PHNX Arizona Diamondbacks Podcast - Is Starting Pitcher Market TOO TEMPTING for Diamondbacks to Pass Up a Trade?

Episode Date: December 11, 2024

Become a PHNX Diehard for just $4 a month! http://gophnx.com/intro-offer-youtube It’s Day 2 of the Winter Meetings…and we’re still waiting for Mike Hazen and the Diamondbacks to do something. With the way the starting pitching market is on the rise after Max Fried signs a record 8-year $218 million deal with the New York Yankees, that something may be a trade for one of their starting pitchers. Will they find a suitor for Jordan Montgomery or will a team change their mind on trading Zac Gallen? We also have more on what draft pick the D-backs ended up with and if comments by Roki Sasaki’s agent just improved the Snakes odds at landing the pitching phenom. Join Derek, Jesse, and Kevin for the PHNX Diamondbacks Show LIVE! An ALLCITY Network Production SUBSCRIBE to our YouTube: https://bit.ly/phnx_youtube ALL THINGS PHNX: http://linktr.ee/phnxsports MERCH https://store.allcitynetwork.com/collections/phnx-locker ALLCITY Network, Inc. aka PHNX and PHNX Sports is in no way affiliated with or endorsed by the City of Phoenix PHNX Events: Get your tickets to PHNX events and takeovers here: https://gophnx.com/events/ bet365: https://www.bet365.com/hub/en-us/app-hero-banner-1?utm_source=affiliate&utm_campaign=usapp&utm_medium=affiliate&affiliate=365_03485317 Use the code PHNX365 to sign up, deposit $10 and bet $5 to get $150 in bonus bets! Disclaimer: Must be 21+ and physically located in AZ. If you or someone you know has a gambling problem and wants help, call 1-800-NEXT-STEP, text NEXTSTEP to 53342 or visit https://problemgambling.az.gov/ Branded Bills: Use code PHNX at https://www.brandedbills.com/ for 20% off your first order! Gametime: Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code PHNX for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply. Circle K: Join Inner Circle for free by downloading the Circle K app today! Head to https://www.circlek.com/store-locator to find Circle Ks near you! Shady Rays: Exclusively for our listeners, Shady Rays is giving out their best deal of the season. Head to https://shadyrays.com and use code: PHNX for 35% off polarized sunglasses. Try for yourself the shades rated 5 stars by over 300,000 people. Check out FOCO merch and collectibles and use promo code “PHNX10” for 10% off your order on all non Pre Order items. Rugged Road: Gear up for your next adventure with Rugged Road Coolers - Your ultimate outdoor companion! Head to http://ruggedroadoutdoors.pxf.io/ALLCITY and use code PHNX for 10% off! Get 10 FREE meals at https://hellofresh.com/freedbacks. Applied across 7 boxes, new subscribers only, varies by plan. When you shop through links in the description, we may earn affiliate commissions. Copyright Disclaimer under section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for “fair use” for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, education and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing. #dbacks #diamondbacks #arizonadiamondbacks #mlb #zacgallen #corbincarroll #ketelmarte #mlbtheshow #mlbtraderumors #tradedeadline #traderumors #allstargame Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

It's day two of the winter meetings, and we're still waiting for Mike Hayes and then the Diamondbacks to do something. Jesse will be joining us from Dallas, and we'll have updates on how this crazy starting pitching market, including today's record deal for Max Fried, is going to impact how the Arizona Diamondbacks move forward. And if they change their mind about trading when they're starting pitchers, talking about all this in 30 seconds. Don't you go anywhere. The addition of the PHMXDbacks podcast right here on PHNX. My name is Derek Monty, occasionally known as your mayor. P-HNX. This is a

CHGO hoodie and my co-host Jesse Friedman is joining us from DLLS. Jesse, welcome in. That's what we call synergy, my guy. It's one and only thunderstick Jesse Friedman. How are things going there in Texas, Jesse? Well,

I can hear people on the streets going crazy right now, Derek, because news just broke that the Texas Rangers have signed Nathan Evaldi to a three-year, $75 million contract. So if you hear some noise in the background, all right, just know that the streets of Dallas are going absolutely desert. Yeah, they're there.

That's a big deal for them. I mean, it genuinely is a big deal for them. And it continues to solidify a starting pitching market that has been inflated up to this point and continues to be that way, right? I mean, three years, $75 million, not to say Nate Eivaldi is not a good. starting pitcher. He had a nice season once again in 2024. But, you know, Eovaldi is getting older. He's about to turn 35 years old. MLB trade rumors had two years and 44 million dollars is their prediction for Eivaldi. He gets three and 75. The Max Freed deal that you mentioned earlier, that also went far over expectations pretty much across the industry. So if you need

starting pitching, Derek, it's a little bit expensive right now. It's very expensive. And we're going to talk on this episode about how the cost of starting pitching might change the Diamondbacks mind about what they're willing to do and who they're willing to trade. But what we want to see, Jesse, is the Diamondbacks do something, do anything at all. And I still trust that they will. I'm sure you trust that they will. But at the same time, this is one of those situations where I can understand people starting to get impatient.

The same way I'm getting impatient with you not writing down the snow slide in the lobby of your hotel. I'm telling you, Derek, the snow slide is currently off limits. Not only is it blocked off, but there is no actual fake snow on the snow slide, making it not really a snow slide at all. It's really just like a massive, I don't know if it's inflatable exactly what the situation is, but it's not really ready to rock and roll. And so I don't know how you can possibly be blaming me for having not gone down on the slide at this point. It's not that it's not that I feel like you might be dragging your feet a little bit on it.

