Passion Struck with John R. Miles - Lisa Honig Buksbaum on How You Heal by Soaring Into Strength EP 268

Episode Date: March 17, 2023

On this episode of Passion Struck, I'm joined by Lisa Honig Buksbaum, Founder and CEO of Soaringwords, to discuss her latest book, "Soaring into Strength: Love Transcends Pain" and how it can support your path towards healing. As a trailblazing figure in the fields of self-improvement and positive psychology, Lisa's leadership has inspired millions. In This Episode, Lisa Honig Buksbaum And I Discuss Her Book "Soaring into Strength." In our interview, Lisa offers a valuable guide for living a life filled with kindness, wisdom, and humor at a time when the world is in great need of hope, faith, and inspiring role models. Her words are particularly relevant given the current challenges of our times. Lisa Honig Buksbaum's unwavering determination, boundless courage, and immense heart enable her to transcend the difficulties and hardships of life, and she discusses how you can too. Full show notes and resources can be found here: https://passionstruck.com/lisa-honig-buksbaum-soaring-into-strength/  Brought to you by Green Chef. Use code passionstruck60 to get $60 off, plus free shipping!” Brought to you by Indeed. Head to https://www.indeed.com/passionstruck, where you can receive a $75 credit to attract, interview, and hire in one place. --► For information about advertisers and promo codes, go to: https://passionstruck.com/deals/  Like this show? Please leave us a review here -- even one sentence helps! Consider including your Twitter or Instagram handle so we can thank you personally! --► Prefer to watch this interview: https://youtu.be/pyB3UerWoUc  --► Subscribe to Our YouTube Channel Here: https://www.youtube.com/c/JohnRMiles Want to find your purpose in life? I provide my six simple steps to achieving it - passionstruck.com/5-simple-steps-to-find-your-passion-in-life/ Want to hear my best interviews from 2022? Check out episode 233 on intentional greatness and episode 234 on intentional behavior change. ===== FOLLOW ON THE SOCIALS ===== * Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/passion_struck_podcast * Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/johnrmiles.c0m  Learn more about John: https://johnrmiles.com/   

Coming up next on the Passion Struck Podcast. Most people are miserable because they think that happiness is a trait, like you have red hair or you're very tall, but happiness is a state. It comes and goes, it ebbs and flows. So optimism, learning how to cherish those micro moments of positivity by being fully present. Like, wow, I'm sitting here at this table and both of my sons are here and my daughter-in-law is here and my 85 year old mom is here and my husband

and my grandbaby. This is great. This is a moment. Take it in instead of like, okay, let's do the table. Let's have dessert. So optimism, it comes and it goes, but if you can experience those micro moments and savor them, you're doing really well. Welcome to PassionStruct. Hi, I'm your host, John Armiles. And on the show, we decipher the secrets, tips and guidance of the world's most inspiring people

and turn their wisdom into practical advice for you and those around you. Our mission is to help you unlock the power of intentionality so that you can become the best version of yourself. If you're new to the show, I offer advice and answer listener questions on Fridays. We have long form interviews the rest of the week with guest ranging from astronauts to authors, CEOs, creators, innovators, scientists, military leaders, visionaries, and athletes. Now, let's go out there and become PassionStruck. Hello, everyone, and welcome back to Episode 268 of PassionStruck. Recently ranked by Interview Valet is the fourth best podcast for conversation.

And thank you to each and every one of you who comes back weekly to listen and learn, how to live better, be better, and impact the world. If you're new to the show, thank you so much for being here, or you simply want to introduce this to friends or family members, we now have episode starter packs which are collections of our fans' favorite episodes that we organize into convenient topics that give any new listener a great way to get acclimated to everything we do here on the show. Either go to Spotify or PassionStruck.com slash stutterpacks to get started. In case you missed it, earlier in the week, I interviewed two amazing authors. The first was Charlotte Burgess Auburn, and she wrote the book You Need A Manifesto, and we talk

about how you create that manifesto and put it into action in your life. I also interviewed Dr. Mike Rucker about his new book The Fun Habit and how you can put more play into your life as an adult. Please check them both out. I wanted to thank you so much for your continued support. Those ratings and reviews are going such a long way to helping us stay in the top 20 of the health podcast category every single week, but more importantly bringing bringing more people into the passion-struck community, where we can give weekly doses of inspiration, hope, meaning, and connection. I wanted to say also, again, this week,

I'm using my personal Friday slot so that I can give you a special interview. Now, let's talk about it. Wouldn't it be wonderful to possess the inner fortitude to never give up and to motivate your loved ones and friends to face challenges head on with courage, humor and grace. Ever since she was a young girl, our guest today, Lisa Honek Bookspam, had a strong desire to help others, whether it was rescuing of line-duck at a park or standing up for her younger brother during his asthma attacks.

