Passion Struck with John R. Miles - Dr. Josh Axe on How to Overcome False Narratives | EP 539

Starting point is 00:00:00 Coming up next on Passion Struck. The best person to listen to and the best person to create your beliefs around are the people that have the greatest fruit in their life in the specific area that we're looking to model. And a lot of this goes back to modeling. I have learned the most in my life from humbly modeling other people that are ahead of where I currently am. Welcome to Passion Struck. Hi, I'm your host, John R. Miles. And on the show, we decipher the secrets, tips, and guidance of the world's most inspiring people

Starting point is 00:00:31 and turn their wisdom into practical advice for you and those around you. Our mission is to help you unlock the power of intentionality so that you can become the best version of yourself. If you're new to the show, I offer advice and answer listener questions on Fridays. We have long form interviews the rest of the week with guests ranging from astronauts to authors, CEOs, creators, innovators, scientists, military leaders,

Starting point is 00:00:59 visionaries and athletes. Now let's go out there and become passion struck. Hey, passion struck fam. Welcome to episode 539 of the Passion Struck Podcast. I am so grateful to have each of you here diving into these transformative conversations. You are the reason we keep exploring, learning, and growing together. Whether you're a longtime listener or just tuning in for the first time, welcome to this incredible community focused on purpose, growth, and igniting passion in every corner of life.

Starting point is 00:01:27 Earlier this week, I sat down with Heather Moise, a two-time Olympic gold medalist, inductee in the World Rugby Hall of Fame, and champion of resilience. Heather shared her incredible insights on the power of mindset, how to break through self-imposed limits, and how small shifts in thinking can lead to extraordinary outcomes. Her approach to overcoming challenges and achieving personal excellence is truly inspiring. You don't want to miss that episode. For anyone wondering where to start with our 530 plus episodes, check out our episode Starter Packs on Spotify or at passionstruck.com slash starter packs, which are organized by topics like leadership, mental health, and personal mastery. And for

Starting point is 00:02:04 more inspiration between episodes, don't forget to subscribe to my Live Intentionally newsletter. For exclusive insights, tools, and exercises, just head over to passionstruck.com to join. Every episode is also available on YouTube, where our community of over a quarter million subscribers continues to grow. You can find us on the John R. Miles YouTube channel for full episodes and on Passion Start clips for quick powerful insights. Today I'm thrilled to welcome Dr. Josh Axe, the leading expert in health and wellness and the founder of DrAxe.com, one of the most popular resources for natural health. In this episode, we're diving into his latest book, Think This, Not That. 12 Mind Shifts to Break Through Limiting Beliefs and become who you were born to be. Dr. Axe unpacks the top mental barriers that keep people from reaching their full potential and shares powerful mind shifts that can transform your life.

Starting point is 00:02:51 Imagine waking up each day with a clear purpose and excitement for what's to come. That's exactly what Dr. Axe aims to help you achieve by breaking down limiting beliefs and replacing them with empowering, growth-focused mindsets. From redefining success to fostering mental toughness, Dr. Axe offers practical tools that can shift your perspective, helping you cultivate a life filled with meaning and purpose. If you want to hear my interview on Dr. Axe's show, you can tune in to episode 168. It was published on September 19, 2024. If you're ready to let go of false narratives and build a life that aligns with who you

Starting point is 00:03:27 truly are, this conversation will be invaluable. Get ready to explore the possibilities that open up when you make intentional choices and embrace the mindset shifts Dr. Axe has spent years refining. So let's get into it. Here's episode 539 of Passion Struck with Dr. Josh Axe. Thank you for choosing Passion Struck and choosing me to be your host and guide on your journey to creating an intentional life. Now, let that journey begin.

Starting point is 00:03:52 Hey, Passion Struck listeners. I am absolutely thrilled and honored today to have my friend Dr. Josh Axe on Passion Struck. Welcome, Josh. Hey, John, thanks for having me. Well, we've been talking about doing this ever since I was on your show. And I think that episode came out in mid September. So I think what we discovered in that conversation is that we have actually studied a lot of the same topics.

Starting point is 00:04:22 So I'm really eager to get your perspectives on the show. Thanks for coming. Well, thanks for having me on. And when you were on my show, it was incredibly popular episode. So thanks again for coming on. I love talking. We had talked obviously a lot about mindset on there,

Starting point is 00:04:34 which was such a powerful conversation. I'm gonna open our discussion about your brand new book, Think This, Not That, which is a New York Times bestseller. Congratulations on that. Thank you. And in the opening of new book, Think This, Not That, which is a New York Times bestseller. Congratulations on that. Thank you. And in the opening of the book, you describe a story with your grandfather, Howard, who teaches you this lesson of think this, not that.

Starting point is 00:04:55 And I think it's interesting because I've seen in my own life, especially from my grandfather, who was a huge inspiration in my life, that it's our early mentors who shape a lot of our mindset. How did those early teachings from your grandfather influence the way you approach mindset and change today? surround yourself with the most. And of course our parents, our grandparents, our pastors, teachers, coaches. I mean, these people in the early stages of our life have a massive impact. In fact, I'm working as a functional medicine practitioner and somebody also that focuses a lot on spiritual health and wellness. One of the things that I've discovered is that it's even my patients that dealt with medical health issues, a lot of those issues actually affect their health

Starting point is 00:05:45 later on in life. It could be their mental health, it could be their physical health due to worry, anxiety, fear, but a lot of that happens early on in life. And I can remember my grandfather told me very early on that life is about this, right? So if I don't know for a lot of people that somebody tells them, this is what life is about. So my grandfather told me very early on, listen, life is about becoming a certain type of person. Life is about adding value to others. Life is not just about plays that I want you to play, you wanna have fun, but life is about relationship.

Starting point is 00:06:17 Life is about advancing the kingdom of God, building a relationship with God, and serving other people, making their lives better. And so having him instill that in me, that message early on, was so powerful and transformative. And even though I don't know that I fully understood at the time as he continued to repeat it over time, it became part of who I was.

Starting point is 00:06:37 And so, yeah, and I was really blessed to have both parents and including my dad and my grandfather that really sewed into me. And one of the things that I found for a lot of people is they haven't had those people. Somebody might have grown up without a dad, or they had a dad that wasn't a virtuous, disciplined person that was sewing into them, or maybe they never had a grandfather who is that sort of person in their life.

