Passion Struck with John R. Miles - Olatunde Sobomehin and Sam Seidel on How to Blaze Your Own Path and Make Work That Matters EP 291

Episode Date: May 11, 2023

Sam Seidel and Olatunde Sobomehin's journey to uncover what makes creative hustlers successful took an unexpected turn when they discovered the vital role of strong values and principles. Their findings, captured in their book, offer a new perspective on achieving creative success. Keep listening to find out why. Olatunde Sobomehin and Sam Seidel Join Me to Discuss How to Blaze Your Path and Make Work That Matters. The Passion Struck podcast welcomed Sam Seidel and Olatunde Sobomehin, co-authors of the book Creative Hustle, to discuss the importance of strong values and principles in creative entrepreneurship. In the episode, Seidel and Sobomehin emphasized the role of having a clear framework to help navigate the infinite possibilities that exist for creative individuals and so much more. Full show notes and resources can be found here: https://passionstruck.com/olatunde-sobomehin-sam-seidel-creative-hustle/ Brought to you by Fabric. Go to Apply today in just 10 minutes at https://meetfabric.com/passion. Brought to you by Hello Fresh. Use code passion16 to get 16 free meals, plus free shipping!” Brought to you by Indeed. Head to https://www.indeed.com/passionstruck, where you can receive a $75 credit to attract, interview, and hire in one place. --► For information about advertisers and promo codes, go to: https://passionstruck.com/deals/  Like this show? Please leave us a review here -- even one sentence helps! Consider including your Twitter or Instagram handle so we can thank you personally! --► Prefer to watch this interview: https://youtu.be/_Wnz5UXslDo  --► Subscribe to Our YouTube Channel Here: https://www.youtube.com/c/JohnRMiles  Want to find your purpose in life? I provide my six simple steps to achieving it - passionstruck.com/5-simple-steps-to-find-your-passion-in-life/ Catch my interview with Lori Gottlieb on the importance of embracing self-compassion: https://passionstruck.com/lori-gottlieb-on-embracing-self-compassion/  Watch the solo episode I did on the topic of Chronic Loneliness: https://youtu.be/aFDRk0kcM40  Want to hear my best interviews from 2022? Check out episode 233 on intentional greatness and episode 234 on intentional behavior change. ===== FOLLOW ON THE SOCIALS ===== * Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/passion_struck_podcast * Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/johnrmiles.c0m  Learn more about John: https://johnrmiles.com/  Passion Struck is now on the AMFM247 broadcasting network every Monday and Friday from 5–6 PM. Step 1: Go to TuneIn, Apple Music (or any other app, mobile or computer) Step 2: Search for “AMFM247” Network

Coming up next on Passion Struck, one of the things we found is that folks who seem to reach these levels of putting their creative work into action in the world have strongly held values, strongly held principles that guide them. Why do we think that that is the case? I think it's partially the case because there's infinite possibilities out there. And if I don't have that clear framework for deciding, I'm going to go this way and not this way. Then I'm just doing everything, which means I'm doing nothing. Welcome to PassionStrock.

Hi, I'm your host, John Armiles. And on the show, we decipher the secrets, tips, and guidance of the world's most inspiring people and turn their wisdom into practical advice for you and those around you. Our mission is to help you unlock the power of intentionality so that you can become the best version of yourself. If you're new to the show, I offer advice

and answer listener questions on Fridays. We have long-form interviews the rest of the week with guest-ranging from astronauts to authors, CEOs, creators, innovators, scientists, military leaders, visionaries, and athletes. Now, let's go out there and become PassionStruck. Hello, everyone, and welcome back to episode 291

of PassionStruck. Ranked by Apple is one of the top 20 health podcasts. And thank you to each and every one of you who comes back weekly to listen and learn, had a live better, be better, and impact the world. PassionStruck is now also unsindicated radio, on the AMFM247 National broadcast. Catch us every Monday and Friday from 5-6pm on Apple Music, tune in, or wherever you listen. Links will be in the show notes. And if you're new to the show, thank you so much for being here.

You simply want to introduce this to a friend or family member. We now have episode sturder packs, both on Spotify and the Passion Struck website, and these are our collections of our fans' favorite episodes that we organize into convenient topics that give any new listener a great way to get acclimated to everything we do here on the show. Either go to Spotify or PassionStruck.com slash sturderepacks to get started. In a case you missed my interview from earlier in the week, it featured Dr. C. McDermott, who is a precision wellness practitioner and holds a doctorate of philosophy in integrative nutrition.

See focuses on preventing disease and optimizing lifestyle through nutrition, behavioral change, mindset, and stress management. See is the author of the International Best Selling Book, Your DNA, Your Life. And if you liked that episode or today's, please go and give us a five star rating and review. They go such a long way in helping to promote the popularity of the show, but more importantly, bringing more people into the passion-struck community where we can teach them how to live a limitless life and provide hope, meaning, connection, and inspiration.

And I know our guests love to hear from you too. Now let's talk about today's episode. Do you know how to harness your creativity, blaze your own path, and make work that truly matters? Today's guest, Tendey Sabameen and Sam Saidel, will tackle those questions along with how to know what principles cannot be compromised, what North Star you will follow as you develop, advance, and transform.

