PHNX Arizona Diamondbacks Podcast - 5 IDEAL Relief Pitcher Targets For Diamondbacks In Free Agency

Episode Date: November 21, 2024

The AL & NL Cy Young winners were announced and for the first time in three years no Diamondbacks players received any votes. We have more on who did and why Shohei Ohtani and Aaron Judge are already the obvious winners for tonight’s MVP awards. We also discuss five ideal relief pitching targets for the D-backs that include Kenley Jansen and Carlos Estevez and why this was historically the most important week in franchise history. Join Derek, Jesse, and Shane for the PHNX Diamondbacks Show LIVE! An ALLCITY Network Production SUBSCRIBE to our YouTube: https://bit.ly/phnx_youtube ALL THINGS PHNX: http://linktr.ee/phnxsports MERCH https://store.allcitynetwork.com/coll... ALLCITY Network, Inc. aka PHNX and PHNX Sports is in no way affiliated with or endorsed by the City of Phoenix PHNX Events: Get your tickets to PHNX events and takeovers here: https://gophnx.com/events/ bet365: https://www.bet365.com/olp/open-accou... Use the code PHNX365 to sign up, deposit $10 and choose your offer! Disclaimer: Must be 21+ and physically located in AZ.  If you or someone you know has a gambling problem and wants help, call 1-800-NEXT-STEP, text NEXTSTEP to 53342 or visit https://problemgambling.az.gov/ Bluechew: Try BlueChew FREE when you use our promo code ALLCITY at checkout--just pay $5 shipping. That’s https://bluechew.com promo code ALLCITY to receive your first month FREE. Visit for more details and important safety information, and we thank BlueChew for sponsoring the podcast.. Zbiotics: Go to https://zbiotics.com/phnxdbacks to get 15% off your first order when you use PHNXDBACKS at checkout. Pre-Alcohol is backed with 100% money back guarantee so if you’re unsatisfied for any reason, they’ll refund your money, no questions asked. Empire Today: Schedule a free in-home estimate today! All listeners can receive a $350 OFF discount when they use the promo code PHNX. Restrictions apply. See https://empiretoday.com/phnx for details. Branded Bills: Use code PHNX at https://www.brandedbills.com/ for 20% off your first order! Gametime: Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code PHNX for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply. Circle K:  Join Inner Circle for free by downloading the Circle K app today! Head to https://www.circlek.com/store-locator to find Circle Ks near you! Shady Rays: Exclusively for our listeners, Shady Rays is giving out their best deal of the season. Head to https://shadyrays.com and use code: PHNX for 35% off polarized sunglasses. Try for yourself the shades rated 5 stars by over 300,000 people. Check out FOCO merch and collectibles and use promo code “PHNX10” for 10% off your order on all non Pre Order items. Rugged Road: Gear up for your next adventure with Rugged Road Coolers - Your ultimate outdoor companion! Head to http://ruggedroadoutdoors.pxf.io/ALLCITY and use code PHNX for 10% off! Get 10 FREE meals at https://hellofresh.com/freedbacks. Applied across 7 boxes, new subscribers only, varies by plan. When you shop through links in the description, we may earn affiliate commissions. Copyright Disclaimer under section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for “fair use” for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, education and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

We know the Arizona Diamondbacks are going to be looking to improve their bullpen this off season, and we have five ideal relief pitchers that the Diamondbacks should be interested in. All this and more in 30 seconds, don't you go anywhere. Jesse, name them all right now. Happy throwback Thursday to you all. Welcome it to another edition of the PHNXTVax podcast right here on PHNX. My name is Derek Monti. Of course, occasionally know.

As your mayor of PHNX, this man next to me, occasionally not. As your vice mayor, my Thunderstay, the one and old Jesse Freeman. And we have, of course, five ideal candidates, like we said earlier, that the Diamondbacks might look into in order to add to their bullpen to make this team better in 2025. But of course, we also do have Shane Divenbach on the ones and twos making Jesse name all five of them before we got to the show. I don't know if we do have five free agent targets talk about Derek. Because if Shane is going to do that to me, then I don't think we're going to talk about him today. We're blackmailing people today.

I was blackmailing Max to sit people on his fantasy football team and Jesse's blackmailing him. It's a big Thursday around here. Here's what can happen. This is the show right here. Me and you, it's cool. Ripping back and forth. Yeah, let's talk about Mariners Diamondbacks trades. Let's talk about that for the next hour.

Occasionally we can just show the Jesse Cam and then come back. See where he's at. Just show that he's still there. Come back to it. Well, of course, I am the Scy Young, a winner of this show, I guess. But we do have the NL. Cy Young results to talk about. Of course, we have, of course, in the AL, Terik Scoobel winning unanimously.

And that was, I don't know. Not much of a surprise. I guess there were some other candidates that were up there, but Terrick Scoob will have an incredible season. And then Chris Sale gets 21 of 30 first place votes and wins the National League Cy Young Award. Interesting, considering that there were some people that thought that that little trade was a bust for Chris Sale turned out not to be. Yeah, I'd say that trade worked out pretty well for the Braves. If you're the Braves, you feel pretty good about trading Von Grissom for a guy who just went out and won the Cy Young Award. It's sort of mind-blowing to me, Derek, that this was Chris Sale's first Cy Young of his career

for as good of a pitcher as Sale has been for so long for this to be his first Cy Young at age, what is he, 35. It's pretty crazy that it took this long. Sort of felt like it was only a matter of time in his younger days. But given all the injury issues that he's had recently, you kind of wondered if Chris Sale was ever going to win a Cy Young. It certainly didn't look that way as a season ago, but his turnaround this year was remarkable and he absolutely deserved it. This is the first time in three years that an Arizona Diamondback did not get a single vote when it comes to the Salyang. Yeah.

No surprise there because it's not like anybody deserved it, but I feel like we just kind of get used to Zach Gowlin constantly being in that conversation. And sometimes Merrill Kelly being at least thought of or considered. Yeah, I mean, J. Mart was snubbed, Derek. Let's start there. That's the one that we need to talk about. You can't put Ryan Helsley. Ryan Helsley can't be getting down ballot votes without J.MAR also getting down ballot votes.

