PHLY Philadelphia Eagles Podcast - PHLY Eagles Podcast | Who are the players the Philadelphia Eagles would consider trading up for in the NFL Draft?

Episode Date: April 4, 2024

Who would make Howie Roseman sprint up the proverbial steps of the NFL Draft’s picking order? In a deep class of offensive linemen, is there someone worth giving up serious capital for? Is Alabama��s Terrion Arnold the cornerback of choice? Would his teammate Dallas Turner move the needle for a team that values pass rusher over all else? Zach Berman and Bo Wulf discuss the possibilities and outline why some players would or would not make sense. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

And P.H.O. I Eagle's show. How we doing, Zach? I don't know what that was. I'm excited for the show. I'm a little spooked out right now at the moment. I had, I was. What a professional we are. Yeah, so much to discuss today. Can I intro the show? Or like, do you have? Yeah, sure. Okay. Yes. Okay. So we have news at the top of the show, which we're about to get to. But we will also kind of set up what the theme of today's show is.

and that is the dream trade-up candidates. And what I mean by that, we talked yesterday about how last year Will Anderson would have been the dream trade-up candidate. Oh, you know, Will Anderson? Everybody knows about Will Anderson. That's not interesting. Are you going to have a coherent sentence this show?

That was actually a spot-on, Zach Berman impression, I think. So we'll explain what that means when we get to that part of the show. But the news that I tease is the Eagles are bringing back cornerback, defensive back, Avanti Maddox per league source first reported by Adam Schaefter. Fonte tough now. Yes.

So, Avanti Maddox are the Eagles. They're bringing Vante back. The Eagles are, does someone spike you calling? I don't know what is going on right now. We were having terrific conversation out there about the Eagles trade-up candidates. We get into this room and it's like there's laughing gas going on.

Okay. Well, you gather yourself. I don't know why. I'll just give a brief overview of this. The Eagles released Avanti Maddox earlier this offseason. Avanti Maddox had a big cap hit. The Eagles got out of that cap hit. They let him see the market, but there's always interest in bringing him back.

So, Aventi had a chance to see the market. I believe at one point he visited the Saints. And now he returns to Philly, which is a good spot for him. He's in theory the frontrunner to be the slot cornerback. And when he's been the slot cornerback for the Eagles, he's been productive, he's been effective, he's been tough. The problem is he can't stay healthy. And so my quick hitter on this is that I'm good with bringing Maddox back. I think he's a good player.

I think he fits. You just need to have sufficient depth. You can't rely on Maddox being your slot corner throughout the season because he hasn't been able to do that. But I like the idea of bringing him back. Yeah, I think this is sort of how we expected this to play out, right? Avanti Maddox is a very good player when he is healthy. He has real trouble staying healthy. And so you let him see the market.

The market's probably going to value him as a player who has trouble staying healthy. And so he goes to New Orleans, as you said. He has one conversation with Dennis Allen and falls asleep because that's the most boring man on the planet. And he's one of the worst coaches in the NFL. Is he that boring? The worst coach in the NFL. And Avant is like, oh, my God. Oh, geez. Give me Matt Patricia.

Or this guy. And so he comes back. And it's probably a very team-friendly deal. Maybe there are some incentives to it. Makes sense. I don't think that they, as you said, are penning of Ante-Madix in as they're starting nickel corner. But as a member of a secondary, you can certainly do a lot worse. I think it makes a lot of sense.

And he's a guy who, you know, by all accounts, people love in the locker. Yes. Do you think they gave his locker away or do you think they kept that open for him? I mean, I think they probably hadn't even thought about it. I'm sure these are things they think about. They're putting up the new name tags. People report next on April 15th, tax day, I believe, right? So, oh, I know April 15th tax day.

When you do your taxes? On the process of it, yeah. Oh, okay. Yeah. I don't know if you were like a just do them two months ahead of time kind of guy. I'm not to do them two months ahead of time. I'm not doing them two days ahead of time. and more maybe like three to five weeks ahead of time.

But you just said you're in the process of doing it and it's 11 days away. Okay, so then let's say two weeks, okay? Yeah, no, I mean, I put all my, I gather all my paperwork together and all that. We went to Florida for the owner's meetings. I mean, I basically took care of everything before the owner's meetings and now it's just a matter of, you know, finalizing everything. But anyways, back to the topic at hand, which is Avanty Maddox. Okay. Do you have anything more to contribute?

They're bringing in Vante back. Okay, so let's look at the... You other corners don't know how to ask. What? All right, so C.J. Gardner Johnson, the Eagles brought him in, and there was talk about the versatility with C.J. CJ's here to be a safety. He can play nickel if they need them to, but C.J.

Gardner Johnson's here to be a safety. I want to make that clear. And then I will say that they really don't have the inside, outside versatility for some of these guys returning. I suppose Eli Ricks played in there, but that's not, I'm not looking at Eli Ricks as a nickel at this point. It's not Keely Ringo's game, certainly not James Bradbury's game, not Darius Slay's game. Isaiah Rogers is a guy who in theory can do it. Zah Rogers has the body type. He's been mostly on the outside as you've pointed out.

But yeah, he's someone to watch there. they signed Tyler Hall is that right and so yeah it is so they have some options there but I do think they they need to be sufficiently

well stocked howie Roseman said at the combine they did not do a good enough job last year with depth at that position and I would agree and I think most importantly if Avanti Maddox does indeed make the week one roster or is on injured reserve or PUP

will be extra points in my favor in flu world order. There you go. Things that matter most. That's exactly right. Are you, there's people in the chat. We got to recognize a super chat. Someone said, did Bo have insomnia cookies?

And that is a shout out to my work in college. Back when you lived on Tyler Hall. No, I did not. I lived the, when I, I lived on Sumner, Sumner Avenue when I had the insomnia cookies delivered to me. Okay. Thank you for correcting the record. Yes.

Yeah. That was when I had. Somebody needs to really do a deep dive into the entire back catalog of this show and the other show and put together a definitive Zach Berman Wikipedia page that has everything. And then I was on Livingston, Livingston Avenue when I had the run-in with the entrepreneurial insomnia Cookies Delivery Man. Oh, so it spanned multiple areas. is. Yeah, I was like, that was my thing. I would get home from work at 2, 3 a.m.

Right. I have to do my school work. I need a little pick-me-up. Order at the six-pack, the chocolate chip cookies, the M&M cookies, the sugar cookies. Okay. And they come to the door. Yeah. You know, I tip the delivery guy.