Who you should surround yourself with so that you can advance in your career and in your life. What are the routines that you will follow every day, every week, and every year that will help keep you going? Based on their well-known Stanford B-School course of the same name, their new book, Creative Hustle, offers many lessons on how to make a living doing what matters to you. Through the experiences of people who have successfully combined their values and passions with their professional aspirations, Hyundai Sabamahin has a lifelong dedication to youth as well as

social entrepreneurship. He is the founding CEO of Street Code Academy, a community-based innovation hub that provides free training in coding, entrepreneurship, and design. He has taught public speaking at LPFI's Summer Math and Science Honors Academy at Stanford University and University, California, Berkeley. Hyundai earned a BA in urban studies from Stanford University. Sam Sidel is a director of strategy and research

at the Stanford D-School's A12 lab and author of the book, Hip Hop Genius, remixing high school education. Thank you for choosing PassionStruck and choosing me to be your hosting guide on your journey to creating an intentional life now. Let that journey begin. I am so excited today to welcome Sam Sidel and Tunde Jeba Mahin, welcome gentlemen.

Thank you. Well, and we are here to discuss your great new book, Creative Hossil, which I'm going to tell the audience. I absolutely loved. And I'm going to just put it up here just for a second because what I love about it are all these pictures and everything and illustrations that they have that help augment and support and complement everything

that we're going to be talking about here today. But before we jump into this book, I always like to give the audience a chance to get to know the guest. And, Hyundai, I have to tell you, when I was growing up, my mom told me this story that she had this Volkswagen Bug. And one time, she and I were driving down the highway and I guess I was a baby and it would have been in Rochester, New York and she hit this thing of ice and she started to spin out of control and thought her life and mine were potentially over when she ended up facing oncoming traffic and everything turned out to be okay. But I understand you have your own Volkswagen

Bug story. Wow. Oh, wow. You dug in the crate for that. So yes, I'm all out to a nation with me. I was raising Portland, Oregon, born in LA, though. And most people don't know that because I spent a very little time before I went to Nigeria. And the birth story in LA was that I was born in an orange Volkswagen bug. So how you dug that out is only to show the type of research you do, but yes, I was born in an orange Volkswagen bug. The story is long because I have a Nigerian father, a white American mother born in 1980. And so there's details around that, but I'll leave that for next time. Orange, Morgan, plug. I was born in. Yes, sir. All right. And then there's one other fun

tidbit I found. So if having to go to Stanford wasn't enough for you, she didn't put enough pressure on yourself. So you wanted to become an entrepreneur and start your own business. What business did you start? I was in college and I had a few jobs. I had to be honest with you, three jobs. I was a basketball manager. I did some work study, community service work, but I also started cutting hair here. And I started a business cutting hair

and linked up with another gentleman who was cutting hair. And we started something called Stanford Troubo Shop, Stion Styles Collaboration. It was five S's and a C. When we said that fast, we got a spot G. And we started its spot G there, a business that later became an acronym for education and service through fashion, athletics, community, and entertainment. So we cut hair, we did T-shirts, we threw events. And the business is still running.

It's been 20 plus years that we've had that brand and the business is still operating here in Silicon Valley. What an awesome story. Sam, I'm gonna hit you up as well. So I'm a huge music fan and people would call me a 90s alternative nerd if you had to go that direction, but I understand you are a hip hop nerd. How did that come about? Well, I was born the year. I believe it's the same year that the first hip hop song was

pressed onto a vinyl record and really grew up alongside the culture. I mean, I grew up in an urban area. Hip-hop was like the bubbling music and culture of that time that I was growing up. I want to give a special shout out to my pops who was a high school theater teacher. And in the way that I think good teachers do listen to his students. So his students recommended some records early on.

So the first one I remember is Grandmaster Flash and the Furious Fives record the message, him bringing that home on vinyl. Because one of his students had said, you really need to check this out. And then the next one was the Beat Street soundtrack, the soundtrack for the movie Beat Street. And those were just hugely influential

and started a love of the music and connection to the culture that has continued throughout my life. Yeah, and you even wrote a book about it. So, there you go. Yes, yeah. Hip-hop genius, it's about hip-hop culture and education and kind of the intersections between the two and how much I think educators can learn from hip-hop. How much hip hip hop heads can learn from educators in a sense. I think it might be a little more the other way around in terms of how most of the book is structured and explain, but I really wanted it to be something that somebody who was a total hip hop head who hadn't really thought a lot about it, like schools and organized education could pick up and really connect with and get a lot out of and then on the flip that someone who's studied education their whole life could, that didn't really know hip hop culture could pick up and learn a lot and get a lot out of and then on the flip that someone who's studied education their whole life could, that didn't really know hip-hop culture could pick up and learn a lot and get a lot out of,

so it's trying to meet both those audiences and even bring them together in a way that I think has been and can continue to be really impactful. Well, that's great and I understand that you both have a huge philanthropic heart and Sam Sam, since we're on you, I'm gonna keep going with this. I understand that you've been working with the Circle for Justice Innovations for over 10 years. What does CGI do?

And why are you so passionate about it? Man, thank you for this question. And I am super passionate about it. And it's not something that I've gotten invited to talk about in a while. So I really just wanna, first of all, appreciate you for doing the research and then giving space for this. This is important to me.

