PHLY Philadelphia Eagles Podcast - How to fix the Eagles offense as Jalen Hurts, Saquon Barkley prepare for Vikings test

Episode Date: October 17, 2025

Class is in session with the professor Deniz Selman as he puts Saquon Barkley, Jalen Hurts, A.J. Brown, DeVonta Smith, Dallas Goedert and the Nick Sirianni coaching staff under the microscope. How can they get the talented Eagles offense back on track against one of the league’s most creative defenses? EJ Smith joins with news from the NovaCare Complex. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The professor tells us coming up next on the PHLY Eagles podcast, E.J. Smith, joining after talking to players in the locker room as well. It's all coming up next right now. The P.H.O.I. Eagles podcast presented by Bet365 and Ashley. I'm Bo Wolf. On my left, you know him. You'll love him. You'll learn from him. The professor. Danes is here. We'll hear from E.J. Smith, who's going to join us in about a half an hour or so. But until then, just a little two-hander, professor. How are you doing? Doing good. How are you doing? You got your very fancy water glass again. Oh yeah. You know, you know how it is.

So I roll. You're Uzo. Yeah. Rucker. Yeah. How are you doing? How are you feeling? Doing good.

I went to, uh, I went to see Alan Iverson earlier this week. Yeah? Yeah, lecture series. How to go? It was surprisingly good. Who was the, uh, moderator? Uh, gilly. Actually.

Really? Yeah. Did he step over? Gillie and Wallow. Um, did he step over him? He did, he did a lot of those. step-over thing. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was... What did you learn? It was cool.

I mean, like, I've always been a big AI fan. I went to all those playoff games back in 01. Me and Feldman were there for all the NBA finals games, which, you know, those games didn't go well, but that was a great era of Sixers basketball, unlike this one. You know that I was triggered when you say I've always been a big AI fan. Oh, yeah, yeah, no. The original AI. Okay, yeah. That's good. I had a chance to go to the Underground Arts last night.

Check out Matt Quinn and surprise you. guest Jordan Milata. Yeah, how was that? What a shot. Did you know Milada was going to be? I did not. Okay.

Yeah. Pleasant surprise. Yeah. There you go. That's good. I saw the video with Milata. But, uh,

good videography. Yeah. No, it's a good, um, definitely felt a little washed. My lot. Oh,

you did. Me. Yeah. Yeah. Rachel and I went. I just, you know, felt a lot of young people.

Yeah. Yeah. That's happening to me a lot. You know, going to a lot of shows. I'm still going to a lot of shows. And, Either it's a band like from the 90s, right?

So everyone's old. Right. And then I feel old because I feel like everyone's old here. Or it's like a new band that I'm trying to get into and then everyone's young. And either way, it's a little, little tricky to know how to feel. I mean, I am washed. There's nothing you can do about it. Yeah.

Passage of time. That's right. That's right. Time just passes. Comes for us all. Yeah. Let's talk football. The Eagles offense.

Disappointing. Yeah. How was your mood affected by a performance like we saw last Thursday? Yeah, it was tough. You know, the Denver game was was hard on me too because, you know, I'm not used to, just wasn't used to the team losing for a long time. But it was a short week, right? Had to get through the film really fast and you know, get on, you know, get here for the show Wednesday. Like it was almost they didn't have time to think about it. And so after that really, really disappointing game on Thursday night, for me, like psychologically as a fan, it's like I still hadn't fully processed the Denver game

you know like it's like I was gonna kind of continue to process the Denver game no matter what happened Thursday and so having to process both together and having all this time like you know without coming on the show without having another game was was actually pretty hard and I'm also not teaching there's a two week break you're just wallowing nothing that yeah it was just like you know so it took me forever to get through the film

how they were a plus night I was okay last night. I had to do drop-off this morning, so I knew that. So I went to bed pretty early, but early for me is like 1.30. Okay. Yeah. Well, let's get into it. Yeah. And let's start, because you have, you have put together some solutions. We're trying to be solution-oriented here. Yeah. Some helpful tips. And this is not rebuilding the offense from scratch. This is within the construct of what we know that this offense can do. You've come up with some things that they can do to maybe tweak things. And we should probably start with how they're performing overall just to begin with.

Yeah, I think like one of the things that is worth doing is stepping back and being like, look, I know like this team won the Super Bowl last year. Everyone remembers the parade. But let's not pretend we didn't spend the entire season. Like including two games into the playoffs. Yes. Talking about how the offense was inept and how like the scheme was stale and how the, you know, the quarterback had problems.

And like there were all these issues. All those things that we talked about were, to some degree, hidden by the fact that the offensive line was playing very well. The running back was able to turn good runs into great runs. And then the defense was world class, right? So those things together made it a Super Bowl winning team, Super Bowl. And obviously the last two games, the passing game was also good. But like throughout the season, we talked about how, like, how come they don't use more play action? How come they're never under center?

How come they don't use motion? How come they don't do that? Like we talked about all those things last year as well. And then you step back and you look at, if you go by DVOA, last year, the Eagles offense was 14th in total offensive DVOA. 14th in passing DVO.

As you told us all along, they had this historically weak schedule, specifically of opposing defense. The Eagles managed to play 21 games last year and only one of them was against the top 10 defense by DVOA. And this year, that's not been the case. They've been playing better teams. So last year, the offense 14th overall, 14th in passing.

Sixth in rushing. This year so far, 14th overall, 14th passing. Yeah. 17th in rushing. So worse in rushing, we know that. Sure. But it doesn't feel, especially the 14th in passing doesn't feel accurate. Right.

And so this is where like, okay, a lot of us last year thought maybe the DVOA formula overweighed strength of schedule, right? But like at the end of the day, it was a historically easy slate of defenses. And this year it's been a very good slate of defense. Which is a good reminder, yes. And we knew the schedule was going to be hard coming to this year. So we knew things were going to be harder. We knew there were going to be some changes and some things that reverted.

We knew that not every counter run was going to go for 70 yards. You know, like, you just knew that there were certain things that were going to be a little different. And the main thing that's different, and I'm not going to try to fix this because this isn't something that can be fixed with scheme, I don't think, is the offensive line's just not playing as well, right? You've got Cam Juergens as clearly not as good as he was last year. I don't know if it's because he's injured or what it is. Landon Dickerson was so obviously hobbled.

Like he wasn't even close to what he was last year. And then Brett Tooth showed us, you know, poor guy, but showed us why Landon Dickerson playing at 60% is still a better option, right? And so now you've got this offensive line that's not, playing great anymore. Tyler Steen's a step down from McIbeckin, especially in the in the run game. Neither of the tackles are playing as well either. I mean like I think all these things like need to be said. Jordan Miletus talked about how he's never felt worse physically in an off season, all those things. And you guys showed the graphic the other day that I posted about the negative

yards before carry, right? So Sequin Berkeley is being contacted before the line of scrimmage. 36% of his carries. That is wild. The NFL average. is 26%. And when you look at the Sequan Berkeley past seasons, including the ones on the Giants, it was never this high. Yeah. The highest that ever was on the Giants was 30% for a season. And so that's really bad. And, you know, Jordan Myelot is talking earlier this week. He said, you know, with Landon, like the two of us would just take the three tech and drive them down the field. And that's not happening this year. They're not even giving us those looks. Like we're not, we're not able to, able to do those things and it's like well yeah

guess what like teams are going to adjust they're not going to line up a three tech between myelada and landin anymore like you're going to play things a little differently you're going to have to do different things let's just accept as a premise that the offensive line isn't just going to magically get back to the same level and put it on the coaches to do what most NFL coaches have to do which is hide weaknesses on their offensive line

yeah right like most offensive lines in the league have weaknesses and teams have to do things to scheme to protect some of those, some of those weaknesses. And so, so that's kind of what the premise of the, of the solutions are. Okay. And I'm going to try to be realistic about it. Yes. And we will, well, let's make this the, the big takeaway presented by X-Finity. And before we get to that, I want to ask you, because I've been thinking about how much of what's going wrong this season. And I know, going wrong, they're still four and two. All of that is understood is paying for things that went right last year.

So EJ has talked about the offensive line, right? Those guys are still banged up from last year, even in all the tush pushes, right? Milana has talked about it. There's no doubt that they are paying the dividends of that.

I think you could say the same thing potentially about the amount of snaps that Jalen Carter had to play last year. And right, boy, did that work out last year? They won a Super Bowl. Obviously, you take that trade off, but he might be paying for that now in not playing it off.

high level and being injured. And I wonder if you think that knowing how you felt about Sequin last year, they felt like it was going to be too easy, which was partially misrepresented. I mean, but, you know, that's partially. Yeah, okay. That thinking that they could just roll a ball out and have that dominant run game again, stop them from being more creative in terms of fixing some things in the passing game in the off season.

Do you think that's possible? Yes, definitely. I definitely think that. And I think we even talked about it a little bit a few weeks ago, how they have been calling the games. And then they switched right after we said that. Like they switched to like a much more pass-heavy approach against Denver, right? But it was like they're still calling the game as if Sequin's going to go off for like 70 yards at any point.

Right. And they got so used to that the year before. So used to, hey, we don't turn it over when we run it. And we do still hit explosives that they thought that they could win, the two things they always talk about, the turnover battle and the explosive play battle with a run-heavy approach. And with the offensive line not being as good, with the offensive line letting Seguan get contacted behind the line of scrimmage at this very high rate, you're not getting the explosives anymore. And they're not even getting successful runs.

