PBD Podcast - Trump's Liberation Day Tariff HEATED Debate w/ Sam Seder | PBD Podcast | Ep. 570

Starting point is 00:00:00 Did you ever think you would make it? I feel I'm so good, so I can take sweet victory Know this life meant for me Adam, what's your point? The future looks bright My handshake is better than anything I ever signed, right here You are a 101? My son's right there I think I've already said this before

Starting point is 00:00:24 Okay, so episode 570 We have a very rich man here today, Sam Seder. He's a guy that loves rich people. Anybody that's a billionaire, his favorite people, absolute big fan. And he's going to tell us why today we've had him on before. I always respect anybody that is willing to come on, may have opposing ideas to sit down have a conversation Sam It's great to have you back on here again. It's it's a pleasure to be here I just want to say that some of my best friends are rich people. I believe you I believe that you have a lot of rich friends trust me

Starting point is 00:00:55 I believe you now the question is you want them to get taxed 90% But we'll have that conversation as well gang a lot of top marginal rate of 90 of 90 percent right, but you're rich too, Sam. Oh no, I am rich as well. You're rich too. Okay, we got a lot of stories to talk about. Sam is obviously a diehard fan of Elon Musk. He wants to give some more praise to him today.

Starting point is 00:01:19 We'll talk a little bit about him. We'll talk about terrorists with Liberation Day. One of the stories CNBC host hits Trump with insult. He'll hate, amid tanking, stock market. We'll talk about that story. Frustration grows with Commerce Secretary Howard Lutnick ahead of Trump's tariff announcement. Loose cannon with half-baked ideas. Another story about private companies added 155,000 jobs in March, more than expected ADP says, Hooters bankruptcy, devastating for a lot of people, $376 million debt and

Starting point is 00:01:52 restructuring. Charlie Javis must wear an ankle monitor despite her budding Pilates career judge rules. Gen Z is facing a career apocalypse. Stephen A. Smith drops Mountain of Receipts on MSNBC writer who called his MAGA mouthpiece. ESPN's Monica McNutt claims Kaitlyn Clark is popular because she's a white girl from middle America. This TikTok deal is getting very interesting. We don't know whether Amazon is going to abide, whether Andreessen Horowitz is going to abide, whether they're both going to be involved. There's a lot of interesting people saying they're going to abide, so eventually one

Starting point is 00:02:29 person will. Who that is, we don't know. There are a couple of stories here with Vanguard. Sam Seder gets real about Anna Kasparian and Cenk Uygur spills the tea on the young Turks. I think that may be an older story, but we'll cover that anyway since it's been a couple years Elon Musk to the five on Tesla attacks We know who is behind it and we are coming for them Obama was working against Kamala Harris behind the scenes Didn't think she could win new book reveals

Starting point is 00:03:00 Nevada school ban ban Nevada schools ban trans athletes from girls sports and major reversal from state. We'll cover that part and then we got a couple of the stories here. Democrats approval rating remains low point. Unhinged Jasmine Crockett roasts herself by admitting she is a DEI hire. Which story is that? Sky News. Trump administration freezes funding to Maine for letting trans athletes in girl sports, massive layoffs, hitting health agencies that track disease and regular food.

Starting point is 00:03:35 Female fencer takes a knee, forfeits and protests of transgender opponents. Texas high school football star. This is a devastating story. Austin Mitcaf, stabbed in the heart, left to die in twins brother arm at track meet. And the dad react. This is going to be a tough one to watch folks when we go through it. We're talking about it right before the podcast. Elon Musk's 24 hours, a Wisconsin Supreme Court loss, Tesla's sales plunge and reports he may soon leave role in Trump's White House.

Starting point is 00:04:05 Yahoo News will cover that story and then Nashville Police and Final Report downplay covenant shooters, transgender identity, hatred of Christianity. That's a daily wire story and we got a few other things I will cover as well. Before we get into the podcast guys, we want a million people to support the future looks bright gear. We are getting very close to it. We got something unique that came in. Just so you guys know, I only, and I mean I only, wear the Valuetainment wallet. This is all I have.

Starting point is 00:04:32 I think Adam's the same as well. But we got these new wallets that are RFID protected wallets to have with different Future Looks Bright signs on it. Rob, if you can go through, we got the red one, we got the black one. If you can go to all the colors so they can see it, beige, blue, gray, brown, you name it. We have it here.

Starting point is 00:04:53 Anybody that places an order with these RFID wallets, you're gonna get a leather keychain added to it with the Valuetainment logo design on it. Again, you support the brand, you follow what we do. If you believe like we do that the future looks bright, go support the gear. These will not last a long time, just like the leather backpack did on Tuesday.

Starting point is 00:05:12 That thing went in no time. Go place your order, carry your wallet with this RFID wallet protector, future looks bright. Okay, all right, so let's get right into it. Sam, question for you. From the last time you were here I think it was two years ago. Yeah, it was give or take two years ago the at the time it was probably a

Starting point is 00:05:33 Terrible season for Trump. I think we can say Trump wasn't having a lot of victories Trump was at a very low Republicans were not convinced that he could go Republicans were thinking it's probably gonna be. Republicans were thinking it's probably going to be DeSantis or it's going to be somebody else. There was a bit of a split in the Republican Party and the MAGA, like I don't know. Even when he opened up his announcement that he's running at Mar-a-Lago, there was not a lot of people there. People were saying, I don't even know, this person wasn't there, that person wasn't there,

Starting point is 00:05:58 this person wasn't there. And then you get these CNN polls. Rob, if you can pull up the CNN video showing where the Democratic Party is at today, play this clip and I want to ask you, Sam, what happened to the Democratic Party? Go for it. Holy Toledo! Voters' views of the Democrats in Congress among all voters disapproved 68 percent. And look at the approved number, just 21 percent, even lower than the Democratic Party at large.

Starting point is 00:06:25 This is the lowest on record for Democrats according to Quinnipiac University polling. You think these numbers are bad, let's go to this side of the screen. Well look how Democratic voters feel. Get this, the plurality of Democratic voters disapprove of Democrats in Congress at 49% and just 40% approve. Horrible, horrible, horrible. Oh my goodness gracious, you just can't get worse than these numbers.

Starting point is 00:06:49 And this is the number right here, really driving all of this. If Democrats have turned, if Democratic voters have turned on Democrats in Congress and the Democratic party, that's what puts the numbers at historic lows. What is it they wanna be seeing these voters? What is going on?

Starting point is 00:07:03 I'll tell you what's going on. They don't like what's coming out of some of those Senate Democrats like Chuck Schumer because take a look at the direction of the party. Democratic voters on Democrats in Congress doing too little to oppose Donald Trump. Look at this. 77% should stay principled even if it means nothing gets done in Washington DC. 65% and this 65% is such a difference from where we were in 2017 at this point, when just 33% of Democrats say they should stay principled compared to 59%

Starting point is 00:07:31 who said they want to compromise. Democrats do not want compromise at this point. They want a fighter. They want to go into the ring like Muhammad Ali did against Sonny Liston. They want to take down the Republicans. They do not want this compromise anymore. They want to be more like Republicans, get up to that stage and fight and right now they feel like their leaders in Congress

Starting point is 00:07:48 Are simply put not doing so and that is why their approval rating for congressional Democrats is that all-time? Okay, even among Rob if you want to pause that some Sam what happened? What happened to the Democratic? Well, I I should start by saying I Always thought that Trump would be the nominee. Two years ago I was wondering why Ron DeSantis was lighting his career on fire by trying to run against Donald Trump, to be honest with you. I think Trump and the Republican Party, I think they're one and the same. So that doesn't surprise me.

Starting point is 00:08:21 Those numbers are some of the most encouraging numbers I've seen in the 20 some odd years I've been doing this because I want to see it communicated to democratic leadership that we want you to fight. And I've been riding Chuck Schumer for 10 years trying to get him... I mean, Harry Reid was a great, I think, as far as they go, leader of the Senate for Democrats, but I think it's time for new leadership in the Democratic Party. This is not even ideological from my perspective. I think there are Democrats that I agree with and Democrats that I disagree with on an ideological

Starting point is 00:09:09 standpoint. But I think a different generation of Democrats understand that the Republican Party is in transit. There is no negotiating with them. I think the biggest thing that Joe Biden, the biggest mistake that Joe Biden made was following the American Rescue Act Which was a massive boon to the American public we cut child poverty by 45 percent in a year I

Starting point is 00:09:39 Just want to repeat that we cut child poverty by 45 percent in a year repeat that we cut child poverty by 45% in a year. And because of that that act when Biden first got in. You know what Republicans were talking about after we could we passed bills that cut child poverty in a year that extended unemployment benefits that provided food stamps that provided health insurance. Republicans were talking about two books

Starting point is 00:10:08 that the Dr. Seuss publisher decided not to publish. And so in my mind, the Republican Party there is completely bankrupt of ideas, and Joe Biden, instead of pushing through Build Back Better over that summer, he opened the door for the Republicans to give a proposal. That went nowhere for three months. Then he opened the door for Kristin Sinema and Rob Portman to come in and give a proposal.

Starting point is 00:10:36 And that ultimately, I think, is when Democratic voters started getting impatient with Biden because we were thinking $5 trillion, $4 trillion, Joe Manchin was saying $6 trillion, build back better bill. And we never got anything like that. It ended up getting split into the IRA, which was a good bill, but I think insufficient and then infrastructure stuff also important, but insufficient. And so I think what you're seeing is frustration from Democratic voters who are saying, A, you're not fighting.

Starting point is 00:11:10 B, you're allowing the Republicans too much opportunity. Let me ask you this. Do you think- C, we need more government intervention. Do you think it's more that they're not fighting or do you think that their policies are simply bad policies and they're not landing? No, I think it's that they're not fighting. What are their policies are simply bad policies and they're not landing? No, I think it's that they're not fighting. What are their policies?

Starting point is 00:11:27 So, tell me what policies are, like right now the Democratic Party, who is the face of the Democratic Party and what are the top three things you guys stand for? Well, I don't think there is a face of the Democratic Party at the moment. I mean, Chuck Schumer is nominally the, you know, the highest elected Democratic official that's out there. That's not a good sign for you guys. 100%. I agree. I call for him to resign every day.

Starting point is 00:11:58 I don't know that there is a single... I don't think the Democratic Party has coalesced around of agenda this is we're having a uh... where there's a fight uh... within the democratic party would be like that do you have someone you like that you would what you would want to see or do you want to see the capitalistic competitive of philosophy of somebody just comes out unless you would is

Starting point is 00:12:20 because if there is even you right now is a capitalist the understand what I mean by capitalistic like competitive Let's just see who comes out of competition competition capitalism yeah, that's good the competition is yeah, I mean I think yeah, obviously there's gonna be a competition I Anyone you like well I think there are policies that I like that that are expressed by like Sanders and AOC on their tour their anti- oligarchy tour. I mean, obviously, I think there are other, you know, policies that are floating around that that I don't know that

Starting point is 00:12:53 they're necessarily embodied in politicians yet. People are looking, there's a lot of stuff that Tim Walz did in in Minnesota that I think is great. Putting the tampons in the bathroom, which was my favorite. Putting them in the men's bathroom. That was probably one of the best ones. That's the type of policy that I think we need in the country. Tell me what Wallstead that you liked. Substantially, statistically, Wallstead. I think things like lunches for kids, expanding educational opportunities.

Starting point is 00:13:28 Wait a minute, there weren't lunches for kids? There wasn't federal money from the Department of Education? Free lunches for kids? Yeah. Okay. What else? No, let's go. I really want to hear it because a lot of this was federal money that just floated.

Starting point is 00:13:43 I really want to know what other states reject during the expansion of Medicare and Medicaid. I should say Medicaid in Minnesota. He provided for expansion to who specifically to through the ACA to people making 400% of poverty. He's got a... Wait a minute. Medicaid is designed, if I walk in with a broken leg, to a public hospital, right? That Medicaid is there to take care of me if I'm destitute and unable to it.

Starting point is 00:14:17 That's a good thing. And that's exactly the things that California did, and it was already there. What was expanded about that in Minnesota? There's it's it's you're expanding the pool of people who can access Medicaid on a state-by-state basis there's still I don't know half a dozen states Republican states that don't don't allow that expansion of Medicaid. Okay so you're not aware that? So you can, yeah, I'm absolutely aware of it. But what I want to ask you is when you expand the Medicaid, it is a fact

Starting point is 00:14:51 that basically you close the public hospitals. And so what you're talking about the things he did in not true. Oh, yeah, ask Gavin Newsom, ask him what happened to King Drew in Los Angeles. This is well documented. I'm stunned. You can do a choice if you want to close a public, I mean, Andrew Cuomo closed a lot of public hospitals in New York State. That's not a function of Medicaid payments. You want to go take a look at California and King Drew and what happened, Gavin Newsom himself talked about it. I'm not a fan of Gavin Newsom, but you're asking me about Waltz and... No, we didn't ask about Waltz. You were talking when you said you like some of the things

Starting point is 00:15:27 Yes, me what was in what I like about Tim Walt's No, you said you know what it wanted one of the specifics of the things that he did Right. Okay. So but continue with with the following Sam if you don't mind because this is what I'm trying to find out Yeah, so one the Republican Party like you said I knew two years ago that Trump would be a DeSantis, all this other stuff. Right. We were on the same page. I thought it was gonna be him, but a lot of Republicans were a little bit still staying safe and hesitant of whether they were gonna go all in or not the first time you and I

Starting point is 00:15:58 spoke. But today, when I said who do you like, what policies, you said I like what AOC is doing, you said Sanders, anti-oligarchy, all that stuff, right? I have a different, I think, way of looking at politics maybe than you do. It's not for me, like, if a candidate emerges who embraces a wider set of my preferred policies, that's the one I'll support. I don't really get too involved in the individual, frankly. I mean, you know, Joe Biden was not my favorite candidate by a long shot in 2020. The fact that there were coalitions built out of Warren and Sanders supporters that

Starting point is 00:16:49 ended up bringing us a much better set of labor policies than we've seen in my lifetime from my perspective. With the National Labor Relations Board, with just the appointments of people like Abruzzo as the general counsel there, the extension of unions ability to unionize and helping working people in that way, and then the antitrust regime that was largely a function of the Warrenites putting in their people to undermine big concentration of money and power those are big positive So I you know, do I like Joe Biden? No, but I also know that if there are the right coalitions formed that That have

Starting point is 00:17:42 You know influence within the context of an administration, that's good from my perspective. Got it. But to me, like running a business or politics, right? Or it shifts when people all of a sudden look at you and they say, I don't like these ideas anymore. So in the, in the democratic party, you have a lot of different people that would have different policies. Hey, I think we should do this and I think we should do that. Great. more. So in the Democratic Party, you have a lot of different people that would have different

Starting point is 00:18:05 policies. Hey, I think we should do this, and I think we should do that. Great. Obviously it didn't land November 5th, 2024, whether it was Kamala Harris, whether it was the policies, whether it's seven states you lose, battleground states you lose, whether it's the majority. It was a bad loss. It was a humiliating loss.

Starting point is 00:18:20 One could say it was Kamala, one could say it was Obama, one could say it was Biden's step and one could say it's Schumer, one could say it's Pelosi. Let's set that part aside. To me the most basic part is ideas. If someone has ideas that's producing results that people like, they want to continue that, right? And we watched, like if I ask a Democrat, even right now, but I ask you for 15 minutes, I still don't know if Democrats know what they're for.