And I have no choice, Jesse. We're just going to have to make it happen. Kevin, can we make Jesse go down the slide even though he hasn't actually gone down the slide? Yeah, you know, I think I think we do have the capabilities. The magic of technology. Yeah, I think the magic of technology is going to help us out with that here. Let's get that. Yeah, let's see what it will at least look.

like if you did slide down the slide. There he is. Yeah, he's having a great time. See, look at how much fun you could be having, Jesse. Look at how much fun you could be having. Oh, my gosh. This is what happens. This is what threatened my case in. I have more time on my hands so I can do lots of things in the time

while I'm waiting for the Diamondbacks to make a move, Jesse. I will say for the record, I know people are getting a little bit impatient. And I see where you're coming from. know, there are some big names that have come off the market at this point. And, of course, you were talking about the slide. I thought you were honestly talking about the slide. Okay, yeah, no, you're talking about the MLB market, what we do. Yeah, the thing we cover with this show.

Sorry, got it. Go ahead. Back to the topic at hand, Derek. Yeah, yeah. I can understand people who are frustrated both with the fact that I have not gone down the slide and also the fact that the Diamondbacks have yet to actually make a move at the winter meetings. But I will say, this is a team that as much as we've discussed in recent days,

that this team has a history in recent years of making moves leading up to the winter meetings. We have seen that now for three consecutive seasons. We saw it last year with the Gino-Swaris trade. The Diamondbacks don't generally do a ton during the winter meetings, at least under Mike Hazen. I'm not sure the debacks have done anything officially during the winter meetings. I guess it depends on exactly which day you want to say is the conclusion of the event. Last year, Eduardo Rodriguez, of course.

that news broke just as we were all packing up essentially. I think that was on Wednesday night. So essentially would have been the equivalent of it happening tomorrow night. But before that, the Diamondbacks hadn't done much. Like, Jock Peterson didn't sign until later in December. Lordus Guriel didn't resign until later in December. You know, the Grishik move that happened after the new year. So, and obviously Jordan Montgomery, that move happened officially after the season actually started.

So there's still a long ways to go here just because the Diamondbacks haven't done anything as of, you know, day two of the winter meetings does not really say much of anything about what this offseason is ultimately going to become. Right. And in fact, it might be smart to wait because, again, I feel like, and Mike kind of brought this up in regards to the Juan Soto, you know, signing and how it's going to kind of get the trade market going. he said yesterday on MLB network that like this is you know now we should see the moves start to make i think that with the money teams had reserved for Juan Soto there are there are going to be massive overpayments for players because it's going to teams are going to be desperate they're going to want to go out and get another big name they're going to need somebody uh you know there's not a lot of premier you know players available at the top of every position you know for players for teams to go out there and and pick up no matter how much money they have

have. So I feel like, you know, waiting for, for the market to kind of start to get going and for some of those names to come off as smart, especially when the Diamondbacks really aren't in the market for any of those particular top players. Like, there's not a lot of top players across baseball that you've heard the debacks connected to. However, Mike talked today about, you know, them not making moves or if they're going to do anything. What did he have to say? Yeah, this is, the question here that was posed to Mike is, is there any disabilities? appointment if you leave the winter meetings having not done anything. And just to preface this, Mike said previously before we got to this question that he doesn't expect the Diamondbacks

to do anything between now and tomorrow night. That doesn't mean that they necessarily won't. I recall last year, you know, the last time we talked to him right before news of the Erods signing broke, I'm pretty sure he told us then that nothing was close and, you know, not to really expect anything. So I wouldn't read a ton into those comments necessarily. It is to possible that something could happen but Mike was asked you know are you disappointed if you don't get anything done by the end of the winter meetings and here's what he had to say zero no the office we still a long way to go and it's again like I said this to you guys yesterday like when you're rebuilding an entire bullpen and you're having to bring in four or five different people it's

fine when you're targeting trying to target one maybe two guys to add into the mix like it's just you're a little more targeted and it takes a little while longer just to add the guy that that's the best fit. I mean, we're pursuing things on the trade market and the free agent market. So we're trying to weigh what the cost is going to be for everything and how we're going to pull it off. I mean, he doesn't seem too concerned. And I know, again, the diamondbacks really aren't in a position where outside of solving first base, they really have any really must make moves, right? I mean, and even then they have a backup plan if they aren't able to go out and find a first basement.

It's not a great one. It's a terrific one in Pavin Smith. But they need to, they do want to solidify that, I'm sure. But I mean, again, I do feel like being patient here is beneficial for the organization. I mean, I just think that it would be a very different conversation if like Christian Walker was off the market and Jack Peterson was off the market and some of the pivot target the debacks. Goldsmith, if Justin Turner, like, if that market was moving and the debacks weren't involved, that's where I could really understand people having concern. And, you know, I think that would be fairly warranted maybe at that point.

But right now, the pieces that the diamond backs are going to be interested in, none of those pieces have really come off the market yet. Like, I don't know, are people really, you know, really disappointed that like Jordan Romano went to the Phillies instead of the debacks? Like, were the debacks ever actually going to sign Max Fried? or Juan Soto or, you know, Willie Adomis. Like, we were never really talking about these names as, as serious options for the Diamondback. So I really think it is as simple as the area of the market that they're,

the areas of the market that they're going to be involved in, those areas just haven't really moved at this point. You're right. Because the only one that really grinds my gears is Michael Conforto going to the Dodgers because damn them and damn the fact that they're able to even go out and get the role players that don't cost very much money. money and bring them in, pay them more money than other teams would probably be willing to pay them defer the payments and, you know, just add to the depth of that team that's already good.

Like the Dodgers aren't going out and getting a Juan Soto or Max Freed, but honestly, with a healthy starting pitching rotation of nine guys and everything that they've already built there, I don't know if they need to be in that market. You know what I mean? But the Diamondbacks, meanwhile, they still have holes to fill. And I think you're right when it comes to that. Like Michael Conferto, that's one name we talked about. But most of the other names that have come off the board already aren't really names that we saw fitting with the Diamondbacks.