And Seekuan Barkley is next to last in success rate by running backs. I mean, it's just, like, wildly bad. I mean, this isn't like an average run game. This is a bad run game right now. and they didn't have to scheme around that last year and they're going to have to this year. And this is something that they really haven't had to scheme around any year. Right? This is new. Like I always point out, and this was part of my like Sequin thing last year,

the Eagles were better in rushing DVOA and rushing EPA per play in 2022 than they weren't 24. Like they've always had a good running game, is the point. Part of that was the quarterback run game. Part of that was just the offensive line was dominant. but the run game has always been good. We haven't had a year where the run game was bad

and the past game had to compensate for a bad run game. Yeah. And so this is new. You know, like every year despite all the continuity on the offensive roster,

which is crazy. The Eagles have more continuity on the offensive roster than any other team in the NFL. Like all of the main characters have been the same for four years. And yet, every year they have this crisis

in October where they have to find themselves and have meetings and discover themselves. But, none of the years has the crisis been, we can't run the ball, right? Like in 2021, it was the other way. It was like, we're passing it too much. It turns out Jalen Hertz isn't Philip Rivers.

Like, we have to run it right. In 2024, famously, they were like, we have Seguan. Let's run the ball. And it worked, right? But it's never been like the running game isn't working. Let's switch to passing the ball and have that and had it be successful. Like, we haven't seen that happen yet. So it's a new challenge.

And so that's part of what these solutions are going to hopefully be about. All right. Well, let's get to those solutions after this word from our sponsors. On the other side, we'll find out the six ways that the professor feels like he can fix the Eagles offense. If your home needs a little TLC or you're dreaming of that next big vacation, maybe even to see one of the Philly teams play on the road, listen up. True Mark Financial's Helock Select just got even better. Rates just dropped, making it more affordable to put your home's equity to work. If you need a new kitchen, big repairs, maybe knock out some debt, well, the Heloc Select allows you to access your cash all at once or just when you need it. Total flexibility, just like a good game plan.

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Number one is... More play action, which we're not going to talk about for very long, because we've been talking about it for years. You know, play action is such a mainstream, like, widely accepted, proven tool in the NFL. Yes. that helps you distort especially zone coverage, right? Because you can move the linebackers off their spot,

guys are chasing the run, and then you throw it to the zone that they vacated. You're able to, you know, have a more effective run game when you do a lot of play action, because now if they're worried about play action, they're not going to be able to, you know, head downfield and fill in all the gaps the way they're doing this here against the Eagles run game.

It helps both the run game and the past game. Everybody knows this. And yet, the Eagles are 30th, in play action usage in the NFL. They're not that bad at it when they do it, but like it's almost like, not great at it either. Not great,

but like it's like it's kind of like, it's not like they're terrible at it in a way that makes you say like, okay, like this is, um, you know, like they're not doing it because they're, because they suck.

Like it's like they're doing fine. It's just like they don't do it enough for the numbers to mean anything. Like I mean 30th in the NFL in play action usage. AJ Brown has three catches this year out of play action. He has 22 not out of play. action, right? He's been targeted nine times in play action, 36 not in play action. So I mean like just the rate at which they're using play action. It's not just AJ Brown. I just picked AJ Brown as an example. No one's really getting a lot of play action targets. They're 30th and under center play action as well. Their only successful under center play action play of the season was a scramble by Jalen on the third play of the season. And that was a scramble. It wasn't even a completion. They don't have a single under center play action completion for a successful play. They have one complete. total, it was a one-yard completion to Kylin Granson in the first game. So I'm not expecting this to change, but I had to put it number one because I think it's like impossible to have an

honest conversation about the Seagull's offense without talking about like, why the hell don't they just use more play? Like it's like like you have the runs. You have past concepts that would work well with those runs. Like like why not? Instead of just keeping the running back into protect, for example, why not have him carry out a play fake and like kind of take away? take away a path threat or that way. You know what I mean? Like it's like like there are certain ways that you can use Sequin being on the field.

Other than having him be like a like a sixth offensive lineman, which he isn't even that good at. You are not advocating for more under center play action necessarily, right? Because I mean, it would be nice. It would be nice. But at this point,

we've accepted that Jalen just doesn't like that. And they really do it very little. I made it a swooper yesterday. Yes. Oh, do we want to talk about that? Oh, man. Yeah, I don't know. I think the solution of,

they're not going to do it anyway this week. right and so well maybe after that meeting they will so um no I don't know I think I think it's fine yeah well I'll come up with something clever for just to understand it uh like you said they are they are middling in both uh according to true media they are 21st any APA per drop pack when they do run play action okay at like 0.02 EPA right while they're 24th in not play action and it's you know negative 0.04 so it's not a huge difference right but it's certainly better. Yeah, it's better. And also there are certain situations where they've been running the ball a bunch that they, it's like when you do pass the ball during these stretches, like, why

wouldn't you make it play action off of one of those runs? Instead, it's like, it's almost like, like, okay, let's go to the passing game chapter and run, you know, like two slants on this side and crash on the other side with the running back scanning for pitchers. And it's like, there are ways to get to those same passing concepts with play action added to it. And it's like when they do do play action. We've talked about this in the past. Do-Doo. It's, yeah, it is, it is like do-do. It's like, like, they, like, you know,

Jalen, like, sort of sticks the ball out, like, no it's fighting on the fake. The offensive line isn't doing anything different. They're clearly past blocking. And teams watch enough film that they know that that's not going to be a run. Like, so. We get, I think we should also, as you go through these six things, discuss whether

like, it's likely to happen. Oh, yeah, yeah. I'll, I'll let you answer those. I think, I actually, I think that they will tick this up a little bit. Okay. Not a huge. I don't think they're going to all of a sudden become, you know, top 10 in play action. But if you're giving me, are they going to raise or rise in the rankings here? I do think so, but I think it will be marginal. Okay.

I think that's probably right. Do you think it'll be effective? And by that, I mean, is Fran going to have like a breakdown of a play where the play action is the reason it worked? Only if he's not incentivized to not do it. Okay, so you think So you think it No, no, no. I think they'll maybe hit a big play

at a play action or something like that. Maybe an unscotted look this week. Okay. All right. I would hope there's something that makes us say, ooh, that's new after all this talk of the meetings and all this kind of stuff. Okay.

All right. All right. James's solution number two. Number two, more crossing routes. The Eagles rank 31st. First of all, the Eagles rank like 30th, 31st or 32nd in pretty much every tendency metric.

So here's another one. The Eagles rank 31st in the NFL at running crossing routes. I'm not even talking about targets or like being good at them. Just kind of wild. Even running the cross, like even running crossing routes.

Do you know where they are in years past? 31st. They did not rank 31st. They ranked in the 20s like in the last like couple of years. Now there were consecutive plays in the Giants game on which first Devonte Smith and then A.J. Brown caught 16 yard passes.

they were both 16 yards. They were both shallow crossing routes against zone coverage. And in both of them, I was like, that's the first time AJ Brown caught a crossing route this year. That's the first time

DeMonte Smith got a crossing route this year. It was the first completion to each of those players on crossing routes. It was the first target for Devanti Smith on a crossing route. This was game six. Last year, for context,

Jalen was eight for eight hitting DeMonte Smith on crossing routes, including some explosive plays. Yeah. I mean, they've never really run that many crossing routes. That has been a thing. and AJ Brown caught like I think either six or seven passes on crossing routes.

Now that's crazy. Kevin Petulow was asked earlier this week. I believe it was Jeff McLean about the advantages of half field reads. And his answer was every quarterback is different, speed it up by splitting the field in half. But that's getting harder as defenses have evolved. You get a lot of different coverages. You used to get indicators. And then he kind of went on about like how maybe there aren't like he was almost like he was like therapy.

Like he was like, he was like, maybe there aren't as many advantages as there as there used to be. So, you know, the half field reads is like, and then no crossing routes, that's the same thing, right? Like one of the most common things the Eagles do is they'll run the crash concept that we've talked or some, you know, sometimes it's called smash, like where you have the in breaker from the outside receiver, the out and the corner out from the inside receiver. You have the two slants. You have the short out from the inside receiver and the go from the outside receiver. These concepts, like they've just been doing them over and over again for so many years that you can really see defenses. Yeah.

Just kind of like waiting to catch those routes at this point. A crossing route stresses zones. It stresses man coverage. Like it makes the defense have answers for something that they're not normally doing. Now crossing routes take longer to develop and you need to trust your offensive line. Is that one of the reasons that we're seeing a little bit less of it this year? Maybe. I don't know.

I don't know. No, no. June still holds the ball longer than most quarterbacks. like yeah no that's true that's true i mean if you just look at a j brown because we always talk about a j brown usage like 11% of his routes last year we're crossing routes only 6% this year our crossing routes so that is that is one of the lowest among wide receivers uh in the league so that that that would be something i think that would i think i have less faith that this is all of a sudden going to become a major part of the offense because it involves kind of a fundamental passing kind of choreography change.

Yes. And it also feels a little bit more tilted toward somebody's preferences. Okay. Now, do you have, are we going to get to? Do you have something about like accessing the middle of the field? Are we going to get to that? Or is this? Because this is part of that. Yeah, I think it is part of that. And it's the middle of the field kind of in both directions, right? So no quarterback throws like between the hatches less than Jalen Hertz, for example. No quarterback throws, or the Eagles are 30th as a team.

So I think Jalen's about 30th as well, at throwing in the middle third of the field. Okay. Like, you know, left or right wise. Okay. And then you have air yards, right? Like how far down the field. And this one is really glaring.

