can literally change your race with this shit so don't go overboard and i was just like huh yeah i don't

oh yeah yeah yeah uh zach find melanotan too uh before his nap before and afters um it will be shocked you can literally take an albino and turn him black like that's how insane this shit is yeah and i wanted to get tan obviously i wanted to get tanner um because i think you look better you know if you're a little little darker and but i wanted to like reduce my time in the tanning bed so it seemed like a good idea but i got like two or three like tiny like freckles and they're black like they're not even brown freckles and it's it's a concentration it's i i'm almost positive it's a concentration. I'm almost positive it's a concentration. I think I'm going to top search results on Google. That's fucking funny. And there's there.

There you are. Oh, I like the bane. Yeah, where's bane? That's my CPAP mask. I know it's Halloween. I literally thought it was one of those altitude masks that you were like training with. That's a big CPAP mask.

If it goes down a bit more, you can actually see that one of me on the bottom right. That one. That's like base level paleness and then melanotan. Can you tan naturally or did Accutane mess that up? My back apparently is also in the suggested images.

Wow, I'm just all over the fucking Google. Not many people are silly enough to inject themselves with something like this. It's just me and you and the rest of these freaks. Wow. That's an intense one, the Reddit guy. Wow. Jesus. His credit rate plummeted.

That guy looks awful. Yeah, he overdid it for sure no shit i mean he didn't wake up one day like that like abusing it to get to that show that redhead with the black top yeah that one some of them i don't know i like actually Milano tan or if it's just like a fucking spray tan and they're just selling something. Yeah. There's plenty of clinics that'll hook you up with Milano tan. I saw a bunch of them online where it's for tanning purposes.

When we were getting my whole stack together, it was like anything and everything that's like legal and like not like abusive or anything like i was i'm down for a melanotan it's like oh yeah so we can get tan but not put myself under like the cancer is causing like uv rays it's also suppressing appetite too which i don't know if i told you at the time you did you did yeah which you know i didn't that was actually a concern it was like well we don't want to like suppress my appetite but when you're cutting it might have been helpful but yeah it might have been but yeah i pinned it maybe like four or five times something like that

it seemed like you need to pin it and then like really quickly get into the sun right yeah you have like a certain window like you would pin it and then typically go like 15 minutes to an hour after. Like you get like this facial flush from it and you know that's when it's like gone systemic. And then you're like, okay, I'm good to go. Yeah. But I didn't love it. I didn't like those little tiny black freckles I got.

I noticed them right away. And I had read that that could happen if you don't tan. Yeah, like dense areas of your body start to get tan disproportionately so like your ball sack will turn like black and then the rest of you stays white oh a guy that you and i know i won't say his name but uh but but we were talking to him and uh he was like be careful that mel, though. I was trying to get tan for a wedding not too long ago. Turn my balls black. Is that permanent now? Is that just his look?

It will fade eventually, but it's like for a decent amount of time, you're dealing with disproportionate black balls, and it looks weird as fuck. Yeah, you don't want that. Do I know this person? No, no. It's somebody Derek and I know. Okay.

But, yeah, I pinned it maybe three, four, five times. It was effective at getting me tan as fuck. And I would literally pin it at the gym. I would just bring it in my gym bag, and I'm in the tanning room fucking. I'm like, man, if somebody walked in right now and saw me with a syringe and my belly fat, they'd really wonder what the fuck was up in here. No, I'm tanning! And they'd be like wonder what the fuck was up in here no i'm tanning and they look like such a liar yeah yeah it because i would i would just load a syringe up and take

it with me to the gym and i was like man this is gonna be hard to explain there's gonna have to be i hope nobody catches me with this fucking syringe loaded up with a melanotan too um but but yeah i uh i ended up like not not digging that i tossed that out after a while I hope nobody catches me with this fucking syringe loaded up with a Melanitan too. Um, but, but yeah, I, uh, I ended up like not, not digging that.

I tossed that out after a while. I don't remember it being too expensive, but fuck it. I, I was happy to try it out. Um, the other thing we're talking about earlier is people moaning at the gym.

Uh, I, I, I just remembered like there's a guy at my gym and, uh, when my workouts go super long, like into like 5. A.M. Uh, he shows up right about then he's in a wheelchair. And so he's got like baby legs. There's a guy at my gym and when my workouts go super long, like into like 5am,

uh, he shows up right about then he's in a wheelchair. And so he's got like baby legs, you know, like, like he could like, but he's so like muscular up top. He could totally like,

he grabs his legs at the knee at the pants and like manipulates them around. However he needs to, to get on machines and shit. And like, he's one of those guys who can like grab a machine and like hoist himself up and like into a machine and out of the chair and stuff. But he's a moaner. First of all,

his wife comes with him. Sounds like you should smack him around a little bit. I dumped him out of his chair the other day. I was like, keep it down. Keep it down. You lock his wheels so you can get the lap machine next. Yeah. Dude, how many pull downs are you going to do over there?

You've been taking the fucking rack forever. No, I don't. I mean, has this seen his push-pull, push-pull? He asked me to push-pull. He asked me. One time this fucker had gotten out of his chair, and he had gotten in the pec deck, and he had like tuckered himself out to the point where he had got cramps in his pecks and he couldn't get himself back into his chair. And he's like, hey, bro.

Hey, bro. I'm like a few feet away. I'm over there working out. He's like, yo, bro. I'm like, yeah, what's up? What's up, man? Can you hoist me back into my chair? And I was just like, he's so sweaty yeah it sounds intimate

like i'm gonna have to like get down and hug him right yeah you're gonna buttfuck him into a wheelchair i'm gonna have to like like like his head is going here and my head's going on his shoulder i'm gonna have to like hug him under his armpits and like get him up like this from the front or behind i would have done it from the from the front but where i'm headed is i was just like nah man i'm good no thanks i i did it i did it that way i was like no thank you right like you said no yeah yeah i felt like that was the for to me somehow that seemed more polite just be like no thanks i'm good like to pretend like i misunderstood the whole question and just go back you got this you got it that's a good line went back to my fucking workout i did not want to get all sweaty with this dude but when

he's working out like he'll be doing like um he'll wheel up to the tower and he'll be doing like curls with um with uh with like the um yeah the cables it'd be like cable curls and he's groaning like loud as fuck like you can hear him across the head of a groaner right are they attention seeking or are they not paying attention like what's happening it's mostly attention he also sings he also wears headphones but he sings out loud to his music and he does dance moves. What an asshole. That's so rude. He wheels into the squat. Not as rude as sabotaging his wheelchair or a revenge plan. He's in the squat rack

and I'm like, why are you in the squat rack? And then he's doing overhead press over there. Over chair press or something like that. And he's just over there with 70 pounds or something. They're doing overhead press over there, over chair press or something like that. And he's just over there with like, you know, like 70 pounds or something like they're doing, doing overhead press, like taking the whole squat rack up. And then like between sets, he's just, he's like singing out loud, like doing like finger guns and stuff. Like it's obnoxious. I'm like, we got to get in here earlier. This is a discipline problem.

Kyle, you brought this on yourself. That guy knows he can't be called out because he's handicapped. His wife looks like... Remember Dog the Bounty Hunter's wife, Beth? The big blonde, giant tits. That's his wife. Does she work out also?

Or is she just there to move them? She dresses like she does. Okay, but she's never moaning in exertion. No, she kind of walks around and gets sweaty somehow. I've never seen her actually do anything, though. Is he always using the wheelchair, or does he, like... Oh, they don't work at all.

Well, but does he use it through the whole routine? Like, is he ever without his wheelchair? Because he gets off of it. He hoists himself into, like, machines sometimes, and then he hoists himself back into the chair but his legs are completely paralyzed i was hoping there was some process where he was away from the chair for a while we could see oh and then i sent you that picture the other day uh another like funny gem story this guy is like 65 70 years old he's wearing jeans he's got like a jack he's got his uh the wallet with the chain on it that goes to the front.

He's got cowboy boots on, and he's got a Game of Thrones shirt on. And he's wearing the biggest heart monitor you've ever seen. It looks like an iPad on his fucking wrist. And I'm usually not a douchebag like this, but I took a quick video of him because he stood out so much. And I sent it to the boys, and I was like, look at this guy. Ten seconds later, he strikes up a conversation with me and is asking me what kind of protein powder I take. And he's telling me, he's like, yeah, I used to be a power lifter. I had a little defibrillation kind of thing back in the day.

