Patriots Dynasty Podcast - Bonus Episode: The Case of Bill Bellichick

Episode Date: November 7, 2023

There's been a lot of debate in the media and in fan circles these days around the legacy of Bill Belichick. Our resident Belichick Fan Club President Andy takes on Renowned Belichick Hater Greg in a court case for the ages. Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/patriots-dynasty-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is Christine Brown and while I have to listen to this podcast as my motherly duty, you have the choice not to. My sons sometimes say some naughty things when they're trying to be funny, but really, they're just being stupid. You still want to listen? Go right ahead. I am not your mother. Welcome back to the Patriot's Dynasty podcast. The only podcast where we're going back and rewatching every game of the Patriot Dynasty podcast, the only podcast where we're going back and

rewatching every game of the Patriot Dynasty era. This week we're going to do something a little bit different because it's been a while and we need to get back into the game. There's also been some stuff in the news about our Lauren Savior, William Belichick. So this week there's been, I don't say some controversy, but some perhaps disagreements off of the air. So we thought we would do a bit of an episode where we kind of voice those disagreements in a courtroom setting. So we have with us the honorable Tim the intern presiding. Tim how are you? That is Judge Tim, but how are we doing? Judge Tim. Okay, Tim the judge

and said it in the intern. Tim the intern judge. The interim judge. Good Lord. Pick something. Just palm. Surrey Andy. OK. I call them the honor. I damn respect in this court. I called them the honorable. Well, they started. And also for the prosecution, we have the dishonor ball Greg

Brown. And one of those Steve who knows For those high paid LA lawyers. It's coming in, you know, oh, yeah Yeah, you look just like that. Great. It's a ruckus. Yeah, all right you slide me. You're driving your two-seater sports car the top down That's right. Yeah, I'll tell you guys here. All right. Awesome. So you are going to be presenting your case against Bill Balochek and what why, well, you laid out what's your case here? Why were you going to let's back up the stack here? Can we acknowledge that the dynasty is over? I think we already did. Okay. Like when we acknowledge the seasons over.

Okay. Can we acknowledge the seasons over? Because that's an important first step here. I don't think you can acknowledge that. It is currently the 5th of October. Correct. We're going into 23. 23. The Patriots are one and three.

They just got their ship pushed in by the Cowboys. Yep. Mac Jones looks like not the answer. Probably won't get a second contract with this team. The offensive weapons are a mess. The defense looks good, but now there's no Christian Gonzalez, no Matthew Judeon. God knows what that unit's going to look like after this. So it's probably a wrap on the year as far as making the playoffs.

I would expect. I agreed. Yeah. I mean, they did just sign JC Jackson, so yeah, that was sweet. Yeah. So who knows? Is this bringing it all back? 10 thoughts. Do you think it's over? I think it's already been over, but as a judge, it has to be impartial right now. All right. So kind of six, they get in the wild card. You heard it here first. Okay. They're gonna jail the offense. They're gonna figure it out once the offensive line gets healthy. I do want to know what I'm gonna keep doing the defense. I do want to know what, uh,

so we already have three losses. What are those other three losses? I don't know. I'm not waiting to schedule. Yeah. Probably the bills at least once, maybe twice. You think we beat the bills? Well, you think we lose to the bills twice? Yeah. Possibly. It's not really good for the division. That's right. There's a wild card, doesn't matter. All right. All right. So I'm going to formulate my prosecution here on the fly because I was told that we're doing a courtroom thing about 10 minutes ago.

Yeah, that's where we all decided this was happening. Well, this looks a bit disjointed. Yeah. The reason is. So this is to see we're going to be deciding if Bill Pellichek is a fraud today. I'm going to be the judge on that. And Greg is going to present his case

for Bill Pellichek being a fraud. And Andy is going to present, will be the defendant for Bill Pellichek as not a fraud. OK, so my first point here, right? The first charge against Bell Check is the obvious one. If you look at them without Tom Brady, it's bad. The numbers are bad, there's no way around it. He's a bad NFL coach without Tom Brady. You want to know

where he stands behind some coaches that are ahead of him, when percentage wise, if you take out the Bradyers, Mike McCarthy, Brandon Staley, Kyle Shanahan, Ron Rivera. Bella check is 80 and 90. He's a below 500 coach without Tom Brady. I'm going to take down some notes. I'm probably gonna need that. All right. So you want some rebuttal to that? So what's his name?

The quarterback for the Ravens who won the Super Bowl. Arba. The quarterback for the Ravens who won the Super Bowl. Oh, yeah. Has a better quarterback rating in the playoffs in Tom Brady. So therefore he's better because his numbers are better. Because we're taking out all contacts to those numbers, right? So, but if you do the same with with Bell Ballachake,

you can take out all contacts to those numbers, then yeah, sure, absolutely. They look really bad. But he took an absolutely garbage Cleveland team, turned them around, made the playoffs, had their only playoff win since, for like what, almost 20 years until just recently. So the last Cleveland Browns coach to win a playoff game was Bill Balecheck. And who did he beat? Bill Parcells and the Patriots in that playoff game. They went 11-5.

The next year, the ownership promised him that they weren't moving the team out of Cleveland and they did anyway, which tanked the whole season and then they said they were going to keep Bill Balecheck and they didn't. And so they fired him anyway, he told me to keep him. That team turned to the Ravens who drafted Ray Lewis that next year, which was a Balecheck decision, or that's what he was going to do with the Browns was draft Ray Lewis with that team.

And then they went on to win another Super Bowl, right? In 2000. So you know, Bill Baleick built that team, yeah. And then you can not look impressed. And then he came to New England and did the same thing. Look at Pete Carroll's record when he took over for for Bill Barcell's, right? He took a Super Bowl team and lost more games every year until he was fired.

Left the team with an absolute garbage roster. Well, not a garbage roster, but an absolute garbage fire of a salary cap situation. To the point where in 2000, Balochect took over, they didn't have enough players to fill the entire roster. So they finished the season, rostering less than 54 players because they couldn't afford it. So from there, Balochect turned that team around too. And we're starting and then, you know, the Brady thing obviously, and all that happens, or it actually happened quicker than you expected to. They were turning around anyway. Sorry to interject here. Point of contention, point of motion. Bell check, turn that team around.

Yes. Before Brady. Yes. What was the record in 2000? 5 and 11. How many players did they have roster? I rest my case. So his first year with the team after taking over that entire thing, he still managed to and I think they started off like

they won like four the last five games too. So they had turned it around at the end of the season because they had to basically rip out Pete Carroll's awful, everything they had to get rid of all the guys who were coasting and they had to change the whole dynamic of the locker room and all that stuff takes a season. In fact, Bell Check's been on record to say it takes three season, three years to kind of install your team. So he did it in two. And then, I mean, is logic that it is good, but I mean, and also it's not like Brady was necessarily the reason in 2001

that they won all those games. Those are plenty of games where Bellicax Decisions and Bellicax Defense won those games. We've watched them. We watched them, we went through the whole thing. 2001 was 2001 to 2004, or mainly the defense. The defense was the driving force we've said it before. It was the driving force of that early dynasty. Yeah, Brady was good, and he did Brady things, but he wasn't the Brady of like 2007 onwards, was he?

So how do you explain Tom Brady going to the Tampa Bay and winning a Super Bowl when he looked like he was cooked in New England? Now, last year in New England. The last year in New England was unfortunate because of the masses of injuries to the offensive line. You're starting Marshall Newhouse at left tackle, where you pulled off of the street, literally off of the street.

You're the GM, right? You gotta have to account for those types of things. You can only account for so much. I mean, he did. He had played, but like the starters got injured and then the back has got injured. What are you gonna do? Like what else can you do?

So what about since then? Since then he's rebuilding. He lost the best quarterback in the history of the first year. So all right, let's think about the first year. Is the rebuilding working? I think it's still too early to tell because the first year was the COVID year. You lost Brady like late. So you had to scramble to pick a new quarterback and it was came you probably because of Bella Jack well now that's just conjecture you got proof of that this is the court of law great you can't just be throwing out

Willie Nilly things all right fine we back all right. I don't want to be an impartial judge. I want to be a pie. Yeah, I know you fucking idiot. They didn't hurt. First year, they were actually doing well with Cam Newton. All things considered until the Kansas City game where everybody got COVID, they still, the NFL still made them play. Right. And then I think from there, Cam Newton got COVID or maybe he was on the gut originally. I don't remember. But whatever happened, he, Cam Newton missed a bunch of weeks. And the way the page dolphins is built is that you kind of build on the last week and you keep building week by week until, you know, as you would see with normal page of teams with Brady, by the end of the year, they're better than they were at the beginning.

