Passion Struck with John R. Miles - Laura Numeroff on Creating a Story of Resilience and Triumph EP 352

Starting point is 00:00:00 Coming up next on Passion Struck. When I was eight years old, I did want to become a children's author. I didn't really pay attention to my gut because I wanted to be like my sister, which wasn't authentic. I hate that word, but it's true. Everybody talks about your true self, your authentic self. And obviously that's what it came back to is what was in my heart, what was in my gut that I wanted to do. It's so true that if you have a passion and you love it,

Starting point is 00:00:28 I'm very lucky to be one of the few people who get to make a living as an author. Welcome to PassionStruct. Hi, I'm your host, John Armiles, and on the show, we decipher the secrets, tips, and guidance of the world's most inspiring people and turn their wisdom into practical advice for you and those around you. Our mission is to help you unlock the power of intentionality so that you can become the best version of yourself. If you're new to the show, I offer advice and answer listener questions on Fridays.

Starting point is 00:01:02 We have long-form interviews the rest of the week with guest-ranging from astronauts to authors, CEOs, creators, innovators, scientists, military leaders, visionaries, and athletes. Now, let's go out there and become PassionStruck. Hello everyone and welcome back to episode 352 of PassionStruck. Ranked by Apple is one of the top 10 most popular health podcasts. Thank you to all of you come back weekly to listen and learn how to live better, be better, and impact the world. PassionStruck is also on syndicated radio on the Brushwood Media Network, Catchest Money and Friday, from 5 to 6 pm Eastern Time on your evening commute.

Starting point is 00:01:38 Links will be in the show notes. If you're new to the show, thank you so much for being here. Or you simply want to introduce this to a friend or a family member we now have episode starter facts. And these are collections of our fans favorite episodes that we organize. In the convenient topics that give any new listener a great way to get acclimated, everything that we do here on the show. Either go to Spotify or PassionStrike.com slash starter facts.

Starting point is 00:01:58 Get started. In case you missed it earlier in the week, I was joined by the renowned leadership thought leader and featureist Jacob Morgan. My discussion with Jacob was so enlightening that I split it into two parts, both equally compelling. The first delved deep into the future of work, personal branding, evolving, employer-employee relationships, reskilling, and a tech-driven world that paramount importance of employee well-being.

Starting point is 00:02:22 In part two, Jacob unveils the vulnerable leader equation, a groundbreaking concept that redefines vulnerability in leadership. This equation serves as the foundation for his upcoming book, Leading with Vulnerability Set to Launch on October 3rd. Please check both part one and part two of Jacob's episode. If they made a positive impact on you, I would very much appreciate you considering giving us a five star rating and a review and sharing it with your friends and family. Those ratings go such a long way, and bringing more people in the passion for our community. I know we and our guests love to see comments from our listeners. Now let's talk about today's interview. I have the honor of speaking with the renowned children's book author, with a prolific career spanning

Starting point is 00:03:00 over four decades. Laura has captivated young readers and inspired countless imaginations with her beloved if you give, with her beloved if you give, series, and other enchanting tales. But Laura's impact extends well beyond her enchanting stories. She has become a beacon of inspiration through her philanthropic endeavors and unwavering commitment to making a difference in the lives of others. From our work with organizations like It Takes a Village and Canine Companions to our contributions, charitable causes such as the Susan G. Homan Cancer Foundation, and first book, Laura has demonstrated her deep compassion and dedication to creating a better world. In our conversation today, we delve into the fascinating journey of this celebrated author. We explore the origins of Heraconic,

Starting point is 00:03:44 if you give a Mausah cookie series series uncovering the inspiration and evolution that led to its tremendous success. We also discuss the creative process behind her diverse range of books including her recent work Raising a Hero which supports Canine Companions and Shed's Light on the Power of Service Dogs. But Laura's impact goes far beyond the pages of her books. We'll explore her incredible experiences from visiting schools and children's hospitals worldwide, to virtually connecting with students from different cultures and backgrounds. Doing us as we embark on this inspiring conversation with Laura Numeroff, we'll delve into the transformative power of storytelling, the importance of embracing creativity and resilience,

Starting point is 00:04:22 and the true essence of leaving a lasting legacy. Thank you for choosing PassionStruck and choosing me. Be your host and guide in your journey to creating an intentional life now. Let that journey begin. I am so honored and thrilled to welcome Laura Numeroff to PassionStruck. Welcome, Laura. Hello, how are you? Lauren Umoroff to Passionstruck. Welcome, Laura. Hello. How are you? I am doing fantastic. And I am so excited to interview you.

Starting point is 00:04:48 My kids absolutely loved your books when they were younger. Oh, thank you for sharing them with them. Yeah, I think we started with the Moose book, which I think was the second book in the series if I have it correct. No, you're absolutely correct. And it's my favorite out of the nine. Oh, I didn't know that.