She always found herself in the role of helper during times of crisis. However, her life took a dramatic turn as an adult when a phone call in the middle of the night sparked a series of traumatic events. In the span of just 10 months, Lisa lost her brother to an asthma-induced heart attack. Watched her father battle lymphoma and saw her own son become critically ill. The overwhelming, pain and grief left her feeling as if she had been permanently damaged, but amidst her darkest moments, Lisa found her calling on a sunrise walk along the beach

during her son's illness. She heard the words soaring winds and instantly knew her purpose in life. She challenged her passion and resilience into creating a global movement that would inspire millions to never give up her experiences with tragedy and loss, led her to dedicate her life to helping others who were going through similar struggles, becoming a beacon of hope and inspiration for many. Lisa Honeg Bookspom is a passionary,

a visionary driven by great passion and action, an author, intuitive healer, well-loved, inspirational speaker, and expert workshop leader and facilitator. Lisa has shared her wisdom with thousands of people throughout the world. These experiences with death and illness. In her family during a 10 month period,, motivated her to launch Soaring Winds, a not-for-profit organization devoted to inspiring children,

families, adults, seniors, and healthcare professionals to take active roles in self-healing to experience greater physical, emotional, and mental well-being. Since 2000, Lisa has shared Soaring words, Soaring into strength, positive health initiatives, with more than 500,000 people. She is the author of Soaring Into Strength, Love Transans Pain, her debut memoir. Thank you for choosing PassionStruck and choosing me to be your host and guide on your journey, creating an intentional life. Now, let that journey begin.

Now, let that journey begin. I am so excited today to welcome Lisa Honeg, Bookspom to the Passion Start Podcast. Welcome, Lisa. Hey, thanks. I'm so glad to be here. I wanted to congratulate you, 2022, you had a big year, including the release of Soaring Into Your Strength,

your memoir. So congratulations on that. Thank you. Yeah, it's been a wild ride. Well, I always like to start the interviews off by allowing the audience to get to know the person that we have on the show. And I know one of the things that you discussed throughout the book are stories of your Jewish heritage and upbringing.

How have your culture and personal experiences impacted your worldview, habits and behaviors? It's kind of been a fascinating journey because to thine own self be true. So when I started writing my book, Sorry, into Strength,, love transcends pain. It was a narrative of a Jewish girl who grew up in a very close knit loving family in suburban New Jersey, and then came to the Big Apple, the big city to make it in the world. So the book throughout has a very unique, distinctive

Jewish flavor because we lived our practice. But some of the most robust and poignant feedback that I've gotten from literally thousands of readers or listeners to the audiobook is, I am from the Hindu tradition or I am Christian or I'm an atheist, but I never knew all of those customs and ceremonies and I really had such empathy and I also had such identification with your story, because it's a universal coming of age story. But some of the themes that are embedded in my faith, which are embedded in all the Abrahamic faiths, Judaism,

Christianity, Islam, is that you believe in something larger than yourself. Rabbi Abraham Joshua Heschel said when he linked arms with Reverend Dr. Martin Luther King, we're praying with our feet. And the way I was brought up, I saw both my parents running to do good deeds, running to do mitzvot or acts of kindness. And I have that gene, that do-good-er gene. And that's definitely very much part of someone who does lead a faith-based life that they see that they're part of something larger than themselves, love your neighbor as yourself, the rest is commentary.

So throughout the book, there's so many examples of when really terrible and traumatic things happened to me or my family when the kindness of strangers or doctors or the resilience that we had within ourselves come to the fore. And the purpose of writing the book was to show people that you're much stronger than you could ever imagine, that you have that inner small still voice that is always there for you when you can quiet

our busy, hectic, active lives, or when you're in the middle of a setback or trauma or illness, to just be still. And then you can draw upon that deep repository of strength. So my book is really for everyone, and there was a comedian Jackie Mason who did a lot of Jewish stick, and on his Broadway show, he said, uh, the Gentiles, the non-Jews, they love it, the Jews, who Jewish, but like again to my own self be true. I tell the story in a very poignant, zany, funny, sad, all the ups and downs of the rollercoaster of our life, but the feedback I've gotten specifically about the faith and the traditions has been beautiful and wonderful, because the point was really when I go into a hospital when I work with thousands of children or families or people who are

really at the bottom of the bottom, I want to connect with their soul, I want to connect with them and let them know that they're not alone, that strength and greatness is within them and that there are so many things they can do to take an active role in their self-healing. So that's what I see and I don't see the things that separate us. I see the things that connect to us and unite us. And that's been one of the blessings of the past few years of this global pandemic that people are really talking about things like isolation or loneliness or feeling bereft of hope. So the timing for my book I think is really wonderful because it's meant to be a healing salve. It's meant to have people laugh, it's a holder stomach because you're laughing so hard

but also things happen in life like the highest of the highs and the lows of the lows. And while we can't choose what happens to us, we can choose how we respond in the privacy of ourselves. And then to be that loving, caring presence for the people closest to us, or for strangers that we have the privilege of encountering. Yes, I think those are all beautiful things and it certainly comes across in all the stories that you tell throughout the book. And I remember when we talked a few weeks ago,

I mentioned to you that I had listened to a podcast that happened to have Hillary Swank on it and the interviewer asked her, when someone asked you the question, what do you do? Her answer was, I thought pretty powerful because she could save so many things, but she said at the end of the day, I'm a powerful storyteller. And this is how you describe yourself as well. And I wanted to ask, what story has resonated the most with you? Sure. Well, our brains are wired for stories. Our brains are naturally

parsing out details and sizing things up. The most compelling thing is that we remember the stories. So sometimes if I'm in an airport or speaking at a conference, someone might come up to me and say, you spoke 15 years ago and I'll never forget the story you told. So for everyone listening, it's great to have the facts and figures, of course, and to have authenticity, but we really connect with people so to sell when we share our stories. And it's in sharing our stories where I think our vulnerability is our greatest strength. So I guess the definitive story that shaped the trajectory of my life and is the touch point of the book, but it's not giving it away.