A really influential part of my early work was teaching in juvenile prison and getting to see up close the injustices of what's called the justice system in this country. And also getting to study about that system at the same time because I was an undergraduate and I was taking courses with a professor named Joy James who has just done really important and powerful scholarship in this area. And so it really, like, the combination of having that, like, experience of working with young people who are literally, I would get to go home at the end of the that experience of working with young people who are literally, I would get to go home at the end of the day and they're being locked in. I have this one visceral memory that just popped in my head as I'm saying this to you too, of a day when I was leaving

the facility and there had been a visit where a young man who was incarcerated there, his young child had come to see him and it was time for them to, I was just seeing this in the kind of foyer of the building. It was time he had to go back to his unit, the young man who was incarcerated there, and the child was trying to run toward him, and they had to stop the child and take him back to the unit. And it was just so clear to me that this is not how humans should be treated. It's not how we need to treat each other. It's not how any other country in the world treats people on mass the way it happens here and that it's a form of racialized violence in this country and has been since the start of mass incarceration.

And I wanted to do something about it. I recognize this becoming a little bit of a long answer, but I wanted to do something about it. And one of the things for me was like recognizing that folks who experienced the system directly understand a lot of what needs to change and how to change it and should be honored in that way. And it can't be there's there's actually an organization called well anyway, I'll try to keep it a little straight here. Basically what happened was I found out about a group called CJI, as you mentioned, John, that was as far as I know, the only at the time, at least the only giving circle, which means a circle of people who get together to give money to particular causes that was led by

folks, and equal parts, folks who were coming with a bunch of money and folks who were coming with a bunch of lived experience. So the circle was those two groups, folks who were coming with a bunch of money and folks who were coming with a bunch of lived experience. So the circle was those two groups, folks who had directly experienced the impacts of the prison system by being incarcerated or in some cases being family members, folks who had dedicated their life to activism in that area, and then folks who wanted to support making some change there. So basically that's what the circle has been and it's grown tremendously. So when we were beginning, we were giving a couple hundred thousand dollars a year and in the last few years

it's grown to millions as people have heard about the work and contributed more and more resources. So there's now a bunch of programs within the larger circle for justice innovation. But the basic heart of it, which I think is really important and is something that philanthropy can learn a lot from, is to have a group of decision-makers that includes people who have directly experienced the challenges of our society that we're trying to address. And that's what that group has always been incredibly dedicated to. It's incredibly complex work bringing everyone into a room together and trying to make these decisions with consensus. And that's so much learning and growth happens in that room. Like the money that goes out has changed laws, has launched big efforts, campaigns, initiatives, produced documentaries, all these things, but also what happens for the people in the room has just been incredibly powerful.

So some other time, we could come on with a couple people from the circle and have a whole conversation about it. I know that was a long answer, but I really value you giving me a little space to share about that work because it is extremely important to me. And like I said, I don't get to talk about it often. Yeah. Hey, thank you so much for sharing that. I just read a story this week that a fellow podcaster who does a show on kind of true crime, actually on earth evidence that on the podcast that set two personers who'd been incarcerated for every 25 years free because they were wrongly convicted. So lots of things we could discuss

about our criminal justice system. But Hyundai, you also are involved in a great organization called the Street Code Academy that you co-founded. What do you do with that organization and how does it go about helping people? I love how you conduct in this. John, I just want to echo the gratitude about the work that you've done beforehand. It gives a chance to speak to some of these passions.

I too was one of the reasons why Sam and I linked to do this book. We care about a vast amount of populations and people being able to live their four cells and human rights, civil rights, these are things that are important to us. And economic empowerment is one of those pieces and one major key to economic empowerment in this day and age is your access and ability to leverage technology and the innovation economy. And so I fell into that not as a technologist, not as somebody who practiced the innovation in a traditional sense, but somebody who wanted that right to be given to everyone equally. And so we started street code Academy that would focus on communities of color and providing what we call mindset skills and access to be able to participate in the innovation economy.

So essentially that means we give free tech education to communities of color. We started out with 20 students. We've grown really fast. We've served over 3000 last year, seven year organization and yeah, we're based in East Palatical California right here in the middle of Silicon Valley and we're housed by a beautiful community that thinks progressively about a lot of issues and now it includes technology access. That's great what a worthy cause both of you guys are both involved in. Well Sam as you and I discussed part of getting on the show today I've recently had on two other D-school professors on the show, Jeremy Utley, who wrote the book, Idea Flow, and more recently Charlotte Burgess, Auburn, who wrote why you need a manifesto,

in a similar style to your book. If the listener is not familiar with the D-school, can you explain what it is and how it differs from other design schools? Sure. And to today, please, of the two of us, I'm the one who works at the D school full-time. So I'll take on the first part of the answer, but I always love hearing Tune Day talk about the D school, because I think it's how you've seen and experienced it through your relationship. Tune Day is, I think, equally shines a different angle of light, but an equally important angle of light on it.

