PHLY Philadelphia Eagles Podcast - Eagles Film Review: Fran Duffy looks for the bright side with Jalen Hurts & Eagles offense

Episode Date: December 9, 2025

Five turnovers is a season’s worth for Jalen Hurts, who achieved the ignominious feat in just one Monday Night game against the Chargers for the Eagles, but underneath that headline, are there signs of life for the Eagles offense coming off the overtime loss to the Los Angeles Chargers? And with the defense playing at such a high level, could Hurts & Nick Sirianni be primed for another resurrection? Fran Duffy joins EJ Smith and Bo Wulf to break it all down. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hello everybody live from the X-Finity Studio and presented by 5365 and actually this is the P.H.O.I. Eagles podcast, the P.H.O.I. Eagles show. The P.H.O.I. Eagles gathering. Welcome. Join us. Fran Duffy. To my left. Lindsey Behind the scenes

I'm Bo Wolfe We're going to talk a lot About what happened In the game last night Was it all pretty Certainly not Sure as hell not But I'll tell you what

Fran How you feeling I spent the morning With Brandon Graham I'm feeling good Cloud 9 I think they're gonna turn it around Wow

Hey why not We should call it like It's like cloud 55 Like yeah you spend You spend some time with BG And all of you feel better Why do you feel better What's the number

one thing coming out of that conversation that's like, you know what? Now I feel better about this whole thing. I'll tell you why. Because after the Bears game, I wasn't sure the defense was up to the task of making up for the offense. Right.

I think they are. After watching what they did last night. No question. And the offense can't be worse. They were so bad in an uncanny. I know they have been really bad. I've been saying that, though. But in that way,

five turnovers I mean if they turn the bowl over three times yesterday they win the game right? Sure. And the Chargers are a pretty good team

that's a tough game to win I know Herbert was banged up and the offensive line is a disaster there I don't know they just got to get I don't know

I think we I have come to terms with this is not last year's team of course it's not it's never going to be the best team

in the NFL, but now you're in a situation where, okay, can they catch lighting in a bottle? I don't know. Yeah, I think the big thing will be the human element of that. It's like the... That's true. Like, can everybody else detach and say like, all right, we need a reset point. Maybe if you win three straight, is that enough? Is that an elixir to say like, all right, like give you that positive momentum going into the...

Well, I think it's there for them. Listen, we don't have to, we don't have to, you know, tick off wins without them getting them. I think they should be able to beat the Raiders on Sunday I think they should probably be able to beat the commanders after that if you win those two games all of a sudden okay let's find out if we're for real

then they have a real test at Buffalo and even if they just play well in that game and they're competitive there's probably a good chance they've clinched by then they can rest week 18 you get these guys healthy I don't know you get in the dance you get a dice roll I don't know I thought it's fine really is a loopy too

Tuesday. Yeah. I like the positivity. I don't know. Sure. Why not? Why not? You want some more positivity?

Yeah. Big day today in the PHY Eagles family. We get to celebrate Lindsay's husband. Lindsay, tell us what happened today. Uh-oh, she was, I caught her off guard. I'm sorry. It's a big day. You always catch me off guard.

Today my husband won teacher of the year at his school. Oh, let's go. So we went and surprised him. He didn't know. He was winning it. So we went with the kids and surprised him. And it was awesome. Did he, like, did he see you guys before it was announced?

So that gave it away? How to take us through? He's a phys ed teacher. So they were, and he was in the gym with the class. And one of the principals had him go in the locker room to, like, check something for him. Okay. So then when he came back out of the locker, we were all standing there. And he knows, like, they bring the family for whoever wins.

Oh, that's awesome. Yeah, so it's fun. That is awesome. Did he cry? No, he literally never cries. Did anybody cry? No, I don't think so. I think I would have cried.

You're about to cry for him, just talking about it. Yeah, I think that's great. That's awesome. Are you on board with the chat calling him Mr. Lindsay? I am, but I don't think he will be. Mr. Lindsay. All right, well, congratulations to Mr. Lindsay. That's awesome.

Thank you. Great. Great start. All right, see? We're bringing good vibes today. Now to the film. Now to the film. All right, here's my question.

As you see, the sort of the rundown of what we're going to go through today, we're going to bounce around a little bit. It's a loopy Tuesday. My question for you, off the top, I think we're obviously, we're going to focus on the passing game in this episode. Just for the start, yeah. Did the bones of the offense and the game plan? look structurally any different to you, knowing that Nick Siriana was more involved in the game planning process this week

than it has for the first 13 weeks. I would say the biggest area where I saw differences was first and second down. They were definitely more aggressive vertically down the field. I think there were more play concepts that were designed to attack the intermediate and vertical area.

Now, that may have been scheme specific. It might have been, you know, who knows we'll see week two if that's the case but you know based off reporting from the weekend obviously you know there was a there were some changes there in terms of the process maybe not in terms of the workflow on monday night in terms of play calling but in terms of what went into the game plan the nick syriani may have been more involved and so yeah i thought that there was there was definitely more of a feeling of hey they're going to be aggressive down the field design shot plays that are you know meant to attack past 10 yards it wasn't just all hitches

in this game. I texted Danes on Tuesday morning and I said my guess is this will be the lowest rate of hitch routes in a game this season and he was like oh be careful it might you know it might not be and I was like I don't know I felt like there were there was less of that especially in the like the first and second down play that explains so much because I was just sitting around earlier today and I got a text from the Danes which just said what is a hitch route oh right so now I understand where that was coming from it I mean it's we we know we have to explain these things yeah right okay that's good all right and so do you want to take us through some of this or you want to talk about it first let's I guess we can talk about a little bit I mean I think that to me the the biggest thing

that I found to be really interesting because again the the chargers have been good at eliminating those downfield throws and eliminating the explosive plays right so the fact that they went they also didn't really hit on any of these plays well that's the thing too is that They hit on, there was some chunk plays. Like some of those like A.J. Brown, like 22-yarders are examples of what I'm talking about. Okay. So the fact that they hit a couple, then for a variety of reasons, some of them they didn't hit on, and we'll get into that. But they kept going with it. So it wasn't like, oh, they got really conservative.

Now, the third down game plan, like the wide receiver screens on like third and nine and third and 11, like throw those out. But that's why, to me, like, the big change for me was, oh, wow, look at what they're doing on first and second down in terms of just being more aggressive down the field. I'm going to throw you for a loop because I have a specific question. Okay. The play that has been driving me nuts all morning, as I've thought about it, was second and 11

from the Chargers 26 with 227 left, this is the ball that A.J. Brown drops in the end zone. Yep. Right? And, oh, man,

if he catches that ball, the Eagles win the game. But they don't necessarily win the game. Yeah. And from a game strategy standpoint, that play drove me nuts because the Chargers have one time out left

with 227. If the Eagles, and listen, if you score a touchdown, fine, of course, I'm not going to complain about scoring touchdown. But the touchdown is not the goal there.

