PHLY Philadelphia Eagles Podcast - PHLY Eagles Podcast | Philadelphia Eagles OTA unpacking, day 2: What is Vic Fangio’s plan for Cooper DeJean?

Episode Date: May 23, 2024

Continuing their discussion of the first open OTA of the spring for the Eagles, the guys focus in on some of the highlight plays, the influence of motion on the offense and the theoretical versatility of the secondary. Join Zach Berman and Bo Wulf to learn more about the inimitable E.J. Jenkins, the shifty Britain Covey, the rocket-armed Tanner McKee and more. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

It's not a Thursday high noon. Bo Wolf joined by the man who refuses to say the phrase sexual napalm. Zach Berman, how you do it? I am well, Bo. Happy to be on the show, excited for the show. Certainly was not expecting that introduction, nor do I anticipate anyone understands the introduction. But you are, you never cease to find ways to make me uncomfortable.

So it is an amazing. amazing skill of yours. Like it can be listed among skills on the resume. Like, uh, find new and creative ways to make Zach. Why does that make you uncomfortable? Because we're on a show broadcast at the thousands and thousands of people. I mean, I hope we reach millions right now. Thousands and thousands of people. Um, we'll get the millions. Okay. I have confidence in that. Okay. Um, but, uh, yeah, so I come, I prepare. I'm thinking about what we're going to talk about. Uh, and then, I get disoriented by such an introduction. But this is part of the conversation we were having before the show.

When you phrase it like that, people are now curious why we're talking about that term before the show. Well, that's how you hook them in, Zach. I suppose so. But yeah, excited for the show. Excited to talk the OTAs and whatever else is on your mind, except some other things that's on your mind, but some things that are on your mind. Yeah, let's get into it. All right. Well, we talked yesterday about everything we saw, well, some of the things that we saw over the course of the practice and smelled at the first open OTA.

We've got some more stuff to talk about. And where would you like to start? Where would I like to start? So, well, the teaser here, the thumbnail, well, not the thumbnail, but the headline was about Cooper DeGine in Vic Fangio's defense. So let's start with that. So we hit on why people are clicking the link. but then we'll get into much, much more. So now if you wanted, you could say,

we're going to get to that. That's the thing they've clicked on. You've got to bring them along, but now you've already promised we're going to get into it. It's like Monday's show, which we've had a good week of shows, but Monday's show with Les Bowen. People enjoyed it. We got nice comments about it, but...

The people love less. What's not to love? The funny thing is, is it was about, like, previewing OTAs with less. We might have talked about OTAs for 30 seconds, and then everything else for the other, that was about an hour and two minutes. Okay.

So, yeah, Cooper de Gene's a good place to start. Yeah, now we talked a little bit about Cooper DeGine yesterday, but you know, you want to get some full names in the headline to bring people in. That's all about the algorithm. You've got to get those bad boys in. Jacob Harris wouldn't do it. Yeah, what are we going to? Yeah, people, you've got to promise something.

Yeah, if you see Jacob Harris, they're not going to do it. I always fall for those teasies, by the way. So I understand when you'll see someone who will have an article being like, Howie Roseman, you know, is about to pursue this explosive free agent or something like that. I'm like, oh, goodness. And I click on it. And it's just like a link to a report about some. Jacob Barris.

Yeah, something like that. But they always gets me to click. Yeah, and then you got the all-caps verb. You got to get that bad boy in there. Exactly. Maybe an emoji or two. Howie Roseman impales. Other general managers.

I don't know. Yeah. So Cooper DeGine, what are you anticipating his role being week one of this season? Oh, you're just jumping ahead. Oh, sorry. I'll defer to you. No, I think that's fine. No, well, you know, the context is that yesterday, when we watched him, we saw him play

nickel, we saw him play left cornerback, we saw him play right cornerback. And it's interesting that the player development plan that Vic Fangio has in mind for Cooper DeGine is throwing a bunch of stuff at him and seeing what sticks. I think that my week one expectation, I mean, it depends on Avanti Maddox, right? You're expecting that probably Quinion Mitchell is going to start opposite Dariuslay. You're going to have CJ Gardner-Johnson and read Blankenship at safety if everybody's healthy. A week one to me, if Avanty Maddox is healthy, I would lean toward him actually being on the field. And I know that he's not guaranteed of a roster spot.

and if he's healthy, it carries a lot of weight because he has not been able to stay healthy. But I think if everybody stays healthy, my expectation is that Cooper DeGine would be more of a special package player than a starting player week one. But by the middle of the season, I would expect that he will be a starting player on the defense. In the slot?

Probably. Okay. Yes. Now, if I ask you this too, what do you think the Eagles think the most probable long-term scenario is for Cooper the Gene? That he's

a starting outside guy, that he's a chess piece moving around, that he's a slot, that he's a safety. When they're predicting ranges of outcomes, what do you think the range of outcome they think is most likely to occur? The most likely probably slot. Okay.

But I think they would like to hold open the possibility that he can be the eventual starter opposite Quinn and Mitchell. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. What do you think? Yeah, I think slot safety is probably the eventual one, but I agree with you. I do think they think-

Slot safety? Or you mean just interchangeable? Slot and safety, yeah, being able to play both. Okay. Almost like a CJ Gardner-Johnson. I mean, I heard, was it Daniel Jeremiah who used to comp Malcolm Jenkins, right? And Malcolm was drafted as an outside corner, then moved to safety. The game has also evolved since, you know, 10 years ago.

But someone who can cover the slot, who can play safety. Kyle Hamilton does some of that in Baltimore. That's lofty. Certainly lofty. But I do think the Eagles internally believe he can play outside cornerback and that there are parts of his skill set that were not utilized at Iowa just because of the structure of that defense that can be maximized here in Philadelphia. Yeah, I think their plan is for him to be on the outside.