And yeah, when we get to that point where, you know, Justin Turner and maybe Paul Goldschmidt are no longer available, then maybe there's a sense of urgency there for Mike Hazen and company. But they do have Pave and Smith. And I joked earlier, but, you know, again, Pave and Smith is a guy that a lot of people here in Arizona love. every single person in our chat it loves and you know again it's not he's not somebody that's incapable of playing first and contributing to this team next year it just doesn't seem like it's the best option might clarify what his role is going to be though in 2025 he did yeah I basically asked the question you know is it safe to say that paven smith will be a significant part of the solution either at first base or at dh we don't know exactly where it's going to land based

on, you know, what kind of bat the diamondbacks are able to acquire, maybe they're able to get multiple guys. We don't know whether it's going to make more sense for Pavin to play at first or a DH, but it sort of feels like if, you know, Pavin doesn't have any options left, like it seems like this team might be in position to commit to him as like a strong side platoon guy at one of those two positions. And Mike Hazen was sort of on board with that idea, but not totally. Here's what Mike had to say. I think he's going to be part of the solution. Okay. The word significant. is doing a lot of work in that sentence.

So I don't know what that really means. Gotcha. He's going to slice it all. I think he's going to hit play versus righties. We'll see how the rest of the roster comes together. I mean, if we require a lefty, that could take time away from him somewhere somehow, or we get two righties. He could have seen an enhanced role, or I don't, so I don't know yet.

I don't think a lot of people are going to like that, Jesse. They don't want our precious ginger-haired Jesus to not be out there swinging the bat and hitting three home runs in a baseball game. But yeah, no, I mean, there's some versatility there with Pavin. It just, again, as much as we joke about it, probably not the long-term solution you want over there at first base. And I don't think anybody really wants that. Yeah, I mean, I also ask Mike, like, how do you go about evaluating a guy who put up

awesome numbers? I mean, it's like a 900 OPS, right? But over a small sample size, it was 158 plate appearances. And it's hard to know what to do with that. And when I asked the question in that way, Mike was like, you did it right there. That's exactly how you evaluate the player. You know that they did really well, but it's over a small sample size. And so you have to factor that in as you are evaluating the player.

I also touched on the fact that some of the underlying numbers with Pavin Smith, which we've discussed in the past, those numbers are also very strong. And it does, I think, make it a little bit easier to buy into the success that he had in 2020. But yeah, as you heard Mike talk about in that clip, I think he's going to play. I mean, again, he doesn't have any minor league options remaining going into 2025. So you expect him to be on the roster. But as of right now, it doesn't sound like it's safe to assume that Pavin is going to get the lion's share of the opportunity at either the DH spot or the first base spot. Well, we do know based on what we heard from Mike yesterday, that Adrian Del Castillo won't be in the DH role either.

and that he will be looked at as a catcher, as a backup catcher, might not be on the main, the major league roster this season, or at least to begin the season for a while. We talked yesterday about the depth there that the Diamondbacks want to have and that they want to have him playing, you know, getting regular starts potentially in Reno and not necessarily riding the pine behind Gabby. But will Adrian Del Castillo end up being a backup catcher for this team? in 2025, Jesse? What are your thoughts and what are you hearing?

Based on what Mike said today, it sounds like he's definitely a candidate for a backup catcher job, but it doesn't necessarily sound like he's at the top of the list. Yeah, we had that conversation yesterday about whether Del Castillo could be an option at other positions around the diamond. Haysen turned that down pretty clearly. He said that Del Castillo is just going to catch in 2025 and also not really be a primary option at DeVey's. even though maybe he finds his way into that role at some point if guys get hurt or whatnot. The Diamondbacks want to see Adrian Del Castillo catch. And specifically what Mike Hazen talked about is he wants to see Del Castillo get playing time.

And he wants to see him get playing time specifically on the defensive end and see what kind of improvements he can make on that side of the ball. Obviously, the defense was really the drawback for Del Castillo in 2024. There's no secret there. The Diamondbacks went to a pretty clearly inferior hitter in Jose Herrera at the end of the season because they just liked him defensively better toward the end of the year. So I don't think I would go into 2025 penciling Adrian Del Cascio in as the backup catcher. It sounds like the debacks want him to be in a position where he's getting a little bit more playing time than that, and he's able to hone some of those skills defensively.

And you just can't really do that sometimes, you know, at a major league level. it makes sense. It just, it's frustrating. And again, fans are excited. They got a taste of ADC last year. And, you know, again, I think that the nature of the beast is that you want to see these guys continue to get, you know, major league playing time, to get better and to continue rising up to being a full-time major league player. You got to pick who's going to be your catcher of the future.

You know, Gabby isn't that much older than Adrian Del Castillo. So it's not like you're talking about having a veteran back there and, Gabby and then having, you know, ADC as the future here. So it's going to be interesting. And again, I'm sure that they want to do everything they can. If there's one position that they would love both guys to be absolute studs at would be catcher. That's a, that's a position that you would like to split playing time more just to keep

those guys fresh and maybe have more of a situation like the Blue Jays had when we acquired, Gabby. Another thing Hazen said on the topic of catching is that the diamondbacks would like to add some depth at that position. I'm not sure if that means that they're looking for someone to sort of replace Jose Herrera as the as that primary backup catcher option. But it sounds like the team wants to find someone else to add to that mix, maybe be a part of that backup competition going into 2025. Hayeson talked about how over the course of a season that, you know, catching is a really, really important position. Obviously, Gabby Moreno has a bit of an injury history as well. So I think

the Diamondbacks would like to have as much depth at that position as they can possibly have. I might be wrong about this, Jesse, but everything I kind of hear from Mike Hazen sounds like this team is leaning towards making trades rather than picking up players via free agency. And with the way the market is going, it makes sense considering the diamondbacks don't have record breaking money to pay anybody. You know, you got Willie Adamas breaking, you know, Giants records. You now have this deal for Max Fried that breaks the record. for a left-handed pitcher being signed, like you're just having record-breaking contract after

record-breaking contract being signed. And it feels very much like the Diamondbacks are going to have to get better at, you know, via via trades, especially with their surplus of outfielders and potentially starting pitching. And I know we're going to talk about this in a little bit how tempting it is. But, I mean, what's Mike saying about who they might trade for? How does like the term of the contract kind of impact things here? Because it feels like the Diamondbacks outside of one of their main starting pitchers like Jordan Montgomery is that Gallon, Merrill Kelly. They would be trading a guy with years of control to potentially maybe just get one year of control back for somebody.