Like the first four weeks are always like extended breezy, right? That's the joke with the Patriots. So the so the previous Patriots teams, the Dynasty teams with Brady, they didn't face any of these injury problems, these important players getting hurt or sick, whatever. So why so why didn't they fall apart like the Cam Newton year? Because we didn't have COVID to deal with. And the injuries, fine, those call it injuries, players that can't play, whether it's COVID or injuries or whatever. But I think the COVID thing is more on top of it.

Like they they had to play a game where they didn't actually practice a week against was it the not the right practice. We're talking about practice. Yeah. I'm throwing it out. Yeah. I think the covert year was just a garbage year just generally like for the whole NFL, not even just the Patriots Brady got to hand pick his team Halfway through that season they the bucks scrapped and whatever they were trying to do and just said Brady like run your own offense Right, yeah, and so he did so he was able to do whatever he was comfortable with with a team that wasn't rebuilding because the pages He had gone all in the past few years drafting, you know, Sony Michelle's and Nikhil Harry's at the top of the draft, which is not something

I normally do to kind of like take advantage of that last window of Tom Brady before you were left or before you were tired or whatever it was he was going to do. And so they had to pay the piper and Brady decided, looked at both teams and said, I have a better chance to go on Tampa Bay because they have all the pieces except a quarterback and the pages need to be built and you don't wanna be here for the rebuild. That's how it looked from the outside. To me, it looked to me outside is that he said,

this team isn't giving me the weapons. I'm gonna go to a team that lets me get weapons and lets me play the way I know that works and win Super Bowls and then he does and is proved correct. That's how I perceive that. So what would you rather have had the Patriots do to get him weapons? Let him draft a wide receiver in the first round. Who did that decision was that?

Who's the decision was what? Drafty Nikhil Harry. That's the problem with the Bella Check thing is if he has his hands over everything, then when it goes wrong, it's his fault. You can't say that like him signing players that are buss or like ads, just whatever the GM, you know, player operations or he, and the draft can't be like, hey, it's someone overroading him.

He's in charge, He's the final decision. He's made that organization that way. So when it doesn't work, it's his fault. I mean, but again, the killer Harry, not contributing from day one was because of injuries again, right? He got hurt and preseason and didn't start until the chiefs game. I think the killer Harry, we can all agree is not the player regardless of injuries that AJ Brown and wherever that guy that was drafted, how did it miss as well?

Debo Samuel. All right. I think it was in that draft too. Who? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean, but at the time it was a consensus pick like nobody was like rang on the page for draft in a key Larry. It was a, it was seen as a safe solid pick. So I mean, what are you gonna do? I mean, a lot of picks are seen that way, right? And what separates the good drafters from the bad ones are they right in the long term?

And if you look back, like everybody is about as right as everybody else. Like you can say that the Steelers have great drafts, but if you look at the recent ones, man, not so much, same with the Ravens, like yeah, they hit on some of them, but they hit as much as anybody else does. Yeah. I don't know if you should have a problem with with Bellicax draft strategy. I just think it worked because you had Tom Brady. And Tom, but you're telling me it worked even the best quarter of work, but even though they had Tom Brady. Tom Brady? But you're telling me it worked even the best quarterback. It didn't work, even though they had Tom Brady in 2019. You're saying they didn't get in weapons in 2019?

Yeah, I think the organization was bad enough that they should have given him more power Brady to do shit like that. Do shit like what? To be involved in recruiting and which players to sign the same Aaron Rodgers shit, right? That we saw. But isn't that what? It's guys in there and the people he's comfortable with rather than rolling out these rookies and these slubs,

these bargain discount guys, and then we're under the cap every year, and they don't work out. So what would you say Antonio Brown was? A ballad check decision? I think that was the kind of thing they should've been doing more of Antonio Brown. Right. Cause that worked really well.

Hey, it didn't work out, but you know what? It worked out in tip bay until it didn't. I'm a super bowl until it didn't. He played the Super Bowl caught touchdown. Yeah. And then what happened? He took all his clothes off in the middle of a game and and danced off the field. And then they they almost been.

That's not where are you? That's not where are you in here. That's not where are you? That's true. But my point is that Bella check did put together the weapons. Like I mean, what was the starting line of week one of 2019 for wider severs? Tim, can you look that up? In fact, I sure are.

And then when, you know, they started losing guys, I can't remember who else they lost. There was another wider see around there too, because if you look at that lineup, it was stacked. They went out and traded for Muhammad Sunni, traded a second rounder for him. Why? Because according to reports, that's what Brady wanted. He wanted Muhammad Sunni. Well, we're talking about facts here, Andy. That sounds like conjecture. That was reported. I can get you a link if you want, Greg. Yeah, well, is it conjecture or is it...

What's that? All right, let's stand back and look at the facts here, right? No, the checks had a long career, a lot of success. Yep. But really, the only success has been with Tom Brady, right? You were kind of spinning, hey, is the browns thing a success because they made the playoffs that one year. I think we can all agree the post Brady Patriots are not a success, right?

How about 2008? They've gotten worse every year since then. 2008, I mean, that team is fucking that team, right? You could say that they... it's an eight game swing from Brady down to his backup. Okay, so an eight games, well, five games swing. I went 11 and five instead of 16 and now, right? Yeah, and they count the playoffs. Well, that's literally the only team to ever win 11 games and not make the playoffs. I mean, that's kind of like after being that you like you went for like foot there. Best team, best team the NFL's ever seen to a non-playoff team. Yeah. That's that's our facts. They are facts, but they're twisted. If you want to talk about twisting

the facts, okay, here's some more show me another team that won 11 and five and didn't make the playoffs. That's a playoff caliber team. And they, that team also, we were there, Greg, if you remember, they beat the pants off of the Arizona carners who eventually went to the Super Bowl. They smoked like 40 to 7. The pages didn't go to the Super Bowl. They smoked the Patriots in the Super Bowl. Huh? The Patriots didn't go to the Super Bowl. You're right. But also show me another head coach who can put together a roster

where your star former MVP quarterback goes down quarter one week one and still wins living games. I mean, Gino Smith basically won eight games for Pete Carroll last year and he's whole sick. He's a backup quarterback. Yeah, and who did they lose?

Like who was starting week one there that they lost? I mean, it doesn't matter. You throw in a backup. You throw in a backup, right? But they went into season with that is the plan. Also, let's tell me, all right. Let's back up. All right, let's talk about numbers here.

Hold up, hold up. What is Steve doing? Is he at the bar? I guess we're taking an intermission, Steve. What are you doing? Oh, cool. Oh, the Lord. I'm a mute Steve until he figures.

I'll fuck you. Yeah. Probably a good idea. That's actually her. Steve. Resume. Because you were saying Greg, we're going back to you. I'm going to go out.

Oh, there he is. Oh, it's Steve. Look back. Not push back. Then you, me. Eddie, come on. I'm not allowed to unmute. I can just ask to you to unmute. I just have the power to mute you, not to unmute you. All right. So Steve, Greg is taking the stance of Belicex Afrod, and I'm assuming that you will join his council, and Andy is clearly defending Belicex of fraud and I'm assuming that you will join his council and

Andy is clearly defending Belicex not being a fraud so Greg was just about to go off He's also see frozen. He sure looks frozen Okay, and there he goes. There you go. It's good. Thank God he's gone So now as the rational and cooler brother I will step in here and settle this case. That should be good. Let me get my notes ready. You know, as the rational brother, I see both sides and I can split the difference here. and I can split the difference here. Should be good.

I think that the problem with Mr. Belichek is that he's doing too much. As both coach and GM, what other person in sports, not even just NFL, has both coach and GM responsibilities. And I get the bill, the bill parcels shopping for the groceries blah, blah, blah, but my god, it's gonna be a fucking, I mean, each of those is a full-time job that they pay millions and millions and millions of dollars for. They just kind of make an out having one guy serve for both, but I saw him. You don't think Bellachax is making enough to cover both? in the dollars for they just kind of make an out having one guy serve both but

you don't think Bellicaxe making enough to cover both? well even if he is like is he stretching too thin is is the game passing by and then the real question is would draw the have Bill Bell check the GM or Bill Bell check the coach. I mean the coach yeah honestly every day to go in that way you won't build the check the defensive coordinator, right? Sure. I mean, I, I am in that as well. And like Andy Reed is the offensive coordinator and don't have a bad coach like fucking. I think we give you a lot of logical path here because you can't take the coach from him because he's got to have the win

record right? Yeah, you ain't going nowhere without that thing. Right, it was a 29 games behind something like that. Sure, whatever it is. I mean, the people who were asking for Bill Bell check to be fired and fucking idiots, Greg included. I'm assuming he said that since I just joined Wavela 8, but... I only use specific setup, but he's been leaning hard that way. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's he's been hitting around the bush. And I'm sure E E I and the top radio people are saying the same fucking thing.