The D-School is an institute within Stanford University that exists to inspire and instill creative confidence in everyone who comes into contact with the place. So that certainly includes but is not limited to Stanford students. And one of the ways that we've worked over the last many years is to work with folks in particular sectors. So for instance, I came to the D school to be co-director of our K-12 lab. So it's a whole lab that focuses specifically on elementary, middle and high school students, teachers, school leaders, district leaders, philanthropists, anyone who's working on families, anyone who's working in that area and bringing that creative confidence to that sector, speaking of the conversation we're just having, some of the long standing injustices

that have existed in that sector, right? But we have another program, University Innovation Fellows, that looks at the same thing in higher ed, not just at Stanford University, but all over the world. And another program that Jeremy has worked with for a long time that works with executives. So we're engaging with audiences outside of Stanford pretty far and wide to try to share and spread the tools, the concepts, the mindsets, the abilities of what we often call human-centered design, but to the end of unlocking that creative confidence and competence. end of unlocking that creative confidence and competence. And today, did you want to add anything?

No, I just want to shout out the people that you've already had on your podcast and including Sam's idea on myself and the life, I think that experience of any of these institutions is the people. And I just think that these who has incredible people. institutions is the people and I just think that these school has incredible people. Yeah, my first cousin went to Stanford Law School and he took a cookbook classes at the D School, which he said just really broadened his overall learning and helped him see things in a different way. Well, Tunday, I'm going to turn this back to you. You and Sam teach the creative hustle class at the D School together, which is also the name as we've discussed of your book. But when I saw those two words together, I personally wouldn't have placed them next

to each other. How did you come up with the name and what is the purpose of the course? It was beautiful. So we've taught it one time as a pop-up or pop- I think they call it at the D school. And let's essentially a short engagement for all intensive purposes. It's a class, but this class was unique. Sam and I wanted to do something almost like an experiment. Had it really been done to my knowledge, at least where you bring a class, half of the students are non-stand for students.

This time, it happened to be from our community of East Palo Alto and part of our community at St. Codic Academy. And then you had half the class enrolled Stanford students from a variety of departments there, including the law school. And so your cousin might have been in the class, but nonetheless, it might have applied because we had a lot of people apply for the class.

And we selected it to be 30 students, to be this experience where you would figure out and be inspired to live your own life in your own way, right? Particularly when we think about folks are put on tracks, folks are put on paths that are almost prescribed for you. You could be at a law school and you're expected to be a lawyer and that has a number of expectations with it. You could be at the medical school and be expected to be a doctor or be in research, but the point is like we wanted everyone to think no matter what folks expect you to be in society to expect you to be, you can live outside of that and what we the subtitle of the book is,

blaze your own path and make work that matters. And so we wanted that message to be widely adopted and by a number of folks. And like Sam has mentioned, he's already had an experience and an affinity for bringing these groups together and having them work together and the magic that happens when we get that diverse group of perspectives in the same room. So that was something that we were both excited about. And we wanted something that would grab folks that would speak to that mentality and folks who come from the hip hop culture identified with the word hustle. That's it. That's a household idea, right? And the world of hip hop. And it means, look, I'm going to be expectations. I'm going to I may even be against the odds, but I'm a win. And I'm going to make it happen. So that was the hustle part. And the creative part was, we really wanted

in the spirit of the D school and the spirit of this blaze your own path and the spirit of like all things are possible. We wanted to really spark people's imagination. What think big about what you want to do with your life? Don't just think small and survival. I think even in the first paragraph, we talk about let's think about how you could drive in this. And that was inspiring to us. So we bounce around some words. I credit a lot of the words, the Sam side down who even this year is writing four books. If you hear him talk about his love, he has a love with I'm putting my own words on it, but essentially making magic with words. I think he says making art with words, right? So I think it was

him who came up with it, but we? So I think it was him who came up with the, but we never know. But it was like in the midst of us talking that combination creative hustle came out. I love brand and rhyme and and feel that street code Academy has that is spotty. I mentioned earlier has that ring. So I love things that kind of stick with you and hit you right when you hear him. And so when creative hustle came to the surface and our conversation, we were like, that's it. We never knew it would be a book. We never knew it would be an artistic and beautiful book like the one that you so generously showed the audience. And so that credit goes to a number of folks who talked about Charlotte earlier, but also Scott Doryley and a number of folks from the D school. But the idea of creative hustle came

from Sam and I's intention to really serve the community that we know and love. Yeah, it's interesting. I have my own book eventually coming out, you know how the publishing world is, so I'm waiting under these. They're gonna give me, thank you. But I came up, it's called Passion Struck, but in it I have five plantos that you cross

to becoming Passion Struck. And the last phase I call you become a creative amplifier. I have plateaus that you cross to becoming passion struck and the last phase I call you become a creative amplifier. And I think we think of this term creative or creativity and we assign it to artists or musicians, et cetera. But to me, a creator, someone who really serves the world instead of serving themselves. It's creativity for the benefit of the planet.

And when you can amplify that, it can create huge profound difference. So just thought I'd throw that out there. Well, I'm going to give a shout out to your publisher, Ten Speed Press, because I think they have done a great job with this book. And Sam, I'm gonna ask you, would inspired you to take the approach that you took in the book?

