PHLY Philadelphia Eagles Podcast - Eagles 26: Trent Cole & Zach Ertz, NFL Draft Home Runs For The Eagles | PHLY Eagles Podcast

Episode Date: July 9, 2026

Two of the best homegrown players in franchise history make our list of the best Eagles since 2000, with Trent Cole, the defensive end who paved the way for the likes of Brandon Graham, and Zach Ertz, the best tight end in Eagles history. Vinny Curry joins the show to reflect on Cole’s greatness before an appreciation of everything that made Ertz the perfect Philadelphia athlete.    Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hello everybody and welcome to the P-H-L-Y Eagles podcast on a blast flood warning. I'm going to say. I'm going to say. I am just silencing notification after notification about the weather outside right now. Live from the Exfinity Lounge and presented by Bet365, Bo-Wolf E.J. Smith. E.J., how you doing? I'm doing great. I'm excited for the show.

I'm excited to talk about two Eagles icons. You know, I know this is the nature of, you know, when you're going through a list of, you know, list of great players that as you go through at some point, you feel like, oh, man, we're really getting into it now. And today feels like one of those days. You know, not to, not to, you know, besmirch anybody that came before. But I feel like we might have done a tear jump. You know, I love my tears. I agree with that. I think you might have done a tear jump today. I think that's right. And I think from this point, especially when we get to a number, I'm not denigrating anybody. I feel like 13 through eight, you could really argue.

argue sort of any order. Yeah. I feel good about the place that we've landed, but I think that that's fair. Of course, we are presented by our friends at Ashley.

And this is a fun one. These are two fun ones. Now, one of them preceded you a little bit. Yeah, I didn't cover Trent. No, I didn't cover it. I mean, I know it's in a thing, but we've got to build up this suspense. I'm talking about Trent Alexander Arnold,

you know, Liverpool, Liverpool, alleged. Didn't cover one of them. Well, you know what? Let's get into it. Yeah, sorry. Spoiler alerts. for everybody.

Unbelievable. I can't do anything. I think at the end of the show, we can unpack yesterday's performance in the resounding results. We don't have to do that. Let's get into it. Let's talk geology.

A common misconception, according to Wikipedia, is that diamonds form from highly compressed coal. Coal is formed from buried prehistoric plants, and most diamonds that have been dated are far older than the first land plants. It is possible that diamonds can form from coal in subduction zones,

but diamonds formed in this way are very rare, and the carbon source is more likely carbonate rock and organic carbon in sediments rather than coal. Well, in the fifth round of the 2005 NFL draft, it must have been a subduction zone for the Eagles, because that's when they drafted Cincinnati defensive end, Trent Cole, and man, that he turned out to be a diamond in the rough. Of course, over the course of 10 seasons with the Eagles,

Cole played 155 of a possible 160 games. He racked up 85 and a half sacks, enough to cement him still as number two on the franchise sack leaderboard behind only Reggie White. He was dependable. After his five-sack rookie season, he had between eight and 12-and-a-half sacks for seven of eight seasons in a row. He played with violence, and he was a menace as arguably the league's best run defender on the edge. In short, he was a rock.

Perpetually underrated, Cole only made two Pro Bowls in Philadelphia, victim of sacks selling across the league. He was the best player on the Eagles defense for at least half a decade, and he bridged the gap from the Hugh Douglas-led defenses of the first Super Bowl run at the early part of the century to the Brandon Graham, Fletcher Cox, Vinnie Curry-led group of the Doug Pearson era. As such, he is probably the best eagle this century not to have been on a Super Bowl team.

But because of his years as a mentor, to young players providing insight into how to win at the NFL level on and off the field, his influence remained. Even still his influence remains. You could say, if we return to the geology of it all, the weathering process has taken place.

Once a rock, coal remains very much part of the soil of the Eagle's success. Number 14 on the list of the Eagles' best players this century is the great Trent Cole and let's hear from him now. I learned a lot. I learned a lot through that journey and I'm very appreciative for it. I'm very appreciative of the Eagles give me the opportunity to come here and make a career

and make a life to be able to make a life for my kids. You know what I mean? So that's how much appreciation I have. I might be good quiet guys on, but that's just me. You know what I'm I move a certain way, you know, and like I said, it's just, you know, I've got the chance to learn to get amongst some of the greats that were in front of me, you know, I'm saying, Hollis Thomas, any Kuloo, I mean, Kirsch, Javon Kersh, Jerome McDougall. I mean, I had some great, Hugh Douglas, I mean, these guys all help me out to get to where I'm at today, you know, It was all part of it. So that's why I took that. And I did the same thing for, you know, for the guys I passed out on. And like said, you know, I was trying to, you know, it was just a great,

just a great journey, man. And met a lot of people, learning a lot, a lot of things in life early on to help me get to where I'm at today. And like said, it's very appreciative of it. Good to hear from Trent Cole, E.J. And now we will hear in the next segment from Vinnie Curry. We talked to Vinny about Trent Cole's influence on him and what made him such a good player and what made him such a good teammate but what are your memories of Trent Cole?