Starting point is 00:07:01 And so it's really important that people go out and find those mentors then that play that grandfather and that father like role that can help them develop and grow because the way that we most grow in our lives is through modeling. It's discipleship, it's mentorship. And I hear from people all the time when I'm teaching lectures and workshops, people come up to me and say, Dr. Axe, I want to find a mentor, I don't have one because it's something I recommend often because I'll tell people that one of the greatest things

Starting point is 00:07:28 that have transformed my life and helped me personally grow is having mentors and people that sowed into me. And I'm always looking to do that to others. And of course we can do it at a distance by John, listening to your podcast and my podcast or reading John Maxwell or other spiritual or leadership in personal growth leaders, but it's also really powerful to have those people in our lives in person.

Starting point is 00:07:53 Oh, I completely agree with you. And I've been a lifelong Catholic. And when I was getting my confirmation, I actually used my grandfather and his name Donald as my confirmed name. I didn't, unfortunately, I was never able to meet my parental grandfather. And so grandfather Donald had a huge impact on my life because he really embodied. To me, a lot of the things I thought a man should be, not that my father didn't, he did as well, but there was just something about the way that he talked to me and taught me things and took me aside and was patient and comforting and inspiring that has influenced who I am today. So I very much appreciate that.

Starting point is 00:08:38 And it leads me to this real quick because I think it's so interesting. So because I had my dad who was an old military guy. And when he taught me a lot of discipline, lifting weights, constantly challenged me, and it was more of that sort of masculine like growth. And then my grandfather did it in such a, as you mentioned, it was like a softer, more gentle, patient way with a certain level of wisdom. And I think it was just part of it was maturity. Some of it was personality, but it was beneficial getting sort of those virtues, different virtues from different people.

Starting point is 00:09:10 Basically same story. Josh, my dad is a, uh, a force recon Marine and probably one of the strongest people I've ever met. I remember as a kid, he was trying to do some repair in my bedroom and he drives a drill bit right through the middle of his hand, didn't even flinch anything else. Basically takes his t shirt off wraps it around his hand, walks by me and says, Hey, tell your mom I went to the

Starting point is 00:09:42 hospital and walks out goes Cause the hospital where, whereas my grandfather was, was also an army veteran, but was just much more vulnerable and just a different complete persona of the human being. So I can relate with you completely. Yeah. And ironically, I have another story where I can completely relate to you. So in the first chapter of your book, you talk about limiting beliefs. And when I was in high school, you're not going to believe this story.

Starting point is 00:10:16 I'm in the beginning of my senior year, and I had always dreamt of going to the University of Michigan. It's where my parents went, my grandparents went. It's the only thing I ever really thought about, but I was getting highly recruited by the Naval Academy. And at this time, I had this English teacher who the student body loved. I mean, everyone went to her for advice. And one day she cost me into her office. And she

Starting point is 00:10:49 basically took the complete error out of my balloon. She told me that I would never amount to anything great, that she thought I was a lot of hype and there wasn't much behind it. And it actually changed my whole life because of this interaction. I think it was one of the driving reasons I ended up going to the Naval Academy because I felt I needed to prove more to myself and to take a harder path. And when I was reading your book, you had a similar experience with an English teacher in high school. And I was hoping you could share that story and how it impacted you.

Starting point is 00:11:26 I mean, this was a like it was for you. I know it was a life altering moment. And everybody has had this moment. I want you to think about what was your moment where you've had something like this happen? And, and have you ever recovered from it? So I was in freshman English class, freshman high school, and a teacher asked me to stay after and it was Miss Noble. I stayed after class, she says, Josh, what do you want to do after high school? And I said, I want to be a doctor. And the reason I said that, John, was the year before my mom was diagnosed with breast cancer, she went through chemotherapy. She lost all of her hair. She almost died. And so seeing my mom suffer like that, it just really pierced my heart. And I said to myself, I want to help people like my mom. And I want to find a better way to help people heal. And so I decided I want to be a doctor at that moment. Well, the English

Starting point is 00:12:11 teacher, I said I want to be a doctor. And she literally laughed out loud. And she said, Josh, listen, with your GPA, you'll never get into med school. She says, my own daughter has a three-point GPA. She barely got into med school. She said, you just failed this paper. That's why I wanted you to stay after. You're getting a D-minus in this class. You'll be lucky to pass. She said you need to try harder. I walked out of there, John, feeling like, okay, well, maybe I can't be a doctor. Well, then my mom brought me to see a medical doctor two weeks later who diagnosed me with ADHD and talked about me like I wasn't in the room. I still remember his words today where he said, your son has a learning disability. And I thought, well, gosh, not only am I not smart,

Starting point is 00:12:54 I'm like medically not smart, there's something wrong with me. So then I just stopped trying in high school. I barely graduated high school. I had like around just above a 2.0 GPA, applied to colleges, got denied by almost all of them And then I applied to one and they said we've got a new program Where if you come and take summer school and you average above a 3.0 will let you in it was the University of Kentucky

Starting point is 00:13:15 I grew up in Ohio and I said, okay. Well, I don't want to be the kid that just stays back I want to go and try so I went and the first class I had to take was English 101 in freshman year college. So I went, I took the class. First big assignment was a paper, turned it in, felt pretty good. But then three days later, the teacher name was Miss Williams. She says, Josh, can you stay after class? My heart sunk because it felt like deja vu. I thought, Oh, no. She said, Josh, what's your major? And I said, Well, Miss Williams, I haven't chosen a major yet. And she said, well, I really think you should consider being a English or journalism major because she said, I think you're really great writer of the 40 some kids in this class, you got the highest grade. Great job. I went from feeling like I was dumb, I wasn't good at school, these narratives running through my head, and finally I had one person tell me that I was smart or that I could do this or I was good at something,

Starting point is 00:14:14 and I completely embraced it and had a transplant there and I said, you know what, I can do this. Later on I switched to pre-med and then I went on to get my doctorate. I then went on later to John Hopkins University, graduated from John Hopkins with nearly a 4.0 GPA. And I share none of that to boast, but just to say this, I went from being the kid in high school that barely graduated to eventually graduating John Hopkins and getting later on, or earlier on a doctorate. And there's a lot of people out there today, John, that they had someone say something to them, a parent, a teacher, a

Starting point is 00:14:48 coach, and they're still living with that today. They haven't had that belief transplant that's allowed them to thrive and experience the breakthrough in their relationship, in their career, in their spiritual life. And so for me, one of the things I've really committed to doing myself and helping others do is making sure that I don't have any limiting beliefs that are holding me back. And then going and replacing those limiting beliefs with empowering beliefs. And I found for so many people doing that singular exercise

Starting point is 00:15:20 of writing down what their limiting beliefs are when they started. There's actually a method, it's called the ABCDE method. It goes like this. One, activate the memory of when this belief started. Number two is B, which is what's the exact belief? C is what are the consequences if you continue to believe the lie?