It really stems directly out of what Tunde was just sharing in terms of the class that we taught and some of the larger D-school ethos. So what I mean by that is the way that we did the class was we brought in three people that the two of us consider like incredible creative hustlers. And we asked them to just speak about their journey, speak about their creative process. And then with the 30 students that Tune Day was mentioning, we spent a day plus and evening

dissecting what we had heard and trying to pull the elements out of those creative hustler stories that we could all learn from and then co-creating our own roadmap for our own creative hustles. And that became this kind of canvas we called it that had us trying to unpack what some of the gifts that we have to offer the world are on one side. And then some of the goals of what we're trying to do in the world on the other side. And then thinking about how to move across that canvas from those gifts that we have to offer to those goals. When we received the invitation to create a book, I think our natural disposition

was how do we take that experience that felt really powerful and transformative in that room with 32 of us, including the two of us and Cram it into this Little form factor. It's not a big object. So it's a challenge to say, how do you get all of that in? So we really structured the book almost exactly like the class. So we really structured the book almost exactly like the class. We broke it down into a few more sections, but each section starts with the story of three inspirational creative hustlers and then works together. We're trying to work with the reader. We don't have their voice in the page the way that we do in the class, have it in the room in real time.

But we're trying to work with the reader to say, let's figure out what's going on here. So every chapter ends with a little box that has like, here's something that we are pulling out of this story. And then each section after the three stories of the creative hustlers, we get into an activity. And we actually ask you to turn the books sideways like this is something different happening here at this point because we're asking you to become the author.

And as the reader, and we walk people through a version and evolved version of that very same activity that we did in the first class. I feel like there's moments in the book where you can almost hear us trying to leap out of the pages and have you as the reader and be like, this is free. This is an active experiment. This isn't just like a passive consumption, but I think pretty much every decision we made in the creation of the book came down to that. Like wanting to have it be equal parts inspiration and practical. We did not just want people to put down the book and say, wow, that's so great that those nine people did these amazing

things. I wish I could be one of them someday. Like we really wanted people to put down the book. I'm on my way. I'm moving right now. And I feel super inspired by the people, I feel in community almost with both the people who are involved in this book and the other people who I imagine are looking at it right now, like me and thinking about what they can do next. Well, I think you both did an excellent job doing that. And, Kunde, I'm gonna turn back to you. You start out the book by acknowledging rightly so

that so much of our world is predetermined for us, where we're born, our parents, our zip code, even what side of the poverty line we're born into. How do you go about uncovering your gifts and goals when you have that predisposition? First, I think the way that you describe creativity and creators in the way that that's expressing in your book, Passion Struck, is incredible. And I wanted to just salute that and let you know that has moved me to think about creativity in a new way in terms of how it relates to the world, how it puts the world better. And so I appreciate that. And then Sam, the way you describe the book and you talk about this equally part inspirational and equal part practical,

I was wanting to give the reader a taste of that by reading one of those. I don't know Sam if you can poke your head around as I answer this question and see if maybe you can read one of those prompts that express that. I think it's really powerful for your listeners to hear how that comes across in the book. But in terms of like how people don't get unstuck from the path that they were put in, I don't have a profound answer. Other than our experience doing this hundreds of times have shown me that just simply giving space and time for us to ask the question, does a whole lot.

I'm not going to say it is the answer to everything, but I know it starts for us, Sam talking about the D school is to inspire creative confidence. And what that does, just when you have confidence, as Strico, we start with mindsets, which just happens when your mindset changes, when your focus changes. When we pull out this canvas that was mentioned,

I'll give you a reader's look of the canvas, for those of you that can see it, I'm holding up one of the canvases that I created this week, my gifts to goals, and it has a number of my gifts and my goals and my principles, people and practice that will help me get there. And I feel stuck, I wrestle with being stuck in the things that I am prescribed.

And so just asking those questions and allowing me to think outside the box gives me space to now get unstuck. Oh, you really like doing these workshops. Maybe you want to do these around the world. I never knew that till I got space to think about what do I actually want to do. And so on my goals I said I want to be one of the best workshop leaders and then I mentioned it as we were talking about different things and I talked about a desire of mine that had been held on for a long time

But it allows me to hold on to that where I want a book dedicated to me I've now written a book and never thought I would whatever do that and I appreciate Sam side Dale and Charlotte Burgess oblong as you mentioned and Scott Durley for selecting that's the right that book. But also I want to have a book dedicated to me. I've always wanted that, right? This exercise gave me a reason to put down those goals again. And so just the time and the space for someone who believes that it's possible to ask you, what do you want to get done begins to unlock. Doesn't necessarily do the whole work, right? Because we talk about imagination plus action.

You got to actually do some things, but just that place to imagine, just that place to think outside the box, gives people, I think the first step in getting unlocked. Well, if I can jump in there, I'm glad you brought all that up because really the sole purpose of this podcast is to try to help people learn how to be unstuck. How do you go from being stuck to passion struck? And I think there are just so many billions of people out there right now who feel lonely, hopeless, bored, broken, battered, whatever word you want to use. And they don't know how to get out of it.

And that is precisely why I wanted to have you two gentlemen on the show because I think your book, in a very easily digestible way, gives some great guidance on how you do that with some inspiring stories that, as Sam said, you interweave throughout the book, which I'm gonna jump to right now. But the whole thing that I found is that you do it

by living your life intentionally. You've gotta make those choices every single day. And as we'll talk to later on in the book, you have a great quote by Aristotle in it about, you become what you constantly do. And that's what intentionality is all about. So Sam, I'm going to turn this back to you now. And as I mentioned throughout the book, you interweave these different individuals into the chapters. And chapter one is on why principles matter so much in your life.