Yeah, my memories of him are and I see people in the chat, Prove John saying this as well. Like, he was just such an underrated player. You know, I don't want to draw too many parallels to Brandon Graham, but similar in that like if you were an Eagles fan and you watched him week in and week out,

you knew how important he was to that Eagles defense and how good of a player he was even beyond just what the statistics would have shown you. And it's funny, like, I didn't cover his career. He left, I think it was in, what, 2014, and I joined the beat in 2019. So it's a five-year gap between when Trent Cole had a locker in that locker room and when I started asking people questions in that locker room. But you heard a lot about Trent Cole, even five years later because of the word you just

used in reference to Vinny, the influence. You know, there were a lot of people in that locker room that point to the example that Trent Cole said. You know, we talk about this with some of the players from like the early 2000s, Trey Thomas comes to mind. Trent's influence like on the next generation that that pass rush that went on to win a Super Bowl,

I do think that there is a tangible impact that he had on those guys. I think that's right. You know, Lutch talked about it all the time. EG talked about it all the time. Vinny, we will talk about. To me, Trent was starting to cover the team in 2009, which was the second of his only two Pro Bowl seasons.

and I will talk about this with Vinny. Trent Cole is like the first guy who really like taught me the importance of run defense for an edge. Yeah. He was and not taught me the importance of it, but made it fun to watch. Yeah. He was so good against the run on the edge

in a way like where like it was almost more exciting to see Trent have, you know, a two-yard tackle for loss against the run than it was to see him get a sack. and he worked so hard at it. We remember those, like, those baby blue eyes, those big eyes that he's got. I remember, like, he was a difficult player to transcribe, I'll always remember. Was he a fast talker?

A lot of little assigns, like, you know what I'm talking about, you know what I'm saying, like how to use those. Yeah. But I would say the best defensive player that I covered until Fletcher Cox came along. I think that's fair. that's fair to say. I mean, reflected in where he is on the list.

I'm wondering. Now, I grew up in this area. I've been an Eagles fan, you know, up until I started covering the team, obviously. Like,

so I have a very, you know, I have a very biased view of this. And maybe it's like this everywhere else. But do you feel like Philadelphia has a special appreciation for like a complete run defending edge rusher? Like,

you know, kind of this archetype of player where it's like, they're not going to be double digit sacks every year, but they are, or a great player, like, you know, to go from Trent Cole to Brandon Graham, and to take a big step down to, you know, as a necessary caveat, but like the appreciation for Nolan Smith even, like where it's like he's so good against the run.

I wonder if that is like a Philadelphia thing where it's like there's a passion for, you know, an edge rusher that is going to give you, give you everything on early down. That's possible. I think that's right. And there's no doubt that the BG part is downstream of learning it from Trent. Yeah. I, they are similar players, like a little bit undersized for the position, make their biggest impact on early downs, but are obviously very capable pass rushers.

And in the way where we think back on BG's career, where there were a couple times where he, maybe almost left in free agency, obviously he was not the right fit with, with Chip. You could, if you had switched their timelines, you know, Trent Cole could have had Brandon Graham's career and could have stuck around. If he has a Super Bowl moment,

he is, I said the thing about, like, the best player to not go to a Super Bowl, I think that that hurts his legacy in so much as, because most of the teams he was on, were not NFL spotlight teams.

Yeah. He didn't get the Pro Bowl accolades and he is not thought of necessarily in the same way that players who are probably worse than him are. Yeah, it's funny to think, like, you know, we've talked about the timeline stuff with some of these players,

if you could put Prime Trent Cole on this Eagles defense, is he, I mean, he's a starter. On the current Eagles defense? Current Eagles defense. He's by far the best defensive end they have. Yeah, I was going to say, but I've really am more leaning toward like what,

how, how, like, impactful would he be across the landscape of the league? And, you know, again, his playing style wasn't flashy necessarily, but I do think that, like, he was a winning player. and if he was on a team that made it to a Super Bowl, like he would be recognized for that more. I think that's right.

Yeah. All right, let us know your favorite Trent Cole memories in the comments. I take us off the rails a little bit. Sure. I always thought my name would have been Ernestine if I was a girl. I, you know, we're talking baby names all the time. Now, my dad told me my name would have been Cole. Really? Which makes, you know, it's talking about Trent Cole makes me think of it. Which is really, really bizarre because my old his sister's name is Nicole. Okay. So we would have had Nicole and Cole.

Do you think it's possibly as misremembering? Oh, I mean, knowing my dad, yes, but. No, it came up recently. He's like, I really liked the name Cole. Interesting. Yeah, you named your eldest daughter, Nicole. That would be funny. Well, I mean, I guess Nicole and Cole.

Maybe somebody out there is a Cole with a sister named Nicole. I'll have to let us know. Potentially. All right. Let's take a quick break on the P.H.L.Y. Eagles podcast. On the other side, Vinnie, Curry joins the show to talk about Trent Cole number 14 on our list of the Best Eagle since 2000.

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and taught you and BG and the guys on that defensive line room, Fletch, what it was like to be a professional. What was so special about getting to learn from Trenkoe from your perspective? Oh, man. I have a list of things, man. But one of the top things, you know, T. Cole should tell us, when we were so young, we should always say, no matter what, you guys need to stick together.

He would tell myself that, BG, that, Fletch that, stick together, together, stick together, stick together. Like, don't let nothing come between the bond. And he says it's going to be coaches that come and go. But if you guys, you know, stick together, nothing could break that bond. And that's going to create a culture like no other. So just to be a part of that and knowing that he laid that foundation, because when we got there, his group was immaculate.