No, I don't think that at all. But yeah, it is a little weird. I mean, yeah, you mentioned Diamondbacks haven't had a situation like this where they haven't had anyone get even down ballot votes since 2021. And that all has to do with Zach Gallen, right? Zach Gallen got down ballot votes last year. He got votes the year before that as well. He did not in 2021.

there was really no diamond back who was deserving of any kind of award in 2021. So I guess that tracks. But yeah, a little weird to have the, the Sy Young results come out and not see any diamond backs there, especially in a season where we thought we might have multiple diamondbacks on this list potentially. Jokes on us when the one we thought that was going to be a good rotation. Instead,

it's ranked in the bottom four of Major League Baseball. But yeah, no, I mean, again, no surprise. But like you said, we do kind of get used to it. We, but there's no doubt in my mind. Nobody on this team based on injuries, based on performance. Anybody really deserved it. Meanwhile, one guy that definitely deserved at least consideration for the MVP, which is named tonight is Kattel Marte. We know that MVP voting drops tonight and that is the probably the least surprising thing that we are waiting for because it's a foregone conclusion that this is going to be a Shoaheotani Aaron Judge Award.

I mean, do you see it going any other way? Uh, nope. Okay. Oh, that's, that's the input from BBWAA, A writer, Jesse Friedman, ladies and gentlemen. Nope. It's just error judge and Joey Otani. Well, I mean, again, the numbers, the numbers are what they are. And it's hard to argue that either of those guys are not deserving of the award and won't win it.

Um, but Catelle Marte is going to finish in the top five for sure. And that's, again, I mean, depending on how much you care about players finishing in whatever. I mean, Cotel does because he gets more money for finishing in the top five. But, you know, again, it's at least an honor for Catelle to be there. And he deserves it with the season that he had. He absolutely does. Yeah, it'll be interesting to see exactly how the ballots look. My guess is that you're probably not getting any first place votes for Cotel.

Maybe he could get a second place vote. Maybe there are some people, as we discussed, maybe a week ago or so, that would look at Cattel's rate stats and just be so impressed at what he was able to do offensively compared with Francisco Lendor. and yes, Lindor did have a very good season offensively as well, but if you compare their slash lines, there really isn't a comparison. Kattel was far in a way the better player offensively. Obviously, Lindorr brings, you know, a little bit more on defense as a shortstop. Sure.

Cotel was valuable in his own way in that regard as well at second base. He played really good defense this year too. I think ultimately him missing some games at the end of the year, it was going to make it really hard for him to get much consideration beyond third place. But you should have a pretty tight hold on third place. I would be pretty shocked if Ketel wasn't a pretty clear third behind those top two guys. You also pair that with where the Diamondbacks finished and missing the playoffs. And it makes all the sense that Francisco and Lindor, if you're talking about those two players looking fairly even to voters, then you're probably going to give the edge to Linder based on what the Mets were able to do.

And again, you got to tip your cap to them for what they were able to accomplish. they overcame quite the deficit as far as their win-loss percentage to make their way back into the playoffs. And honestly, they made this season kind of about them. When you think about the 2024 season, even though they didn't win the World Series, the Mets are kind of one of the main characters in the 2024 season. A big part of that was Francisco Lindor being the leader of that team. So again, all credit to those guys and credit to the guys that are going to win it, Shohei and Aaron Judge.

Curious if you think any other Diamondbacks players are going to get any down-bout, votes for the MVP. Yeah, well, before I say that, I just want to say that I'm kind of an idiot because they literally named the finalists for this award. And Catea is correct. So we know, we know Catelle Marte is getting third place. That is not a question tonight. But yes, as far as other guys on the Diamondbacks who could get down ballot votes,

this is a really interesting question. Some people might have forgotten that, believe it or not, last season, there were three members of the Diamondbacks, Derek. who got MVP votes who appeared on an MVP ballot. Of course, if you are voting for MVP, you don't just vote for your top three or even your top five. You put 10 names on that, on that ballot. And that means that when you rank them in order, essentially.

And you rank them in order. And that means that when all the ballots are cast, we inevitably have usually over 20 players who appeared on at least one of those ballots, right? You've got 30 people casting a ballot with 10 names on it. Right, right. So you're not just going to end up with 10 names. Not everyone's going to pick the same 10 guys.

We usually wind up with about 21 or 22 guys who show up on a ballot. And the Diamondbacks had several of these guys a season ago. So yeah, it'll be very interesting to see how that pans out. I was listening to baseball barbecast last night. Our friends, Jordan Schusterman and Jake Mintz, our pals over there. And they were doing a fun exercise where they tried to predict all of the players who would show up on on the the MVP ballots and in both leagues and believe it or not Derek they had three diamond backs on their list who did they have on their list could tell martez the obvious one you want

to try to guess who the other who the other two guys are oh man um i would say a j puck no no these are these are these are these are obviously um position they are position players so gino swarres gino swaris was one of them yeah both of them both of them both of them pick kicked Gino as like a lock. They both had Gino as a lock to get at least some. Interesting. Down ballot MVP vote consideration. Wouldn't be the first time for him.

I believe two times in the past, Eugenio Suarez has appeared on an MVP ballot 2018 and 2019. So yeah, I think there's a pretty decent chance that Gino appears on a ballot. Do you want to guess who the other guy that they picked is? Oh, God. Christian Walker? I think that's a pretty good guess, but it was not Christian Walker. They picked Corbyn Carroll there.

No. Well, I mean, honestly, if you start looking at just Corbyn Carroll from the end of June beyond, then yeah, I could see how that would be your assessment. Oh, yeah. And in a lot of cases, that's what, you know, guys vote based on isn't just necessarily what they, how much they struggled for a portion of the season, but how good they were once they kind of found the rhythm and how long they were able to sustain that for. So that doesn't actually surprise me too much, but I think we just know that Corbyn Carol had a very, very, very erratic season to say the least and lacks consistency.

Corbin was one of the MVP vote getters from last year, if I'm not mistaken, right? Corbin finished fifth last year. He finished higher than Juan Soto. So Corvin, yeah, 2023 was very, very impressive for him. You're going to do that sometimes. Yeah, you're going to get some votes, not just some rookie of the year, but an MVP as well. I feel, I think I'm with the baseball barbecast fellows about Gino. I do think that someone is going to give Gino like a 10th place vote or a ninth place vote or something like that.

