PBD Podcast - David Pakman | Should The Government Tax More!? | Ep. 231 | PART 2

Episode Date: February 1, 2023

On this episode, Patrick Bet-David and David Pakman will discuss: Why David Pakman is not a socialist  Why Elon Musk is good for society  The Strategy for Ron DeSantis to beat Trump in 2024  Protect and secure your retirement savings now with this complimentary precious metals guide. Go to http://goldco.com/pbd FaceTime or Ask Patrick any questions on https://minnect.com/ Want to get clear on your next 5 business moves? https://valuetainment.com/academy/ Join the channel to get exclusive access to perks: https://bit.ly/3Q9rSQL Download the podcasts on all your favorite platforms https://bit.ly/3sFAW4N Text: PODCAST to 310.340.1132 to get added to the distribution list --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/pbdpodcast/support

David, why are you not a socialist? Why am I not a socialist? Well, you say you're not a, unless if you are, that means, okay, so tell us why are you not a socialist? I'm not a socialist because I'm a genius. You grew up in Argentina. Well, I was five when I moved to the US. But like some of your family, they're supporters of socialist.

Like who? Your mom is not a, your mom supports socialism or no? No, what did I get that? There's an article that says about your mom support socialism. Oh, oh, you, that made, so okay, in Argentina, in the 60s, when my mom, when my parents were kids, among the Jewish community, there were lefty socialist Jewish groups. They were sort of like nominally socialist and they were cultural and et cetera.

And my mom certainly was part of that when she was 12 and 14. But no, my parents aren't socialist. That doesn't mean anything. I'm just because my mom's a communist. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm just curious of where that came from. Why are you not a socialist?

I think that the market is a fine way to direct resources in the vast majority of areas, whether it's sneakers or automobiles or cell phones. I think that that's absolutely a fine way to direct resources. I see it as an authoritarian imposition for a government to come to a business owner like you or like me and say you must socialize the ownership of this company. And I'm against that.

I don't see any reason for that. I don't see a legal basis and I don't see a moral basis for it. What I am okay with as a capitalist, right? And I know I saw your conversation with my friend Kyle Kalinsky and it seemed like you guys were talking past each other a little bit on social democracy versus socialism or whatever. I consider myself a social Democrat, sort of in the mold of Denmark, Sweden, et cetera. Those are capitalist countries that have decided to socialize a couple more things than we've socialized in the United States.

That's really the difference and it's capitalism. It's a form of capitalism. Capitalism to make the money, socialism to spend the money in a lot of these countries. No, I mean, I think that's a common talking point, but maybe to distill it in a way, are we all okay with socializing the military? Are you cool with that?

Like in other words, we use taxes. So then let me ask the question different way. So it's funny to me, just a way a lot of people on the other side are funny to you when somebody says I'm not a socialist, but then they defend socialism and go straight to military and how much it costs and how much money spent. That's not the direction I was going to go ahead. I'm just saying, but what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what Go ahead. So go ahead. What I'm not doing. Go ahead. Okay.

Are you okay? Socializing the military in the sense that we have one military run by the government, our taxes pay into it and it's centralized and that's the military. There aren't a bunch of different. There's not, you know, Patrick's military and if you want to pay taxes there and that military might have different goals than the military in Texas. That would be crazy, right? We socialize the military.

We have everybody pays their taxes. We have a federal military. Fair. Keep going. Do we have that? Keep going. We can't make progress unless we establish where we are here. I'm curious, but I'm curious to know where you're going with this.

Well, but because you said that's not the argument you're making. So, curious to know where you're going with it. The argument I was going to make was not that we spend too much on the military. Okay. So I'm curious what you're going to say. Are you okay with the military being organized the way it is? We pay taxes and then the military has centralized command and that's the way it's organized. Is that okay with you at the federal level?

That's the current system that we have here. And does it bother you or is that okay? Does it bother me that we have a, I don't even think we have at this point, but we can have a strong military that prevents future wars for somebody who lived in Iran and went through war for 10 years with Iraq and experienced all that? Yeah, I'd like us to have a strong military. Okay, and you're okay with it being run the way it's run. We pay taxes.

I don't think we're running it well right now So I don't know what you mean by that, but I'm not happy with the way we run it today. I these aren't I these aren't trick questions I'm sure so where you don't let me give a different example. Yeah, are you okay with the fact that the fire department is Socialized usually at the municipality. I am you're okay with that. I'm okay. Are you okay? Because it's community because it's where you live. Yes. Are you okay with the FAA being socialized in the sense that the traffic air traffic control is run by the FAA. There aren't all these different air traffic controls where here's a couple airlines that use one and then here's a couple airlines that use another. We have the FAA, they run ATC, this is what keeps planes from running into each other.

Are taxes go into it? It's socialized. Is that okay with you? Socialized means we are distributing the cost among the people and giving centralized control to that entity. Is it okay? Am I, am I willing to spend a portion of my taxes? Not my question. For that, yes. Okay. The difference between where I think you are politically and someone like me is I'm okay socializing a couple more things. Okay. So it's really when these conversations go off the rail with allegations of socialism and whatever, you just said you're okay socializing a number of things I mentioned and there's more, right? We could say, are you okay with like the VA,

that's a socialized medicine, I don't know if you're okay with the VA, maybe you are, maybe you're not. You and I agree on socializing a whole bunch of stuff. I wanna socialize a couple more and otherwise everything's the same. I don't know that that makes me social. Let me ask you question, David.

So out of every dollar you make, what are you comfortable being taxed on, like being taken away? It depends what I get for that. Can I give an example? Sure. Okay. My willingness to be taxed would be greater if, for example, my or my daughter's college education were paid for by those taxes. So in a vacuum, it's really hard to answer that question because it depends what we get. Okay, so let me continue with these questions, please. So who do you think makes better decision for your daughter?

You or the government? What kinds of decisions? School. School. What kind, like college? I just say, if you pay me I'm the government but I'll choose which school she can go to versus you don't pay me the government you take that responsibility and you get to choose to send your

daughter to what school she wants to go to. What do you mean the government chooses? But I'm giving you those choice those options. So meaning the government says these are the schools that will pay the tuition for. Okay. You're talking college and university. I're talking college and university. I'm talking college and university. Okay, okay. Yeah, so I'm assuming that's what you're talking about. You're talking public school.

Well, I didn't know which direction you were going on. Yeah, but so, okay, so but go back to when I see the question, I asked the question, I said, so what percentage of your dollar are you willing to be taxed on? Yeah. Not taxed on just taxed. Yeah. And you said it depends on what happens with what I'm paying for.

Right? Kind of which you said, OK. So do you think, I mean, is that logical? Do you agree with that at least in principle? Do you? Well, I think you have a good brain and a good mind to make better decisions on what to do with your money than the government can.

