Passion Struck with John R. Miles - How to Overcome Identity Distortion and Live Authentically | Spencer West - EP 784

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Starting point is 00:03:22 Coming up next on Passionstruck, asking yourself the question, why am I here? really leaning into that and stop worrying about what life is and start wondering what it could be. I think those are the two things that, as when I was writing this book that really resonated and that I hope people will pick up on is to really just pause and take a look around you and why am I here and what do I want? And then having that ability to wonder what could be. Because part of the framework also for this book is this idea that we have to have self-trust and self-confidence.

Starting point is 00:03:56 the self-trust to be able to listen to what's in here and what we want, and the self-confidence to believe that you can actually achieve whatever that is. And so to do that, I think we have to start with those questions. Welcome to Passionstruck. I'm your host, John Miles. This is the show where we explore the art of human flourishing and what it truly means to live like it matters. Each week, I sit down with change makers, creators, scientists, and everyday heroes to decode the human experience

Starting point is 00:04:23 and uncover the tools that help us lead with meaning, heal what hurts, and pursue the fullest expression of who we're capable of becoming. Whether you're designing your future, developing as a leader, or seeking deeper alignment in your life, this show is your invitation to grow with purpose and act with intention. Because the secret to a life of deep purpose, connection, and impact is choosing to live like you matter. Hello, friends, and welcome back to episode 784 of Passionstruck. Have you ever looked around at your life and realized that somewhere along the way, you became the person everyone expected you to be, but not necessarily the person you were meant to become? Maybe you've chosen the career that looked successful on paper, stayed in relationships

Starting point is 00:05:15 because they felt safe, measured your worth by accomplishments instead of authenticity, or spent years trying to fit into expectations that never really belonged to you. Throughout our Connection Crisis series, we've been exploring the invisible forces that shape how we relate to ourselves and to one another. Last Tuesday, Katie Morton revealed how our earliest experiences create emotional blueprints that continue influencing us throughout adulthood. And then on Thursday, Adam Lane Smith helped us understand how attachment patterns quietly shape the relationships we build and the stories we tell ourselves about love, safety, and belonging. Today, we're asking an equally important question. What happens when the person you become isn't actually you?

Starting point is 00:05:59 My guest today is Spencer West. Spencer is an internationally acclaimed speaker, activist, and bestselling author, whose remarkable life, including climbing Mount Kilimanjaro without legs, is inspiring in ways that go far beyond physical resilience. Because beneath every extraordinary achievement is a much more universal story. It's a story of learning to separate your identity from everyone else's expectations. In this conversation, Spencer shares why so many of us unknowingly build lives around inherited definitions of success,

Starting point is 00:06:33 why safety often becomes the greatest obstacle to authenticity, and how breaking free isn't about becoming someone new. It's not remembering who you've been all along. We'll explore why belonging without authenticity ultimately leaves us feeling empty, how identity becomes distorted over time, and why flourishing begins the most

Starting point is 00:06:53 moment we stop asking who the world wants us to be and start asking who we truly are. If you've ever felt successful on the outside, while quietly wondering whether you're living your own life or someone else's, this conversation may become one of the most important you've ever heard. Before we begin, if today's episode resonates with you, please share it with someone who may need this message. And if you haven't already, leaving a rating or review on Apple Podcast or Spotify is one of the best ways to help others discover PassionStruck. You can also download today's companion workbook and reflection guide completely free at the ignitedlife.net.

Starting point is 00:07:29 And now, let's dive in with Spencer West. Thank you for choosing Passionstruck and choosing me to be your hosting guide on your journey to creating an intentional life that matters. Now, let that journey begin. I am absolutely honored today to welcome Spencer West to Passionstruck. Spencer, how are you doing today in Canada? First of all, I'm so grateful to be here. And I'm good. It's a bit of a gray, rainy day, but I kind of like that. It's kind of nice to have the juxtaposition every now and then.

Starting point is 00:08:01 I love to bring in guests from Canada because it's one of my top three listening countries that I have a lot of people tune into. So it's nice when I can take these interviews out of the United States. So I'm excited about it. Happy to represent. Spencer, for those meeting you for the first time, can you take us back to the beginning? we have all what I think are defining moments. And you had one when you were five years old, but for you, it started even before that. Can you talk about the early moments of your life

Starting point is 00:08:38 and what shaped it? For sure. So when I was born, so I'm originally from the United States, so I told the line between the two countries. I'm a citizen in both countries. But when I was born in the state of Wyoming, no one knew that anything was wrong with me until I came into the world.

Starting point is 00:08:54 And then they realized that I had a genetic disease called sacralogenesis, which caused the muscles in my legs not to work. And that's a pretty rare disease, even to this day, they don't really understand how or why it happens. And there's varying degrees to it. So for me, it affected the muscles in my legs. And we realized that I wasn't able to move my legs.

Starting point is 00:09:13 I could feel them, but I wasn't able to move them. So at the age of two, they amputated my legs at the knee. And the hope was that they could fit me with prosthetic legs and then I would navigate the world that way. But when it came time to actually do that, they just didn't work for me. So then we went back to the drawing board and they decided to amputate my legs just below my pelvis. So that way I could get around on my hands and also potentially use prosthetics and use a wheelchair.

Starting point is 00:09:41 So that's how I acquired my disability. It was at birth. So this is all that I've ever known. So now that's how I navigate the world, a little bit on my hands and mostly as a wheelchair user. And I'm going to just bring this up. Because when I was five years old, I went from being your typical kid doing your typical kid stuff until one day I was in the middle of a game of tag and was running away from my next door neighbor when he pushed me from behind. Listeners heard this story. You haven't. But I went head first through a basement window and it forever changed my life.