On the other side, to be fair, they're saying the same thing after that Kansas State loss. So we are. Many and after the 31 nothing opening season loss in 2003. So sure. A common mistake. There's been a fair minute, but these are some of the moments that are a few in part between and those ones, whatever. But I think that there is something to be said for BB and Twilight years, giving up the GM side, because even if, think about from this perspective,

at some point, you're not going to be here too much longer, right? 30 games longer, 30 wins longer from here. You're not going to just plug somebody in to that role. You're going to have to plug two people into that role, right? You're going to have to hire a coach and a GM when Dell checked leaves. Been role, right? You're gonna have to hire a coach and a GM when double check leaves. Been dairy.

So why not hire a GM now to get up to that speed and then when double check leaves, we hire Mike. I think Gerard Mayo is the no, right. Right. Brables my number one. Okay. Well, I think usually the

I've just like the GM picks a coach or the other way around, but I think it's usually there's some sort of like deal between the two of them that they're going to work together. The owner gets to pick both, but like, it's my point of like, I don't know, I think you can see that he's lost it or he hasn't adapted to the times and whatever. And that's a fair criticism. Is it? I think at some levels it is, right? And Greg was texting me the other day about Mac Jones

has no escape ability and he's not wrong. And there's that fumble that he had or that terrible across the body throw across the field pick six that he had were both sort of symptoms of his in his capability. And part of that is tied to this. That was, let me be honest,'m hand there a doubt in the draft. Whenever we got a quarterback for the 15 pick blah, blah, blah. But If Dullcheck is solely focused on coaching up the players, he was dealt. I think he could be better as opposed to spreading himself over the entire continuum of everything, of finding, evaluating, selecting, scouting the other teams in the NFL, finding all those players, bringing them in,

and then coaching them up. And I think that's probably where you got caught a little bit with his pants down last year, where he is like, I'll trust, you know, like in Patricia and Joe Judge to run the offense, and, oh, that didn't work, you know. If Dolce had solely focused his efforts on coaching only, would the pages be better? I think that's a more reasonable take than Greg's, far earlier, right? Well, then I missed all of Greg's takes.

Well, we said it was a courtroom I had to prosecute. I can't just be like middleman there. Commented it felt like you didn't want to be the middleman anyway, Greg. Well, I don't think he's doing a good job since Brady left. I mean, the case for, was it a good coach for Brady is here? I mean, I think it's obvious.

Yes. Yeah. Has he been a good coach since then? I don't think so. You know, I did a good. Personnel guy or how do you? Because I see them as two very distinct roles. And on some levels, he's been good and some levels.

I think both. Well, that's how do you think he's not been a good coach? What's the plan? Personnel wise. Well, that's a GM thing. What's the Patriots identity? It isn't a GM thing. What's the Patriots identity? It isn't a GM thing because he's the GM. Well, that's my point of.

He's not doing a great job doing both. And he's the only person in sports that does. Exactly. You know, the other slash GM in any of the major forceports? Exactly. And he's not doing a particularly good job either, right? Right. So what you and my point is like, he's going to be gone here at some point. So let's, if you're going to get to take one thing away from the guy in my Zobie GM. If you're going to get one thing away from the guy in my Zobie GM. Because he is the best coach in the NFL.

And now you just know that. You still think that right now? No. Do I think that? Yeah. No. Kyle Shanahan is the best coach in the NFL. Well, it's Andy Reed.

Andy Reed also got a case for best coach in the NFL. No, and A lot of these guys have done it with like multiple quarterbacks, too, right? Andy Reed did it with what three separate quarterbacks Had them as like perennial contenders. He did MacMath with MacNab He did it with Alex Smith you Alex Smith Okay sucks and now he's Alex Smith, Alex Smith, okay sucks. And now he's doing Alex Smith, not to do it that. You're making playoffs with Alex Smith. And I mean, he had a

persona playoffs is that that's the bar. Right. Well, no, he's like, what's going on? What are you doing? Go check when the playoffs are taught with Mac Jones. Having winning seasons. He's had, he's had 10 seasons without Brady and seven of them are losing seasons.

Okay. Thank you. And none of those are starting like a rebuilding a program. That's what we've been talking about. Why do you want to show winning from day one? Why do you have to rebuild if you have a dynasty team? Who is the Browns quarterback when they rebuild when they beat the Patriots in the quarterbacks? Fucking Bernie Khozar or some shit? He's been he Tesla Ver quarterbacks, fucking Bernie Khozare or some shit. Many tests of Erdi. They fired Bernie Khozare, yeah. Right. Pete Carroll's rebuilding. He's doing fine. Gino's bit.

Yeah. They didn't skip a beat. Right, because you know, after that last year, well, they won back in, when was it? 2013? Hey, it doesn't matter. If you're talking about transitioning from one quarterback, Erad, to another, He's doing a bad job. No matter how

Be careful and he's having one try it. I mean the thing like if you don't pick the right quarter But yeah, who was he gonna pick in that draft otherwise? I don't know like Pick up Gino Smith from free agency. It's working in Seattle. You know what I'm saying Brock Perdi He was available. He's doing just fine and say if it's working in Seattle. You know what I'm saying? Brock Perdi. He was available. He's doing just fine in San Francisco. On the same team that traded what three throw from picks for exactly. They can make mistakes in San Francisco and they can still look like the best team in the NFL. Because they're good, they're doing good business, which is what we always thought Bellicic was is like, even if every these picks don't hit all the time, he's going to find the guy in the back of the draft, they're going to like fit into the culture, the patriot

way, and they're going to be a good football team that's above 500 and always in the contention, right? That's what we thought. But I don't think that's what we're looking at. We're looking at like a poorly cloaked sloppy team that really Misses on important picks and if you miss on them, they don't have any like Foundation to be like okay, we're still gonna be good even if we miss this pick I'm on Greg's team to a point where I Think there's a lot of sports for you to talk about Bill Bell check the MGM fucking Bill Bell check the coach. And like that's a line that I can sort of get behind of like

I think Bill Bell check the GM has struggled to adapt to the changes in the NFL and he's maybe the changes in the NFL and he's maybe tried to zig too much when they've zagged, right? Like he's, it seems like he's leaned way into the defense and run game during this NFL of the last five years of the ball over the yard, right? And they're bigger and slower and they've tried to get to that a little bit on the defensive side but the offensive side is not caught up and I'll love to see because it has to happen at some point it's my point of like when bell check retirees if you if we fire bell check right now we're not looking for a coach we're looking for a coach and a general manager.

You can't do that. You know, but give me a time where they just fire a coach in a GM at the same time and like those teams are just, they're the Chicago Bears, you know? But it worked on the bandit's. Right? It worked for many years. I mean, you talk about the, maybe this is McDaniels too of like, with their missing McDaniels. I think that's a thing we're not really talking about much, but you talk about the two tight end sets that they rolled out. That was like, there was no one else in the NFL doing that,

and they drafted the personnel, and they rolled out the sets, and it worked great, right? And then that year, they did the fast offense, right? That they were snapping it in under like 20 it worked great, right? And then that year they did the fast offense, right? That they were snapping it in under like 20 seconds every time, right? That worked amazing. And it was always like, okay, they're ahead of the curve. They're ahead of the curve.

But that doesn't seem, it seems like they're behind the curve now. And it's like why? So hold on. Because, Andy, all the Mac Jones isn't who they hope he would be. And you can argue that like, you know, they should have drafted a different quarterback that year, right? But I think they went in with the plan of giving him

however many years, whatever. Well, Cam Noon, did they just see what they thought they would be? He was the best quarterback available when Brady left. Yeah, he was exactly the thought he's gonna be yeah Probably and he was actually doing okay in the first few weeks until he missed a few games and then couldn't keep up with the offensive Game planning whatever you know six out to me is the last year when they tried to Transition to the zone run game

transition to the zone run game. The beginning of the year in Train Camp and it was just fucking miserable, right? It was like a half-hearted, a half-ass attempt to like adjust to what the new running game ended like you watched that game against the dolphins and they fucking gashed us on that. It was the zone run game cut back where there's just nobody home in the house. I don't know, I don't know the answer is, but from my perspective, you can't just do the bell check the booth. I think we all know that Bell Check is a defensive-minded coach, right? Sure, I mean, Bell Check is the coach and you hire a different offensive coordinator who's, you know, Bill Valcek or B.O.B.

But you can change the entire culture, right? You hire a combo GM OC that want to come together and make the Patriots different. I say bring back McDaniels. He's going to get fired soon. Yeah. And he's getting a lot of help. That doesn't solve the problem with the the patients are playing the football from the games we've been watching right. Good that rookie year, right? Under McDaniels. Yeah.

