PHNX Arizona Diamondbacks Podcast - Torey Lovullo extended through 2022

Episode Date: September 24, 2021

On this episode, Jesse and Derek discuss the breaking news on Torey Lovullo's contract extension through 2022 with a club option for 2023, how this impacts the team, and why TANK SZN is just as fun as playoff season. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hello and welcome to the PHNX D-BACs podcast right here on PHNX. My name is Derek Montia, occasionally known as your mayor of PHNX. And I am thrilled to be once again joined by my co-host. But before I find out where he's been this entire time, I would like to let you guys all know that this show is brought to you by the Draft King's Sportsbook app, which is America's top-rated sportsbook app. Download the Draft King Sportsbook app now. use our code P-H-N-X.

And for betting simply $1 on any college or NFL game, you will get $150 in free bets instantly. That's the Draft King Sportsbook app and R-Code P-H-N-X. Again, returning, joining the podcast, once again, is my friend and co-host, Thunderstick Jesse Friedman. Jesse, where the hell have you been? You know, Derek, I've been having a lot of fun hanging with kids in my happy place.

I've basically been a glorified camp counselor the last few days. That's essentially where I've been. For those that don't know, Professor Friedman over here is a teacher during the day when he's not being a sports broadcaster. And yeah, it's nice to have you back.

We missed you. It's honestly like the greatest combination of jobs. I'm a math teacher by day and I'm a sports journalist by night. Yeah. Yeah. It's really incredible. You put those math skills to use at night, analyzing all this data.

Right. Yeah, the math never stops. It never stops. It's all math all the time. Just like it's tank season all the time, Jesse. Tank season! It is tank season all the time. Yes.

Well, tank season is here, but we have some good news. We're going to get to that in a moment. Tori Lavallo has been extended by the Arizona Diamondbacks, depending on how you feel about that, whether that's good news or bad news. news. But yeah, you said good news, Derek. You must have been persuaded on the show.

I've told you. I lose all the arguments I'm involved with. I lost the jersey argument on the Phoenix sports podcast. I lose all of them. But I'm happy to take part in the debate. I will say that tank season was slowed down a little bit today with the Arizona Diamondbacks avoiding the sweep against the Atlanta Braves. It did not look good for a while there.

The Atlanta Braves were really just beating up on the Diamondbacks. And when I say that, I haven't seen so many home runs at Chase Field in years, it feels like. I haven't seen that. It seemed like the Braves were just knocking everything out of the park. Today, Madison Bumgarner looked good. There was some good offense. Carson Kelly had a big day for the Diamondbacks. Hit a double even after getting hit in the beanbag.

So you got to appreciate that. But overall, not what we wanted because the Diamondbacks win. and now we are in a position where, you know, the Baltimore Orioles, they're up when we take a look at these standings. Right now, they have the advantage. They are winning their game currently against the Texas Rangers. They're up two to nothing in the top of the seventh. So hopefully this tie will keep going on where they also win today and they sit at 49 and 104. As you can see there, the other teams, their heart isn't in it.

They're not down with tank season. The thing is not for the faint of heart. No. You got to be committed to this, Jesse. You got to be committed to the bit, all right? So the thing about this situation now is, you know, the Diamondbacks and Orioles seem to just be neck and neck. When one loses, the other loses, when one wins, the other wins.

What happens, Jesse, when this ends in a tie? Okay, I'll answer your question in a second. but can you pull up the graphic again? Oh, let's do it. We need to take another second to appreciate what is happening in the left half of this graphic. This is so extreme and unnecessary. And I, for one, am here for it. These teams are all drowning.