Starting point is 00:18:49 Like what are their policies for? Well, I'm not speaking for the Democratic Party. I can tell you what I'm for. Tell me what you're for. Oh, I am for universal healthcare, single payer healthcare. I am for increased ability to unionize. I am for decommodifying parts of the housing sector.

Starting point is 00:19:09 I am for decommodifying power. I am for decommodifying access to the internet. I mean, those are my big ones right there. I think if we can- Who in your party is for that? Well, who in the Democratic Party is for that? I don't know that there's anybody in our party who embraces all of those. That is a major political figure.

Starting point is 00:19:36 I think I'm to the left of the Democratic Party, but I think there are elements of what I want that are represented by people in the Democratic Party. I think having a very jaundiced eye to the overwhelming concentration of wealth and wealth disparity I think is a fundamental problem that we have in this country. I think too much of what happens in this country is a function of the concentration of wealth. I mean, that gets back to why I want to return back to the tax regime we had in the 50s and the 60s, where the top marginal rate was 90% for every dollar above in what today's money would be about $4 million.

Starting point is 00:20:28 So and just to explain this, because I've seen so many people on the right, not understand marginal tax rates, that it's almost disturbing. The first million dollars that you earn is taxed at 32%, whatever the prevailing rate is. The second million dollars you earn, 32%. The third, 32%, because I think that's the highest, maybe it's 37% is the highest. Once you get over four million,

Starting point is 00:21:00 every extra dollar after that is taxed at a 90% rate that's what you want that is what we had in this country for several decades in the post why do you think that's good though because we talk because you think that's good I'll tell you because it flattens wealth disparity time and that is when you have the greatest expansion of the economy right when the wealth of the country is shared By as many people as possible obviously it's not everybody gets the same amount But do you think that's a popular idea? Do you think that do you think 80% of Americans want that Americans want that I think if I was to show Americans

Starting point is 00:21:44 If I was to show Americans if I was to show Americans for 20 no no no put up a put up a graph of income disparity right the you put up a graph of income disparity Americans are shocked when they realize how much money yeah is held by the top 1% in this country, really the top 0.1% relative to the rest. I mean like literally a handful of families have more money and more wealth in this country than 50% of the population. There's so many questions to that. For me the question is the following. Here's what I'm trying to go with. I get you show that to 80% of Americans and there's no questions. It's gonna be like what the fuck? You know what else you can show. You can be like, what the fuck?

Starting point is 00:22:25 You know what else you can show? You can't because you're a guest. But you know what else? You can't, C-A-N, you can't, you're a guest. So if you, somebody could go and say, okay, why don't you pull up who pays the most taxes in America? The top 1% pays 50% of taxes in America. Okay? So you can give

Starting point is 00:22:45 that argument. So to me if we go back and forth, but this is the part I want to do with this specific argument, this specific idea, where I want to go with a guy like you, okay, is I think sometimes like the Democratic Party, you go to a message and you know how Trump tests things out. Yeah Greenland, we go to Greenland, Greenland, Greenland, Green go to Greenland Greenland Greenland Greenland Greenland yeah Greenland. It's gonna be we have we so one way or another we're not gonna go to war but woman Yeah, you know a third term. I you know, I'm not talking about third time But a lot of people are talking about third term third term third term

Starting point is 00:23:17 Yeah, you know, you know Canada should just be a fifty-first state governor to do it governor to do governor to do governor to do Trump will throw these things out there, okay? And then the market reacts to it, and the market will say, what the, what is he talking about? And then I believe, this is cause, this is how I do it as a business owner, you kinda, I'll be in front of,

Starting point is 00:23:40 I'll never forget one time I brought nine of my guys and I dropped an idea on them. You should have seen the reaction on everybody. You know what the reaction was. They looked at me like I was high They looked at me like I am on shrooms. They're like Pat respectfully, these are terrible ideas. So, you know what happens to business owner? They're so used to coming up with bad ideas What do they do? They move on with bad ideas. So to me Trump gets up there and says what do you think about this? And then he looks he says okay. What's the guy that I respect? Okay, this guy's pretty reasonable. What did he say? What did she say? Okay, let's move on to the Democratic side somebody like you but I would but let me just finish the point

Starting point is 00:24:15 I'll come to you. Trust me. I want to hear from you to me It's I feel like the Democrats like you okay. You have a voice people watch you You're an influence in your community and you actually have the ability to kind of go and help your community out, help your party out. There are certain policies that you keep pitching that is no longer popular, that's been exposed so many times because what we learned, like the biggest part why some of the conservatives like the Doge concept and some of the Democrats that like the Doge concept

Starting point is 00:24:47 is it's government wasted expenditure. Obama talked about it, Clinton's talked about it, people on the left, they've talked about it for many, many years. And the average person watches this and says, okay, so after four million, you wanna put the tax rate at 90%? Yes, I do.

Starting point is 00:25:03 Okay, so all you're saying is that the government knows how to use my money better than free enterprise I don't believe that well so that's what you are you know that's not the that's not the premise of why I want to do that taxation I mean the government will redistribute the money and that's no longer a popular idea in America. That's the part where you see the young Turks kind of growing and evolving and seeing some of the ideas that kind of is not popular. Listen, the fact of the matter is government always redistributes money.

Starting point is 00:25:38 It always redistributes money. Every government at every moment is redistributing money the question is which direction is that money flowing that's it if there is no doubt the government's redistribute money at every moment the question is which house is directed at it what how successful have they been at it how good are they at it how much waste have they done with redistributing my there's no listen There's no doubt my mind like look we have a massive massive military budget

Starting point is 00:26:09 And if you want to look for waste and fraud in government, that is where you go. That's where all the money is Everybody knows it there's an enormous amount of waste and fraud. They can't even get through an audit How many audits has it been half a dozen? Security, yeah, and they can't pass a single I agree. So security is audited all the time. Do you know how much money? Let's talk about this for a second I watched the video of you guys on the plane down of When Elon Musk was in Wisconsin Blowing up his whole brand essentially and he was on stage with a guy named Garcia.

Starting point is 00:26:45 Do you guys remember this video? Of course. Yeah. Okay, it was like two days ago. Yes, the social security numbers spiking in the last four years. The social security numbers. 2.2 million new non-citizen social security numbers.

Starting point is 00:26:55 Yes, and the amount of misinformation from every single person, all of you, was astonishing to me. What was it? What was the misinformation that was said? Well, I almost feel like we should go Every single person, all of you, was astonishing to me. What was it? What was the misinformation that was said? I almost feel like we should go through the whole video. This is coming from a socialist.

Starting point is 00:27:11 No, no, no. The level of credibility of a socialist, a system that has never worked. Wait, listen to me. But I wanna hear you. That is anti-Oleg Artsyarionov. But I wanna hear you. I wanna hear you.

Starting point is 00:27:21 I wanna hear you. Go for it. First off, you seem to not understand that these were not undocumented immigrants who were getting these social security numbers. They are non-citizens. Now, when you came to this country, you were an immigrant. Your parents came.

Starting point is 00:27:40 Legally. Every single one of those people who got those social security numbers are here legally. They're not citizens, just like you weren't when you first came to this country. You get a green card, your parents get a green card, they go through a process. All of those people. And to understand, they got their Social Security card. I really want to see your point.

Starting point is 00:28:02 Well, the point is, you referred to them as undocumented and illegal, you did. No, I said non-citizen. Excuse me. Don't say everyone here, I said non-citizen. Correct yourself. I can't remember which one of you got it wrong. I think you did.

Starting point is 00:28:14 You're thinking, but I don't. We can play the video and go through it, but. I'm still trying to get to the point. Well, the point is they're not illegal, they're not undocumented, they're all legal. The expansion from that program, the EBE program, which is enumeration beyond entry, was started under the Trump administration. The numbers have gone up because yes, under Biden, as opposed to Trump, there was an expansion

Starting point is 00:28:42 of people who we hear like you're, like you know, probably I'm not sure a lot of a lot of illegal no no excuse me plus million a single one of them breaking number of single hold on you're changing the subject now No, no, I'm not talking about that video. Yeah, and every one of those Social Security numbers Let me ask you a question. So how do you feel about the illegal immigrants that came to us for years? I will get to it. Yeah, you don't care about those people. I will get to the undocumented. You cared about children. But you don't want to talk about this and I don't blame you because it's embarrassing. But let me do a quick time out here.

Starting point is 00:29:12 Let me do a quick time out here. Sam, let me just do a quick time out. You said you don't want to talk about this. You just spun away from a question I asked you and you brought this up. You haven't even addressed the question I asked you. Wait a minute. The point that I add, let's go back to what I asked you. I asked you a question that the money that's going in,

Starting point is 00:29:31 Americans proved that they don't trust the government getting the money than free market, free enterprise. You never addressed that. I don't think that's the case. People love social security. People love Medicare. What did we learn with Doge? The American people said, Sam, enough of you taking our tax money American love Social Security, the people love Medicare. What did we learn with Doge?

Starting point is 00:29:45 The American people said, Sam, enough of you taking our tax money and see what you're doing with it. Elon Musk made that Wisconsin election of a referendum on Doge. To the extent that we've seen anybody vote on Doge, nobody heard the word Doge before November of last year. To the extent that we've seen a referendum on Doge, it just happened in Wisconsin, it

Starting point is 00:30:06 happened in Florida where the where the size of the win by those down a Republican congressman was cut by 1720 points, I mean this is a wipeout and in every rep, you're going to see a difference in Republican lawmakers over the next year and a half because anybody who was in a plus Trump district or less is now starting to go like wait a second that's why must is being shown the door supposedly so getting back to

Starting point is 00:30:39 my point about those Social Security numbers they were given all to legal non citizens and every one of those cards. you can't vote because I think you definitely said and I think maybe you said that this is a democratic strategy to get voters hold on for a second. The Social Security card that they get literally says not legitimate for voting purposes it is so that these on these Non-citizens who are legal that night just like when you came in excuse me pay into the art so security System and get many of them never get that money back I guess so in addition to the undocumented immigrants who pay in twenty two billion dollars a year Into Social Security and get zero back these people pay several $22 billion a year into Social Security and get zero back, these people

Starting point is 00:31:26 pay several billion dollars in a year and only if they become citizens, which most of them won't, most of them will go back home over a period of time, they're here for temporary protected status, maybe some of them are refugees and they get permanent citizenship, they won't get that money either. So every single thing of that video, this video here, was completely wrong that you guys did. It was fascinating to me because I feel like you, at the very least, I believe that you care about the information you're putting out and this was all wrong. And so they're up there. So then this is is all a lie these guys were up there just completely bullshitting with all the numbers they're he's saying that people in the

Starting point is 00:32:11 government people in the government are blowing the whistles he didn't want to say their names he was giving them praise and for some exam for you to say that you care you care about the kids and the labor and all that stuff we've had an open border for four years and all the illegals, way more than 10 million have come into this country. California, is that where you live? No. Where do you live?

Starting point is 00:32:31 I live in New York. Okay, great, even better. California, so the amount of money that we spent on illegals with housing and all that shit and Gavin Newsom passing a law that you don't even need an ID to vote. You're saying that we're coming up with where these people aren't coming in for the votes?

Starting point is 00:32:45 That's the main goal of this whole thing. What was the open border for? Why was the border open for four years? Answer me that question. First of all, the border was not open. Give me a, are you kidding me? Look at the, what do you mean the border wasn't open? Are you, hold on, did you smoke before you came in here?

Starting point is 00:33:01 That's ridiculous. By the way Vinny, here's the part though. You're full of it, bro. Here's the part. Get out of here. Sam, here's the part though. You're full of it, bro. Here's the part. Get out of here. Sam, here's the part when I hear this, okay? Anybody can look at that video, the things you were saying yesterday

Starting point is 00:33:12 was a complete sack of lies. Gorgeous misinformation. Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam,

Starting point is 00:33:23 Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, Sam, You're talking illegal immigration. You're over you. The fact that you're saying the border wasn't wide open. How many deaths have happened? How many Fentanyl deaths have happened per year while your freaking president, Joe Biden, was in office? How many Americans died just from Fentanyl and you're saying the border wasn't wide open? We've had the most illegal entry in four years in the history of the country.

Starting point is 00:33:45 Dude, dude. Alright, I'll answer you. Let me finish. And this is why your party sucks. This is why your party is at 29% approval because you got 20, thank you. Because all you guys do is talk shit and just go anti-Trump. You have no policies. You guys have no vision. You have no leaders. You're talking about oligarchs and you hate the oligarchs. What do you think Bernie Sanders and AOC are gonna get their money from? They're donors. Okay. Like don't lie to yourself. For you to look and like brother you're talking about yesterday we lied. AOC and Bernie Sanders don't take money from those people. Hold on, ready for this? You're saying that we lied two days ago.

Starting point is 00:34:17 You just lied and you're gonna look like a fool that the border wasn't wide open. Look at this chart. What does that chart say to you? What is that? What did Trump, when Trump was in, he was trying to close it, but your party was fighting it. It's unbelievable how many illegals have come in in the past hundred days. But this is the part to just be very, just show the data. Illegal immigration, this is Wall Street Journal, is a bigger problem than ever. Oh no, that's fake news. These five charts explain why. No, no, no, no Trump got shot trying to show these charts literally. This is October of 2023 go to the next one guy who was registered Here's another one And then I want you to say what you want to go a little bit lower the data right no cuz he said it's inaccurate

Starting point is 00:35:02 This is another one. Okay, well go back up, go back up to the, and then go to the last one, Rob. Go to the last one, Rob. Go to the top one here. I mean, this is the numbers you were talking about. So this is, you can- Start one by one, go up. Explain every one of them, go for it.

Starting point is 00:35:14 Okay, yeah, go ahead. Yeah, you can see that this is what constitutes illegal immigration. These are, if it was an open border, you would not have these numbers. You would not have the numbers to know when Title 42 ends, more people are coming to the border and they're being put into a system, period.

Starting point is 00:35:35 And that's the definition. Because they were told to come, Sam Lemming says, when your president says, come to the country. Is he just gonna yell all the time? No, I'm not yelling. You just give me facts. Can I turn down his microphone? Because it does feel like he's yelling.

Starting point is 00:35:47 You can't, yeah. Just see which one he is. I think he's seat three or which one is it, Rob? Seat three. Seat three. Seat three, go ahead and lower that right there. And then the mic. Right there.

Starting point is 00:35:55 Volume, just lower. Is that good? Is that good? Oh, seat two. There you go. Okay, go for it. All right, go ahead. Okay, go ahead.

Starting point is 00:36:02 All right, so. You're still gonna hear the the truth though. Go ahead. No, I'm happy to can't turn down the truth. Open border would mean that we have no records of people coming across the border. The law in this country has been that if you put your foot in this country, it's a, it's an international law. It's a US law If you put your foot in this country and you apply for asylum you are due a process to do that 98 percent of of those people Who are then what you guys would call catch-and-release? Come back for their hearings. We are woefully understaffed in terms of like

Starting point is 00:36:43 Immigration judges and that process is definitely broken. I would love to see more money spent in the processing of these people so that we can establish which ones like your family. Like my family as well, illegal immigrants. No, no, but came in through a refugee status. They weren't citizens on day one. They came in, they know through a refugee status they weren't citizens on day one they came in they went through a process and they've been and it's possible the at that time i mean i remember you know

Starting point is 00:37:13 i was old enough to remember the iran hostage situation i remember the the the fallout afterwards there may have been some form of temporary uh... protected status whatever was at the time that allows people to come in, then they're assessed and processed. It's determined that yes, their claim for asylum is appropriate or not, et cetera, et cetera. That's what we're looking at there.

