PHNX Arizona Diamondbacks Podcast - Merrill Kelly & D-backs Have “Mutual Interest” In Return, Gallen Return Seems Unlikely

Episode Date: December 5, 2025

According to a report from John Gambodoro, the Diamondbacks and Merrill Kelly have mutual interest in a reunion. Could the D-backs finally be closing in on the starter they've been searching for? Meanwhile, a Zac Gallen return feels less and less likely as his projected price tag keeps rising in a rapidly shifting market. Alex D’Agostino joins the show to break down the D-backs’ conversations with Kelly and Pete Fairbanks, what to make of the inevitable Ketel Marte rumor mill, and why the MLB Winter Meetings remain one of baseball’s strangest traditions. Plus, Tony Clark’s comments about avoiding a 2026 work stoppage give us a bit of hope… even if we know better.JOIN THE SUPPORTERS CLUB ➡️ https://tinyurl.com/yc6km2r4An ALLCITY Network ProductionSUBSCRIBE to our YouTube: https://bit.ly/phnx_youtubeALL THINGS PHNX: http://linktr.ee/phnxsportsMERCH https://store.allcitynetwork.com/collections/phnx-lockerALLCITY Network, Inc. aka PHNX and PHNX Sports is in no way affiliated with or endorsed by the City of PhoenixPHNX Events: Get your tickets to PHNX events and takeovers here: https://gophnx.com/events/Aura Frames: Exclusive $35 off Carver Mat at https://on.auraframes.com/PHNX. Promo Code PHNXALLCITY — including us here at PHNX — is teaming up with Big Brothers Big Sisters of America for an exciting three-year partnership. To learn more, visit https://www.bbbs.org/allcity/APS:  Find instant rebates, discounts and special offers on smart thermostats, energy-efficient appliances and more at https://marketplace.aps.com/default/heating-cooling/smart-thermostatsBranded Bills: Use code BBPHNX at https://www.brandedbills.com/ for 15% off your first order!Husband & Wife Law Team: If you’ve had a serious injury, Call The Husband & Wife Law Team first at 602-783-8841 or visithttps://husbandandwifelawteam.com/?utm_source=allcity-padcasts&utm_medium=digital-phx&utm_campaign=allcityShowNotesChicken N’ Pickle: Family friendly fun awaits! Visit chickennpickle.com to plan your visit today!Access Auto Insurance Agency of Arizona, LLC (Access Auto) is a renowned agency offering personal and commercial auto insurance options to Arizona residents. If you’re on the hunt for a new policy, call Access Auto today at 1-480-400-0546 or get a free insurance quote by visiting our website www.access-insurance.com.Visit https://www.macu.com/accounts/checking/mystyle-checking?cid=ea-PHNX-AZ-mystyleAugust2025-checking to learn more about their MyStyle Checking Accounts!bet365: https://www.bet365.com/hub/en-us/app-hero-banner-1?utm_source=affiliate&utm_campaign=usapp&utm_medium=affiliate&affiliate=365_03485317 Use the code PHNX365 to sign up, deposit $10 and bet $5 to get $150 in bonus bets!Disclaimer: Must be 21+ and physically located in AZ.  If you or someone you know has a gambling problem and wants help, call 1-800-NEXT-STEP, text NEXTSTEP to 53342 or visit https://problemgambling.az.gov/Gametime: Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code PHNX for $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply.Shady Rays: Head to https://shadyrays.com and use code: PHNX for 35% off polarized sunglasses. Try for yourself the shades rated 5 stars by over 300,000 people.Circle K: Join Inner Circle for free by downloading the Circle K app today! Head to https://www.circlek.com/store-locator to find Circle Ks near you!Monarch: Use Monarch to get control of your overall finances with 50% off your first year at https://www.monarchmoney.com/phnxWhen you shop through links in the description, we may earn affiliate commissions. Copyright Disclaimer under section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for “fair use” for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, education and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Is that you, Merrill Kelly? We have more on there being mutual interest between both sides on a reunion as well as so much more that is already happening here during the off season. Plus, our guy Alex Dagestino, stop him by to give his thoughts on what we might see Mike Hazen and Company accomplished during the winter meetings. We're starting all this in 30 seconds. Don't you go anywhere. Happy Friday and ski to you all. Welcome in to another edition of the PHNX, DBEX podcast. live from Studio K, presented by our friends in Circle K.

It is I, your mayor of PHNX, occasionally known as Derek Montia. Once again, happy Friday to you all. We made it. We're here. It's time for another weekend and time to relax. But not for the Arizona Diamondbacks, Mike Hazen, and his front office, because they have a lot of work to do at the winter meetings. And we will be following along very closely with that. and I won't be doing it alone.

We're going to be joined by Alex Dagestino here and a little bit to talk about his off-season priority checklist. And of course, I am joined by the Leche to My Cafe. It is the one, the only, the incomparable Damon Farrell, aka Damon, Damon on the ones and twos. Happy Friday to you, Damon. And happy Friday to you all. Of course, this show is brought to you by our friends at GameTime.

Go download the GameTime app right now. If you haven't done so already, create an account and use code P-HNX for. $20 off your first purchase. Terms do apply. So make sure get down on that deal and those already low last minute ticket deals. Things are happening, Damon. I mean, we're not doing anything, but things are happening across baseball because we

definitely are seeing some moves being made, including what was described as a big trade yesterday, huge trade. And I'm going to mess up probably every single. single name in this trade. So let's go ahead and take a swing at it. This trade was between the Red Sox and the Pirates. The Red Sox received from the Pirates right-handed pitcher Johann Ovido.

That's probably not right. Left-handed pitcher Tyler Samanigo. Sam, that's probably not right either. And then last catcher Adonis, Guzman. Yeah, that Adonis Guzman is. That one's pretty, yeah. That's a U of A player. Yeah.

He just was, he was the catcher on U of A's team that, that just went to the College World Series, Derek. Nice. Well, this is where you, this is where your Tucson expertise comes in. 100% and then Ovieto, yeah.

