Pints With Aquinas - Catholicism, Tattoos, & Getting Banned From Australia (Shayne Smith) | Ep. 545

Episode Date: October 8, 2025

In this episode, Matt sits down with Shayne Smith—professional stand-up comic, newly confirmed Catholic, and (apparently) political extremist—to talk about how being Catholic is punk rock in today's crazy world. The conversation also touches on prayer, the Latin Mass, online death threats, tattoos, getting banned from Australia, and much more! 🍺 Want to Support Pints With Aquinas? 🍺 Get episodes a week early and join exclusive live streams with me! Become an annual supporter at 👉 https://mattfradd.locals.com/support 💵 Show Sponsors:  👉 College of St. Joseph the Worker:  https://www.collegeofstjoseph.com/mattfradd 👉  Truthly – The Catholic faith at your fingertips: https://www.truthly.ai/ 👉 Hallow – The #1 Catholic prayer app: https://hallow.com/mattfradd  💻 Follow Me on Social Media: 📌 Facebook: https://facebook.com/mattfradd 📸 Instagram: https://instagram.com/mattfradd 𝕏 Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/Pints_W_Aquinas 🎵 TikTok: https://tiktok.com/@pintswithaquinas 👕 PWA Merch – Wear the Faith! Grab your favorite PWA gear here: https://shop.pintswithaquinas.com

I'm a Catholic. Crimes against Catholics were committed for the crime of being Catholic. I'm commenting on a Catholic issue, criticizing a Catholic person, and people are telling me to stay in my lane. People would be like, you're a Catholic, so you're like a Nazi. Yeah, exactly. What? It's the leap there. That was wild of you to do. As you begin to convert, well, at least for me, like, you know, you're letting go the world. And there's that part of you that's like, just afraid. Like, oh, man, I have a good friend, and he's gay.

to think I hate him now. I was raised in a generation where Christianity was what had to be subverted. Right. Question all authority was what we would say. And now I just so happened to accidentally be raising my children in a generation where to be Christian is to be punk rock, to actually be a Christian. So you're the cool punk rock dad now. I don't know if they would say that. But I...

Hey, welcome to Pines of the Quietness. Today I interview my good friend and comic Shane Smith. We've had Shane on the show a few times before. Shane converted to Catholicism a few years back, just got married, wonderful guy. So we speak about everything from, you guessed it, stand-up comedy, to Dungeons and Dragons, to what it means to be punk rock. There's a lot that goes on in this episode. Hey, and I want to say thank you.

A lot of people have started subscribing to the channel. And if that's not you, please do us a favor. Click subscribe and the bell button. It really helps support the show. God bless. Enjoy the show. So you were banned from Australia. What happened?

And I'm sorry on behalf of all Australians who love you. So I filmed an entire special about it a couple days ago. Okay. Another special. The entire special is only about getting banned from Australia. So I went to get a work visa And they wouldn't give it to me To the point that we were like

We got to get a lawyer involved So we're trying to figure out how to get to work visa And then Australia was like You're a political extremist And everyone like my agent is like What? Sheen's a political extremist Because like I'm pretty regular on the internet Like I am a political extremist

So they were right They're right Kudos to them Yeah yeah they're totally right I'm a political extremist I'm a religious extremist. I'm an extreme guy. I'm an aesthetic extremist, you know?

All of it. And so I get it. But also, like, what do they think? What do they think I'm going to do? And so basically, it turns out that, like, I was on, like, a watch list. And how I got on that watch list was by being Catholic. Because Joe Biden was spying on Catholics and putting Catholics on watch lists. And they had a bunch of different types of watch lists.

and like Tulsi Gabbard was on one and a bunch of other people and like but so then they share that information with our allies who are like oh this person's sketchy or whatever like if the TSA is watching you and won't give you pre-check they're going to tell Australia about it probably anyway it was this whole huge like wild mess and so we sorted it we started to sort it out thinking like all right it's going to get his work visa we'll send him into the country and then Australia started looking into me. And they were like, we don't like you. And they straight up were like, we don't like the people you talk to. We don't like the podcast you're on. We don't like the merch on your store. We don't like what you post. And so then they were like, if you want

to work visa, you're going to have to like do a bunch of stuff. And then they started like censoring my social media. And my lawyer was like, they're not going to let you in the country. If you don't take these shirts with guns off your website, you got to do X and Y and Z. It was like an insane, like, rigamarole, right? And during all of this, the country of Australia is, like, being crazy to the point that they're like, write us a letter apologizing for the speeding ticket you got when you were here. That's not true. It's real. It's real.

Did you ever pay it? Of course not. I live in America. I'm going home. Why would I pay that? I know. So in my act, I joke about how my original plan is not to pay it. I also was going double the speed limit on the highway.

So the cop, like, I didn't know that Australian cops were, like, really serious about the law. Yeah. You guys are like, hey, you have to follow the rules. Yeah. Like, people don't even jaywalk. I was in Brisbane and people were, like, behaving themselves. Even the crackheads were, like, kind of like, hey, easy now, you know? Like, they were like a little, like, they were in their lane, like, kind of well-behaved.

It was weird. Oh, I can't wait to figure this out. So it turns out you ended up going there? I end up going. Okay. So I end up going but it took me over a year of litigation and a new president and essentially like it took so much work to get and they didn't award me the work visa until like I'm not joking literally like two weeks before I had to leave one last twist of the knife to be like you also you have to pay the maximum amount to come here and maybe even don't it was crazy. All right. I have so many questions. All right.

So how did you find out that you are on a Catholic watch list? So there's no way to know like 100%. No one's like, here's the watch list and you're on it. But like my lawyer is like, hey, just so you know, like clearly something's up. They're watching you. This is what happened. Yada, yada, yada. And we were like country of Australia, like explain yourself.

Why is Shane a political extremist? And they would like, because that was their verbiage. And then they had me do a bunch of stuff. Like they censored me and did all these other things. What do you mean they censored you? You weren't showing up in Australia or they were asking you to do. They were asking me to do things or I would not be awarded a work visa. Okay.

And they like, like I did like Jesse Peterson. You know who this guy is? Or is his name Jesse Peterson? I don't know. A black fellow. Oh, don't know him. He's an African American man. He's not, black and African American are technically different.

I don't know. But it does. So anyway. he's African-American, but he's like a conservative. He's like a, he's like kind of a troll a little bit. He's a funny guy. He makes very funny content. And so I did his podcast or whatever.

You know, and he's like grilling me about stuff. He's a sort of a controversial guy. So he asked me like, do you think there needs to be more white babies? That would be a question he would ask me. And I'm like, sure. Define need. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think, yeah.

Yeah, if I'm making them for sure. Like I want my family to grow. grow, we're all white, whatever. I don't know, man. So I, you know, he's tried to be controversial. I answer all these questions. The country of Australia was like, we saw you were on that podcast.

We hated it. Like they, the amount of stuff that they were trying to do to get me to not have a work visa just because they didn't want me in the country, like, what did they say, espousing conservative values. I wonder if you say the country of Australia,

it was probably a 42-year-old man named Graham. I point that out at certain points during the joke because I'm doing it. I do like frame it as the entire country of Australia because it's funny. But in reality, I'm for sure like what happens is there's caseworkers assigned to different things and algorithm probably handles most of it.

One specific caseworker like has to look at like every 50th flag flagged account or whatever. He happened to see mine thought, screw this conservative guy. I'm going to make it difficult for him. and then at every point just made sure to make it difficult for me. I'm sure that that's essentially what happened, right? Or once they see it, everyone who's working in that government office is not conservative,

and they're like, we're going to give this guy a tough time. But I mean, Candace Owens and like multiple other speakers were barred from entering the Commonwealth in general, but also Australia very specifically. So I don't know what's going on with that. Do you have problems? I haven't had any problems yet, but I'm in Australia. citizens. So that might be why. Maybe if I went now, they would. But it's funny because I'm obviously like offended on your behalf, but I'm also thinking, that's kind of cool. We don't want

you. Piss off. You got to apologize. That's kind of cool. I kind of like that. I thought that was your guys's thing for a while. Weren't you like the hardest country to immigrate to for a little bit? I think we still are. Really? One of them. Yeah. Yeah. And I was, I was, here's the funny part though. So they made me do all this stuff. Frustrating, expensive. I had to travel around. I did different, multiple different types of background checks and local places I had been arrested. They wanted me to physically go get paperwork for them, basically creating busy work to stop me from coming to the country. Yeah, I mean, surely it wasn't worth your time.

Well, here's, at one point, we're trying to get this. And they're like, we want a transcript of your comedy. And we were like, what? Because they want, they say, we want to make sure you're not espousing conservative views publicly in Australia. That was the worst they used. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. straight face, they said that.

Yes, espousing conservative views in Australia is what the man on the phone said. Unbelievable. So he's just like, you can't just come into our country, it's an American, it show up and then start telling people. And make sense. Yeah, and tell people to be conservative. And his assumption that I would do this was the people I spend time with and the fact that I'm religious.

Like they asked for, they wanted, they made me get, not character, like like a reference yes character references that's the word I'm looking for so they made me get character references specific from blue-haired lesbian women no specifically the man from Australia

told me no priests no religious people that's what I meant by the blue lesbian that's what he said that's real they did that they actually for real did that I'm gonna need a tranny so I need someone who's disabled dude they were just like

how many levels legs. How many, what kind of place does he park? The person who wrote your character reference, could he fit in a canoe easily? What's the deal with that? You know, you're like, what do you want for me, dude? And then here's the crazy part. I had like dirtbag comedians write the reference. So like the ref, you wanted show business references. That's what you want. Not like, it was it was crazy. And eventually it culminated in them being like, you've done everything we've asked, you've written us all these letters, you've done all this. You need to. an FBI background check in person.

So they made me do like this crazy whole FBI thing that I had to fly to. And like it was a whole, it was wild. At some point did you think this isn't worth it? Yes. Why was it worth it? At the very beginning. Why was it worth it? Why did you go for content?

So they said write us a letter and that's where I was out. And my agent was kind of pushing me along because obviously he books this shows and he has relationships, these bookers, and he cares about these people, and he cares about these work relationships, and whatever. So he's kind of like, hey, I know that you have more dignity than to write a letter apologizing for speeding, but like, I need you to just play ball. And so we're working on it, and, you know, we're writing a letter. Oh, I hope you kept the letter. That would be a great thing to read it. We have it. We have it. So, but then at one point, I'm like, I'm done. I'm out, actually. I'm going to lose money on these shows. I don't even want to go. I don't care.

And at that point, the shows had been cancelled and rescheduled. And then also the country of Australia can't canceles the show. So they go, if you tell people, you can't, if you're telling them, you're litigating this. And that's why you canceled them. Like, we're, no. You need to, so I had to be like, for personal reasons, the personal reason being, I'm being harassed. So they were banning you and told you you couldn't say you were being banned. Yeah, they were like, if you want to go ahead and publicly talk about this, we're just not going to let you in. Like, at every point, they're like play ball with us or... It's like they knew that what they were doing was petty.

Yes. Yes. 100%. That's why I'm so convinced it was like a guy or a small group of people who are aware of my online presence. I, like, it's crazy. It was a crazy experience to experience. And I've completely lost my train of thought where I just was, but...

I was asking why it was worth it. Oh, and so anyway, so yeah, I go to, I don't want to write the letter. My agent, he gets me to write the letter. That's his job. Honestly, great job for him. He's good at his job. So I'm still coming. At one point, I'm like, I'm out.

Too much money, too much time. This is annoying. My, my fiancee at the time. Now wife was like, yeah, I support you. Like, if you don't want to go, don't go. Just stay home with me, whatever. And so I'm like, yeah, I'm not going to go. And then I start getting messages from people in Australia.

Are you going to come? Like, do, will you pray with me? you get here like we're all so happy you're coming no one ever comes to australia like i wonder why oh crazy no one ever comes here i wonder if it has to do with all your animals are mostly poisonous spiders and the fact that your government is is like being rude all the time i don't know could have something to do with it but so at this point now i begin to feel like oh these people have made plans they bought tickets the tickets were rescheduled they're still excited to see me I'm like, dang, I got to show up for these people.

And you know what? It was worth it. It was incredibly rewarding. So the FBI background check, you did that, and then you said they issued it two weeks before. I did the FBI background check literally like two weeks before the shows they go, you're approved. So I had to buy the ticket then. So I'm not buying a ticket. The insurance on an international ticket is like $500.

So I'm going to risk $500. dollar you know and so then i end up paying it's it was crazy so tell me about what it was like going to my country where you went and so so uh firstly i was angry because i showed up to your country and this is the end of the stand-up bit and this this is a come out for a while so who knows the bit is but like i get to australia and once you land there everyone's cool no one even the tsa people aren't doing their jobs i flew the whole time i was there you guys basically are on the honor system like I showed up to at the airport and they were like you're good right and I was like I guess and they let me in you guys are just Canadian about it

when you get to the border were you expecting to get some grief yes yes after a year of being harassed and in dealing with litigation and lawyers and like all this crazy stuff and fly to different background I just fly to Utah to get like police background check from Utah fly to where I was living at the time in the state and make sure to get a background check They made me do multiple, like, weird, like I had to jump through so many hoops. I get to the country and they're like, yeah, just come, like, whatever. They didn't even bring it up. Literally, no.

They made me print my work visa out like a child. I had to bring it physically like a guy going to middle school. Okay, everyone, I got it, you know. I have the paper. And on the paper, it said, I had a social exemption. And it said, if I offended any groups of people, I could be deported. Goodness sake. Yep.

how perfectly vague enough to remove me when needed. I got a feeling if you had of offended good old conservative people keeping the country together, they would have been fine with that. I don't know what's going on in Australian politics. I will say this, so I did the jokes about Australia in Australia. And it was. Yeah, how did they receive that? So it was just, and let me, let me back up, because I've always been interested in this.

How you, I just listened to Jane McCann special recently. I don't know if you're sure. He's terrific, isn't it? Yeah. And he was talking about America. And I think to myself, you've got to be careful when you're talking about a country to that country. You can be a little cheeky, but they have to know you respect them and love their country.

So how did you go about that? I probably didn't do it as good as I could have been more respectful, probably. But I think that everyone knows that I'm a silly guy and I'm so excited to be there. I think that I got up on stage with like, I'm so excited to be here, and this is what just happened to me. And so most Australians, I would say 75% of the people at the shows were like, yo, this was hilarious. Like the shows, firstly, I would like to say all the shows were great. The audiences were great.

People laughed the whole time. It was super fun. My opener also killed it, like truly, really fun shows. We did, the show in Sydney was like an all time, like an all time great, like top, top 10 of all time show of mine. It was so fun. But also, after the shows, and this is a, I have about maybe 10% of my shows in America and about 25% in Australia, maybe a little more where people come up to me after and be like, so what's your deal? Do you think you're some kind of victim? People say that.

Yeah, they would be like, so you think that, you think Christians are under attack. Like, they would listen to it. I would see them enjoy the show. And then afterwards, they would immediately take it personally like, you know, Christians aren't under attack. Like when Will Smith slapped Chris Rock, he was enjoying it. Right, right. Yeah, and he was, but they would literally confront me like, you know that bad things aren't happening to Christians.

Is this act like some kind of thing so that you can make people think that it's hard to be Christian? Like, they really like took it personally. And with that sort of attitude? Yes. Very much like this snarky, like, so what are you doing? Or it would be like full confrontation. That didn't happen.

people like basically essentially being like it would be impossible for you to be inconvenienced hurt or otherwise discriminated against based on this fact because you guys are in charge of everything and the people who did that to you actually are good and don't do anything bad that's like the what's i can see the gears turning in their brains like oh actually the people i vote for don't ever do that so you're wrong and it's like what? Or people would be like, Joe Biden's Catholic. Why would he be mean to Catholics? Yeah, you're right. And Obama's black. Thank God he's black because racism doesn't exist anymore. While he was president, there was no racism. And the government did nothing bad to black people. For sure,

it didn't. You know, what kind of logic is that? Of course, just because the president is a thing, doesn't mean that other things don't happen. Stalin's Russian. They're still hurting Russians. You know? Well, he's Georgian, but that's a different story. Whoa. Yeah, I was just in Australia in January with my wife and we were watching the news and we realized I can't trust anything they're saying. They were, they were demonizing this group of, you know, good old Aussie boys walking down the streets, singing Waltzing Matilda and calling them neo-Nazi white supremacists. I thought, I don't believe you at all. Right. Not at all. I mean, you didn't interview them. You didn't ask any questions of them. It's very one-sided in

Australia. So I've been getting like a lot of attention more than normal over being a Christian who used to inhabit non-Christian spaces. So I've been getting a lot of like atheists or like opposition attention, I suppose is what you could say. And I have noticed that the Nazi thing is huge. Like that's their first insult right now. Still. Like people would be like you're a Catholic so you're like a Nazi. Yeah. Exactly. You're like what? It's the leap there. That was wild of you to do. But here's my thing also. I go, what, this is my new thing I do. I go, what is a Nazi? The world to white supremacist, but you say non-white people can be Nazis. Kanye West is a Nazi. Mexicans are Nazis. Like, there's Polynesian people and, you know, are Nazis now, apparently.

Like, you accuse all these groups of being Nazis or Nazi adjacent. And then you'll accuse like this group of australian guys who are like i guess nationalists or whatever they're they're patriots it's the word we use you know so they're patriots and and your your thing is they're they're nazis but they have non-white people with them right always yes definitely so then you're like so what is a nazi if it's it definitely doesn't have anything intrinsically to do with color and so then they go okay fine it's uh it's you know and then they kind of just waffle on the question and you're like what is a Nazi? What do I want? And what am I going to do about it that makes me so evil that you are saying this? Like, so I'm not German. I'm not a member of the German Socialist

Workers Party. So like, what are you accusing me of? And they actually, for real, don't know. That would be a nice follow up to what is a woman by Matt Walsh, maybe? What is a Nazi? Yeah, what is a Nazi? And people have like, do you know, obviously they're like, well, fascists and fascists believe blood and soil is like the term they use because whatever, but that doesn't even apply to America. So I don't even know what they're accusing me of almost ever. I just think of being icky. Yeah. You're in opposition to me, therefore you are evil. I'm the good guy. Anyone in opposition to me is the worst guy. The worst guy I can think of as a Nazi. You're a Nazi. So you converted a few years ago and you kind of came on my show before your official

reception to the church obviously. Yeah. So I mean, what was, you've touched upon it here, but what was that experience like? What did you expect would happen as far as people's reaction to you and what is happening? I thought people would be mad for sure. I thought people would be disappointed. That was my big thing when I was first converting. Like, oh, I'm like disappointing so many people I love and respect you know and there's that like you're as you begin to convert well at least for me like you know you're letting go the world and there's that part of you that's like just afraid like oh man I have a good friend and he's gay is you going to think I hate him now yeah you know and then it's crazy too because then you become Christian you're like I love him

even more I want the best for him I want him to succeed and flourish And like, I think about him all the time. I pray for him. I was never thinking about that guy, you know, before or like wishing him well in my spare time. Now I do that for all my. So, you know, if anything, I love him more. But I, you know, you have this deep fear when you convert as a completely secular person with no family in it. Like, oh, all these people are going to think I'm evil or whatever or just assume things.

So I was really worried about all that. That was less of a problem than I thought it would be. and but the regular people being mad was more of a problem okay okay so i see what i see you mean so people on the fringes as it were yeah yeah yeah who might be homosexual or something they didn't seem to care that much people who knew me well were like oh i don't care i'm like oh thank goodness yeah they're like yeah bro do you i know who you are what are you gonna stop talking to me now you know and i'm like thank you yeah for understanding like that i can that you know i can see your lifestyle not approve of it but still love you right want the best for you and you can know that i

I want something different for you and not take it personally. Right. And also not have to agree with me. And not have to agree with me. All you have to do is respect me. And I will respect you. And it's like pretty easy. It's almost crazy how easy it is if you lead with love and kindness from both sides. You know, it's like, but, um, yeah. And then, but I got so much hate from people I'd never met. That was the thing where I was like, oh, okay, people I've never met are telling me I'm a Nazi people I've never met or saying crazy things like for instance now we had that school shooting I have then I posted like hey I think how people are handling talking about prayer right

now is really disgusting people are saying like thoughts and prayers that's we've had enough thoughts and prayers we need action okay that statement in and of itself sure whatever I don't agree with it necessarily, but I agree we need action. Someone should do anything. And I also think we need prayer. So, like, I see where they're coming from. But then they go, people say my thoughts and prayers. And then people are responding like a dunk, like enough prayers these kids were praying when they got shot at. And I was like, oh, that's a disgusting thing to say. Just say, hey, your prayers are great and I'll be praying too. But now is the time for faith with work. you know whoa you just killed it with that statement Gavin but instead Gavin Newsom the governor

of California says these kids were literally being shot out or praying while they were shot at so what's your insinuation there and the insinuation is a prayer didn't work yeah the god doesn't exist and it's all a fairy story and we've got to be practical instead of spiritual exactly whereas no Christian in the history of Christianity has ever said all we have to is pray and not love our brother yeah yeah yeah that's in James right if a poor person comes to you and you say be well-fed or go on your way, God bless you. Like, what are you doing? Yeah, yeah.