I was walking along the beach during the height of my oldest son's catastrophic illness and there was a trifecta of trauma, three things that happened in a 10 month period in my family. My only sibling and baby brother Gary died suddenly of an asthma-induced heart attack, and I got the phone call at four o'clock in the morning and had to tell my parents the terrible news.

And a few weeks later, my daddy had a second bout of non-Hodgkins, lymphoma, and he needed a bone marrow transplant. And throughout all of North America, we couldn't find a match. So my father became the bone marrow match for himself and my mother and I were like fighting with the doctors to go back and do a fifth stem cell harvest because they weren't able to get, they were getting hundreds of cells and they needed millions. So it ended up that my dad's stem cell transplant saved his life and he lived 19 years cancer free. So when these two traumas, my brother's death

and my father's recurrence of cancer in less than 10 months happened, my family was pretty much whipped, we were exhausted, but we weren't ready to then get the phone call. And this is the highest of the highs and the lowest of the lows. I was in the middle of Las Vegas, Nevada, launching the largest telecom company in the world,

and upon telephone and telegraph, NTT, and my husband called and said, honey, you have to come home right away. Now, he has a very bizarre sense of humor, so I thought he was pulling my leg and joking, and I said, I gotta go. The show was starting in 20 minutes. The Broadway actors are about to start in our booth. I'll call you later

I love you and he screamed don't hang up. Jonathan is catastrophically ill and you need to fly home immediately. Now, of course, no parent would joke about the health of their child. So 12 hours later I was on the first flight flying home speeding through the night back to my family. And for the next four months my son was twitching and drooling and heavily medicated. And the head of neurology told us, go be by the ocean. And Manhattan is an island surrounded by water, but he didn't mean go hang out with the traffic and the cars and the trucks on the west side highway. So we rented a cottage 12 miles away from here and we lived there for four months and my son had seizures. I had to sleep in his bed to massage his tired limbs, comfort him and help

him go back to sleep every single night. So I was pretty trashed emotionally from five to six in the morning I'd walk along the beach crying and praying and singing. That's where I let it all out. along the beach, crying and praying and singing. That's where I let it all out. And on one of those morning walks, the name and feeling, soaring words, came to me from above. And I just looked up and I closed my eyes and I felt lighten and cursing through my body.

And I had this calm sense that everything I had done in my life had prepared me to create this global movement of all the things that my family so desperately needed that didn't exist. So the morning after my 40th birthday, I was grace walking back from the gym and I was saying how great my birthday party was and I before, because no one was sick and no one had died. And I said to my brother because it was five in the morning and there was no one on the deserted New York City street. I miss you, give me a sign. And I looked down just at that next step and there was a beautiful little heart on the sidewalk. And the heart is the logo for soaring words. And that was the morning that I was going to start working on the business plan. So I knew that my brother Gary was with me, as he's always been with me,

and that we were going to launch this global movement together. And that was back in 2000. And since then, we've helped half a million people, kiddies, families, adults, seniors, and all the people at the front lines of healthcare who can be overwhelmed with caregiver fatigue and burnout. So just taking all the things that I knew from my personal experiences with Zathan illness, and then all of the leading scientific

discoveries that I've learned in the field of positive psychology and bringing them to people in a way that's simple and easy for them to have these immersive experiences that take just a few minutes that can shift their thoughts, their attitudes, their physical well-being and their emotional well-being and their mental health. So it's been a wild ride, but that's really I think think at the end of the day, the story that defines my life. Although there's a lot of great stories in the book. There's 50 really short, two or three or five page chapters. So it moves at a fast clip. Well, that was a really beautiful story and it's led to an amazing mission that you're now on.

I wanted to throw this at you though. Many of us have ideas, dreams, and passions, but we never manifest them. We don't get up and just do it, but you ended up taking that step and doing it. What is your advice for listeners on making the decision and then taking the actions to pursue your dreams? So that's a great question. And the thing I hate the most about being a positive psychology thought leader or keynote speaker is, when I'm telling my stories or speaking to people to inspire you to go for it, don't hold back.

I don't want people to put me on a pedestal so that they feel even worse. It's not a competition. We all have an inner illumination and radiance. We all have dreams. And what I'm really focused on and have spent the last 22 years doing is connecting people to that inner spark. And for some people that could be being a really loving caregiver to their family,

or being a kindergarten school teacher, or being a really loving caregiver to their family or being a kindergarten school teacher or being a janitor. Some of the most beautiful encounters I've had over the past 22 years with soaring words as I traveled to different countries and cities, 196 hospitals. I would meet janitors where people bringing the food who explained to me that their role was to help the patients and families smile. Their role was to let those people know that they cared so much for them, and that's why they were putting so much focus and emphasis into the work. So our culture is obsessed with status and money and titles, but for people listening, your mission, your passion could be something as simple as Hillary Swang said

that she wants to tell powerful stories that could ignite other people to take the next right step. So a few things for me that I've learned in my considerable wisdom, I hope, is I used to think I'm macho I'm hard driving I have an MBA from Columbia I study with Martin Seleman the founder of the field of positive psychology I'm hot stuff and I know that I'm very tenacious and I'm very pure like I know that I am doing this for Service of others like that. I don't need anyone to give me accolades