Starting point is 00:10:17 I developed a sensory processing disorder, speech impediments, eyesight issues, chronic migraines, issues with cognition. And it's been a battle for me ever since then. And so I think they're visible wounds and then they're invisible wounds that a lot of us carry. But for me, one of the worst parts of this whole experience was that I was told early on initially that my life was going to be different. And I started to accept that until I met a speech therapist who wouldn't allow me to accept that

Starting point is 00:10:57 and said, you don't have to condition yourself to live your life like this. That's a choice. You have another choice, John, and that is to live your life however you want to and to accomplish whatever you want to.

Starting point is 00:11:08 Did you ever face a decision or circumstances like that? John, A, thank you for sharing that. And B, what a great person in your life to give you the autonomy to choose. I think that's so lovely. After my second surgery,

Starting point is 00:11:21 they were like, every kid wants to walk. So we want to give you these prosthetic legs. And prosthetics are so helpful for so many people, but they weren't for me. They were like so difficult to use, and I found them so challenging. And not only did they say that every kid wants to walk,

Starting point is 00:11:35 but they kept reinforcing this idea, just like everyone else. You're just like everyone else. And so in my mind, I was like, these two things don't add up. You keep saying him like everyone else, but then when I'm out in public, people are asking me inappropriate questions.

Starting point is 00:11:46 about myself and my body, so then I'm not like everybody else and being singled out. And then these legs that you want me to use are so difficult and so challenging. So from kindergarten to sixth grade, I use them with a wonderful physical therapist and a teacher's aid. And then in sixth grade, we all sat down and they all said, do you like using these? And I was like, no, it's so challenging. And I can get around much faster on my hands as a wheelchair user. So then that's what I've been doing ever since.

Starting point is 00:12:14 But yeah, that was like, that was the first time where someone gave me autonomy and asked me the question of like, what do I want? And that was the first time where I even realized that I had that option. So yeah, that was a very one of the first transformative experiences for me. I'm not sure if you're familiar with Jen Brickerbauer. The name sounds familiar. Jen is a personal friend of mine and I had her on the show a number of years ago, but she was born in Romania without likes. and her parents gave her up for adoption because of, I guess, the expectations that they didn't think that they could fulfill of giving her the life that they wanted her to have. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:12:59 And he was adopted by a family in Southern Illinois. And one of the things that she told me was that early on her parents made it clear to her that they were never going to treat her like she had any kind of limitation. So they raised her with the belief that nothing was off the table. And she said it completely changed her life, having that mentality that anything is possible. And it seems like your experience is very similar to that, that you have had always this thought that you could shape your life however you want to from a physical standpoint. But we're going to get into an identity standpoint as this interview goes on. Is that kind of a true understanding? I think that it was a trend.

Starting point is 00:13:46 It isn't. It's like a mix of the two. Because I think that idea that I could do anything that I put my mind to was very helpful as a young person because it gave me the freedom and the excitement at what life could be and what it could look like. And this was a very popular thing to tell disabled kids in the 80s and 90s was you can be just like everyone else and you can go and do all the things that you want to do. And part of that is true and part of that isn't true.

Starting point is 00:14:14 You know what I mean? Because there's still barriers today that stop me from being who I want to be and prevent me from doing things that I would like to do. Stairs instead of ramps getting to a place and there isn't an accessible bathroom. So I think it's important when we talk about disability is that mindset was helpful for me in the beginning. But as I've gotten old, I realized it can be also harmful because it can create a false sense of what the world is like for disabled folks. And there's still so many barriers that exist, both attitudinal and physical, that prevent

Starting point is 00:14:46 disabled folks from fully participating in society. And this is something that I experienced even in my early teens and I was trying to get a job. And this was back in the day when you would literally take your resume and application and handed in person. And all of my friends were getting jobs. And I wasn't. And I had more experience than my friends because I'd worked for my grandmother to real estate business during the summer.

Starting point is 00:15:08 And so I was starting to see some of these barriers that exist that were. out of my control that had nothing to do with me necessarily, but everyone else's idea of what disability is. The answer is yes and no at the same time. Both things exist. Spencer, part of the reason we're here today, and I thank you for going into that to help set the backdrop, is we're here to discuss your brand new book, Breaking Free. And as I was reading through it, I think the heart of the book is that it isn't about disability. It's a book about identity, distorting. Is that a good way to think about it? That's definitely a part of it in me leaning into those identities for sure.

Starting point is 00:15:47 Yeah, and that one of the key things that you want people to understand is that we're not limited by our circumstances, but more through the expectations that are imposed on us by the external structures that we interface with. And so I know this personally because I lived through most of my life, over, over the external structures that we interface with. always feeling like I was never enough. And I was becoming a person that I thought the world wanted, but that felt more and more like an imposter to me because everything that made me, I was putting on the shelf, thinking that if I exposed those things, that the world wouldn't welcome me in. And I think that although I'm talking about me, the more that I have done this podcast, the more people who are listening to it, I actually think it's, It's the vast majority of people on the planet.

Starting point is 00:16:43 What are your thoughts on that? The whole crux of the book is around one of my favorite quotes by Palo Golo from the alchemist who says, maybe our journey is to not become anything. Maybe our journey is to become everything that isn't really us. And that's what I've been doing for the last 25 years of my life is peeling back all those expectations that I put on myself or the society, put you give you some examples. It's from the time we're born, there's an emphasis on who you're, should love and who you should have a relationship with, what success should look like, what your

Starting point is 00:17:15 career and what the American dream is, and all the things that you're supposed to chase to have a normal, successful life. And so he did all of those things, and then A, it didn't feel right. And B, it didn't work out for me. One example is when I got to college, I had, because I had just listened to everyone else, I didn't know what I wanted to study. I picked a major that I didn't enjoy. I failed a class for the first time in my entire life.