Corbin, I feel a little bit less confident in just because, I mean, I guess this was the case with Gino too, but there was such a narrative for like the entire first half of the season that Corbin was just a shell of himself, right? everyone was sort of, not everyone, but a lot of people were talking about it around the game is, here's this guy who just totally went off his rookie season and has just not been anything like that in his sophomore year. But as the season progressed, he, as you said, he was a very, very, very good baseball player from basically the middle of June through the end of the season. So I wonder if like that narrative being in people's heads and then looking at the numbers and seeing like

solid numbers, right, it is a 2020 season. But it's all. also an OPS of 749 and an OPS plus of 107. Like I think there's going to be other guys that that are higher than that. There's really plenty of other guys who are higher than that. So I am a little bit skeptical of Corvin showing up on a ballot, but it wouldn't it wouldn't totally shock me at the same time. It definitely wouldn't shock me as well. But like you said, it's, you know, it's MVP voting and you got to come up with 10 names.

And sometimes it's, it's, you know, who you saw and who you felt really was the most valuable players, especially to their team. I don't know. I guess that's why it doesn't, it also wouldn't surprise me to see, you know, no downvotes, down ballot votes for the Diamondbacks players because they didn't reach the playoffs and they just might not be considered by voters. But congrats to Cattell Marte. He deserves that recognition. He also deserves the pay bump that goes along with finishing in the top three.

Give that man his money. I need more flashy cars and more flashy shoes. I also think it's interesting to look at last year. where we mentioned Corbin was fifth in MVP voting, but the Diamondbacks did have two other players who also got down-ballot MVP votes last year, or I guess I should say down-ballot MVP vote. Both of them appeared on one person's ballot,

and it was a 10th place vote. Was it Zach Gallen? Zach Allen was one, and the guy you said earlier, Christian Walker was the other one. He was pretty good last year. Both of those guys got one 10th place vote in MVP last year.

So, yeah, I can safely say we're not going to have any debaq's pitcher showing up on any ballots this year. That's for sure. Maybe Jay Mart, maybe AJ Puck. But yeah, I think it is possible we could see a Gino, a Corbyn Carroll. Maybe someone votes a Christian Walker again this year. I would think probably not given that he missed that month with injury. But you never know, Derek.

Things are, things tend to work out in weird ways. Like T.J. Friedel got a 10th place vote last year. There's a lot of sort of random players who get votes on a year-to-year basis. Gabriel Farrer asks a great question, by the way, Jesse. I know this doesn't relate to any of the MVP or Cy Young voting, but with the big story right now in MLB being Juan Soto and Roki Sasaki, who do you think gets off the board first? I mean, we know Sasaki probably won't happen until January 15th. That's like the earliest that's going to happen. Yeah, that would be the earliest that he could sign.

Do you foresee that deal being done prior to that? essentially in it just being one of those situations where he signs on that date? Or do you think that that's like when things will open up and the hot stove will get even hotter? That's a very good question. I mean, normally the way that we see the international signing period work is, as we've discussed quite a bit, teams have these agreements, you know, they have these verbal agreements in the works for years leading up to that date. And so it's kind of a formality of just making it official once the date actually comes around. I guess it's possible that Roki Sasaki could play out the same way where all of the negotiations are going to work out or occur before that date.

And then once it rolls around, it's just a matter of actually making everything official. I think there's at least a chance, a decent chance that Juan Soto signs before January 15th. I know at one point there was a rumor about him wanting to pick his team by the end of the winter meetings or something like that. I'm not sure that's going to happen. but I do think that Soto is going to sign before Sassaki maybe by a pretty wide margin. Like Shohei Otani last year, I know it felt like an eternity,

but he signed in, what was that, the second week of December, I think. So I would be pretty surprised if Soto dragged out all the way until mid-January. For the sake of all of us,

let's hope that that does not happen. For the love of God, please, let's get it done. Let's get it done. What we do know, that the Diamondbacks aren't, probably aren't going to be

in the Soto sweepstakes, but we never know. But what we do know is they are going to be in the market for some relief pitchers. So we have some good candidates. The Diamondbacks might be interested in that are free agents this offseason. We're going to be talking about those candidates on the other side of this break. So don't you go anywhere? Of course, betting over at Bet365 always makes sports more fun. And you can get down with the 90 million users worldwide on Bet365.

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especially around, you know, Thanksgiving and the holidays, stop by the Starliner diner. You won't be disappointed. It's the place to go there for lunch. Even if you don't get a vehicle, just go eat there. All right. Well, of course, we have some candidates here for the Arizona. Diamondbacks to look into this offseason as far as relief pitching goes.

I know that first base is going to be the biggest priority, obviously considering the departments. of Christian Walker and the fact that they're going to need to have a first baseman. At least that's what I've been told. The fact that Jerry Depoto is going to make a trade for Pavin Smith, probably send over Andres Munoz. So you won't even need to worry about the reliever, really. You just need a first base.

That's fine. Well, we'll go into some more first base candidates as well. But, I mean, just in case Jerry takes the holidays off and the Diamondbacks need to make a quicker decision, we have some good candidates, of course, that they can look into. Jesse, I know that the Diamondbacks don't have a lot of money to spend. but relievers essentially shouldn't cost that much. And I mean, they're set on starting pitching. So it feels like they should be able to go out and get a quality arm,

even if it's one of the more notable, more expensive arms out there in the bullpen. Yeah, I guess one of the biggest questions here for me is we know the diamond backs are interested in acquiring a back-end reliever. But what kind of back-end reliever, I guess? Less so lefty versus righty. I think we're probably looking for a righty given. AJ Puck is now very, very good, a member of the Arizona Diamondbacks. But yeah, are we looking for a closer? I guess that's sort of the big question.

And yeah, approaching this, we sort of went that route. A lot of the guys that we're going to talk about today are guys who have recent closing experience, not necessarily that like you couldn't take them out of that role if you wanted to, but guys who at least are capable of filling that role. And you think about where the Diamondbacks stand as far as far. as closers are concerned, Justin Martinez was really the answer down the stretch after Paul Seawald was removed from that role. I know Tori Lavello refused to call Justin Martinez his closer at any given point. But that was the reality of the situation, basically. I know A.J. Puck,

you know, some other guys might have filled in once or twice, but it was really Justin Martinez's job. And he did well, but at the same time, do you want, you know, your 23-year-old who still is kind of getting his feet under him in the big leagues. Do you want to name that guy your closer from day one or maybe find someone who has a little bit more experience? I often wonder if the reason why that Tori didn't do that was like the same reason why I won't call you my friend publicly, right? It's just it's too much pressure on you.

