Passion Struck with John R. Miles - Rear Admiral Tim Gallaudet USN (Ret.) On: The Keys to Leading in Turbulent Times EP 117

Starting point is 00:00:00 coming up next on the PassionStruck podcast. I wouldn't say I was a natural leader. I was, but the Academy gives you all the basics and lace the foundation and then through great mentors and listed and officers, me and you, we were carried by people who helped shape and refine our leadership skills and overall approach. And I'm thankful for every one of them. There's thousands of them that I couldn't name right now. But that's kind of how it happened. And what I've discovered and seen is that everybody has an opportunity to lead. It doesn't have to be one in authority. Welcome visionaries, creators, innovators, entrepreneurs, leaders,

Starting point is 00:00:41 and growth seekers of all types to the passion-struck podcast. Hi, I'm John Miles, a peak performance coach, multi industry CEO, maybe veteran and entrepreneur on a mission to make passion go viral for millions worldwide. And each week I do so by sharing with you an inspirational message and interviewing high achievers from all walks of life who unlock their secrets and lessons to become an passion struck. The purpose of our show is to serve you the listener. By giving you tips, tasks, and activities,

Starting point is 00:01:15 you can use to achieve peak performance and for two, a passion-driven life you have always wanted to have. Now, let's become passion struck. Hello everyone and welcome back to episode 117 of the Passion struck podcast and thank you each and every one of you who tunes in weekly to listen and learn had a live better be better in impact the world and I wanted to share with you some of the amazing guests like today's episode we have coming up on the podcast. These

Starting point is 00:01:45 include our episode on April 5th which will be with New York Times best-selling author Susan Cain who is using our podcast to release her new book Better Sweet. And if you're not familiar with Susan she is the author of Quiet which has sold over 30 million copies. Additionally we have New York Times best-selling author, Brechen Ruben, coming up. New York Times best-selling author, Admiral James Stavridas, who will be joining us May 25th to use the podcast to launch his new upcoming book, Tariska Doll, as well as astronaut Nicole Stott, Jordan Harbinger, and many, many other incredible guests.

Starting point is 00:02:25 And if you're new to the show or you would like to introduce this to a friend or family member, we now have episodes starter packs, both on our website and on Spotify. These are collections of your favorite episodes organized by topic that gives any new listener a great way to get acquainted to everything we do here on the show. Just go to passionstruck.com slash starter packs to get started. And if you would prefer to watch these instead of listening to them, you can subscribe to our YouTube channel at JohnArmiles where we have well over 250 different videos that will give you a weekly dose of inspiration as well. Today's guest, the honorable Tim Gallaudet PhD, where Admiral United States Navy retired, is the CEO of Ocean STL Consultant and the former host of the Blue Economy Podcast from 2017

Starting point is 00:03:20 for 2021. Admiral Gallaudet served as the acting under Secretary of Commerce for Oceans and Atmosphere, NOAA Administrator from 2017 through 2019, and prior to that he served as the Assistant Secretary of Commerce for Oceans and Atmosphere, Deputy NoAA Administrator. Admiral Gallaudet had a 32-year career in the U.S. Navy, culminating in him being the oceanographer of the Navy. He has a bachelor's degree from the U.S. Naval Academy and holds masters and doctoral degrees from the Scripps Institution of Oceanography. And in today's discussion, we go into his journey both going to the Naval Academy and then becoming an officer and what he learned from both of those experiences.

Starting point is 00:04:08 We discuss some of our similar experiences we both had on our first ships in the Navy. We go into the role of an oceanographer and what they do for the United States Navy and other forces as well as what it meant to be oceanographer of the U.S. Navy. We then go into his role at NOAA and some of the key initiatives he worked on when he was there, including the Blue Economy Initiative, Unman Maritime Systems, the Vulcan Skylight Maritime Information Tool,

Starting point is 00:04:37 and many others. We also go into his leadership acumen and his one-pager that I will put in the show notes for the audience on the leadership skills that he learned throughout his 32-year career. And finally we go into his upcoming book, Heavy Seas,

Starting point is 00:04:52 Leading America's Top Ocean Agency in turbulent times. So much great content here and thank you as always for joining PassionStruck and joining me as your host and guide to creating an intentional life. Before we begin, I would like to emphasize that this podcast is part of my hope and desire

Starting point is 00:05:11 to bring zero-cost information to the general public regarding how to create an intentional life. And keeping with that theme, I would like to thank the sponsors of today's episode. Thank you, Green Chef, for sponsoring today's podcast. With fresh produce, premium proteins, and organic ingredients, you can trust Green Chef as the number one meal kit for eating well. I love the fact that whether you're looking for carb, conscious, gluten-free, plant-based, or calorie-conscious options, or you just want to have

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Starting point is 00:06:16 to get $130 off and free delivery. That is greenchef.com slash passionstruck130 and use code passionstruck130 to get $130 off. Thank you, 10,000 for sponsoring today's episode. Physical health is essential to me, informs the very foundation for achieving elite performance. And if you're like me, it's so hard to find trading products that are built strong enough to stand up to my hit classes, spin classes, CrossFit and Jim Days. That is why I love 10,000 apparel and it's dedication to continuous improvement. They follow Malcolm Gladwell's prescription for perfection and 10,000 is true to that philosophy with their attention to comfort and quality.