Sure. And maybe it's the kind of thing where, in a perfect world. When you're in base, it's Dijin and Quinny Mitchell on the outside, and then when you move to Nickel, Keeley Ringo comes in and plays on the outside and Dijin slides inside, right? Something like that. I would sign up for that.

Well, of course, that's unrealistic to expect that all of those guys are going to hit. But in a perfect world, yeah. Positionless football. That's not positionless football. Yeah. He is changing positions. That's not positionless.

Yeah, positionless meaning that he can play all over the place. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. that's versatility. He's able to play multiple positions. Positionless is like, oh, there's all these guys. Everybody's interchangeable. It's total football.

That is not the same thing. When you have one player who is able to move around, that's not positionless. That's multi-position. So you're arguing the same. So positionless with the way it's kind of been understood and with the way it's discussed is means that you don't keep them within the confines. of a traditional position. So multi-position and positions.

That is not what positionless means. Yes, that is. I'm telling you that's that. He's changing from the outside corner to the nickel. Those are specific positions in the defense, specific roles that he is playing. This is not Isaiah Simmons where you're like, oh, you got this guy on the field.

He's just a football player. It doesn't matter where you put him. He'll go, he'll cover anybody. That's precisely because he can play different positions. So multi-position and positionless is... We are going to, this is going to turn into an actual argument. Shane says, wait, they're both genuinely not know that's what positionless means.

That is not what positionless means. No it is not. Yeah, positionless, the way it's used in sports does not mean that you don't play any position. It means you are not, that a position label does not apply to you. Positionless basketball, I've given you the history of this. It is that the players on the Miami Heat, they don't have to play just power forward or small forward or point guard or shooting guard or center. On a given possession, they play dead. different positions. So multi-position

and positionless. You are wrong about that. Chat, way in. Chat, weigh in. Because I actually feel strongly about this. Yeah, that's fine. You feel that way. You are wrong. Just because you believe something is wrong doesn't make it wrong. You are not the arbiter of everything in society.

You are incorrect. Maybe, but this does help explain why you keep pitching positionless because it just means that you don't understand what positionless means. So you're just asking for guys to be versatile. We have breaking news. The Feldorf Eagle have signed John Ross to a one-year contract. Thank God.

The Eagles read, the Eagles read all PHLI on Tuesday night. They knew that, hey, Zach had other stuff he could be doing, but he was giving the people a list of seven players that they could sign or that they could acquire, and John Ross is one of them. John Ross, of course, first round pick out of Washington in 2017, set a then combined record with a 4.23 40-yard dash has been an underachieving player with Cincinnati and with the New York Giants in the NFL. But John Ross can absolutely run. I asked someone in the building a few weeks ago.

Can John Ross still run? He said John Ross will always be able to run. So the Eagles are adding one of the fastest football players in NFL history. and he hasn't played an NFL snap since 2021. Correct. But John Ross can, he can certainly stretch the field. And he fits the off-season of draft pedigree. So Howard Roseman is utilizing my Madden strategy from the past decade.

Well, yeah, I mean, he's, of course, you love it. This is a former top 10 pick. That's what I'm saying, yes. Yeah, so we can get back to the position. No, no, no, no. We do not need to. I do not want to talk about that again. Let's use the excuse of the John Ross signing to get us away from that nonsense argument.

John Ross, so yes. A top 10 pick in 2017, as you said, no catches in three games of his rookie year. Then 21 catches for 210 yards in 2018. His best season came in 2019. His third year, 28 catches for 5006 yards. And then after that sort of fell off the map. had 224 receiving yards in 2021 for the New York Giants. This is a guy who, as you said, the theory of John Ross

is that he can help stretch the field. It's a similar best case scenario to Cois Watkins. Like if he can give you what Cois Watkins gave you, that would be like a good return on the investment here. I think it's very easy to say that he's on the outside looking in on the roster. Like he hasn't been on a team and he was a tryout player, but an interesting person to bring into the building. Yeah, so what's interesting about him, like you mentioned, the fact that he was a tryout player, they've at least seen him. It's not just working off of tape from 2021. It's not just like a random workout at the facility. He spent the two-day rookie minicamp with the team, so they had eyes up close on him. I would agree. Outside looking in, he's, he's, you mentioned aside. It's 511-194. He's not like Ralph Finn, right? And he was compared to, you know, and he was compared to.

to Deshawn Jackson, Brandon Cooks, that type of player when he was coming out of Washington, probably overdrafted. I remember the Eagles had the 14th pick that year, and there was a lot of smoke about the Eagles going after him then. Did not last that long, of course. And then when he was on the trade block with the Bengals, I believe in the 2020 season, I heard some whispers that the Eagles were interested in him then. They did not make a move.

Still young. What's... 28? Yeah, 28, or under 30. So I would expect he doesn't make the team, but we'll see. Also a poster boy for the wide receiver buckets as a player who did not really produce until his senior season in 2016. And so if he's this talented and this fast, he should have produced earlier in his college career. Okay.

Yeah. So we'll see what he works. Maybe he gets number 13. There you go. Yeah, that would be big. That would be big. So let's let's let's wait so yeah I'm sorry no I want to stay here on the receivers because let's talk about what we saw yesterday You know there was no Devante Smith

A.J. Brown was out there But you know the rest of the wide receiver group leaves a little bit to be desired now ania Smith who We had talked about on Tuesday as a player that we wanted to see he is still not practicing He had that shin injury in the run up to the draft so he is going through some position drills but is not participating in team stuff so we didn't get to see him out there so even more of a depleted group than you might have expected, but was there anybody there who just caught your eye in any way who was out there yesterday? Well, I thought Paris Campbell was solid.

Maybe there was some confirmation bias there. He played, right? He wasn't injured, so it wasn't a myth of Paris Campbell, right? Took work with the first team. That's your Paris, that's your Paris. We, we, we, we. What? What?