And my question for you is, why do you believe the best creative hustlers choose their beliefs deliberately? And why does this matter? Well, part of the answer to this is that we've learned it by talking to a lot of creative hustlers and trying to find the common elements from their stories. I mean, we're talking about super diverse people, racially and culturally in terms of age, gender identity, geography, and what discipline they

work in, right? Where like you were not limiting creativity to the fine arts or the arts or anything like that, we've got politicians in here, we've got community activists in here, we've got chefs in here, we've got marketing executives in here. So talking to all of them, there's a lot of difference in what they describe. But there's also a lot of similarity. And one of the things we found is that folks who seem to reach these levels of putting their creative work into action in the world have strongly held values, strongly held principles that guide them. I'll start to speculate because you also asked why do we think that is the case. I think it's partially the case because there's infinite possibilities out there.

And if I don't have that clear framework for deciding, I'm gonna go this way and not this way, then I'm just doing everything, which means I'm doing nothing, right? I'm so like scattershot all over the place. I'll say, I've struggled with this, and I think one of the reasons that some of my creative hustle hasn't always achieved what it could have is because I'm like excited.

I'm like, but I could learn from that too, and I could learn from that too. I think one of the things I've heard said about design is great design is as much about what you keep out as what you put in. And so I think that having those clear values is what helps people successful creative hustlers know what to let in out of all the stuff.

They could be receiving as input or putting it into the world as output. It like helps to really narrow that and give it a laser-like focus. So time and time again, we've found that folks who have that clarity are able to move work that really matters to them and to the world. Sam, thank you so much for that great explanation.

And in chapter two, you discuss this importance of discovering who you are and then showing others, what can we learn from the story of Christopher squint, sandifier? Yeah, we call him squint and he's a dear friend of Sam and me. And there's so much to learn, but to Sam's earlier point about how all of these creative hustlers anchor themselves on a principle. He, I'm really glad that we, that he emerged as the first chapter

because he really embodies that I think profoundly. He's a visual storyteller, photographer, filmmaker. And so there are a lot of avenues he can go. And I've been behind the scenes with him, many of these opportunities to go left right or etc. And I've seen him to Sam's point, leave out a lot. I've seen him say no to a lot. And I've seen him say yes to some very oddly peculiar type of

opportunities. And when you dig in to like, why did you say yes? And why did you say no to all these other things? And he gives you the simple answer that it's about what he loves. It's about love. It's centered around the kind of message he wants to put out into the world, the kind of people he wants to be around, the kind of efforts he wants to endorse. It's like, oh, you got to buy something different. I always look at the contract. I look at the bottom.

I'm kind of money is going to be made from this exchange. I look at how many listeners are going to be hearing this message about spending this hour on the podcast. I'm looking at these metrics that I've just been created, pattern around. And I too have a strong sense of who we're aligned with. And I'm honored to do things with Sam Sideos. It's a joy to be in the process and meet incredible folks like you and so I have that too But he has that so deeply rooted as a center and so we talk about in the book how he does that right and the brand that he has made about

himself and the way he thinks about himself and because he's Born on Valentine's Day because his parents have told him, you're on, you put on this earth to love, he's adopted that idea and said, everything I do is gonna be about love. And as he takes photos and he finds himself being moved by something other than love, he wants to get back to that route

and he wants his shots to capture the intimacy and the authenticity that comes from loving that person, loving their work, loving the activity, loving the moment through his lens, right? So he wears red every day. He gave himself a nickname. We know him as squint that talks about his perspective and kind of the value behind that and also he wears red to remind himself of that value of love. And so we talk about in the chapter and then ask readers at the end, I don't know if you have it pulled up Sam, maybe you can read that. Yeah, but at the end we ask readers,

what's your way of doing that? Do you mind, John, if Sam reads that little story? No, that's fine. Yeah, sure interview. I think it's three or four sentences here. As I mentioned earlier, each chapter ends with us trying to make sure that we're pulling some practical either tips or prompts out of a really inspiring story to help readers move from inspiration to action.

So this one is called Inspired by Squint. Squint uses his nickname to remind himself of his unique perspective, and he wears the color red to remember to lead with love. Can you come up with an outward manifestation that exemplifies your principles? Perhaps you come up with a new nickname for yourself. Carry a certain totem in your pocket every day. Change the backdrop of your smartphone, or add a message to the cover of your notebook. Experiment to find what is right for you.