Starting point is 00:37:34 As you scroll up on those other charts, you can see when Title 42 ends, which was only supposed to be an emergency situation for half that has to do with health. And you can't have it both ways either covid ends or it doesn't end the pandemic. And so people come in, there's no doubt. And that number on that chart that Musk had under Biden, more people receive temporary protected status. We had a problem in Haiti as the country has fallen apart

Starting point is 00:38:08 You had people from Ukraine coming in because of obviously the invasion These are all under temporary protected status They all got social security numbers so they could pay taxes into our government and not necessarily get the services back And vote for them. No, they can't vote. Those Social Security cards literally say, on the card say, you can't use this for voting. AOC said, we don't have an illegal immigration problem. We have a documentation problem. That's what AOC said.

Starting point is 00:38:34 So this is not something new. You know how when you talk about who's better at gerrymandering? Who's better at gerrymandering, the left or the right? Republicans seem to be better at that. Republicans are much better at that. I know, I agree, guess what? So it's not like they can fight it and say no, we're not that's their reputation They have it that they're better at gerrymandering

Starting point is 00:38:52 Strategically, they're better at doing that but when for you to sit, I don't have a problem. May I make my When I when you sit here and you watch Yourself when you're saying these policies and you spew out these policies, what the average person does, they'll watch it and if they've already outgrown it because today the problem with, you know, folks, content creators have today is the following. Say we say something on a video and we're wrong. You know what others will do? They'll react to it and they'll say stuff to it. And if we're right, they'll keep coming

Starting point is 00:39:29 to us to want to hear more of it because they'll say, at least you sound reasonable. And they'll say, you know, I want to hear what John has to say. I want to hear what Joe has to say. I want to hear what Megan has to say. I want to hear what, you know, whoever these people are that are giving ideas out there want to to say right? But when you keep saying stuff that others are able to tear apart so many times That a liberal a former liberal watches that maybe was a viewer of you and says How can Sam not see this and outgrow it? He is still stuck on this policy. That's been proven Americans don't want to pay more taxes to a government that wastes their taxes, how does he not see that? How does he keep pushing this agenda back and forth?

Starting point is 00:40:09 Then you lose an audience and the people you keep is the following. Here's who you end up keeping. You end up keeping an audience that makes you think you're right, but that's not always the case. You keep an audience that of course hates rich people, rich people are bad people, and they're probably not making a lot of money and they come to Sam to save them. Hey, let's trash and bash rich people because this is what we got to do. Yes, Sam, let's go after the rich people.

Starting point is 00:40:35 But in reality- Are you talking about me? Because we just had our biggest month. And when people- You had the biggest month because of Jubilee. You were on Jubilee and you were on that show. We've been going back up. No, you were on Jubilee and Jubilee gave you a lot of eyeballs. Oh, Jubilee brought a lot of people agreed. A lot of I mean, I know. I mean, a lot of people agreed that more agree or disagree.

Starting point is 00:40:56 I would say a lot more agreed. Well, you would say that because you're in it. So I mean, you want me to do metrics. We had our biggest subscription. I believe you Jub me to do metrics we had our biggest subscription I believe you can Jubilee helped you okay but my point is is that credit you should say thank you to Jubilee that's a that's a very Jubilee yeah I would also add that like I think there are definitely people who watch my show and then over a period of time are going I disagree with Sam and proudly those people move to the left of where I'm at

Starting point is 00:41:27 you think people move to the left of you hundred percent same do you realize hundred do you realize how how to to make a statement and I love that you said it oh it's true I love that you said it so you think people who age and live longer they go further to the left and to the right you think as people mature mature in life... Am I the oldest person on this? No you're not. I'm pretty close. No you're pretty far. It's just the other guy looks very young. But you as you... How old are you? He's 62. You got me by three years. Yeah so you're not. So you're 59 dude. Good for you. But do you think as people age they become more conservative or more liberal more leftist? I think it changes with generations. No, that's not the case. There is a

Starting point is 00:42:13 Evident more of one or the other do you think like it's asking a question Do you think as we age do our bones get stronger or weaker? They get weaker as we age do we become more leaning? Okay.? This is a chart perfect. Thank you for that pure research as we age We become more conservative But to you the more you age the more you become progressive and leftist see that's the part where Americans as they age and go through You may have a very nice audience that finds you this I think if you look at this chart And first of all you also notice that like the dynamic shifts right if what you were saying was

Starting point is 00:42:49 true 70 to 79 would be a greater Republican favor than 60 to 69 good I don't know what to tell you but but I will also tell you I'm looking at the numbers you put up on this graph! 18 to 24 is 34, then it goes to 32. Oh my god, you know, they became more liberal. Because they went to college and they screwed up their brains. And then they go to 40 to 47, 50, 50. Oh, they dropped to 51 and they go to 58.

Starting point is 00:43:18 Nope, they're becoming more liberals at 70 to 79. Do you know why 70 to 79 become more liberal? Do you know why 70 to 79 becomes more liberal? Do you know why 70 to 79 becomes more liberal? Do you know why 70 to 79 becomes more liberal? Yes, because they're getting Social Security. Exactly. So they got to protect it so they're like, hey man, at least, yeah, I agree, but still at 80 plus they're more conservative. You know why 80 plus they're more conservative? I will also suggest to you that it has to do with the years that you grow up in. It's the same thing I said to you last time as well.

Starting point is 00:43:46 People 50 to 59 grew up in a Reagan era and a Thatcher era. And as in the wake of that, you can see that people are more progressive, increasing. Why did Charlie Kirk blow up so much the last four years? Specifically 18 months. Why did he blow up on TikTok out of all the places? How do you blow up on TikTok? Do you know he was the most viewed Jubilee out of all of them?

Starting point is 00:44:10 Did you see that Milo? Can you see how many views Charlie Kirk got on Jubilee? But this is just absolute. Why do you think Charlie Kirk blew up though? I have theories. I wanna hear it. How did he start? How did Charlie Kirk start?

Starting point is 00:44:28 I don't care how he started. I'm asking how he's finishing. How did he grow up so much in the last 18 months? Going to colleges, speaking in front of colleges? How did that TPU essay get started? Tell us. Let's see what angle you're going to. I actually want to hear what he says because I'm watching these two times.

Starting point is 00:44:45 He got paid by a billionaire to start that organization. Oh, got it. It's just the truth. So there's no conviction. Listen, there's nothing wrong with it. So there's no conviction on what Charlie does. No, no. I'm sure there's conviction in what Charlie does.

Starting point is 00:44:56 Why did Charlie do so in the last 18 months? I mean. Why do you think? A 20-year-old guy, why is he blown up the way that he is? Why is this? Well, he's not 20. He's in his 20s. 28 years old, 29, 30 years old. No, he's 30 now, but he? Why is this? Oh, he's not 20. He's in his 20s. 28 years old, 29, 30 years old.

Starting point is 00:45:06 No, he's 30 now. He's 30 now, but he started when he was 20. Yeah. The last two years he was in his 20s. Why has he blown up so much? I mean, I think there's a lot of money circulating on the right. But he started when he was 18. He got from 24 U.S.A. and he was 2012.

Starting point is 00:45:18 Sam, to blame it on the money, what about his voice, his reason, his rationale? He went for a bright bar. He was compelling. By the way, so here's a question. Here's a question. So you think if you got the same money, Charlie Goddard, you would have the same views? Yeah, I think, you know, I saw Milo Yiannopoulos on Tim Pool about a month or two ago talking talking about how the daily wire got so big and he said, this is Milo Yiannopoulos, well he said, he said in the right wing content era, he said, we buy, we buy bots, we buy views,

Starting point is 00:46:04 we buy, I mean I knew, I'm telling you what Milo Yiannopoulos said. This is what he said. Pull it up. And he said, we fake it till we make it. And that's why he's non-existent anymore. He used to be a big voice. Now you don't hear nothing about him. Sam, respectfully, there's something called giving credit where credit is due. Regardless of where Charlie got his money. Hold on, hold on, hold on. respectfully, there's something called giving credit where credit is due, regardless of where Charlie got his money. Hold on, hold on. I don't care. It's great. I'll give him credit. Charlie Kirk, but it's made a lot of money, but that's not where the credit is due. What do you want me to say? And I don't even know how much money he's made.

Starting point is 00:46:36 The point is he's motivated a lot of people. That's what the, where the credit should be done. He's changed the hearts and minds of people on campuses. He would arguably be the number one reason that Trump flipped Arizona to not give someone credit for the good work they've done and blame it on a billionaire. Must money flipped Arizona. You look at, TPUSA played heavily in the Carrie Lake race. Huge. And the biggest, the widest loss they had was people under the age of 30. Okay.

Starting point is 00:47:11 So you don't want to give Charlie any credit? I don't care. Sam, hold on. Give him all the credit in the world. Sam, before being a nihilist. I'll give him a trophy. Sam, you've had, let me just ask this question. What does he want?

Starting point is 00:47:20 He can take the car. Sam, I don't think Charlie needs anything. Charlie won on TikTok. Let me just ask this question. He can take the Sam We're right here, but Charlie needs anything. Yeah, Sam So billionaire gives Charlie money and he automatically wins, okay I got a question for you explain how mark Benioff puts money in the time magazine and it goes down. I Don't know who mark Benny office. I have a red time magazine and Well, you should get around more. It's unfortunate come out of the echo chamber mark Benioff isn't one of the most successful Entrepreneurs of all time who used his money after his business success

Starting point is 00:47:51 And he went and he buys time magazine because he wants to push liberal views and values and the thing craters he would well then Hit him up for money getting out of my Hit him up for money. We'll be getting out of my bubble, right? Yeah, but you know what it is, Sam? I like to give everybody the benefit of the doubt. I truly do. And I try to look at the only one you can succeed in business and in life and in sales,

Starting point is 00:48:14 like you're developing other people, is you have to always look at the best of everybody. You don't have a choice. As a parent, you have to always look at the best of your kids. You don't have a choice for them to do their best, to always look at the best of your kids. You don't have a choice for them to do their best, right? And I truly want to look at you and look at it from the part of the best to say capable, great communicator, temperament is solid.

Starting point is 00:48:39 You go through it. I want to see all the good with you. But the part where you sit there and you realize some policies don't work, the young Turks. What policies don't work? Go to the- Name a policy that I support that doesn't work. What do you think about- 90% tax rates, I would start there. Like I say, when we have those in this country,

Starting point is 00:48:58 everybody can look this up. We had what was known as the great compression. It was the greatest? The largest expansion of our of our economy and the lowest well Do you think we had in the history of this country? I don't know how you would define it any other than a six Let me ask you a question. Let's stay right here in this 90% tax at 90% So top marginal okay, I'm with you so you get to keep 10% No, no, no 10% Marginal after four million. Okay. No. Well, here we go. I'm gonna ask you a question like stay with me for a second

Starting point is 00:49:31 You just said you had a great month great quarter, right? Like you jubilee was Billionaires, you know what billionaires are Profit revenue did you make in the last quarter because you've went viral so many times how much I mean I don't know but I would guess it's somewhere around tens of thousands tens of doubt so not millions tens of thousands okay so what are you gonna do with that extra 30 grand hundred grand what are you gonna do with it we're gonna hire another person oh so you're gonna expand well I don't know if we're gonna expand but I I'm gonna I'm gonna

Starting point is 00:50:04 probably I mean you're gonna invest well I may invest know if we're gonna expand but I'm gonna I'm gonna probably I mean You're gonna invest well, I may invest in this. You're not just gonna bear it in the sand. You're gonna use it. Okay Here's the problem. Yeah, this is the company. These are pre-tax dollars when I say 90 cents on every dollar I'm talking individual tax. So these ideas this is not about corporate tax It wouldn't impact anything you're saying about the business But go ahead, but we're talking about taxes in general No, no, there's a difference between personal taxes and corporate tax well if you have an s-corp it flows through to the individual So it's the same thing. How are you registered with the with the?

Starting point is 00:50:43 Same as individual but respect to you. But you can't take- See, we don't have a problem with you making money and getting rich. We'll be okay with that. Honestly, I'm a little disappointed. It was only tens of thousands of dollars. I wish it was millions of dollars. I wish the best for you.

Starting point is 00:50:54 But here's the problem why you can't tax your way to making everybody wealthy. No, no, no. I'm not taxing my way to making everybody wealthy. I am taxing... Understand, the 90% tax rates on every dollar after four million is to deal with wealth disparity in this country because I believe the more you concentrate wealth, the more you concentrate political power. Why four million? And I believe in democracy.

Starting point is 00:51:19 Why four million? Just because that's what we had for 15, 20 years in this country. I mean, it was 470,000 in 1940. Just because I'm a student of history and I really appreciate Ronald Reagan. Do you know the Reagan story of why he ended up running for governor and for president? Do you know the whole tax story? Let me give it to you real quick. I know the story of GE sending him around to fight against Medicare.

Starting point is 00:51:42 Okay, but that's not the story we're talking about. The tax story that Ronald Reagan basically was like, holy crap, because everything with taxes has to do with incentives and motivation. So the story with Reagan was the following. The top marginal tax rate back in the 40s and 50s when Ronald Reagan, before he became a governor, he was a famous what? Actor. Actor. There we go. We're on the same page. Be actor. Was $200,000. And the equivalent of $200,000

Starting point is 00:52:11 today is 2.5 million. So at $200,000, the top marginal tax rate was your favorite number. 90%. 90%. We're going somewhere. So do you know his famous quote? I'll do two movies a year. I get paid $100,000 per movie tell me why I should go make a third movie Because if you're gonna tax me at 90% and you know what you shouldn't you've seen exactly we didn't know no no No, don't go there guy. Don't go there guy numbers if you don't want to no no no no no No, I'm make it stop it. The reason he wouldn't make the movie is because he would only keep 10% He said famously I can make freaking gone with the wind. I wouldn't keep any of the money It has to do with you said stick carrots and sticks if you don't incentivize people if you don't incentivize entrepreneurs Yeah, why would they work harder? Okay, why would they invest so you just had a great incentive you killed it

Starting point is 00:53:05 You made 10 Take your metaphor do something with that money So what happens when Ronald Reagan gets to that threshold of the of the wealthiest of the wealthy in the country? Because that's what it takes right to be making four million dollars a year You're making up four million dollars a year. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,

Starting point is 00:53:24 no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, Top percent is about six hundred five hundred. Okay. So you're in the top point five percent of the just like you're in the top One point percent of a podcast or you're doing great top point five percent What happens when Ronald Reagan decides? I'm only gonna make two movies a year is

Starting point is 00:53:57 You get an opportunity to be that actor Gets the opportunity to make that money so So shittier actors get more opportunities. It sounds like DEI. No, it's not. Believe me, I've been out in LA. The best actors don't necessarily get every role. And so it gives an opportunity to spread the wealth. That's exactly what I'm talking about.

Starting point is 00:54:16 It's about centralized subjective fairness on the altar of greed and jealousy. That's what it is. Because it's not fair that all of these people work their ass off and did and achieve something we have to stop them and go get someone else who maybe isn't working hard that's so unfair are you telling me that there aren't enough hard-working actors who get your stick no it's not what you're saying I'm asking you a question here because it's about greed and jealousy, isn't it? So the greed that you attack is the greed that you have.