The goal on that possession at that point in the game, tie game is go get a first down and you win the game, essentially. Yeah. Right? You get a first down. They call their timeout.

Okay, you run the ball, goes to a two minute warning. You get two more runs. And the game is over and you kick a field goal and you win. Yep. So that play

did it look like it was designed for that or is that a Jalen check? Oh, I can't answer that. Okay. With certainty. I'd have to go look. I did not notice anything on first watch that looked like a hand signal from Jalen

that they would change that. Because that's what this offense has done sometimes. Listen, I love the deep ball. But sometimes they go for the deep ball as the kill shot when it's not actually the kill shot. Right. You know what I mean? Yeah.

Like there was the one earlier in the season when they went forward and fourth down and they didn't need to do that. So that play's been driving me nuts. There are also, I mean, that's the thing about, those kinds of plays and we've talked about it is that they are low probability plays

and so even you know there was it was late in the game it was a third down it was the final drive it was the third down their answer against cover zero was like oh we're just gonna throw it up to AJ it's just like oh right you know and it's just like yeah like it didn't hit and just like the

previous one like yeah like AJ you know it goes through AJ's hands you'd like for him to catch it but like am I going to kill him for dropping it and like it's not like a terrible drop but those are low probability plays for a reason. Yeah. Then they,

like, I don't even know what that call was on third down after the timeout, like a screen with no blocking in front of it. That's incomplete anyway. What was that? They ran, was it two or three of those in the game?

And they're from different formations. So some of them, you know, that one was two by two. So it was literally one receiver blocking for Devante out in front. Those are like maybe, potentially my least favorite play in all the football, potentially.

Worse than a shot. on same side run uh yes yeah yeah i think so i think so oh no so seeing a lot of those on third and 11 third and nine that was that was painful all right let's let's get into the snappies and let's let's start with you want to talk about some of the downfield passing right i do so let's do let's start with an incompletion to devante smith that you think is emblematic of some of the stuff you saw yeah so second drive of the game it's first and 20 this is after the Tyler Steen holding call on that quarterback draw. And this is a sale concept.

And when you're looking here with a sale concept, number one, it's a three-level stretch concept where you see, number one, you've got 12 personnel in the field. So you've got two tight ends here to the boundary side. You're going to bring Devante Smith in motion from right to left, and he's going to run the deep post route. Now, the sail route is going to come from the tight end position,

and that is Dallas Goddard. The Eagles hit on this play, a very similar kind of concept, earlier this season against cover four. This is, I remember breaking it down, this is exactly what you want, and they run it perfectly here, because what you have to do, when you're playing cover four,

if you've got the split safety look, and if you're trying to run this post route towards the middle of the field, you have to account for this safety, and you have to account for this safety. And so the Eagles do that with a couple of routes. Number one, you're going to get A.J. Brown from the field side attacking vertically, he's going to hold the eyes of this safety

and hold him there in the middle of the field. And then you're going to get the sail route from Dallas Goddard, where he's going to work up the hash mark and then break out towards the sideline. He has to get to a certain depth. And if he does that, he is going to hold the boundary safety. And what that does is it creates a wide open void in the deep middle of the field for Jaylen to be able to lay this out for Devante. So as the routes kind of develop here, this is perfect. This is exactly what Jaylen wants. The safety is holding on Goddard, the backside safety is holding on AJ.

all kinds of real estate out here to lay this out for Devante Smith out in front middle of the field if you're going to miss you're honestly you want to miss as far right as possible but unfortunately he lets this go you can see this is where Jayland's letting this go plenty of room to operate and he puts this about here it lands just below the S and so it's too far on the outside I guess the inside

of the route for Devante and it ends up falling incomplete now we go to a little bit later in the drive this was just a this was a couple of plays later here uh yeah this was four plays later after the completion of devante they dial up something similar again and again this is it was a recurring theme like oh okay this is something else they dial up this time they're in empty and oh man yeah they were in empty so much last night and it was bad the empty numbers were very very bad um and they're we'll get into a few different things there but uh they get into empty and what they're going to do is they're going to bring devonte mvante smith in motion here into a late stack

which is something we have not seen from the Eagles very often, but they're going to bring him in motion, and he is going to be the primary here on this play. The Eagles, I mean, going back to, like, Andy Reed, like Deshaun Jackson would hit on this play, different versions of this play, where basically you're going to get A.J. Brown running like a curl route here, and that's designed to hold this corner on that side.

You're going to get Devante running a through route, a deep vertical route across the middle of the field. That's what you're hoping that this safety is taken away so this corner, rather, is taken away so that he can't get under this route from Devante Smith. You're also going to get a route over the ball from Dallas Goddard.

Again, you're hoping that's going to keep anybody here in the middle of the field. And then you're going to get another backside post here from Darius Cooper. That, to me, is the second read on this play. So, Jaylen... Primary for me, but...

Yeah, well, of course. But so you've got Dallas over the ball, you've got A.J. Brown here at the bottom of screen to the boundary. Here comes Devante Smith on the through route. he's going to cross the face of the safety, and then if that's taken away, you don't like that? All right, well, now you've got Darius Cooper here on the backside post.

So that, to me, is what the read should be. And again, everything is flowing from right to left here on this play, right? You've got this route from A.J., you've got Dallas running that way. You've got Devante, you've got Cooper. Everybody's flowing this way. Jalen steps up, he hits the top of his drop. There's a little bit of pressure here, not enough to me for him to bail, but you can already see he's stepping up and ready to eject and he starts rolling to his right

he's rolling away from the flow of the play and now he starts immediately calling for cooper to uncover it becomes scramble drill but you had devante devante's streaking open obviously a j's over there dallas is over there he's already his momentum has already carried it this way across the field so it's a lot for him to kind of uncover this becomes a it's a one receiver route essentially in the scramble drill and it ends up being i think it was like a two-yard scramble for Jalen on that play. So two plays on that drive, designed to go to Devante. One is just a bad ball, and the other was a turndown

that you could say like, all right, pressure had something to do with it. But on that drive, I thought that that was a, you know, kind of interesting to see that show up. But there are a handful throughout the course of the day. I've got more. I want to give myself a little bit of a breather. We'll give you that breather. We'll give everybody else a breather.

Take a quick break to hear from some sponsors. Much more coming with the professor. The other professor, Grand Duffy. Shots fired. Yeah, you got numbers too. Bet365 has 90 million users worldwide, and they live stream over 780,000 events each year with early payout offers across the NBA and NHL,

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by using the promo code P-H-O-Y at checkout. that's A-U-R-A-Frams.com with promo code P-H-L-Y. Terms and conditions apply. Back on the P-H-O-Y Eagles podcast, Bo-Wolf and the Prefrancer, Fran Duffy. What do you think? Workshop it. I mean, the standards, the standard is the standard. It could be worse, yeah.