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Starting point is 00:07:57 difficult to remember, so we are putting them in one communion place for you. Go to passionstruck.com slash deals. Now back to passion struck. I am a static to welcome Admiral Tim Gallaudet to the passion struck podcast. Welcome Tim. It's great to be here, Jellin. Well, it's great for me as well. And I have been trying to interview you for almost four years since you were at Noah when we first started discussing this interview. And you and I share an alma mater. And whenever I have a guest on from the Naval Academy, I always ask them why they ended up attending the Academy. Right. Well, first off, the biggest reason I went to the Naval Academy was to study oceanography. And I had learned about the Naval Academy program growing up in Southern California.

Starting point is 00:08:52 And that's where my love for the ocean really originated. But my dad had been a reserve naval officer. So every Army Navy game in December, we were glued to the TV. It was sort of a house law. And I got this sort of influence of the Academy, very positive one. But I didn't join just to go to the Navy. I really wanted to study the ocean. And I just turned out that the Naval Academy had one of the best undergraduate oceanography programs

Starting point is 00:09:17 in the country, and it still does. So, and I didn't know if I'd stay in the Navy, but I was able to do oceanographic work my entire career and loved it and never stopped. So it kind of worked out. I got to see the oceanography program up close and personal because my roommate Scott Bodiker was in the oceanography program himself.

Starting point is 00:09:39 But I have to tell you, if I had to do it all over again, I would have picked Naval architecture and it was too bad. We didn't take those classes until our junior year because I just loved them. Yeah, that's interesting because I love naval architecture also and even ocean engineering, all that cool ocean tech. So in hindsight, I probably could have majored in any of those and really enjoyed it just like you. I understand you and I have something else in common. We both love endurance sports,

Starting point is 00:10:07 and I think you grew up being a swimmer. And while at the Naval Academy, I was in varsity, cross country, and track, but I think there are a lot of similarities between long distance running and swimming, because whether it's spending a long time on the road or in the pool, it makes a huge difference, especially for a swimmer. Yeah, I didn't know that about you

Starting point is 00:10:30 and you've done your homework, congratulations, but yeah, swimming was a powerful influence on me. That's really how I ended up really falling in love with the ocean doing these open waters, swim, swim, and Southern California. And I stuck with it, I swam at the Naval Academy, and I even continued that. And at one point when I stuck with it. I swam at the Naval Academy. And I even continued that. And at one point when I worked with the Navy SEAL headquarters

Starting point is 00:10:48 in San Diego, I kind of got back into training and broke the national record in the Lyle, from my old man age group, 44. But yeah, it's been a positive influence on me. And they kind of discipline and teamwork and goal setting that you do and certainly in a Durham sport translates into so many positive areas of your life and career. In both of these sports, a lot of people think they're individual and nature, and while there is an

Starting point is 00:11:17 individual aspect, they really are team sports. Because even though you might have your individual portion of the race, it's really about how you were showing up as a member of the team and how you're helping the team overall win. And I imagine just like in running in swimming, there's a huge team dynamic. Oh, yeah, absolutely. When I at the Naval Academy, for example, we did a dual meets every weekend against our Ivy League and Colonial Athletic Association competitors. And it was all about winning. And we won as a team.

Starting point is 00:11:53 We didn't win as individuals. And to be honest with you, my memories that in Naval Academy are primarily of my swim teammates. There's a lot of things that go on around the fan-croft hall dormitory, all theus, that people have many memories about, all the discipline. But most of my, we're in the pool, having with my buddies on the team, and that's a, and that carried me a big way through the

Starting point is 00:12:14 academy. While ironically, my plebe and youngster year, my roommate was actually a varsity swimmer. So I got to watch him up close and personal. I've never seen anyone in my entire life eat that many calories. He was a butterfly racer and I don't think I've ever seen anyone with calves as large as his. Yeah, that's, that's a, my daughter is also in butterfly right now and yeah, that's a demanding stroke. and when you're putting in up to 10 miles a day and the double workouts then you kind of need that energy. Well I wanted to switch from our time

Starting point is 00:12:51 at the Naval Academy to you entering the Naval Service and here again you and I had similar experiences although on different ships that overlapped. I happen to be on the USS ComptiGrop, which is a decommissioned destroyer. And unfortunately, before the ship get underway, it was the first time in peacetime that a ship had ever been sabotaged. And as a result, the commanding officer, EXO, and engineering officer were all relieved of command during our cruise.

Starting point is 00:13:27 And I think you had something similar happen to you when you were on the USS Kitty Hawk. Can you explain that? You're right. And that's a timely question because many of us Kitty Hawk veterans right now are watching the ship as it is being towed around the Straits of Magellan, around South America

Starting point is 00:13:44 to be delivered to a scrapping yard in Texas. And yeah, I love the ship. And I had the experience I had that was like yours was our commanding officer, Captain Tom Hyle. I would have just finished the first deployment to fly strikes in Afghanistan, the very first strikes after 9-11 to attack the Taliban. And we were coming from Japan. We came back to Japan to get the ship ready for now. What was brewing, and that was the original invasion of Iraq in 2003. And the ship had some major engineering problems. It was the oldest ship in the Navy at the time, the last conventional carrier, non-nuclear.