You know what I mean? Like and also that's a wild analogy. Even though it's true, it's just it's something I won't acknowledge publicly, much like Tori wouldn't acknowledge Justin Martinez as his closer. But no, I mean, obviously we know that when Paul Seawald came over, he wasn't a dominant closer. He wasn't a guy that was coming over here and an elite relief pitcher in the league. It was just that he was a very good closer and he had years of experience. It's remarkable what the addition of Seawall did for the bullpen.

And we've talked about this so often. It's the reason why it's, I guess, a little baffling why Tori wouldn't name a closer there down the stretch. It seemed like once they did have that person identified the year prior, that everybody knew their role and everybody felt more comfortable in those roles. So I feel like the reluctance to name one of those guys that are closer, whether it was Justin Martinez, whether it was AJ. I don't care who. Could have been Joe freaking Mantipli for all I care. Just name a closer so that everyone knows what their job is. The amount of feedback we received from the rest of the bullpen when Paul Seawald came over is still sticks in my mind.

because they all emphasized how important it was having that guy in that role. And that's the reason why we think the Diamondbacks might go out this offseason and make that the priority so that they have that security down, you know, that that, at least that role locked down and everybody else can kind of work their way into their roles from from that point. Yeah. So, I mean, like all that to say, our starting point in coming up with, with ideas for who the deba backs could target is that we want, they probably want a closer.

Maybe ultimately they're going to decide that the prices are too. higher or whatnot and settle for something, something different from that. But that's sort of our starting point in this discussion. And that brings us to a closer for a couple of teams in 2024. It was very, very good. His name is Carlos Estevez. We've talked about him as a potential trade target for the diamondbacks in the past. Now he would be, of course, a free agent target.

And you can see why, Derek, looking at these numbers, 55 innings in 2024 with the Angels and the Philadelphia Phillies. He was moved at the trade deadline, a 245 ERA, 0.91 whip, a strikeout rate, 23.6% walk rate at 5.7%. Like that. And he was 26 for 31 in save opportunities, which is not, doesn't jump off the page necessarily, but that's over 80%. That's a solid conversion rate for sure. Well, and again, no closer is going to be perfect. But we will all still as Diamondbacks fans freak out when they blow saves.

But I mean, the thing about Esteve is, is, is. is just, again, the idea there that the Diamondbacks don't necessarily, I don't know if they need to go out and get necessarily maybe the best closer available on the market. Sure. He's a very effective closer. And I think you talk about those numbers being with a pretty bad Angels team. He could still have a lot of value, I think, on a competitive team.

And he did with the Philadelphia Phillies, that's for sure. Yeah, you know, he gave up a certain grand slam to Francisco Indoor. That's true. playoffs that is true no no relievers were good at the playoffs yeah right right you know that everyone we talk we talk about is is well actually the next two guys we talk about we're pretty good at the playoffs so i guess you stay corrected on that front but video game rob thompson refused to use carlos steves we know that that's that's that's true uh yeah carlos estvez is solid i don't know that he is 2.45 ERA solid moving forward.

I'm not sure I expect him to maintain that level of production. We showed it earlier. His strikeout rate at 23.6% is actually pretty low for a back-end reliever. You know, league average strikeout rate is about 22%. So you're barely above the league average. So, and obviously with a closer, you're expecting probably a lot more swing and miss than your average pitcher. So the big development for Estévez, 24 was that he sort of just stopped walking guys.

You see that walk rate of 5.7% is really, really good. That was far in a way, the lowest walk rate of his career. But he's not missing a ton of bats. You know, you look at the barrel rate that opposing hitters had against him. It was relatively high. So I'm not really looking at Estevez as an elite closer moving forward, but that sort of is what he was in 2024. And you have to feel pretty good about that.

Do the debacks have elite closer money is the question? Is that what makes him a more attractive? What? I was going to let you finish. No, go ahead. No, that's what? Here's a bigger question. Is the closer spot in baseball the most important position when it comes to intangible things?

Like, as R.A. mentions, the Kamehameha celebration, the dominant walk-up song and video presentation that Cam mentions. Those are more important than anything. No, you're right. I mean, that's 75% of being a closer. The rest of it's getting kind of in the strike zone. Like Diaz would be nowhere near. Oh, absolutely. We wouldn't even know Edwin Diaz's name most likely if it would be for that entrance.

It's a lot of true, too. That trade was really good for the Mariners, by the way. It all comes back to the Mariners for Shane. It really does. No, I mean, I don't know. We've seen closers be fairly important, at least during the regular season. That's the one thing here with the Diamondbacks, especially considering how short they fell of the playoffs this year, right?

If they had a closer and they win one more game, then we're talking about what they did in the playoffs and not them not making the playoffs. So I do think that that role is very important for the Diamondbacks to fill and to have and to not have it be this closer by committee, despite the fact I still think that that's outrageous. I think that using the best available relief pitcher

in the ninth inning based on matchup still makes the most sense to me, whether it's AJ Puck or whoever else. But still, I'm in favor of them getting this closer role established. And again, the one thing with Estevez compared to these other guys we're going to talk about is cost. And the Diamondbacks might need to fill, obviously, some more roles besides just that first base role. And they might not be able to afford some of these more elite closers that are available in the free agency market. So MLB trade rumors projects three years, 27 million for Carlos Estevez.

yay or nay, Derek. What do you got? Yeah, I'm doing that. I don't hate that. And I also don't know, like, again, it's the fact that he's a solid back end reliever. So if the closer role doesn't work out, I still think that there's some value there. But I mean, again, this is not what we're looking for. We're really looking for a closer. I think that we can be confident that's going to be good in that role. And I don't know. I mean, I'm trying to look for the future here for the Diamondbacks. And I still think that Justin Martinez is going to be the future.

