PHLY Philadelphia Eagles Podcast - Philadelphia Eagles scouting combine recap: The latest whispers about Zack Baun & free agency

Episode Date: February 27, 2025

Zach Berman is back from Indianapolis, where he staked out every Eagles decision maker, tapped their phones and found out their deepest, darkest desires. What does that mean for Zack Baun’s future with the Eagles? And as Milton Williams, Josh Sweat and Mekhi Becton prepare to cash in, what do we think about the Eagles’ plans when the league year opens in two weeks? Join Zach and Bo Wulf for a roundup of all the fun in Indianapolis. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

And welcome to the P.H.O.I. Eagles podcast on a beautiful Thursday afternoon here in Philadelphia, Bo Wolf, Zach Berman, who is fresh off his trip to Indianapolis. Zach, you're buzzing. You're glowing. You're in your element. Yeah, I mean, I'm happy to be in studio with you. Talking Eagles, talking football. You know, there's a part of me that wishes I was there. But I'm thrilled. Yeah, but you got in. You got out. You don't want to overstay your welcome. You said this was your most productive trip ever. You've been to the combine for like 17 years. 12 combines.

I felt this was a productive one. Probably for or partly for the reason you mentioned. If you're not there as long, right? There's less idle time. You're squeezing things in. I came back with more stories than I anticipated, number one. Number two, I thought when I, perhaps because the Eagles had just won the Super Bowl.

Congratulations to the Eagles. And it was our first time speaking to Howie and Nick. There was just topical things there. There wasn't, you know, there was, I felt efficient on that day. You know, yesterday it happens to be that number one pick in the drafts from Philadelphia, right? And is an Eagles fan. And then. You need a fan to cool yourself down.

As I said on the show yesterday with Fran, I really enjoyed going to the women's form. I found that to be interesting and enlightening, you know, different anecdotes from different coaches that I heard there. And then you just, you see different people, you hear different things. You're sniffing it out. You're looking for some sco-scoopies. Well, I feel like I didn't come back with that firm piece of news that you wanted me to. Well, I don't know. But we'll see.

Maybe you have something that will lead to that. Exactly. Yeah, that's the hope. That's the hope. Okay. Well, very exciting. I want to hear a little bit more about it. Yeah, so we'll start as we, as was the thumbnail for today's show with Zach Bonn.

Oh, we'll start with Zach Bonn. Okay. I feel any differently than you did on Monday when you flew down to Indianapolis about the Eagles' intentions with Mr. Bonn. I think even more that they're going to try to keep them. I thought that before. But there is a sentiment out there that the Eagles, like I said, that, that, that, that the Eagles are not going to be able to. I think that sentiment has more to do with Eagles history at linebacker.

I think Vaughn is their number one priority, and I think they're going to push to get that deal finished. What do you think? I have a lot of thoughts on both of those things. First of all, relative to the Eagles history at the position, I talked about this a little bit with Fran on the draft show this week, which you can also watch on P.H.O.Y. YouTube and check out on your PHLY feed. I think a lot of the Eagles history at the position with not allocating prime resources to the position

is beyond just valuation of does linebacker matter relative to the defensive line and all the other important positions. It's also about projection. It's a position where it's difficult to project guys how they're going to fit into your scheme, right? there's a long list of first round linebackers who don't turn out to be any good, right? And even when you're going from team to team at that position, there's a bit of a guessing game there. The difference with Bonn, obviously, is that they have seen it. So you would be paying for a player who played at a defensive player of the year level in this defense for this coach with these teammates, right? So there isn't the projection there.

And so that's why I think they are more willing to, extend for him. And hopefully for their sake, the fact that he is 28 and he's only done it for one year, brings the market down a little bit. And it's, you know, 16 million a year. And I think, and I think that that is what they would be willing to do. Yeah, I think you have a good framing for what's different here. I also think that every year is unique and that when you compare it to past year, it's not been making this point now for two months, is that assuming Dary Slay is not back or even if he is back on a reduced number, this will be the, you the least amount of cap space

that the Eagles have allocated the cornerback, certainly in a long time, since Howie's returned in charge here, they'll probably have the least amount invested in defensive tackle that they've had in a long time. Actually, I mean, this year was pretty low, but they took on, there was a cap hit this year

for Fletcher Cox, right, that you won't have next year. So I look at this and I say that there are conditions in place that I think would allow them to pay, for a linebacker. I think if you can concentrate the guaranteed money in the two years, similar to what they did with Saquan Parkley,

and you get the age 29 and the age 28 and the age 29 season, that makes sense. And then the thing that we've harped on, and I think it's absolutely accurate, is they don't have the internal reinforcements that they have in other spots. That if they lost the detackle, if they lost an edge rusher,

they lost a right guard, I think they like what they, I think they like some of their internal options. They don't have those internal options at linebacker right now. Yeah, that's true. I think that's less of the important thing because I think they would be willing if they don't resign Zach Bond to do what they always do. And that's roll the dice on a couple, you know, $3 million options and hope for the best.

And I think there is reason to think that with Vic Fangio, you're going to get overperformance from those players. You're not going to get Zach Bond level performance. I think the difference here is that like for him to have played at that level and change the defense as much as he did. And then, you know, as we talked about, his, his versatility to allow Vic Fangio to not change personnel, but still be flipping between fronts. Like that's, that's a thing that would be very difficult to replace. It's why I think, like, I think Zach Bonn is their number one top priority in terms of like the order of operations over the next three weeks. I think, I think

that is the domino that will set up everything else that they do for a few reasons. One is because just thinking about the, like, how they want to play the comp pick game, he doesn't count against it because he's a re-sign. If he leaves, then you probably can afford to sign somebody else in the $14, $15 million range, because theoretically that would cancel out the bond signing, and you would still be getting probably a third-round compick from Milton Williams, right?