Yeah. When you look at this, like, especially- it has never thrown the ball over the middle of the field that often. That's true. Now the Eagles are playing, the Vikings this week. Do we have the air yards?

graphics? I believe so, yeah. Okay, like I think there are, yeah, so this is one that shows Jalen Hertz's career and how far down the field his passes have gone, like what percent of his throws go negative yards, up to five yards, up to 10 yards, up to 15, up to 20.

That green that you can barely see for 2025 is 15 to 20 air yards. The Eagles are dead last in the NFL at throwing passes in that range. Only 2.9% of Jalen's passes have traveled between 15 and 20 air yards.

Crazy. The Vikings, in contrast, are first in the league, by the way, 14%. So that's, you know, like five times as many almost. Of their passes are going that distance. And when you look at the Vikings on this league-wide chart here, you can see that they have almost the exact same number of passes traveling negative yards, 0 to 5, 5 to 10, 10 to 15, 15 to 20, 20 plus. They make you defend the entire field, both width-wise and length.

lengthwise. The Eagles don't do that. They don't throw to the middle of the field and they don't throw those middle ranges and it's not like they throw a lot 10 to 15 yards either. Like when you when you expand that middle of the field to 10 to 20 yards, the Eagles are still dead last. Yeah. In throwing in throwing 10 to 20 yards. And yeah, this has a lot to do with the, with the lack of first of all play action. Like a lot of play action passes are designed to hit that part of the field because that's the part of the field that the linebackers are vacating. Yeah, exactly. And then it also has to do with not running certain route combinations and crossers. And it has to do with, I think there's a case to be made that that part of the field

is accessed by scheme more than by players. Absolutely. Right? Yes. Absolutely. And for a team that is built on our players are better than yours, it makes sense intellectually why that would be. But yeah, I mean, they're giving up a bunch of the field that they can attack.

That's absolutely right. Right. And then it's hard like coming into this game to not do a comparison. between AJ Brown and Justin Jefferson, like two very talented receivers, both top receivers in the league and how they're used and where on the field they're targeted. AJ Brown in that 10 to 20 area yard range,

17% of his targets are in that range. Justin Jefferson, 38%. And in his career, Jefferson's never been below 30%. Wow. So, like, he's been in this like kind of schemed up offense where he's getting a larger variety of routes than AJ Brown. AJ Brown runs a disproportionate number of slants

and a disproportionate number of posts and goes and the posts and goes you could argue like it's like well that's not you know he's downfield but like you rarely get targeted on those like those he ends up essentially running clearouts yeah and who's you running the clear out for you know like Johan Dotson's running a hitch underneath that Jalen's not going to throw anyway right you want to right well that's exactly right run the clear outs so that Devante can cross the field underneath you right for example but that's not what you're getting

you're getting Devante running a hitch like instead so So yeah, it's just just, like, I just don't understand. I don't understand this. And these plays aren't in the, like, the one thing that would make me push back on they're not going to do this is we know they have it in the playbook. It's just a matter of pushing that button more. And we know they like to spam like the same concepts over and over again. But I don't know if maybe you're right.

Maybe it's just, you think it's just Jaylen's preference, that he's not throwing those like maybe higher risk. throws like they could... I think that's part of it. Yeah, I do. I don't, but I don't know. I don't have a good reason why. All right, let's get to the professor's solution for the offense. Number three. More empty. So this is... I think the word is actually emptier. If you wanted to make it one word. Yeah. Would you say emptier? The room looks emptier. Interesting. Right? I don't think you wouldn't say more empty. You could say more empty.

Looks more empty. Without the couch there, the room looks more empty. You can totally say that. Emptier. Emptier. All right. You're like world class at, uh, at, uh, what's the word here? Getting off track?

Yes. That's not a bad thing. That's fine. In this last game against the Giants, the Eagles were an empty eight plays. This is most of any play, any, uh, this year. This is very anecdotal because it's just this week. But Jalen was 7 for 8 for 46 yards out of empty. Eagles were 75% success rate, 6 for 8 on those plays.

Only 42% success rate would not an empty. Now, that's just one game. But the Eagles have had a ton of success out of empty in the past. With Devante Smith in the slot. I know you like have, I don't know if you wrote about it, talked about it, like in the past. I used to write stuff like that. Yeah. And like it's a time.

In addition to the skill set of the players that you have and getting them in space and all those kinds of things, there are a couple of other things that getting an empty does. One, it lets all five of your guys get in the route, which I wanted to put in to, you know, I didn't want to make that its own thing because it kind of goes with this one. I don't know if it's because of past protection fears, but I've talked about this almost every week now. I'm getting kind of tired of it because it's more and more of the same. And it's getting worse and worse every week.

the Eagles are still dead last at getting all five players out on the route 32nd in the league only 61% of their dropbacks involve all five players actually running a route that's dramatically lower than what we've seen from the Eagles in past years they're having the running back stay in

protecting even when it's kind of obviously a four-man rush they've done it even against three-man rushes they're lining up in 12 and having both tight ends stay in to block against what turns out to be a four-man rush so you've got three routes with seven guys to cover them and it's not, they're not really shot plays. They're running like long curls,

like things that would only work against the blitz, basically. And the team's not blitzing. You know, we've talked about how they're guessing wrong. They're guessing wrong. And just the fact that they're guessing shows you that they're thinking a little bit too much about what the defense is doing,

something that AJ Brown referred to when he said, like, like, we need to take what we want. Yeah, let your killers make place. Let your killers do their thing. Do their thing and also take what we want instead of take what they give us, right? So I think empty would solve a lot of these problems.

Now empty is not the only way to solve that problem. You could also just not have more people staying into block, be your answer to the Blitz. But I think empty is a big part of it. And also the sim pressures, and we're going to talk about this when we get to the Vikings defense, they run more sim pressures than any other team in the league. And the Eagles have faced more sim pressures

than any other team in the league. One of the things that Empty does is it makes it harder to disguise coverage. Right? You put the running back out as the number one receiver to the sideline. You put the tight end out as the number one shiver to the other sideline. They could keep their corners out there

and make you think they're playing zone and then play man or whatever. But they're not, they're very unlikely to do that, right? They could put the linebacker out and still play zone. Some teams are doing this kind of disguised, but it just makes it harder.

Like you don't let the defense dictate what they're doing. And France talked about this a lot. Most teams don't have that many different answers for empty. Yeah. Like you learn early in the game. hey, when we're in empty, they're checking to this. You know, when we're empty, they're playing, you know, they're playing cover three.

Or when we're empty, they're playing man every time or whatever it is. And then you're able to get to the part of the playbook that beats those coverages. And so it's just something that I think can help the Eagles dictate rather than react. And how often have they been in empty? Oh, very little. Right. Yeah, yeah. Like very little this year.

There were previous years. Oh, much less. Right. Yeah. And this is a thing that they have excelled out in the past. Yeah. They've never been like top of the league in rate of being an empty, but they've been like... It's something they've been placed in the past.

Yeah, yeah, top half. And they've been very good at it. And that's why I think there were games this year where they had like two plays and empty the whole game. Yeah. I think this is one where they will dial the needle, dial the knob up. But I am concerned that the reason they're not doing it is because they don't trust the offensive line. Even though for the reasons you've said, that doesn't necessarily preclude them from going on. Yeah, I mean, so many teams.

when they're an empty, they get the ball out faster. You know, like, and Jalen Hertz is one of the slowest at getting the ball out. Like, like, it would speed him up as well. Oh, and one of the reasons that teams don't like doing empty, which doesn't apply to the Eagles, is the lack of a run threat out of empty. The Eagles have been awesome. Well, the quarterback draws out of empty. Like, they've literally been like an awesome running team out of empty because the quarterback can run.

To be able to go empty and still present running as an option is a bit of a key. Exactly. So like the unwillingness to do play action, the fact that you're guessing wrong on the protections, the fact that the quarterback is this like run threat, all of these things would lead you to think like, hey, this team probably uses empty more than any other team in the league. And instead, they use it among the lowest. All right. Three down, three to go.

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That's rocketmoney.com slash p-h-l-Y. The professor's solution to change and fix the Eagles offense. Number four. More running from a left. and passing from 12. The 2022 formula. Yeah, and even further back,

going back to Doug, right? It was one of the big Doug things, like pass it when they're expecting you to run it and when they're in base personnel, run it when they are spread out, right? And it sounds easy and simple, but like the numbers show that the Eagles have been good at doing these things,

but they're just not doing them very much. Overall, Eagles EPA per play this season, is much better not in 11 than an 11, right? They're 26th, 26th than EPA per play when they're in 11 personnel, which they're in about, what, 60% of the time or so 65% of the time, when they're not in 11 personnel,

they're second in EPA per play plus 0.1.2. Now, part of this is the quarterback sneaks, which are out of 12. But even when you remove those, they're still significantly better, not an 11 than an 11. So I broke it down into running back runs. I took out the quarterback runs, which, you know, they, they're just better in 12 because all the sneaks are in that.

I broke it down into running back runs and dropbacks. And when the Eagles are in heavy personnel, they're sixth in dropback success rate. They've passed out of heavy personnel 41 times. They're sixth in the league in success rate when they do that. They're 29th in the league and running back, run success rate when they do that. They've run it 60 times. Now, that rate of passing is 20. 27th highest in the league.

So basically they run it out of those heavy looks at the, what is that? The sixth highest rate of any team in the league, but they're not good at it. And we've talked about the reasons, right? You're putting so much stress on your tight ends being able to block. You're inviting the defense into the box with like just a lot of bodies there. And you're forcing the tight ends to block defensive ends or you're forcing the tight end to, you know, be a rapper on counter that they're not, you know, good at doing. Like all those things that they haven't been able to do very well with Grant.