Obiedo. Ohioho. Oh, Vietto. I'm not going to even try. Yeah. Mr. one, Mr. Tyler's name there. That's a tough one.

That's a tough one. Now, this next one is impossible, but I actually looked up to pronounce. Joss Nixon Garcia. Garcia. Garcia. Yeah.

Josh Nixon, Garcia. In the proper tongue. Trevioso. Trevio. Trevio. Trevioso. Leviosa. Leviosa.

Leviosa. Trevioso. Again, this is where we need Megaran's song about being bad at names to play for sure. But Joss Nixon, Garthia, he was a top, he is a top prospect in Major League Baseball. He is the number 85 overall prospect. in baseball that the pirates are receiving. And once again, the pirates continue to try to stay young. They try to trade for top prospects.

They're keeping their team, you know, exactly what the pirates continue to be. Part of the problem of baseball. We talk about the Dodgers being a part of the problem of baseball. Pirates are equally as much a part of the problem of baseball. Meanwhile, the Red Sox receive Oviedo, who is a very good pitcher, and they continue to upgrade their pitching Pitching Arsenal there. Best part about this is that I learned

that Joss Nixon-Garthea's nickname is the password. And that's because his first name spelled J-H-O-S-T-Y-N-X-O-N. Looks like one of those auto-generated passwords by your Apple phone when you go to sign up for a new website and they're like, do you want a strong password suggestion? That's fire. And you're like, no, I'll never. remember that but the password that's a that's a great that's up there with one of some of the best

nicknames it really is it's really good right right especially if he's awesome too right like if you're awesome and you get a nickname like that that's incredible i think big christmas has got to be the big christmas at noel oh my god let's go yeah that's amazing that is that one rules that one definitely rules uh meanwhile other baseball news free agent news the cubs have interest in tatsuya my Damon and I'm willing to go to war with the CHGO Cubs podcast over this. I don't think

they understand how angry I will truly be to see them get yet another one of the top pitchers, especially from overseas and leave us in the lurch wanting. I think we went through this with Mike, right? We went through this with Shota Yamanaga

and yet here we are. Here we are now. Possibly. Yeah. And in showed us coming back too for him it's like hey guys save some for the rest of us yeah no for sure you for sure i just i agree with katy she says cubs can take they grubby hands off of our man get it get your hands off of him what were you saying i just i i can't like i can't help it like consider that across baseball every team i look at is like the phillies are interested in adding cody bellinger and i'm like cool don't they already have like a 250 million dollar payroll

Yeah, I'm like, how is it that every team that we're competing against is able to add to their roster while also keeping all their elite players? And yet we're sitting here slum in it being like, you think Merrill Kelly would maybe take a slight discount to come back there? We're going to get to him in a second. Well, we know, well, we know Zach's gone. So I guess we'll just, you know, he'll leave. It's like if we were any other team that's competing in the NL, we'd say gallons back. we're getting rangers sworez we're in on on uh you know am i it's like how come what happened you know why why did they get to live the life that i want to i want to live you know well i mean for

from one perspective the diamondbacks have committed money to their young players so there's that with the extensions that they signed them to but yeah you're right now i mean even yesterday i felt like my dream wish list which was just me going crazy and being like which guys do i think would be the best fit. Still didn't seem that insane as far as additions. That seemed like, don't get me wrong, that would be one of the best off seasons any team had.

If they, Diamondbacks went out and added all of those players that I suggested they added if money was no object. But still, that amount, that bundle of players cost the Diamondbacks $100 million extra in payroll, right? And you're right.

We're not the kind of team that can just suddenly take that on, but other teams can. And other teams can forego the, you know, luxury tax or the competitive balance tax, tears and all of that, not care about how any of that happens. You also have the fact, Damon, that you have a team in the Dodgers that think about how much above they are above the competitive balance tax, right? And that's with showing Otani making nothing on an annual salary because of the deferred payments, right? He's making

nothing. He's making next to nothing. Imagine if he actually had his full contract as part of their payroll. Like, I think that teams circumventing the competitive balance tax by deferring payments is one of the biggest problems with baseball right now. Yeah, it's insane. Because that is starting to happen across baseball. We're seeing all of these deals haven't attached. There will be deferred money as part of it.

And I think really that's what it is. It's circumventing the competitive balance tax. If you want to defer the money, that's fine. but a team should have to have the annual value of that player as part of their payroll. Not what the, they're actually paying them, but the actual annual value of the contract, not stretched out over 20 years, but it should all be part of it. And we're going to continue to see it, right? Kyle Tucker visited the Blue Jays spring training facility in Florida.

Kyle Tucker is going to be a Blue Jays. And again, the Blue Jays are like, well, if you can't beat them, here's our wallet. Let's just join them. Let's just, you know, and we'll probably see deals like that for teams that already have a huge payroll like the Blue Jays have. Start deferring payments and just getting right into the game with everybody else. It's almost a necessity for you to keep up. Yeah, you're losing the arms race to the Dodgers if you don't get involved in deferrals whatsoever.

And the Diamondbacks to their credit have deferred. a lot of their more recent contracts. Right. I'm not saying that they're free of that either, but I'm just saying as far as the as far as the amount of money. The level is wildly different. You are allowed to defer. And the amount of money you're allowed to put off,

like as if you're not paying that player, that in a contract over a 10 year span or whatever the case is, is words I can't say on this podcast anymore. I'm going to have to save it for an audio-only D-backs after dark, Damon, because this is stuff that, I mean, I truly feel passionate. about and I think that it sucks that we have let franchises be like, oh, okay, that's the rules.

All right. Well, the Dodgers have more money and deferred payment, like contracts on their books than some franchises have in total franchise value, Derek. Right. That's a massive issue. Right. Right. Right.

Well, I don't know, but they are now pursuing Robert Sforres because Tanner Scott didn't really work out, right? Tanner Scott. The true deal that broke the camels back, if you would, the straw that broke the Camels back. Not the Show Eotani deal. Not other deals, not other guys they brought in, not Yamamoto. No, it was that deal. And it doesn't seem to be working out for them. And now they're trying to find another closer. They also may trade Teoscar Hernandez, according to rumors. So whatever makes that team worse, I'm in favor of. Meanwhile, the Mets are pursuing Joe Ryan from the twins. And the Mets seem like they're going to be relentless this offseason, Damon, just absolutely relentless.