And then maybe a fourth from Josh Swett. They're not going to sign that many qualifying for agents, but if Bond leaves, all of a sudden maybe you're, you know, dipping your toe in the Trevin Merrick market or Osa O'Digizoo or something like that, right? If they keep on,

they're not going to be in the market for those guys because they're not going to want to risk canceling out the Milton Williams' comp pick. I think that's sort of the way they're thinking about it. And because I think they really want the player back. And like, do you take anything of Devin Jackson from the Inquirers at that event

with Zach Bond and he's like doing the Eagles chant? Like, do you think that get news on this front like next week that maybe they're they're yeah you and i we spoke about excuse me uh you and i spoke about how they can try to sign him before he hits the market because there is risk and once he hits the open market for the reason that um sometimes happens if if a team's targeting let's say Milton williams and they don't get Milton Williams and they all of a sudden have more money they're flush with more money than they thought then you can some teams would would then say all right let's let's pay a million more, two million more to this target than they originally valued him at.

And the Eagles have walkway numbers for every player. So it would behoove the Eagles to try to come to an agreement before he hits the open market. Having covered Howie as long as you have, do you think that he is giving them some kind of ultimatum? Like we will go high to this number. Yeah. But if we take it to Sunday, like, you know, we're out, something like that. Good question.

I don't I think they would probably Because with the player from your own team You might not want to take it to for the reasons you're saying Because if you're waiting on bond Then all of a sudden maybe you lose out on what you're playing Yeah that's what you probably say is But if you're born you're so close to getting to the open market Don't you want to see what the you know

You probably say that this this offer might not be there So it opens at what noon that Monday Yeah New one week from Monday we'll be live Yeah, so this offer might not be there at 3 p.m. Monday because we need to act accordingly. For the reason you mentioned, you need to turn that money somewhere else. Oh, breaking news. Thank you to Tyler for giving us this information.

This will help me not have to write this player up for the top 100 Eagles free agents. Trey Smith, the Chiefs right guard getting the franchise tag at over $23 million for guards. That's a hefty cost. But there you go. One player is worth it. A player who I think would have been in that, like probably not a target for the Eagles, but like if they don't sign Bonn,

would they then be willing to sign him? Probably not. No, but it's also, it's money that someone's not spending on Trey Smith. Now, so I don't think the bears would have been in the Zach Bond market, obviously, because they have T.J. Edwards, Tremaine admins. Yeah, which eagle do you think the bears

are going to sign in the first 20 minutes of free agency this year? I'm a Kai Bechtin if I had to think of one. That's a good question. Yeah, I'm expecting Bond to be the priority, but I think your framing's terrific, and I think it actually ties in something else that I wanted to address here,

which was I've gotten a number of questions about what did Howie mean by asking for patients. And unconventional. Yeah, so, well, the patients part... Two separate things? Yeah, the patient's part is, is I think it's important because you

unintentionally just hit it on the head in that I think there's Tell me what's unintentional. It might have been intentional. It might have been intentional. Howie understands there's excitement from the fan base about Howie season, right? You get the free agency like

how he's going to do magic, how he's going to work magic. But the first week of free agency very well might be the Eagles lose player X player Y, player Z. and they don't add anyone of like significance. And if you remember even the year,

actually it's the last time the owners meetings was in Palm Beach, but the 2022 offseason, the Eagles weren't very active the first week. And like the fans were up in arms and the Eagles were doing this like behind the scenes campaign that be patient here. Guys, we got to get Kwez Watkins as targets. Yeah, but also like, hey,

you know, the player acquisition season doesn't end right now. And then draft day, they trade for A.J. Brown, right? And there were other moves that they did thereafter. C.J. Garner Johnson was acquired the end of the year. So I think when Howie makes that point, I think what he's really trying to reinforce the fans is when we do our show next week, that Monday, we'll be talking about them losing guys. We won't be talking. It won't be like, oh my God, Howie signed this player. And if they sign a player, it's probably, like you mentioned, the $1 million, $2 million lottery ticket type.

Yeah, I think they will, I would not be surprised. If they keep bond, I wouldn't be surprised if they add somebody close to $10 million or so, somebody like Azizzo Jalari or somebody like that. But I think you're right. I'm not sure about that, but okay. I'm not saying they will. But if you keep bond and then that is offsetting like a Bechtin contract or something, you're still going to get a couple big compics. It's why I think that if they're going to make a big splash, it's much more likely to come via trade.

Sure, exactly. I think that's definitely possible. And for the things you're saying, like, yeah, that period is often later in the offseason. And because I think they're going to be playing this compact game, I think there's a good chance they're earmarking, okay, we're going to have a future third to trade next August, like they did for Johan Dotson.

Like, maybe that's going to be our big ticket item. And you're absolutely right. And in addition to that, it could be a Bechtin situation like last year where they, so you do your top 100 list. And there might be 15 players on there who are lingering after the draft, right? And the Eagles might be more active then when it doesn't affect your conflict formula, when you have a better sense of what your roster is post-draft. And they could look for some of those value-free agents that time of year, which obviously they did four Becht in last year.

and they've done that in the past looking for guys in May in June and how he would bring up to you. They signed Ligarrett Blunt in May, right? So it could be a situation where there are players like what Bechton did last year who were hanging around seeing what holes there are after the draft. I was talking to someone this week who was trying to understand the Bechtin situation. And I said had the Eagles drafted an offensive lineman in the first two rounds like they plan. or like they thought they would, I doubt they would have signed back to him. For sure.

So that's, so it could very well be that, that type of situation where someone's lingering on the market and it doesn't affect your compact formula and that, that guy is more of a path to playing time. It's also, I mean, it's not a great class of free agents, especially at the top. So it's, there aren't a lot of guys that they would be willing to, to wait in those waters for, to begin with. Yeah, what did you make of the unconventional part of the comment from Howie Roseman? So the unconventional part of it, a few things there. I think not being aggressive in signing and acquiring players. Number one, I think like letting good players at priority positions walk,

you know, Milton Williams being an example. You gave, it was a great thought exercise. When was the last good free agent that the Eagles lost, especially a guy they drafted in the prime of their career. Like Milton Williams, the only one you can think of is probably Jordan Hicks or T.J. Edwards. Yeah, I think Jordan Hicks is probably best answer. Yeah, and that's a different position. When was the last time they led a good defense alignment?

Right. Homegrown defensive or offensive linemen? Exactly. Unlikely. So it'll look unconventional. Isaac Siamalu maybe, but he was a little older. And that was like his third contract. Exactly.

