Pints With Aquinas - So … The Russell Brand Interview | Cameron Fradd | Last Call Ep. 22

Episode Date: July 9, 2026

It’s Last Call! My good wife, Cameron, is here so we can chat and catch up with you on our goings on.  Pints: Last Call Ep. 22 - - - 📚Resources Mentioned: Pints With Aquinas (Malcolm Guite) https://youtu.be/CcYToxtmFHs?si=7gmTyT-PypPaFVoB Pints With Aquinas (Russell Brand) https://youtu.be/EchxNAlT79Q?si=_AdKamVkx1jDgWOv Truthy 30 Day Free Trial: https://get.truthly.ai/TlbX/MATT30 Enjoy these episodes and exclusive content ad free, one week early with DailyWire+ : https://get.dailywire.com - - - Today’s Sponsors:  Exodus 90: Download the Exodus 90 app today, or visit https://Exodus90.com/matt Catholic Match: Visit https://CatholicMatch.com or download the app today. It’s free to get started Catholic Herald: Go to https://thecatholicherald.com and use code FRADD for 30 days of free access Exodus 90: Download the Exodus 90 app today, or visit https://Exodus90.com/matt St. Paul Center: Start your 30-day free trial today at https://stpaulcenter.com/pints. Or become an Annual Member and receive a free copy of the complete Ignatius Catholic Study Bible. - - - Become a Daily Wire Member and watch all of our content ad-free: ⁠⁠https://www.dailywire.com/subscribe⁠⁠ 📲 Download the free Daily Wire app today on iPhone, Android, Roku, Apple TV, Samsung, and more. - - - 📕 Get my newest book, Jesus Our Refuge, here: https://a.co/d/bDU0xLb 🍺 Want to Support Pints With Aquinas? 🍺 Get episodes a week early and join exclusive live streams with me! Become an annual supporter at 👉 ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://mattfradd.locals.com/support⁠⁠⁠⁠ - - - 💻 Follow Me on Social Media: 📌 Facebook: https://facebook.com/mattfradd 📸 Instagram: https://instagram.com/mattfradd 𝕏 Twitter/X: ⁠⁠⁠https://twitter.com/Pints_W_Aquinas⁠⁠⁠ 🎵 TikTok: ⁠⁠⁠https://tiktok.com/@pintswithaquinas⁠⁠⁠ 📚 PWA Merch – ⁠⁠⁠https://dwplus.shop/MattFraddMerch⁠⁠ 👕 Grab your favorite PWA gear here: https://shop.pintswithaquinas.com - - - Privacy Policy: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.dailywire.com/privacy⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Visit buick.com.ca for more details. Yeah, that's fine. It was more if Avala needed something right now. This should be the show, just us figuring out. family stuff. 20 years. 20 years. That's pretty wild.

Yeah. Are we moving? Do we want to talk about that? Sure. Cold showers, holy hours, and 2 a.m. night vigils. Join Father Columba Jordan and the Exodus 90 Brotherhood for the St. Michael's Lent Challenge. We start August 12th. Download the Exodus 90 app today or visit Exodus 90.com slash Matt.

Cameron Fred. Welcome to Last. Cool. Thanks for having me, honey. You look beautiful. Lovely to have you on the show. Thank you. It's always nice when your hair and makeup people can do this. I look way better than when we went to coffee this morning. I disagree, but I think you look great then too. But wonderful jewelry from Lithuania. My goodness gracious. Thank you. This really cute, attractive Australian that I know flew to Lithuania, preached the gospel and brought me back gorgeous amber that I'm loving. That was me, right? Oh, yeah. Some of us right. Well, I have a list of things that we need to talk about today, like going to Lithuania and meeting the patriarch of Constantinople. I want to talk about that. Interviewing Russell Brand and the fallout from that, joining the Daily Wire and what my honest opinion has been,

it's been about seven months since I've been here, I think. Yeah. That's wild. Yeah, that's longer than some relationship. Not ours, but some people. I want to talk about the Mormon fallout from when I addressed them. And then Malcolm Gait. I really enjoyed him. Like, I kind of wish that he was our kids' grandparents. Don't tell your dad my dad that. I want him to be my grandparent. Yeah.