They are not going to stop until they fix all of the perceived problems that they have with that team. And they are another team that, like you said, they have the, you know, again, they have the means to go out there and get whoever they want and do whatever they want. Yeah. The Dodgers you're saying? Yeah. Yeah. And just all these teams. No, I'm at the Mets. I'm sorry. Oh, the Mets. Yeah, the Mets. The Mets also are another team that have all of the,

they have all of the resources to go after whoever they want. You know what's funny about the Mets though, Derek? And it's probably the most like LOL Mets part of baseball that could ever happen. Mets fans have like, you know, obviously they're such a passionate fan base. And there's been so many like laughable seasons over the years where, you know, they do the LOL Mets thing like they did this year, right? This past season, how they missed the playoffs with like a.

99% chance of making it or whatever. The Mets waited until baseball was going to have a lockout to change their salary cap rules to get the richest owner in baseball. Like they got Steve Cohen. They were like, we did it. We're going to ruin baseball finally. Eat that, Yankees fans after all these years. Yeah.

And then like four years later, MLB is going to come out and be like, we're not going to play a season so that we can get these salary cap rules under control. and Mets fans are just sitting there like, wait, we thought it was our turn. And it's like, no, no, no. We're now changing the rules. When you start spending, that's when things have gone too far. Yeah.

Ew, gross. Not the Mets, nasty. We got to change these rules immediately. I love it. I don't have any problem with the Mets. I just think it's hilarious. And Jack's right. I'm making the amount of money that Otani is received,

or that they're hit for, for Otani to be like it's a million dollars or not. Well, it should be 70. That's the thing is it should be 70. Well, and again, it's just those those efforts to not only circumvent, right, the actual true value that you're paying a player, but you're just not doing that just with one guy. You're doing it with several guys on your team. And, and like you said, like Jack said, the Diamondbacks are also in they're doing it. I mean, every team in baseball is doing it. But I mean, at least most of the teams are keeping like the Diamondbacks there attempting to do that in an effort to keep their total payroll below the CBT threshold so that they can remain competitive and meanwhile the Dodgers

don't care you know what I mean? They're just doing it in general because that's the only way that they could actually afford this team you know because it's it's outrageous and they're able to just go out again after winning a world series after winning two world series they're able to go out and be like, oh, nope, we need to fix our bullpen and get one of the best closers available on the free agent market. It's insane. Yeah, I mean, the thing that comes in mind for me, Derek, is like, are there other leagues where teams can circumvent the salary cap rules?

Absolutely. Right? Like, I think about the NFL. I have you, like, the, the way that they restructure. You want to talk about the clippers in Los Angeles. Well, that's, I mean, that's, that's straight up cheating. But that's straight up cheating. Right.

But I'm talking about your foot. Look at how far teams are willing to go. right that's that's an example of how outrageously far teams are willing to go true and there's probably a lot of that to bring in a start right that we don't know about but i mean it takes me back to the old college days where you couldn't pay players but yet guys had full-time jobs at you know donors to the programs car dealerships where they never showed up and never did a day's worth of work but we're getting paid a full-time salary they got a lease yeah yeah there will be efforts made to circumvent whatever rules are put in place to improve a team and bring in the top talent.

Like, as if already having the Dodgers or the Yankees or, you know, the Boston Red Sox, even, or Chicago Cubs across your shirt isn't already enough of a draw for most players to want to go play for those historic teams that their families have grown rooting up for and being a fan of, right? But now we have guys like Tatsuya Mai that want to come here to the United States and actively beat a team like the Dodgers. and yet he's still probably going to land with another one of the big franchises

now, especially with the Cubs going after. It makes me sick. It makes me sick. But we do have some big news to talk about. And of course, that big news, we're going to share with our guy. We're going to bring in here our guy, Alex Dagestino, and we're going to talk to him not only about his off-season checklist, but John Gambadoro's tweet suggesting that

Merrill Kelly and the Diamondbacks have a mutual interest in his return to this team. and meanwhile a Zach Gallen return is seeming more and more unlikely. We're going to talk about all of this on the other side of this break. Don't you go anywhere you're watching the PHNX Diamondback Show. Well, this holiday season, you might want to actually be on the naughty list if that includes getting your holiday shopping done at Fascinations. At Fascinations, they have everything to make your nights merry and bright this holiday season. And you don't need the weird eye contact.

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And hopefully they can get you started on whatever financial goal you're trying to reach. Look to Desert Financial for checking in savings accounts, mortgages, loans, credit cards, investment options, and so much more. When you open a free checking account online, get $200 and bonuses. Get started by visiting desertfinancial.com slash 200 today. Well, of course, we have a lot more to talk about. And, you know, again, we know we have some rumors floating out there. Those rumors are only going to get hotter. The stove is only going to get hotter as we approach, not only get to the winter meetings, but get through the winter meetings. So we're going to talk about all of it with our guy, the, I don't know, the CEO of our newsletter, essentially, the one, the only Alex DeGastino. Alex, thank you so much for taking some time from updating everybody every single day on every sport around here and your fine work that you do over writing about the Cardinals, unfortunately.

I'm sorry. Sorry about that as well. But thank you for joining us, my friend. Thanks for having me on, Derek. Good to be here. All right. Well, we know that the Diamondbacks have some rumors. Like things are starting to get a little hot,

and those rumors are specifically about some pitchers. We have this tweet that Gambo put out. essentially saying here that the Arizona Diamondbacks, that things might be cooling on Zach Gallen, he said I would still peg the return of Zach Gallant to the Diamondbacks is unlikely, but hearing there is definitely mutual interest from both sides on a return for Merrill Kelly. So I guess let's start with that. One thing I have said is I very much have wanted Merrill Kelly back, but I also don't think that Merrill Kelly is going to be a very exciting free agent move for.

much of the fan base, I think it'll just feel more like we are a bit, a bit whole. We are a bit complete again when we thought we were going to lose both of these guys. What are your thoughts on bringing Merrill back and what it would mean to this team and specifically the fan base to see him come back? Yeah, it just doesn't really feel right to not have Merrill Kelly on this roster, to be honest. Yeah, I think what you're looking for this offseason is something that's maybe adding a little bit more stability than anything else. I know everyone probably wants to see like a Freddie Peralta or a Joe Ryan or something like that. But Merrill Kelly is exactly what they need in terms of stability and in terms of being able to provide innings.

