PBS News Hour - Full Show - Listen Again: Dave Chappelle on Trump and the importance of comedy

Episode Date: June 17, 2026

We're revisiting our episode with comedian Dave Chappelle, who sat down with Amna Nawaz in Yellow Springs, Ohio, for a wide-ranging discussion on his concerns around free speech, the importance of local journalism and why he doesn't regret his controversial decision to perform last year in Saudi Arabia. PBS News is supported by - https://www.pbs.org/newshour/about/funders. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy

Hey everyone, it's Omna. We wanted to let you know that we are taking a brief summer break over here at Settle In. We're prepping all new episodes for you coming very soon, so stay tuned for that. In the meantime, please enjoy re-listening to one of our favorite conversations that we recently taped. And remember, you can always subscribe to Settle In wherever you get your podcasts. Dave Chappelle. Yes, ma'am. Hi. Good to see you. Thank you so much for having us here. We really appreciate it. Honored. It's an honor.

So Yellow Springs, Ohio. I know. Not where most people think Dave Chappelle is. Not an obvious choice, but I grew up here in part. Yeah. So I'm from D.C. Yep. My parents split up when I was very young, and my dad relocated here.

So I would spend parts of every year visiting him here. And then in like, say like 98, he fell really ill. and I would drive back and forth from New York to check on them and then ended up buying a house here. Because at that time there were really no places to stay. Huh. And right around 2000, I moved into the house. I left New York, moved into the house. And I stayed here ever since.

I mean, I went back to New York to do Chappelle Show, but when I wasn't shooting, I'd be right back here. And when I left Chappelle Show, I was just here. I didn't know about that connection with your dad being sick and you coming back and forth. That must have been really hard but also special in a lot of ways. I think so. I think guys and their dads have that weird relationship. You know what I mean? Kind of like walking into your father's footsteps to some degree. So to that end, I think that's why I'm active now in the community.

community. I think for the first 20 years I was I lived a very quiet life here. But since COVID the town started facing certain challenges and I stepped up. This is one of the challenges that the local NPR affiliate here WISO is a treasure of the town and we almost lost them because they left the university and there wasn't any real estate for them to have a station in town. Yeah. And I spoke with Luke and said, well, what if we could find a place? And we ended up finding this place. In those summers you spent here with your dad and the time you spent here,

did you listen to WISO? Oh, I liked. Really? Yeah, it's a big part of the local life here. It was just funny. My friend, a friend of mine visited me here once, Neil Brennan, who I used to do Shepel show with. And he said that about El Spring.

He said, this place is like if NPR was a town. And it kind of is. It kind of is like that. What do you mean by that? Explain that to me. It's just very community-oriented and soft-spoken and all the things you would think about of a local NPR affiliate. You know, there's only like 3,800 people live in this town.

It's a small town. But it is a real community. Everyone kind of knows everybody. And I like that. Is it hard or weird to be Dave Chappelle in a town of 3,800 people? I mean, you raised your kids here, right? Your family's here. This is your home.

Yeah. I don't think it's any harder than any. It's maybe easier in some ways. Yeah? Because if I don't know everybody, I recognize their faces. People will tell me if my kids are messing up or anything. They tell you bad? Oh, yeah.

I just saw your kid over there doing this and that. It's just a small town community, not too many surprises. So it's a good contrast for what the rest of my life. You know, and it keeps you humble. These people don't care about any of the stuff I do. So tell me about where we're sitting right now, how this place caught your eye and why you called up WISO and said, hey, why don't y'all move in? Well, the idea of WISO leaving Yellow Springs would have been culturally catastrophic for us.

Why do you say that? Because we're all very proud of the work they do and the presence they have in our community. And if they were broadcast and even from Dayton, we could still listen, but it wouldn't be the same. It's a big part of our community. And I'm friendly with a lot of the people who work at the station. So that's why I called them. When they were facing the specter of leaving town,

they weren't the only ones at that time because COVID was about to shut up businesses and the rest of it. Which is why I ended up buying so much property in the town. It's not like I want to be a land baron in Ohio or far from it, but it was, you know, expediency. It was just the right thing to do at the time. And this building is what they call the old school house. Our current governor, Mike DeWine, he went to high school in this building. When I was growing up, it was like a municipal building, like a courthouse. And then it was just abandoned for years. There was a guy that taught karate class in here, and I think that's it. Like, there was maybe

be like people do art classes here. Yeah. But the building was kind of shuttered. So I bought it. I met with Luke and an architect who's actually based in San Francisco, but he's from here. I knew him here when I was growing up. And he designed, our lead architect Max Crone, designed this new iteration of the old school house.