If you guys remember. But T. Cole is probably, you know, one of the best defensive players to ever play the game. That is, first of all, that is sage advice, right? Because it is true. It's going to be a rotating cast of people in the building and they're going to be having different coaching points and coaching styles.

But what really does matter is that the guys on the field are working together. From your perspective, Vinnie, having, as we know, being an Eagles fan, that you come into the building, you're playing that position. Obviously, you must have watched a lot of Trent Cole. What was it like, okay, this is the guy, and then finding out what he was actually like as a player and what went into his success? Oh, so it's a cool story.

So when I was in college, you know, when I was in college, I just to watch them. I used to work on the fans. And so the college coach was like, what the hell are you doing? What the hell are you doing? I'm like, man, I got to get my T-Cola on it. So we were watching. This is when they first come up with the, yeah, yeah. Now, look, I took it.

I tweaked it. Now the whole league do it. The whole entire league do it coming on to Rock. I said, yeah, just pay the homage, man, where it came from. You know, I ain't going to say I invented it. it, but Ticole, if you watch it, you know, I kind of tweaked it, bro. I took it from him, though. Okay.

I like that. But, yo, but let me tell you something, man. When he's done for the game, and then me and him talks about this, you know, Tico was famous for a hot-by move. Napos was doing it, call it the cross chop. I'm like, you know, that's a shankhole move. Like, I don't put your different name on there. Man, what he did for the game is crazy.

And, like, if anybody go back. and look at any Ticoe's sack. He is known for the hop-out move, and then they call it the cross-chop. Okay. Man, Tico been doing that for years. Yeah, I want to get into some of the specifics, some of the real, like, nitty-gritty of edge play

and what made Trent so good? From your perspective, what was like what made him elite? What was the most impressive part about his game? Well, that hop-out move, nobody was doing that. Okay. Nobody was doing that at that time. And it was so deadly. and then when you

play high you, Tico, man, pause, but you're stiff and you were getting that and then you would try it and you'll get jammed,

like boom, boom, he'll do it. It looks so fluent, man, and he would just laugh, bro, he would just laugh,

but Ticoe probably one of the hardest workers you ever, ever seen play football. And then we used to laugh again because I said, man, usually had his personality

is after all that, he'll pull out of soda like yo you drink my own dude bro that's very funny not under chip chip must have got rid of that you know no he used Tico had that thing in his car

in his truck in like cases I'm like yo T you crazy bro and you know you're so young you're like is this the thing you're like you know what I'm saying I'm like I'm saying right this is a secret I'm like I'm not a show the drinker but yeah yeah yeah you know he's from Ohio

so he'd be like yeah man you don't drink pop I'm like call it pop yeah oh man that's very funny um i also think about trent as you know listen he is second in franchise history in sacks you know he had he had he was so consistent i think six seasons in a row with at least eight sacks but when i think of trent i think of the guy who sort of taught me as someone watching the game how important defending the run for an edge player was he was so good against the run. Right.

Oh, man. So in the beginning, man, him would you sit there and go over it and go over to run and go over to run because he used to always say, bro, you've got to be an all-around player. He said, you know, T-Cole, you know, when he starts preaching,

he becomes this philosopher, right? He goes, you know, everybody wants to say, edge rush or air-rusher, no, I'm an all-around player. And I was like, he's like, yo, you dominate first or second down. Of course, you mean, sax come, it's going to come, but when they look back at it,

you don't want to just be labeled just a sat guy. And, you know, you want to be an overall defense, I mean, an overall defense in. And from there, I just be like, you know what,

I'm going to dominate first or second down as well. You know what I mean? And like I say, he helped, he helped to this day. You know, it's not maybe once a week, once every two weeks,

you know, he calls, he checks in, you know, with his guys. And, man, and that's, be honest,

he would have broke, the Eagles franchise sack record if they didn't send them to, if Chip didn't send him to, uh, Indy. Yeah, that's possible. I mean,

now Reggie's got a bit of a distance on him, but he could have got there. Yeah. Well, what, Chicoe end up playing, what, two more years?

Yeah, I think he probably, I think Reggie's got a little bit more distance for, for how long Trent played. But I could be wrong. Diccault, I try to hype you up, Chey.

I do believe, though, I mean, I think he, and then we said it, at the time, he was one of the most underrated players in the league. You know, I think he's only got three Pro Bowls. He should have had more than that for sure.

He was an elite, elite player. A hundred percent. And then, you know, like, Man, Tico underrated period, bro. That dude is cold-blooded, man. And you know what you was getting every Sunday with him. And like I said, he helped us mold the landscape of practice. That's why we practice so freaking hard because he, he, you do. didn't expect anything less from him. And I'm like, yo, if this dude could just drink

20 ounce of mountain dew and come up here and just do that like, yo, this is crazy. Do you think, is there someone who you think that he got that from? Like if we're sort of tracing the lineage of edge guys, like did he get that from Hugh Douglas and, you know, like the on and on and it goes down? I'm pretty sure. I'm pretty sure he did. But you know, when we got here, Trent Cole was very vetted. So he was like, this was like, yo, this is the schedule, this what we do, this is how we do it. You know, and we had a good group of guys, man.