What she said? I said, where? Is that a French word? Yes, I'm just putting a little extra stank on the Wii. Ah, okay, all right, fair enough. So Paris Campbell, who, who, it's actually not even spelled P-A-R-I-S, it's P-A-R-I-S, so it's actually, it's different. It's different than Paris France. Nonetheless, Paris Campbell, yeah, yeah, caught my eye, moved well.

he caught, I had him down for two passes over the middle. Does that seem right to you? Why? Okay. So Paris Campbell. Jacob Harris, who was a fourth round pick by the Los Angeles Rams, did not do much in terms of, like, catching the ball for the Eagles, but got the guy opened downfield. And you're looking at six, five, two over. I'm not sure he got open.

Queenie Mitchell was all over him. Both times he was targeted downfield. There was one when he dropped it. Yeah, but he was like blanketed. It was like reacting to the back shoulder or an underthrown ball. He got down. Okay. I would not say he got open.

Okay. But anyways, Jacob Harris was downfield. So he caught my attention in that regard. Joseph Van Gata taking work with the first team. Just in terms of the depth chart, didn't do much as far as catching the ball. Will Shipley was involved in the passing game, like not just catch the ball out of the backfield, but splitting out. So just something to pay attention to in terms of the versatility. of Will Shipley.

Other than that, Johnny Wilson, Johnny Wilson looks the part, man. You know, he reminds me of Tyree Jackson. Yeah, that sounds about right. Okay. Could you see that? Yeah, I could see that. I think that's like probably the perfect comparison.

Okay. Like the idea of him is better than the... Well, and you probably have about similar expectations. Yeah. Now, they once traded Zach Eritz because they were so excited about the possible of Tyree Jackson. The summer of 2020, man, that was an interesting one.

They'd love them from Tyree Jackson. Well, probably the pandemic's fault again. You're blaming the pandemic. Chiquon Davis also looks the part a little bit. Sure. At 6-5-215.215. But yeah, nobody was like out there making plays, really,

aside from AJ Brown. Which is probably why they need to sign someone like John Ross. Well, exactly. And it's also, I mean, you mentioned it like, Jillen Hertz was like holding the ball for a lot yesterday. Like it's seven on seven. The ball's got to come out quickly. And I think part of the reason for that is they don't, they don't have a lot of down roster wide receivers making plays. Although Britt and Covey, actually, I thought had a good day. I don't want to misquote you, but I think I overheard you on the sideline. That is like a gripe of yours when the quarterback

doesn't throw it in seven on seven. Is that correct? Did you say something along those lines? I don't remember. Okay. I believe you did. Probably. Yeah, it's seven on seven. Yeah. Like the ball's got to come out. Yeah. Yes, agreed. Okay. Like, if you throw an interception. But you were saying you didn't want to misquote me, but then there was no, there was no quote. Well, I think that's what you said.

I think you said, I have a particular gripe when the ball does not come out in seven-on-seven. Like that, you're probably watching, because for you to make that type of comment, you were probably watching it with like someone who's football acumen, you really respect. Maybe like a friend Duffy or a Shil Capadia or something like that. I'm like Zach Berman. Just like two football guys. This is the year of you knowing ball. Just like two football guys huffing and paul, you know, like, yeah. Huffing paint?

Just talking shop, right? But, I mean, look, I give Bo a lot of credit for his astute practice observations and watch more than I deserve. Make sure you check those out on all pHL. Why.com, no, but now I say this in earnest, the first seven-on-seven period, okay, the obviously all the offensive lines. linemen are on a different field. Everyone's doing seven on seven. All the eyes of all the reporters are on seven on seven. Because look, this is like the sexy thing to watch here. You got the quarterbacks and the wide receivers and the running backs. You get the DB matchups. But over on the other side, on the separate field, the O line, they're just doing drills. They're doing like nothing

that that gets you really excited. But Bo is over there watching the O line. And I say this is It's not correct, but that's okay. You weren't over there? Not in 7-on-7s yesterday. I was there during individual stuff, but once they started 7-on-7s, that was the only action going on. I'm sorry, individual stuff then, individual stuff. Okay, so not so. Of course.

Yeah, I weren't watching the ball security drills on offense. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, so I reframed, sorry, I'm all, I'm conflating it. It was a very exciting 90 minutes for me. It was like everything. It's like sensory overload, you know, I bring my son to five. Like football napal. I bring my son and daughter to.

five below and when they walk in it's like sensory overload there right that's what the first practice of spring is like for me so much is going on. Kid in a candy store literally yeah and then the other thing too I try to be friendly to everybody right and so

you have other reporters sometimes who want to come over and chat with you catch up on things and you're being polite but you're also like hey I'm only I only get 90 minutes a week of this right like let's you know here's my you have myself You can text me, call me anytime.

I drives here, I drives to work, from work, when I'm filling that time up. Like, right now, I kind of want to watch football. All right. So any reporters who are watching, you're listening to the show right now, do not talk to Zach during practice. That's not what I'm saying at all. That's not what I'm saying, you know. Let the man scribe. All right, Zach, before we get going with the rest of the show, let's talk about our friends at Rocket Money.

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Just, what is that? Just, you just giving bunny ears? Are you six? Just walk in or schedule an appointment on Monday to Friday from 10 a.m. to 6 p.m., State age and health restrictions may apply. Ask a red aid pharmacist for details. Let's unpack this year. Were you bored?

Was there something? A little bit. Well, you know, it's just funny when it's the solo shot and you can just creep in something behind. It's not fun. I've never seen you on a solo shot and felt compelled to reach over and put. It will happen one day. It will never do that. I'm 38 years old.

I'm not six. What was the last time you've ever done? Well, having a little bit of fun, you know? Do you do bunny ears and photos? No, but. You know, the inspiration struck. What inspired you? You saw me and you said, I need to do bunny ears.