You did, but he also looked like they asked him to do literally nothing that first year, right? Like they told him, I remember the Jets game where they, like he had chances to take shots on the field and he just would not do it no matter what. Like they did like the throwback pass to him and he would have like 10 seconds and like still just dumped it off to the the short guy and whatnot. and he would have had like 10 seconds and like still just dumped it off to the the short guy and whatnot. So I think because of that, they've kind of, you know, they tried to draft Bailey Zappy the year after in 2022. Obviously that didn't work out, but whatever he was forced around pick. But they've also like, I think alluded to what Steve's looting to is they've tried to be that run game as well,

to what Steve's looting to is they've tried to be that run game as well with Steven Sinon, who was it before? Who's the guy that went to the... Yeah, thank you. Let's do with them. And I think that kind of actually worked in Mac Jones's first year, right? You have this rookie guy, and so you surround him with whatever you can, you build a dominant defense because that's what Balochack is good at, right?

And I mean, he's got, you can gain plans in the hall of fame for it. He shut down some of the best offenses in history and super balls with his defensive game plan. So, and he's doing it again. I thank all these people talking about how the league has passed and by. If you look at his defense and how he's doing it again. I think all these people talking about how the league has passed and by. If you look at his defense and how he's now using what three, sometimes four

safes on the field now because of how light things are, and he's specifically gone out and drafted these guys. You know, like the, you know, called Dugger, crafting him like with their first pick pick from some no-name school. Now he's running that defense, right? They have a bunch of guys like that. They brought in Jalen Mills, who's that tweener, safety linebacker guy who can come up in the box and still stop the run. They have this really dynamic defense that is giving Dolphin's team fits that just put

up 70 points on the Broncos. Right. But the point of the league is past you by is that you have a really dynamic defense in your one and three. Like, defense doesn't win games in the modern NFL. You're right. But I think a lot of teams this year are finding out that how your offensive line goes, your offense goes. And the

page of the offensive line hasn't started the same five players yet, right? They've had a different line of every week because of injuries. But also your drafting players like goal strange out of fucking East bum, fucking university. Yeah, and he was good when he's not hurt, but he's actually got hurt and braces. And know this hurts your heart, but I'm on team Greg of I think Belicechek is trying to outsmart. He's trying to zig too much when the rest of the league is sagging and finding the cold strangers and it's just like it's not that complicated and take that,

yeah, and roll out of them and say, hey, Bill, check, here are the groceries. Fuckin' make us a goddamn delicious meal. I feel like he could do that. I feel like he's a little... So I think about what I just said, though, like right now, like half the teams in the league are finding out that if your offensive line isn't solid

Your team's gonna be your offense is gonna be garbage look at the Bengals this year Look at how that offense is running and You know they they kind of mastered a bit the year that went soup bowl But it's completely falling apart and they won in three as well. Was that right? I don't know if it's on my idea. I think they are And they have all the weapons in the world that right? I don't know if it's on my idea. I think they are. And they have all the weapons in the world, right? They have a superstar quarterback, like top receivers.

And they're in the exact same position. Yeah, but if you were to put money on which team has a better record at the end of the year, I'm taking Cincinnati does injuries account for that though. Just right now, if you said, Hey, Greg, you have a hundred dollars. You're going to biggest and yet it's We're not one team or the other We're going to wheeling Greg. We're going to wheeling West. We can put a bet on this Good I'll put it on the Patriots. I just can't believe it. I'll put it on the Patriots. I just can't believe it. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll bet. I'll. You'll also be in Wheeling, West Virginia to put a bad on this. That's true. Yeah. Well, there you go. I mean, what you need in the moderna NFL is an offense to win games, right? I mean, what's the modern, okay, give me an idea of the modern league.

How far back does that go? I haven't heard a word from the Tim Turner here. I'm interested to hear his take on this. I don't have a take on the judge. He's supposed to be the impartial judge, but he's on Team Greg. I'm here by myself. Back to the way I like it. Just my take on it is really just everything that you say, Andy, just comes back to Belichick. Belichick's one that puts the team together regardless of.

And I think Steve has a point where he's he does try to, you know, throw a dart in some place that no one else is looking instead of taking obvious talent because I think that he's such an ego maniac that he doesn't want to take on a personality that he can't handle. He wants someone to come kiss his feet and say, Bill, please save my career. And I will take no money. I'll put my body on the line. And, you know, and he's just not getting that anymore because he's got a bunch of Gen Z years and kids and he's a 70 year old man. I just think that's that's really. Oh, come on. I love it.

Tim. Okay, Boomer. You know what I mean? I think it's a boil sound too. I think he has a tough, tough, unconnected appears. Is Bella check the salad generation or is he a Boomer? He's a Boomer. Even though the salad generation is? He's a boomer. Even though the Salad generation is.

He's a boomer. Pretty bloomer. He's got a close. I mean, it's pretty, uh, it's a good point, though, right? I mean, there is the, the shift in coaching strategy to like being the buddy panel, right? Sean McVeigh. I don't know.

You don't think he has a tough time connecting to players? No, I don't know. You don't think he has a tough time connecting to players? No, I don't think so. I feel like he would have heard that from a fuller players. I think it's more he's struggling to adapt to the like the GM bell check. It's struggling to adapt to the market. Right. I don't know. But I think that's a good point too. I know, I think that's a good point. I just think more like he's that's where it's gets kind of screwed up because he wants them to come and kiss his feet and take the like the less amount of money. Now whether that comes from you know ownership or if that's coming just from Bill. I might be able to connect with them on a personal level, but he's not going to pay you.

Regardless, no matter what you do, he's not going to reward you with the money. All right, Asad, they come down. I don't think that's true. I mean, I think the, you have a point, but it's more, he's always looking like, because he's coming at it from a GM perspective of what's going to keep his competitive for the next five years plus, right? He's always looking like because he's coming out of from a GM perspective of

What's gonna keep his competitive for the next five years plus right you can always ball out and blow your salary cap and kick the can and have a huge team How loud the Rams or the box or everybody and have like a no-bass team with the crap cap is crap and do whatever the fucking want this year But you can't sustain that in and out, but to the next point earlier of that process only works when you're competitive every fucking year and you're going to God damn playoffs, right? And there's a little bit of, he's definitely resistant to that. And a new GM might not be, and like, hey, Belchick, here's like, I went to Whole Foods and I got you the best groceries, like, stop going to goddamn stop and shop and fucking all the and trying to find the shitty ass things and find the value is and

and stop it in the produce that's expired. And like, here's the best stuff. It's like, you should have shit on your face. Like, you got to work and then we'll suffer a bit and then, you know, he won't do that because he's the GM and the coach. Is that the point I was trying to make though, Steve, because that's not what I'm saying at all. I'm just saying, you're saying they don't want to. Yeah, I'm just saying, I'm saying more like he doesn't, the way that he brings in his team like I think he wants people Like I just think it's hard for him to have people that have no ego and he doesn't want that he just wants Yes, the military style like I'm in charge you listen to me

I mean probably comes from his background right is dad is military all that stuff which I don't think I think you're on Somewhere like the younger generation doesn't respond well to that. I mean, you think, you see Chamex, you see in college all over the place, right? Deon Sanders, like that's a good example of like the, it's trending towards like I'm your buddy, even though I'm the coach, I'm not in charge of you. I disagree. And whether you think that that translates to success on the field is like one thing or another, but I think it's hard to argue that players are excited about like, yeah, me and Bill,

you know, really? I mean, I feel like he's at the other side of that conundrum of knowing everything about the game football. Yeah, but everything I think there have been a lot of Those special defense The people have ever learned you know, and yeah, but if you're prick about it No, but he's not a prick about it. I can have a really smart boss. That's also In your in-deer company is like hey, you know, I'm I used to I ran Nike like you guys want to And I'm normal, but you guys want some of me like I think you'd be about it. I Mean that's literally what

Like a bunch of players especially on defense. I've said like they they came you like JL Mills came Specifically signed with page specifically to be coached by Bill Bellicic. Yeah, but they're also guys that are willing to sacrifice their ego And it's not and you, who has the biggest ego, the most talented players. So you can get your like, you're scrappy guys that are willing to be the fucking good lunchpale guy, but those aren't guys that are winning in the modern NFL.

Your way off, if you think we can't attract talent because the Belliciek is the block here. Right, yeah, I agree. Your way off if you think we can attract town because the dollar check is the block here. Right. Yeah, I agree. Here we are. I might see a top. I'm like, keep an ante on the same side of something. Like, do you mean there's more than Greg and I do, I think. I just, I don't know, I just feel like Steve likes to be a natural contrarian and to sometimes probably more mop. But I can't stand on. I can't believe you're not just on the middle.

Let's be sure. Yeah. I mean, natural progression, right? No, not this. No, this is how it is. Little brother. It's how it works. Yeah, I think so.

That's my lot in life. Well, I see you meet lean and more Andy right now. I think the whole like Belichek doesn't pay people is overblown to. He will pay people. I mean, he, yeah, I mean, he paid Cronk like extraordinary money. He's, he's, I mean, he'll for it because I like, there's always somebody who's like the top paid player at their position in the league. Yeah, I thought when I thought player at their position in the league. Yeah, I thought I'm going to hide down playing some of the work I think that.