And, you know, he led that charge, you know, and it was just awesome to be a part of because now you see where it went to. Like, you know, obviously that group that he was in charge of go out and went in the Super Bowl and he was there, he was a part of it, you know.

It was just amazing to have him as a mental What was the best? Because I know that he was also important in like just telling you guys how to become pros even off the field. What was the best piece of non-football advice, Trent gave you? Not football advice. He always said, save your money, man. Save your money, man. That's how he said like that.

Like, this I talk. You know, some people talk like this. With their hands, for some reason, he always do it like this, right? Yeah, he does. Yeah. I'm telling you this now. I'm telling you now. I'm telling you now.

I don't care what it is. Save your money, man. Just save your money, man. rainy day is coming v running day is coming like all right bro yeah that is good advice save my money i'm i'm living very comfortably all right last last thing viny is is a big picture on this project that we're doing the eagles 26 aside from trent when you just think of of your time in philadelphia

if you had to say one guy who was the best player that you played with who would you say who would you single out oh bow come on We play with some legs as, bro. I know. I know. There's a lot of them. It's a very hard exercise. Jason Peters.

Jason Peters. And why is that? We're still watching. Everybody's still watching on Sundays. I ain't seen nothing like it yet. Yeah. I ain't. Yo, JP, people don't understand.

The people are like 340, bro. J.P. People run with us. You know, you know how that make you feel? You go back your locker like, hell, no. Like, Jason Peters, girl. it's nothing like that dude couldn't do that was insane. I remember like he was coming off of Achilles injury when we got drafted, right?

So when he walked in it was like, but you was there, it was like a different aura. Yeah. Look, a breeze came in when he came in. I was like, damn, what the hell? And then you start watching him and he started getting his Achilles stronger and his killie stronger. Then after that season, Chip Kane and then, you know, he was back.

when I've seen this man jump up and try to win a miller basketball, I was like, oh, hell no. I have never seen nothing like that in my life. I was like, oh, this is crazy. You know, once again, Tico, like, he's the best in the business. That's, like, you know, I said, oh, okay, so that's your secret sauce. Them two dudes used to go add to that. Well, that's the thing, is the two of them going up against each other, right?

Like, that helps get you ready for Sunday. And I will only say this. Remember at that time, J.P. Didn't call for help. I'm talking about prime time, JP. He didn't call for help. He owned the island by himself. You know, you got Demarchus Ware.

He had Ryan Carrigan. What was the other? Rapo. He had. Pierre Paul. JPP. Pierre Paul. O-C.

Talk. Yeah, bro. Like, you know, and J.P. Will him that ass up, Paul. So it's like, yo, it was insane. And then when film come, we'll watch our film go around our film and we see what he did.

Now, when you got the building, seen what a left tackle was doing? Yeah. It was insane. I think that's well said. Well, Vinnie, thank you so much for the insight. It's great to see you, my friend. Man, great seeing you.

man, I see you guys soon. Training camp. Sounds good. We look forward to it. Vinnie Curry, everybody, thank you so much. Back with more on the other side here on the PHA Yagles podcast. It is almost here. That's right. MLB All-Star Week is coming up. So get ready, Philly, because this summer, you, we are the center of the baseball universe.

I've been driving around the city, seeing the posters of all the different players who are going to be here. very cool to feel like you are in the mix. And five days, one city, every eye on baseball is on us. We've got the culture, the competition, the celebration, the biggest stars, the biggest fans, all in one place for America's summer tradition. The stars are going to come out.

The fans are going to take over. And this city is going to come alive. Not just a game, baby. It's a homecoming. So don't miss MLB All-Star Week. It's for the people. Click the link in the description below. To learn more, can't wait for the Home Run Derby.

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To number 13 on our countdown of the Eagles 26, the best Eagles this century. Do you remember what the tension felt? light. When Zachertz feigned to the corner of the end zone, cut inside, and caught a Nick Foles pass about at the five-yard line, took three steps and dove into the end zone to seemingly give the Eagles a 3833 lead on the defending Super Bowl champion New England Patriots with 221 left in the fourth quarter. And then when the ball. popped into the air, do you remember the anxiety of whether that touchdown would stand? It took three minutes and 29 seconds for the play to be reviewed.

Three minutes and 29 seconds to find out if Zach Ertz would be immortalized. three minutes and 29 seconds of waiting, praying, hoping. Three minutes and 29 seconds. Of course, you know what happened next. Gene Sterator confirmed the call on the field. Brandon Graham stripped Tom Brady, and the rest was history a very long time me. Looking back, it's appropriate that Earth's goes down as the player to score the game-winning

touchdown in the Eagles' first Super Bowl victory. His was a perfectly Philadelphiaan tenure. He arrived in the city as a second round pick in 2013, drafted to initially play alongside Brent Seleck before eventually replacing him. No wonder howie Roseman has tried to run that playback again twice so far. In the beginning, Ertz was shy, struggling with a stutter in the media and adjusting to life in the NFL. On the field, he quickly became one of the league's best receiving tight ends, topping 700 yards in year two and 800 yards in years three and four. He wasn't yet a fan favorite, though, and the tide turned against him in 2016 when he famously turned down a block on the sideline against Vante's Perfect and the Cincinnati Bengals.