Starting point is 00:05:06 I know they also liked about the pigs and the pancake as well. It's such a popular series of books, and I think the fourth one actually was under the New York Times bestseller list for something like number one on the list for five or six months. A lot of them were on the list, but I've lost track and it wasn't originally bought as a series. So when I eventually, after nine rejections sold, if you give a mouse a cookie, that was my tenth book. I had already written and illustrated nine others. And they didn't do any promotion. I didn't do any book tours or anything because nobody really knew who I was and they didn't want to spend

Starting point is 00:05:49 money on the none now. Luckily, it took off and I was reading it to a classroom making like $50 a day for talking to kids at schools and the teacher said, oh, it's a really good circular story. And I asked her, oh, what's a circular story? Because I hadn't written it intentionally, it's such. And eventually, a couple of years later, they did most. Still not a series. Then, two or two later, they did pig, pancake, and then I got a contract for

Starting point is 00:06:29 six more books. So that's when it became a series. I have to imagine once you got that deal for six books, it was probably both exhilarating and at the same time terrifying because I'm guessing after you do so many ideas it gets hard to keep coming up with more. Exactly. You hit the nail on the head. Yes. If you give a mouse cookie, I got the idea in my head, beginning middle and end, when I was on a long drive with my boy friend at the time, the drama from Night Ranger. We were living in San Francisco and we used to go to Oregon to visit his parents. The first two times the drive is really beautiful. And then like by the third time I was starting to get a little bored. And when I get bored,

Starting point is 00:07:17 I get antsy and when I get antsy, I get silly. And I started thinking of animals and food that I like. So I pictured a beautiful black and white zebra eating Cheetos. But what I can't understand is if you can put a man on the moon, I can't they get it so you can eat Cheetos, but not have to lie. And say, oh, I didn't have Cheetos. Oh, it's on that arm. You're on your mouth and on your fingers. So I pictured arm around the mouth of this zebra and I love pizza. And you know how orangutans have long gangly arms and when you pick up a slice of pizza, the cheese gets all stringy.

Starting point is 00:07:57 So I pictured an orangutang being tangled up in cheese string. And at that time Mrs. Feehls came out with those gigantic talkative cookies, and I pictured a mouse nibbling on it. But instead of thinking of another animal, I just started thinking he'd want milk and a straw and an napkin and then on and on until we got to his parents' house and I had it finished, came back to San Francisco and I typed it out on my $50 wonky typewriter and sent it out and got it rejected nine times. And then finally we broke up, I moved to Los Angeles to try to write the television, I got a phone call from at the time Harper and Roe, now Harper Collins, saying, we'd like to buy your book. That was the

Starting point is 00:08:49 tenth book and since I sold my first book in college in 1975, I've written 47 illustrated magazines. Well, that's amazing. And if I have it correct, when you sold the mouse book, you had originally gone to Harper and the editor you went to, turned you down, and then you resummeted to a new editor that you had heard had joined. Is that correct? I did. There were eight other publishers in between the original rejection from Harper. So about a year later, I heard that there was a new editor, her name was Laura, so I just thought I'd give it a try.

Starting point is 00:09:26 I'm hitting the nail on the head. Most editors read, first they read manuscripts by the authors they work with, and they read manuscripts that are sent in by agents. I don't know now, this was in 1981 or 1980 something. They have what's called a slush pile and they have some person reading all the manuscripts in the slush pile and if they come across something that you think is worthy of showing to the editor that's what they do and somebody found mouse in the slush pile and brought it to Laura. I don't

Starting point is 00:10:01 really know how it went to the first editor, but that person has never come forth. I wish they would, so I could thank him or her. Well, the whole publishing world is a bit of a mystery to me, because you and I were discussing a little bit beforehand. I first had a very hard time even finding an agent. I probably approached over 60 of them and kept getting turned down for what was maddening because everyone gave me a different reasons if i would have gotten some commonality of answers it would have made more sense but some said you don't have a big enough platform other said they didn't know if the content was going to resonate other said they didn't rep first time authors so it was like this myriad of things So I actually went down the self publishing route and then just said, I'm going to give this one more go. And I rewrote the book proposal. It had been about

Starting point is 00:10:51 eight or nine months later. I redid the chapters. And at this point, the podcast had gotten significantly bigger and all four agents, I sent it to bid on it. And I ended up going with the one I felt most comfortable with. And then proceeded to get rejected time and time again by every publisher we sent it to. And the funny thing this time is that most of the publishers liked the book, but they didn't think I had a big enough platform to bolster its success. And that's why Harper passed on me as well as Heshatt. Penguin loved it, but it didn't fit their editorial direction. Oh, you had four agents?