Starting point is 00:14:25 And bad and some other factors about the ship's readiness caused the 7th Fleet CO to fire our captain Tom Hyle. And you know, especially when you have a captain that you love and is just a very servant leader like he was, that was crushing on the crew. But what inspired us was how he carried himself after. I mean, we all loved him before. He was great to stand bridge watches where that stood bridge watches. He was just always positive, a great leader,

Starting point is 00:14:54 and very skilled aviator. But he never once complained. He never once tried to fight it legally. He was very quiet about it. And he stayed in. He didn't just give up on the Navy, he stayed in and went on to serve as the chief of staff of the Nimitz Strike Group and made a deployment to the Western Pacific and Arabian Gulf. And I just am so inspired by his total humility and selflessness. I mean, when people will talk the talk about being self-list and about being a thick of service

Starting point is 00:15:27 and military, but that guy walked it like nobody else. And I'm still friends with him. And that has inspired me and really helped me a number of times while I was at NOAA where I was maybe thinking about leaving. And his example helped me continue and do good. So let's talk about what it means to be an oceanographer. Because during my career, I was lucky enough to spend a lot of time with oceanographers. Because as I was preparing Intel for either the ship or when we went out on seal missions, the entire weather report really played a huge impact along with that intelligence and how we were given our briefings. So a lot of people think of a weather person as being on TV,

Starting point is 00:16:12 but an oceanographer in the Navy goes well beyond that. Can you please discuss what that role is and why it's so vital? Well, great. John, yes, that was my job for 32 years or really 28. But I include my time at the Academy because we had an ID, a military ID, and I studied Oceanography there, but ultimately, yeah, the weather and the environment drive all safety and performance in any given mission. And that's why I really love the field. I'm working as an oceanographer for the Navy because we worked with every warfare specialty. Yes, you talked about the seals. The seals used weather information and ocean information more than any other

Starting point is 00:16:51 Area or warfare area because you know, they're in the element and and you could play for example If you didn't time the currents right and you were doing an insertion the Seal delivery vehicle with small mini subs, and you didn't time the tides, right? The currents could prevent you from reaching your objective point. And that's happened before. So knowing everything about the environment, the weather, visibility, the illumination of the moon, if you were doing a sniper overwatch mission, for example, in Fallujah, that

Starting point is 00:17:21 thing to be exposed like that. So they planned everything around weather, ocean, and all types of environmental data. And again, there are other things like the ocean has weather, you know, the currents and the salinity and the stratification you see. And those are physical aspects of the ocean that some Marines live in to IBA because of the fact that their sonar and their ability to see by sonar, if you will, and detect enemies and then void enemies is, changes and is variable depending upon the ocean conditions, and on and on. Of course, aviation, everybody knows whether affects aviators.

Starting point is 00:17:58 And so we were, I've been involved with a range of missions. One great example in the longer term climate kind of, where climate is long-term weather. I just met with, when I first took over at NOAA, I met with Admiral Bill McCraven, the commander of the force that killed Osama bin Laden. He's a four-star Navy SEAL, most people know him. And he told me that on that mission, the timing of that mission was driven by Intel, but also in a huge way by temperature. Because as it was warming in Afghanistan, it was reaching the limit those special operation helicopters could fly.

Starting point is 00:18:38 They can't fly in really warm conditions because they can't generate the sufficient lift they need to move. And, and was a major planning kind of threshold that they had to kind of do the mission before God too warm. And they cut it really close by the way. So yeah, whether a window of an oceanography, we're just a fantastic career choice for me. So if someone isn't familiar with what it means to be a flag officer like you are. How would you equate being an admiral or a general to someone in the civilian world? Oh, well, if you have any senior executive and a company would be something like a vice president or that equivalent, that's pretty much the flag offer community in the Navy and

Starting point is 00:19:21 the general officer community and the other services are the senior executives of the service and they're the ones with resources and authority like a name big company. So what does it mean to be the oceanographer for the United States Navy? It sounds like a ton of responsibilities. Yeah, well, I had a number of really awesome titles. I was the oceanographer of the Navy was my primary job. With that, I had some other jobs, like the navigator of the Navy. I was the director of a task force on the ocean, task force ocean, task force on climate change, and a number of other hats.

Starting point is 00:20:02 But ultimately, the oceanographer of the Navy is the senior officer of all the oceanographers and aerographers is the ellisted version. In the Navy, that person, my job, controlled all the budget, all the policy for those 3,500 or so sailors and civilians. So it's a small community that did that work across the Navy. And then it acts as a

Starting point is 00:20:27 senior advisor to the chief of naval operations and all things related to the oceans. So I'd be brought in and I met with then the CNO chief naval operations, John Richardson, because his big concern was he saw China and Russia catching up in their ocean science and technology capabilities. And he knew that for our undersea warfare forces, seals, submarines, stay ahead and be competitive. We had to know the ocean better than them. It's kind of like the concept of high ground and land warfare. Having the high ground gives you a tactical advantage. There's high ground in the ocean and knowing it's better than the adversary,

Starting point is 00:21:05 whether it be through some renauperations, various types of intelligence collections, naval special warfare, and joint ops and all types, that will allow U.S. forces to be basically have a better position and prevent. So then coming out of that role, how did you make the transition to become the Assistant Secretary of Commerce and the Deputy Administrator for NOAA? And if someone's not familiar with NOAA's mission, can you please explain it to them? Yeah, I'd be happy to, John. The National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, or NOAA, is an agency in the Department of Commerce and it's America's top ocean climate and weather agency. So anything regarding those three areas, we cover down, we do the

Starting point is 00:21:53 science, I say we I feel like I'm still part of that great agency. There's a scientific and research component, there's an operational support component, and there's a kind of public service component. And so you have like the weather service that provides forecast and warnings to people across the country. Big hurricane comes up towards the Atlantic, let's say, and you have the National Hurricane Center in the National Weather Service putting out advisories and warnings and saving lives. And there's the ocean service, which has charts and a variety of conservation areas like coral reef protection. You have a satellite office that does light 18 weather satellites.