My heart, this and that. I had to have some stints put in. And I just can't. I was out of the gym for a while. But I was always a power lifter. And this is a little bitty dude. have some stints put in and i just can't you know i was out of the gym for a while and i just but i was always a power lifter and this is a little bitty dude like like like but he goes over to the smith machine for people don't know it's like it's uh the ultimate tool for power lifters it's like a barbell but it's on rails so it's a little safer it's this silly thing like it fucks up your

range of motion like that's up your back because it's not like a natural movement for people. It's this straight up and down thing where you've got a barbell and locked into a track and you can twist it and you can lock it in so it's safe and everything. More like the one on the left, I guess. I don't know. I don't see any of them that are exactly like

what we have. Maybe the chick with the red beard. The Matrix Magnum Smith machine there, two to the left of where your cursor is. That. Yeah, exactly like that. It's got some locks on it. I want to say the barbell itself weighs 15 pounds,

something like that. It's much lighter than an Olympic. I didn't know that. It's like 15 pounds, but he's got four plates on each side. He's strong. He's going 40 or five in a, no, it's not fit.

It's not a 45 pound bar. Yeah. He's got, I don't know, three 60 or something like that on there. I, I'm not going to do the math. He's got four plates on each side. And,

and whenever I see somebody lifting heavy or like appearing to about to lift heavy, I'm like, all right, we'll see what we got here. I can't lift that shit let's see he's and he's trying to overhead press like 350 and he's he he like gets it unlocked and he's going and he does this

lock and then he like stands back looks at it with his hands on his hips like yeah yeah we did a thing we did a thing and he does three sets of that and then he moves on to something else and i'm thinking like the joker who's putting those plates back who's putting those plates back handicap guy you don't do unracks as part of your routine kyle i always rack my weight i always know my weight wait am i saying it wrong what is it called when you just take it off the j hooks and then put it back on that's unracking it right oh yeah i don't know like half deadlifts or whatever not even i was just making a dumb joke where you take like let's say you're about to squat right you know you like take it off the j hooks and yeah it sounded like

that was what he was doing just and then there's another guy who's like honestly like a real big dude he looks like he could lift a lot like like a really strong black guy that comes in about the same time i do i do and he only he does uh like one eighth reps on everything like every exercise but i can't argue with his results because he's huge i don't know like like like what are you seeing him do one incline barely like he's doing incline bench and he's got about five inches of motion like he's just boom boom boom boom but with like three plates like like he's he's over there like lifting pretty fucking heavy but it's always like like tiny range of motion and he does it on every single lift every machine well it's working for him based on what you're saying like i i mean it it always seems weird to me

because it doesn't make any goddamn sense but i wouldn't say anything to him because he beat the shit out of me maybe and then there's and then there's the other guy who just smells so strongly of weed every night that it's like somebody's baking an apple pie in my kitchen tempting me or something like that like dude has a periphery of weed stank around him that's like 15 feet in every direction he's is he rude like the other now he's chill as fuck he's blazed out every night he's not working very hard one by twos i mean he hits his he he hits his reps and he gets the fuck out and goes and smokes more weed i assume you know what i want that i can't get a uh a curl bar that's rackable so i could do it in the squat rack. That would be

so cool to me to not have to pick it up off the ground. I'm ready to buy it, but no one has anything in stock because COVID, I guess. I have one of those cheapo little preacher curl things as like a... You have so much space. I have so much space down there. I went

overboard with my basement jam. Do you have any pictures of your jam that you could show off like now? I'll have to get some. I don't have any since I moved all the furniture and everything out. But yeah, there were like times where it was like, I'm feeling a little down. I'm going to buy something I don't need. It's like, do you need an overhead press machine like a Delt raise? No, no, I have a power rack and I have shit like I, but I bought it anyway.

What do you show Derek derrick your uh your gym maybe like you have like a video that you that he could like buffer through real quick or something a while ago i think i have to hunt for it yeah i am yeah i don't know i i could make i should get some pictures there's not much to see it's just a nice rack of dumbbells a functional trainer and, and a squat rack, really. How's your stuff going? Good. So I'm actually doing well right now. The month of June, I went on this motorcycle ride and barely worked out at all. I worked out like three times in hotel gyms.

And a month before that, I broke my finger. So that was like two weeks of nothing and then two weeks of modified best you could. It sort of knocked me off my routine for a bit. Probably just this week, I feel like I'm working out as hard as I was before. Kind of back at it.

Broken finger. One of the last shows I saw. One of the last pictures I saw. I forget what it was. I'm pretty happy right now. I think I gained like six pounds on my motorcycle trip or four to six, something like that's the range. And, dude, I would have been so happy to look like this a year ago. But now I'm like, what did you do to yourself?

Get your shit together. what did you do to yourself get your shit together and uh but it's just feel better about myself when i'm going in the right direction and working out hard than when i'm going in the wrong direction yeah by the way load stack here in a couple weeks finally for real yeah the month of august it's been uh such a delayed project from my end like it's literally my fault. And that's just because I put out so much content and I'm like so spread thin that stuff always just falls on the back burner, but it's finally done.

And then now that it's done, I can just like reorder every single time and I don't have to like, you know, deal with any kind of weird, oh, is this, you know, format of trademarked ingredient in stock or this or that? Like we can just like do giant orders every time it's out of stock and make sure we're consistently in i might order

another batch right now because i anticipate like our demand since we talked about it the first time is so much higher now like i think we might sell out like first week we'll see i hope you're right that'd be cool why is it hard to keep things in stock like grill line has the best shit and half the time i wanted i can buy it demand exceeding manufacturing time the demand has been like like this and manufacturing time stayed the same so it's like it's literally a matter of we can only fit so much shit onto our manufacturing lines to pump out at a time. And some of the stuff, for example, like tricasterone, I make it. It's not like I can use regular equipment. We actually use a specific thing to encapsulate the ingredient.

It's called a hydroxypropyl beta-cyclodextrin complex, which is a very advanced preparation thing. We'd send it across the planet, get it complexed, and then send it back. It's a very advanced preparation thing that we like send it across the planet get it complex and then send it back it's like a very intensive process so some of the some of the stuff is like it's not a matter of just like putting it in a fucking bottle and like throwing it out there it's like it requires many steps of preparation and the demand is just like fucking insane so you outsource the actual manufacturing i assume yeah right yeah but and you're having a hard time getting the manufacturing capacity that you wish you could um yeah like we've kind of outgrown our manufacturers ability to match our demand essentially and we have multiple manufacturers

but it's like some of them can only work with certain products some of them can only do certain things in certain capacities with certain formats of products so a lot of it is like being bottlenecked by manufacturing but we're working like we're constantly working on getting that to a point where we're never going to run out and even if it involves like we're buying actual equipment at this point ourselves and like coordinating with manufacturers to get certain things domestic that we used to have to send it across the planet to get done. So like it's, it's getting there, it's getting there. And we're going to get to a point where everything's just kind of like on it on repeat. So on the spectrum of business owners, right? You've got me, who's kind of a pussy about expansion. I'm always worried about my overhead. You know, I hate to

get it to the point where it's like, dude, the first $10,000 in sales every day just goes towards expenses and then profit starts after that. I like a leaner ship. And then on the other end of the spectrum is, do you remember the Orange County Choppers guys? You probably have seen the Tuttle's argue with each other. They were buying a bigger building, it seemed, every week. It was as if they thought that gravy train would never stop expanding, expanding, just doing great. Where are you on that spectrum? Are you like, ah, do we want to add more manufacturing capacity?

Is that an investment we want to make, or are we nervous, or are you just like fucking stepping the gas? No, we're balls deep. We just bought a few acres of land, and we're going to be building a 50 to 100,000 square foot building on it for escalating our ability to even... 100,000 square foot building on a couple acres of land.

What country is this in? Maybe it's 50,000 square foot building. I don't remember, but it's in Boise, Idaho. Yeah, I've got a 10,000 square foot building and it's big. We're constantly outgrowing our warehouse.