Starting point is 00:11:31 Or fitting? The last four that I sent it to all said that they would be interested in working with me and I ended up picking the one I'm working with. That's incredible. I've just been rejected by four agents. Congratulations, I think that's really great. I think people think authors or it really be anyone achieves these great things and it just comes up out of nowhere. And I know your journey had a very interesting start because

Starting point is 00:11:59 as I understand it, you went to the Pratt Institute following in your siblings' footsteps. I have learned was to get into the fashion industry. What ended up happening with that pursuit? And then how did you then change to going into becoming a writer? Well, I have two older sisters. The one in the middle, Emily, is 10 years older than me. When I was eight, I wanted to be a children's author. I was an avid reader,

Starting point is 00:12:26 and Eloise and Stuart Little were the two books that inspired me to want to write my own books. But as I got older around 15 or 16, I really idolized Emily, who was a fashion designer. By the time I was ready to go to college, I decided I was going to do that. I only applied to Pratt. I got in for fashion. This was 1971, and I hated it. I hated it. I couldn't sell.

Starting point is 00:12:54 It was just not what I had anticipated. The second year I majored in photography, which is another passion of mine, and I didn't think that I was going to make a career out of it. So by my third year, Pratt Institute had something called University Without Walls. So you were matched up with a counselor, and you could take classes in other colleges. You could travel. I had an internship with an animator from Sesame Street. I had an internship at the only jazz station in New York. I got credit for having my own jazz show at the school station. I spent six weeks in France with 14 other students studying illustration and photography. And then my last semester. I was at school of visual arts

Starting point is 00:13:48 or Parsons. I can't remember what I was looking through their catalog for something easy. So I called my counselor, my guidance counselor, and I'm going to take Tai Chi. He said, hold on. And he came back on the phone. And he said, you need two studio credits,

Starting point is 00:14:03 which is some art class. So I looked through the catalog again and saw writing and illustrating children's books and I thought that's probably easy. So I took the class, I might teacher assigned us a homework to do writing illustrator own book. And we did our own books, which are called dum called Dummy is the mock up of a book. And I wrote a book called Amy to Short about the tallest girl in the third grade,

Starting point is 00:14:30 even though I wasn't, and brought it into the critique and she liked it and I had an illustration portfolio at the time. So I sucked the dummy in the portfolio made appointments with our directors at the publishers and oh I just happen to have this with me. So the first four publishers I went to, nothing happened. The fifth appointment I had was with McMillan and the art director took my dummy to the editor and they bought it. So I graduated with a degree in a Bachelor in Fine Arts and a contract for $500 to right illustrate my first book. And then I thought, okay, well, then I'm just going to be doing this, but it wasn't that

Starting point is 00:15:21 easy. And it wasn't really till now that I was Eventually put on the map Because we were discussing dealing with rejection as a common challenge for many aspiring authors as well as people and other Professions and I understand you have a motto of never give up. How has that helped you navigate through setbacks in your career? I've been to probably over 150 elementary schools talking to kids about my life and being an author. I always say mouse was rejected

Starting point is 00:15:56 nine times. What if on the eighth rejection or the third I just said I give up I can't do this anymore. I wouldn't be here.. I wouldn't be here. Mouse book wouldn't be in your hands. A couple of books that I've written that I have abandoned after a while because I get to see what is going on in the trend of children's books and realize I'm just not going to work. But I've had way more than nine rejections. For one book, I have a book called Would I Trade My Parents? And that was 15 rejections.

Starting point is 00:16:30 It's, it's tough. It's really hard. I get upset, I get disappointed, and I give it a day, and then I send it right back out to another publisher. Sometimes I send it out immediately. So in all days, in the sale mail, I had a way to get a letter of rejection.

Starting point is 00:16:47 And now I can get rejected the next day on email. I once got six rejections in one email. I've been rejected myself multiple times in a day. This was from one editor. Oh my goodness. I met her at a convention. And she said, oh, I'm a blah blah. And I said, I know you projected six bucks a month.

Starting point is 00:17:09 And then I punched her. Really? No. Actually, I do. I take boxing lessons. So you just wanted to punch her. Oh, yeah. Well, I'm glad you bring that up.

Starting point is 00:17:24 One of the people I've had on the podcast who I refer to along these lines frequently is one of my longest term mentors that I've had. Her name is Wendy Lawrence and I met Wendy during my youngster year at the Naval Academy and she went on to fly on the space shuttle multiple times. When I've interviewed her, one of the things that she says, as she talks to groups of kids, even to the state throughout the country, is so many people today give up on their dreams so quickly. And she always emphasizes the message

Starting point is 00:17:56 that you've got to give yourself permission to dream the dream. And with that comes lots of rejections. It's that resilience and then constantly taking action to get closer to where you want to go, that gives you, as you term it, that never give up mentality that eventually gets you towards success. As she written a memoir? I don't think she has, but I think it would be a great one. She was the first female distinguished graduate of the Naval Academy as well. Wow, she was the first female distinguished graduate of the Naval Academy as well.

Starting point is 00:18:24 Wow, that's incredible. Another similar story to this. I remember interviewing my friend Dan Pink and as we were talking, I said, is it easy for you to keep publishing these books? And he said, no, he said, as an author, you're only good as your last book. And I wonder if you've ever felt that way.