Yeah, I think given the prices that we've seen in free agency so far, it's hard to look at free agency is like the answer to all of the Diamondbacks problems, right? You could run up a pretty significant bill pretty quickly based on what we've seen so far. So yeah, one question that I asked Hayeson yesterday is what do you see as being necessary for you to do? Do you think it is necessary for you to make a trade? I specifically asked about a center fielder or a starting pitcher because that's what we've heard most about primarily. is it necessary for you to do that in order to get where you want to go? And he was sort of non-committal on that, which is kind of the answer that I expected,

basically just that he doesn't know at this stage. But, yeah, based on the prices that we've seen so far, it's hard to believe that the Diamondbacks can really make the improvements that they would like to just be a free agency. I mean, we're looking right now at about $25 million or so between where the payroll stands now and where it stood last year and it sounds like we're expecting a payroll in a similar range. So $25 million is just not, I mean, Michael Conforto just signed for $17 million, right? You've all they just got $25 per year.

You can go down the list, like $25 million for the 2025 season. That's probably not getting you, you know, three or four quality players to add to your, to add to your roster. So how all in are they on 2025? How willing are they to give up a guy with years of control to essentially acquire a player with one year of control. That was, that's a great question, Derek. And we ask that very question to Mike today. And here is what he had to say.

I'm willing to give up control to approve the team. So I don't love the concept of it in certain situations. But like, it's, it is what it is. Like, you got to, if you're going to do what you can to move the ball forward with the 2025 team, then that becomes available. obviously sometimes that makes them more available.

Those players are more available because of it on the other side. Sure. Yeah. What do you think? Yeah, it sounds like, it sounds like 2025 is a really big year for this team, right? And Mike Hazen is, I don't want to say willing to push all of the chips in necessarily, but you can hear there. He's willing to concede control in a trade,

which means he's willing to give up a player or maybe multiple players that have more years, of control than what he's getting in return. And yeah, this question was specifically about those guys that only have one year of control remaining, guys like Josh Naler and Devin Williams and Ryan Helsley. We've talked about a lot of these types of players on our show. And the point that Mike made there is like, yes, it sort of hurts in a way to trade for someone that only has one year of control left. But also, it probably means that they're a little bit more available, that the other team

is more willing to actually deal them than, you know, trying to pry away like a Nathaniel Lowe from the Rangers who has two years of control or, you know, maybe even Ryan Mount Castle of the Orioles. Like they have some depth over there at first base. But, you know, I don't think it's a guarantee one way or another that they're willing to make that move with two years left. So it does sound like the diamondbacks are willing. It doesn't necessarily mean it's going to happen. But I think they're willing to, you know, pay a fairly hefty price maybe to just get somebody for one year if they feel the impact is going to be big enough. Man, Jesse, I, I just, I don't know what's going on anymore with this team.

And I don't know if I trust when they say one thing or another, like it sounded very much like they're all in. I just, I don't, I, like, I don't know. I, I'm, I will withhold judgment until we see them. make a move because I just I still can't believe that this team really feels um I guess that confident in this year that they would may be mortgage the future for this year. I understand kind of going all in from a perspective of what you have is going to be potentially leaving and you want to try to make this a winning season. I understand maybe going a bit over

budget and some other things for this season maybe adding guys on a one year contract but I don't know so much about you know making those trades for guys for a one year deal. I don't know if the diamondbacks are that close right like it's an unfortunate you're so you're not about it Derek you're you're here in this talk of like kind of going all in like maybe trading some assets for for guys who have one year of control and you're like eh i don't know if i believe in this 2025 team quite quite to quite to that level i mean i i would be i would be a hypocrite considering i think i sat here right here on this show yesterday it said i did believe in the way it's constructed i think It's the idea of going out and, and, you know, making those big dramatic moves to try to improve this team in 2025, right?

Like, that's the thing. Like, stay, stay focused on what your, you know, plan is. Don't do anything radical where you're mortgaging the future in any way. It feels like they've been fairly good about that. You might have to part ways with assets. And I'm not saying that that's not part of it. I just don't feel like, you know, seeing some gigantic trade where, like, oh, we're going to. to, you know, get rid of Jake McCarthy and, you know, Ryan Nelson and Gilbert Diaz and like a bunch

of pieces in order to try to like solidify this team for this year because then you're really going to be in a difficult place of rebuilding in 2026 when, you know, the free agents that you have leaving depart and you don't bring them back and you also trade it off, you know, assets that that would be here or would be part of this team in the near future, you know, so I don't know. It's not that I'm not all in on it. I just, it's hard to, it's hard to really think that the Diamondbacks could make a trade big enough. That would be worth, you know, mortgaging their future like that in order to make this team actually competitive for a world championship in 2025. I don't know.

I, I could see why Mike Hazen is kind of in, in the place that he is or the way that he sounds in, in this audio, Jesse, because he doesn't, he doesn't sound truly confident. He also doesn't sound terribly like nervous about what the future holds for this team. So like I kind of, you know, I think that they're in a good spot and they just need to address their needs. They also need to realize that they're going to go over budget. Like that's it. They're going to have to spend money in order to make this team complete and make this team competitive. And that's the route. I would prefer they go.

