PHNX Arizona Diamondbacks Podcast - Zac Gallen returns to form as Diamondbacks snap losing streak against Cleveland Guardians

Episode Date: June 17, 2023

Bolstered by a stellar outing from Zac Gallen, the Diamondbacks ended their three-game skid with a comfortable 5-1 win over the Cleveland Guardians. Gallen returned to form, Corbin Carroll continued his NL MVP case and Scott McGough shut the door. We also discuss where Zac Gallen and Merrill Kelly rank among starting pitching duos in MLB.WATCH YOUR FAVORITE TEAMS HERE: https://www.fubotv.com/phnx SUBSCRIBE to our YouTube: https://bit.ly/phnx_youtubeALL THINGS PHNX: http://linktr.ee/phnxsports PHNX Events: Get your tickets to D-backs Takeovers, Knockout Nights & Suns Watch Parties at BetMGM, and MORE here: https://www.eventbrite.com/o/phnx-56002330273 Go to omahasteaks.com and enter PHNXDbacks for $30 off! Minimum order may be required. See site for details.Go to https://saturdayneon.com and use code PHNX for 10% off your order today. Free shipping for orders over $200!Gametime: Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code PHNX for $20 off your first purchase.Manscaped: Save 20% Off and Free Shipping with the code “PHNX” at Manscaped.com. BetMGM: Download the BetMGM app and sign-up using bonus code PHNX (betmgm.com/phnx). Place a pre-game, moneyline wager in the amount of at least $10 on any market at standard odds price. You will receive $200 in Bonus Bets instantly regardless of the outcome of your wager! Just make sure you use bonus code PHNX when you sign up!Swing for the Fences: https://promo.betmgm.com/en/promo/sports/swing-for-the-fences 3-Ball Challenge: https://promo.betmgm.com/en/promo/3ballchallengeGambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER (CO, DC, IL, IN, LA, MD, MS, NJ, OH, PA, TN, VA, WV, WY). Call 877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY). Call 1-800-327-5050 (MA)21+ to wager. Please Gamble Responsibly. Call 1-800-NEXT-STEP (AZ), 1-800-522-4700 (KS, NV), 1-800-BETS-OFF (IA), 1-800-270-7117 for confidential help (MI). Visit BetMGM.com for Terms & Conditions. US promotional offers not available in DC, Nevada, New York or Ontario.Pins & Aces: Check out pinsandaces.com and use code PHNX to receive 15% off your first order and get free shipping.Circle K: Text PHNX to 31310 to join the Circle K SMS subscriber club and get BOGO 32 oz Polar Pops! Head to https://www.circlek.com/store-locator to find Circle Ks near you!OGeez!: Learn more about OGeez! at https://ogeezbrands.com//. Must be 21 years or older to purchase.Four Peaks: Follow them on social @fourpeaksbrew & @fourpeakspub! Must be 21+. Enjoy responsibly. When you shop through links in the description, we may earn affiliate commissions. Copyright Disclaimer under section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for “fair use” for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, education and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hello and welcome into a Friday night edition of the PHNX DBAX podcast. My name is Jesse Friedman. I am the vice mayor of PHNX, which I think is a title that I apparently still hold. And I'm joined today by Sean DePause. Mr. Electric. Yeah, Mr. Electric. We're embracing Mr. Electric. Yeah, I think Mr. Electric is what Derek's been going with, so I'll take that one.

Got the D-Back's sombrero going over here. Yeah, our friend's over at Foco. Looking us up with the best in Diamond Vax merch. There you go. The Arizona Diamondbacks played a very good game here today against the Cleveland Guardians winning this game by a final score of 5 to 1. Sean, the biggest news of the day for the debacks, of course, was that Zach Gallen appeared to be very much back. Oh, yeah. He is now after today 7 and 0 with an ERA of 1.00 at Chase Field, which is absolutely unbelievable. And maybe the most significant thing, Sean, is that his fastball velo bounced back, which was a big concern for some

people after his last start against the Detroit Tigers. His fastball Velo today was at 93.6 on average, which was actually a tick above his season average of 93.5. So incredible, incredible stuff today from Zach Allen. I'm going to take this off because I got a big ass head in this cutting off circulation of my head. It's fair. But yeah, no, he was back. And I think, Yeah, you heard a lot about how it was, you know, the, it was an early start in Detroit and all that stuff. And obviously that was like a good theory, but you didn't really know until you saw him pitch again. And he looked, yeah, he looks like his old self, which I think was kind of what we expected. Like, I think in talking about Zach Gowan and his struggles, no, none of us really felt like it was a permanent thing.

Like this was the new Zach Gat. Yeah, he was just bad all of a sudden. I think we all expected him to get to come back to being Zach Gallen again. He did that tonight with seven strikeouts. It was it was a hell of an outing. Yeah. And I mean, it continues to be, it continues this narrative of Zach Allen being absolutely unbelievable at home.

And his numbers on the road, Sean, are still not good. Of course, that wasn't going to change today. But one in two with a 5.79 ERA on the road versus 7 and O with a 1.00 ERA. at home. Not sure exactly what's going on there. But Brent Strom when he spoke to the media a couple of days ago, talked about Zach Gallant's fastball and just how good of a pitch that can be and how good it can be when he really works primarily with that pitch and kind of builds

everything else around that. Gallen threw 55% for seamers in this game, which is a pretty high number, 29% curveballs, 13% changeups. And then he threw just three cutters in this game. But he really did what it sounded like Brent Strom. wanted him to do the other day pitching with that fastball. He got six whiffs on the pitch. Pretty good amount of soft contact in this game as well.

You know, it's 93 miles per hour, but Zach Allen's 93 miles per hour is not the same as some other people's 93 miles per hour. And we saw that in this game. Yeah, yeah, Shrami was talking about how he was relying too much on the curveball, I believe. And it was nice to see him. Hey, that's why you go and get a guy like Shrami, right? That's why he's such a great pitching coach is he's able to spot these things in his pitchers and go to them to make these adjustments and and gallon clearly did like you like you just

pointed out and he was he was making his pitches uh david and i were joking at one point about how he wasn't getting some of his calls but he was he was certainly making his pitches um and that's all you can really ask for him is that this is like i said the exact zat gallon that we came to expect the that gillan that would come to know and love um and he looked like him his own self again yeah the only real mistake that Zach Gallen made in this game was a very obvious one to Jose Ramirez. It's a mistake a lot of good pitchers make to Jose Ramirez, to be fair. That's, that's fair. But yeah, it was sort of like a center cut cutter that didn't really seem to cut a whole lot.