But the Diamondbacks and Orioles definitely are the ones that need a life preserver at this point. And that life preserver, Jesse, is Elijah Green. It's Elijah Green. I need that number one pick. Obviously, there's lots of good options for, all of the teams in the top 10, but it definitely feels like green is still that, that ultimate prize still feels like he's going to be that number one pick. I watched video of him yesterday, and he just seems like he's four years into his major

league career when I watch these videos. He's, he's taller and bigger than everybody's playing with. He's, you know, going three for four and, you know, four, for four in some of these games that I watched as a high schooler. It's just wild to see a talent like that. But again, it's also like a grown-ass man playing against high school kids is what it looks like in these videos. But yeah, what happens when the Baltimore Orioles and the Diamondbacks potentially end the season with the exact same record if that's what happens. Yeah, I mean, we're not that far away from the end of the season about a week out, right?

So this is looking like honestly a fairly likely possibility in my book. And yeah, so I looked into this there because I was really curious what happens if there's a tie. and I did some research and found that the tiebreaker between two teams is their previous year's record. So if the Diamondbacks and Orioles wind up with the exact same record this season, we would look at their 2020 records in order to decide who gets the tiebreaker. The team with the worst record sort of wins the tiebreaker, right, and would get the first overall pick. Okay.

So who had the worst record in 2020? That's where it gets good. The Diamondbacks and the Orioles were both. were both 25 and 35 last. What? What? I know, right? It's absolutely wild. How? How does that happen? They were both 25 and 35 in 2020.

That's incredible. There is a very real possibility that they go back to back seasons with the exact same record. And so I have racked the internet, Derek. I have searched and clawed my way around the internet web. I've tried to find an answer to this question. And honestly, I can't. You look at all of the most official websites.

that all they mention is the tiebreaker is the previous year's record. There is no mention of a follow-up tiebreaker because, frankly, the odds of two baseball teams having the exact same record in back-to-back season is like astronomically low, right? Yeah, this has to be like near impossible for that to be something that actually occurs, especially considering the variable that was the 2020 season too, right? I mean, that's a, I guess maybe with less games, it's probably a higher percentage chance that they finish with the same record rather than more games.

But what are the odds that these two teams and these two seasons finish with such terrible records that match each other? Like, that's insane. Yeah. So honestly, I have no official reading on this, but my assumption, which I think is probably a pretty safe assumption, is that it probably goes back to their 2019 records. And in that case, the Orioles would win the tiebreaker. They had the worst record, the worst record of the two teams in 2019. So ultimately, I think the tiebreaker probably goes to the Orioles in this situation. That's the, that's the moral of the story. But this is unprecedented, right?

Like, this is something that. Absolutely. That Rob Manfred in his office might actually have to, like, address and make an actual official ruling about if one doesn't exist at this point. Yeah. Yeah. We'll see. My guess is they probably have a rule written somewhere that they just don't really post

publicly because they feel like the odds of this happening is. so low. Yeah, this never happened. Yeah. Yeah. And it's never going to happen. And yeah, they probably didn't think it ever would. Wow. But ultimately, Derek, I mean, if there's ever a tiebreaker between another team and the Orioles about

which franchise is worse, the Orioles are probably going to win the tie. Yeah. Tie goes to the runner, and the runner is always the Orioles. Interestingly enough, I think you're right because the only other possibility, right? would be a one game playoff between the teams and then the loser gets the number one pick.

I mean, that's the only other option I could think of. You'd have to make it the winner, right? I mean, that would just be a speaker big. But the winner would end up with a better record, Jesse. The winner would end up with a better record. I don't know. I mean, you'd have to, you'd have to, like, you'd have to just change. I mean, what are you going to do?

Start, like, David Peralta as your starting pitcher? It's a 16 inning scoreless affair with nobody's trying at the, at the plate is basically what I'm imagining. Someone finally buntz one for a home run by accident, and that's the winner. Yeah, well, I don't know. I will say this. I feel like tank season at times as ridiculous as it sounds. I know this is crazy. It's not.

