PBD Podcast - "PornHub Is A Crime Scene!" - Laila Mickelwait EXPOSES PornHub Execs Shocking Child Abuse COVER UP!

Episode Date: November 29, 2024

Laila Mickelwait joins Patrick Bet-David to reveal SHOCKING details about PornHub’s alleged illegal practices and their new owners, Ethical Capital Partners. From underage trafficking to hidden email exchanges and lawsuits involving high-profile companies like Mastercard and Visa, this interview dives deep into the controversies surrounding the world's largest porn platform. Discover the secrets they don’t want you to know. 📕 PURCHASE LAILA’S BOOK “TAKEDOWN”: https://bit.ly/3ZuJb5r ------ 🦁 50% OFF BLACK FRIDAY VT SPECIAL: ⁠https://bit.ly/3COGKSb⁠ 🧢 PURCHASE THE LIMITED EDITION VT BLACK OUT HAT: ⁠⁠https://bit.ly/48lYfEY⁠⁠ 🎄 VT CHRISTMAS COLLECTION: ⁠⁠https://bit.ly/4hDCt3S⁠⁠ 📕 PBD'S BOOK "THE ACADEMY": ⁠⁠https://bit.ly/3XC5ftN⁠⁠ 📰 VTNEWS.AI: ⁠⁠⁠https://bit.ly/3Zn2Moj⁠⁠ 🎙️ FOLLOW THE PODCAST ON SPOTIFY: ⁠⁠https://bit.ly/3ze3RUM⁠⁠ 🎙️ FOLLOW THE PODCAST ON ITUNES: ⁠⁠https://bit.ly/47iOGGx⁠⁠ 🎙️ FOLLOW THE PODCAST ON ALL PLATFORMS: ⁠⁠https://bit.ly/4e0FgCe⁠⁠ 📱 CONNECT ON MINNECT: ⁠⁠https://bit.ly/3MGK5EE⁠⁠ 👔 BET-DAVID CONSULTING: ⁠⁠https://bit.ly/4d5nYlU⁠⁠ 🎓 VALUETAINMENT UNIVERSITY: ⁠⁠https://bit.ly/3XC8L7k⁠⁠ 📺 JOIN THE CHANNEL: ⁠⁠⁠https://bit.ly/3XjSSRK⁠⁠ 💬 TEXT US: Text “PODCAST” to 310-340-1132 to get the latest updates in real-time! SUBSCRIBE TO: ⁠⁠‪@VALUETAINMENT‬⁠⁠ ⁠⁠‪@vtsoscast‬⁠⁠ ⁠⁠‪@ValuetainmentComedy‬⁠⁠ ⁠⁠‪@bizdocpodcast‬⁠⁠ ⁠⁠‪@theunusualsuspectspodcast‬⁠⁠ ABOUT US: Patrick Bet-David is the founder and CEO of Valuetainment Media. He is the author of the #1 Wall Street Journal Bestseller “Your Next Five Moves” (Simon & Schuster) and a father of 2 boys and 2 girls. He currently resides in Ft. Lauderdale, Florida. --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/pbdpodcast/support

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A little over a month ago, I sat down with the new owner of Pornhub, Solomon Friedman, and Ethical Capital Partners, and we had a conversation together. After the conversation, I asked a lot of questions, tough questions. Some of them were answered, some of them were not. It got to a lady named Layla Mikkelweight, who is the one that started Trafficking Hub petition and got 2.33 million signatures to shut down Pornhub. She reached out and says, Pat, a lot of things were said, a lot of things were missed, I want to come to your podcast

and talk about it. Eventually we were able to make it work, we had the conversation today. She comes with a folder this big showing the lawsuits they're going through and email exchange of CEOs and executives of what's being said of taking down videos of underage porn that was under while MasterCard or Visa's asking them, why is this video still on your website? She's sharing that exchange, very weird. She's talking about Bill Ackman, a guy that's worth

almost $10 billion, getting involved and making a phone call to CEO of MasterCard or CEO of MasterCard or Visa, who was a MasterCard or Visa who was a former colleague that they played tennis together saying, hey, did you know about this? And then all of a sudden those guys took action. The amount of things that she shared with me and said, Pat, Solomon lied to you. This is her words. He lied to you when he said XYZ.

I want you to see this for yourself. If you know me as a family guy, I got four kids, not a fan of this stuff that's out there, especially underage stuff and anything having to do with human trafficking. Many times when we think about child trafficking, we forget the fact that there's human trafficking above 18 years old or revenge porn. A lot of that stuff that's going on right now as well. Layla broken down in ways that I had no idea. This is what she does 24-7 following these stories, even to the point that the previous owner of Pornhub that ended up having tax issues reached out to her to tell her issues that's really going on on Pornhub.

Again, I want you to watch this for yourself and be the judge of whether this website should stay up or it should take it should be taken down because that's what they're trying to do there and I think you're gonna see some insight if you enjoyed the previous one that we did I think you're gonna love this one here today again with Layla McElwade. She was from Broward County Florida she was missing for an entire year and she was finally found when her distraught mother was tipped off by a Pornhub user that he recognized her daughter on the site. She was found in 58 videos on Pornhub. So this is us

emails from the CEO. Can we tell Mastercard that it just slipped through the cracks? They want to know what we do. They're communicating amongst each other as employees. They're saying what should we do? She couldn't be older than 13 and 14 and the video was obvious. And they left it up. Under new ownership or old ownership? This is the old ownership, but old ownership is the same VPs and executives that are there today, right?

But there's not enforcement. And why are they not being held accountable? There's not enforcement. I don't get that though. Who wouldn't enforce that law? It's kids. I want to address something that Solomon and his partner said on this show. I mean, you could play what he actually said. It's a complete lie.

They exploit and they harvest the data of every single user that visits their site. They're currently being sued in a class action. And I think we will see full criminal prosecution of the owners of Pornhub. And I hope that we do. Okay, so folks, a month ago or so, I interviewed the new owners of Pornhub, okay? Solomon Friedman, and he brought one of his associates, and we had a very good conversation together. It was to find out what's really going on because the level of criticism that Pornhub's gotten over the years and then while I'm doing that one of the things we talked about was the petition the fact that Trafficking Cup

petition has roughly, Rob if you can show this, 2.33 million signatures worldwide and I said that's very interesting after the interview was done with the new owner I Get a message from a Layla that says Patrick. I'm the one that Posted that traffic in her petition getting all the signatures and she wrote a book called takedown which will put the link below Then I started looking into what she's done the interview She's done and I have again more questions about Porn Up. I thought it was the right thing to do to bring her here to give us a different perspective, not from the owner's perspective, but from the other side saying we need to do something about

Porn Up. So with that being said, it's great to have you on. Thank you so much for having me. Of course. So tell me, when you watched it, like what was it when you said, I'm going to reach out to Pat, I want to have a conversation. What part of the interview prompted you to wanna do that? From the beginning. I mean, from the beginning, it was clear that you were going to ask really good questions,

and I wanna give you credit for what you did. As an outsider, looking at the situation and being able to go deep into the important questions, but what I realized is that you weren't getting the answers, that there was deflection, that there was lies. And I said, look, we have to set the record straight because there's nothing more important than the truth. The truth is what is really going to set people free.

It's what's going to bring change in this situation. It's what's going to bring justice. And I said, look, we need to actually tell the truth. And so that's why I reached out. Fantastic. Now for the audience to know the outcome of Traffick and Hub. So I went and read what the outcome is. Rob, if you can go up a little bit so we can read that.

Traffick and Hub is a decentralized global movement of individual survivors, organizations, and advocates from across a broad spectrum of political faith and non-faith, economic and ideological background, all uniting together for the single purpose of shutting down Pornhub. So it's not getting them to use better technology like Yodi, it's not getting them to use better methods of filtering things out, it's actually to shut down Pornhub and holding its executives accountable for enabling, distributing, and profiting from rape, child abuse, sex trafficking, and criminal image-based sexual abuse. So your outcome with Pornhub is to shut the website down.

Tell me why. It's not to shut down the entire porn industry. It's to shut down a corporate trafficker Pornhub because, like you just said, they have globally distributed and profited from the trauma of countless victims since 2007. And what justice looks like in this situation is not a slap on the wrist. A slap on the wrist does not deter future abusers. A slap on the wrist does not bring healing and closure to victims. So from day one, when we realized that Pornhub was not a porn site, it was a crime scene,

infested with videos of real sexual crime, and the crime that gets distributed, you know, it's one thing for a victim to be raped. But when that's filmed and then uploaded and then distributed for profit and pleasure to millions of users per day, they call it the immortalization of their trauma, where they'll never be able to get over that because it's gonna get just like the sadistic game of whack-a-mole. They just have to keep finding and begging

and trying to take it down again and again. And victims of this kind of abuse, you know, we call it image-based sexual abuse all the way from child rape to adult rape and trafficking and what we used to call revenge porn. You know, they have a 50% ideation rate for suicide. So this is really a life and death issue. And so we felt from the beginning

that the call to action here was to shut down Pornhub because we felt like that was, severe harm demands severe consequence. So, you know, you say that and you know, you obviously, I pushed them very hard when they were here. And for me, it was like, what somebody want to be a porn star there's certain things to it even to the point that you know I'm sitting here watching a documentary called after porn ends the story of porn stars what their life is

like after they're out of the porn industry and how do you go back to a normal life from that space but there's a few things Rob can you pull up the story of New York Times the the 2020 article, right? I think it is. The Children of Pornhub. Exactly. So this is the article that is disturbing to read, but I want to read it to you because I think it's stuff that we need to…

I've got four kids and I openly talk to my kids about this kind of stuff to prepare for them because they're 12, 10, specifically to the 12 and 11 year old, but the 8 and 3 soon I'll be talking to them as well. I want to read this to you. So if you can zoom in Rob and we can read through this article together. So this is an article that they wrote, exact date Rob if you can go a little bit higher, December 4, 2020.

Okay, so Pornhub prides itself on being the cheery w winking face of naughty, the website billboard, a time score and provides snow plows to Boston. Okay, great. Next, the supposedly wholesome Pornhub attracts 3.5 billion visits a month, more than Netflix, Yahoo or Amazon. This is when Yahoo was relevant that you would even mention it. Pornhub rakes in money from almost 3 billion ad impressions a day, one ranking list Pornhub as the 10th most visited website in the world.