Starting point is 00:18:45 What was the author? Dan Pink, he's a repeat number one bestseller. His most recent book was the power of regret. Oh, it's also nonfiction. I don't know if I agree with that in my case, because Mouse was like 30 books ago, and it's still my best one. My latest language we can talk about in the philanthropic section is raising a hero on it's about service dogs. So that's my last book that I wrote, let my last book ever.

Starting point is 00:19:19 I was gonna go there, so why don't we talk about that? What motivated you to explore this book? What was your inspiration behind it? I was at a book convention and I lost my way at that time and I asked what he was doing at the convention and she said, she wrote a book about him. He's a surgeon, a SNIP dog. And she started telling me how they are trained and how far they can smell. It was, I was amazed. And I thought, if I don't know this, and there are a lot of kids that probably don't know this. So I wanted a right of a Paul dogs of jobs too and I started working on it

Starting point is 00:19:52 and I don't know what happened. I didn't keep up with it cut to five years ago. I needed help with my website and I found a young guy. His brother had severe cerebral palsy and had a service dog and when I met the dog and learned about what she could do I was blown away and I thought I have to write about this. So he told me about the dogs and what they do and how they're trained and we ended up going down to one of the facilities where they trained the dogs. I've been involved with CC, which is came on companions. They're the largest organization that trained service dogs and they have six or eight facilities in the United States.

Starting point is 00:20:35 And they give the dogs away for free. There's a waiting list. We ended up doing it ourselves with a kickstarter campaign. Because I really didn't want to get involved with the publisher on this one. I was very protective of it and I wanted it on the way I wanted it. We raised $35,000, which is a nice little chunk but wasn't enough really because Sean was going to be the publisher and get the book made and distributed, but we still needed an illustrator. We didn't have a budget for the one somebody I really wanted, which is Lynn Munsinger. So I ended up putting up notices in on college keyboards and stuff like that and trying to

Starting point is 00:21:19 find somebody who would take out maybe a flat rate, didn't find anybody. So I had done a bunch of books of Lynn Munsinger, she's my favorite all-time children's book illustrator. And Sean said, oh, just call her, just see what she says. And I was like, oh, I can't. It was just do it. So I did. And she ended up doing it as a gift to us.

Starting point is 00:21:41 She didn't charge us anything. Sean put together some little book tours, Barnes and Nobles in the different areas in Northern California. Amazon Barnes and Nobles ended up calling Sean to carry the book in the store. And it's got no over 105 store reviews on Amazon. And it didn't sell as well as we had hoped. I have since become incredibly involved with Canine Companions. I've been, you know, an honorary chair at their fundraisers and have met an amazing amount of puppyraisers. These people raised the puppy from eight weeks to a year and a half before they get sent to one of the facilities

Starting point is 00:22:25 for a year to learn the hard stuff. I've met people who have the dogs as service dogs, so the dogs are used for everything from kids with cerebral palsy up to autism, and they have a special program for that, so with PTSD. And I'm not one of them with his dog and he demonstrated. He put his head in his hands, well like he was really upset and the dog sat up and put his paws on his lap and he said, when he showed me a video of him in bed having a nightmare and the dog gets into bed and lays down on top of them. So the pressure is very relieving for panic attacks or nightmares. And it's been incredible.

Starting point is 00:23:11 Yeah, I was so happy to read about that because I originally went down the path of trying to get one from Southeast Guide Dogs, which is here in the Tampa area. And they do a lot for people who need dogs who are blind or have trouble seeing so guide dogs, but they also do dogs for veterans and unfortunately about 18 months into the waiting process about a month before I was supposed to get the dog I get a letter saying that they've decided not to give me a dog. I ended up at that point really wanting one and found my own and just did a whole bunch of YouTube videos and trained my dog on most of what he knows. Oh my goodness. Did they tell you why they weren't giving you the dog? Nope. Never gave me any answer. I tried to go back and ask and they refused to let me know.

Starting point is 00:24:03 But my dog does some of the similar things that you're describing. He knows how to go into the house and clear the house before I enter it to ensure that it's safe. If I'm having a night terror, he will come by the side of the bed and either look at me or put his paw on me. He can understand if I am having some type of episode or feeling weary and he'll come over and put his pond me or sit next to me. He knows how to block if I'm feeling uncomfortable in a

Starting point is 00:24:30 space. He knows how to watch if I have to have my back turned and don't feel comfortable. Seems like that. You taught him this? Yes, I did. Wow, I'm really impressed. Yeah, it takes a lot of work. They are bad, which is named. His name is Bentley. I love that. That's one of my top 20 names for dogs. Yeah, it's so funny because he's a black Bentley and we have friends who got another

Starting point is 00:25:00 lab at the same time and they named theirs Royce. So they have a silver Royce and I have a black bat. And if I have it correct, didn't you also donate a portion of book royalties to first book? I'm also involved with first book. First book, they were probably the first organization that I got heavily involved with. First book donate, a couple of brand new books

Starting point is 00:25:23 to kids who don't have any. And I donated a portion of I can do it. I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I can do it.