And Jose Ramirez did what Jose Ramirez tends to do with those kinds of pitches. He's been on a tear lately for them. But yeah, Beyond Gallen, just a well-played game all the way around for the D-backs. It felt like they might have been able to put this game away a little bit earlier than they did. When all was said and done, the Diamondbacks, left 13 runners on base and we're three for 12 with runners in scoring position. So maybe this really should have been kind of a blowout win for the debacks when it was all said and done.

But this was a game that they had to win in some ways, a game that they should win, right? You've got Tuki Toussaint stepping in last minute to start this game for the Guardians. Tristan McKenzie, unfortunately for Cleveland, went down with elbow discomfort. I believe he had a shoulder injury earlier in the season. So it's nothing like having one of your key starting pitcher. have both shoulder and elbow problems in the same season. Rough news for them. But Tuky came in, pitched against his former team.

Wasn't bad. I thought he sort of held his own. You know, he walked several batters on his way out of the game, but he did sort of hold the Diamondbacks in check in this game. But I feel like the moment that it was announced that Tristan McKenzie was not starting this game for the Guardians, the Diamondbacks should win this game, right? It's Tuki Tussana guy just coming up from AAA. has not really had any kind of consistent success in the majors

against the Diamondbacks ace. You know, it's a golden opportunity to snap a three-game losing streak and the Diamondbacks were able to do just that. Yeah, Tucson, a Diamondbacks draftee, as they were sure to point out at the start of every bottom half inning on the broadcast. Did they? Yeah, every single time he came up.

It was like, Pavin Smith, ready to start off the inning against Diamondbacks draftee, Tuki Touss, dropped in 16th overall by the Arizona Navvaks and blah, blah, I think most Diamondbacks fans would like to not remember that. Obviously, Tuki has not turned into, you know, the front line starter that a lot of people... Yeah, a lot of people thought that he might be given how high he was drafted. But the Diamondbacks did trade Tuki Touss to the Atlanta Braves in order to, like, get off of Bronson and Royo's contract, which is not the best practice. Of course, that was the previous regime, not this one.

As a part of a series of trades to the Braves where we were getting absolutely... where the devax didn't. I mean, they did get Phil Goslin out of that trade. And, you know, Phil Goslin, you know, illustrious Diamondbacks career. He did have some good moments while I was here. But yeah, obviously, you know, one of the worst trades in Diamondbacks history, at least on paper, even if Tuki hasn't turned into what a lot of people thought he would be. Elsewhere in this game, a pretty good night for the offense as a whole.

Several guys with two hits in this game could tell Marte, Corbyn, Christian Walker, Jake McCarthy, all had two hits in this one. Josh Rojas had a hit and a walk in this game, reach base a few times. Good to see him bounce back a little bit. And Geraldo Pardomo, Sean, somehow, you know, everyone's expecting regression. Honestly, I'm expecting regression. I don't know. Yeah.

It doesn't have it. He's hitting 302 with an 888 OPS on the season, and it just seems like her. Is this who Geraldo Ferdomo is? I don't know what to do with this. Yeah, I mean, and I think that's just coming. kind of a little bit of a microcosm of this entire season. It's just the unexpected production from certain guys, right? You didn't expect.

Yeah, so true. You didn't expect Geraldo Perdomo to be a legitimate shortstop making a case to be playing every single day. You didn't expect necessarily Gabby to be one of the best defensive catchers in the league or Catell necessarily to be as back as he's been. Or obviously you didn't expect even Corbyn to have an MVP caliber season. And so, yeah, it is, it's good to see that as much as it. It doesn't feel, it's uncomfortable to get comfortable with Geraldo Prado. Like you said, it kind of feels like you should be expecting a regression. Sure.

But it's hard to, like, you keep son doing it. At a certain point, a regression is going to become impossible. So, yeah, it is, to see him just keep producing in big moments is, it's so weird. Like, to be, to just like, as much as you expect regression, you also expect him to be producing a big moments at this point. And it's a pleasant surprise for sure. Corby and Carolyn, this game, as I mentioned, two hits, a big double that drove in a run, 308 with a 97 OPS on the season. And yes, he got some pretty, that was right after I left the ballpark in order to come here.

But from what we saw on the broadcast and what some people said on Twitter, sounds like they were some pretty loud MVP chance going on in Chase Field. In front of a pretty decent crowd, almost 28,000 at the ballpark tonight. So pretty good turnout for a Friday night. But yeah, Sean, I mean, this man just continues to cement himself in the MVP conversation. And as of right now, you can make a case that he's right at the top of that list with the season that he's had. I tweeted this out. This is Corbyn Carroll's 99th career major league baseball game.

And we are literally talking about a man who is arguably the MVP frontrunner in his first full season, just unbelievable stuff for that kid. And that 99 is impressive because, like, you expect at some point, speaking of like, the regression thing is you expect at some point for him to look like a rookie. And I know he may have a little bit when he was dealing with his injury. He kind of looked like a rookie the other night when he was chasing his hat on the sack fly. More at the plate, you expect him to look like a rookie

where he just really hasn't at any point. And at this point, I don't expect him to look like a rookie at any point. Like he just looks like he was made for this. He looks so comfortable as a big leaguer. And that is obviously really a very good sign, right? like I don't think anyone would necessarily jump down his throat if he was if he had some struggles every now and again and he just hasn't really. And again, it's it's part of that unexpected production that you're getting from guys where they're just kind of, everyone seems to be not hitting it up a level more than you expected with the exception of obviously a handful of guys.

And that is, it is uncomfortable because it's hard to expect that for an entire season. But yeah, they've done it up until this point. so I'm not going to complain about it. Speaking of unexpected production, Pavin Smith had a good day for the Diamondbacks at the top of the lineup. I shouldn't be saying those things about Pave and Smith. Yeah, it's fair now at this point. I think that's what the cry of Diamondbacks fans is right now.