Now there is, you know, there's a little bit of risk there with his age. But I think at the end of the day, this is this is a guy that's meant a lot to the organization and a guy that's really done very high quality work for the Diamondbacks. and you know you're getting probably five to six quality innings, even if he's not striking out 10 guys. He's going to provide length, and he's going to be pretty durable, and he's going to be reliable. And that's what they need in the rotation more than anything.

Right now, they need innings, and they need to know what they're getting. And it's so funny because this is a guy that just a few years ago, felt like, at least for me, it feels like just yesterday, we were talking about, can this guy come back from the KBO? and, you know, pitch in Major League Baseball. And now it's like, can we bring back our most consistent pitcher that we've had over the last, like, five seasons?

Can we bring back that guy that would now be like a veteran presence, you know, in the clubhouse that the Diamondbacks don't necessarily currently have? You could say Erod has plenty of years of experience there. But as far as the starting pitching rotation goes, they have a lot of work to do. If they're able to bring back Merrill Kelly, you feel a little bit better, perhaps. about them plugging in a younger, you know, minor league guy, potentially a prospect as potentially a starting pitcher, rather than, you know, if they aren't able to do anything with starting pitching and have to look in-house for both of those options.

I don't feel like that's even a possibility for this team. But, you know, again, with the rising cost of starting pitching, it feels less and less likely that the debacks are going to be able to go out there and get two quality starting pitchers through free agency and be able to afford that. Yeah, that's the tough part is that they need two starting pitchers. It's not, it's not let's go and get an ace because we're, you know, we're one pitcher away or let's go and take a flyer on a guy.

It's, well, they need two starting pitchers that are going to be consistent and be in that rotation regularly. And I'm not so sure. I'm not so sure about, you know, Christiane Manna and Bryce Jarvis filling out those two spots for the entire season, maybe in the event of an injury or something, but I don't know. So, yeah, they need more than one starter, and that's very tough to get. Well, and you published in the PHNX newsletter the other day, your list, your checklist for offseason needs for the Diamondbacks.

We talked about it on Tuesday's show, but a great, great list, something I very much agree with. Your list had two starting pitchers as their number one priority. then you add closer and then setup man your first four players that the diamondbacks need to go out and get all pitching and man i don't disagree with you at all it's just it gets to the point where what do you think the diamondbacks can sacrifice off of this checklist without actually going to get that they could you know still be competitive without yeah i know i know you didn't necessarily agree with my my setup man prediction uh yeah well good okay i mean i i i i i don't don't disagree with it. I don't disagree with it, but I do think when you look at it as the third

highest priority above first baseman, backup catcher and right-handed outfielder, I was just curious as, you know, do your thought. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I think, you know, you can probably get away with some kind of first base platoon. I would imagine, you know, Pavin Smith probably has a better season this year than what happened last year. And, you know, you never know what you have with Tyler Locklear. Maybe he, maybe he takes a step forward. There's, that's still a, question mark. So the first base thing, it's not, I think that one might be a little bit more room to work with. And outfield as well is maybe not super high priority. I think the reason why I went with a setup man as the number three priority. And maybe I shouldn't have have listed it

as set up man. Maybe I should have just said another quality leverage reliever. Because I just, I don't think there's even enough. Let's say you add, you know, let's say you add a roll as Chapman. You still don't have a guy that you are absolutely certain. is locking down the seventh and the eighth inning. I, you know, maybe, maybe, you know, Andrew Salfrank was really good last year. Kevin Ginkle is hopefully going to be healthy. Ryan Thompson's going to, was, was pretty solid. Like, you might get really good quality innings out of those guys, but even still, we saw

what happened last year. You're going to need depth and you're going to need guys who are capable of contributing in a leverage role, even outside of the ninth inning. But you have to work backwards from the ninth inning when you're constructing the bullpen, in my opinion. Well, and that seems to be what Tori Lavello doesn't do, right? That seems to be what this team doesn't do. They want to just keep their options open and they want to have the high leverage guys for late

and then other guys that they use in the earlier innings and essentially have two groups of guys, one that they trust implicitly and other guys that are there just for the earlier innings or like blowouts where they need to eat innings or whatever the case may be. I just think it's kind of ridiculous that they don't have that and don't think that that's important despite history proving that the best teams have that exact thing, including a setup man, as you said, like somebody that you feel comfortable with once you get to the eighth inning, that eighth and ninth innings are taking care of and just need to get there,

whether it's the starter going seven, whether it's a starter giving you five and needing to use other two other guys to get through six, seven. You feel like the most important part of that is the eight and nine. And the Diamondbacks don't have guys for either of those roles, right? They also don't really have a first baseman, which is just weird to hear them confess that in a press conference as well with Pavin Smith and Tyler Locklear over there going, hey, but I get it. Locklear is injured and Pavan really isn't a first baseman. He's just a guy that they've attempted to fit in somewhere, you know, and I just don't know.

I don't feel great about the way they're constructed. And I do think that they have a lot of work to do. but they also can't just like punt on this period of time that they have Corbyn Burns here. You know, they're paying him so much money that it's just insane to think that, well, you know, 2026 is kind of a wash. And then we don't even know about 2027 as far as if that season will happen. So like, or when it will happen or what's going to, you know, what that is the whole entire situation is going to look like. So like, I don't know.