And, you know, he tries to see if there's anything else I'm interested in it. And I say, no, I'm good with them. I'm good with the cookies, man. It's a good racket for him. Yeah. I'm good with the cookies. cookies. In any event, let's get back to the topic on hand, which is the draft. Well, quickly, do you think that bringing Avanti Maddox back changes anything about their draft plans?

No, not at all. I think this is stocking them up here at slot. There weren't that many great slot options available. And I would probably say Maddox is probably as good as what's on the market right now. So, yeah, it gives them an option. there, what you don't want to do in any situation. And we can talk about this with the depth chart is you don't want to go into the draft saying, we need player X. Like, we need to fill this spot in the draft. And not to say that's what it was at slot cornerback, but I think when the Eagles have made bad picks in the past, and slot's not the same as like wide receiver in 2021 or, but, or right, or, you know, guard in 2011. But what you don't want to do is you don't want to do is you

don't want to say we're going to find, you know, we're keeping this spot open for the draft pick. So, yeah, you want to kind of draft proof your roster. What about safety-wise? Do you imagine that there's a possibility that that's where they envision of Antimatics if they end up drafting a, you know, a young corner who can play inside and does this maybe change at all your thoughts on if they're monitoring the Justin Simmons market? No, I think with Justin Simmons, it's if the price is right, right? So it's, it's, it's clear Justin Simmons isn't getting right now what he wants. I think the Eagles would have interest if the market comes to them, but I don't think they're

going to bring the market up for Simmons. As far as Avanti Maddox, it's the old coaching cliche, the more you can do, the more you can do, right? And so... But the best ability is availability and that has been an issue. Yes. But if he can do more things, it's going to help him do more things for the Eagles. But the bestility is versatility.

Okay. Do you believe that? The best utility that, yeah, I guess... Do I believe that? What do you think? I don't know what happened when you walked through these doors today, man. We were sitting at that desk. You were here early today. We did good show prep. Now, why do you say that? When you say that, you make it sound like I'm not usually here early.

That's not at all when I'm making it sound. We get here around the same time every day. There's some days when I'm here first or some days when you're here first. You're correct. I agree. Yes. So that's what I'm saying. You beat me here today. So you were here early today You had your pen in hand You were jotting your notes down

You were you were really like Like you were clued in It's well known in this office That let's save the small talk for after the show This pre-show, Beau's doing his work Yeah Yeah that's true Yeah, exactly

Every day, every day I'm cramming for the test So yeah So Yeah so that's that's my point I do my show prep a little earlier than that. Don't be a show off. I'm not showing off.

No, I'm saying. So I'm probably annoying in the office sometimes. I'm more apt for like the small talk with, you know, Vince or Julia or whoever's in here. You're keyed in. I respect that. It's not showing off. I do it. Emily's at the gym this morning, 6 a.m.

I'm doing show prep. Big flex. Yeah. Yeah, I suppose so. I know I had stairs coming. I didn't have to go to the gym. Yeah, exactly. She's like you're going to the gym.

I say, no, I'm going up seven stories today. Well, I mean, we've got to talk about it now. I was going to save this for later. But have you, what's been the reaction in your life to the Starris conversation from yesterday? Have you heard from people around the world? I've heard from the minions. Like, the people who worship at the altar of bow are like, this is the weirdest thing in the world. I've heard from people who say this is a very normal thing.

And actually, I researched it online. And you at, um, I, I, I, um, I, I, um, I, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, I, um, I, I don't want to misquote this, but you almost, I think you exert the same amount of energy running up the steps, then walking up the steps. For the reason that I said, because of the momentum, like, if you're walking up the... I don't think that that's how momentum works, but... No, because you're regenerating every time when you're walking up a step. And so it's... Anyways, we don't have to get into this, but yeah, I heard from some people who said...

You heard supporters. I did. I, well, I heard, I don't want to say imitators, people who do the same thing, you know, people who, oh, yeah, now, this was kind of misconstrued, which often happens on this show, as, as me being like, you know, Carl Lewis up these steps. You kept saying the word sprint. Okay, that's, I, I meant like hustling up the steps, go quicker, I go quicker up the steps. I mean, you and I have been, have been working closely together for a very long time. How is it that I, that we've never walked upstairs together? I guess we were big elevator people

But this thing You don't like my elevator habits And now you don't like my stair habits So I guess we're We're best off sitting still Yeah Bo doesn't like that I talk to people

On the elevators It's not always I just think there's a time and a place Yeah I mean I think it's weird Or Julia Do you think it's

If you're on an elevator with someone Yeah Do you think it's It's and it's just you and them Okay Do you think it's weird to just like to stare at the ground, not say anything,

or like acknowledge their existence? I mean, it depends where you are and who you're with. I feel like I would always just say yes. I'd say hello and how are you, you know, what floor if I'm closer, but... Sure, general acknowledgement. Let me give you a specific scenario.

It's six in the morning. You're at a hotel and some guy is like walking down for his, is going down for his coffee and he's got his company's shirt on and the man is a costume. by a peppy morning person who says, oh, do you work for that company?

That's where I get my dental insurance. I mean, I'm sure he appreciated it, but I would probably be with sunglasses on and silent, and that would not be. I mean, first off, we weren't. Is it good? And then it's like, oh, is it a good company to work for? And like, yeah, he asked me how the dental insurance was.

And I actually, I was pretty honest with him. And he said, I've heard that. But, yeah. I didn't think that was a bad thing. And I'm not, you know, I'm not asking for, like, pertinent, personal conversation on the elevator there. What I'm trying to do is, is you're just making it, you're being friendly. I think it's weirder if you're just, like, staring at the floor, not saying anything in the... I think, I think the whole thing is to read the situation, read what you think the other, if the other person wants to talk, if you got a Zach Berman in there, yeah, have a little conversation.

But not everybody's a Zach Berman. Some people want to just look at their phone. And tune out for a couple seconds. He wasn't, if he was on his phone, if he was, he was, he was on his phone. He was literally standing there. And we nodded at each other. And I said to him, and he said, oh, that's why I was asking for it, you're saying. No, I think, I think he was happy to have the conversation.