And so I point out in a video, like, I'm very angry. I'm very angered by this, which I think is fair. I'm like, listen, I'm Catholic. These are Catholic kids. I'm a Catholic father. My Catholic child goes to Catholic. You know, like, I'm very close to this. Should just feeling about it and thinking these kids died for their faith, oh, for the crime

of being Catholic, and praying in a church. And so for you to criticize the prayer, which is what the shooter who murdered them was doing, I think is disgusting. I think that you're on the side of the shooter in that sense. You know, that's horrific to be on this man's side. And so I was like, oh, this is evil. I hate this, I pointed it out in a video.

And I said, even in the video, I'm like, if you're trying to bring people to your side, this is a horrible tactic. Every, hundreds of comments of people being like, you're missing the point. missing the point. Oh, I'm like, no, I'm not. I know that he's saying we need action. I'm not referencing that. I'm saying that he's being discussing towards prayer and then people are like, so you're more worried about prayer than dead kids. You know, and then they start to gaslight. And then

it's like the whole like, oh, so you don't care about anyone. Oh, and you want nothing to happen. And then people start and now I'm getting comments and DMs like, well, go ahead. I hope you put your kids in Catholic school. Make sure to enroll your children in Catholic school. These are comments I'm getting from people in messages. And you're like, oh, cool. So I was just like, I'm a Catholic. Catholics were murdered. I'm criticizing another Catholic because Gavin Newsom is a baptized Roman Catholic, apparently. You know, I don't know that for sure, but I think he is. And so I'm a Catholic. Crimes against Catholics were committed for the crime of being Catholic. I'm commenting on a Catholic issue, criticizing a Catholic person and people are telling me to stay in my lane.

you know what I mean like hey what are we doing right now in America or in the world in general and if of all the times like I'm allowed to talk on a subject this is the one time I'm like this is all my stuff get me in here I have an opinion you know yeah and I just think people the thing is people are like oh you care about this more than like dead kids or whatever And it's like their unwillingness is a secular person to see that like prayer matters to us in any way, shape, or form. Or our religious practice is like essential to us or like deeply important. It just doesn't, as Christians, it doesn't, it doesn't make sense to them. Whereas of course, if it was a mosque that was shot up, you know, it would.

No one would say we need more than thoughts and prayers. No, not one person, not one person. So is this the first time you've come out on a, say, cultural topic and have been lamb bastard for it? Or since, because when was your, I mean, your reception of the church was about a year ago? No, two. Oh, okay. Two years ago even. So had you been commenting on things that got this kind of backlash, or was this the first time?

I had, I've, so I've, through my career, I'm a comic, so I say shocking things. So I'm totally fine receiving negative feedback. And I've received tons of negative feedback for like, you. You know, like I've said that pit bulls as a dog breed shouldn't exist. That'll rile people up. You know, and so I've said some stuff. Yeah. You know, I've also, like, been in trouble.

I've said political things. So, like, I have been in trouble. And I've also said Catholic things that have gotten me in trouble before. I've also said Catholic things that don't get me in trouble, and that's fun. But, yeah, every once in a while, I find that it's just like I'll just get absolutely attacked in this crazy. way and then of course like you get attacked and then like it rolls the death threats and stuff in and you're like really you guys are gonna like and the thing is too it makes you feel stupid because I don't want to go online and be like hey just so all you liberals know you guys are all like

yelling at me like no one's being charitable no one's seeing my argument and you're all being completely rude absolutely unwilling to respect or understand that I have faith that it's important to me and then people are telling me to kill myself and stuff you know so i's but i don't because the people who tell you are like you know it's like the most it's like you look at their profile and you're like you you couldn't run if you to hear to kill me if you needed to so these threats are like you know from from people who aren't doing so well aren't doing so hot yeah yeah yeah yeah, yeah. They're the, you know, there are people who need, like, who would write a letter because they can't get into beans and brew with their, you know, because they're quote unquote disabled or whatever. These are like people who are disabled with rainbow hair. I want to say a big thanks to the College of St. Joseph the Worker based in Stubanville, Ohio. You'll recognize many of their faculty and fellows from the show. People like Dr. Andrew Jones, Dr. Jacob Imam, Dr. Mark Barnes, Dr. Alex Plato. Listen to this. Their program combines the rigor of an elite bachelor's degree with the practicality

of training in the skilled trades, and their tuition model is structured so that students graduate without crippling debt. If you're a bright young man thinking about what college to go to, apply to a place where you not only learn the good, but gain the power to do it. Apply to the college of St. Joseph the Worker. If you're a parent, look into this college for your children. And if you're not in either category, just consider supporting the mission. Go to College of St.Joseph.com slash Matt Frad to learn more. That's College of STJoseph.com slash Matt Frad to learn more. There will be a link below.

Thanks. This is going to sound out of left field, but it connects. Did you play Doom, Wolfenstein, Quake, as a younger man? Yes to all. Yeah. It's funny. You go back and try to play Wolfenstein. I almost feel seasick because there's no sort of bounce in the steps.

Here's the point. someone said to me that he thinks this online trolling and go kill yourself and this tough man attitude in comments sections is just the new doom like that's what people are doing they don't play video games where they kill bad guys yeah they go online and say really aggressive things and i guess the dopamine hit or uh whatever is happening in your brain when you have these interactions is just as good if not better than when you used to play ducum 3d for so they don't mean it. No one's upset. Literally no one is upset. I kind of agree with you. Yeah. What do you think? Someone said that to me, Eric Ybarra, the more I think about it, the more I think there's something to it.

I think that, I think that people are actually upset, but in like a very visceral, emotional way, not in a way that's thought out. But is anyone sending you a message like that shutting their laptop lid and going, I think they're probably like, oh, hi, Wendy. I don't think anyone's really upset. Yeah, I don't know. Maybe I'm wrong. You might be wrong, but I, I, I think. think it's possible. I think that people do a lot of hand-wringing. I think that people are online and then they set the phone down and they're like amped up from it. I think like I've seen people like freak out. They like that maybe getting amped up in the way others get amped up by listening to political podcasts. Right, right. Why do I keep doing this? It just makes me depressed about the state

of humanity. Well, time to listen to the next one. Maybe it's like that. That's me. That's me watching a documentary about like, you know, some foreign conflict from 50s. 50 years ago, and I'm like, history is doomed to repeat itself. Anyway, you know, I'm just like blackfilling myself there. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I, um, I think that they're mad sometimes.

Here's the thing that people say to me sometimes, I'll engage in the arguments. Because like, this is another funny thing. This is a comment I got. Someone messaged me and they were like, look at you commenting in the morning. And I was like, firstly, I'm awake. Like, what? I'm sorry that I'm a normal life. You're some.

Gen Z is like, oh, so you're up before 9 a.m.? Probably because you're insane and you just woke up to comment to me. No, bro, I have a child. What are you talking about? It's so funny to be like, you're awake in the morning. What's wrong with you, you sick freak? Like they don't understand that grownups just wake up for life. But then, so you're awake in the morning and he goes,

and you're just replying to comments. Hey, when you commented, did you not think? think I would reply to you? I read these. I'm like a full human being. And I also want to interact with people. That's literally what this is about. You know, and then he was like, he didn't never replied. And I was like, what happened there? I just think people are like, I think people are mad and they're so emotional that like, there's no, like the phone is, they're not hearing or seeing you. They're just in their own minds like as the hero. Have you ever heard of the like there are people who so when I was young I was addicted to daydreaming and I've said this on the

podcast but one of the big problems with that is that people who get addicted to daydreaming you get so good at it that it kills your motivation to do real things because people then become scared or not scared but you'll be like well I imagine myself as the hero on the baseball team and it feels really good and it's definitely not the same but I'll just let it go I'll just And so now I never have the motivation to actually go, be the baseball hero, because I can just imagine it when I want. And I could be the baseball hero today, and I could be the skateboard hero the next day and the martial arts hero and an actual superhero. And now I'm era going, you know, and it like saps your motivation to do real things because, and this ties into like, they say, don't tell people about your plans because telling them gives you the dopamine as if you were doing it. So you're like, I'm going to stop, I'm going to stop smoking cigarette.

and people are like, what amazing? That's so good for you. And you're like, and I am great for saying I'm going to stop. And they're like, yeah, definitely. Yeah. And then you don't because you were like, ooh, that felt good. I did it. And then you're out.

And so like, I think that people are like out of their minds and they're like, they're fighting, you know, us or whoever online. And they're doing the imagination thing where they're like, I'm an action star. I'm the hero. I'm literally fighting evil. It seems to me that there are three types of comments. Well, first of all, it seems like YouTube has to make everyone who is interacting with YouTube in any way addicted to their platform

or to the best of their ability. So that means not just the viewer, so you click and now there's shorts and you, you know, not just the creator. Yeah. Because in the back end, you know, it shows you how well your videos are doing, how they could be doing better. But also the commenter, right? There's an incentive to say snarky things.

humility rarely goes viral, so forget about that, say something so you can kind of get a bunch of thumbs up and feel good about yourself. So the three kind of comments that I see, right, I think 95%, well, this is not fair. I think there's a large majority that is friendly and then some that is the other half is snarky. But there's also the people who are genuinely interested. They usually begin with serious question here. And then they say something, and I always love that. Like, This is, you know. Serious question here is a good one. But most comments are not worth reading.

I don't read them anymore. I've, I need to stop. Yeah. I need to stop engaging as much. And I have done better. I bought an Apple watch so that I can have days where I don't use a phone. It's actually a nice way to go about it. Yeah, yeah.

You motivated me to do this. Yeah, yeah. I don't wear it anymore because someone told me to get cancer, so now I've got a normal watch. Really? And you trust this cancer person. I don't trust anything. I don't know. There's so much, this.

I mean, I smoke cigars, but I don't wear Apple watches. So you tell me, I don't know, I'm worth listening to. You got to draw the line somewhere. Yeah. You know, you have to, there has to be like some place. Because it's funny for me, like, sometimes I feel like, yeah, like, hey, don't eat that. Skittles are the worst thing you could possibly eat. We need to be better.

And then I'm like, watch me jump this motorcycle. Like, what am I doing? I'm going to die doing that. For sure I am. What am I? Well, so it's tempting because I'll post a video, and I, genuinely hope that it's a blessing to people. And so sometimes I'll dip into the comments to go, ooh, that's why we don't go down into that basement place. Right, right, right.

Yeah, yeah, fun times. My comment, here's the thing. And I, I do, do you ever go into your like DM requests? What does that mean? Like on Instagram or something? Yeah, yeah, yeah. You have them on every app. Well, what's funny is this is how you and I met. You sent me a DM saying, hey, Pines really helped. I think you said that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I did. Thank you very much. and I'm like, oh, that's awesome. And then Josiah was like, do you know who this is? I'm like, no idea. He's like, we need him on the show.

I'm like, all right. That's so fun. So I tend not to go in there. Yeah, I try to keep my life simple because there's too many people trying to get a hold of me and I just can't respond to everybody. Yeah, yeah. But you go in there, hey?

I go in there. Well, I've gotten work from it. Yeah. Like, people will be in there like, hey, do you do this for shows or whatever? Or I'll like, or people will collab. You know, like, you know, it will be something like this

where I'll make a friend or reach out to another person who's doing a thing. And then, so yeah, I'll check, but I don't, I don't respond to them. And I also don't like, I'll just, like, filter them. So, like, there will be some days, weeks, you know, that I don't see any of them. So, but yeah, I've been much better about being off my phone. My wife has motivated me on that one. I can't wait to talk about that. But a question, do you think that, what was I going to ask?

Yeah. the nastiness that everybody acknowledges takes place in comment sections and online. Do you think that's filtering over to in-person interactions? Because it seems to me that up until now I hear people say, no one would ever say that to you in person. And I think that's true. Like the other day someone in a comment section said,

hey, Matt Fred, you're aging terribly. And I thought, are you autistic? Why would you say that? And I don't think anyone would say that in person. Never. And yet you were just telling me in Australia of people were coming up and being aggressive. So I wonder if we are.

When I say aggressive, I just mean like calling out like the like, what are you doing here? They're definitely not being rude by any means, but they would just be like, so do you think, so, so what's going on with this, you know? Yeah, sometimes it would be in message form after the show. But sometimes it would be in person. In Australia, I had a few like punk rock people come up to me and be like very, they're just so insane about their thing that they think everything is their thing. Like when you're in that world and you're like, I'm a, I live in my little punk rock world and I have my like nine really close friends and we watch what these 20 people

on the internet do. And it feels like the entire world is revolving around us and this time in our lives and we're revolutionaries. And this all feels exciting and important. And I'm a part of something. And these people are the antithesis of my thing. And you're like, well, we kind of like this guy and we're allowed to like this guy because he's in our little morality square where if you know because you can't like an artist unless he fits all my little boxes and he comes over and we support him but then he says some kind of sus things or he's aligned with these people to we think are kind of not good and now like everyone is the enemy so they're going to confront me like it's this weird sort of thing but i think that nowadays in person especially in america there is a lot more confrontation like

if I wore, I have a hat that says make America holy again and it just looks like a maga hat and people, people yell like people say stuff or like chirp out at me like from cars or whatever. So I'll get stuff or I'll get really bad looks from women or like, you know, dudes wearing tivas or whatever. You know, so I'll get like that kind of thing. But I don't know, man. I feel like we're, I think it's more confrontational than it's ever been. But at the same time, like, in person no one no one's going to do anything no one's going to catch a body in person

like every time someone I've confronted someone in person they've just dropped you know they've collapsed under the weight of of the situation yeah goodness yeah I told a you know the story about me till long ago

I not look at porn on his yeah yeah yeah so that was something like that where I said stop looking at porn please really loudly and that was great and I want to just I I bring that up again because I want everyone to do that. If you see someone looking at pornography, I'm not talking about like a flashing sex scene, which is horrible enough,

but someone who's like watching ongoing sex scenes in movies, you should ask them loudly to stop watching pornography. If they don't, call the stewardess and loudly say, I'm afraid that man is masturbating. Yeah, for real. 100% we need to bring back public shaming. Yeah, yeah. For shameful things.

People need to be made to feel ashamed for things that they ought to feel shameful if they won't feel it naturally. the the rejection of shame blows my mind it's such a negative thing i i was talking about this the other day and i wanted to make a bit about it but i don't know that i can make it funny enough let's do it let's process it so i wanted to talk this is a bit i've been doing there is uh we have eliminated bullying from society completely you're not allowed to question shame or bully people ever right no gatekeeping allowed therefore we've removed all inherent risk to self-express which has made being a weirdo, being an art person,

dressing different, having piercings, doing tattoos. It has removed all the inherent risk. And so now all of these activities are masturbatory. They're nothing. Dude, this is brilliant. And you, because you and I were walking through a mall in Pittsburgh recently. And you brought this up to me.

You know how sometimes you're listening to someone like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And they're like, oh wait, that's brilliant. Because we had pointed out how these stores sell punk rock items. And that's what led to this discussion. Break this down again, because it's really intelligent. Because when I was a kid, right, I dressed all in black. My friends were all called the heavy metal group.

People didn't like us. And we liked that they didn't like us. Yes, 100%. And in they're not liking you, it united you together. Yes. And so this is a strange... We were a misunderstood minority. Right.

And this is a strange phenomena of human existence because that then makes, it raises the quality of your music, it raises the quality of your friendship, the quality of your experience. And it also, I think personally, when you really get down to it, raises the quality of your interaction with the other groups. Every group is defined. Every group of people has their own thing. And because they're insular and because people are like, you're doing something different, I don't like what you're doing, I'm doing this. your thing becomes very special and good and worked on and sincere and when it's sincere and authentic

and in a space where it can grow and be pushed forward and now you're reaching out to other people and you're getting to get you know and this is all very beautiful we've removed that we've destroyed community by what we thought was building a super community this is a really good metaphor

for why a one world government is the most evil thing we could do but like in any case yeah so you you take away bullying so we're not the heavy metal kids anymore you can't say that hey when Matt comes to school be normal to him even though he dresses like that

treat him like everyone else but Matt's not everyone else Matt's kind of weird he likes heavy metal stuff he's into this if I don't acknowledge who he is and what he's about and I just sort of am like yeah whatever that that's benign

then like it kind of takes away from your authenticity, from your sincerity, and now you're just sort of doing what everyone else is doing, but in a different tone. Is it sort of like we're mainstreaming weirdness? And when we mainstream weirdness, it's, it, it no longer has the benefits of being weird. I think that if nothing is, if everything is taboo, nothing is taboo, sort of in the opposite direction. Nothing is taboo. So nothing is taboo. It's like weird double negative almost. I don't know, but it's, so just nothing is, is taboo anymore. And so if everything is permissible under the law, yeah, you know, so like what is unique? What is like, isn't it always going to be

whatever goes against the mainstream narrative? Right. Something like that, because I've got, you know, I know children, I got friends who have children my age who are teenagers, and they're like, let's go burn all the gay flags. I'm like, whoa, maybe let's just hold, hold on. Yeah, yeah. Or, or they're very opposed to BLM, but in extremely vocal ways. Right. And I like the way Matt Walsh put it. He said,

when your ninth grade teacher, Barbara, is pro BLM, that's the moment. Right. Teenagers are no longer for it. Right. And so is that the new punk rock?

It's no longer being for death metal and wearing skulls on your t-shirts. It's now, maybe like conservatism, however that's understood, is becoming cool among teenagers? Well, the argument against that is that

conservatism is inherently anti-punk. And so the only way to be punk is to be anti-conservative. But that's, firstly, I just posted a tweet about that where someone, this person is like, if you're going to be punk, you have to be anti-establishment, anti-government, anti-this, you have to participate in this. You have to do that. And then the guy replies, my favorite thing about punk rock is all the rules. You know, punk rock is actually about not, it's about refusing to participate in

larger society. That is what punk rock is at its core. That's why you dress in ways that are purposefully ugly. You make yourself undesirable to the larger population. You make your hair in ways that makes you ugly. It's not, you're not trying to be attractive to other punk rock people. You're supposed to be being ugly to the larger society as like a statement against them. I opt out of this.

I don't want anything to do with you. I'm over here. So what we're seeing today, then it sounds like is the reverse. Because it feels like you've mainstream are ugly. And chopping off the hair and tattooing themselves into oblivion. No offense. No offense. But those who are trying to go against mainstream society, like,

I actually want to be a traditional wife who stays at home with my kids. And men are like, I want to get in shape and take responsibility for my life. Is that what's happening? Kind of. I think that what we're discovering is that a lot of this stuff like my tattoos, it turned out that those were like always totally and completely aesthetic. You know, because at the end of the day, all the inherent risk regarding my tattoos was societal. And, like, societal risk is real.

For sure, it is. Like, to have a lot of tattoos and live in a place where they're not accepted, it's going to affect you. Like, I can't be a cop. I can't, I don't even think I can work at Starbucks, actually. Really? Yeah, I think that they, their law, their rules on tattoos says no, like, full on face, but maybe not. That's funny. I thought they would have demanded that you do get face tattoos.

That's so, yeah, I don't know. I think that. So, in any case. case like it does there is inherent risk in that way sometimes but mostly it's gone and so like what what is punk rock that is an interesting question like our generation you know uh got to answer like millennials got to be like wait hold on because hot topic is a thing what's punk rock again wait green day's the most popular band what's punk rock again everybody is it Travis Barker dating supermodels and then marrying Chloe Cart wait hold hold

up. What's punk rock again? And so everyone's trying to like re-figure it out. And I think that, yeah, punk is anti-establishment. Whatever the establishment is, punk is the opposite of it. Punk isn't something that you agree with or disagree with. Punk is just is. And punk will always be anti-establishment. I might not like that punks don't think like me politically in the future or whatever, but they're still punks. You're supposed, it's so funny. for, I'm imagining, like, I'm just having this realization. Holy crap. So old millennials, like in our 40s.

Yeah, me. Are like, oh, so these kids think they're conservative. So you've got like a cowboy hat and Daisy Dukes and you're making jokes and you, and you think you're some kind, and you're a conservative and you say you're punk rock. You got tattoos and stuff. That's not punk rock. You can't be punk rock unless you're anti-establishment, anti-George Bush, anti-war, and all these other things and you know and then you're like yo you're the old man yelling at the

sky who doesn't understand the new youth who doesn't understand what they believe and why they believe it who totally doesn't get it and you're telling them how things should be yeah you are the conservative now you know the in in like in this like weird topsy turvy punk rock sort of way where you're like no you don't get it I get it do what I say because will I say goes and it's like that's opposite of punk rock that makes that kid more punk rock than ever for making you mad when they express themselves and you get mad they're doing punk rock big dog you're getting punk rocked this is how your grandpa saw green day you know what i mean like you're getting green dayed i love it but like so now when you're like you're like you go out into the

world and you're like boom a bunch of piercings and you're like i'm a goth okay who cares Even like the most Christian people I meet, like the most hardcore Catholic people I meet are like, yeah, you have a lot of tattoos. Who cares? It's almost like, like, yeah, it could matter less. Do you know your prayers? Are you in a state of mortal sin right now? Okay, then who cares? You know, now the conservatives are like how you respond to the world is more important than your aesthetic. we've sort of done this three this thing so now we are the ones who are like oh you look weird we don't care come over here whereas if you're over on the other side there's a ton of ways you can't look things you can't participate in you know it's very interesting how it's all going down yeah it's wild to think i was raised in a generation where christianity was what had to be

subverted right question all authority was what we would say and now i just so happen to accidentally be raising my children in a generation where to be Christian is to be punk rock, to actually be a Christian. So you're the cool punk rock dad now. I don't know if they would say that. But I guess what I'm saying is it's probably objectively a lot easier for me to raise my children Christian today than it was if my parents had have attempted to do it back in the 80s and 90s.