Starting point is 00:15:39 D is dispute it, why it's not true? And E, exchange it for the thing you need to believe in order to experience the greatest outcome in your life. And if people can do that and start to write down the limiting beliefs about themselves, about God, about the world, about others, that's where most people start to experience, I think, some of their biggest breakthroughs in life.

Starting point is 00:16:02 I think that's an extremely good point, and I also wanted the listeners to understand that the degree that you got from Johns Hopkins, if I'm correct, was in organizational leadership. I was just going to say, I think it complements the work that you've done in your medical profession and expands so much of the discipleship that you've created on your podcast and in your brand. So, so with, with that as a backdrop and these limiting beliefs, I thought it was really interesting, Josh, that in both our books, we use an analogy of. stool and the support structures under it to go into this belief system that people have. Can you walk through that analogy? because it's a little bit different than the way I describe it, but I think it's important for listeners.

Starting point is 00:16:52 Yeah. The, the way that I think about it is when I use the term mindset, I think our mindset, our way of thinking about things tend to be held up by multiple beliefs that we have about something. So for instance, there's a friend of mine who is a fairly successful entrepreneur, but he could be so much more successful if he overcame this mindset that was a scarcity mindset. And so, and I've asked him questions about this, and again, he's a really close friend of mine, but he's told me things in life

Starting point is 00:17:21 like, well, my dad used to tell me that money doesn't grow on trees and you got to fight for every last thing you get. And he was one of 10 kids. And so he's developed this mindset over time to where he hoard money and he doesn't want to invest. He's not generous because of it, or he doesn't take risks. And so his mindset, this scarcity mindset is made up of multiple beliefs. There's only so much money. You've gotta fight people for money. You wanna save rather than invest in these multiple issues. And you think about it as a table.

Starting point is 00:17:53 And if you have weak legs of this table, everything collapses. And so it's really important for people that you go. And this is another discussion, John, and I'd love to hear your thoughts on this. One of the things that's so important for people to do when you look at the most important mindset people have, one of the most important mindsets is what is success? What does it mean to truly be successful? Because the world today tells us it's fame, it's fortune, right? So it's a big

Starting point is 00:18:24 social media following or it's a certain size house or driving a Lamborghini or so much money. That's what the world says success is. But if you look at the Bible, or you look at the people that you and I, John, are probably like, we want to be like these people, right? Probably like their mother, Teresa's, the John Maxwell's, the people that are, have done so much good in their life, Martin Luther King Jr. It's like, well, they had a big impact for good.

Starting point is 00:18:50 And so my definition of success, which is one of the most important mindsets, needs to be made up of these beliefs. So if my beliefs are, well, success is, okay, I have a big house, and I've got a million dollars in the bank, and I've got a million followers on Instagram or whatever it is, that's going to cause me to live a certain type of life versus if my definition of success is loving God, loving people, making Earth a heavenly place,

Starting point is 00:19:16 adding value to others is my entire goal of blessing other people's lives. Well, that's gonna be a very, like my wins become very different. And so people really need to pick through their life and look at their mindset about a certain thing. And then what do I believe specifically? And what beliefs do I need to start to exchange in order to live a more meaningful and significant life?

Starting point is 00:19:44 I love that you bring that up and in this chapter that we're discussing you use a person who I highlighted in my book as well Steve Jobs and I think you bring up an important element here to your question that you asked me and that is I was very much on this path of living the Steve Jobs life. I was so focused on my career and success that the pillars underneath my school were all these external measures of what I thought were going to bring me fulfillment, but were only bringing me despair instead. And I think you summed it up really well in the book when you're talking about Steve Jobs. What good is gaining the world but losing your soul? What good is growing a company but losing your family?

Starting point is 00:20:30 What good is gaining wealth but losing your health? What good is being right but ruining your marriage? What good is getting a promotion but losing your integrity? And when I think about that in my own life, I met with a career coach who was a psychologist and he had me do this exercise where I looked at my own stool and what was underneath it. And then I looked at who I wanted to become and what needed to change in the pillars that were underneath me.

Starting point is 00:20:59 And it's many of the things that you write about with Steve Jobs. I wanted better relationships. I wanted kids who down the line wanted to still go out on dates with me when they were in their 20s, 30s, 40s, however, because they liked hanging out with their dad. It meant I needed to have a new relationship with my mental and physical health. I couldn't keep burning myself out like I was doing and expect that I was going to be able to operate on all cylinders like I wanted to. It meant that I needed to change from so much of my time caught up in serving myself into being a disciple and serving others.

Starting point is 00:21:38 It meant that I needed to double down on my faith journey and use that as a core element of my life, building the soul journey that I wanted to phase in my life on this planet. So that's how I redefined success for myself. I don't know if you want to build on that or take it anywhere, but that's how I personally redefined it. That's so powerful. One of the things that I realized was, the best thing to believe is the thing that the most successful people believe in terms of real success. Again, my definition of real success is more of a biblical narrative around making earth a heavenly place.