Yeah, but this is my point of like, but yeah, and that's the other thing too, Steve. That's a great point is the like the patrons will like Belichag will say, listen, this is what we think you're worth. Feel free to go out and get a better offer. If you find one great, if not, come back and this is what you'll get.

And it all came back. Well, Steve Brown's a high-time came back. Where's the call that's coming from? When you're Sean McVeigh or Pete Carroll and the buddy coach, you can't do that. That is removed from your entire repertoire of... Is that what the gym? I know you're really good at your job, but the market is this and I don't give a fuck about and then it was your value of the market. And and like this is my point of BB trying to, hey, he has a full and both camps and let's be real. He's really fucking good at it or was really good at it. How do you want to look at it? To the point where we want to

fucking ton of sick people champion chest because he is really good at it. But this setup is unique. Give me, come on, think about it. Any other top four league franchise where the coach is also the GM for any year more than this. Does it happen in English soccer, Greg? What do you think in the history of any franchise ever? Really?

There's nothing. He has the only one who's ever done that. And it has worked. But Robert Kraft, in my opinion, these company BBs, Hey buddy, great, loved it. Obviously not gonna fire you because it worked so well.

But like, which would you rather do? Would you rather be the GM? Would you rather be the coach because you can't do both? And I think that is our path forward of Baby gives up one of these two. He's doing two full-time jobs But I think he's as good a coach as he is because he gets picked the players. He has built this He can also be a really fun good coach when given the groceries. He has built this. He can also be a really fun, good coach, when given the groceries. I mean, that's right. Steve's got a point that I can do.

I don't know the coach. Yeah, the coach didn't need this old G. Yeah, but like, it's not, we're going to say, like, we're going to force a GM on you, Bellachack. Like, if you want a coach or a fit and a system and like, yeah, of course, go find John Robinson. Go find. But does that make him a better coach though?

If he picks the guy and says that here's what I want, I want the bargain heap guys that are going to come in and not say anything yet. Yeah, we're going to end up with the same type of players. He's going to change anything. If they have, just like, a name on the draft pick, yeah. Yeah, you need someone that's going to be like, no, Bill, I'm getting you this guy or I'm drafting this guy instead even though you want this guy. But what if that doesn't work? And it's an ego thing, right? What if the offense doesn't work when they do?

Well, he's tried it. He ain't working now. I mean, you go, hey, Bill, on defense, you can draft any fucking D3 player you want From the North line What what calendar year is it when the Patriots get a Non-Bell check GM is it I mean depends if you think it's gonna give up that role. I don't think he wants to get never would Why would he give it up. I would give it up. It's all or nothing. We're gonna have a non-bellow check as the GM, right?

Probably the same year we have a non-bellow check coach, I would imagine. Yeah. He's not gonna step down from that role. No. I mean, $25 million a year. He's not gonna do that. I don't think it's that. I think he's going for the win record.

Yeah, it's been a big tool. He absolutely is personal. Yeah, it is a personal thing. And if I was double check, and I was focused on that, then the more time I could spend on coaching, the less time I could spend on all the other bullshit. That's how he sees it. I'm a man of salary cap in the entertainment.

Talent players are cut. And like that shit, like like let's let me coach it's like half his he can half his workload and coach forever I don't I don't think he wants to do that honestly I think he wants to get the thing with Shula and then I think eventually he wants to be enough to hand it out to Steve Belichak or Brian one of the yeah that's another point if we're still in the courtroom to Steve Belichick or Brian. Yeah, that's another point. If we're still in the courtroom, fucking Steve Belichick, dude, are you kidding me? Are you kidding me?

No, you're right. That defense is terrible on your his leadership. Dude, I don't care. That guy should not be coaching a defensive unit in the NFL. That's ridiculous. Why? You bought me a Steve Belichick shirt. Just get out of here.

People are fucking out of here. Greg, you bought me a Steve Bale texture that when he's in the, and I'm thinking, yeah, he's a shirtless object. It's funny. I'm not on that. I'm not saying it's not funny.

I'm just saying that you can't be, like you can't hold yourself seriously and be like, I'm gonna have my fucking son do it. Like that's ridiculous. I don't know. Kyle Shanahan. I was got it. Okay, how did he get his start in the league?

Exactly, but they let him go do it on his own, right? Instead of it like just that how we started. You have to let him do it on his own and do it on their own. Kyle Shanahan was started doing it on his own. Ask a point. No, I don't know. Where do you start? Ianham was started doing it on his own. Ask a point. No, I don't know. He started. I started under his father.

Look it up. He started under his father. He was either, was he an offensive coordinator under his father? The nepotism is at least a my concern. He actually might have been. Hold on, hold on. What is Steve? He is an offensive coordinator for the Red Skins

when Mike Schanham was a good cook. All right, so is Steve? He was an offensive coordinator for the Redskins when Mike Shanahan was. Yeah. All right. So is Steve Bell check going to be a good head coach in this league? And how about Mike? Maybe it's going to be a head coach here. Even aside from that, I don't think it's a good look regardless. I don't think it's a good look for Shanahan either.

The nepotism right is horrific. And we're all and we're even having these conversations about like, why can't these black guys get Jobs in the league and then they're like oh, yeah, but you know, I'm with your brother And then it's like yeah, my son just got the gig dude That's ridiculous like that son doesn't get the job if Bill Bellichek's not the head coach, right? That's it for I mean he's growing up around football Just if I mean he's growing up around football. He's

you're on the mail is over here being like what the fuck do I got to do? Does fucking like 35 girl guy just like going to be like, oh, and who is there? Who is the the defense coordinator before that? Andy, do you agree with Steve Bellichek getting the gig? Yeah, you do. Why? Cause he's fucking good at it.

It's going into that based on what? Based on the results of this defense and how well before he had the gig. The secondary, wasn't he the secondary coach when we played a, when we were in the Super Bowl, and Svilly? How many points did that secondary give up? The Rams defense to him. I mean, he was, if it, I'm just sexy.

You don't even know how to do you. The guy right where I fell Brian Belchegg. He's not as good. So he's not shit. I know, but even if he is good, the optics are bad. Oh, sure. I mean, put him on a different team. I'm both let him figure it out.

You missed my head coach, Pinkrich. Who would you rather have as head coach than Belch? If Belch act retired in two years. Oh, I mean, this like if people that are available, I don't think we should fire them. So I don't think there's anybody available that's as good as him. But oh, wow. Can you say that again? Oh, I have to defend. But if you asked if there's anybody I would say on fucking

fron. God damn it. Should I should I pick six? I can pick six. He's a fraud and also say that he you hit his last point. You just he just said, but you're

agree with me that he should keep coaching and give up. Yeah, no, I think he should be the head coach. Yes. Okay. But he's a fraud. Who's your ideal replacement? Ideal Shanahan. I think Shanahan's the best coach in yet, though. We're not going anywhere.

Come on, I got a little bit of use. He's better than Kyle Shanahan. The pictures job opens up and it's a very desirable job because they're historically awesome. Frances the great owner and a rabbit fin based as obvious by this goddamn podcast or rewatching games from 2004 or five years. Who's who's going for it? I mean, there's not that many good coaches out there just sitting around waiting. My number one bike label.

Yeah, you probably consider it. I think it definitely goes for it. Well, I've surpassed and has done pretty fun good with not much in Tennessee. Yeah, well, that offense he's put together is way better than what the Patriots have right now, right? It's just way better than what should be. I mean, I think they've scored over 20 points.

Have they? I think so. Seven last week against the angles. Well, you know what? It's really come true. My heart take that Ryan Tan and the fucking sucks. Yeah, but you have to say that about Josh Allen. And that's just darker and darker.

Hey, 102 is pretty good. That's fair. That's Yeah, it's fair. That's fair. That's fair. Yeah. I'm a picture of that. Steve waited out, Tanny Hill. He'll wait out Josh Allen to leave for us.

That's what I did out there. I mean, the guy does talk to Bollover a lot. So just wait until his legs give out on him. And he can't outrun the defense. Yeah. I can't throw a fucking mile. I can't throw a fucking pile. He can't take those body shots. Speaking of nepotism, you know what I fucking hate is these big college basketball coaches

that have their son is like the 10th guy in the bench. And it's like this like it's like garbage time and they bring out this darky white guy that's out there like just strictly shooting threes. He's not a good. Jack and threes, yeah, yeah. And it's like, oh my god, dude, this kid never would get into this program if his dad wasn't the head coach. So my favorite part of Greg's napetism thing is you wouldn't be on this podcast if it

weren't for your brother. I'd have a lot more free time and you know, I'd be fucking happy. Is it takes so much time, Greg? for your brother. I'd have a lot more free time and I'd be fucking happy. It takes so much time, Greg. Right. Yeah. Greg does all the work on this podcast for sure. That's right. Don't tell me Andy. I can't look, but don't push them. But I want to go back to Greg talking about how in this, the modern NFL has passed Belicechuk by because he focuses on the run game and the defense.