And it has little to do with me. Yeah. And maybe I'm attributing good parenting skills to myself as my children are so beautiful and well-rounded and love God and all that, when really it has way more to do with the culture bend, I wonder. Maybe. Do you know what I think about sometimes? I think about the fact that society ran without like these hyper-crazy extreme

countercultural movements. And there's always been extreme countercultural movements since, you know, Mesopotamia. we can like we know there were roman gangs we have like depictions of them and what they were up to we know that roman youth like did their hair they did punk rock you know but sort of not the way we're doing it and ours is so prevalent and obviously we're seeing it in our society but like we did have everyone sort of agreeing on one thing for a long time and when someone was very strange people would point out that's a weird guy and sometimes it would be strange and a fun way and people would point out that's a weird fun guy and he would be the comedian or or whatever even the

the gay uncle who's a terribly polite and very well-dressed guy who's part of your family circle right he's not the majority he's this anomaly who you love anyway yes but you don't pretend he's everyone exactly and so you're and you're all like okay whatever this is fine then our new generation is being raised without fathers, uh, the, the last two generations have had a horrible time with parenting. I mean, we're all parented into an oblivion. Like no one knows, like everyone needs therapy. Everyone's full of trauma. Everyone's parents messed up. Almost everyone comes from broken homes. And what I noticed was, hey, I grew up in a place, um, that was incredibly traditional. You literally could not grow up in a more traditional place.

You're saying you did? I did. I grew up in a very small town in the middle of Utah, you know? So these are Mormons, but they are wildly conservative. And these aren't just Mormons. These are country, Utah, rodeo Mormons. These are hardcore people, right? So I was always weird in punk rock.

My stepfather was into motorcycles and stuff. Like I've, you know, I've always been immersed in sort of alternative. culture. But when I was a kid and I was a weirdo and I was trying to pierce my eyebrow and I got a tattoo at 14 and I'm doing all this stuff, other kids would be like, that Shane, he's crazy. Yeah, dude, Shane's a punk rock guy. Hey, we invited him to the party. Get Shane in here. Here's the weird punk rock guy. And we would have, you know, conflicts or whatever and they would make fun of me. But at the end of the day, we were also friends. And we were men and we respect to each other. But they had really good upbringing, so they were incredibly secure in who they were.

so they say I'm a conservative guy who lives in a conservative town I see what my parents are doing my family loves me I belong here I play these sports I love my girlfriend I do they're wildly secure in who they are when you become insecure you see someone getting a lot of attention and you go oh man I need attention yeah how do I get it I could weird myself up and then everyone starts to weird themselves up. Now everyone is weird because all of our strategy to get attention from our parents, to get attention from our peers, to get attention from people to feel love, to feel seen is to cause a ruckus. Every single one of us is banging on pans, tattoo on our fate. Like, look, me, hey, me over here. I don't know. Would it be okay if I shared one of my favorite Jack

Johnson lyrics with you? Please, please, please. Tini bopping disco queen, she barely understands her dreams of belly button rings and all those kind of things. Symbolic of change, but the thing that is strange is that the change has occurred, and now she's just a part of the herd. I've probably shared that with you before. You haven't. That's really good. Very profound, I think.

Wow. Yeah, yeah. Because it starts out like, I'm unique. I'm original. Right. And you're like, I would just love to see a woman who's beneath the age of 30 without a tattoo. Right. That would be the new punk rock.

Right. I think, I tweeted this the other day. I really think Gen Alpha will see tattoos as cringe because of how insane we've all gone. with them. I think so as well. I think so as well. And here's my thing. I love tattoo culture. No regrets. I like being heavily tattooed. And I think if being heavily tattooed was mainstream, it wouldn't affect my enjoyment of it, right? I like how I look, whatever. Yep. But it's also a cultural thing. Like I grew up in a culture where everyone had lots of tattoos and it was like a marker of your participation in the culture and all these other things.

And so my tattoos mean a lot more to me than just aesthetics. And growing up, they were really important to like how I saw the world, how I interacted with the men I respected, how I was received into the communities that meant the most to me. And those communities were really authentic because there was a social price to pay and people held us accountable and stuff. But now everyone needs attention and we're all weird. And so now no one's secure.

So anytime you see someone getting attention, you go, I'm going to weird myself up and get attention too. Now, all people are weird. So my observation is society runs best when fathers and families love their children so thoroughly that should your child choose to be punk rock, this child is making the choice with the full knowledge and consent of what it means societally and the price they have to pay. pay, therefore making a complete and total authentic expression of themselves.

And because that is a complete and total authentic expression, their friends who also have that complete and total authentic expression will have all these things in common. Now they're friends. They're incredibly close. Their relationships are real based on this very real thing. And that's really beautiful and good. You know, and then you have all these secure kids who are not punk rock. And they say, ah, you're a dork.

Your hair looks stupid. whatever and then secretly they kind of think like punk rock girls are cute or you know but society chugs along all based on the idea that kids are secure enough to make authentic choices about how they express themselves because their parents love them when your parents don't love you everyone becomes punk rock and society looks stupid like like a like a just a bunch of toddlers screaming for attention literally so now i'm in a situation where i got a lot of tattoos because like I liked them and it was a cultural thing. And of course I liked the attention.

I would never pretend I didn't. That's embarrassing. But like now I'm in a situation where I am the norm. But also you had a wild life. Yeah, yeah. And I could imagine people who, you know, three weeks ago lived in a cul-de-sac with a what a used polo shirt have now tatted themselves and like, hey, we're the same.

Dude, so real, like salesmen come to my door and their polo with full sleeves and a neck tattoo. and I'm like, no. You're not my people. Get out of here. I don't know you, bro. Devin. Yeah, yeah.

And he's just with Disney tattoos and stuff. We're the same. And I'm like, no, we're not. But also, like, it is funny, you know? And it's like, hey, but here's the problem. Now we live in a very inauthentic world where we don't know who's authentically expressing themselves in certain ways. Gaykeeping isn't allowed.

No one knows who is what. or what's going on. We're not, and so now we're not connecting correctly. We're bouncing off of each other. You're like, hey, I'm a big nerd. I'm going to go to the game store and get involved in this community. But the community's all weird and messed up

and there's all this drama because it's not an authentic community. So let me ask you this then. If we're right in thinking that it feels like, even if it's not true, it feels like the vast majority of people are trying to be weird to try to get attention. Right.

Does that just mean then that people have to try to become even weirder than whatever the medium of weirdness is. And now we have Dragon Man. You know, we got people cutting off their nose and removing their ears and tattooing their whole face like there's a lizard. Is that really happening more or more? Guys, I've seen stuff like that.

I think so. And then you've got people who pretend that they're cats and need litter boxes in their school rooms. Furries and things. I think that it is all more extreme. I think that it's obvious that we've seen it. I think that we're scaling back heavily right now. I want to tell you about Hello, which is the number one downloaded prayer app in the world.

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My family uses it. It's fantastic. There are over 10,000 audio guided prayers, meditations and music, including my lofi. Hello has been downloaded over 15 million times in 150 different countries. It helps you pray, helps you meditate, helps you sleep better. It helps you build a daily routine and a habit of prayer. There's honestly so much excellent stuff on this app that it's difficult to get through it all. Just go check it out.

Hello.com slash Matt Frad. The link is in the description below. It even has an entire section for kids. So if you're a parent, you could play little Bible stories to them at night. It'll help them pray. Fantastic. Hello.com slash Matt Frad. I think we're in a scaling back period where I think everyone jumped the shark and we all realized like...

It's like we woke up in a dumpster with a hangover and went, what the hell? Dude, do you remember what we done? Do you remember like 10 years ago when every millennial was like pizza and cats? Dude, I have a pizza tattoo. Do you remember that? Like pizza's the best. There was a thing where like every millennial like had a pizza tattoo and that's quirky. And then one day we all woke up and we're like, so this is dorky.

What are we doing? And like, you know, like that happens. That's like what's happening culturally just with alternative culture in general. But I do think we just need to get back to a place where parents love their children so well that the children make authentic choices about who they want to be. That's like our biggest problem, right? It's social contagion. Everyone is just pursuing their brand of social contagion. Everyone's unhappy because no one's living in authentically true life.

depression reigns supreme you know and so that's obviously the thing the church offers and i think why we're doing so well because people like me are like so my tattoos are only aesthetic nothing weird about me is permanent or matters i'm just expressing myself sort of vainly and then i go how could i express myself in a way that matters really that makes a real statement and then you have god being like hey the ultimate rebellion is to reject all the world and you're like that sounds pretty punk rock what's to deal with that and he's like people will hate you if you do this and you're like that's exactly that sounds pretty punk rock and then you get in here and you're like whoa this is very punk rock and then every part of the

religion people are like why would you do that this is crazy what are you up to i'm going to kill you over this and you go seems like i'm doing the most punk rock thing everyone's mad at me all the time. Did you encounter Aussies who knew you were Catholic and wanted to pray with you? They saw your story online,

that sort of thing? I saw a bunch. I prayed with a bunch of people. I was informed that praying is illegal. You cannot publicly pray for someone because if they're gay,

you could go to jail. Oh my gosh. That's a real law that was passed while I was there. I also met several priests who did not wear their collars and told me because they didn't want

to like cause a ruckus like they had been a... I hope you told them to cause a ruckus and to not just wear their collar but to please wear the cassock. I honestly, I'm with you there. I feel as a convert so uncomfortable telling priests anything like,

hey, this is what I think about what Europe. But since you paid to come and see me, I'm gonna. Right, I should. But I feel for them too. Like, imagine like, I'm gonna go out with my parishioner. Listen, I would like to first say that I think all preach should wear a collar all the time if you're out in public

and I saw someone hassling a priest. I would be involved. Leave it at that just in case you want to go back to Australia. I would involve myself in a very real way. But like I understand, you know, also just being like, I just want to come to a show with my parishioners or my family or my friends. And I don't want to be hassled and harassed.

And I also don't want to be like make it about me or whatever. And so there's fear and anxiety and whatever. So no judgment. No, I, but also, like, come through, bro. We need you. Come, like, we need you to be out here in your uniform on the front lines, letting people know. I wish there was a layperson's uniform.

Honestly, like, I'm like, dude. I think it's the giant scapula that hangs out of the back of your shirt. Yeah, yeah, right. But, like, truly, I wish there was, like, a casick, like, almost like, I'm out of my mind, like, this is just a part of every married man who's like, could have joined a religious order. I could have done it, you know, but I'm like, I want to be out there. I want people to witness the faith in an authentic, like, organic way. And priests are the most organic, like, whoa, that's a freaking priest, you know? I love that, especially in the cassock.

People go, if you got a choice, if you, you can wear a cassock and you don't, you and I would wear a cassock if we could. One, dude. Yeah. Yeah, I would for sure. It looks awesome. Firstly, Neil from the Matrix War I. That's awesome. Secondly, when people see a priest and they go, whoa, is that guy like some kind of crusader? I'm like, yes, he is, actually. I think part of it is the peer pressure from within the diocese

where other priests look at them and think you think you're better than us or why you're doing that, which is unfortunate. But anyway, we support you, Kassik-wearing priest. I like what you said earlier about the guy who accidentally became the boomer by telling the Gen Z kids to do conservatism the way he thinks conservatism should be done, if I understood correctly. Or to do liberalism the way he thinks liberalism

should be done. I'm sorry. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But I see that in the church. I remember I was giving a talk in Canada. This is under the pontificate of Pope Benedict the 16th and the priest were saying how out of touch Pope Benedict the 16th was

in trying to promote Latin and the Latin Mass. And I thought, oh, the irony. irony. Was the camera on me? You were talking. You had such a lovely voice too. Could the camera be, did you see that? I rolled my eyes so hard. I almost did a backflip. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, but I thought it's so sad because this middle-aged dude has no clue that he's the one out of touch, how ironic that is. And I wanted to ask you, because you come from a diocese where you very unfortunately had a tyrannical bishop try to suppress the Latin Mass. What was that like? In, it was, insane. It's crazy to wake up one day and be like, what? My diocese is trending? What's going on?

You know, like, I think most people are like even vaguely aware of who their bishop is. They just want to go to mass and confession and sort of get involved with the, you know, the life teen or like whatever group or Bible study and just like plug along. Yeah, it's hot enough. We don't need you attacking off. For real. And then one day you're like, and now I have to know all this. And then, like, yeah, they shuffled all the priests around and the diocese, they did a bunch of stuff. He tried to make it so he couldn't say St. Michael's Prayer at the end of Mass.

Why would you do that? He said, the reasoning was, and I'm paraphrasing, and God forgive me, I don't want to misquote or misrepresent a bishop, even if I don't agree with them. Yeah. But I think he said that it may make people feel that the mass itself wasn't sufficient. Oh, for goodness.

And that we need more. Firstly, we always need more. We always need more prayer. We always need more mass. We always need more euchar. But if it was that change isolated, we'd go, okay, I don't agree with you, but fair enough. But he was also saying things like you can't, again, I don't want to misunderstand it. But even in the nervous order, he was trying to make, you can't kneel to receive you.

No kneelers, kneelers removed, no kneeling. Was it things like large candles? I don't think on the tongue. I think no candles at all. I think it was, I think that he also like was like, was like, we need to be lighter on the dress code, which, listen, I love my parish. The people in my parish are like wonderful people who have received my family, like so beautifully and been so understanding, kind of got married there, but our dress code, something has to be done. Like, it's very, it's

already, hello? We just have like, I just feel like we have girls coming from like volleyball practice straight to Sunday Mass. Please be here. This is why everyone in your diocese should start attending the Latin Mass. Yeah, I know. I've, and listen, I'm agree. We, we, have Latin Mass around. Even just as a sign of solidarity with the persecuted Catholics. Right. Right. I know that many, many people have been kneeling. I kneel every time until I will be asked not to. Yeah. And of course, you know, at that point, I'll just simply stand. But I'm doing everything I can personally. But I'm trying to be involved as a lay person and just sort of stay in my lane. Because again, criticizing the clergy as a new convert is straight. I already feel like

I'm out of my bounds because I converted and my conversion was very powerful for people. It's heck, it was powerful for me. I get it. And I think because of the witness of my faith and the consequences I suffered as a result that gave me a lot of goodwill with Catholics who were then like, you've been Catholic for a year, come speak at my parish. And I'm flattered and I think that it's been fruitful and good. But there are times where I have that imposter syndrome where I'll be watching a Trent Horn video

and he's like, don't give celebrity converts any attention. And also new converts don't make YouTube channels or talk about the faith. Just enjoy yourself. Like, and then I'm like, he's talking directly to me and he knows who I am. He's definitely not. And he hates me. And that's why he won't follow me back on Instagram. You know, like, and then I get out of, and so then I get annoyed with myself.

So then I'm, we have controversy in my diocese. And I'm like, I'm saying the most lay person, lay person. person possible, so. Well, what, what ended up happening there? Because he obviously got a ton of backlash. I don't know. So I know that he's a liberal, he's a liberal bishop. And I think that my diocese is the largest in the country.

And I think that he took that to mean liberal policies were in the South. The South is very Protestant. And they're not just Protestant. They're sort of like a big hats in church Protestant, which to their credit is, the most fun Protestantism, big, loud, fun, dressed up songs in church. Yeah. We're Catholic. We like that too. We love singing for the Lord and breaking it down and dressing up. In Latin. But also, like, but in general, like worship concerts are sick. That's a really cool way to get involved with God and the community. And like, but anyway, so I think he thinks,

like, I'm going to, I have liberalized this parish. This is, or this diocese, this is the most popular diocese. This is what they want. And he actually is getting it wrong. The reason the diocese is the most popular is because we're in the South. The South is wildly religious. A lot of these Protestants are looking for more. They're converting. No shade to our Protestant brothers and sisters. It's just how it's going. And our diocese is growing immensely because we're in the South and we have religious, good, God-fearing people who are looking for the truth. Good priests. And good priests and people who are just looking to, you know, be united with God. And he's just like, oh, and this is because of liberalism. And then so he's like doubling down.

And it's like, it's actually because of the conservatism. It's actually because of the tradition and because of all these other things. Like, dude, we have adoration one day a week. And it's like badly, it wasn't very well organized. And people were, I would ask people everywhere I go, like, where's adoration? Why don't we do more? And they're like, well, no one, we don't want to have to like have people sign up to protect the Eucharist. And it's like, you know that every dude's, my wife was talking to this.

And she's like, you know every dude's dream is to die protecting the Eucharist, right? My wife like told the lady like that we're talking to it. She's like, you know every dude wants to literally like, if you just. put a sign-up sheet, every guy in the world is going to be like, I'll guard it, I'll do it, I'm the guard, do you have a uniform for me, can I have a gun? What about a sword? Is it

okay if there's a samurai sword? You know, like immediately they would have like nine things, we're there, dude. I want it, but they were like, you know, dragging their feet and they changed it to like this other thing, boom, everyone's going, everyone wants

it, you know, people want more. There is a stereotype in the church, unfortunately, that people who go to traditional masses or desire traditional piety look down their nose to everybody else. And I understand that there's people in every group who do that.

But it seems to me that I see the opposite happening. I see people who go to Novus Auto churches, people like this bishop and others are not going to speak for the bishop himself because I don't know anything about him except for those implementations, but who speak very disparagingly of people who desire the tradition of the church,

who desire to celebrate Holy Mass the way it has been done for 1,500 years before the revolutions after the Second Vatican Council. Yeah. And they're like, I just really want, I love my family, and I think this is beautiful, and I wanna worship God, like, what I do with my body at the liturgy matters.

Yeah. I don't, like, and anyone, every, we all know this, like when you proposed to your wife, you can tell me about this in a second. I presume he didn't just stand before her, like a man at a post office buying stamps, to paraphrase Peter Kostnevsky. Like, we kneel down. what we do with our body matters,

and we just want to do that before the Eucharist and to be punished for that, or to be told we're naughty for that is bizarre. I prostrate myself when I pray. And I've started just to do it in public. I don't even care. So full on, like, I'll just get down on my knees and prostrate myself and pray,

and I'll usually have a rosary or chakki. Did I pronounce that right? It means not in Russian, chotky. Shot key, yeah. So I, and I'll, or a hand cross, and I'll put that, and I'll pray, and I'll do this in public at the, I pray at the airport all the time. And people will be like, whoa. And but people will ask, be like, what religion are you? I'm like, I'm Catholic.

And so I've talked about this publicly. And I had other Catholics be like, don't kneel down when you, don't prostrate yourself. When you pray, you look like a Muslim. I'm going to do it harder now. Thank you. Yeah. But I also want to be like, hey, I need you to read a book. like any book about any Christian like what are you talking about don't prostrate my

they took that from us brother what are you talking about we've been doing this Byzantine prayer mats are like we've been having them like what I will lose my mind so there's that like weird like oh so you think so you're oh so you're super fancy you're embarrassing you know and it's like I get a little bit of that but I don't know I think that mostly people just want reverence. It's not even like, hey, listen, the Latin Mass is my favorite. I love it. I want it.

But like also, really, I just want reverence. Like, I want there to be a patch of ground on this planet where I can go to and have my desire for God taken seriously. And I'm patronized with, hey there. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Thanks for coming. I know the sports game was on today. That's my American accent. You like it?

It's real. It's really. I want something demanded of me. It drove me into a fury right now. Your accent was so good. And you do a very good accent of an American guy who's punchable. Thank you, I suppose. Well, I think that's what you're going for.

But I like, yeah, it makes me crazy. It makes me crazy. I just, I'm with you. Because I think the most affected I've ever been was in Novice Ordo Mass. The most affected? What does that mean? Affected like during the mass. Okay.

Like the most intense. intense religious experiences I've ever had have been in a novice ordo. You know, and obviously, I think the most intense religious experience I've ever had is an adoration, but I've had beautiful, really intense, like in reverent novic soros.

Like, I love a low mass. Like, you know, we got the kneeler. We've got the readings. Not a lot of singing. A little bit of chanting. A priest who's incredibly reverend, like where it feels like, Oh, we are here to worship.

Yeah. This is all Christ the whole way through. It's very serious. Alter servers who are intense and take, you know, and then no extraordinary ministers of the Eucharist. Just straight. That to me is perfect. I don't.

So like when people are like, oh, you need the Latin Mass. Like, no, I just need reverence. Can we have some of that? And then you have. So I'm not even asking for the Latin Mass. And then you have a bishop who's like, not only no to the Latin Mass, but no to the other thing too.