Starting point is 00:54:51 You're sitting there, these people must have been greedy, they got all this money and everything, and you're envious and you're greedy for their money, so we're going to take it from them. It should be 90%. They'll keep making, oh, but that's good because now we've stopped them from making good movies. I think it's pretty obvious to everybody how jealous I am of all of you. 90% they'll keep making oh but that's good because now we've stopped them from making good movies. I think it's pretty obvious to everybody how jealous I am of all of you. No it's not. Not everyone.

Starting point is 00:55:11 But your point about incentives. That is why Ronald Reagan brought in Arthur Laffer. The Laffer curve. Yes of course. Explain it. The Laffer curve says that the higher you go up on taxes the lease incentive there is for people to make money yeah or to try harder to turn more and work harder to stay late and be an

Starting point is 00:55:32 entrepreneur exactly try to build something going but the lower you have taxes you can actually lower taxes and you'll get more revenue because these people are going to actually be more incentivize because they get to keep more arthur laffer was the key adviser to Sam Brownback when he became governor of of of Kansas in 2012. You can look this up people just have to Google Sam Brownback Kansas 2012 what happened with the great Kansas experiment he did

Starting point is 00:56:00 exactly what author Laffer said he slashed taxes slash taxes for s-corps, etc Within I think it was two or three years the Republican legislature rose taxes Because revenues had cratered so badly and they had so destroyed What was once the jewel of Kansas their education system their higher education system. They rose taxes their education system, their higher education system, they rose taxes. Well, there you go. I mean, there it is. Kansas provides compelling evidence of the failure of supply-side tax cuts, which is exactly what you're at. Do you know how many case examples I can show of cutting taxes helps states, helps companies, helps people?

Starting point is 00:56:38 Yes, please show me one. How do you think this company that we're sitting... Hold on, Sam. Show me the state. Sam, hold on. Google the state. You want to throw out some... How do you think this company that we're sitting, hold on, Sam, hold on. Google the state. You want to throw out some, how do you think this company right here? Wait, wait, wait, no, let him say that and respond to it, okay? So for example, where are we at right now?

Starting point is 00:56:52 What state? Florida. Okay. Can you tell me why out of all the 50 states in America in 2024 that voted for president, why did 5450 state become more Republican? Can you tell me why out of 50 states that voted for president in 2024, can you tell me why the two states that lost the most people, the only two states in America that lost a trillion dollars of money on their management,

Starting point is 00:57:14 that left their states to another state like Nevada, Texas, and Florida, can you tell me why those two states, imagine New York and California, during COVID, lost a trillion dollars of wealth that left to other states. And even after all those people that left, the two states that became more Republican than they were before in 2020 were New York and Texas. Can you tell me why people come to Texas? Why do people go to Nevada? Why do people go to Florida?

Starting point is 00:57:39 Why do you think it is? Is it because maybe they don't have state taxes? Why do you think Arthur Laffer is in Tennessee? Why do you think Musk is in Texas? Why do you think Rogan went to taxes? Why do you think Arthur Laffer is in Tennessee? Why do you think Musk is in Texas? Why do you think Rogan went to Texas? Why do you think California is losing so many jobs? I think it's because of high taxes. I think there are definitely people who like to evade taxes.

Starting point is 00:57:53 It's evade taxes. Evade. Whoa. But no, no. But guys, let me say respectfully, I just figured out who you are. I'm telling you, I just figured out who you are. Deep down inside of you, you have, you are driven by so much power, control, a deep rooted feeling matching the qualities of a communist that wants to tell you what to do and you think you know what's best for others and if it isn't your way, everybody else is wrong

Starting point is 00:58:24 and by the way, an extremely unattractive quality. I'm literally just advocating for higher taxes on super wealthy people. No you're not because what you just said, what you just said, let me just make the point here. You just said people who left California and New York, your first response was, they're evading, as if they have to pay you. That's not how this works, they're evading taxes.

Starting point is 00:58:51 These guys are tax evaders, they left. No, it's called, if a company offers better benefits, are you on Rumble? I think we stream on Rumble. Where do you put your video clips the most? YouTube? YouTube. Why YouTube? That's just what the technology was when we started.

Starting point is 00:59:11 Why don't you do it on Vimeo? We do run it through Vimeo. Why don't you do all your stuff through Vimeo? Why do you do it on YouTube? That's where the most people are. And that's where they pay the best? Well, yeah, I mean that's where we have the most audience. But we have a bigger audience.

Starting point is 00:59:28 You're evading the revenue going to another company. You're such an evader of her. We're on all those platforms. Sponsorship money going to another company that keeps more money of it. You're such an evader. Why are you evading all this sponsorship money? You're such a sponsorship money evader.

Starting point is 00:59:40 Sam Cedar's a sponsorship money evader, everybody. Come on, man. I'm a sponsorship evader. What is it? What did you call it? No, you call people leaving California tax evaders. I think there's a lot of people who leave high tax states for low tax states. Is that evading or is that just common sense?

Starting point is 00:59:57 You just call them tax evaders. I think there's a lot of people that do that. If they're going for tax reasons, then they're trying to there's also a lot of people that go to lower Versus higher People that shop at H&M or is a shopping at better opportunity called saving money situations if I if I if I have to If I have to be under someone's watch

Starting point is 01:00:22 Like a dictatorship quality like you that thinks you know what's best for you think I'm a dictator Financial dictator the way you are You feel your first answer was a tax evader That's how you view them. You don't view them as a as a asset to the state You see them as criminals you just called entrepreneurs that leave New York and them as criminals. You just called entrepreneurs that live in New York and California as criminals. Is tax evader a criminal? Rob, can you pull up what a tax evader is? Type in tax evader synonym. Tax evader synonym. What are some tax evader synonyms? Can you go to tax evader synonyms for also tax dodger, tax fraud, tax avoidance. You're calling these people criminals. A person who tries to avoid paying taxes, often through illegal means.

Starting point is 01:01:08 You're calling somebody who leaves paying taxes criminals. So I left California because I'm sorry, I should have said tax avoiders. Right, okay, so tax evaders, right. Avoiders. It's called better opportunities. Are we good with tax avoiders? It's called better opportunities. Am I a better person if I say tax avoiders? Sam, you're also a tax avoider. better opportunities. Are we good with tax avoiders? It's called better opportunities. Am I a better person if I say tax avoiders?

Starting point is 01:01:25 Sam, you're also a tax avoider. Better opportunities. Because if you have an S Corp, you have what is called as write-offs. That's such an evader. Do you write anything off? So like when you do, you do write-offs? Do I do business? I already know the answer.

Starting point is 01:01:35 Of course you do. You write-off? Such an evader. You're such a tax evader. Why would you do such a thing, Sam? You're a tax evader. Call the college. Shame on this guy for writing off tax evader. Call the college.

Starting point is 01:01:45 Shame on this guy for writing off tax evasion. Call the feds. Here's something that I- You probably have an accountant helping you. He does. Sam, here's something that I've learned. It's okay to say the following. You ready?

Starting point is 01:01:56 Man, I might have been wrong on that one. Man, I just continue- In anything. I should have said tax avoider. Because where growth happens is when you're like- Tax avoider. happens is when you grow, I remember the most amount of money I ever made was in 2016. I was like, oh my God, I'm a millionaire now. It's a tax therapy session.

Starting point is 01:02:14 I was like, oh my God, I'm paying all this taxes. I don't like this. And I created an escort. You know what fascinates me about this is that I'm talking about policies that impact the country. I'm talking about the implications of taxation on the top 0.5%, top 1% of this country. Who pay 50% of taxes, Sam. And it is boiled down to you guys saying that I'm a bad person. No, no, no.

Starting point is 01:02:38 I don't care. I actually think you're a great person with bad ideas. I don't care about any of you as individuals. Same bold bad ideas. I don't care about any of you as individuals. You're as same-bold as us. I don't care about me. Exactly. I don't disrespect you, though. I'm talking about policies.

Starting point is 01:02:52 When we get into policy, I notice how this all pivots, and I don't blame you because, frankly, if you tell the American public, and maybe not this audience because this audience is built around your business doings and whatnot. But if you tell the American public that they're getting fleeced and they are losing political power to money, they react like they did in Wisconsin. They basically reject it. And so that's that what happens what happened November 5th. What happened on November 5thth those people didn't come out

Starting point is 01:03:27 They came out to vote for Donald Trump because Donald Trump is a character that they like didn't they come out in 2020? Oh Why didn't they come out to because they because Donald Trump was very close to their experience And I think I have a feeling in 2024 They'd also can vote him out if he tries to run again. Can you imagine, like you had four years of a guy, his name is Donald Trump, then this motivational speaker named Joe Biden shows up, and he fills up the arenas, and he wins.

Starting point is 01:03:57 Every time he spoke, two, 300,000 people would show up to just hear this man give a speech, like one of those great- No, that's the thing, Biden was a complete was a complete like placeholder for not Donald Trump. This guy gets up there and he crushes Trump and you guys are like oh he got so destroyed crushes Trump look at the way Biden beat Trump people don't want a person like Trump and in America watched all the policies that You support Biden comes president. He does what he does

Starting point is 01:04:28 Four years later his vice president his VP Kamala Harris Google And see how popular his VP runs for office Okay runs for office loses every battleground state 89 count loses every battleground state, 89 count, 50 for 50 states become more Republican. And you're sitting here saying, you guys think you got better policies? No, I think Kamala Harris's, I mean, I think, look,

Starting point is 01:04:56 I think it was what Biden did in staying in was atrocious. He should have gotten out way earlier. There's this story coming out now of like Ron Klain coming, seeing him before the debate and realizing The guy was a mess And I think Harris's campaign was also poorly run I think that you know, we nobody could tell what her policies were Mark Cuban's going out there saying You're gonna get rid of right. I agree

Starting point is 01:05:21 Mark Cuban's coming out there saying like oh, don't worry. She's not going to do any more of this antitrust stuff On one hand. I don't want a billionaire coming out and speaking for my candidate Did you vote for her? Did you set that one out? No, I voted for her. You voted for Kamala What why with just because I vote? What did you I want to hold on This is what drives me crazy about your side. You guys voted? I voted for the lesser of two years.

Starting point is 01:05:50 What policy were you going for? What do you think that she was going to do different? What can you possibly? I would rather have you sit that one out, Sam. I'll tell you. She was not going to cut Social Security functioning. She's not going to cut the USDA. she's not going to cut the u s d a she's not going to cut the f t a

Starting point is 01:06:08 she's not going to lose us five hundred billion dollars worth of of of uh... return on investment it with the i r s she's not going to cut uh... the bureau of labor statistic she's not going to cut that's three hundred i was investment investment investment return on the vote that's a boy and a dollar that you give to the IRS We get six or seven back. She's not gonna cut the museum Google it every dollar spent at the IRS gets six back

Starting point is 01:06:37 In returns goodness very anticipated cuts from Doge the cuts from Doge are gonna cost the our government 500 billion dollars According to studies suggests. All right, I undersold it a little bit according to who? Okay, well that you can spend time attacking the people do these calculations not that you need me to tell you more Yeah, well, I'm just curious. I'm just curious the one rando tariffs applied in a willy-nilly fashion that crash the economy. So you don't think the tariffs that Trump is... and I get it. The tariffs are exactly what American needs right now because... let's just go to the border. What he did with the border, with Mexico, with the tariffs, what happened to Fentanyl?

Starting point is 01:07:21 What happened to all the deaths? What happened to all those illegals that are... what do you mean? He threatened them and they went to war... Fentanyl comes What happened to all the deaths? What happened to all those illegals that are coming? What do you mean? He threatened them and they went for war? Fentanyl comes across the border at ports of entry. Fentanyl? Yeah, Fentanyl comes across the border not in illegals crossing the desert. It comes in- Oh really?

Starting point is 01:07:37 Coyotes and- Oh really? Oh wow. It comes in at ports of entry. Google that! Sam, I don't need to Google when it's like, you said you voted for someone. You're coming up with these policies. The worst pick ever, the biggest loss ever. She lost everything because your side, you're talking about people. Let me ask you a question. You're acting like

Starting point is 01:08:01 your whole side was surprised that Biden wasn't there. Everybody knew, including you, he wasn't there at all, but you guys are like, he's just not Trump. The worst president in the history of the world, of this country, four years, because you guys were pretending that he was all there and we knew it. And who was making all the decisions? Who was making all the decisions? Who was signing all the shit? Who was signing off? How many times did you have to see Biden sitting there and they'd ask him a question and he'd go, oh, I can't because they told me I couldn't. He wasn't in charge. They who?

Starting point is 01:08:33 Yeah, who was they? Come on, Sam, it's like the most devastating loss. The world, the country is over it. You guys aren't pivoting, okay? And if you think the future is Gavin Newsom, AOC, Bernie Sanders and Jasmine Crockett you guys are doomed nothing is going to change and Elon Musk you think Elon Musk is a net positive or a net negative for society for what he's

Starting point is 01:08:55 doing and pointing out what the hell these people have been screwing us for all these years and he's pointing out you guys are mad at the person pointing out who robbed from you than the actual robber that's the truth bro yeah he's pointing out you guys are mad at the person pointing out who robbed from you than the actual robber That's the truth bro. Yeah, he's a billionaire. You think he's doing it because he needs the money Has he found what do you mean? How much how much fraud is he? Yeah, where's the person? Well, who is going to be indicted for fraud? Well, what about the waste what way because it's not stop it What waste they just cut the the Sam? Agency that provides 295 million dollars to museums and libraries you appreciate libraries Don't you I know how much you're eating is Sam you're pinpointing the one good thing that they probably know

Starting point is 01:09:35 What about the waste of countries all around the world for LGBTQ? Agendas in Rwanda the money you're talking about do you want money going to a fraction of a percentage and if we wanted to get rid of that money there is a way of doing it and that is to have Congress vote and reverse what they authorized in the first place. But to have a billionaire come in and decide based upon what his personal preferences are that he's going to cut government in this way I'm sorry that's not democracy it's not even remotely close to it doesn't have the power to do anything he makes a suggestion why do you think and

Starting point is 01:10:12 then the administration will do it why do you think Americans voted I don't think Americans heard the word doge outside of it being some type of cryptocurrency before I think why do you think Americans voted for Trump? I think because they want change. What were they not happy with? I think inflation was a big part of it for them. What else do you think? I think for a 90% of his voters voted for Mitt Romney.

Starting point is 01:10:43 I think the Republican Party wants to, you know, have tax cuts. How do we get inflation? How does inflation happen? Can we stand 20, 24? You said inflation. Give me one second. How does inflation happen?

Starting point is 01:10:54 Inflation can happen in a couple of different ways. Inflation can happen because you have too much monetary supply. Inflation can happen in terms of, both from a monetary supply level or a fiscal stimulus. And inflation can also happen if you have a once in a lifetime pandemic that completely screws up all of your logistics. And so, you've got shipping containers that usually cost four grand to ship, but now they

Starting point is 01:11:22 cost 22 grand to get because they're in far flung places because the pandemic screwed up. That was in 2021. That was in 2021. Well, it reverberates through the thing. We saw inflation dropping through 2024. We saw rate cuts on the table because we saw inflation dropping. Do you think any of it was with... Again, so those are the main two issues.