Starting point is 00:25:40 I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if I can do it. So sponsor a horse, have you heard of therapeutic riding? I have heard of it. Yeah, so it's these very gentle horses that are usually donated, they're used for kids and adults with Down syndrome, physical disabilities. And it gives them a sense of freedom and a good way

Starting point is 00:26:03 to stretch their muscles, give some confidence. There's a facility out here outside of LA. So I pay for his upkeep movement board, just not veterinary and bills, and his name is Linus. So there's a girl who has a dog from CCI or CC who writes him. So I'm a photographer, as far as with her dog and with Linus. That's wonderful. Yeah, and I wish there was a lot more than I could do. I also thought you did some stuff with around cancer awareness and prevention.

Starting point is 00:26:37 So about 25 years ago, I got a phone call from Sprint and they said they wanted to do a book for children for the month of October about breast cancer. And I said, I'm very honored and I'm left and I realized I've never written the non-fiction and I thank God I don't really know much about breast cancer and I called them back and they said, don't worry, we're going to introduce you to a doctor who's a survivor and has written a book for children about breast cancer. She told me at the hospital in Houston where she works, there's a little group of kids and they called them the

Starting point is 00:27:14 Hoke Tree. And then she gave me 10 points. Like it's not contagious. The whole house was turned upside down. We found out. And for each point, I came up with a child and a name and an age. So for you can't catch it. My mom told us that having cancer is like having a broken arm. You can't catch it. It's not contagious. And then I got one of my other favorite illustrators, David McPhale, to do the illustrations. So it's called the Hope Tree Kids Speak Out About Us Cancer. They sent me on a little mini book tour, and I went to some wellness centers, and then it was paperback. And then at the end of the month, that was it. I gave it to Simon and Schuster to print it in heart cover. And we, the doctor, myself and the illustrator,

Starting point is 00:28:07 donated all the money that it made to Susan Coleman. And Oprah had it on her show. The doctor was in the audience. So I guess you were right at the front panel. How wonderful. I unfortunately have had way too many issues with cancer in my family and my sister currently has pancreatic cancer, so it's definitely a topic that is close to my heart.

Starting point is 00:28:33 I'm very sorry. Speaking of Oprah, she's had my books on her show. She had a pig of pancake and she said, this is one of my favorite children's books. Sometimes I just have to read it in the morning. I keep it in the kitchen. And it was on her children's best cellar, best favorite books, whatever. So I love her. Well, I did too. And I had thought I was gonna get an opportunity to interview her in August.

Starting point is 00:29:02 She has a new book coming out with Arthur Brooks that looks just fantastic right at my alley and I thought I was getting both but unfortunately she canceled and I'm interviewing Arthur. I've interviewed him before and he's an incredible human. So I'm very honored to get to have that opportunity again. That's great. I'm sorry that she didn't let she cancel. I imagine she's busy especially during a book launch. Oh, yes, oh, I can't imagine. I can't imagine what she has to go through. Press the interviews. I've been interviewed quite a bit. And one interview was for a

Starting point is 00:29:41 newspaper interviewer sat there and took notes as I was speaking and answering her questions. And then I read the article and I was like, wait a minute, when books are not published in that language, we're chained up with that. I'm sorry. I'm supposed to believe anything I read now. I want to keep going down this long therapy road

Starting point is 00:30:03 just a little bit longer. Can you share with us how you got involved with the takes of village and what inspired you to support their cause? So my dream was always to build a library and a university or an neglected area of Brooklyn to thank my parents for being so supportive. I get emails all the time from schools wanting me to come visit, talk to their kids. And of course during the pandemic,

Starting point is 00:30:30 I did a lot of Zoom visits. I even spoke to kids in China, Japan, Italy, Germany, South America. And then a woman named Julie Arco emailed me and she's involved with the time-illegible filters, which is an organization that Bill of Libraries in Africa and Nepal and Mexico and would I like to retell a class of kids? Yeah, definitely.

Starting point is 00:30:57 So, group one class, about 15 kids, there was one little girl on the bottom right and they started asking questions and they were so charming and attentive and so sweet and so she said, how do I become an author? And I was about to say, well, you need to read a lot of books and I realized they don't have any And I realized they don't have any. And it just broke my heart. They were so sweet and so cute. And then I talked to Julie and did some research, talked to my money manager, because it's a big chunk of money, and opened up a library in Malawi.

Starting point is 00:31:41 And then I went with the head of, it takes a village, Julie, her husband, and her son, and we went to the village. The little girl's name was Debora, and I watched through photographs, the library being built, and then we went for the opening and I have a picture of me in the board looking at folks in my library. I can't believe I got to meet her and the opening there were over a thousand people at the grand opening. I cut the ribbon. There's a plaque about the doors dedicated to my parents. First time I've been to a third world country thing that struck me was that these people have nothing and they're the happiest.