So that's what I look at in terms of the unconventional. Yeah, the status quo part of it or that it will kind of be against conventional wisdom. That's my read on it. because Howie, there was a follow-up question there. I know a lot of fans might have watched the press conference, but this was off to the side. There was a follow-up question, what do you mean by different? And how he said maybe he didn't frame it correctly.

He said, and this was when he used the quote, fans won't have to change their jerseys, or they won't have to get new jerseys, but we're going to lose players. It's not going to be the same team. And Howie made another reference to the fact that young players are really going to have to step in and play.

Similar to what he said last year. But when I hear that, what I mean, my interpretation is Moro Ojima, Jalox Hunt, these guys are going to emerge into bigger roles. Is that he talked about that layer cake and that they're going to lose a layer from the layer cake and a layer has to step up. Okay.

Man using desserts after your own heart. Yeah, well, he's already used the ice cream analogy. A quick thing, by the way, I have. A piece up on all phtly.com now. Becoming Daug. Now's the time. I caught up with Howie one-on-one. Actually, if you were watching our show, which I hope you were.

And I went and I sprinted off. Yes. Like a man returning a valet. That is how I sprinted then. Yes. I did not get a chance to talk to Howie Super Bowl night. You know, I exchanged pleasantries, but didn't get a chance to interview him Super Bowl night. and I haven't interviewed him since then.

And there were certain things that I wanted to ask him about, including, you know, we saw him dancing. You were that you took video of it, and Howie's locker room demeanor decorum was different this time than the first Super Bowl. And I know comparison is a thief of joy, but comparisons also a healthy method. You know, it's a way to kind of see whether there's change,

whether there's growth, and how he pointed to like the release, It was the framing that was less used about the parade and that you discussed, like the relief of winning that first one. And he said there was joy, but there was so much relief. And then he said here he was able to let loose a little bit, like appreciating how hard it is to get there. And I think there wasn't like that monkey off the back feeling for the second Super Bowl. And he said in your story, like if he thinks about the big picture success, it's more about having gone to the playoffs as many times as they have. been to three Super Bowls as opposed to

overweighing the result of the one big game. Exactly. Because I said to him if like the first one was vindication, is this one validation for you? And he did. VV. Yeah. And he did not like that framing because he's like,

validation for me is making the playoffs, you know, seven of eight years. Okay. He says you can have one, you can have one bad year and people say you're a bad GM. And I was like to, I was like,

no, that doesn't happen. Does it? He kind of laughed at that one, right? But then he's kind of a shot at ourselves. Yeah, I understand. Yeah. And then he said, you can have one good year.

That doesn't make you a good GM. He thinks the seven of eight years, he's particularly proud of that. As he should be. Yep. All right. Let's take a quick break to hear from our sponsors. More on the other side with Mr. Combine. Don't say that.

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What's the talk? A lot of poop yourself conversation, it seems like. I miss the genesis of this, but I think that's a different rate. Look at that smile. Unbelievable. A lot of comments about your baby voice. My baby voice? The Mark Murphy voice.

What about? People were here. Would you... That was the initial question. Gotcha. Would you poop yourself to assure victory in a race? I mean, what are the stakes of the race? The answer is no.

I would not. I mean, if I get a million dollars for winning the race, then yes. Okay. Yeah. But just to win a race, no. Okay. What about Mark Murphy? No, I was reading the YouTube comments and Discord.

I thought you're supposed to stop reading as much of the YouTube comments. No, that wasn't what it was about. So, yeah. But the Discord, a lot of people liked your Mark Murphy impression. Well, I didn't do anything. It was a nice to have on the show. Or the dramatic reading. It was nice to have him on the show.

I appreciate him spending the time. That and then I think it was, was it the first time people heard your Josh Harris voice? That guy. Debuted Josh Harris's voice for the first time. I don't remember how it sounds, but. Well, people like that. Okay. Some minor news on the Eagles coaching front, Zach.

Yeah, so well, there's two pieces of information here. First, credit to our friend Elliott Shore Parks reported that Greg Austin is returning to the Eagle staff. Greg Austin was here during the Chip, Hellie era, then went to Central Florida, Nebraska. He was following Scott Frost around. My guess is he'll be assistant offensive line coach taking over for T.J. Pagnetti. Yeah, that's, that's, that's my guess. Did overlap for a couple years with Cam Juergens in Nebraska.

Oh, okay. Nice, good nugget there. There you go. And then is it, this was according to Syracuse 24-7. They said that the Eagles interviewed. is it Nunzio Capanelli? Am I pronouncing it correctly? You tell me.

You're the Syracuse, man. Well, I've known of him. He was the interim coach, actually, two years ago, and he was actually... I used to write for the Star-Ledger. I don't know if I've ever mentioned that. But I know a lot about North Jersey High School football. Sure.

And that family is, like, royalty in North Jersey. So he is the quarterback's coach for Syracuse, and they had a great pay. passing offense. Now, I got to give credit, Jeff Nixon is their O'Cordinator. I thought Jeff Nixon did a really good job. But Nunziio worked with Kyle McCord, who I think I might like a little more than Fran does, admittedly. I think Anthony and I like him probably more than Fran does. Well, I know why you like him. Because he's from Philly. Yeah. And, well, no, I mean, I'll defend Kyle McCord quickly here, okay? He, there was this idea that he's at Ohio,

State, he's playing with Marvin Harrison Jr., they should be better. He was kind of scapegoated at Ohio State. He goes to Syracuse, which doesn't have the talent of Ohio State, and he leads the country in passing. And he's like, now the offense has something to do with it, but he really improved. He said he, I read a lot of articles on him. He was in a better mental state. He was kind of playing free.

But he was, I thought he was good last year. Now, Fran evaluates it more from like a prospect perspective. you know, Fran's probably looking forward for different things. I thought he played well. He was moving the ball well. He was making good throws. So I was impressed with him last year. Okay.

Any other news on the quarterback coach interview front? Yeah. So Nick Siriani said that they need to interview, or I'm sorry, that they need to hire a quarterback's coach and two quality control coaches. So that would indicate that they hire the assistant offensive line coach, which would be Greg Austin. We'll see.