No, but as before we go into the specific education, because I'm trying to find points of agreement here, because I actually don't think we're really that far apart on a lot of these issues. Are you of the mindset that just hypothetically, are you okay paying more in taxes? If the taxes include fire, police, roads, bridges, are you generally, just have you have you have you ever lend anybody money? Yes, but do you not answer my question? But I'm an answer to this is my way of answering you have your way of answering I'm an answering the way I'm answering. So have you ever lent the same purse, have you ever lent money to somebody a good amount and they never paid you back?

Fortunately not. Okay. Yeah. Cool. Well, guess what? Yeah. I feel the same way you do about giving money to the government because they haven't had a good track record of doing right things with my money. No, it sounds like you're saying the opposite. I think I have not had an experience. Well, your wiser, good for you, that you haven't had that experience because it sucks but here's the part. Have you ever lent your car to somebody and it didn't work out for you? No. Never happened to you. No, I have leases and I just tell them, listen, I'm the only person who can drive. I don't even know if that's true. I just say, my insurance won't allow somebody to borrow anything from you. Yeah. Have you? Yes. Okay, give me an idea.

Something. Anything. Something like that they broke or something like that. Whatever you, you lent somebody. Oh, I'm trying to remember. And people don't really ask me for stuff very often. Like, this is a serious question here, man. Like the world is relying on you given the right answer.

What if I, I mean, maybe when I was like 14, I lent somebody a disc man and they didn't get that. Are you a video game guy? Are you a gamer? Not really. So what do you do for fun? Bike, read, travel. You ever lent a bike to somebody? God no. So you're, you're, you're, you a gamer? Not really. So what do you do for fun? Bike, read, travel. You ever lent a bike to somebody?

God no. So you're, you're, you may not be. No, I've lent a bike. No, I've lent a bike. Okay, so have you ever lent a bike to somebody? Yes. And they jacked it up. No.

You've never had that happen. No. Then you're living in a freaking utopia. That's why you don't understand economy yet maybe. I have undergraduate at graduate degrees. I know, well that part, but that's concerning as well. I mean, that probably means I know less. Well, not necessarily. That just means you program. It's a different story to think in one way because that part, but that part is true. A lot of it with current

education. I was programmed and then deprogram. Well, you got, when you got 13 to one, that's a true monopoly of professors on the left to the right. That's pure monopoly. But let me go back to the question, what I'm asking. You asked me the question, are you comfortable, as long as what they do with the money? That wasn't my question. What was your question? My question was, as a general principle,

are you okay paying a little more if you get more? Per-same question, in my, as the same thing. Here's why the answer is no. Oh. Okay. The reason why the answer is no. Okay. The reason why the answer is no, I love your sarcasm. The reason why the answer is no is because if I give somebody a relative a thousand bucks, okay. The last thousand dollars is going to give me.

I'm telling you, bro, I'm going to pay you back 1500 bucks in two years. Yeah. Never get her back. Okay. Two years later, you come back to me. Hey, this time give me 5,000, but I promise you, I'm going to fix, I'm going to give it back 10 grand. Yeah.

Okay, no problem. Here you go. Two years later, he comes back up. Do this time, I'm asking for 10, but I'm changed. Right. I'm good, bro. Trust me. I'm going to change money.

I'm going to fix it. If you give it the third time time you're an idiot in my eyes We keep giving money to people with zero accountability and we just keep saying here He goes to the smart one money are you talking about it? 1.9 trillion dollars, but money for what programs any programs any programs that were given money to that There's no accountability for which being wasted. Any one of them include military, include any of the entitlement programs that we have. Include welfare, include food stamps, include any one of them.

We can pull it up and I'll tell you right now, any one of them. But what I don't understand is what do you mean by there's no accountability? Can I give an example? Please, because I think what you're trying to say is that you don't know where I'm going with this is an issue Well because so what you're saying is you know exactly what happens with the money when you give it to when you pay taxes

No, I just don't understand what you're talking about you really don't know what I'm talking about let me give you So I'm gonna just give one example and then we can open this up and you guys can have fun doing what you're doing What I think you are saying is fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. And I think what Patrick is alluding to is the fact that we are now at $30 trillion in debt. Okay. And the fact that we keep piling on this issue of like,

I get it, we all need military, we need the police, we need the firemen, we need all these social systems, we need a social safety now, we need welfare, we need Medicaid, we need welfare. We need Medicaid We need Medicare. I think what his point is is like at what point is enough enough now We want to pile more stuff into a storage unit that is already filled to the brim And we need to keep piling and piling and piling more and at one point is he's saying can we stop Funding the government this way because it's not it's not a good look for us because we're at 31, 32, 35 trillion.

And what he's saying, I think is like, we're going to have to make some cuts and make some adjustments. Okay. And you're saying, let's double down, let's, let's, let's keep adding some to this. I didn't say that. No, I'm just saying, I'm like, you want to add more systems, you said. I, I think you said, I want one or two more. No, but wait a minute.

You really didn't understand what I just said. Did he not understand it? Or did I not? Did you, I think you said I want one or two more. No, but wait a minute. You really didn't understand what I just said Did he not understand it? Or did I not I'm asking you did I want to get to just a very specific example of a specific program that you're Displeased with Body anything so you're against all government program. I didn't tell you all government Prove so which ones are you against if you if you if you give money into programs that you're coming out saying, Hey, we're going to spend $88 million for this. If you want me to pull it up and we can go through expenses and tell you which ones

works and which one doesn't, we can do that as well. That's what you want to do. But if you constantly come to me for more money, let me just put it through this way. Yeah. What does it mean when a company or an individual is in debt, $200,000? when a company or an individual is in debt, $200,000? When a company or an individual,

okay, let's just say I'm in the $200,000. Okay. And it was $100,000 five years ago. Okay. It was $50,000 10 years ago. It was $10,000 15 years ago. I come to you for another $50,000. Should you lend it to me?

Probably not, no. What are we doing? What are we doing? We're lending our taxpayers. It sounds like you're an ally. But we're lending our taxpayer money and we keep getting you to more and more and more and more and debt.

If the government was an individual or a corporation, I don't understand why investors keep giving this government more money when they have no cash. The critical answer is the government and countries are not like households or companies. That's the difference. It's just, it's not an analogy. That's not true. That's not true though.

So meaning it's okay for us to keep going into that. That's okay. That's not what I'm saying. So what is different about? I think it's important to have a balanced view that when it comes to, and what's crazy about this is I'm not advocating for getting more and more into debt, right? Trump did a great job of blowing up the deficit. The deficit, we still have a positive deficit.

It's slightly lower. No, this doesn't say Republican or Democrat. I'm telling you, I'm not supporting a theory. President's generally speaking increased debt. But first make the argument on how different it is to give the analogy of personal household that it's okay for the government to increase its debt, but not on the personal side. It's not a question of it's okay. It's not the same. And what I'm struggling with Patrick is that like everything I'm saying is just being relayed to me, usually interrupting me incorrectly. So now I'm having to clean

up what you think I said to then answer the original thing. My point is the follow. So you said those three are different things. They are different. They are different things. They are different things. With a household or a corporate budget or debt,

you at some point at the end of the day don't have any more recourse to carry the debt and you either have to declare bankruptcy or you have to all the things that you know. With a country, of course, if the economic growth becomes decoupled from the growth in the national debt, that is a problem we've seen it in many, many countries. But in the United States, and again, I'm not saying who cares about the debt or the deficit, but I think we have to appreciate that there's a difference.