Like I know why I get up every morning and run to the gym to get energy to do this work. But in my wisdom as I have gotten older what I realized is I'm going to do Lisa. God can do everything and teach everyone and be a martyr or be this like robotic superwoman I just have to do the next right thing. So before I go to sleep at night I look at my cell phone calendar I also like to write it out and I love checking those things off But I also know that I need to put into each day Lisa time going to the gym doing my swim six days a week, doing some cardio, walking as much as I can,

spending time with my mom, who's 85 years old and she's a real badass and we love spending time together, spending time with my husband when all the devices are shut off and spending time with my kids and my granddaughter. So I need to build all those things into my very busy, active life or else I could work 23 hours a day, seven days a week and that's

not going to be good for myself or anyone else. So in terms of passion, it's a great time because it's still the beginning of the year, but it's always a great time to wake up and just say, and it comes back to stories, what's the story you're telling yourself? Are you a victim or do you want to be a victor? What's the story that you were born into? And now with all this awareness and discourse and social justice movements, we're finally talking about things that were so inequitable for so many hundreds and hundreds of years.

So it's a great time to be part of that change. And we all have the opportunity and our microcommunities and our lives and in the larger world community to do the next right thing. So by being alive in such an interesting time of possibilities, you just need to settle down with a cup of tea or a blank piece of paper

or your computer and just ask yourself, how do I want to serve, how do I want to show up? And what I love doing more than anything is going into a behavioral health locked psychiatric unit or going into an inner city school, where society has told these people you're not really important, you're kind of your garbage. And I don't mean that, that I think that's

what society's labeled people who don't drive a certain car and have a million people on their Instagram. They don't really matter, not an NBA star. I go in and say to those people, today we're going to learn how to have more agency or have more resilience or have more gratitude. And after doing the workshop together, where they write about a time in their life when they felt so grateful or write about an esteemable thing that they did for someone else where the other person

had no idea that they did it. And when people can connect to these character strengths within themselves, to these aspirational parts of themselves that make them unique and beautiful and strong and kind. It creates a shift. And once you create a shift in your possibility and your awareness, then you can just take the next right step.

Well, if I say being kind is really important to me, let's look at my weak. How am I showing up? When am I doing that? Or if I say it's really important for me to connect to my friends and people around me, am I really doing that? Or does that always go to the bottom of the to-do list? So I think being vulnerable and being authentic in the privacy of our own goal setting is really

helpful because you could take off all that armor and that BS and to say let's be real like in three months from now in a year from now what do I want to say to myself that showed me that I took a few more steps closer to igniting my passion to igniting my purpose. It's not a race, it's not a competition, it's a journey. And we take steps forward, then we get kicked in the stomach and we take some steps back. But what I've also learned is that it's the setbacks and challenges that devastating times in our life that often are our best teachers. So one no one wants a trauma or set back to happen. What my dear friend and mentor Dr. Richard Todesky,

who's a pioneering scientist in the field of post-traumatic growth, he talks about the fact that 67% of people experience different domains of flourishing after the trauma. So again, Dr. Todesky and I were not saying, go out and hope that something really bad is gonna happen to you or your family. But when something does happen, and I mean trauma, a capital T, not like Ubroca fingernail or they didn't have your favorite

flavor of ice cream when you went to the supermarket, there's these things that we could experience. It's 67%, two thirds of people's report in empirical studies. A sense of purpose and meaning that perhaps they didn't have before. A sense of appreciation for the relationships in their life. A sense of awe and wonder watching a sunset or a sunrise or just being alive. A sense of purpose and mission. So there's a lot of room for us to create more of the life that we want to have,

instead of just having a sense of resignation and hopelessness that we were born into this zip code or we were born into this family intergeneration trauma. Like, I've just seen heroic people who have been able to step out of the narrative that society or genetics has imposed on them. And to really be heroic and to really touch with that inner voice. I always say I'm a visionary, a visionary driven by great passion and action. But for me, it's not all like, man, it go. And it's not all that. It's the passion,

but one of my other signature strengths is the spirituality. So I need both. I need that time in the pool. I need that time for observing my Sabbath where for that 25 hours, I'm not on the treadmill, I'm on the roller coaster. So everyone will find their own blend of what lights you up, what makes you, and a great way to get started off after you've done a little bit of the exploration. Ask five people that are close to you.

People who know you really well, it could be colleagues at work, it could be close friends, or it could be people that you know in a less proximal way, like maybe just someone in your neighborhood, but ask people to describe you in a few words, and you'll see certain themes come up as how you convey yourself and see if that feels true or not. And the great thing is there's no wrong answer. You can always co-create the story that you want to tell. You can always co-create what you want the trajectory of your life to be about. There's a lot of agency. There's a lot of movement in there. about there's a lot of agency, there's a lot of movement in there.

So many of the things that you just brought up coincide with the exact mission of this podcast, which is to try to help people learn how they can live an intentional life. One where their passions, their inner gifts are called to serve others and make the world a better place. And one of the core aspects of the people I try to bring on the podcast are what I call everyday heroes. And my question for you, because I consider you to be one of these everyday heroes, is what is the impact that ordinary people can have on doing extra ordinary things? It's enormous, and I think it's what feels the world.

So whether that's a bus driver, taking those extra few minutes to help someone get on the bus who might need some extra time and not make them feel ashamed or not make them feel badly, or during COVID wearing the masks, I would say hello to people as I walk through the streets of my neighborhood

in New York City and say, hello, good morning, hi. And people would often be bewildered. Do I know you? Or I said, no, I'm just friendly. But even something as little as that, we never know what's going on in someone else's day and someone else's reality. So it just takes a nanosecond to be kind or gracious or considerate.