Starting point is 00:22:20 If there's trash on the ground, we pick it up. If an area is dirt, let's turn it into regenerative rainforest. And then relationships, I think, not just with the earth but with people and God is even more important than that. And so for me, that's my definition of success, is doing that not just now but also with an eternal mindset. And so what I try and do in different areas of my life is not focus on what I believe, but focus on what is the most successful people in their field believe that it's also virtuous. So for instance, I might have my own ideas right now about finances, but I want to go and say, how does Warren Buffett and Elon Musk, how do they think about wealth? And how do they think

Starting point is 00:23:02 about growing wealth? And I want to study and adopt, maybe I pick them and a few others, what do they believe about investing in finances and everything else? And I want to then go and adopt those same mindsets and beliefs for myself in discovering the truth. Same thing. How do I know what's true spiritually? Right. And I need to look at because there's a lot of different religions out there. There's within Christianity, right? We've got Protestantism and Catholicism and Orthodoxy. Within Judaism, you've got different, you've got more of the Reformed and Orthodox there.

Starting point is 00:23:37 And then there's Buddhism and there's Islam and all these other things. And for me, there's a Bible verse and it reminds me of this. Jesus says, you'll recognize them by the fruit in me of this. Jesus says, you'll recognize them by the fruit in their lives. By their fruit, you'll recognize them. If somebody has good, beautiful fruit, like a Mother Teresa, or a Martin Luther King Jr.,

Starting point is 00:23:54 or a William Wilberforce, or these people that changed the world for good, what is it that they believed? What was their religion? What was their spiritual belief? Okay, the people that have the best fruit in their lives, I'm gonna follow them. John, there's a lot of marriage coaches

Starting point is 00:24:09 and counselors out there. And I remember one of them, and they'd been divorced five times. Now, sometimes we can learn things from a divorce, right? And there's great counselors that have been remarried and now have a great marriage and they learn from the first time. But somebody that's been through five

Starting point is 00:24:24 and still struggling in the middle and then giving someone else relationship advice, it's similar thing with health. Have you ever seen the pictures of some of the people running the health of the United States and then some of the other countries who are running the Department of Health versus you look at someone like a Robert F. Kennedy Jr. in his 70s ripped and shredded and very healthy, very mentally sharp. And it's okay, who am I going to listen to with the best person to listen to and to is in the best person to create your beliefs around or the people that have the greatest fruit in their life in this specific area that we're looking to model. Same thing. It's if you and I are learning how to

Starting point is 00:25:03 do better shows, like in to educate and help inspire people is that are we looking to model. Same thing, if you and I are learning how to do better shows, like to educate and help inspire people, is that are we gonna be spending time studying? Again, it's probably gonna be Joe Rogan and I don't know, Jordan Peterson and other people that have good shows versus somebody who's never done it before. So I think it's important. And a lot of this goes back to modeling.

Starting point is 00:25:21 Like I have learned the most in my life from humbly modeling other people that are ahead of where I currently am. I think that's such an important mentorship tidbit that you just gave. Even in my own career, when I was looking for mentors, I was always looking for a mentor who was at a place that I wanted to be two to three steps ahead of

Starting point is 00:25:45 where I was now, because I wanted to learn the shorter path to get there and the mistakes that they made that I could avoid. And I think it's such an important thing that you bring up. And yet we tend to look just across the horizon instead of longer term in who we want to become. And I want to go in a little bit different direction, Josh, because when I think about historical figures, and I've heard you talk about this person before, a person who I've always admired was Michelangelo. And I think back about being in his shoes when he's asked to

Starting point is 00:26:26 paint the 16th chapel and he's not even a known as a painter. He's a sculptor and he gets this edict from the Pope and his first inclination is there's no way in heck I'm going to do that. And if my history is correct, he then escapes from the Vatican to get out of it. And then does some soul searching and it brings them back. But I know that I know Michelangelo is a person who you cite as well. What do you think a listener can learn from his journey? Well, I'd say there's two things. If somebody is listening to this and they're saying, you know what, I want to live the greatest life possible. I want to get to the end of my life, and I know that I left it all in the field. I have no regrets. If you want to do that and grow to

Starting point is 00:27:12 your maximum, there's two things you need. You need to grow in character, and you need to grow in your unique skills that God gifted you in. And that's what we see with Michelangelo is that he had such unique gifting as an artist, as a sculptor, as a painter. And he took that to the highest level possible. It reminds me of in the Bible, there's a parable of the talents, right? And so God gives somebody one talent, another two and another five. And the person with one buries their talent. Now that's fine. That's actually money. But it also could be seen as your God-given talent. Maybe it's education or coaching or customer service, but one person buries it. The second person goes and doubles it. And the person with five goes and doubles his. Well, later on that master comes back, which is God in the story.

Starting point is 00:27:59 And the one that buries it, and he says, you're evil and wicked for doing so, for wasting your talent. And the other two, he says, now I evil and wicked for doing so, for wasting your talent. And the other two, he says, now I'm gonna double what you even have and give you even more beyond that. And so I think about Michelangelo in the very same way. Michelangelo had a talent and he also had a certain level of character

Starting point is 00:28:18 and amazing work ethic and wanting to do something that was inspirational and that would honor God. And so he went and created, I mean, I want to say it took him like seven to 10 years because they said he went partly blind while he was painting the Sistine Chapel. I mean, here's the other inspiring thing about this.

Starting point is 00:28:36 When I was recently in Italy, I was doing a, I took a tour on Michelangelo because I just love his work so much. And they had said, he lived to be 88 years old Which during that time the average lifespan I wanted to say was like upper 40s So so he almost doubled the lifespan of a lot of people and part of it I believe was because he had so much purpose He was doing something really meaningful really significant because it was divinely inspired and so

Starting point is 00:29:01 To sum up I want to say the life of Michelangelo, there is a story of him after he had just finished painting the Sistine Chapel. And he's showing somebody his work, and before they revealed it to the public, and he's showing somebody, and somebody said, Michelangelo, why did you spend so much time painting this little corner that literally nobody's going to see? And his answer was, because God will see. And to me, that was so moving of thinking about our lives in that way that, you know what, somebody might not see it, but God will see it. And that's a very eternal mindset. If somebody wants to be successful, we see this in the psychology research, that the

Starting point is 00:29:41 longer somebody thinks out, okay the more successful they are So if somebody's living for today only they tend to not be very successful Versus somebody has a 10-year plan and is working towards 10 years or their lifetime. They tend to be much more successful Well, Michelangelo goes beyond that as he was thinking eternally and he was even more successful reminds me of a CS Lewis quote and he says the people that do the most in this life are the very people that think most about the next life. And so Michelangelo was able to do that via taking his skill to the highest level possible and taking his character. And what a lot of people do today, John, is they try and become jacks of all trades of maybe doing a thing here or there, rather than going very deep in one topic.