If your economy keeps growing, if that national debt grows more or less in parallel with the growth of the economy, and it continues to be backed, you don't get to that day where there is the, you're now being evicted crisis that an individual has. That doesn't mean, I want to, let me say this one more time, I'm not saying the debt doesn't matter. There are people who say it literally doesn't matter. I'm not saying that. Here's the question.

Let me kind of try to give the point of, example I want to give to you. So what is a sign when an institution keeps increasing its debt? What sign is there? So if I keep getting fatter, is it because I'm a big bone person, or it's because I may have a bad diet

and not exercising, what do you think? I guess it, you need personally. I forgot, you personally, I guess I'd have to ask your doctor, I forgot. If you, you're a small bone guy, you don't seem like you were big when you were, have you ever been 200 pounds? No. Okay. So if you all have a sudden next time you come on the podcast,

you're 250 pounds. You should be concerned. You should be concerned. So can you accidentally become 250 pounds? Uh, accident, it would be a number of accidents in a row. Exactly. Which by the way, you probably enjoyed your dinner. You probably enjoyed your food, right? But if you came back 250 pounds as a friend or even somebody that's in the similar space that would create in content, right? Should I off camera say hey, bro? What's up? I would appreciate it if you do. Okay. I should do your father You got a kid. I'd like you to be around for your daughter. Thank you statistically. We're better society when we are right? Okay, so if you

Come to me and I'm smelling bad. I'm not shaving. I look like crying. I have nothing. And I'm getting worse week after week after week. Should you question and say, Pat, is it okay? I think so. I think it's a good idea.

These are fun examples. I'm trying to have fun with you. I'm trying to have fun with you. But no, it's not. If a country keeps increasing its debt, year after year after year after year after year. Should we not be concerned? We should be concerned about whether we're spending money in the right ways. We should be concerned about whether we're going to be in another one-point-intrallion hour. I'm not saying that. That's the thing. You know, I don't.

But you are saying that because you said the only difference when you went to your example of military and you wanted me to say yes. And you said, look, I'm not a socialist because I think this. And he said, the only difference is, I just want to or three more programs. And what I'm saying is, we can't afford it today. Okay, that's-

Maybe in 20 years. But do you, and I worry that I don't know if you think I'm talking in bad faith or if you maybe don't understand my political views, but I think differences that are actually much more subtle than you think they are are being blown up as if there's this crazy difference here about what's going on.

We're definitely using different rhetoric in this conversation, but I don't know whether we're actually understanding each other really that well, because I'm with you. If there are programs that are wasteful, how do we define wasteful, right? That's the difficulty. But if there are programs that are wasteful,

if there are programs that are not economically stimulative, if there are programs that are being used for fraudulent reasons or whatever the case, I'm gonna be right there with you saying we need to do something about this. The things I'm looking at, when they are done in other countries, the country doesn't become socialist.

You can still own your business. They don't socialize your business. They don't, they don't communize your business. None of those things happen. Many of these countries have really good business environments, but they're just saying, hey, we have enough riches here that this capitalist system has created, which I'm in favor of, where we can do a couple more things. And it's all in sleep. And all of a sudden, what I'm saying to you is, you don't want it.

No, it's not what I'm saying to you that I don't want it. Yeah, we can't afford it. If you can stop interrupting, I can tie them, show them, freaking, you know, it's not fun, is it? No, I'm good with it. It's part of having conversations with people. It isn't a family. But if I sit there and I say, David, we can't afford it right now. I would say, what do you mean? I would tell you it's called $31 trillion.

It's what it's called. We're in debt. A lot of debt. And you may not have to pay it back. Somebody has to pay it back. Your seven-year-old is going to have to pay it back. But that money is not going to print it back. Seven months old is going to have to pay it back. may not have to pay it back. Somebody has to pay it back. Your seven years going to have to pay it back, but that money's not going to print. Seven months, seven months old's going to have to pay it back. Someone's going to pay it back. Okay. That

31 trillion dollars, you're not just one to go and say, guys, let's just write this thing off. You guys okay, China? Hey, Japan, you cool. Just write this thing off and just forget about it. And let's start again. Yeah. How cool would that be? We can't do that. We have that debt. We can't afford it right now. One of the things about a lot of these issues is, first of all, they're way bigger than any conversation where we just like list the programs and say we cut. If you look historically, countries don't cut their way to economic prosperity. Countries tend to grow their way to economic prosperity. You with me so far?

Yes. Countries grow their way out of economic prosperity. No, that's the opposite of what I said. Countries grow their way into economic prosperity. They grow by building up too many times. So let's keep getting into debt. It's what you're saying. No, that's not what I'm saying.

So what are you saying? What I'm saying is over the long term, if the government spending is economically stimulative, it will help to grow the economy. It's fundamental demand side economic. So like as an example, there are certain government programs that are highly, are these cigars, by the way, I just noticed this over here. You can take it.

If countries spend money on, I don't know, you seem to be looking something up. I don't know if you're paying. I'm listening to you. I am listening to you. Go ahead. If countries spend money on economically stimulative programs, the high economic multiplier, they can create growth. If countries spend money in ways that are not economically stimulative, then it increases

the debt. So, for example, just to pick two different programs, I don't have any emotional attachment to these two programs, I'm just gonna list two programs. Food stamps, and what has happened in here, by the way, are those gummies? Yeah, taking vitamins. Man, this is, this is helping for you, right?

I know. I don't want to be a 400 pound guy. Food stamps have a high economic multiplier, okay? Tax cuts for the very rich have a low economic multiplier. I'm not passing any judgment in any way. I'm just telling you, there are ways that the government can spend money that is good for the economy and ways that is not so good. That's my only point.

What were the two programs you said you wanted to add on? I think we should have some kind of minimum level healthcare system for everybody. And it would actually be cheaper than what we have. What we have includes people that go to the emergency room as primary care, which is insanely expensive. Sometimes they don't pay their bills and that leads to everybody who does have health insurance

is just absorbing that cost. We would just be cheaper if we provided everybody some basic level of care. There are states that have done it. I think that's just a basic thing. And secondly, I would like to socialize some aspect of paid family leave, parental and maternal, not hugely expensive. It's economically stimulative, in the sense that when other countries have done it, they

find that productivity ends up being higher when parents return to work. It's been widely studied. These are just like two things. We're already paying for most of them either in terms of productivity losses or through the healthcare that we pay for to absorb people who don't pay and use the emergency room. It can be done revenue neutral. What percentage, like if it goes back to it, with what we have right now, the way it is today, what percentage of your dollar are you comfortable paying in taxes?