Alcatera, et cetera. And so when you're in those looks, especially when you get the opponent in base, line up and make them cover you and have them have answers. One of the things the Eagles did very well against Denver and they kind of just went away from it was lining up in 12 personnel,

two tight ends to one side, two wide receivers to the other. You get coverage indicators that way, especially against teams that play the corners over when they're in man and then they don't when they're in zone. And then you also, sometimes you end up a mismatch. You get AJ Brown running full speed at a safety. If he keeps running,

if he keeps running, right? As long as he's not rerouted. Well, he was rerouted and he still was wide open against the safety. So, you know, those are those are ones where like, and he's rerouted by a dropping defensive end on that play, by the way, which highlights the fact that you're making defensive ends cover AJ Brown. Safety's cover AJ Brown, right? And they could do a lot more of this. They just haven't for whatever reason. Meanwhile, when they're at 11th personnel, they're not that good at passing. They're 19th in drop back success rate. So they drop from 6th to 19th

when they get into those spread out situations and they pass it at the eighth highest rate out of 11 personnel of any team in the league. So there's a disproportionate amount of passing out of 11. Obviously every team passes more out of 11 and runs more out of 12. But the Eagles just do it to a to a, as with everything else, more extreme degree.

What do you think? I feel like this one is kind of like the first one, the play action one, where it will marginally improve, but I don't expect it to be a wholesale change. Even though it was a 2022 staple? Yeah. It was the same coaches.

I know. I don't know. Whose preference is this? Like what's the reason? I find it hard to believe that this is anything. This one, I think there are a lot of things in here that if you want to, you can presume it has to do with the courts.

quarterback's preferences. This one is just coaching to me. Don't you think? But because it's the same coaches who were doing this a bunch in 2020. Yeah. Because they've been working hard for a long time. They're too tired. They're not sleeping enough.

I don't know. So many of the things that both Siriani and Petulow say all the time and that Jalen hints at at times as well is that every week is different because the opponent's different. And that's one of the reasons I think that this offense looks so schizophrenic. Yeah, I feel like I feel like I feel like they are tailoring their game plan to the opponent too much. Right. And they've played very unique defenses that have very strong personalities. And it's like, it's like in a relationship, right?

Like if you're in a relationship with someone with a very strong personality, it's very hard to to kind of be yourself and not just be like a reflection of that strong personality. And it's like they've been playing like Todd Bowles. Like, you know, now you got Brian Flores now. Like it's like these like these these kinds of defenses that do these things that, um, you know, rates that other teams do. And it's almost like they're thinking too hard about it. I think it's like. And instead they should be like, we have AJ Brown.

It's like it's like you're lying. It's like if you have, if you're telling a different story to five different people and then you got to keep track of all the different lies because you're changing things based on what you want to hear. Sounds like you're speaking from experience. No, but rather if you just tell the truth and you're yourself,

you don't have to remember anything. You can just be who you are. And this offense has, has no who you are. Yeah, I like that. And it has no who you are even though it's been the same exact people on offense.

It's been the same characters. And they've had success. They've had good offenses. They've been to two Super Bowls and one one. Like it's very strange that they don't have a personality, that they are such a weak personality and they just ends up being a reflection

of what the defense's personality is. I really like we should push this relationship analogy further. Yeah. Okay. There's speed dating. I don't know. Yeah.

Solution number five. More RPO's. Not a whole lot to say about this because we know that the entire offense was based on RPO's in 2021 and 2022. They brought it out against Denver and we're very good at it. I think there's six for seven success rate

on RPO's in that game and very low success rate, not in RPAOs. I understand that RPAOs are a little bit defense specific, like you're not going to run RPAs against certain looks. But RPAs help the run. game, they help the pass game, they let you stay on schedule in situations when the run game

isn't working. And, I mean, it gives you that option in certain situations for when you do run a play that's not an RPO for it still to pay benefits, kind of like play action, where if you've shown enough RPO looks and you've done enough of the stuff where there is some sort of pass attached to it, you're not going to have those people going downhill to stop the run. So like the regular non-RPO runs should work a little bit better as well. when you have RPO's. Looking around the league, there are so many creative RPO's

that other teams are using that the Eagles could easily use. Like, I mean, the Eagles typically do, like, the zone read RPO where, like, Jalen has the option to keep it and throw a bubble or throw a slant or something. There are other teams that do RPO's with GAPS games. The Giants are an example.

I mean, the Giants, like, just breaking down the film of this last Giants game, like the Giants had a lot of really cool concepts, like really cool RPO concepts where they're running counter where they're running some sort of gap scheme with some sort of read attached to it. The Eagles could so easily do that

and it's a great way to eliminate a defender in the run game, right? Like just don't block that defender because we can't block him because Grant Calcuttaire can't block anybody. So instead just don't block him, right? And have him worry about the pass. Worked against Denver.

They ran one RPO against the Giants. I have no idea why. Like it's like like there's nothing about the Giants defensive structure that says RPO's won't be good against them. They have like edge rushers who are aggressive, good pass rushers like who you could read and who you could kind of eliminate that way. And they just didn't do it. Like and I don't know. Don't know why. I don't know why either.

And it is, uh, it goes back to the same conversation we've been having where it doesn't feel like it's like they put their game plan together for the week and they have to stick to the game plan. Like, well, we put in all those hours on the game plan. Let's, we got, we got to hit the buttons that we put in, you know, put on the mixing. No, no, no, that's good. But you know what I mean? And it's like, oh, we can just go back to this. Like, why not? And it does, you know, when Nick talks about it too often, it's like, well, working harder is always going to be the solution.

And I just, I don't think that that's right. Right. I don't know. I think old timers talk about Bill Walsh as, um, players hated playing for Bill Walsh, in part because this was back before, you know, CBAs and stuff, where they could have like two a days and longer meetings and all these things. But apparently Bill Walsh would have essentially two entire game plans for every week. And the game would start.

And he would say, like, okay, like, we're doing this one because they're playing. They're playing zone against this look or whatever. So, like, we're going to scrap the thing we worked on for half the week and do the other half. And it's like the Eagles don't have, they don't even have like a one full game plan. They have like a quarter of a game plan that they just hope is going to get them through the whole game. All right.

One more. Solution number six. Related to RPA run game. Like what are we doing? Three of the seven games in Jalen Hertz's career without a single QB designed run other than snakes have been this season. Three of the seven.

Three of the six games this year. He doesn't have a single quarterback run that was designed. Last week, he only had one. And it was the greatest play in football, Bash Counter Reed. It actually worked really well. He made the right read.

He kept the ball. And then for whatever reason, he bounced it outside. If he had followed the blockers, it was going to be a successful play. What do they do after that? They don't call a single other one of those plays the whole game.

And it's like, this happens so much. It's like it didn't work the first time. And so we're not going to go back to it. They also are at fault in the other direction. It's like, oh, that mid-zone crawl call with Cam Juergens pulling around the guard. worked great on the first play of the game. And it didn't even work that great.

It just happened to have a cutback lane. And so they called exactly the same thing out of the same look again on the second drive. And it's like, it shows how anecdotal the play calling has been. It's like, that worked. Let's do that again. This didn't work.

Let's not do this again the whole game. And it's like it's not keeping defenses off balance. It's making the offense more predictable in that way. So I mean, you're not doing play action, right? You're not accessing certain parts of the field. Like you're not stressing the defense. You're not making, you're not making them, defend things that you're not doing

not having the quarterback involved in the run game just seems crazy to me like this goes hand in hand with the empty thing because you can do quarterback draws out of that as well of all the six things here

this is the one that I think is the most intentional on their part I think it is maybe they haven't been thinking about crossing rounds enough or you know

it just the week to week game plan has meant not going empty as often or RPO's as often. This is one where, like, I do really believe from the organization on down, and I don't know if it is a protect Jalen Hertz for the end of the season. I don't know if it's a Jalen Hertz preference himself.

This is one where I mean, just given what we've seen in the past, this is one that I think they are intentionally not running him as much. And I think they kind of need to for the reasons you're saying. I've heard, well, Jalen was asked about this twice this year, earlier in the year he said

you have to ask KP and then this week he was asked about it and first he said it's just how the games have gone and then when he was directly asked if he was influencing the amount of QB runs there are he just said no so I don't know if you believe him on that

but like that's what he said about it and then I've heard theories that they're waiting for later in the season right it's like not worth doing now because it does increase injury risk to Jalen, it's going to be worth it come playoff time. He's going to run more than.

Maybe there's something to that. I mean, I don't have a good way to quantify how much the injury risk changes. He has been hurt on running as a quarterback before. It's not like he hasn't, right? Like sometimes, like we used to say like, no, actually every time he's been injured, he was in the pocket.

He's good protecting himself. It's not, and he is pretty good at protecting himself. Slide over a little bit. But he has. Ah, but he has. Where am I going? Kind of in the middle here? We'll wait until we reset.

Okay, okay. He has been hurt running it on designed runs, right? Like against Chicago, for example. Okay. We're through six. That means we can get to the rest of the show, including the introduction of E.J. Smith, who is here from the Nobucare Complex.

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See if you're eligible, fill out the form and you're entered. It's that simple. Enter now and you might be watching the next big game in a fan cave built by you, courtesy of Ashley. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome to the show, E.J. Smith. Yay. Thank you for having me. I appreciate it.