Not Austin and Greg. Not Austin, Greg. So there's no update there. I genuinely believe that that search is still going on as was reported, you know, the, it would make sense for them to look at the college ranks. I don't know who else they've interviewed for that job, but. For a quarterback's coach? Yes.

I have a couple names, actually. Okay, let's hear. Alessandro del Piero and Roberto Benini. Am I supposed to do? Ha, ha, ha, ha, or who are they? Or what's the appropriate response? good reporting okay

where does Alessandro work Verona okay so because they're Italian okay I see what you did there they have

a shout out to the Connor Orr they have a lot of coaches of Italian descent on their staff I believe it's actually Connor Orzo

no it's just Connor ORR OR Prideus Grantin I'm saying away from the Italian thing. But Nunzio, I do know from talking to people in Syracuse that he's very well regarded in that program. He survived a coaching change, which is often a good sign.

When there's a regime change and they keep you on, he was, I believe he was the tight ends coach maybe, and then he moved the quarterback's coach or something of that nature. His brother, Anthony, is the new dec Coordinator with the Jaguars, came over from the Packers last year. Before that was with the Dolphins. Some people might remember him from Hard Knocks in season.

He was actually on Vic Fangio's staff in Miami. So if you're looking for kind of a connection with the Eagles, that might be a connection with the Eagles. That makes sense. But he's from a very prominent North Jersey high school coaching family. Yes. And then I think as people are getting a hang of in the chat, maybe in order to comply by the Rooney Rule they have to interview Mario Bellatelli.

Trying to. Mario Ballot. Is that the soccer player? Yes. Okay. I see what you did there. Okay. You would have.

Who's the one from? Who am I thinking of? Who's the one? Who's the founder of Edoy? Isn't that a better? Mario Batali? Yeah. Okay.

That's what I thought you were referring to. He's canceled. Okay. So that's why I was like, what does that have to do with the Rooney role? So, okay. Yeah. Um, boy, would you have, would you have hated the day that I had yesterday? Not, no, no, I think you would. Oh, is this the car experience?

Yeah, okay. Listen, I am not, I am not, uh, searching for efficiency with every minute of my day, as you are, but I certainly don't like just sitting around for six hours in the middle of the day. Oh, yeah. Just forever. Like enough. Can we move on with this process? Why is there so much lying involved. Why are like, oh, well, this is the best we can do? No, it's not. I know it's not the best you can do. Like, why are we going to do this dance? And like, it's just, it's such a pain in the ass. Anyway, we had to get at a trade in my lease for a new one because we

need a third row with the baby on the way, but just a, just a pain in the ass. So how are you as a negotiator? I am not that good of a negotiator because I don't have the patience. Okay. But I was like, their initial proposal, I was like, okay, I'm good. I'm leaving. Like, I don't, this is, I don't even want to start here. Yes. Like, okay, no, no, no, let me, let me talk to the boss.

And then it's like, okay, let me talk to the boss. And then somebody else comes in. It's like, all right, let me figure this out. It's just like, stop. Like, why this entire industry just built upon lies? It's so ridiculous. Anyway. Yeah, that's, that's tough.

That's tough. But are you happy with the end result? I'm fine with the end result. Okay. Yeah. It was not the ideal end result, but that's okay. Plus the car that I really was coming to get, it was had listed on their website,

but it wasn't there anymore. A little bait and switch. Yeah. How do you like the third row? Well, I haven't really. I mean, heavier to drive? A little bit. Not really, yeah.

You see, parallel parking in that's going to be tough. Now, if you're a skilled parallel parker. Sure. But no, you just, it's harder to find spaces that accommodate cars of that size. Yeah, the car itself is not that much bigger. I just like, whatever for next year, for three years from now,

I need a sicko who works in a dealership so we can, I can just get away from all the rigmarole. That's what I'm, that one, I want to take advantage. Oh, okay. At some point. I don't like, can we just work this out ahead of time so we can, I can be there for an hour instead of six? You know what we need, if I'm being honest here.

A sponsor? Yes. A sponsor. I agree. Let's wet the beak a little here, right? Isn't that the expression? I agree. Yeah.

Hey, we, yeah. Let's go. We'll do your ad reads, but we'll give firsthand experience what it's like to drive your car. Yeah. Yeah, this is perfect sponsorship territory. So bad. I agree. I know one place I'm not going to ask a sponsor.

Anyway. Okay. Uh, yeah, what were your other highlights from the week? So, regarding... Tell us about dinner. About dinner, okay. With Cosell. Oh, yeah, all right.

I'm happy to talk about that. Oh, was there another dinner? Who was the other dinner with? Last night, I, I had dinner with two Philadelphia reporters. Um, and we, we talk shop. Um, I'm gonna guess. It was a little bit of a lighter crew this year. It was a much lighter crew.

Actually, the Eagles commented on that. It was the lightest crew. there's been in maybe like two dozen plus years. Was it? Probably because of the Super Bowl. I think a lot of places either they used up a lot of their Super Bowl budget or there are people who are traveling recreationally and it was just too tight to come to the Super Bowl.

But yeah, there were only like seven Eagles reporters there, which there have been, you know, 15 at times. I'm going to guess your dinner was with Elliot and Zengaro. No, Elia had left. Okay. So Zangero and Martin Frank. No, I, no, unfortunately not. No. Olivia.

No, Olivia had left as well. McLean. Really? Yeah. I didn't think he would slum it with you. Wow. I'm insulted by that. Jeff's a good friend of mine.

We've worked together for him. I know he is, but usually he's out and about trying to get other stuff done for those meals. I'm surprised. Wow. It's not a you thing. It's a Jeff thing. He said he went slum it with you. I didn't know I was slumming your territory.

It was great. He sees you every day. Usually he's using these opportunities to get to meet with other people. All right. I see that. We had great conversation. But no, the, where'd you go?

To one of your favorite places. Do do, do, do, do, do, do, do. What's one of your favorite places in Indie? we've been there the airport you're really just like indie we've been there you and I have been there

two times oh the place that's outside of downtown yeah yeah like that place blue beard yeah great meal I do like that place great meal although I had the pasta a little garlicky and you're self-conscious

the rest of the night right so brush the teeth a few times yeah it's coming out of your pores though yeah that's that's the problem but it was it was good pasta in any event. Dinner.