We can make more money, Jesse. We can't we can't make more, you know, Jill. Dezze's we can't do that that's a that's a fair that's a fair perspective and i i just had the exact same thought running through my head like we have seen in in recent years the 2024 season being an example of this where ken kendrick you know sort of sets the expectation for payroll in a certain place and then he sees an opportunity to you know acquire a certain player or maybe push the envelope a little bit in a year where he really feels like the team has a chance to contend and based on everything that I've heard over these last couple of days, this is a really big year for this team.

Like 2025 is a really important season. If you are going to hang on to Zach Allen and you're going to hang on to Merrill Kelly, you know, these assets that probably could get you quite a bit in a trade right now, then you kind of owe it to yourself to be aggressive and to really not push all the chips in necessarily, but to really go for it in this 2025 season. And as you're saying, that might require the Diamondbacks to just, spend a little bit more money in order to get the pieces that they want. Well, we are going to discuss more from Dallas with Jesse Friedman.

I need to know if Mike Hazen has spoken to any general managers face-to-face, if Jesse has seen that happen yet. So we'll get those answers on the other side of this break. Don't you guys go anywhere? Of course, it is an excellent time of the year to go out and purchase yourself a new vehicle or especially a new vehicle for that special someone. And I've said it before and I'll say it again, there is no bigger baller of a move than buying someone a car and having that big red bow on the front of it, just like the commercials. But Sanderson Ford can help you get there.

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day of high school where you wanted to get like signatures from all your friends that you met on the cruise. There's all sorts of weird stuff that goes on like that on a cruise. So I'm just imagining maybe Mike Hayeson leaving post-it notes on people's doors or something in order to just get the message across about

hey, let's talk, let's chat. Let's talk starting pitching for maybe a first baseman. Well, as you know, Derek, I was hoping to to ask this question to as many GMs as I possibly could. Unfortunately, they aren't doing like a big group general manager availability this year. So Mike Hazen is really the only GM that I have easy accessibility to here over these few days. But I did get to ask Mike Hazen, how is it that you communicate with other general

managers first of all at the winter meetings when you're all like in the same hotel together. Yeah. And in the past, I have heard GMs and including I think Hazen said this in 2022 that, you know, you'll be in the same hotel as all of the other GMs and all the other front office executives, but you're just like texting them from your hotel room, which is like sort of hilarious to me. But Hayzen said that you, I'm in the hallway. Hey, Bob. Hey, Tim. And then go back and like text each other and be like, hey, so let's talk about a trade. Hazen said that he likes to, he likes to do things in person when, when he's at the winter meeting. So he said the vast majority of the communication while he's been here in Dallas

has been in person. I also asked about how he communicates with other front office executives when the winter meetings are not happening. And he said he's a big phone call guy, Derek. Mike Hazen is one of those people. He said that other front office executives really like to text nowadays, but he is one of those people who still likes a good old-fashioned phone call. And I asked him, do you think that other executives are annoyed at your preference for phone calls? And he said probably yes. So he is very self-aware about it. But you could understand, right? Like, I personally definitely lean on the texting side of the spectrum, as you well know. However, if it were part of my job to like negotiate very complicated transactions with other people,

then yeah, like maybe a phone call makes a little bit more sense. Yeah, I mean, I am a, I hate text messaging. I really do. I can't stand it. I feel like it takes us entirely too long to have a conversation. More than anything, I hate waiting for your reply, Jesse. more than I hate anything in my entire life. I hate staring at those three little dots waiting to see what you're going to say.

I say I hate sitting there going, why is it taking him so long? This was a yes or no question. I don't understand it. So I am not a person that would deal well with doing trade negotiations via text message. Imagine if they left me on red for eight hours. I wouldn't get any sleep. I would spend the whole night worrying about what I said wrong or what I could have done

differently to maybe make them reply to me at a normal time like a normal person, right? But that's, uh, that is what it is. It's good to know that Mike is a good human being, though, that actually likes getting on the phone and speaking to people. We've lost, we've lost our connections with human beings, folks. Uh, but speaking of losing our connections with what it means to be a human being and have real normal human being money, Max Fried signs with the New York Yankees reportedly for a record eight year 218 million.

dollars, Jesse, making it the largest contract ever issued to a left-handed pitcher. And the fourth largest deal for any pitcher in Major League Baseball, including his teammate now, Garrett Cole. I guess this is the pivot, right? You lose out on Juan Soto to your, you know, in-city rival team. And you feel like you have to do something pretty quick. And the New York Yankees did exactly that. Max Fried is a really good pitcher.

I know his 2024 season did not get off to a great start. The Diamondbacks caught him sort of at his lowest point. They scored a whole bunch of runs against Max Fried way back in April, but he finished the season well, had a 3.25 ERA when all was said and done. And I guess the way this relates back to the Diamondbacks, Derek, is that the debacks have a starting pitcher of their own, who is slated for free agency a year from now.

And we've been saying all along that the Max Free Deal, maybe to a lesser extent the Corbyn-Burnes deal are going to inform how much Gallin is worth on the open market next off season. And this is a pretty big number. 10 years, $300 million for Zach Allen? I don't know if it's going to go there. Max Fried and Zach Gallen are, it's interesting to compare them. Freed has been better at run prevention in general. You look at his numbers over the last three seasons.