I mean, you joke about this in your work sometimes. times about how much of the town you own. It's a lot. Oh, yeah. Right? Like how much of it do you own now? I got a lot of property, but organically. I was kind of just trolling people because, you know, people here change averse. Really? I would say so. In the Midwest in general, but in this town in particular, I think they do kind of thumb their nose it. change. I think that a lot of the changes that this town and this region of country going through are inevitable. And I think they mistakenly thought I was the catalyst for the change. They didn't understand that it was something I was trying to get in front of.

When you say trying to get in front of, what does that mean? Anybody who wants to sell something here will come to me first. Because they assume that I have all this money. So so many people were coming to me, especially from the business community that he could kind of see a mass exodus. And it was out of necessity, which would mean a lot of the storefronts where they got shuttered and all this stuff. So I just bought the buildings. I weighed people's rent for a couple of years so they get back on their feet. And the town moved on.

But that's like, you know, behind the scenes. I don't really talk about that publicly, but that's why I actually. did it. You know, when we talked to Luke, he said that it seems like you have a really clear vision for the town in terms of the investments that you're making and the way that you're trying to support people. Is that true? Do you? I do. I mean, you know, yes. The short of answer is yes. What's that vision? I think historically speaking, the town was anchored by Antioch University, which was a very important cultural hub here and different than the rest of the region. So around here, this is a Trump country.

People love Donald Trump here and whatever, but this town is like a Bernie Sanders Island in the Trump seat. Antioch, historically, it was a very subversive university. Its alumni includes like Kareta Scott King and, and Rob. Seraling and Leonard Nimoy and like the famous actor John Lickie out he's from Yellow Springs his dad used to do the theater department but it was it was very culturally significant and subversive school it brought youth to town it brought academia to town and and and all kinds of different thought and the university is ailing it's leave it's leaving a huge cultural vacuum in its

absence so you know That's something I can fill somewhat with what I do and who I know. You need art in your life and you need culture in your life. You know, there's also demographic issues in the town that I don't want to get into, but the average age here is like, it's like 65. Yeah. So the people who made the town great, you know, they're getting on an age, they're getting tired. And younger people are leaving.

The younger people are leaving, which, which is a statewide problem. I think one of Ohio's biggest exports, best exports is its people. Like qualified people leave Ohio. So I'm just trying to make it so that, you know, the ladders a little bit longer. Like if a person develops an interest in New York City, they can pursue it to completion. In New York City, in Ohio, at a certain point you're going to have to leave and go somewhere else to keep climbing the ladder. So I just want our ladder to be as long as possible or at least give people a solid place to start.

You know, it is one thing to invest in real estate, revitalized businesses. This is also a working newsroom at WISO, right? There's an element of journalism here that you're supporting by giving them a home that they can afford to stay local in this community. Was that part of what drew you in? Because there's sort of a different return on that investment, right? Well, for instance, they did a program where they would do community voices and then they would have younger people come and work on the station. My son did it.

He would work at the station. Your son worked here. Yeah, developed a love for broadcasting and media. And they were great shepherds. I mean, I saw him flourish under their tutelage. So I was, you know, I was happy to support the station. I'm very excited about what we're doing here. Yeah.

If you want to smoke, you should feel free. Yeah, I know, you looked at the ashtray once, and I was like, please feel free. Don't wait for us. Sorry about it. No, not at all. So I didn't say anything earlier. No, you're good. I do want to ask you, though, Dave, because there have been different examples.

You've seen them in newsrooms and news outlets around the country where a really wealthy person comes in to help support the journalism, support the news outlet. And some of those examples don't end well for the journalism. Was there any hesitation on the staff part here? Did you have to have conversations about that, what that look like, how they maintain their editorial independence? I don't know that we ever really discussed it. But in my mind, I'm just the landlord.

I'm not, you know, I'm not, it's a church and state type thing. I don't want to tell them how to do anything that they do. I just enjoy the work that they do, and I enjoy their presence in the town. So if you, for example, say something that generates headlines, they can cover that the same way any other journalists would. Well, I hope it would be a little nicer than most of the journalists would be, but I also know, I'm realistic.