You know, he's, he's someone, he's in the Phoenix Airport Hotel at 6 a.m. He's probably like, you know, go-getter, an ambitious person. He's going down to the gym. He's here on business. and yeah he was happy to have the conversation well Zach the good news is we have him here right now to answer the question here he is

yeah all right lastly I do need to circle back to the stairs oh god all right let's talk about the the genesis of this part of your life is this like do all the Bermans run up the stairs or is this something that you came upon you read somewhere at some point in your life and decided I'm going to be one of these people

first I was not one of these people I thought you meant the elevator conversation because my brother is actually the opposite my brothers are like my brothers think it's weird when someone talks them in the elevator I had a brother or I have a brother who lived in a building at one point

and when he moved he was like the best part about that is he didn't have to see people in the elevator my kind of guy so yeah honestly I never thought of the stairs thing until And I think I overstated it.

So you've been running upstairs your whole life. I think I overstated it. But yeah, I don't. I'm faster on stairs than I am. I'm not like a fast walker. But I'm a, I'm fast on stairs. I don't know. That's, I haven't thought much about it.

And I think we've allocated far too much time in this show to this. I could do like three more hours on the stairs. Yeah. Let's, let's spend the three hours on the draft, on the trade-up targets. Well, you know, we promised that we're going to get to the draft event. and I don't know that it's going to happen today because let me first tell you about our friends at Oli Pop. Oli Pop is, you know, Oli Pop, we've been talking about Oli Pop. You need to get that gut health fixed.

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go, Puff, go, sprint up the stairs and get yourself some holly pop. I was putting my kids to sleep last night. The Phillies game hadn't started, and there was a thought in my mind that in a former life, like before I had a family, before I had kids, what I would have done on a night like that was gone. Let's keep it PG. Was gone to the ballpark, right? Because you can find some great deals on a game that was delayed.

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Okay. Yeah, because, yes, yeah. Yeah, we do these riddles together. And yes. It's a good one. He does this thing, this one, are you smart? And then he does like, you know, what's two plus two? What's four plus four?

And he keeps going up all the way, you know, to like, you know, to the hundreds and hundreds and hundreds. And then he says, what was the first question I asked? And the first question is, are you smart? Not what's one plus one. But he thinks this is like the best riddle for people. So, yeah, that's like the, how do you spell it? Yep. Yeah. Yeah, reads the best.

I'm with you. Yeah. Can I tell you, I have perfected an impression. Oh, goodness. I just want the audience to know I have nothing to do with this, wherever this is going to be, if this is offensive, if this is funny, please absolve me of any type of responsibility for what was about the deal. This may, I think not a single person may recognize this, but in my house, this is a, I've nailed it. This is the dinosaur train conductor.

Are you ready? Okay. Okay, here we go. Well, bless my scales and pull my tail. Okay. Good work. Good work. Thank you.

I'm not sure where that's from, but that's good work. I told you, the dinosaur train conductor. Oh, is that the name of the show? Dinosaur train. Dinosaur train. Gotcha. Good stuff. Bless my scales in palmer tail.

Doesn't worry. You gotta go up at the end there. Case you get a kick out of that? I mean, it's just, it's killing everybody. It's great. Awesome. That's better than you. And then there's also a, there's a, there's a,

what if Kirk Couss was the conductor? Yeah, my, my, my, my, right. There's also the dinosaur who, uh, is sort of an Elvis ripoff. It's like, hey, little mama. Okay. I'm a little bit scared of a crowd, little mama. A little thirst and truadon. No, nothing.

I mean, I'm not familiar with the show, but yeah, sounds great. Sounds great. Sounds great. See, we got some fans. All right, good. All right. Okay. That'll do it for this episode of the future, Y Eagles podcast.

We're going to talk draft tomorrow. We promise we're finally going to get to it. No, let's get to these straight up kind of these. The thought exercise here is, we talked yesterday about Howie Roseman's draft history, the proclivity to move up, but those have been small move up. Sure. Part of that is because they, They've been picking a little bit higher, and so there's less room to move up.

But they are at 22. It is rare for them to stay put. I actually think there's a good chance that they do stay put this year. But what we want to do now is talk about not the guys who are sort of small trade-up possibilities, you know, like the Andre Dillard situation from a couple years ago, the guys who might be tempting for them to move up significantly. And let's define that as they have two second round picks. Somebody they would be willing to give up one of those. second round picks to move up for.

So you're probably talking about the like 13 to 16 area. And there might be some give back like you give up a second, you get back a third or a fourth, something like that. But guys who they would view as like difference making players and worth giving up, you know, significant capital. Now, I have five guys here and they're like four of them. I can sort of squint and see it. And like I could see how,

Howie Roseman would talk himself into it. But there's really only one guy who I view as a realistic possibility, but we can sort of go through all. But again, I just want to give you credit because I think that's a good way of framing it when I texted you about this on the ride home from work yesterday. I was thinking that, like, you know, I didn't know how to define this because you can say, all right, well, trade up from Marvin Harrison Jr., right? No, it needs to be like a realistic type trade-up thing.

So saying you're not giving up next year's first, but you're willing to give up. one of your seconds. So that gets you. So really if a player drops out of the top 10 and they're in that, yeah, let's say 11 to 16 range, 12, I think you said 13 to 16, that's a really good way of framing it. And I'll tell you, I actually have, this is not necessarily done on purpose, but I have five guys and five different positions. Okay. Do you want me to start and we can Yeah, you start? I think you're, the guy you're thinking of is probably my top guy as well. Okay. I think now I'm going to start here with the guy who is probably the least realistic to drop. But if he did, I could see them talking themselves into it.

And that is, I do not believe that they want to draft an edge in the first round. I do not believe that they should draft an edge in the first round. However, I do think if there were circumstances that led to Dallas Turner dropping to like the 12 to 14 range, I think that they would be interested. Now Dallas Turner is, you can give us the full report here, but actually all of my guys here, they sort of check almost every box. He just turned 21, contributor as a true freshman, three years of productivity, a little bit of a drop as a sophomore, 10 sacks as a true junior, a little bit undersized, 6,3, 247. So that would be the one knock, although his actual, his top athletic comp on mock draftable, yeah boy, Josh sweat. but otherwise 88th percentile wingspan 80 percent arm length great testing numbers 44640 which was a 98th percentile 40 and a half inch vert which was 97th percentile 92nd percentile broad jump so you can understand like that this is a super athlete whose whose limitations are a little bit like power right but knowing the things that the eagles care about a guy who was productive at a young age at an elite school at an important position that's a guy who I think

would intrigue them. Yeah, you and I are in alignment on this. Dallas Turner to me, like, he's the best edge rusher in the draft, and there's no one close. Latu, Jared Verse, Chop Robinson, there's a dropout. There's a tier of one. And that's what you look for when you're trading up, too, is like, you don't want, you know, you're not going to trade up for a guy you can get a comparable player at your

spot. Those other guys you mentioned, I haven't done my full deep dive on them, but generally speaking, I would have no interest from the Eagles perspective. I mean, Chop Robinson athletically. Maybe. You'd have to move down, I think. But Dallas Turner, for the reasons you mentioned, like, you know, the age, the production, he was starting on Alabama's defense as a true freshman.