Starting point is 00:17:41 I normally got really good grades and did really well in school. And I really had to listen to what do I actually want? What do I want to do? Not what's going to go make me a lot of money. And so I really had to do that. And at the same time, I was also coming to the realization that I was gay and that I didn't fit into this mold that people were trying to put me into. Although I tried really hard to, it just never felt right and it never felt like it was me.

Starting point is 00:18:07 So the crux of this book is this idea, and although I'm queer and disabled, I realize that's not everyone's experience, but this idea that we all have these expectations that are put on us, and so we go in the direction of those, and then when they don't work out or they don't feel right, then no one tells us what to do once that happens. And that's what I've done in this book is to tell people what I did and how I did it in hopes that it provides a bit of a roadmap for them to do the same in whatever capacity there is. Maybe it's not coming out or being disabled, but maybe it's being a relationship you don't want to be in or a career that you're you. you're not enjoying or a city you don't want to live in anymore. They can be simple things like that. You open up the book by describing yourself as a warrior. And you talk about opening up for Demi Lobato in front of almost 20,000 people, miming Mount Kilimanjaro, living what looks like

Starting point is 00:18:57 an extraordinary life. And then you kind of pull the rug out from under it. And you say, know those things came from circumstances, talent, whatever. They came from the decision to reject a safe, uninspired life. So why do you think so many of us fall into that trap of living that safe life instead of living the inspired life that I believe God put us here to live? I think for everyone it's different, but for me it was safer. at the time, you know what I mean? It was, I came from a small town in Wyoming.

Starting point is 00:19:39 I was trying to figure out who I was and see the world. And it was safer and easier to just believe and accept what people were telling me was the right thing to do. And that was like such an important lesson for me to learn and continue to learn is the idea that, oh, sometimes what keeps you safe isn't always what you need. You know what I mean? And sometimes we also make a trap of our own design. This is part of the book that I also talk about. When I graduated college and I came out into the world, I was like, great, I did the thing you told me to do. I have a degree.

Starting point is 00:20:10 I'm going to get a really good paying job. I'm going to make all the money that I'm looking for. And that'll be it. And that didn't happen. No one cared that I had a degree and I couldn't get a job in my field. And I eventually got a job at a salon as the client operations director. And from the outside, I had everything that society told me that I should want to need. I had money and stuff.

Starting point is 00:20:29 But inside, I was like, oh, this doesn't feel. right and I'm dreading the work week and living for the weekend. But in my mind, I was like, but I'm making money. So this must be the thing that I'm supposed to be doing. So I got caught in my own trap of, well, I need money to live. And this job is fine for now. So I'll just keep doing this thing. And then four years goes by and you're like, wait, I stayed here because it was safe,

Starting point is 00:20:55 because it gave me what I thought I needed. And then after four years, I was like, this is not what I want. This is not what I need. I want a job with purpose. And I want a job that is not in this specific field. And that's what started to change is I realized I was like, oh, I'm in this trap that I then created myself. And I had to figure out how do I now get out of that?

Starting point is 00:21:13 But the first step was recognizing that I had put myself in this space to begin with. Before we continue, thank you for supporting Passion Strzruck and for making these conversations possible. One of the biggest themes emerging throughout the Connection Crisis series is that disconnection doesn't always begin with other people. Sometimes it begins the moment we disconnect from ourselves. When we build our identities around achievement, around expectations, around proving our worth, we can spend years chasing a version of success that never actually satisfies us.

Starting point is 00:21:45 That's one of the central ideas behind my upcoming book, The Mattering Effect, because genuine fulfillment doesn't come from becoming more impressive. It comes from knowing that who you already are has inherent significance in building a life that reflects that truth. To help you apply these ideas, every episode includes a free companion workbook with reflection questions and practical exercises you can find at the ignitedlife.net. Now, a quick break for our sponsors. Thank you for supporting those who support the show. You're listening to Passion Struck right here on the Passion Struck network. Now, let's get back to the conversation. I want to go back to some of your early childhood examples that you have in the book.

Starting point is 00:22:35 Sure. Because I think I spent a lot of my time talking about belonging versus mattering. And a way I try to frame this is imagine you're at school and it's gym class and you're going to play kickball. And as it always happens, the teacher says, I'm going to pick two of you and then you're going to pick who you want on your team. Belonging to me is when someone picks you to be on the team. But mattering is something altogether different. Mattering is feeling. that they actually want you on the team and they're celebrating your uniqueness by being on the team. And I remember being in those situations where especially because of what happened to me, I wasn't the first person who was picked. And sometimes I was at the very long line of getting picked or not. And then you know what it's like to feel excluded because no one passes the ball to you and they put you in the outfield where you're not going to make any damage. that they're winning or anything like that. And I have to imagine you felt much that same way. But can you maybe talk about this,

Starting point is 00:23:42 what it felt like for you and how that made you think about your own uniqueness and your own feeling like you were enough? I have such a similar experience. So I really appreciate you sharing what you did. I dreaded gym class all through school for the same scenario. no one ever wanted me on their team. And then when they did, it was they were forced to. And then often, you would hear them complain under their breath.