Are people interested in this? Yes. Okay. Dinner on what night? Was it Tuesday night? Fran, who by the way, Fran is awesome. People say I butter him up too much on the show,

but I'm happy to do it. Like his draft stuff's outstanding. He's really flourishing. Who is people? Who's people? Yeah. People are like, you got to chill it with Fran.

Three people say. that and you think it's everybody? Don't take everything, every little comment so hard. I know, but look, I'm excited for Fran's work, but Fran, in addition to being created his job, just a great guy too. And he texts me and he says,

he says, you know, we have this spot open for dinner, but I'm just warning you, it's like, it's heavy prospect home. Sure. And I'm like, I love the draft. This is a treat for me. So as we mentioned on the show, I was there with Ben Fennell.

Greg Cassell, Dane Bruegler, and Fran. Now, I got... How much Nick Scrotum talk did you guys do? Nick Scorton did not come up. Okay. Didn't did not come up. But I think it's like this test to see, you know, it's like an initiation or a job interview where they want to see how it's like, have you done Martinez yet?

You know, and Martinez, of course, just a right. running back from Miami, right? Who's not like a first three round back, right? If you've done Martinez by now, you're really in the thick of the draft rep, right? And then it's not enough like, I say this like not just with like respect with admiration. Okay.

And this is almost even like a shot at it. It's not like a shot at me, but like an unintentional shot at me. You know, I interpret it as a shot. I shouldn't say it as a shot. but it just shows that there's levels to this, right? It's, there's a difference between watching someone and doing someone

to use the draft terminology. Yeah. Okay, because like you talk about a player, yeah, I've watched him, but I haven't done him yet, right?

So that's, that's what comes out. That's, that's what you hear. So all these guys, I've watched, right? I mean,

I, I, big college football fan as it is. You know, I, I searched the YouTube stuff, but I'm not, doing like the three-game scouting report that you would do if it's like an official

You're an happily married man. But that's, but so the distinction between so you, a player comes up, he said, I've watched him but I haven't done him yet. That's, and that expression was said probably five, six times at the dinner table. Who was the alpha at the table? Oh, I wouldn't even say there was an alpha. I wouldn't say there was an alpha. It was just, there was this mutual respect and this like interloper on the side.

You know, because, but I mean, they were all very nice. And I have admiration for all of them, respect for all of them. But it was, yeah, I was very much the interloper. Like one of us was not like the others. And it was, you know, and like, like Ben is as nice as could be. Ben's asking me, you know, about what's the. season like for you this time of year and different stuff about the you know about the eagles like he was he was so nice engaging me in conversation and i want to say ben you're the man respectfully

i'm okay listening here you know like you know i i think he might have wanted like make me feel included which was nice but i'm almost cool listening to these guys uh and i've learned so much about these prospects uh and some of the the stuff might have confirmed what i saw on certain players some of it they might have it might have changed away i've viewed certain players where i have to i have to go back to it where i feel good about myself in this dinner is um is if they if they're bringing someone up and a big thing with with like uh people in football is uh they don't have sometimes the same affinity for knowing people's names that i do right so it's not like 45 on yes like have you done Have you done the, you know, Missouri tackle yet, right?

Or that kind, you know, or have you done the tennis, you know, you pick player, school player, you know, school position? And I'm like, or they're talking about, do you remember that guy that they drafted a few years ago from UCLA? And it's like, I know that name, right? And I'm firing away at that. So my contribution to the Dayton Jones. Dayton Jones from UCLA, defensive line, man, remember him? Yeah, that's why I said him. Okay, yes.

And then, yeah, or different like running backs that, who is that back that this team had in camp? So my contribution can be like, I have a pretty good memory about that stuff. So that's where I was adding to the table. Okay, very nice. Take a quick break and find out about what you can add to your proverbial table. And that would be rocket money because if I know you like I think I do, I know that you can't every single subscription that you have. I can't name all of mine, and I am not alone. Over 74% of people have subscriptions they've forgotten about. With Rocket Money, I don't have to

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which which is totally cool with me right fran went to the pacer's game without you that's oh i think he had a crew he was going with right uh but i bring this up as a way of saying trouble in the ranks No, not at all. I was following that Pacers game last night because if I wanted to make a bet on the game, I would have gone to one place. And that's Bet365. Okay, Bet365 is 90 million users worldwide.

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is that if you are a new customer breaking news from Bet365, new customers now get $150 in bonus bets when you bet $5, win or lose, sign up, use the code P.H.L.I. 365, deposit $10 and place a bet for $5 to get $150 in bonus bets if your bet wins or loses. Bonus bets can be used on spreads, totals, player props, futures, and more. Whatever that moment, it's never ordinary at bet 365. Must be 21 or older and physically located in PA. If you or someone you know has a gambling problem and wants help, call 1-800 gambler. I had a few questions for you based off of Halley. Can I ask you that? Or did you have more

stuff you want? No, go ahead. Okay. Because I always love having these conversations with you. And the nature of the talk back the other day was it was more kind of me. You couldn't see me. I couldn't see you, but I was unloading notes. We weren't kind of going back and forth. I'm curious, something I paid more to, that I brought up more than the other people in that scrum was how we making a point about the 26 and 27 extensions and how everything that they do this year. has to have those off-season

in mind. Do you think this is a real thing? Do you think this is just kind of a narrative he's creating? I mean, if you look at it, Gellan Carter and Owen Smith, and then it's crazy to think that you're already talking about rookie extensions,

but Quinnion, Mitchell Cooper, the Gene would be eligible the following year for contract extensions. And if these are players that you deem as like, you know, major extension players, does that factor into your thinking at all.

I think he's probably overstating that. Okay. I think it would mean you're more likely to like sign somebody to a short-term deal, I guess, right? Or front load of money, but I don't think that they're going to be, I don't think that they're going to be signing someone to, I don't think they're going to sign any external free agent to a deal that has more than two years of guaranteed money, assuming that they bring Zach Bond back. Yes.

If they don't, then maybe there's one player like that. But I think that might be part of it. Yeah, that makes a little bit of sense. What about you? Look, they've drafted better than they have in some past years now.