Yeah. I don't know. By the way, I know you don't want to harp on on this, but I'm reading the chat here. And this is actually one of the more polarizing topics we've discussed because people, like, in back-to-back things. I don't, I'm just saying, Beau is one-hundred- I'm going to be mean if we talk about this. I don't want to be mean. I'm just saying this really probably needs better understanding because Ziggy Marley says,

says, I'm right. Go Birds says you're 100% correct. So really, we have no consensus here. Typically, these arguments, there's consensus. It's usually pro-bo. But I am, I'm curious. We need a third-person arbiter. No, we don't. I'm right. Everybody else is wrong, if they're wrong, position list is not multi-position unless you can play every single position. All right. You're right. We probably don't need to go down this rabbit hole because I actually, I actually think, I actually think you're misinterpreting it, but we don't need to go down this. You are.

That's fine. All right, fine. I told you I don't want to talk about this. I didn't think you get so worked up about it. Goodness. All right. Last thing on the wide receivers, one thing that we mentioned,

but maybe haven't fully unpacked, is were you struck? Did you notice the pre-snap motion that was going on during practice yesterday? I noticed it, but I need to really wait for like 11 on 11. and they got a true sense of how the pre-snap motion is used over the course of the play. Yeah, I mean, we're all looking for it because that's, in theory, something that's going to be added to this offense that did not use motion very much under Nick Siriani.

And, you know, they were using motion yesterday. There were a couple snaps where it was not just, you know, sort of like one guy from the side of their formation to another. And then you snap the ball. There were a couple ones where it was like, A.J. Brown's coming over. He's in the slot. And as he's moving the ball of snap, like that was interesting to see. from a like they're installing the base parts of the offense but i don't think we can you know say with any degree of uh confidence how much motion there's going to be at 7 o3 this morning the

topic on radio was that jowen hertz looked faster did you notice anything about jellan hertz's speed okay that's why i asked you were there you had you're i mean at no point yesterday was jailen hertz running full speed yeah i think it was based on a clip of him carrying out a fake 60 yards down the left side. But he's done that in the past. I mean, it could be something. I guess my, because this is something that I imagine, people want to know how to J-1 look.

J-Lan's healthy this time of year, right? When J-Lan's playing in December, there's an accumulation of hits. And last year, he was obviously dealing with a lower body injury early in the season and throughout the season. Then he had the hand late in the end. but it was affecting his mobility, as you and Baldy were very early on last year.

So he's healthier now. He should be able to move better now than he did last year, but it's not as if he was running all around. Yeah, I mean, it was practice and he's a quarterback. There was no way to tell if he was running faster. Okay. Okay. Want to stay on the quarterbacks for a bit?

Sure. What do you think of your boy, K.P., besides, or I should have my boat. I mean, I was a little bit underwhelmed by Kenny Pickett just for one practice, but that's, you know, it's one practice. You wanted to say what? Bold declarations. Yeah, I think I did not see anything to make me think that Kenny Pickett is definitely better than Tanner McKee.

One of the things you were looking out for when we did the draft the other day was the zip coming out of the hands. You felt the ball was zippier out of the hands of McKee? Yeah, I thought the ball was particularly lazy coming out of Kenny Pickett's hands. It was floating there a couple times on throws to the outside where, you know, you were just waiting an extra tick for the ball to get there. There was one nice throw he made. The last play of practice he was rolling to his left.

What? Yeah, Gainwell? Yeah, he fired it in there. Now that was an incomplete pass. Gainwell was out of bounds, but he did fire that ball in and throw into his left, and it was well-placed. I'm not saying, I'm not judging Kenny Pickett by one practice, but I would say that, yeah, arm strength is not his top tool. Accuracy? Did you see the accuracy?

To some extent, yeah. Okay. Will Greer stand out the one anyway? No. I mean, he didn't throw a practice, and he didn't throw a pass in seven-on-sev. Seven and Sevens, yeah. Okay. Got some hair to him.

He does. His brother is actually really famous. Pam? Ham. Am I missing a joke here, Julia? I said Pam. Pam Greer. That's the only person I can think of,

last name Greer. I just want to make sure I'm not, like, being offensive in any variety. I don't know Pam Greer. Am I supposed to know Pang Greer? What has she been in that I'm familiar with? Jackie Brown? Is this one of these things

where I'm culturally illiterate again? I mean, I think most people know Pam Greer, but I am certainly not surprised that you don't know Pam Greer. Yeah, I don't know Pam Greer. I would imagine there's not a lot of people, or I should say not a lot, I imagine there's other people my age demographic who don't know Pam Greer.

There are other people, yes. I would imagine many people in my age bracket. I don't, but actually in the age bracket that we're in, maybe a little below or next to us, they might know Nash Greer. Okay? Nash Greer is an internet sensation, a TikToker. Yeah.

I don't know Nash Greer. Yeah. What's his hook? He's like a famous TikToker. But what's his TikTok hook? What does he do? He does videos on TikTok. Or no, he was a vine.

He became known for his, so not TikTok. Tucker, I'm sorry, Vine. He became known for his online videos on the now-defunct video sharing service, Vine. But I remember, I know about this because Will Greer, who was a prolific high school recruit, he signs on at Florida. And when he's at Florida, one of the stories was about how, like, here's this guy who's a superstar quarterback. But his brother is actually more notable than he is, more famous than he is.

And that's what I heard about Nash Greer, but I was not on. He's got a Wikipedia page. So does Pam. That's true. He's actually, he appeared in Scream, the 2019 version. So an actor as well. Yeah. This sounds like a good...

A real impressive... This sounds like a good wolf's den coming up. Well, then you can be guaranteed that I will not do it. Because for the new listeners, Bo cannot take ideas from anybody else. I can take them. I'm just not going to use them. Just don't, yeah. Yeah, just.