And then as you go lower, you'll see this. Yet another side of the company, its site is infested with rape videos. It monetizes child rape, revenge pornography, spy cam videos of women showering, racist and misogynist content, footage of a woman being asphyxiated in plastic bags, a search for girls under 18, no space, or 14YO, no space, leads in each case to more than 100,000 videos. Most aren't of children assaulted, but too many are. After a 15-year-old girl went missing in Florida, her mother found her on Pornhub and 58 sex

videos. Sexual assaults on a 14-year-old California girl missing in Florida, her mother found her on Pornhub in 58 sex videos. Sexual assaults on a 14-year-old California girl were posted on Pornhub and were reported to authorities. I can go on and on and on reading this entire article. It's very disturbing. When this came out, there's a story that came out on how Pornhub reacted to this, which if I'm not mistaken, they took down 10 million videos. They took down now today.

So if we, I want to update those stats for you because by the end of 2020, so trafficking hubs started in February of 2020. By the end of 2020, they had capitalized on coronavirus. So they had done some crazy PR stunts, which they're really good at doing, offering free premium to the entire world, their views and their traffic skyrocketed. So by the end of 2020, they were actually, according to the CEO,

the fifth most trafficked website in the world, they had 170 million visits a day, 62 billion visits per year, and they had enough content being uploaded that it would take 169 years to watch if you put those videos back to back. Now they had 56 million pieces of content on PornHub at the end of 2020.

Today, the story that's told here in this book, today they have been forced to take down 91% of the entire site. They went from 56 million pieces of content in 2020 to 5.2 million pieces of content in 2020 to 5.2 million pieces of content today in what Financial Times has called probably the biggest takedown of content in internet history.

That's insane. So now it's 90% because the article I read- It's 91%. 91%. At the time it was 80% the one that I read. Correct. That they take down. So let's go with that.

Let's continue with that. So $56 million to $5.2 million. So their argument may be Solomon Friedman, they bought it in March of 2023. So when I'm asking them when you bought the company, there was a part when I said, okay, you bought the company. Of the things that you said the company has changed, oh, we no longer do that, oh, we no longer do this, oh, we no longer do that, great. How many of the old executives and management team

that was there when this was happening are no longer there that you came in, you clean house, you fired them, and they're still there? What do you know about the old executive team versus the new one? I thought that was a brilliant question because when they purchased a hastily concocted pop-up private equity firm that called themselves Ethical Capital Partners, purchased a distressed

asset in March of 2023. That was Pornhub and all of its parent, you know, sister sites. Sorry. I want to first of all tell you that Pornhub is owned by a parent company that used to be called MindGeek. They recently renamed it to ILO because they're trying to distance themselves from their toxic reputation as peddlers of crime. Back in the days, it was MindGeek's pre-prior to ethical partners.

Yes. Then they renamed it. But this is a history. This is the trajectory of Pornhub from the beginning. So they started out as Mancef. When their owners got in trouble, they, uh, you know, it was six, it was over $6 million. Mancef, Manwin, Meinge.

Yes. Then they got in trouble with the law. Then they had to sell it. They sold it to a German entrepreneur named Fabian Tillman, who actually is, you know, one of the people that came forward to help hold PornHub accountable. Um, the former owner of PornHub, Fabian Tillman, he's called the Zuckerberg of Pornhub accountable. Former owner of Pornhub came to... The former owner of Pornhub, Fabian Tillman, he's called the Zuckerberg of porn. So he purchased Pornhub,

a distressed, sorry, a Mansef. And then he purchased it and his vision was to dominate the global porn industry. So what he did, he got a $362 million loan from Colbeck Capital and he rolled up the

entire porn industry under one company that he called Manwin. Manwin dominated the global porn industry. Fabian Thielman? Fabian, exactly. Please continue, I'll follow. Manwin. Yeah, so Manwin, then he got in trouble, he got arrested for tax evasion. And then he had to sell the company again.

So you see a pattern here. So he sold it to CEO and COO for Ascentoon and David Tisolo and a man who was the secret majority shareholder that purchased 61% of the site. He was unknown to anybody. He kept his identity hidden for years. We finally exposed him and found him in the midst of the trafficking movement to hold them accountable. His name was Bernd Bergmeyer. And so then he sold it to them and then it became MindGeek. And then years later, they're in legal trouble. They've been charged by the federal government for knowingly and intentionally benefiting from sex trafficking. They lost Visa, MasterCard, Discover, PayPal, all cut ties with the site because they confirmed it was infested with videos

of real sexual crime. They lost all mainstream advertisers and partners. Even KY Jelly and Weed Maps will not advertise on PornHub anymore. They were kicked off. K.Y. Jelly will not advertise on PornHub. No, they will not because of what happened. Very disappointing. Because of the exposure that happened. Okay, and then they got sold again to Ethical Capital Partners, who has now renamed MindGeek ALO.

So you can see a pattern. This is kind of what has happened over the years with Pornhub as they get in trouble, they try to rebrand, they get in trouble, they try to rebrand, and now this is the latest iteration of Pornhub. But when you say that, what is the pattern? The pattern is who the buyers are or the pattern is do new people come in and they're turned on by how much traffic these guys are getting and they try to clean it up and nobody can. What is the pattern?

It's not that they can't, they don't want to because of the business model. But I do want to go back to your question because the question was whose heads rolled? Who actually got fired from the company? Who left the company. And it was the CEO and the COO who are the minority shareholders, David Tisillo and Firas Antoun, again, two men that had hidden themselves from the public for so many years until they were finally exposed and had to face the public in a parliamentary inquiry in 2021. But they were forced to leave the company.

And they're the only ones. Why were they? Just because when a new company- Well, because of everything, it was a disaster for them. What is the background with Ferris, Anton and David Tissela? So he was there from the beginning. They were both there from the beginning when it was Mansef.

So they were originals, right? From the inception when PornHub was purchased for $2,000 in 2007 by a man named Matt Keizer, who was part of this original Mancef group. And so they were there from the beginning and they've stayed with the company. They were forced to resign just because there was a tsunami of bad headlines, one after another. It wasn't just the New York Times. Thousands of media articles have been written

exposing them. And then it was after the New Yorker did an 8,000 word expose on them that it was the final straw and they had to depart the company. And then that's when ethical capital came in. But let's ask a question. I mean, you're a businessman, right? So if you're coming in and you're saying, okay,

we're gonna call ourselves ethical capital, we're going to try to rebrand Pornhub and kind of try to kind of resuscitate the brand, what would be the first thing that you would do to be able to legitimately say that you are actually a new company, fresh start? Wouldn't you get rid of all of the people who were complicit in these crimes against children? Number one, that's the first thing you do. Clean house, right? Of course, yeah. Okay. Elon Musk bought Twitter, let's just kind of use a case study. He bought Twitter at a time where Twitter was censoring,

silencing, and you know doing all the things that America, even election was affected by some of the roles that Twitter played, and then we found out later on that the communication they were having with the White House, Elon buys it, they have 7,500 employees, the next day he fires 50%, they're down to 3,750, the next week, 1250 quid, so in a week or two, he went from 7,500 employees to 2,250 employees.

So first thing you gotta do, so I asked the question, who was there? So what percentage of the old employees and executives 7,500 employees to 2,250 employees. So first thing you gotta do. So I asked the question, who was there? So what percentage of the old employees and executives and directors and VPs that were there prior to ethical partners buying them to now? Most of them are still, the only ones I'm aware of that are gone are Ross and Tune CEO, the COO,

David Tisolo, and then Frank Mancina, who was the CFO. Did you ever try to talk to those guys or no? I mean, if you read this, they attacked hard. They were not interested in Congress. They did not want to solve the problem. Tell us about it. They wanted to attack those who were raising the problem, not only me, but victims. In what way?

Well, really quick, I just want to finish that point about the executives, because I think it's really important to know that today, the same men, I I mean the CPO, Kareem El-Morazi, so he was there from the beginning. He was there, he was promoted by Feroz himself to his position. Matt Calici, where we have emails here that were uncovered in legal discovery talking about the way that Matt was discouraging taking down illegal content from the site when they were discovering it. Can you read one of them? Or is that something that can be read?

100%. I mean, it might take time for me to open these up and get those conversations. I wouldn't mind reading one that says, leave the ones under age under. If you have any of it, I'd like to read it. So here we go. This is what I wanna show you.

So this is us emails from the CEO. Okay, so this was uncovered in legal discovery. So let's go here. Okay, here's one. So this is an email exchange between the VPs who are still there. Is this public record? This is public record.

Okay, fantastic. So we can show it. So the crew will come afterwards and get the B-roll and show it to the audience as well. Yes, so here's this one example. So Serena, the girl that you showed in the New York Times piece. Let me talk about her. So Serena, she was 13 years old when she was sexually abused by, you know, being convinced

by an older... Her? This is Serena Flautus. Okay. She's from Bakersfield, California. So as an innocent young teen, she had a crush on a boy older than her. She was a straight A student. She had never kissed a boy before.

And he convinced her to send him some nude images and videos of herself. And she wanted to impress him, so she did. Those videos were shared with classmates. And soon they were uploaded to Pornhub where they were getting millions and millions of views. She would beg for those videos to come down and either she would be ignored or when they would respond they would say, prove that you're underage, prove that you're a victim in this video.

And if she did get it down, it would just get re-uploaded because one of the things that they did was they placed a download button on every single video on Pornhub. So and this is not a download button like on YouTube where you kind of can watch it later but you don't possess it. It's a download button where actually you can own on your device. 170 million visitors per day had an opportunity to download and possess her trauma and then re-upload it again and again and again and again. And this sent her on a spiral of despair. She ended up dropping out of school because of being bullied. She got addicted to drugs to try to numb the pain.

She tried to kill herself multiple times. It's just amazing that she's even alive today. And then she wound up homeless, living out of a car. Okay, that's Serena. Thankfully today, she's actually suing the literal hell out of Pornhub. She's suing the owners by name. She's suing the company. She is suing Visa for monetizing her abuse on the site. And she's suing the hedge funds that funded this whole operation. We could talk about that later. But Serena, so this is Serena's abuse video.