Starting point is 00:22:35 The environmental satellites are amazing pieces of technology and they, again, data saves lives. No, also runs our manages our nation's fisheries and then also there's a Noah core, which is just like the navy and naval oceanography like my field. And so the reason I kind of came over, but I did come over is because they saw what I did in the navy and the folks in the last administration thought, well, you know, that's really everything that happens at NOAA, except instead of being just for the Navy, it's for the nation. And I was pretty well equipped to come over and to oversee activities I had been seeing in the Navy for nearly 30 years. Yes, when I first reached out to you four years ago, I was working for another company, and we were

Starting point is 00:23:20 co-headquartered in the St. Petersburg location of NOAA. And it was really eye-opening for me to get to see firsthand all the different missions that they were performing. So one of the things I learned about you back then was your involvement in the Blue Economy Initiative. And if a listener isn't aware of what the blue economy is, perhaps you can give them a much more in-depth explanation. That's great. I love this, of course. That was probably my signature initiative at NOAA. So establishing our priorities when we came in, our team of leaders in the agency in 2017,

Starting point is 00:24:00 we picked a few topic areas to advance. And one of them was science and technology, AI drones, things like that, applying it to all other missions. Another was satellites and diversifying our satellite architecture. Another was our weather model. When you hear about the American weather model, always being maybe inferior to the European model, a really important life-saving capability. Lowa and the weather service owned that American model. And our goal was to make it better than any other model in the world. And we put things in place to do it.

Starting point is 00:24:31 And then lastly, the one that I owned was this blue economy initiative. And simply put, the blue economy is a term for all of the ocean and coastal-based areas of economic activity and growth. And the key aspect of the term blue economy refers not just ocean activities and economy and growth, but sustainable ocean economic growth. So fisheries, for example, it's not just about over-fishing. It's about fishing so that we don't overfish, we sustainably keep the fish

Starting point is 00:25:07 stocks. And so by managing that resource, for example, we'll ensure robust fisheries for future generations. And so on and so forth, you can think about, for example, if one part of the marine economy that I think is really important is marine debris removal, marine plastic removal, and prevention. People don't want to go to trashy beaches, and know a conduct in several studies that show that any given county like in Southern California would see revenue amounts of 10s and millions of dollars more like exercising some very inexpensive beach clean- up activities. And so, and there's

Starting point is 00:25:46 just many other aspects of the ocean and coastal economy. There's, you know, tourism and recreation and beaches. There's also this area that's really getting increasing focus and that's coastal resilience. So, a combination of activities, whether it be building out natural infrastructure like restoring marshland that prevents inundation and helps communities not suffer from storms as high as to high as a degree or other activities such as better weather forecasting is a huge preparedness activity for coastal residents. Yeah, so the ocean economy, blue economy, it's all about being sustainable and protecting our resources at the same time.

Starting point is 00:26:32 So I want to use this as a jumping point to discuss something that's not only important to us here in the United States, but globally, and that's our oceans. And one of the things that was eye-opening for me was watching the Netflix documentary C. Spiracy. And how fishing operations are having such a cascading impact on so many of the fish species and their role in supporting all of humanity. And I know you are very, very involved with how do we take a look at protecting these species, the impacts of climate change and so many other things.

Starting point is 00:27:07 So I thought you could dive into this a bit. Well, I'd be happy to. I'm passionate about this, but quick, this flame or John, I'm not, I'm not endorsing the film, C. Sclercy, they get a lot of things wrong in that. And I wouldn't call it entirely scientific, scientifically based. But however, the idea idea that ocean and environmental conservation is important for our well-being, for our economic prosperity, and national security, you know, to talk about that,

Starting point is 00:27:37 that's absolutely valid. And so, for example, and it's an interesting time, it's not new, we're celebrating the 50th anniversary of several pieces of legislation. I think the Clean Water Act is one, the National Marine Sanctuary's Act is another. And there's a few danger species act as well as, I believe the Marine Mammal Protection Act,

Starting point is 00:27:59 all of those that have been in place for several decades. And now what we're seeing though today is more and more people, philanthropies, industries and governments getting behind conservation for all the good that it does, whether it be again, the economy, our own well-being and national security. Like for example, let me,

Starting point is 00:28:20 I get a couple really interesting ones are coral reef conservation. I'm part of a nonprofit called Forest Blue. I'm on their board of directors and special forces veterans that are helping restore and replant coral in South Florida. Well, there's so many great results of that. Corals are the nurseries for fisheries. They're also important to tourism destinations and say of Florida benefits by about $8 billion

Starting point is 00:28:46 a year from coral reefs to low. And then of course you have the fact that coral reefs help resist inundation and wave action. So they get their great barriers to storm surge and the likeness. So that is something important for coastal communities and their resilience. something important for coastal communities and their resilience. And of course just the biodiversity of the ocean and the genuine just good that is in that our coral reefs are really the coin of the realm in terms of biodiversity.