You just won't use them. Okay. So one thing I wanted to mention. If you say be nice to Zach, you can be sure that that will not be utilized on the show. Let me, there is one piece of news that I wanted to discuss, not even discuss, just mentioned. Keely Ringo, who was absent from practice yesterday. We were sort of speculating that he's probably been around. This is a bit of a, I would guess, an outlier.

The Eagles put out the video. They went bowling on Tuesday as a team. Kili Ringo was there. So, like, you know, I think that puts that to bed. Kili Bingo is with the team right now. And same thing, Devante's been with the team too during the offseason. Well, the Eagles said that they've had full participation over the course of the voluntary workouts. Like, everybody has been there at least at some point.

Exactly. Which includes James Bradbury in theory. Yeah, someone said, I think it was Elliot. He said that he saw a video with Bradbury in it at some point this offseason. So, yeah. Okay. elsewhere on the list here that you wanted to talk about in terms of players you mentioned Jacob Harris. Sidney Brown, you wanted to discuss his ghosting.

Yeah, so Sydney Brown stands about 50 yards or maybe 30 yards behind the play, which, by the way, I made this observation to someone I was watching practice with. Vic Vanjo does not stand behind the defense. He stands behind the offense. Yeah. Where a lot of defense coordinator stand behind the defense. defense. So just Vic prefers a different vantage point. Anyways, a spot where a lot of de-coordinators like to stand, you know, behind the defense, Cindy Brown was there, and he was doing reps on air, if you will. Back when I played baseball, we used to call him dry swings, right? And so he was,

he was doing those mental reps, those reps on air. When he, and Cindy Brown, of course, recovering from a torn ACL, he was mimicking what he would be doing on that given play. what's your read on this as someone who knows body language and knows football players? Do you think this was performative? Do you think this was something that makes him who he is? Do you think it was, I guess what's your read on it? I think it's who he is. He's like a part of what the Eagles like about him is he's like a try-hard guy, and this is part of that.

Yeah. I mean, I think your comparison to dry swings is good. because this is like a thing where like coaches like when you're in the batters box like use that you like take that and and it is completely unhelpful and like serves almost no purpose but I actually do think like from that it's it's different because like when you're doing the dry swings off to the side it's not the you're not seeing it the same way but where he is deep like deep deep deep deep deep deep deep in the backfield he's it's it's a similar vantage point like I think that's totally I have no problem with that yeah I agree back when I you know so when uh when uh when uh

batting practice would be cut short, and my reps wouldn't come. My coach was like, Berman, go do dry swings. I'm like, what am I doing dry swings for? I'm not getting in the game. It's like, Berman going to do dry swings. Yeah. Might as well kick me off the team. Like, what a mean thing to say.

I was, I was, so I would be like dry swing. I would go overboard and I would like make sure he heard. No surprise. He heard. I'd be like, two one count. curve ball coming completely tracks yes exactly so I would do that so like this is

this is my approach here I got I got two strikes so I'm not striding right like that kind of thing yeah yeah that makes a lot of sense would you stride with two strikes or you shouldn't know you choke up a little bit maybe shorten up a little bit but yeah not too much okay last one you had on here Zach was Will Shipley who spent a little bit of time working in the slot and maybe that's related to the

wide receiver, shallowness, but the Eagles using him in some different ways. Yeah, I think the Eagles were and are excited about the way he can catch the ball. Now, he didn't really exhibit that much yesterday. He had a drop or two out there. At least one. But I do know they think he can be used that way. That's something that the scouting staff liked about him coming out. And my guess is, now look, Kenny Gainwell,

caught a lot of balls. Memphis was not really used that way in the offense. To be fair, that's not how the Eagles offense was structured during the past two years, or at least Hertz wasn't thrown to the backs. But I think one way they're going to use Shipley is to try to throw him the ball, and I think they think he can make plays in space. And yesterday was an example. There you go.

What about the players we heard from on the press conference podium after practice? Yeah, so let's start with Jalen Carter. Okay, Jalen Carter, who, man, I feel. too bad for the person who sat in the seat after him. So that's Darius sleigh, right? J. Owen was sweaty. Okay. What a no-sell.

What would you like me to say? How do I sell that? Boy, that would be sweaty. Like, I don't know. Yeah, so Jalen Carter really focused on his conditioning this off-season. He said he actually spent less time, kind of like on some of the handwork type stuff, more time on conditioning, knowing how important that's going to be. He's going to take a lot of snaps.

I mean, I think this is not a bold take. He's the centerpiece of the defense. Les Bowen has a piece up right now. I want to talk about this. Yeah, Les Bowen has a piece up where the premise is that he's the most talented player on Vic Fangio's defense. Fletcher Cox isn't here. The Eagles didn't add someone in Fletcher Cox's place.

Jalen Carter is going to be the guy, and Jeline Carter is going to have to take a heavy workload. Absolutely. And what caught my eye in what Lest wrote about is, you know, hearkening back to when Vic Fangio in his introductory press conference was talking about sort of his disdain for load management and, you know, connecting that to Jalen Carter, working on his conditioning, maybe Jordan Davis in some, like, you know,

we saw him looking a little bit slimmer at the Eagles Autism Challenge bike ride. We know that this Eagles defense, historically, under Harry Roseman, has wanted to rotate those defensive linemen a lot. That's not really what Vic Fangio, at least did last year in Miami. Fletcher Cox played 15 games of 17, played 59% of the defensive snaps. And even that was an uptick from usual years. Jalen Carter was second on the team, 48% of the defensive snaps in 16 games. Jordan Davis was third, 45% of the defensive snaps in 17 games.

Christian Wilkins last year for the Dolphins. their number one defensive tackle played 17 games, 81% of the snaps. Zach Seiler, 77% of the defensive snaps. So there's a bit of attention here between, you know, the way that Vic Fangio would put the load on those defensive tackles and what Howie Roseman and the organization has done historically. Last year was a bit of an uptick from usual years.