So we're getting to a point where it's so expensive to rent warehouses that we might as well just make our own. So we're just buying land now and building buildings on top of it. This is a warehouse. That's the purpose of this space or is it manufacturing? And yeah, we're constantly- So this is a warehouse. That's the purpose of this space or is it manufacturing? No, this will be warehouse as well as just like employees filling orders

and doing customer service and stuff. But above and beyond that, we want the space in case we expand into manufacturing more to have that space available. So that's where the several acres of land comes into play where we can kind of like build out as needed rather than consistently jumping like building to new building to new building like somewhere else kind of thing because that's what we've been doing to date if you were to invest in your personal manufacturing

as opposed to outsourcing it what products would you manufacture um but probably we'd focus on our flagship stuff so that would be you know the gorilla mode pre-workouts would be the number one like capping stuff is a lot easier so i don't know maybe we would do the nootropics and just because it's easier to capsulate stuff than to mix like vats full of powder i don't know it kind of depends because to be honest it's not like i oversee it directly so i couldn't tell you oh, this is easier to streamline than this. So not really sure, to be honest, but it's definitely like potentially in the pipeline to just get everything localized into like one on site area rather than having it occurring in like multiple different areas and have more ability to keep up with the demand. What's the hardest part of this like enterprise

is it isn't the marketing the accounting behind it the hiring the right people like hiring the right people who are like proactive and do shit without you holding their hand like guys like sometimes there'll be stuff to get done and you'll something will fuck up and you'd be like whose job was this and it's like if you didn't tell and it sounds like a very basic thing like something i don't know like if we're like recently oh maybe i shouldn't get into too many specifics but you run out of lids and you're like who's my lid guy yeah like for example something very basic to complete a product or to you know tell customers about something something that you would think somebody is taking care of

and then you realize it's not done and it's totally fucks up and costs us hundreds of thousands of dollars because of one little thing that just like causes a landslide of problems. And then it turns out it's like an employee who just like didn't go out of his way to do it because you didn't notify him as an owner,

like, hey, this is wrong, you go fix it. Like we need people who are actually intelligent and go-getters to be like even alert me that something's wrong because i don't have the time to fucking you know see everything going on like that's the job of whoever is like a manager of this you know an employee doing this if there's some major issue like let me know and then i'll give you a green light if you need my approval or just go forward with it if it's something basic that needs to be fulfilled like not having labels in stock for a product and then it's like we can't proceed with manufacturing if there's no labels there and it's like well who's you know supposed to order the labels why haven't they been ordered and it's like we're ready to manufacture something but there's no labels there so we can't do it like

that kind of shit i'm like we need the guy to be on top of it in terms of not having to hold his hand and we're getting better at getting the right people in place but it's been a slow process of finding actual like a i don't know like a team players essentially yeah yeah i guess you spend most of your time creating demand and maybe the chemistry like like you determine what goes into it but that seems like a one-time task i formulate everything and i was like coordinating all the manufacturing for a while and then i've slowly started like outsource even like ordering the stuff but i still see i still oversee almost all the formulations some of them will have you know like random stuff that people want to make. Like we're coming out with a mushroom formula that's like lion's mane

and some other kind of like exotic herbs and whatnot, because it's really popular right now. People like lion's mane for like nerve growth factor increase and stuff like this, that kind of stuff. If it's not like a hyper specific, like a product that I'm really passionate about, I will let somebody else formulate it and I'll kind of just look at it and give a green light. If I think it's, you know, hits kind of the checks the boxes of what's effective. I'll be like, okay, like, I can put my name behind that. But a lot of it is still me manually doing it. And that's partially with bottlenecks as to sometimes and is a problem of my own time management. For example, load stack, I had to make sure some of the ingredients were like trademarked formats of

it and high quality ingredients i wanted to have like a really effective nitric oxide precursor in there because the original load stack when you looked it up on the forums way back in the day they use arginine in the load stack which is like a very ineffective way of causing vasodilation it's like the least effective way to actually get your blood arginine levels up which sounds really weird it's sort of like the bioavailability thing we talked about earlier where you take carnitine but you only get so much carnitine out of it so like if you were trying to raise your arginine levels and get like vasodilation to your dick and get like very potent effects you need something you can fit in a capsule of very little space that is still going to be potent like a 10 gram of like l-citrulline or something you're very limited so like that's where my

expertise comes in to be like okay what can we fit in here can we still have it in a reasonable capsule amount will that fit in a bottle let's make sure we get this ingredient because i don't want like a shitty version of you know fill in the blank nutrients i want like a bioavailable version of you know this ingredient that kind of stuff is all like i'm doing the calling the shots on that and sometimes it bottlenecks us though because i'm doing like two videos a day on my channel which i need to keep my demand up which then also is how i recruit athletes to my program and whatnot because they want to work with you know the fastest growing brand in the you know industry right now and just work with me in general because i actually help these guys like personally a lot too with their own stuff um whether it's you know you know

different things in their lives so a lot of this is like contingent upon me making sure i maintain all this other stuff that's totally separate to me being just like the formulator slash owner so sometimes shit like falls off the wayside and that's where I'm just trying to outsource as much as I physically didn't focus here. I'm trying to work as much as I physically can. And it gets even like the process of hiring somebody. It's so time intensive that you can be like, fuck, like I don't even want to go figure out how to find that guy. And it's not just outsource, but delegate. It sounds like is.

Yeah. You know. Yeah. So where is your staff? Are they in Boise? It sounds like it's pretty global. We have, interestingly enough, there's only two of us are in Canada, which is where I live. But our warehouse that has like dozens of employees is in Boise, Idaho, where is where our warehouse is.

And that's where my business partner, he kind of like oversees stuff in person. So fortunately for me, i don't have to physically be present there to oversee the employees make sure there's nothing going wrong with like shipping and like fedex and very like you know day-to-day stuff so i'm more like big picture marketing formulation call you know make big decisions kind of thing but the day-to-day shit all happens in boise idaho as well as in some different states we have some individuals that work remotely and whatnot but for the supplement company it's basically all boise idaho for the merrick health that's like all over the place because it's

telemedicine so that's like a totally different business model entirely you get a lot of plates spinning you do exactly but it it's work but it it sounds like you wake up every morning and you're like dude i'm doing cool shit right now this is what i like the job i wish i had when we diagnosed drifter and we found his pituitary adenoma like that shit is so rewarding to me like being able to be the guy who like found that for him when he's gone years of not knowing what's wrong with them like that kind of stuff is like i'm doing the right thing not only can i make money doing it but like we're fucking helping people too like i've dealt with doctors before like like uh that didn't know their fucking ass from a hole in the ground um like like i've told this story before i had syphilis years ago and they couldn't figure out what the fuck i had

like like i had um i that the skin was peeling off my goddamn palms and they were like put they were putting me on prednisone which really fucked my whole world up like like all sorts of awful symptoms from prednisone uh side effects from prednisone and it wasn't even like an effective treatment i need a shot of penicillin in my ass that's that's prednisone prednisone is a is a steroid but it's not the kind that makes you strong it's like a corticosteroid yeah it's uh it's like it's not the kind that makes you strong. It's like a corticosteroid. Yeah, it's anti-inflammatory. Not the kind you want.

No. And remember in Sopranos when she was getting diarrhea because she was ratting Christopher out to the feds? Yeah. They were like, yeah, we're going to put you on prednisone. It has some side effects, though. It could cause something we like to call moon face and she's like she's about to go get married and it's like yeah they say i mean these like heavy doses of prednisone for a goddamn month fucking up my like mental state i was all depressed like fucking crying and shit meanwhile like we we didn't solve the fucking debacle

no doctor ever figured it out. I went on WebMD. Everybody's like, don't go on WebMD and come up with a bunch of crazy ideas. I went on WebMD, and I was like, this is syphilis. I got fucking syphilis. I'm six months from being Al Capone pretending to fish. I'm six months from being Al Capone pretending to fish. Yeah. I literally ordered a syphilis test off the internet,

fucking pricked my thumb, pissed in a cup, sent it back to them by mail order. They're like, yep, you got the syphilis. And I go to my doctor, my regular doctor, and I'm like, I've got syphilis. That lady you sent me to has had me on prednisone for like six fucking weeks. I'm all fucked up.