So I don't know if they need to sign a closer or back end reliever right now to a longer term deal. They could maybe get a little bit more expensive option. That's maybe just a one year deal and fill that gap until 2026 when I think Jmart might be ready. Yeah, that's a and that's a really important part of this discussion, I think, is do you actually want to commit three years or four years to a back end reliever, not just from a risk standpoint, which there certainly would be some if you're giving three years to someone like Carlos Estevez. but also just from a like do you actually need someone for that long right the diamondbacks in and as far as the bullpen is concerned they're in a pretty decent spot like justin martinez has a lot of team control left a j puck you have for two more seasons you know kevin ginkle ryan thompson those guys have multiple seasons of control remaining uh maybe you don't feel the need to find like a long-term closer solution maybe it's more more of a stopgap situation uh and that serves as a perfect segue to our to our to

to our next guy, who is or was a member of the Los Angeles Dodgers. So maybe people are not too happy about that on the front end. But Blake Trinen also was a pretty big reason why the Dodgers won the World Series in 2024. And you can see his regular season numbers here, 46 and two-thirds innings, a 1.93 ERA, 0.94 whip, strikeout rate up over 30%. So about seven percentage points higher than Carlos Estevez, walk rate at 6% a FIP of 3.00. We do not have his save numbers here, Derek,

because Blake Trinan, I believe is the one guy on the list that we have today who did not spend some giving time closing in 2024. He had one save and five opportunities, but saves are a weird stat, and I wouldn't really read much into that at all. So he's the guy who has closed in the past. I think he probably could close if you need to, if you need him to, but more than anything, he was just a really freaking good back-end reliever in 2024.

What's going on with Blake's last name there? It was it was misspelled, so he just turned to Blake instead. Yeah, no, I get it. Well, I mean, there's many advantages there, right? The biggest one being that you're taking one of the Dodgers' best pitchers away from them, and you are making them a Diamondback. He was also extremely elite for the Dodgers, and you could argue that they wouldn't have won the World Series,

even with all of their high-powered, you know, high-priced free agents, all, everything they've added. He was probably the key to them winning the World Series there and just a big part of even their regular season run. So just a really good pitcher that you can take away from a division rival and add to your team. And I think that's obviously the biggest reason to do that, not to mention all the benefits that brings to this, you know,

this Diamondbacks team. This is an elite closer, and that's what right now the Diamondbacks need if they want to compete in 2025. This is kind of an all-in season for them. So I could see them going in on a shorter-term deal. That's worth a lot of money to bring someone like Trinan in. Yeah, Trinin, the big thing with him has always been injuries. He missed, has missed a ton of time in his career with shoulder issues. You look at his career stats.

he pitched five innings in 2022 and did not pitch at all in 2023. So he basically missed two complete seasons with ongoing shoulder problems. And then he finally got healthy in 2024, did have an injury pop up early in the season. It wasn't shoulder related. But for the most part, was really healthy throughout the 2024 season. And he did serve as the Dodgers closer, at least a portion of the time in the playoffs. He had three saves over the course of the postseason. And he pitched two in a third innings in game five of the World Series in a game where the Dodgers were extremely shorthanded on the pitching side.

Jack Flaherty gave them basically no length. And Blake Trinen was able to step up in a huge way. And again, this is a guy who's at all kinds of shoulder problems the last few years. Like not necessarily the guy you want pitching 45 pitches in one game. But in the biggest moment, he was able to come up in a really big way for them. Well, since we want to steal a pitcher away from the winning team from the World Series, might as well also talk about stealing one away from the losing team from the World Series. And that's Clay Holmes.

Clay Holmes is a guy that had kind of a rough career with the Pittsburgh Pirates there for a while and then somehow just became incredible with the Yankees, fairly incredible as a reliever for them. And he posted a 1.61 ERA in his first season with then 2.54 in 2022, 2.86 in 2020. and then last year was actually his worst DRA in his time with the Dodger with the Yankees. 3.14 or pie there as Shane so eloquently put it. 63 innings pitched a 1.30 whip, 25.1% strikeout rate, 8.1% walk rate. 30 saves out of 43 opportunities. Kind of like Carlos Estevez, right, Jesse, like not a guy that's going to blow you away with the numbers too much.

His strikeout percentage just a little bit there above league average. but a guy that got the job done for the Yankees this season. Well, just so I'm reading, make sure I'm reading this graphic correctly that Shane made us, this does not communicate that Clay's ERA was 3.1414-159. You're so annoyed. You are so annoyed. This is why I won't admit he's my friend in public, right? We're going back to this there.

Bring up the little Shane cam. I want the Shane cam up there. We'll just do this ourselves from now on, Shane, because I don't want to talk to him anymore for knowing that off the top of the same joke Derek i had to go with the bit you know you know i don't think you did i don't really i really don't think you did but uh clay holmes again another great option uh not going to cost nearly as much as some of the others but again these guys were in the world series Shane so you get that world series exposure and i feel like that's maybe the danger of trying to sign them in their you know walkier after their contract is that they just

now cost more because they were on teams that went all the way to of the World Series. Jesse, what is the, doesn't pie have something do with a circle? It does. What does it have to do with a circle? It's what you used to determine diameter, right?

Pie is the, wow, I get, I'm like flexing my math teacher muscle on the show. Why are we doing this? Very often. I hate this. Pie is the ratio of the circumference of a circle to its diameter. You see?

I guess it's on the right direction. You still don't get your camera back. Yeah, don't put the camera on him. Jesse say something nice about Derek. Impossible. again this is why i won't admit he's my friend uh one thing that stands out to me about clay holmes is he's really not going to say anything that he does not have anything we're just we're moving right along here we've got more we have more uh free agent we got sorry we got to show moving i forgot

so clay holmes had a 64.6 percent ground ball rate in 2024 like that and i think that's something you have to very much factor into his profile yeah he You're right. He's not going to strike out everyone in the world, a 25.1% strikeout rate, as you said, just a little bit above league average. But when you're getting so much contact on the ground, it definitely helps a lot. Holmes is a guy who doesn't really allow many home runs as a result of that. It makes sense. Everything's on the ground. It's hard to hit a home run when you hit the ball on the ground.

That's what I've heard. So, yeah, I think he's a solid reliever. people probably perceive him as being worse than he actually is because he pitched for the Yankees. And as an outsider, the fan base there does not seem to take too well to relievers who are anything other than like absolutely dominant. I'm going with Elise's comment here because we know at least is actually Mike Hazen. So this already means that they're not going to sign home. So it doesn't matter.