He admitted later the loud criticism of him then was a turning point. He could have retreated inward, shaken off the portrayal as the uninformed opinion of outsiders and gone about his business as usual. Or he could take the moment as the tough feedback from someone who cares about you. He could accept the brotherly love. And boy did he.

He made his first Pro Bowl in 2017, scoring eight touchdowns during the regular season, before becoming a Lombardi hero. In 2018, he set the franchise record and the NFL tight end record with 116 receptions, bringing us the, as far as I'm concerned, forever famous three-word complaint of an anonymous Eagles person to reporter Josina Anderson. too much hurts. No such thing. In 2019, he showed just how tough he really was.

He played in the team's playoff loss to the Seattle Seahawks while suffering through two broken ribs, rib cartilage fractures, and a lacerated kidney. He continued racking up catches as the master of leverage using his preternatural understanding of space to create just enough of a window to steal a first down. He set the franchise record for receptions in a game with 15. He also had games of 14 catches, 13 catches, 12 catches, 11, 10, and all the way down. By the time he was traded to the Arizona Cardinals midway through the 2021 season,

Howie Roseman finally acquiescing Ertz's request for a trade once the team opted not to meet his contract demands with his own successor in place. At the time, Ertz ranked second in the franchise list in all-time receptions, just 10 behind Harold Carmichael's 589. The day the trade was announced,

Ertz did an unusual thing. He insisted on having a press conference, in part to say goodbye, in part because he had something to get off his chest. one of the things that kind of irked me the past couple days, Ert said at the time, is that when word of the trade was coming down and people started to know about it,

they'd say to me, well, you know, you're going home, you're going back to California, Julie's home in Arizona. No. This is home. Philadelphia's home. And that was tough,

just to kind of articulate that to people that I love this place. I've said it all along. The city he entered as an outsider that intimidated him at first, that was hard on him, it got into his veins. Eventually, life took him elsewhere,

but not only was this his home, he was offended, you would consider any alternative. How Philadelphia is that? Post-Eagles, Ertz kept his ties to the city, his foundation doing impressive work. He was also involved in what is

probably the most embarrassing moment of Nick Siriani's tenure in retrospect. The irony of that post-game encounter being that even though Siriani is a Super Bowl winning head coach with the best record in NFL history, he would probably not like the answer of whose side Philadelphia would be on in that fight. So let's welcome to the list. Number 13, the best Eagles tight end of the 20th century, the man responsible for the most important. and touchdown in franchise history.

Man responsible for those three and a half minutes of tension. Zach Earth. Tension and in and out of the studio for that one. For the record, I had no idea. And for the first minute, I was convinced that you were breaking me. Like, you know, there's, we don't have our monitor like we normally do. And I'm thinking, oh, maybe this is a ruse. Maybe the camera's on me the whole time.

So I had to do some research. And by the time I figured out, like, that it wasn't a ruse. I was like, we're here already. might as well just go with it um but with that said very well set up with zackertz uh me and cousin grace were agreeing because when you do these i just become like one of the sickos i'm in the chat just like having a good time with everybody and we agree that that was a bar and a half too much irts no such thing um the thing about zackertz that i find remarkable there's a lot of things but um he is one of the more rabbit-eared players to really find success in the city and i think

that's a really, it's a tough needle to thread and it's remarkable that he was able to do it the way that he was. He was not immune to the criticism from the outside world or the outside narratives. He accepted Philadelphia's for who they were, understood where they were coming from, and why they felt the way they felt, and he was able to compartmentalize it and love the fan base and give his all on the field without the pressure that a lot of athletes succumbed to with Philadelphia's intense scrutiny. And I think that that is really special. You know, a lot of guys have to handle that different ways. They have to either shut it out or we've seen guys struggle with it.

I think the fact that he was able to kind of accept it for what it was and still find success being aware of that, I think is really remarkable. Well, that's a good point because it is difficult, you imagine. Yeah. Because he, like, he, you know, he paid attention to what was being said about him and written about him. It's hard to do that and still maintain your sense of self to some degree and sense of purpose. Yeah, he was able to thread. Yeah. I mean, he would, yeah, I remember doing like a,

a silly thing, like a fake commercial with him and his, and his wife, just like as part of an article. And I showed him because it was funny. He's like, oh, yeah, I already read it. Like, he'd already seen it. Yeah. It's like, you've read this? Yeah, I mean, but again, it's like, how rare is it that you hear?

It was a Hertz commercial. That's red. Hertz. Harts, okay. You should do the same thing with Jalen. How rare is it that? you know all of like the intensely like, you know, have like the heavy scrutiny that fans have for you and you love them still. Like you still like most players will love the fans because they

don't really get into that type of stuff. I think the fact that he was willing to like receive so much of it understand where it was coming from and like, you know, even through the, maybe the stuff that crossed the line like to love Eagles fans and love Philadelphia the way that he does. I think it speaks to who he is as a person and I think he is, you know, a remarkable person. And then as a player, he's interesting in that he's a skill position player who is not great because of, you know, the highlight plays. I mean, he's got one of the most famous plays in franchise history. But he's not Deshaun Jackson running past everybody.