It could be worse. All right. Let's talk about a couple good plays from the downfield design here. And if we're thinking, okay, maybe they're just tweaking this offense a little bit. maybe this is a little bit what it's going to look like more moving forward this is what it could look like in a good version of it yeah and that's a couple good ones to me the the thing that stood out was that there were there were there were plays to be made there were plays where it looked like are you know what they honestly those were two of them right where the the post was there at devante

like that guy and we've seen jalen you know hook up on that play with devante here this season and that one was just an it was an errand throw and then the second one was you know more of a scramble drill, and, you know, it just didn't work. Now, again, they had some other plays here in this game where I'm like, okay, like I see what we're going for here, and I kind of dig it. I like what, because we haven't really seen it so far this season. This is a good example here where, again, you're going to get Devante Smith coming in motion, where he's going to now serve as eye candy in the backfield where you're going to get jet action. You've got Jahan Dotson. He's going to run a clear-out route. You've got Dallas got it running to the flat. This play, though,

is designed to go to Sequan Barclay on a wheel route down the right sideline. So again, you're getting a post-wheel combination. You got flat control. We haven't seen a lot of these kind of vertical elements on display in this offense this season where, again, you're trying to attack. Essentially, the Chargers are in cover three. They're playing cover three zone coverage. We know the Chargers were a big-time zone defense coming in.

So they dial up these concepts to attack these various forms of zone. What you're hoping here, if you're Nick Siriani, if you're Jalen Hertz, is that this route from Jahan Dotson takes this cornerback towards the vertical part of the field and now you've got Sequin running into the void. That's where you're hoping. Now, they do a great job here at the Chargers

and they're all over it. This corner, he does a good job of reading this and that takes the throw away from Jalen Hurd. Jalen does not force this ball to Saquan and instead it's a good scramble. He ends up scrambling for nine yards. So that's the thing is when we're watching on TV and it's like, oh, again, he doesn't look confident

with what he's seeing. Another scramble. That's a good scramble. That was a good decision on Jalen's part. You go to a little bit later. This is actually the, yeah, this is the first play of the third quarter. They come out and they run. It's another sale concept, another three-level stretch concept. This one goes to A.J. Brown gets me a swooper point here off of under center play action. No one you're in such a good mood, by the way. What's that? No one are in such a good mood. I wouldn't go that far. You got Jalen Hertz under center. You've got heavy personnel on the field. You got a condensed formation. so it's a run look.

You're running Devante Smith vertically down the field. A.J. Brown clears the first level. He's going to work towards the sideline. Three-level stretch concept. Boom, boom. There's the flat. So now you're stretching. You have the vertical, or you have the outside corner.

He's taken down the field. The flat defender, he's occupied by Dallas Goddard. And now you've got a huge void here for A.J. Brown to be able to work through. And Jalen's able to layer this throw up and over for a catch. So again, like, it's just. Time and time again, it wasn't just, oh, it's second and eight, it's got all hitches, right? It's second eight, it's slant flat again. They just, well, that is such a, I mean, that is such a basic route concept.

Yeah. And yet, I cannot remember a single time, other time this year where AJ has been targeted in that fashion. There haven't been, there haven't been, there haven't been. No, and that's the, to me, like, when I'm looking at it, I'm like, all right, like, that's a, that was a difference. So it was a different feel watching it this morning from that standpoint. I'm like, okay, there were aggressive calls consistently throughout the course of the game. And even like, oh, okay, like I was ragging on the screens, the third down wide receiver screens. Well, they threw a screen like a pump and go where this is, Lindsay, if you want to take a look,

this is one where you've got Devante Smith as number three. He's going to run the bubble screen and Jalen Hertz is going to pump the bubble. he's going to pretend he's throwing this to Devante Smith. You're trying to get everybody flowing down here. You're running a receiver vertically down the field. Darius Cooper, I got to think this was the most snaps Cooper's played all season. I would think so.

He was out in the field a lot. And then you're trying to leak Dallas Goddard outside. And again, you're hoping that Dante Jackson runs vertically with this play. And so it's another concept where they are trying to target zone defenders. Like it's not just ISO ball where it's like, all right, you have a deep curl and you have another route over the ball and there's a vertical route. Like these are the types of concepts. I'm like, yeah, like, okay, I see what the plan was here. I get what the idea was here on this play. Now, the problem on this drop back, Jalen hits the top,

and this play is going to be open. He's going to have Dallas got it here. But look at Jalen. He slipped when he hit the top of his drop. So he trips. He probably honestly still had it there because he catches his balance and steps up. And he probably still has Dallas Goddard here on this one. but I think he was just a little bit queasy didn't really want to try and make this throw Dante Jackson was lurking a little bit so he waited and waited and waited and ended up throwing it and ended up being incomplete along the sideline but again there's just to me like that's the last one here from this one Lindsay there were a lot of examples of them being aggressive and purposeful with what their route concepts were attacking down the field they just

didn't capitalize on enough of them second most snaps and again the season for darius cooper but the first was in the Giants blowout win, so he got a few at the end of the game. Okay. Yeah. Interesting. I actually, I looked at it, and I was like, did he out snap Dotson? And he did not.

Dotson had more, but I think Dotson had a lot of them at the end. I think Dotson was out there. I think there was one where they, like, went tempo. Told you, by the end of the season, he's going to be the number three receiver. He might be. Might be. I wouldn't even know.

I'm not going to put a ceiling on it either. Well, how can you? Yeah, listen, this is part of why I'm squinting and feeling some optimism. Because, I don't know, Jalen's not going to play that bad. I mean, he's not going to slip. He's not going to throw four interceptions. If they're attacking downfield more, that's better process. I don't know.

I don't have any reasonable expectation that they're even going to be an above average offense. I just need them to be like the third quartile instead of the last quartile. Sure. but here's my here's my concern okay for interceptions last night does that say like up nope dial it back we're not going to be as aggressive well that is a very that's my reasonable concern that's the concern for me gotcha yeah that's a fair point that's the concern for me it's a fair point I don't know they're getting lane back I don't know getting lane back yeah and that'll help especially in the run game yeah

Um, yeah, Fred Johnson didn't have a good day in the red game again. Um, but yeah, should we go back, take a look at some quick game stuff? Yeah, let's look at some quick game stuff. Then that was less encouraging and we didn't, I'm not, you're not even calling this stuff encouraging, but this is even, this is even worse. Yeah, I mean, again, this, we talked about the amount of empty and I didn't, I haven't looked at the numbers. My guess is the empty numbers aren't good.