He has a 2.80 ERA and a 149 ERA plus, which are both really, really good. Zach Gallen has a 3-2-E-R-A over the last three seasons and a 131 ERA plus. So he hasn't been as good at run prevention, but you also have to look at the durability factor, which is really important. It's why I think Corbyn Burns is going to get a ton of money. And in that regard, Zach Allen definitely wins out. He's made 93 starts over the last three years, and Max Fried has made 73. restarts. And so you look at their total production value, it's right around the same,

even though Freed has been better than Gallen on a rate basis. So I don't know exactly what this will mean. Obviously, we're still one year away. I think gallon's dollar value still has a pretty big, there's pretty big error bars right now for me because a lot of it is going to depend on how good Gallin is in 2025. Like if he rattles off a 2.5 ERA like he did in 2022, and makes every start, like maybe it is 300 million. I don't know if that's totally out of the question. Whereas if he has another season like the one he just had. It's going to be in the neighborhood of this, you know.

Yeah, yeah. If he has another, another season like the one he just had where he misses some starts, maybe it's like an ERA in the 36, three seven range. Like maybe he winds up getting a little bit less than Max Fried. I think that's also impossible. But yeah,

for anyone, you know, thinking the debacks can bring back gallon for, you know, 5, 125 or something. like that's that's just not the reality of the situation. Are teams still asking the Diamondbacks about starting pitching? Did Mike Hazen make any comments in regards to if they're getting any calls on Gallen or perhaps Merrill Kelly?

We definitely know they're getting calls on on starting pitching. I think if they make a move, there's a decent chance that it involves. If they make a trade in particular, there's a decent chance that it involves moving a starting pitcher. But yeah, as we discussed on the show yesterday, this team seems to be very, hesitant to move on from Zach Gallen, as well as Merrill Kelly. Those guys are sort of in the same situation, both just one year away from free agency. And what Hazen told us today is that he's basically told teams all along, like, it's going to be really, really, really hard for us to move Zach Gallen or Merrill Kelly this offseason. That hasn't necessarily stopped teams from asking about them,

based on what, on what Hazen said today. But he said that anytime a team does bring up those names, they sort of know what they're getting themselves into. Like they're approaching the conversation knowing like, hey, we know you're probably not going to do this, but you know, we just wanted to check in or would you consider this instead? Or Diamondbacks have made it known to teams that Zach Allen or Merrill Kelly, you know, maybe they're not untouchable, untouchable,

but they're about as close to that as you could get. What do they want in trades? What are teams calling the Diamondbacks on? Yeah, it's starting pitching and it's outfields. as well. Center fielders in particular, as we've discussed in the past, like either you, you might be moving a Alec Thomas or a Jake McCarthy, or you might be parting with one of these starting pitchers. Theoretically, the diamondbacks have a surplus on the starting pitching side, even though it doesn't necessarily feel like you can ever have actually too many starting

pitchers. So it'll be interesting to see if the diamondbacks are able to get a deal done. I asked Hazen if he feels more comfortable moving a center fielder or more comfortable moving a starter. And he basically said, I don't want to move either of them. But which is an understandable explanation. Like the debacks have some depth in both areas, but they don't have like a ton of depth. You know, this isn't 2022 when they had just an absurd number of outfielders. And it felt like they kind of had to deal one of them. They very well could carry both Jake McCarthy and Alec Thomas on the rock.

roster going into 2025. And you certainly could take all six of these starting pitchers as well as the depth options behind them into the season as well. So yeah, it's not really clear exactly if it's more likely that they deal a center fielder, more likely that they deal a starting pitcher. But we do have an audio clip of Hazen talking about just sort of in general what teams are looking for in trades. He said that it is not, it is not prospects.

It is very much major league ready players that teams are looking for. And here's what Hayeson had to say about that. They don't want to trade for prospects. They want to trade for originally players. Right. So yeah, we'll trade up prospects, but nobody wants them. The teams that may want prospects, there's only a few of them that I think he'll place a premium on the value of those prospects. The good thing we have is we have a number of upper level players that have major league service and time that you,

You could call them prospects if you want to. Maybe they're not penciled in on our major league team. Maybe they're not full-time big leaguers just yet, but are at least in that where you could say that they could play for another team's major league team. If they had a hole and they really valued those. I feel like things have changed a little bit, Jesse. And I mean, I know the market does change, but I feel like not too long ago, the Diamondbacks weren't really willing to part ways with prospects.

And that's what they were getting calls on. And now it's more of major league ready players. Yeah, I mean, I think it's just the reality of the situation across the league right now, where when you add an additional wildcard spot and you've got 12 out of 30 teams making the postseason every year, every team feels like they have a shot going into the season. And so, yeah, there's just not a lot of teams that are looking for prospects at this point. And I think another factor in this is that the Diamondbacks prospect-wise don't have the most enticing options available, right? especially for top of the market type players,

like when the White Sox are dealing garret crochet or you think about some of the top trade assets available on the market, I'm not sure the Diamondbacks really have the pieces to land any of those guys. So that is a factor here as well. Well, the Diamondbacks might not be out of the market for one starting pitcher

based on the agents made by Roki Sasaki's agent, Joel Wolf, which is an incredible name, Not as good as Mount Castle, but it's up there. We'll talk about those comments, and if it does, in fact, mean the Diamondbacks might not be out of the Sasaki sweepstakes just yet. We'll be right back. Don't you guys go anywhere? Whatever the moment, it is never ordinary at Bet365,

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located in Arizona. You or someone you know has a gambling problem wants help. Call one hand her next step, text next step to 533442 or visit problem gambling.azc.gov. Speaking of being located here in Arizona, it is a wonderful time to be here. Of course, not only is the weather great, but it's a new era here in Valley of the Sun. The Sun Devils are a big part of that. But we are merging tradition and history with innovation and pageantry at the 53rd annual VRBO Fiesta Bowl Parade presented by Lerner & Row. I love a good parade and I love the festival parade. You got to come out.

The event is free to the public, family friendly on December 28th. We have all those colorful floats, balloons, community groups, and marching bands that will march through Central Phoenix. It's a great time. come out check it out with the family plus you'll see our our guy Grand Marshal ASU and Mesa wrestling champion Anthony Robles who's the subject of the upcoming movie Unstoppable

will be the Grand Marshal to join us in person on Saturday, December 28th at 10 a.m. Or watch it all happen live at AZ Family 3 TV for the parade route and more information checkbiestable.org slash parade. Have you guys ever been in a parade? Have either of you ever been in a parade?