One percent. Really? Less than Abe Lincoln imposed. No, listen, I mean, I'm not going, this has nothing to do with what I'm telling you. You can pull up a different story. I'm not going to do this. Um, but what percent are you willing to pay today? I am not a high tax guy.

Okay. What's high tax? High tax, I mean, listen, I don't want to get too much into my personal finances, but like I don't like that. I'm not auditing you, bros. I don't like that. I don't like that close to half of my income is going to tax. You don't like that.

I think it's too high. I think it's too high. So what do you think is reasonable? Oh man does it include healthcare and college or not? I don't know. Yeah. I mean, even number though. You know, I say it doesn't. I think you know, you care no college. No healthcare, no, yeah. What we have today? I would love to be in the, you know, 31 total. Just so you know, we're on the same page there. Yeah. Okay. So for me, the difference is the following.

Yeah. One time, I'm doing a podcast. I don't know what I'm doing a podcast with. Anyways, this was like a year and a half ago. Sounds explosive. And then, no, it wasn't. Actually, you know, you know what I like about podcasts like this? Yeah.

It makes me go a research atopic. You know, so one time we did a podcast about taxes and you know how taxes at 1.90% you know, it was a 90% taxes and it was like for a long time. Ronald Reagan. Ronald Reagan wouldn't do it more. Holly was this is what they're doing. This is what it was like.

So you're talking about a 90% marginal on the very top incomes under I. Correct. And I make my point without you, freaking intellect with degrees to interruption, freaking high school graduate. See that's at home in them. Okay.

All right, so let me go back to this with these two Jews bullying me right now. So, so we're talking about taxes. Yeah. Okay. So let me go find out what's going on with taxes here and the history of it. Okay. So we send our research to him and I said, send me anything you had on taxes.

You can assume this was like a very exciting two weeks of my life, to just studying taxes. It was awesome, great experience. I can only imagine what it's like to want to be an accountant. It's got to be like a fascinating experience. High suicide, high suicide.

High suicide, yeah. So you know what happened? You know, the one data that came about on when taxes got started, the history of tax, you know the whole story, but you're it is all this. I'm not going through that part. But I wanted to find out, because a lot of people on the left say, you can't compare governments

to companies to families. You can, it just might not be useful. But meaning it's not the same thing, you can't do that financially, all this other stuff. So you see the Lincoln thing, that story know, story pops up where, you know, back in 1861, this guy goes up and says, hey, we kind of need some money. This war was so expensive for us. We're going to have to tax everybody 6%. But I promise you, when we paid off, we'll stop taxes. Do you know what happened? Well, after they paid it off, the taxes didn't end. No, it ended. Oh, they didn't. let me read it i don't know the center of the six no let's look so watch this year okay on

august fifth eighteen sixty one linkin imposed the first federal income tax by signing the revenue act strapped for cash strapped for cash which the government is kind of like they don't have cash they're in set yes so there they need cash just like a corporation or family we don't have cash so we need some debt yeah with which to pursue the civil war linkin and Congress agreed to impose a 3% tax on annual incomes over 800 bucks.

As early as 1861, Lincoln had began to take stock of the federal government's ability to wage war against the South. He sent letters to cabinet members, Edward Bates, Gideon Wells, and Salman Chase requesting their opinions as to whether or not the president had the constitutional authority to collect duties. According to documents housed and interpreted by Library of Congress, Lincoln was particularly concerned about maintaining federal authority over collecting revenue from ports along with along the South Eastern seaboard, which he worried might fall under the control of

Confederacy, the Revenue Act language, a-ra-ra-ra-ra-ra. Okay. According to the U.S. Treasury Department, the comparable minimum tax income in 2003, after adjustment for inflation would have been around $16,000, Congress repealed Lincoln's tax law in 1871, which means there was no more taxes. But it came back up obviously in 1909. So this is an example of a story where we need some money.

Let's go to the people. The people say, listen, here's some money, but I hope this stops. It's gonna stop. So the moment we allow the government to use this power too much, they've abused it. And for me, my only argument is, if I have to choose between giving you a million bucks,

that's gonna sound crazy, okay. I hope this doesn't get your head too big and you get too confident here. If I give you a million bucks, or if I give a million bucks to the government, I'm willing to bet you're probably gonna create, you know, a better climate with a million dollars than the government would.

And if I have the choice to give a million dollars or a billion dollars to creators, job creators, small business owners, on what they can do as a source of investment, versus giving that money to the government, government. If there was a FICA score, if there was a FICA score, I don't know what your FICA scores, but you know the range, 400.

Very high. Okay. Oh, extremely high. 400 to 820, give or take that's the number where it's at. If we had to give a FICA score to the US government, what do you think their FICA score would be today? Yeah, but he needs polls. Give me the polling on that. No, listen, I mean, what you're saying is super interesting. I, the, they know the point Is. government. Yeah. What do you think their fight a score would be today? Yeah, but he needs polls. Give me the polling on that.

No, listen, here, I mean, what you're saying is super interesting. I didn't know the point I'm making now. Yeah, I do. No, it took a point. And here's one of the things that I think we, I'm guessing we would probably agree on, which is when you think about the way

that we organize society, this isn't politics, this is just like sociology, philosophy, kind of like reality. Once you get a group of people bigger than about 150, 150 people, okay? If you want that to be run in some way that works, what we might define as works, you have to start introducing some level,

some level of centralization. That doesn't mean with 150 people, you have to start introducing some level, some level of centralization. That doesn't mean with 150 people, you need the tax system and everything that we have right now. But it's just kind of like a reality of organizing societies that a society's grow from 150 people and think about it, 330 million people now in the US, 8 billion people in the country. They're the idea that you have, which is, I'll just pick some people to give a million bucks to instead of the government. It's that it just doesn't work. That's it. That's it. That's somethings have to be said. I'm having fun with you, buddy, when I'm telling you that,

but the point I'm trying to make. But the idea is an interesting one. No, but but the point. It's not okay. No, it isn't interesting. The point I'm trying to make to you is that's how the US government was ran. Yeah. The country you and I are living in. Yes. It was ran that way. Guys, we don't have money. We go to the people. I promise you once we pay this off, we're gonna stop taxing you. And we accepted it. You know, no taxation.

So this, we accidentally find with this, we're game with this. And then now it's peer abuse. We don't have a choice now like we did back then. It was ran like a company. It was ran like a family having their finances in order to date, America's Ficus scores in the 400s. You know in the 400s, what you should be able to finance?