Yeah, somebody tweeting out, we love Pave and Smith and everyone else being like, do we now? Yeah, Diamond, we never doubted. Nobody ever doubted. My leadoff hitter, Paveen Smith. he was one for three in this game with two walks. He was on base three times. A run scored an RBI came through in a key spot early in this game with an RBI knock. We're going to talk a little bit more about Pavin Smith later in the comments that Tori Lavello made earlier today.

But we should get to our King Snake. We already talked about him. But Zach Gallen, just an unbelievable bounce back outing. Obviously, the Diamondbacks need Zach Gallen to be the kind of pitcher we've seen. over the last few months in order for them to be able to get where they want to go. And seven innings, six hits, one run, seven strikeouts, no walks in this game. On the season, he now has 19 walks compared to 100 strikeouts, which is unbelievable. Just incredibly impressive stuff.

Just before we hopped on the show, Damon informed me that apparently Zach Gallen is the odds-on favorite right now to win the Cy Young Award. which it's still obviously early in those conversations, but the National League's Siong conversation is sort of wide open right now. You can understand why Zach Gallen would be at the top of that. I actually have it right here. He Gallen is plus 200. Kershaw is plus 550 and Spencer Strider is plus 700.

Zach Wheeler is plus 800 as a fourth option. It's amazing. Bryce Elder isn't even, isn't even on that list. He has like a low low 2 ZRA at this point. But what do you think, Sean? Is this going to happen? I mean, it might, because the reality is that the other pitchers in the N.L. are not really like the guys that you would expect to be in this conversation

are not really making a case to be Scy Young winner. Spencer Strider got absolutely rocked. He got rocked by the Tigers the last time. They played. Obviously, Sandy, I think is completely out of the picture at this point. Like, and obviously all the Dodgers pitchers have just been dealing with injuries with the exception of Clayton Kershaw. Like, it almost seems like,

at a certain point. By default, he might end up winning it. But yeah. Yeah, like, he might not even have to have some crazy season. Yeah, because he's the favorite, and he hasn't been good recently. So, and like I said, no one else has been good. And yeah, we're in a position now where, like we were saying, the Diamondbacks might sweep the awards.

They have a chance to sweep. They have a legitimate chance to sweep the awards. So by that, you mean Corbyn Carroll for Rookie of the Year, which seems, I don't want to say a foregone conclusion, but we're pretty much to that point. Minus 350 at this point. Yeah, I mean, it pretty would be kind of weird at this point if that didn't happen, I think. Corby and Carrow for MVP, because somehow that's a thing now. Zach Allen for Cy Young, as you just said.

And then I think if the season ended today, you know, it's pretty early to be talking about manager of the year, but generally it goes to managers of teams that have big bounce back seasons. And if the diamondbacks continue at this current pace, or even if they don't continue at this current pace, even if they win, you know, 85, 90 games. That's a pretty big turnaround from where they were last year. And an even bigger turnaround from two years ago when the Diamondbacks won 52 games and somehow, you know, at this point, they're in the playoff picture. Tori has a pretty good case at this point.

Yeah, no, 100%. And it's not like this is just a team that was bad last year. Now they have, they brought in all these new pieces. Like, it's a really young team, too, which I think lends to Tori's argument for manager the year. Like he's doing this with a lot of guys who do not have a lot of major league. experience. Right. Hey, well, yeah, why does Scott McGuff get reliever of the year?

Reliever of the year? Yeah, Scott McGuff. Let's get. Let's just sweep it all. Bring me all the awards. He has been incredible. I mean, Scott McGuff just continues, continues on this tear. I don't, yeah, I, again, Scott McGuff is, you know, if you see him on the street, you would probably have no idea that this man is a professional athlete. But it's incredible.

I mean, it's incredible what he's able to do with a baseball. He clearly has found the grip on. a splitter, which was really his most important outpitch. He was relying a little bit more on the slider earlier in the season, even though I don't really think that's his best out pitch. But he's gotten to the splitter more lately. And for some reason, Sean, nobody can hit the thing. So, yeah, there you go.

It's, um, he needs a bobblehead. I'm going to say that. He needs a giveaway. We need a Scott McGuff giveaway. In silk pajamas. In silk pajamas. Oh my gosh. With some like candles and Lothor Vandals playing.

Playing the saxophone. Yeah, baby. Well, speaking of giveaway. Do we have that picture of Zach Allen and what he was sporting out there on the mound? I don't think this is a giveaway item, but it should be. We're not talking about the jersey, although that maybe should

also be a giveaway item. The snake skin belt, Sean, how do we feel about this? I love it. And he's not, he wasn't alone in the snake skin. Rojas was rocking some cleats with some snakeskin on him too. It's such a good touch. It fits the jersey, like just the color scheme so well.

And then we're the fucking snakes. Like, of course. We should, we Honestly, this team in general should utilize snake skin pattern more. Yeah. It's a fire pattern that they have, I would argue, like a monopoly over because who else is using snake skin patterns and major league baseball? Like, I would like to see more of it. This is a great look from the hottest man to grace a pitching mound, maybe ever.

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, my God. I remember the first day. So, Zach, this is not the first time. I don't believe that Zach Gowell. has worn the snake skin belt. It was maybe a month ago.