He's not shady juking people out. He's not Sequin running deep. He's like winning 15 yards down the field in tight spaces. using like the power of how hard he works because he's practicing all of these routes and the intricacies of them all the time and his understanding of leverage. Everybody would always talk about his leverage,

his understanding of space, like things that are hard to appreciate the minutiae of from the outside, but it leads to the accumulation of what is obviously a great career. Maniically dedicated to his craft. And I think that it speaks to the longevity that he has had in the NFL. You know, it's funny, I'm going to tip my cap to Fran here because he has said this about Zachertz before that he's like unkillable. You know, the, you know, he's with the Eagles, they draft Dallas Goddert.

And that like succession plan lingers because Zacherts is just so good at his craft and he won't let anyone out work him. He goes to Arizona. Same thing. He goes to Washington. Same thing. He is stuck around the league longer than I think most would have expected because of that work ethic and his. dedication to the craft of route running and understanding leverage and all of the things that you just alluded to. So I hope it comes back against those 11 catches. I was going to say,

I know that he would like to. And I, I wouldn't bet against him. I mean, he had a really, really tough injury at the end of last season, obviously. And, you know, we'll see when he's available to play and where he will sign. But I'm sure he'd love to come back and get 12 catches. Even when he left, like, you know, that, that, that departing press conference, he's like, I'll let Harold have it for a few more years. Like, I think, you know, in his mind, like the storybook ending is here. And I mean, it's, it's like, it's tough to envision it being a likelihood, but you can't roll it out. This is a sentimental organization and he's a sentimental guy. Yeah, I think that's right. Do you think they, they would entertain bringing him back? I think it's, I think there's a scenario in which that could

work. Yeah. I think it makes sense. It depends on where the team is at. Yeah. There's a lot of ifs, but I think it would be a fun reunion. Me too. Him and Nick would have to. who would have to clear the air. I mean, I think they already have clear the air. One man enters, or two men enter, one man leaves. Yeah. Head coach player, Zachertz. Yeah, we'll see.

I think it would be a fun reunion if it did happen. All right, we've got a little bit more on Zacherts on the other side. The professor is going to reflect on Zacherts, and we will get into another discussion about the best combination of first and second round picks in Howie Roseman draft history. Stay with us. From the big soccer tournament that's been happening

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maybe starting to become larger part of the offense, like in the NFL on a lot of teams, like Zach Gertz and the way that he could run routes, the way that he could out leverage people and be as effective as he was despite not having, famously not being a yards after catch guy, right? Like we know about the play in Cincinnati,

I know he's talked about that recently where, you know, he was a mistake and he didn't, you know, he should have tried harder that kind of thing, but it was never his, it was never his game. Like his game was out leveraging people, getting open, you know, catching everything, and he was good enough at that stuff

that he was able to overcome the fact that he wasn't like a super violent physical player and that was probably better for his own health going forward that he wasn't like that. You know, comparing him to Brent Selleck who he was teammates with who probably, you know,

might have done more damage to his body than he should have, right? But yeah, I mean, Zach Kurtz, I mean, of course the catch in the Super Bowl that, you know, brain-breakingly took them forever to review, which was really annoying. But, you know, is going to be something we think about. But, like, he was a big part of that team. Like, it wasn't just that catch, obviously. And he was a big part of the offense for a very long time.

And he was a security blanket for multiple quarterbacks, right? Over, over his career. Yeah, so don't have anything bad to say about the guy. Thank you to the professor. Yeah, it's good to hear from him. He's gallivanting across the world. I know, but I miss it. Yeah.

He deserves his time off, but that doesn't mean I get to miss him. Yeah, I think that's fair. Yeah. What else would you like to say about Zach Hertz? So I have a, I think one of the biggest what ifs on the list. Oh, okay. Revolves around Zacherts here. Okay.

We heard so much in 2022 about the Eagles core for Lane Johnson, Fletcher Cox, Brandon Graham, and Jason, Kelsey. and I'm not saying that like anyone and the team's history would change obviously with Zach Hertz but I do think his personal legacy he was on that team if he was on the Eagles at that time it would have been the core five and I always thought that like you know because when we started talking about the core four like the journalist in me starts thinking like okay who would have been like around the fringes of that core four and Ertz is the one for me like it would have been a core five if he hadn't been traded the season before and it's a

It's like a, he has a great, he's had a great career, so I don't want to overstate this, but it is like an unfortunate story. If you think about it from his perspective only, like the Cardinals were six and O when they traded for him in 2021. And they were viewed by most people as like a Super Bowl contender at that time, or at least a playoff contender. Yeah. And the Eagles on the other hand, it's Nick Siriani's first year.

They had a lot to figure out. And the Cardinals went five and six in the games he played that season. and they went four and 13 each of the next two seasons while the Eagles, you know, turn things around with Nick Siriani, go to a Super Bowl the next year. Obviously the 23 season didn't end well, but again, on the trajectory toward a 2024, Super Bowl team. And, you know, we talk about some of these guys.

This part of the list is a lot of great Eagles that didn't spend their whole career necessarily with the team. And I think for Zach Hertz, it's like, if he had just stayed here the whole time, like he's higher on this list, you know? Like the core four, we haven't gotten to the guys in the core four yet for a reason and they deserve their places. It is a little bit of a personal what if, like an individual legacy. What if? What if Zachertz was the fifth number of that core five for the last four or five seasons?