Starting point is 00:24:08 Oh, great, I guess our team's not going to win today. But the only time people wanted me on their team was when we were playing dodgeball because I was like short and fast and hard to hit. Any other time, no one wanted me on their team. And so for a long time, I internalized that and thought, oh, I'm not an athlete. I don't have anything to contribute to my athletic team. And there's going to be a point to this. So stick with me.

Starting point is 00:24:29 When I got to high school, I was told. by the administration. If you want a good college application, you really should think about playing a sport to add it to your application. I was like, okay. So I tried out for cheerleading because I had done gymnastics as a kid. My parents are really great at fostering some of those really passions. And I tried out and lo behold, I made the squad and they embraced me with open arms and it was really great and it was myself and three other boys. And that year, we went to the state cheerleading competition. And we took first place and brought home a state championship title for that year.

Starting point is 00:25:01 And that was the first time where I felt like what you just described, where I didn't just belong, but I mattered. And that for me, I could be a part of this team. And collectively, we could all bring our gifts together and bring home this great win. And that was the first time where I felt that more as like a young adult and understanding how important that was. And then also understanding that I shouldn't rely on other people to give me that. feeling, I also have to own that and feel that for myself, which I just learned about 10 years ago

Starting point is 00:25:35 through lots of therapy. But I think that's really important. I think it's a good framing that you put that through. So I definitely have that experience. And I think there are different forms of isolation and childhood that we're all going through. And I recently wrote a children's book about mattering because the sad thing is our kids four to eight years old, almost 40 percent of them don't feel like they matter for various different reasons. But I'm not. But I'm not really, But it's just, I think everyone is susceptible to this experience of feeling isolated. And it happens during different stages. It could happen when you're going into middle school and people are bullying you because

Starting point is 00:26:16 you wear different clothes than they do or you talk differently than they do or you name it. And then that leads to isolation in college. And then it leads to fear of abandonment. and then withdrawing further. And then you start going into a life where you're visible on the outside, but you feel more and more invisible on the inside. Yeah. And for you, you went through all that,

Starting point is 00:26:43 and then there was a breakthrough that happened. What was that breakthrough? I had a couple. The first one really was when I was in college, and I was studying for my degree, but I was miserable because I was starting to explore being queered and what that looked like and starting to understand. That's who I was.

Starting point is 00:27:03 And that was a really formative time in my life to be able to admit that and say it out loud and then live it and to understand that that was okay and that I did matter and that I was allowed to take up space and I was allowed to be who I authentically was born to be.

Starting point is 00:27:19 So that was like the first time. And then the second time where it broke free from this mold and this idea of what the world tells us we should be and how we should be is after when I was working at that salon, I was pretty miserable. And a friend invited me to go on a volunteer trip to Kenya with him to help build a school because he knew I was struggling. And he was like, let's like get you outside of your comfort zone. Let's go do something different.

Starting point is 00:27:41 And so we went. And it was a life-changing experience for all the things we were working, volunteering with a non-for-profit. And we helped to build a school. But then had the opportunity to visit one of the local schools and hang out with the kids. And they were very very cute and wanted to give me a tour of their schools. and then they wanted to ask me some questions about myself and about my body and about my disability. And after I shared a bunch of just about me, a young girl said to me that she didn't know something like this,

Starting point is 00:28:08 meaning the loss of my legs could also happen to white people too. And that phrase brought everything into focus for me. And up until that point, my disability was just something I thought that had happened to me. It wasn't really an identity yet. And that was the first time I was like, oh, there's something about my disability that I've missed. And on the flip side, I was like, oh, maybe I could be a motivational speaker. And I don't know if this has been your experience, John,

Starting point is 00:28:31 but there's this interesting thing for folks that, like, have very visible disabilities is everyone wants you to tell them your story. So they can feel inspired and they can do good things in the world. And I never wanted to be that type of speaker. And so when I went on this trip, I was like, oh, maybe it could be a speaker. And although I could tell my story, it would be in service to and on behalf of this organization that I had fallen in love with. And so then when I came back to North America, I just, I applied for a job there. And a few months later, moved to Canada where I was only going to stay for two years and then I never left.

Starting point is 00:29:05 I've since moved on from that organization. But that was the other really big time where it broke free of all of these ideals and carved my own path and went my own way. Does that answer your question? I think it does. I'm going to be vulnerable with you and lean into this a little bit because maybe it'll help one of the listeners. Sure. I do a lot of public speaking. And every single time, it is absolutely terrifying.

Starting point is 00:29:30 And it's the largest stage I have ever been on was I did the keynote at the Dream Force in the late 2000s, like 2009-ish, 10-ish, 11-ish time frame. And get up on stage and I'm out there with Mark Benioff, who's the CEO of the company. And there are 45,000 people out there. And we had rehearsed the day. day before we had a teleprompter in front of us and I knew Mark and I knew that he goes off the script all the time so we didn't do anything that we had rehearsed for nothing on the teleprompters oh no and to make it worse Will I am from the black eyed peas who's a good friend of his was in the front row doing googly things at us trying to get us to crack out

Starting point is 00:30:18 that's not what makes it terrifying for me what makes it terrifying for me is Because of what happened to me from that head injury, oftentimes what is going on in my mind and what is coming out at my mouth are two entirely different things. And so I misspeak, I mispronounce, I still listen. And when it happens, it makes me seem sometimes like an idiot because I will say the wrong thing because what I'm thinking is the right thing, but what comes out of my mouth is completely different. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:30:51 And it happens. And so now I've learned to, if it does. happen. I lean into it and I say this is why it happens and it really and it gets smoothed over, but you never want it to happen. Yeah. And it happens sometimes without even you knowing it, it happens because you go, you rush through the moment and don't even realize you've misspoken. Totally. So I like to speak. It's important that I speak, especially get the message out that I want to, but it's never something that I intentionally want to do. Yeah. There are ways I've tried to compensate for by taking improv classes and doing postmasters.