I can't control that. And even if they did cover it, I've heard them a while. They'll have to say that I'm the landlord when they covered, or the same way on seeing it, and they can't. You go, Warner Brothers is our parent company, if they have to report on Warner Brothers. But I'm not even a parent company. I'm just a local guy facilitate. This place underwent an enormous transformation, and only because you stepped in to help save it.

I mean, the history of this building in Yellow Springs, turning it into what it is now, it was a lot of money, a lot of time on your part, right? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Tell me about that. part than that. You know, my grandfather died in this town. My father died in this town.

You know, I didn't come here to die for sure, but this town is insoluble from my narrative of my life. You know what I mean? There's a lot of important milestones. Like you said, I raised my kids here. And whatever's happening in this part of the country is, as the economy here, reimagined. itself or whatever, the people are the best resource here. And community radio is one of the greatest ways

that I see us interface. It's so much better than a message board or a Facebook post. It's so much warmer than that, so much more optimistic. The way they cover journalism, you know, community-powered fact-based journalism. Like, you know, there's some baseline of truth that I don't necessarily feel like we get get from more corporately interested media.

You know, the more you empower institutions like PBS or like NPR, the more they can be ours of and for the people. And I think now more than ever has been proven that that's necessary. There has to be some baseline of truth somewhere because information is an avalanche of information. I don't know how anyone can decipher through all of it. And good journalism is a godsend in a time like this. So I support it.

The ethics of journalism. And when it's at its best, it's like, man, this is really important. And I think here in America, we know that, but recently it's been taken for granted. Why do you say it's been taken for granted? You know, with this, not to get political, but this administration has a history of, of, of, of painting journalists is an enemy of the people, but I don't, you know, but that's the interface that we have for all this information.

And a lot of times, journalists are empowered to be as honest or as truthful as they can be. Because like you said, like could they report on me? Of course they could. I mean, if they had to, but it is what it is. I think people take it for granted that, someone would risk their life and go to Iran or go to, you know, Israel, or go to any of these places just so that we can get some semblance of the truth.

Because at a certain point in my life, I got overwhelmed with how little I'd actually seem for myself. So I understand the importance of going out and seeing it or getting information or being trustworthy with the information that you, or being bound to some sort of ethics. when you dispense information. When was that? When did you feel like you weren't getting the full story? Is that a recent thing? No, it's probably after I quit Chappelle's show. Like probably around 2004 or 2005.

Yeah. I didn't think that I was getting the real story. But, okay, it's a good example. Yeah. There was a ton of stuff about me in the media. Yeah. It wasn't true. Like, no full fact that, you know, all kinds of crazy.

But then it got me thinking, well, what is true? And what is actually going on? I've been everywhere. I've never really seen anything. You know, I get on a plane, off a plane, on a tour bus, and off a tour bus, and do a show.

But during that time of my life, I took a good look around everywhere. I went to travel the world and just saw people, and at that time I could still travel alone. And it was great. I rode my motorcycle back and forth across America twice.

Did you really? Oh, yeah, I saw everything. met all kinds of people, some of which I'm still friends with. But, I mean, it's the larger point that most people now seem to live sequester lives, especially like COVID and post-COVID. I think one of the hardest things right now for people to deal with is that no matter what happens, they have work tomorrow. The Epstein Files could drop and the whole upper echelon of society could be monsters and he still had work tomorrow.

Nobody knows what to do about any of this. And nobody really knows they don't believe anything anymore. They don't know what's true anymore. And in a time like that, I think a dedicated good journalist is a heroic thing to be. You talk a lot about free speech defending the First Amendment. it feels like supporting WISO at this time is part of that effort and support as well. But you noted this political time that we're in,

which is you're not just facing public criticism, right? If people don't like what you have to say, the government, the president can apply pressure. And the media can. And the media can. But we saw what happened with Jimmy Kimmel, for example. We've seen the president threaten other late-night hosts. Does any of that make you guard what you say

or think twice about what you say and how you say it these days? Let me think. How can I answer this honestly? Do I guard what I say? No. I am strategic at times. Strategic. If there's something I want to convey, well, how can I say this?

But normally I just do what I do. I look at it. And then I think about, will I edit this or will I edit that? And the rule I had was don't edit for fear. You know what I mean? If it's artistically not right or if it's this or this, there's other considerations. But I wouldn't edit something just because I was afraid of the repercussions. Like, did you mean it?