Starting point is 00:30:27 And I think the best thing somebody can do is say, I want to grow in this one single area. Maybe it's a character quality, maybe it's a skill, but spending hours upon hours and just getting better at that one thing. And that's how people tend to experience the greatest success in their life is going very deep. And we're living in a world today. It's just so superficial. It's okay. I've got 1000 friends on Instagram, but how many of them are really friends? I'd rather have one true friend I go incredibly deep with that I can trust and build a deep, meaningful lifelong relationship than 1000 friends on social media. So I think the same thing goes for our work and our life is the more we can grow this, you know, decide on that one area where God has gifted us and take that to the max, the bigger impact we'll have. I completely agree with you.

Starting point is 00:31:14 And I don't talk about this that much publicly, but 2017 I was very close friends with a gentleman named Tim and Tim was this type of friend that you talk about, the person who three o'clock in the morning, you're struggling. And not only will he pick up the phone, he's that one who'll drive across town to sit with you and put you at ease. And unfortunately, he ended up committing suicide and I cannot tell you the void I felt in my own life of not having that deep a friendship and they're so difficult to find. And when I look back upon that, I just wish at times I could have done more to help him

Starting point is 00:32:01 and I didn't even realize the pain he was going through. And I think sometimes we see people so superficially that we often put these masks on showing a different version of ourself to the world that's really going on inside. And I think as we're meeting with people, we need to understand that people are struggling and it takes a lot of vulnerability to get through those layers to reach a point where you're willing to give like I was with my friend, Tim, and I wish he would have done the same back to me. And I wish I could have asked more proven questions to get him to share more with me. I don't know.

Starting point is 00:32:46 Well, one of the things John, I just want to say too, I mean, this is one of the things I love about your podcast is you're constantly now inspiring people in really having a great impact on the world. And so I've been so impressed by just saying, I mean, first off, your podcast is one of the fastest growing podcasts, one of the most successful podcasts, and helping inspire people in growth and leadership. And so the work you're doing now is so impactful. And to your point, one of the things that I think I realized when I ran my functional medicine clinic full-time,

Starting point is 00:33:15 now I have a virtual practice and we have people that I advise on healing a number of issues, but I can tell you from working with tens of thousands of patients, almost every single person is really struggling with something in their life. It could be low self-esteem. It could be going through a divorce, losing a loved one, workplace issues. But most people have some level of emotional turmoil. And for a lot of people, they may have gone years without somebody saying something truly nice

Starting point is 00:33:45 and meaningful to them that's uplifting. Like when I had Mrs. Williams tell me, and she said, Josh, you could be a great writer. Like for me, I don't think I had somebody say something like that to me in months. And so for some people, they've never had anyone say that to them. So I really, one thing, I lead a men's group now.

Starting point is 00:34:03 And one of the things I'll do every year in the men's group is I'll put My hand on the guy's shoulders individuals and I do this because my grandfather did this to me I don't look them in the eyes and I'll say God has gifted you to do this I believe you have this calling you have this gifting you can have this impact and help cast a vision for them in their Life and speak life into them in terms of what I see Their giftings are their character are into them in terms of what I see their giftings are, their character is as well. And so I would encourage everybody who's listening here is to you be that person as somebody else. Put your hand on their shoulder, look them in the eyes, and tell them what in them, the goodness in

Starting point is 00:34:39 them, the impact they can have, challenge them to grow, because it might just save someone's life, it could transform someone's life, help set them on a new trajectory. And those, I can think through a few times, not just Miss Williams, I can think of my grandfather doing that to me. I can think about a mentor, a Ben, who was a doctor who did that to me in my life, and a friend of mine, Jordan Rubin. Those are, were the, somebody doing that for me was these, those created the single biggest turning points in my entire life. Yeah. Thank you for sharing that. And it caused something for me to think about the past three

Starting point is 00:35:15 weeks, gone to church every single week, two times I went to a Catholic church. One time I went to a non-denominational church and it's interesting because all three of the sermons were talking about service and the need for us to serve to feel fulfilled. What I wanted to ask you, Josh, is I think a lot of people feel compelled to serve, but then the next question is where do you serve? How do you use your talent?

Starting point is 00:35:46 I think people go about it the wrong way. I think we try to think our way into how to serve instead of realizing that if we just put ourselves out there, other people are going to see our inherent talents, and it's going to point us in a direction where we end up serving. How do you think about that? Well, I think you're spot on. I think you're exactly right. And I think there are two ways to do this, but number one is what you just shared, and that is just show up somewhere at a church, at a synagogue, at the local soup kitchen, but just start showing up and saying, you know what, I'm gonna devote one hour a week, two hours a week, to just doing something

Starting point is 00:36:26 where I don't get anything in return, I just get to serve someone who's in need. And over time, they probably will see some gifts and skills that you have, and you'll be able to utilize those gifts and skills within that community you're serving. And so again, a place I like to do that is church, and so it could be, and I'll give you an example, I've

Starting point is 00:36:45 got a friend of mine. And what he has his daughters do is they go to church, but they also I think once a month go and maybe more than this, they're high schoolers, and they go and spend time with the four and five year olds, like just serving in that way. And other people go and help part in the parking lot, or one might lead a growth group. I mean, there's a lot of ways, or they go and do soup kitchens, or help with handing out clothes to the homeless,

Starting point is 00:37:11 or gathering clothes. I mean, there are a lot of different things that can happen. So that's number one to your point, is finding a group you can just show up at and just plug in with everybody else. And over time, maybe you do have a new gifting where you can serve in a more unique way outside of that. And the other thing is you might think about also in your,

Starting point is 00:37:31 and again, I think there's so much value in just showing up in serving in a specific community, whether it be religious or non-religious in some way. And then the other thing is do think about your talent. Like I'll give you an example of something I've done for years, John, is I do see patients via the practitioner, I have a group of practitioners in a virtual practice,