It was a few weeks ago. I was there in the clubhouse talking to him after the game. And he showed it to us in his post game interview, you know, that he was, I think it was on his bobblehead night, actually. When he, I asked him, you know, does it mean a lot to you to have the kind of success that you had on your bobblehead night? And he was like, yeah, like, you don't want to get shelled on your bobblehead night. And then he pulled out this belt and it was like, this is also my first day where

this thing and you don't want to get shelled when you're trying a new look out there on the mound but yeah Zach Gallen looked great tonight both from a drip standpoint and also from a pitching standpoint pretty pretty impressive stuff all the way around speaking of impressive stuff you all should get your hands on a ph-nx diehards membership as soon as possible the deal sean is is truly incredible the amount of stuff that you get with this is is pretty amazing. First of all, you get all of the writing on our website. So my full count newsletter, you get all the stuff from Craig, from Gerald, covering the coyotes and the sons. You also get all the stuff from Howard covering the Cardinals, all of the written content on our

website. Some of it's free, but the best stuff is behind the paywall. So you absolutely want it for that. And then there's just a bunch of free perks in there as well. You get a free merchandise item from the PhNX locker every year. You also get 20% off of all of the. your events purchases, all of the things that we got going on around here. We would always love to see you out for any of those things. We have one of those of our own coming up in July with our takeover on July 25th, I believe it is. We hope to see you out at Chase Field. You get 20% off that as well. You also get a $50 gift card for Mountain Mikes. Yes. It truly does. I mean, yeah, basically the Mountain Mikes alone, if you like pizza, then you should just, you should

just get a dieharts membership and use it as an excuse to go eat pizza. We have a super sticker from Shane Diefenbach. Uh-oh. Shane Diefenbach says, Baby Lemon looking up to our Lemon character standing in a superhero position. Oh, I'm going to have the fine what the sticker actually looks like so I can show you. Yeah,

so he's not actually saying this. This is a description of an object. This is what Shane does. He tries to, he tries to pick what he thinks would be the weirdest thing to say out loud as a It's a pretty good one. Baby Lemon looking up to our Lemon character. It is, I like how it refers to it as

our Lemon character. Thanks for the Super Sticker though, Shane. Yeah, we appreciate that, Shane. Also, while you're here, be sure to drop a like here on this video if you're watching us right now. It really helps my self-esteem personally.

And it helps the YouTube algorithm, which we're all about helping the YouTube algorithm around here. I've locked him in my basement until you get a certain number of likes. Right, right. Yeah, that's why he's not here. Yeah, that's why Derek isn't here.

He's not out of town. He is currently stuck in Sean's basement. And any tweets, pictures, text that he says to suggest otherwise or simply a cover. He is in my basement. So throw Derek a bone. Makes sense. Eric A bone and like this video. There you go.

Yeah, and also, if you're one of those audio people, we love our audio-only friends as well. So if you enjoy listening to the show on an audio app, we always appreciate you leaving us a review there as well. preferably a five-star review if you feel like we're deserving of such things. Sean, we're going to go ahead and jump into some roster conversations here, some more big picture stuff with the Diamond to actually mention Pave and Smith and the impressive day that he had at the plate. And this one, which, you know, there's been this narrative for a while that every time people

are ready to pull the plug on Pave and Smith, he goes out and, you know, as a key contributor. And he was that today. Obviously, this was a bigger win for the day. D-backs. It's not like Pavin Smith hit, you know, the game-winning go-ahead home run, which he has done a couple of times this season. But Tori Lavello was asked before the game today about why Pavin Smith continues to occupy the lead-off spot for the Diamondbacks. And I guess you can somewhat see where Tori's coming from with the kind of night that Paveen had in this game. But here's what Tori had to say earlier today when he was asked about why Pavin-Smith is still the

primary lead-off man for this team? Yeah, I don't want to run from, I don't want to run from the success that he's had. I know that he's very capable of getting on a great run. You know, he was on base a couple weeks ago, I think four or five times. He's very, very equipped to see pitches, swing with strikes, and when he does that, he's going to hand it off to the next guy. In this case, it'll be C-Till. we just have to get him to the point where he's laying off the pitches that are probably secondary stuff,

stuff off the edge of the plate, stuff that's down. So I'm hoping that it gets better, but I don't want to be blind. I don't want to have the blind spots and say, I'm going to force feed this. I'll make some adjustments if it doesn't get better. But I like where it's at still, but I have to pay attention to it. Interesting answer from Toro Lavello, especially the way that he, that he starts. started that answer, you know, talking about how he didn't want to run away from the success that Pavan has had, which I know on Twitter, people did not take kindly to that comment, which is

fair. It's understandable. Pavan Smith, frankly, has not had a whole lot of clear success in the big leagues. He was really good at the beginning of this season. His numbers were solid for a few weeks. It looked like he might be turning the corner. But at the end of the day, Sean, it still feels like, you know, despite what Paveen Smith did today and despite what he has done at times this season, he just doesn't really do any one thing

all that well, right? There's not a lot of defensive value there. There's not a lot of base running value there. And offensively, you know, he still has a, you know, a sub 700 OPS for one of the better offensive teams in baseball. It continues to be a little surprising that the Diamondbacks have paving in the leadoff spot. Yeah.

And it was funny because he said, I don't want to force it, but that kind of seems like exactly what he's been doing. recently is forcing him into that lead of the spot. And Nicholas is making a point that I was going to make is, is it there are, it's one thing if this was a team like devoid of of other options to bat leadoff. But it quite clearly is not. Jake McCarthy, as Nicholas points out is what it seems like he would be a perfect leadoff hitter with the way he's playing right now. He's consistently getting on base in creating chaos once he gets on base. You got obviously look at guys like Cattel and Corbin, who you probably want a little later on that lineup.

also be very effective leadoff hitters, in my opinion. Yeah. It just seems like there's even a guy like Geraldo Perdomo, seems like he would be a better option at leadoff. So that is a frustrating thing. And there are, I feel like every now and again, Tori has these kinds of things that are a little, that make me, maybe question some of his decision making a little bit.

But it is, I definitely, it was a weird answer. I don't like it. Because with a performance like this, it kind of seems like it's like, see, he deserves to be a lead off hitter. Yeah. Even though he quite clearly does not, in my opinion. But I don't know. If he's going to stay up here, he can at least keep doing what he did today, I guess.

Yeah, I mean, you can, in some ways, I can maybe see where the debacks would be coming from on this. Pavin Smith has a high walk rate. He does see a decent number of pitches. He draws his walks. He doesn't strike out all that much. A strikeout rate is below the league average by a few percentage. points at this point. So there are some positives there. Like just those two things alone, you know, not that many guys do both of those things. Not that many guys, you know, walk as much

as Pavin is walking and don't strike out that much. It really is a valuable skill set. The problem is that he just hasn't really been impacting the baseball. When Pavan is putting the ball in play, he's not doing nearly the damage that you would need to in order to be what Pavan is, right? He is a corner outfielder first baseman. You know, you're not looking for a seven, You're looking for at least 800 to make a guy like that an everyday player. We haven't really seen that. One trend with this front office has been, it seems like the Diamondbacks value stat cast data quite a bit, like the expected stats from statcast quite a bit.