I came across her abuse in 2020 on PornHub. It was clear it was abuse. This was one of several videos. The comments indicated that it was abuse. She clearly looked like she was 13. She couldn't be older than 13 or 14, and the video was obvious. At the time, I was in touch with MasterCard's VPs

because I was trying hard to get them to demonetize PornHub because I knew that's the Achilles heel of PornHub with credit card companies. I sent the VP her link to her video. Your teen requested a ride, but this time, not from you. It's through their Uber Teen account. her link to her video. Oh, interrupting their playlist to talk about Defying Gravity, are we? That's right, Newton. With a Bronco and Bronco Sport, Gravity has met its match. Huh, maybe that apple hit me a little harder than I thought.

Yeah, you should get that checked out. With standard 4x4 capability, Broncos keep going up and up. Now get up to $6,000 in rebates on eligible 2024 Bronco family models. Visit your Toronto area Ford store or ford.ca. To Visa. To MasterCard. To MasterCard, okay. They sent it to Pornhub and said, what is this?

They actually said, we received, so the VPs and the CEO were in an email exchange. We received the below referral as suspected child porn located on PornHub with the URL to the video. They clicked on that video. They saw that video. And you know what they did? They debated whether or not they should, what will make us look worse to MasterCard if we take it down or if we leave it up? It wasn't automatically, let's take that down. And they left it up. They left the video up. For how long? In the litigation, so in Serena's lawsuit, it says that they left it up, that it didn't come down until the big purge in 2020. That her abuse videos didn't come down until the pur purge in 2020. That her abuse videos didn't come down

until the purge of 2020. How long is that? So that would be, so let's see, this happened in May. Of what year? Of 2020. Okay, so December 4th, so let's just say later, so seven months, six months. So they're here saying, can we say it slipped through?

Can we? Who is saying that? Can we say it slipped through? Can we? So they're saying, can we say it slipped through? The CEO is saying, can we tell MasterCard that it just slipped through the cracks? They want to know what we do. They're communicating amongst each other as employees. They're saying, what should we do? We're in trouble with MasterCard. They even say, who's sending these videos? The CEO says, I know it's Lila who's doing this.

Uh, the question for MasterCard is what did you do to verify her age? who's sending these videos? The CEO says, I know it's Lila who's doing this. The question from MasterCard is what did you do to verify her age? And they're talking in these email exchanges saying we don't do anything to verify age because this is the whole way that this started. Since 2007 PornHab became the YouTube of porn, where anybody anywhere in the world could become a pornographer and upload sex videos to the site.

And they were not verifying. So I tested this upload process in February 1st of 2020. After I heard the story in the news of that 15-year-old girl, she was from Broward County, Florida, she was missing for anard County, Florida. She was missing for an entire year and she was finally found when her distraught mother was tipped off by a Pornhub user that he recognized her daughter on the site. She was found in

58 videos being raped and trafficked on Pornhub. Okay. I was haunted by that story. I was haunted by another story at the same time where the Sunday Times did an investigation. They found dozens of illegal videos on the site within minutes, even children as young as three years old on Pornhub. And I was up late one night, and this is in the context of 15 years in the fight against trafficking. And I'm up late, you know, consoling my own newborn who was crying in the middle of the night. And I was thinking about these stories. And I was haunted with a question, how in the world did that abuse end up on Pornhub? And I tested the upload system that night and I found out what millions of people already

knew. And that was the crux of the problem. They did not verify. In under 10 minutes, anybody with an email address could anonymously upload content to the site. They were not checking ID to make sure these are not children. They were not checking consent to make sure these are not children, they were not checking consent to make sure these are not rape or trafficking victims, and because of that the site became infested with videos of real sexual crime, including Serena's abuse,

including so many victim stories I could tell you. Okay, so let me ask you this question. So for the longest time, there was a basketball team, the Clippers, I don't know if you're familiar with the Clippers, they had an owner called Donald Sterling and Donald Sterling there was clips of him being racist, comments he made, dropping the n-word I think, I think, I, Rob you know what I'm saying, you've seen the clips where he's saying words and he talked about them in a very disrespectful manner, many racist comments, and he was banned

from the NBA for life and fined $2.5 million. So every time he thought about the Clippers, he thought about him. This is Donald Sterling. And nobody wanted to play for them. Black players who were there, they didn't want to play for them. And they had a pretty good team. They didn't want to play for him. NBA forces him to sell.

He sells it, I think, for like $2 billion and a guy named Steve Ballmer. Steve Ballmer is the number five employee from Microsoft, worth $150 billion today. He comes in, he buys the Clippers in 2014, 2015. Rob, I don't know what the year it is. He cleans house when he comes in. Now it's a great organization. Things are great. Things are smooth.

There's no issues, And Clippers make a comeback and it's actually a fun team to watch. I don't know if they're no longer right now, but they made a good run at what they did. Okay, so the new buyers buy it in March of 2023, okay? Give or take, the dates I have it somewhere around here. When they buy it, one of the things that I asked is, so now you're saying 91% of videos are taken out from $56 million to $5.2 million. It's a big number to filter

all that stuff out. And I ask, I say, so how do you know when somebody is uploading a video that the person is underage or not underage, right? And we look up, there's a software that I think they use called Yodi, and Yodi is a third party service to improve age without giving up the identity to the company. So I can go on there and say, Hi, I'm Patrick Bay David, boom, you know how you do your app or whatever. Yeah, Patrick Bay David, you're 46 years old, you're fine, you can put up your video. Great, fantastic. No, you're 15 years old, you can't put up your video, cannot be uploaded. Great. All right.

So that is headed in the right direction if this thing is going to stay on. That's the progress. Question I ask is how do you go back? But they didn't start doing that. So say they bought it in March of 2023. I have the emails where they're telling their users, it is only in September 3rd of 2024 when they started requiring the age and consent verification of the individuals in the videos. Prior to that, after December, the big takedown in December after the New York Times article.

For 18 months, they're not requiring age of people in videos. So they only required the age of the uploader. I got it. So that's September. So that's just two months ago. Yes. And even- Is this documented that they just- I have the emails right here.

Let me show you. I will show it to you right now. So Yodi, can you pull up when did Pornhub start using Yodi? New videos uploaded as of September 3rd, 2024, onward will only be published if IDs and proof of consent have been submitted and approved for all co-performers featured in the content. So prior to this- Who is approving that?

Who? Who does that? YOT does this service for them. YOT does that. Yes, but before that, let me just tell you, they were only requiring the ID of the uploader. So remember I told you I tested the system in February 2020. There's four people in the video.

I'm the one that's uploading the video. You only check me, but the three other people that are in the video, you're not verifying them, but the video gets thrown, it's on there. Okay, now let me give you an example on why that doesn't work. There is a man named Rocky Shay Franklin in Alabama

who raped a 12-year-old boy. He drugged him, he overpowered him, and he raped him. And he took 23 of those assault videos and he uploaded them to PornHub. At the time, they were being sold as a pay to download content on the site. Rocky Shay Franklin's in prison for 40 years. You can look it up. You can Google Rocky Shay Franklin for 40 years in prison for what he did. He was a verified uploader. We have the picture of Rocky. We know what his Pornhub username was.

He's not the only one. Multiple victims who are suing Pornhub today had their abuse, whether it's adult rape or trafficking or child exploitation, uploaded by verified uploaders. So we know that that does not stop and they knew that upon acquiring the company, they knew that just requiring the idea of the uploader does not solve this problem, yet they allowed those 5.2 million videos, right? So those were videos where the uploader would have been verified, but not the individuals in the videos themselves. They only started to require that in September. So ethical capital partners went that many months profiting from, and I say profiting from because

this is free porn, but it is highly monetized porn. Every video has ads around it. They sell today, they sell 4 billion ad impressions on porn hub and at sister sites every single day. Well, if you look at the estimated revenue, 2022 was 468 million, 2023 was run half a billion, 2024 could be between 450 to 550 million dollars according to some of the numbers that we see. Okay, so they started using Yodi of everybody in the video a month before they came on the podcast because they came on October 4th, you're saying September 3rd? September 3rd, 2024 is when they started doing this and they even then sent a follow-up email

to say, I know this is going to cause friction, right? It's going to be a more difficult process to upload, but what we're going to do is we're going to create a loophole for you. So let me show you another email. Is that an article Rob that shows what they're using? Is that the announces biometric technology to verify users? Yes, this is February 3rd, 2021 from Vice, and in it they mention Yodi right down here. For uploaders, it's for uploaders.

So for uploaders they started in 2021, but for everybody in the video, they started at September 3rd of 2024. And they implemented a system, so what they did was to make it easier. They created essentially what's a loophole to the system, where they created an auto tag option, where anybody, so you can get one person verified

and they describe it here as an auto tag function. So if you auto tag somebody else, that they will automatically, they don't have to verify their agent consent in that, so I'm trying to explain how this works. So you have a performer that is actually verified. So they show their ID and they do their consent form, then they can toggle on this feature that they describe in these emails to their users where they can auto accept incoming

tags. So another person could have X, Y, and Z individuals in their videos. And in order for them to get around actually having to show the ID and consent of all those individuals, they can go to somebody who has the auto accept, auto tag on and just tag them, okay? And what they said in this email, if and if they abuse the feature

and try to tag you in a video that you're not in, are a compliance team will catch it and may not allow it, May not. Do you know what may not means? This is tricky, right? May not means we may allow it, right? So even now it's clear that this system isn't really a robust and reliable system. And yet they're here, sitting here, Alex with that cross around her neck,

and she's been there for so many years. She was there when these children were being abused, where the rape and trafficking victims, and even today, I mean, even today, they have illegal content on the site. And you know how I know this, the proof is the fact that they had to file a report under the Digital Services Act. The Digital Services Act is a European law, and they really fought hard not to have to

report under the Digital Services Act. They said, look, we're not a very large online platform, is their argument, because very large online platforms have to report. And they actually did and they had to report how many videos that they took down that were illegal content. And from February 15 of 2024 to June 30 of 2024, they reported 3770 images that they believed were child sexual abuse material that had to be taken down and over

8,000 was eight thousand six hundred and seventy nine. I think was the number of non-consensual and adult rape videos So that's averaging about a thousand children and two thousand adults per month because this was four and a half months That they had to disclose and that's not counting 300,000 videos that they just lumped in under general terms of service violations. General terms. Now let me, so in your eyes, let me continue with this, who right now, like who do you go to to report this and they get involved and say well this is you know we got to investigate this. Who is being helpful, who is, you know, we got to investigate this.