Starting point is 00:37:52 it's called the Health Institute. And so we take care of a lot of people with hypothyroidism, autoimmune disease, diabetes, infertility, and we put together programs and supplement packages and help people heal and reverse their chronic illness. Now I get paid to do that and the practitioners do, but sometimes I just probably at least once a week, I go and create a health plan for somebody for absolutely free, right? And so I will go and figure out, for instance, now I will share with you, John, a lot of them are referrals from

Starting point is 00:38:22 figure out, for instance, now, I will share with you, Jon, a lot of them are referrals from my mom, or a lot of different people I know over time. And so my mom is a breast cancer survivor. And so she'll have a woman that say who had maybe has breast cancer. And my mom will say, Hey, could you talk with them? And I'll do more than talk with them. I'll go and write down an exact eating plan, a supplement plan, maybe even send them products for free, and do everything I can to help serve them. I'll spend time, I'll pray with them on the phone. And I do that without getting paid because

Starting point is 00:38:50 I know that God gave me a gift in His Son and I want to be able to give gifts in return asking nothing in return. So I think the primary way is what you just shared is being able to plug into a community in some way. But also think about what your unique gifts are and try and do some of those sorts of things on a regular basis. Here's one other thing. I mentioned earlier, very few people have had a word of encouragement an entire week, okay, that are adults,

Starting point is 00:39:19 primarily, but also a lot of kids. Maybe once a week, you have a time plugged in for 30 minutes where you just send positive messages to people in your life. Could be a text message, could be a handwritten note. I had a friend of mine I met in high school. I went to visit him in Grand Rapids, Michigan. I was speaking at Kellogg's in front of their headquarters demanding they get the dyes and the chemicals out of our cereal and food supply. But while I was up there, I saw a friend from high school I hadn't seen

Starting point is 00:39:45 since his wedding 18 years ago. And after seeing him, he wrote me a handwritten note of how much my friendship meant to him, even after we hadn't seen each other that long. And it was so meaningful because handwritten notes are so rare today. I mean, like I'm gonna keep it because it was just that meaningful.

Starting point is 00:40:00 And so just things like that, that you could just schedule once a week for even 30 minutes can radically improve the lives of others. I'm so happy that you went down that path at the end, because it leads me into something I wanted to talk to you about. You were just talking about connection and the need to connect and express gratitude and to share with people the impact that they're making. I think one of the biggest diseases that I see in the world today is the disease of disconnection. We are so disconnected not only with other people, but we are so disconnected from ourself. And I found this in my own self years ago that I thought I had self-awareness.

Starting point is 00:40:49 And if I would look back on myself and rate where I was probably a two on the 10, because I was so disconnected with everything else in my life that I wasn't spending the quiet moments that I needed to have that connection. And when you're disconnected with yourself, you're disconnected with everything else in your life. I was hoping you might give some thoughts on this disease of disconnection. Yeah, it makes me think of two things.

Starting point is 00:41:15 I wanna talk about self-awareness and then something actually very different, but I think they're both to your point. The other one is loneliness. Now, we live in a culture where a lot of people talk about goal setting. And I'm a big goal setter. And I know you are too, like casting a vision for your life, setting a goal, creating a strategic plan that's powerful. But when you look at the ancient spiritual texts, the Tanakh or the Torah or the Bible, or you look at a lot of the Buddhist or Taoist philosophy and monks, they don't talk about goal setting almost ever. They talk primarily about self-awareness. Goal setting is where you want to go.

Starting point is 00:42:00 Awareness is where are you right now. And you can't truly get to where you wanna go unless you know where you are now. So think about if you're driving in a map, you're saying, hey, I wanna go to, I wanna go up, I wanna go down to the Florida Keys, wherever it is, okay? But what if you don't know where you currently are? How do you know whether to go east, west, north, south?

Starting point is 00:42:22 It's pretty hard to know. So self-awareness is the epitome of wisdom. Okay. And it's one of the most important, it's a cardinal virtue that we need to develop if we're going to grow to our highest level possible. By the way, there's some great research that shows the people that are the happiest do two things. They're the people that serve others the most and the people that are experiencing the most growth in their life and their character and skill. So if you want to be happy, it's essential you do that, but it's really hard to grow unless you have a level of self-awareness. And I think that you develop self-awareness by thinking unbiasedly about where you are now.

Starting point is 00:42:58 And for most people, that's going to lead them to a great level of humility, of realizing that, you know what, we are finite beings in a vast, endless world, and we don't necessarily have to have a lot of meaning. And that's very humbling, but then there's a level of confidence that's built knowing that we're children of God created for eternal life, and to know that we can literally alter the life of someone else, as we've talked about we could say something mean and hurtful to somebody which could cause them to take their own life or have a negative experience or

Starting point is 00:43:34 whatever or we could say something to somebody that could save their life or cause them to go on to do great meaningful things with their life. So I think there's a level there of understanding at the simultaneously. We're almost nothing. We're dirt and we're mud. Yeah, we're also eternal divine beings. It's you want to hold both things in your hand at the same time and be aware of yourself in that way. And then some of the people that I respect the most, John, it's probably similar with yourself, they are the most spiritually and self-aware. Like I'm thinking about pastors, rabbis, priests, monks. There's some of them where it's very hard to rattle them. It's almost like they're sitting there had they have a calm sense of spirit

Starting point is 00:44:17 that's calming towards others. They ask, they see into your soul in a way, some of them even, that are really very aware. And so you could say something negative to them or hurtful, and they're going to sit there without any expression change or maybe the thing that will pop up on their face is a smile and say that they're going to be thinking more about hurt people hurt, say hurtful things. Like they're going to sit there and look at you and think there's hurt in your life, how can I bless you, how can I love you, and to help you heal?

Starting point is 00:44:49 Versus a person that's not self-aware, if somebody says something hurtful to them, they're gonna respond with something hurtful back. They get punched, they're gonna punch back. Versus it's like Tae Kwon Do, I believe it's the martial arts, but if somebody punches you, you take their own force and you use it to move them

Starting point is 00:45:04 or against them in that way. It's more of that sort of, that self-awareness, that spiritual awareness or growth is having that sort of ability. And so being aware of your strengths and your weaknesses and being aware of where you need to grow and also being aware of maybe what others are thinking and feeling so you can support and bless their life.