Nothing. I don't know. 60% down, 30% for cars. Oh, it's at 400, you know, it should be 100% down. But so what would you want? So you said you were with me on low 30s for tax.. Okay. Yeah. So really it sounds like the issue is more. I would I would want a flat tax and what I'm saying I would want a flat tax meaning I'd like to go somewhere between 10 to 15 to 33 and a time to go to 30. That's not flat is it? I get that. But what I'm saying is if a miracle

like right now we need to pay off that guess what yeah which attacks me thirty three okay but let's gradually pay some of the stuff off i would like for them to say we're gonna go off a budget of twenty five percent or twenty percent the thirteen percent every we're gonna pay off the debt kai but here's a problem yes you know i don't know what never never happen well there's a lot of reasons i mean i don't know i think i'll give you my reason why congressman people will never win. I'll give you like a show agenda. If we have no term limits, these guys are going to play

whatever games to you're for term limits. Are you two? Me too. Absolutely. You kidding me. Yeah. Guys, we just found some common ground with David Patron, Patrick, David, term limits on the agenda. My challenge isn't a, you know, my challenges were giving money to people that have proven to have no clue what to do with it and that keeps climbing. Now when it comes to like social safety net, right, can I tell you my view on this stuff and you tell me a few of you, right? I move to the US as an immigrant.

Okay. I had the benefit, if my parents had to pay for my initial schooling, like if they had to pay out of pocket for elementary school or whatever the case may be, that my mom wasn't working at the time, my dad was just starting a job where he didn't make a lot of money. They couldn't have afforded

if that public school said we're gonna charge you, right? So I immediately got the benefit of that. Follow along, right? I got the benefit of police protection and then avenge all these different things, contract, so when I started my show intellectual police protection and then avenge all these different things, contract. So when I started my show intellectual property. So the way I see it is, I've been extraordinarily fortunate to be able to build my business

and get to where I am thanks to a whole bunch of things that everybody paid for through taxes. So my view now is, I'm, let me finish up, I'm also, like I recognize, you know, I've got these great employees. Many of them had public school educations and they have certain protections when it comes to safety in the world. All the different things.

You should be able to do all that with no more than 30%. I'm not even getting to through that. But so I feel it's almost like a patriotic thing where if taxes are properly set and being spent on the right things, I think now my success, which only exists because of previous taxpayers through all those programs I mentioned,

it should go to help other people who don't have it. That's a wrong mindset, in my opinion. Okay. And let me tell you why things are wrong mindset because, okay, you have a had a job. Have I ever had a job? Yeah. Well, yeah. No, you don't have a job right now. You're a business owner. Have you had a job? Yeah. Well, yeah. No, you don't have a job right now.

You're a business owner. Have you had a job? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Worked for corporate. Okay. Were you there for five years? Like, did you work for a company for five years? Yeah, I mean, this is kind of funny,

but I worked for the now defunct retailer Circuit City for five years. Really? Yeah, selling extended service. They pay very well, but I don't know when you work. In the commission. They were paying very well in the commission. I got laid off when they went from commission to hourly

Yeah, the people who were making too many commissions. They didn't want to pay a salary. They laid us off check this out Okay, so let me see if what year was it you work in a circuit city? It ended in 2003 So it would be like the era by the way, can you tell everybody how much a good salesperson at circuit city was making? Well, if you remember because I had'm willing to say this, I worked part time because I was like starting college, 30 hours a week, and I was making 75,000. That's insane. Yeah. At circuit city, okay. They realized it was insane. But not paying these people. But that's bullshit, though. That's bullshit, though, because that's why they went out of business. Right. The model was working. You guys were doing your part. That

started came up. They're then best buys two guys were doing your part. That's why it came up. Do it there. Best buys two, seven bucks an hour. But you're about to validate my point. So check this out. There's a perfect example here. The perfect example is here. So for me, you know how you go to funeral

and everybody's mourning. And maybe you don't know the person, but you're gone because of somebody, you don't have a relate like it's in law or somebody like that. But just depend on everybody's face, you don't have a role like it's in law or somebody like that. Sure. But just to paint on everybody's face, you feel it, right? So for me, when I hear a company going out of business, breaks my heart, especially

company that's been on for a long time. Because to start a company is a very hard, very, very hard to start a company, to make it last five, past five years, super hard, 10, 20, 30 years, and then create hundreds of thousands of jobs. It's not easy to do. Somebody and a group of people have to sacrifice a lot, right? Okay. So what you're saying is the following.

Yeah. Hear me out. Okay. So the people who started Circuit City, those who started Circuit City, those who paved the way before you, and they came and they crushed it, and now there's new management. And now because the people before you paved the way, you should accept lower salary to give back to the people that paved the way before, but it's not the people before that paved the way.

It's the people today that are running circuit city. You're actually not given back to the people that paved the way. You're given it to the idiots that are running circuit city today. That's what's going on in America today, meaning, you and I, I love America. I lived in Iran 10 years. I lived in Germany two years. I was in a military, and I come from a family politically

on complete opposite sides, but I love this place. It's an amazing country. My responsibility on how I can contribute to society isn't through paying taxes, it's through creating jobs, it's through, you know, when I pay my taxes, I pay a lot of taxes this year, a lot of taxes this year.

Last year was a lot of taxes, I've been paying a lot of taxes period. So, but for me when I pay the taxes and I ask, where did that thing go to? Okay, what happened with that? What did they do with that? If there's doing such a great job with it, why does the debt keep going higher?

Why are we, you know, keep not seeing any kind of return? Things are still same thing, both of them are not asking to raise more money. Oh, it's only the left, you know, the Democrats that just want to go, no, that's not, it's both the decides who are part of the same camp, another 1.9 trillion, another 2 trillion, another 2.7 trillion.

I'm not for it. So all I'm saying to you is, the same way the circuit city folks ruined a great job you had making 75 grand, you're working 30 hours a week. Yep. They came to new management, decided to change the compensation structure

that was working. That's the perfect example of a circuit city one out of business, same thing that a lot of politicians are doing today. Yeah, it doesn't seem at all analogous to me, but I love talking about selling extended service plan so we can stay on circuit city if you want, but in all seriousness, it doesn't seem analogous to you.

It doesn't really seem analogous to you. Oh really, so let me ask you a question, why did circuit city go out of business? Well, let's see. I'm thinking back now, they went out of business because when they switched people from commission to hourly okay they got rid of the people that were doing really well because they didn't want to pay us the hourly of wow so they got rid of the entrepreneurs they got rid of that no so so it's not analogous at all they got rid of people that are self

motivated people got it so that So that is actually the perfect example because they changed the comp plan. They increased taxes for the people that were working. That's not at all analogous. They didn't increase taxes. They just laid me out. Did the $75,000 people make $75,000 again after they changed the comp? No, they did not. At a different job.

Not at a certain city. Not at a certain city. You laugh at me because you see the point. They left to a different place. But then you got a new job and started making laughing because you see the point. They left with different plays. But then you got a new job in the start of making more money. But the point is, this is why people leave the California. I was just going to say, is that exactly now, is the people get the hang out on New York and California?

That's called a high tax states to come to low tax states. So I mean, we can talk about high and low tax states. The effective tax rate, especially if you own cars and homes in a lot of places ends up being very close. Okay. Let's get off of circuit city. No, I don't want to get off of circuit city. Stay on this point because that is the point, though.