Starting point is 01:11:43 You don't think anything else. So you mainly think it was inflation, and your second point was... Well, I think in large part, we have structural problems in this country, and that's why we keep getting change elections where we keep going back and forth, back and forth. And I would say those structural problems range from... I think a lot of them have to do with wealth inequality. Okay, so you think Democrats are better at helping wealth inequality or Republicans? I think Democrats are marginally better. Tell me, due to what policy?

Starting point is 01:12:16 Well, taxation helps. That's a big part. Strengthening labor, I think during Biden, I had a lot of problems with Biden, but they. Where 6% of the workers work from home. Yeah. So how about... A labor, I mean, strengthening labor strength in the marketplace helps with wealth inequality. I think antitrust goes a long way to wealth inequality because it literally is to break up the concentration of wealth.

Starting point is 01:12:39 Here's the other question for you. So Trump's closed up the border, right? Where we are not getting, like this numbers have dropped dramatically. Well, I mean, if you go back and look in the and I don't necessarily agree with Biden doing this. But if you go back and look at the numbers starting in the summer of 2024, maybe a little bit before and stop it. I'm sorry, go just put it up there. I'm not in favor of what this is, but he did do it wait put up the graph What I'd like I'm not in favor here's what I'd like to do I'd like to get through some stories

Starting point is 01:13:15 But I just want to close the knot here and move on because we're not gonna See if you can get a graph of that right if you just want to show up graph on immigration from 2021 2222 is that the chart you want to see what you just want to show up graph on immigration from 2021-22-22, is that the chart you want to see? What do you want to see? Let's see the one over the past, you said he dropped it dramatically in January and I'm suggesting if you look at the past 12 months. No, no, it's the, okay, Rob, do me a favor, find the chart on immediately when Trump comes in, what happens to illegal immigration in America? While you're doing that, here's a question for you. Ten million illegal immigrants

Starting point is 01:13:48 came through the border in four years under Biden. Way more. What's the number of undocumented immigrants you think we have in this country right now? What I'm asking is those four years. How many do we have during those four years? That came through that we have according to credible sources. What's the number you hear? That are in the country now or actually just crossed? No, that came through illegally during those four years. I would imagine it's probably close to like five, six, maybe to 10 million.

Starting point is 01:14:16 Let's say 10 million people. Tom Hover said 10 million. Let's say it's 10 million, but give or take 2 million. Let's just say it's 10 million the number, okay? Those 10 million people that are coming here, are they rich? No, vast majority of them I would say are not. Are poor, right?

Starting point is 01:14:29 Okay, that they're coming here. Who does that benefit? They're gonna need jobs, right? And what are they willing to work for? Oh, I think they're going to get exploited without a doubt if that's where you're going with this. Oh, so let me get this straight. So who do they benefit? Do they benefit larger corporations that get cheap labor?

Starting point is 01:14:49 They benefit, yes. Oh, so let me get this straight. Processing plants and whatnot. Oh, that's why I want them to have documents. Let them come to the border. So give them documents so that they can get worker protections. So then if that's the case, you know what that validates? Joe Biden and the Democratic policies are better for the billionaires than Trumps are because they brought in cheap labor. And that cheap labor helps who? Helps the rich.

Starting point is 01:15:18 Oh, I am in favor of a path to citizenship that is much easier. And by the way, those 10 million people that came here illegally, give or take. And that was in that bill that they suggested in the fall of 2023 that Trump said he didn't want because he wanted to keep it as an issue. Who do those 10 million people take jobs away from?

Starting point is 01:15:40 Who do they take jobs away from? I don't know that they take jobs away from that. Oh really? No, we are at, when I, in 20 years ago, Who do they take jobs away from? I don't know that they take jobs away from that. Oh really? No. Oh really? We are at, when I, in 20 years ago we were told that the lowest unemployment that it was possible to have with a functioning economy was what?

Starting point is 01:15:54 You remember? It was something like 6 to 8%. And now our unemployment is at 4%. And so I- And it was lower than that before. I continue- You're not answering the question though. Who do those people take jobs away from?

Starting point is 01:16:08 I have answered it. I think largely they don't take jobs away from people. Oh, they don't. Of course they do. Hang on. Perfect. I love what you just said. You think they don't take jobs away from anybody.

Starting point is 01:16:18 Perfect. So if we go and we look at when China started trading, let me make the point, when China came through and was able to bring labor to us, 1971, it was called the Pink Pong agreement that they had where, you know, we can send labor there and labor at the time was 8 cents to 20 cents an hour where for us minimum wage was a buck 60. Then in 2001, when the Clinton policies helped China join the World Trade Organization, and at the time, minimum wage in China was 20 cents to 50 cents, depending on different regions and for us was 5.15.

Starting point is 01:16:52 We lost six million manufacturing jobs, give or take the next seven years. Michigan, you got Indiana, you got all these other places. Where did those jobs go to? Who did they replace? Who lost those jobs? What happened to Detroit? All that manufacturing went to China. That's right. So what do you think these 10 million people that come here, who are they going to take

Starting point is 01:17:07 jobs away from? Americans who are here legally. Those jobs are going to go to somebody that's cheap labor. That was the movement of capital. Capital decided that it was cheaper for them to move to China. I'm specifically talking about the last four years. So when you're saying labor is not going to be taken from people in America, that's the credibility you lose. That's where people in 2000, Rob, can you play the clip

Starting point is 01:17:30 with Stephen A. Smith, who has been a staunch supporter of the Democratic Party for decades, and now Stephen A. Smith is being called as a member of MAGA. You know, Rob, we can't play the whole thing. Can you go to the main part? Do you know the main part or no? Right after he reads this is when he responds. Okay, let's see what he says, Rob.

Starting point is 01:17:48 Go for it. This Owen, Sean Hannity, and other prominent voices from the right on this podcast has reasons for his premise. Here's a portion of what he wrote on MSNBC.com in an article titled ESPN's Stephen A. Smith is a megaphone for MAGA propaganda. Jones says, quote, Stephen A. Smith's embrace of the MAGA movement and its influencers has only continued. In recent days, for example, he has

Starting point is 01:18:18 spoken with right-wing commentators Ben Shapiro, Megyn Kelly, and Bill O'Reilly. You might be thinking that these were adversarial chats between a left-leaning centrist and a conservative, but to adroit listeners, they can come across more as conservatives in friendly discussion than anything else. Smith's overt politicism seems to fly in the face of ESPN's apparent effort in recent years to deter some of its talent from speaking on controversial political matters.

Starting point is 01:18:48 Either way, the network's most recognizable host is now regularly platforming MAGA propaganda at will." End quote. Now, my team reached out to Jones to have a discussion about the article. I wanted to invite him on the show to talk with me one-on-one personally. I hope we get the opportunity to have that dialogue.

Starting point is 01:19:09 He was busy. He didn't avoid the call or anything like that. It was no comment or anything like that. He didn't say anything. He was just very, very busy. We called it the last minute. No shade on him. That's why it didn't happen.

Starting point is 01:19:19 But in the meantime, let me express to you what I think about what he wrote. I think that's the exact problem with the left. You see, if I don't agree with you, I must be MAGA. It must be the case. I'm platforming MAGA propagandas. That's so. I don't view it that way.

Starting point is 01:19:45 First of all, even though I lean left, particularly with how I vote with presidential elections, I wanna emphasize that I've always been a centrist, my entire life. I've never once described myself as a Democrat or a Republican. I'm a centrist, I'm a moderate. I don't trust either side. I'm not on one side of the other hook line a sinker

Starting point is 01:20:08 You will see images or you'll hear me rattle off names of people who've been on this show Yes, you see Ben Shapiro there. Yes, you see Bill O'Reilly there. Yes. I was recently on Megan's Kevin Megan Kelly show Did you know I'm on News Nation with Chris Cuomo every week? Did you know that I just appeared with Jake Tapper On CNN Do you know I've been on MSNBC on several occasions? Do you know you can pause yes Sean so do you know what happens when a guy like Stephen A. Smith, he said he's always voted left when it comes on to presidential candidates that he has.

Starting point is 01:20:50 So he's not a guy that voted for Trump, right? When a guy like him comes out and he says, what the hell is going on with the Democratic Party? Is that what he's saying there? Oh, he said it many times. You must not follow what he says because he has said that nonstop the last two months, three months. No, I don't follow what he says.

Starting point is 01:21:10 You should. He's actually very good. He's reasonable. It would be good for you to watch. I like his approach. I think he's a good... Do you guys identify as MAGA? No.

Starting point is 01:21:18 No? Do any of you guys identify as MAGA? Here's my question. Can I ask a question? I've been registered independent. He seems to think it's an insult. That's not to say make America great again. It shouldn't be. If you want to make America's an insult. That's what I'm saying. Make America great again. If you want to make America great again, I'm all in.

Starting point is 01:21:28 Call me MAGA all freaking day. I'm MAGA. I'm MAGA. I just want to make America great. He seems to take it as an insult. No. I am America first. I'm America first. I voted for Trump in 2016. I voted for him 2020.

Starting point is 01:21:44 In 2022 when people were leaving to the DeSantis camp, I stayed on the Trump camp. I've never been off that camp. He's the right guy for America and I've been a registered independent now for about 17 years. What do you think about these tariffs? No, no. Stay on this topic here with Stephen A. We'll go to tariffs next. What is the topic? That some guy from, I've never heard of from... No, the guy who wrote the... from a guy I've never heard of. I've never heard of Stephen A. Smith. No, the guy who wrote something about him.

Starting point is 01:22:08 But what do you think about Stephen A. Smith, what he's been talking about lately with the Democratic Party having issues with him? He's a centrist. I don't have to subscribe to what a centrist perspective. I mean, he's a centrist, like Gavin Newsom is a centrist. Gavin Newsom is a centrist? Gavin Newsom is saying the exact same thing as Stephen A Smith

Starting point is 01:22:41 I have a set of politics. I don't care what Stephen A. Smith does. I don't care what Gavin Newsom does. I don't care. So you're rigid, you're not changing anything? It's not a question of I'm rigid and I'm not changing anything. There are specifics, like over time I have had a different perspective on the deficit over the past 20 years and understood it in a different way. You become more liberal over the last 20 years. You become more of a

Starting point is 01:23:08 leftist and progressive. You gotta be more malleable. I mean to the extent like I don't you know like you guys have these like labels that you like to use and there's some type of gradation. I've always been about where I am in terms of taxation but I am for a little bit more decommodification probably than I was 20 years ago. And all I'm saying here before, I'm going to go to the audience. Audience, we're coming to you here in a second to go through some of the stories here. Why, are we going to talk about tariffs?

Starting point is 01:23:37 We're definitely going to talk about tariffs. Whatever stories we go through, but the one thing we did learn here with you is America grew up the last four years. America grew up the last four years. Many Democrats grew up. Every state became more Republican because of the horrible policies on the left, whether it was how they handled COVID, what they did with our kids, how they handled people that didn't want to take the vaccine, and people were fed up. And they voted for a guy who had already been president for four years.

Starting point is 01:24:09 So it's not like they said they want something new. They said, no, we want to go back to the guy previous to that guy. That is the biggest black eye to Obama, to Kamala, to Democrats, to everybody on the left. When they went back to the guy that they said they didn't want four years later saying, it's like an ex coming back and saying, babe, I messed up, I should have never gone with the other guy, you were my guy, or guy, babe, I screwed up, I should have never left you for the other girl, I'm such a dummy, please Trump come back.

Starting point is 01:24:38 That's what America did. And a guy like you who's sitting here saying- I'm not a big fan of Obama's and I'm not a big fan of Harris's either. The point is you still haven't graduated Sanders. That's like seventh grade. The people that follow Sanders and AOC are in seventh grade, eighth grade. Their heroes are in high school. Your philosophies are popular in high schools, not with adults.

Starting point is 01:25:01 The policies that you support are high school policies. They were not popular when I was in high school. Oh, are you kidding me? Karl Marx was a hero in kids that went to high school because teachers were feeding the Karl Marx stuff I went to high school Ronald Reagan was president. I can assure you that in the wall still existed and There is fear of communism and that socialism was barely ever expressed. Your step away from communism, like socialism is a step away from communism. That's kind of where you are.

Starting point is 01:25:31 You're like, you're right there saying, guys, I don't want to fully publicly say I'm a communist. I'll stay in this room. No, I'm not. I'm not. I'm not. I don't want to say I don't want to go. I don't even identify as a socialist either. You're a progressive though.

Starting point is 01:25:43 I would say I'm a progressive. I'm 90% is socialist. So what's right of progressive, what's left of progressive? I know you're not big on labels, but just humor me. What's right and left of being a progressive? I'm probably a social democrat, so I would say that there is a certain amount of society where I believe we do not need the private market to deliver it is less efficient. So when it comes to health insurance, we have already in this country, one third, maybe

Starting point is 01:26:13 a little more actually, on some form of government health insurance. The VA is actually government healthcare. The doctors work for the government. And that is actually gets very, very high marks. And all I hear is good things about the VA. The VA everybody gets high marks? No, the healthcare does. That's 100% false. I get the worst service from the VA. Let's just, and I'm a veteran and he's a veteran, he doesn't go to the VA, I go to the VA. I called yesterday just to make an example in our work area. I called, nobody's picking up the phone for me to get an appointment. Zero. And when you

Starting point is 01:26:49 go there, it's the most depressing thing. But the good news is when you go to like get your, to the DMV, the driver's license, that's great service, right? Oh, that's the best. Yeah, that's the best. The VA is not good. The states run the DMVs, but my experience at the DMV is not that bad. You want to go to Terry? But respectfully, there's one thing you said. There's one thing you said.

Starting point is 01:27:07 You said the private market is less efficient. We can look at 250 years of government and everything we've got here. I just can't get past that. What's the administrative cost for Medicare? And if that's your feeling. What's the administrative cost for Medicare? Hang on. If that's one of your foundational beliefs that the private markets will be less efficient,

Starting point is 01:27:27 then it's no wonder you're where you are. I'm not going to pick on it. If that's your foundational belief- What is the administrative cost for Medicare? Tell us. Two to three cents of every dollar Medicare is spent on administrative costs in the private health insurance- Administrative defined as what? You got to be careful. you got to be careful I Got to be careful when I hear things like that because guess what you go back

Starting point is 01:27:49 Can you look at well I was only counting this the rest I'm not counting this It's like the same way have a dollar same way your side would count unemployment and come out later and readjust all the staff 97 to 98 cents actually goes to paying Medicare providers doctors You know we going to move on. I'm just- We're going to move on because your core tenant- I don't answer the question, Tom.

Starting point is 01:28:10 Your core tenant that the private markets are less efficient is wrong. It is 17 cents on every dollar. We can't discuss anything. Because they're paying for advertising, they're paying for shareholder value, et cetera, et cetera. For every dollar you spend, and on top of which, anybody who has private health insurance, who deals with it themselves, knows it's like having a second job, just to either get reimbursed or you get a figure out every year when you re-sign up.

Starting point is 01:28:38 It's my doctor in or out of the program. It's a mess. It's a disaster. It is the most inefficient possible... Well, Medicare is so good and so wonderful. People love Medicare. Why was MedSupp and Medicare Advantage invented? It's so good, Medicare. It's everything for you. Because the Republicans wanted to privatize it, and it is widely understood. Oh, really? I don't get drug benefits.