Starting point is 00:45:27 So I do think that being connected to yourself, and as the Bible talks about, the Holy Spirit or God for even that level of a higher consciousness working through you, that is so incredibly powerful. And the people I see doing not just the most with their life, but the most good with their life. Because there's not just the most with their life, but the most good with their life. Because there's people doing a lot with their life, but maybe it's working towards evil.

Starting point is 00:45:51 Bill Gates does a lot with his life, but I think it's a net negative, right? And so there are other people that are doing it towards the good. And the other point there is with loneliness, and I'm not sure which question you were wanting, I think it's the self-awareness. But not being connected only to yourself and the Divine, but not being connected to the others, is one of the most physiological destructive things in the world. In fact, there was a study, and I published this in my book, there was a researcher and they found that when it comes to decreasing lifespan, experiencing extreme loneliness for a day is the equivalent of smoking 15 cigarettes. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:46:30 I think it's actually 21 Juliet hunt one instead. Okay. Yeah. Brent, she's she teaches her EYU. That's right. It's 20. It might be 21 cigarettes a day, or it might be two different studies, but overall you think about how damaging that is, it's incredibly destructive. And so I think that going into foster, I mean, my mindset, John,

Starting point is 00:46:51 rather than having relationships that just fall into my lap, which I'm generally open to, but more so, I go and really, I'm very conscious about who are the five people I spend the most time with in making sure that I'm doing everything I can to love them and be a great friend and add value to them, and that they can do the same reciprocal to me, to be a sort of iron sharpens iron for each other. But I do think we're in an epidemic of loneliness right now with people today. And I think that's another reason why, you know, when I first got into practice, the top issues that were growing were cancer, heart disease, diabetes, childhood obesity. Today, by far the number one issue is mental health issues, depression, anxiety, and loneliness, and identity disorders. Well, I think a lot of that comes back to this disease of disconnection, but it's that disease

Starting point is 00:47:39 of not connecting with ourselves. And when you're not connected with yourself, you don't feel like you matter. You don't feel like you hold significance, which I think is the whole reason God put us on the planet is to feel significant. And when you don't feel that aspect of your life, yeah, it's going to lead to a bunch of mental and emotional health issues. Oh, exactly. I do think that's the epitome of identity issues is that it's that low self-worth. My life doesn't matter.

Starting point is 00:48:07 And people need to understand that it does as eternal significance. And to your point, I do think that's the core, the core of the issue. Well, Josh, I'm going to take you completely on a different topic. It's a health topic, but I'm going to tie it into this disease of disconnection. And I have never talked about this before publicly. Not sure why I'm choosing to do it now, but I thought it tied in. I, throughout my adult life, have been a drinker. And August 1st of last year, 2023, I decided to stop drinking altogether. And I get the question all the time from people, why did you stop drinking?

Starting point is 00:48:46 And I really don't think it's a question that needs to be asked. And I've never really answered it. But for me, it came down to this whole disease of disconnection. I found that when I was drinking, it was leading me to be more disconnected from myself. And I wanted to see if I gave it up, what changes it would bring in my life. And what caused me to wanna talk about this is, I realized that so many of the things I was doing, the activities, the people I was hanging out with, everything else,

Starting point is 00:49:21 they were really surrounded by a connection point of drinking. And I found that when I was drinking, I wasn't having deep connections with people. I was not having deep connections with myself because I was using it as a way to escape from the feelings that I was having, not to mention the health benefits, the cognitive function benefits, the sleep benefits that I've had come with it, but I know you've talked a lot about alcohol and its negative impacts, but I was wondering if you've ever touched on it from that lens.

Starting point is 00:49:58 Well, John, we have, in fact, I did a podcast not long ago and really talked about some of the negative impacts of alcoholism, how to overcome addiction with nutrition and mindset. I'm trying to think of who gave this quote. I want to say it's Carl Jung, the famed psychologist, but he says something like this. When we don't have a certain level of significance and meaning in our life, we go and we numb out with idle pleasures. But basically, people are looking for meaning. If you don't have meaning and significance in your life, it's painful. It's lonely.

Starting point is 00:50:41 It's a selfishness. It also affects your sense of value. And I think about right now, like anytime in my life that maybe I've had a sense of lacking value, there's some sort of a deep-seated emotional spiritual pain that sort of is there. And so I think that a lot of people who maybe don't know their purpose in life and don't know their unique gifts and skills and aren't using that for good. I think anytime we live out of alignment with the way God designed us, it's painful or it leads to pain in the long run. And so, a lot of people will use alcohol to numb out. It's numbing

Starting point is 00:51:19 in a way, right? And it's not just alcohol, though. I think it's almost anything that we can become addicted to. It could be Netflix and constantly just watching things. It could be scrolling constantly on Tik TOK or Instagram on social media. It could be shopping. It could be drugs. I mean, there's numerous things that we use to numb ourselves out, but in those times, it's when we're typically the least self-aware as well, when you're numbing yourself. And so with someone like you, I think that now, maybe you're at a point in your life

Starting point is 00:51:48 now where you probably have, from what I perceive, maybe more purpose and meaning than you've ever had. Again, you're having such a great impact on so many lives and so many people. And you've heard this before, because you've probably read some Tony Robbins, too. He talks about this. Now, this goes way back to the Bible. I think it talks about this generally in the Old Testament, but we make decisions for two reasons, pain and pleasure, right? If we can get enough pleasure from something good in our life,

Starting point is 00:52:15 then that's the best way to go. But sometimes we make decisions to avoid pain. And so I think certain things could be drinking other things. Maybe we're doing that to avoid certain types of pain, but when it comes to connection, obviously the more you are clear of mind, probably the deeper you can connect with somebody or have a real connection to. So I think there's a lot, I think there's a lot to that conversation, a lot to that

Starting point is 00:52:41 idea, but by the way, culturally we're seeing this a lot with Gen Z ears as well. There are more people now giving up things like alcohol than I think maybe what was happening 10, 20 years ago. I'll tell you the thing I've realized is just how much it is a social norm to drink. I mean, I remember. Yeah. And like two months into it and going into restaurants and observing everyone around me and every single adult is drinking and it becomes such a norm.