David, that's the point. But I'm trying to have a different conversation. I'm sure you are. I'm trying to stay on this. But not because it's a more advantageous conversation, because you're saying it's not an elegant. What I just want to know from you is, I get it with the company, the circuit city deserve to go out of business and it was allowed to go out of business. And that was grim with

you because they made a terrible business decision. I'm completely with you. What I'm asking you is on a human level in a country as rich as the United States, 330 million people, all these different things. I'm not saying no one should be rich, I'm not saying taxes should be 60, but I'm not saying anything, I'm just saying for the little comparatively that it would take just to make sure that there's no hungry kids,

for example, the little little thing, you don't have to go to the ER when you have a problem, you could, isn't that worth it to you? I salute this. We can go to that. Stay on this issue. Don't digress. Stay on this issue.

By the way, just out of curiosity, who's your guy? Like, when you were, who do you look up to? What, what comedian guy your style do you look up to? I just, I just wrote a name that because you're my me of him. You sure? You don't have heroes. You don't have comedians you like?

No, David, you got someone you like. I'm just not. This guy doesn't lend money to people. He doesn't lend people their cars and he doesn't have comedians you like no David you got someone you like I'm just this guy doesn't lend money to people He doesn't lend people their cars and he doesn't have a celebrity You don't have a celebrity you don't have a Politie you like you don't have anybody you watch like a Bill Mark guys like that that used to I like this guy Like I'm a big Bill Marga. I love Shepelle. No none of that. I mean I casually would watch Bill Mar but I mean are you a John Stuart guy or you a you know

I like it. I would watch John start a little bit. So let's go back to circuits. Okay, but I mean are you a John Stuart guy or you a you know I would watch John start a little bit. So let's go back to circuits. Okay, I digress. I want to know about your name. He was my technique for selling the service plan. Yeah. Do you want to know that? No. You're staying on service. I he's digressing. You listen, we can stay on circuit. But do you know why I'm staying on this topic? No. Okay. Let me let me this this is is, there's a metaphor here. I promise you. In the business world. Yeah. Okay, when a guy or a person leaves a company, yes, they leave for a reason in the sales industry.

Many times they leave because comp changed. Okay. So what happens with comp? This is what typically happens with comp to our sales people. A guy sits there, this is 2003, you said, that's what 20, so holy shit, you're seven, you're making 75 out of 18.

Yeah. Okay, so check this out. I got in this, you wanna really know a crazy story. I was, that's why I love Circuit City story. I was audited because it wasn't plausible that I was making that much. And so a guy showed up and investigated it with a recorder.

And they're like, so where exactly did you make this? It was a crazy thing. My mom sat with me. My mom me my mom sat I was like mom I don't know what's all like on the computer I know I know a lot about the circuit city folks yeah I recruit a lot of circuit city folks after that happened to the insurance industry I remember that but but this is why here's the part though because you guys were sick circuit city sales training was awesome same was ballet total fitness by the way I'm a Bali's guy. Okay. So, Circuit City is sitting there and they're saying, who the hell is this

Pacman guy? We're paying 75 grand year working 30 hours a week and he's 18. Right. He shouldn't get paid that. Correct. We should only pay him six bucks an hour. Yes. There's no way this guy's worth it. We're overpaying them. Some idiot at the top said what? We're overpaying them. Yeah. Okay. So they came up with this idea that let's fire these guys that have charm, charisma, sarcastic, witty, people like them.

They're selling awesome. Who cares if you make 75? They flipped it on them. Yep. That happened to me when I was at 21. I just got an military. So people at Bally's at one point were making 180, 200 grand year in the 80s, in the 90s sales people.

By the way, Circuit City was paying 180, 200 year to sales people. Circuit City was killing it, right? It was like one guy making that much. Well, one guy per place. In Connecticut. No, no, no, no, no, no. There was no one in our store making that much.

Well, maybe not your store, but there's a lot of guys that were making money at circuit. If you're 30 years old making 75, there were plenty of guys that were making money. I'm sorry, 18 years old, making 75. Yeah. A lot of people were making the circus city doing sales. So here's the point.

Please. Guy changes the comm. Yep. He lost you. Okay. You get fired. You go elsewhere, you do other things. Yep.

Did a lot of other people leave? Well, anybody making under 10 an hour in commissions was too bad of a salesperson. They got rid of them. Anybody making over 20 an hour? There were two people in our store. I was one of them. They got rid of us. So they only kept those 10 to 20. So they kept them over average people. They just kept average people. Socialism doesn't work. Socialism would have been keeping up. Oh, no, you want to flip it, don't you? No, no, no. You're true. But think about that. Socialism would have been you've got to keep the ones

already. No, actually it's not socialism. It's so common. It's so common. That's insane. So it's just crazy. This is a great conversation about things completely disconnected from

their 100% connected. But I love the conversation. They're 100% connected is what they are. 100% connected because it's like saying, if you tax people less, hey, wait a minute, Elon's making too much money. These billionaires are getting too rich. These millionaires are getting too rich.

This is not good. We need wall tax. We need this. We need that. No way we should be doing this. Hey, Elon's saying something in whatever was in California and the mayor responded back and he says, okay, note it. Boom.

I don't know if you remember this. Do you remember when the mayor or back and he says, okay, noted, boom, I don't know if you remember this. Now, do you remember when the mayor or the councilman respond to his co-hosts at the Convali? We should do away with him. He's like, all right, got it. We should do away with Testline, their diss and Ilana's diss. And God has tweets back and says, no, it moves to Austin. Great.

Guess what, Austin got Ilana. A lot of people Florida got a lot of great talent. Texas got a lot of talent. People leave when you change complaints. I'm sitting here giving you the example of where taxes are good, 33, we're on the same page. Okay. I'm willing to go 33.

You're saying 30, 31, which you're a little greedy. I gotta tell you, you're a greedy socialist. This is so, first of all, come on, yeah. Okay, but are you an Elon fanboy? Not as much as your Joe Biden boy fanboy No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no painting of Biden in the back? Oh, okay. All right. Go ahead. What is your thought? Because I was a relatively early Tesla investor and I still drive a Tesla. I think it's going to be my last one. I've sold the shares.

Where are you on Elon? Because a couple of people wrote to me. They're like, oh, Patrick's a fanboy on Elon or on Tesla either. Okay. So. Can I take a sip? Yeah. Is that an energy drink now? It is. Okay, so. Can I take a sip? Yeah, is that an energy drink now? It is.

An omelette, love by the way. So it's a long string. No, it's not. But by the way, while he's drinking this, why are you done with Tesla? Why is this the last test? The reason you are not Elon Musk fanboy. I know. I know emotional thought, whatever about Elon.

Okay. So here was my thought. Okay. When I got the Tesla shares in 2015, emotional thought, whatever about Elon. Okay, so here was my thought. Okay. When I got the Tesla shares in 2015, I thought electrics coming, early mover, range and charging network are the things that matter. This is gonna set them up.