Starting point is 00:32:26 Everywhere you go, you get out of the van and they're singing and dancing. I did more dancing than I did in my disco days and seven days. It was just the most unbelievable experience. I miss the kids a lot. I don't know if I would love to go back and see them, but I'm still trying to raise money for it takes a village. I have something on charity buzz. Have you heard of charity buzz? I have not. Oh, it's a website. It's like a silent auction online. So I auction off lunch with me and I raise over a $1,000.

Starting point is 00:33:05 I take people to lunch. A lot of times they're authors and they want advice and stuff like that. And then I also auction off a Zoom visit and all the money goes to, it takes a village. I'm hoping to do a go fund me to raise some money. Well, another thing that I use and I'm not sure how you go about approaching YouTube to get this inserted, but for certain causes, I will designate a charity that has signed up with YouTube that people who see the episode can donate to and some of these charities such as the St. Jude organization have received hundreds of thousands of dollars for doing this. I encourage all the charitable organizations that I see to do it because it doesn't cost

Starting point is 00:33:53 me anything as a podcaster or as a YouTuber. And I love to add those when I can to some of the videos I put out. Did you tell Amy about? I have not. Okay. Then I forgot about this too. So I was somebody's make a wish. When I told make a wish I would love to do something for them,

Starting point is 00:34:12 I didn't think anybody would really want to meet me because they always want to go to Disneyland or meet Magic Johnson. But there was a young girl, I guess just like 15, who wrote a book about her problem. And I helped her, I was a young girl, I guess just like 15, who wrote a book about her problem and I helped her, I was her editor, so that was very rewarding. It was truly touching and must have been a huge impact on her. Was she able to get that book published?

Starting point is 00:34:38 She saw it published it, but I think it's on Amazon and she found a really good illustrator who did it for her. I got to meet her and her parents at the Make a Wish office and then we worked online on her manuscript. It was a very nice experience. And it sounds like much more impactful than perhaps a short visit to Disney World would have on her and her aspirations. Yes, I totally great. I think it was an amazing thing that she did and she's truly an amazing

Starting point is 00:35:14 young girl. And your heart just goes out to them. But I was so glad to be able to help her. I have a great make-a-wish story from my childhood. We had these great neighbors across from us growing up in York, Pennsylvania, and unfortunately, their eldest daughter developed a rare and curable form of cancer, and she always had wanted to get into politics, but they realized she probably wouldn't be able to live that long to do so when she was in high school and her early college years

Starting point is 00:35:47 I actually reached out to Ted Kennedy to see if he would bring her in and he actually worked with her and invited her in to be part of his team for a number of years to give her as much exposure as possible to what it would like to be a politician and I guess it turns out that the cancer she had was the same cancer that his son had. My goodness. And I think there are stories like that from people that you never hear about, but just the stories that they would say about how good natured he was and how he would introduce her to everyone, including presidents and other people and open the door and make her feel the only person in the room was truly memorable.

Starting point is 00:36:29 That's incredible. That's so nice to hear. So much better than some other presidents. Well, Amy asked me to ask you this question. If I said to you, it takes the village, how would you complete it? And what does it mean to you personally? Besides building the library, I was hoping you could explain what impact it has had on the kids. I think it takes a village, like you said, to just aid to build the library, but then all the people involved to staff the library, incidentally, since then, materials have doubled. The price of opening a library now would be like

Starting point is 00:37:15 a little bit inhibitive to me, so I'm glad I did it when I did. And I saw all the people in, literally, in the village. And villages, they are so it's ironic, but the parents getting involved in the library and the kids now being able to take books home to their family. They just become a really nice, circular kind of thing we do if you do this. And this will happen. At the opening, there were all these village chiefs. The library comes with a thousand books, ten laptops and a full-time librarian. I'm just watching all these kids looking at all these books

Starting point is 00:37:59 on the shelf that they can read. They can take the book, they can take three books home and read them to their parents. Just watching the books on their faces, they were sitting down and turning the pages of a book, in some cases turning pages of my book was really touching and rewarding. It's one of the best experiences I've ever had. I mean, that week in Malawi where it's life changing. Well, in speaking of life changing, you visited hundreds of schools, countless children's hospitals, and that must have been such a rewarding experience and continues to be one for you.

Starting point is 00:38:38 Can you share with the audience a heartwarming or memorable moment from one of those visits that's left an impact on you? If there was a class when they left the auditorium, the teacher came out there and said, the little boy who asked you about your book, who's told you that he thought reading your books, I couldn't get him to read a book that I put me. Now he just won't leave the library.

Starting point is 00:39:03 And then the fact that I spent a car ride coming up with this idea and that took me two hours to sit down and write it when I got home I would change a lot of people's lives I get a lot of fan mail and they answer all of them the best one I got was from a mother of twins five year old twins with autism one severe and one not a severe, and they're from Jackson Heights, Queens. So it was special for me because that's where I had to go to get my eyes. I started wearing glasses and kindergarten and my dad, my parents' friend, was an optician in Jackson Heights, so we used to go there for my visit. And she said the more severe autistic son wouldn't eat anything.