Yeah, he was beautiful. Well, I guess we could just talk about Malcolm now. So I had known about Malcolm for a while. He has these lovely shows on YouTube where it's actually his wife who knocks on the door. And he's like, oh, come in, come in. And she sits down and he just smokes a pipe and talks to her. I would love to have a double date with them. Oh, my goodness.

Yeah, he would love you. I think I'd enjoy him. And I'd enjoy her. The fact that she even does that for him. They just, I don't know. And one of my questions to him was, what's your favorite pipe tobacco? And he said his wife doesn't mind the smell of pipes, especially the more, what do you say? Not the English blends, but the aromatics.

Oh, okay. Yeah, so he'll smoke that in the house, but that he has like a den down the back of the garden, a shack where he smokes his cigars. That's kind of like you. I have you smoke the cigars outside, but I don't mind pipes inside. Yeah. I am in agreement with her. So I think I'm beginning to maybe switch over to pipes, which is wild, because for the longest time, I haven't preferred them.

I'm proud of you. I like a pipe. Like, I feel like it's relaxing, it's inviting. My hair doesn't reek. My clothes don't reek. I feel like when you smoke cigars, and cigars are better than cigarette smoke, but they're still not as good as pipe. Pipe smoke is like, oh, that's nice.

Yeah, you can actually get a good, this is a good advice for the fellas out there who want to smoke around their wife or something. you can get good aromatic blends. Like the other day, I don't think you even realize what it was that you were smelling. We remember we were out in the back deck and you're like, oh, that smells amazing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think then you realize it was my pipe. Yeah, no, I thought it was a nice candle or maybe some incense.

Come on. That's great. Yeah, so he was terrific and that episode absolutely exploded the main episode because it's on Spotify and Daily Wire and everything. I think it's already over a million. It was really good. I was sad to break up the episode. I didn't have enough time to watch the whole thing. But I feel like it would have been nice to light a fire and just sit and just enjoy the whole episode and one sitting. Yeah.

So many people. I don't just mean the main episode that got it to a million. It was also the breakout clips. They got like 3, 400,000 people were loving it. So that was a real honor to have him on. And we, I think, crashed their site and sold his books out. That's awesome. That's nice.

Patriarch. So I was just in Lithuania recently and had the joy of speaking at a big Congress there in Vilnus. where the beautiful divine mercy image is. Vilnus used to be part of Poland, and so Sister Faustina, now St. Faustina was there and was guiding the artist in the drawing of that. But the patriarch of Constantinople was there, and the bishop of Vilnius wanted to introduce me to him, and I was thrilled about that, obviously. Am I right in thinking that he's kind of the head of the Orthodox? Yeah, he's the head of the Greek Orthodox. church and he would hold the highest ranking among old orthodox churches.

Okay, so almost like our Holy Father? Kind of, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it was really amazing. What an honor to meet him. He was, so it was very, you know, everyone was gathered around him trying to meet him. And the bishop said this. And I don't know if I should be laughing or as embarrassed as I am, but he said,

Your Excellency or whatever they call him, your old holiness or something. They said, this is Matt Frat. He's a podcast. You're like, I want to crawl in a hole and die. I'm a podcaster. But he's not wrong. It's not like I have much else to offer than that. But it's not like you're sitting in a basement recording on a microphone. That's true. I mean, that's how you started. I just think it's funny. Like, what was the Patriarch's supposed to do? Oh, wow, podcasting. He was so paternal and beautiful, just a short amount of time I was with him. Like, he wrapped his hands. around my hand and asked me how I was and where I was from.

Like a real fatherly presence. Oh, it was such an honor. And then what's funny is, okay, so then I'm walking back somewhere else to work on the talk I was about to give. And the fellow who was taking the photos sent them to me. And only then did I realize I was standing right next to, he was a bishop, Pope Benedict the 16th private secretary. Oh, wow.

Yeah. And I didn't even know him. I didn't even notice, didn't say hi. Do you wish you could go back, turn and say hi? Yes, yes, definitely. And then we- Maybe he's watching right now. I doubt that.

And then we uploaded these photos to Facebook and it said this might be AI of me in the Patriarch. And someone said not even Facebook can believe it. Ah ha ha ha. So that was fun. Very good. What was your opinion of my interview with Russell Brand? Did you- I liked it? I did.