And you're like, what? Come on. I can't say this. It's like St. Michael's Prayer or kneel down. This is wild. I don't understand, I just don't understand why so many are committed to that losing strategy.

I made a post about this recently. It feels like the church hates itself and wants itself to die. Here's what I mean. I was in Europe. And it was after three months, just got back. back and Croatia was phenomenal. A lot of faith in Croatia. But I was in Austria. And no doubt

there's good people in Austria, good Catholics in Austria, but I'd go to these different churches and you've got these glorious churches that were built hundreds of years ago. Yeah, yeah. But then they plaster them with these childish posters or advertisements for upcoming concerts or religious art that has never inspired anyone at any time. And it feels like self-hatred. It feels like you're embarrassed to be Catholic. And so you're trying to change it. And you're trying to change it. And we can tell you're trying to change it, by the emphasis you're putting on these weird aesthetics. I was in Vienna.

My wife and I went to this glorious Gothic church, which was locked and so we couldn't go into pray, but we could pay money for a light show that they do at that church. Look it up online, it's a real thing where they, yeah, lights, who knows, smoke machines. Yeah, they just, and I'm sure it's very beautiful. You go into the church, you sit down,

and they talk about creation through displaying lights all over the cathedral or something like this, but it just seemed to me that, oh, we hate ourselves, and we're embarrassed to be ourselves and we're trying to make ourselves something that we aren't, that's what it felt like. So when you talk about a losing strategy,

I'm saying the same thing, I think. Why do you hate yourself? You don't have to hate, it reminds me, and this is the analogy I use that upset everybody, and maybe it'll upset you, I don't know. There are examples of beautiful women. Most people aren't beautiful, right? But there are some people who are beautiful,

and then they make themselves ugly. This is clearly something that's happening. Yeah, the actress who plays Wednesday, they shaved her eyebrows and that's like her deal now. These women, they tattooed themselves, they chopped their hair off, they die at blue, they stay, they put piercings throughout their face. That is, you're clearly uglier now.

Yes, and that is, and I think, and now maybe there's a multitude of reasons where people do this, maybe it's the desire to not have attention, maybe it's punk rock, fair enough. But I also think another reason is, is self-hatred that I don't love myself. And if I did, I would become beautiful again and I see the church in different instances hating itself

and I wanna invite us to stop. I'm with you. I agree with everything you said. It doesn't offend me in any way, shape, or form. People uglify themselves because they want to mark themselves as a thing so that other people can seek them out. It's the same way, like, if you're a gay man, you dress a certain way to attract other gay men so that they can kind of know, right? You're on the hunt, as it were. And I think that most of people's self-expression when it comes to uglifying themselves is, like,

like, hey, I have the right opinions. Come over here. This is me. You can talk to me about it. I'm safe. I'm one of the good ones. That's like their deal. Okay. And I think that's where that's coming from. Okay. But in any case, the church just trying to destroy itself. It's a testament to the church of strength that we've been trying to destroy ourselves off and on for 2,000 years. And God, it's like, no, you can't. Well, because my fear is we're talking into a rootless generation, right? A generation that doesn't have any history that is sort of, maybe the millennials,

we severed ourselves off from that. Don't trust authority. Don't be proud of your traditions or your heritage or your race or anything. You know, whether you came from Italy or England or Africa or wherever. And so now we're just like floating through the void and we realize that's no way to live

and now we're desirous of tradition again. I want to belong to something. be part of a larger epic tale. And so now when we evangelize, when people listen to Pines with Aquinas and they wanna come into the church, we're looking for the beauty of tradition. And then we're like, why did we give that up?

Why did we sell that? Can I tell you a metaphor that I'm thinking of that my brain is just putting into my head? So there's this giant land mass and boomers are on the landmass. This is human history and tradition. We've, you know, we've kept parents good enough, the kids are secure,

that almost everyone is expressing themselves authentically. So when someone is weird, it's authentic and that doesn't break society. So weirdos are good. They're an expression of authentic, you know, whatever. So things are going well. Then boomers, the greatest generation happens, and boomers need to separate themselves and define themselves. Everything is easy for them.

Their parents saved the world, yada, yada, yada. It's a lot of pressure. So boomers go insane. They have the easiest of anyone who's ever had it in society ever. Boomers won history, right? American boomers or Western boomers specifically. So they go, we don't want anything to do with you. And they detach themselves with poles with us, the generations they make attached to them.

So they separate themselves completely to define their own identity. So they're apart from the whole. So every single other person in history is over here on this floating island. boomers all separate themselves we're going to create a new world in this new world things are going to be even easier and better and sleeker and we're all going to have houses we have all this money and they raise us without all this stuff over here they don't do the best job you know but i'm not saying all boomers are bad but we all kind of agree what a weird generation that was and they kind of raise us weird and the world is weird now because of it right so that we we all

have it easy, but not as easy as our parents. We're the first generation and then the generation after us, the generation after it, for it to get worse, right? Okay. I mean, I don't know how much I agree with all these premises. Sure, sure. I think I've had it easier than my parents did in some regard, but not in what mattered maybe. Right. I think, I bestowed an identity and a guy was, you know, we had a family that lived close by and things like that. I think I had it easier than my parents, for sure. My parents had a go of it, right? They had hard lives. but still I I we're here like we've separated ourselves culturally we're going into the future now right that's like kind of the deal and as we're all doing this we're like well we don't like the boomers you know you guys separated yourselves because you had it so easy and you needed your own identity we're going to do ours push off from you but instead of all of us pushing off from them together we all just swam off in different directions ultimate freedom ultimate freedom I'm out of here, who's coming with me? And then we just swam out together. And every little group in

pocket of millennials and zillenials and everyone, we all just went out into the water. Well, it turns out if you just swim out for freedom, you're free, but you drown eventually. Right? And we're alone and we can't help each other. And so we're all out here just drowning because we wanted freedom and we all left the island. Was the island not good? It wasn't good. It should have been attached to the big one. But like, We're like two problems removed and hurting ourselves. Does that make, that's like truly how I feel. So it's like, okay, so you get an island and then maybe the boat is of the boo, but I don't even know what a boomer is.

I know people use it pejoratively. I'd love you to explain it. It's the generation that raised us. Yeah, but I don't know what's wrong with them. Why is everyone always critical of boom? I actually don't know. I'm not making a statement. They had the, so financially you could have just had a minimum wage job and bought a house.

College costed, like a 20th of your income. was crazy you know like so it's not you're saying it's not their fault that they had it easy no not at all their parents worked incredibly hard and then their parents said we gave you we won world war two we did everything vietnam is over boom okay live your life or like you know they fought all these war they did it you so we fought all the wars have all the peace have all the money whatever and then boomers were just like kind of it's the tyler durden thing where gen x he says we uh we work jobs we hate to buy things we don't need to impress people we hate yeah we have no great war ours is a spiritual war okay uh chuck pollinick it's a pretty good book but uh fight club um in a really interesting

book considered chuck pollinick is a gay man so okay so i'm thinking okay you get an island and maybe the okay then the boomer is that what's the boat yeah yeah they remove they leave the island yeah yeah yeah and then we're all either in dinghies right who are slowly drowning yeah yeah or we're swimming from the dinghies. Or we swam out. And so what does the island represent them? Because it seems like it's a lot more of a stable, grounded thing. The island represents safety.

It represents tradition. It represents humanity. And it represents like striving towards. The natural proper way to live, maybe attached to the earth. Right. Right. Right. Exactly. It's stable.

It works. It's there. And it always has worked. Wow. And, you know, and so human flourishing is on that island. This would be an amazing short story, right? Right. Well, you don't use the language of boomers or millennials.

You just have this group of people who are done with the island. They set off to give their children a better life. Their children have only ever known the boat. Right. The children, they can get into dinghies. Then there's not enough room in those dinghies, so people have to swim. So, so many of us are just... And then you've got some people who are trying to swim back to the island.

That's us. Okay. We are swimming back to the island. And a bunch of us are now making it. We're in 2025. So many of us have swum back to the island. And we're on the island going, you guys got to get back over here. And there's people in dinghies, and they're like, actually, but we want to do this.

And we're like, listen to me. You are eating rations and you are sunburned and nothing is going on. And that dinghy, you're going to die. On this island, there's a lot of, we have a chucky cheese. We have a freaking David Busset. Like, we got video games. We've got pizza. We've got animated rats.

We are killing it over here. You got to get on the island, you know. To extend the analogy, though, you could understand that some people who have swum back to the island have become obsessed inordinately, which I suppose is superfluous, just obsessed with certain activities that happen on the island, right? So if we're like, we didn't take care of our bodies, now my entire life is going to be about the gym and this is, this island has this to offer. Yes. So you can get weird on the island if you obsess over a particular part of the island. The island. Or like I'm going to go out into the farm and raise all my own livestock.

That's great. Yeah, yeah, your entire life and everything becomes about that specific thing. Is that possible? Exactly. I think so. So you're picking parts of the island you like, but why the island works is because it's an ecosystem. And the ecosystem points towards one thing. And when society does the best, what are we all pointing towards God? Yeah. Even, even eras that are culturally away from us that we don't agree with when they're pointed towards a higher power, like even the Islamic Golden Age, when, they were united and trying to seek God, they were doing the best they ever did. Yeah. Okay. When we were united and seeking God, we were doing the best we ever did. When that church was in the Holy Roman Empire, it was probably doing a lot better than when it had the light show.

You know what I mean? It's also insane to be like, this church was built by the Holy Roman Empire. People, this was the place. Like Austria was really important. and now there's a light show there, I can't get over it. It makes me, was it even good? Did you play it? I certainly wouldn't have gone to the light show.

I was disgusted and walked away sad. It's so crazy to be like, I want to encounter God in this building. And they were like, what about encountering the Blue Man group? What about that? Like, no, dude. I don't want that. Yeah, wow, that's really fascinating. Truthly is a groundbreaking Catholic AI app built to help you know, live,

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would have more in common with my grandparents than I did. In other words, they're taking interest in things that maybe my grandparents were telling my parents and me to be interested in, but we weren't. Yes. Whether that be working with their hands or just being a normal human being with a normal marriage. I could not agree more. And it's insane to go online and see like 21-year-olds being like, I reject hookup culture.

Yes, that's the stuff. And they're not even Christian. Yeah. This is just pervasive in the culture in general, you know, not even on top of all the converts and stuff. are you seeing because we're all in our little bubbles or at least we're afraid that we are

so I'm not sure how much of this is true are you seeing people not just turn against hookup culture who are secular are people who are secular are they turning against pornography as well I think so but I just think that it's so ubiquitous

it's so ubiquitous I think that it's like one of those it's like it's like smoking was in the 90s everyone but smoking's coming back so that's what's wild that's really interesting My wife uses nicotine patches for health. What is happening?

Dude, I've heard so many good things about nicotine for health. I'm like, is this an island thing? Are we back on the island? Will we right? Dude, were we wrong to demonize Mowbrus? I know. Just for YouTube, yes, we were. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I think that maybe smoking cigarettes is probably bad for you. I think nicotine and however you, you know, I think there are ways to get it that aren't as bad for you, probably. Yeah, I think that's right. I think it's fine. So, but like, in the 90s, we knew smoking was bad. We started the bad smoking campaign to stop smoking.

Everyone was kind of like, yeah, yeah, yeah. We know it's bad, but we're all addicted. And they just kept smoking. And it just took a while for that truth to permeate the culture to the point that we just weaned everyone out. And now smoking went from being something that nine out of every 10 people did to one at every 10 people, right? I think that's pornography now.

I think we're finally to the point where nationally or worldwide, the conversation is like, yeah, we know this is bad. We know it sucks and it's gross and it's evil. We know it's gross. I can't stop doing it, but I know it's bad. And I think that 10 years from now, smoking will be like porn where we've dismantled this, you know, trillion dollar industry and made them a shadow of them of their former selves. I really believe we can do it. That would be good. I hope.

But again, it's so insidious and it has its hooks in so many people. Yeah. Something I thought was cool five minutes ago, but maybe now I'm not sure, is people quitting alcohol. All right, let me explain what I mean. Obviously, if somebody has a problem with alcohol,

all the power to them if they decide to quit. Right. And clearly there's a lot to be said about the dangers of alcohol and how it's essentially poison that may make you feel good, but will probably just ruin your night's sleep and make you make bad decisions later on. I'm fine with that.

But I don't know. It's, I don't know if this is just true of everything that things kind of gain a following until they peak and then it's cool to go against them. And maybe that's true of every single thing in the world. Yeah, it does feel like that's what everyone does. Because right now when people tell me about how they've quit alcohol, like I know you quit alcohol and I think that's awesome.

I really do. And I really have a lot of respect for people who choose to do it. I know it's difficult. But I don't know. The cooler it's becoming to quit alcohol, the more I'm like, I think you should, I think we should drink alcohol.

I think we need to bring back beer. But I don't know if I'm really saying that as a sort of reaction to what is now annoying me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It may be. It may be. I have tried really hard. I think that when I was young, I had this thing where I was incredibly punk. Like, I had a punk mindset.

I don't think I was actually punk rock. I wasn't good at it. And I cared about a lot of stuff. Punks don't care. That is one thing that people are like, oh, punk rock is about caring. It's like, it's about not caring. That's why they do hard drugs and stuff. People say punk rock is about caring. Yeah, I know. Oh, does that mean like your... About politics and stuff. Like, it's about caring about people, man.

It's like, no, punk rock is about opting out of society, you idiot. But like, there are parts and subcultures of punk rock that are about caring. So I'll grant them that. But so like, I forgot what you just said. Drinking alcohol. Drinking alcohol. So like, I have no idea where I was going to go with it now. I've completely lost my train. Well, anyway, for those who were watching, one of queer alcohol, good for you. I wanted to ask you about the, it's kind of old news now, but the American Eagle ad with, what's her name? Sidney Sweeney.

Sydney Sweeney, you commented on this and hell broke loose, what happened? Dude, I keep getting in trouble lately. I don't know what's going on. I think that's going to continue. I think that's okay. Yeah, I think that the more I publicly am like, hey, this thing seems obvious to me

and then people like, they're like, it's not obvious and you're actually evil. It's okay. So what, I actually don't know what you said. What did you say and what happened? So I said, so a bunch of the Sydney-Sweeney ad came out. Yeah. It's funny. It's real quick. If I had have seen that ad and hadn't have heard the reaction, I'd have went, oh, that's an unfortunately immodest commercial. But when I saw the insanity rage around her, like Warpy Goldberg said it was racist. As soon as I heard that, I'm like, now I'm on Sweeney's side. Right. How is this possible? So American Eagle makes a

very overtly sexual ad it's bad it's literally just every ad ever it's a normal ad like what that's what they do but she's in the jeans and then it's sidney suini has good genes it'll be like a voice kind of like a burger king commercial where they bite the burger you know it's all sexy or whatever and then like something something about sidney swiney swiney has good genes or like the traits your eye color is determined by your parents your genetic whatever city suenie has good genes basically the joke is that like you know it's just like it's like saying tell your parents i said thanks you're gorgeous like that's a pickup line weirdos say right yeah so that's the joke is the jeans or whatever so people saw this and they're like in this climate in 2025 you're gonna have a hot blonde white

woman and you're going to say that she has good genes yeah this is eugenics oh my and i want you to be like so my my point was you're insane you're saying nothing this is isn't happening. This is crazy conspiracy theory stuff. And then I made a TikTok being like, firstly, there was this singer Doja Cat and then Lizzo. The two different singers. Yeah, she's that overweight black woman. Didn't she? I don't know who the other ones is. I think she's lost some weight. So I love the people are like, she's a big girl and we love big girls. And then she loses weight and they're like, congrats, you're beautiful. We love girls. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm like, okay, sure. Oh, good for her. Good. Yeah, truly good for her. And then Doja Cat. They made fun of

Sidney Sweeney. Hey, she's a celebrity too. Make fun of her. If you don't like her ad and you, so they're basically doing like, Doja Cat made a video where she was like doing a Southern accent where she was like, when your parents are together and that means you have good jeans. Like she's trying to like make fun of it. Yeah. Because she thinks it's bad or whatever. So I said, I saw the ad and there was all this outrage and I made a joke where I said, I saw the ad. I'm with you. I'm outraged. This is a vicious attack on ugly women. This is unfortunate. I stand with ugly women everywhere. If you're mad about this, I'm with you. They can't do this to you. And then I was like, also now they're upset. Like you're upset.

You're not working out. No one wins. Like I was pretty, I was like, it was a joke. It's a cheeky joke. Now, is this sort of the one where, you know, how Babylon B would sometimes present an article and everyone would think they're serious? Were there people seeing this thinking you were serious? Yeah. Okay. Yeah, yeah. Which is fine. People can think I'm serious and get mad at me. That's funny to me. But a lot of people who understood what I was doing was like, this isn't it. Firstly, you're making fun of black women. I'm making fun of famous millionaires. I don't.

Who cares that they're black women. They're famous millionaires with all this power making fun of another famous millionaire. And I'm a person in the public space who makes fun of public people. This is, this could, the order of operations couldn't be more correct here. But because I'm a white man, they were like, you can't criticize Lizzo. Lizzo's doing better than me you know what I mean like she has all the money in the fame what are you talking about

of course punching I punch up at Lizzo yeah you know and not just because she's the size of a house and that's how it works boom got her you know what I'm like but for real though congratulations on losing the weight Lizzo I'm very proud of you but like it sucks it's so dumb so people

got mad at me and they were they were mad at me calling me racist whatever whatever that's fine I figured that would happen But then people were like, you are a disgusting Nazi. You're going down the alt-right pipeline. Becoming Catholic has changed you completely. Now I see that you are for eugenics and you are like, people were like, you're a full on Nazi.

And I was like, do you really think the American Eagle ad was promoting eugenics? Like, what is their plan? Firstly, women, these are pants for women that shop at American Eagle. American Eagle is going to sell their pants to mostly white women. How do white women vote mostly? Yeah, very liberal. Very liberal. So you think American Eagle was like, hey, y'all, I know how we can sell to these people.

And they're like, we're going to do racism. And they're like, outright racism. We're going to do secret racism. We're going to do secret science racism, eugenics style. And they're like, how are we going to do that? And they're like, we're going to say that Sidney-Sweeney has good genes. and racists are going to love it. And they're like, but most of the women who buy our clothes are not racist.

And they're like, we can get these boys in them overalls wearing these girl jeans tonight. Like that's, is that what you think you thought American Eagle? Like, that's their big plan to make millions of dollars. You know, it's insane. American Eagle didn't do that. And then people would, what was the argument? I would point that out, like, this is insane. What would they stand to gain?

There's no monetary. incentive this is capitalism they're not doing that they're they're not an ideologue american ego has black people in their advertisements on their website right now their owner is jewish explain to me what you think it's and then they would be like well even if they didn't do it on purpose they should have known in this climate that's the end argument where you're like right they have black people all over their website and their advertisements and working at their stores their CEO is jewish their clientele is liberal. They're, you know, overwhelmingly, uh, there's no possible way they thought Nazism would sell. There's not enough people in the United States. Like, what are you doing?

And then they think they go, well, they should have known better. I'm mad. Wow. And so I just have to absorb all this. So I mean, as a new Catholic, how do you navigate this? Because I don't know about you, but when people criticize me publicly, I really do try to take a moment to go, all right, did I do something wrong here. And if I did, I don't want to keep, I don't want to keep being wrong just because it's cool to double down. I really don't want to do that. Right. How have you navigated that in your own life as you get this backlash? And how did you navigate this one? And I mean, are you losing events because of this? Like, uh, no, I am getting harassed because of it. I am getting harassed for sure because of it. And people sometimes, like, reach out to people who

give me work and complain or whatever. But, um, I haven't lost any work since my conversion. When I converted, I did. But since then, it's been fine that I know of. I'm sure. I would be sure I've lost work without knowing it. Dude, 100%. Where people were like, I'm going to invite, because I used to get invited to other comics events all the time. Yeah. Other comics would be like, do, we're doing this cool thing in L.A. You could fly out if you want to do 20 minutes on it. It'll be such a good time. And like, no one invites me to stuff like that anymore, you know. Did you know when you converted publicly that this would happen? Yeah, I did. I thought my career would end.

Yeah? Yeah. Yeah. I thought I would just go back to working in a factory or something. Really? Yeah, 100%. That's really punk rock. Yeah, because it feels like in, I don't know, you could tell me in mainstream comedic spaces,

you're allowed to be conservative, but you got to be silly conservative. You have to be like drunk uncle conservative. You have to be uncle at Thanksgiving conservative where you're, where everyone's just like, Oh, Jeff is crazy. You can't be like, um, principled and conservative. And you definitely can't be conservative and religious. Conservatives are allowed to not be religious. As soon as you add the religion, people get really mad.

And religious allowed to be not conservative. Exactly. Exactly. You can't combine them. As soon as you combine them, you're a Nazi. Yeah, then you're an enemy. You're the enemy. Yeah.