Maybe it's going to be even more so this year, and they're going to put even more on Jalen Carter and Jordan Davis. Good point. And I think Vic Fangio's going to win this one. I think Joe and Carter is going to play as much as Vic Fangio wants them to. Do you disagree? I don't know that I disagree with that being the actual answer, but I agree with the Eagles' long-time philosophy that, like, yeah, let's rotate those bodies and keep those guys fresh. It's for the big picture, you know, serving what's going to be best come January, I think. Yeah, now that said, the Eagles have three detactors. who I stand out above the rest, right?

And they're going to play three detackles a lot, right, if you have a 5-2 front. So when you have Jalen Carter, Jordan Davis, and Milton Williams, now Morrow Ojimo can push in there. Maybe they add a backup nose there. But my guess is that Jalen's not going to come off the field that often. Other guys will.

Jalen won't. I mean, I do imagine that he's going to play the most snaps for sure. Like he's not going to play every snap, but yeah. They're not super deep there. And I think to your point of like the centerpiece of the defense, as we have talked about, like the Eagles are on paper, not as good on the edge as they were heading into last season or the season before. And part of what could still make that work is if either Jalen Carter in year two

or maybe a little bit less likely, but Jordan Davis in year three, if one of those guys takes a real leap to some degree, then all of a sudden maybe the pressure on the outside is not quite so great. You're right. And they need to be Jalen Carter. I mean, Jailen Carter, a top 10 pick, potential number one pick going into that year. Jailen Carter needs to be the difference maker. He needs to be there, Fletcher Cox, they're in Domen, Zoo, they're Aaron Donald,

like that type of player. The teams that have an interior player as their centerpiece, I think that's how the Eagles are looking at Jalen Carter. It was topical yesterday. to bring up Vic Fangio, of course, because of the comments you brought up to me on Wednesday's show. I had not heard of it then of Jayvon Holland. And we've heard this from a few dolphins. And Jaylon Carter, as you would expect him to say,

all his interactions with Vic Fangio have been, you know, positive. He loves Vic. But he said he's an old school guy. Like Jaylon Carter said he personally is an old school guy. He says in Apokka, Florida, Apopka or Apoka? A, P-O-P-K-A. I'm sorry if I... I don't know the answer.

Okay. He said they're like, they have an old school type of program. It's an old school town. You work. And so he doesn't mind being coached like that, he said. All right. Well, speaking of Vic Fangio, we know that he's a big Phillies fan. And Vic, if you're watching,

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But, yeah, Rich Hoffman's PHLY newsletter every morning, PHLY Sports Newsletter, if you didn't catch the Phillies game the night before, if you didn't catch our Flyers show or our Sixers show, I hope you catch all of them. Rich tells you everything that's going on in a funny way. I love it. It's awesome. Caliph says Emily is a mom who works too hard who loves her kids and never stops. A gentle hand in the heart

of the fighter and Zeeby has the nerve to call her out on fixing ribs. No, no, no, no. I said they were delicious ribs. I said I was trying to plug. I was trying to this says here, personalize it.

They want us to personalize it. the stories. So I was personalized the stories. I did not have Butcher Bucer's meat last night. I was explaining what I had for dinner. And we went to the car as the store, she made delicious ribs. They were a little on the healthy side, but they were delicious. It was like a sugar-free

barbecue sauce that was on there. But they were great. They came right off the bone. They were terrific. I'm just saying that I would not have objected to high-quality meat that we got from Butcherbox. All I'm trying to do here, I'm going to tell you, I'm going to take you behind the curtain.

This is good. And now everybody knows you won't lie. I'm going to show you how the sauce. You could have lied and said they were Butcherbox raised. I'm going to show you how the sausage is made. And Butcher Box, I'm a loyal customer here, so I'm not doing it. Okay. We encourage hosts to share authentic stories and put their own spin.

That's exactly what I did. And now I'm getting, I could just read it verbatim. Like I once did for. for a company that... The other thing is you could have done that without casting aspersions on Emily's meat buying habits. Honestly, though, this is the thing.

So I'm still getting used to our... I shouldn't say getting used to this. We're nine months into this now. I love doing this show. But I said last week, I'm better at like offering my... at speaking... at writing,

cogent and salient points than I am sometimes speaking it. So when we're on this, you have to be a bright lights player to use the NFL term. Like, there's no rewind, there's no pause. There's some podcast

where people do like 35 takes. We don't do that. We're live, okay? So if I'm doing a butcher box read here, and I need to give my own spin on it, I'm thinking, what did I have for dinner last night? I would have liked to have butcher box instead.

So, yeah, that's all I was presenting. Okay. Yeah. Well, Emily, we respect you. And we think you're doing a wonderful job. I did find it interesting that you refused to say sexual napalm because you didn't want that. Clipped. Yes.

But you did say, and I wrote this done, that's what I had come in my box. Bo, you have the weirdest mind. That's what you thought of. I'm just saying. That could be clipped, too, and used for some other purposes. says, I don't know. Yeah, I'm not worried about that. Yeah.

Okay, so after Jalen Carter, we heard from Darius Slay, Tyler Steen, and Sequin and Barclay. We talked a little bit about Sequin yesterday. We talked about the golfing stuff. So tell me about Slay and Steen. Yeah, so Slay, first off, if you remember the video that the Eagles put out when they drafted Quinnian Mitchell and they said you can stay at or that they want to. staying next to Slay, and Quinyan said he'll live with Slay if he could.