Starting point is 00:53:11 That's what makes it so different when you see someone not do it. But the for me, the benefits of not drinking have been so tremendous that it's created a completely different value system for me in who I want in my life, who I don't and where I'm willing to spend time and how much time I was wasting before when I was drinking. John, it's so powerful. I'm thinking back. So when I was in college, okay, I drank a pretty good amount with the guys there. I was in a fraternity, which going back, I never would have joined. But again, you learn. So I did it my first couple years, I drank fairly heavily my freshman and sophomore year. And then I got to a point where I just

Starting point is 00:53:51 felt really empty. I thought none of my relationships were meaningful. I felt like I did have really meaningful relationships in high school. I just prayed to God and said, God, I need you. And I ended up starting to really pursue God in my life, on my unique gifts and talents, my purpose, all of that in my life, it seemed to be more full. However, I did have some of the same friend group, and every time, every social gathering was alcohol. Like that was at the center. And I'd find myself drinking and then not feeling good the next day or not being as productive or still not having those meaningful relationships.

Starting point is 00:54:22 And I realized like I needed to find a completely different social group. Like it was almost like I had to fire or break up with my friend group and go find a completely different friend group because I felt like when I was hanging out with them because I would try not to drink and I felt okay everyone else is drinking I'm the one not drinking anymore at least only drinking one. And so I felt lonely like I was the black sheep of the entire group for a while until I went and found a completely different group of friends. I think that's hard for a lot of people. Cause a lot of us have relationships.

Starting point is 00:54:52 We might feel guilty about maybe leaving a friend group behind, but I think if you don't have, I think about it like this, a psychologist said this, he said, um, if you wouldn't recommend your own child hang out with them and you wouldn't love that your kids are hanging out with them, you shouldn't hang out with them as well as one of your close friends. It doesn't mean you can't minister to their life and you can't support them on occasion, but actually having a deep friendship with them or trying to pursue that sort of thing with them, if you wouldn't want your own child to have a deep relationship with them, then

Starting point is 00:55:24 that's not the right fit for you either. Amen to that. And I know you've read my book. It's something that I highlight in the mosquito principle. Yes. The blood suckers. Yes. That's a good, it's so true. Josh, I think we're going to have to do a part two of this because I didn't even get into Josh, I think we're going to have to do a part two of this because I didn't even get into the whole healthcare questions, health related questions I wanted to ask that I know the listeners really wanted to hear you discuss. So I think in the future, and we talked about this before you came on, we need to do this again in person and maybe do a longer exploration because there's so much more I want to get into with you. Well, I'd love that, John.

Starting point is 00:56:09 And all, as I told you, I got family in Florida, all come down sometime from Nashville and would love to be on your show. Let's do an in-person and actually love to have you to Nashville and interview you here as well. And if people do want to learn, I obviously talk a lot about health on my podcast, like men, how do you boost your testosterone? Women? How do you naturally balance your hormones, gut health, immunity and a whole lot more and a lot of mindset and growth stuff. So people

Starting point is 00:56:31 could check out the Dr. Josh Axe show too. But yeah, I would love to have you on and this is an honor. Again, I know that you've got such an incredible base of listeners that are inspiring people and want to do big things with their lives. So again, I just want to say thanks so much for having me on today. Well, Josh, it was such an honor and you do have an incredible show. I highly encourage my listeners tune into it. So much wisdom.

Starting point is 00:56:54 I always look, listen to your shows and Stephen Cabral's, who I think is a mutual friend of ours as well for a ton of topics. I have no idea how he puts out so much content. That guy is a machine when he was doing almost all solo episodes But thank you so much for being on the show, man. Awesome. Well, thank you, John. God bless everybody Thanks so much John again What an insightful conversation with dr Josh acts his journey from personal challenges to becoming a leader in natural health and holistic wellness is a powerful reminder of how mindset shifts can redefine our approach to life and health. Dr. Axe's story of turning pain into purpose, harnessing the power of food as medicine,

Starting point is 00:57:33 and embracing small, intentional changes serves as an inspiring guide for anyone looking to elevate their well-being and reclaim control over their mind and body. As you reflect on today's episode, think about this. What limiting beliefs are you holding onto that might be holding you back from the life that you deserve? How can you start shifting your mindset to not only overcome those barriers but thrive in ways you've never imagined? Remember, as Dr. Axe shared, true transformation begins with the beliefs you choose to hold

Starting point is 00:58:01 and the small, actionable steps you take each day. For more on Dr. Axe's work, including his latest book and wellness resources, check out the show notes at passionstruck.com. Don't forget to explore our YouTube channels for today's episode and more. And visit passionstruck.com slash deals for exclusive offers from our show sponsors. Supporting them helps keep Passion Struck thriving. You can connect with me on Twitter and Instagram at John R. Miles or find me on LinkedIn. I'd love to hear how today's conversation impacted you. Looking to deepen your journey?

Starting point is 00:58:29 Head to passionstruck.com and take the Passion Struck quiz to see where you are in living your most intentional, purpose-driven life. Sign up for the Live Intentionally newsletter for weekly insights, actionable exercises, and a courage challenge to put these lessons into action. If you found value in Dr. Axe's wisdom, please rate and review the show with five stars and share this episode with someone who could use a boost of inspiration. Your shares help expand this community and amplify our mission of leading intentional lives full of purpose. Now here's what you can look forward to on our next episode of Passion Struck.

Starting point is 00:59:01 I'll be joined by the insightful Kim Scott, author of Radical Candor and renowned leadership expert. We'll dive into the essential principles of open communication, authentic leadership, and building strong, trust-filled relationships in both your personal and professional life. The whole point of hiring people is to encourage them to make a contribution. I mean, there's no point at all in hiring great people and then telling them to sit down and shut up, which is really what bias, prejudice, and bullying in different ways do to people. I think it's important for leaders to learn how to teach their teams to disrupt bias in the moment.

Starting point is 00:59:37 If we ignore these comments, then we reflect and reinforce them. Thank you as always for being here and sharing your time with us. Remember, if you found value in today's episode, share it with someone who could benefit and keep applying what you learn here so you can live reflect and reinforce them.

Passion Struck with John R. Miles - Dr. Josh Axe on How to Overcome False Narratives | EP 539

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