So that's really interesting. because before when I had my show and I was promoting socialism as a means to communism and I was very interested in leftist politics, I was, for instance, like with this Gavin Newsom thing. I got so many comments telling me I didn't understand my own argument that I had to call Josiah actually and be like, can I have a reality check? Am I crazy? And he's like, no. You're not crazy. They're just talking past you. They're not seeing your point. They're not listening to what you're not saying and also what you're saying they're just talking at you and i was like oh thank god yeah you know it's helpful to have people like that in your life yeah yeah you know we'll shoot you straight right right

so it's like okay good but like still i mean it's the amount of of just like people piling in and acting like that it's just like what do i do with this yeah you know yeah someone did that to me recently when i made that comment about beautiful women who lop their hair off dire blue and tattooed themselves into oblivion. That was the language I used. Right. And someone said, the fact that you think a woman with short hair is ugly. I'm like, that is, are you trying to misunderstand me? Or yeah, a woman gets a tattoo and you think she's ugly. Right. I didn't say any of these things. So I don't know how to interact with you. Yeah. Yeah. It feels like you're not trying to understand what I said. They're, they have an imaginary guy that they're mad at. And then he is attached to every opinion that is

in the opposite camp of them. So, like, there's a conservative bad guy who, like, wears a Nazi uniform and he runs around and he's, like, attacking people in the night, whatever. And he lives in their head. And when you say, like, oh, yeah, I just don't, I don't think abortion is good.

That, he says that. And so now you're him. Or when you say, like, oh, man, maybe women, it's just crazy that so many beautiful women think it's a good idea to get a lot of tattoos, which even if you're, pro tattoo is a thing to say it's interest like oh a lot of women are getting tattoos they they hear that and then they would go that's what the bad man in my head says yeah and so you now

you're him i saw this meme and it said you know how they nobody and then middle-aged white women and it was just a tattoo of like floral floral tattoos it's like yeah that is really interesting that every middle-aged woman i don't know if they're white or black or both or everything are getting those but that's just that's an interesting thing to point out My generation got a ton of them, you know, and like, because tattoos are cultural. So, like, the generations of people are going to look like the other generation. The barbed wire tattoos. I'm sure that's coming back.

Oh, yeah. No, the barbed wire is a Gen Z thing. Okay. They all have it. So it's come back. Now it's old. It already did it. It's old.

It's lame now. Actually, I'm not joking. It is dorky to have barbed wire. And, yeah, it's like two strands of barbed wire. Okay. So, like, it doesn't even wrap around. That's the thing. And that's, that's dorky now.

You go, yeah, yeah, cool tattoo, bro. Wow, it's a lot to keep up with. I know. So here's how I've navigated it. I've stopped keeping up on purpose. Obviously, I'm like plugged in because I like music and I like this and like that. So I'm like around. But I realized as I was converting and stuff, like, all this is aesthetic.

So what's important? And then I was like, oh, the God, like, I'll just do, I'll just be Catholic. And so once you're authentically Catholic, then expressing myself becoming. this like, well, I could do anything I want as long as it falls into the purview of what I'm morally allowed. And so then self-expression has become really, really fun and interesting to me. And so I'm like, dang, I wish more people could get to this authentic place where they feel so secure in themselves that they don't need any external stuff or whatever. And so all self-expression then becomes wildly authentic. That's, and that's, and that's,

God's promise, right? Come to me and I'll give you, I'll help you be the most authentic version of yourself. And so like in God, then you express yourself as authentically as possible. How have, and maybe you don't even know this because I don't know if people talk to you about this, but how have comedians reacted to your conversion? Or would you not know because if they were against it, they wouldn't talk to you about it anyway? They wouldn't talk to me about it. I think that I'm a pretty confrontational person

and other people are afraid to be in a confrontation with me because I'm comfortable with it. So other comics avoid that. But I've had other comics, like, mention things to me or sort of make statements that are supposed to be qualifying where they'll be like, they'll do this, they'll be like, someone, like, will accuse me of something. Like, let's say, like, I get a comment on YouTube.

Like, I'll collab with. another comedian. Someone will be like, this guy hates gay people. And then another friend who's a comic, who I haven't talked to for a while, will be like, I know Shane. And I know despite his religious whatever and his change of life, I know that he's a kind of person who would never hate gay people. And it's such a silly thing to say. It is. So, but what they're kind of doing there is being like you and you and you don't right oh and you don't like they'll kind of like that's the vibe where they they'll give a qualifying statement like I know Shane and he would never do this and they kind of look at me like what do you believe and I want to be like yes I don't hate people

bro what is wrong with you like if I was going to hate people it would be weird to hate a guy for liking other men sexually right I don't know why I would devote any attention to that right it's so so like there's this weird like I think that um I think what's going on is that we were in a moment culturally where everyone was very smarmy because of the atheists and everyone is like, and I understand religion and Christianity and now Christianity is having this big comeback. Catholicism is leading the way and Catholicism is wildly complex, intimidating, interesting, crazy to look at, a lot going on. And I think that a lot of normal people are like, oh, so I don't know anything about faith actually. You know?

Yeah. I thought Christopher Hitchens told me everything I needed. Right. People will be like, um, and the, you know, people will be like, didn't Jesus say to turn the other cheek? And then you'll be like, Jesus also told us apostles to buy swords. And they'll be like, so I don't know what to believe now. And it's like, it's almost like you never looked into it and you're just repeating the thing the atheists say to make Christians who aren't educated feel bad. But like, so there's that, that whole deal. So I don't know. I don't know what, uh, I'm losing my train of thought yet again. So you got married

I did how was that It was incredible Good yeah Like all the sacraments it was It you know It was a big deal And it like deeply affected me It was a long time coming

We were engaged for like Eight months or something Longer than we wanted to be We wanted to be engaged for like two months You know But the church and her wisdom went We've seen this happen before No

The church went Ah old up Old up And so I had to work on an annulment which was, you know, made slowed down by the fact that certain people involved are enemies of the church. And so they purposefully made it more difficult than it needed to be. Oh, because they were seeking information from your friends and family? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Because the church. So for those of you who don't know, it would be interesting if you got this far into this podcast and didn't know how Catholicism works. But if not, and I'm sure there's lots of people. When you get married in Catholicism, I affectionately call it being super married. Yeah. Because I grew up with the, the secular no-fault divorce version of marriage as the version of marriage that you seek, which is to say a legal contract that is incredibly temporary and has almost no consequences to using. Actually just made a YouTube video where I thought a bunch of people would be mad at me about my opinions on marriage.

And a few secular people were like, no, I agree with you. where I was like no fault divorce is bad there's no even no point in getting married being married is simply like a temporary legal contract you it's it's insurance you're getting married for insurance you know and so anyway when you're married in a Catholicism you are married you are not leaving that marriage no escape hatches but death yeah yeah yeah yeah it's like uh you know I wish I knew more about World War II tanks. It's like being in a Sherman on the Eastern Front or so.

No, there were no sure. Actually, no, there were Germans on the Eastern Front because of the Lend-Leese program. So actually, that's a correct statement. It doesn't matter. Listen, I've been watching a lot of World War II documentaries. I really wanted to sneak some tank talk. You did it. I got no idea what's happening. I'd like you to text me

some links to some of these documentaries so I too can sound educated. They're really fun. In any case, yeah, yeah, I got distracted by tanks and I lost my train of thought of what I was just talking about. Marriage. No escape hatch. No escape hatch. So I'm super married. Um, and so, uh, I had been previously married. I had a secular marriage, uh, that wasn't real. And so, uh, we got married by like a guy who got a thing from a website and we didn't take it seriously. And we, there was no fidelity. And it was a bad

marriage. We messed it up. And, uh, I'm sorry to her that I didn't take it seriously and that I wasted her time and hurt her and that she hurt me and yada yada yada so i had to tell the church about this obviously hey i used to be married and they go okay well great it's probably not real but we got to look into it before we let you get married because marriage is the most important thing and when you get married you can't get unmarried and i was like oh okay sick so i'd do an annulment all right so that's an annulment is basically the church investigating of what is maybe a previous marriage and they will bring you the findings. You either are married, which in that case, you're married. Yeah, you're married. You're just married. Or that marriage wasn't valid. So they'll annul the marriage

in the eyes of the church, allowing you to say, hey, you're good to go. And then they will grant you a marriage. Right, which is just a statement that you weren't married to begin with for those at home. A declaration of nullity. Exactly. There was no marriage. Exactly. There was no marriage. So now people are caught up. Because I have a feeling the last couple times I've done this podcast, a bunch of people had a lot of questions for me after. So anyway, so there's that. So we, we, uh, I had to get an annulment, but the person I was previously married to is like, you know, deeply involved in things that are negative, witchcraft, things like this.

And so I had a weird go of it. But, uh, we put in the time, the frustration, the work, we made it happen. And, uh, thank God we did because doing it the right way. And, and even though it was frustrating to be like, I got to do all, these paperwork and get these people in here the taking marriage seriously doing the classes doing everything going through the process like by the time we got to marriage i felt so ready and so like locked in and purposeful and it just felt good you know i was like we did it we earned this we made it happen it feels good and real and anyway that it was beautiful uh father gregory

Pine married us, celebrated our marriage with us. So that was great. So we had, did he do any of the prep with you? Or was he just there for the day off? He didn't do any of the prep. He was just there for the day of. So we went to our diocese and we had to go do the meeting. And for the non-Catholics, there's several meetings and classes you do. Sit down with a priest and he's like, what would you do if he had no money and couldn't have kids? And your wife has to be in front of the priest. Like, what would I do? That's a crazy question to ask me. right now live so that was fun um yeah and so we got married and the sacrament was beautiful my wedding was perfect like 10 of 10 it was so good it was really really really wonderful um yeah

and then uh so a married life since it's been awesome like i'm really enjoying it i was talking about uh the security that comes with being like married for real where I'm like, oh, I'm in a situation where this person can tell me anything, and I'm going to be there with them through this. You know what I mean? And then because I'm that committed, it gives me this sort of permission to like be authentically myself, but it also keeps me in check in such a way where I'm like, wow, how beautiful is that?

My wife is risking so much to be married to me. like what if I turn out to be cruel or I let myself become slovenly or I don't provide like so many things can go wrong with me as a man and she has like looked at me and said like I trust to you that is crazy and so to like also to rise to that occasion whereas before when I was married like oh yeah if it goes bad well we'll just get divorced and now it's like well if it starts to go bad now I've put her in a situation I could couldn't forgive myself for putting a woman in. And so, like, it's, it's this awesome, like, well, it reminds you of Paul's idea of, like, treating your wife as your own body. Right. To become one. So now it's like, all right, the two of us are now one unit. So I need to do what's best for this one unit. Right. Because if I do what's best for me at her expense, I'm actually doing damage to myself. Right. And it's this whole, like, and then, and then now it really puts into perspective the like the the way the power structure is supposed to work men submit to

god women submit to men families you know the children submit to the wife and the husband we raise them together we all look up to god and then extending out into the community extending out into the state or or the larger community extending out into the country extending out into the people you know and it's like oh man this makes so much sense everything is so much much easier when it's ordered when it's ordered when i wake up and i go okay i know exactly what i need to do i know exactly who i need to be thinking about who matters what matters get those ducks in a row okay now what else i got that now what it like massages your brain like to and also to uh to be married is to delete every other woman from existence and so like of course lustful thoughts

exist, lust is inescapable, especially as men. Like, that's our great spiritual battle in this age, lust and pride, right? And to some extent in our modern times, sloth, unfortunately. But, like, there's also that freeing part of you where, like, I'm like, oh, I'm going to go to the gas station. Like, you know when you're single, you're like, I'm going to go to the gas station. There's going to be a pretty girl there. I can't wear my crocs. Like, when you're married, you're like, I'm like, oh, I got to get in shape so my wife thinks I look good at home. And then when I go to the grocery store, I'm like, I'm insane. I'm wearing cowboy boots and swim trunks and half of a t-shirt. And I've got, I'm just like, I have just my daughter

on my shoulder of my sunglasses. One lens is broken out. I could care less, man. I'm like in it. You know what I mean? And it feels so good to just, to live your life in such a way where you're like, there's only one person I want to be attractive for. And then there's these people's opinion are what matters most. And again, it orders you towards God, which then pushes you towards being a more authentic version of yourself. So now when I do want to wear something or I do want to express myself, it truly feels like

it's for me like my wife is who I want to be handsome for so when I wear the cool outfit the James Bond wore and it makes me feel confident it's not because I'm trying to impress these women I'm having an authentic experience ordered by God where I'm enjoying my day being dressed how I want in my own little world feeling so good for me and now I'm like expressing myself authentically. And that's what I found through marriage is like there's so many times where I'll be doing something or spending my time on something or dressing a certain way or pursuing a goal. And I realize, oh, dude, so much of what I used to do was affected by women or their view of me or my access to them or whatever or what these people are going to think because of this.

And now that I'm married with a, I'm like, nope, this is authentically what I want to do right. this is me and my wife has like helped me become myself which then has like you know that's so good for your mental health i don't think i could handle the amount of negativity i get online right now if not for my family and how they allow me to be so authentically me that's great yeah it's really cool i remember jordan peterson had a great point he said you want your spouse not only to love you but to love the you, she knows you can be. So in other words, she's not just settling for who you are.

And that's nice in the moment. You know, spread rose pedals before me, tell me I'm handsome, pat me on the back, whatever. Yeah, sure, that's lovely. And I could put up with that for a embarrassingly long time. But I also want a woman who knows who I can be and is cheering me on. So I love how you said that.

She's, I'm becoming who I am because of her. Yeah, yeah, it's so cool. Now, with such a negative, I don't want to exaggerate the negative experience that you had, but maybe, let's say, with having a less than optimal experience and what you thought was a marriage prior, did that impact your desire or lack of desire to get married again, quote, unquote?

And what's, yeah, how's it been different this time around? So it's so funny. I, again, I've always, even when, oh, now I'm remembering a point I forgot earlier, I'm having one of those. Bring it up. I'm having one of those weird, I know. Brings it back. That's it.

That has to be it. I didn't drink. You offer me a coffee this morning and I was like, a Diet Coke will do it. I'll get myself together. And then I'm having this podcast with you and I'm like, what was I thinking about? I've said that like five times, which is really funny. And now I'm doing it again.

Have you forgotten? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's going deep. This is so good. What? So where were we just now? Good point. Okay. Yeah, I guess you're less than optimal experience in marriage. did that especially as an older man too getting married right like yeah yeah yeah early 20s anymore

oh i'm older for sure so were you were you thinking is this worth it or you know i know i know it seems to me i remember when i try to give josiah dating advice i'd realize oh i know nothing about how jensi dates or what dating looks like today i got i was dating in 2004 and you had to get married in 2006 i don't know anything today apparently because people look at me like i know nothing when i tell them what hell they should date. It's insane because there's like a cutoff. Like 2010 down, all of human history, you date the same. We only just changed it, right?

And what happened in the chain? The internet. Okay. Now you meet on the internet. That's where you meet. So you meet strangers. Which doesn't work because women's attractiveness to a man is not immediate. Yeah.

So if every woman was going off of what she sees, they'd be two out of every 10 guys. The profile photo. Maybe. And I think that's, I think, I think, I think, I think it's true that, that women need to get to know a man before they find him attractive. And I think it's less true of men. But I will say, there's definitely been times in my life where the more I got to know a woman, the more I started to be attracted to her because of her personality. Have you had the reverse?

Meaning, you get to know a woman who's gorgeous. But the more you get to know where the less attractive she becomes. Yeah. Yeah. I have that all the time. I'll even think someone is beautiful and like a non-sexual. No lust whatsoever and they'll start to say things and I'll be like, nah, dude.

Like there's a shallowness to them or something like that. Yeah, yeah. I think that cruelty and cowardice and laziness are the things that are most unattractive to me. In women? In anyone. Cruelty, laziness, and cowardice. Okay.

So what, that's interesting. So what, can you think of an example of a woman who's been lazy? And what does that mean? What does that look like? Laciness is like, just like an inability to take care of yourself. I see, yeah. You know, I couldn't be bothered. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Or just like a, you know, it would be like if you go to play video games with a girl and she's like, I want to play games, but I just don't, I don't know how. And it's like, no, you don't want to. You're lazy. You could just learn. I want to play chess with you, but I don't know how. Okay. Yeah.

So you have the internet. Or you could ask me to teach you. It sounds like what you're saying is, yeah, there's a lack of motivation to be interesting. Because when someone's like, I could learn to play chess, I don't want to. Yeah. It's like, be interesting. Figure it out. Have a desire to learn.

Well, that's the thing where people go, that's the big debate where people are like, what do you bring to the table and women say, I am the table? Do they really say that? That's a thing people say. I've had a real life woman tell me that in real life. Who thinks she's the table. We started to have a joking conversation. No one is that interesting.

that they will yes yeah yeah it's also disgusting like oh okay so you're an in any man object like so okay tell me about the woman who told you that oh it's we were she joking she wasn't joking we were doing a whole we were like on a date we were doing a thing and we were we were just like bantering and I made a joke about like listen

I don't remember we were like out sitting and it was like a it was New York so it was like a nightlight like a similar situation like it's like having drinks and we're talking and um at one point i make a joke like and that's what i bring to this relationship you know if we had just met each other it's a big joke i don't remember what it was i like fell down or say it was like a silly thing and then she's like uh oh what else do you bring and i would be like in general to a relationship and then i'm doing like half a bit half a real thing so i want to spark a real conversation so i was like well i'll bring like uh you know

adventure, loyalty, self-awareness, a desire to put you before me, you know. And I started to say like, just qualities that you want in a person, like what people bring to a relationship. And then I was like, and what do you bring? And then she was like, I don't know. And I was like, you don't know what you bring to a relationship. And then she was like, I bring me. I am.

I was like, what do you bring a table? I am the table, which I then found out as like a meme from online that people do. That's it, okay. Yeah, yeah, like a meme women were doing at the time. Like, I am the table. So she told that to me. But they were sort of saying it unironically.

Unironically, yes. Yeah, it makes me think of how feminism has poisoned so much. Because even in Catholic relationships, it seems to me that most people understand what a husband is for, what his duties are. Like, what are you about? And they might say something,

protect and provide. And then you say the woman, all right, and what's your role that you should live up to? Yeah. And that, I think for many women, feels restrictive, Like, how dare you say that there's anything I'm obligated to do?

It's like to love and serve my husband and children. Like, you put that on a woman and it sounds like hate speech now. Yeah. You put it on a man. It sounds like the least he could do. The least he could do is so real. Is that right or I don't know? No, that's 100% right.

That's the like, we want to be equal. Give us equal pay. I want to date a man who makes more money. Why can't I find a man to provide for me? hey, you make as much as the men that you deserve to be with. That's what you asked for. So now men don't make more than you.

Deal with that. What are we doing here? Like, did you not want that? Do you want equality or not? So you want equality and you also want a man to take care or do better than you. You know, that's weird. And then you're like, okay, well...

That's interesting. So the men who do the best... That's why hypergamy is a thing now. where all the women are going after a small group of men. Okay. I thought hypergamy had to do with your desire changing or something. I don't know. Maybe I don't understand it.

Maybe I don't understand. We're two very dumb guys. I'm just really glad I married a really good woman who knows it's her job to love and serve me and the children. And who I desire to love and serve and protect. How much easier does it make when that is the case? And you're like, especially as a man? These bananas, like I really do think that should show people who are watching, who are, many people are critical of me, the more critical I've become a feminism.

But it seems to me like, if I said, it's my job to love and serve my wife, everyone would like, yeah, my wife, I want her to love and serve me. People would recoil and they recoil, I think, as a result of the indoctrionization, not a word maybe, of feminism. They also have like a cartoonish villain of like some hick in Alabama. you know, who's like, you're not allowed to talk to the Wilson's. Get inside and make me my food before I hit you again. Like that, like they conjure up this cartoonish, non-existent. That guy exists in like one in every 100. That's a psychopath. That's a psychopath. And actually, woman,

you'd be lucky to date a man from Alabama. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Honestly, dudes from Alabama go hard. I like Alabama a lot. But it's like, come on. What are we doing? That's not real. Like, if I serve you, you must serve me. If I give myself away to you, you have to give yourself away to me. That's kind of the deal. To answer your question from before, marriage, did the first marriage effect the second? So when I was still, this goes back to me remembering a point I forgot to do. But so when I was a communist and I was very much into all that and I had a show where I was promoting it, I was still very traditional in a lot of my values. As many, not socialists, but communists are.

A lot of communists are socialists. I mean, socialism is still socialist. Like national socialism is also conservative. Socialism is in the title. It's all socialism. Anyway, so I had a lot of conservative opinions, and everyone was cool with them. Guns, you know, and I also was pro-marriage.

I was very pro-marriage, and I used to say, despite the fact that I'm secular, I believe in marriage, I would like to try one more time. That's the last time I'll ever try. that's what I would tell people which is very funny that almost I don't think it is but this is one of those times where you're like and the holy spirit spoke through me and because it knew that I only had one more time in me because I only needed one more baby because that's the

permanent one but like uh I did uh I used to say that so um the reason this goes back to what I was saying earlier is because I think it's very funny that I used to be pro gun and then uh but because I had a lot of liberal opinions about many other things, socially liberal, people were very cool with me. Now I criticize Gavin Newsom and people are like, oh, so you're pro-gun, you disgusting monster? And I'm like, whoa, I know you liked me three years ago when I was pro-gun but communist. So your issue isn't pro-gun. Your issue is now that I'm the evil Nazi that lives in your head. You're projecting that on to me. Doesn't matter. So anyway, I was married. it went badly, I take responsibility for that, for sure.