It just, it feels like this is a mess and they have no choice, but to try to fix. it and to try to be as competitive as possible in Burns' time here as a pitcher. Yeah, you have to do something. I mean, Burns might even opt out after this year. You never know. I kind of, I get the sense that he probably wouldn't, but you never know. It's not a guarantee that he would want to stay here. The one thing I'll say about the setup man and whatnot is when you have a closer,

and we've seen this happen before, when you have a closer that's actually reliable, everyone else seems to kind of find their roles really, really well. Like when Paul Sewell was here in 2023 and he was really, really good that year, Kevin Ginkle was like the best eighth inning guy in baseball and Ryan Thompson was perfect. And you can't expect perfection like that. But maybe somebody steps up into that role more solidly if you just make sure they know they are not going to be responsible for the ninth inning or they don't have to be ready for any situation.

Well, I remember Mantipli saying that exact thing, that the biggest change was once Paul Seawalt came. Everybody knew their role. Everybody knew what their role was. And again, that seems to be important. That seems to be important. Well, a guy that can definitely help them out is Pete Fairbanks. We had information

that the Diamondbacks were in talks with Fairbanks. Nick McCorough confirmed that. His sources said they were in talks with Fairbanks. So, I mean, versatility there, either way, whether he's a closer or a high leverage arm. It feels like Pete Fairbanks would be a fantastic solution that might cost you about $5 million less per year

than other options that you would consider to be, I guess, a similar talent level of being an elite high leverage reliever. Yeah, yeah, I like Fairbanks as a fit. And I think, yeah, in terms of cost, he's going to be a lot more affordable than some of these other guys that are flying off the board. I mean, like 16 plus million for some of these guys. It's crazy.

Yeah, yeah, that's insane. And especially for guys that had ERAs in the mid-fours. I mean, Fairbanks has been, you know, sub three most of his career. He's really, he had a bit of an odd stretch last year and had some interesting interviews, which selfishly, I would love to cover Pete Fairbanks as a member of the Diamondbacks because that guy, that guy is a fun personality, that's for sure. But I do think. I was going to say, I don't understand really.

Sorry to cut you up. I don't really understand why he isn't part of the same class that is getting more of the $14 to $16 million per year. When you look at his track record, he has been incredibly consistent for Tampa. Yeah. And I think, you know, his his like fan graphs crowdsource estimate is like $8 million per year, which I think is probably a little bit too low. It's probably going to get more than that. But if it's less than what some of these other guys are making, that's still a pretty good deal. even if his strikeout numbers have gone down a little bit. He used to strike out north of like 13 guys per nine innings. It's down to around like eight or nine now.

But he's still finding a way to get it done. He's been effective. I mean, the peripherals aren't showing that he's a worse pitcher than his ERA. And I, the one danger is I don't want to see him show up and then have Tori Lavello say, well, he's going to pitch in high leverage. We're not going to name him the closer. No, name him the closer. Until like Justin Martinez comes back, name him the closer.

Yeah, do not pull that. Do not pull that on us, Tori. We're not doing that this time for sure. I know you do a great job writing for not only for us, but over there for D-Backs on Sports Illustrated D-Backs, D-Backs on SI. And I just wanted to see, are you prepared for the Cotel-Marté rumors? Are you prepared for the storm

that we are about to get Alex who could tell Marte of rumors from the winter meetings because it feels like I mean it feels like this is it right like either things are going to have kind of gasoline poured on the fire and it's going to go crazy

or this is where they die and we finally realize that it was kind of all a bit of a more of a logical move rather than something the Diamondbacks definitely wanted to do yeah yeah I mean I don't know if they're really going to go away this entire off season. I think he's too much of a too much of something for people to write about, you know,

nationally as, you know, mocking him to their team or to, you know, contenders and whatnot. The amount of jersey swaps I've seen are gross. It's gross on the internet right now. The mock trades for like low level prospects to random teams. It's like, no, come on. But I still think I lean towards him. not going anywhere this off season, mainly because I just don't think that they're going to be willing to take that kind of a prospect deal, that kind of a deal that's, well, you know, a Tyler Locklear

type or something like that. They can't, you can't, you can't. Yeah, it has to be major league level, you know, controllable starting pitching. And I don't think Mike Hazen is going to budge too much on that. Well, I mean, let's hope he doesn't because this is a situation where we have an MVP caliber player on our team. And the last thing we want to see is him go be that for another team. I think the one thing that's missing is having a team around him that's performing and winning and being successful. I mean, Cotel Marte, you had him to an already powerful team like the Tigers, for instance, and watch him blow up, you know what I mean? But a team that has pitching, you mean? Yeah, yeah, a team that has pitching. That's the key. That's the key. Something we don't. Something we don't. Something we

don't but hey Alex we appreciate your time man thank you so much for stopping by you have been killing it with the newsletter we have told everybody to make sure they go get that newsletter you can get it at go p hnx.com slash newsletter it is absolutely free go grab it right now or go sign up for it you'll get it in your inbox every day and it's been delightful you've been you've been doing great work made me laugh out loud the other day with your comment about the sky being blue there being forks in the kitchen and the cardinals being a terrible football team. So thank you again, sir.

So much for stopping by. We appreciate you. Thank you, man. Appreciate it. All right, man. Make sure to follow Alex, by the way. You can follow him at Alex Dag, D-A-G-A-Z on Twitter. So make sure to follow him. We're going to take a quick break. And on the other side of this break, we're going to talk about Tony Clark's comments in regard to the collective bargaining agreement and being a little hopeful that a deal can get done without any games actually being missed.

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Terms and conditions do apply at participating locations. Visit CircleK.com for detail. Well, we have so much more in regards to the collective bargaining agreement to deal with. I do not even want to start talking about it this early. We are one year, essentially, away from the collective bargaining agreement that exists in Major League Baseball ending. And according to a report from Bob Nightingale at USA Today, Tony Clark, who is the executive in charge of the Major League Baseball Players Association, I don't even know what it is stupid title. Who somehow still has a job? Who is somehow, yeah, right?