Yeah. Yeah, I really, I enjoyed it. I feel like, I know people have said that like his conversion, is fake, I just feel like, you just have to look at him and listen to him to hear his heart. And I thought he had a really beautiful heart and just sharing. And like, this is what the Lord's done. And seeing his beat up Bible, like, that is not a Bible that he's pretending to have a conversion with. Like, it kind of reminds me of my Bible back in the day that was, like, covered in duct tape. It was just like a cheap Bible that had so many bookmarks. And so, and I didn't

know where the verse was, but I knew it was on this side of the page and it was a pink highlighter, you know and I just yeah I enjoyed it you made him very I mean he's normally very human but I feel like the two of you fed off each other well and I think it was good for him to have that I loved his humility I didn't see the Pierce Morgan interview is that the one that was yeah not great but I think this was a great I don't know if it was like the next interview he did was okay I think it was beautiful for him to come back and just have such a humble demeanor like he's not saying I never lived a life of sin, like he admits it and he's repented and loves the Lord? Yeah, it was an interesting interview, right?

Because he actually contacted me a few days before to see if I would do it virtually. And I said, no. And so he said, no problem at all. And we got on the phone together. He was really sweet. And so I flew in specifically for that interview. And it was hard, right? Because, I mean, this man is being accused of having done some really evil things.

And maybe he did them. I don't know. And so I, but he also has. hasn't been, you know, it hasn't been proven or anything like that in a court of law. So, you know, we brought it up. And so I think maybe in the beginning I was a little intense with him because I was like, I need to bring this up, right? But in about, I'd say it took about 30 minutes like all conversations that I, a lot of conversations that I have. And then we got into a real good flow. And I am with you. A lot of people are telling me, no, his conversion is fake.

And here's my thing. If somebody tells you that I have converted to Jesus Christ, unless you have good reason to think this person is lying, I think you should accept what they're saying is true. I think that's always the case. If another human being says something about themselves, you should accept it. Now, and here's why I accept it. I thought you had a good point. I mean, the Bible he carries around everywhere. It's just like a little cheap Bible. I know somebody who is a popular. Catholic Bible teacher, I'll just say his name because he doesn't mind Jeff Kavens, Russell's been in contact with him for over two years, right, in private. Next, he's been sober for, I want to say over 10 years. So it's not like he's, oh, look, he's pretending now he's all good. No, he's actually been off drink, off tobacco, off drugs for well over 10 years, if my memory serves. Also, his Christianity is weird and infected, I would say, with New Age thinking. Sure. So what a weird thing to do to try to win the Christians over but have a weird take on things.

Yeah. His wife is a traditional Catholic, that's another reason. And then finally, like, what's the argument? Is the argument that he's going to whitewash his personality so that his peers in a court of law will be like impressed with him and let him off? Better to become a Mohammedan or an atheist to him. Who's thinking that being a Christian is going to impress people in England? Well, I also think he would have become more squeaky clean.

If that was his plan, he's not doing a good job because he's still very much him. Yeah. And as you said, there's a lot of, it's mixed, right? But it's like, okay, if you were going to do that, wouldn't you be like the perfect Christian if you were faking something? Yeah. And then people will say, oh, it's so convenient like now that like all this stuff comes out. And it seems to me that what they're saying is, oh, now he's hit rock bottom. I'm like, yeah, but isn't that like the cliche?

And it's a cliche for a reason. Like when people hit rock bottom and their life implodes, they tend to, like, reach out to God. So are you saying that's not allowed or that doesn't happen or when it does happen? That happens to a lot of us. A lot of conversions happen because of rock bottom. Yeah. I also think you let him have his dignity. Like we, like John Paul II says we are not the sum of our failures and weaknesses.

Like, we were the sum of the father's love. So even if he's done horrible things in his past, like he's still a son of God and he has dignity and worth that we ought to treat me. And he has done really rotten things in his past. And he's condemned those things. He said, I was a sexual deviant. I was disgusting. All of that.