Starting point is 00:29:18 So there's just all these really good aspects of conservation corals are one. You could look at wetlands as another. You could look at the deep ocean as another. You can look at the deep ocean as another. There's life throughout the water column. And it went in that's an area that people are increasingly concerned of because you see we're really dependent on upon foreign sources for critical minerals and what's happening is people are looking at the deep ocean for mining those. And that's a bit of a concern because there's habitat there

Starting point is 00:29:45 that we don't want to destroy either. And so you kind of get a picture. So I wanted to talk about another thing that happened while you were at NOAA. During that time, you struck a deal with the Navy to create fast-tracked unmanned maritime systems. I thought that was so fascinating. Could you talk a little bit about that program? That's one thing in the conservation discussion that sort of gets overlooked. Often people want to over-regulate and protect, which is all good, it's good to protect. It's like there's this sort of tension whether or you're just going to over-protect so that that people can enjoy the outdoors, if you will, where are we going to be slack on that

Starting point is 00:30:26 and put the environment at risk? And so there's this healthy tension. And one area that can sort of create wind winds and all of this is technology. And so drone technology is just exploded. And then when I was in the Navy, I advanced that in a pretty big way to monitor the ocean, the ocean currents,

Starting point is 00:30:42 the ocean temperature. And then I'd carry that onto NOAA and grew. Basically, they had no organized, uncrewed vehicle program. They do now. We got that pass some legislation and the new President's budget of 2020. Now they have a formal program, a new office and an operation center. Why? Because NOAA uses drones for just about everything.

Starting point is 00:31:07 We used surface drones, for example, to do fishery surveys with sonars to just assess their biomass, if you will, and set catch limits. It's really important for the Alaska fishery last year. In fact, had we not been able to take those drones out which by the way our ships weren't able to go out because of COVID so we took the drones out there did this survey and because we had the data the fisheries managers were able to set catch limits to an extent that basically fishermen were able to earn a hundred million more dollars that year in the Alaskan poly fishery. Just one example a hundred million million drone survey right there. We are using drones flying out of our Hurricane 100 aircraft to monitor the hurricane, wind speed intensity,

Starting point is 00:31:52 and structure, if you will, in the hurricanes, which is really important data to predict their intensity. We're using aerial drones to map coral and other habitats and underwater drones to survey the ocean. It's a fantastic program. And then we're actually adding on a number of other technologies by imaging with these drones. We've then applied machine learning and better cataractory, characterize environments and classified

Starting point is 00:32:21 them for conservation and study scientific research. And I can just keep going on, but you see that there's quite a bit of activity by using uncrewed systems to a modularly environment. Yeah, so another thing that you did while you were at NOAA was you did a partnership with a company called Vulcan to use a system called Skylight for marine information, especially around unreported and unregulated fishing activities, which I thought was just what a cool partnership. Can you explain what that technology does and how it worked? Yes, that's good, John. So Vulcan was Paul Allen's company, and yes, we work with them to develop an AI-based tool

Starting point is 00:33:05 to take AIS data, which is the automated identification system that ships use to transmit their location. And sort of basically, geographically identify areas where illegal fishing was potentially occurring, using a bunch of different rules, if you will, of knowing the legal fishing activity in the past. Certain waters are more subject to it than others because they have lacks enforcement like in the fin of a Pacific. At a bigger picture, I like that example,

Starting point is 00:33:33 because I highlighted two things. One is the power of partnerships. So we partnered with a number of philanthropies like Vulcan, as well as commercial companies like Caledano-Sianic to expand our mission of ocean conservation, science, and research, and exploration and mapping. The Caledano-Sianic one is really neat because it was led by Victor Vescovo, this famous ocean explorer who's still diving the world's trenches, and he said the record for diving in the Challenger deep that he's gone there 16 times in his own Triton submersible Manufactured a human operated submersible so super awesome partner who helped us map that challenger deep in other places that No one could never have done so partnerships are really key there

Starting point is 00:34:22 And the other interesting thing that that that that Vulcan Skylight project highlighted was just you said is the increasing potential for advanced technologies, AI drones, like we talked about. There was a thing also that's fascinating called omics, which is an umbrella term for basically bioinformatics, epigenetics, genomics, net's a volumic transcriptomics. It's microbiological big data. And that's allowing us to understand ecosystems not invasively.

Starting point is 00:34:53 So not having a capture sea life to study if it actually just take, like for example, some of the skin or cells that come up a fish and being able to analyze the DNA and know, you know, scoop of sea water, how many species are in that area? So all sorts of great technologies, is what I'm saying. And so technologies and partnerships were something I think that we were able to promote in advance, NOAA's important mission. Well, that's fantastic and very fascinating, because the more I look into the ocean, the more I realize, we've almost explored space in many ways more than we've explored the deaths of our own ocean.

Starting point is 00:35:34 So can't wait for that science to increase so we can go deeper and deeper and see more into the incredible life that's down there. So I wanted to use this as a jumping off point to start talking about leadership and the consulting business that you're doing now. But I thought it would be an interesting segue to talk about ADHD and I'm not talking about the ADHD that you see in kids or people with attention deficit disorder, but you have a different type of ADHD, and I thought we could just spend a couple minutes on that. Yes, thank you, John. Well, this is my term. This is one of my mentors, longtime mentors, Adam Olchon, a white former oceanographer of the Navy, who's what's the I called in his and he kind of introduced me at one meeting and it's sort of stuck but he mentioned the fact that I'm an admiral yes and

Starting point is 00:36:30 a that I am also a doctor of PhD and then I'm the honorable. It's a way of it when you would get a senate confirmed politically appointed position and that's that's gives you the title of The Honorable. And so having those three and you include my devotion to our country, that was his term for me being an ADHD professional, if you will. But this is classic John White because he's such a great guy, and he just got a beautiful sense of humor. And it was fun one, so kind of stuck.