And I think these everyday heroes are the the fuel that drives civility and kindness and connectivity. So the Harvard men's study, which has been going on for over 90 years, measured a very well-heeled Boston, New England, social men who were from very wealthy families, they were all white, they were aristocratic. Because those were the only people that Harvard admitted back at the turn of the century in the early 1900s. And then they took a whole cohort of men who worked on the other side of the tracks, laborers, construction workers, people who worked on the railroad sanitation. definitive thing that defines health outcomes, longevity, positive physical health, emotional health, strong marriages, strong relationships, was it wealth and zip code and education, or was it something else? And the results are stunning. The results are that the most important thing

to determine someone's future of addiction or health is the presence of one caring adult at some time in their life, preferably in childhood. whether that's a teacher, a neighbor, a school crossing guard, or a librarian, or someone who's a coach or someone mentoring people. But we always have that opportunity to be that caring presence for others. As you may or may not know, the population is aging and it's aging significantly. There's going to be so many more people over 65, and the next five or six or seven decades in the United States, then young kids and twings and 20 somethings. So I call that the invisible generation often. These are the people who they might have white or silver hair, but like when I'm in the pool at 7 30 in the morning, they're they're swimming and they're my heroes. But I always like to say

something authentic. Hey, I love your red shoes your eyes are so beautiful or that was a great swim because our society again is so focused on this pop culture and fillers and Botox and looking and acting a certain way. So there's so many ways that we could show up and be heroic to someone in our life, lowercase each. And we saw that a lot during the global pandemic, which by the way is still very much with us, helping someone with groceries or just calling and checking into someone, just taking that extra 30 or 60 seconds to be kind. And that's one of the benefits that's come out of this past three years, I believe. I'm glad you brought up the Harvard study of adult development episode two, that for 39. We did the book launch of The Good Life by Dr. Robert Waldinger,

who currently leads that study. And it is shocking what they found looking at all of these men and now. It's expanded to their kids and their grandchildren and men and women. So it is remarkable that it doesn't matter how much money you make or which side of that equation you're on, it doesn't matter what your political beliefs are, it doesn't matter. In so many ways, all these things you do, but if you don't have the strength of relationships,

it has a drastic impact on your longevity, your happiness, everything that has to do with it. And he also has a TED Talk that has almost 40 million views if you want a more succinct version of the study. So I highly recommend they check out either my podcast or that book. TED Talk and podcast 239. I'm going to watch it. So you've alluded to it a number of times now. You currently lead a global initiative to help people of all ages to take active roles and self-healing to experience greater physical, emotional, and mental well-being. Can you tell us a bit more about your programs and the impact that it's having? Sure.

So, when I started, Vichin, I said, my mission is to help millions of people. And my mom, bless her heart, was one of my first proofreaders. And she took a big red pen and she grossed out millions. And she goes, you mean hundreds, right? And I said, no, it's a vision statement. It's supposed to be big. So I still pinch myself when I realize that we've probably helped over a million people. Although we have data about 500,000,

but I know that number's much, much larger. And I think that when I started also, I had a really strong vision and idea of what I wanted to do. There are, and we're thousands and thousands of charities that would send hospitalized children and their families to Disney World and buy them video games and give them money and all of those things are important but I wanted to

do something that would ignite the sense of creativity and compassion and resilience within the child and the family and since 2019 we've been working with adults and municipalities and individuals and marginalized communities. I wanted to say to them, you have something really powerful to share with another person who's going through a really tough time. Are you interested in doing a soaring superhero or after a workshop? We always embedded a 15-minute pay-it-forward project. And people said, Lisa, these people are at the bottom of the bottom. Why are you asking them to do stuff for other people? But I knew intuitively, and now I know empirically from all of our research projects with thousands and thousands of participants,

that isolation is one of the most present emotions when someone's going through a setback challenge, trauma, or illness. So by saying to someone, today we're inviting you to do something kind for someone else. It shifts their perspective, and they pick up that pan or crayon or magic marker, and they're reminded that they are a creative person who wants to do something who's capable of giving to others. So that was very counterintuitive back in 2000, but now people are like, oh yeah, I get it, that's brilliant. So I think the thing about having a vision and then creating something, every day you have an opportunity

to see if what you think people will respond to they do. And so it's very easy to make course corrections to be very nimble and flexible in real time. So back when the pandemic hit, the basis of my success and the funding and the engagement that was fueling soaring words growth was with corporate audiences. I worked closely with diversity and equity and inclusion managers. I worked closely with sweet executives and Fortune 50 companies.

And when they had a global meeting or a national meeting brought in to give a keynote and a hands-on immersive project. So whether that was 5,000 people with Johnson and Johnson in seven countries or 400 network engineers at Verizon in a really nice resort and we brought in 300 kids on the inner cities there. We would have people decorating quilts and pillows with inspiration or messages and artwork and we would donate them to children in local hospitals. So that was a great run,

and I knew how to do that, and we could expand it, do it in person, do it on Zoom. But then when COVID happened, all of that went by-by. I mean, the lights were turned off, the door was locked. So I said, what am I gonna do? Who am I gonna be during COVID? What am I gonna do?