And I agree with him. I think all those things are disgusting. I also think that if I was as good looking, charming, rich and as famous as him, I would have been worse. And I think a lot of people who are clutching their pearls and yelling at him, also would have been. It's just they're ugly, don't have much money, and no one wants to be with them. And so it's easy for them to point the finger and make fun of him. Now, with all that said, maybe he is lying. Like, maybe this is all a charade. But what I'm saying is, unless you've got

a good reason, I just feel like the internet is a breeding ground for cynicism. Oh, I know why you did. Error on the side of mercy. I like that. Yeah, charity. Yeah, charity and mercy. Yeah. That's what I think. living in the information age is that we can start treating everything as information, even our faith. We consume content, we learn facts, we listen to talks, we accumulate knowledge. But Christianity isn't ultimately about information. It's about a relationship with Jesus Christ. And one of the primary places we encounter him is in sacred scripture. That's why I'm excited about what the St. Paul Center is doing. Their mission is simple. Helping Catholics, encounter Christ through Scripture and grow in confidence sharing the faith.

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Here's why. Okay, so Daily Wire hires a Catholic apologist. That's weird. I kind of feel like they still feel like they made a mistake. They don't realize it, but I'm like, you're going to realize it soon because they were very clear, you know, like, we're not going to get in your way. You can do what you want. Like, great. So my second episode was telling the Jews that the Catholic Church is that. the new Israel and they need to convert. I had an episode on Islam that was pretty blistering. You know, interview against the Mormons. But here's the thing. It all happened in one day. All right. So I sit down with Joe Heshmeier. We go after the Mormons. Cool. Then I sit down with Joe Heshmeier again. We review videos from Mormons and respond to them. Cool. Then I do a monologue, right, where I write this article and they turn it into a video essay. That all happened in one day.

So it was all supposed to be like one episode. Yeah. But they decided because it would work better to release it as separate content. It looked like you're doubling down each time. Yeah. And I'm happy to. Like I'm happy to double down or triple down or quadruple down. But it just sort of, yeah, it gave the impression, I think, that I was coming after them specifically.

But here's the big thing. So like, Dally Wise is this big company. And people often think that there's, I don't know, it's also desperately organized when it's like, no, no, this is a company like, a lot of companies where things go through the cracks, right? So whoever's in charge of their blog portion or article portion on Daily Wire, they were like, yeah, just send us articles who want us to post. I'm like, well, here, I wrote a monologue against Joseph Smith. And they're like, yeah, sure, we'll post that.

I think they were wrong. They also agree with me. They were wrong to do that. Okay. And here's why. One thing, if I'm on my show ranting and raving about other religions I disagree with, which I plan to, which I do, which I do, and plan to continue. With all other religions?

except for... But it's another thing when I release... When they release an article, it looks like Daily Wire. They're giving the stamp of approval. Right. And Daily Wire is a conservative company. They love Mormons because Mormons are part of that big conservative tent.

That's just not my mission. Like, my mission isn't like conservative republic. That's not my thing. My thing is I want you to be Catholic. Church. So, anyway, that was what happened with the Mormon thing. And that leads us to Daily Wire in general. So I'll answer this question, but I want your take. How do you think, honestly, and be really honest, how do you think it's been?

I think it's been great. I feel like you love what you do. And I feel like the more hats you were wearing and as the years have gone by and the more you had to kind of oversee other people and other things, I could see the light dimming and you like kind of going out. I feel like, yes, I feel like that's why you have to have August off because you kind of. to come back alive and it's like, okay, he's above water, he's not drowning, and then you slowly get to the point where you're drowning again. And I feel like Daily Wire took a huge burden off of your shoulders, and they were like, all these things that you don't like doing and you're not good at, we have people that are really, really good at it, and we're going to have them do it, and you can just do what you're good at. And I feel like you had a new zeal for the show again and a new excitement, and you get excited when you come in for a week, you know, know? I actually do. Like, I had really just. Yeah, I think it's great. I feel like it's, and I don't know, I don't watch all your episodes, but I, I feel like you, it was like you were set free and like the, the weights were taken off and you're running again, and there's a joy and a beauty and a zeal that's come back that wasn't, that I could see that was going out, that maybe other people couldn't see, but because I know you so well and intimately, I knew. So I think it's been a great, a great.