I can tell you the empty numbers. Okay, let's see, let's hear it. First of all, 16 snaps at, of empty in this game. Yeah. Which is the most in the Siriana era. Okay. So let's start there and tell me if you think there was anything that the

Chargers were doing defensively that would have made that the game plan. So some of the good things about going in empty, all right? You can get coverage tells where you say, all right, you have Sequan Barclay lined up far out wide. Is a corner across from him or is it a linebacker or safety? That could tell you if it's manner zone. So if you have a defense that likes to disguise. coverage, that's a good way to be able to, you know, to get that tell, get information to the

quarterback. You also, if it's a team that likes to disguise coverage, let's say they like to show too high, hey, it looks like it could be cover two, but they actually rotate and it's cover one man or the opposite where it looks like it's going to be man. If you are empty and you are in a five-man protection because there's nobody in the back, there's no tight end in the back or running back in the back field to help out with protection, the quarterback typically is going to get rid of the ball faster. And so if the quarterback, if you know the quarterback's going to get rid of the ball faster, uh, as a as a defense, you can't disguise coverage because you don't want guys having to run

to get to their spot when the ball's already getting out. So, uh, defenses are much more likely to say like, all right, play what we're going to play, play the down. Don't, uh, oh, you know, disguise ourselves out of coverage because they're, you know, they're lining up and empty. So typically the ball's coming out fast. You're trying to get more information to the quarterback. If you have a quarterback who's a run threat, that can obviously be a factor as well.

was not in this game. Yeah, I would say those are some of the biggest things that you can get from empty. The fact that they went and did it, I was like, oh, okay, and I saw what they were doing on a handful of them, but again, they were not able to hit on a number of these plays. Okay, and then so in terms of how efficient they were,

how effective they were in empty in this game? Which is a good chunk. 16 plays is a good chunk. It was their second worst EPA per play of those of the season, but it's actually really the worst because the worst is just the Packers game when they had one play and it was a bad play. The success rate was bad, but it was like 37.5%.

And their success rate for the game itself was 33%, their worst of the season. But on part with it. Their success rate was 33.5? In the game. Crazy, right? Man. But here's my concern with the empty yesterday. 16 plays.

Yep. We know that what has worked for the Eagles out of empty before is the fact that it is a bit of a cheat code for them because Jalen is willing to run. Yep. they had one design run play on those 16 plays yesterday one came back for penalty one came back for penalty so that would be two

at a 17 17 um and I actually haven't watched that play so when I when I make my first run through the film penalties are taken out so I actually haven't gotten the chance to watch that back my guess is like I know Steen got flagged I think that's a Jalen penalty

just by the the nature of that uh him basically running outside when he shouldn't have but I would I I want to go back and watch the end zone copy of that. That was my first blush after watching that live last night. I've sort of come around on, you know, we know that like the last couple weeks in the production meetings,

it's clearly been said to the broadcast teams like, oh, like, Jalen's going to get more involved in the running game, and like, you know, that's really what's missing from this offense. I don't need Jailen to be involved in the running game right now. I need him to scramble more and more effectively. I think that is a real issue, and I think that's where he can bring something else to the table. But the Jalen running game stuff doesn't look good right now. I don't know. I don't

know what that's, in theory, if you do it a little bit better, then maybe that's taking some attention away from Sequin, and that opens up the running game in general. But it, to me, that's like they're using old solutions, and it's not the right solution right now. I think that there's also something to be said for the fact that it's not an on-off switch thing. Yeah. Like, it's hard to just say, like, okay, we're going to be a QB run team. and get Jalen back into the rhythm of, you know, following blocks on QB counter and, you know, getting through the mesh points of, like, all their different read option elements. Yeah, I think that there's probably something to that as well.

That reminds me of another play that drove me crazy yesterday, which we texted about in real time. The fake draw. The fake draw. Yeah. Because I love the fake draw. What a good idea. We're so obvious with the draw sometimes. Let's do a fake draw.

But then they show the route concepts, and the whole idea of a fake draw is that you're going to draw the linebackers up. And there was nothing in the middle of the field. There was nothing designed to take advantage of the space that was being vacated. They ran that play. I said this because this morning. They ran that play for a touchdown. Was that the Colts game in like 20, in 2021?

Oh, that sounds similar. I think they ran. And it was like perfect. It was beautiful. 22. Maybe 22 is the Colts game. Okay. So yeah.

So they, it was beautiful. And that's another one where it's like, oh, like in that part of the field, that was a little bit close. It was like 10 yard line. This one was a little bit further away. so like the distance like quite didn't like match up with it too yeah i was i was with you that one didn't uh didn't move me okay anything else on the quick game before we get yeah we have a lot of

things in the quick game you want to do it now or you want you after the break let me let's do all right here's we'll do we'll do the quick game stuff for the opening drive opening drive two plays from the opening drive and then we got some man coverage stuff on the back end of that great okay good tease all right all right opening drive first play practice this all week you should feel great about this Right? You should feel great about this from the jump. Come out and empty. You got Sequin here on the bottom of the screen. He's going to come in motion over to the other side.

You're going to motion to a four by one kind of look here. And what that gives for Jalen is like, all right, I've got A.J. Brown running a slant, ISO, one-on-one. The defense is going to react because you've got Seaquin going across the formation to a four-by-one. We're going to get all this action over this way. And now we've got a matchup that we want where you've got now A.J. one-on-one. Well, it didn't really play that way where they basically, they're playing cover four. And essentially, this becomes double coverage on AJ and the slant. You've got the safety keying in on the slant.

You've got the corner playing with outside leverage. So Jalen, he wants to throw this to AJ, but it's essentially double coverage. It's quarter's coverage. He's not throwing it. But this is the same thing, Beau, that we have talked about on the show time and time again with these quick game concepts. if you are not super sharp with your timing in the quick game by the time you get your eyes back

over to the other side, the other stuff is done, it's dead. So they are running a concept, I'm going to bring this back really quick, they're running a concept where you've got a corner, you've got basically two snag routes here on the other side where those guys are going to turn

it's almost like hitches where it's like a slant and hitch kind of deal and you've got Sequin to the flat. If you don't throw the corner with timing, that's gone. If you don't throw these routes as soon as the ball, as soon as those guys turn,

that's not happening. You can see, Jalen is, he's got his eyes over there, but his feet aren't there yet. He's not ready to throw. And if you don't throw this right away, the corner's going to crash on it. So by the time he does get his feet over,

that's gone, that's smothered. These guys take that route away. You're not going there. So now it becomes scramble drill. First play of the game. Disaster, fire drill, right away. So now you've got AJ and he's like, all right, well, I got turned her. So now I'm going to turn around and he ends up throwing this.

And yeah. Right. And he stutters at one point. And if he goes full, it's probably a catch. But yeah. It's scramble drawer situation. Sorry, Lindsay. So that's like first play of the game, automatic fire drill.

So now we've got third down drive ends on a sack. There's a couple third downs later. Thank you, Lindsay. So third down. We talked last week about, all right, what? what are the what is the what is the charges identity on third down they like to do the four man rushes but it's exchange pressures and they're going to show blitz they're going to bring guys up in the line of scrimmage you don't know who's coming but they like to just say they're going to send

four and sometimes they might play man coverage out of this sometimes it might be some kind of a zone so they come out eagles are an empty cover or an empty set and you've got in breaking routes you got an in breaking route from goddard where he's going to just turn you know he's going to look at the ball. You've got Jahan Dotson where he's going to run. Basically, it's like a hitch route. Tank Biggsby on third down, running a little hitch route just at the sticks.