I want some penicillin in my ass right now and he's like yeah god sorry about that like immediately like here's my cybilis um meanwhile like i uh we get my blood work and uh and derek looks at it and my ta my t s my t s h levels are like real fucked up and he's like huh uh it's uh it's a thyroid uh thing right thyroid stimulating hormone so it's like what would tell you how much t4 to create so it's kind of like it's basically like tell your body has a feedback loop where it's like the tsh goes up if you need to produce more thyroid hormones so it's kind of like signaling to your body like make more make more thyroid but it's like a signal that if it's too high it means your thyroid is stressed out basically

because you're like not producing enough hormones your body's like increasing the signal like you need to make more like stimulating to make more hormone thyroid stimulating hormone so it's like i'm off the top of my head the reference range is like five to seven or something like that. And mine was like 19 or something like, like crazy stupid high. And I'm doing my web MD work again. And it's like, but to a Terry tumor.

And I'm like, Oh God, no. And Derek's like, let's try some selenium. I'm just like really a $12 bottle of pills. Cause I think I need a cat scan. But I, I, I took selenium i'm just like really a 12 bottle of pills because i think i need a cat scan but i i i took selenium for like a month or two three months or something like that and the next

time we did blood work it's like tsa tsa tsh is like right back within the like realm of like safe healthy levels i was so so happy so happy yeah so he was getting the iodine from his diet for the diet we created, as well as the selenium in, which ultimately is what took a lot of burden off. Like, that's an example of your micronutrient intake being critical, because a lot of people won't realize that shit, and they'll be, like, selenium deficient or whatever. And then before they know it, they're, like, have a hard time losing weight

because they're, like, borderline hypothyroid, and they don't know why. Like, basic shit like that can be overlooked. Yeah. What does selenium do like um part of it is it helps like convert t4 to the active thyroid hormone t3 and it helps with a lot of other functions in the body but mainly from a thyroid perspective it's like the active component of like conversion to the act the actual free form t3 that is going to be it's kind of dictating your metabolism to a certain extent so if you have low thyroid hormone output you have a really fucking hard time losing fat even if you're like dieting as aggressively as like the next guy and he's getting way better results than you know if you're hypothyroid you could just be having a very difficult time losing

weight because your metabolism is like literally slower than the average person. What foods do you get selenium in? I think some nuts have pretty dense quantities of selenium. Eggs are good. Those are the best ones off the top of my head. Amazon will sell you a bottle of this shit

for $12. That's easier than eating, right? Lodestack has a big dose of selenium in it. I was about to say, when I'm taking Loadstack, I cut the other selenium out of my supplementation because I've always got to keep in mind,

there's a lot of shit in Loadstack. I've got to be careful here. We're going to be taking way too much of something. But yeah, I was so glad that you figured that out because I literally thought I had a pituitary tumor. I remember telling Kitty, I was so glad that you figured that out. Because I literally thought I had a pituitary tumor. I remember telling Kitty, I was like, pretty sure I've got a tumor in my brain. She's like, what horrible luck.

Like fucking, God, I was super concerned about that. Like whenever I got that blood work back, that was worrying. But yeah, sorted that straight out. What are the, when you're analyzing people, not necessarily athletes, anyone, what are the most common vitamin deficiencies you see in people? Um, vitamin K is a big one, which is like something that regulates, um, calcium deposition. So you can end up with clogged arteries really easily if your vitamin K2

intake is not on point so that's something that's why kyle supplements with that k2 supplement because that's pretty pretty hard to get from food honestly getting enough k2 um what else uh potassium most people are severe like that's a mineral but most people are like they get enough sodium they salt the fuck out of their food but they don't have enough potassium to kind of like counterbalance it. And then they end up with high blood pressure or other like dysregulated fluid retention issues. And potassium is huge, which is like most people are getting barely anything, but you need like 4,700 milligrams a day as your RDA. Whereas so a lot of people are salting their shit, but not having any potassium.

That's a big one. As well as magnesium. That's big. I don't know. Like some of the B vitamins, like you get kind of. Yeah, it a big one as well as magnesium that's big um i don't know like some of the b vitamins like you get kind of yeah it's like magnesium as well yeah yeah magnesium is pretty hard to get through food honestly like especially if you're in a calorie deficit that's where the supplements can actually really help because it's pretty hard to keep your micronutrients like peaked when you're eating like 2500 calories for example yep so um off the top of my head other stuff like some of the b vitamins can be difficult for some people depending on if

they're getting enough red meat or other stuff one of the best things i can recommend some people can't stand it and this is why i'm probably going to come out with like a beef liver capsule supplement but just having an ounce of cooked beef liver every day i do that and i don't mind the taste but that is like nature's multivitamin you hit so many of your micronutrient needs just by having like one ounce of beef liver every day huh yeah not a fan yeah i'm not a fan i'll keep taking my pills yeah oh you just got it i was gonna say you have to fry it but now i'm defeating the purpose yeah yeah oh that's the other thing like people people ask me about like ice cream liver is not bad it tastes pretty good people ask me about like like how do you cook things and make

it like like stick to those like calorie numbers and like the the big things that'll like really fuck up your uh your calorie intake are condiments things like uh ketchup mayonnaise barbecue sauce and there's alternatives to all that stuff, except for mayonnaise. There's no good mayonnaise alternative. Maybe tzatziki sauce is like one of the better like condiments I've found that I could make myself because it's like Greek yogurt, dill, lemon juice, and I don't put the olive oil in it, which is what makes it fucking good. Yeah, that sounds gross.

Ketchup, Thai calories. Ketchup, good. That sounds gross. Guys barbecue sauce? Guys barbecue sauce? Guys barbecue. Let me get my barbecue sauce because it's the best shit ever. I found the best barbecue sauce ever. Kyle found the best ketchup too. It's the one I have it almost every day. I'm looking

at my order history now. I don't eat much ketchup. Well, I eat plain potatoes with nothing on them. And Kyle's like, it's not really high class. But yeah, I find it to be like an appetizer. Not anymore. I used to put salt on it. Now I just dip it in this ketchup.

Yeah, yeah. Hughes, he has some good sugar-free stuff. I'm waiting for Zach to share it, but yeah, yeah. So this is my ketchup solution and, um, it's real low calorie serving is like,

I don't know, 10 to 15 calories or something like it's pretty low. And, uh, Oh, you nailed it. Fucking nailed it. So five,

so like, you notice all my shit's like brand new in the bottle because i buy so goddamn much of it um g hugh's uh sugar-free ketchup it's five calories per tablespoon regular ketchup has so much sugar in it that that it's in uh in europe it's technically defined as soda like uh it's it's a it's like a sugary fucking beverage technically speaking And their barbecue sauce is sick. And it's the same calorie density. It's five calories per tablespoon. You can, like, drench

your food with this, almost, and get almost no extra calories. Two carbs per serving. A serving's two tablespoons. And Kyle knows... Oh, I thought there was a break. Kyle knows this, but there's a... There's low- fat or low sugar uh maple syrup i'm trying to say sorry that is also like you can dump maple syrup on shit guilt-free like he's gonna go grab that now he probably is

this stuff i just linked is unreal and rice this teriyaki sauce, absolutely ridiculous. For me, I have found that a baked potato is the... In terms of calorie to appetite satiation ratio, top of the food chain. I just want to have one.

Have you ever had takoyaki noodles before? I've never heard of that. If I saw a picture, I'd know. They're basically have one share with talky noodles before i've never heard of that yeah but a different shape yeah so they're basically like um they're essentially calorie free now the texture of it some people don't really like but when you're deep into a diet this can be a game changer there's like for an entire like the same equivalent amount that would be 250 calories of pasta you can eat this and it's five to ten calories and what is it called it's called uh shirataki noodles oh get out of here with the shirataki noodles those things are awful

he was just telling us that well if you're deep in a diet and you have like you're dying of hunger and you put like the sugar-free the seal sama teriy're dying of hunger and you put the sugar-free, the Silsama teriyaki sauce on it and you put some chicken in it, you can get just the chicken calories basically with some of the sauce and you can eat what seems to be a full pasta dish and fill yourself up. I'd rather go hungry. It looks so bad. It's so thin.