Starting point is 00:37:07 Well, I love it. And I was wondering, while you were in the administration, I had a friend who was the Assistant Secretary of State, Keith Kroch. Not. Yes, I've known Keith for about 20 years. Oh, how about that, okay. And I was wondering, and maybe the audience doesn't

Starting point is 00:37:28 realize that, but you were both the assistant secretary of commerce and then the undersecretary of commerce. And what is the difference between the two titles and responsibilities? Okay, quickly, the undersecretary is higher than an assistant secretary. And that's, so I was acting under secretary and also the acting no administrator for a year because the White House nominee for that position had not been confirmed. And then ultimately he never was confirmed. So I maintained that position.

Starting point is 00:37:59 I was appointed as the assistant secretary one below the under secretary and the deputy administrator, one below the under Secretary, and the deputy administrator, one below the administrator. So, and then my counterpart, who is another Assistant Secretary, we switched places, basically, because there was never a confirmed administrator, and he took over the acting under Secretary and no administrator. Well, I reported to my original position, and it was actually, for that reason, to focus on the blue economy initiative because we weren't the administrator had a lot of administrative duties and ultimately I was able to have a lot more time to focus on some initiatives like that.

Starting point is 00:38:38 And and the science and technology I talked about. Okay, so one of the things that we both obtained and it was one of the main driving forces for me going to the Naval Academy is in addition to getting to study great things such as oceanography or engineering. I really think it's one of the premier leadership institutions in the world and so I'm sure you had similar experiences but I got to meet Admiral Stockdale and Admiral Lawrence and Roger Stovak and Ross Perot and Senator McCain did our commencement speech. And so you get this exposure to the leaders,

Starting point is 00:39:14 some who are Naval Academy grads, some who are just significant worldwide leaders. But how much do you think both that beginning stages at the Naval Academy and then your time as a J.O. and then as you moved up to a Lieutenant Commander and Commander, how much of that leadership acumen has now defined your career and what you've accomplished?

Starting point is 00:39:41 Great question. And I would say all of it, really, you lead from the beginning. I mean, I wouldn't say I was a natural leader. I was, but the Academy gives you who helped shape and refine our leadership skills and overall approach. And I'm thankful for every one of them. There's thousands of them that I couldn't name right now. But that's kind of how it happened. And what I've discovered and seen is that everybody has an opportunity to lead. It doesn't have to be one in authority. You don't have to be senior to be a leader. I've seen many junior sailors leave me in terms of character and attitude. It's been a progression for me.

Starting point is 00:40:32 And I'd say it went into really high years of flag officer because when you're an admiral and Navy, you're in charge of a community and a command with thousands of people, you're in the press. Everyone looks at you, everyone listens to you. They know that you're setting the tone, the direction, and so I was very mindful about that and thought long and hard about my leadership approach and the words I would say, the things

Starting point is 00:40:57 I would do, knowing it was on full display and could move people or not. And it's a wonderful privilege. And then I think it went into even higher gear, or I know it did, when I was at NOAA, because then it was really up in my game. I was in charge of a 20,000 person agency distributed all around the world with $6 billion budget.

Starting point is 00:41:20 And then influencing tens of thousands of more in terms of partnerships in a community in the earth and oceans and climate science community in the US and internationally. So, you know, long story short, at the higher I got the more I really appreciated that I had a wide aperture and I affected a lot of people. And that, I took the obligation very seriously, but I didn't stress out about it. I actually viewed it as a great gift. I thought, man, if I do, if I everyday say something good

Starting point is 00:41:57 to somebody in public or even just individually, you know, I can affect a great deal of good in the few four years I had in the agency. And long story short, I think that happened. I think we ended up succeeding pretty well. And people I think were uplifted in a number of areas in the agency continues to thrive. Well, you do something that I have only seen a couple leaders in my entire career do. One of those happened to be Ross Bro. The other is a gentleman I worked with at Lowe's named Steve Saladji and Steve at that

Starting point is 00:42:36 point time was the head of distribution at Lowe's and it's a big job. He had close to 30,000 employees under him across all these different distribution centers. Most of them if it was a full distribution center, these things have a thousand plus employees each their million and a half square foot. I met Ross Perot one time and it was amazing to see him at this point in time. He was in his 80s when I got a chance to meet him, but at Perot systems, he would just randomly pick a table to sit down at and he would join you and have have lunch with you. But every time after that, that I ever saw him and it could be months away, he would always go, hey John how are you doing? How is your son? How's your daughter? And it was the same thing with Steve Sylogy. We would go to a facility up in Chicago or Indiana and he might get there once a year and I swear he knew 75 to 80% of the people's names and not only that they're hobbies, they're spouses names, they're kids. And I know this is something you pride yourself in. And I just want to know, how do you do it? Because it's something

Starting point is 00:43:55 I have tried to do and have never mastered. Well, well, I wouldn't thank you, John. I wouldn't say I pride myself in it. That's a, that's like the wrong way to look at it because it's not definitely about me But you're right. I think one of the most important leadership tools if you will is exactly that Knowing your people and really learning about them knowing who they are and remembering them How I do it. It just takes work now, but found it was delightful, because I'm interested in people. So the way I did it is I would look every time I had a meeting, I'd prepare for it.