And because I have two speeds as a New Yorker fast and faster, except when I'm turned off and then I'm on the purple couch and just chilling out which is so much fun. I never knew that for many years. I said, I'm going to create all this wonderful content. So we created the Soaring and Distraint Positive Health Initiative. And I never worked harder than the last three years. We had teams of videographers and researchers. We created 23 Soaring and Distraint workshops that are all delivered asynchronously. They're all pre-recorded with immersive workbooks and hands-on activities.

And that's what I did over COVID because I could have been like, oh, I just wasted 17 years of my life because it's gone away and it's not coming back. But I said, I'll be damned. I'm not going to let this stop me. I'm just getting started. I really haven't even started. That's how I look at it. And today I woke up with a gift. And tomorrow, hopefully, I'll wake up. So I just have so much more I want to do and want to give because I want to scale. So we spent the last three years creating content

and now fortunately about three or four months ago we started getting phone calls. People got our newsletter which we'd stopped doing for a couple of years. Hey, we used to work together at City Group or hey, I was one of your favorite principals for eight years. And now I'm a superintendent at the New York City Board of Ed. Let's get together and do something

for the 12,000 kids in my district and then getting an invitation from the National Institute of Health, the NIH, six weeks ago to apply for a 10-year grant based on applied research to work with throat interventions, with individuals in marginalized communities to reduce health inequity. So that was such a gift with a red taffit, a ribbon tied on it because that's what I have set out to do for the last 22 years and then to be invited by the NIH to put something together just for today and just for

this week. I have long lists and a big team of amazing people who are committed to doing this. And that's where I'm going to stop, John, because I'm not counting the money and doing this. I'm in today still. We've got 13 days before the application is due. So it's having that balance of what feeds me, what lights me up, what can I humanly possibly do, baking in time for self-care and feeding yourself and nourishing yourself emotionally and physically, and then just don't hold back. And one thing coming back to what we were saying about relationships, you need to find your tribe. You know who, if you say, hey, I just got the speaker that I want to have that to someone who's going to roll their eyes or be multitasking and not even look up from the newspaper when you say that. You know who's going to be like, you go, you are amazing.

So find that tribe of one or two people or more and get yourself in relationship with those people. I have accountability partners that are amazing authors and we talk shop about our work and I have people who are really committed to doing the positive psychology and bringing that down to people who don't own books from people who have lots of master's degrees. So when you find your tribe, those are the people that can really hold you and together just like you want everyone to succeed and thrive and be authentic, those people are there for you. Dr. Richard Tedesky calls them expert companions.

They don't have to be expert in anything, but they have to be really good listeners and to be able to have high quality connections and active constructive listening so that when you have those micro moments of success or setback, they're the ones who are going to be there for you to say, you got this, let's go. Well, I was hoping you might be able to just take us a step further into understanding the soaring and its strength positive health model. Can you explain what it is and how it could impact a person? Sure. So it started with my capstone thesis when I was getting my masters and applied positive psychology with Marty Seleman at the University of Pennsylvania. I had already been running the charity for 11 years, but I wanted to go back and find out what the science was and bake that into what we already were doing.

And of course to expand it. So when I wrote my thesis, the model was called SOAR SOAR. And now, because always learning and growing in one of my signature strengths is curiosity and love of learning, not to be static, not to sit back, eat bonbons and say, hey, we did a great job. What else do we need to learn? What else are we doing?

So the model is called soaring and it stands for shifting, shifting your thoughts, your actions, and your emotions to have the greatest amount of room to feel all your feelings. And one of the shocking revelations for me during COVID was that I had to feel my negative emotions and my sad emotions and not stuff them and bury them. Because I was raised to be a good girl and to be happy. So I called Talbent Shahar one of the founders of the field of positive psychology and said, I am not thriving. And he goes, yeah, that's what happens when you're positive psychology called leader. Everyone thinks you're happy all the time. But it's only when you feel all your feelings that you can really work through them and move forward with them. In fact, in a couple of hours,

I'll be interviewing Dr. James Pennebaker, who's the leading expert in the world, an expressive writing and positive narrative. So shifting, being able to be aware of your feelings, your emotions, what your body's telling you, and pay attention to that. O is for optimism. Most people are miserable because they think that happiness is a trait, like you have red hair, or you're very tall, but happiness is a state. It comes and goes, it ebbs and flows. So optimism,

learning how to cherish those micro moments of positivity by being fully present. Wow, I'm sitting here at this table, and both of my sons are here and my daughter-in-law's here and my 85 year old mom is here and my husband and my grandbaby. This is great. This is a moment. Take it in instead of, okay, let's do the table. Let's have dessert. So optimism, it comes and it goes, but if you can experience those micro moments and savor them, you're doing really well. The A stands for agency, which is such an important part of leading a passionate, agentic life, that we can't control what happens to us, but we can control how we respond to it, which is tied in with

the R, which stands for resilience, that you are so much stronger than you could imagine. And there's so many things, and that's why, in my book, I put all of the stories, the setbacks, the really painful stories of being molested as a child by a stranger, and the really happy stories, like winning that million dollar account and being in the middle of a trade show and winning best of show and then finding out on be strong and that we will not be flattened. The eye stands for imagery, healing imagery. We each have an internal GPS that when we go inside, it takes 30 or 60 seconds, we can imagine things and our cells don't know the difference.