Like somebody who has been part of federal investigations in regards to their youth baseball program that may or may not be, and youth baseball program might just exist for some sort of weird. It's a scam. It's a pension fund for players and his daughter, apparently, to run. But Tony Clark spent four days meeting with players at their executive board meeting this week

with the hottest topic being the upcoming collective. bargaining agreement. He told the players to be fully prepared for a potential work stoppage, but to also ignore the noise that the game will be shut down when the CBA expires on December 1st, 2026. How do you ignore the noise that the game is going to be shut down due to a work stoppage on December 1st, 2026? I don't know. I mean, I guess you go out there and you shut your mouth and you play the game and you go hit the ball, right? Don't talk about that. stuff. But considering, you know, how stupid it is that there's going to be a work stoppage and that apparently this one seems like it's going to be more contentious than the last one we experienced.

I don't know why players would not, would be able to ignore the noise, right? He said to USA Today and the Associated Press yesterday, our interest is getting in the room and hammering out a fair and equitable deal. That is like the, that is the catchphrase of this CBA, fair and equitable. Our commitment is in the room at the table and getting to an agreement that is fair and equitable. Ding, ding, ding. Other stuff is just noise. So again, I understand what's happening here. I understand that, you know, baseball is in a very weird place. And it kind of always has been. the situation, the amount of control that a team has over a young player when they're a minor leaguer that makes their debut, the way teams used to manipulate service time to get an extra year out of certain young players,

the way that pretty much a substantially good baseball player, perhaps an elite player, one of the best in the game, might only have one or two chances in their career to make a big payday, is a huge problem with baseball. It's a huge part of the problem, right? So there has been a problem kind of baked in here forever. We've talked about how little minor league teams pay, you know, the minor league players, right? Most of minor league players, especially ones that don't have very high aspirations to actually make it to major leagues. Or maybe some of those that didn't get a big signing bonus sometimes have to have two, three jobs as well as being a baseball player.

right? That's kind of crazy to think about that. And then they get in trouble for having multiple jobs just to make ends meet, right? So there is a lot of problem. I'm definitely, despite what I have to say about Tony Clark, there are plenty of things that put me on the side of the players when it comes to this, right? So the idea of a salary cap in baseball is very much anti-player pro owner, right? We feel as fans that we are a part of it. we are a part of it because it does impact our enjoyment of the game. Overall, fair is fair. And as much as players and the players association will make you believe this is about them getting a fair payday and getting what is fair and equitable,

I would argue that other sports have figured out a way to do this, have a, you know, a salary cap and still allow players to make plenty of money, right? we live in tough times right now the baseball players aren't the only ones that are struggling i think all of us are struggling financially right now in this country and it makes it very difficult uh you know to to to i guess relate to things like odell beckham junior's video about only making eight million dollars a year or whatever after taxes or whatever the hell he had to say right like uh i'm sorry most of us will never see that much money in our lifetime let alone per year, so we don't want to hear about how hard it is for you to make it, right? But baseball players, meanwhile, some of them, especially in the case of like a Zett Gallen, for instance,

some of them can have their big payday come and go and they miss that window simply because, as Gallen was in 2025, they have a downseason. If Gallen had two back-to-back seasons that were as bad as his first half, most teams probably wouldn't even consider giving him a long-term deal at all or maybe even a contract in the first place, even a short-term deal, right? And that basically flushes all of the excellent work that he put into his career prior to that down the drain. Many players go through that where their best years were when they were under a contract with their team, you know, the team that drafted them early on and they might have a couple of down years and then they never get that glorious big payday

that one, maybe they would have gotten when they were younger. Did they deserve it? Did they not deserve it? That's a whole other thing. And yes, cool bro is right. Gallon is inconsistent now. But we don't know that. I mean, Gallin was actually fairly consistent in the second half of the season.

And you don't really know what you're going to get, which is the risk right now with a team going out and signing Gallon, right? But again, my point being is that this overall, over the last few seasons has kind of pointed this off season, the offseason between 2025 season and 2000. was supposed to be when Zach Galen got his big payday. We've joked about it. We've lamented about it.

We've talked about it quite a bit. But again, the fact of the matter is that inconsistency that you're talking about might have flushed all of his hard work that he's put into his career down the drain, no matter how good he is from this point going forward. And no team might give him that big payday that we thought he was actually going to get. So again, there's that. But here with his comments, this is what Tony Clark said in regards to a work stoppage he said we never go into a negotiation trying to miss games i can't speak

for the other side but we don't go into a negotiation trying to miss games but in our history we've missed games we go into negotiation looking to move the industry forward protect and advance player rights as a part of that we're going to negotiate in that fashion here but we're going to be prepared for what the other side is telling us they're interested in doing we don't go into the conversation looking to damage the game, particularly in a world where the game is moving in a very good direction. It's that part that's the most frustrating, right? This was one of the best world series, despite the fact that we here at this show hated the results, hated the end results of it. This was one of the best world series that most of us have ever seen in our lifetime, right?

And again, the game is very popular. I think that the changes to the game have made it efficient. I think they've made more people want to watch it. I think they've made people, you know, new younger fans pick up the game and start enjoying it. And I could only imagine in this world of having so many other distractions and streaming services and sports and things to watch that a work stoppage is going to impact the lives of many people outside of those that work in baseball. Right? This guy right here. I don't, I kind of have a self-serving interest here. But I don't

I don't think that Tony Clark is not being I don't think he's lying about this. I don't think that they go in wanting to miss games because nobody wants to miss games. The owners shouldn't want to miss games. But the owners are the ones that are going to lock out the players

and cause a work stoppage due to the lack of a CBA being in place. It just, it seems outrageous, it seems ridiculous. And again, there's times that they say things that is kind of outrageous. Like we're seeing some of these contracts that players are getting and Tony Clark says we should be celebrating our guys in the game and what we're seeing.

Our guys are doing that. They're performing night in, night out, but the noise is suggesting that the sky is falling. We'll see once we start formal bargaining what that looks like, but our players are ready for whatever that is going to look like. And what I will say is that, yes, the players are performing in and out. There's no doubt about that. but the players, once again, in many of these cases, especially these contracts,

we're already seeing this off-season, are getting paid. And I mean, again, it's, in some cases, we find ourselves constantly saying, wow, look at how much he got per year. Look at how much he got for year. The bar keeps moving up. It keeps getting higher and higher.