Yeah, it's hard because it was always going to have to end with Goddard here. Right? Like it was becoming too complicated, not just from a money standpoint for what Zacharis wanted to be paid, but just like the egos involved, like those guys both want to be the number one tight end. Yeah. Eventually that comes to roost. But like if,

if Dallas got it wasn't here, and this was more of like a, he gets the Kelsey treatment of just getting to be the guy. Yeah. You know, yeah, he would certainly be higher on the lip. Yeah, it's just, if you're Zach Hertz,

you probably wonder about those things. And he's made it clear. You know, I was listening to my former colleague, Jeff McLean, he had a podcast with Zacherts, a few months ago as he's going through this rehab process, it was a really good look. It was a really good chance to hear from Zach talk about his career. He makes it clear he didn't want to leave in 2021. Now again, he wanted a new deal. He was weren't willing to give him that. But I do wonder when he looks back at his career,

how much he wonders about like what it would have looked like if he had stayed here for his entire career. Yeah, and I think this is where, I mean, as we talked about this is where his heart is, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Too bad. Let's get to the Hand Your Delt presented by our friends at Parks Casino.

My question here for you, E.J., is the best tandem of first and second round picks under Harry Roseman. And for this one, unlike the Eagles 26, you can project forward. Oh, I like that. You tell me where you think this is going to land. Where are you going to put your chips on these three options? You've got Lane Johnson and Zach Ertz. Man.

You've got Devante Smith and Landon Dickerson. Okay. And you've got Quinyon Mitchell and Cooper DeGee. Oh, man. You have to go with Lane and Zacherts. You have to. I think you have to. Because it's like, you know, the legacy in hand is better than the one in the bush.

Yeah. But I probably go Quinyon Mitchell and Cooper deGene. Number two. Over Devante and. Over Devonte and Landon. It's tough. It's very tough. Devante could easily go down as one of, if not the greatest receiver in Eagles history.

Like that is not easily, but it is possible. It is a pathway that he has in front of him, depending on how the next few seasons go. And Lane is a Super Bowl champion with the team. I don't know. Ertsin Lane, like those guys, or sorry. I don't think you can get. Queen Anne and Cooper. The fact that they are in the secondary together, I think plays to their favorite.

because they will always be seen as a tandem, you know? I mean, I will put a lot of weight in the Cooper to Gene pick six in the Super Bowl. I think that's always going to, that'll be something that lives in Eagles history for forever. And, you know, Devante has the dagger. So now I'm waffling a little bit. I only have to pick the top one, so I'm picking the top one. Okay. I'll let the chat decide the other two.

I mean, it's impossible. It is impossible to get better than, then. arguably the best player in franchise history. And a borderline Hall of Fame tight end. Yeah, that's pretty good. Yeah, the Quinyan, that's actually a fun, like the two versus three is a fun debate. Who would you have taken?

I think if I'm projecting and guessing forward, I think I probably would put it on Quignan and Cooper. Really? If I'm guessing. Okay. Not right now. But if I had to say what I think it's going to play out like. that's what i mean that was my first instinct

but i mean davante has a dagger like that is going to be a super bowl moment we remember forever ask me again in a year let's see how this exercise uh this is one that i think fran would enjoy uh it was just crossing my head to create uh your eagles team of the 2000s where on both sides of the ball you've got 11 spots you have to have a first run pick a second round pick a third round pick a fourth round pick a fifth round pick a sixth round pick, a seventh round pick, an undrafted free agent, a free agent signing, a trade acquisition, and then I guess one wild card where you can do whatever?

This is a fun idea. What would the team look like? Do you use your second round pick on Jalen Hertz, or do you use it on, you know, Shady McCoy or Deshawn Jackson or Zach Hertz? I think you have to do jail. You have to use it on Jalen in the second round. I don't know. You could use, you could use it as Michael Vick as the quarterback as the free agent signing or

Yeah. You've got, you got Kelsey as a sixth rounder. Yeah. Easily. That's easy. You know? This is,

that'd be a very fun exercise. JP is the trade. I mean, you got Cam Lott is a draft-up. My Lata is the seventh rounder. My Lada is your seventh rounder's a lock, and then you have lane. I think you have to,

yeah. I say you have to use it on lane. I don't know. It's as a fun little. But at some point, you're like, what position do I need to fill for the first rounder? Well, AJ is your trade acquisition.

I think that's an easy one. Unless it's Jason Peters. I take my lot of in the seventh. Getting your franchise left tackle, M.A.7 is too good value. That means you have to use Lane. Yeah, I'm taking Lane, and then I'm using my trade acquisition on AJ. And I feel good about that. Second rounder on Jalen.

Third rounder, Milton Williams comes front of my. You do the exercise on offense. Oh, on offense, okay. So I need to find a good offensive player. I mean. Third round offense is Brian Westbrook. Oh, yeah. No brainer.

Okay. This is a fun exercise. We should do this. Okay. I mean, we don't have that much time before training camp here. So. Which way time? I'll close the book on the Hanger Delt presented by our friends at Park Casino.