Crazy. Right? That says something. This was for all the recruiting nerds like me out there, and we'll get some recruiting conversation in here as well. He was the, like, just a five-star. coming out of Fort Lauderdale, like a true, true, true, everyone wants this guy in the country type player. The size, you hear that knock, he did put on weight when he was at Alabama, or he put on strength, that should say.

He came in much leaner than he is now. 34-inch arms, which is like really good for someone who's 6'3 or thereabouts. was a team captain at Alabama was like the best player on that defense well that's not true Caleb Downs but he was the guy who like you always circled he can drop you're not drafting a guy because he can drop but that just shows you the athletic ability that he has

you saw the sack production you see the athleticism like 446 is absurd and all the other measurements there. Like, you mentioned Josh Swett. That's an interesting mock draftable one. The player he reminds me of was Brian Burns coming out of Florida State. Yeah, I think that's a reasonable comparison. And Dallas Turner to me is like he's, if he gets past Atlanta, let's say, then you start

to say, all right, you got to think about this because, look, the Jets were a team that you imagine might have been on them. Now the Jets get Hassan Reddick. So if he's, if he slips past 10. then, then that's, I think he can be a difference-making edge, and I think he's the clear top edge rusher in this draft. I think I agree with you. And because of that, I don't really understand why it even seems to be a possibility

that he could fall out of the top 10. I mean, you know, you're going to have four quarterbacks in the top 10. You've got three receivers who are definitely going a couple tackles maybe. But like, he is a guy who I could convince myself is worth giving up that second round pick for. the other concern you've got to wonder about is this is an Eagles team in the NFC East. You got to play Dallas. Do you feel uncomfortable having a player named Dallas on the team? Yeah.

You'd have two Dallases. You'd have twice as many Dallases as they just need to bring Dallas Reynolds back as the assistant offensive line coach. Yeah. Yeah, shout out to Les Bowen on that one. But so, yeah, I hear what you're saying. I saw a clip on social yesterday from our friends at C.H. HGO. Adam Hogue does a terrific job covering the Bears there. And he was talking about wide receivers specifically.

And he's like he keeps hearing and seeing that there's going to be, you know, three, four wide receivers taken in the top ten. And his point was wide receivers tend to slip. Like teams build with, you know, teams build on the lines of scrimmage. I was wrong about this in the 2020 draft, 2020, 2021. Yeah. I thought those, I thought that like Judy and Lines and Lounge. Lamb and Waddle, or not Waddle, it was a...

So the 2020 draft? 2020. The J-Wryger year. Yeah. Yes, the 2020, yeah. Yeah, where I thought those guys were going to go earlier. Yeah. And they all slipped to, like, the mid-teens.

And there was a run on tackles in that draft, too. And so, yeah, so it does surprise me that, you know, like, real credible draft people when they do their mock drafts have Dallas Turner sometimes. If he gets past Atlanta or Tennessee, like, in those early teens. and I'm like, well, if he's there, I would offer my second round pick because he's a rare prospect in my eyes. Okay.

I'll give you my next one. And this is another one where I, and this is why I think they're going tackle, because we've talked about how, I don't love the framing of you draft a guy based on what the contract value is, you know, relative to that. The draft is about, is about getting the best players you can

and at important positions and because this draft is so deep at tackle, it is a rare opportunity to get a very good tackle at 22. Yep. And I don't know that there's too much separation between, you know, guys two or three through seven. But let's assume that Joe Walt goes in the top show. Sure. He's out of the picture.

The one guy who I could see them moving up for and probably not like this is not like a Dallas Turner move up. It would be more of like a to 15-16. Just the profile. I think Olu Foshanu is the guy that makes sense to me. Yep. The Penn State tackle obviously. Now this is a guy who has only played left tackle.

And we talked about, I don't think that that is a negative for the Eagles. So I think Jordan Milata's versatility is a factor here. Turns 22 in December, so he's only 21. Rotational player in 2021. Then two years as a starter, his, you know, like the, you know, sacks and quarterback gets numbers he gave up are great. Not enormous at 6.6.312. And he's got those

80 bitty, teeny tiny hands. Eight and a half inches, which is the exact same size as Kenny Pickett's hands. Kenny Pickett's got the small hands for a quarterback. He's got small hands for a left tackle. But other than that, and that's maybe one of the reasons that he might fall, in terms of like the athleticism, their rare traits of the way that he moves, something that Jeff Stalind might be intrigued by. He's the one guy who I could see them viewing as, uh, differentiated from Fatanu and Fuaga and Tyler Guyton and Amarius Mims. Yeah. So I'm, I'm with you there. And I, I had him on, on, on, on this list when I first sorted it out. And I agree with you. And I think in his case,

in Foshano's case, there's, there's almost like, um, post hype fatigue, if you will. I think that's right. Because like going into the year, he was viewed as like the top tackle. You kept hearing, you know, it was a surprise when he went back to Penn State this past year, because he would have been the top tackle in last year's draft. And I don't think he, there was anything this past year that really pushed him down the board. Joe Altz kind of gotten pushed up the board. Quarterbacks and wide receivers are outstanding. But yeah, Fashano, when you look at the age, when you look at like the athletic profile, I know sometimes you can make, where I can make too much about this, you look like the

personality profile, like a really smart guy, a finalist for the Campbell. award, which goes to the top student athlete in college football, when actually he was, he went to high school with Caleb Williams at like an elite private school in Washington, D.C. Gonzaga. Yeah. And so he's, he's, there's a lot. Dan Dickow taught him how to play. Not Dan Dickow was not there.

But yeah, he. Do you have this problem with Tyler Guyton? Does he make you always think of AJ Guyton? Not at all. Really? Yeah. There's more than one Guyton in there. There's more than one Guyton in the world.