I have a private healing imagery practice. It came out of needing thousands of people in hospitals or clinics and hearing their stories and knowing that there were things they could do on an individual level to shift. So I studied with Dr. Gerald Epstein from the American Institute of Mental Immitry. I studied with him for three years to become certified in what I had known from being a young girl. I always had this ability to tap into other people and to use flow and force is greater than me to help people activate that inner imaginal realm. There's a wonderful organization called the Coincidence Project,

which I was invited to be on the global board of directors of. And it's scientists, and physicists, and people who are very skilled and knowledgeable and practiced in the art of synchronicity, which is when seemingly random things happen that are impossible to be random. It have great meaning and significance for the people involved. Synchronicity, serendipity, coincidence. So that's a wonderful group where again, that's part of a tribe that I'm part of, where I can go and talk to people about

synchronicity stories and coincidence stories and not have people think it's like a weird parlor game or some cheap trick. The end stands for narrative, positive narrative, how we tell our stories and even listening to hearing, reading and writing stories has an impact on our world view, our philosophy, and how we're feeling physically, emotionally and mentally. So that's a wonderful repository that everyone can have access to. And then G, which stands for gratitude, which I believe is the most powerful of all the positive emotions.

We can be grateful for drinking water. We can be grateful for small things like I buy flowers every week because there's a wonderful place in my neighborhood like a bodega and they're beautiful and the flowers last for two weeks. So it just gives me great joy to see them. So it's a really small micro intervention that has a really positive outcome. So that's the soaring into strength model. And whatever we do a program, we ask people to fill out a five minute questionnaire at the beginning and the end. And then we can measure the movement or the changes in their physical and emotional and mental well-being. And now, hopefully, with this larger grant funding, and as we start to scale, we'll be able to trap people

and as we start to scale, we'll be able to track people over time that we'll want to stay in the study with us to be learning and experiencing new insights and discoveries so that we can track how they're shifting and growing and changing over time. I think it's wonderful. And there are literally hundreds of millions of people globally who are suffering from mental health conditions. And then there's billions of people who are experiencing some form of loneliness as many studies have pointed out.

And many times these people who have these mental illnesses are labeled with a stigma, and they're told that this is a chronic state that you can never get out of, which there've been many studies now that show through post-traumatic growth, or there was even a book written this past year by Dr. Christopher Palmer, whose psychiatrist at the Harvard Medical School that he found a direct link between your metabolism and mental health disorders. My question though is how could we collectively better support people who are suffering either from loneliness or mental illness? Yeah well I think there's a lot of positive things that have come out the last three years. The first is, I think generational. My parents' generation, grandparents' generation,

of course, no one would talk about these things. They would be talked about in behind closed doors and whisper tones. And the person who was experiencing the mental challenges being wired the way they were made to feel in some way less than marginalized guilty as if they weren't strong. If you just tough it up, when you say that to someone who's by beholder, that's really

not helpful. It actually makes them feel like crap. So what I've noticed generationally is I've had over 440 interns and fellows at soaring words over the past 22 years, and a lot of them are very upfront about their diagnoses as it were, labeling it, mentioning it, talking about it. And I think that's great. In the appropriate context, you don't have to wear it on a t-shirt, but knowing who is a trusted expert companion or someone that you

could confide in, that takes some of the stigma of trying to hide things. So we have a shorthand of someone saying, I need to take a little time, or my grandmother just went into hospice, one of our fellows told me. And I said, take the time you need. What do you want? She said, it's just need to take today off. I was so grateful that she said that instead of powering through pretending that everything was honky-dory, and I'm not the mother or therapist to all the people that I encounter, but always, you could ask someone,

would you like to speak about it? You could suggest that they get professional help. That also destigmatizes them from taking that action. A lot of different racial groups and cultural groups have things about men going for help or women or anything. So there's just being that compassionate, empathetic person that could help people get the resources they need. But I like you, John, am a big believer in physical activities like endorphins, what would we do without them? So, while I'm not saying that someone should just work out their way to perfect mental health,

there are many studies that show that by having a rigorous eyes program that works for you is the way to start having some of those hormones being created. And then of course, there is a lot that have been done with medication. I'm not a doctor, I always say, don't play one on television, but there are great strides that people

have made so that they're able to live with whatever the issue is and have happiness and thriving and the ability to function and get out of bed in the morning. So I think it's great that we are talking about this because for decades no one talked about it. Still, it is a global epidemic and it's not going away. So it's something we really do need to address. Yeah, I had Dr. Kerr if it's sterled on the podcast last year and she has a great book I have called Younger You and one of the most important findings that she had on this,

I'm reducing biological age and having longer longevity is the importance of daily movement. And you've alluded to it a bunch of times today. I know you're a huge swimmer this past weekend. I supported a number of my friends who swim in an annual event we have here in Tampa Bay called the Frogman swim and it goes to benefit the Navy seal foundation and fallen or injured seals and their families. And but I know for you it's almost a daily ritual for you to do that. You also get on an elliptical, et cetera. How would you recommend someone who's maybe struggling with this idea of having this movement? What are some easy steps that they might take

to try to incorporate this more into their lives? Again, it gets back to what we've been talking about this whole session, community, relationship, just take the first step. So maybe your local YMCA or JC, there's so many things online and in person that don't cost a lot of money, pay as you go. So finding out where you can go and it's not about setting goals like I'm going to run a triathlon in two months, it's about what can I do that's realistic?