And then you've got a rap concept here, where you've got Devante, we're going to hitch with AJ behind it. Now, this is a classic, like, one high side versus two high side. Sometimes we say, oh, it's man covering. If it's man, you go over here. If it's a zone, you go over here. This one, If it's going to be one high, which one high safety,

all right, now you're working this side of the field. If this were a too high look, now you're going to work this side of the field. And this concept works great against cover two. This is one of the Eagles' good cover two beaters is you're going to get A.J. Brown running that in-cut. But if you're going to run this against one high, this ball should have gone two tank Biggsby all day.

if Jalen's not going to throw and we've talked about this in the past he doesn't throw it to guys he doesn't have trust him don't put tank Biggsby out there on third down if you're not going to throw it to him don't put him out there and have him be a primary read

and a concept if you're not going to throw it to him and like all right well he doesn't want to throw that all right well you keep working John Dotson doesn't win quick enough so he gets off that Goddard's taken away he gets his eyes all the way back around to work the too high side

well this doesn't work because you got, instead of it being two high safeties, again, it's one high, which means you have an extra defender underneath. Yeah. That's a, that's, that play's not going to work for A.J. Brown. So now Jalen's got nowhere to go. This is a bad read from Jailen.

This is bad execution. And this ends up being a sack. The Chargers ran a play where it was, we actually broke it down on the pregame show where it was like, oh, they try and get Oway, the two-way go, and O-way works against that. O-way-way. I actually wrote that at my notes and thought,

oh, that's a nice look. him. He ends up beating my lot of late, but that's a Jalen Hurts sack. So that's bad execution from the quarterback on that one. But that's also like, it's the opening drive. It's the, I guess it was the second or third down. This is what we worked all week on. He had extra time.

Like, how does that, like, if you're, if the quarterback's not comfortable with that, if he doesn't want to throw to tank Biggsby, if that, if that should be Shippley, if that should, then that's what that should be like the third down game plan. That definitely left me wanting here this week. All right. Good stuff. Great breakdown. Back with more on the PHAY Eagles podcast. It's the holiday season, which is the season for spending money.

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I was doing the show with Cuzz this morning and I'm sitting here. I'm here. Cuzz is here. BG. is there. And on the other side is Handsome Rich. And so I'm staring at Handsome Rich. And I'm like, ooh, Rich is looking good this morning.

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Check out all that we've got at the P-H-L-Y store. You're wearing one as well. Yep. Good stuff for the holiday season. And become a die-hard. Get access to France. Draft database. Nothing better.

Plus E.J. Smith and Les Bowen have columns up this morning. So you're going to get covered from all angles. Let's check out the soupies. What do we got on the super chat front? We start with Frank Baba, not to be confused with Brutus, the barber, says, I don't want to talk about this team. I can't imagine how much the PHOI guys don't want to do this.

I love doing this. What else would you like to talk about? Um, nothing. Who's got it better than us? Yeah, nobody. Frank Barber again says, what would surprise you more, Fran? The Eagles go two and two over the last four games,

or they go 0 and 4. Oh I think Owen four Oh and four would surprise me more Yeah Owen four would surprise me more Like would I be Now we could do like turkey How like layers of surprise

The thing is I feel a little bit of optimism Is because I feel like everybody else Is now catching up to where I was last week Right Still game I mean we are the two people Who did think they were going to lose this game We are the only ones who predicted that

So I was already there Yes No let's see what they do I want to say More than any other game this year It might have been because of my Swooper self-scouting where I was like, I'm too over-indexed on this offense.

I've been too high on them all season. I've been waiting for them to dig out of this. My read on this game and how I was going to play out was like, it's exactly how I thought it would. Big flex. You thought that Jill and Hertz was going to have five turnovers? No, I thought, but I thought that the offense was going to struggle. I didn't think it was going to be turnovers.

I thought more three-in-outs. How do you feel about us continuing to save five turnovers when two of them happened in the same play? Do you think it's unfair to throw five on him? Yeah, I think. I mean, it's not like they got an extra possession. They got five extra possessions. I agree with that.

However, I think it is, and that's where I was originally, but I do think it is fair to say, hey, Jalen, fall on the ball. Yeah, like, that's country fumble. What are you doing? Our city fumble, yeah. I agree with that. Get down, dude. I got a gift.

Yeah. Spit it right back. Will Madden. How has Steen played this year? How much better was Mackay Beckton last year? Mackay was much better in the run game. I think Steen is more even in past protection. Steen has been okay overall.

Not good, but he hasn't been terrible. I didn't think he was particularly good last night. But he's definitely, I mean, he is like a tier below in the run game, for sure. No question. Okay. Fair breakdown. CDP, will Howie restructure Jalen Hertz's deal this offseason? Will Jalen Hertz want to restructure his deal this off-season?

I think we're going to have a lot of conversations about what this off-season might look like depending on how these final four games go. SRG, Franz Grabbies are probably the best part of the show during the season because he does such a great job breaking down the game, but man is in a tough watch this year, L-O-L-L. Tell me about it.

I would love to be here, like saying, like, oh, look at this touchdown. Look at this, look at that. But it is what it is. It is what it is, and that's what it is. Scott Galupo, here's my big takeaway from last night's game. Pitchers and catchers report in two months. Shorber surprise you? No, yeah.

Surprise you? Relief. I was not a relief. Five or one-fifty. Yeah, but I was happy to see it for sure. Hmm. Yeah. as the wise people say

not my money no question yeah finally Musa Bo is huffin positivity rabbit gas you and I have not had a chance to talk about the positivity rabbit

is a positivity rabbit or is a positivity bunny I mean it's not it's nothing and this is my problem with the whole deal who is a.J. Dylan to foist this upon everybody else to now become memed. Like, this is not a leader of the team

being like, oh, yeah, we could use a little break here. This is a guy who has been inactive for half the season and from all our vantage points is the next guy to be released if they need to open up a roster spot. And it's darkly funny that he's sitting there being like, how can I contribute? How can I contribute? I'm going to get this blow-up bunny

and it's going to be the only thing that people remember about me in this season. You know, that's what that reminds me of. It happened about a week after you and I met. Vince Young Dream Team. Vince Young Dream Team. That's what he'll most be known for. I mean, at least Vince Young played.

Little known fact. I was one who shot that press conference. Really? Yeah. Nice. I was my first year working with the Eagles that I was working a press conference camera. And, yeah, the Vince Young dream team press conference.

Little did I know. I was sitting there. I was like, oh, man, this is like a legendary moment in Eagles history. My other, my other favorite press conference from that training camp memory is Nomdi's press conference. And Scott Hansen happened to be there. Ah, yes. Right. And the way that in the middle of the press conference, he's just like, nomdi, Scott Hansen NFL Network.