Not as far as I'm concerned. So, yeah, so I hear you there. He is someone I would trade up for now. The one thing that I wondered is he's, and again, I'm not an offensive line expert. We're going to have a lot of offensive line talk. We hope to bring in people on the show who can kind of give expert opinions on this. But from those I've read and from the people I've spoken to about this, he doesn't necessarily have the guard profile, right?

And so if you're looking like, all right, who can start for now, that doesn't mean you can't learn, but who can start for you day one at guard? I don't think that should be a factor in making the decision. You just take the best player, but he's not. This is your chance to get a starting tackle for the next, you know, I hate saying 10 years because that's, so I registered, but for the next six years. Yeah, but I do think with offensive tackles, you think 10 years with offense to tackle, some other positions, like I don't think when you draft a corner.

or a wide receiver, you might be thinking 10 years. I think offensive tackle, the lifespan at that position, you're hoping it's a two-contract guy. So, yeah, so I like that. And I'm on board with you there. And it does surprise me because going into the draft. Do you like him second best of the group? I do.

And I thought going into this draft cycle that he'd be the top guy, based on the production, based on the athletic profile, Joe All has seemed to jump above him. Joe Walt's interesting in that going into the year at Notre Dame, like Joe Alt and Blake Fisher were both viewed as elite bookends. And Joe Alt kind of took his game to another level. There's a lot to like about Joe Alt, you know, just a really productive player, 6'9, brother of a former Philadelphia Flyer, actually Mark Alt.

Joe Alt really seems to be the top guy there. But yeah, I think Foshanu, I think Al and Fashano are the top two. I keep seeing, you know, Fawaga from Oregon State kind of being pushed in there and maybe that's the case. I'll admit I learned more about Fowaga at the start of this draft process. I didn't know as much about him during the season.

I guess I wasn't staying up late. I wasn't staying up late enough, I guess. That's right. I have general skepticism about offensive linemen who, like the very first thing that people say in why they're good is that they're nasty. Okay. Yeah. Like, it reminds me of Trevor Penning from a couple years ago. Like,

oh, great. Like, he's like, he's like trying to beat up people at the Senior Bowl. Meanwhile, Kairn Johnson's like dusting him around the edge. Let's calm down a little bit. I think Fulaga is a fine prospect, but yeah, I would rather take the guy who's athletically gifted. So then I will go here with the offensive tackle. I will give you, because I was thinking of Fulaga here, but I'm saying, am I really

kind of putting this on Fulaga? Maybe I'm leaning toward big school guys, but J.C. Latham is interesting to me in that a really strong player at Alabama has some good. Guard versus the I think he can play guard. There's a little bit of Sean Andrews to his game in terms of like the overpowering size, like the physicality. You're smirking here. I'm trying to remember the song.

Get your Michael Phelps on, your Michael Phelps on. Get your Michael Phelps on. You're Michael Phelps. J.C. So. That's for the real heads out there. Yeah. So look, I'm probably on brand here going with two Alabama guys so far.

But J.C. Ladin, who was the right tackle. who just like just huge like you see jacy ladham like between him and a marius memes you can block the sun right um yo but uh yeah yeah um i i think if he's someone who who now he was a right tackle in um but if you say all right he can be lane johnson's replacement but he can also step in and play right guard for you uh that's the offensive tackle that i put here but I would rather trade up.

I would rather trade up for Foshano than for Latham. Do you view my issue with, is it Latham or Latham? Sorry, I think it's Latham. Yeah, Latham, let's go Latham. My issue is I don't know that I view him as differentiated from the rest of those guys and I would not give up a second round pick

with confidence that he's going to be that much better. Like I would rather have Tyler Geyton and a second round corner. than just J.C. Lath. Yeah, I am with you there because it goes back to our Dallas Turner argument. You look at tiers. Where's the drop off? And so if you say, oh, and Fashano are the two top ones, then Fashano is there.

Then you trade up for them because maybe you can get Mims or you can get Geyton and you don't know if there's the differentiation compared to J.C. Latham. All right. Before we keep on, keeping on, let's talk about Moses Foco. Foco is a leading manufacturer of sports and entertainment merchandise with a product line that includes apparel, accessories, toys, collectibles, novelty items, and more. Foco has been with us since day one. It's the best officially licensed gear for all sports and fandoms. If you're going to a basketball or a hockey game or a baseball game now that the season has started, show off your love with team-branded friendship bracelets, whether it's hoodies, jackets, beachwear, or even overalls,

There is something for fans for almost every occasion. Plus, Foco has hooked PHLY up and provided awesome pieces for our sets, which you can see behind us. Foco always has our back for Philly Sports, and they have yours too. Get the best gear around by using the link in our description. For all non-presale items, use the promo code P HLY 10 for 10% off. Go check it out, click around. Hard pressed not to find something that you want on Foco. I was pumped to see my most recent Instagram follower.

It was Philly Sports Trips. Oh. And I'm pumped to see that because Philly Sports Trips does a great job. I was monitoring very closely the trip to Clearwater where people had a great time. Our Ph.L. Why, Philly staff was there. Fans got to meet Charlie Manuel, hang out with him. And Philly Sports Trips, they planned the whole experience out from flights and hotels, the game tickets, and transportation. I've been on their website a few times in the past few weeks looking at their Brazil itinerary.

We're really impressed by that. You spend, so you should be on the lookout for more events throughout the year with Philly sports trips. We're pumped to have them as a partner here at P HLY. And don't wait the book. Head to all pHLY.com slash events to learn more about potential trips that are coming up. All right, let's have the Brock Bowers conversation. Yes, all right. You knew where I was going here.

Okay, he's my third guy and I'm ready to have this conversation. All right. Brock Bowers. You didn't even let me introduce. You knew me that well. You knew me that well. Brock Bowers is the best tight end prospect since the last best tight end prospect of a generation. Since Kyle Pitts.

Since Kyle Pitts. Exactly. Yes. Very productive. Extraordinary. As a true freshman. 882 receiving yards and 13 touchdowns as a true freshman. Comes back the next year, 63 catches for 942 yards and 7 touchdowns.

And then last year missed some time with an injury, but in 10 games had. 714 receiving yards with six touchdowns. That's more production per game than it was. Over the course of the beginning of his career, he turns 22 in December, so he's only 21. He can block. He's from Napa, which I mean, like, if you're getting real concussion uncle,

do you really want a guy on the line of scrimmage who's like sipping wine? I don't probably not. There's more Napa than sipping wine. No, there isn't. And yet his name is Brock Bowers, which is a great name for a tight end. Really high-level analysis here. All that stuff.