Can I do this twice a week? Can I walk for a half a mile a day? Can I go on that elliptical machine for 10 minutes? Can I start at level three? And then maybe in a month, build up to level six. So setting really small goals and then building it up, it's always great to have an accountability partner. That way, if you could do it with someone else, even if you just check in with each other

on text or you could actually do a walk or run together two days a week, and then do what makes your heart sing. Like, for me, that's swimming. When I, after that first lap in the pool, I am in the zone. I'm so blessed out. I'm happy, which is why it's really important to me, but for someone else, it might be dancing or it might be biking or it might just be walking. My mom got one of the Apple Watchers and she was walking for a mile a day, go mom. And so there's so many ways that you could just get that cardio going and get those endorphins moving. If people are having physical challenges,

I'm a huge believer in the amazing work of physical therapists. These people are just so knowledgeable about anatomy and there's been times when I've had injuries where I've had to go to them and I hate it. But I go because I wanna come back to having as much of my capacities as possible for as long as possible.

So again, it's not a competition, it's not a race, but just do one right thing. Just make a commitment to do one right thing. Just make a commitment to do one thing and just pay attention. I promise you that after you do some kind of working out, you will feel differently than if you hadn't done it. And the last thing is drinking water is so, so important so you don't get dehydrated. Drinking water, I drink water all day, all night,

I get up in the middle of the night, use the washroom, like just drink a lot of water. And then also this is so sexy. This is such an exciting thing to tell people. The new research said saying that getting eight hours sleep is so essential. I used to pride myself on getting five hours, four hours or six hours. Those days are over because when I'm sleeping for eight hours, all the cells are rejuvenating and my body is taking the time to repair and come back to a state of vitality. So working out, getting a good night's sleep, drinking a lot of water, and then there's a lot of research which is such a compelling title.

Sitting is the new smoking. Just check out that research. It's all scientifically proven that if we sit all day, if we're really like a couch potato, we need to get up every hour and just walk around for two minutes so that you can just be supple and just get things activated again. So that is my advice. Well, thank you for that. And I'm going to end our discussion where I started it, which is on faith, because faith is the foundation of your essence and life, but faith doesn't have to equate to religion for everyone and it often doesn't. But I'd still like to ask you this question, how has your faith deepened over time, especially as you've gone through some of these moments that we talked about and the traumatic events, and what is your advice for a listener on how they can strengthen their own faith?

Sure. So, that's a really great distinction you made. When I talk about spirituality, I practice my faith, but it can be just love of nature, appreciation and respect for other human beings or this great gift that we call life. So it doesn't have to be that you go to a church or a mosque or a synagogue. That's not what I'm talking about. For me, when the most horrible thing in my life happened, when I got that fun call at four o'clock in the morning, I had a choice to make, I could hate everyone's guts and be bitter and mean and miserable for the rest of my life. Or I

could choose to deeply, authentically be so grateful for the 35 years that Gary and I had together. And that's what I chose to do. So holidays were an are pretty painful. Oh, we're going to my sisters, my brothers, my nieces, my nephews, all that stuff. But I know that what I had can always be with me. And my faith just let me thank and be grateful for what I have instead of just focus on the paucity and what I've lost. So, the thing about faith is it's a renewable source of energy. And the thing about faith that's really fascinating, like hope, which has proven scientific state, is that faith is usually activated in a moment where something bad happened, where there's an absence of goodness or there's a calamity that happens.

And that's when faith is tested. When things are amazing and we're on the top of the world, yes, I mean, we could be faithful and be appreciative of all those gifts, but faith is usually deeply embraced when we're in the cauldron of the bottom. So that's been my experience. And just being able to laugh, like I remember the first time I laughed after Gary died. I was like, how could you possibly laugh? But we laughed. We laughed a lot. And it feels good to remind ourselves that we're here right now, that we have all the tools, all of the skills, all the strengths right inside of us.

And if we just choose to relax into that knowledge, and then the last thing we were talking about loneliness a lot, but I used to tell my kids when they were very little and now they're 32 and 26 and all grown up, I'd say, how could you be bored? How could you be lonely? You're with the best person I know. So get comfortable with being alone in the privacy of your own company and then you'll never be bored or lonely a day in your life. So I've really enjoyed spending this time with you John. I hope that

what I've said will ignite a spark for your listeners. It's been really fun talking to you about my book, soaring into strength, love, transcends pain. It's an ebook, it's an audiobook, but it's a hardcover book and a paperback book too. I hope people will check it out and send me a message and let me know what you thought about my stories. I just want you to know that I'm sending you strength and love. Well, at least to that point, where is the best place that they can do that? It's on Amazon, vn.com, and pretty much anywhere where books are sold. I got an email from someone over the weekend that she went into her independent bookstore in Montana, and they ordered the book for her. So love independent bookstores as well.

So, but if you type in my name Lisa Honeig books bound good luck spelling it. Or if you type in sorry, it's a strength love transcends pain. You will be able to find it on the internet. Oh Lisa, thank you so much for being here and best of luck on your grant. Thank you. Thank you, John, and keep soaring into passion. I thoroughly enjoyed today's interview with Lisa Honeck Book Spam, and I wanted to thank Lisa Scott Berry-Coffman and my friends at the University of Pennsylvania, including Katie Milpin, for giving me the honor of interviewing her. Links to all things Lisa will be in the show notes at passionstruck.com.

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