A lot of their decision making tends to line up with what those numbers say should happen. And Paven has underperformed his statcast metrics fairly significantly this year. They don't say that he is a well above average hitter, but they say that he's about a league average hitter, which is a lot better than what he's actually been this season. Yeah, I just, again, I think, like, I feel like this is going to get real, like, philosophical maybe, but, like, kind of like re-looking at how you look at a batting lineup. Like, I get that, I understand what you think he can provide there,

but when you have guys like Geraldo Perdomo who are providing, like, pretty consistent offense at this point from later in the lineup. Yeah. Well, then put Paving later in the lineup ahead of Rolopoldopoldo, and you get relatively the same effect you're looking for. You get a guy on base and you get a guy who's consistently driving in runners. I feel like that's a match made in heaven. Yeah.

But, again, it's working. So I guess we're being a little nitpicky here. Like, they're still winning games. So it ultimately doesn't matter if Paven's not being that productive. I mean, it obviously matters. matters, but it only matters so much because they're winning games with him batting leadoff. So I'm only going to be so upset about it. They might win more games with him not batting.

I agree. I mean, I agree. Yeah, but it is, I guess it's a nice problem to have where we're deciding, where we're, we're getting upset over where guys are in the lineup or if they should be in the lineup when they're still winning games. Yeah, that's, that's a great point. The Diamondbacks after the game today are 42 and 28 through 70 games. I believe that's an even 600 win percentage.

That's really freaking good. Pretty good. It would be like third in the AL East, but still pretty good. Yeah, right, exactly. Elsewhere in Diamondbacks roster news, the Diamondbacks announced today to where Lavello announced today that Ryan Nelson is going to make his next start. If you saw our postgame show yesterday,

it seemed in the moment that that was not a guarantee. Tori was asked after the game, are you guys fully committed to Ryan making his next start? And his exact words, I believe, were we'll have those discussions as we always do. So he was kind of making it sound like they always talk about that, which I'm going to guess, John,

they're not talking about whether Zach Gallen will make his next start after tonight. Hey, you never know. We'll be like, ah, he got to let the home run. We might have to bump up from the rotation. That was a center cut cutter.

Yeah, we can't have that. Jose Ramirez. We can't be making those kind of mistakes. But yeah, it was kind of an interesting, non-committal sort of answer yesterday. But Tori came back today and made,

it abundantly clear. Ryan Nelson will make his next start. And we have a video clip of that conversation with Tori talking about why he thinks that Ryan deserves that opportunity. We sit down and talk about what the next strategy, the next, the strategy of the next five, seven days will be. And we went back in and we talked about it. And he's going to get the baseball again. And for a lot of reasons that the reasons are probably built in and the conversations that I'm having with Stromi. Strami is is advocating for certain changes that are slowly taking place. We had to cut off the video there.

Things get a little choppy, unfortunately, after that. But yeah, Tori goes on to talk about Brent Strom and how it seems like in some ways this, this decision was heavily influenced by Strom and him feeling like Ryan Nelson has been making some adjustments and might only be a few more adjustments away from kind of turning a corner. It seems like there are some pretty big problems here, at least for me, Sean, the fastball usage as we talked about yesterday continues to be extremely high. He did throw some really good changeups in that game, but it kind of feels like he's not really comfortable using his secondary pitches as much as he needs to be.

So maybe it's just a matter of, you know, hey kid, go out there and throw 40% changeups or, you know, just like kind of force him to go out there and do some stuff that maybe he's not comfortable doing. But this is the decision that the diamond backs are making at least for right now. Yeah. And I mean, like I mentioned earlier, we're talking about Zach Allen. This is, again, why you hire a guy like Stromi and you don't hire a guy like him and then not trust him when he says he believes in Ryan Nelson or he's making changes and whatever. Like if he says that he thinks that this guy should be getting the start, he's one of the best pitching. in baseball for a reason you have to trust him to a certain extent and all the other side of it too

is like cogs was saying is who do they bring up this is not necessarily the situation where there's like an obvious an obvious replacement we've talked about it a lot already but like fought has not been great in triple a have he's been better recently but it did not start great and then outside of that it's like okay you you're not bringing dray jameson back in the starting lineup so you it's almost like it better fucking work like you got to you got to give this as much of an opportunity as you can before you decide that it is not viable. Yeah, which, I mean, maybe this team is inclined to do longer than they should, looking at you, Madison Gumbarner.

But, like, they're in a situation where they don't really have much of an option right now. Especially when they're heading towards a trade deadline and they expect to be aggressive. You need to know what you have. So I don't necessarily have a problem with them trotting him back out there at least one more time. But I'm not going to. He's going to go out there. I'm not going to have a whole lot of confidence that it's going to necessarily be the best performance. There is something to be said.

That's a good point that, you know, coming into the trade deadline, if you do go out and get a starter, you need to have a pretty clear idea of who you don't want in the rotation. And right now, I think Tommy Henry has been better overall than Ryan Nelson, but not necessarily by all that much. It's not like Tommy Henry has a 350 IRA and Ryan Nelson is way over five. These guys have kind of gone back and forth the whole season where for a couple weeks you think one of them's better. And then the next couple weeks, you think the other one's better, you know, lately, I think Tommy's been a little bit better. But he was not good at all in his start against the Phillies either. And he's the one going tomorrow for the debacks against Shane Beaver, which is a, you know, obviously a really, really tough pitching matchup there.

So, yeah, we'll continue to to monitor this situation. And I do think that, as you said, it kind of comes down to the debacks, just not really having any other great options at this point. If they did have a pitcher in AAA that they felt really good about, if Brandon Fought hadn't been called up yet to this point in the season. And, you know, we were still having everyone clamoring for Brandon Fought to make his big league debut, then yeah, you would call up Brandon Fought, but he's still, you know, figuring some things out in AAA. And I think the D-BAC still want to give him some more time to do all those things.