It's part of what we're trying to do here, John, is not tell people pick a color like a squid and wear that color, it's not a formula, but it's finding the version of what he's doing that's so powerful with his name and wearing the color red that actually makes sense in your reality, in your life, that's gonna remind you of your values

the way that works for him. Well, Sam, that was really beautifully said. Tune in, I'm gonna just go back to something that you said because in chapter three, you guys have this great quote by Adrian Marie Brown and I'm not going to read the whole quote but the first line of it is your know makes the way for your yes and one of the most popular podcasts that I've done and I do a solo podcast every Friday. I did one on we say yes to everything in our lives, but we forget that sometimes saying no is what really allows us to be intentional in doing the things that are going to take us to where

we need to go, because when you say yes to everything, you're saying no to nothing. And you just get overwhelmed with the enormity of it. And so Sam, I think I'm going to pass this over to you, but why do you think this is such an important principle and how did author and TV broadcaster Ayesha Curry learn how to base both her personal and professional choices on her core principles and learning from that quote that I just mentioned. Yeah, thank you for pulling that quote out because I think it is relevant to something we were just talking about, right? It comes back to that point about what you keep out and what you let in. And Esha Curry just beautifully articulated that in our

time with her. And she talked about going to see Michelle Obama speak. I believe that's where this kind of like the seed formed for her. And Michelle Obama said learning to say no was the biggest lesson she had learned. And so she started talking about how she's carried that into her life and how much it's transformed her creative practice and what she puts in the world. And yeah, we found that both the principle, but also the particulars of the story and how she's manifested it and what it opened up for her to be really inspiring. So we tried to capture that. And then around that same time, Adrian Marie Browns, it's a book and anthology.

It has writing by a bunch of authors, but she's one of the editors. And that quote was in that book, and it just felt like it was so fitting for what Aisha Curry had shared with us. So that was how that ended up being like, the lead pull out quote in that chapter. If you want to share more specifics about Aisha's story,

that stood out to you, but that's a thread that runs through what we were just talking about, the quote you shared John and then what I used to share it with us. Well, I'm going to jump into chapter four, Tunde and speaking of quotes, you give an amazing one by Martin Luther King where he says, Courage breeds creative self-affirmation, how it is produces destructive self-appenigation.

And I recently did an episode on what it means to be a person of courage, because I think we get bravery and courage, really mixed up. What can we learn about this from the story of rapper and school founder, TCLS? Yeah, thank you. I look up to, man, Martin Luther King, Jr. and David T.C. Ellis for really similar ways in which you already drew the thread, living and courage. And we have a lot to

learn from David T.C. Ellis. Shout out to Sam Sideows, but hip hop genius, which just came out with the second edition this year, but came out 10 years ago. In fact, I have it behind me. If your viewers could zoom in on the books behind me, Hip Hop Genius. I see it up there. Yeah, so long story short, right?

Like David TCL has had to overcome a lot to be able to call himself a school founder and it wasn't a traditional path. It was somebody who didn't graduate from high school, who had challenges with the law, who had personal demons to overcome. But yet there was a resilience and afford to and a courage to go beyond that. And we call them a school founder. We got a book almost dedicated, almost exactly to his story. And we got a

chapter in our other book. There's three books right now that have already mentioned David T. C. Ellis, because of that curves, right? Because of that, to nasty to overcome. And because ultimately, the driving force behind him is to give and to be that, I forgot what you called it, but the creative what was your term, John? Creative amplifier,? Creative amplifier. A creative amplifier.

He's amplifying and setting a pace for education and what it could look like, right? And I don't even know any of the students, but that would be a whole other way of understanding his amplification and meet those students, of which his school is inspiring and empowering. So David T.C. Ellis is in the streets of Minneapolis and he gets some league ideas around what's coming out from Warner Brothers movie Batman and

he goes out and uses this sort of unauthorized information to put out a rap song. And that was really courageous and it really could have ended him up in trouble. But it didn't Prince heard it loved it signed him. He was Prince first hip rap artist signed. Now you're making history with this, the records of classic. He's in that he's moving with Prince and he's got a signed deal right out of it. And so we asked readers to think about, what could you do that may even be on the border of legal and illegal. Like just think it, just imagine like, what could you do to push your thing forward?

Then we say, I love this prompt because it's always shucks. What are you asking me to do? And then it says, you don't have to do it. That's not what I ask you to do that. We're asking you to think about it because it opens up possibilities. What would it be if I just showed up on stage

and said, man, I'm the best. Okay, would that be not the greatest thing, but other stages of where it would be great for you to announce that you wanted people's attention on your product. So anyways, TCL is courageous gentleman who we think is making work that matters. He certainly blazing his own path. And he has a real inspirational life that's guided by courage. I could ask you guys a ton more questions, but we only have time for two more.

Sam, in part three of the book, you go into why your rituals and practices matter, and I'll turn back to that quote that you mentioned in this part of the book by Aristotle, where he says we are what we repeatedly do. And I'm gonna focus this question on you because of course I'm gonna ask you about is someone that you know and have known for a long time.

How did Academy Award winner, John Hader, use her ambition and extensive research to truly comprehend both herself and others to create a claim movies that advance the cultural dialogue. I mean, there's so much that goes into that answer, right? She's been working hard for a long time and so I would hate to ever report to say I can give you the full and complete answer to that question.

I can talk about some of what we highlighted in the book but she is such a trove of information about what creative hustle means and all of its facets. What we really dig into in the book around research practices, and we talk about research as, sure, traditional research, we can look things up, now we can use chat GPT to do some research for us, but also human centered research, getting out there and talking with people and actually getting into relationship with people, being a huge part of her practice as a screenplay writer and a director.