Starting point is 01:28:56 That Medicare Advantage is the worst part of Medicare, and people get sucked into it, and they find out that they've been hoodwinked. I mean, these are all easily found data points. Sam, did you fly here? Yeah. Did you go through TSA? Did you go through TSA pre-check? Did you go through CLEAR? What did you go through? On the way here, my TSA pre-check was not on the thing, so I just went through. That's messed up. You paid for it though, right? Yeah, it was 60 bucks for the TSA. No, I'm saying, think it's like a 500 bucks or 100 bucks for five years for a TSA pre-check TSA pre-check I think it's $65 for five years. It's amazing. It's a great deal. Why don't you do clear? I Don't want to do a private company TSA pre-check is basically like a public private partnership No, yes a little bit more is TSA pre-check is the government. You pay a little bit more. Adam, you have to know he looks at private companies and he frowns about frowns upon

Starting point is 01:29:55 private companies. Is that what's going on? Because that's all it is. Oh I didn't fully understand. I'm not going to give my money to a private company. And meanwhile, I want to own and run one. Yeah so let's go to the next story with Terrence. Can we stay there for a second please? You don't want to give money to a private company but you are a private company. You're trying to make money. Well I don't want to give my biometric information to a private company. You're using it to say. Or your dollars. What about just private companies in general? I don't think I'm happily fine with TSA Preach

Starting point is 01:30:21 and all. Guys, we already got it. With TSA. Let's move on. I'm moving on. Okay. I'm learning. I'm moving on. No, I already learned. I understand. It's great. So we know what the argument is.

Starting point is 01:30:30 Progressive. Trump said to unleash Liberation Day tariffs. President Trump will unveil Liberation Day tariffs on Wednesday at 4 p.m. That was yesterday. That was yesterday. In a White House's Rose Garden, promising to stop America being ripped off and deliver a new golden age of U.S. industry, though U.S. White House President Ken Laman said that he was still perfecting it to make sure it's a perfect deal with advisors less than 24 hours before.

Starting point is 01:30:57 Trump, who on Monday claimed he'd be very kind, has kept details vogue with reports suggesting options from reciprocal tariffs to a 20% blanket rate or preferential Treatment for some nations Rob if you want to play this is this yesterday Rob or is this this is yesterday from the Rose Garden This is fantastic. Go for it. My fellow Americans. This is liberation day We've been waiting for a long time. You're all about to be liberated from your money. April 2nd, 2025 will forever be remembered as the day American industry was reborn, the day America's destiny was reclaimed, and the day that we began to make America wealthy

Starting point is 01:31:39 again. We're going to make it wealthy, good and wealthy. I also have another clip. This is the president discussing how the tariffs will help eliminate income tax. From 1789 to 1913, we were a tariff-backed nation and the United States was proportionately the wealthiest it has ever been. So wealthy, in fact, that in the 1880s, they established a commission to decide

Starting point is 01:32:06 what they were going to do with the vast sums of money they were collecting. We were collecting so much money so fast we didn't know what to do with it. Isn't that a nice problem to have? What do you think Marco? Good problem? Marco would love that problem. But we don't have that problem anymore but we're not going to have it very much longer I will tell you but they collected so much money word They actually formed a commission to determine what they were going to do with the money who they were going to give it to and how much then in 1913 for reasons unknown to mankind they established the income tax so that

Starting point is 01:32:40 Citizens rather than foreign countries would start paying the money necessary to run our government. Then, in 1929, it all came to a very abrupt end, with the Great Depression. And it would have never happened if they had stayed with the tariff policy. It would have been a much different story. They tried to bring back tariffs to save our country, but it was gone. It was gone.

Starting point is 01:33:04 It was too late. Nothing could have been done. It took years and years to get out of that depression, far longer than even FDR. Had that office right over there for a long period of time. The ramp system, it's rather intricate, was built because of him, and every time you walk up, you think of him, and he did a great job in many ways, but it lasted long beyond his terms, as you know.

Starting point is 01:33:28 But it's not too late any longer, and we're going to start being smart, and we're going to start being very wealthy again. We're going to be wealthy as a country because they've taken so much of our wealth away from us. We're not going to let that happen. We truly can be very wealthy. We can be so much wealthier than any country. It's not even believable, but we're getting smart.

Starting point is 01:33:49 Okay, Tom, your thoughts on this, and I'm going to come to you. So markets love continuity, even if continuity is rooted in, you know, trade inequality and things have been going on for decades. And to get through the shift, to get through the food poisoning, it's gonna, we can see markets react to sentiment and markets don't know what to make of this. How many tariffs are gonna stay for a day versus a week versus a month?

Starting point is 01:34:17 You don't know. How many tariffs are gonna shift? Israel actually backed down and said, okay, we're done, yesterday, correct? Israel went, hang on, we're good, we're backing off, we're done here, interesting. Canada moved a couple of them, not the rest of them, Canada's still figuring it out, but they're blinking,

Starting point is 01:34:34 Canada is blinking. So now the question is gonna be, how long does all this take, and the markets, the markets don't like it, the markets don't like the sentiment of uncertainty, and that's why you have Jim Cramer and other people, oh, we're getting killed out here. You're getting killed because you like the status quo that you had a minute ago because you knew how to play that game and you knew how those markets worked.

Starting point is 01:34:54 And respectfully, they're there to trade and make money and increasing market. What is easier? It's easier to stay yesterday with what we've got or there's a greater goal. And the greater goal is American jobs And the jobs report was better than people thought. Huh interesting. That's not a headline. Why is that buried and You've got the uncertainty of the markets now The uncertainty markets makes everybody look at their 401k and look at the things and be concerned and yes There's concern there

Starting point is 01:35:22 but you got to look down the street and see where we're going and It is not easy to get through the food poisoning But there is life on the other side and you can see that's what the president is talking about And I think we got to trust it and we got to look at what's going on We can already see little islands of change going on. So let's find out how everybody else moves on these tariffs Sam You said tariff was the last word that That was the only time you used the word tariffs. Look, I am in favor of tariffs when it is part of a specific agenda to build a certain industry or a certain industry within a certain region.

Starting point is 01:36:03 This is absolute insanity. First off, they're going to use this as potential revenue. Like he says, it's not going to replace the income tax, but what they're going to do is they're going to use it as an excuse to cut taxes on wealthy people. You guys will be very excited about that. But who's going to pay that tax? If it's $600 billion a year, as they're saying, over a 10 year period, it's going to be $6 trillion.

Starting point is 01:36:29 That is going to be an average of $5,000 tax on Americans. It is a regressive tax. I like taxation, but I like progressive taxation because $5,000 for somebody making $40,000 is a much bigger problem than $5,000 for me or for you and so this is a regressive tax on Americans now. If it's to work. To build up industry and I don't know how we're going to have a banana industry in this country or how we're going to

Starting point is 01:37:05 have a lumber industry to rival Canada's because we just don't have the wood, and so on. People get the idea. There are certain industries you can actually say, this is one we're going to build up. Maybe there will be a low cost clothing business that revives in this country, but I doubt it. But if tariffs are meant to work to build up industry, that means people aren't paying those taxes. So the tariffs may not raise the money, but what will happen is, and I think you understand this too about pricing, if the price of goods goes up on average, and it looks like in some

Starting point is 01:37:41 of these places, it's going to go way above 10%. I mean, some of like, you know, Vietnam, like 39%, China, 75%. They're adding all these tariffs on it's insane. Then US companies, to the extent that there are ones that are making these same goods, they have between zero and 75% to raise their prices. And they will because, you know, like the price of this, there's a certain elasticity and they can justify raising their prices 5% if their nearest competitor is, you know, 25% raise in price. I mean, they'll do it because, you know, there's some products that people just can't do without.

Starting point is 01:38:21 So this is such a disaster. And of course, what it also does is last time we had a major financial crisis in this country in 2008, it took six years for the stock market to get back at parity. You're talking about the 401Ks have been a disaster in so far as people just don't put as much money in them as they should because they don't have the money on a regular basis. But God help those people if there wasn't social security, a robust social security, because if you've got to retire and you're 65 and you were planning on retiring, you have a small 401K, it is screwed and it may not come back for years.

Starting point is 01:39:03 Maybe it'll come back tomorrow. How do you feel about reciprocal tariffs? It is screwed and it may not come back for years. Maybe it'll come back tomorrow, but I feel about reciprocal tariffs Here's the other Absolute insanity those tariffs that he claimed on that chart are not tariffs Every every economist out there has been saying where did he get these numbers and they're starting to figure out that they did some weird There's countries on there that don't even have people in them. It's bizarre.

Starting point is 01:39:28 They took like the CIA fact book and just made a list of countries. I mean, it's completely for show. Which countries? There's a Google it. There's like one or two places where there's no people. Every single one of those. No, no, they released a big release. He'll find it.

Starting point is 01:39:46 And these are not actual tariffs that are being applied to us. Every single one of these countries, China, the EU, Vietnam, Taiwan, Japan, South Korea, Thailand, Switzerland, Indonesia, Malaysia, Cambodia, which of those countries are they're not people living? Put in the Trump just added a tariff on a country with no people. All right, but okay, so he added one country that maybe is underwater. It's just an indication of how slapdash this is. No, dude.

Starting point is 01:40:16 But these are not tariffs. These are not- You're focusing on one random little- Those reciprocal tariffs, they're not, those aren't tariffs. He is basically what they've tried to figure out is like where did they get these numbers Those were typical tariffs. Those aren't tariffs. He has basically what they've tried to figure out is like where did they get these numbers from and they have taken the trade deficit and divided it by what we send there. That's the way that they've assumed that that's a tariff. It's basically they're just saying, we have these trade deficits.

Starting point is 01:40:43 Of course we have trade deficits with certain places because there's some products that we're just never going to make. There's some places that don't have the buying power that we have. So this is just bizarre. Even former Trump trade people were just like, well, maybe it's just an opening salvo for a negotiation. And maybe it's just an opening salvo for a negotiation, and maybe it is. I mean, I'm just fortunate that I'm not planning on retiring soon and my 401k isn't decimated,

Starting point is 01:41:14 but this is going to cause inflation, and these prices are not going to come down. I mean, Trump is trying to tell US automakers, don't raise your prices, and if he wants to impose price controls, he would not be the first Republican president to do this. Nixon was the first president and the only president, as far as I know, to do price controls, at least in the modern era. I'm not necessarily against price controls in certain situations, but this is like such an own goal.

Starting point is 01:41:39 It's fascinating. Of course. No, Jimmy Carter's wager price controls for decades before Nixon. Whoops, whoops. Checking my notes. No. Leave this after. Right.

Starting point is 01:41:50 It wasn't just Nixon. Well Nixon started it. It was part of it. Right? And there was no other president since Nixon. Nixon started it. I was just kind of correcting that. Okay.

Starting point is 01:42:00 Back to your rant. I'm for price controls. You are for price controls. Well, I think we should have applied some in the wake of COVID. Yes, there was a lot of gouging going on. I think everybody knows that. I mean, there's plenty of data that at least 40% of the inflation was a function of gouging in some form or another.

Starting point is 01:42:22 Sam, number one, respect for you for being here. I don't think like genuinely, whether you're a progressive or democratic socialist or skew socialist, you're talking to a bunch of capitalists and an angry patriot. That's cool. Like we're not going to change your mind. You're probably not going to change our mind. But what we're solving for is the truth. The reality is these reciprocal tariffs.

Starting point is 01:42:42 What Pat asked you about, are you familiar with the golden rule? Do unto others as you want to do unto them as I go do you abide by the golden rule? I mean in my personal relationships. Yes, there you go So the golden rule is you want to do something to me? I'm gonna do it to you If you treat me fairly, I'll treat you fairly if you're good with me I'll be good with you but if you want to toots fair hold on guy if you want to actually take advantage of me then all of a sudden we might have to have a

Starting point is 01:43:13 Economic war and that's what's happening. So if you show up that list I know you want to focus on the one random country that you can't name Hold on tell us how England is taking advantage of us. Well, England is part of the UK We understand that but if you want to go ours, the UK, Sam taking hold on You know when people talk you listen and then when you talk I listen that's how conversations go, you know I'm just asking you to clarify. I'm gonna get there So the way that these tariffs work is if they're doing something to us will do something then Rob show the picture So I would love to hear where you think so all these countries have people living in all these countries. These, you know, China, the EU, that's part

Starting point is 01:43:49 of, you know, all those countries over there. You get the UK over there, Vietnam, Taiwan, Japan, India. I'm pretty sure there's a bunch of people living in India, South Korea, Thailand, all these countries are charging us. So the reality is if you go through the numbers, not feeling there's the whole list Sam I need you to pay attention I got it here we go now they're charging us way more 90% of you to access their markets then we are charging that is not that's the whole point those are not tariffs stop it you're gonna have to breathe Rob do me a favor so we're charging on

Starting point is 01:44:21 average two and a half percent the EU is charging on average 20% Japan is 24% China 34% Taiwan 32% Vietnam 46% These is what the numbers are now if you have different numbers I'd love to see them but the reality is some of these countries are our friends and some of these countries are our foes and In as Trump says if you want to listen to what Trump says in many Cases, you know many of our friends are a lot worse. He cited Australia won't even let us sell US beef So all these situations are actual numbers, you know, he talks about the golden rule Trump there's a there's a there's a

Starting point is 01:45:00 Similar to there the golden age of America is what he talking about Because this is a way to bring down our deficits to reduce taxes i would love to hear if you had a better idea down our deficits when you there's these are trade deficits okay so we have a trade deficit with canada of 200 billion dollars a year they charge us in many cases 200 300 percent for dairy okay mexico is no they do not no you're're absolutely on the dairy this no no no your dairy is absolutely you think there is my dairy yes, this is not true or is not speech yes Trump lied there is not a single pint of like you live a day or not how many countries

Starting point is 01:45:40 don't have a very sure India's got a couple that dairy goes to Canada. Now we don't, if we sell a certain threshold, tariffs are applied, but we don't reach that threshold ever. There are no, not a dollar. Because it's too damn expensive to access the marketplace. Anyway, I'm talking about the sweeping tariffs. You're talking about being a milkman. What I want to understand is why don't you think- You guys don't care about any of the facts at all. It's hilarious. You're talking about being a milkman. What I want to understand is Yes me Dairy Google dairy tariffs to can't your dairy

Starting point is 01:46:20 Brought up dairy, but you want to go I'm giving one example. You want to have that's the only example you gave auto Auto industries they charging us 25% We're now doing a minimum tax 10% across the board so minimum but in other places Vietnam Let me let me ask a simple question So the whole thing Adam just said it could have been simplified to we have around a trillion dollars of trade deficits Would you like to fix that part of the reason why we have those trade deficits is because a we keep our dollar strong Be because they're a bigger customer bases those trade deficits is because A, we keep our dollars strong, B, because there are bigger customer bases in this country than in other countries. Our economy is based upon consumption.

Starting point is 01:46:55 Do you think we're helping other countries' economy improve? Don't you think we have the leverage to ask more from them? I think, again, I think tariffs work if there is a specific industry. We saw this in the chips act, right? There were carrots and there were sticks in the chips act. We want to onshore ship production in this country, both for like, you know, economic reasons, but also like long-term national security reasons. And so what you do is you provide incentives and disincentives.

Starting point is 01:47:24 Have you ever negotiated a deal with anybody Well, I mean yeah, I guess you do and are you decent negotiator? Are you a bad negotiator? Are you a horrible negotiator? What would you put yourself as a negotiator? It depends on the context, okay? Do you try to find a way to negotiate with both sides win like a fair negotiation? Okay? So this is Newsweek. It's a you know newspaper an outlet to negotiate where both sides win like a fair negotiation. Yes. Okay. So this is Newsweek. It's a newspaper, an outlet that's on the left, but Rob, if you can go all the way to the top.