So, yeah, having some clarity going into the trade deadline is going to be important. And Ryan Nelson has had his moment. There have been moments over the last, you know, over the last few months and going back to last season, how many Diamondbacks fans were excited about the future of Ryan Nelson when he went out there in San Diego against one of the best lineups in the league in the league in the league in his big league debut last year. I think he threw seven scoreless innings that day. There have been some really bright moments for Ryan Nelson along the way. It's just a matter of trying to sort of put everything together at this point.

Yeah, yeah. Um, you hope he does, right? Like, obviously you would, you'd love to be in a situation where you have a young guy prove that he can be a viable starter and you don't necessarily have to do it's not a spot. You feel like you have to replace the rotation. But yeah, I don't, I don't think we are quite there yet. So we'll see. Definitely, definitely room for him tomorrow.

But like I said, not going into it with like the utmost confidence, especially when you consider it was going to be on the other side. I guess it's Tommy Henry. It's Tommy Henry tomorrow. Yeah. Yeah. Whatever, the next time we get to see Ryan Nelson, I'm not going to be the most confident. I think it's Tuesday in Milwaukee, so we'll see how that goes.

We want to take a quick moment here to tell you about our friends over at Circle K. We are excited to partner with our friends at Circle K. Check out your local Circle K for the best coffee, beer, and snack selection and premium gas. Sean, of course, the snack selection is incredible. All of the Circle K branded stuff is better than everything else on the shelves. The gummy snacks are gummier. There you go. It's an objective truth.

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Redel on Redel. Hey, it says it's toasty as Gallon's fastball. It was toaster than Gowin's fastball. But I would say it's about as toasty as gallons basketball on the night. It was back. So shot them out. They also have the Four Peaks draft room, which I have not had a chance to go to yet. But it's located on the Sweet Level.

You don't always need a ticket. You don't have a need to take it on a sweet level. He's a ticket to the stadium. Anyone can go up. The views there are great. They have a huge selection of the amazing Four Peak Spears. So make sure you check that out next time you go to DeBax game. And they also are still running their Four Peaks for teachers promotion.

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Poor Sean has been at the office for like 14 hours today. I have. We have to cut him some slack. Right about four weeks, of course. They also have their teachers Tuesdays. Bring a valid teacher ID and receive $4 pints of Kilt Lifter, wow, hazy, and hot knot at their 8. Street Pub and Tempe.

Our friends are our 4-Pakes. They're amazing people. So check them out at 4-Peaks Brew and at 4-Peaks Pub to keep up with the latest at Arizona's hometown brewery, but you must be 21 or older to drink 4-Peaks and you must drink responsibly. Well, Circle K and 4-Peaks are certainly a dynamic duo, Sean. That they are. But another dynamic duo for the Arizona Diamondbacks is Zach Gallen and Merrill Kelly, who have absolutely formed one of the most dominant one-two punches in all of baseball this season.

We've kind of had this one on the back burner for a while. It's a topic we've been wanting to discuss for a while. We're finally going to do it. So the question, Sean, is where do Merrill Kelly and Zach Allen rank among pitching duos in Major League Baseball right now? And we have a few caveats here. They have to be healthy. So no Jacob de Grom in this conversation, unfortunately.

Feel bad for our friends. The Dodgers are completely eliminated. The Dodgers. One healthy pitcher. Yeah, that would be tough for them. So it's only guys that are healthy right now. even if they've pitched a substantial amount this year. We're only looking at guys who are healthy right now.

Sean, I'll let you start off on this. You can know if you want to name some duos who might be good competitors or if you want to tell us up front where you think they rank, you can take this wherever you like. So the first caveat I want to give here is that I am also kind of eliminating the Tampa Bay Rays because in fury, they are the best, but Glassnow has not been back very long. He obviously has been injured.

It's fair. I feel like, like, realistically they are probably like a, maybe the best, if not, like a top two or three, but I'm just,

for the sake of this, I'm going to leave them out. Um, I'm going to, you know, I'm going to put them around. Um, the fourth best duo.

I mean, I think off rip, I'm looking at the Cubs and Rangers. Um, the Cubs Rangers are the three that I feel pretty good about putting above them. Obviously, Schroman.

would argue is the best pitcher in the one of the best pitch is in national league this year, him and steel. The Rangers, they have like three guys, but obviously of all the in Gray are the big two. And then the Astros and Hobby year and Valdez. I just,

I mean, the Rangers in and themselves have three guys that are top 15 in ERA. Yeah, their pitching staff is amazing this year. And then, yeah, the AL just has some really good pitching staffs. So I would,

that's about where, I would put them. I think you look at a team with the twins, too. They have an argument, but I feel a little more comfortable with Zach Gallin and Merrill Kelly than I do any combo involving Sunny Gray, to be quite honest with you. That's fair. So, yeah.

Okay. So I have, yeah, we have quite a bit of, quite a bit of overlap on this. Yeah, I think Justin Steele is her right now. Yeah. So if you're, if you're going to do the Cubs, then I think it would have to be Marcus Stroman and Drew Smiley. Yeah. And somewhat interesting.

I mean, Marcus Stroman does have like a mid-2 ZRA, which is better than either Gowan or Kelly at this point. But Drew Smiley, he has had a really good season, but I don't really view him as a, yeah, yeah. He's not really a number two starter in my book. So I don't have the Cubs on my list. I do have the Minnesota Twins on my list. But I agree with you. It's a little, it's a little tough.

But I think Sonny Gray with his 2.370 RA, he is. He's been very good. And I was not a believer. I thought early on when he was doing this, it was going to fall off. They weren't playing very good teams early in the year. Sure. I mean, they do play in the Central.

That was a very good point. But it hasn't. He's still been pitching very well. So, yeah, it's hard to deny that twins pitching staff right now. So, yeah, and I guess the other knock, now that I look at, I didn't even notice this before, to be frank. He's only averaging about five and a half innings per start. So he's not pitching particularly deep into games.

That one's right on the edge for me. it's Sonny Gray and Joe Ryan. Joe Ryan honestly might be a better pitcher than Sunny Gray. He has 91 strikeouts compared to 15 walks and is going substantially deeper into games, averaging more than six innings per start. So that duo with the twins, I think is interesting. I did have them on my list. I also did have Jonathan Gray and Nathan E.