And then also holding the mirror up and doing what we call, I believe it's in the title of that chapter, me search. So it's one thing to say, I'm going to research and study everyone else, all of you, it's another thing to say, who am I in this? Where do I show up in this story? And this is really important in her work, the film that she had that just won some Academy Awards and Sundance and all this is a film about children of deaf adults. That's not her experience. She is not a deaf adult nor is she a child of deaf adults. So how does she come to understand that and how does she come to see her own place in the story and in telling the story. And so she asked some really great questions in

there about what stories are mine to tell. And if I'm telling stories, what's my role in doing so properly and with respect for the folks whose stories I'm sharing, there's not easy answers to those questions. She does provide some very specific things that she did just for folks who are interested in how she went about creating such a film. In that sense, I just think it's an incredibly important aspect of our practice. If we're trying to create art and create it with heart and with positive intentions and to move beautiful things in the world, I don't know how we could possibly do it without doing the kinds of things that she describes in that chapter. Our invitation at the end of that chapter is really for folks to try to pick that up and figure out how it applies in their work, right? It might look very different if you're a politician or a community organizer than it does if you're a screenplay writer.

But we ask what are the tough personal and interpersonal questions facing you? How could learning more about yourself and others allow you to show up more fully and contribute stronger to the world? So that's the way we're cracking open the question and trying to make it universal no matter what someone's creative hustle might be. Okay, and then my last question,

and I hope you can each give a short answer to it, is what do you hope readers take away from this book and how will it help contribute to the greater good of society? And, Tunde, why don't you go first? I'll keep it very short. Blame your own path and make work that matters. That is a very internal place. We want readers to know and chase what's right for them. And I get encouraged. I was just with a friend of mine that we've known for 20 years and I told him a subtitle of the book. That's how I aim to live, right? I want that for my children. I want that for my loved ones. I want that

for each of you. I want that for the world to blaze their own path and know you could do it and live with others. Of course, live within our current constructs. Of course, and also push to find your own way. I love that. And then make work that matters is how we didn't say make work that makes money. We didn't say make work that is generational wealth and those things are important. But we said and we put first make work that matters. So what we care about in your gifts, in your goals is that the world is a better place for blaze your own path in it. And so that's how we want to see the world better. Because we're asking people to make work that matters. Okay. That's an incredible answer. And then Sam, I'll ask you to answer the same question. Well, I mean, I agree with you. That's an incredible, that is the answer to me. What I'll say is we also want people to feel the vibe.

So when we talk creative hustles of class, when we lead it as workshops, like you come in, there's music playing, there's gonna be a little bit of quotations from hip-hop songs and from Aristotle. There's gonna be some swag, some fun, some jokes, and we're gonna get busy. It's gonna be hard to be in that room

and not make your own gift to goals campus. It's gonna be hard to be in that room and not be generous and share with someone nearby how you could contribute to their creative hustle. It's gonna be hard to be in that room and not share actually what you need, which is often harder to share than what you can give. What I want, in addition to what Tune de Fraise perfectly

and I couldn't add anything to in terms of kind of the content or the message, is for people to feel all of that when they are holding this book through the beautiful art by squint and hope, man, through the words that Tundeh and I put down through the stories of the creative hustlers we profile. And the students, also we share some stories about, we want you, when you pick up this book, to feel all of that. Well gentlemen, thank you so much. It's been just an incredible honor for me to have you on this podcast. I'm so glad that Karen reached out to me, your publicist,

and I am just so joyful to be able to spread your message to so many millions of people who need to hear your words. So thank you both. Shout out to Karen and yeah, thank you, John. Great to connect with you and good luck with the book, good luck with the podcast and all of the creative amplification you got going on. Thank you so much for that. I thoroughly enjoyed that interview with Tunde and Sam.

And I wanted to thank Sam and Tunde, Penguin Random House and Stanford D School for the honor and privilege of having them appear on today's show. Links to Sam and Sunday will be in the show notes at passionstruck.com. Please use our website links if you purchase any of the books from the guests that we feature on the show. All proceeds go to supporting the show. Videos are on YouTube at both John R. Miles and Passion Struck Clips. As I mentioned at the beginning of the show, you can also now find us Monday and Friday from 5 to 6 p.m.

on the AM FM 247 National broadcast links in the show notes. Everties or deals and discount codes are in one convenient place at PassionStark.com slash deals. I'm on LinkedIn where you can subscribe to my newsletter and you can also find me a John Armiles on both Twitter and Instagram. Or I post daily, you're about to hear the preview for a very special interview that I did with Dr. Marshall Goldsmith who has been consistently ranked as the top executive coach and one of the top

10 business thinkers in the world. We discuss his latest New York Times bestselling book, The Earned Life. The people listening to us right now tend to be focused on ambition and achievement. They tend to be goal achievers. They're listening to learn things and hopefully help them achieve more. And one of the things I talk about that is very important in the earn life is never become addicted to results and never place your values of human being based on results. That's always a mistake. For two reasons. One, you don't control the results. And two, how much

long-term peace and happiness do you get after you choose results? A day? A week? Remember, we rise by lifting others. So please share the show with those that you love. If you found today's episode on creativity useful, then share it with those that you love and care about. In the meantime, do your best to apply what you hear on the show so that you can love what you listen. And until next time, live life, passion struck. you