I'm not actually saying this, but at times it feels like it's more fun than a playoff race. Well, what, your team is in it for what? a wild card spot. My team's in it for a franchise altering draft pick, yo. That's way bigger odds than you and your wild card where you're going to get swept in the next round, pal. I'm excited for tank season, baby, and I am excited to say that I have made plenty of money betting against the Arizona time and facts during tank season, which also makes it kind of fun. Remember, just because they're losing doesn't mean you have to. And I think that's a good time. to talk about the Draft King's Sportsbook app and how I've been betting on these games.

I've mostly been betting on run lines because I find that to be something that I just looking at some of these games and knowing baseball, kind of like I do, this is probably the most insider knowledge I'm pulling into my Draft King's Sportsbook app and the bets I'm making. But Jesse, I'm telling you, sometimes they just scream to me that a one and a half run line between the Braves and the Diamondbacks, that seems like easy money to me. However, I did not bet on them today. Look what happened.

Look what happened. I didn't bet against them today, and the Diamondbacks won. So, you know what? Do what you feel like you need to do with this app. I don't have any morals when it comes to it. I just enjoy trying to win money. But you do what you need to do.

If you don't feel like betting against Diamondbacks, you can find plenty of, other options on there. Drafking Sportsbook, they're an official sports betting partner of the NFL. So they have all sorts of great NFL bets. One thing that I've really been into has been the single game parlays, the same game parlays, let you combine multiple bets for a bigger payout. It makes things a little bit more exciting. Yeah, you can take the line for the team to win. But I like to also throw in, especially for the Cardinals, how many yards Kyler Murray is going to get in his particular performance. So far, I've, I've just swung for the fences. Everything has been

the over and I have luckily won so far, almost everything. But I will say that I have been conservative and I've been having a lot of fun. Again, if you use our code PHNX, you will get $150 in free bets instantly for just making a $1 bet on any college or NFL football game. And Draft Kings is safe, secure and reliable. The best part really is that you can deposit and would you draw your cash whenever you want, unless you're like my friend Jared, who by accident put $2,000 in it, and then try to immediately take it out and had all sorts of problems. So don't do that. But if you bet on these games and you take your winnings out, the cash is there for you to withdraw whenever. Again, you can download and use our code PHNX to get that $150 and free bets instantly just by making

that $1 bet. And I implore you to make just a $1 bet. Do it. Call them on their bluff. Get your $3.50 back on, like I did, and then get your $150 in free bets. Remember, 21 and over only, Arizona only. Gambling problem, please call $1,800 next step.

New customers only, minimum $5 deposit and $1 wager required. Eligibility restrictions apply. See draftkings. com slash sportsbook for details. And yes, Jesse, I am openly admitting that I have bet against the Diamondbacks, but you know who I wouldn't bet against. That's Tori Lavolo. And I say that because I had this fear, much like a lot of Arizona Diamondbacks players, that if this season ended and the Diamondbacks and Tori Lovalho parted ways, it was going to be maybe one or two years before we saw him leading

some other squad to a world series or some sort of, you know, huge playoff run. Only a matter of time, right? But the big news today, obviously, Tori Lavolo has been extended. He has been extended through 2022 with a club option for 2023. You wrote an article on it, Jesse. So let's talk about it. Let's talk about the impacts of Tori Lavolo sticking around. and, you know, mostly, mostly the positive things that can happen for this team by him still being here.

I think Steve Gilbert said it well in his article when he pointed out that we probably shouldn't be too surprised by this, just because the Diamondbacks have hung on to Tori Lavello throughout this season, right? Right, exactly. There's two months where the Diamondbacks were, you know, unbelievably horrible. They kept him, right? And we often see managers dismissed in the middle of the season. So I think that's, you know, even another factor that we hadn't even brought in before. But, but, but, uh, but yeah, I mean, I don't want to say I told you so, Derek, but,

Oh, here we go. Here we go. But yeah, I mean, I think, again, you know, I've never said that the diamondbacks needed to bring back Lavello. I think there's something to be said for, you know, having a new voice in the clubhouse. But I think there's also something to be said for what they're choosing to do. And that is to take a guy who is very well respected around the league and give. and give him another shot.