And the reason I was asking like how far back does the modern offense go is because in 2018, they won a Super Bowl by holding the, I think the seventh highest scoring offense in NFL history to three points when their offense put up 13 and they did it on their ground. Yeah, but that's that's kind of an aberration of what that team was. It wasn't I think because that team was, it started off as kind of a quote unquote modern offense throwing the ball around the. But they're all there.

Why does he just got hurt? And then like right at the end of the season, they conferred into a power run game against the bills and the jets. And then Sony Michelle just like scored the most playoff touchdowns of any rookie running back in the history of the NFL on their way to winning a Super Bowl. But again, that has to do with the line. And you're saying the modern NFL, the modern NFL offences based off an offensive line.

They had a good offensive line. That's right. So Bella check should already know that. And why hasn't he, why would he take a shot at Cold Strange versus, you know, what, I don't know, I can't, I don't know from that specific draft, but... So you're saying offensive line is important in the mind. Very important. But you're ragging on, bell check for drafting, an offensive lineman in the first round. Because... Because he picked the wrong lineman.

If you look around the league, that draft in the war room for the Rams, when they made that pick, they out loud laughed because they were expecting him to be a fourth round pick. Like, why are you taking a shot on someone's phone? Because it came out after the draft, like I'm people had him in the second round. That would have picked before the Patriots and there was actually a run on guards. So he was the next best.

And I got some bad news, dude. What's that, bud? The 2018, we had the fifth ranked offense in the 21st ranked defense. In what regard? Yards. Yards doesn't matter, Greg. Yards doesn't matter. 21st ranked defense in what regard yards. Yard doesn't matter Greg. Yard doesn't matter.

Three points. What was it? All right, fourth and seventh. Four of those sevens. So the offense. Oh, for the fourth ranked offense, Andy, that's the point. But Greg is also missing the game without a good offense. Do you remember that?

You remember that Rams chief, chief game that year. Yeah, exactly Where they were just it was isn't crap. I was one of the most I don't want to bend one of the best NFL games of all time regular season right where they're just it was Electric was it 50 for a 50 something ridiculous? Yeah, sure It's held that offense to three points. Yeah, but yeah, but match that up. That was the deep and set. I was double checked.

That was clock control. That was the punter who probably should have been the fucking in the back. Yeah, but that's like a sea championship game against achieves right? I also. Tom Brady. Greg of like that was how what year was those 2019 I was looking

Three or four years ago. That was a while ago where It's only gotten more that way. It's only gotten more into the 54 52 side of things and Belichpet has leaned into the success of that 19th year of all of clock control solid defense. And I'm on the team of, I don't know if you can win that way anymore.

And to get to that Super Bowl, they've been charged just 41 to 28, and then they beat the Chiefs 37-31. Like those games don't happen without Brady. You don't get to that Super Bowl without Brady. And the reason they won the Super Bowl is because Brady, maybe not specifically that game, but the reason you had a good team and you got to Super Bowl is because of Tom Brady. And the Belichack. And I think you could say Belichack won the Super Bowl.

That specific game with his game planning and his defense, but again, you can't get the like the Patriots do that Every now and then where they have a really good game against a good team and you're like, oh, this looks like we could compete But over the length of a season, it's just not sustainable to play like right Right to the point of like that specific formula worked in that game and the as hard as this is talked about the other side of the coin is That shit worked on Austin 2007 right yep, yeah and It worked but like the full game the full season to get there to even be

In that game in itself you need to be all the fucking yeah It's like Bellicaxe a master game planner, but you can't game plan every game. You know? Just from time restriction. You know, I hope it goes well. You can't sit there and like, yeah, re-coach everything.

We'll let you go. Yeah. All right, I think it just goes back to Bellicaxe is a defensive minded head coach like that's his skill set. And so he goes out. I mean, I think historically he's gone out and found an offensive coordinator who I feel like has free reign of the offense, right? I mean, we see it change from. With the players that Belice has picked.

That is I think the core of the issue, which is worth. I mean, Belice has picked some awesome players and he's gotten lucky over the years with the Brady big, with a ground pick even, right? Like he's got he's had so many things and whatever, whatever, but I would love to see a GM in a different offensive system and then let Belichick be the coach and on the defense. I mean, I have to imagine that

the offense coordinator and probably at the time Brady had some say in who they were bringing in for the offense. But you know, it's not just putting his foot down be like, no, we're drafting for this offensive line. They were sitting down as a what? You just interesting the draft is how good it was. And then there's a like just started being bad all sudden. Like especially like the front end. was and then there's a like just started being bad all of a sudden. Like especially like the front end.

Like I have the the picks in front of me like from oh four. I guess even go oh one. It's like Richard Seymour, Vince Wilfork, Logan Mankin, Sprint and Maryweather, Draudmau, Devin McCordy, Chandler Jones, Dante, High Tower. He wasn't the GFM at the time. What do all those have in common to them? I don't think he was GM until like a couple of years after he started because wasn't Scott Piole the the the Indio's GM from the get wasn't he? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He was a lot of you see

he was them French and GM. Yeah. That was a reason you took the job. I thought. Yeah. But yeah, I think Peele was part of the. He's had some big time. Peele, Demetrof, who went to the Falcon. Falcon, yeah. And we didn't live Super Bowl. John Robinson at the Titans. There's been some big time Nick Casero, big time person.

Now guys were never GM was by the left. Because they weren't GM. They want to go to the GM role. So who left in 2012? You don't know. Wait, you tell me. I'll just go. Because there's a pretty steep start.

After that, because then it goes Dominic easily Malcolm Brown, Isaiah wins. Sony Michelle and Nikhil Harry, Mac Jones, Cole Strange, Krishen Gonzalez. But I think from like, I say, I think Nikhil Harry and Sony Michelle, I think that was the Patriots trying to give Brady some weapons on offense at the top of the draft to kind of maximize that last window. Because if you look before that, like you were talking about those early 01 to 04 drafts or all the way through, what do all those picks have in common? They're either offensive lineman or they're defensive players because that's what Bell checked knows best.

That's how he builds this team, right? A good offensive line and a good defense. And then, you know, you can say let Brady figure out the wrestling offense because one of the offense was built that way and Brady thrived in it. And that has worked for 20 years. But then, yeah, I think there was this kind of, it felt like a shift in philosophy where they started drafting weapons. And everybody on Twitter was like, oh, finally, BilliEx started drafting weapons in the first round and it didn't work.

Well, it did. They won one more Super Bowl, but it kind of like now look at it. Their offensive lines are a bit in shambles and kind of wasn't 2019, which I think is part of why Brady left. Because you start in Marshall Newhouse and your backdoll and you could tell Brady was frustrated, because he just couldn't trust that his protection would hold up to be able to do what he normally does. But that goes back to Belichack, right? If he's the GM.

Yeah, Andy, would you, would you want Belichack the GM going forward? Yeah. You want him, you want him buying groceries? What about the judge? Mm-hmm. What about the judge? I'm just to see what the judge says on this. Okay. Uh, I disagree.

I don't think that he should be buying the groceries anymore. Okay, we got three, I get, we got three on four. Uh, I am also, I'm open to a, I usually have one page is placed. I don't know if we have to, right. I am also open to a one-page-it's place. I want to be me. Because my point is big picture of long-term. Like, you can't have one dude doing both. And the last thing you're going to take away from him

is coaching. You definitely want them to stop coaching and be a full-time G&M. You're not gonna fire it. I can't have somebody. So how was your transition gonna go? It's gotta be like, okay, BB, we're gonna have a GM come in here. You can pick them. I don't give a shit.

Like, find the guy you want. Get one of your homies back. I don't care, but we need to split this role. So I got a question. I'm gonna teach theoretical questions. I don't care, but we need to split this role. I got a question. I'm going to teach theoretical question. I just want to say in 2019, they started Isaiah when it left tackle as a rookie.

And I think he started off okay, but then he went down, they had to get Martian new house. They were starting Ted Caris at center because David Andrews didn't have like something with his blood or something ridiculous. Remember that? We talk about injuries again Andy. Yeah, everybody gets injured. But he that's that's Andy's main point in the as well. Yeah, like how do you GM around that? Like okay, everybody gets injured. So what do you do? That's part of it. It's five. You build the next man up. How long has that worked?

I stopped. I'm going to put eventually work for Andy Reed. He figures it out. He doesn't win as many Super Bullets. I can't. Oh, yeah. Yeah, not. Yeah.