I wore my Cliff Essentials hoodie in honor, Cliff from yesterday. But yeah, I've been enjoying your conversation in the car. Oh, nice.

I had to redo my mic. We're good. Okay. Do you think we solve the problems? You don't have any... Oh, go ahead. Yeah, do you think we solve the problems? I think that,

well, solve the problems will be up to the Eagles coaching staff. But no, I think that you guys raise a lot of good points, especially like, I mean, I feel like the RPO thing has been, it's something that I've just been really confounded by all season, the lack of RPO's into here, like, the thing I was thinking about, so like, now this was fun because like when I'm listening to you guys in the car,

I've got things I wanted to say. One of the things I wanted to mention is that, like, the Eagles have consistently prioritized, like, bringing in college coaches. And you'd think that, like, bringing in, like, a Scott Leffler, right? Like, that would present you, like, it would give you an opportunity to, like, investigate like what are college teams doing? What are some of the newer RPO's, the more creative ways that teams are trying to

leverage things like that. So yeah, I think it is it's been something that's clearly been missing with the offense, something that I think really could help them stay on schedule, especially on early downs. Bo back, baby. Good, good troubleshooting behind the scenes from Andrew. Unbelievable.

Black out there, fantastic. Bo kind of jokingly talked about how Scott Leffler not getting enough. Yes. You know, attention. But maybe... Yeah, why not? Maybe there is something to that, right?

I mean, what's he doing? Like, what's his impact, right? Like, because he's, he's like the main new character around the coaching stuff. So, like, it's like, we're looking for differences.

Petulow's been here the whole time. Sirianni's been here the whole time. Like, Jalen's been here the whole time. So is Scott Lefler part of the, part of the reason for some of the changes? Did you learn anything from the locker room today, E. Oh, yeah, honestly, it was kind of a ghost town in the locker room.

I was dragging myself through the mud a little bit for not pulling the plug earlier so I could join you guys. But yeah, it was- And he felt pot committed, you know, you had already put in the time, you know. Yeah, no, Sequin Barkley did pull the listeners back behind the curtain. He's become a late Friday talker. So he's, he puts me, like we were talking about with RPO's, I feel like I'm the linebacker that's in conflict here. You know, it's like. Or maybe he's like the, maybe he's the reason that they're always late to the line on the play clock.

I don't think I don't think I'd attribute blame for Sequin on that one Is it procrastinator? I don't think it's procrastination I mean listen I don't begrudge these guys for having a preference for when they talk That used to be the Devante Smith time right?

Like late Friday? Yeah it still is. Oh, still is okay okay so they're both yeah Okay so nothing good to see you I'm sorry I tried

I did try. How about Nick today? Anything from Nick that you found interesting? I did find it interesting that... Siriani, for those of you unfamiliar. There has been definitely a common theme throughout the week from players and now Nick Siriani talking about the importance of like focusing on your individual role.

Like, you know, dominate your box has been what you hear from the players. And I do find it interesting. Like, you know, Nick didn't like necessarily say that that's like just this week that they've been harping on it. But I think it is clear that it's been something that they talked about based off of what the players have told us. And Nick didn't deny that, you know, when asked about it today.

He was talking about how that is usually like what you default back to. I know you guys talked about like how the work was central to what Nick was talking about, but I also found it interesting this like this push to like focus on yourself that has kind of been prevalent throughout the week. Tell me if you agree with this. I felt like Nick looked more rested today and a little bit just generally better mood than he was the rest of the week. I would agree with that.

I think that the... Because part of the reason I wanted to go today, so maybe I will spin this as a positive locker room today. It sounds like you left me alone. Well, no, I just... Listen, I enjoy the show. So, like, you know, I can get here to talk to you guys.

I want to do it. But I thought it was important this week to take the temperature of the locker. You know, feel out where... Clifety 2 temperature check. Exactly. And I feel like... Kind of 2023 radar?

And honestly, no. I don't think that that felt like this. The locker room this week did feel a little bit more relaxed than maybe you would have expected off of a two-game losing streak. I think that the mini-buye did probably, that's probably the product of the mini-buys that these guys came back. It sort of felt like a reset. And yeah, I don't get the sense.

So the one thing I did accomplish in the locker room, and I will tease to my locker room notes that will come out tomorrow. I did have a conversation with AJ Brown. and I would like to That's a big deal I would like to go back I mean I was gonna say I had a nice conversation with Sam Howell yesterday

but you really went up to me I've had a good conversation with Sam Halel you know it's easy that's nothing to sneeze at I don't as well another good narrator in the Eagles locker Talk to screen time All right so my conversation with AJ Brown The one thing that I don't think I need to like listen back through

and kind of parse to make sure that I represent accurately is like him talking about like the the energy in the locker room not really matching the energy externally. You know, it's like, because I was, I wanted to talk to him about like some of the scrutiny. Yeah. It goes with everything he says, every inflection of his voice, every facial expression. And he said that a lot of that really is more about external factors, you know, like what he said earlier this week.

Like if you look around the locker room, it's normal, right? Like, you know, there's, you know, these, it's not like there's a, there's a tension. And I did feel like in 23, you started to see that creep in. And so, so yeah, I mean, does it really matter if they go out and lose on Sunday? Obviously not. And that goes into a lot of what you guys have talked about. But I don't think the panic meter, especially in that locker room, rings out the way that it did at points, you know, I guess in the 2020 season. I think where I would disagree with him and just looking at the last game and it's going to be really interesting to see how it carries over to Sunday is just on the field.

the way they got pushed around yeah okay yeah and it didn't look like 53 guys who were all you know fighting for every yard both sides of the ball too yes and so that's the thing I want to see how they come out

and play energy wise on Sunday yeah that to me is I mean listen you want to win the game I would be I would feel much better about you know if they lose by three points but you know you see the effort I think that would be okay.

Well, I think that there might be an intentionality to the way that they have been this week, you know, trying to not like breathe, like, tension into, like the way that they looked against the Giants. It's so hard to compare to 2023 too, because that was such a late in the season and a start to that collapse where, I mean, the team was 10 and 1, right?

And then it just went. And I know there was talk about how miserable they were even when they were winning. Yeah. But this is the earliest two-game losing streak this team has had since 2021, right? So like, like, we haven't seen, we haven't had to see, like,

like they haven't had to react to a two-game losing streak like this. Yeah. And it's almost weird because the two losses came within four days of each other, and then you get a break. And I don't know. One thing that I heard this week that I wanted to ask you guys about

was Milita on his radio show, which is like a gold mine for, for, like, he just like says a lot that they probably don't want him saying. He was asked him, if it's coaching or a player execution issue, and he said that compared to 2023, it's definitely more of a player execution issue. He said the coaching has been very good in detailed. And then he said, I'll just say it right now. In 2023, it wasn't like that. Like he said, the coaching

wasn't detailed. The technique wasn't there in the coaching in 2023. So totally throwing Brian Johnson under the bus and saying that like there's a huge difference in the amount of coaching detail this year. Now, he can't say the coaching sucks this year, obviously. but he also didn't have to say that the coaching was like that in 20th. He goes there to make you think he's really telling him. Yeah, maybe in two years he'll talk about how the coaching sucked in 2025. I think the evidence is there this year, like some of the missed explosive plays in the passing game,

especially that there have been instances where the call was the right call and it came down to player execution. And yeah, I mean, I don't know if you saw Milattas press conference on Wednesday, but he did. He said if you look at the tape, you see that the focus isn't always there with the offense. No, it definitely felt like that going back to like the message from Nick and from the players about like focusing on your individual assignments. It seems like that's been a real push this week.

And I think it is probably addressing that type of stuff. Yeah, one of the one of the completions to AJ Brown in the red zone. Tyler Steen is just flat out run blocking. Like he like he like starts running down the field. And he's like, wait, no one else is run. And he like has to like step back. And he could have been flagged for. He got back in time.

but like it was, or he didn't go more than a yard, but like, that's a good example of not focus. It's like everyone else knows it's a past play. And he, and that had happened in another game. Speaking of focus, professor, we'll get to more of this conversation in Bover time. Just in time. Nailed it.

Didn't want to disrupt the Bover time timing there. Yeah, we got to nail it. We got to get the little things right. Gotta be nailed. Master the things to take no talent. I think Bover Time takes talent. I don't know about that. Like just saying Bovertime takes down?

The delivery, it's strong. Takes style. Thanks. That's a good friend right there. Okay. I don't think he's saying Boe overtime. He's saying boo over time. Yeah.

That's even better. That's funny. Well yeah, he's going. The capitalization in the middle is interesting. They're saying... Boer overtime. Fran's still upset you guys. Then just let him have the perpetual swooper item for free.

It's not how it works. Yeah, what did you think? He knew it. knew it. He knew it didn't deserve it. No, I thought you guys should have just been on it again at that point. No, I was like, come on just put on it again. Yeah, because it affected later items. Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, I understand.

Okay. What else is in your notebook? Vikings defense, Fran got into it some, but like it really is funny how they just, you know, and like Mina talked about this when she was on with you guys on Wednesday, like, they just major in all the things that the Eagles got trouble with. their second and overall blitz rate. Now the Eagles have been good against straight blitz this year. Seventh and big blitz rate, which is something we've seen the Eagles struggle with in the past.

And they're first in four-man sim pressures, right? Which has been kind of like the flavor of the month thing to discuss in terms of things the Eagles are having trouble with. The Vikings do it 18% of the time. That's first in the league. The Eagles have been facing it 19% of the time, which is first in the league by a mile. Like the most anyone else has faced it is the Ravens at 14.