Who is being helpful? Who is not? People you're reporting to. Law enforcement's helpful. They are helpful. Yes. In what way? I mean, they will actually process a video.

So there are certain attorney general's offices across the United States that have become passionate about this issue and care about it. And so a video could be sent to them, and will then reach out to Pornhub and demand that it comes down. So that's helpful. One thing that's not helpful is that Ethical Capital Partners has set up a system where if a user sees a problematic video on Pornhub, they can't just flag the content and take

it like actually just flag it. They have to log in. That's how you just tweeted that. They have to log in. That's how you just tweeted that. They have to create a user account in order to report it. Now I find that interesting because children don't have to create a user account to watch the videos on Pornhub. What?

Anyone in the world. So a child, right? Anyone with a device. Go to Pornhub.com. All they have today and they didn't even have this. You're gonna be fine, because I'm the one that's gonna write you up. So they only have-

Oh shoot, back up. Yes. I didn't, seriously, that's the homepage? Yes. Okay, they didn't even have an RU18 click through button when all this started in 2020, that any fiber- I hear them laughing in the back.

You see those guys in the back? So let me ask you, you're so funny, Humberto, I can hear you. So a child can go on without logging in? But you can't flag a video. If you see a video on Pornhub that you think is illegal, you can't just flag that video without actually logging in. Yet, they allow anybody to watch their entire

library of millions of videos without logging in. So I mean, how ethical is that? Right? So, okay, so you go in. Anybody can go through any of the videos that are on there. But if I want to report something, I need to log in. I've already consumed the video. I've seen it.

But if I want to report, I have to log in. Why do I have to log in to report? I think that it's a deterrent factor for reporting. Why? Because if they get... So let me tell you another thing. In the legal discovery that's happened, so there's now, let's see, nearly 300 victims who are suing PornHub in 25 lawsuits, including multiple class actions on behalf of tens of

thousands of child victims. Okay. And part of the legal discovery has uncovered the fact that they only had one person, one person. Now the company had 1800 employees by the end of 2020. And they employed one person to work five days a week reviewing videos flagged by users as containing terms of service violations, including what would be child rape, trafficking, all sorts of non-consensual content. They had a policy that a video had to be flagged 10, sorry, 15 times before it was put in line for review. Are you following me?

So an abuse victim, a child- Before it was put in for review, one person that does five days a week, I'm following. Right. So a victim could find their abuse on Pornhub, they would have to flag it over 15 times for it to even be put in line for review. Oh wow. And their entire backlog was 706,000 videos.

Now, these. 706,000 videos of 15 times being flagged? Of a backlog of flagged videos, videos that were flagged. Not 15 times, just flagged once. Yes, just flagged, flagged? A backlog of flagged videos. Videos that were flagged. Not 15 times, just flagged once. Yes, just flagged. Flagged videos. Now here are the emails that are saying, so this is the CEO again. They're in trouble with MasterCard. Is this the old CEO or the new CEO? For off and tune, but the CPO, who's currently the same CPO, the VPs that are currently the same VPs are discussing this policy. And they're talking about, look, he says the below seems good and reasonable.

Videos with 15 flag is never viewed. And then he said, we have 706,425 videos that have been flagged that are in the backlog, okay? So this was the process. Now tell me now based on that, is it any wonder that they make it difficult to flag videos? I don't know how many they have today but that's a system they have. CPO is a Chief Product Officer? Yes. Okay, who's the Chief Product Officer? What's the name of the guy? Kareem Al-Morazi. Kareem Al-Morazi.

Kareem Al-Morazi. Yes, E-L-M-A-R-A-Z-I. Oh, is that it? Like it's Sep? No, just he's giving you a suggestion right there. He says, do you mean, yeah, right there. Is this the guy? There he is, right there.

Okay, so can we read his background? I want to know his background. Kareem Al-Morazi is currently Chief Product Officer at MindGeek. Before joining MindGeek, he served president of TV and managed services at Playboy Plus Entertainment from August 2011 to July 16. Before their time at Playboy, Karim was with Bell from June of 2002 to September of 2011, where they held the title of General Manager of Mobile Solutions. In this role, Karim was responsible for Business Solutions and Wireless Professional was going to some

of the management. Okay. So, all right. So he was at Playboy. From Playboy he comes in here, Chief Product Officer, and the email he's saying, those that get flagged 15 plus times don't get that many views. The other 706,000 videos that got flagged do? No he's the one that's part of this discussion where they have set up a policy so this is what is so problematic. The policy is the 15? The

policy is the fact that they have one person out of a staff of 1800 they're making hundreds of millions so from it you're a businessman again if you're a company that wants to make sure that there's not illegal content proliferating all over your site, okay? You have 1,800 employees. Most of them are not doing the compliance work. In fact, we have evidence that they only had 30 moderators

moderating the content. What was the number they told me when I asked them? Do you remember that when I said how many moderators? They said they wouldn't tell you a number, but they said hundreds. They said hundreds. How many is actually doing it? Well, I know that as of 2020, okay,

as of 2020, they only had 30. And not only was, so they had 30 working 10 per shift and These people were actually tasked to watch at least 700 videos per shift They were reprimanded if they had less than 700 some of the more advanced moderators that were there for a long time and you had to skip through things very quickly or even watching up to 2,000 videos per eight hour shift and they were watching these just skipping through these they just skipped through them they just skipped through the videos so you watch it on 2.0 speed but this isn't even just Pornhub this is for all the tube sites so they own Pornhub, Red

Tube, YouPorn, GayTube, XTube you know I mean so many tube sites and they had 10 people now compare this Facebook has 15,000 moderators okay this is a company that owns most of the world's most popular porn sites okay think of the massive they hired 10 people per shift to do this job okay that is a policy that they put in place while they are not verifying agent consent while they have one person reviewing flagged videos. So when I say that these executives and these VPs set up these policies, these weren't accidents, these were decisions. How many videos are uploaded per hour?

They gave the number, do you remember the video, Rob? They said there were 2000 per day now, okay? They used to have 25,000 per day. Now it's 2000. In 2020. Okay, so if they got 2,000 per day, it works if you have hundreds, like they said. To review every video. To review every video.

It doesn't work if it's only 30. The problem is it doesn't matter if they have 10,000 moderators. If they're not verifying the age and consent of every individual in every video, it's a guessing game. And you hit on that during your interview. It's a game of Russian roulette with people's lives because there's no way that they can guess properly who's 16 and who's 18, right? Because not even a pediatrician can guess on a consistent basis who's 15 and who's

18. You just cannot do it. Is this the part, Rob? This is where they explain how many moderators they have. Can I hear this? I'm curious. Every single video is reviewed by a human. We have age ID consent for uploaders, everybody appearing in content. There is absolutely no incentive to do otherwise on our platform. I always make that point. Like from a business

perspective, there's no incentive to do anything but the highest standards of trust and safety. So you have a company with 1,500 people, you're gonna have people who are saying nonsense. Technical product manager? So I have to say this, this is not someone, obviously when I'm reviewing the company and I look very, very carefully at it,

including spending time, none of these, these are not trust and safety staff, these are not moderators, these are not people in compliance. Whatever idea they have, although it's very interesting, we learned something from these videos. We actually learned a very important lesson, which was you can have a company of 1500 people

and you'll have graphic designers and you'll have salespeople and customer support. All of them need to be educated on our trust and safety system. So we actually, the company in response, and I think it was absolutely the right thing to do, now, whether you, doesn't matter if you're the janitor. Are you gonna tell us how many moderators, Rob? So we actually the company in in in response and I think it was absolutely the right thing to do now Whether you doesn't matter if you're the janitor tell us how many moderators, right? They're gonna say he continues this word salad where he actually doesn't answer how many moderators they won't tell they won't say exactly

How many they were no, he just can't I mean they used to have 30. Okay, but here's what he just said was they review every Single video now, let me say they've been saying that since they started defending themselves in 2020. Let me tell you what that means. That is their admission of deep complicity because there was a 12 year old boy, right? Drugged, overpowered and raped in 23 videos with titles that indicated that it was abuse. I won't say what they are on because I don't want people to be disturbed, but the titles of the videos, maybe I will. I mean, Young Ass is Best, Uncle Secret, Little Nephew, things like that on these videos.

They had confirmed by the Sunday Times, children as young as three on the site. Be quiet. The Sunday Times did an investigation in late 2019. They found dozens of videos on the site that were illegal within minutes. Even children as young as three. They have had, now I've seen these videos and this is described in the New York Times piece by Nick Kristof, videos where victims are so unconscious and drugged, their bodies are completely limp, and a masked assailant is actually lifting the eyelids of the victims. You can see their red bloodshot eyes. And actually touching the eyeballs of these victims.

In Pornhub. On Pornhub. Drug needles, where you could see the needle with which they were drugged. I don't want to disturb people by describing it in too much detail, but let's just say these, it is clear that this is not acting. Okay? When you're actually tickling the feet and you're touching the eyeballs of a rape victim, and what they're saying is that they're moderators.

What he just said was that, this is what they've been saying since 2020, their moderators viewed those videos. They approved and this is confirmed. We have, I mean, look at lawsuits, 179 page complaints detailing the evidence of a site infested with real obvious sexual crime. He's saying that those moderators viewed and then said, looks good, let's go ahead and put this live on the site. And not only that, let's go ahead and monetize it with ads because every video, I mean, I describe in my book one video of a clearly prepubescent child.

It was, it's so obvious and she is being anally raped by a perpetrator and she is protesting in the video. And we reported it and it didn't come down weeks later. It was still up under new ownership or old ownership. That was, this is the old ownership, but old ownership is the same VPs and executives that are there today, right? Okay? We already know that. They already said that.

It didn't come down. It got reported multiple times. It was only when we got the FBI involved, then they reported to the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children that they finally were forced to take down this video. And even when they took down the video, because traffic is so important to them, because inventory is so important to them, they took down the video, but they left a black box there that said removed at the request of the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. They left the tags, the title, the views, the comments, everything. Why?