That's too. All right, theoretical question. Because Tim brought up something earlier that I want to see what you guys think. Does Bella check have a big ego? I don't think anybody can do this. I think what are the answer is the real question. Just in general, like in an NFL circle, like, well, for the media, obviously. If we brought Bella check on his podcast, he would have an absolute

Maserid to go out the post go fuck ourselves and he's above us. But he be really players. I don't think I think you guys are way off on the. He really younger players. All right. So Steve, all right. So you were talking about Andy was talking about how he'll have a player go test the market and then come back to them.

So I think it was, I don't know when it was, but when Lawrence guy went to go test free agency, he had a number for Bellachack. Bellachack gave him a number to him to go test free agency. He didn't, he went out for the market, didn't get what he wanted, he came back. And then Bellachack said, yeah, that offers no longer on the table. Go fuck yourself, you can take less or you can do whatever you want.

You think that has an ego or if a guy relates to his team, does he, you know, at least give him the offer that he presented off first? Or someone's phone mode that he presented at first. Or someone from both of them. I'm reinforcing my point of the difficulty that Dalc check faces serving both roles of on one hand. He's no, I'm not. I'm not going to have to. If you don't want to say,

I'm going to go, Steve. Does he have any? He goes, stick on that one thing. Do you not think that the little bit egotistical for you? Say that I'm your boss and you're like, hey, I don't think I'm getting paid enough. My contract's up, but I want to get paid a little bit more. And I say, all right, Steve, go ahead, go check it out.

And then you're like, yeah, I didn't find anything. And I go, yeah, well, now I'm paying you $50 less. You're going to make less money now. How the fuck are you going to feel? Anything I have an ego or no? Well, first of all, you $50 less. You're gonna make less money now. How the fuck are you gonna feel? Anything I have an ego or no? Well, first of all, if you're my boss, I'm quitting anyways. I'm not gonna be a real idiot right now.

I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna, I need to do it. I'm not gonna, if you're the idiot, you're the idiot. I don't wanna sleep on the goddamn streets. But second of all, this is your, your reinforcing the issue of having Belchak

stop saying that's the board is saying around you're dancing around you is it am I not egotistical in some way if that hypothetical scenario I just presented is presented to you. No, that's just my business man. Man salad tap. That's what she did. That's a great thing. And then the other is like, maybe the fire. Yeah, because you can be a business. It's over there with a lot of these woods at stake.

And their families and this money that they're making. And they're putting their lives online, not literally putting their lives in line to play this game for money. And it's when your coach is like, and the GM is making those decisions because I got caught, man, John Robinson's real piece of shit on Pete Carroll. Like, you know, John Robinson's giving you 50 cents in the dollar.

Yeah, but that's not what we're talking about Steve. You can still be like, hey, I respect you. Go get money, I respect you. It's lit. Go get money. I respect you. This offers stands if you come back. And then if you're not a prick, when he comes back, you go, here's the deal. All right. Good.

But like, instead of being no I can't sing up. I'm playing up pre-kill. Like it's just that one instance of one instance. Go, go, go, go, go.

I want more money because Larry. Cool. As a GM, it's a totally different fucking thing. I want more money because they are cool. As a GM, it's a totally different fucking thing, but like this is where I think we're struggling because the worlds are blended. I'm not struggling to answer the question, Steve. I don't think so. It's a prick move for someone to say, this offer is here and then you go do what I said

is fine for you to do. You come back and I say you're not getting that same deal. It's not like that anymore. That's like the fucking mafia, dude. Watch any episode of the sopranos. It's the same fucking thing. I think he's kind of a pro. I mean, it's got to be like this offers on the table. You come back and you have you didn't find anything better So I'm like, all right. Yeah, well the deal's changed now Well, that's I mean at the end of the ads business right? I

Have to say that and then I can say it Steve so I This is a fucking sad Steve. So I think it's one thing that's a John Robinson. Wow, what a pooh the shit. You know, I'm being a girl. I'm like, well, he really fucked you over. But don't worry, I'll get you, you know, we'll coach you up and you'll make some money in the next contract.

You can't see that if you're Bell Check when I just fucked you on the salary cap because you don't have to have a welcome day. One day I've been over five years and half this year. And now I have to coach you. All right, Andy, what do you do? I'm having those two roles separate. Steve, you already made that point.

We know. How could other course, buddy? I think that there's been plenty of examples of Bella check altering deals in players' favor. Like they literally just did it with Trent Brown where they he was going to miss some of his to be earned. Yeah, bonuses. So they restructurate so that he would be more likely to hit them.

And I do that a lot with, you know, if you miss it by a little bit at the end, they pay, they pay you those bonuses anyway. But again, to, I think there is a bit of, you know, businesses, business. And there's been a lot of talk about how Ballochek as a GM is kind of a hard ass in negotiations. Even players who love him, like, I love being coached by Balochack, but trying to get a new contract out of him was paying the tits because it is all about the team. And so, like, at that part of it, I think he separates the business from the player, which is really hard to do when you're also the coach to Steve's point. But that is the business side of things.

Like Bella check puts a number on what he thinks you're worth. And then, you know, if you want to go out and test that, that's great. But that number made change when you get back. I don't know that is there an ego piece? Not to that. No. To any of it. No. I mean, everybody's got an ego at some. I mean, he's the winning is the second winning is coaching the history of the NFL. There's got to be some sort of ego about that, right? Right. You can't ask about it. Right. But if you're a thing is everything is about the team, that ego needs to be back to the door because that's exactly what you expect of your players. And I feel like that's what should be. That's what he does do though. I don't think I don't think that's true though. I just

want to because just the way that he's running it, the way that watch the way that he interacts with the the media and all that kind of stuff. I just feel like that. The media doesn't do anything for the. It works when you're winning, right? He doesn't do anything for the the it works when you're winning, right? He doesn't he doesn't show any accountability and yeah, they're also look at the whole thing with the Malcolm. Good thing. What do you mean while he doesn't show accountability? Whenever the team wins, he puts all the praise on the players. And whenever they lose, he says it's my fault.

We didn't coach him up correctly. Yeah, he does. He just goes, you know, I need to play better and coach better. I mean, he's to do that Yeah, but what if you want to Then you can Build your brand your own Team

build your brand your own personal bond. It's a team. Now I'm a I'm a team. Yeah, look what happened to him last year. You couldn't see the field.

There's our best player. There's a little bit of draw. Draw because I'll be tested at the most. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. I see to me.

It's time Brady. There's a high degree of control in in the Patriots organization, right? They want to control a lot of things and it's my way or the highway. And that works when you're winning, because no one can say shit,

because you're winning and the culture works, and the team is above everything, because the team is winning. But once you start losing, that shit falls apart real quick, because the players only respect it in between. We just franchise it right. That's every franchise. And I don't know, I'm more about

exactly what helped it together was Tom Brady is what I'm saying. No, I'm way more about keeping that fucking distance. I'm way more about keeping it as an event since I'm like people just fucking go buck and say it with a fucking wand. Yeah, I know, but they, but if you're not winning, it's going to fall apart. Right. That's why I like Patricia tries to do that shit in Detroit. And it's like everyone's like, this isn't bad. All of our coaches, right? They go out of the way and they try and institute this culture. I'm in charge my way the highway. We're fucking running windsprints. And it doesn't work because you don't have the legacy of the winds to fall back

on to, to demand back on to to demand the respect and to demand people to conform. What we do. We do. But everybody, but it's slipping because now we're starting to lose and it's like this could get worse before it gets better. Yeah, but none of the players are the ones complaining about this though. Like, you know, but you don't have to. Just the media public about it, Andy. Give it up. The media says, shit, the players thing. That's definitely what they know. It's a no.

They're not going to come out and say it because they're still part of the team, right? There's no benefit to them to come out and complain. So in 2003, it's Mac Jones actually out and said, uh, the players hate their coach. He was talking for the team. Dude, maybe there is a piece of that at that time.

There were players that were, I think it's winning. There were people that were definitely questioning Bella together at the time that is definitely confirmed in. Players. Yes. Who? I think Ted Johnson has spoken out a lot.

So don't chuckle at who it is. He's a player, yes or no? He's a player. There were a lot of players that were playing for a hell of a. It doesn't, that's not the point. The point is where there are players in that locker room questioning what Bill and the check was doing. Yeah.

And just the sneak test is there probably was because it was a question will move. Yeah. I mean, it worked out for him. Roll the dice and it worked out for him. But still, there, there was some validity to the fact that Tom Jackson, what he said, that they, some players hate him. I mean, you can just say some players hated. What did he say? Did he just accept it? All players hate their coach. Did he just make it up?

I mean, you just said that Ted Johnson has an ax the grind. So does he hate belligerent? I absolutely. Yeah, he does, but not for nice. I said, I have a thousand of these. Some of their players were super happy or fiasm to whatever it was. Yeah, your best friend, Gloria Malloy that's been to battle with you in one game.