Starting point is 00:39:48 He didn't talk. He wouldn't let them cut his hair. But after reading mouse, the first word he said was cookie. And we let them cut his hair. I'm speechless thinking about it. But his first word was cookie. Yeah, what an inspiring story. And Laura, I was hoping before we end,

Starting point is 00:40:07 I could just cover a few more questions for the audience about some of the key learnings that you've had from life and becoming the author you have. And the first would be, what are five things that you wish someone told you when you first started and why? When I got my first book published, I had nobody telling me anything about the business. I was doing it all on my own. And I wish somebody had told me at that

Starting point is 00:40:36 point to either get an agent or stick with one publisher. When you are with one publisher, they treat you differently. Then when you go from publisher to publisher, when you are with one publisher, they treat you differently than when you go from publisher to publisher. I was just happy to get my books published by anybody who would want to buy them. I wish in the very beginning that I knew about all the rejection that would be confronting me in my career.

Starting point is 00:41:00 I wish that I had learned about the business. It's unfortunately, it's a business. In the very beginning for the longest time, to me I was just in awe. This is so nice. It's still dense bugs. This is lovely. Beatrix, Potter, Bunnies, Rabbit, and Ducks. It's a business. And there's things that happen in the business that aren't peachy keen to be thrust upon it without knowing what's coming. It would have been nice if somebody opened my eyes in the very beginning. I wish that I had somebody negotiate my contracts in the beginning. I didn't have an agent.

Starting point is 00:41:39 I've never had an agent. I know there's not five, but I think it's four. As you mentioned, you've now written over 40 books, and if someone's listening to this and they haven't even read one yet, and you share some of your insights on how you spark creativity and find inspiration for your books and how maybe the way you do it could act as a springboard for someone who might be listening to great one themselves. I get most of my ideas from hearing something or saying something.

Starting point is 00:42:16 So for an example, my ears are always open to hear something that might give me a germ, a little germ of an idea. I was with my ex-fiance who was an environmental scientist and we saw a Dalmatian and I said, oh, wouldn't it be not cute and red sneakers? And Paul said, dog's over sneakers. And I heard dogs don't wear sneakers and I just started rhyming. Dogs don't wear sneakers and pigs don't wear hats and dresses look silly on signs these cats. And we got home and I started typing and writing the verses and I ended up writing in that verses for two books. So the second one was tombstone glasses. Yes, sorry. I was at a horse I used to write horses. I was at a horse show and I heard someone say my horse lost food and I thought of Cinderella. So I rolled Ponyella. It's a parody of Cinderella but with a pony losing her show.

Starting point is 00:43:16 And I think you have to really keep your eyes open and your ears open. ears open and sometimes something will just spark an idea. Also, I highly recommend keeping all these days you can just have a little recorder even on your fit that I guess those apple ponds can do it. But I've come up with ideas in my head when I was driving. Luckily when the mouse came to me I wasn't driving. Hell he was. But I've had ideas while I was driving. Luckily when the mouse came to me, I wasn't driving. Hell, he was. But I've had ideas while I was driving. And by the time I get to where I'm going, I forgot it. Always have something to jot down your ideas. It's really easy to just forget something.

Starting point is 00:43:56 I think reading a lot of children's books really helps. And talking to kids, just being around kids. I don't have kids. I love them. I never wanted them But people always say well, how can you write children's books without kids? I go well because it's quiet But from going to all of these schools and being around kids spending time around kids talking to them I sparked my imagination gets my imagination going and so those are some of my handy-dandy perps.

Starting point is 00:44:28 I know we already talked about, never give up. But is there another favorite life lesson, quote, that you have that's been relevant to your life? Yes, because when I was eight years old, I did want to become a children's author. And I didn't really pay attention to my gut because I wanted to be like my sister, which wasn't authentic. I hate that word, but it's true. Everybody talks about your true self, your authentic self. And obviously, that's what it came back to is what was in my heart,

Starting point is 00:45:02 what was in my gut that I wanted to do. It's so true that if you have a passion and you love it, that saying, if you love what we don't have a job, so I'm very lucky to be one of the few people who get to make a living as an author. I'm going to be 70 and it's, oh my gosh, you know, I'm the elderly author, glasses and everything, but it's been great. It's, I've had a really great career. I've been very, more thankful and excited about it. I'm going to Alaska in two weeks from my birthday

Starting point is 00:45:39 and I've never seen a mouse. And so I found this conservancy center when they rescue wildlife. And the young girl, I asked a question and the young girl knew my books. And now, she, they're gonna give me a special tour and I'm gonna feed a moose. Thank you for that.

Starting point is 00:46:01 And that sounds amazing. I've always wanted to go to Alaska and it's on my bucket list as well I have seen a moose though when I visited a yellowstone How far away was it? Say maybe a half a football field was it gigantic? There were a number of them there were probably six or seven of them together and they were really majestic But there were tons of wildlife when we went there.