I know that, as I say, the internet is a breeding ground for cynicism, and so people will believe what they want to believe. But the fact of the matter is, I am thrilled to be here and that everyone at the Daily Wire has been so kind to me. You know, Brett Cooper, who used to be part of the Daily Wife, she left, and she was saying in a video that people were trying to get her to speak out against Ben Shapiro, and she's like, why would I do that? He has only been kind and supportive to me.

And it's like, same thing here. Like, Ben's been, I don't have a lot of interaction with him because, you know, he's he doesn't, you know, he's not in Nashville, but he's been terrific and supportive. Yeah, everyone here in the company's been amazing and they stuck to their word. Yeah. Do you remember there was like two weeks of me saying, you know this is a Catholic podcast. You promise me I can keep, you know. And they've let you. And it was in the contract. Yeah. And so yeah, they have. They've completely let me. I mean, I even published an article called why Ted Cruz is wrong about Christian Zionism. I've done articles. It's just.

The mainstream narrative, I think, some of it might be right, but I think 90% of what I hear is just false. I know it's false because I'm here and I can see that it's false. And then I see people who aren't here saying things. Like, wow, that's interesting. It actually makes me wonder how much stuff I just accept that isn't true. But no, they've been amazing. And here's the thing. It's not like I'm doing my Catholic show and they're saying, hey, don't make it so Catholic.

And I'm saying, look at the contract. No, it's like no one is telling me who to have on. No one is. Yeah, so I agree with you. Everyone's been lovely. Producer Maria is a saint and makes this show happen. And Melanie and Luke, who does social media and Olivia, who does the edits to the intros. It's a real honor. Yeah. We have a beautiful statue, as you know, of the Blessed Virgin Mary up there. And I pray with my guests before every episode and just Lord Jesus for the conversion of sin. through the Immaculate Heart of Mary. And then if it's a Protestant, I always make them sacrifice a bird. That's a joke. I don't make them do that. That would be awful. Go outside, catch a bird, turtle dove, preferably. Yeah, I'll settle for a whatever, a crow.

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that are like, oh, wow, are you back visiting Florida? It was a si-op. Yeah, we had that whole video. Like, we're moving. Well, that was the plan. It was the plan to be fair. It was the plan. Yeah, I feel good about us staying put.

Yeah, me too. And I'm grateful for it. No, I, yeah, it's funny. I'm really proud of us for making this decision. Okay. Do you remember our friend Carrie saying to us, you guys move the way people vacation? Yes.

And, you know, when we took this job, It was, it just, we just, no one said we had to move here, but it seemed to make sense. But, yeah, I'm, I'm, after having made, you know how people say one of the signs of God's will is that you'll feel tremendous peace. Yeah. And I think after we made that decision, both of us are like, oh my goodness, obviously, we want to stay here. Yeah. Yeah, I think whenever you have, um, trials and rough times. and my health stuff.

It's just like it's not worth the risk of trying out a new location, new doctors, new hospitals, new, you know. Do you think we're just antsy, ADD people? Is that why we're? No, I think that we were trained from, we were missionaries when we first got married, and it was a one-year commitment. And we were like, Lord, wherever you want us to go,

we will sell everything, we will give everything away, and we'll go where you want us to go. And I think we still have missionary spirits, and we're happy to do that. Like if the Lord said, I want you in Croatia, or I want you in Italy, like we drop everything and go.

And I don't think that's a bad thing. I think it's, sure, Lord, where do you want us? But I think that we need to do a better job, especially the more kids we have, and it's not just us that's being affected, it's all of them. It's like, okay, should we do this?

And to be fair, our kids are homeschooled, and we are their center of gravity, as it were. So when we do crazy things, like go to Austria or something, they want to come with us? When we say, we're going to move to Croatia, they're like, okay, maybe. Yeah, they're a part of it. We're not dragging them along. They're part of the discernment as well. But, no, I don't think we're crazy.

I think we were trained as missionaries early on. And I think it's a good sign of detachment that we're willing. But I think it was prudent for us to stay in this time, this situation. I think it was good. What's something you're looking forward to? I'm looking forward to our anniversary trip. Yes. We won't say where we're going.

We won't. But I'm pumped. 20 years. 20 years. That's pretty wild. Yeah. Your dad would say you don't get that for manslaughter. Yeah, my dad, for those at home, has a joke.