Valdi of the Texas Rangers, which is so weird because going into the season, like both of those guys look like number four starters. Yeah, exactly. And yet here we are talking about them being, You could make a case they've been the best duo to this point. Jonathan Gray is third in the league right now among qualified starters and ERA at 2.32. Eivaldi is sixth in the league at 2.59. Pretty crazy stuff that they've been able to pull off this season.

That Rangers team. I know they're not the, they're not the rays or the Braves, but who boy, that team is a, that's one hell of a team. Yeah, yeah, they have absolutely surprised literally everyone on the planet. at this point. The Astros, I think, are kind of an easy one. Framber Valdez has continued to be incredible. Christian Javier's had a really good season, too. So I think you have to put those two guys in front.

So that's three duos. That's three duos that I would put in front of Gowan and Kelly. The other one I had, Sean, I had one more. And it actually is from the Tampa Bay race. Okay. It's not Tyler Glass now. I agree with you. He just came back.

He has shown glimpses of being incredible like we've seen him be in the past. but I have Shane McClanahan and Zach Eflin. Okay. Who again, Zach Eflin, like number four starter, right? But sometimes guys sign with the Tampa Bay raise and weird things happen. And here we are. I don't think McClain or I don't think Eflin necessarily lines up with either Gowan or Merrill Kelly. But Shane McClan.

But Shane McClan. He's probably been the best pitcher in baseball this season. He's 11 and 1 with a 2.12 ERA, you know, pitching deep into games, averaging about six innings per start. So I think I'm at four, Sean. I think I'm at four teams above them, which I guess would put Zach Gallen and Merrill Kelly as the fifth best starting pitcher duo in all of baseball,

which, yeah, maybe they're not first, but fifth best is still pretty darn good for your one, two points. I think I'm going to put them, if we're moving the Cubs, and I think about that, I think we'll probably put them fourth. I don't,

I'm not huge on the, on the twins. Yeah, and obviously I don't have the raise in the conversation right now, but I would say they are pretty firmly in the conversation for top five, and that's a pretty damn good place to be when you're trying to win baseball games. Yeah, yeah, I think top five is pretty safe at this point. Other duos that I considered but that I didn't have in front of Gallen and Kelly,

Alex Cobb and Logan Webb of the Giants have been quietly very, very good this season. They're really close to Gallen and Kelly, honestly. I think you can maybe go either way. I would probably lean toward the debacks a little bit, just because I think Gallen is probably the best pitcher out of all those guys. Bryce Elder and Charlie Morton of the Atlanta Braves, maybe some skepticism there of whether Bryce Elder is really for real. Charlie Morton just kind of continues to do his thing,

even though he's like 55 years old at this point. I also had Jose Burrios and Kevin Gosman of the Blue Jays, which I think is close. They have pretty good peripheral numbers. Both of them have ERAs over three. So if you're looking at more of the simple stats, I think the debacks win that one. But that's another interesting duo where you could certainly have a conversation there.

Who is healthy for the Mets right now? Pitching wise. I think both Scherzer and Verlander are healthy. If I'm not mistaken. They're just not pitching very well. It's very fascinating that I would argue that on a team with Scherzer and Verlander, Kodi Senga is probably the best picture on the team. Yeah.

Well, that pretty much says in a nutshell why the Mets are where they are. Yeah, but I think in theory, that's a prime candidate for like a watch out second half of the season. They shouldn't be this bad. And then all of a sudden, Verlander and Scher are somewhat back to themselves. And that is a pretty dangerous pitching staff in general if they end up being what we think or what they have been for most of their careers. Yeah.

Yeah. that's a great point. There's a lot of teams you could probably say stuff like that for. I mean, if they, if we, if the White Sox pitchers are pitching at their peak, Dylan C's and Giolyto are a pretty deadly duo too. That's fair. Yeah, Scherzer, I do think both of those guys are healthy right now. Scherzer and 11 starts is a 445 ERA.

And Verlander in 8 starts has a 440 ERA. So they basically have been like league average, maybe a little bit below the average this season. And where did it leave? Yeah, I mean, Verlander, is 40 years old Sean and max Scherzer is 38 years old yeah which is again all that money where did it leave you you're paying all that money it's a pretty old dudes yeah i mean i didn't necessarily expect this drastic of a regression but a regression was not was bound to happen um yeah it's not just their

pitching staff too like starling martay former diamond back uh has not been good it seems like he might just be sort of doing the end of career thing where he's his sprint speed is not nearly what it once was just not really impacting the baseball like he did before. Francisco Endor is another veteran player on that team who just hasn't really played particularly well. And apparently we've turned into just like a New York Mets like problem podcast. We're just going to talk about the Mets and their problems now. Speaking of potential problems, let's take a look at the Probables for the rest of this series.

It's not terrible, Sean. I don't want to make it sound like it's so bad. But yeah, Shane Bieber against Tommy Henry, certainly a little bit lopsided to Shane Bieber, as we talked about in a recent show. I think you said it was seven scoreless with nine Ks against the Astros. But that was, yeah, against a pretty damn good team in the Astros. But yeah, it was incredible. Tinfoil hat, Shane Bieber coming in here is going to just stink it up.

I think we talked about this the other day. He's going to stink it up lower his trade value for the deep in Mexico. Get them because he wants to help his own team. There you go. But yeah, on paper, that's definitely a dangerous, a dangerous matchup. But that being said, we've seen Tommy Henry come out and pitch some pretty some pretty spectacular baseball. So if we get a peak Tommy Henry performance, then anything is possible. Yeah.

But that's definitely a question. Like you mentioned earlier, it seems like any given week, Tommy Henry or Ryan Nelson are passing each other's powers back and forth. So who knows who's on tomorrow. Yeah, yeah. Big start for Tommy Henry, as it has been for Nelson recently. I think all of their starts are pretty important. Shane Bieber, seven innings pitch, three hits, nowhere and runs. One walk, nine strikeouts.