Starting point is 00:44:31 I'd look who was on the meeting, and I'd always look them all up, if they were on LinkedIn, or if there was a web story on them. And I always throw that back at meetings, oh, you got me to be here, or you did this recent project, or so on, like that kind of thing, a connection is so powerful powerful and people light up. Especially when you're in charge of a big agency,

Starting point is 00:44:50 like your your friend at Lowe's, you know, for someone like that to remember a more lower-level junior employee's name is amazingly powerful and positive. And that's where I meant by the obligation and the gift. If you took the time to do that, when you take the time to do that, it just it just lights people up. And I've gotten feedback to that, you know, use those exact words about being a remember, feeling valued. And it's just very simple. It's emotional intelligence 101. And I also liked it, though. It's so delightful to know your people, to see what they're doing,

Starting point is 00:45:29 because I personally, I just identified with everyone in NOAA. Most of them had environmental science degrees. We had a lot of common experiences. Many had been in the Navy. And so it was just, I had so much joy, a day-to-day working with employees, the agency.

Starting point is 00:45:45 And by showing that personal attention, I think it served the agency well and our kind of morale scores and the federal surveys reflected that. Yes, well, in St. Pete, a friend of mine was the controller. And one time I was talking to her and telling her, I think I was gonna interview you and she's an Air Force veteran. And she said, in my entire time in the military, I've only ever gotten one email from a flag officer and it was Admiral Galadette.

Starting point is 00:46:17 And it was about him congratulating me for some good work that I did and she goes, I had no idea he even knew I existed. And so she said it really made her double down on wanting to be part of NOAA because of that kind act. So I thought I'd pass that on to you. Oh that's so that just really makes my day. I've heard that before a lot and that's exactly the case. To be able to do that, to have that gift, I think too many people approach leadership as a sort of like, okay, what am I going to accomplish and for the, you know, the job. And I think it's equally important to talk about like what effect am I going to have for

Starting point is 00:46:56 all the people. And I did that thousands of times. And it wasn't just a little random email where this like, I would take time and I'd learn about what that person did. And of course, I wouldn't just like little random email where this, like, I would take time. I learned about what that person did. And of course, I wouldn't just, like, say everything was great. We had prioritized, and if someone was really supporting what we thought were the priorities of the agency

Starting point is 00:47:13 and it's a standard way, I'd look them up, learn about them, send them a note, and have an exchange. And so that's nice to hear. I appreciate the positive feedback. Yeah, something I did, and I, once I reached the stage of having 6000 plus employees, I couldn't do it anymore was on everyone's birthday, I used to write a handwritten note to them, regardless of where they were located.

Starting point is 00:47:36 And I would wish them a happy birthday, but more importantly, I would thank them and tell them how important they're the work that they did mattered. And it went so much further than you could possibly ever imagine, and then wanting to be part of what you were creating. So I think that's great what you did. I wanted to cutos to you. That is really, and you get it because when they get that letter, they show other people, they show everybody in their work center. Hey, look at

Starting point is 00:48:03 this. The boss sent me this, and the effect on the whole agency is just cannot be underestimated. So good for you, John. That's great to hear. Well, it leads me to a question that I often debate with people and that is going forward. Do you think it's more important for someone to have emotional intelligence or to be focused on the adaptability equation. Because everyone used to talk about emotional intelligence and now more and more people are talking about AQ. And obviously you probably need a balance of both, but it does one ring out to be a stronger priority for you.

Starting point is 00:48:44 Oh no, I think both are important. I can't grade one over the other. An important thing is, don't sacrifice one for the other. That's both matter. And a good leader has to, a good leader will find a way to be able to do it all. I am not one that, a lot of people think that if I do something, I can't do

Starting point is 00:49:05 something else. I think being creative and thinking things through, you can do a lot more than you think you're capable of doing. Yeah, I kind of agree more. So with that, I wanted to transition and I am going to make sure I put this on my web page. So if someone's listened to this, you'll be able to grab it there. You have a one-pager, which I think is an incredible idea, but it's a one-pager about your leadership acumen, and it's called all-in, all-good, and all-for-one. And so I just was hoping you could touch on that and then maybe use this as a jumping off point to talk about your upcoming book, Hold In Fast and Heavy Seas,

Starting point is 00:49:52 because I think the two kind of go hand in hand. Yeah, okay, John Short. This was interesting. I everybody in the Navy, you were probably in command, it develops a leadership philosophy. It's a statement of what I believe in as a leader, and you post that or make it available for all hands to see. And it's a great tool for people to know what their leader is about, and it's a help them in their own journey of leader development. So I had been trained in that. I had good people like my friend Admiral John White

Starting point is 00:50:26 helped influence me, show me what he did, and I did that in every command tour I had. I got to know him, and I saw how hungry people were to develop his leaders. Because in civilian science, they can see leader development programs are not like they are at the Naval Academy and the navy as a service. And so I thought wow and they looked to me as Nandemul and navy is like someone who could lead like they thought okay he must know something.