It looks like someone told me a rumor about food. Here's how you know that shit's bad. It's like the ghost of pasta past. When you buy the good brand, they advertise on the pack, no smell. They literally do. The good shirataka noodles or whatever are the ones

where they have triple rinsed them to get rid of the smell that naturally comes from those fucking noodles because they smell so gross. I had a similar experience with Stevia. Do you want to go first? There's lots of low-calorie syrups. This is

literally the best one. I've tried them all. That shit Greg Doucette uses is not nearly as good as this. It has no calories. This is five calories for two tablespoons and it tastes like maple syrup um it's a maple grove farms low calorie syrup in maple they have a butter version too but it doesn't taste like butter it tastes in canada we have so many few fewer options for like low calorie alternatives so when i go to a grocery store in the states

it's like it's wild to me how much selection you guys have. That explains our amazing physiques. When Greg mentions his choice of ingredients, a lot of the time it's based on what's available in Nova Scotia. You know what I mean? I can imagine he's never even seen what you just showed. I've never seen that either. It's sick. I've tried every other conceivable low low calorie syrup and most of them have double the calories per serving and that's by far my favorite um and i i would make a good bit of

that like french toast uh it was just like so filling um i could do i found bread that was like high in protein it had like a couple grams of protein per slice and only like 40 calories a slice so i could you know three slices of that is like no calories, like drenched in egg white. My wife bought some like protein bread stuff and she's like, look, it's 60 calories a slice or no, it's 90 calories a slice and 10 grams or 11 grams of protein per slice. And I was like, that's actually not bad for bread. And it is vile it is so like like you know like you want the texture of bread when you're biting into bread and it's like it is so weird yeah it is a the densest kitchen sponge you've ever felt it is it's horrible is it called um

like carb something on the does it say carb something on the thing? It might. I don't know the bread. I've gotten some bread. I've used this bread before. It's a half of a loaf for $10 fucking dollars though, and it's kind of what you described. But being that dense, I don't care if I'm soaking egg whites in it because I can just get more egg whites in there. That's fair.

I was trying to use it like a sandwich because it's bread. in there that's fair i was trying to use it like a sandwich because you know it's bread and it was i would also i would also like i remember um i i had somebody over and uh they were like have you seen the guy who drinks egg whites on the internet and i'm like i know the guy who drinks egg whites she's like why would he do that and i'm like i i literally like we're in the kitchen and i like grabbed a carton of them. I'm like, cause they're so good. Cause they don't taste bad. They taste fine. They don't taste good.

Like when you have egg whites, you really realize how much the yolk is carrying that team. All right. I got another one for you. I got another little half. Oh, you disagree. I like egg whites tastes just as good. But when, so I have an egg white omelet for my breakfast almost every day.

It's just egg whites with some salsa in it. That's my five days a week breakfast. And the egg white omelet for my breakfast almost every day. It's just egg whites with some salsa in it. That's my five days a week breakfast. And the egg white is good. But if you do have an egg, it's a little thicker and you're like, it's more satiating. But I don't find it's all about the payoff. It's all about what sacrifices you are willing to make and stick to the coffee. I was trying to say coffee before my stevia. And when I first did it,

I used the liquid stuff and it tasted chemically and it was bad. And Kyle made a mention of like, now with less stank in his noodles that my Stevia was like, now we taste better. It was like, I promise we don't taste horrible anymore. And you're a sweetener. Like sugar doesn't have to apologize for its taste. Sweetener shouldn't have to either. Yeah, that's how you know Stevia is probably the best sweetener for you because it cannot compete on a level playing field with the good sweeteners. The powdered Stevia, I think is pretty good. And then I'm down to... I went from full cream, which I liked, or maybe it was even vanilla vanilla good cream or something. Do some sort of

almond cream. Now my coffees have gone from a hundred calories to like 15 and you have a couple of coffees a day and that's a notable difference. So don't ever eat egg whites, eat egg white product. All right. What does that mean? It's, Oh man, my lighting. I can't tell with your lighting. So like, this is just, this is, this is liquid egg whites, but they do some sort of black magic to it so that it looks like regular eggs. Hmm. Do I not have a glass? Sure, die.

Whatever. Let me get a glass so I can pour it and show you what it fucking looks like. I'll give a fuck. It's good. Good for you. He doesn't give a fuck, Woody. There's no limits around here. I'll give a fuck. It's good. Good for you. He doesn't give a fuck, Woody. There's no limits around here. I'll drink egg whites. I'll drink three ounces of egg white

product. I'm wild. I'm kooky. I'm crazy. It's just hard. You're talking about you need to make all those sacrifices for the little things and they add up. It's hard to get over the initial hump of getting used to those substitutions over the real thing but once you are just like zevia like i'm used to this now when i first moved to this instead of like regular diet soda for the most

part i was like this is so sad it's just not good compared to the real thing so like this is actually a brand i haven't used before but um Really putting it out on the line there then. Yeah, that looks like eggs. Yeah, it looks like eggs. And it's the consistency of eggs. It's not like that. It's kind of thick. It looks like you beat the yolks up in there.

I have an easy time substituting great stuff with good stuff. And that's like the whole point. Is it as good? No. But I don't know. stuff with good stuff. And that's like the whole point, you know, is it as good? No, but, uh, I don't know. I just don't feel like I'm giving up very much for what I got in exchange. And I lost a lot of weight and I was happy about that. I'm still happy about that. Um, but, uh, where I struggle is when I'm not home. Like I'm tomorrow, I leave, I'm going away for the weekend for a paramotor fly in type thing. Cool. It is super difficult.

Even grilled chicken. Everyone says, I get grilled chicken. It comes on bread. If you take the bread out and try to have a chicken, lettuce, tomato, freaking dirty handful of caveman food, that's not satiating. You're hungry afterwards.

I can't have just a chicken breast and nothing else with it you get like the chicken breast at a lot of restaurants like i've done this in like health kicks like you order the chicken breasts like and you cut into it and you start eating you're like this is the best chicken breasts i've ever had in my life and then it's like oh i'm at a restaurant there's half a stick of butter on this chicken right now that's why it's so much better than the chicken i'm having at home because they don't care i was telling them like yeah the instead of egg whites i get egg beaters so it's like it's just egg whites it's the same macros as like egg white but it's um the consistency and the flavor is completely

different like it's not fucking gross wow egg beaters are going back for more huh i mean this is a different brand that i normally use. This is Publix brand. And this did not taste good a second ago. This is like seasoned in some way. They put salt and some sort of like onion powder in there. So it tasted like it tasted like onions or some shit. Like they fucked up my order. This is not what I ordered.

I did not. I did like normally I can drink this shit and then not mind it all. I will, I guess. But that's vile. I mean, the onion's probably a good addition once you cook it up. Make it a little tastier. Oh, yeah. Well, not if you're doing French toast, though, right? I don't want savory. You know what I mean?

I feel like we should use Kyle drinking that stuff in our load stack advertisement. We could. Enormous load! Look at this! Never waste a drop of your own protein I was actually wondering if Shopify was going to have some problem with our label

because we just have cum splatters all over it I thought we removed the cum splatters no no we kept a tasteful amount of them there was this hilarious moment where like it's the four of us and like maybe the guy who's designing the label for us all in one chat. And Taylor's like, yeah, yeah, I like that.

I like the cum splatters. And Derek's like, guys, could we pull back a little on the cum splatters for the credit card processing companies? I don't know if they're going to dig that. And Taylor's just like, could we leave a couple of cum splatters? Some dribbles, maybe. Because it's funny. I know it's funny. You need more cum splatters for a load stack.

You know what we should sell? You know what we should sell with the load stack? I wish we could, like, a black light. A black light? The first 50 purchases come with an ultraviolet. Yeah, the first i've had by the way i have a i don't know if it's even possible i don't want to put any extra shit on your plate but uh i've got so many people asking for to like pre-order it i don't know if that's in any way i'm afraid to like have

too many people exceed the demand and i know that sounds like you don't want people to pay and then not yeah i guess hypothetically we could limit it, but we've never done pre-orders for even like the stuff that sells out in one minute. So it'll be out in like a couple of weeks and then I'll make a video plugging it and I think it'll be a solid launch. Yeah. We'll,

we'll all promote it for sure. I think it'll be fun. I mean, look, I've said it before. I'll say it again. It works. Like it's shocking. Like women mean, look, I've said it before. I'll say it again. It works. Like it does shocking.