But Elise quote unquote says, I watched him pitch a lot and it was usually always dramatic and never easy. It's why you stop being their closer, L.O.L. I don't want that drama in my life, Jesse. I don't need that drama in my life. You know what? I would like a low drama, like just conflict-free closer that just kind of comes in and does his job. Maybe it's not flashy. Maybe it's not sexy.

Maybe he's not throwing 105 miles an hour. But I don't need that in my life. What I need is to not have, you know, ulcers because of our relief pitchers, especially in the back end because that's what I feel. That's a good way to lose my ulcers on. That's a good way to pitch relief pitching. We need less ulcers. Yeah, less ulcer.

So ulcer free baseball. Please. That's the Arizona dime best way. I have enough gray hairs in my beard already. You should have seen me before I took this job. But yeah, I think that there is something we said about a ground ball pitcher, but Lee says he's not, he's not very, he's not without his excitement. What Elise said is very valid.

He had a 1.30 whip, which we showed earlier, which is, which is on the higher. end for a back end reliever, right? Like, that's a lot of base runners. So, yeah, by no means do I view him as a dominant weapon. I don't think he's maybe quite as good as he was a couple years ago. His velocity hasn't really dropped. His sinker still averages about 97 miles an hour, but it just got hit around quite a bit in 2024.

Opponent batting average on the sinker, I believe, was 318 this season. No one was really touching his slider or sweeper, but that sinker did get hit. fairly well. So yeah, he's not, I don't know if you're necessarily penciling Holmes in as your closer if you sign him, but at the very least, he could be like a helpful addition to the mix, right? Like Clay Holmes is better than whoever is like seventh on the diamond backs of the depth chart right now, right? So he's still an upgrade, but yes, he is probably in a bit of a different category than some of these other guys. You might not want to just commit to him as your closer on day one. We have a few more.

names to go over. And by the way, all of this stuff is from Jesse's article that you can find over at go pHNX.com. You will be able to find it. This is a little bit of a preview for an article article he's writing right now. So make sure to check that out over at go phnx.com. If you haven't gotten a diehard membership yet, check that out. Of course, it pays for itself. There's so many great options, of course, or I guess benefits, you should say. Get yourself a free t-shirt. Get access to all of Jesse's premium written content. Get access to Ask Archie and all of our wonderful content, including our first episode of D-Backs After Dark with me and Damon, where we're just going to air our grievances with each other and curse a whole lot.

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make sure you subscribe over there and leave us a review. And on the other side of this break, we will talk about some more candidates the Diamondbacks can go after and free agency to help bolster their bullpen. So don't you go anywhere? We'll be right back. Check out Heela River Resorts and Casinos because no one does it better. We love going out there. We'll be doing so many of our events, including Suns and Cardinals watch parties.

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as hot. It's nice outside. It's actually quite cold. Jesse will attest to this. It got cold too fast, but we're still thirsty. And Circle K is still America's thirst stop. So make sure to stop by there. Get yourself something to eat. Get yourself a snack. Get yourself a drink. Even if it's a warm one. Or if your car is thirsty today. Or if your car is very thirsty. Today is a great day. Got 40 cents off gas today. 40 cents off per gallon. What time is that at change? You know what time that starts at? I think it's from four to seven. Four to seven tonight. I believe. I'm bad on the details. But of course, today's the day. So make sure to stop by Circle K today. Say, a lot on gas, fill yourself up. Of course, fill up your car and join the inner circle for free right now

by downloading the Circle K app today. Terms and conditions do apply at participating locations, visit CircleK.com for details. Jesse, what's your favorite stack from Circle K? I have been enjoying the peanut butter pretzels, which we have here in the office. Those are six down an entire bag of those. Five stars. 30 minutes ago. And I guess that would be during the show, not 30 minutes ago. But right before About 30 minutes before the show went on. He feeds him. He takes care of himself well. And you can't do that circle.

Okay. Also, you'll save 25 cents off for gallon on your first five Phillips when you join the inner circle. And you'll get your first five polar pops for free. So do that right now. Well, we do have some more potential reliever targets for the Diamondbacks to take a look at in free agency. And one name I think Tim brought up there. He said if you're not going for stop yet, it's Trininon or Yates. No homes.

Well, you might be right about that because Kirby Yates is a very good option. And that's who we were going to talk about next here. Kirby Yates had himself quite the season last year. Did he ever? 61 and two-thirds innings pitched a 1.17 ERA and a 0.83 whip, a strikeout percentage of 35.9%. I guess the only, if you want to call it a downside, the only downside here is this walk percentage was at 11.8%. But 33 saves out of 34 opportunities. Kirby Yates was outstanding this season.

He was also free. I like it. Yeah, Kirby Yates was, he was unbelievable in 2024. I don't really know how to explain this, frankly. I guess we should start by saying this isn't the first time that Kirby Yates has had a season like this. If you go back and look at Kirby Yates in the year 2019 with the San Diego Padres, he was an all star that year. Got, speaking of all of the balloting that's happening right now, all the voting, he, finished ninth in Sy Young voting that year, had a 1.19 ERA.

So this is not the first time that Yates has done something like this. But yeah, it was unbelievable. The Rangers signed him to a one year, four and a half million dollar contract last off season after he had a pretty good year in 2023 with the Braves, not like a great year. Not a season he had last year with the Rangers. Not a season that he had in 2024 with the Rangers. Derek, that was one of the best one year four and a half million dollar contracts. Boy, you could possibly imagine this guy was unbelievable.

He missed the entire 20, 21 season due to injury that he sustained in 2020. And he comes back with the Atlanta Braves and pitch okay. I mean, didn't pitch great in 2022, but he pitched pretty good in 2023. But nothing, neither of those seasons or, I mean, anything outside of that season in San Diego that you're referencing, did he come close to being as good as he was last year? And that's the reason why he is just probably one of the premium names available right now on the market when it comes to, you know, bullpen arms. But again, we've also seen this before.