Starting point is 00:50:55 I thought well I do. Why not share it. And so I did that I put it all into one page and a kind of summary of my principles and philosophy. And so, and it did in a way that was sort of not a cool and easy to remember. And the idea is that that I wanted something that people would look at, remember, and be a nice guide for them. And so I kind of put it into a glossy and then I shared it everywhere.

Starting point is 00:51:24 And people tell me they hung it up in their conference rooms and framed it. I mean, I was the response was pretty amazing and I still sent it around. And with that in mind, I thought, you know, I do have a story here and I sort of the basis of a book I'm going to write about how I learned all these leadership principles, and again, I break it into three kind of pillars, all in being commitment, all good being positive attitude, hugely important, and all for one being humble and a team player. And I have, you know, those details under you, it's on one page, and ultimately all of that I learned in the Navy,

Starting point is 00:52:02 and when I got to know it, I saw how important it was to apply it in a federal agency, especially during the last four years. I mean, you know, whatever side of the aisle you're on, there were some challenges that we had in government. And so my book is titled, Holding Fast and Heavy Seas, Leading America's Top Ocean Agency in turbulent times. And I go into how I developed my leadership approach

Starting point is 00:52:32 and how I applied it to this great agency with wonderful people who wanted to be led by leaders with integrity and who valued their work. And so there's a lot of ups and downs and a lot of very interesting people. I've met both President Biden and Bush and many congressman senators and a few astronauts and Nobel Prize winners

Starting point is 00:52:53 and so on and so forth. It was a great journey and I hope to release it sometime in the fall of 2022. Okay, well I can't wait to get a copy of that book. And now I understand that you are now consulting and I'm just going to give some of the names of people you're advising. One of them is actually a company I used to work for, Boos Allen and Hamilton, precursor SPC, Zona space systems, sofa ocean, I explode tomorrow, linker technologies and many more. And I just wanted to ask you,

Starting point is 00:53:26 someone would be interested in your services. What are you specializing in now? That's great. Thank you for doing that. Well, when I was at NOAA and in the Navy, I saw the value of private industry. We partnered maybe in NOAA, both with the private sector, to do so much work like with drones and technology.

Starting point is 00:53:45 And so now I'm working with many of those same companies to advance the mission of better latencies and provide for better environmental stewardship, understanding, and of course the national security piece through the Navy. So those companies you just read off, all of them are doing really innovative ocean weather and environmental tech and science. And I love that. I love that field and area. All of these companies are innovative and they have great cultures. And so, ultimately, if people or anybody out there is working in a startup that's trying

Starting point is 00:54:21 to get some work with NOAA, the Navy, the federal government, or even universities and international customers. I really know a little bit about OceanTech and EnvironmentalTech, and I'm passionate about it, so I'd be happy to help. Okay, and if someone was looking for a way to get in touch with you, what are some ways they could reach you on social media? Yeah, I'm on your website. Yeah, I'm on LinkedIn, Facebook, Twitter. I kind of don't really watch my Instagram account, but my kids do.

Starting point is 00:54:55 And then of course, yeah, I do. I have a webpage, my daughter gave me. I don't really need it. So I have a lot of people offering to upgrade it, but it's just fun to have. My company is oceanstl.com and you could always email me at oceanstl.com. Oceanstl.com. Yes and I also encourage the audience because I got to listen to a few of them, your

Starting point is 00:55:23 podcasts because I love how you would bring panelists on board, which is something that I would love to do going forward. I'm gonna end with one last question. I've had the opportunity to interview a number of astronauts, some of them probably know Wendy Lawrence, who actually was my physics teacher at the academy, actually was my physics teacher at the academy, Chris Cassidy, my classmate, who I went to an apps with, and most recently, Kayleigh Barron, who happens to be on the ISS right now. And my question to you would be, and I think I'm going to get an interesting answer, if you were sent to Mars and you were one of the first people who landed and they said that you could put in one law, regulation, premise for humanity of Mars going forward. What would it be?

Starting point is 00:56:13 Oh gosh, it's a, to me, that's a no brainer. The golden rule, treat others like you want to be treated is really the essence of my leadership philosophy and whole approach to life. That works everywhere. It's author, it was very genius in coming up with it.

Starting point is 00:56:32 And I think people need to do that more here. And if we ever go colonize Mars, that should be rule number one. Okay, well on that, Amorgalladette, I'm gonna end today's's discussion and thank you so much for joining us on the Passion Strike podcast. It's been fantastic. Thanks for including me, John. I'm so excited I could bring to you that interview today with Admiral Gallaudet, one that I have had in the works for over four years since he was the NOAA administrator back in 2018.

Starting point is 00:57:05 I truly hope that you enjoyed his words of wisdom, his leadership example, and his advice on so many topics. And if there's a person like Radmult Gallaudet, Susan Kane, Brechen Rubin, Admiral Stavritis, or other upcoming guests we have that you would like to see me interview, please reach out to me on Instagram at JohnRMiles or on LinkedIn at JohnMiles. And if there's a topic that you would like to hear me discuss on our Momentum Friday episodes, please reach out to us and email at MomentumFriday at PassionStruck.com. I so appreciate all your support, all the five star reviews globally, and now over 90 different countries subscribing to our podcast. Now go out there and live life passion strife.

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Passion Struck with John R. Miles - Rear Admiral Tim Gallaudet USN (Ret.) On: The Keys to Leading in Turbulent Times EP 117

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