They're gonna, it's gonna be crazy. So I bought the shares. Eventually I got one of the cars. I was like, this is fantastic. When you buy shares? When? When? 2015. February 2016, I think the shares. Eventually I got one of the cars. I was like, this is fantastic. When do you buy shares? When? 2015. February 2016, I think it was.

So I get the car. I'm like unbelievable range, fantastic. The charging network, all this stuff. The build quality kind of sucks. Everything's rattling. There's things that are held together. It seems to be by tape. But that's okay.

I get it. They haven't been building cars very long. It's gonna improve, it's gonna improve. Got the second Tesla, better build quality, still it's the same issue four times now, every time, it's literally something that has to be ratcheted, has to be taken apart. Now, the other companies that,

let's be honest, Audi builds better cars than Tesla, they've been doing it for a hundred years, they don't rattle, et cetera. They're losing the charging network advantage slowly, partially thanks to the inflation reduction act and the high speed transfer. We go, spokesperson for Biden, go ahead, keep going. And also the range, there's more and more cars now

that are matching the range. So I think the time that first mover advantage is diminishing drivers. So David, the time that first mover advantage is diminishing drastically if if somebody didn't know either one of us. Yeah. And they have to pull to say who's a Elon fan boy. Yeah. Who would be you? Why? Here's why you're against all of it. Can I can I can I answer? Well, why you such a bully let me answer man. One, I've never owned a Tesla. Okay. Two, I don't own Tesla stock. I've never bought Tesla stock.

Okay, because I thought it was always over price. Wow. Okay. But here's what I will tell you. Please. As a jockey, I'm a fan of the jockey. Him being the jockey. The business, I thought Tesla, too many people who were fanboys, who thought that it's just

because it's him, it's going to kill it. It's down 85% for the year. By the way, but the point is it's at the right number right now. It's around the number. It should be give or take. Maybe it's still not at the number it needs to be. But long, if it's a long investment, I think it's a good long investment. I think a lot of people got killed last year. By the way, a lot of people made money last year as well. Citadel, Ken Griffin made $16 billion last year. You don't make $16 billion during a flat economy or even slightly down.

You make it because you were shorting certain stocks. And some of the famous stocks to short last year, hence the company and the boy you love the most, you know, you're got Elon Musk, okay? Not my guy. Well, you listen to him. I'm on paper. What he's done. You're a fan boy. I'm out of the stock and I'm getting out of the car. So you're got Elon Musk, okay? Not my guy. Well, you listen to him. But on paper, you're a fan boy.

I'm out of the stock and I'm getting out of the car. So you're an ex-fan boy, is what you are. It's okay, it's nothing wrong with that. The product was had a specific advantage. You've never been a fan of the product. I've never been a fan of the product. I've never been one that has gone, but by the way, my best, one of my best friends,

every time, he named his son Elon, that's qualified best friends, he named this son-in-law. That's qualified. Okay, he owns Teslas, Stox, all of it, total fan of that stuff. I'm not that camp. What I do like is the following. Just so you know, when you leave this place, you best say thank you to Elon.

You owe him a thanks, a big thanks. Have you enjoyed the session we've had today together? Yeah. Is this a good day for you? Yeah, I mean, listen, I don't know that I think we talked past each other a lot and things that are not actually disagreements were zoomed in on and I think we would actually get along on 80% of stuff if the conversation was not for television potentially. Did you watch cows show when Colin and I were together or no? I watched some of it. Okay, you know how much fun I have with Kyle? No.

The same way I had a lot of fun with you. I have no idea how much fun. By the way, if you told me you are willing to come back next month, you're on next month. I enjoy this also. You don't want to think you need to know with me. I don't look at comments anymore. The comments on this from your audience are going to be brutal. I'm going to need a new therapist. I'm going to need a new therapist.

I'm going to need a new therapist. I actually think, I actually think they like you a lot as well. Trust me. And here's why they're with our audience. The reason we're with our audience is because we like people like that to come. We don't want, like, by the way, you know who's going to be on Thursday? You ready for this one? I don't know.

Like the complete opposite of you. I mean, guess it's going to be Ben Shapiro. Is it? Worse, James O'Keefe is gonna be on Thursday from Verita, Roger Verita. Oh my God. Yeah, so he's gonna be on. But if you, I'm sure you guys would like to have lunch

together, have a good time together. I'll still be here. I'll swing by. But here's a point. Here's a baby. He said something. The point I want to make to you is on the topic of differences and all. You said he was gonna to have to thank Elon for something.

Yeah, because without Elon, you and I wouldn't have tweeted each other. He's running Twitter right now. We talked about it. We tweeted each other last year. I know we did. But you know, again, from the... What does that have to do with Elon? It's a connection we have through Twitter that he's running now.

He's still a friend a year ago. It had nothing to do with it. It doesn't matter, man. I'm giving this guy credit because you and I... It's been for... He's running now. There's a year ago it had nothing to do with it. It doesn't matter, man. I'm giving this guy credit because you and I, it's been going to find the reason to thank Elon for something. I'm looking. Listen, I have a thing to apologize.

I'd like to find reasons to be thankful for people. Rob, do a poll right now. Who is a bigger Elon Musk and boy? There is no way or bad, but, but, but, but if you want to say like in an area that I believe in, what he's going to do as a jockey, yeah, I believe in him as a jockey. So if I'm going to, if I'm going to long anything, I'm going to long what he's going to be doing investment.

By the way, I really appreciate the metaphor that you're using right now of the horse versus the jockey. The horse in this instance is the property of test. I'm a believer that he's right. The horse. I agree with that's an action. Guys, we are finding common ground here in P.B.D.

P.B.D. P.B.D. P.B.D. P.B.D. P.B. The circuit city did have a little analysis. I think only at the four-ocial

soupy-kissile level. I think if we don't do deeper it's it's it's all come on bro. That's like there was you there was you you dropped like it's as if I wanted to say it, but you said it. They got rid of the top guys and the bottom guys to make the middle guys happy. That's socialism. It's not it's so they do. He's so on your face. Does something for the bottom. Out of the later saying he's not a socialist. Folks. He's defending socialism. Okay, but so the reality

is circuit city did shut down. You know what would be a cool shirt? Here would be a cool shirt. Here's what would be a cool shirt. Oh, wait for it. Can you pull up this book called First Rate Madness? Pull up the book to cover. I have an idea.

I have an idea for our friend here. I've got a book that I'm working on, so maybe I could take this and this will be the cover. Let's see. I don't know if you want to use this cover, but it's a so pull up that you see that cover right there first rate madness Yeah, part of it is Kennedy, okay, yeah part of it is

Lincoln in the other one is I don't know who the bottom left one is could be Jackson because they talk about him a lot It's not Sinatra. Oh Are you being sarcastic? No, I'm kidding. Yeah, okay No, I think we should get a picture like that mate and I'll tweet it out today just because I like you I think it should be half the face should be Biden. The other quarter should be Bernie and the last quarter should be Elon Musk as a fanboy for him. And I'm going to say David, this art was create.