And I think if we're honest with ourselves, you give the best manager in the game a pitching rotation of Matt Peacock, Riley Smith, Seth Frankoff, John DuPontier, and Corbyn, Martin for two months. They're not going to do great either. And I just think we have to keep perspective when it comes to Lavello.

For all of you fans out there, I'm sure there are people watching right now who are super pissed off about what happened today, which I understand, right? I mean, the Diamondbacks have been absolutely horrible, they still have a chance to have their worst record ever this season. But I think you have to keep it in perspective. And I really don't think that Tori Lavello is to blame for much of this.

As hard as that is to separate the unbelievably bad results from the guy who sort of has more power than anyone else in this situation. But I think, you know, I understand where they're coming from. They're going to give him one more season, right? It's not a long-term commitment. They're going to see if next year, hopefully with a healthier team, maybe a little bit more depth on this roster. Maybe he can, you know, get the tide to turn. Gambo from Arizona Sports had tweeted out basically that we still don't know the contract

details, but it sounds like the contract is not as much of a pay increase as a manager receiving a contract extension normally would get. They didn't want to see LaVolo or they didn't want it to be seen that like LaVolo was getting rewarded for this season, but they did want to bring them back. Something Mike Hazen said today in his press conference in regards to the extension was that we've had a lot of conversations and we feel like Tori is still, even though all the things we've gone through this year, has maintained stability and structure around what we're going to try to accomplish moving forward. I think he does a very good job of managing a baseball team. And I think to that agree that obviously the results are the results, I think that I have

to take some reflection and some introspection on where some of those things fell down for us this year and where that's going to impact us moving forward, right? So I feel like what he's saying there is especially that, you know, a lot of these things are out of Tori Lovolo's control, right? Tori Lovolo doesn't necessarily have that same, I don't know. He doesn't, I think a lot of people know that this wasn't on him. And I know people aren't happy with his managerial decisions. I know fans do not want.

you know, that same thing over and over. They feel like how is this team going to get better when you're not doing anything to change the results? The manager is the managers, so they feel strongly like this team isn't going to get better until someone else is leading it. I don't tend to necessarily agree with that just because of that metaphor I personally feel is the situation. you know the diamondbacks giving tori lovolo a box of eight creole lucrans and asking him to draw a mural on the side of one of our beautiful buildings in downtown phoenix right and even lovolo has this attitude of like all right um all right i can give me some time i'll do it they're like no we want it done by october and he's like what no you only gave me eight crayola crows like october right so that's how some people that's how it feels right it's like you can't give someone that rotation that you just brought up and expect them to succeed on any level, right? And I don't know. I don't know going forward what, you know, I don't know if Tori Lavolo is going to be on a

short leash next year. That's a great question. I don't know if we see him, if they have this lack of success again, I doubt we see him make it to the end of next year like we do, like we did this year, you know. But there's a lot of, there's a lot of factors that go into that. I think as frustrated as we are as a fan base at times, I think that the Diamondbacks are a little, a little bit more patient knowing what they're giving Tori LaVolo to work with.

I mean, when you look at his record with this team, it's not mind-blowing, you know, it's sub-500, right? This includes these playoffs as well. We're looking at 334, 365 as manager of this team. But again, like you wrote in your article, it's it's average it's not crazy especially for a small market team that doesn't have the same payroll as the dodgers or you know even even the Padres as they've proved this season you know the interesting thing there though is that someone tweeted out today there's a good chance the

diamondbacks and the Padres are going to end up playing the exact same amount of playoff games the Diamondbacks however they have tank season baby they have Elijah Green maybe coming over so But, you know, what do you think the impacts are on this team by Tori Lavello sticking around? Do you think that this allows some stability and maybe some peace of mind for these players going into next season and beyond perhaps? I think you'll be hard pressed to find a player that is angry about this decision. That's the first thing that I'll say. I don't think, you know, if you're envisioning in your mind right now that there's chaos in the clubhouse and everyone's down because they can't believe that Tori Lavello is coming back this year.