Starting point is 00:31:31 So I'm putting myself out there and trying through just mere practicing, trying to get more comfortable that it's not going to happen. And that's what typically happens is it happens less. That's great. And I think that's good to get outside of your comfort zone. But I will say I definitely, I've never had a fear of public speaking. I get nervous, but I'm not afraid to do it. But what I think, and I wish, it's easy for me to say.

Starting point is 00:31:59 But for me, I just think when we make mistakes, like, that's the stuff that I love as an audience member because I'm like, oh, you're human. You're like me. And I'm like you. I just, one of those moments happen, I actually love it now because I'm like, oh, it gives me a chance to be like, oh, this was a mistake. All right. And then it allows people to do the same, to lean into the vulnerability of, we're not going to to get everything right all of the time. And if we try to move past it or pretend like it didn't happen, that's not helpful. And so what you're doing is by explaining what's happening and why it's

Starting point is 00:32:31 happening. I think that's so beautiful because I think that's where connection happens because then we can see ourselves in that person. So we book, Spencer, you talk about something called the trap. What did that look like for you personally? Yeah. There was two things. The big one was really my job working at the salon at the time and and being and creating this trap of my own design of okay well I got a good job and it's making me lots of money so I did the thing so I might as will just stay here and then that's like I said after four years I was like oh I don't want to be here anymore this is not where I want to be and I needed to get outside of my comfort zone and try something else what started for me is to get out of that trap as I was living with my best

Starting point is 00:33:15 friend and he was taking interior design classes at Scottsdale Community College. I was living in Phoenix at the time. And I was watching how excited and passionate he was about his life. And I was like, oh, I don't feel that way at all. In fact, I'm kind of jealous. This is how you're feeling about your life when like, I am miserable over here. So I started to take theater classes again because I did theater all through school. And that's initially what I wanted to do with my life, but then realize that's probably not going to work out for me. But I started taking theater classes again. And that's how he slowly started to get out of that trap

Starting point is 00:33:49 because the joy came back in my life of like, oh, yeah, I forgot. There's things that I love to do. And so it was through that helped me recognize, oh, I was in this trap and this loop that I no longer want to be in. And the first step to get out of that was to find something that I loved to do that brought me that joy, which then made me realize, oh, I want more of this joy. I want to keep feeling this way,

Starting point is 00:34:11 which then ultimately, me to go to East Africa. So yeah, the track was something that I created myself and then had to figure out how to get myself out of. And for someone who's listening right now, how would they recognize that they're in that trap? Yeah, I think there's a couple of things. It's to really take a look at where am I at right now? What am I, am I feeling happy about everything in my life? Are there areas of my life that bring me joy? Or are there areas of life that I'm like, wow, I'm really struggling with this specific area. Again, maybe it's where you live,

Starting point is 00:34:44 maybe it's your relationship, whatever that might be. And then really looking at where do I want to be? Like, where do I want to go? And then we can ask ourselves some questions of, am I showing up as my full self all of the time? Are there parts of myself that I'm hiding? If so, why?

Starting point is 00:35:02 Start to answer some of these questions. And that's what I did in the book, which I might have mentioned earlier, is at the end of every chapter, I've given people questions and exercises and different perspectives to think about in hopes to help them figure these answers out for themselves as well like I did. So two of the central questions that I liked from the book are why am I here and where I want to be in the future. Yeah. And I think it's really important that we're discussing this.

Starting point is 00:35:29 I'm not sure if you've ever heard of Tom Gillivich, who's a professor at Cornell University or his research. Oh, please tell me. So he has really been studying, among other things, regrets that people have. And he has spoken to thousands of people who are in their third trimester of life. And 76% of them have the same regret. And it's not living their ideal life. And it's interesting because as I've talked to hospice nurses, Ronnie Ware, being one of them, who wrote the book, Five Sayings of the Dying,

Starting point is 00:36:07 I can't remember the book. I should. Brain fart. But she mentions the same thing in a different way. But what's interesting to me is it's the same exact thing from observing this with people in the actual experience of going through that phase and someone who's looking at it through a scientific lens. But if that's 76% of us, that's a ton of people who still have a child inside of them who had this dream when they were younger, like you did, of being an actor. In many ways, they're still dreaming those dreams, but they're letting them just die on the vein until it's too late to do something about it.

Starting point is 00:36:48 Yeah. And to me, that's really sad. And it's one of the main reasons that I'm motivated to do this podcast and other things because I think that is one of the reasons that is leading so many people to feel the way that we are in. society today. And to me, a lot of this gets back to, I recently did this solo episode about the Truman Show. And when people see that movie, a lot of people gravitate to the end of the movie when he is sailing in the storm and he runs into the side of the sphere and then he walks out

Starting point is 00:37:26 and does the bow. But what I really concentrated on was the spotlight coming. When a spotlight falls from the sky and he's what in the world is going on. But everyone around him is acting like life is completely normal. And I think we all have spotlight moments like that. Some are more visible than others, but it's really about activation. And when that spotlight happens, how do you stop waiting for permission for you to do something different with your life and identify how to take that next step. What do you advise people to do when that spotlight hits? Yeah, it's so funny. That's literally the name of one of my chapters is find your spotlight. No, that's why I used it. I figured. Yeah, like I said, for me, it was like taking that theater class and remembering how

Starting point is 00:38:18 much joy it brought me. And not that I was doing it for a job, but just that it gave me that simple sense of pleasure, which then brought more pleasure into my life and then wanted me, it forced me to start seeking more of that in other areas of my life. It's like, oh, this is making me feel good. I actually find a job that makes me feel good. So I think it's like doing those small things. Now, you don't have to go to East Africa and you don't have to necessarily take an acting class, but maybe you're like, I'm going to try a yoga class and see if that works out for me,

Starting point is 00:38:46 see how that feels. Something that I recently started doing, I still do this in my own life all the time. I started learning how to sew with a sewing machine. There's a great little place near where I live in the city here in Toronto where they do like adult sewing classes where you learn how to make a tote bag and learn how to use a pattern. So it's just like getting out there and doing some things that you used to love to do or currently love to do and just making space and time for those things. Another example to just even simplify it even further.