Starting point is 01:47:50 Okay. This is a Newsweek outlet. So full list of countries of reciprocal tariffs. This is from today, I believe, if I'm not mistaken. Yesterday was updated today. Okay. Go a little bit lower, Rob, if you could. So let's just kind of go.

Starting point is 01:48:03 No, no. Let's just start from the top and see what it says. So it talks about the liberation day, great, got it, white matters, tariffs remain in place until US narrows a 1.2 trade imbalance recorded last year. That means we're making others $1.2 trillion more than we're making. That's the imbalance. Okay, so this is Newsweek. The president said there was a baseline. It means that we are buying more stuff from other places

Starting point is 01:48:28 than they're buying from us. Sure, yeah. Because we have the biggest consumer engine in the world. Sure. So it would make sense. Okay, so if that's the argument, continue. Now then the next thing would be, hey, charge me the same thing I'm buying from you

Starting point is 01:48:42 as you're buying from me. Let's keep that number the same number. Don't overcharge me for it. That is not a tough request that we're making. Go a little bit lower Rob. Keep going. So the President's are based on 10% of all imports. Okay, great.

Starting point is 01:48:54 According to a chart Trump held, you have 34% on Chinese imports, 20% on goods, European goods, all that. That'll come up when we go a little bit lower. That's the picture he's talking about. Keep going lower Rob. So it's ultimately going to be 54 plus another 10 on China. Until we become reciprocal. Yes, the U.S. had an overall trade deficit of 918 in 2024 with the largest gaps coming from China 295, EU 235, Mexico 172, Vietnam 123.

Starting point is 01:49:19 That's the numbers that we have there. Then Cambodia topped out a chart of 49% tariffs, followed by Madagascar 47%, Sri Lanka 44%, Vietnam 46%. If these were the two countries you said they don't have people there, I think they got people there. So if we go a little bit lower, keep going, keep going, keep going. Here's a full list from Newsweek. China, tariffs charged to the US, 67%. Us to them 34% EU 39 This is the list that the White House put out and all economists are looking at this and going what are they talking about? Yeah they're not gonna put out false information

Starting point is 01:49:53 If not that's Newsweek You don't believe in fake news You believe in real news So Taiwan 6432 Japan 4624 India 5226 who would a hell negotiate look at by the way each one of them It's almost 2x 26 times 2 is 52 25 times 2 is 50 36 times 2 is 72 31 times 2 is 62 but they did 61 32 times

Starting point is 01:50:17 2 is 64 Malaysia 24 47 go a little bit lower up 4997 1010 UK were the same so South South Africa 30.60, Brazil 10.10, Bangladesh 37.74, 2X. If these numbers are true, Sam, let's say somebody on the left, okay, fact checks this and this is someone that's a person you respect. If these numbers are accurate, what do you say then? I'm going to read from CNBC, since you guys won't Google this. Many observers said the US appeared to have divided the trade deficit by imports from a given country to arrive at tariff rates for individual countries.

Starting point is 01:50:55 Can you text the toons so we can show it so the audience can see it? Just Google CNBC. How did the US arrive at its tariff rates? Go for it. We're not uncomfortable showing clips. Just say it, he'll pull it up. So which part do you want him to read? Well scroll down right there just number two many observers said the US appeared to have divided the trade deficit by

Starting point is 01:51:11 Imports from a given country to arrive at tariff rates for individual countries So much methodology doesn't necessarily align with conventional approach to calculate tariffs I mean, they've just made up what the tariffs were. No. Sam. Okay, maybe their methodology is different. What are the actual tariffs? This is my question though.

Starting point is 01:51:31 Who are the tariffs? I actually wanna know this here. Rob, you can ask Grok to fact check it. You can go under Charlie Kirk and just type in Grok. Is this accurate, these numbers? You can go to ChadGBT, that's ran by Sam Altman, who is an enemy of Musk, and see what that one says.

Starting point is 01:51:47 You can fact check both of them. This is all I want to ask you, to see what's your credibility with being able to reason. If those are correct, that they are charging us more taxes than we are, what do you think is the right thing to happen? If those numbers are correct? I think we should look at what industries we want to build in this country. Car industry, let's say. Let's say we want to build solar panels, which is one that I would choose. Just as an example, we could go down the list, right?

Starting point is 01:52:19 And I would also look at like, okay, what regions do we have in this country that need more jobs, more manufacturing? And then I would target tariffs, not necessarily on the whole country that's coming in, but I would target on those products coming from a given country because that is what is called a plan. Does it matter what the product is? As opposed to this buckshot. No, no, no.

Starting point is 01:52:43 Absolutely. Oh, so you're willing to pay more to the... You're willing to allow the other person to tax you more for product you're buying than you're doing it to them? Who needs who more? They're not taxing me. They're inhibiting... Wait, hang on a second. Reciprocal tariff is simple.

Starting point is 01:52:58 It's saying, if you charge me an additional 30, let's match it. I'll do 30 as well. The point is, is that when let's say China has a 50% tariff on our cars, okay? And they do that because they want to build their car industry. It is not going to create inflation in China because they have such a high tariff on our cars. We may have, and certainly by we, we mean corporate America. Politicians, not corporate America. It's corporate America. It's politicians.

Starting point is 01:53:31 Listen, I saw in the 90s, like how corporate America was so freaked out by Tiananmen Square. But I'm telling you. You still haven't answered my question. My question is, if that's accurate, if those numbers are accurate, that we're being charged with. I'm not going to punish the American people if that's accurate, if those numbers are accurate, that we're being charged more. I'm not going to punish the American people with a regressive tax because you have some literally elementary school notion of fairness. Elementary school.

Starting point is 01:53:52 Honestly. If those are true, okay, on them charging us more, would you sit there and support- They're not charging us more. They're charging more for our products to get in there. Do you think it's fair for us to pay twice as much as we're charging them? Do you think that's fair? I don't think that fairness has anything to do with it. What's best for the American public?

Starting point is 01:54:15 What's best for the American public is the question I would ask. Who needs more? Does YouTube need you or do you need YouTube? I probably need YouTube more. Why do you need YouTube? I probably need YouTube more. Why do you need YouTube more? Because they have a lot of other people they can go to. Thank you. Who needs who more?

Starting point is 01:54:32 America? Do you need the American customers or do we need Bangladesh? Who needs who more? We better hope that a lot of these countries don't. I mean, Canada is starting to develop a different relationship with China. I mean, this is going to ruin a lot of them. It's going to bring jobs to America. This is why Apple said, I'm investing $500 billion here.

Starting point is 01:54:53 This is why the UAE said $1.4 trillion. This is why Saudi said $600 billion. This is why all these companies said hundreds of billions. From your mouth to God's ear, I hope this goes well. Why are they saying that? But why are they saying that though? Why are they saying that? I hope this goes well. But why do you think, why did Rolls Royce say we're going to move our different plants that we have from Mexico, Canada and China to the US?

Starting point is 01:55:14 Why are they saying that? Why are they saying that? These are jobs for your American people that are not getting paid. Trump's trying to get those people jobs. Why don't you support it? There may be some benefit in terms of like manufacturing but overall you're gonna have a regressive tax on America if if if you see it's not targeted when you target cars I agree with you tariffs have a place but there's no plan here

Starting point is 01:55:37 the idea of just blanket fairness only you have anything from what they don't have any forcing Americans doing the guys done more aggressive tax 60 days than the last previous four presidents and Not including and I hope the courts continue to inhibit what he's doing. Yeah Sam that's where you go. We're just to build on what Pat was saying Apple promising to invest 500 billion SoftBank, Oracle 500 billion, Nvidia, TSMC, the 100 billion 200 billion Metta 500 billion, Eli Lilly, 27 billion Johnson and Johnson, DMAX, CMA, CGM, Ceylon, GM, Honda, the list goes on all these companies are basically saying to bring back manufacturing jobs to America bringing back jobs Will stimulate the economy isn't that good for America part of why I respect

Starting point is 01:56:31 Is the fire let me tell you why we say Why respect Sam can be helpful in others? We're not gonna get huge banana production in the United States now your bananas are gonna cost so an extra 10 Hundreds of billions of dollars. But he's not gonna give you credit. You're not listening to what I'm saying. You don't understand. He just said earlier, I'm not gonna give my money to a private corporation.

Starting point is 01:56:51 Oh, okay, gotcha. He just told you earlier. No, I said I'm not gonna give it to Clear at the airport. No, no, you said private corporation. I have TSA pre. Why would I give it to the private one? We can go back and play what you exactly said. This is recorded.

Starting point is 01:57:02 So for me, to me, I'm already at a point that for, you know, you, you, I ask you, if it's the same, if those numbers are accurate, do you support it? No. I would go, okay, so no matter what Trump does, you're not going to support. No, I would support targeted tariffs. If trillions of dollars are going to be invested in the US economy to create jobs, you don't support that. What's that? If trillions of dollars of money is going to be invested the US economy to create jobs, you don't support that. What's that? If trillions of dollars of money is going to be invested into our economy to create jobs, you don't support that.

Starting point is 01:57:29 No, of course I do. You want that money to go to the 10 million illegal immigrants that came here that was open order on the Biden. That's what you're saying. And by the way, the fact that you're open about it and you're honest about it, great. At least you're not playing games. At least you're saying, that's who I am. I would much rather give my money to TSA because it's a government entity than Clear, it's private. I would much

Starting point is 01:57:49 rather give my jobs to illegal immigrants than give the jobs to Americans. Clear is also like double the price. It is. At least you get what you pay for. That's now, you're changing now the argument to go to. I even had a problem, to be honest with with you paying TSA pre because it is sort of just creates two tiers. Would you be comfortable if there was no clear and no TSA pre check and everyone just had to do be the exactly the same just everyone TSA? I mean, would you be comfortable with that? Comfortable in this? I mean, the way that there was no paying for anything, there's no clear. I do think there's no chance of error to people

Starting point is 01:58:25 everyone just had to pay that they have to wait in line and that rich people get to fly through. I do. First class on the way here. No. We ever flown first class. Back in my show business days. What an elitist you are. They were flown. They would pay. So everyone should be the same. Everyone should just do TSA. Everyone should fly economy. It's very unfair if some people I think are doing better than others.

Starting point is 01:58:53 I get it now. I get it now that it is a little unfair that money will get you through that line at the airport, which is like a supposed to be mass communication I mean mass transportation yeah I do think do you only take the regular basic uber do I only take the basic uber lift uber lift do you only take do you never use the black you never use the the SUV I did to come here oh so you won't pay out of pocket but if someone will pay for you but wait there's one thing you're a straight-up communist, but wait, there's one thing. But you're a straight up communist. I love it.

Starting point is 01:59:28 Hold on. There's one thing that you said that I respect the fact that you're this you're here. You're just espousing socialist communist ideas. Massive respect for you coming here. You can embrace it. It's all the one thing that kind of we just know is you saying that you hope that these judges keep interfering with Trump's agenda, which is you're basically cheering for unelected bureaucrats to go against the will of the

Starting point is 01:59:50 people. Like you're hearing yourself. That's not democracy. That's a power grab. So you're happy with all the judges and all the law for everything going after Trump. With those unelected bureaucrats. Yes, those unelected guys. You're cool with that?

Starting point is 01:59:59 So if it happens to your guy? I am cool with judges appointed by Bush and Obama and Biden and Trump stopping the unelected bureaucrat Elon Musk from shutting down key functions of our government. Yes. Okay. Our government has been broken for... What has anybody done to fix any of the problem? All the money going going all the everything. The fact that you're happy with them trying to Sam, this is the will of the people.

Starting point is 02:00:31 How many 70 some million people, you can laugh all you want, but you're happy with judges interfering with what the president of the United States has been tasked to do. He has a mandate and he's kicking ass and I feel Sam, I will quote from Elon Musk. This is a referendum on Trump. This is a referendum on Trump. This is a referendum on Doge. This is a referendum on Musk. And two nights ago, he got clobbered in Wisconsin. And he was there on the ground in front of a big American flag telling lies about social

Starting point is 02:01:03 security and the american people in wisconsin not all not all sixty percent six percent of the people in wisconsin this purple state basically said go home enough so that trump has to leave that he's going to go he's going to get rid of uh... a musk and take a mouth i don't think he actually will probably but he felt the sting enough that he realizes he has to do that because Doge and Musk, and I suggest Trump, very unpopular.

Starting point is 02:01:34 I mean, obviously we're talking a margin, right? Because there's going to be 45% of people who are going to be in favor of whoever the Democrat is and 45% who are going to be in favor of whoever the Democrat is and 45% who are going to be in favor of whoever the Republican is. But on the margins, yes, six months ago it was different, but today it's very different I think. But Sam, and here's the thing. Okay, so Trump is done after this, right?

Starting point is 02:01:56 Four years, he's gone. You promise? Well, he's going to be gone. Like he likes to troll all you guys and you guys all lose your minds and I get it. I haven't really. But what, here's my thing. Again, and this is going back to the beginning. What are you guys offering? What is your side saying to okay besides the Trump evil Hitler because that shit didn't work your side literally called him Hitler and the Guy got shot in the freaking head. Okay, that's your party now now. He's gonna be gone. Okay, what who are you guys gonna put up?

Starting point is 02:02:22 Who is it? Because it looks like it's gonna be Gavin Newsom. He's podcast all this shifting to the other side. You guys literally have no money. I would bet you any amount of money that it's not Gavin Newsom. It's gonna be the front runner for this upcoming up the I will bet you any amount of money that the nominee in 2028 will not be Gavin Newsom. That nominee or is gonna be running guys. Guys, place your bet. Yeah, let's place it. 100 bucks? That's all?

Starting point is 02:02:48 Let's do 500 bucks. Oh, look at this. Let's do 500 bucks. Sugar for 100. Sugar for 100. Don't be a pussy. Adam, shut your freaking mouth. I bet you 500 all the freaking time.

Starting point is 02:02:56 Bet in the middle at 250 right now. I still wanna know who would you think in place of the bet. And let me finish. In 2028, who is, if right now, I know it's a while out, who in 2028 is going to be the front runner for the Democratic Party if it's not going to be Gavin Newsom, who that slithering snake is making the move to do it? Who is it going to be? I'm very curious.

Starting point is 02:03:19 I will bet you a thousand it won't be Gavin Newsom, but you're stuck in a game. I don't know. I think there's a chance that, I think that like if I had to guess, and this is not necessarily who I would support, and I'm going to wait, I don't really, to be honest with you, I have spent zero time thinking about 2028. But if I had to guess, I would say somebody... No, that's absolutely true. I would say Pritzker, Whitmer. Pritzker. Pritzker. Pritzker. A billionaire. You're comfortable with the fact that he's a billionaire? No. Like I say, I'm just guessing based upon what I'm seeing out there. I think Buda Jez also, not a fan. I think he's going to run. I think, like you say, Newsom's going out there. I think Buttigieg also, not a fan.

Starting point is 02:04:05 I think he's going to run. I think, like you say, Newsom's going to run. I would imagine there's going to be a couple of people in Congress who are going to run. I don't know if we know, even in a list of people that I would name, I would feel that confident that I would know who would win. If you could root for one person like just like I would like to see this person. Who would it be? Bernie? Well no Bernie's I mean too old. So AOC? Is that your favorite candidate? I don't think would win. So who's your person? If you could put your money on one person.