And that was like made that play. He made that training, put his balls on the table and it worked out and it worked out because they want it's always out because you win. But you know why they want to be a new person.'m positive to you once you're once you're all turned up here what do you rather us do I don't think you know what they want sort of thing bullshit come on it works from a base I want to keep they no I want to keep that standard of excellence now fuck that I want to keep that standard of excellence. Now, fuck that. I want to hire Dion.

I want to draft Dion's son number one overall and be like, yo, Dion, a filer fire and bill. You want to take you want to trade away our players and take the shit out in the season and just what players do we have? Yeah. You want to have Steve? What players do you want to play it? Steve, what place would you go? I want to keep her on IR. I got the perfect GM for you.

His name is Jim Urseys. He's a cold sky. A lot of experience. You can fucking do a bunch of goddamn pills. Take a shit out of the guys. And hopefully we will have a good start too. Nice job, Steve. Nice job.

I just like, that's what struggles for me is like the burn it down guys. It was like what you mentioned earlier, Greg, because we can't get better than Bell Check, but we fired him. Correct. The fuck you got to do, we got to roll. We're going to be bad. We're going to be bad. Is what I'm saying.

And we have to accept that we're going to be bad. And we're going to get a good one. We're going to be bad. Is what I'm saying. And we have to accept that we're going to be bad. And we're going to get here and we're in Tennessee. And we went to that fucking Titans game. And we need to get in the goddamn stadium and they scored a touchdown. And we heard them score touchdown standing in line to get in the fucking stadium. And we get it to our steeds and they scored another touchdown. By the time we set our eyes down on the beer, we're down 14-0. And we lost, like, I remember.

That was bad. Yeah, it was like 40-7. That was the Tom Brady they tried to throw the Philly Sash with him. The second falls on his ass. And I wanted to leave in the fourth quarter and you're like, what are you doing? You got to take your lumps. You got to sit here, you can't sit here, I have support the Patreons and not,

and give up when it's like, you know, we're getting the shit kicked out of it and sit here and take your lumps and... Yeah, but at the same time, you have to admit when it's not working and it's bad. Like to stick your head in the sand and be like, no, it's Bellachek, you'll figure it out. We're gonna, next year is, you know,

it's like, you have to call it like you see it, it's not working, I don't see optimism for it working, I don't think burning it down is gonna make it, maybe that does fix it quicker, but I think we owe something to Bella check some respect that he's, he's turned this franchise into one of the best in sports, and he kind of comes, and he, with that that comes he can do whatever you want Right, and we have to be like okay, but it doesn't mean we can't criticize him and say hey

You're you're lagging behind the rest of the league right now and there's other coaches that if I could make a trade I would I would You stop they're not gonna trade trade, it's not going to happen. So the other alternative is fire them and pick up a schlub off the street, which I don't think is a good idea either. But it's not good. Can you note the timeframe on this and sniff this? Because it might be the most rational even had to take Greg as ever had. Oh god. Because I have absolutely 100% of% of the growth you're totally right up like just because he's been great doesn't mean he's in me from criticism, but he's also early respect of that the longest

leech of all time. I know. And we should have gave that respect to Brady too. He's working and what's the not forward? Like let's let's talk about the path forward here. Because whatever it's been doing is in working. And my perspective is a new GM. Deon Sanders, Amy, Shadoor.

I don't want Belch at the culture place on Lincoln Riley. No, no, don't. Why Lincoln Riley's a fucking beast. Give me GM. Give me GM names. I don't know Lincoln Riley's GM give me GM names I don't know GM names. I know Okay, he was a question Lincoln Riley right now No, why?

Because he's not as good as Bell check Bell check that's Lincoln Riley and Caleb William and also The coach you he's not going anywhere because he's chasing a record. They're Lincoln Riley and Caleb Williams and also the coach you he's not going anywhere because he's chasing a record. They're linking Ryan and Caleb Williams starting week one next year. Don't have the fucking hanging the first pick bro. By being terrible this year. You're seeing the bears who are they getting their dicks kicked in right now as we're talking.

I don't know. I don't know. Are they better? Either way, the bears have the number one and the number two pick. There's no way they do right now. But it's we for Steve. But Lincoln Riley is a type of guy that would make me go, whoo, because he's an offensive minded coach that clearly can connect with players that has like,

the coordinator is proven success across a few different offensive minded coach that clearly can connect with players that has like the coordinate. Well, he's proven success across a few different competitive environments, right? He's he's won at Oklahoma with Kyler, Mari, and he's made four different quarterbacks. Good. Right. So he's showing it's not just like the quarterback doing it. You want to as the offensive coordinator? You want him as your head coach? You want to have your head coach? I want to miss the head coach.

How many quarterbacks is Nick Sabin made? Good. And called. Yeah, I'll take Nick Sabin too. If for that man, if Nick Sabin wants to jump to the I mean, how many coaches have done that before? Nick good. I mean, you're married.

Be good. Yeah, I know. I'm not. Listen, I'm not saying it's going to translate perfectly, but it's worth a chance, right? No. No. Over an aging bellicic. Yeah, I'll give me a new GM to transition and infuse a talent with a different type of player

that Bellicic needs to adapt to. And I know, but he's not going to want to do that. It's never going to happen. You're talking about something. Yeah. What? Bell Check do that. In history of the NFL.

Yes, he is. And he's also in his mind, also the greatest GM. He's not going to just be like, oh, OK, I'm old. I'm, yeah, right. Come on. Are you? If there's one part of his job, even GM he's not gonna just be like oh okay I'm old. Yeah Are you there's one part of his job even he doesn't like doing which part of it you think it is I think you like doing it all I think you like control Like that's not what I asked what part with oh so now we're gonna jump around questions right What that's crazy job it doesn't like doing you know but it's calling players and telling them they're cut.

That's probably the least. And he doesn't even do it. I don't think he does. I got some hand lotion when he's calling those players. I don't think he does it. He's like in South Park when they're like twisted their nipples. He's like, oh, yeah. You're kind.

You're so kind. Oh, yeah. And you can go find a better deal on the market. And if you come back this deal I'm gonna be here for you. Oh, I'm sorry, Lawrence. Oh, yeah. This deal is no longer valid.

It's only for the new. It's no longer on the table. Balls are on the table. It's a new customer only. If you have a new one, I can give you give you. Oh, no. Oh, no. Oh, no. Oh, sorry. Oh, that's great visual there. All right. Should we end on that? All right. Yeah. Any closing arguments here? Yeah, I love putting down predictions that we never follow up on. So when do you think Bell checks last game he coaches is how far behind is he from From Shula and gay. 19 19 19 19 19 19

All right, my answer is 20 28 then 2020 the last game like we 17 or 19 whatever the NFL expense it to 28. Yeah, as he does to do it for the patrons. I'll do the same thing. Yeah, and he gets it in that last week He gets that record That's win 20 Yeah, so Andy's right Bella Tricks got to 299 and Shula has 328 29 I will disease 70 70 Yeah, he carols 72 and he looks 10 years younger than him. I can't stand P Carol

Dude watching him on that game dancing around after they had their like 12 sack against the Giants and he's like hopping up and down on the sidelines. I was like I can kill me. It's so enthusiastic, it's disrespectful. Like act like you've been there before, dude. Like, the, the, the, the try to get embarrassed, but their fans are at their lowest point ever and fucking, he carols over there like, yeah, guys, good job. Like, yeah, the face from him when they threw that pick in football. I know. Yeah. I was so I was so like angered at him

in that Super Bowl just because of his personality and how I didn't want them to win. Do you remember that Greg? What being pissed? I remember them panning to his face and I was screaming at T. I was like, fuck you, be careful. And then they panned a Richard Sherman. I was like, fuck you Richard. Yeah, great face too. Oh, it's the best. The best.

My. Okay, Thardick. Yeah, so we should do some closing arguments. Yeah. Yeah, so we should do some closing arguments. Yeah, I don't know the end of 2027 season. I think they'll check. But coach of the Patriots. Spelling you guys thing. I said 2025 20 30.

30. 30. You'll be alive in 20. You just guys as I had coach like fine. I think it's going to be a lie in 20s. I mean, he's seven. Did he just dies as I had coach like, fine thing? Yeah, like on the sideline. He leaves to run for president. He leaves to fall to be the president.

Taking my talents to DC. I thought the floor is ass. I think that might be where we are. Yeah. Yeah. Well, 2030, Belichick for president. For president. Yeah. We'll get the shirts ready.

Hmm. All right. Well, I think, uh, I hasn't had to ask, but Tim, are you going to have a ruling on this? Yeah, I'm going to rule with Andy and Steve Sides and Steve, like, went on the fence. That's a bullish sign. Well, I guess the only thing left to say then is... Turn in next week to see how much of a blubbering little bitch Greg you on the page.

It's die is the podcast. Turn in next week for another Patriots 10 point performance. Stale. Yeah. Some more screen passes. You know, and some draw plays on third and 16. 13 and 16.