I should have known better. I should have acted better. I could say lots of things, it doesn't matter. So I felt personally that it was my fault that that went badly. Because as a man, that's my, I'm supposed to get married and have a family, and I'm supposed to, like, guide my wife and take care of her, and I failed. I wasn't even taking care of myself, so I failed. So in my opinion, my first marriage didn't affect the second in any negative way or make me gun shy or afraid because I saw I wasn't married.

I wasn't behaving like I was married and I wasn't leading and I wasn't like all in. So it just kind of my first marriage, if anything, galvanized me or my first try at marriage or whatever you want to call it because it wasn't a marriage was to just motivated me. I feel like it made me better, you know. And that's so unfortunate to be like, oh, I grew. And like, I'm looking at the silver lining. But like, you know, our families had to pay that price. And my ex-wife, God bless her, no matter what she thinks of me or the church or our non-marriage, like she was wrapped up in that.

And all these people got hurt. And marriage is so serious and to bring households together and involve. people and stuff and not do it. And with the solid foundation and the commitment and the consent and all the understanding is so dangerous that like I just like imploded this thing and hurt all these people and experience this. And so if anything, I'm more thankful, more happy, but also there's that part of you that's like, God, forgive me for what I did to that woman and our families and all the pain it caused. What's it like being a dad?

It rocks. In contrast to the horrible pain and guilt I may feel for my past and my past actions and how they've affected others, being a dad is the coolest thing in the world. So I was in the position for like, you know, obviously me and my fiancee were together for a year, close to a year before we were married, a while, you know. And so I was in the position of like being. around that child and sort of being a dad-like figure, especially I'm dating her mother. It's very clear. We're all spending time together as a family. We go on trips. So she began to call me dad before we were married and we were just sort of locked in. We're engaged and I'm all in. And so that experience was really cool. But now that we're living together where, you know,

we have a marital bed where we're like locked in. We're a family and a house. You know, it's incredible. Incredible. My favorite thing is just like how how much fun it is to like see the differences between us as parents and like what a dad and a mom do when they like really fulfill the roles, you know, because she's the nurturer when something, you know, when she's crying or whatever, she's with her mom and her mom's like, everything's going to be okay or whatever. But I'm the like, what's the problem we got to solve it? Stop crying. your cat isn't going to come to you when you come home every time like we had a whole thing where we were gone for 10 days and we came home and the cast didn't immediately run up to her like an

anime cartoon and be like we missed you and then she had a breakdown okay and she was like well the cats don't love me they don't remember me i correct i'm a failure as a cat that's not correct as a cat as a cat owner you know she's freaking out and i had to be like these are cats they don't act like dogs you are their pet yeah and i want and so that's what they think Yeah, and I had to do this whole, like, in bed for an entire hour. I'm trying to put her to bed. But we were having a, instead of being like, it's all okay, I love you, I did a dad style like, you understand that the cats aren't smart.

Yes. You understand that the cats aren't dogs. Yes. Can you explain to me how you think the cat see you? And her and I had this like really cool back and forth conversation where I'm like, I'm constantly saying the phrase, so you, do you understand? Yes, I do, dad. And we went through it.

And by the end, she felt better. Yeah. But I was like, what a different contrast in styles and how both are totally valid and you need both. Yeah. You know? And like, or just like putting her to bed. Like we take turns, putting her to bed every night.

And then there's a routine, you know. We got to do the Hail Mary's, the Our Father. I'm going to throw the St. Michael's in there. I'm trying to get all the Mass prayers. So we pray together. So what we do is we start with the Hail Mary. Well, first, actually, if I'm putting her to bed, She runs to a room and closes her door, turns off the light, and hides.

And then we play hide and seek. Or I switch things up and I also close the door and turn off the light. Now we're both hiding. And so there's a hunt situation, which one of us gets the other one first. Then we say Hail Mary. We sit in bed and we hail Mary together and we do the prayer. And then we freestyle. And I pray and kind of show her like what it looks like.

And then I ask her what she wants to pray for. And sometimes it's four others or four. things. Sometimes I have to like encourage her to ask for things. And I'm like, what are you afraid of? Who do you care about whatever? Sometimes she's very like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's get this part over. And I have to slow her down. Sometimes she's like, yeah, yeah, let's get this part over. But she does it. And I kind of let her get away with it because I want her to understand that like, it's just a prayer. That's all we got it. We're just in here to talk to God. Sometimes it's going to look different than others, but we're engaging. And then we finish off with the Our Father.

And then while we're finishing the Our Father, we both start laughing maniacically because we know we're about to start fighting each other. Because as soon as the Our Father ends, it's time to get tucked in. But she doesn't get tucked in until we wrestle and I pin her and burrito her by force. So that's like a small, like, it's that kind of stuff. Nightly ritual. That we, we you're those like small dad things where you're like how fun is that that like we have this whole deal together and then when mom has to put her together she's like she's looking at me like tomorrow night i'm gonna take you down like that kind of stuff is so fun i love that and i imagine then you do that thing as a parent where you're like dude thinking as it as yourself as a kid like

how sick would it be to wrestle my dad every night yeah i would love that was so cool you know. How old is your daughter I can ask? Eight. Okay, I've got to tell you my favorite game when my kids were that young.

Yeah, yeah. Because you might want to implement this. I would sit still and I would pretend I was a robot and that there was a button on my body that they had to press to turn me or to activate me. And so I might be thinking

it's my right pinky finger but they don't know that. So they just come up terrified because as soon as they turn me on I'm going to attack them, right? So they touch my ear load, my nose, my head. And then when they finally touch it,

I stand up and chase them around. Yeah. And the only way they can deactivate me is by touching the same place that they activated me from. So they had got to be cognizant of where they're touching me the first time. Yeah, yeah.

And then as I die, once they touch it, I say, I was just learning to love. And it's a great game. It's a great game. No, having kids is absolutely beautiful. It's the best. I love it. Very happy for you.

I love it very, very, very much. Well, we have a bunch of questions from our local members. Is it a KFA? Yeah, please. jump to them. Please, let's do it. Caylan says, Dudgeons and Dragons or Magic the Gathering.

I could see Shane being an incredible bard. Okay. You have to explain what that means to me. So Magic the Gathering, the famous card game, there's more money in Magic the Gathering than the World Series of Poker. So that's a crazy fact.

Really? Yes, that's not a joke. Magic the Gathering, I think, makes more money than like the video games industry combined, some crazy thing. Who owns Magic the Gathering? Wizards of the Coast. And what else do they own? Dungeons and Dragons is.

well really they have all the money buy it or did they invent it they've had it for a while I think they I well I mean oh shoot I'm forgetting the man who invented Magic the Gathering but I think they've had it since the beginning magic the gathering in any case I love magic Richard Garfield there oh no did no Richard Garfield invented Richard Garfield created Magic the Gathering oh he did he designed as a PhD student in mathematics wow I was wrong who was I thinking I I thought you were saying Gary Gygax. I don't know that.

He invented Dungeons and Dragons. Okay. Okay, he was also a Scientologist, strangely enough. So, who knows? In any case, I like Dungeons and Dragons more. Magic the Gathering is not very cool these days. I think the art has been bad and the theming and I just don't like him. Did they go woke?

Yeah, crazy style. And they also did Lord of the Rings and they're like, we're going to reimagine the Lord of the Rings. I hate that. Yeah. We talked about this on a show about Amazon's depiction of the Lord Eric. You went off for about 45 minutes. Out of my mind. They made Blaragorn, so they made Black Aragorn.

Oh, for goodness. Dude, hey, it's a huge property. The Tolkien Estate allows them to make new characters. There are black people in Middle Earth that are heroes for sure. Make that character, bro. For the love of everything that is good and right. If you want black characters in Lord of the Rings, there are black people there

just write a really cool character of them you don't have to make Blair agorn anyway doesn't matter it bums me out for black people because I'm like if I was a black guy I don't want black hair agorn I want the coolest black guy possible with a giant axe killing orcs

give them a backstory let me get into it you know what I mean but whatever so Dungeons and Dragons is better I love Dungeons and Dragons though I don't play Dungeons and Dragons because I don't like Wizards of the Coast So I play Land of Eam is the game I've been really interested in recently. It's Lord of the Rings combined with the Muppets, my two favorite things.

I would never have thought that sentence could have existed. Can I tell you that I, in my, I've been. What's a code? It's called Land of Eam, E, E, E, M. Since I was a child, my ultimate dream comedy project, if I could do one thing would be to do a Muppet movie that is a Lord of the Rings remake. That's, if I could do one project, that would be it. Okay. That would be the ultimate for me.

Fair enough. James Schlosser says on a scale from one to ten, how much do you like Father Gregory Pine? 10. 11, as much as possible. When did you get to know him? How did you end up asking him to celebrate your wedding? I got to know him. I reached out to like the godsplaining podcast as like a fan.

Like I'm obsessed with and love you guys. Everything Father Pine does is great. father gregory which he prefers i've learned and so um yeah i i just love and i love the everything they do at the house of dominican studies like they're incredible and it really the way they engage with the faith is how i desire to and so the way they speak the way they engage with it the way they learn that's just speaks to me that's my stuff and so father gregory is awesome so then I got to do his podcast and then we became friends. Now I ask him theological questions. I've had him come out to a show. Did you, so did you go do a show that he went to? Mm-hmm. Oh, nice. Yeah,

yeah, yeah, yeah. And then I also performed at Sikh and he was there for that as well. So we've spent some time together. And then, um, so I had gone to the House of Dominican Studies and stayed uh, for Sikh. And so I hung out with all the guys. We all went to eight. It was so fun. And, When I got engaged, I was like, well, I have all like these five Dominicans in my phone in a group chat. And we were going to get married. And I was like, I would really love to just try to get married by someone who means a lot to me.

It could be anyone, but any priests, but I want to try. So I just sent that group chat like, hey, which one of y'all wants to marry me? Thinking like, if I could get a Dominican to do, that'd be awesome. And of course, Father Gregory's like, I'm. I'm the guy. And I was like, let's go. That's fantastic. You're my favorite theologian.

If you had a baseball card, I would have it framed, which is embarrassing, but also real. I really, yeah, I love it. So that's great. Sue Ann 48 says, do you think your work and set up comedy as self-expression? Do you think of it as that way, that way? And how do you balance that with giving your audience what they expect of you in a show? Do you think audience expectations always end up destroying creative, expression asking as someone who's trying to publish a work of fiction.

So I think that it is self-expression, and I think audience expectations can and do ruin self-expression, especially when you accidentally lock yourself into a thing. So like when you're a band and you put out the really good album and then your sound changes a little bit because you're trying to evolve and people get mad at you, that's them trying to lock you back into their version of what they want from your self-expression, right? I think comedy is like music in that way where you can train the audience. I think that if I went up and started doing like,

like set up punchline, set up punchline or started doing really mean jokes or roasts or weird topic, like people would be like, what is this? But I don't know. I wonder if my audience, what they expect for me outside of for me not to be like gross obscene yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah my audience expects me to not be obscene but you know what i've found every once in a while i'll just like swear of one

little swear just like an adult see how they handle it yeah yeah yeah well it'll but it's almost always like integral to what's happening in the story so i'm not just like flippantly like and this gross but i'll say a word and i no one ever mentions it no one's ever like i wish you wouldn't to swore or whatever. So I think that it's just like the overall cleanliness people desire. Yeah, I think that you need to, a lot of the expectations of the audience are going to be on you as an artist to cultivate that audience. So if you're putting out your first work of fiction, that's a huge opportunity for you to set the tone. Don't worry about what they want. Only worry about what you want because that first piece of thing you make sets the tone that you will then be

beholden to. book Wild at Heart by John Eldridge? No. It's an excellent book. I know of it. Yeah, he's got a line in there where he says, don't ask yourself, what is the world need? Ask yourself, what makes me come fully alive and then go do that, because what the world needs is people who've become fully alive. He's quoting another book, but the point is, I think that's true with anything with, like podcasts, for example, don't ask what is, what podcast isn't in existence that I could then fill that gap. What do you want to do? And then do that because it's really going to come through whether or not you enjoy what you're doing

as opposed to just doing what you think will fill a gap. Right. Yeah. This all comes back to me being like the more into God I am and the more submitted I am, the more authentic I become

because my, the things I want to do are simply just because. Like, I have everything I need. It's that thing where like, what job do you do when you have a million dollars? Yeah, yeah. It's that except for in life.

What do you do when you're satisfied? Yeah. So you know what you're supposed to be doing with life and you are ostensibly satisfying that desire. What now? Yeah. And that's when like, that's how Tolkien and C.S. Lewis and Chesterton and Aquinas and, uh, you know, um, Dante and all these people create these masterworks because they're satisfied. What do you create when you're satisfied? Only the thing I want to create most. most authentic thing to me. You recently did another, what do you call it, special? Yeah. I didn't realize that, because the last one I saw was one about ghost hunters. That's right. There's another one?

I filmed another one. Wow. I wrote and filmed a special in less than a year. Is that ridiculous? It's a lot. Most comics, I say once every three years. Is your hope? And the style in which they do it is different from me too.

I mean, I'm writing like whole stories. my special both all my specials are like one one story since my second one how did it go and when does it come out so it went really well it went incredibly well actually i thought i was i'm a i'm curious how to be received online live audiences have loved it like it has been so fun live how many times did you give that set before you recorded it would you say a hundred plus holy mackerel yeah that's that's remarkable So by the time that you're going to record it is your hope that it's going to be tight

without being stagnant. Yeah. Yeah, that's where the acting part comes in. And then you have to keep in mind, too, when you're filming a special, you've got whatever's going on in your life at the time. You know, so you've got like doctor's appointments, a pregnant wife, a sick father, a dying, you know,

you've got stuff happening. So it's a lot to like, oh, I got to go out there and perform and I've got to be authentic and I got to make this happen, but I can't forget what I was going to say. And it's a lot. Do we know when it's going to release? I don't. You never do with my, the people who produce my albums, they just sort of like let me know when it's ready.

I would assume by December. I hope by December. It was so good. It was one of the better live recordings I've ever done. Like the second show I did was unbelievable. Like I think the show went like eight minutes long, longer than normal because the laughs. It was so fun. I just had the best time. Yeah. And, um, of course it was like super fans. So it was just like the awesome. Yeah. But yeah, it went really well. I'm so curious to

see how people receive it. I do say some pretty, I do make fun of Australia pretty hard. Though I do say, I do qualify many, like I am sure to be like, I love Australians. But Australia. Yeah. Your government is really cramping my vibe. There's like a, um, a continuing joke where Australia will pose me a problem like give us a transcript of your comedy and every time the solution of the problem is like what do I do oh that's right Australia is a government I don't respect them so I keep repeating that's a thing that repeats so I'm very clear to be like the government the country because Australians as people uh I think Australians and Mexicans are the closest to Americans you can get really yeah I think so Australians are our long lost brothers

I think that Australians have a, the spirit of freedom lives in you guys. I, um, obviously love America and Americans, one in particular, my wife and my four children. Um, but there is something about Americans that, that bugs me and I'm sure I do the same thing. And I noticed it when I was living in Austria, right? Like, there's certain countries that follow the rules. And then there are certain countries who are like, don't tell me what to do and that's America. but I'd be in Austria and we'd be like we were in an airport lounge and a kid had his one of my kids had their foot up on a seat and someone came when hey don't have your feet up on

the seat and if that was an isolated incident I would think oh that was just one guy but no that sort of thing happens a lot but I like it I like it because there is a there is a social expectations in certain countries that people follow and the idea I mean I made fun of, I said the other day, like, yeah, Americans are loud. They've got cool stuff to say, shut up. That was a joke. It is actually annoying when Americans are really, really loud in countries that are kind of quiet. And I kind of like, not self-aware. I had to keep saying to my children in Croatia, shh, your American is showing. So I don't like, I don't like that about Americans that I encounter overseas. It does tend to be this, we're loud and we're messy

and we don't care. Yeah. And it was like, this is our home. If you could please not put your feet up here and do you know what it is is that those americans you're seeing that's the first and last time they're ever traveling is that right you almost always okay it's a big country we don't got a lot of money my americans don't travel internationally americans travel in america so like that that that international trip is probably like the first and last time that family's going out or these people are there and not to say that they though then they get to act crazy but it is to say that like it doesn't occur to them. Like they're ignorant of the idea that like America's so big and you spend so much time

in it. Like, you know, you're like, you could drive three days across it. And there are still more places to go. Like, it's insane. So then you get out into the world and you're like, so everywhere is America because you're ignorant and you don't know and you haven't thought about it and you haven't really thought about your place in the world or different cultures and you get over there and you act a fool because you're done.

and you're ignorant. And that's not an excuse, but I get what's happening. Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I know you're kind of exaggerating maybe, but I wouldn't say it's dumb. I, I, uh, I don't think anyone should know ahead of time how they, how they act will be perceived by another culture. I mean, how could you possibly know that? It would be weird. I think, though, that especially in the Commonwealth, that's like a huge strength of anyone from the Commonwealth is the desire to sort of, I think, the British Empire was so big and so expansive and so insane and so multicultural, that there's like

a politeness whenever you encounter a people and that is like British politeness is like so civilized so as to never offend any other. Well, I mean here's an example in Australia that's sort of not unlike the please take your feet off the chair example. I remember my wife and I were

in Australia, we were in an elevator and we were getting, I think we were going into an elevator and the lady walked past And they said, just so you know, we, you let people off before you come on. That kind of thing is not something I could imagine ever happening in America. Like people explaining to each other how you should act. No. You could have that in like the New York subway.

That's a real thing. You're supposed to wait for everyone to get off before you get on. And if you try to get on first, like a man will, that's what I'm saying. They wouldn't politely tell you. It's not polite at all. They're going to shove you or something and be like, what are you doing? Yeah. We're getting off.

Like, yeah, yeah. But I mean, but I also got really frustrated with Europeans criticizing America to me and my wife because I think you can criticize your own country and you can criticize your country to a fellow countryman. But to have someone from Europe tell me what they don't like about America just seemed very rude. And it seemed that way because it was that way.

Yeah, yeah. Like if you're part of my family, then we can criticize mom and dad, but you can't criticize my mom and dad. Or if you do, you do it with great gentleness. I've had a quite, I mean, I was in New York and a comedian, you know, for a long time. I spent a lot of time with foreigners.

I never saw Americans criticizing their countries. They always criticize ours. And I get that we're like the big dog, right? Yeah. And whatever. But it was, it was interesting to be like, strange. Because I feel like if I say something about France right now, you're going to lose your mind, you know, but it is what it is.

Philip Z says, did any video game amaze you with its story? Yeah, a bunch. So many. I mean, so, so many. What games are, like, Chrono Trigger was one of the first games where I was like, this can't be this good. I'm going to look it up. And I kept playing and I was like, it can't be this bit.

Like, it blew my mind. Final Fantasy 6, Final Fantasy 9, Final Fantasy 8. Let's see. Who are any of the Zelda's? All of them are good, but the really good one is probably Majora's mask. Let's see, what else do we got going on? The Witcher series is incredibly good. Persona is incredibly good.

God of war. I'm afraid that I won't ever like a video game again. Really? I liked video games in the 90s. But I try to play video games today to relive the joy of my youth. And I'm like, what am I doing? You can't do that. You can't relive the joy of your youth.

You have to enjoy it as a new hobby. it's doing a new, different thing. Fair enough, but I can't do that. I've tried to play new video games and get it. I want to get into them, but I can't. Just be a guy who drives vintage cars. Just get the actual vintage games and enjoy them. Well, that is what I do.

That's what I'm saying. I can enjoy what I used to play. Oh, okay. I can't seem to enjoy what's coming out today. That's more common. It's so common nowadays that they're making like new stainless steel game boys to actually play old game boy games. So they have like a good screen.

So you can, you basically get to relive but now or you can buy like a PlayStation that plugs into your HDMI, no problem, but it doesn't open. It's got every PlayStation game already loaded on it. One of my favorite nights. It wasn't favorite, but it's one worth noting. My wife and I were in Lizier, like Therese of Lizier, in France, we were in a hotel bed

and we were playing retro games on the Nintendo Switch, but retro Sega games. Yeah, yeah. Because she grew up playing Sonic, the Hedgehog, and I did, because we were. we grew up around the same time, obviously. And so that was a real fun day night. Nice.

I like that. I like that. I once heard of a couple. Their names were Garth and Rebecca, and he set up a date night for her one day. So this is advice for people who are looking for a date night with their wife. He lit candles everywhere and they just played video games all night. That drank wine.