I don't think that's happening. You know, these guys really, these guys really love and respect Tori Lavello as far as we can tell. Do I have to remind everybody once again that Eduardo Escobar, who is no longer with his team, once said he would die for Tori Lavello. And Eduardo Escobar doesn't even speak that great of English. Yet that was the clearest, most dedicated statement in English

I'd ever heard him make in my entire time of covering this team, right? I mean, when a player speaks that way about you, I feel like it speaks volumes on how. they feel about him. No one's ever debated that he wasn't a player's manager, but, you know, like you said, it really comes down to the success of the team, not really what the, how the players feel about it. They're going to be excited that he comes back. Yeah. And another thing that I'll add to this is I think we should view this from Mike Hazen's perspective. If you're going to sit there as the GM and decide not to bring back your manager,

I don't know if we always recognize, like, mentally what that must feel like for a GM. because Mike Hazen's probably looking at this season and being like, yeah, Tori probably could have done some things differently. But I think Mike Hazen is probably looking at himself in the mirror right now and being like, I didn't really set up my manager for success. Like he's probably viewing this more as his failure than a failure of his manager.

And I think he's probably right in that, right? And obviously Mike Hazen has, he has other limitations, right? Diamondbacks aren't spending money. So, you know, I think management probably should. in the blame of this as well. But not to mention the personal issues that Mike Hazen

has going on in his own household. It's completely understandable with what is going on with his wife and his family that, you know, he doesn't have that full dedication to this team. And he has shared that. It's the reason why he kind of stepped away mid-season and, you know, talked about the other front office kind of taking over for him while he was going to be absent. But these are all, you know, all of this impacts this team. right and it's all very unfortunate that it does but you know Mike Hazen is a very very intelligent person

and he's made some absolutely tremendous moves for this ball club again Mike Mike Hazen just like the toy lovolo crann situation was handed a broken vase and a thing of super glue and said fix it quick before our parents get home right and he somehow did it you know with all of those deals and everything the way they structured Madison bumgarner's contract to bring him in while, you know, they still had the Tomas on the books. There was a lot of things that he has done positive for this team. Unfortunately, they just haven't seen more success than that 2017 season when they won the wild card and went to the playoffs, right? I think, you know, we are where we're at, but I will say that I am very glad that Tori Lavolo is still around on a personal note because I like him very much.

And I can completely separate the way I feel analytically about this team from my personal feelings. But on a personal note, just like probably what you were describing the players feel, I like him a lot. I think he's a great person. And I think he's great for this organization. I really do. I just don't. I think he takes on far too much of the blame for, you know, the way this season has gone when there's so many other factors.

You know, he might have lost this. them three or four games, but he didn't lose them, you know, 60. So we'll just say that. But anyway, they, they definitely have, they definitely have a lot of potential. I think that I'm still not betting on them next year, but you can do what you want in the Draft King's Sportsbook app. Please use our code PHNX. And again, if you go there this weekend, sign up for betting $1 on any NFL or college football game, you'll get that $150 and free bets instantly. So again, that's code PHNX, and we can't thank you enough for doing that. I can't, you know, think of a better manager, you know, like we talked about who would replace

him, but something that was really interesting to me that Steve Gilbert, once again from MLB.com, had tweeted out, was that LaVolo will have significant say over what happens with the coaching staff as all coaches are in their final year of their contracts. So I think the big question there is, do you think we'll see Lovolo kind of clean house? Do you think the debacks will move on from this coaching staff? Or do you think they'll bring back a good number of these guys? They better not bring back Matt Hurges. Yeah, there it is. There it is. That's all I wanted to hear. Make fetters, pitching coach. Let's do it. Make the move, commit to it. The guy is a tremendous coach and person.