How are you, buddy? And then you're going to get to the question. Like really making sure you get that in there. I don't know if he, does he even, does he even do training camp tours anymore? I don't think so. I don't know if he leaves that room. Yeah, right.

I think he lives there. Might be right. Yeah. Must be nice. All right. Tell me about the issues with man coverage. Well, this was another game. We talked about this last week,

how the numbers against man-to-man coverage were not good for Jalen Hertz. And any other time that he has faced a high volume of man, the Eagles have won he's usually been really good last week against the Bears was not the case and this week once again now I haven't pulled the numbers I don't know what the ratio was

in terms of man to man versus zone all I can tell you is that the Chargers have been a high volume zone team over the course of this season I think there was like third most zone of anybody in the league thank you third most zone of anybody in the league and in this game

I noticed a lot of man where they felt comfortable saying like yeah we're going to go, we're going to go man to minute. And I, you know, we talked about how they, they do a good job of preventing explosive plays and take it, but that's not because they've got great man-to-man cover corners. You know, this is a more like the, the unit is, you know, the sum is greater than, or the, what is it, the hole is greater than some of the parts type of secondary where, yeah, like, they've got Derwin James, is a really good play, great player. But the guys in the secondary, like, you know, it's Cam Hart and it's Tar Hebe Still, and it's Dante Jackson,

and it's Benjamin and St. Juice, like, nice player, decent players, but not. not like, oh, we're going to play man to man and you are not going to be able throw on us. And the fact that they felt comfortable playing as much man as they did for the second team in a row to do that, it's a little telling and it's a little alarming because to me that says that defensive coordinators and defenses are like, okay, we're going to dare Jalen Hertz to make these throws, whereas that was, and also take off and scramble, which is the second week in a row where teams have done it and have had success and the Eagles

have not been able to make them pay for that on the back. So according to true media, and this is early, it was 17% man from the Chargers, which is only the 10th highest of the 13 teams who have played the Eagles this season, but it is above average for them. For them. It's their fifth highest of the season. They play usually about 12, 13%. Okay.

So, all right, so it's not as high as I would have thought, but still relatively high. Now, that said, again, like the Eagles, this is not, this is something in the past where you're like, oh, if they, if you play man against the Eagles, like Jayland Hertz is going to make you pay. Right. And there's a play early on. This is a third and I've got the number here. This was a third down, third down early in the game where basically it looks like it's

going to be a too high coverage here at the snap of the ball. And so it's like, all right, what exactly, what coverage are the Eagles going to get here on this play? And it ends up being two man, where you've got two high safeties, operating in the deep part of the field and it is straight man to man across the board and not only is it straight man to man

but it's going up against it this is like the pet people this is straight iso ball baby you've got these routes are not working together at all you've got a deep curl route you've got a deep curl route you've got another curl route

you've got dots and working down the down the seam a little bit so none of these routes this goes against what we what we talked about earlier and again that's why I thought it was really interesting, Beau, because conceptually,

and we've talked about this when, you know, coaching staffs, the Eagles are one of them, we'll say like, all right, this coach, you're in charge of this part of the game plan. Yeah.

You're in charge. The first and second down game plan was much different than what the third down game plan has been. And when I'm looking at this, it's third and long, we're doing straight iso ball. This is much different than a lot of the concepts that we were breaking down earlier.

It's like, oh, it's a post wheel and you've got floods and three level stretches and you have all this. This is straight ISO. Look, if you're, if you're, if you're,

Jalen here on this play and this is a this is not a great ball but he also didn't have anywhere to go with this like uh when he when he drops back to meet this he has got to get this because you can see the all these corners they're playing underneath they're playing in trail and the reason why is because you've got these deep safeties over top so you can be very aggressive you can be very handsy you can trail and play underneath so now if you're the quarterback you kind of have to layer this up and over the underneath defender right but not too much for the not too much for the safety to patrol this so it's a it's a tough throw and if your guys don't win you really have nowhere to

go so yeah he overthrows this there's the there's the there's the target he overthrows this and mickens ends up coming with the interception so come back a couple drives later they're down the red zone this is the this is the this is the play that lost a jf swooper point and we can all celebrate now that his goal to go his goal to go swooper point is now because now and you told me before the show this was the the worst play of the game this was the this was the the toughest miss for jalen in the game because, again, they showed they're going to play. They could play two-man against us on third down. So what do you get before the snap of the ball?

Again, the Eagles are in empty. Got two high safeties. It looks like it's going to be two-man. And why no, Dane is, has said this numerous times in the past. Like, oh, they don't have anything dialed up to beat man. Like, where are all the man-coverage beaters? They dial up a really nice man-coverage beater here on this play, where you've got Dallis Scottert working vertically.

You've got Devante Smith running a slant right underneath it. And the defense is playing two-man. You've got two high safeties. You've got straight man-to-man underneath. So this should work perfectly. The field already looks wide open. Yep. Jalen is going to start looking over here.

I want to make sure you hold that safety right where he's at. And you want to make sure that void is wide open there in the middle of the field. He gets his eyes back. Perfect timing. Here comes Devante. Off the slant. No pressure at the moment. His guy is picked up.

off on the natural rub play wide open man and he doesn't throw it this is a killer this was like this was honestly like maybe the the most upsetting turn down from the season oh god middle of field wide open two man that was it the design of the play yep and no pressure in his face yeah but you had a three you had a three man rush from the chargers here so you had a three man rush with a spy which is what they did on the last one too so all right we're going to play man to man coverage we're going to spy Jalen Hertz just in case he does want to take off, but we're going to force him to stay here and throw it and beat us with his arm. And he doesn't do it here on this play. And the other part of it, what do you think? Is that he steps up and he starts working to his left. But

again, Devante's working this way. Yeah. Dallas, after running that little pick, he starts working this way. Dotson, he works outside. And then he starts, so all these routes are designed to come back towards this part of the field and he's going this way. So he's working again against the flow of the defense, against the flow of the rest of the past catchers. Now he's forced to throw across his body to Devante in the back

of the end zone and it's very nearly a sack fumble. Yeah. Henley gets to him just as he's thrown. It ends up being a, called an incompletion. We did get to see Brett Tooth moving on this play though. I mean, boy, was he flying in the ball with the ball. Yeah. Does not count as it. It did occur

to me. It almost counted as an offensive line target. And E.J. Did you, do you have any idea why he doesn't throw that ball? No. Do you think there is any residual trauma from the interception of Deshawn hand dropping that he's worried that there's a guy dropping into that area that he doesn't know? Yeah, it could be. I don't know.

It could be. It could be. After that. Yeah. That's one of those. Like, I couldn't tell you why he doesn't throw that. That one, that one was like that one was the toughest turn down of the day. All right.

I think everybody needs a little brain. to process that one. So let's take our last break here on the PHA Y Eagles podcast. We will try to move on from the passing game on the other side. Listen, you've heard me talk about game time before.