Because they want inventory. Because they want it to be picked up on Google to drive more traffic to the site and maybe they won't see that particular child's abuse, but then they'll just get directed to a whole bunch of other material. Okay, so that's when I said, aside from you, who is reacting to this? Obviously, is it- Oh, so many people obviously is it is it is it is it a movement? I get it's a movement, but now if you're in front of a court and You got lawyers, I got lawyers representing them pornhub, and I got lawyers representing you and the victims right

The lawyers representing them are going to say, your honor, we bought this company in March of 2023, we know these were the issues, here's what we've done, pa pa pa pa pa pa pa, we made the investment, we've gone rid of this and we've gone rid of that, and back in the days this, 91% of it is gone, and we are following the guidelines and this because we want this thing to be extremely compliant and we wanna follow the guidelines by every single state and da da da da da da, and this is what we've done. Do you know? That's not how the law works.

But how does it work? Because you can't go commit a crime and just because time has passed, you don't get held responsible for it, okay? So, right? That's not how justice works. That's why. Not if it's new ownership though,

because if I buy a company that- Well, they're the ones who are being sued. So, ILO, right? Ethical Capital Partners is not able to escape the litigation of what- I understand, but even with the law that comes after them, because your outcome is you wanna shut down Pornhub. That's you.

The 2.33 million signatures that you've collected, they're supporting you because to shut down Pornhub. That's you. The 2.33 million signatures that you've collected, they're supporting you because they want to see Pornhub being shut down, not being moderated, not, you know. I'm glad when they're taking steps to limit the amount of illegal content that is on the site. Can they do anything where you will be in a position to say, guys, it's fine, I can stay on? Absolutely not.

Why? Because victims will never forget. That's not what justice looks like. It doesn't look like you say sorry, you say, okay, we're gonna clean some stuff up now because we got in trouble. It's not because they wanted to do this, right? If they never, if the petition never happened,

if Nick Kristof didn't write his article, if Bill Ackman didn't get involved to help get the credit card companies to cut them off, if they didn't... Bill Ackman is the one that got the Visa and Massacre to cut them off? Yes, so Bill Ackman, I love Bill, he's been such an important advocate in this fight. He read the Nick Kristof New York Times piece, you know, I think it was the day after it was out, sipping his morning coffee in his penthouse. And he was incensed because he has daughters himself. And I ended up getting in touch with him and explained everything that was going on.

And he not only tweeted about it, he actually contacted Ajay Banga, who at the time was a CEO of MasterCard because he knew him from the tennis circuit. And he shared the article and he said, look, you need to do the right thing here. And he said, I'm on it. And that's when they announced that they were going to be investigating the site, even though we had already been engaged with MasterCard now for almost a year at this point, but they were resisting. They were resisting. But then finally, they actually said, okay, we're investigating. Of course they confirmed the illegal content all over the site because they knew about it from the start. Well, in one article that says Visa and MasterCard stopped doing business with Pornhub in December

of 2020. But this is 2022. But no, no, no. So they got back on. So here's what happened. So Bill Ackman intervenes They confirm the illegal content MasterCard is the first one that says okay, we're disengaging with Pornhub Visa quickly follows suit. They're not gonna be left behind in this discover

Does PayPal already had done this at the beginning? Whatever Visa does MasterCard does whatever MasterCard does Visa does okay? so that was the worst thing that could have ever happened to Pornhub. And I think Unilever and PayPal also stopped advertising and offering their services to them during that same time. Correct. They had done that actually at the beginning of December 2020, but they were losing all of their advertisers and whatnot. So who is allowing them to accept payments today? Who do they still have?

So they have cryptocurrency and they have bank wires as payment options. But I'll tell you the story of what happened. So they get cut off by the credit card companies. Now this is the worst thing that could ever happen to them. I mean, Fabian Tillman told me earlier in 2020, if you want to go after Pornhub, go after the credit card companies, because that's the only thing they care about. It's true. And when they announced that they were cutting ties, Pornhub did the unthinkable. true. And when they announced that they were cutting ties, Pornhub did the unthinkable. And that is when they took down 80% of the entire website because it was all unverified content,

because it was infested, because they didn't have ID and consent, because they didn't know who was in the videos. And there were so many illegal videos, that was the only thing that they could do to try to woo the credit card companies back. And there was headlines all over the world about this. So they lost the ability to process transactions for their premium and they had cut off the advertising as well. But two weeks later I found out an insider

from the company came forward and said, I know you don't know this. This was months later. But two weeks after that New York Times piece, they actually went back to the advertising arm of the company. The advertising arm is called Traffic Junkie, and that's how they make most of their money. I mean, today they sat here and told you, how do we make money on Pornhub? We make it through advertising. They were selling 4.6 billion ad impressions on Pornhub every day.

Okay, that's how they're making their money. The credit card companies went back. advertising. They were selling 4.6 billion ad impressions on Pornhub every day. That's how they're making their money. The credit card companies went back. So then it was round two with the credit card companies. Of course, one of the first people I called was Bill. I said, you're not going to believe this. They've gone back. He said, I'm going to help. He did. We engaged with the credit card companies again, but it wasn't until there was they were resisting again and again. It wasn't until August of 2022 when Visa lost its motion to dismiss. So Serena sued Visa, she sued Pornhub and the owners and executives and Visa lost their motion to dismiss the case. Judge Karmak Carney in California gave a scathing decision.

He said, according to the facts in this case, Visa gave Pornhub the very tool through which to complete the crime of knowingly benefiting from child trafficking and denied them. Made headlines around the world. Bill got him and I on Squawk Box with Andrew Sorkin 17 minutes we're calling out Al Kelly The attorney for Serena got on Squawk Box the day before calling the pressure was on the headlines were piling up

And then Al Kelly came forward with a personal statement. He said I usually don't do this But I'm a father and we're gonna cut off Pornhub once and for all. And then of course MasterCard follow, Discover, and that's how they finally got cut off by the credit card companies. So if it's crypto only and wiring money, you can't make a half a billion dollars a year like that. Well, it's because they have the other pay sites, right? So they own, they have the subscription sites, they have the Brazzers and the Reality Kings and they manage Playboy and they have MoFos and so many others. What percentage of the revenue comes from Pornhub?

I don't know today how much of their total revenue as a company is coming from Pornhub versus their other sites. There's no way it's a lot if it's only wiring money. It definitely tanked. It definitely tanked. I mean Pornhub used to be the cash cow now I think what it's used as is more an advertising are armed for them So they advertise their other pay sites on pornhub right when you go there, so let's let's go back to this

So let's go back to You know you want them to shut down, okay? Let's say they do pornhub is shut down all right. Yeah now what right you think there's not access to what are the other porn sites that are available or even the Dark web or you don't think any of that exists and it's accessible to people like You what did you accomplish? What's the accomplished? Yeah, The solution to part of this is not just to hold PornHub accountable, but we want to prevent this in the future. And what that means is that we're pressuring not only governments, but the credit card

companies. So the financial institutions, I think, are the key to this. And you might understand this as a businessman yourself. We want to see Visa, MasterCard, and Discover say, we don't do business with user-generated porn sites that don't reliably verify the age and consent of every single person in every single video. Just like they have anti-money laundering policy, they need to have anti-online exploitation policy.

And when they do that, they're the doer at scale. So they are the solution at scale. Because these companies, they may be free porn, but they're not free They exist to make a lot of money and it's really hard for them to do that without the credit card companies and financial institutions So I think that is the ultimate solution in addition to governments enacting the same policy So this even if you shut down Pornhub policy. So this, even if you shut down Pornhub, it's not going away because the porn laws in America are not going to look. By the way, it's so interesting because in this election, porn was one of the issues in the election. I don't know

if you saw the video or not. Did you see the ad the Democrats ran? Oh, I think I did. We're scaring people that they're going to take away porn and all that. Watch this here. One of the ads they ran, Rob, I think we texted it to you. If you, you know. Yeah, I saw it. Brandon, did you send it to Rob? Rob should have it if you have one of the clips. I think this is the one. Yeah, watch this.

This is a commercial. If folks are watching this, this is not a spoof. This is a real commercial ran with budget of Kamala Harris to scare people who watch porn to not vote for Republican. This is maybe one of the weirdest commercials ads I've ever seen in my life. The only thing that was missing is Kamala Harris coming at the end and saying, hi, I'm Kamala Harris and I endorse this message. Go ahead and play this clip.

Sorry, you can't do that. What the hell, man? How'd you get in here? I'm your Republican congressman. Now that we're in charge, we're banning porn nationwide. You can't tell me what to do. Get out of my bedroom, you creep. I won the last election, so it's my decision.

I'm just gonna watch and make sure you don't finish illegally. I mean, that's ridiculous because, I mean, porn, like it or not, it's legal. It's constitutionally protected as expression. Okay? It's not going away. That's not my goal.

That's not the goal of Trafficking Hub. That's not the goal of my organization, the Justice Defense Fund. We're after making sure that these sites are not infested and globally distributing and monetize sexual crime, monetizing sexual crime. That is what we're after. And the problem with Pornhub is that it is doing that. And so when we're shutting down Pornhub, it's not shutting down all porn.

If you wanna have porn, you do so legally. You do so by verifying age and you verify consent. And that's possible. That's possible but you have to reinvent the business model of free user-generated porn and that's okay. That's okay if they have to do that. Yeah I mean again so what are the laws right now with porn? What are the laws right now with porn when it comes down to underage porn? It's illegal. I mean it's illegal to possess it. It's illegal to distribute it, to advertise it, to monetize it. Why are there so many sites that have it?

They're breaking the law. But there's not enforcement. Why are they not being held accountable? There's not enforcement. I don't get that though. I don't understand. I'm very confused with that part. So who wouldn't get that though. I don't understand. I'm very confused with that part. So Who Who wouldn't enforce that law it's kids, you know We had a guest on here a couple days ago where the interview went out and it was a great car I wish she would mention more people that are alive instead of just mentioning people that are no longer here with us One of the conversations was around the fact that according to the FBI, 2022 data, 359,000 children are missing.

I mean, I had a dog missing for nine days, Jimbo, and we were devastated as a family. Parents missing a child? Are you kidding me? The pain? What policy is above that? I don't know what policy is above that. It's not a matter of the policy, it's a matter of the enforcement and I think the problem is there's so much of this going on and there's not enough political

will and there's not enough resources being dedicated to do it and that's why I think there's power in civil litigation because civil litigation puts the power into the hands of the victims. They decide whether or not they're gonna pursue justice in court and they're not waiting and relying upon the government. And what often can happen is when you have a powerful legal complaint and the lawyers do all their work and discovery and they unearth all of the facts and the evidence, then the criminal prosecution can come on the heels of that.