Pretty resounding response. Oh, hang on. I'm not done talking about Zach Ernst. We don't need to get into it. this. We don't need to get into this. I've been beat up enough online over the last 24 hours. For Zachertz to go. Pull a Zachertz and use it to fuel yourself. I will not get better. No. It's not overtime, but if you've been saying I need to be banned from the game, get out of here with that nonsense. What I was going to say about Ertz, I know you mentioned it in your your intro here,

but to go from like the criticism that he received for the Vante's perfect thing. And then fast forward to him like playing through a lacerated kidney in the playoffs and being widely regarded. Like there other than like concussion uncles who are always going to hang on to the perfect thing, nobody will question Zachard's toughness as a Philadelphia Eagle. And I think that's, you know, a significant thing. You know, it's like it's something to appreciate how he embrace the city. and basically like took on the persona in a lot of ways that the city always wanted from him,

almost to a fault. Like, you know, if he were one of my loved ones, I'd be like, I don't want you playing through a lacerated kidney to impress anybody or even for yourself. But again, I think everyone respects his toughness for what he did. Yeah, I think that you can make the case. You talk about those core four guys that his is the most Philadelphia relationship. because Fletcher

put him to the side because he has sort of removed himself from that. He was never necessarily all about embracing that. BG's is probably the right answer because his also includes the same negative stuff in the beginning and then the embracing of it. Whereas Kelsey's is more like...

Like a love affair? Yeah. Now, I think he would disagree with the fact that he didn't have the downs because, you know, he was about to, he was going to trade him. That was more about the organization. Yeah. I don't think it was coming from the fans. Kelsey's almost like, man, what a, what a fortunate turn of events that someone so perfectly, you know, built for the city, became an iconist. Yeah.

Whereas Ertz is like, he came here, he went through it, and he had to leave, but he remains a part of it. Yeah. I don't know. It's a different kind of story. Yeah. No, I agree. I think, like, Kelsey to me is like the storybook one. But I think Ertz is, the fact that Ertz got to that status is a little bit more real.

Yeah, and it's also like a tribute to or like a reflection of him earning it in a way that is very Philadelphia. Yeah. Let's pivot and tell you that. If you want to watch the rest of this episode, you can do it on YouTube or all pagellwye.com. But for now, we had to. Overtow. And we're back. Do you think that

Eli Stowers will have half the career of Zachers? I mean, the odds would tell us no, right? I mean, I think Eli Stowers could turn into a great player, but it's a high bar. I mean, I guess

half of the career, are you saying, like, in terms of production, or in terms of, like, you know, does he does he be can he be like a zackert's type player for this offense for half the time i meant like half the production but yeah that's probably a better way to put half the production is more likely than be what zackertz was even let's say three quarters of what zackertz was it'll be very hard i mean logic would tell you know how did you how did you honestly feel about your performance yesterday after

reflecting on it the thing is like i still feel good about it i felt good about my team um and i want to I want to make it clear. Like the feedback has not been unanimous. I think that the people who are on your side are just more aggressive about it. Oh, that's not true. I mean, I feel fine about it. I really do. I think the most common thing I've seen is that people were rooting for you and then

after the sake of my picture, like, ah, have you seen like the Moreno meme? No, I don't see this. No, I feel fine about my performance. I think this is an audience that has been watching you play games. for a while, and they like how you play games, and that's fine. I don't, like, I think it's honestly, it's been weird for me because, like, I think if you talk to most football fans, you would get, like, a much closer, like, 50-50 reaction to the argument, like, would you rather start an offense that already has a franchise quarterback

with Devonterer Sequin? I think you, like, I think maybe it's a testament to how intelligent our audience is that they would all start their offense with Devante. I think if you were just like asking Eagles fans out in the world, it would be a lot more split. And I feel fine about my decision. Sequan is more of a unique player

than Devante is at this current state. All right. Maybe in a year I'll be, I'll say I was totally wrong. Devante is a top 10 receiver in the NFL. Top five, I would say. He's probably like top 15 right now. Even if he's a top 20. He still should be drafted ahead of safety.

We can agree to disagree on this one. What do you want to do tomorrow? You're asking me this in-bo-in-bo-time. I'm just wondering if you have an idea. I don't know. I'm sure we've got plenty of ideas. We can talk about training camp. We could talk about some of our favorite

and least favorite storylines going into training camp. We could play a game, although I don't really want to play a game anymore. I don't because it's still licking my wounds. about the Eagles 26. Oh, it's been great. It's been really enjoyable. It's been, again, we're getting to a point now with the list where we're talking about some, like, iconic players.

It's been fun to reminisce about players I watched growing up, but especially fun to talk about some of the players that I covered because, you know, it kind of lets me, honestly, it's been nice to, like, go back and read some of my own stories. You know, wonder, man, like, this guy used to write a lot. He used to write all the time. So, yeah, it's been good. Okay.

How about you? My podcast. Yeah, I used to write too. I meant the Eagles 26. I've been flexing those muscles just a little bit. Yeah, you're excellent writing. Yeah, I got nothing left. With the Eagles 26?

I hope not. What do you mean? I'm asking you how you feel about the Eagles 26. It's been fun. It has been. Three minutes and 29 seconds. Here we go again. No, no, we're not doing this again.

No. Once was enough. All right. That'll do it for this episode of the PHA while you podcast for Lindsay and E.J. Thank you to Vinnie Curry. Yeah. Trent Cole and the professor. We're joining us with cameos on this episode. We are back tomorrow. Two o'clock for all of us here. Thank you for watching. We'll talk to you tomorrow. And as always, we love you.