And here's the thing. They're not going to continue to draft at that same way. Exactly. They have to price that in. Exactly. Yeah. But as I said, I am expecting this time next year,

Jalen Carter, to become maybe the highest paid defensive player in football, right? They'll act quickly on that. There was this other quote that I've probably given more helium too. Shout out to Fran than some others. And because I thought this was... To be fair, Fran did not invent helium.

I know. It comes up in baseball a lot too. Yeah, I think it was invented before sports, actually. No, I know, but baseball drafting, there's two, you hear helium and you hear proximity. Are two things that come up a lot in baseball drafts. This quote from Howley, because he basically kind of outlined what, what, what, their thoughts were and I always like this and maybe it's it's it's an easy narrative after after the fact but I actually think he's pretty honest here he said we felt like the opportunity was in last year's

free agency to sign some guys who can make a difference for our team knowing that this year was going to be mostly maintenance and trying to get guys back obviously the play of a bunch of these guys is now affecting some of our decisions and I ask you this for two things because he he spoke about how they looked at last year's free agency class and this year's free agency class. And sometimes I think that can be a stretch because you never know what a class is going to look like. You don't know how players are going to materialize. I remember Howley using that point one time about the quarterback draft class. And like the one that he was saying wasn't as strong was to Patrick Mahomes class, right? So you you never know how that materializes. But from a strategy

perspective, it is true. Last year, Sequin Barclay, Bryce Huff, C.J. Garner, John, between those three. I mean, those are not as much, CJ, but if we include them in there, those are three, you know, decent contracts that they sign from the outside. And so do you think this was their plan that last year was going to be the spending year?

This year, even if the Eagles were, let's say they went 11 and 6 this year and were out quickly, that this still would have been the way they operated this offseason? I think mostly, yes. I think whether that was a correct projection or not, I think that that's probably right.

But if Jalen Carter had a bad year and Quignan-Mitchell and Cooper Jean didn't look so good, then he might think differently, right? He wouldn't have to plan for those extensions. And then how he... Sorry, I didn't give you too much there. Howie made a few references to the amount of players that they... And he was kind of talking about this in comparison to

the last time they were in the Super Bowl, but he brought this up on a few of occasions, the amount of like in their prime players that they have right now that there's a clear I think there's like 20 there's there's there's guys 27 28 29 years old that do you think there's a feeling in that building that they need to capitalize right now on this window when you have a j brown when you have sequin barclay because look this roster you know we we talked about the 27 extensions like this roster is going to look different in in 27 when you have the amount of start players that they have or high-profile players that that they have in this age group put Zach Bonn in there too right the Eagles have this the these two years or you're probably looking at Sequin AJ you know maybe Zach Vaughan and you're trying to take advantage of the years from those guys lane Johnson won't be here two years from now presumably yeah I think well listen

I don't think it's ever in how he's nature to not try to win a Super Bowl right so yeah I think he would like to take advantage of this young in their prime core that they have. But I don't think that that unless they're like truly rebuilding. I don't think it's going to be super different from him from an operational standpoint. I think he's going to be paranoid about who is available around the league. Who can he add that makes sense for their timeline? And I think he's going to be aggressive. It just may be the time when he is aggressive is a little bit different than the first week of free agency.

Sure. You're right about that. Now, the Miles Garrett of this, and this was the quote that I referred to, but at the time I hadn't transcribed it when you and I spoke, when he agreed with the parameters that I was putting out there regarding when they trade for first round picks, but I'm sorry, when they trade first round picks for high profile players, but he said all those things have to match up. And so we look at those. There's a lot of attractive items out there. And we spend a lot of time talking about every position and every good player and we're selfish. We want everyone, but at the end of the day, it's just not the position we're in right now. Do you think Howie is being honest there that he's, this is his, his way of saying, hey, guys, cool off. We're not going to go trade for Miles Garrett. Or do you think this is him just kind of keeping distance on, on this concept? Yeah, I think that's probably more public negotiation than anything. I mean, I do think that generally speaking,

GM's talking at the combine is the time when they lie the most. Agreed with that. Right? Like, I think it is the lowest percentage of truth that you ever hear from that. I always say I prefer the owner's meetings to the combine for that exact reason. The combine, there's actual substantial stuff. I'm sorry, the owners meetings are substantial stuff. I remember talking to an editor at a former employer being like,

if you have to send me to one, send me to the owners meetings because I'm getting real stuff there. the combine, you're getting just a lot of like conjecture. Well, yeah, and it's also always the difference between, you know, just because how he says the Eagles are not going to do something, does not mean that they're not going to say something. So don't report that the Eagles are not going to do this. That's what the GM is saying. But I also, I mean, I think it is more likely that they don't trade for Miles Garrett

than it is that they do. The one thing that, you know, the report I saw about like, well, you know, if the commanders are involved in the Miles Garrett sweepstakes, that's going to make the eagles more likely to get involved. And maybe that'll push them over. Like, that's not how they operate. No, not at that is not going to be a factor. It's not going to be like Andrew Bears like, well, hey, you know,

I got Adam Peters on the other line. Like you want to go and actually, no, it's not. That's not the problem. Agree with you. They set a price, right? Yeah. I agree with you there. Which, yeah, I saw that was a thing that was making the rounds.

I don't really agree with that. What did you, speaking of things making the rounds, did you have a chance to see the fist, Cuffs at Starbucks? I did not. Excuse me. I don't know where this is coming from. I did not.

I saw that report actually when who texted it to us last night. And I got to text at like four in the morning from Tony Buns about it. But it was there was someone else who texted us before that. Yeah, you and I were on a text last last night. Maybe it was Fran. I don't know. But no, I did not. I know I did.

If you had to pick a fight with any. other NFL reporter at a Starbucks at the J.W. Marriott, who would it be? I'm a lover, not a fighter, man. I'm not, I'm not fighting. I mean, I'm not going to win a fight. Okay, if you had to kiss another. Yeah, I'm not doing that either. But I would say that if there's, if there's someone who had to write a sternly worded email to another reporter? Reporter, who would it be? But you write it at the Starbucks. I plead the fifth. Okay, I think I know the answer.

I plead the fit. Yes. But no, man, that, look, if I can butter you up here, the best. A lot of butter on this episode. The best story on that Starbucks was written by Bo Wolf. And it was a great idea. But if you were that, you know, I passed by that Starbucks a few times on this trip.