And basically they use everything they found in the civil litigation to pursue the criminal. It makes their job easier. And we've seen that over and over again. Yeah, do you remember the part when I asked them a question, I said, so is your goal as in Pornhub to help people go out of the porn industry? Oh no, a lot of people are very happy with their jobs.

And I said, what are you talking about? How the hell does somebody become a porn star at 18 years old? They consumed underage to be inspired to do that, right? And you go through these data and you talk to other people and say, so what is the profile of somebody that becomes a baseball player? Well, they're da-da-da-da-da.

What is the profile of somebody that becomes a lawyer? What is the profile of somebody that becomes a dentist? What is the profile of somebody that becomes a dentist? What is the profile of somebody that becomes a realtor, an actor, an athlete? What is the profile of somebody that becomes a porn star? What is that profile? What percentage of that is broken homes? Where kids are forced to find a way and you go look up some of the statistics on, you know, percentages on what kids are going through, on how they get introduced to this business.

As you're going through this search and the 2.33 million people that are messaging you, how many people have reached out to you that are former porn stars or former abusers that are saying, hey, my clips are still out there? How many of those people are reaching out to you? A lot, a lot. I mean, some of my most helpful allies in this fight have been those in the porn industry, or formerly in the porn industry, but in the porn industry.

I mean, talk about illegal content. It's not just child rape and trafficking. It's copyright violations, pirated content on these free sites. So, you know, at one point I had several porn performers who were telling me they spent hours a day scouring PornHub and its sister tube sites trying to find their own illegal content to try to take it down.

In the course of doing that, they were coming across a whole bunch of child abuse and trafficking and they were sending the links over. But you know, some of the greatest allies have actually been in the industry. And yeah, there's a lot of pain that goes on with a lot of people. I mean, a book I recently just read is by a porn producer named Vic Legina, and he has a book called Filthy. Did you say Vic Legina? Vic Legina.

You're not joking. I'm not joking. Trump would love that name, the way he says China. It almost sounds like... Yeah. So this is not a joke. This is not a spoof. No. It almost sounds like. Yeah. So this is not a joke, this is not a spoof. No, he actually was a producer and director

for many, many years, and he wrote a book about his experience, and one of the things that's really clear is that there is definitely a lot of trauma, and there's a lot of history of prior abuse and all of those things that are in the professional studio produced porn industry. Even some of the porn performers

who actually were in the studio produced content are suing PornHub. There's a porn star named Phoenix Marie that's currently suing for tens of millions of dollars. She's suing ILO and the parent company PornHub for her own exploitation. So it's not a secret that that happens. But the work that we're doing is to help those who are not in that professionally studio

produced content, although they're welcome to come forward for help if they've been abused too. But I think to your point of children who are witnessing this, it's not just that they might aspire to the porn industry someday. I think probably more concerning than that is the fact that eight-year-olds as their sex education, as their introduction to sex, could actually witness a real sexual crime on Pornhub as their introduction to sexuality. They could witness a real rape. They could witness abuse. There's a study done by the British Journal of Criminology and they

looked at over a hundred thousand of the videos that are on the home pages of these free tube sites and they found that one in eight, one in eight of every of those videos shows violence and non-consent. So that is what children are viewing when PornHub allows free access to these sites by anybody with no restriction, with no safeguarding. So I say that children are abused in front of the screen and children are abused behind the screen. I think both need to be protected. As the world's population grows, so does the need for resources like potash to support

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Only $6 at A&W's in Ontario. Experience A&W's classic breakfast on Now. Dine in only until 11am. What do you see as the pattern of people who get into the porn industry? Do you see, Rob, can you actually ask this question? Let's do this. Let's ask Chad GBT and let's see what it says. If you go on Chad GBT and ask the question, what causes someone to get into the porn industry? I'm actually curious to know what the answer is going to be. And so financial motivation, okay I see that everywhere. Personal choice and agency, sexual freedom and empowerment, right. Influence of environment, makes sense. Psychological, emotional factors, self esteem of being validated, trauma, vulnerability in certain cases of

individual have history of abuse, trauma might be susceptible to entertaining industry, coping exploitation, rebellion and escapism, okay, recruitment and opportunity, socioeconomic and educational barriers, makes sense, online accessibility. All right, so question, what is your view on the difference between OnlyFans and Pornhub? Do you have any problem with OnlyFans? Well, I have victims who have been exploited that have come forward who have also been

exploited on OnlyFans in the past. How do you get exploited on OnlyFans? They have really watching. So one of the beautiful things that's happened in holding Pornhub so publicly accountable with all of the serious repercussions that has happened to them is other websites, it's a domino effect, right? Other websites and other companies are watching what happened to them is other websites, it's a domino effect, right? Other websites and other companies are watching what happened to them and saying, we don't want to end up in that position, so let us proactively try to clean up what we're doing

and improve our IC. But with OnlyFans, I think one of the biggest things is that it's subscription-based, so that it's not just free access to go on the site. So I think that definitely prevents children from being able to access that content freely like they can on the free PornTube sites. I think the free PornTube sites are the most dangerous out there, not only from the user perspective of who's viewing it, but also from who are in the videos. And I want to address something that Solomon and his partner said on this show. When you started to talk about protecting children from access to the site and they

raised this big objection, right? Oh, this is about privacy. This is about privacy. And I just want to point out how ridiculous that is coming from them because for one, they exploit and they harvest the data of every single user that visits their site. They're currently being sued in a class action for the exploitation of user data. So they already do that. But you pointed out that because they own pay sites as well, these subscription sites,

they already age verify on those sites, right? Because you have to have a credit card to access the site. So they have no problem getting the personally identifying information, the name, the credit card, the address of people for their paid sites. But they suddenly have a problem with age verification with their free sites because their free sites depend on frictionless traffic to the sites to sell ad impressions. So I just want to point out the flawed logic that they're using in that case and point out the fact that it's a lie, that this is really about privacy when it's really about

money for them. And in fact, I have emails from their senior community manager discussing this very fact. And what she says, not email, sorry, post online. She says exactly what you said. Mindgeek loses money. Age verification devastates traffic. Pornhub stands to lose 50% of traffic. It costs us money to verify and overall it's a disaster. That's exactly what it's about when it comes to the resistance to age verification. I don't think it's 50%. I think they'd lose 90%. I think if right up front, if the website verified 90% is gone, 90% will be gone in no time.

So I think whether it's 50% or 90% I think the important thing is the truth again, is to get to the truth. What is the truth? Why are they resisting age verification? And it comes down to money. For sure. It's expensive. It's's gonna be the traffic that goes to it. So if you have to do that, the cost and the traffic, and you have to be able to show, like when you do a sponsorship with somebody, when we used to entertain a lot of sponsorships two years ago, it was, so how many views you get?

We get this. Okay, we pay this per this. Okay, cool, no. All right, we'll pay this. All right, sounds good, boom. Here's how much you want. We're gonna find a hundred thousand dollars. Great. But if you don't have viewership, you know, advertisers are not gonna pay you big dollars. You have to get the eyeballs. They don't want to not give up the eyeballs. They don't want to lose traffic. They don't want to lose traffic because that's the business model of free user generated porn. So I think

it's really, really important, especially because, you know, this is going to be making headlines soon with regard to age verification for users because the Supreme Court on January 15 is hearing their opposition to age verification in Texas. So Texas- Pornhub. Yes, it's Pornhub and their partner, the Free Speech Coalition. So they call themselves the Free Speech Coalition. And so Texas actually enacted age verification requirements for users.

They went ahead and sued the state of Texas. Now it's going to the Supreme Court. And it's under this pretense of, oh, we care about privacy. We don't want people to have to show their ID to access a porn site. Well, they don't have to show their ID to Pornhub. I would never want anybody to have to show their ID to Pornhub. I would never want anybody to have to show their ID to Pornhub. They have third party sites, right? Yo-T.

These are reliable. These are privacy respecting corporations that are third party that exist to be able to easily and safely verify age and ID. And so I just want to call out the BS from them. I want to call out the excuses and just get right down to the truth. Just say it like it is. Say it that you just don't want to lose profit because you want to put profit over the safety

of children every single time. Yeah, I mean, when I'm looking at this website, Rob, the Free Speech Coalition, nonprofit, what a great name though. Free Speech Coalition. Honestly, it's a great name, FSC. The adult entertainment industry in the US founded in 1999 what opposes the passage of an enforcement of obscenity, laws and many censorship laws.

That lady to the right, Nina Hartley, if you wanna go to her, Nina Hartley is from the industry herself, right? She, by 2017 she had expressed, she's an American porn star and sex educator. By 2017 she had appeared in more than 1,000 adult films. She had been described by Las Vegas Weekly as an outspoken feminist, an advocate for sexual freedom,

and by CNBC as a legend in the adult world. She's not leading it anymore. She's not, what is she doing now? I don't know what she's doing now, but I know that she's not. She's not leading it anymore. She's not? What is she doing now? I don't know what she's doing now, but I know that she's not. She stepped away from it? Yeah, I don't think she's the leader of this. But this is an industry, so it's a porn industry interest group.

Basically, they exist to lobby for the interest, not of porn performers, not of those who are actually in those videos, but for the industry. And they fight laws every single time. They fought really hard. And I think they won. There was a law in the United States that actually made it illegal to depict a child. So where it wouldn't be real, right, it would be a depiction of a child. It could maybe be a realistic depiction, but they fought it being illegal to depict a child in a video. And that's when the explosion of teen porn came to be where so teen is one of the most

popular categories on Pornhub for so many years in a row. And when you say teen, right, teen, they have 18 year olds that look like children. They have pigtails, braces, flat chest, they talk like children, they act like children. They have pigtails, braces, flat chest, they talk like children, they act like children. And it's an entire genre of porn that exploded because it's not illegal to do so. In Canada, it's actually illegal to depict a child in a pornographic video, even if it's not a child. What is that, Rob? That's what she's describing,

somebody that's above age or maybe above age but they're portrayed as a younger person. Is that Dylan Mulvaney or is that actually, no I'm actually asking, so that's not Dylan Mulvaney? No. Oh I'm sorry, I thought it, it looks like him so. And so that was the problem on Pornhub is, real children were being raped alongside

depictions of children. But by the way, what is the position legally against AI porn that they can do? What is legal or illegal with that? Is there laws against it? Like if CGI and they can, the direction chat GBTs go and the technology that they're gonna be creating, what if they use AI to create porn? Is there any laws against it?