And again, another person from the Diamondbacks organization, I would love to see continue to rise and get opportunities. It is. Yeah, one thing I'll say real quick, Derek, I think it is strange that, like, the timing of this is a little strange because you're, you're simultaneously not making a long-term commitment to Lavello because, I mean, you're literally not, right?

It's a one-year guaranteed contract with a team, option for the year after that. But you're also kind of giving him the keys to the future. You know, if you're letting him decide, you know, who is your pitching coach, who's your hitting coach, who's your bullpen coach, all of those things. So this is going to be very interesting to see what happens because if the diamondbacks, you know, do, you know, they're obviously bringing him back this year. But if the diamond backs decide to move on from Tori Lovela at the end of next season and not bring him back and not pick up that team option, they're still going to have an entire coaching staff of guys that he brought on.

So obviously that's something we can, you know, we can revisit when we get there if we get there. But I do find the timing of that a little bit strange. Yeah, yeah, I get what you're saying. And I don't know. I think at this point they might want to start looking at some of those other coaches. I mean, as, you know, as people they want to replace. Hazen was asked today, by the way, about Lovolo possibly being extended.

on that club option. And he wasn't, he didn't want to talk about it. You know, he said at one point, he didn't want to get too bogged down in 2023 because at this time they were still looking at, you know, they're still in 2021 and they have a lot of work to be done between now and then. He said, we can ask him all we want next year about 2023, but he's not going to get too far down the road. And that's, I think, a good way to address it, right? Like at this point, Lavolo being picked up for 2023 would kind of be a reward. if he can get this team out of this, you know, situation, right? If next year they don't have the injuries and they don't have all of the catastrophic events

that occurred to this team happen, how successful can it be, right? Can he get it back to where it was at? Can he, you know, make a run again at another wildcard spot or something of the sort? Maybe this is the offseason that they give them a couple more free agents than just, you know, just bolstering the bullpen like they did last off season. they're going to have to do something i mean we've talked about it a lot right there's there's definitely some gaps there's some places where they're going to need more of a veteran presence moving forward with all these young guys coming in so i'm sure that's one thing that maybe our our our viewers today

are a little more on board with i think i think that's a good point there's a chance the diamond baxter and they're not going to go all out this off season but to give torre levello a fair shot i think they probably recognize they're going to need to do a bit of a better job this next year you know putting a viable major league team with reasonable amounts of depth at each position on the field. I just think at the end of the day, looking at what might happen to the San Diego Padres is a perfect example of why even going out and spending all the money that you can and getting as many pieces as you can still might not end up working out for you. You're still going to have Padres, man. Right? I mean, but then you have the giants that won't stop winning, you know, and,

the Dodgers are getting beat up by the Rockies in Colorado. The Rockies, by the way, I mean, we touched on this, but the Rockies have like a crazy record since going back to May 15th, right? Yeah, they're better than the Padres for the last few months. Yeah. Right. So the one thing that, you know, again, even the Rockies have there is a positive role, right? Like they're on a good streak leading in the next season.

They have a lot of belief and confidence in their team. So if the Rockies right now can, take what they're doing and maybe add a few key pieces in the off season, they're going to be yet another formidable foe in the NL West for the Arizona Diamondbacks to face. They're also about to lose Trevor's story, which doesn't make sense to me because they decided to keep him at the deadline. They didn't get anything for him at all.

I know Trevor's story himself was very confused. And once the deadline hit and he was like, I think we were going to trade me. So we'll see what the Rockies. But you're right. They've had a nice second half. and, you know, there's some interesting pieces there for sure. Yeah. And by the way, speaking of interesting pieces,

you can read Jesse's article about why he felt like the Diamondbacks should retain Tori Lovolo, as well as my article on both the curse of Baxter the 4th, as well as some of that information from today's press conference from Mike Hazen on extending Tori Lovolo. You can get all of that, all of that beautiful, wonderful, fresh, hot, big content at Go, p hnx.com. We just want you to come be part of the family with us and appreciate the support that everybody's given us so far.

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