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Nicely done. Back on the P.H.O. Eagles podcast. Do we have to talk about anything more on the passing game? Should we flush it? No, let's, yeah, we can move on. We've gone 55 minutes. It's almost overtime. Running game. The success in this

game yeah for them came under center yes uh they were now a lot of that i have it here 52 yard season low 9.1 success rate when running from shotgun in this game that's the second worst of the syriana era what was worse uh i think there is a oh it's the niners game oh from 23 okay it was bad i mean and so like there were a handful plays where you could see like the defensive tackles knew like oh like cam jerkins is going to pull on this play i'm going to shoot through this gap yeah and because jurgens isn't going to be there and i'm going to impact the running back in the back field that happened on the one empty qb draw um there was like a trap play where it's like oh they they know what's coming like uh there were there were just a few where

yeah like they they they were dialed in okay but what worked a little bit in the under center game aside from the well-schemed up the there was the the 19 yarder uh very early they had some you know what this was when we're like man they're having a lot of success on over the left side yep and then they just sort of went away from it so yeah so i know it's not that easy but sure but i mean i don't know so like they so on that first one i didn't pull screen grabs for these but first play it's 19 yards inside zone Sequin presses this up to the line of scrimmage gets the linebacker sheet inside and bounces off all the blocking was good. All right, 19 yards, off and run.

And very next play, they come out in I think it was a 12 personnel set. Either way, it was like Latsu was in the game. And typically, when Latsu's in the game, if he lines up to the right, they're going to run to the right. They went with a nice little change of pace where they put LATO on the

right, almost like a fullback, and they ran just straight weak, the weak side going the opposite way, right into the, you call it a bubble of the defense where it's like, basically if you just take a screen grab and you say like, okay, what is the weak point of the defense here they ran right at that weak point it was perfect when it goes 10 yards and I'm like oh okay I'm pretty sure it was the first time all season they've had two double

digit carries back to back on the same drive I looked it up it was the second time all season that's back to back first down runs oh geez okay it's not even that yeah so right um but yeah but yeah I think when you're looking it's like okay there's there's something here it was the giant's game and I think the actually the thing goes we're both double digits as well okay yeah well either way uh yeah uh yeah uh nothing we're not a lot of change. Don't hang a banner on that one. Either way, yeah, then you get back to the rest of the run game, the rest of the way, it was more of the same. It was like, oh, there's a run where they run behind Calcutera as the lead blocker at the point of attack against the defense or against

the linebacker. Like, okay, so that's a loss. There's another one Fred Johnson misses at the point of attack. There's another one where guys trip over each other. There's another one where Dickerson who didn't have a great game. Dickerson, you know, couldn't quite get to the reach block. you know, it was, oh, here at Juergens misses a guy. There was a little bit of everything. You know, so it was, there was frustration. I know there was some, the frustration with some, like, oh, like, why didn't they, why did they stick with the run game so much?

Why did they keep, I don't know, I think, I think that the, the run game, they're going to, they need the run game. They need it. They need it. And, uh, I don't know how much of it's fixable. Does Lanes impending return? Definitely helps. Okay.

I mean, you know, four. sure helps does it fix everything probably not but it definitely does lane make a bigger difference in pass pro or in run blocking v i mean fred johnson is a worse run blocker yeah Fred johnson is a worse run blocker but lane is also an elite pass protector so it's like uh you know that's tough um but for what the eagles need i think you probably want his run blocking more right right now because uh here's my feel on this this offense right now i'm going to ask you what your feel is, Fran. And you're going to tell it to me.

Okay. In Bovertime. So can I ask you a question? Please. The game goes to overtime last night. Was I thinking to myself for James in Bovertime? A hundred percent. Very good.

Yeah, absolutely. Were you? It crossed my mind, yeah. Of course. I think everybody who watches this show is thinking the same thing. I would think so, yeah. Yeah. instead of in parenthesis

OT everybody had inferences BOT Right I think the best version of this offense for 2025 is a lot of stuff we did at the top of the show I think it is based on like vertical pass game

dial up shots be aggressive but I have reservations about whether or not they think they should stick to that based off the outcome of this game yeah And in order to do that, but in order to do that, you also need the, you need to pair the run game with it. Right. And, you know, that's going to lead to, it's not a dominant run game, as we know.

Yeah, all of this in theory, if you were able to make some big plays in the passing game downfield, that's going to lighten up the boxes and that's going to help out the running game. But, yeah, it's all, it's all theoretical. But it's also the Raiders. Come on. I'm glad you didn't mention to BG my theory from my analogy from last night right about the Cardinals game in 23

I did not mention that too very good I thought about a lot when you guys were on with Cuzz this morning I was like you guys he was making it feels good yeah that's yeah that's my to me that this this Raiders game reminds me very much of the come on Kenny Pick it

at Arizona good knows the knows the team yeah I don't know we'll see all right let's give the defense

it's flowers after we've gone an hour into the show because it was really an impressive performance defense was awesome let me ask you let me start with we all know that the front

was awesome yeah in this game what did you see from the back seven just I mean incredibly sound just across the board like it was you know

watching those guys and a lot of it was helped by the fact that the rush was so good it also made it a little bit tricky but all the honestly like

I don't want to say it's boring but watching the watching the people when they are humming the defense on the back end can be boring because it's just like hey we're going to just out-execute you we are just better running our coverages than you are running your concepts

and trying to gain separation Quinion was awesome Dejean was awesome he's targeted a couple of times downfield like zero panic zero panic whatsoever yeah it was really good Marcus Epps was good he was always where he needed to be

It wasn't tested all that often. But again, like the rush absolutely helped the coverage look good. A couple plays late where they went with Michael Carter on the field instead of Marcus Epps. I'm curious what people say about that. Yeah, it's a good question. But yeah, I thought Epps looked solid. I thought so. Jehad Campbell got in the mix a little bit more.

Yeah. See anything from him? I mean, listen, Nacobi remains such an unbelievable blitzer moving forward. But I think you saw in that big play, the 60-yarder on the opening drive to Vidal, where like, oh, that is just Nikobe's speed. Yeah, and then there was a, there were a couple plays. I want to say it was late third quarter before the fourth quarter. I think it was, I think it might have been McConkey was running a shallow cross

and the Kobe picked it up and he was just hauling, trying to keep up. And it was like, oh, man, like if Herbert caught him, like it would have been a problem. But yeah, I think teams are going to continue to try and isolate Nikobe in those situations. They did try one with a running back out of the backfield at some point. point as well in the second half I just couldn't hit but yeah I thought Campbell was solid yeah he did it again like he's he's been fine he's for for a rookie linebacker like yeah I think he's done a fine job and adory Jackson's looking better yeah they he had the the the coverage on the second snap of the game was essentially a pb you against quentin Johnson I was I thought he saw

that really quick he's always going to be hit and miss coming downhill but I think the like in terms of like coverage responsibility and discipline in zone coverage like All of that, like the comfort in the scheme, I think, has improved over the course of the year. Okay, let's talk with the guys up front. The framing I had with Anthony this morning is, I think, relative to expectation, Jordan Davis is probably having the single best season on the team, relative to what we expected heading into the year. I'm just going through my head and thinking if that's, if I've got anybody else to rebuttal.