I just, you sell me on it. Okay. I believe that this is a, that this is a possibility. Yeah. So, okay. That I would not, that I would not like. So Howie says, so how he's in the room. And he's gathering all his scouts and executives and different, you know, analysts.

Now is Tom Donahoe here? No, Tom Donahoe here. And Howie says, everybody write down on a piece of paper, who in this draft? has the best chance of becoming an all-pro player, okay, the best player at his position in this league. And I'm going to collect this and we're going to tally it. And the player whose name is highest, you know, the player who gets the most votes is the player we're going to target.

He tallies that. The name that will come up the most is Brock Bowers. More than, I mean, unless you feel K. Williams is going to be like the best quarterback or the best quarterback in the NFL. Unless you feel Marvin Harrison Jr. is going to be the best wide receiver in the NFL. Unless you feel Joe Alts can be the best tackle in the NFL. What about Malik neighbors? Or I like Ramanzae. But really? Yeah. We're going to have a disagreement there. Okay. Brock Bowers, in my opinion, has the chance to be the best tight end in the NFL. He is so productive. Elite at getting open, elite at running after the

catch. He doesn't have standout size. He did not run. You don't really know what his measurements are. But when you watch Georgia and you could say he was the best player on the field, offense or defense. And they had, I mean, they had great defensive players. You watch him as a true freshman against Alabama. He took over games. The recruiting nerds out there who are watching this will remember Alabama, I brought in Darnow Washington and Eric Gilbert, like two five-star tight ends, great players. They couldn't get on the field over Brock Bowers. That's like Brock Bowers was the number one receiver on the national championship teams as a true freshman. He was better than Adanoi Mitchell, who is, you know, who is outstanding this year in the end of the draft.

He was better than George Pickens. Like Brock Bowers was the top guy in the offense. And he's been that way for three years. So if you're saying we're giving up a first and a second round pick for a player, for what you want is someone who has the highest likelihood of being an elite player. Now, it's not an elite position, but it's an elite player. And I think that's what Brock Bowers could be. That's number one.

Number two, if you go with the Bowulf theory of how can we upgrade this offense, right? Brock Bowers can play in this slot for you. I believe. Missing me with that. Okay. Dallas Goddard is, as we've said, a number of times on this show is older than Zach Earts when the Eagles drafted Goddard. It is older than Brent Selik when the Eagles drafted soccer years. But in addition to that, Dallas Goddard is coming off his lowest yards per game since the 2020 season.

So Goddard's production is down, not just the health. the production's been down. I still think Dallas Goddard's a really good player. But if you go from Goddard to Bowers, like you feel real good about what that tight end room is going to look like post-Gotter. I think he has the ability to day one, upgrade your offense, and then year two, year three, be one of the elite players in the league at his position. The ability to get open, the ability to run after the catch,

the ability to be used around the formation. you've seen Dallas Clark comps. You've seen George Kittle comps. I think that years from now there's going to be Brock Bowers' comps. I think he's a better player than what Sam Leporta was coming out of Iowa last year. Sam Leporta was a major difference maker for the Lions. So yeah, I can absolutely sell you on Brock Bowers. If your logic is, let's find the player who has the chance to be the best player at his position in the NFL.

I think there is connectivity. between Sequin and Barclay, the decision to sign him and the possibility of drafting Brock Bowers on a couple fronts. You know, it is if we need to make this offense, a top five offense in the league, while adding weaponry that's not necessarily going to upset AJ Brown and Devante Smith,

and I could see yourself talking yourself into Brock Bowers. I think what you said about Dallas Goddard is the most important thing here, and it's not that they need to upgrade tight end two. It's that Dallas Goddard there's a bit of a risk

that he is like about to fall off a cliff. His production has waned and he has trouble staying healthy. So I can sort of see that. There is also what would worry me a little bit is some of the worst howie instincts of look at this splash I made.

Everybody's going to pat me on the back or on the league. Like look at what I did. I named the, the, I got the busiest guy possible without really thinking it through. Like, oh my gosh, they got Brock Bowers. They got another Georgia guy too. Like, oh my gosh.

I have, I have concerns about the player and the value. I mean, he looks awesome. Part of the, like, there's a lot of times where he's just so wide open where it's like he's schemed open that bothers me a little bit. That doesn't bother me, but it's like, you know. that's not going to be the case in the NFL. Also, his, like, his superpower is breaking tackles. Is that going to be?

Now, Dallas Godd is good at that, too, but is that going to be something that he can do against NFL level competition? You know, the SEC is as close as it gets. That's true. I think he's probably a good player. I mean, I think he's probably going to be a very good player. There's a good chance he's a pro bowler. Like, if you had to bet on anybody being a pro bowler, he might be the guy.

Now, it has changed a little bit in recent years that, like, Titans used to, to take a long time. It used to be like a three-year deal before a tight end was really even functional in the NFL. That has changed a little bit recently. La Porta is one of those.

But the big problem here to me is like the confidence interval, the range of outcomes. If he is not a pro bowl tight end, if he is not one of the four best tight ends in the league right away, it's a bad pick.

And to give up your second round pick, to move up to get him, I just, I cannot believe that that is the best use of the resource. Okay. Look, I hear what you're saying. But I don't think it's, I don't think that it's off the table.

You know, I don't love the idea of training up for a non-premium position. And so I get that. Now, there is this idea that tight ends are undervalued and maybe that during the lifetime of Brock Bowers' deal, there's a market correction there.

I mean, you know, Travis Kelsey is the number one receiver in Kansas City, right? Now, I'm not saying Brock Bowers, that's going to become Travis Kelsey, but I am saying, I suppose I am, because I'm saying he can become the best player at his position in the NFL. When you said that about Howie, it kind of tapped into something that I'm curious your thoughts on this. Do you, I guess what do you think is more important to Howley? Hitting big or not missing? Because I frame it that way as saying like, if, because you said,

oh, there's all this talk. Look, Howie Rosem got him. I don't think you're worried about Brock Bowers missing. Maybe Brock Bowers doesn't become all pro. Maybe he's just like a pro. I shouldn't say just a pro bowl. But like if you trade up for someone, if you trade up for an offensive lineman who's like Andre Dillard

and just miss on him, that or if you take Jalen Rager and he misses, like maybe there's this instinct where like take the guy who the floor is high enough where you're not going to look back and you say, man, you missed on that pick. Yeah. I mean, I think I, I, I, always think that saying like a guy has a high floor is, you know, it's the Aaron Curry conversation. Sure.