Starting point is 00:46:26 And sometimes I heard that they'll just walk into some of the towns from the park. That's what I've heard. Yes, I never got to witness that, but we did see elk and other things that would just walk into town. Oh, I've never seen, well, we have coyote and deer here. I've seen deer walking in the sidewalk across the street. I live in a canyon. So there's deer and rabbits and everything, but I've seen deer just strut enough the sidewalk that's better deer.

Starting point is 00:46:58 The last question I had for you and it's a fun one I like to ask. I mentioned Wendy Lawrence, who's an astronaut earlier in the episode, but if you were given this opportunity to be one of the first people to go to Mars set foot on it and the powers that be said that there was one edict or law or governing philosophy that you could put in place, what would it be? Never give up. I thought you were going to ask me what I go. Would you go? I don't know. No, I admire astronauts. Another good friend of mine, he's a class man of mine from the Naval Academy.

Starting point is 00:47:42 It used to be the chief astronaut and I asked him about how soon he thought we'll get to Mars. And he said, people don't realize that the biggest thing that we have landed on Mars so far has been about the size of Volkswagen. And we have never tried to lift it off. He goes for us to put people there, you're talking about something the size of one or two greyhound buses. That one we're going to have to land there successfully, but then we're going to have to figure out how do you get that thing off. He just said, if you think about the logistics of that, plus this is probably going to have to be powered by nuclear fuels, so you're going to have to build a nuclear refueling station on the moon and other things, he goes, the people who say that this

Starting point is 00:48:25 is going to happen in five years, he goes, there's just no way unless we develop cold fusion or something happens overnight, that would give us a different way to propel ourselves to get there. And then we're going to have to experiment a ton of times with unmanned missions before we even send someone there. Right. That's fascinating. I love stuff like that.

Starting point is 00:48:46 Yeah, Pat, note them since I was 18. Oh, wow. That's great. Would you go up in a space shuttle? I would love to go up. I'm not sure I'd want to go on that mission to Mars, but I think space exploration would be exhilarating. Laura, thank you so much for joining us today and sharing your wisdom. I know so many of our listeners will want to hear this episode, so thank you for giving

Starting point is 00:49:13 us the honor of being here. Oh, thank you so much for having me on your show and one of my favorite subjects, passion and philanthropy, two subjects. Passion, or philanthropy. Well, thank you again. All right, you have a good weekend. You too. What an honor it was to interview Laura Numeroff, and I wanted to thank Laura and Amy Malin

Starting point is 00:49:39 for having her appear on today's show. Links to all things Laura will be in the show notes at passionstruck.com. Please use our website links if you purchase any of the books from the guests that we feature here on the show. Advertiser deals and discount codes are in one convenient place at passionstruck.com slash deals. And I have some exciting news that my new book passionstruck is now available for preorder

Starting point is 00:49:59 and it's all about 12 powerful principles that will help you unlock your purpose and create your most intentional life. Links will be in the show notes. Videos of this episode are on YouTube at our two channels, John Armyles, and PassionStruck Clips. You can catch me on all the social platforms at John Armyles, where I post daily motivational bits of information. You can also sign up for my newsletter at either johnarmiles.com or passionstruck.com. You're about to hear a preview of the Passionstruck podcast interview I did with my friend Dr. John Deloney, who is a best-selling author, mental health expert, and host of the Dr. John Deloney show.

Starting point is 00:50:35 For over two decades, John's immersed himself in research, experienced personal growth, and has compassionately guided countless others towards reclaiming their lives from the grip of anxiety. The key to this transformation lies in the power of choices, six essential choices that pave the way for a non-ancient life. He outlines these choices in his brand new book, Building a Non-Ancient Life. These steps are not easy, but they're stepping stones towards building a brighter future, enabling you to rise above challenges and find peace amidst chaos. The lie that we tell ourselves is, I don't want other people to find out. And I'm constantly reminding folks, if you're struggling with anxiety, if you're struggling with depression, if you're struggling with food choices and body image issues, the people around you know.

Starting point is 00:51:21 The demon there is often, if they truly love you, they will think it's them that's making you uncomfortable and they'll try to solve it. And especially your kids will try to solve it. And so you have a group of people wondering why every time you're in the room, they feel uncomfortable and they think they're crazy. Everybody knows. Everybody can, whether they know it intellectually or they feel it in their body, they know when you're not all right. And so the greatest gift you can give somebody to say the word, I'm not all right. Remember that we rise by lifting others. So share this show with those that you love.

Starting point is 00:51:51 And if you found today's episode useful, then please share it with someone who could use the advice that we gave on today's show. In the meantime, do your best to apply what you hear on the show so that you can live what you listen. Until next time, go out there and become Ash and Struggle.

Passion Struck with John R. Miles - Laura Numeroff on Creating a Story of Resilience and Triumph EP 352

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