Like women are like the, the fuck is it always like this? And I'm like lately, don't look at my medicine cabinet. This is all me. I tell him, I'm like, I literally am like part of the manufacturing of a product and make come

loads bigger. And they're like, are you out of your fucking mind i gotta i'm glad there's this thing on tinder called moonlight or something like that it's like a security thing so that like somebody knows where you are and i feel like they're like i'm glad i signed up for moonlight this guy makes cum pills there's some of those there's some of those studies that companies like on it like alpha brain like some of those companies they'll they'll fund a study with the university like i don't think it's it would be out of the question to spend like i

wouldn't mind spending a decent amount of money to like fund a study where we could like prove like this is how much your load will increase like this is did you see all right so this is super gross but did you see how maybe the clip of the the of the measurements that I took? Yeah, you sent a lot of descriptive detail, yeah. No, maybe so I came into condoms and I compared over the period of time and I drew the semen out of the condoms with a three milliliter syringe. I was like, huh, tastes the same. I literally measured semen down to the milliliter

like like to actually to the cc like like and i want to say uh you could go back and like see what i said before because that's like what's accurate but i remember it being like nine mils or something like that like something absurd you know it's another reason that reinforces how potent this shit is is you were on trt which shuts down your sperm production while you were doing the experiment. You still had this massive increase even when you're shut down. Your literal balls that manufacture are shut down right now. I'm glad. This is a great question.

How effective of male birth control is my TRT dose? Not enough for me to give you a green light on that. Especially with your carnitine in there, dude. You might be fertile right now. Very. Oh, no. That's Kyle's worst nightmare. Alright,

so we're cutting the old carnitine right now. I can come with responsibility. Yeah. I think call it a responsibility. Yeah. But I think people will love it. We worked, before we got your obvious high level of expertise, it was literally just Kyle and I texting back and forth, and I was like, what else do you take for cum? I take zinc, sunflower, lecithin.

And he's like, sunflower, lecithin. And I'm like, yeah, I think the lecithin is a really heavy carrier in this formulation. Keep adding more and more things. It got better. I didn't quite do the syringe in the condom thing. I just kind of gave like a... That's a lot of cum.

At the maximum bottle size you can fit capsules into. This is how hectic this thing is. The bottle is this big. I keep telling people, and every time I repeat myself, they're like, wait, were you serious? I'm like this thing is it's gonna the bottle is this big fuck like like i i keep telling people and every time i repeat myself they're like wait were you were serious like yeah it's a bottle the size of a goddamn football and it's like it's nine capsules a day like look if we were trying to rip you off with some sort of bullshit product that didn't work it'd be one pill okay it'd come in a bottle that was this big all right it'd be like yeah take one of these a day you'll be

fine no we made something that fucking works and it is nine pills down from i think initially it was 16 pills yeah yeah yeah today it was the point where it was like would we better up be better off just taking scoops of powder and yeah we were gonna do like a pre-workout load stack basically you just have like a fucking shaker full of stuff yeah but uh but no it it absolutely fucking works um i mean i i take it every day it's it's me too well i'm i'm out now i ran out of my my sample packs well i'm out of i'm out of like the like branded uh version but i've got like all the prerequisite ingredients like in individual form so that's why i'm taking almost 30 pills a day because i'm taking so many i'm taking my normal

supplementation plus like my my homemade load stack it's it's it's ridiculous and it works yeah i had i had people come over and they were like like they're it was in my kitchen like next to my my protein and everything the creatine, and they're poking around like, what the hell is a gorilla load stack? And I'm like, it's to make you cum more, idiot. They're like, why? And it's like, because it's funny. It works.

And they thought nine pills was silly, but Kyle hit the nail on the head. That's how you know it's not made up. This will be good even for performance in the bedroom though too. The nitric oxide precursor I put in there shits on just plain L-arginine. You'll actually notice a difference in erectile quality too.

This on top of your Blue Chew or your Viagra Cialis too, it's a fucking significant difference. Does it have an impact on blood pressure to dialysis lower it yeah yeah not by a lot but like enough yeah that's the direction you want if it's yeah what is blood pressure was a little bit high and uh i recommended some of those um salt alternatives that you showed me months back oh the no salt no like like maybe that one and a couple others like like I experimented with several of them. I found one that was good for topping things and one that was better for cooking.

I made some changes. I got it back down to 120 and stopped measuring it. You're in the clear forever. That's how it works. I take my blood pressure once a month or so, and it's been good for a long time. Yeah. I remember when we first started the thing,

and Derek was like, yeah, salt your food to taste. I should have probably pressed him a little more, but I was just like, lots of salt. That's what I like. Okay, sounds good. And I'm just like salting the fuck out of everything because I like shit salty. I would have taken that as like as much salt as you want anytime.

That's basically what I did. And one of those like diet hacks, one of the ways that I would deal with like hunger was that Orville Redenbacher popcorn that's 100 calories a bag. And I found like this seasoning salt for it that tastes like buffalo wings so like so there was a couple times where it was like i can either have three quarters of a cup of rice which is like and it's gone or i can replace my carbs with like two whole bags of popcorn and i would just like eat my like piece of beef my peppers my spinach and then i'd have like this big ass bowl of popcorn i was like all right i can live like this oh and sugar-free jello that's where being intuitive kind of comes into play with the vertical that because it's mainly

geared towards guys trying to get like jacked and maximizing sports performance and muscle building so like some of the stuff you can alternate in like popcorn for rice, for example, if you're cutting, definitely highly encouraged because otherwise you might be like unnecessarily starving yourself. At least like you're eating the same amount of calories, but you feel way more hungry because the food is so dense in nutrients. Like although you have like with rice, you're not really trading off micronutrients if you swap it for popcorn. So like by all means, if you're in a calorie deficit, like that you know that's exactly what i was thinking too yeah and like um like those are the two things i used the most when i was just like actually fucking hungry like i would finish my meal and i'd be popcorn and jello popcorn and jello like i found this like sugar-free jello that comes like by the you know how you buy like the cheap eggs and they come in like 36

pack like big giant things i was buying jello like that and when it's zero calorie jello it's like where we age a time 10 at a time like like if i'm hungry i would just keep eating jello and something about like jello mixing with the popcorn in your stomach i feel like it forms it forms some sort of mass of like density that makes your body feel satiated for a while. Like popcorn. It might. I think it really did. It felt like it.

It was like jello and popcorn was mixing together in my stomach to form like, oh, it feels like I ate food. If you don't chew the popcorn, it's even better. Yeah. You just got to choke it down. You just swallow it like pills. Yeah. Like those last couple of weeks, like it was stuff like that that like kept me like alive,

I guess it was like eating stuff like popcorn and that no calorie Jell-O because I would finish those. If I remember right, it was five calories. I know you're calling it none, but it was almost none. Mine was like 20 or something. And you have, you want like four of them

as a snack and that adds up to something yeah so like the name brand shit is five calories um and i found this like i said it was the generic shit that's just on a piece of cardboard with cellophane wrapped over the top that my grocery store happens to have and uh it's like super cheap packaging but it was pre-made for you already um they're in like little cups they're like little jello cups and like each cup it says zero calories it might be five and they're rounding down i know they'll do that sometimes but shit like what's 40 calories like it's yeah yeah it's worth not counting every calorie don't get me wrong but like i remember somebody was like they were talking about measuring spinach. And I was like, dude, if you're measuring your spinach to the gram, like you've got bigger problems than I do.

What a psychopath. Like there's so few calories in spinach. I just get a handful at a time. And like I cook it until there's enough spinach in the pot. What happens if you eat too much spinach? Nothing. You become a pot fighter. You have a little more spinach in the pot. What happens if you eat too much spinach? Nothing. You become Popeye. You have a little more spinach in you.

Jackie prepares my meals and it's my wife. She weighs it all for me so I can enter it in chronometer, whatever. I don't even have the heart to tell her I don't choose the right... They're different mixed vegetables every day and she's weighing them to the gram

and I just choose the same fucking thing on chronometer every day because it's easier. And that's like close enough. Some things are so non-calorie dense that it's just like have at it. I eat those carrots

every day. I hate them. I hate those carrots. What do you like? I eat a handful of baby carrots every day. I hate them. I hate those carrots. What do you like? Carrots. Yeah. I ate like a handful of baby carrots a day as part of the fucking vertical diet for some goddamn reason. I read something about it's good for digestion and maybe I'm sure there's some sort of micronutrients

in carrots. You can eat too many carrots. They hurt my stomach if I overdo it. And grapes. I went through this kick where it was like, you know what? If I want to watch TV and have a snack, I'm gonna. I just want to live a happy life. And grapes, I don't know anyone who got fucking way overweight

and just said, I got to cut the grapes. So I start like pounding grapes and watching TV. And 30 minutes later, the pain. Oh my God, my stomach hurts so much. You can overdo grapes easily and quickly. And it's a big problem. I didn't know how to get relief from it. It just, it took hours. It was terrible. That's one thing about the vertical diet. I'll say it's great for digestion. Like your whole like pooping cycle is just like on point. Like you've never got stomach cramps or like diarrhea or anything like that. You just seem like

really good digestive health. Digestive health is off the chain for the last year. That bout of food poisoning I had last week aside. My digestive health is off the chain. It is. Hello, kids.