I think that they're trying to catch up with, you know, the advancement of AI and being able to create abuse imagery because, you know, what they can even do today, and I say keep your kids' faces off social media if you can, because what AI can do today is actually take the face of a child from a picture and then create child sexual abuse material from just an innocent picture of your kid playing at the playground.

They can take that, and then they can make very realistic-looking child sexual abuse imagery. And that needs to be completely outlawed, and we need to have strong laws against that. We call it deep fakes as well. But in the United States, there's been a law that's been enacted since 1988 for the porn industry, for the brick and mortar, porn industry, porn valley,

you know about porn valley, right? You grew up, right, you were in your Chatsworth, is that right? Inglewood? And it's called USC 2257, and it requires age verification and record keeping and it's actually a felony if you don't keep those records and be able to produce them to the DOJ anytime they want it, they can request it because it's understood anybody with a brain knows that if you don't have that, the industry is going to be awash with criminal content.

The problem is that with the advent of the internet and the YouTubes of porn, that these companies have basically ignored the law. And Pornhub would be held to the standard of this law because the law says if you transfer pornographic content in the United States, if you produce or transfer pornographic content in the US, you have to be held to USC 2257, record-keeping law. And they have been transferring, right? They had a download button on every single video, but they were transferring that content. So they have violated that law millions and millions of times without now, without repercussion, and we need to see that change. Yeah, I'm curious to know what happens and what happens afterwards like

what is once some happens with them let's just say if it does then what? If so if PornHub is held fully accountable right we've made a lot of progress and holding them accountable there's still lawsuits that need to be resolved restitution needs to be paid to victims. What we're going to see is a transformation of the entire industry, of the entire online porn industry, to become a safer place for children, for victims, for generations to come. If this, if we're successful, the internet will become a safer place because there will be regulation on user generated porn.

So how did they attack you? Did they at all attack you? I think one article I saw is they attacked you for you being a Christian or something like that. What was that article about? Yeah, I mean that was the kind of the play that they made from the beginning. Instead of actually acknowledging that there was a problem and taking the necessary steps to fix it, what they did was they tried to deflect, they tried to

deny that it was a problem, and then they tried to discredit those who were raising the problem. Like me, like victims, like so many other... I mean, at one point we had 600 organizations that were involved in this fight, But what they did was they tried to say, look, this is just a religious right-wing moral crusade against people who hate sex and want sex removed from the internet completely. Don't listen to anything they say. And that was their play. And said Exodus credit shady and bad joke a group of Trump ties waging war on a pornhub. Is this it?

I mean it's one of many Articles that were written like that. So who's who wrote this by the what side is this daily? This is a daily beast. I mean the daily beast is essentially, you know Unfortunately in my opinion with the stuff that they've produced that is actually blatant lies about the movement You know a glorified tabloid But they don't have the same credibility. I mean, I don't know if they've had it. They just don't.

Oh, that's four years ago. The picketing and launching hotline anti-trafficking campaigns against porn hubs. I don't know if that's strange. And that's what Solomon said right here, right? So Solomon was here. And you know what he said? He said that trafficking hub was started

by a group called Mor and media that's been picketing against sex shops since he said the 80s and 90s. I was born in 1982. I founded trafficking hub. I started trafficking hub. You could play exactly what he said. It is just a blatant lie because they say, oh, they're conflating trafficking and sex work the only one conflating trafficking and sex work and porn is porn hub by hosting

Real sexual abuse and crime against actual legal videos. I mean you could play what he actually said It's a it's a complete lie. We've had people from left and right Atheists have joined this fight alongside Muslims and Christians, we've had people who are pro porn and anti porn, left wing outlets with right wing outlets, because simply we can all agree that nobody should be raped and trafficked for profit on the world's largest porn site.

Rob, is this when he says that or is this when I ask, are you a man of faith? This is when you ask. Are you a man of faith? Yes. Go ahead and play the clip. Go back a little bit. I am a man of faith. Because then you have a safer internet.

I think that's the wrong one. Are you a man of faith? Oh, okay. Yeah. I am a man of faith. You would say you are? Yeah. Are you ever conflicted?

I think that the work we are doing in an industry, whether you like it or not, right? And we happen to, we like the people we work with. We like the industry, okay? It will exist. So to be part of the movement that's gonna make it safer, not by getting 2.5 million, shut it down, have a petition, be nasty, but by actually doing the work,

investing in making it safer, this is an extraordinarily positive thing to do. And destigmatization as well, competition be nasty, but by actually doing the work, investing in making it safer, this is an extraordinarily positive thing to do. And destigmatization as well, because one of the realities is that this is a very stigmatized industry, right? And we know full fact that when there is increased stigma, right, there's more, there's increased violence. So whenever we have...

I'm listening. I'm just reading hard. Okay. I mean, you were trying to... I got a big nose when I read the whole city... You don't have credit for that. whenever we have. I'm listening, I'm just reading hard. Okay. I mean, you're trying to- I got a big nose when I read the whole city. I mean, you don't have credit for that. Yeah.

I mean, so- I don't know. I wanna tell you something about Solomon. I think this is important to the context of this conversation, and I reported this in Newsweek, and you can pull it up if you want. I wrote an article in July, it's called, PornHub is still a crime scene even

after its rebrand. You can pull that up. Solomon, you know, actually is a criminal defense attorney that has a history of representing pedo criminals in court. Okay. So he's represented all kinds of criminals, but he has had a specialty in those who are pedophiles. And he actually publicly congratulated the sinking of a massive child pornography case in Canada that involved over 7,300 videos of child sexual abuse, including over 2,000 videos of infants being raped by grown men, okay? This is a documented case that happened in Canada. Wait, wait, wait. And go to the Newsweek article, go ahead right there.

Is that it, Rob? Yes, you can click on those links, and you could see that he actually congratulated the sinking of this case. Where did he say that? He said it on Twitter. He's since locked his Twitter account down. He was a criminal.

Empty congratulates Weinstein defend illegal computer search by Ottawa police sinks child porn case Ottawa citizen. Now if you go back and you can link to the archive of the article he shared, he did it twice where he congratulated the sinking of this case. If you click on 7,730 images, okay, go ahead. I think you could click on that. Can you click on that? It's loading right now. Okay. There you go. So there's the case and in the case you can see the details of the amount of child porn that was on this man's device and he's congratulating the sinking of that case. Okay. So man's device, and he's congratulating the seeking of that case, okay?

So that's who we're talking about as the face of ethical capital partners. And it's no wonder that they wouldn't be honest about what they're currently doing, what's happened in the past. And I just think that it's really important to expose the truth about this company, who they are, and what's actually currently going on. So what's this here? This is illegal computer search by autopolice, Sinks child porn case, judge commits acquits man found with 7,730 explicit images on flash drives. This is the man that got, he was representing him? No, it was a colleague and a criminal defense attorney.

And so he was just saying, congratulations, good job. You sunk a child, a massive child porn case on a technicality. And so I think the, so the point that I want to make here is that character matters, right? And if you could lie about something as easily, like a proven lie that says that trafficking hub was started by a group that used to protest sex shops in the 70s or sorry 80s and 90s, this is easily, I mean, they have investigated

trafficking hub deeply, they know exactly who started it, what have investigated Trafficking Hub deeply. They know exactly who started it, what it's about, who's involved. And if you would lie about something so simple as that, then how could you trust anything that they're saying? So, I mean, I think that's breaking news coming in from bet 365, where every nail-biting overtime win, breakaway, pick six, three-point shot, underdog win, buzzer beater, shootout, walk off, and absolutely every play in between is amazing. From football to basketball and hockey to baseball, whatever the moment, it's never ordinary at Bet365.

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Look for Melissa and Doug wherever you shop for toys. Yeah, I mean, look, the story came out, Rob, I don't know if you have it or not, the story about this guy who was allowing people election betting site. Is this the one? Yes. FBI raids apartment of an election betting site, Polymarket CEO and sees a cell phone, sources say the FBI raided Shane Copeland's home

after the website elections betting market controversially predicted Donald Trump's win. And the FBI went after this guy. It's just a website that, you know, can you go a little lower Rob? If yes, he's a cell phone electronic device a betting site polymarket CEO in a raid in his New York City Department Wednesday The company's market wagered correctly and controversially and Donald Trump's favorite bets who would win the president presidential election Even though opinion polls showed a tight race. This is ridiculous. You lost seven states, battleground states, new phone who's this. The point of the story is this, if they're willing to investigate a person like this,

who accurately got it right on how bettors were betting, they can investigate other people if they choose to, but it's not a priority. I'm excited about the new AG. I think Bondi is her name. Pam? Yeah, she has a history of really going hard on child exploitation trafficking. And about the new AG, I think Bondi is her name. Yeah, she has a history of really going hard on child exploitation trafficking. And that is really encouraging to know

because the fight's not over. I mean, PornHub was criminally charged by the US federal government for intentionally profiting from the sex trafficking of over 100 victims in a notorious crime ring, a trafficking ring called Girls Do Porn. Now, the guy that was running the ring was on the FBI's Most Wanted list, and he was a partner with Pornhub for years. I mean, he had 800,000 subscribers. They had 600 million views on Pornhub. And so the federal government did investigate this, they criminally charged them. And this was in December of 2023. So you could look up DOJ Pornhub charges and you can see that

if you want to. Unfortunately, this was only about the specific victims that were represented by this particular crime ring. And there's so many more victims who are awaiting justice to be fully served. And so I hope that what we'll see the wheels of justice turn slowly, but they do turn. And I think that we're not done with this fight for justice yet. And I think they will turn. And I think we will see full criminal prosecution of the owners of Pornhub and I hope that we do because when that happens there's going to be a huge deterrent to other abusers and I think that's a key

point here is that deterrence is so important and we've seen it in other industries when there's accountability, think about the hedge fund insider trading, right? When we saw criminal prosecution, when we saw huge fines, we've seen it diminish, right? Yeah. Look, to me, I ran an insurance company for 15 years.

We sold, I've been in insurance for, since day before 9-11. And I've been in that space. And we would, I'm around a lot of sales guys. We're in 50 states, we licensed 60,000 insurance agents, a lot of young men. We were half, 54% women, 46% men. A lot of husbands and wives got married.