You think about the guys who have been really good this year, Cooper to Jean. What you expect? expected, Quigionette Mitchell, expected. Yeah, I think that's a good point. I think that's fair. Because, like, even like the guys who were expecting big things from, like, Ojamo, like, has been good, but not, like, you know,

about as good. Yeah, AJ, you know, thinks that he called on. Because he was just listening to me, but. So, yeah, I would say that's probably fair. And again, like, my expectations are, like, okay, he's going to be a really good run defender and a steady presence and he won't be a plus pass rusher

on a week-to-week basis, but he can give you a little bit of something here and there and last night he gave you something there. Where are you at with Jalix Hunt? Jalix is impactful against the pass. He definitely can get pushed around in the run game a little bit. Not a liability,

but he's just okay against the run. I would say that it's like it's like Tyler Steen in the run game. Okay, that's interesting. Where it's like, okay, he's not a, not a negative yeah but he's not like a positive either um and there aren't a lot a lot of plays we're all man like watch them like squeeze this run lane and really set a hard edge like it's more

just like our like from effort sometimes it might pop here and there and he does his job but it's not always great he got pinned inside on a couple plays um by tackles like he he can get out muscled a little bit so i think that's an area where he can continue to grow will he be at a point this off season where the question is bulk up to try to get better against the run but risk losing some effectiveness as a rusher? Maybe. Yeah, he's a guy that because he is so athletic that like, he probably won't lose too much.

But I think they'll probably continue to try and find that balance. Okay. And then what did you think of BG inside? Season high, 29 snaps, I believe. Yeah. Most of them inside. I thought it was good.

Yeah, I mean, you know, obviously they're trying to fill those snaps without Jalen Carter. And so being able to put BG in that spot, I thought it made sense. They didn't stand out in a negative way at all, certainly. yeah I thought I thought it was solid okay I mean the defense as a whole I mean they they just they were constantly around Herbert like I know you're not like a

pressure guy but like the press the pressure rate was the best pressure rate of any team any defense in a game this season he was they were constantly around him constantly so and some of it were like this is and this is the you talked about like the difference between like Hertz as a scrambler and what we saw from Herbert last night Herbert like when he was gonna go like he went yeah he just he just took off and went and I think that part of it with Jaylen is that there are times where he's like he's rolling he's rolling he's rolling and he's uh am I going to throw it am I not and then by the time he takes off like you're not getting those explosives you're not getting like those successful plays

that's the thing about Herbert is like if it wasn't there he took off man and I was I was looking last night or at the next gen stats yeah it was last night during post game we talked about the pressure rate number he was pressured 28 times last night Herbert that's a third game this season where he's been pressured 28 times the rest of the league has only had one of them really yeah look he's just been like under duress the entire year because you hear the raiders offensive line is even worse but yeah i mean the raiders line has not been good for most of the season yeah super chat from fresh prince who says how would you stork rank macuba epps and brown for one game let's say for the rest of the season i think we know who's number three

We don't need to bury the guy. Yeah. I mean, if we're taking everything into context, I would probably say McCuba. Okay. Yeah, I think just, you know,

he's got more juice than his legs now at this point. But I don't think it's a huge difference. Personally. Yeah. Yeah. I think you get that veteran savvy from Epps. Yeah. I've always been a Marcus Sepp guy.

I like Marcus Seps. Absolutely. I like Marcus Sepp. Yeah. Like of a guy. He doesn't make big mistakes. Yeah. I've made a lot of Marcus Epps.

Yeah. Handsome fella. almost invented him uh will madden turkeys of blame for the season so far offensive coaching jalen howie and the lack of o line investment let's just let's lump in because that's uh i guess he's saying howie and the lack of all that investment so maybe that's uh that's one item that's a combined there's no comma there no no oxford comma so we're gonna have to lump them in together because I do think the offensive line itself has been a big issue

but if we're pinning it on Howie that's where that's them where you're putting your turkeys 50, 40, 10 50. Only 10 on the O line with Howie? Yeah, honestly, I feel like that's probably even high for me personally.

I don't think that's Look, they miss some shots in the draft like, you know, they tried to trade down. They didn't think the Raiders were going to take two guys. Even still, like, I don't know if... Caleb Rogers. Caleb Rogers, thank you. I don't know if Caleb Rogers is going to save the day, you know,

if someone gets hurt, if Landon Dickerson gets hurt. So now he's had some good moments, for one, I understand. Like, he's looked okay lately, but I'm talking about Caleb Rogers. But, again, I don't think that he's saving the day. So my gut is, eh, let's go 55, 55. 55 coaching coaching 40 quarterback wow five I think I would put more on the line I think the line is a little bit more blame whether however you want to well blame that but if it's if we're just talking about the investment then yes yeah that's right I thought I

thought that's what that was was the if we're just saying the line itself I would put it a little bit higher yeah if we're saying the all I would put that a little bit higher yes okay do you want to do you want to can I reallocate if that's because to me like Just keep in mind, Lindsay's is eager to get out of here. She says all the, she's making up reasons. She says the audio's down. She's like, I got to get out of here. I'm going to go home to Mr. Lindsay.

Yeah, right. Celebrate. I could have not coming at all today. I mean, like, Julia, do the show and I came in. Go ahead. We'll move it on. Yeah, I think, to me, I think that, um, um, 30, 30, 30, 30, 30, 30, so split what's the 10?

Howie? The 10th. Yeah, that's howie. Just take Howie away. Take Howie away. O-line, offensive coaching,

Jalen. Let's go, um, 35 coaching. 30, O-line in general. Where does that take me? 35?

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You went from... Jalen hasn't played with a jail. Well, I know, but you went from going 50 to 40

and then now it's 35, 35. I know, I'm trying to do this on the fly. I think that, um, because, I think that the coaching with the offensive line, you have to coach around the issues along the lines.

So I lumped more of that with the coaching in the previous iteration of the exercise. Okay. I think that's right. I also think the coaching, some of Jalen's jailening for the bad is, the coaching needs to get more out of him. And so it's hard,

you know, it's hard. Yes. Okay. All right. This was not as loopy as I was expecting. too much football after an overtime loss, I would say. But that's okay.

We'll have fun later this week. Thank you, Fran. Great stuff on the snappies. Thank you, Lindsay, for making it look so good. We'll talk to you guys tomorrow at 2 o'clock. Mina comes will join us. E.J. Smith will be here. I'll be here.

We haven't exactly got what free bird rule is going to be for tomorrow, but we'll figure it out. The what? We'll be here. Look it up. See tomorrow. And as always, we love you. We all silly like the mayor.