And man, that thing is an epicenter to the point that I should have taken this, this photo that they have the video board of the orders. Yeah. Okay? Because now they're... You can do the mobile ordering now. You can do the in-person order. And they have if you're, like, if it's, if you've ordered it, if they're preparing it,

and then if it's finished. And at one point, there was, it was, they had to flash the screen like three times to get all the names there. Oh. It was crazy. one of my takeaways from that piece was just how impressive that staff was I mean they were just churning stuff out

oh man but yeah so what both referring to if you haven't seen is the report that Ian Rapaport and Jordan Schultz got into it I mean the scene of of Jordan Schultz getting into a fight out of Starbucks

I mean what could be better than that I'm like we he's his own person right I see what what you're saying he's his own person. Yeah, I understand he is a human being, but it's still very funny. But, um, man, I'm surprised he didn't pull rank and say, get out of my, you're not allowed

in here. Yeah. I, I would just say he can have a friendly, like, you have a friendly conversation. You can even have a spirited conversation. It doesn't need to get intense. I think a good point from the chat. You calling yourself a lover feels a little disingenuous since you won't even tell them that you love them.

Okay, I was using the phrase. I'm not looking to fight anybody. You never get in a fight, you know you can't win. So I wouldn't be able to win that fight. Okay. What else is going on? I mean, there's a lot I can talk to you about. I don't know.

Well, yeah, I want to hear about your trip. I want to hear more about the Whispers. What was the most interesting sighting you had at one of the morning somewhere? The most interesting. You see, this is the challenge for me. Like don't consider that stuff, like on the record, per se. Okay. Did you hear anything that was interesting to you?

Leaguewide or Eagles? Yeah. So this, look, there's a lot of like Stafford conversation, which I'm actually not as into as as maybe I feel like I should be. I always try to, like if I was a national reporter, what would the biggest story be? I always think that, right? the Stafford thing is I feel like there's such

like leverage play from like both sides here on on that you know if you hear well if Stafford doesn't come back at the ramps number they're going to pivot here and you hear Stafford has this market and that market and that market there's a lot of people curious about Stafford what what comes up a lot is like man this is such a bad draft you know when it when people talk about the prospects the question that a lot of out-of-town people,

whether it's people with different teams or different or with the media, ask about the Super Bowl, like about this Eagles team, you know, you know, how did Howie do it? I got a lot of those questions. I didn't get a lot of how to Nick do it. I got a lot of how to Howie do it, right?

But, you know, I will say this, And this speaks to the loyalty that Nick might engender is that people who used to work for the Eagles were commenting how good they feel for Nick because I do think whether it's fair or unfair, there is this perception that Nick takes a lot of heat in the city. So there were people who felt genuinely good for Nick. But no, the, as,

As far as like Eagles moves, when I would bring up Dallas Goddard to people, people were surprised by that, which again, I think that there has to be a decision made on Goddard. That's not a name that there was a lot of buzz out there for. People were asking about Milton Williams's market and Josh Sweat's market. I got questions like, is Milton that good? And I'm like, yeah, I think Milton's that good. But, and then there were questions about Bonn. But overall, yeah, a lot of, you know, man, you probably had no rest.

Like in between, you know, the Super Bowl was like a week ago. You got that. And how was this run? Did you see it coming? And then, boy, is Sequin, is Sequin that good? And I'm like, yeah, Sequin's that good. But no, not as much like of the gossip variety. you know, I want to know about, I ask people about Patuo.

You know, am I pronouncing it poorly? I think you're doing fine. Patulow. Well, that was weird. Patulow. Patulow. That's what I'm saying. I listen back to it.

I'm trying to figure out what I, I know there's certain pronunciations I don't do well. You're doing fine. Okay. Patulow. It was pretty good. Yeah, people who've worked with him in the past have commented the same types of like he's very organized. He was close with Shane. I heard that. So I'm curious about that. Okay. Then we have a super chat to get to from Shea who says, have y'all watched Fran do someone?

I actually, I have sat on the proverbial cuck chair in a film room with Fran and I have watched him do someone. Yeah. We haven't. By the way, I don't want to hold you up here, but I did want to ask you your opinion on the NFLPA survey. His friend and I spoke about it. And you have real keen insight to the organization, to the building, to the survey. And I do want to reinforce, I said this yesterday on the show, because someone had told me before I came on that the survey was done before the season. Yeah.

Okay. And I got another confirmation on that. So I don't know if that would have changed anything. But, you know, I do think that. I'd probably change like Nick's ranking. Well, actually Nick was pretty high. It was like 13th or something like that, right? It was like an A-minus, but it was like 16th or something like that.

Yeah. Yeah. Thank you for watching on streaming on Fast, by the way. Check out the rest of this episode on all-pHLY.com. No, but I bring that up because the team travel this year. Like Brazil, I know they flew differently than they did before, but I don't know about the other flights. Yeah, I think my, my general takeaway from it is, like,

I think it is a useful tool for specific purposes. Like, the Eagles apparently don't do a good enough job with, like, child care during the game. Like, that stuff matters, and there are little things that they can address. And with franchises that are, like, always at the bottom, like the Cardinals or whatever, like, it's good to publicly shame them. I do think that from like a what really matters or what is changeable standpoint,

like I don't think the Eagles being towards the bottom in locker room size is going to really make any kind of material difference in attracting free agents or their opinion around the league and how well they treat players. I'm the facilities guy. Yeah. Yeah. Like I mean, listen, I think it's good information to get. But I don't think that it in and of itself is an accurate sense.

snapshot of like how the eagle stand as an organization relative to the rest of the league in terms of like just in terms of what they do for their players i agree and i think that some of those as as friend and i discussed excuse me as friend and i discussed some of those had to do with just the restrictions of their facility and that's very real and i mean if i if i talk to people in the organization and they try pushing back on that i would say like I've been in other locker rooms. The Eagles locker room is much smaller than other locker rooms. That's the and as I said yesterday it was built for a different era of football. And when I say different era of football, what I mean is there were just fewer players under

contract. I use the example all the time. Brian Dawkins had two lockers. Now there's not enough lockers for everyone on the roster. So that's that's a very real thing. But the Eagles are are also limited as far as I... I don't think that that is exactly... I mean, they still had 90-man rosters in the off-season, right? Like, it's just about like, it's about the footprint

that they're allowed to have in that building. Well, yeah, but there's, no, at the time, though, there were nine, there were eight practice squad players. I know, during, I know. I understand what you're saying, but I don't think that really, that has changed the size of the locker room.