Sure. Yeah. You would have said the same thing about Kyle Pitts, right? Like, this guy's going to be great. I mean, he is great, but. He isn't great. I mean, he has a chance to still be functional. He is not great.

He was outstanding as a rookie. He got hurt. And that brought his, his value down in these last two years, the injury. But, yeah, I mean, I'm still, give me all your, all your Kyle Pitt stock. Like, I will put it all. I put all my chips in the table for Kyle Pitts. They took Kyle Pitts over Jamar Chase, didn't they? Or did Chase go first?

Yeah, Chase went first. Or they took him over Waddle. They took him over Waddle. They took him over Devonte. Yeah. They took him over Sertan and Horn. That's true. And Pines Sewell, right?

Yeah. No, you're right. They did take him over Chase. He went four. Chase went five. Which is the perfect framing. should have taken Seoul, premium position. But it's the perfect framing.

They took a tight end over the top receiver in the draft, and he's been just okay. They could have had the best receiver in the NFL. I mean, his rookie year, he had 68 catches, 1,000 yards, 15 yards, 15 yards of reception. Well, he had 60 catches. 68 catches, 1,000 yards. Yeah.

All right, I hear your point. I think Pitts is a star, but I hear your point. We don't need to relitigate Kyle Pitts three years later. But I know, but I mean, especially when he grew up right over there. Well, that is the conversation. Yes. You know, now it's a little bit different because you would be.

You're not drafting him at four. You'd be, you know, trading up to draft him at 16 or whatever. But trading up is also is actually, I think, kind of similar to taking him a guy at four. Like, you better be sure. Sure. And if he's, if he's, if he's just hitting like his 80 percentile outcome, that's not good enough. Yeah. So he is on Daniel Jeremiah's board.

board. He's the seventh overall player. So the idea of getting like a top 10 player on this track. And it's, when you're going to take a guy at a non-premium position and value him that highly, like he has to be one of the best. And I don't know that I can say with certainty that he's going to be one of the best. Yeah. I mean, I look at this board. He's the, and again, I'm not saying Daniel Jeremiah's gospel, but Daniel Jeremiah does this. really well. He's worked in the Eagles front office. He's the top non-quarterback, non-wide receiver on the board. But that's also evaluating the player, not the value. Exactly. Yeah, that's a value

in the player, not the value. So I'm saying, so it goes to my original argument is, is you say, who is the chance of being, the best chance of being an all-pro player in this draft? And I would say that is, I mean, maybe I would say, I love Marvin Harrison, Jr., but there's a lot of really good receivers. I think Brock Bowers has a chance to be the best tight end in the NFL. Okay. Two more guys. And I still have not gotten to the guy who I think is the most likely. I'm going to give you one more first. And boy, would it be odd if they drafted a defensive tackle for the third consecutive year? But I could see them being intrigued by Byron Murphy the second. Now, so impressive that Byron Murphy the corner was able to have a son at about five years old and that he grew

in to be such a productive defensive tackle. And a lot bigger. And a lot bigger. Byron Murphy the 2nd from Texas, still 21 turns 22 in September, undersized, right? You get sort of the Grady Jarrett comps with him. He's six foot and a half,

297, rotational player for two years. And then as a true junior last year, five sacks from the interior, tested pretty well at the combine, 91st percentile, 40, 83rd percentile, 10-yard split, all that stuff.

The reason that I think I could see them talking themselves into Byron Murphy is this is a situation where we are the best spot for him, right? Because if we have Jordan Davis plugging up the middle and Jalen Carter attracting the attention to his right and you put Byron Murphy to his left and they can, like he's just going to feast on one-on-ones, he's going to eat. And if we are throwing the fastballs on the outside, we can die. dominate the middle of the line. I could see them talking themselves into that.

To me, this would not be like give up a second round pick. This would maybe more like move up four spots or something like that. But he's a guy who I think, like I don't, I mean, it would be wild to draft a defensive tackle three years in a row. But I could sort of see themselves talking themselves into him. Yeah, they'd be wild to take one three years in a row. But I would rather have him, and I think they would rather have him, than any of those second-tier edge rushers. Sure. right?

I just think, like, what does it say? This, that would basically make Jordan Davis an early down run stuffer. Like, that's, you're saying this is what Jordan Davis is. Well, yeah, but we've had two years to watch. Sure. Let's not, let's not pretend that, you know, we're going to count on something else coming. It takes away Jordan Davis playing in even fronts. Well, I mean, they rotate.

There's enough, there's enough snaps for them. But also, I mean, Jordan Davis is not going to be counted on to play a ton on even downs, even fronts. So, yeah, look. If you're saying, let's just talk about the best players, I get that. If you trade up three years in a row for defensive tackle, I'm saying, Howie, is this the best way to use your resources? But yeah. I agree. But it's a position we know they care about.

It's a way that they could build the team. I could squint and see it. I don't think it's super likely, but I could squint and see it. And who's your most likely one? My most likely one. And this is to the conversation we've had, about the position. I don't know that I think

that they will have a ton of confidence that they can stick at 22 and differentiate between the corners. The corners, the second tier of corners. But to me, Terry and Arnold is everything that they want. Played on a very good defense. Now he redshirted his freshman year,

but then two years playing. It was an All-American last year as a redshirt sophomore. He's not like, an elite athlete test out of the gym which is a reason why he might be within range 511-189 he has played inside so there are paths to immediate playing time wherever you want

you know we'll see how Avantiematics does but I could see them and let's say some other team values you know Quinn and Mitchell more because I don't think the Eagles would but let's say that Quinion Mitchell goes like 13 or something like that and all of a sudden at 15 16 Terry and Arnold is still there on the board I could absolutely see

and I think that he is the player who I would view as the most likely trade-up possible for them to go get him at a position of short and long-term need and a guy who checks every box. I hear what you're saying, and I don't disagree. I don't know if I personally have the confidence that he is a cut above the corner you're going to get a 22. If that is the case, then absolutely.