And I don't want Mark Malanson to completely always make me scared and nervous about signing guys. But like, yeah, we've seen guys have an incredible career or at least incredible season prior to the Diamondback signing them, see Jordan Montgomery. and then having them come over and maybe not be as good. I think if there's any downside to Kirby Yates is the erratic nature of his career, and you can't really see a path where he has had, he's been as consistently good as he was last year, but I'll still take it. I mean, especially if based on that lack of consistency,

he might be on a little cheaper, I guess a little bit cheaper than a guy that had a 1.17 ERA would normally be. just based on that. So, I mean, I think that the Diamondbacks, in my opinion, this would be the guy that I would go after. Yeah, if you're looking for just a stop gap, I think it's harder to do better than Kirby 8s.

It's probably just going to be a one-year deal. He is 37. Next year will be his age 38 seasons. So that maybe doesn't feel great. He's getting up there a little bit. But coming off the season that he just had, I mean, you're not going to expect him to have a one ERA in 2025. but if you could have a 2.17 ERA instead of a 1.17, like, you'd probably take that too.

The downside here is that because of the season he had, yes, it's a one-year deal, but it's probably at a fairly high dollar value. It's probably, you know, MLB trade rumors, I think, had one year 14 million for Yates. And I'm not sure the Diamondbacks, you know, we've tried to kind of play around with the numbers and you feel like you've got $25 million to spend. If you trade Montgomery, maybe you've got more. like 35 to 40 million to spend this offseason. I don't know if you want to put $14 million of that just on a closer that you don't

absolutely need. So I'm a little bit skeptical that the Diamondbacks go a direction like this, but someone is going to pay Kirby Yates a lot of money and they very well might benefit from doing that. I mean, based on what we saw in 2024, it was unbelievable. Just imagine for a moment that Kirby Yates does have a 1.17. and that somehow some way AJ Puck finds a way to replicate his performance just with the diamondbacks last year. He had a 1.27 ERA right. Well, he had a 1.32 ERA. Yeah, last year just with the diamond backs just as a reliever with the debacks. That's incredible. That's a that's a back end

that you're going to have a hard time getting past. So if the diamondbacks have a lead, they're not going to have to worry about squandering that lead. And I know, you know, at least based on the way this team is constructed, that their offense isn't going to going to be as potent next year as it was this year. So they're going to probably find themselves in some closer games, most likely. If that's the case, they might want to invest in a guy that's going to be able to lock it down like that. But again, the downside to someone like Yates is, is he going to be that next year? And there's really no way to know that.

Yeah, there is risk. Yeah, given the age, the injury history here as well. I mean, he basically didn't pitch for three years with elbow issues. So sort of like Blake Trinan, there's a bit of a concerning injury past year, but he was healthy in, in 2024. And I mean, 33 of 34 and save opportunities, it doesn't get much better than that. So, yeah, you can dream on a debax bullpen with Kirby 8 at the back end. You know, you can dream on it a little bit with some of these other guys too. But, but Yates duplicating, replicating his 2024 season in 2025.

It's pretty wild to imagine how good that bullpen. could be. Well, one other name, and especially if you guys didn't like Blake Trinen that you might not like, is Kenley Janssen, a guy long-term Dodger, recently a Boston Red Sock, who put up some pretty good numbers himself last year, still not as good as some of these other guys we're talking about. But based on where the Diamondbacks are financially, might be, might be a little bit more in their wheelhouse as far as what they can afford. 54 and two-thirds innings pitched for the Red Sox of 3.29 ERA, 1.06 whip, 28.4% strikeout rate, 9.2% walk rate, and then 27 saves out of 31 opportunities. So pretty good year there for Jansen. Does it, I don't know, does it, does it give

you pause to have a guy who is very much associated with the Dodgers, like sort of known as one of the best closers in Dodgers history? Have that guy donning a Diamondbacks uniform? No, that doesn't bother me at all. And in fact, I've seen entirely too much of the Dodgers. Diamondbacks players going over to NL West opponents and revealing all of Tori Lovolo's secrets to them. So I wouldn't mind maybe knowing a little bit more. We kind of know what Dave Roberts is thinking. I mean, it's pretty fairly clear. But I wouldn't mind having somebody like that.

And again, it's more about, you know, his strikeout rate there. That's pretty good. And I mean, that's pretty good. Kind of what we would like to see is I think all of us envision the Diamondbacks closer being a guy that can come in and just shove and make you feel good. good about the team having any kind of lead in the ninth inning and that that lead is secure that we're going to get through this one inning of work. Jansen has has that stuff. He just wasn't as good with the results as some of these other pitchers that we talked about were last year. Jansen is is still solid. He's not an elite closer by any means. He's he's a far, far cry from

Kirby Yates there. It's true. But at least in in terms of what he did in 2024. But on the whole, Kenley Jansen has just continued to be a steady presence in the ninth inning year after year after year after year. And you know, you look at his Velo, like his cutter is 92 miles an hour, which maybe doesn't feel great. But also it's been that way for like five or six years now. That's not really a drop off. He hasn't last year, bizarrely, he threw 94 miles an hour. But outside of that, it's been basically 92 for about six consecutive seasons. So, yeah, I think Kenley Jansen is someone you can pay.

Encelain in the ninth inning and feel really good about he's he's not going to get you elite results necessarily, but he just continues to do the thing. He throws his cutter basically every single time. And somehow, you know, after 15 years of doing this, it still works. And somehow still nobody has figured out how to hit it. So. Ina Jackson is right. She says, let's stop worrying about injuries. We just hired Kaplan, right?

Yeah, that's how that's how this works. Don't forget about the biomechanics. We're going to fix everything. You come here, come to Scottsdale, getting this dry weather. Kaplan will help you. you'll feel the best that you've ever felt. I don't know why that didn't happen for us last year, and I'm still sad about all the injuries.