I feel like your body is like this big machine with 100 fucking dials. I'm like, all's like this big machine with like a hundred fucking dials. And I'm just like, all right, everything to a hundred for the last year. No one hasn't been in a hundred that you succeeded anyway. Your sleep schedule is not what people would call ideal. And it hasn't caused any trouble for you, it would seem. No, I get my eight to ten hours a day no matter what. I'll get the sleep in um but but doing this show like having to i have to be up at some point and sometimes like it doesn't quite match my workout schedule or uh or whatever and sometimes like i

would have so much caffeine that it'd be hard to like get to sleep on time but i would get the eight to ten hours every single night and i read uh somewhere like sometimes different times of day yeah you have to almost never normal times of day yeah i would sleep through the day almost continuously that's why i would get so mad if like somebody rang my doorbell in the middle of the day and like woke me up because uh derek's got a crazy sleep schedule too like usually when we're texting, it's 4 or 5 a.m. my time. Yeah. But yeah, I take a lot of sleep aids.

I take the Gorilla Dream. I take a bunch of that sublingual. Melatonin. Melatonin. And if I really have a hard time, I'll actually take like an over-the-counter like Tylenol PM or something like that. That sleep is super duper important. I think a lot of people undervalue like how important getting a full eight to ten hours of sleep are.

Because I read this article about some guy who broke some power lifting record. I don't remember what lift it was. But he was saying that he was sleeping 14 hours a day. Like leading up to like his prep for the contest. And that kind of stuck in my mind, like your body's kind of like growing and repairing itself, like during that time that you're asleep. If our only goal here is to get big and fucking strong, whenever we're not working out, we should probably be getting as much sleep as possible. And so I had no problem getting some extra sleep. When you're on the vertical diet, all the red meat, how do you keep your cholesterol under control?

It just regulates itself if you have everything balanced. Like it sounds it's like you're going to get your protein from somewhere. So it's like in general, you have a lean, like high quality cut of meat, like a bison. And then the rest of your diet is filled with like, you know, rice and like other micronutrient, not the rice is micronutrient dense.

That's like, not, it's just a way to get calories. And if you're trying to gain muscle, it's easily digested, blah, blah, blah.

But the other stuff, everything is designed to be like well tolerated. And it's not like you're having the fatty, like McDonald's, you know, fucking trans fat ridden not like you're having the fatty like mcdonald's you know fucking trans fat ridden stuff you're having like high quality grass-fed bison from like a butcher or something like that kind of thing isn't going to totally nuke your lipid profile so in general you shouldn't really have a problem maintaining like a high quality blood work if you're eating high quality food it's just a matter matter of guys who are getting the bottom

of the barrel shit that are going to end up with problems. If you're eating that 80% lean ground beef, you're going to fuck your cholesterol up. I spend a little extra. Yeah. Is sugar terrible for your cholesterol? I know you're in the middle

of a thought, but I thought sugar was a big part of why cholesterol was bad. No? That too, but it also depends on how well you tolerate sugar to begin with. For example, Kyle, he went for a walk after every single meal, which helps you keep your blood sugar under control and helps actually partition nutrients. For him, he's getting the maximum benefit of each food, and he's only eating as much as he needs to like feel recovery and in a deficit, not even hitting his like physiologic needs. He's literally losing weight. So it's pretty hard to fuck up your lipids when you're like depriving yourself of the food you need to like survive. So for like it's not that hard to maintain if you're doing like enough exercise consistently.

Like a lot of people don't realize to the little walks after meals are probably healthier than going for one big burst of exercise. Yeah. How about we say – and then cut you off. Oh, the beef that I eat is extremely lean. It's 97% lean and it's expensive. It's $10 a pound like I said earlier. Sometimes I would grind – if they didn't have it, like I use Instacart to get my groceries a lot. They'd be like, they don't have lean beef. And I'm like, get the leanest sirloin steak they have. And so

they would give me the leanest sirloin steak they have. And then I grind it into ground beef in my kitchen. I would just, I've got a KitchenAid meat grinder. So if I wanted ground, I would grind up two pounds of like sirloin and it's like super duper lean like when you look at it like you can't find fat it looks like a tuna steak or something and uh and i would just use that so like i never ate even 90 percent like ground beef everything was just super super super lean like there's no cholesterol on my diet it's so calorie dense i can't afford it right like if you're eating that if you're eating like like those 10 almonds i eat a day or the fattiest thing i eat probably the most calorie dense thing

i eat every day is 10 almonds that was um counting my calories and putting it like weighing it and putting it in chronometer i didn't realize how bad not bad but like i didn't realize what nuts were i thought they were a protein nuts are fat are fat. Nuts and seeds are fats. It'll fuck your diet if you have too many of those. They're so good, though. I'm a big fan. Mix in some sugar with your fats and you got a great meal.

That's the thing. Some of those almonds you can buy are literally coated in candy. It's like candy fat. Your brain loves it. Your brain is like, oh, you found the fucking tree of life. You found fat covered in candy. It's like candy fat. Your brain loves it. Your brain is like, oh, you found the fucking tree of life. You found fat covered in candy? Yeah, throw some M&Ms in there and some raisins,

and you got yourself a good snack. We'll be able to survive for weeks like this on the Serengeti. Meanwhile, your brain doesn't know that you live on a couch. And then you weigh it. Like if you weigh a bowl of trail mix, right it like if you weigh a bowl of trail mix right i used to have a bowl of trail mix as i as i plumped up and it's it's like 1800 calories or or 2000 like like half of your day's calories came from a snack that you could have done without it was just a break in discipline because it's for hiking like when they're like oh i don't have enough room yeah sleeping you mean you do you

i do it uh netflixing you know sometimes i like to have 1400 calories of pistachios and go directly to bed one thing i would do is i would usually save like 200 calories from my diet uh every day because i knew i would always wake up in the middle of night. And I know it's not good for sleep supposedly, but I had these like 200 calorie protein bars and it was like, seems like I can get an extra burst of protein synthesis if I have a protein bar like in the middle of it. Like I wake up at 3 a.m. or not at 3 a.m. I'd wake up at noon because that's my 3 a.m. And I would have like a carb killer, uh, like protein bar that was just nothing but like 200 calories of protein. And like, I don't know.

I would, I would eat those. I would eat one of those almost every night when I was, when I would wake up. Cause I'd wake up starving. I'd wake up. So I would wake up in my stomach. Would it all like growling at me?

Yeah. The cutting was, it was not a lot of fun. It was fun to watch, like watch the results because like every week it was just like a different me me. Yeah. The cutting was, it was not a lot of fun. It was fun to watch, like watch the results because like every week it was just like a different me in the mirror. It's nuts when you're like cutting that weight that fast. Well, I mean that itself, like unbelievably motivating. Yeah. That's, that's the thing that I told people was like the reason that it's, I felt like this,

that, that something that made this a lot easier was like, I was just getting results, like visual results, like every month, like there was a different me. And I went through my photos, like this is October, November, December, January, February, and every picture, it's like a different human being almost. And it's like, when you're getting results like that, it's super easy to stick to just about the most Spartan of like programs. And I don't know that that was super helpful. And I think it's just a testament of like pushing yourself that extra 10%. And you know, all the all the stuff we've talked about from the diet to the supplementation to the the TRT, the carnitine, the cardio, the lifting, every bit of it, like combined to like squeeze out that extra 10

percent of uh results and just being able to see visual results are such a big kick in the ass to like keep going though it's a huge deal because if you i'm sure plenty of people have like started a workout program gone hard as fuck for like a month looked in the mirror and saw the exact same person and been like fuck fuck this. Fuck this. I want a cheeseburger. Yeah. I've said this before, but I want to repeat it for anyone interested in starting. I used to go Monday, Wednesday, Friday.