Been in one or been to one? Been in one. Marched in a parade. I don't think so. I've been in four. So that's why I'm the mayor of PHNX. I just want to set the record straight when it comes to that. This isn't something that I just call myself. It's not something I just appointed. It's a crown that I wear, unfortunately. And heavy is the head that wears the crown, which I don't have a crown anymore, Jesse. I'm no longer going to be the champion of our fantasy football league, which I know I never speak about on this program at all. I never talk about. I'm very humble about the championship that I won last year. However, you might have,

I don't know, this podcast took quite a tumble, Jesse. I think we really, we really did a bad job this year. I come in dead last. I'll be going to the Waffle House. You had one of the most catastrophic falls in fantasy football history that I've ever seen a human being have. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Are we going to exclude my heroic rise? Yeah, I want to talk to you. You are the reason why I'm at Waffle House, Kevin. No heroic rise at all, sir. You are the reason why I'm going to Waffle House and I blame you exclusively. Do you want to tell the people why?

Oh, God. Let's talk about Jesse losing because Josh Allen scored 51 points and who was it? Jamar Chase scored like 45. Jerry was an absurd number. Jesse was absolutely robbed. Jesse has not won a game since I beat him. I somehow broke the force field around his team. and then he never recovered from it.

But it's been that season. I feel the need to set the record straight on my performance in the T.HNX Fantasy Football League. As someone who admittedly knows basically nothing about football, I put together a pretty darn good team, if I do say so myself, as some people who play fantasy football might be aware, don't always have control over how many points your opponent scores. You played that defense. I was basically tied for second in points scored in our league with 12 teams, and I went 7 and 7.

I scored the second most points of any team in our league during this last week and would have made the playoffs if I had won. But the team that scored the most points this past week was, of course, Johnny Venerable, the team that I happened to be playing. And I basically had that kind of luck for five consecutive weeks. and after I was seven and two, Derek, and I finished seven and seven and narrowly missed the playoffs. It was absolutely devastating. While these clowns out here want to do nothing but bury us, I'm going to give credit where credit is due. This is the most competitive season of fantasy football I've ever played. And I think it's because fewer people wanted, the majority of the people in our league wanted to not go to the Waffle House more than they wanted to win the championship.

and I think it's that balance of fear and carbs that helped keep this a lot of parity in this league, a lot of parity in the league, Jesse. Not a lot of parody in Major League Baseball with the way these contracts are going, however, but one man, one glorious phenom, one beautiful baby boy wants to help bring a little bit of parity to baseball by potentially signing with a small market team, Jesse, and I, of course, I'm talking about Roki Sasaki, the guy that we hope, wish, pray that the Diamondbacks could somehow land and change the trajectory of this franchise forever.

We know Cody Delmendo over in CHGO has been doing nothing but eating like ramen for the last three weeks consecutively every single day in hopes of somehow impacting the decision here that's going to be made. but his agent had some interesting comments today, Jesse. He did. He did have some interesting comments. Yeah, Joel Wolf, he answered a whole bunch of questions, Derek, and there were about 400 reporters who were mobs surrounding him.

I did not get the memo, although I don't think anyone really gets memos about these things. Agents just sort of pop up all of a sudden. And then they just get, like, totally mobbed. Still expected that happened to have happened with Scott Boris at some point. I was going to say, I remember improv. to Scott Boris meeting that went completely out of control. It turns into like a, you know, small concert by U2 or something in the lobby of a hotel. But here is what Roki Sasaki's agent, Joel Wolfe, had to say about his client potentially signing with a small market team instead of one of these big spenders in Major League Baseball.

Do you think he would consider small the midmarket teams? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think that there's an argument to be made that a small. smaller mid-market team might be more beneficial for him as a soft landing coming from Japan, given what he's been through. Sorry if I'm not doing this wrong. Given what he's been through and not having an enjoyable experience with the media, it might be.

I'm not saying it will be, but I don't know how he's going to view it. it might be beneficial for him to be in a smaller market. But I really don't know how he looks at it yet because I haven't had a chance to really sit down and, you know, discuss it with him in great detail. I did find his initial reaction to the question very interesting. Like he sounded very much, very, very positive that a small market team could be, you know, like he said, a great landing spot for him. due to you vicious media members, Jesse. You guys just eat these people up alive and they don't have anything to do with you.

But what are your thoughts? I mean, does this, he obviously was non-committal there at the end. He definitely kind of walked his comments back a bit. But he definitely, it's at least an encouraging sign that the Diamondbacks could have a shot here at signing him. I'm not sure how encouraging it is that the Diamondbacks will sign him. But I think it's maybe more so encouraging in my mind that the Dodgers won't.

at least you can kind of talk yourself into that, right? Like if, if Rokeesasaki really does prefer a smaller market, like that doesn't exactly scream Los Angeles. So I guess it could still scream San Diego, right? I mean, that's one of the smaller markets represented in major league baseball. That wouldn't be a great outcome for the Diamondbacks either.

But, yeah, I mean, at least keeping him out of L.A., like if you're a D-Bax fan, you're probably on board with that. I wouldn't count the Diamondbacks out by any means. They did do quite a bit of due diligence. Scouting Roki Sasaki, they had, you know, multiple executives out, out in Japan, seeing him pitching person. So they did devote pretty significant resources to scouting him. And I have to believe they'd think they'd have a shot. The reports don't really have the Diamondbacks tied to him, which is interesting to me, because I've gone over several articles.