Relievers, closers are getting close to, you know, $15, $20 million now per year. It's crazy. and the only reason why they're getting paid that much is no matter what a team like the Milwaukee Brewers or the Arizona Diamondbacks could offer someone like Roberts-Wores, the Dodgers ultimately can offer more. The Mets can ultimately offer more. They don't mind because to them, oh, well, we would offer them $14 million, but we'll take $17 million. Fine, give them $17 million. We don't care. Because to them, $17 million isn't a back-breaking amount of money, but to us, $14 million already was a back-breaking amount of money, right? So I, I, I, I don't know. Because, like, I, I want players to get paid, and I want this to be fair, and I am on the side of the players. But I can't help but feel like when I hear someone like Tony Clark speak, Damon, that it's like, yeah, yeah, I mean, yeah, I understand wanting them to be protected, but I don't know if baseball players are really being, like, I don't exploit it? Like that just seems weird to be with the amount of contracts the guys are getting with guys getting paid a billion dollars

I don't really see how they're currently getting like exploited and how like putting a salary cap on this is going to make them have to take like minimum wage type contracts. My main thing and of course I forgot to change out the. Oh, we had our guy. My main thing is that they like yeah, these salaries keep in. increasing and I'm like I'm never the guy who's like caping for the billionaires but but the the issue for me is that your low your lower tier players get screwed in the process and you completely just throw these guys in the garbage can of like well who cares about the eighth reliever on the right this team right when it's like well a floor could help improve that dude's salary in it

of itself if you guys properly structured contracts getting more money why are we just worried about, you know. It's all about the superstars. Ranger Suarez is getting more money. Yeah. Like those guys are going to make their money. Right. Don't worry about them.

Right. Well, but then it comes down to, well, those lower guys do they really deserve that? You know, well, a guy with a zero point to war over 2025 does he really deserve more money. It's like the point, you keep acting like your advocates fighting on behalf of every player. But realistically, like you said, you're just fighting on behalf of the rich getting richer. Those guys are going to get huge contrast. those guys are going to receive so much money that they cannot actually spend it in one lifetime.

But again, there is just this weird sense that MLB owners, which honestly, too, like you said, I don't want to constantly feel like I'm defending billionaires that could absolutely pay more money, you know, for all of this stuff, Damon. But man, I just, I read this and I just feel like this entire situation is just silly. You have guys getting paid an ungodly amount of money

and you're acting like, you know, trying to figure out a way to control the game is just so anti-player. This should be something both sides are working on together. This should be something players have interest in. Like, I don't want to have to go play for the Dodgers just to receive the amount of money. I feel like I can get as my maximum.

Or one of three teams. Like, oh, I can go play for the Yankees, the Dodgers, the Mets, or the Blue Jays. Like aside from that, no other team can really afford me. Like, what a weird place to be in, especially considering that you have guys like Corbyn Burns out there kind of taking a discount just so you can come back to Arizona and live here in a place that makes his wife and his family happy. There's other people out there, I'm sure, that would like to live places that would make

their families and their wives happy, but they're like, sorry, I can't go to Minnesota because they don't pay people up there, right? Like, that's what's crazy. So you're 100% right. The floor is far more important to be implemented here. so that teams like the pirates and the Tampa Bay Rays and the Minnesota Twins stop creating these stars that then they just become kind of like a minor league team for the bigger more, you know, the teams that do spend to steal those stars away

once they're created and they're seasoned. Like, oh, perfect. They have like four years of being in Major League Baseball now, time to pluck them away. They're going to be an all-star first basement for us. And I know it's not exactly the thing that players in the current want to hear. But baseball needs to market to these players as well that like this game will not grow and become popular enough for you guys to make more money. Right. Unless we make it where all teams have an opportunity to be successful because as it

currently stands, there's a reason that baseball is growing in Japan because their team is winning every goddamn year. We all got to eat. We all got to eat in order for major league baseball to thrive all teams have to eat and it's not like we all eat at the same time sometimes you got to stagger the eating well i would just imagine that like baseball in like the bay area for example took a drastic drop in in what people care about and there's still a lot of giants fans but i bet a lot of people that were Oakland A's fans are now like we're done right and and you lose a ton of interest so yeah you might be gaining japan mexico the dominican republic because all these big market teams continue to be good year after year after year. But the American market needs you guys to

make it where teams like the Kansas City Chiefs can win the Super Bowl because they draft the right player and they pick the right coach. And in baseball as currently constituted, it doesn't work like that. You could run into a dream season like the debacks did and you still lose in the World Series to a team like the Rangers who, you know, maybe doesn't strike you as a team that is like this, this like you know they're not the dodgers they're not the yankees go look at that team's payroll they spent a lot of money go look at that team's payroll they wouldn't get there if it wasn't for the amount of money that they were spending you have to pay to win in this sport and it kind of sucks because it's just not it's not a fair system for the smaller market teams uh jarmie strong a z says does the

expansion help them new markets i don't know like theoretically yes the expansion helps because of the amount of new fans it brings in and those fans are going to be excited in those particular cities just to have a new team, right? But some of those cities could react in the same way we did here in Phoenix, where you have a lot of season ticket holder attrition from one year to the next, and then it causes the team to like have to be competitive to bring a winner to the city and try to win as fast as possible. We're seeing that with these expansion teams like the Golden Knights in Las Vegas, right, where these teams pop up, they exist and the next thing you know, they're winning a championship or at least very competitive very quickly as far as, you know,

being introduced in the league. But I don't know. I think overall here, this is all just preparation once again. This is the reason why the Coutel Marte rumors bother me so much, Damon, is because I feel like they are simply preparation for the inevitable. That's what this is. This is Tony Clark preparing the players for the inevitable, which is going to be a work stoppage. And it's just really up to how nasty does it get? How many games do we miss? How many days are we locked out? And when will baseball come back. Essentially on the line is billions of dollars. We don't even know how much these teams make because they refuse to show us how much they make, but it's a lot of money, Damon. So like I doubt that, you know, again, once again, as much as both sides want to, want to try to,

you know, have this standoff and, and, you know, make the other side quit first. We cannot have this linger too long, especially right now when baseball is at, it's, it's, it's, it's, finest. You know, it's really good right now. And Cool. Yeah, the sport. 207 is 100% right. Six year service rules should be fought against by the players. Yeah.