The league average is only 8%. So we talked going into the Denver game about how Vance Joseph hadn't run a single four-man exchange pressure yet on the season. And then against the Eagles, he called 10 of them, right? And so there's no way Brian Flores isn't going to come into this calling those.

Milata said it's like a fun bag at a party and you don't know what you're going to get, right? You said that in the locker room about Brian Flores. You tried to say that you sometimes you'll get a lulley and then went off on a tangent about how that's not what we call it. It's not called a lulley in the U.S. Yeah.

A lot of disguised coverages, as Fran was saying, and a lot of late rotation out of very unorthodox looks. So like last week there was a game where Harrison Smith, who, by the way, is no longer a full-time player on the defense. He only plays in Big Nickel and Dime. He and Theo Jackson are two of the three safeties on the field. They're lined up on the end of the line of scrimmage on either end. Looks like they're going to blitz.

And when they blitz, it is almost always zoned. So they run zone behind blitz's second highest of any team in the league. And so that gives the quarterback a read of blitz. zone. Instead, what happens just before the snap, they both casually jog back the full 20 yards and become the too high safeties and what turns out to be two-man coverage. So it's man coverage and it's too high instead of blitz, zone, zero. Like, it's like the whole thing is like, and you talk about zero, like how can zero be zone? Against the Eagles in 2023, I pulled out my notes for this, the first four plays of the game, they blitzed both linebackers, six-man rush, the other five just

birds on a wire waiting for the route. So it wasn't really zero the way you normally see it where it's like just man. It's more like it was like I remember texting with Fran back then and being like, what do you call this? And I think we landed on zero match. Like it's like cover zero match. And it was like such an unusual.

Yeah. Well, he talked about how they do something similar to two Buster on the show. I thought you were going to talk about it. But yeah, so they did a bunch of that zero match stuff. They did it throughout the game. And then they did a lot of drop eight, drop eight cover two, drop eight, cover three. And the cover two is almost never,

normal. It's always like Isaiah Rogers becomes one of the safeties and then, you know, medalist comes down and plays like a like a corner. And they very rarely play normal nickel. Like the things that you're normally used to seeing, they play 61% in base personnel. That's third highest in the league. League average is 28%. So they're in base a lot against 11 as well on early downs. And so that's something that the Eagles have to kind of think about it. Cam Juergens was talking about it earlier this week. Curious what that does for the Eagles decision of whether to play more 11 or 12. This might not be the week that they play more 12 because they're thinking

well if they're going to match 11 with base maybe we can do it that way or they're going to be in base anyway. Let's play the 12 condensed run game because they're not good at stopping the run which I hope isn't what happens but so and then they don't play normal nickel hardly ever they play big nickel

with medalist as the nickel and then they play dime with Harrison Smith coming in as well and so yeah a lot of I can give you in the interest of not making this bad podcasting. I will give you each one guess and I'll give you a specific field.

I talked to one player who said that they love Brian Flores' defensive system today. I'm going to tell you what position group and I'm gonna, I'll tell you that they play in the secondary.

Who like would love Brian Flores? This is now turning into the podcast. I don't feel like most of the secondary is experienced enough to have an opinion here except for Adori Jackson or Marcus Epps.

I don't, I mean, they're just familiar with what he does defensively and like they think that that's awesome it's like the way you got to play now i feel like the player who would thrive in it the most is cooper djean oh no no no no cooper to jean all right then is you get one guess someone who plays on the eagle side oh i know who you already use your guess i didn't say he play yeah i know who it is and this is a guy who oh it's someone who doesn't play yeah it's a guy who can't play for vick fan joe but would love but would love to play for brian oh

sydney brown yes okay okay yeah yeah I see. That makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. Because you can just use as a question. He's basically like, trade me,

train me, trip me, no, no, that's not what he, no, now I feel bad. It's not what he did at all.

No, but that makes sense. He's the kind of player who, that's why I asked him about it. Yeah, that's a good one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I watched Brian Flores as press her this week. And he said something which like, almost sounds cliche, but I thought it was, it was a good, like, kind of lesson in life and, and everything else as well.

Like, He talked about how when they get a new player in, he always sits down with that player and says, like, you're really good at these things. And this is how we're going to use you. And I feel like he would do that with Sidney Brown. And he also knows what he's not good at, right? And he wouldn't have him do other things. And it's like, that's like almost exactly what the Eagles offensive staff like doesn't do. Right.

It's like, like, you're good at these things. We're going to have you do these things. It's like, like, sit down with Grand Calcutera and be like, you know, like, we're going to use you as the rapper on counter because you're good at it. like would not be something that anyone ever said. So hard for me not to just start rapping when you do that. No. Go ahead. Oh, I was just going to say that when you guys were talking about like the RPO game,

I know I'm going back to RPAs, I feel like it's a big, it's a big thing. But don't apologize. Well, I feel like, okay. Like the, the Grant Calcutera, like you don't need to like ask him to block the defensive end because you just go out on the route. It's the same thing we talk about with like the exchange pressure. Danes is here, I'll say the exchange pressure, where it's like if you don't feel great about your addressers,

drop one of those guys into coverage. Like that is like an example of like good coaching where you kind of coach around. Yes. Maybe somebody's defensive. And I think Vic does do that. Yeah. Well, yeah, there's some pressures are an example of it.

Sorry, the exchange pressure. Danes, I know it's on your radar. How much the egos have been, you know, shuffling the practice squad? Oh my goodness. Got a couple new characters this week. Yeah. I'm a little bit worried about it.

Titus Leo? Yeah, that's the one that bothers me. Okay. You're worried about Well, I think it's a little bit Doc to test too much from the Eagles.

Like, oh, don't look at us. Everything's fine here. Like, we are, we are still a cohesive group so much so that they sign

a guy whose name is tight us. It's on brand for you. Yeah. I mean, that's like, welcome to the podium, Joe Walker. Tell us if the team has

cohesiveness. Tight us. Eli Ricks has been released five times. since August 26th. Just think about that. Five times. None of those times by Ivanka, unfortunately.

Oh, that's good. You don't know what he's doing on those days off. He's getting those. Yeah, I mean, I guess. He might be asking for those. Hey, get you release me? It's fine. It's all the matter.

I just need Tuesday off this week. Tight us. Leo. Who's the other new guy? Oh, they signed Titus Leo, by the way, if you're wondering why they didn't just sign KJ Henry again, is because KJ Henry signed with another team. And then the other new guy is Jaheim Bell.

Oh, Jeheme Bell. Jaim Bell, yeah, who they gave number 46 to, taking it away from Kwez Watkins. Quez Watkins is now 86. So, Quez Watkins goes from 46 to 86, which makes me worry that he's one step closer to getting on the field. E.J., is it on your radar?

that the Eagles have not reassigned the Darius Smith's locker yet. Yes, it's on the radar. Of course it is. I think it's on all of our radars. Yeah. Okay. It's interesting.

Usually those things turn over, especially when they have so many things in the middle. You never know. All right, what else you got? How about the other side of the ball? Yeah. That's interesting to you about the Vikings' offense. Well, one of the things that we need to talk about

with the Eagles defense is that after watching the film, I came one step closer to your more panicked view of the defense than than Fran. I was texting with Fran before I watched the film and Fran was like, Fran was like, I watched the film. The offense is way more concerning than the defense. Like, what do you think? And I was like, I haven't watched it yet. I had to give myself a few days.

Wow. Now I have right to the eyes. Now I have watched it. And yeah, the offense was concerning for all the reasons that we've discussed. It was already concerning. Yeah, exactly. That's the thing. It was already concerning.

And the defense saved this team last year. They were awesome. That game against the Giants was the eighth worst performance by an Eagles defense in the Siriani era. Obviously the worst under Fangio. The other ones, it's four from 2021, two from the late season collapse in 2023. And then, of course, the famous Super Bowl

that Jonathan Gannon individually and unforgivably lost in a solo performance. And you do have to wonder if the Eagles win that Super Bowl if Michael Vick never goes to prison. And then Jonathan. Gannon. What is wrong with that guy? It's like what is what the hell?

Like what a jerk? Seriously. I mean, hate that guy. Such a dick. It is over time. I guess you can say that. I fucking hate that.

Wow. Fuck that guy. I mean, it is, you know, I will never forget. I don't care. The Eagles could win the next 10 Super Bowls and I will still not ever get over the one

that Gannon lost. All right. there were some I wrote a haiku about it last year I don't know if you remember I remember the concept of it yeah do you remember the word for word

I think it was decades wait it has to be five right 575 many years many years will pass but I will never forgive

Jonathan Gannon that was the haiku all right never said it was good it just said it was Michael Vic apparently what a ridiculous thing to say Michael our quarterback went to jail who needs the abacus now

I'm trying to come up with a new one that's basically just what he said there were some repeat issues in this game from the Denver game that that bothered me a little bit since you're asking about the current defense the Eagles cannot count to four in four by one looks like

this has been an issue they didn't have enough people over the four men look out of four by one empty against Denver they just flat out didn't have one guy like covered and then in this game McCuba is man coverage it's a five man rush it's a four by one look Maccuba has to rotate down and get the fourth guy

he sort of does and you know Fran broke the stown so I don't want to get into too much but he sort of does and then he loses him and it's like he doesn't quite realize he's in man coverage he's constantly watching the quarterback when the quarterback's scrambling and trying to you know he's a ball hawk we know he needs to watch the quarterback to make those plays but like you're in man coverage you have to cover that fourth guy

instead he just loses him. And he missed the tackle. He also tripped Cooper to Gene on the same play. It was a disaster. Then there's another one that was like a schematic play that I thought Denver had a really clever answer to the way the Eagles normally cover crossers. Teams typically run crossers from the strong side to the weak side.