If you meant it, just say it. You told an audience in Saudi Arabia last year it's easier to talk there than it is in the U.S. right now. Is that true? You feel that? It was for me that night. Why do you say that? Because the king said I can say whatever I want. I mean, look, they want me to do a comedy festival in Saudi Arabia.

They want me to come. They don't. Yeah. They don't want me to. I'm not going to fly all the way to Saudi Arabia to do a sanitized show. And I know I got a lot of criticism for me. You did. Did that surprise you?

No, but they're mad about anything. You know, where is this clean money that everyone's speaking of? There's actual slave owners on my local currency. So I don't know whose money is clean or dirty. It's like I go there with good intentions. I do what I do. And they pay me well for it. That's the extent of it.

In that case, that was the extent of it. At a great time, and the crowds, you know, it's hard for people to understand that American culture is probably its last decent export. And all the shit we sent over to the Middle East, our culture is like the best of it. And if they could have seen that crowd screaming like I was doing magic tricks just for jokes. It's like watching a baby taste sugar.

How satisfying is it if you can't say everything you wanna say and then you see a guy just saying anything, man, that's inspiring, that's empowering. Yo, they need to know that that's like the last great thing we got in America and they're threatening that. So I'll go and I'll do it for you and they loved it. They were screaming, you know, old school admiration of America. or an American, and then when I get home, it's just like, well, you know, you worked for a dictator.

Whatever. Whatever. No regrets about doing that show. Not yet. Not yet. I mean, you know. And our government taxed me, so there you go. You also did Saturday Night Live's first show in 2025 after President Trump was reelected to office, and I remember in that monologue you spoke directly to the president, and you said, Donald Trump, I know you watched the show. That's right.

And you said, I mean this. When I say this, you said, good luck. Please do better next time. I met that. Yeah, I met that. How do you think he's doing? He's joking, right? Man, come on, man.

Nobody wants to feel this way. And I don't think anybody wanted a war. They definitely didn't want to, arguably. lose one. But when you're asking him to please do better, what was it in that moment that you were asking the president to do and to do differently? Well, I believe in that same monologue. I reminded him that everyone on earth is counting on him.

Yeah. I think I made the point that the presidency is no place for a petty person. So personally, I would say that, you know, anyone in any type of leadership position or even like a nightclub comedian like me we have to suffer sites and injuries and we have to kind of just let some things go and we have to focus on what's actually important and not cultivate a broth of confusion which I believe is I believe he's doing that you know but you know for political expediency or whatever reason I don't understand this methodology

But I just know that Americans, I think everyone wants to have some semblance of peace. And they get there different ways. Some people think there's different things threatening their peace, you know. But being a president seems like an opportunity to be a very unifying force. And I feel like perhaps he squandered that opportunity, to put it likely. You also said, I'm tired of being controversial. And that's a word a lot of people have used to describe you, right? Some of your jokes, some of your remarks in the past more recently about transgender people, for example.

Do you feel like it's fair to call you controversial? Do you consider yourself controversial? Yeah, that's a hard thing to talk about because it's a larger question of, is it actually controversial? You know, the mechanics of being a nightclub comic have been the same on my life. No matter how famous I've gotten or, you know, or not, it's just, their job is the job. And it is a weird phenomenon. The more successful you get, they would start to vet jokes as if I were doing something other than being a nightclub comedy. Like, all of a sudden I had to consider everybody, but, but I don't believe that I did. I was,

I was considering people that went to nightclubs and paid the cover charge. and we're standing in front of me. Now, when you start your career and you go on stage, usually nobody knows who you are when you go on stage. They don't know if you're funny or not, and you literally have to win the crowd over. But then as you get more successful, they kind of know what to expect,

which is why you're successful. Then they buy the ticket just to see you. And you have to live up to whatever their hopes are of what the evening is like. But what happened, I think, was that, that a lot of people who weren't actually invested in what I was doing had things to say about what I was doing. But, you know, or, you know, some journalists would come

and would listen to shows and take jokes out of context and print them wrong and just to get rage baits. Because clicking became medium. People didn't buy newspapers anymore. the ethics got looser and the headlines didn't really match the stories anymore. It's just what can get people to engage. So I think the country got on the whole algorithm of negativity. Even positive things, they would just spend them negative just to get people to click.

And I think artists had to suffer through that. And some artists which, you know, would try to appease everybody and other artists because they, you know, because it's art and commerce, right? And I was just, we're selling it. And everyone got to that differently, but, but, ideally I'd want to be free from an algorithm. No one has made a ticket to see how right or socially responsible I am. They just want to have a good time.