And I see what you're saying. like if you feel that there's a tear of Mitchell and Arnold and Mitchell goes first and Arnold's there at 15 or 16, you're moving up. You're calling up Cincinnati and you're saying, I want to go get Arnold. What's it going to take? He looks to me like the best prospect of the bunch by a significant bunch. Yeah. So then, I mean, corners are hard. Like, to me, he's not, he's, I don't feel the way about Terry and Arnold, the way I felt about sauce gardener or the way.

the way I felt about Derek Stingley or the way I felt about Patrick Sartan or the way I felt about J.C. Horn. And now that could evolve here. But I think that yeah, he's probably the best of this group, I would say, but I look at this group as kind of like the strength here

is that there's good corners like, let's say, three to six, you're going to get good, you know, there's good players there. I would rather stick and pick at 22 and take, you know, a Cooper de Jean or, you know, Kui McKinsterie or someone of that nature at corner, then saying, all right, I'm going to give up another pick to get Arnold.

But I agree with the logic. If you feel there's a clear difference between him and Koi, between him and Cooper DeGine, then it's worth giving up a pick because that is such a hard position. And if you have conviction in the player, I would give it up. Did you have anybody else? No, so I had the collection of offensive tackles. I didn't know if we would have the conversation about the Oregon State guy.

And I think you keep hearing, well, he can play guard and tackle, right? With that profile, I preferred Latham, but I was considering him. I was saying wherever that drop off is at tackle, like if you feel that there's a drop off from Latham, I'm sorry, from Fashano, from Lathano, from Ler, from Ler, from Ler. them and then you feel like the next category is Mims and Guyton, I would try to trade up for that higher tier. Wherever you feel that drop-off is, I would try to trade up

for that. But the one that I felt I liked Foshano and then I thought lay them because of the versatility. Just generally speaking, I want to say that like you know, trading up and thinking that you have a degree

of certainty on a prospect and giving up draft equity to do it is usually not great. Agreed. And so, like, unless it is, like, you know, Dallas Turner, I think I could sort of talk myself into potentially. And I like Terry and Arnold a lot. It would depend on the price.

But I think they're in good position to stay at 22 and get, like, I would not, I do not think that they should trade up for a tackle. Because I think it's a unique opportunity to sit at 22 and get a top 15 caliber offensive tackle. I actually think that they're in position to trade down. I agree with that. Yeah. I don't know if there's going to be a big demand to move up to the 22.

There's not usually a ton of movement from 19 on. Now the Eagles have done it before. Yeah. But let's say Michael Pennix falls out of the top 20 and he's there at 22. And a team in the second round wants to move up. I would consider that and add a second rounder next year or something of that nature. like similar to the Dallas Goddard trade that they did a few years ago and it took it it takes a lot you know it depends how far how far back you fall but a team at the top of the second wants to move down or say like carol you or say a receiver slips and Carolina is is like man you know how's how's Brian Thomas still on the board here let's trade up and then you go to the top of the second round and then I feel like you can get a good tackle there and also they lost their third round pick maybe you get a third round pick back at some point so yeah I I think trading down would maybe be more appealing.

But the player that jumps out to me is Dallas Turner. And then Brock Bowers, I don't love trading off for a tight end, but I really like the player. And then if you feel like there's a drop off at offensive tackle. Okay. Good discussion once we got to it. Yeah. We were opening. But there's one commenter.

I read every YouTube comment. We all know that. There's one commenter who does not like how we start the shows with Small Talk. And every time he's like, I can skip the first time, but then he always chimes in, like, I really like this talk. He's watching.

He's watching. He's sticking around. Yeah, appreciate it. I think he's just doing it, he's doing it because he knows you're reading. I think deep down he loves it. I read everything. I know you do.

Yeah. Message boards, comments. I feel very confident that deep down, he likes it. He likes it. He likes being able to complain about it. We got to get these iTunes comments back going. We haven't had one in like two weeks.

we got those rolling again show a little skin maybe it'll happen I'm not doing that bless my skills and pull my tail there you go they'll like your dinosaur impression fun show coming up

we have our we have a very popular guest coming tomorrow go ahead I was trying to think of someone very popular I was pitching it to you Demi Lovato

is she popular I was pitching it to you can we say it yeah we got Baldi coming on Fletcherca oh sorry sorry we got Baldi

Emily Berman. That is not happening on the show. I'd be afraid of what she reveals. Brian Baldinger. Wait until you see how he walks down the stairs. Brian Baldinger will have on tomorrow. Excited for that. Always good talking Baldy.

We're going to get into some of these offensive line conversations with him because you know he's grinding the film on these old linemen. So looking forward to that. And then Bo and I are actually going to have a meeting right after the show where we're mapping out the next few weeks. And I've already kind of brainstormed how we're going to lay this out. I'm curious what both things. But we are going to go deep into draft discussion during these next weeks.

I promise you it's not going to be a situation where it's like Wednesday before the draft that we're introducing you to players. You are going to hear. I mean, I disagree with that. There's always players to introduce. You know what I mean. It's like, all right, let's talk about the draft. It's this week. So, yeah.

So. Yeah, we can get into it during these next few weeks. Excited to do so. I will make no such kind of promise. We're going to talk about whatever we want to. talk about. That's what we're here for. All right, good stuff. Thank you to everybody for watching and listening. Thank you to Chris Mad Dog Russo. Thank you to why. Well, that was the beginning. Oh, that's what you were doing. Okay. I didn't put it together. I just thought you had some insomnia

cookies when you walked in. We got get insomnia cookies to. They get a lot of free press. Yeah. Although everybody probably thinks that they're THC infused. I don't know what that means. You don't know what that means? I'm familiar with what that means. I'm saying I can't give testimony for that. Okay. Oh, Mike asks, what about the trivia question you posed at the end of Tuesday's show?

I got a couple of responses on Twitter about looking back for the last time a team made the Super Bowl with at least two members of the starting secondary being white. and I forgot to look at what the answer is. It was the Los Angeles Rams people were coming up with. When? I'll tell you real quick here. We got a few of these responses. Oh, I didn't.

I only saw two responses. Yeah, two of these responses. Big Mike, I believe, said Super Bowl 1, but I thought that was a joke. Super Bowl XIV, so 14, Nolan Cromwell, and Dave Elmendorf with the Iowa Rams. Yeah, those sound like white guys.

from the from the L.A. Rams Nolan and Dave. That is from Paul Arch 65. So thank you, Paul. And really impressed that you know that. Help, help. He's beating me. Look at that.

That's him calling for safety help. Okay. Thanks for watching. It's too fast. I want to close the show? Bless my skills and Paul Matel. All right. That'll do it for this episode of the P.H.O.E.E.O.E.

show. Thank you for everybody watching and listening. We will talk to you to tomorrow. at noon. And as always, we love you.