Slai said if he wants to, he can. It hasn't happened yet because Slai hasn't been in the area right now. Slai lives in Texas during the offseason, right? So Slai's not moved up here yet. But that is something that he certainly didn't deny. He likes Quigioninichael. He said that he studies cornerbacks leading up to the draft. He watches film of these guys.

he's not someone who's like oh the eagles draft of quenionette mitchell who's that he knows who these guys are and i and i can tell you this he is a football junkie like i i do this thing each week where i go to him and i talk to him about the opposing team's top receiver and he'll give you like eight minutes on the guy right um and he talked about how he used to train with sauce gardner and avante maddox when they were in high school in detroit and that he always has players hitting him up to watch the film and he does that. So yeah, he's aware of both Quinyan and Cooper to Jean. He said that

he wants to prepare these guys as much as he can because he doesn't have a lot of time left, but no one's beating him in a race. He says, Isaiah Rogers thinks he can beat him in a race, but no one's beating him in a race. When he said the thing about not a lot of time left, what's your guess on his

long tail here at the end? Two years. Here? Oh, I don't know, one year here maybe. Okay. Yeah. Including this one. Do you think that this is his last year with the Eagles?

What's the contract? Let me pull that up here. I certainly wouldn't rule that out. That would actually be a good show this summer is players who we think are like playing their last years with the team because there are some high profile guys that might fit that conversation. Yeah, Cooper or Darius Slay. Nothing guaranteed next year? Nothing guaranteed next year.

So, yeah, I could see this being his last year with the team. I think that's probably the most likely outcome. And then what about Tyler Steen? Tyler Steen. Tyler Steen, so he was asked about, well, I should say, I asked him directly, is this your job to lose? And he says he's not viewing it that way. He thinks he has to earn this job, right?

And so that's the approach he's taking. I thought he spoke well about the transition from tackle to guard. Like he's more comfortable with it this year. It was an adjustment. It was an adjustment last season. I like Tyler Steen. Yeah, me too. Personally, yeah.

I think he's got interesting perspective. Yeah, nice guy. Always enjoy talking to him. And yeah, it's interesting hearing him talk about adjusting from tackle to guard. It's, you know, I asked him a question that I hoped to would get like a fun answer. that's when he walks in, he sees his locker has been moved to Ken Gergen's a local. Yeah,

because that shows you're the top right guard, right? And we talked about this back when Ken Jergin spoke to reporters. In the back right corner of the locker room, they have five lockers, and it's arranged with the starting offensive line. Now there are times when a player gets benched

and they don't have to move their locker, but going into the season, so they literally moved Jurgens' locker to Kelsey's locker, and they put Steen in Jurgens' locker. They gave Steen Juergens' locker. Okay? So what's that feeling like? It's like when the manager calls you up and says you're going to the show, right?

Nah, he's saying he didn't, he didn't think much of it. He said he didn't even notice, really. I'm sure he noticed. His stuff was moved, right? Right. He didn't think much of it. No. And, you know, I think he was asked about, like, specific things that Statland is asking him to work on.

And he didn't necessarily go into that either. but just like getting used to working with a little bit less space and having people on both sides of you is a thing that he feels more comfortable with now than he did a year ago. Exactly. Well said. With Sacon, we talked about the golf thing, but from a football perspective,

he said that it like sunk into him when he was in the huddle, the first day of seven on seven. So I assume he's talking about Monday. And maybe Devante was there, or maybe he was just saying it as a figure of speech. But he said he saw AJ Brown, Devante Smith, Dallas Goddard and J. Jalen Hertz. And he's like, this is pretty good or this isn't bad.

And that doesn't even factor in the offensive line. I mean, I'm going to take a shot here at the Giants. I mean, John Ross is like the best player he's ever played with. Parrish Campbell. I mean, seriously. So, yeah, that stood out. And, you know, I've pointed this out on social media last night. J.1. Hertz, A.J. Brown, DeV.

Smith all have contracts that are locked in through at least 2028, you know? In Sequin's case, he's going to be here 2024, 2025. We don't know about 2026. They can get out of the contract then. We don't know if Dallas God are just going to be here beyond this season. But Sequin can feel confident that during his time with Eagles, he's going to be playing with the best wide receiver combination he's ever played with. And I would argue the best quarterback he's ever played with, too.

I mean, easily. Well, like he had ended the career, Eli. There was a period. I mean, Eli won two Super Bowl ranks, but he had end of the career, Eli. Yeah. Easily. Yeah, exactly.

So. Tanner McKee is the best quarterback he's ever played with. Other than Joe Hurts. Eli was better than Tanner McKee. I disagree. I mean, you love Tanner McKee. Well, Eli retired for a reason. He didn't have it anymore.

He retired because once a giant, always the giant, right? I guess. That's what he said to his retirement. That's not why he retired. Yeah, he had a chance to keep playing, but he wanted to retire a giant. I think he changed it actually. He said once a giant, always giant, only a giant, I think is just what he said. What was his last year?

Classy. 2019 played four games. Yeah. Was that, was that, did Sequin come in 18 or in 19? Sequin came 18? 18. So he had one year with Eli playing a full year. But yeah, I mean, they weren't.

He wasn't good. Eli? Did they go to the playoffs that year? No, no, he didn't have a playoff. No, he was 5 and 11. Yeah, he's never actually last year was Sequin's first playoff year. I'm confusing that with

that random Ben McAdoo year when they won and the Giants players took the boat trip to or trip down the Florida before the playoff game in Green Bay and then got their butts kicked in. Yeah. Macadone.

What? Macadone. Macadone. Yeah. Could have been. the Eagles coach. He could have been the Eagles coach. They wanted him to be the coach. A few guys. They like Adam Gates that year as well. Maybe like the Jeff Rlery always hires the right guy is a little bit luck driven. Well, I would suggest anything in life's luck driven,

but you're evaluated based on the decisions you make, right? So. Sure. You know, they made the decision to offer the job to Ben McAdoo. You're, and like who knows how Ben McAdoo would have done here. Sure. Right? So that's the other thing. I mean, George Sefer was outstanding in San Francisco was not good in Carolina.