I've read several, I've seen several tweets from, you know, you media people. and yeah, there doesn't seem to be an inclusion of the Diamondbacks in that talk. It doesn't really mean that they're not. Like you said, it's what they're actually doing. It's the effort they're putting forth. So the fact that they did devote those resources to scouting him does show that there's an interest there regardless of what journalists are reporting. Yeah, it's hard to know what to do with that. I mean, I'm not sure necessarily how much stock to put in these lists, you know, people were reporting from.

from the outset that like she was going to sign with the Dodgers and it was a done deal. And then Joel Wolfe has spoken, you know, has been very outspoken against that, that that line of thinking that Sasaki really could go just about anywhere. It doesn't sound like the money is going to matter that much. That is one other takeaway from the comments that Wolf made today. The diamondbacks are in the second highest tier in terms of their international bonus pool. once it resets on January 15th, we expect Sasaki to sign after that. They're going to have $6.9 million right around there to spend on international free agents.

There's a few teams around the league that'll have $7.5 million. But, yeah, based on what Wolf said today, that money is not really going to matter. It's sort of negligible, you know. I mean, I know to us common folk, the difference between, you know, $7 million and $3 million or whatever. That doesn't exactly sound negligible. but Rogi Sasaki is the type of guy who could get a $300 million contract a six years after after he signs this initial deal.

So yeah, the amount of money that he makes on this contract is not really all that important. All right. Well, on the other side of this break, we're going to talk about the Arizona Diamondbacks at the MLB draft lottery today and how we once again got hosed. Don't you go anywhere. We'll be right back. Of course, now is a great time.

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So make sure to use code PHNX for 10% off your order over at Saturday neon.com. Jesse, there were some big winners. and some big losers in the MLB draft lottery today. The order was selected at the winner meetings, and you have the nationals getting the number one overall pick. Here we have the breakdown. That's messy, Kevin. That's messy.

I'm just going to tell you that right now. It's quite ugly. I'm sorry. All right. Well, the biggest loser, Jesse, in this entire thing probably has to be the Miami Marlins, who were tied with the best chance of getting the first overall pick. Instead, they end up

with the seventh overall pick. Gross. That's gross. We got some other winners. It wasn't just the nationals. You got the Mariners. Jesse with the 15th essentially best odds of getting the first overall pick. The

Mariners get pick number three. I know Shane Defenbach is probably going to be thrilled about that. I'm sure he will be, Derek. I mean, I'm sure he's also convinced that the Mariners will draft a player who will emerge as a promising young second baseman and then proceed to hit 180 in the major league. But that is neither here nor there. The Diamondbacks landed at number 18 overall,

which is, I guess, disappointing in a sense, if you're a DeBax fan, that is the worst possible outcome here. It is the lowest draft pick among the teams that did not make the postseason. However, the Diamondbacks also had the best record among those teams. So they have, had the worst odds to move up out of, out of all of these 18 teams. So I know Miguel Montero, he was the Diamondbacks representative out there on stage. I saw it with my own eyes. You know, he is, he is possibly ashamed. But at the end of the day, this is a random process. There's not a whole lot that he can do about this. So the Diamondback sort of swing and miss, but not really a devastating fashion. They get the number 18 overall pick. And yeah, I,

think they're going to be just fine. Well, on Wednesday, we will have the Rule 5 draft taking place there at 2 p.m. Eastern time in Dallas, Jesse. Will the Diamondbacks select anybody in the Rule 5 draft? And will they potentially lose anybody here in the Rule 5 draft? What are your thoughts? Mike Hazen said that they haven't had that discussion internally yet. They haven't finalized whether they planned to select anyone.

my inclination is that they probably will not select anyone just given where where this team stands and the fact that they're trying to contend next year. If you do select someone in the Rule 5 draft, you have to carry that player on your 40-man roster the entire offseason. Correct. In the next year, you have to carry them on your active roster the entire season in order to actually make them a true member of your organization. So given where this team stands, especially in the bullpen and how much, how many

depth options they have there. I don't really expect them to take anyone. Do I expect them to lose someone? I'm not totally sure. Mike Hazen did have, did express some concern over that. I think there's a pretty decent chance to someone gets taken, but I'm not entirely positive who it is. There's a few viable options there. Well, we're going to wrap things up because Jesse, Today is Mrs. Montia's birthday, and I'm going to get home to spend a few hours with her before it's over. I just wanted to wish my wife, Jen, a happy birthday. She is one of our researchers, as Jesse will tell you on the show, always providing us with great information. Lead Ph&X devax analyst, Jen Montia.

Yeah, for sure. She's absolutely a star when it comes to that. I wouldn't be here without this woman. So I'd be alive. I just mean I wouldn't be here at Ph.NX. you wouldn't even know I exist most likely. But I love you and happy birthday to you. I love all of you.

Jesse, maybe not so much in that blue blazer in a DLS studio looking so happy out there. But you can follow Jesse and me. I am at cap underscore K, man with a K. He's at Jesse and Friedman. Of course, large intimate Kevin Thomas is at Kev-O posts on Twitter.

Yeah. Yeah, you got it. I'm still working on that one. C-plus. C-plus. tried it's an effort thing right but of course our shows at p h and x underscore debacks but all roads do lead to at p hnx underscore sports on twitter instagram and facebook jesse'll be back tomorrow from dallas we will have more uh we'll be back at 2 p m tomorrow so make sure to join us for that that way jesse can be there for that final media availability with mike hazen

and bring you any information pertaining to that rule five draft or anything else that happens with the diamondbacks here before the winter meetings wrap up but again we thank you guys so much for your time we appreciate you stop and bye. I do love you. I appreciate you guys. I hope you have a wonderful evening. We will see tomorrow at 2 p.m. Make sure to join us for that. And in the meantime, have a wonderful night. And remember kids, baseball is fun, but it's so much more fun when you actually do something. Diamondbacks, do something. Do something. Please. Please do something. Quick.