Oh, it definitely has. The amount of players that you have during the season now. It used to be they took those makeshift out. I understand that. Yeah. I'm just, it's not,

it's not, it's not, that's not the reason. That's not the main reason. Oh, I think that's a big part of how the players feel. And then they're, they don't have outlets.

I've talked to guys about that. They, uh, listen, that would be, like, you know, I got an outlet by the bed.

Yeah, what the hell are we doing? Yeah. So, 25. Yes. So that's something that, that,

that, that, that comes up. Um, but also, typically, your practice facility is privately funded. You can sell naming rights, but it's typically privately funded.

So if you change it, you have to pay for it yourself. Yeah, and there is, because they can only have such a big footprint, there is only so much they can do unless they leave the city. Exactly. You think they'll do that?

I don't think they will leave the city, but I do wonder if there will be changes to that facility. See, I don't know what you can do. Do you move? it's against kind of the organizational culture to have the non-football staff in a different building. Like that's something that...

Well, there's a lot of football staff at the stadium already. Yeah, so you wonder... But I don't know how much more room they have over there. Yeah. But if there is a new stadium, if they work a football practice facility into that stadium or something like that.

Good point from CDP who says what better child care could you get than giving Jeremiah Charter's kid a job. That's a good point. That's a good point. There you go. All right. Anything else?

What's the best thing you ate in Indy? Best thing I ate in Indy. I mean, I love Cafe Patachoo. Although I didn't get a cookie this year. I went there one time. But the best thing I ate last night, I enjoy last night. I didn't have the same eating week

that I had. Honestly, I was in and out. I was working each day until dinner, and then I would go to dinner, and then I would, I would go out after dinner. But, yeah, this was an in-and-out trip, honestly. And so, no, I mean, it's not what was me, but I've once spent six days at the combine, right? And you have a lot more. The best thing I ate was probably that pasta last night. A little garlicky.

Yeah, a little too garlicky before not good because then you're, even if you're okay, like you're thinking about it in every conversation, right? You know that feeling? Yeah. Yeah. I don't imagine it was that bad. No, but you're just, you just hope it's not, right? You want to leave a positive impression with everything.

Is there you trusted to ask for an honest assessment of your garlic level? You can never do that. You can never do that. You can ask me. Is it coming out of my pores now? Do I smell garlicky? No. Okay, good.

Thank you. We got a question here. Super Chad from CDP who says, thoughts on Bezos' new direction for the Washington Post's op-eds, Zach. I don't like it. I think that the, it is true that like the nature of the op-ed section has evolved from when newspapers were there,

but I don't like screening what the op-eds are going to be. I think that's a lame rationale is that like people aren't coming to you for like all the opinions anymore. I think the very nature of the page is to have, I'm in general, like in all area, I'm in favor of diversity of thought. Like I want to, I want to know different opinions and then I can formulate the opinion myself. And so I never like it when something is screened or you only read one side of it. I typically want to read both sides, hear what, hear, hear different opinions. And so I, I don't like that whatsoever. I honestly, all I read was the memo that was sent.

I haven't read any corresponding stories on it. So I will find out. But yeah, no, I mean, in, in general, what I wanted, like, I'm in favor of more information and then let the consumer decide as opposed to filter. through the information to conform to a perspective that that you feel is representative of how news or society should be. So I don't like that. Okay.

What? Chad is very proud of you. I actually think I've been pretty consistent about that for, I mean, I feel very strongly for six years doing this show, I've been, you know, going back to our previous show, I've been very consistent about, like, diversity of thought. And actually that's part of when I get, when I get, uh, uh, criticized for like, defending people sometimes. It's, it's, it's not even defending people.

It's, it's just like, I, I, I, I want to hear from everybody. Um, and I. Oh, you see, that's where you and I are, are, I don't think that everybody needs to be. You see, but then what you're doing is like the opposite. I mean, we don't need to get in. But, but then all you're trying to do is just, uh, getting people who, who agree with you. It's like it's like confirming what your thoughts are. There are barriers.

I do not need to hear from the head of the Ku Klux Klan. Oh, yeah. I mean, I don't seek out the head of the Ku Klux. I don't need to hear from everybody. I don't need to hear from a Nazi. Yeah, but I'm saying like if, like when there's, let's say like there's an election, I want to read what both arguments are and then I can determine myself. You know, I could determine for myself.

That was when we've had this discussion. Yeah, that's when we were talking about like endorsement. bit polyanish. It's not, it does not reflect the world we live in anymore. So you're doing the same thing Jeff Bezos is saying is like, it's not reflecting the world we live in. Yeah. And, and my exact point is, is, is, is like, the, some of the, the, the, the most, some of the, the best perspective you can get is someone who has a different perspective from, from yours. And that would either fortify your opinion even more. You're like, you know what, I hear what you're saying, but you're wrong.

or you can say, you know what, I haven't thought about that, you're right, or you can say you're not right, but maybe this one part of your argument, something that could inform me. So I, yeah, I want to hear from everybody within reason. Well, I think, yeah, I think the... Within reason is carrying a lot of weight.

Yeah, I think within reason is carrying a lot of weight. Yeah. Much more weight than it used to, probably. Okay. We can save that for another day. Yeah, that's okay. All right, good talk. They'll do it for this episode of the P.HLY Eagles podcast. We are back tomorrow, 2 o'clock.

I think we might have a special guest joining us. So that will be exciting. Good way to end the week. And the next week, oh boy, are we all into offseason stuff? We've got Zach's offseason plan coming. We've got the Eagles top 100 free agents. We've got quackatology. We've got trade targets.

It's all good stuff. So, buckle in. The NPO is just heating up for Zach and Tyler for helping us out today. We thank you for watching and listening. I'm Bo. We'll talk to you tomorrow. And as always, we love you.