And I'm, and I'm, boy, I'm very good at that. Like, like, I have things to say. I have things that I feel, but my job. It's my job and there's me and an audience that are very engaged in one another and we're having a good time and I look at a lot of that criticism as just interlopers chiming in on a very pure conversation. I'm struck by how you refer to yourself still as a nightclub comic. That's all I do. Yeah?

You still say yourself that way? That's all I've ever wanted to be. You still enjoy it? Yes. Like it's still challenging. It's still fun to do. I probably laugh more in my life than more people, most people get to.

But I think that's because I ignore a lot of the trappings of being a celebrity. I'm just a comic, you know. I mean, I like, you know, I'm just a comic, man. At the end of the day, I feel like that more than anything else. Raising your family here, You have two sons, a daughter. I think your sons are mostly grown. Your daughter's a teenager now. Yeah, I'm staring down a barrel of a completely emptiness.

What is that like? What's it like to be a parent to young adults right now? Ah, that's a good question. You know it's funny, okay, I was talking to a friend of mine the other day, and we were laughing about how no one really would know what the teacher kid now. What skillsets are going to matter 10 or 20 years from now? as the world becomes automated and everything is just changing. So we decided that your character is your destiny. You know what I mean? Just like, you know, if you're a good person,

that's pretty much all you can ask from anybody and hope for the best. I don't know if anyone needs to think anymore. What do you mean by that? The machines are doing all the work for it? It's AI. It's quantum computing. It just seems like thinking is for poor people.

It's a joke. By the way, I forgot where I was. But it's true. It's just like who's, you know, no one reads books anymore. It's just so different from when I grew up. I guess for my kids, I have anxiety a little bit. Really? They're all young people.

About what their futures will look like. Yes, but they also are the antidote to that anxiety because they are so capable and they are so thoughtful. that I hope, I still hope that they'll do better than us. You mentioned a little bit of your life here sort of being like walking in your father's footsteps, that your father's buried here, your grandfather's buried here, you've raised your family here. I wonder, do you think about, you're in your 50s now, right? Yeah, yeah, I'm 52.

Do you, do you think about ideas like, like legacy, like what it is, you're leaving behind? Does that kind of stuff cross your mind? Not yet. Not yet. No? No, I'm still active duty. I still work a lot. You know what does happen at 50 is, at this age you start losing people more often.

And that's been kind of tough, but maybe that's how those thoughts will start. But that's, that still doesn't seem to be. That still doesn't seem like something that'll happen to me. It happens to other people. Is there anything else you want to say I haven't asked you about, especially about why so, this community, your role here? Well, I'll say this. When I mentioned walking in my father's footsteps,

this is a path, I believe, he would have taken. He was big on the ethics of community. You know, the whole Black Panther's mantra of think globally, but act locally. And the understanding that you maybe can't change the world, but you can fix the stoplight on the corner or something like that. And, you know, I think I'm doing most of this,

even press around it, because I want to inspire people to take charge in their communities in a positive way, not just about excluding anybody from anything, but facilitating as much happiness and ease and comfort as you possibly can. So that, and then when you do it, it's inspiring because all these negative things you hear going on all around the world,

but then you look outside and it's a beautiful day and there's families that you can help or even a smile as charity if that's all you got for somebody, but you should just really focus inward on your communities. And, you know, when COVID started, I think the worst, not the worst, but one of the most daunting signs was most places they hoarded bullets and toilet paper. But they didn't do that here. You know, like, everyone would just buy one row to leave something on the shelf, and that's what a community should be like.

That's all I'd say, because it's just always good to, you know, whatever you can. do to help people, you'll feel better doing it and you'll have more faith in people doing it. You have more faith in people now? Without question. I mean, I mean, I don't know that I could have had any more faith. I quit my show, the media put an avalanche on me, but people supported me and I got through it. Every person I stand in front of, they had to get a babysitter, go through all this trouble just so we could be together. and we get to be together every night. Like, I actively depend on people in a way

that is very humbling. Even though I'm famous and celebrated, it's a very humbling way to have to get through life, but they've never let me down and I try to always hold my end of the bargain. Dave Chappelle, it's been a real pleasure and an honor. Thank you so much for having us here. My pleasure, thank you guys for me.

I really appreciate it. Man, my pleasure.