Starting point is 00:39:11 And when I was in therapy, my therapist was like, what do you like to do in your spare time? And I was like, I don't know. My life is my work and my work is my life. I don't know. And she was like, I think you really need to foster a sense of play here. And one of the things that I realize that I love to do is put together Lego. And so even it's just simple as carving out of an. hour for yourself to put Lego together. That's what sort of helps you find your own spotlight.

Starting point is 00:39:32 It doesn't necessarily mean on a stage, but it means what's something that you just love to do, that you want to do? And I think that's what helps us aid towards looking at like, how do I bring all of these aspects into my life so that I'm feeling joy everywhere. It's funny. The name of this podcast, obviously, is passion struck. And I wrote a book of the same name. And I started to realize on Amazon when I was getting some, reviews for it that weren't very kind that these people for whatever reason were targeting the book and had never read it when they were talking about that it was about passion and relationships and how it dies and how the book wasn't delivering on that promise.

Starting point is 00:40:16 Okay. But I'm going into this because one of the key areas you focus on in the book is going from passion to purpose, which is really a lot of what the term passion struck is about. For you, when you hear those words passion struck, what does it mean for you to live a passion struck life? Yeah, I think for me is whenever possible, I want to do things that I feel passionate about. I want to spend my time doing things that bring me joy, that bring me light and love and excitement. And then to take that further and then to also have some sort of purpose to it. There are passions that we do, as I mentioned, like, like, oh, and sewing, which are just for me,

Starting point is 00:41:00 but Kilimanjaro was an example of that. I had this passion of this organization that I was working for. And I was traveling 200 days out of the year as a speaker, which was great and also grueling. And I was telling audiences that you need to get involved with the things that you're passionate about.

Starting point is 00:41:15 You need to run campaigns, whether that's fundraising or awareness. But I was just talking about it and I never actually done it myself. And then I wasn't getting time with my friends and family because I was traveling so much. And that's what I learned was so paramount

Starting point is 00:41:26 to recharging my batteries. And so I'd been speaking for so long, that had become my passion, but there was no purpose to it anymore. It was just a job. And so that's when I decided to climb Mount Kilimanjaro and it wasn't just to climb the mountain. So many disabled people have climbed the mountain before me and so many have climbed after me. That was old news to me. But I wanted to raise a half a million dollars for clean water in East Africa. And I wanted that passion to translate into a purpose.

Starting point is 00:41:52 So it wasn't just living for myself that I could translate that to other things as well. So yeah, so passion struck for me is that idea of, oh, everything that I do, I want to have some sort of passion in it and hopefully have some joy and then translate that into some sort of purpose. The same reason why I use social media. I use social media because I want attention. I use social media because I want to educate folks on the intersectionality of my identities and what that looks like. So yes, we can have some fun and make some jokes and do some fun things every now and then. But also, there needs to be a purpose to it. And I think that's what really helps us break free from all the things we're trying to break free from.

Starting point is 00:42:25 when we move from passion to purpose. Yeah, and in the book, you write, when you were in Kenya, I found the link between what I love to do and what I felt called to do. And that was to combine my love of performance through public speaking with the power of my own disability. And I think that is something we don't realize.

Starting point is 00:42:46 It's we have superpowers, but sometimes I don't think we see the superpower in the same way that other people might see it. A lot of people would think, my disability, how could that ever be my superpower? And for you, you double down upon it. Why do you think that's something we tend to ignore, not to double down on something that other people see as a weakness,

Starting point is 00:43:09 but we, if we really looked at it, would see it as a core strength that we have? I think for me it was like, because people were always singling me out from physically looking different all the time every day, I was like, I just want to fit in. I just want to feel normal, so to speak. But now as I've gotten older in hindsight, I'm like, oh, that's not what I want.

Starting point is 00:43:34 What makes me, how do I want to say this? I think for me, what I realized is the beauty is in the difference. It's not in if we all looked the same and we were all doing the same thing and all speaking the same way and dressing the same way, life would be so boring. But that felt so safe at the time because I didn't want to be singled out because people were doing it anyway. But then when I was like, oh, if I take control of the narrative, if I'm the one that is leaning into this identity, then that feels better for me. And every time that I did the opposite of what I thought I should do is where all of the magic lived.

Starting point is 00:44:08 You know what I mean? So leaning into my disability, suddenly was like, oh, everything starts to work out for me when it wasn't working out before. So the part just felt really important to me. But I think it was because before that, I just wanted to fit in, not realizing that that was actually not helpful for me. Spencer, there's a part in the book that got to get you to tell this story. So I was never fortunate enough to meet General Norman Schwarzkopf, but I actually know his daughter who lives here. And you write that he gave you a Spirit of Courage Award. But can you go through the background of this and what happened?