But, of course, that's in the past. And we are going to talk about the past. We're going to talk about why this past week was one of the most important weeks in Diamondbacks history on the other side of this break. Don't you guys go anywhere. We'll be right back. Of course, our PHNX Winter Pickleball tournament

is December 14th at Chicken and Pickle. And Chicken and Pickle, of course, it's an amazing indoor outdoor entertainment complex that includes a casual chef-driven restaurant, sports bar pickleball courts most importantly indoor and outdoor and just a variety of ways to have fun for you and your group whether it's a family gathering whether you're just meeting up with some friends maybe you are having a party with your co-workers whatever the case may be chicken and pickle has you covered with plenty of space to do so and they also have us covered with our winter pickleball

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Instruction and facilitated player are included, plus every participant receives a $10 chicken and pickle gift card. So don't miss out on the fun over there. Also, if you are looking to improve your home this holiday, season before you have some friends and family come over maybe to head over chicken and pickle you know they're going to stop by your house and you should have your house looking at its best with our friends at empire today they have the right product for your needs quick and professional installation and a price match guarantee they also service their own warranties themselves so you

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Restrictions do apply. See Empire Today.com slash PHNX for details. It is throwback Thursday. It is. And we are required to talk about Diamondbacks history at some point due to the nature of this show and of course this is a very very important week jesse because on november 18th 1997 this was the date of the major league baseball expansion draft where the diamondbacks truly became a team filling out their roster and that expansion draft actually happened right here

in town across the street over there at the phoenix civic center uh team officials for the diamondbacks and the tampa bay raise which might not be the tampa bay raise any longer met at the phoenix civic center where they selected players from the other 28 teams rosters and this is basically when the Diamondbacks were born. We talk about a lot of important dates, first game, first time it was decided the Diamondbacks could exist as a franchise. But this was the first day, Jesse, that Brian Anderson became an Arizona Diamondback. This is the first day that Jorge Fabergas became a Diamondback.

Most importantly, Damian Miller and David Dulucci, those were the guys. When I was looking at this, I was like, wow, those guys were drafted 45th and 47th overall. And you just think of the importance to that those guys played. to the Diamondbacks eventually winning a World Series. They were steals. They were absolutely steals. They were highway robbery in the expansion. I mean, for real.

Yeah, I'm really fascinated by what this would have felt like for the players that were being drafted. Right. Because on one hand, I don't know exactly the mechanics of how this worked, but like your previous team did not, did not make sufficient effort to protect you from the expansion draft. So clearly they were not like so, so concerned. about losing you. And I guess it's kind of like the Rule 5 draft, which we've been talking about lately a little bit. Your previous team is like sort of willing to put you out there

and see what other teams think of you. And sure enough, you wind up moving to a new organization as a result. So I really wonder what that transition was like for some of these guys. The raise and the Diamondbacks could pick any player not on the protected list of the 28 other teams, although no team could lose more than one player in a given rank. in a given round.

The protected list for each team consisted of 15 players from the rosters of their entire organization, both their 40-man roster plus all minor league affiliates. Each a team could add three more players to its protected list after each round. So it was an ongoing thing of adding protected players during the expansion draft itself. And all players in an organization were eligible to be drafted except those with no prior major league experience who had less than three years of service if signed at age 19 or older or had less than four years of service if signed at age 18 or younger. Weird.

Right. And this was all based on the back that they had the expansion draft, I believe, in 92 when the Colorado Rockies and Florida Marlins came into the league. So again, this is where a lot of players were selected and it's just interesting to see some of the names. and even a guy like Krimm Garcia and how he played a role in the Diamondbacks eventually getting

right Luis Gonzalez isn't wasn't he part of that trade I'm not mistaken he was yes Edwin Diaz was part of that as well yeah yeah yeah Mariners Mariners great Edwin Diaz was also taken in the expansion draft I think it's a different Edwin Diaz

you know who was taken in the expansion draft from the Mariners Bob Wolcott if that name doesn't ring a bell well it makes sense because he played one year for the Diamondbacks and posted a ERA of 7.09, I think. Oh, very nice. You're right about that. Edwin Diaz was the second base, but yeah, yeah,

different, different guy. Yeah, other Edwin Diaz probably born, but not particularly old at that point. It's probably like seven or eight years old, something like that. But it's fascinating. It's fascinating to think about. It's fascinating to think about you said, like being teams, imagine us covering this, right? It was three years old.

Right across the street and having two new teams out there picking players off of each. each all these other rosters Twitter would have lost their mind about this should I say Twitter do I say blue sky now I don't know You can't whatever you want Can I okay well not whatever you want No whatever I know they told They gave me a list of things I can't say but

With the 50 second pick No no yeah And the MLB expansion draft The Oroz of the dimeback select three year old Edwin Diaz Yes From from from daycare Yeah Well there was a so Omar doll

I'm curious when he was Okay, so he was the second pick of the second round, it looks like, in the expansion draft. And that is pretty impressive. I mean, I don't know exactly how he was viewed by people at the time, but Omar Dahl in 1998 for the Diamondbacks had a 2.88 ERA. He was really good. That's a 146 ERA plus. At that point, a 288 ERA was a pretty darn big deal. So, yeah, it's funny looking back at some of these picks and like, oh, my gosh, I totally recognize that name.

And other guys are like, wow, they took him really high in the expansion draft. And I'd never heard of them. Never heard of them again. Well, we do have some fun stuff, of course, coming up tomorrow. So make sure to join us then at 1 p.m. But until then, we appreciate you guys so much for stopping by. We always thank you for your time. You can follow us on Twitter or X or wherever.

I guess we're on blue sky now. So follow us there as well. So make sure check us out everywhere. You're on social media. I'm at K-Marsk, Man with the K. Jesse is at Jesse and Friedman of course large insman isn't here but he's still kept Tom rights and we still want you to figure that puzzle out on its own but we got Shane Diefenbach on the ones and two Shane do you want to say anything else about what is going to happen to your

mariners eventually andres Munoz is not going to be a dime back and if he is I I'm not going anything on that because Jerry DePoto could very well trade him Jesse now we're going back and forth sorry I'm derailing this conversation no I want to hear about he was like should I include him in the article and I was like, uh, and then he was like, you know what? Depoto traded Edwin Diaz with four years left to control. So that could totally happen. Yeah. You just can't rule out anything with Jerry Depoto, you know?

You're not wrong. That's all I got. No, you're not wrong. So look for our episode on the Andre Munoz trade next week because we'll definitely be talking about that. Like I said, I'm a cap underscore gay man with a gay. He's a Jesse and Friedman. That guy over there is at Shane Deef.

Our show is at pH and X underscore Dbacks, but all roads do lead to at PHNX underscore sports on Twitter, Instagram. and Facebook. We thank you again so much for stopping by. We will see you tomorrow with another 1 p.m. shown until then. Have a wonderful evening and remember kids. Baseball is fun, but it's so much more fun when you get yourself an elite closer and everybody else knows their job.