That rocks. Me and my wife do that all the time. And by do that, I mean we just sit in my living room and I have a, I put the computer right next to the couch kitty corner. Yeah. So if I'm sitting working or playing games, even if she's watching TV or whatever,

she's in arms distance of me. Okay. And then the kids' battle station is next to me. So as a unit, we are, because I were nerds. I'm a big gamer and stuff. So we got to,

we're all locked in together. So that's very nice. Cal, someone says, are there any good comedians you like? I like Jennifer Forweiler and would want to support other good comedians, especially ones who don't have nasty humor

and aren't afraid to show their faith in God? You know what's so funny? Firstly, Jen Fullweiler is great. I really like her. I'm gonna, yeah, I plan on having a conversation with her soon. She's a good woman. Yeah, she's great. She's very cool.

We have a lot in common. We both like history. It's funny because I'm like, oh, dude, I know all these good Catholic comics. And then I'm like, oh, they're not clean at all. They're out of their minds, actually. There's this one, this one kid eganism. I think it's how you pronounce it, eG, B-A-N-I-S-M, maybe underscore underscore, I can't remember.

He's on Instagram. He's a Catholic comic, and I don't think he's super clean, but he's not, like, overtly disgusting either. But he's like a Gen Z kid, super into anime, went to Japan, but he's very Catholic. He makes a lot of content about the saints and stuff. He went to Japan and took photos with, and I'm forgetting his name immediately,

the samurai saint. Okay. There's a, and he had a samurai sword, but the bottom of it is a crucifix. I know of the story, but I don't know the name. So it's unbelievable. If I wasn't covered in tattoos, you know that guy would be my entire back. That's so awesome.

It's unreal. Is it Dom Justu Takuyama? Yeah, it probably is. So we went and took a photo with him, and he's just a really cool guy who's living his faith in an authentic way. And also being a comic in an authentic way. So I wouldn't say he's clean, but check him out. Up and Coming Catholic guy. Yeah.

Um, other comics who are really good. I mean, you know, all of the ones you know, Napragazzi and like, if you want clean comedy, you go on Drybar and just start, start watching and see who you find. I wonder if they knew just how successful they would be when they started this. I don't think so. I think they thought it would be successful and good, but I don't think it would be anything like it is.

Yeah, people kind of do get fed up with the vulgarity and the sexual talk. Mm-hmm. They do. It's like today, heard that in twisters there was meant to be a kiss at the end at the airport which they removed not a sex scene like a passionate kissing that they removed because i guess the director said people don't want as much of this in their movies anymore that's weird that okay that's weird though that's like but i think that's right i think that's kind of right i'm tired of even the the latest superman which i

regret watching i love superman but i regret watching that just that was it like a one minute kiss at the end. Really? Just intense stuff. And I don't want to take my kids to have to see that stuff. I don't mind, like, romance. And I think that it's an integral part

of... Twisters have a lot of romance in it. It's just, I think what we're saying is kind of like we were saying earlier, right? The pornography is ubiquitous. And even if it's not pornography, you might have these, like,

strong, passionate kissing scenes. Sure. And even that, we're like, you know what? I don't, that wasn't necessary we don't need it. Yeah, I guess that the way you're describing it is different from how I'm imagining. I'm imagining like a kiss, like a Casablanca on screen style.

That would be nice. Also, I will say that there's a thing where like they do kisses and they're like making out. That's what I mean. Where they're like, hey, keep the lips closed. Hey, I'm over here watching you. Just kiss her like a man. Why are you talking like there's no reason to get French about it?

Kiss her German style. Well, don't do that, but at least American style. Peter C. says, I would guess that since Mary was a huge part of your conversion, you probably have a devotion to the rosary also. If that's so, what does your routine with the rosary look like? I mean, I have a devotion to the rosary. I don't have like a specific planned out one, but I have a devotion to it in that I am devoted to it. I try to pray the rosary every day. I mess up. Very often I forget it and I end up just like listening to the Bishop Barron rosary and just doing it in my car along with him. That's great. Yeah, I try to pray the rosary every day or on days that I just

think that like I'm missing the mark or I'm not doing well. I'll just pray the rosary in my head 10, 10 Hail Marys at a time while I'm doing dishes. And then I'll be playing video games and I'll all of a sudden become self-aware and I'll like start to manual breathe or whatever. And I'll be like, I'll do the rosary a couple times. Or I'll have a lustful thought and I'll hit 10, a decade of the rosary or whatever and I think that because I now my response dude even when I get scared the last night in the hotel room I went to the bathroom like in the middle of the night with the light on and you know like it's pitch black with the lights on so you blind yourself and you turn the light off and it's dark yeah and I just had that like there's there's something like peeking out from

my door looking at me feeling like in my my brain just imagines the scariest like unclothed woman with her gray withering skin and her jaws half missing and her teeth are long and her hair is scraggly and she's peeking out at me and I go to look and she looks away and now she's crawling on the like you know your brain is like let's do the scariest thing possible especially when you're half awake and you don't have control over that yeah my brain does that I hit a Hail Mary boom you know so it's become such a response that um the amount of rosary praying I get in is not as much as I would like. But the amount of Hail Marying I'm getting in

is a full rosary's worth a day. So that's where I'm at. And I think that being practical and being honest with yourself and just praying as you can, praying where you need, praying as you do is important. It's like that Job thing where

God is pleased with Job for Job cussing him out. And he's like, but he's praying. Like God interacted with him, but he was mad. Yeah. And everyone's like, well, that's not good.

And it's like, well, no, no, no, but he's praying. What's the line, pray as you can, not as you can't?

That's a great. That's a great. It sounds to try it to be helpful. Right. Actually, it's like, well, how can you pray?

We'll do that. Right. And of course, I could tell myself, if you really cared, you would make time. But I feel like the more habits I create like this,

the more it turns into, now I am praying the rosary every. It's, you know, holiness is, is a slow and steady movement towards heaven, you know. So I'm just trying to allow myself on the march. I want to tell everybody to go and get the power of the rosary.

This just came out by Gabby Castillo. I've had him on the show before. Really great fella. And I want to make sure I've got the book right. Yeah, the power of the rosary by Gabrielle Castillo. Go and get that book. It's the best book I've read on the rosary. Interesting.

I mean, I guess I shouldn't put him up against a montfort or some saints, but you know, this would be the book. I'd really recommend getting it. The power of the rosary. I had a moment where I wasn't watching the podcast on a screen, but I thought, and I went to pull out my phone and be like, power of the rosary. Thanks, Matt. Oh, I'm here for real.

Well, I'll just ask you after, but it's just a very funny moment where I was like, hold up. This is real life, actually. There are cameras on us. It just came out. Here's what it looks like. Power of the rosary. Nice.

It's incredibly helpful. I love that. Yeah, Gabby's awesome. Okay, what else are we got here? Yeah, yeah, what do we got going on? When will Shane be back in Florida? Well, now? This year, in the next month or two, I think.

If you go to shanesmithcom, you will find the dates. I'm doing a theater somewhere around here. I don't know what this means. Do you agree? He says that the culture is saying we're allowed to laugh again. Oh, what does that mean? I mean, so the culture for so long was so offended, and the culture was so serious, like, hey, that's not funny, whatever.

I do think the culture, we are in a everyone's laughing more moment. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The more people laugh, the better things are. Peter C. says, my wife and I saw Shane in Fort Worth last year, and he was great. Question, Star Wars or Star Trek? Oh, Wars. I like a post-apocalyptic fiction as opposed to a utopian fiction. So, Star Trek is utopian.

Yeah, I like that. And Star Wars is post-apocalyptic. So if you notice when you watch Star Wars, like, everything's old, nothing's new, but everything's futuristic, but everything's broken. But they're living in like the ruins of an ancient, more advanced civilization that came before them. And I think that's really interesting. Lifting Disciple says, any advice for a husband and wife going through OCIA this year,

what to expect, what not to expect? whoa um that's a great question going through with your wife sounds so much better than by yourself yeah wow i can't imagine firstly kudos that's awesome my suggestion to you is like just enjoy it just enjoy the time don't rush it don't don't like uh i did this thing there were times where i was so hungry to be baptized and received the euchrist and participate in the mass fully and stuff that I was like, all right, let's go. Let's just get this class over with. Let's get it going.

And I realize like, oh, the class takes as long as it does. And I'm here to learn and enjoy the faith and engage. And this is one of the ways to worship is to give my time and my effort. And so just like be present, be there. It's all a part of it. Don't rush it. I like this question from Quinn. He says, what are your dumbest, pettiest, absolute marriage.

ending opinions. For example, thermostat temperature, subtitles always on during movies, toilet paper roll position, et cetera. Oh man, what is that for me? I don't know. You know what? I really don't have that many. I very confidently think my wife is like annoyed by it where you don't have any strong opinions on things that like I just kind of like, um, I'm so go with the flow that like my wife is in charge of the air temperature. Yeah. Not because I'm not in charge

because I don't care. Yeah. And I love her. Yeah. And she changes it a lot. And I just wouldn't, I wouldn't even notice. I'm a turn the heat off guy.

Like, I'm a like, I don't know. I'm just very simple. Like, before I was married, I was sleeping on a cot. It, in a sleeping bag.

Like, I just don't. Do you have, do you have, so you're saying you don't have many pet peeves? I don't. Yeah. Especially with her. My wife and I have decided

that whoever, says, you know me, I'm easy is not easy. Dude, and I have a fear that that's me. Well, I ask my wife all the time. I'm sure that. No, no, no. I wasn't saying you're saying that. I mean, you'd probably be pretty self-aware to know that, especially if your wife's telling you. Yeah. I'm not easy at all. Really? I have all sorts of things that bug me. When people chew ice in front of me, I need it to be a frigid temperature while I'm sleeping. Even if my wife is having hypothermia, it doesn't matter. I need to be cold so I can sleep well. Um, I need to always She's never allowed to drive.

What am I, you know, a woman? I'm not gonna give you my testicle. I need to drive the car. Even if I've had a beer, not more than one. I need to hold the remote. I needed my exact volume. Now, I'm very difficult to live with. Okay. Yeah, it's unfortunate.

I wish I wasn't. I really wish I wasn't. I'd love to be like, hey, whatever. I think many, many, many couples find themselves and the one is difficult and the other is. Yeah, and maybe I'm exaggerating. Although if my wife were here, I can imagine. you're going, no, no, you're not.

It's funny, my wife has a lot of those. My wife is the like, yeah, yeah, she's got stuff and she stands up for herself. But it's so funny because that's what attracts me to her. Yeah. I love that she's like, I'm cold, turn the heat up. Yeah. Like when she advocates for herself, that is like really admirable quality. I like to be asked of.

Like when, like, I just, I, yeah, when she needs something, it brings, me great joy to give it to her. Yeah. And so to be like, yeah, you're in charge of the temperature because I don't care. It's kind of a slam dunk for me. It affects me zero and I'm the hero. And it rhymes. You know, but eventually now I'm going to have to mitigate, uh, um, conflicts between her and children. And so then I will have opportunities to be the bad guy where I'm like, actually Shane Jr. is right. It should be warmer in here because I have to like sort of that, That then, so I should enjoy being the good guy while I can. Yeah, interesting.

Because I'm going to be in a, I'm going to be in a point where people are going to be mad at me because I have to solve conflicts. And the dad, oh, he's has someone mad at them. Parker Prudholm says, no question. Tell him, I said, thank you for defending prayer on his Instagram and that the comments people left were whack. Oh, thank you. It was insane.

It's insane for people to say the things they did. I literally was in the bathroom, like, while we had a break and there was a comment. meant being like, um, I know that you don't like an echo chamber. So this person has followed me for a long time. I know you don't like an echo chamber. Something, something like, uh, so why aren't you seeing what these people are saying and just crying religious persecution? You're doing what you're accusing them of, which is a crazy, because now we're in a

circle where I could say, well, you're doing what you're accusing me of, you know, like what it's this insane like, is no one paying attention to what I'm saying? It was wild. Yeah, I think I asked you this before, but how do you handle that? How do you handle backlash? There are times I'll say things and I'll get corrected on them

and I'll be like, I don't know if they're right or not, let me check with people. And there are other times I'll say things, people correct me on. And I'm like, no, no, you're wrong. But I do think all of us, maybe to some extent,

have this lizard brain that wants to just shut down controversy and not be the center of everybody's hate on the internet. So how have you handled that? I have handled it by engaging with people that I think are reasonable or who could communicate with me to a point of reason. And when I do that, it's very rewarding and feels good.

So there's a ton of people in that post where I was like, why do you not think this is offensive? And they'll say, well, because he, Gavin isn't being offensive in this tweet where he says they were literally praying as they got shot at because he is referencing the fact that that prayer without action is evil and I go okay I see your point of view I 100% agree with you that he does want that message that's his kind of gotcha message why is saying exactly what he said what does he mean by that what do I take from they were praying while they were shot at literally what does that mean what was my inference and then they say I think the inference is that the prayer didn't help them which is what the inference is right

we all know that all rational honest people know that's what he's inferring yeah and then i say so catholic kids were murdered for the crime of being catholic by an insane person and you say we call out for prayer because prayer is a huge part of our lives deeply integral to everything we do many of us have died for the right to pray and he is say he is you know criticizing prayer do we agree and then they say oh okay i see where you're coming from and then i'm say, so my argument isn't not that something shouldn't be done or even that something should be done. I was ignoring that part. I'm simply saying, I think it's horrific for this shooter who hated God to do that and then for you to try and solve the problem by saying something the shooter

would say. Okay? That's disgusting to me. So I'm Catholic. The victims were Catholic. The shooter targeted them for being Catholic. Gavin is ostensibly Catholic. I couldn't be more in my lane to criticize this. And then someone says, well, they don't reply. So I've gotten to that point in the conversation in that post multiple times and then one, because there's literally nothing to say. Once I get you to that point, you go, so you don't disagree with me, I say, I don't disagree with you. You're just so focused on the politics part. You're not seeing how I feel as a religious person who this is deeply meaningful to and then they say oh i get it but so many people are like no i don't care about your religion prayer is fake you know and then so that's where the disconnect

so how i handle it is by like at least reaching one person and then i go so i'm not crazy so they can hate me i don't care if they hate me so i absorb quite a bit of hate where i'm like whatever yeah you're i can't get you like that girl who was like you you have a christian victim complex after a person murdered children for expressly being christian you have to go what you're crazy i don't have to i don't have to engage with this yeah or care what you think luke w says i know he is a gun guy i am curious if a zombie apocalypse happened tomorrow what rifle or pistol would he want to roll with what rifle or pistol that's such a good question um i mean listen you want whatever is going to have the most ammo so i wonder how much two to three is in the world basically you just get an ar 15

and you or oh man my crank i have an a k chambered and nato ammunition that's pretty cool that's probably what i would use and then so now i've access to all this nato ammunition that's all over the country and the pistol oh dude 22 subsonic enough to get into their brain not enough to make noise so i've got the the zombie remover 9000 from up close uh you know and then i've got the uh the the boy the rifle i can make things happen do you have a favorite zombie movie it's got to be 28 days later doesn't it that's a really good did you see 28 years later is that the latest one yeah yeah is it good it was actually 28 years after the first movie so that's clever i think i think they were waiting for years yeah yeah yeah to wait

i heard it was good i heard it was all right i'm not a horror okay but my brother is huge on horror he watches all new horror movies the second they come out he loves the genre 28 weeks later i thought was very good but 28 years later there you go yeah 28 days later i thought was a good movie but it's not my favorite i think my favorite is um the uh dawn of the dead remake yeah the fast zombies the mall oh wow it's got not that this necessarily matters but rotten tomatoes let's see well rotten tomatoes get 88% but audience gave it 2.2% oh 2.2 stars i should say that's so funny yeah it always cracks me up when the critics are in opposition to the public yeah it's interesting it's it is like what's going on there what are you seeing that i'm not joe connelly says what is your favorite set

you've ever performed he says also my fiancee and i loved your set in Rosemont last year. Nice. Rosemont was good. My favorite set I've ever performed was during COVID. I was hired by a, I was high. I was hired a power company or some kind of solar energy company to perform like during COVID. And it was near the end. So it was when like, are we allowed to do stuff? Didn't we just have protests? Can we get outside? And I went to do a company gig. It was like a corporate, which is bad. those are bad gigs and it got shut down by Gavin Newsom literally he shut these rich people down they were going to do this big conference and they shut down the show so I was going to get paid

like all this money to do this huge conference for like thousands of people at like their you know solar power wind energy whatever Gavin Newsom literally says COVID you're done I shut the whole event down so whatever I'm still going to get paid guys like well you came out and Everyone's bummed and this, this guy, this crazy rich guy is like, hey, I want to do something from my employees at my house. We're going to have a get together, even though it's COVID and we're not allowed. What would you be open to like doing a thing? And I was like, let's do a full show, dog.

Invite everyone to the house. I'll just do a house show. He had a big enough house. Yes. He's got a mansion. He's got a big California house. This guy rocks, by the way. He invites all these people.

We have this big barbecue, this awesome dude. and then everyone eats, we're hanging out, we're talking and whatever, and then we all gather in this living room. I mean, people are like sitting crisscross applesauce on the floor. People are like standing on the banister. It's like, it's just like a full house party. And then with no microphone, no opener, nothing in the middle of a perfectly lit living room,

I just walked up in front of everyone and started doing comedy. And it was the best show of my life. hands down so fun so funny everyone is having the best time like literally just the best show and it was in the coolest circumstances a house party illegal during COVID like it was it just rocked it was the best but those people went nuts dude it was the craziest show when do you know a good percentage of the people in front of me as I perform don't know who I am is Is that usually just an open mic nights that you can be assured of that? Obviously, when they're buying tickets to see you, most of them have some idea who you were.

So I don't really do spots anymore. Not that I don't want to. I just don't. What does that mean? Open mic? It's doing spots. It's like, as a comedian, you work on material and you, you, like, go out at night and you do, like, open mics or, like, 10-minute shows or, like, smaller shows. They're called workout rooms.

And, like, a lot of people put on comedy shows where it's, like, 10 comics for 10 minutes each or whatever. and as a pro you that's where you learn that's where you practice that's where you come up with material i stopped doing that a long time ago i just write everything you see is written i write it out and i'm just pretty aware that it's going to be funny and then it works why don't you do spots um i see i see your point is you work it out on paper as it were but i work it out in my imagination i don't write on paper okay so when i write i just write in my head so like i'll just like play video games to write or I'll go work out or whatever and it just lives up here forever like I've never written I don't transcribe my act okay yeah yeah yeah so um it all is just up here baby

which if you've been watching the whole show and you've seen how many times I forgot what I was talking about is concerning maybe I have to start writing things down um but yeah uh I mean do you think you do well at any given I do and I do go do spots sometimes uh and I do great and what's the the advantage and disadvantage of a 10 minute set versus an hour set? The advantage is that you can get in and out and you can really see how things work and get in, yeah, and get in there. And it's also those workout rooms have the people who don't know you. So a lot of the time, I would say nine out of ten people in a workout room have no idea who I am, which is very fun. I've never had a problem with that. Sometimes I headline and

I can tell like half the room knows me and the other half is new to me. And that's fun. How can you tell that i can just feel it i know what you mean but i can just feel it um i how they're receiving you i gave a talk someone had me come talk about my testimony and i've done that a couple times it perishes and it's so rewarding and incredible and fun and like that's the direction i'd like to move more in my life but i had someone asked me to do it at like a college and of course yeah you you want me to come out and you're going to fly me out and pay me. And on top of that, I get to do something awesome. But when I did it, I could tell like, oh,

only some of these kids are Catholic. Most of these kids are just here to see me talk. And for some reason, by looking at them, I knew. And then when I got off the stage and I started talking to people, then it became apparent to me. I was right. And I was like, whoa, how did I know that?

Yeah, interesting. It was just by looking at how they were reacting to me. Everyone's respectful. Everyone's kind. Everyone's cool. Really weird. How long do you have to win an audience over in any kind of half hour, hour set? The whole time. Because I would think, though, if you miss that first 20 seconds to a minute,

it's got to be really hard to catch up. It can be. Like if the first joke or two don't work, are you screwed? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, you can be. You can lose them and not get them back. I think that you could always get them back. See, you can also get them, lose them and get them back. That makes more sense to me. I could see you could get them, lose them and then get them back. So, for example, we had Jim Gaffigot in a focus conference. He made a joke halfway through after everyone was loving him. He talked about being Hitler's wet dream, you know, that joke he has? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And you could feel a dip in energy. And he went, don't lose me now. Don't lose me now, Catholics or something like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But I would imagine it's very difficult to bomb for the first 20 seconds and then to pick back up. That is hard. And partly, I imagine that's difficult,

is because once you've bombed for the first 20 seconds, and by bombed, I just mean the first couple of jokes didn't land. Yeah. I could see you getting, as a comic, getting anxious and then sucking more as you desperately tried to win them over. That's the classic thing that happens. That's bombing in a nutshell. I watch it all the time.