Starting point is 00:44:48 because I thought it was a pretty interesting event. Totally. So growing up in Wyoming, my dad and his dad and his brothers are very much men who like to hunt and to fish. And they're very passionate about it. And a lot of their identity, which I have such appreciation for. But they wanted me, my dad wanted me as his only son, to be that person too. And I just really wasn't. When I was 16, my grandfather always wanted to take me hunting in South Africa.

Starting point is 00:45:16 and I just, I never liked the idea of it. It was so uncomfortable for me. I don't feel like I should have that much power over another living being, but I was like, all right, I'll go because it's like he's been talking about it forever and I might as well try. And so we went and we went hunting and we did all the things. And I didn't really like that aspect of it,

Starting point is 00:45:36 but I liked being in South Africa. And then when I came home, the Safari Club International, which is, that's a whole other story for another day, but they wanted to give me this award called the Spirit of Courage Award for going hunting in South Africa. And General Norman Schwarzenegov

Starting point is 00:45:53 was going to present the award. And at the time, George Bush was the president, the first George Bush senior. And he was also there. And so I went and accepted this award. But in my mind, it was like, this feels so silly. This disabled person went hunting

Starting point is 00:46:05 and now you're honoring me for you're giving me an award. He didn't take courage. The thing that took courage is wanting to hang out with my grandfather, my dad, and build things. That was terrible. That's what took courage.

Starting point is 00:46:14 So there's just this, weird thing about disabled people and doing normal things that are celebrated for. And it's like, I'm just living my life. But I was such a weird thing that I never quite understood. I have to ask, I answer, what does it mean to become the Karen for others? I mean, maybe I'm mispronouncing the name. No, that's right. So first, just context. Karen, I learned when I was on Kilimanjaro. So one of the days, my buddies and I were really struggling. Altitude was affecting us. And we were going to reing back and forth because we hadn't slept well. and we'd notice that there was like these intentional piles of rocks along the route at Kilimanjaro.

Starting point is 00:46:51 And when we were struggling, our guide just said, it said, guys, let's take a break. And he's, let's talk about what these are. And then he told us, he was like, these are Karens. And a Karend is a symbol for when you're lost. It shows where the path is again, both physically and emotionally and spiritually. And that was like, it was like a big moment for all of us to remember A, why we're there. But for me, it was also a bit of validation.

Starting point is 00:47:14 Oh, I think that's part of my. my job here, this life that I have right now is to be that sort of caring for other folks, to be like, hey, I figured a few things out. So follow me over here, and I've got a few answers. And we all have the capacity to be that for other people. This is not just something that I can do because I've written a book or I've gone on tour with Dem deum the bottom. This is something we all have the capacity to do. You do with your podcast is just giving folks an example of what life could look like and then daring them to keep walking on the path to create that for themselves. and then vice versa.

Starting point is 00:47:46 But I think it's important for us to recognize that we all have that power to be able to do so and to lean into that whenever possible. I think it's a powerful symbol. And I always like acronyms and symbols because I think they help you to at least help me to remember things. I always try to create an acronym for everything and then link into something that I can visually remember, especially when I'm doing public speaking, because that's what helps we keep the order of things in place.

Starting point is 00:48:15 I did want to take an opportunity to go outside the book for a second. Given that you are such a prolific public speaker, and I know that's something that either members of the audience are aspiring to be more of or maybe it's something that scares people half to death. What have you found are some of the keys that have made you such a success in this space? I had a really great mentor who was, although was a bit harsh and I wish maybe he could have been a bit softer, was so helpful in helping me understand how to be a good speaker. And I'll never forget, she was so lovely to work with me every Sunday in the office to I would present my speech. And then he would give me feedback.

Starting point is 00:48:58 I remember the first time that I presented a speech. At the end, he was like, Spencer, I have my legs. Why should I care about this? And that was the first time that I learned one of the most important rules of and what I think is the most important to be a really great speaker is to know your audience.

Starting point is 00:49:15 And by knowing your audience, how can you relate your story to them? Because if you're just going to get up there and tell your story, that's nice. And people might be inspired by that. But then they're going to go home and that's kind of going to be it. And so he really helped me understand

Starting point is 00:49:33 how to tell his story. So although I'm telling you how I lost my legs, at the end of the story, I usually will bring it back to the audience and help them understand how what that means to them or for them or what that looks like. So I think it's really understanding your audience and knowing that anytime you're going to tell a story, how is it relating to them or how can you relate it to them? And I think for me, that has been the key to my success. The other thing that I would say is I for so long, I was like a youth speaker because I was in my, mid to late 20 is when I started speaking professionally. So I was speaking to a lot of schools and a lot of middle school, high school, and university students.

Starting point is 00:50:11 And then they were like, we want you to maybe transition into corporate speaking. Would you be interested in that? And I was like, okay, and tried to write this corporate speech, tried to read a bunch of books on business. That wasn't my degree. I studied communication, not business. And then I had another mentor who sat me down and he was like, you don't need to understand anything about business.

Starting point is 00:50:30 He was like, your job is to share lessons that you've learned. So he was like, tell me a couple stories that you love to tell or stories that people never heard before. And he helped me understand. Oh, there's a lesson here for corporate people. They'll give an example. One of them is I talk about my speech as the importance of asking for help. And I talk about climbing Kilimanjaro and help. Friends needed my help at the end.

Starting point is 00:50:50 I needed their help at the beginning. But then I related back to the audience and this idea that depending on the audience, it's like, if you work in HR, your job is to help folks navigate the company and all the things that come along with that. or if you're a teacher, your job is to help students get the knowledge they need to then go be whatever they want to be out in the world. And so although my story is about Kilimanjaro, the lesson is we all have the capacity to ask for help and should. So I think it's those two things. Know your audience and how can you relate to what you're talking about to the audience. So it's not just you telling your story. When you do your public speeches, do you invite a Q&A or typically not?