Whole body, Monday, Wednesday, Friday. And in my head, the idea of doing like push, pull, and then legs, abs. It sounds like two days, but it's one rest. So it's a four-day cycle. Push, pull, legs, abs, rest. It was like, oh, that sounds so hardcore. Exercising like three days in a row before your rest. It seemed like it was a step up.

And then when I tried it, I got it. As far as like my, I'll say triceps are concerned. It's push, rest, rest, rest, rest. If I did that right, I think I did. And then your biceps are the same thing. Rest, rest, rest, rest. If I did that right, I think I did. And then your biceps are the same thing. Rest, pull, rest, rest. I think I'm doing this right. Anyway, the point is when I did Monday, Wednesday, Friday,

I'd hit it Monday and then I'd be at 100%. Wednesday, I roll into the gym at like 85%. And then Friday, I roll into the gym at like 75%. Monday comes around. I'm not at 100. I haven't gone from 75 to 100. I'm coming back at like 90. A few weeks into it, unless I skip workouts, then like even on Monday, I'm at 60%. And by the end of the week, I can't do shit. I'm sore all the time. I'm threatening injury all the time. It's just a steady degradation degradation whereas if i go

push pull legs abs rest there's the rest i need so that every push day i'm at 100 every pull day at least that muscles at 100 right you know my triceps might be sore on pull day but who gives a fuck you know they're they're pushing muscles it's fine yeah yeah that yeah i agree completely like um like like knowing what exercises to do what how much weight to put on there how many reps and sets to do um like i hadn't had a program like that since high school um and i remember like all through life trying to find another program like what we were on in high school because they they he had this chart that was like all right what's your max on like your max one rep thing all right we'll then do this many reps and this many sets and i don't remember what it was it's irrelevant but because because like

what you and i and like what derrick has uh me doing is like completely different it's three sets of 12 to 15 but like just having a chart to go by is so instrumental because like what i said a few hours ago like if you're just going in the gym, like, all right, I get, I see guys do it all the time. Like, like I see guys come into the gym and they just, they look lost. They're like, all right, all right. I've seen this machine before. This is the pull, this is the pull down thingy. Okay. How much weight should I do? Ah, probably 30 pounds. Right. All right. I'll pull 30 pounds for a while. All right. Now let's go over here and, uh, Oh, this is the pushy push okay i'm gonna i'm gonna push 35 pounds and i just i see them like bouncing around from machine to machine like doing this half-assed thing and they get done in like 40 minutes and i'm

like i don't think you did anything i don't think you got anything i can't i've never done that i've never i've never known anyone to do that to not have a routine and like a track their exercises every week and i was talking to a friend of mine he's like oh this is nice because you come into the gym and there's no like question of what you're doing that day and i'm just you had questions about what you were doing that day yeah you just showed up with hope that it would pan out like you didn't bring a notebook with like first you're gonna do seated rows then you're gonna do bent over and this is what you did last week with maybe notes on how you felt about it last week. I see it every night. I have a notebook as well.

I know you do. I have a notebook that I've kept since the very first day that I began doing this thing with like reps and sets. Like, you know, I have like a code that I use. Like, oh, you failed here. Repeat this this much weight, you know, or i'll put like a plus sign that means you know tack on depending on the thing sometimes i have to add 2.5 pounds sometimes i have to add five sometimes i have to i can i have micro plates that uh derrick uh show me like where to get them and i can throw these like tiny tiny micro plates on for things like curls but i keep really close

track of it and i know exactly what i'm doing every single night but yeah i see i see guys all the time that come in that are clearly like huh oh they got one of these well let's do some of that and it's just like they're they do those for like five years and make no change and then they don't realize every workout you put like even like because you're new to this you put you know, five pounds of lift sometimes per workout. But once you plateau adding those micro plates on like one pound every week or something after a year, what you've added like 20, 30 pounds again on like a lift potentially, whereas the other guy is still doing the exact same shit. So tracking is like super critical. Goes overlooked.

Yeah. It's huge. i love the micro plates um some of the stuff it's hard to like like with the some of the stuff only goes up in increments of five like i'm using a plate loaded machine or something like that some of the plate loaded machines i've maxed out at this point and i'm i'm i'm like balancing five pound weights and sticking them on top of there's this thing called a gym pin and this is a company that contacted me a while ago it's basically like a thing you can shove into plate loaded machines or like and you can then load micro plates onto it super intuitive thinking device and it's just like it's like an extra pin you put into your stack and then you can load

whatever you want on it so i definitely recommend getting one of those yeah i might no trainer i've got one for each stack okay i'm gonna get that because i'm so strong that it doesn't get it done for me it's not too many things i have maxed out like the uh the i use an ab crunch machine which you know it's one of those things where you're like you're rocking up and down and that thing maxes out at 250 pounds or something. It's like, I can do four sets of 15 at 250. I want more weight. I don't know. Need to get some of those.

Yeah. Gym pin will get it done. My gym pin, I think, holds three plates. I already feel a little silly. There's no world where I need three plates on top of the stack. Yeah, no. You're a colossus at that point. This exercise involves me sitting on the tricep pull-down bar, just floating around.

You ever see somebody put so much weight on the pull-down that it lifts them off when they get off? Yeah. I saw a girl fucking take off the other day. This is the lat pull-down? Yeah, she's doing lat pulldowns and she's got her knees locked into the thing and when she gets up, it literally picks her up

and carries her all the way to a standing position. Wait, she stood up holding it here? Did she do it with style? No, she's a little girl. By the time she's ready to get up, it's like lifting her into the air. One of my short friends who's

like one of those like tank bodybuilders who's just really short i used he would hang off the thing like a fucking monkey and i would have to grab his shoulders like drag him under the thing and like push him in to like lock him in he'd crank out like 15 reps and then he'd fly out of the fucking thing like a rocket launcher but does he do it cool with style or does he look like he's out of control uh i guess he got pretty good at controlling it but you you look like you're launching yourself like it just i like the idea of like gracefully standing up and getting that's hard to do when you're holding like fucking 200 plus pounds with a lat pull down yeah i guess i'll have to get there now i don't have a lat pull down machine.

I just have a cable thing and I sit in the squat rack with the bar across my lap and I stopped doing it. I just do pull-ups now. I like them more. Okay. Yeah. I, I do a lot of different,

uh, we've got so many cool attachments now in my gym. Like they got those, uh, those bars that you were talking about the other day, Taylor. Yeah. I ordered some of those. You can get all sorts of

funky grips. So I experiment with that a little bit on lat pulldown stuff. Yeah. If I add one more machine to the gym, I risk overcrowding it, but it might be the lat pulldown. It's very versatile. You can do a lot with it if it has that

seated attachment as well. You don't need the seated attachment because, I mean, you have the functional trainer. The seated attachment is the only thing I need. Oh, unless you're talking about the pull down on the bottom. That's what you mean. Yeah, I was meaning like the seated row capability. Yeah, yeah. I don't need that.

I just need my legs held down so I can properly do all the scripts. Yeah, definitely my legs held down. It'll lift me off the ground too if I don't have my legs locked in. I won't go flying or anything though. Well, you guys want to call it a show? Yeah, I was about to say, it's about a wrap. Thanks for sticking around for the full four hours, Derek. Thank you, Derek.

I know it's a fucking haul. We do it every day. Thanks for hosting. Appreciate it. Yeah, man, we really appreciate you coming on. I want to thank you personally for all the work over the last year, man. It's been awesome working with you.

I'm very thankful for all your help. You're the man. No, happy to help, man. I was excited to see this all come together. And it's like, I've wanted to talk about it for a while too.

It's been hard for me to keep my mouth shut. I feel you. You messaged me the other day. You're like, when can I make a video about this? I'm like Wednesday, man, Wednesday.

We're, we're, we're going live with this thing. Uh, but yeah, check out Derek's clinic. It's Merrick Health. Check out all of his Gorilla Mode products over there. I love the pre-workout. If you take pre-workout,

I highly recommend the Bomsicle flavor. If it's in stock, you never know. It's the best flavor, in my opinion. It's fucking tasty. Awesome. I appreciate it, guys. PK?