And one of the common challenges while you're sitting there mentoring a young guy or you're in a sales office walking around, can't tell you how many times I walked in on people watching porn, okay? And look, it's the direction we're going. It's gonna be there. AI is gonna take you to a different level.

Virtual reality is gonna take you to a different level. Relationships with AI where people, look at the number of birth rates going lower, where we're having fewer kids because we have more TV time, more ways of not having the, people are on their phones more than they're talking to their girl or their wife or their husband, they're just like stuck like this.

Normally if that wasn't there, they'd be spending time together. So this eliminating porn is gonna be very difficult to do. My biggest challenge with this space is going to be underage. I have zero, I have zero. I don't have any tolerance for it. Zero tolerance when it comes down to that. Zero. My entire conversation with them was, okay, so now you run one of the bigger sites. If you're running one of the bigger sites,

that traffic comes through you. What if laws can force you to do the right thing? Because if they don't go to Pornhub, that traffic's going somewhere. It's going to go somewhere. What if laws can force you to do the right thing? Because if they don't go to Pornhub, that traffic's going somewhere. It's gonna go somewhere. What if that becomes a standard and enforcing all the other companies that are benefiting from it to say, here's the guidelines you have to follow?

Because you can take this guy down who's selling cocaine to everybody in the community, somebody else is gonna go sell that cocaine. It's gonna go, some's gonna happen. Versus getting to the bottom of it and saying, where's the cocaine coming in from? Where's the fentanyl coming in from? Where are we selling this stuff?

What do we do with the damages that this is taking place? I posted something the other day which obviously is not, constitutionally it's illegal. I said, this whole illegal immigration stuff, if somebody commits a crime in America and you're a US citizen, whatever the laws, you get the crime. But if you commit a crime in America and you're, if you want to pull it up Rob in one of my tweets, and you're an illegal immigrant, I think the punishment should be five to ten times. And if it has to do with anything to do with kids, rape, anything, you go to jail for the rest of your life, zero tolerance. Come do that on our homeland. You get death penalty done. Don't touch

our kids, don't touch our women, don't mess with them. You're going straight to jail and even at the highest level death penalty. And obviously that's a little extreme for some people. It's my position. I think there needs to be some kind of a punishment if you mess with this great country that we're living in right now. Yeah, this is the one. Well, I appreciate your passion for justice. I think I can see that. I'm not okay with that. I'm not okay with that because, and the other part is educating. Like when I joined the army, I'll never forget when I joined the army, our drill sergeant taught us, I was 18 years old, we're at a unit and they said, hey guys, before you have

sex with a girl, ID them. Can you imagine how weird of a thing that is to say? Like, what do you mean? He says, before you're gonna go, because you're gonna go out, you're gonna have a lot of interaction with girls. They like guys in uniform. ID them, don't do anything.

That's kind of weird. Why? Everybody's asking why, why? If they tell you they're 18, don't believe it, until you see the ID. And then you see a couple guys, that fear they put in the young men, it was like, dude, you know, some of us are like a deterrent, right? You know it for some of us to go 30 and up

We're like look, I'm just gonna be like, you know, look over 30 I'm playing the other game to be a little bit safer so I don't have to worry about it now This is a team we live in a different kind of a life, but some guys are like nah, it's gonna be alright It's gonna be alright. Boom. God got arrested went to military jail Let me tell you that scared the crap out of a lot of people very quickly But you also need to shape the mindset of young kids of what's possible, right? My son right now is learning how to fight and he's a very good fighter right now. It annoys me because he kicks me So when I'm he's 12 years old, he still thinks he can beat daddy

I'll whoop his tail right now still but I think he's got two more years before it's gonna be dangerous for me to threaten him If we fight but I had he's got two more years before it's gonna be dangerous for me to threaten him if we fight. But I had a talk with him last night. I said, listen, bro, just because I'm having you train with these UFC guys and you're getting very good, you mess around anything in school, you do something. There is not suspension.

You're getting kicked out of school. You can't be using this weapon that you're learning here. This is not a joke what you're learning. You can really hurt somebody. He says, no, I get it, dad. I said, listen, you just gotta realize, we'll make the investment, but make sure this is to prevent fights, not to have fights. So someone needs to coach these young men. Someone needs to

have, it's preventative, right? It's as much preventative as it is, you know, because we have to be proactive. Like a lot of parents I talk to, I'm afraid to talk to my kids about sex. Well, you better do because somebody else will. I'm afraid to talk to my kids about sex. Well, you better do because somebody else will. I'm afraid to talk to my kids about drugs. You better talk to them before somebody else does. Well, I'm just worried about it. It's embarrassing. It's uncomfortable.

No, you got to do it. So I think it's both preventative. I think it's both proactive. And then at the same time, making sure the punishment for underage is so high that scares the crap out of companies to say. But not only underage. I think we need it for also, because adults are definitely suffering from, I mean.

If you're saying revenge porn and stuff like that, of course, any. Rape, trafficking. All of it. No, to me, it's underage dad, but rape is rape across the board. Doesn't matter how old you are, young or old. Human trafficking is human trafficking. For anybody that's doing any of that, that to me is the highest level.

Underage, when some of these guys are doing that, to make the money. Yeah, I mean, there's a spectrum of abuse. Well, let me give this data. Let me give this data. Let me give this data, because you just said that, I was gonna wrap up, but I'll give you this data. So you ready?

So as of 2023, global US sex and trafficking statistics, approximately 49.6 million individuals are estimated to be in modern slavery worldwide, encompassing forced labor and sex trafficking, of which 12 million are children, of which 54% of those are women, girls, in modern slavery. It's a $150 billion industry and then it breaks down to say in America, the states, number one is California, number two is Texas, number three is Florida. Each state I've lived in a minimum of four years. But as you go a little bit deeper, you see it's also happening on adults. The percentage of what's going on with adults, because typically you think about human trafficking, you think underage.

There's a lot that's above 18 years old that this is happening to as well. This is a real issue. I would be very curious to know whether it's Pam Mundy, Trump, any of those guys. I think Musk is not one that's a fan of this at all. Neither is Vivek, neither is Trump, it would be very interesting to see how the current administration attacks this issue that is an epidemic that very few people have the courage to talk about. And even when we do these types of podcasts, right, people say, they'll message me, Pat, get off this topic, it's painful to watch. You gotta watch it, it's real.

But go back to the business stuff and all this other stuff. Look, I'm doing it because I want parents to be aware that this is out there and we have to get more educated. I appreciate that so much that you're doing that, that you're shining this light because there's nothing, we can't stop it, we can't prevent it, and I love your heart for prevention because this can't be a game of whack-a-mole if we're gonna solve a problem at scale

And we're talking about online sex trafficking or talking about online sexual abuse There are solutions that can prevent it at scale and I think that that's what we really need to focus on Yes, justice, but also like you just said prevention prevention is the key and thank you for shining a light Thank you for using your platform. Because what I've seen, what I've learned is that this movement needs all of us. And the businessman who has a platform, the lawmaker, the journalist, the lawyer, everybody. Including everybody at home who could simply click share, click like, make a comment. It actually means something. No, for sure. Again, share this with everybody and folks click on a link below go order the book take down and

support Layla because you know Layla's got her own set of things that she has to deal with family you talked about you know kids and all the things that you're doing to dedicate your time to something like this and get to the bottom of it and having some powerful people that are coming after and targeting you, it's not easy to do. So if you wanna support her, please go order a book that just came out a few months ago, support Take Down Inside the Fight to Shut Down Pornhub

for Child Abuse, Rape, and Sex Trafficking. Leila, I'm glad I responded and I'm glad you reached out for us to sit down and have this conversation. You're amazing, keep at it. Thank you. Anytime, take care everybody, bye bye bye bye. You're amazing. Keep at it. Thank you. Anytime. Take care, everybody. Bye bye. Bye bye. You're going to think I'm crazy when I tell you this, but the last 13 and a half years, I've been working on my first fiction book to write ever. Fiction book to write. And

while I finished this book, a year ago, I got the strangest phone call about one of the characters in a book where the guy wanted to meet with me and he read the book. And afterwards it's like, wait a minute, am I the villain in the book? This is a story about a character named Asher, who is half Armenian, half Assyrian, whose father was involved in the Iranian revolution, linked to Savak, working with the Shah, that they escape and he gets recruited

to a secret society. Well, when you go to the secret society, it's been around for a couple thousand years, they've developed some of the craziest leaders of all time, and they test you. There's unique tests that they have at this society where they test to see your emotional mental toughness. One of the tests that they have is very rigorous. It's purely mental. Of course, there's a physical one, but one is mental and emotional.

If you're Armenian, if you're Syrian, if you're Persian, this is a book you're gonna be reading and saying, holy moly, this the kind of stuff you talk about in here? Yes. If you're somebody that's fascinated by history, this is a book for you. Characters, there's a technology that this society, secret society builds, where you go into a vault, I won't spoil it for you, when you go down,

they have a technology where you get to sit down and watch and have a three, four-hour conversation with Tupac. You can set up a debate between Karl Marx and Ayn Rand. Karl Marx is in the book who wrote Communist Manifesto. Ayn Rand, who wrote Atlas Shrugged, is in the book. Marilyn Monroe explains the concept of seduction and sex in the book. When you read the book, it's about development of the next leaders in the world and how they do it and how they've been doing it for many years. And it's also about how to prevent the end of civilization and how this organization goes about doing it.

So I've never written a parenting book before, but if I ever wrote a parenting book, this is the closest thing to it because it's all mindset, a lot of crazy stories. Again, 13 and a half years. Trust me, I told myself, I will not publish this book until I sell my insurance company and I'm fully disconnected from it, where it's no longer my responsibility 100%. When you read this, if you're a creative person, if you like fiction books, if you enjoyed Atlas Shrugged, if you enjoy Divergentgent if you like books like that. I think you can enjoy Reading this book. It's the creative side

Business books is very easy. Here's how you do it. Here's another this how it works This is very creative if you haven't placed your order yet now you can order it on simon and schuster amazon I'm going to put the link up below somewhere here. Maybe even in my profile go order the book and read it. I Sincerely, I've never written a book where I can't wait to read your reviews to see what you think about this book. So I'm going on this wild journey and we have some plans with this book here. If you support the things that I work on, I would appreciate you going on reading the book, order the book on Amazon, and then post a review.