So that kind of stuff happens, right? So, yeah, I think environment has a lot to do with it, but you're evaluated for the decisions that you make. Okay. Anything else you want to talk about? Look, I'm here. I'm obliged to be here. So if you got anything else, you want to ask me, I might not answer it, but.

Is there anything else from practice that? You thought what you think is worth discussing. From practice. No, I mean, we'll be out there again on Thursday or next week. I think I assume on Thursday. And we'll get a better sense of attendance if they are mixing and matching. The second team running back yesterday, was it Davis Price or was, no, it's Gainwell? I believe it was Gainwell.

Yeah, I think we kind of covered it. The one thing that's- to, let's frame it this way. What are the things that you would like to see that you're going to be curious to see next week? Well, honestly, I'll say this. It's just a need, and I don't fault eagles for this. It's the nature of it.

So I'll take you guys behind the ropes or inside the ropes, if you will, okay? We have to stand at one spot on, like, one sideline of the field. During these practices, the defensive linemen are on the complete opposite end. I'll bring binoculars next week. You know, Dave Zengarro does a great job.

He always brings binoculars. But I couldn't see the delinement. So I would like to get, I do want to get my eyes on some of these edge rushers, the DeLyman. Brandon Graham was participating in 7-on-7 doing a lot of dropping. Nolan Smith, he can move, right? I mean, you would expect Nolan Smith to look good in 7-on-7 periods. He's a good athlete.

But I do want to get my eyes on these defensive linemen next week. Yeah, and it's hard because they're not in pads. it's just sort of seeing how they move, but yeah, that's interesting. To me, it's just how are things different than they were this week. You know, are there combinations and the secondary different? I'd like to see where Kili Ringo lines up how he's looking. But, yeah, I mean, let's make sure that we're taking everything here with a pretty big grain of salt. Fair enough.

Big grain of salt. What's coming on top for our show tomorrow? You've got some ideas. Yeah, so I'm going to, it's going to be a playoff, you know, our, our good friend, Shield Capadia. Oh, my gosh. What? We got to steal something from Shield?

We're not stealing it. We're taking something that he does and building on it. This is your, you want to take the reins and your big thing is to just take something from Shield? Let me explain. Let me explain. So Shield does this thing where he has like one through nine and you pick the numbers. And it's like a different thing. Oh, my God.

Who could come up with such a wonderful framing device? That's always an entertaining show when he does that. Okay, I always enjoy that. This is not going to be that. It's not about the numbers. It's about the actual questions. I know. That's what I'm saying.

You don't know what's coming, right? It's like a Monte Carlo situation, right? So this is going to be a little different. It's going to be a spin-off that game I play with my son. If you watch the show yesterday, you'll understand. We're going to have an X-Axed and a Y access, similar to Immaculate Grid. There's going to be three categories in the X, three categories in the Y. Okay?

It's going to be Eagles. let's say along the y axis it's going to be eagles NFL miscellaneous okay and then it's going to be along the x-axis would you rather i'm going to have a would you rather i'm going to have a would you rather i'm going to have um a uh convince me okay okay uh so i tell you something and you have to convince me your opinion of it and then it's going to be predict the future I like this This has nothing to do with Shield's thing You didn't have to give him any credit at all

This is a creation of your own You always like You're going to have to go all the way back To just like the inventor of conversation If you're going to be Giving everybody credit here I'll tell you how I was in the shower

And I was thinking about the show The next two days And I was thinking about tomorrow's show And I was like maybe I'll come up with an idea I like this device And I was starting with Shields device. And I was like, let's build on it. Let's do a different thing.

I was thinking the game I played with my son. But I don't want to be a trivia type thing. So I'm like, what if I combine these two concepts? Where it's like you're playing, you know, if you saw Jason Kelsey on Jeopardy yesterday. You know, you don't know. I was going to ask if you saw this. I saw, I just saw the clip that New Heights. I mean, New Heights.

I was trying to get you to watch Jeopardy. And then all of a sudden, in the final, there is Jason Kelsey. Yeah, New Heights does an awesome job with. clips. I saw the clip online of Jason doing it. And yeah, so it's, it's kind of like that. So Bo can say. And what an episode that was. So Bo could say, would you rather NFL, right? And then I would give you, you know, two different things. And you would have to tell me which one. I think people understand. It's good. It's a good one. I look forward to it. Or convince me Eagles. And I won't pick this one, but I'll say, convince me why Tanner McKee.

he's a better quarterback than Kenny Pickett or something like that, right? Okay. And it'll be a fun way to talk about. Yeah, that's fun. I actually, I'll give credit to our P.HL.I. Flyer show, Bill Matt, he has something, and Charlie Connor,

but Bill's kind of, he steers the ship with, he calls it F-A-Round Friday, where they kind of have, like, different fun things they talk about. We're entering these summer months. So I'm trying to think of different framing devices that we can use, and there is, you know, there's a period this summer where Bow is going to be out of town,

an extended period, and I'm already thinking, like, okay, Bo is the creative genius on this show. How am I going to entertain the audio? You know, I do it for, I can't do 14 days of mailbags or 10 days of mailbags. Much as you would like. Yes, what is I would like? What if I'm just like, guys, the next two weeks supply questions for every single show and I will answer them, yes. So, yeah, I'm trying to think of different framing devices. Okay.

that would be fun. The Jeopardy was great. Oh, I got to watch it. Oof. What a performance. I don't want to spoil it if people are trying to catch up, but I was very happy with how it turned out. All right. That'll do it for this episode of the P.H.L.Y. Eagles podcast.

Stay tuned tomorrow, live at noon. Zach's framing device, look forward to that. And that'll do it for this episode. Thanks to Julia for making it all happen. Thanks to everybody for watching live and listening. We will talk to you tomorrow. and as always we love you.