So you've got like three receivers on one side, one on the other, and how do you cover that crosser from the trip side? The Eagles typically do it with the safety on the boundary side. That's usually read Blankenship, waiting for that crosser to come over. We've talked about how Fangio is like a master at this. What Denver did is they ran Bobby Engram from the boundary side

where he was the only receiver on a crosser to the field side. Now there's nobody to catch that guy. Like the person covering him has to actually run with him. And that was Keely Ringo. He got out leveraged across the field. It was an 18-yarder. The Giants ran almost exactly the same play with Wondale Robinson. He ran a crosser from the right side to the left side,

out leveraging Keelie Ringo. Keeler Ingo was very slow to trigger to it. And he looks and there's nobody there to catch that crosser because, again, it's not the structure of the defense that the safety is going to catch that. The safety has to worry about other things on the other side in that situation. When you're on the boundary as a corner in a Fangio defense, you're typically essentially in man coverage. And Keely Ringo has been put in that position way too often now, which is why he's benched now because he's trying to either pass that off or he doesn't understand or whatever. So that was a repeat issue. there is no chance that Kevin O'Connell is not going to run

some version of that. They're not going to do four by one, that they're not going to do those kinds of crossers from the boundary side to the field side. So those are two things I'm going to look for in this game. The other thing that was disturbing, we all talked about it, was just how they got beat up,

play after play, after play. I mean, Giants had 10 of 11 plays at one point that were successful in a row, beating up the Eagles on run plays. Four guys ended up on the ground on a counter read. We have breaking news. Oh, I'm sorry to cut you off. Is it a serious Smith's Locker or no?

The Vikings have announced their starter this week and quarterback. And it's Carson Wentz. It's Carson Wentz. All right. So there were, I was going that way. Yeah.

Yeah. It seemed pretty clear. The Wentz, mah. They both did pressers and stuff, but like it was pretty clear. It was going to be Carson. I remember that guy. What's your lasting Carson Wentz memory?

I try to be positive about it. I mean, like, at the end of the day, the Eagles won their first Super Bowl. Because Carson Wentz was awesome that year, right? Like would not have without him. So try to be positive, but it's hard for it not to be. Do you have a favorite memory from that season of Carson Wences? Favorite play?

Probably the, probably the like the escape against Washington. Yeah. Is like a moment. And then he had the pass to Cory Clement in the against Washington. We're also against Washington. Yeah, yeah. I was going to say that Washington game. That was a great.

That was a great one. Yeah. peak Wentz experience. Yes. That throw, yeah, his third read, perfect throw.

Yeah. He was just awesome and then the, that the throw on the sideline when he was against the Seahawks like stumbling out of bounds and flings it 40 yards. Oh yeah,

Taggallor, yeah. Like it was like one of the hardest. On the film from the end zone, it looks crazy. Like it looks like it's not real. Yeah, he had a throw like that last week. Did he?

Yeah, unbelievable. Like going to his right, he like kind of ducked under a pressure, went to his right. and then threw it across his body and completed it down the sideline. And it was just, it was like such a Carson Wentz moment. I think that's what Fran was getting emotional about. Seeing those kinds of plays combined with like some of the other stuff that he still does.

I mean, but your favorite moment on film this week had to do with the exciting mics. Oh my goodness. Yeah, there was a play where Cooper DeGine and Reed Blankenship run into each other. And it looks like a scene from like Scooby-Doo or something where they like, they like run into each other so hard that they both bounce into the air and like fall to the ground. like like a cartoon. Like real humans don't normally bounce like that. So that was,

that was pretty funny. Everyone and I watched it over and over again on the, on the film. That was very funny. Yeah. Yeah, but no, the getting beat up, getting confused,

like getting calls, like all these things that we haven't seen from this Fangio defense before has me a little bit worried. And it's like, is this team just not physical enough to stop the run? Because you don't have the guys

on the defensive line to do it. I think it's, It's not being talked about that much, but Jordan Davis isn't quite as strong against the run as he was. And that makes sense, like, because he is smaller, right? Like, like, I do wonder if that's like a thing. Like my, I wouldn't say a concern, but my, I always wondered, like, if you take away, like, his size, like, to a certain degree, how does he compensate? Because it's like, I think the thing with Davis is that he's, he's a special player because he moves that well at that size. Right.

And now he, and he talked about a lot in the summer, like, trying to compensate, like, in, strength what he would lose in size. And yeah, I, I haven't studied it as closely as you, but I did wonder if that would impact him as a run defender, especially as a season war on. I think it has a little bit. I think it's just like there are plays now where they're doubling. So for example, there was a play where they're doubling, it's more out of just because of the alignment, but they're doubling Byron Young. And then the center just like single-handedly is able to move Jordan David. Yeah. Like, and I feel like that didn't use to happen. Where that happened as well. Yeah. And like it's, it's, I guess it's important to point out that he does have like a tough

job in a Fangio system because they run, they have so many light boxes. But still, yeah, no, I think that that's a fair observation. Yeah. And then it's also disappointing that we talked about how, well, he's lost weight now, so he should be on the field on passing downs. And they're bringing Ty Robinson on passing downs. I mean, on those third and longs, it was Ty Robinson and Morrowodroma out there, which it's great that Ty Robinson's getting out there and doing anything any deflected of pass. And yeah, he even had a few nice rushes. But like, in terms of Jordan Davis usage, like that's one of the things we keep on wondering, is he going to be out there? on those plays and in a game where Jalen Carter doesn't play for him still not to be one of the

one of the detackles out there on third downs is worth talking about because I thought the point of him losing weight in part was that he can be out there on those plays now how much do a healthy Jalen Carter and Quinnion Mitchell paper over a lot of these yeah I mean with quinine Mitchell it's like I'm still a little bit concerned because he can take away one side of the field but it's the offense gets to choose where the ball goes and unless that second quarterback spot gets better. I mean, I don't know what's going to happen. I mean, there were so many plays in this game where just by alignment, the Eagles were giving up a first down. I mean, Adori Jackson's playing eight yards off on third and four. And you can tell before the snap, it's going to be a

throw to that side. Like, it's not that hard to figure out. And it reminded me a little bit of those Gannon defenses where it's like, you know, just seeing that happen in a Fangio defense, like, makes you wonder, like, how much of it is Fangio and how much of it is that it was slay and Q out there and they had confidence to, you know, play guys up close. And these were not world beating wide receivers on the Giants. So it's going to be a challenge this week. And Q can travel with Justin Jefferson, but. Yeah. But that still leaves the other side of the field. And also it's like Quinnian Mitchell off of a hamstring injury against Justin Jefferson. Like you feel good about Queenian Mitchell in almost every matchup, but that is just an objectively insanely difficult

matchup. Yeah. And they do cool stuff. I mean like against Pittsburgh, they lined up Justin Jefferson like behind he motioned behind the running back and then he ran a wheel route from the backfield and they just handed it off to the running back three guys chased Justin Jefferson and the run went for like 15 yards and then one week later they go from what Dublin to London or whatever they do the same thing again same same motion and this time they actually throw it to Justin Jefferson on the wheel and he's open because this time they didn't play it and it's like that's such a good example of using a player in a creative way you having one play that they watched on film like like you know feed another it's like all the things that we wish the

Eagles offense did. Yeah, it seems like they've He's defending himself in the chat. He says, I'm willing to say that this week was a blip for the defense, what we saw versus McVey, Baker Mayfield, and Mahomes as opposed to the offensive structure.

That's pretty good. I know. All right. Maybe it wasn't pretty good. Did you listen to the birds with friends shows from London by any chance where the entire episode was in that accent? I vaguely remember that.

I do vaguely remember that. Which I guess speaks to maybe I didn't listen closely enough. Yeah. Couldn't listen to the whole thing because he hates the Beatles. Not this again. Please. Can you, when you listen to Beatles songs, can you tell who's singing just by hearing it? I know what my own voice sounds like, yes.

I don't know. Like, what's your confidence when you hear a Beatles song, like if it's Paul or John singing? Good question actually Because for me it's like Surprisingly hard Like I like Like if I hear them talking I can tell which one it is

But when they sing They sing so similarly That I can't I can't tell with confidence Not that many turkeys All right Yeah I wouldn't feel confident about it Especially as like

Now that I've been crowned The resident Beatles hater On this podcast I don't hate the Beatles For the record You just think they're overrated. Overrated isn't the right word.

They're fine. Losers? They're fine. I mean, that means you think they're overrated. I guess by the definition, I don't think that they're like the greatest band of all time. Okay.

Anything else? No, I think that's it. Jersey colors. We need to worry about that. They're wearing white on green, which they wore against the Rams this year. That was the only other one this year.

they're very good in that combination as they are in every combination under Siriani so we'll see you like that stadium I do like that stadium it's my first time yeah when did you start covering 2019 okay they played there in 2019 right

you didn't go to the oh yeah I didn't go to the away games in 2019 okay love man on the totem pole listen the inquiry inquires got a long totem pole so no it is overtime

I actually did check myself when I said I was like, it's over time, it's fine. Yeah, eagles are nine and two wearing white on green under, under Seriani.

Did you then get to travel to all away game? I guess no, because 2020 was... 2020 was my first year traveling. So do you think that I shouldn't say my first year covering the team was 2019?