Well, oh, Dad, why have you been married like 35 years? Yeah, you don't get that for manslaughter. I really do not sound Australian anymore. Yeah, you do. I can tell because when I impersonate my dad, that accent. started up. So different to mine. Yeah.

I'm actually really excited. I don't think I've told you this or not, but, you know, like, so for a few years there, I would give up the internet every August. And the last two years, I haven't done that. Have you not? No. Weren't we, we were in a foreign country last August, right? You know, here's why.

Because when we went to Austria, how long we were there? Three months last year? I think so. I batched a bunch of recordings. And then we were in Austria and I was writing my books. So it seemed a bit weird to be like, and I'm going to take all of August off. It's like, dude, you've been hanging out, drinking beer and writing books.

Yeah, that's true. So it seemed completely unnecessary. But I actually have it baked into my contract here that I'll be away in August. But everyone, don't be afraid. You will not be pints with Aquinas deprived throughout the month of August because we record these interviews ahead of time. So nothing will change as far as what's on YouTube and what's on Daily One. wire, but yeah, I'm really looking forward to it. And I think I will do it. I think I'm going to do

this. I'm going to give my phone and computer away again for the month of August. Yeah, it's wild for you. Your life gets way more complicated. It's true. Hopefully not as much now that you're with Daily Wire. Like, they take a lot of that on. Yeah, you just have Maria calling you every day. That's true. What the? The world is burning down. Do you want me to tell them? Yeah. I remember one year, something big happened. I can't remember what it was. You know what it was? I think it was the McCarrick scandals, the sex abuse scandals. Sorry, I didn't mean to laugh at that. That looked really bad. What was funny was you and I were at Divine Liturgy on Sunday and the priest was like talking about this. I'm like, what's going on? And I was like, oh, yeah. You know, looking back on my

little life, that will be one of the best moments of my life. You and I in July were in New York City. I bought a copy of the brothers Karamazov. I'd never read it before. And then it was So last day or two of July, I had you change the password to my computer and phone. We were in a friend's condo on the beach, remember? No. Kerry's Beck. Oh, yeah, yeah. So who it carries, yeah.

And I remember just being like, that's it. And then I plotted out how many chapters I'll read a day for all of August. I think I should have been a bit more loving to you because you were like, where is my husband? He's like having a coffee, just reading. Dostevsky without a phone. What, the world's burning down. I was looking forward to more of us time and family time, but... Yeah, I promise to do that this year.

Okay, good. Yeah. I look forward to that. Yeah. But you loved it. You had a good time with Brother Kay. Oh, that was the best time. Yeah.

You know, there's a big lie about the brothers, and that is that it's difficult to read. It is. It's not. When you read it to me and you made the names much more simple, I enjoyed it. Yeah. I wonder how much of that is just this myth around books, because they seem so distinguished, and so you think I could never possibly. You're also not dyslexic, too, so I think that's in your favor.

We have to say what happened this morning. That was so funny. There was a sign behind you, and I looked at it like three times. So I'm very dyslexic. So I'm like, I'm sure I'm reading this wrong. And I thought it was supposed to say. Yeah. But it was.

That's not a word, right? And I was like, honey, am I wrong? Is that supposed to say? Does it say... There's no way that's... It was a decorative sign. Maybe it's like... In French or a foreign language?

Is it really the restaurant name? But what... How do you print... Sorry, everybody, I'm talking to producer Maria right now. Like... Like, how do you... Oh, it's the restaurant name. That's what Maria's telling me, my ear.

That's the name of the restaurant. Yeah. They spelt wrong in the... That's the name of the restaurant. Maybe they spelled it wrong on accident, but they'd already printed out the signs. Like, well, let's just go with, tell people it's French. People can look up and see that it's not French. Okay.

Oh, that's funny. Okay. I just assumed I was reading it. Oh, yeah. Okay, well, just beep it out. We can't even say this because of security. Oh. And we can wrap up.

Cameron, I love you. Thank you for being here on my podcast. You're welcome. Thank you for having me. Spotify. It's Jay Shetty. Are you one of those media strategy people? Scrolling through spreadsheets, searching for an audience that pays twice as much attention to your ads than they do on social?

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