Yeah. Houston Astros. His Velo is down a little bit, but I mean, Shane Bieber was an unbelievable pitcher. I mean, hey, as a number three, though? You can, it can work. It could certainly work. In that series finale, it's Zach Davies against Tanner Bybee. maybe not a huge advantage either way in that one.

I think Davies is probably a little bit better than what he's shown so far coming back off the injured list. But yeah, as we said at the start of the show, this was the game in the series of the Z-backs were really supposed to win, like just clearly supposed to win on paper without Tristan McKenzie in there, Tuki Tucson against Zach Allen, perfect opportunity to snap a three-game losing streak. That's exactly what the Diamondbacks did.

Do we have an update on what's going on in L.A.? between the Dodgers and the Ninth. The Dodgers had taken back the lead on a bloop single by Freddie Freeman. It's five. It looks like we're an extra innings here. Yeah, five, extra. So maybe they tied the game. That's, yeah.

Mike Estruski, 0 for 5 on a day. Tough. We actually, there is one D-Backs hitter who's really struggling that we didn't talk about before. Oh, I was hoping we didn't have to. Yeah, well, Lordeus, L. Jr., friend of the show, is O for his last 22 with nine strikeouts. And his at bats, frankly, Sean, have been pretty uncompetitive. Yeah, very. It's not ideal.

And it was something I was going to mention earlier when you're talking about how this probably should have been a little bit more of a blowout. If you had almost anybody else in that Lotus Gurriel spot, it probably is. Like, if we're looking at one specific spot in this game, like he had opportunities and he went over. Yeah. And that can't happen from a guy. Where was he betting today? Fifth. um yeah six like whatever it was that that can't happen from a guy batting the middle of the lineup for

sure especially when the guys in front of them are doing their job and getting on base yeah i think it was think it was fifth in lineup yeah so um i i'm not like lordis is a is a season vet at this point so i'm not like i don't think this is i don't think obviously the performance that he had early on this season was pretty spectacular i don't think it's necessarily uh fair to expect that but like He wasn't going to have a 1,200 OPS every month. It's also, this is not Lord of Scuriel either. So I think eventually it's going to balance stuff out and we'll get a pretty damn good hitter again. But as it right now, it is certainly, I'm not going to say it's costing them.

Well, I mean, in the Philly series maybe, but it's, it's at least costing them runs, if not costing them games. Yeah, his at-bats have just looked awful. It's not the kind of stretch where you're like, oh, it's just some tough luck, some hard hit balls that aren't, they don't finding holes. he's just frankly all out of whack but there is some history there he definitely came over with the reputation of being kind of a streaky hitter and that's exactly what he's been he was not it was sort of mediocreish in april not all that great he was basically the best hitter on the planet in may and so far in june he's just really struggled so july he'll be really good august will be bad september he'll be really good darn that means in october that means he might he might not be that doesn't line up all that great Sean I don't know how i feel it's Not that. But it means he'll be good going towards the playoffs. There you go. Maybe playoff Lordus is just a different animal.

There you go. Never know. The purple, as long as Derek keeps his purple hair. Well, that's my thing. I think it might be time for a switch up. I think we might need a new hair color.

Maybe go teal, maybe whatever, whatever you want to do. But I think it might be time to switch it up. In the clubhouse today, D-Bachs players, they were being passed around like Lortis wigs, basically,

purple hair wigs. Oh, yeah. And everyone was bringing them in the clubhouse today. It was very funny to watch. But yeah, that Dodgers Giants game obviously has some implications in the division. The Giants entered today 36 and 32 compared to the Dodgers at 39 and 30. Those two teams are only two and a half games apart at this point. This isn't just a conversation about the Dodgers in the NLS competing with the Diamondbacks.

The Giants are also very much in that race. And the Padres are also in that race. They've been playing better as a Dodgers. of late. So that series in LA this weekend with the Giants and the Dodgers is certainly going to be a big one. Speaking of series over the weekend, you should get out to a game this weekend with the D-backs and the Guardians.

As I said earlier, almost 28,000 at the ballpark tonight. They got the Parogi Dog. There you go. There were Corbyn Carroll MVP chance. I think there were some cool moments in the game tonight. And you all should absolutely get out there using our friends over. at the GameTime app. Game time, of course,

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If we could go because I found like some great tickets. That's how I always got my tickets. I'd wait until a second. PD yesterday night, I think last night, maybe two nights ago. He went to, 8, 180, 182. Yep. Concert, I was doubting my numbers. And he bought the tickets two hours before the concert on game time.

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Well, we do have an update from that Dodgers Giants game, which I'm sure for people listening on audio, that game is long over, and this conversation is very irrelevant. But as of this moment, as Cog said, Brandon Crawford did just hit an RBI single, so the Giants have a 6-5 lead in that game. But thank you all for being with us here late on a Friday night.

We really appreciate you being here with us. Big win for the Diamondbacks, Zach Gallen returning to form. A lot of good things happening in this game. We'll see if the debacks, are able to continue this run over the weekend. We won't be back until Monday. No shows on Saturday or Sunday,

but we back with you for Mailbag Monday on Monday. So we hope to see you then. In the meantime, you can give me a follow on Twitter at Jesse and Friedman. Mr. Electric, Sean DePaz. You can find him at Sean underscore to pause. Okay, I remember the underscore. Yes, sir.

Does the underscore stand for something in particular? Isn't that a thing? Like, you decide, like, what it stands for or something? I might need the chat to help me with that, the discord I haven't come up with anything that stands for. We'll, well, it's, for some reason I thought that was a thing on other shows.

Well, I know on Rising, they have two underscores in their name because it's double the underscored up with a fun. Oh, that's what it is. That must be, that must be what I'm thinking.

Yeah, we'll figure out what the deep, what the deep philosophical meaning of the underscore and Sean's Twitter handle is. Damon, you can find him at Damon Dogg, and you do have to bark as you're, as you're following him. Yes.

With a W. be sure to give our show account a follow as well that's at p h and x underscore debacks on twitter and of course all roads lead to at p h and x underscore sports that's on twitter instagram and facebook thank you all so much for being here with us this evening we really appreciate it and remember kids baseball is fun but it's so much more fun when zach gallon and merrill kelly are at the top of your starting rotation