I mean, I covered the team. Absolutely. I'm not territorial like that. So you went to the home games but not the away games? Mm-hmm. some of the driveable road games but yeah no flights

both of the losses wearing white on green I'll continue were in that 2023 collapse they lost in Seattle and they lost to the Giants in the last game so those are the only two times they lost with this uniform combination since you asked

any any predictions for the game EJ not score but like something we might see uh yeah I think that I would expect to see the Eagles like commit a little bit more to the run game and try to do a better job putting defenses into conflict, whether that is play action or RPA game. I think that that is probably something.

That's something I would expect. You know, I know that Flores is going, like the Flores defense dictates a lot to an opposing offense, and we've heard the Eagles talk about, like not wanting to be as reactive on offense, but I think the answer is going to be the run game and then again, the play action off of the run. And just a few things about the other side of the ball.

I mean, just big picture, the Vikings offense has been really bad. I mean, like, they just, you know, they're 27th by DVOA, 27th in EPA per drive, 28th in series conversion rate. They're dead last in success rate against the blitz. I don't know if that means like Fangio will blitz more or if they just thinks of that as situational.

They're not really getting anything out of big plays. They're 27th in EPA from big plays. 30th in EPA lost from turnovers. They're just kind of bad across the board in everything. It's been a little bit better with Carson than it was with McCarthy. But I don't know. they haven't run the ball very well at all. I don't really know.

Better at special teams. Back. Yeah. They're better at special teams. Ninth. Eagles are 25th and special teams devoid despite like a blocked punt for a touchdown and a block field goal to win the game.

Yeah, yeah. No, it's the kickoff returns have been just a disaster. Oh, I was going to ask one thing about the Eagles defense too. Ah. After you like, wow. Okay. How fortuitous. Yeah.

Two things. coming. Nikobi Dean. Yeah. Are we going to ask the same thing? Oh, interesting. Go on. Well, you were in the locker room, so I'm curious if you got the same feeling from being

there as I did from watching the very short videos that they post. Nicoby Dean, Jihad Campbell, and Zach Bond all talked about Niko Bedeen as if he's going to play this week on defense. Yeah, so that was what I was going to ask you is I... You were going to ask the same question. I was going to ask about Jihad Kamen. The Jihad Campbell side of this. Oh, the playing edge kind of thing?

Yeah, I know. Make some space for it. It's, I like making space for things. I don't know how to interpret Nacobie Dean's, like, accounting of these things because he's bullish on it. But I do think that we will see him integrate more into the defense progressively. Like, what I'm curious. He said they held me out on defense because there wasn't practice this week.

Yeah. In a way that implied that, like, he was going to be on favor. I think he would have been bullish on, like, playing. Okay. And I don't, and obviously that that didn't happen. Okay. So I think he is pushing for things. But when you ask him about like his role in the defense, he really doesn't like to get into it too much.

So I don't know. I agree with you. Like when you listen to him talk about it, it does seem like it will be, he'll have a role on defense. And I think he probably will what it looks like. I mean, it's going to hinge on Jihad Campbell's usage. Right. And I wanted to ask what you thought about Jihad Campbell on the edge. Yeah.

So Jihad Campbell has been doing the like rotating to the edge a lot. as the overhang in base where it changes the front from a 5-2 front to a 6-1 front. Could you do that in nickel and change it from and turn it into like a, well, no, if you have Nikobi Dean, Zach Bonn and him all out there in a different kind of base look where you go to a 5-2 front. Yeah. That's the only way you're going to get Nicobi-Deen on the field. Right.

Right. You need it to be like a four three base, which the Eagles never do. Right. Instead of a five two base. Or a three, three five, which we don't see much in the NFL. But that's kind of what I think that's kind of what I mean by... Three three five would like look like a five one like that penny. But then you have two linebackers playing his edges, right? You don't need to do that.

Right. Now, Vic Fangio is going to want to steal edge snaps. He's done that in the past by playing three defensive tackles and a single edge defender on the field. He did it a little bit in one of the games this year. I'm blanking on which one it was. I think it was the Tampa Gets. game. He did it like on five snaps or something. He did it 51 times last year. I know that. So we might see that, but that doesn't get a third linebacker on the field. Like you would,

you would need to do that in a scenario where you're essentially using Jahad Campbell as a real edge. Yeah. And then using the other two linebackers on the field at once. Jihad Campbell said he's excited to see Nikobie D and make plays on defense, which indicated to me like maybe he knows something. And Zach Bond talked about how it's easier to go from inside. to outside, then outside to inside, which why is he talking about that if that's not a process that's happening with with your head camp?

Now he's too small to play edge. I was going to say now that like, the Eagles are already getting pushed around. Yeah. Play edge rusher. Because it's like, to me it's like, oh, maybe you steal some early downs putting him out there,

but it's like, do you really want him at the point of attack that consistently against the run? On film, he looks okay, like knifing through a gap and like taking on a blocker in that situation and making a play, but he has not looked good actually on the edge. Like when he's been the edge

on those like six man lines like he's getting double teamed and pushed out of the way and teams are having plenty of success like running it outside those toss plays the teams have been running. The Vikings are going to run those as well. I'm not sure if like that's the best usage of of Jahad Campbell plus all this talk of how good he is in coverage

like do you want to take him out of that role and put him in a different role just to get to go beyond the field. Right. If the edge like room wasn't so thin right now and I don't know if it's going to get less thin soon, But, like, you know, I don't think this would even be a discussion. Yeah, it would not be a comment.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the thing. So, yeah. How about it, Nikobe Bean? It'd be one of the least inspired. You had so much time to think of it, too. That's all you could come up with. Who's going to return kickoffs, CJ?

It's a good question. Is Xavier Gibson going to play? Why is he on the roster? Why is he on the team? If you can't return kickoffs. I mean, he can return kickoffs. So let him do it. They haven't, I mean, everybody.

else can't catch the ball. He's like the one guy who's like ever successfully returned kickoffs, right? Yeah. Another thing like a schematic difference on kickoffs now is that very few teams are only putting one returner back there. Like Dallas is doing it because they really want Turpin to get the ball. So like he's back there and he's like willing to run to get the whole field. Most guys aren't fast enough to do that. Like you can't just put one guy back there, which gives the other team a choice of who to kick it to. So you basically need two guys who can who can return kicks. And the Eagles don't have any. So yeah. I'd also like to see. Britton Kevin Kevin Covey will turn puns but yeah the Britain Covey like this like the fact that he

hasn't been called up also surprised me um I mean like he's post injury and you know obviously didn't stick with the Rams but we've seen what he can do in the punt return game at least before the injury so yeah Fran's talking about how Gibson's been good at it but again like with this format you would just kick it to the other guy wouldn't you like who's good who's the who's the second guy going to be Shipley yeah I guess if it's Shipley and Gibson then you have two guys who hopefully can catch the ball you know all right All right. Good stuff, everybody.

Remember, we've got you covered all day long on Sunday with the kickoff show, the halftime show, and the postgame show with Jamie Lynch and Vinny Curry. Super Bowl champion. We'll hear from E.J. Smith. What are your travel plans? I'm flying out Saturday afternoon. Well, your arm's going to be tired. It's a bad dad joke. That's a really bad dad joke.

That's why he asked you, E. Just because you want to tell you. I want to know. I don't have very many plans outside of that. Okay. It'll be fun. I like a... Go to the mall.

I like a Minneapolis. I love a mall. I don't go to the mall. I hate the mall. What are you doing? I'm a suburban Philly kid. Like, I love the...

It's also not in downtown. No, it's not going to be near where you're staying. I'll find a way. This is... Why are you hating on malls? Mals are good? I don't have a problem with the mall in general. I mean, most malls at this point are pretty depressing.

That one's fine. I live there for a week. time of year, you go for a mall walk. It's a little cold outside. You just want to get some steps. If you never been to Minneapolis, go downtown. I can do both. These aren't usually... I'm like the most anti-mall person I know, so like I'm not even going to...

Like, I get depressed within six seconds of being in a mall, and I run out. Even if I really... Even if I really need something, I just, I literally scream and run out. All the commercialism of it? Is that what it does? No, just everything about it. I just stay... It's sterility. I don't like... I've talked before about how I don't like chains.

I don't like the kind of like, sterile corporate thing. Interface capitalism. Everything about a mall is like everything I don't like. So, yeah. I don't go to the mall to buy a lot of stuff. Especially in the city.

It makes no sense. Well, yeah, suburban, suburban boy over here. Unfortunately, malls have taken over Turkish culture. Like my cousin grew up in malls in Ankara, even though like it's a city that has

organic marketplaces, you know, like, and so the replacement of the organic old like merchants. Since you're wearing the Cliffy shirt, I will say that I think he would call you out on, you're hitting suburban too hard when really your boonies. I don't live in the boonies. It's funny that Cliff thinks I live in the boonies, but no, I don't.

Also, I didn't mention this yesterday. Cliff and my dad got into like a legitimate argument about where Cliff is from. What? Like, Dad, I think he knows where he's from. I like that. Was it like a philosophical argument or? I think it was like Cliff doesn't like to claim part of the area that he's from. Like, you know, like he's not from like a certain part of that town.

He's not from France part of that time. Yeah, he doesn't like to claim that part. Got it. Anyway, that'll do it for this episode. Thank you, Danes. Thank you, E.J. Thank you, Andrew. Thank you, Lindsay.

We will talk to you on Sunday for all of us here at P.H.O.I. Enjoy the weekend. And as always, we love you. Like the mayor.