Starting point is 02:04:44 That's my point they don't have anybody. That was my point. They don't have anybody. That was my point. They have nobody. No, no, no. I don't speak for the Democratic Party. Exactly. I'm asking Sam Seder. I'm not asking the Democratic Party.

Starting point is 02:04:52 I want to see. You've got to have someone in mind that you would like to see. I think Murphy's also going to run. I want to see what people, like who shows up with what. I'm not even speculating. I'm asking who would you want to see? You. No, no, but you don't have anybody. Yeah, you don't really. Yeah, I want to see who's gonna hear a big

Starting point is 02:05:09 podcast or you'll have one person you'd like to see to be president. Yes. It really depends like on just give me a name of you don't have like, how do you not have a name? Well, that was my point. They don't have anybody, bro. That's the whole point. I was saying, hey, I'm not asking them. I'm just saying Sam Cedar, professional podcaster, progressive democratic socialist. You don't have one person you'd like to see. Like to see as president? Himself, I'd vote for Sam.

Starting point is 02:05:34 That's it. I mean, I'm curious, you know, I'd be curious like, if I just don't know enough about like someone like Andy Bashar. Okay. But you know enough of who you like. Just say who you like. I don't have that kind of relationship with politicians. You don't know their names?

Starting point is 02:05:56 I've had on the show. Come on, Sam, bro. Do better. Just say a name and we'll move on. Jasmine Crockett. No, I don't like her policies. Who do you like? I mean, I Jim McGovern from Worcester Mountain. There we go. Jim McGovern. Congratulations. Jim McGovern. There's our boy. Future president

Starting point is 02:06:19 of the United States. Jimmy McGovern. Get it Jim. Making America great. Let's go to the next story too. I'd like to do two more I like to do two. He's a great actually congressman. No doubt. No, he's got a chance Texas high school football star, you know, you should also keep an eye on Pat Ryan I mean, there's some stuff I disagree with him on policy, but he's also pretty good up in 18 All right. Now, you know names. I love it Texas high school football star Austin Metcalf stabbed in the heart left to die in twin brothers arms at track meet This is a very very difficult story. This is the father and Vinny

Starting point is 02:06:55 Maybe you want to preface what happened with the story? Okay, so so they Allegedly they went to a track meet. Yeah, and I guess the the guy in the bottom They went to a track meet and I guess the guy in the bottom said something like, or the guy in the top said, hey, you're in the wrong area. He stands up, stabs that kid on the top in the heart, and the other guy runs away, and then his brother, his twin brother, comes and holds him as he's taking his last breath and he dies. And then this is the father, which is the most, this is probably one of the most humble, Christian-based freaking interviews. He's getting a little bit emotional, but listen what he says about the whole situation.

Starting point is 02:07:34 He died in his brother's arms. They were twins, identical twins. And his brother was holding on to him, trying to make it stop bleeding. And he died and he died in his brother's arms. And I rushed up there and I saw him on the on the gurney. And I could tell they said he wasn't breathing. I could see all the blood. I saw where the wound was. Austin, his father shares, was born two minutes before his twin brother Hunter, the two inseparable. As you can imagine, Austin is being remembered as an outstanding student

Starting point is 02:08:05 at Memorial High, his football team's MVP and a young man of faith. His father grappling with loss and forgiveness. I'm not trying to judge, but what kind of parents did this child have? What was he taught? He brought a knife to attract me. And he murdered my son by stabbing him in the heart.

Starting point is 02:08:32 The son, the guy was in the wrong place. They asked him to move. And he bowed up. This is murder. I don't know. I know they have someone in custody. Yep, they do. And you know what?

Starting point is 02:08:44 I already forgive this person. Already? Already. I don't know. I know they have someone in custody. And you know what? I already forgive this person. Already? Already. God takes care of things. God's going to take care of me. God's going to take care of my family. Wow.

Starting point is 02:08:56 Tom? I think this is one of those amazing testimonies I've seen in a long, long time. And I think there's something, there's two things here. And he's asking without condemnation, just the question I think we all should be asking. What was up with the parents? Is this a single parent household? What sort of guidance was there?

Starting point is 02:09:23 What sort of enablement are we giving? And to stand up and say, I forgive this, most people won't understand. They say, I can't forgive him, I want him to go to prison. Well, maybe that's what you want, and maybe that's what you're going to get. Because there's consequences for crime, and if this young man, the one that's photographed there in the mug shot that's being circulated, if that's the guy and this is what he's done, and the witnesses confirm it, then he's going to go to trial and that's all going to shake out, and he's going to go to prison for a long, long time.

Starting point is 02:09:53 And I think consequences are different from forgiveness, and the forgiveness this guy has in his heart, which appears to be led by Christian values, is tremendous. And what it means is, I'm not gonna let eternal bitterness here hurt me. Is he gonna hate what happened? Absolutely. And the loss he's got for his son, the grief has just begun. But he's also saying, I'm turning to the Lord

Starting point is 02:10:20 to remove my bitterness so that I can go forward and live. And there's gonna be consequences here on Earth as this kid. There's two tragedies here. The tragedy is we have one young man apparently, if this is the guy, who's gonna go to prison for a long, long time. So he's gonna be gone to his friends and family

Starting point is 02:10:37 just as this young man that was murdered is gone to his family. And the question is, what was the core of the belief structure and the life support and the examples and the mentoring and big brothers and people around that leaves this guy why do you bring a knife to an event because you have intent and you're going to show people and you're going to do. This is all well documented in the failures of what goes on and I have a lot of, man, I just got so much respect for the father

Starting point is 02:11:13 at this time of grief to be speaking this way, but I've also got it, it says you get what you want. You know, you get what you vote for and you get what you want in this country. And if you want things that are gonna help, you know kids develop differently and better Let's get behind that but there's a flaw Somewhere in the heart of this kid that number one He he's carrying a weapon that he intended to use apparently and he used it

Starting point is 02:11:40 What are your thoughts on let's go look at that? I think it's, I mean, anything involving children is difficult as a parent. That's always difficult to see. And I think, very admirable, the father's response to it. It is sort of reminiscent of what they call, rest of justice, which I think has application in some areas and others a little bit more difficult. But that's what you're talking about when you talk about that type of forgiveness and making sure that the victims of the crime or the family of the victims can move on and

Starting point is 02:12:20 live their life without being stuck in that moment to the extent that you can. I can't even imagine losing a child or a sibling, frankly. But I think it's a little bit exploitive to assume that this is necessarily a political issue. I mean, yes, I don't think people should be carrying weapons in public. I don't know where this took place, what the gun laws are or what, but yes, I am against people having weapons in public. I don't know why this guy brought the knife in his pocket when he left the house.

Starting point is 02:13:04 I don't know what goes on at his house. I don't know if the guy was on the other team or I don't know any of the details about it, so I wouldn't make some type of larger political statement that this has something to do with electoral politics. I mean, we have a society that in many ways elevates violence. And I think you could argue the violence that we pay for in other countries and get back pictures on your TikTok every day of what the our weapons have done. Certainly MLK said, you know, every bomb that we drop in Vietnam blows up here. And the idea behind that was that, like, you know, you cannot have a society that condones

Starting point is 02:14:01 waging violence and not expect that violence to end up being self-inflicted. Adam. Well, it's a sad story. Hurt people hurt people. I think it's entirely appropriate to speculate who raised this young man. You're 17 years old, you're bringing a knife to a track meet. Someone asks you to, Hey, get out of the way in the wrong place. And you end up stabbing them in the heart.

Starting point is 02:14:31 I mean, what's going on with this person? What type of emotional pain, what type of anger, what type of hurt was this person already dealing with that? This was how he enacted his revenge for being told to move at a track meet. You know, Texas has the death penalty, if I'm correct. So I don't know what's going to happen with this kid. He's 17 years old. I'm sure he'll be tried as an adult, my opinion.

Starting point is 02:14:54 But my message is to one person and one person only. It's to the twin brother who's still alive, Hunter. And I can't even imagine what this guy is going through right now because the father took the high road obviously probably a man of faith a Christian and I understand his perspective the twin brother who looks identical I believe I can't even imagine the hurt the pain the grief every time he looks in the mirror he's gonna see the brother that was killed and died in his arms.

Starting point is 02:15:26 You know, oftentimes people say, Hey, I'm praying for you. I'm praying for you. Genuinely, I think anyone that runs into this guy in his life, give this guy the biggest bear hug you possibly can and help this guy cope. I recently was in New York because I had to go to a funeral for one of my closest friends, younger brothers, and they were incredibly tight. And to see the hurt in the family and the pain in the family and the hurt in my good friend's heart because he lost his brother was so tough to deal with. And all I could do was give him a hug and say I'm there for him. So, Hunter, the brother who's still

Starting point is 02:16:03 alive, you're living for two now. My message to you would be like honor your brother, live for him, and make the most out of this life because you got two people to represent for. So God bless. Yeah, that was a very good take, Adam, on a story like this. You hear this, it breaks my heart. As a parent, you don't have anything to say, and for the father to react that way? I mean, give me a break. my heart as a parent you don't have anything to say and for the father to react that way?

Starting point is 02:16:25 I mean give me a break. Like there's not more class to be shown than to handle that. You know I don't see the story everywhere. I don't see people talking about it. I don't see it you know where it's being publicized or talked about. You did say you said this is it's what word did you use? You said I don't think it's a story for us to use as anything What would you said something about political? I don't think there's political or anything to it The question that a lot of people would ask is what would it happen if this was the flip side? Oh, who would be covering it right now? Oh my god, where would it be right now? Where would the story be right now? That's the divisiveness of what America's sick of. That's the divisiveness. That father gave a message that's a unifying message. That

Starting point is 02:17:10 father gave a message that is an example to other fathers that you try to. You're like, oh my god, the standard. But to me, when we think about why America flipped in certain places and why maybe mainstream media has been getting a black eye just as much as the Democratic Party, just as much as the US government, just as much as CIA, just as much as FBI, is because the American people are just sick of it. They're fed up.

Starting point is 02:17:35 They want to go back to living a normal life, and they want these divisive messages to slow down and find ways for us to sit down and have a conversation together. Sham, there's probably less than 10% of policies you and I would agree with. But the more and more I listen to you speak and say the things that you say,

Starting point is 02:17:52 and your approach to it, I sit there and I say, hmm, I can't understand this guy, why he believes what he does. But you know what I will say? Tremendous respect for you to come here. You came, you gave your arguments, did your thing, you leave. This is the second time we've done this. Not a lot of your peers do this often and they all get invited. They all get invited. I don't know that I have any

Starting point is 02:18:20 peers. No, what I mean is from people on the left that are, you got 1.76 million subscribers, you put up 26,000 views, you are somebody that in your space you speak and you have an audience that listens to you. They like to see your perspective. But a lot of people on the left when we invite them for whatever reason they don't show up and I got so much respect. It's a long trip for me, it's just a straight shot down from New York. Respect for guys to come in, sit down,

Starting point is 02:18:46 have the conversation, and everybody that's watching this, whether you agree with him or not, you have to respect that he came here. Because that to me is a very, very high level of respect of anybody that's willing to have the conversation. If you do that, we need more of that and let the American people decide and say, I don't agree with Pat.

Starting point is 02:19:04 I think Pat is wrong here. I don't agree with Pat. I think Pat is wrong here I don't agree with Sam. I think I agree with I think I grew it up I think I no problem you get to decide and we get to have the conversation but I want to at least return the compliment to you because I According to Tim pool was blacklisted by all the right-wing shows was blacklisted by all the right wing shows. 2 years ago when you had me on and I think that you know I I think it was my opportunity to say like I can be well behaved sitting here and we can get into arguments and whatnot. You are the only show that would do it not

Starting point is 02:19:39 him is since sort of oddly reversed and I was on his show in November. But after I think he sat right here and said that I was a grifter, but but be that as may so I appreciate that and I appreciate the fancy car that took me here. Next time we'll just put you in economy Sam. Feel free. Sam, publicly, please come back again. Would you hear from now? Even in four years with the better whatever dollars exactly Hundred bucks charge interest on yeah, so tomorrow we have Terrence Howard. That's a podcast is gonna go up Very interesting conversation. I brought a guy that was a 17 year

Starting point is 02:20:24 He's been he's currently with NASA. Like he had to give a disclaimer and say, my opinions today are not the opinions of NASA. So we brought a physicist that works at NASA to sit down while we had, Terrence here, had a lot of different conversations, play this intro, this will go out tomorrow morning, 9 a.m.

Starting point is 02:20:40 Go ahead, Rob. After I'm done here today, I'm going to put online the equations necessary to have unlimited energy just to say, f*** you, to the world. Interesting. Okay, so you can sit back and let me know if you don't mind. You guys have never met. And you're currently working for NASA.

Starting point is 02:21:00 That's correct. I don't have the degrees he has, and guess what he doesn't have? He doesn't have an understanding of how the universe works. You don't think Erick Weitzel has an understanding? Oh, he has no understanding. Entire quantum mechanics build on this model. Is wrong.

Starting point is 02:21:17 Or he brings another dimension. If another country gets their hands on this... It's the end of America. What have you found? If I have to go to China, they won't hesitate a moment to use a linchpin, which they're forcing me to do. Do you know that they took away my passport? Why does this matter?

Starting point is 02:21:35 Puffy invited me. Are you saying what I think you're saying? He's like, I think he's trying to f*** you. That's what my assistant said. I was like, oh. If it's wrong, you'll never hear from me again. I walk away. I walk away.

Starting point is 02:21:43 I walk away. I walk away. I walk away. I walk away what my assistant said. I was like, oh I'm not here to give you a lecture on the politics. If it's wrong, you'll never hear from me again. I'll walk away. But if I'm right... Oh my God. Let me tell you. So you guys talked about everything. It was so entertaining. By the way, here's the crazy part.

Starting point is 02:21:59 Guys, you know who I'm talking about? Here's the crazy part. Huh? By the way, it's very interesting. Because you know he was on Rogan the first one It was very interesting. Yeah, of course, and then they do the one with Eric Weinstein the four-hour which I thought it was fascinating to watch the exchange but For whatever reason the the the gentleman dr. You from NASA Didn't fully disagree with some of the things he was talking about, which

Starting point is 02:22:26 was very weird for me and had never met. So he didn't find him. We didn't tell him that he was going to be here until he came here. The first time he met Dr. Yu was two minutes before we went live. Yeah, I saw the meet. That's right. So anyways, by the way, here's the crazy part. Terrence Howard's on my neck.

Starting point is 02:22:42 I said, Terrence, all these people that are ask me stuff, I'm not doing it no more. I want them to ask you, so if anybody wants to ask any questions of Terrence Howard, download the app Manect. Rob, do you have the QR code? Wait, do we have the lower third right now? Okay, so it's in the lower third. If you see it, just go. You can send him a Manect and whatever questions, thoughts, and stuff that you have, he's officially on Manect. You can ask him the question. All right, Sam Cedars YouTube channel is gonna be also below in the description. If you wanna give it a sub and follow his content,

Starting point is 02:23:09 we're gonna put that there as well. God bless everybody, take care, bye bye, bye bye. Thanks.

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PBD Podcast - Trump's Liberation Day Tariff HEATED Debate w/ Sam Seder | PBD Podcast | Ep. 570

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