Starting point is 00:51:27 Always. I love a Q&A. and that's actually one of the ways that I learned that my speaking wasn't effective in the beginning because I would give this great speech and then at the end, undoubtedly someone raised their hand and want to know what happened to your legs

Starting point is 00:51:40 because I wasn't really telling that part of the story and it was like, oh my God, they've heard nothing. That's the thing that they've been thinking about this whole time is like, where are your legs? So I like Q&A because it gives you a chance to expand on what you've talked about, but sometimes it's also helpful to get some feedback. And oh, what are people listening to?

Starting point is 00:51:59 What did they hear? What did they pick up? And are these things that I should lean into more or things that maybe I shouldn't lean into? So I love a good Q&A. Yeah. What's one of the most bizarre Q&A questions you've ever gotten? This wasn't necessarily a question, but I remember I have a speech where I talk about leveraging talent with disabilities and the importance of hiring disabled folks.

Starting point is 00:52:22 And I break down some of the myths of why what stops employers from hiring folks like myself. And then I was talking about how we can all be allies and what we can do for the disabilities community and then I was in a city where it was like snowing that day and I'll never forget one of the guys who worked for the city who runs the one of the snow plows is like this is all great but I'm just telling you that I'm not going to be able to have the sidewalk plow by the time you leave sorry I can't be an ally and so it's that I remember that thinking that was so funny and that he was just being honest and vulnerable in that moment and then one time years ago I had a high school students raise their hand and be like do you wear boxes or briefs so I've had a whole slew of odd and funny questions over the years, but those are the two that come to mind currently. Yeah, because I've recently published this children's book, I've been now talking to a lot of elementary students, and I will tell you, they ask some of the most profound and unexpected questions you will ever not be prepared for in your life. Totally, totally. And it's such a spectrum, right? Because sometimes it's this really

Starting point is 00:53:23 deep question that you're like, how does your little brain, your little body know to think these things? And then other times it's like, what's your favorite dinosaur? Yes. Yes, and I've gotten both of those full spectrums of questions. Totally. Spencer, I always like to end these episodes by giving the listeners some homework. If someone's listening and they feel right now like their life doesn't just quite fit, what's one step that they could take today to help them break free and start living the life that they want to?

Starting point is 00:53:58 I think there's two things. I think we mentioned it earlier asking yourself the question, why am I here? And really leaning into that and stop worrying about what life is and start wondering what it could be. I think those are the two things that, that, you know, as when I was writing this book that really resonated and that I hope people will pick up on is to really just pause and take a look around you and why am I here it and what do I want? And then having that ability to wonder what could be. Because part of the framework also for this book is this idea that we have to have self-trust and self-confidence. The self-trust to be able to listen to what's in here and what we want and the self-confidence to believe that you can actually achieve whatever that is. And so to do that, I think we have to start with those questions.

Starting point is 00:54:46 Awesome. Spencer, for people who want to learn more about you, where's the best place for them to go? You can find me on social media on Instagram and TikTok and YouTube at Spencer the number to the West. So Spencer to the West. and then I've got a website which is west.com. And if you're not familiar with Spencer's accounts, you definitely want to check them out. You are quite the hit on social media. So congratulations to you on that success.

Starting point is 00:55:12 And thank you so much for joining me on Parish. It's my pleasure, John. And thank you for all the kindness and caring that you put into today. It was very much appreciated and noticed. That brings us to the end of today's conversation with Spencer West. And what I hope stays with you is this. The greatest limitations in our lives are often not physical. They're psychological.

Starting point is 00:55:33 They're the expectations we've inherited, the identities we've accepted, the stories we've repeated so often that they begin to feel like the truth. Spencer reminds us that flourishing doesn't begin when our circumstances change. It begins when we stop living someone else's definition of success and begin trusting our own voice. Authenticity isn't something we discover, it's something we uncover. It's what remains after we've stripped away everything that never truly belonged to us. As we continue the Connection Crisis series, we'll be joined by Adrian Gostick.

Starting point is 00:56:06 For decades, Adrian has studied one of the most overlooked drivers of human connection. The simple but profound experience of feeling seen, valued, and appreciated. Together, we'll explore why so many workplaces unintentionally create cultures of fear instead of trust, why recognition is far more powerful than rewards and what every leader can do to help people feel that they truly matter. Because whether we're talking about families, friendships, or organizations, people flourish where they believe they are valued. We're all living right now in these uncertain world,

Starting point is 00:56:40 and you can't take that away for people. You can't make the world this simple, easy to understand place anymore. We're living in Vuka, right? Volatility, uncertainty, complexity, ambiguity. That's our borderline. place right now. That's the baseline. And so with that, though, you don't have to amp things up. You don't have to create more pressure. I was in one big Fortune 500, big brand. And one of the employees told me, he says, working here, he says, they have this description that a gun is

Starting point is 00:57:10 placed in your back when you start, and the trigger is pulled. If you stop sprinting, the bullet will get you. If today's conversation challenged the way you think about identity, please share it with someone who may need the reminder that they don't have to keep living someone else's story. You can find today's companion workbook and additional resources at the United Life.net. Check us out on YouTube and until next time, remember this. The life you were meant to live doesn't begin when you become someone else. It begins when you finally have the courage to become yourself. I'm John Miles and you've been passion-struck.

Passion Struck with John R. Miles - How to Overcome Identity Distortion and Live Authentically | Spencer West - EP 784

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