That is what I'm talking about. Six years service rules are crazy. It's some sort of that that's such a half-ass effort to try to get these teams to be competitive. You know, the, the small market teams, right? Like the pirates and stuff. But all they do is let the guys stay there for six years. And then once the time's up, they're like, see ya, enjoy the Yankees. you enjoy the Dodgers.

Yeah, no, no doubt about it. I think that that's like, and people will hear a lot of our takes so far and be like, caping for the, for the owners, huh guys? But it's like that's one of the things that needs to be argued in the other direction. Get rid of arbitration. The service time rules are ridiculous. Make it like a rookie contract scale when you sign out of high school or out of college. And then once you get to the majors, you know, hypothetically based off your contract,

you can then, you know, reassess your value or whatnot. But as it currently stands, like, there should be no floor. There should be no service time rules. And, or I'm sorry, there should be a floor. There should be no service time rules. And there needs to be a cap. That's the big one that will, the players will push back against. But it's like, we'll give you these things if we can also get these things just so we can kind of,

instead of it being here, we can kind of get it to like here across baseball where the lower teams are the gap between the higher and the lower teams is not like a minor league baseball team and an all-star team. I just some players entire career is six years long. You know what I mean? Yeah. And that's not even that bad of a run. If you were just good good for six years and then that was it, you were like, that's a pretty solid career. And you probably make a good amount of money, but not what you could make on the open market. Not what you could make on the open market. And some guys just never reached that point. Their career just kind of gases out before then, right? And then you have this weird. And then you have this weird. Rule 5 draft, which, by the way, that takes place next Wednesday at 2 p.m. Eastern Tang, which is directly during our showtime. That is during the winter meetings. A lot of things take place during the winter meetings. Damon, you got the Rule 5 draft. You have the draft lottery takes place during this time. And we talked a bit when we had our guy Cogs on the show about what other players the Diamondbacks could kind of lock in on and maybe focus on during the

Rule 5 draft. But I found a guy we didn't talk about, Damon. And quite frankly, Glock and spiel me. This guy, bring me the big fella, is what I'm saying. Bring me the big fella because I need this guy. His name is R.J. Petit. He is, was really good this year, honestly. In 2025, he had a 2.44 ERA. He had a 1.06 whip.

He had 79 strikeouts in 66 and a third in. Pitched, but that's not why we care about him on this program. We care about him on this program, Damon, because this man, according to his minor league stats page, this absolute hoss of a man. Mountain. Mountain. Some, some say mountain. Six foot eight, 300 pounds of pure twisted steel and sex appeal.

we should call him the mountain the mountain yes that's what we should call i mean look at look at this absolute unit this guy is and uh yeah he has himself uh he definitely has himself some some great stats um but again a couple of things i want to point out his name whole name robert george pettit but he goes by r j and i don't know where the jay comes from is it not junior that's a i've never seen anybody use are like j as a junior yeah they do that yeah okay well maybe that's where it's coming from maybe i think maybe he's robert george pettit junior and that's r j for short i don't care i wouldn't question him you know why because he's six foot eight and he weighs 300 pounds he can call himself whatever he wants damon yeah he can call himself whatever he wants

yeah the mountain can do what he can't what he can't do he can't ride most rolling coasters. That's what he can. But I don't just want him on my team. He can't ride coach either. Yeah, he can't ride coach. He's definitely going to be offered up the emergency aisle. Yeah. We're going to offer you the emergency aisle for everyone else's sick. Yeah, yeah, you get both seats, too, homie. Also, great stash, great stash. And I don't just want him on my baseball team. I want to manage his pro wrestling career. That's what I want. And we'll call him the mountain. and he'll be champion of IZW in no time.

Trust me. Some things to keep in mind also with the Rule 5 draft is that teams must pay $100,000 to select a player in the Major League phase of the Rule 5 draft. And if that player is required once again to remain on the 26 man roster for the full season. And if the selecting team removes them from their roster, then the player is offered back to the original team for half the cost. So we paid you $100,000, you pay us $50,000 and you get the guy back. Not a bad way to make a cool 50 grand, right?

I mean, I'm not going to see that money, that much money in 2026. So I don't know. But last year's Rule 5 draft was the most active in decades. Teams made 83 total selections. It was the most since 2004. And Damon, do you know who is the most notable Rule 5 pick in history? No, I don't. Roberto Clemente.

Wow, it was a thing back then in the 60s? see how long baseball has been screwed up? The Rule 5 draft has been a thing since the 60s, huh? Hall of Fame outfielder and my personal hero, Roberto Clemente, a man with a cannon for an arm, he was the most notable Rule 5 draft pick in history. So, and remain so, and probably will remain so until the end of time. There's been some other guys that were fairly notable,

but for the most part, nobody is going to even touch Roberto Clemente there. So we appreciate you guys so much. We have had ourselves some fun today. It's Friday. I hope you guys all have yourselves a great weekend. By the way, I'm going to be out joining the Cardinals crew for their away shows this month. So if you want to join us on the away game days out at Heeliver Resorts and Casinos, you get to see this mustache in person out there.

So make sure to join us for that. We're going to have a whole lot of fun. Of course, you can also follow us on Twitter. I'm at Cap underscore Cave Man with a K. Damon is at Damon Dog with a D-A-W-G at the end. and as always we are all Damon's dogs. Bark, bark. I said bark, bark, bark.

Our show is at PHNX underscore D-Bags, but as always all roads lead to at PHNX underscore Sports on Twitter, Instagram, and Facebook. We love you guys so much. We thank you for your time. We will see you back here on Monday at 12 p.m. with another mailbag Monday episode. And we're going to have hopefully some news.

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