To real quick clean up, I don't do spots because I live in rural Charlotte and I don't want to go to the clubs. I want to spend time with my family. straight up that's it I'm lazy I want to play video games and I want to be with my wife and my kid and when I'm not doing those things I want to be playing baseball or running or writing or writing or doing any number I just don't care to be on stage it doesn't do anything for me do you not get a rush from it no so for example if you and I were hanging out tonight and

there was a local stand-up club and you could get a spot would you want to no no no I wouldn't care for you does nothing for me okay does nothing for me I think that at one of the, I would think if I was good at something like you are. Yeah. I'd be thrilled to get in there. I'd rather be good at it with you alone. Because what I'm good at is just connecting with people. Okay. What I'm good at is laughing. So I'd rather just have a laugh with you. You know what I mean? Or my why for my friends. The audience doesn't do it. Sometimes, you know, you've had this experience or you've seen this experience where you go and you watch someone, they're playing a show, right? They're singing. They've got their guitar out and they're saying.

and someone will come, hey, you might have my friend plays because their friend is awesome. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's whatever. But do people ever do that to you as a comic? Does that translate over to comedy? It happens like, if you're like out doing spots, sometimes there's someone who's like,

give me the mic, dude, I'm the one. Or open mics, that happens all the time. And how bad are they? Oh, terrible. Never good. Never, not one time ever. Every guy who's ever been like, give me the mic, I'm on it.

It's just immediately started bombing. it's incredible. My favorite thing is when you go to open mics and it's the guy who's funny at work and he invites all of his work friends and they're all really excited and he's very nervous and you call his name and he goes up and bombs in front of everybody and you're like,

whoa, you're learning a lesson about the world right now because you're the king of your workspace. But no one's the king here. We're all jesters, buddy. Yeah. How do you, how does a human win themselves over to a crowd and what does that say about humans? I mean, I think I have some, I have a lot, I think of experience in this and that I get up and speak. I'm going to be speaking to like 15,000

people at Focus Seek this year. But what do you think there? Like what is it that makes someone likable? Can you make yourself likable if you're not naturally likable? No, I don't think so. I think it's a natural thing. I think so too. Jerry Seinfeld has this, not actually not a bit. it was just him saying if you're at a here's how to learn stand up you know then you you should never be doing stand up if you need to go to a class on how to be funny you'll never make it as a committee i agree give up now 100 million percent if you don't have it you don't have it you're not going to get it that's not how it works like and it's also so funny because um i think that if you have it you can make it better but if you simply don't have it like what are you doing i don't know um it goes

back to the like um no one was loved so then everyone was weird where like uh it used to be that people's parents loved them and they were very secure in their identity so you see the funny guy and you go jeff is very funny me and my wife love him and you're not worried about your wife leaving you for jeff because he's funny and you're not secretly angry at jeff and you don't hate him and you also don't need to be him you and that's enough and that's cool and you're a normal guy and you love your wife and you enjoy, but we live in a society where everyone needs attention because it's the way we interact and it's the way we feel valid and good and none of us has security. So everyone wants to be famous. Everyone wants to be the comic. That's why crowdwork is

popular. Crowdwork isn't popular because it's more funny than written bits. Written bits are always inconsistently more interesting, more funny, more exciting, better when you watch comedy. No one's favorite album is a crowdwork or whatever it would be very rare but people love crowdwork because you are a part of it oh i'm there oh he's talking to me okay i can put myself in that situation it it bridges the gap between the crowd and the comic you know what i mean it allows them an opportunity to be famous too and they really really really really need to want that people are obsessed you know and so I think that's like the rise of crowdwork is not is is is everyone's insecurity it's the it's the showing that we're every single one of us is like but I could be the comic what if I was

the comic what if you all liked me what if I was funny and everyone liked me and I had attention and I was loved what if for a moment everyone saw me and it was good you know and it's like honestly heartbreaking that's why anytime I do crowdwork I never ever make fun of people I I build them up that's good so like last time like I did I did some crowd work and I was like what do you do for a living and of course I like to do crowd work and make fun of crowd work as I'm doing it so I'm like talking about how lame it is like okay I'll let's do the blame what do you feel like me and he was unemployed oh and people are like hissing you know we're like people like kind of

and I was like firstly don't be ashamed of that like so you play video get you're a pro gamer you play video games for a living and I was just like and so I started like making it sound like it was great that he was unemployed and I was like what are your hobbies and of course he had like anime and I'm like you're killing me here but it was very fun it was very fun to make him help you here feel cool and then after the show he came up to me and he was a guy who was very clearly like nervous to meet me yep socially awkward one million percent came to the show by himself cargo pants or the lanyard if anyone was wondering what kind of person this was you know what i mean like it's shaking my

hand kind of like nervous like yeah bro that was awesome thank you so much that was so cool what is it about it's almost like that that feel good comedy that i think you're referring to is a direct contrast to say roasting it was like um who's the guy who just did the the espn awards everyone's talking about he got fired from uh snl and then brought back norm no Shane Gillis yes um Shane has this excellent bit about Down syndrome people, where he says, oh, is he okay? He's doing better than almost everyone I know. I'm sorry he's not on anti-anxiety medication like everyone else. And it was just this beautiful bit, I think just made everyone feel good because he was clearly lifting up those people who are so often talk down to or whatever. Yeah. That awful thing that Richard Dawkins said

on Twitter when someone tweeted and said they found out their unborn child is down syndrome and Richard Dawkins said, aboard it and try again, just straight up said that. And everyone knows that's disgusting. And so to have someone like Norm McDonald, I didn't know, no, no, but Shane Gillis call that out, it was just beautiful. So yeah, what do you think about that, about positive comedy versus roasting comedy and what's your opinion of both? I'll, can I be very vulnerable with you? I would love that. So, and we could tie it into something you asked me earlier. So earlier you were like how do you know if you're off the rails so people ask you things or like if you're wrong because you're getting lots of negative feedback like maybe you're wrong super valid

you have to check up on that like in and challenge yourself and your preconceived notions or whatever so um oh my gosh i almost choked to death i aspirated my own spit incredible i am killing it by the way so um all right so we're talking about i'm losing my train of thought because i just almost died sorry that um so roast comedy versus kind of feel good positive oh feel good comedy so um i i got recently i did the thing with uh talking about gavin newsome right yeah yeah and i was like oh man i felt like this is a huge injustice and it bothers me so much and i want to make a snarky little joke to like lash out at these people and sort of educate. So I did that thinking people would be like, I kind of see where you're coming from. He's not doing himself and he favors, whatever. But people

got really mad at me. And so I'm kind of like, all right, people are mad. Am I wrong or am I right? I really, I'm right. I am objectively right now. But everyone's mad at me. And I'm over here saying like Gavin Newsom isn't catching any flies with vinegar and he should use honey. Now, I'm not catching any flies with honey. So that is what I should think about. So I was thinking about that this morning or last night, actually, and this morning. I was thinking about that and I was like, oh, man, and all these people were angry. And I think I was really negative. And I think that I wasn't wrong to stand up for my faith. And I'm not wrong to stand up for prayer. And it's clear these people just simply don't understand my religion or my beliefs. And I'm like, what would have been better

to do. And then I'm like, what probably would have been better would have been to do what I originally thought of, which is to make a little video being like, he said this about prayer. This is what prayer means to us. This is why that sucked. So it would have been less about what he did wrong and more about praying right, a positive video. And I didn't make that video. I made the snarky one. And I was like, I don't think it's wrong to make the snarky one, but what do I as a person and a creator and a man want to do? and I was talking to my wife about it and I was like, I think I want to be just more positive.

And I was like, I keep getting caught up and being frustrated by injustice. Yeah. And then I call it out. And that's righteous and good and funny sometimes. And there is nothing wrong with that. But what do I really want to be making? What do I want to be spending my time on?

And I was like, oh, I should have made a positive video. That's beautiful. Well, Brian Regan, I think, does that well. He's very positive, but he also talks about what annoys him about other people, like Captain Me or, he said he would love to be the guy who walked on the moon. So when somebody's talking about all the things they do, they go, oh, I walked on the moon. So he's clearly pointing out things that annoy him. So I think there's validity to that, but he does that in a kind of gentle, optimistic sort of way. Right, right.

And I'm realizing, like, I want to, I want my comedy to, like, push people. up whatever that means like I'm not like trying to do like some political thing I just mean in spirit like in general and I was thinking about that Gavin Newsom video and like I'm wrong I will double down if they make me prayer is important he was disrespectful to prayer that is bad he should be ashamed of himself and ask for rip he should repent straight up like but also I should be more positive and so I was thinking about like I was just thinking about that like it sucks to admit that I'm wrong in that way, but like, I want to be more positive. So to the, like, positive comedy, I'm actually in a point in my career right now where I'm about to write a new

album. My last album, while I wouldn't say it's negative, it is me being mad at Australia. And the whole thing is, like, really smar me and like, like, I make fun of Australia a lot. Like, I make fun of your money. I make fun of a ton of stuff, you know? I make fun of Canada. I make fun of kangaroos. I know. It's all deal. But, and I'm like, it is fun to do that. But on this next album, like, what if I was only positive? What have I made something sound good? And now I'm like, I think that's what I want to do. I just, I don't know. I don't want to be negative. I want to be less negative even than I have been. I wonder if it's different temperaments receive things differently. Because I think of like snarky kind of comedians. I think of like Bill

the way he's become and others and maybe not Bill Burr but people in that vein where I listen to it and I just feel like I don't know just it's funny it's sort of like when you've got a best friend who's sarcastic they're funny but you kind of feel tired afterwards and then there are people who are funny in a wholesome way right king of the hill yes so like what king of the hill is to that um I don't know many of those other adult cartoons that are right right disgusting and sarcastic there's something nice about that kind of quaint, optimistic humor that's not unintelligent for its quaintness. Right, right.

Donald, maybe. I mean, that's real life humor. That's like the humor we encounter in everyday life. Because you don't encounter like, the most disgusting thing you've ever seen, and you're like, whoa, that's funny. Like, that's not real life. Real life is, um, your wife is like,

look at my cool new jug I just bought. And then it slips down and the, the top of it is still in her hand. and it explodes all over her and your child is laughing so hard they pee their pants. You know what I mean? Like that's regular.

Regular life isn't... Regular funny. Isn't gross. And so when you encounter that wholesome funny, it's very real. It's like, oh, this is just life. What would you say he does that really well?

The Muppets. Okay. The Muppets are the funniest people. You're going to have to send me a link. I don't remember watching the Muppets ever. I don't know if you don't have the nostalgia for them if they will hold up as an adult now. Yeah, I see.

But I adore everything they make. Like, I love the Muppets. They made a Wieser music video. Did they rock? Are they still going? Yeah, yeah. The Muppets are still out and about. They're still a thing.

Why do I think, when I think of the Muppets, you'll have to educate me here. They were the most famous in the 70s when Jim Henson was alive and doing all this stuff. I was about to say, I think of Sesame Street. 70s, 80s, maybe the creatures were made by the same film. Yeah, yeah. I think that the Sesame Street guys are Muppets or they're just puppets. A Muppet is different from a puppet.

How? That's a good question. One's a puppet. Okay, got it. It's hard to say. What do you think? Yeah, keep going. I don't, as far as like wholesome people, I think Nate Bergotsie is like really good.

I've heard that name. I don't know if I've listened to it. You should go listen to him. Okay. Go listen to his half hour comedy special. Nate Bogartzi. Bargazzi. It must be tough when you become popular and then realize that no one knows how to spell your name.

Yeah. That's me. No one knows how to spell my name. Nate B. Oh, there he is. Baragazzi. Yeah, he's super famous right now. He's doing very well for himself. He's kind of him and Leanne Morgan are on the same, like, vibe, you know. I don't know who that is. So, that is Sheila? Leanne Morgan, yeah. So she's a famous Southern comic. I actually think you looked her up and didn't like her. No, she's in her 40s or something? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, my point is I've never encountered a woman I find as a funny stand-up. That remains. Yeah, yeah. But she was close. Leanne's great She has a new sitcom I liked her because it felt like She was being herself And I believed her Right

I find a lot of female stand-up comics Not all but tend to be vulgar or gross Or just not funny I just don't find of funny I find the men who are like that Are also unfunny And again it's an authenticity thing Where you're like him when he was young

Yeah Wow Yeah yeah Okay thank you for pointing that out I'll check him out Yeah yeah So go look his 30 minute special on Netflix is the one you want first.

Really? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Incredible stuff. And you can watch it with your family. It's all clean. God bless it. Well, that, just his set. Good goodness gracious. Easy now. You know, I don't want your kids to be seeing anything. Maybe final question. We can begin to wrap up. But what is your thoughts on roast comedy? As I say, maybe it has a lot to do with temperament.

But whenever I watch a roast, I just feel so gross. It just feels like people attacking each other in mean, vicious ways. And maybe I just don't get it. maybe I'm not temperamentally wired to enjoy it. What are your thoughts? I think roasting at this point has become like a comedy culture thing. Whereas like before it was sort of like the big man of the night and we have some comics and they make some jokes and everyone laughs it off or whatever.

Now it's like intense. Like it's crazy. And a lot of the craziness is you, when you have a roast, you have multiple comics in one area. You know what I mean? So it's no longer just like a couple comics and they make fun of the main guys and then they leave. Like the comics are almost always more roasting each other than anyone else. It's a really weird thing. But so, yeah, the roasts are mean.

Incredibly so. But to get back around to this positive versus negative comedy, did you see how Norm McDonald flipped it when he roasted? Was it Bob Saggett? So I, was it Bob Sagget? Yeah, yeah. Did you ever see that? I can't wait for you to watch it because he just done it. He did a bunch of roasts that were like, like dad jokes.

Yeah. It was so beautiful. I have seen it. I did love that set. Yeah. That roast is good. Um, the only roast battle I was ever in, I won by giving them compliments instead of roast.

I did funny compliments. And they were. And then they were so overtly mean and really, they were funny. But their stuff was so mean that I played it off. Like, what? After, after I was not like in. that ended up being so funny that I won. Okay.

So I'm not a, I have roasted before and I can be like, I can be evil for sure. I've had some roast jokes that were like wild. That even thinking about now, I'm like, oh, why would I say that? It's so crazy to say. But you know what? It is what it is.

Did you see Donald Trump at that Catholic dinner when Kamala didn't show up? Oh, yes. I forget what the name of that dinner is Al Gore. No, no, no, alcohol. What is it? I forget. A bunch of people didn't show up.

And that was, he's hilarious. Yeah, Donald Trump is the funniest president who's ever been. Clearly a funny guy. Yeah. When people try to say he's not funny, it's like, you can't say other things, but he's clearly funny. Yeah, yeah. You're living in some kind of weird world.

He's funny, but he's just, you know. Where do people learn about you? What you're doing, what you're up to? They can go, find me at shainsmithcomedy.com. Shay Dozer, pretty much all, it's what socials are. S-H-A-D-O-Z-E-R. Why is that? That was my gamer tag back in the day.

And I just never changed my Instagram. And now I think it's funny. Shane Dozer. And I just keep it. Why did you choose Shane Dozer? It's a reference to the Kill Dozer, yeah. Okay. Yeah, yeah.

And me and my group of friends, so we grouped up during the Call of Duty Modern Warfare two days. So this is early 2000s Xbox Live. So we were doing Halo and Modern Warfare 2. And so we were on the internet playing games. And there used to be gamebattles.com, which is a website where you could gamble. It was illegal technically, but they shut it down because of the internet gambling.

But what you could do is you could set private matches and then put money in this pot and the website would give it to those who won the match. And so then you would be able to like challenge other people to games to make real money. So we used to play for money. We made quite a bit. playing Modern Warfare 2 on Xbox Live.

In any case, it was a crazy time. And we referenced a killdozer because crazy story, killdozer. I can't wait to your new special comes out. I think I've told you, and I think you were very flattered by this as you ought to be. My daughter once saying,

no, no, not Jim Gaffigan, that Shane guy. Oh, come on. That's the best. Aval Afrad, who is honestly one of the top, I don't know, five funniest women I've ever met. She is hilarious. Yes. And she loves your stuff. So when I told her last night, she was bummed that she had

some homeschooling. She couldn't come. But that's so funny. I'm excited for my new special too. I hope you like it. I did take some, I had some like especially egregious stuff that I decided was too mean to keep in. Oh yeah? Like I referenced the queen a little bit. And I took that. I took that out. I did those jokes in Australia and Canada. And I would say the audiences would like physically recoil. When I do a joke about blowing up a car and in the joke I'm like we put like mannequins

of fake people in there and when we did it, the queen was one of the people we blew up. Okay. And then I say well I'm Catholic, my friends are Irish. This is a slam dunk for us to blow this lady up fictionally, you know and people like, you know, I forget that Canada and Australia like they're almost

more into it than the English. And dude, in Canada especially, I said that like people like a woman like oh like fainting style it was very funny it was wild i did say some pretty like you know controversial things but i was like really the royalties getting you big time were you able to take them out after the fact do you mean or you chose not to include it in the set i didn't include it in the set so once you give the set do you have any editing rights after that the driver yeah yeah yeah they'll like send me a final cut and ask me

what I think and ask me if I, like, want certain things. And if I, have I told them like, hey, I can't, that can't go in. They would save me, yeah, sure. But like, it's dry bar. What could I have said, you know? So I, I do change the jokes a little bit from live to, to internet. Just because I'm like, I was like, there's just no reason for me to be so egregiously attacking the culture of the commonwealth.

Yeah. Like, I know as an American, I want to make fun of the queen. and I think it's very funny and stuff. But I do like see like, hey, that's your thing. And it is sacred in a way. And I will make fun of it on my own time, but I've already made fun of you enough. And I want to strike a balance between fun and not.

And I do want people in the Commonwealth to enjoy it. Here's an interesting contractual question, which you don't have to answer. But does Drybar own the rights to your comedy? Can you say any of those jokes elsewhere? I think so. If you know it's going to be recorded and posted? I think so.

I don't know 100%. I should know that. Just in case they own the recording, not the jokes. Okay. So they own what we made together. But you couldn't presumably go and record that exact same set. You can. Comics have done it.

I won't say names because I don't want to embarrass it or be rude to anyone. Yeah. Because get the bag if you can. But there are multiple comics who did like an HBO special. And then they got the Netflix deal after. Well, that's a much bigger deal. And they redid most of those jokes on the next special. So if you go watch.

those two specials, you'd be like, yo, this is 45 minutes of the same stuff. But like, they knew that they wanted that good stuff for the Netflix audience. So they, and that's fine. Like, sure, yeah, whatever. I'm actually going to, a story that's on my first album, I want to re-record as a bonus second album or as a bonus like seventh album I'm on to make. It would be funny, I think, if you were running out of content and you wanted a new set, you could do just the offensive bits that would never record it as part of a special and explain why it is you wouldn't do them.

That is very funny. That would be a cool live show to do. It would be. I do that in a way. The reason I think that would be funny and interesting is that people would, even you explaining why it is you couldn't do this and then doing it,

it would just feel more less of a performance and more of a kind of dialogue and... Yeah. But I'm not a comedian, so don't take any advice from me. that's funny. I like that. Yeah. I, uh, yeah, I want to do a crowdwork album. And we've talked, I've talked so much trash about crowdwork that I'm like, you know what? I should show people that I'm capable of it. What's the best crowdwork comeback or back and forth you've had? I've had. Oh, I've had a ton of like really, really, really incredible crowdwork moments. Here's the thing about

crowdwork. It really is if the crowdwork rarely, when it goes really well, it's almost often like the crowd it's hot and it's fun. So just to involve them and to just do jokes, it's like, great. It's a slam dunk. Like, I totally get why comics do it. I get why they farm clips. It just bothers me that it seems like it also hurts the,

the art form as a whole. And that's also my opinion. I don't know that for sure. I'm not in every comedy club every week, you know? But like, yeah, I think that, so, you know, crowdwork is awesome. So it's pretty easy. So when you say, like, best one, like, I don't know, man.

I've had a lot. I'm trying to think of a very specific time where it was crazy. Oh, man. I've had some wild moment. I did a show with a friend of mine. It was an all black show. And as someone coached me into saying the N-word and the crowd, people were like, there was a doo-do.

I literally thought he was going to throw up from laughing. that's how hard he was like it was it was one of the like biggest laughs i've ever seen in my life me and my friend got the laugh together but he's like trying to coach me into saying the n-word and i was like what does he coach be he was like say you know like say we're all cool you're the only white guy here there's no phone like you say it no no but i i did pretend like i was going to and it was a whole thing but it was like just the fact that i said something that sounded like it. Yeah.

And everyone was just going crazy. It was really funny. It was one of my favorite comedy moments ever. Yeah. It was really, really, really funny. Good. I always love talking to you. Thank you for taking the time to come here and hang out with me.

Of course. I love hanging out, man. Thank you for having me out in beautiful sunny Florida. You're welcome. Well, God bless, man. Thank you. Last time we ended a podcast, we hit the St. Michael's. Do you want to pray to St. Michael?

honor of my diocese banning it. You want to lead us? No. I don't know it good enough. Son, Holy Spirit. Amen. St. Michael, the archangel, defend us in battle. Be our defense against the wickedness and snares of the devil. May God rebuke him.

We humbly pray. And do thou, our prince of the heavenly hosts by the power of God, cast into hell, Satan. And all evil spirits who prowl throughout the world seeking the ruin of souls. Amen. Amen. Done. Let's go. Ha ha.