Can you tell our graphic design? I'm sure he's going to talk shit all day today. We're going to have a good time. That's a gift for me to you. I don't know what we're talking about, but it sounds interesting. Yeah. What was the name you wrote down describing David? He's John Stuart.

It's guys talented. I like it. I like it. You're very talented. You never heard of David before. Well, people say you enjoy, when we're talking about Jews who are 5'8". You are the good, no.

I'm actually not going there at all. I'm going purely talent. Okay. You're the the witty the the poking the sarcasm You have it you have that talent. It's you can't teach that you either have it. You don't have it. You have it I appreciate you you really are very pull up a picture of John's to know you did there is sort of an uncanny Joe's love it. Yeah more All right, let's I mean come on Young John steward here is that a new picture? Oh, that's new. That's a much. Can I get a young John's

Through a young John's why would they put that picture on his Wikipedia? He's got to have better When he was young he was way harder Oh, look at that. I'm sorry. There you go. You're a blondeer version. He has a little bit better hair I think but you're good hair too. Okay, last we got eight minutes here. Wait, but so you're not that He could be a Jewish last night a Syrian a Syrian. Oh, so a Syrian and like that That betta is house bet David got it. Ben is son of yes And I speak I speak air make as well. Really? Yeah, no, you're way more of a young John Stuart. Sounds hard to believe.

Joseph Gordon. Hard to believe. So for example, when I watch Passion the Christ, I actually cannot understand what they're saying to you. Literally. I didn't watch it. And even if I watched it, I assure you I would not have understood it. Yeah.

Okay, so last thoughts here. Before we wrap up, we got seven minutes. You pick your topic. What do you want to do? If you don't have a topic for you, but you're in show. So the Santis, what's gonna happen here? What are your thoughts with? Do you think it's gonna be ugly?

Where are you from the School of Thought and there's gonna be a Civil War? It's already starting. You heard what Trump said yesterday, loyalty, I'm about loyalty, so okay, give us your thoughts. I do think so. I think Trump is furious. There have been reports for six, seven months

that the Santis should have said, I would consider it if Trump doesn't run. think so. I think Trump is furious. There have been reports for six, seven months that DeSantis should have said, I would consider it if Trump doesn't run. And DeSantis did has not said that. And you're supposed to say that. That's the loyalty test. I do. So selfishly in two ways, I hope it's an absolute disaster. One, I think it'll make it less likely either of them win if they have a year during which they're just going crazy at each other. And number two, I think it would be hilarious because honestly, either one could end up on top.

I know that there's this idea among some of my colleagues that DeSantis is similar to Trump, but smarter, better spoken, less gaff prone, all these things. Trump is really good with the nicknames and the making fun of people and stuff. If DeSantis declares, and they're actually running a national campaign, not Florida, but a national campaign, I would not understate the possibility of Trump really doing to DeSantis, what he did to Little Marco, you know, calling Ted Cruz's wife ugly, this sort of stuff. It could get ugly, and's not clear to Santis we'll get the best of it. Yeah, I don't know if I disagree.

It's a, okay, so here's a question for you. You're on the inside strategy team for Trump. You're on the inside strategy team for the Santis. What do you tell them? I know you're gonna say Trump's not gonna do anything. You say anyway, what are you saying? What would you say is a strategy for, if you're like, hey, to win, we got to do XYZ. What would you say? I think I have, I am terrible on political strategy, but one of the, if I, if I had been

advising Trump, I would have said, don't announce in November five days after a midterm election. I would, I would not have done that. If I'm DeSantis's team, I would say, listen, you're not even running. And in some polls, you're defeating Trump. I would wait, continue to allow Trump to be furious, continue to allow Trump to, he had his low energy rally in South Carolina. Nobody went, he was sweating and it was bright orange. It was just horrible. Keep letting Trump do this stuff where he just looks silly. And then when you finally do announce, really think about it and do it in a way where you actually launch a formidable campaign. Instead of jumping in now and getting involved in this stuff, I wouldn't do it. Very interesting feedback. Okay. Question. Do you have a book

you're promoting? Is there anything you're promoting? It's it's being written still. So I don't have it to promote. So what would you like us to drive to? You YouTube channel or Twitter? I would love it if people Twitter, oh God, no, I would love it if people went to my YouTube channel and subscribe. That would be unbelievable. Can we put the link in? No.

Put the link in chat, description, all of it. And David, you have to know I can't wait to have you the next time around. I can't wait to be back. I can't wait to be back. I can't wait to be back. I can't wait to be back. I can't wait to be back. I think the the next one's gonna be better than this one because now we kind of have an idea. Now we know each other and I can come prepared,

we can talk energy drinks, cigars and supplements. Yeah. I, so yesterday we're like, so what are we gonna talk about tomorrow? So listen, this guy's an expert on private equity. We're gonna talk venture capital. Yep. And we're talking GBT is what we're gonna talk about with him.

So what do you talk about? I'm a disguise nut tag guy. I said anyway. All of the other David Pakman. No, I'm talking about you. We're joking about it yesterday. Cause there isn't a package. Is there another David Pakman? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know, I don't know. All of the other David Pakman. No, I'm talking about you. We're joking about it yesterday. Because there isn't. Is there another David Pakman?

Yeah, I know. I know there is. I know there is. Well, we must take him down. Did you think he was telling you? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no I should have accepted a call on stage and say, let me tell you about your fan boy Elon Musk just called about you. I told Pat, I don't know if you're joking right now, but we're gonna spend two hours talking about politics,

Trump, socialism, Bernie, Biden. Yeah. And I was proven correct. Yes, you were. By the way, try not to circuit city for making it the man you are today. Thank you. No, in all seriousness, I talk with my circuit city colleagues.

It threw me at age 16 when I started 15 into a situation where people would come in all sorts of different types of people. I immediately have to build rapport. I immediately have to figure out how to build a relationship, get them to trust me, et cetera. How to talk, think on my feet. It was invaluable, even in what I'm doing today. It was just an unbelievable thing. And it ended sadly with, as we know, they fired the top people.

Well, gang, if you enjoyed today's podcast and you want us to bring our buddy here back, give it a thumbs up and subscribe to the channel. And shared this, I think the audience wins today. Then when there's banter, there's disagreements, there's arguments, you know, you sit there like, I like what he said. I agree with him. Pat got the strong. He got the strong.

Whatever. You win. You got the argument. We just had a conversation together. We're all winners. Have a great day, everybody. We'll do this again on Thursday. You're all winners like he said.

All winners. Whether you're at the bottom, the top or the middle. Yeah. You're all winners. Take care. Bye-bye, everybody. You have rules. Get to trophy.

Exactly. You're all winners. Take care. Bye-bye, everyone.