Pirate Wires - Vance/Walz VP Debate Reaction, Port Workers Threaten America, & Pirate Idol Quarterfinals

Episode Date: October 4, 2024

EPISODE #72: Welcome back to the pod! This week we're discussing the VP Debate between JD Vance and TIm Walz. Vance shined in the spotlight, solidifying his spot at the top of the Republican Party. We saw a return to somewhat normalcy. The port workers threaten to go on strike. And we have our next round of Pirate Idol! A 80 year old man gets put in prison for cloning sheep? WTF? Featuring Mike Solana, Brandon Gorrell, Riley Nork, Matt Marlinski We have partnered with Polymarket! Get your 2024 Presidential Election Predictions: https://polymarket.com/elections  - Disclaimer: Not Financial Advice, For Entertainment Purposes Only. Sign Up For The Pirate Wires Daily!  https://get.piratewires.com/pw/daily Pirate Wires Twitter: https://twitter.com/PirateWires Mike Twitter: https://twitter.com/micsolana Brandon Twitter: https://twitter.com/brandongorrell Riley Twitter: https://x.com/rylzdigital Matt Twitter: https://x.com/mattmarlinski TIMESTAMPS: 0:00 - Intro

Gentlemen, the audience can't hear you because your mics are cut. I immediately was impressed by J.D. Vance, I think, as most of the country was. Politico said it could convey to voters aggression and opposition to feminist ideals. Meanwhile, Waltz's bug eyes showed his passion and emotional intensity. J.P. Morgan analysts are estimating the pork strike could cost the U.S. economy $4 to $4.5 million a day. Nostalgia vibes, it's nice to see the Jersey mob back at it again. An 81-year-old Montana rancher was sentenced to six months in prison this week after cloning a quote, near threatened species of sheep.

What's up guys, Welcome back to the pod. We are, I mean, we got to talk about the debate, just straight out of the gate. We're going to talk about, obviously, we've got our polymarket segment coming up. We're going to look at Walt's Vance sort of expectations versus reality. And then we're going to talk quite a bit about the pork crisis, the strike. But first, I mean, Tuesday was the battle of the, I don't know, junior guys. And we all have opinions on it, but I would like to just start with a breakdown. with a breakdown. Yeah, sure thing. So Ohio Senator J.D. Vance and Minnesota Governor Tim Waltz took the stage. It was their first and only scheduled VP debate of the election cycle. Right away, we sort of saw a dynamic that would come to embody a sort of viral meme that would appear on X shortly after the debate, which was J.D. appearing calm, confident, Tim Waltz sort of appearing nervous, stuttering, eyes kind of bugging out a little bit, which some attributed to his passion.

More on that later. You once again saw some weird editorializing and fact-checking by the moderators, which JD called out in real time, after which they cut his microphone, which was a bit of a notable moment. But outside of that one instance, though, you had many people commenting on it was a bit of a notable moment. Um, but outside of that one instance, though,

you had many people commenting on it being a bit of a more civil debate than ones we've seen recently. Um, one moment that went absolutely under the radar, um, in mainstream coverage, so much so that we had to like put out a piece on it, uh,

was Walt's once again, claiming that hate speech isn't protected under the first amendment, which is simply not true. Um, JD was calling him out for saying that in the past, and Waltz only doubled down on his comments, which was very revealing. But while they didn't pick up on Tim Waltz apparently not having a grasp of or recognizing the First Amendment, the media was quick to touch on an equally important issue on the minds of voters everywhere, which was JD Vance's facial hair. Politico said it could convey to voters aggression and opposition to feminist ideals. Meanwhile, Waltz's bug eyes showed his passion and emotional

intensity. So I think an apology might be in order for Pirate Wires here, Solana. We thought the big story out of this was the Democrat VP nominee throwing the constitution out the window. Little did we know it was actually JD's five o'clock shadow. So we'll have to do a better job of that next time, I guess. How could we? I immediately was impressed by JD Vance, I think as most of the country was. I expected him to be good at a debate. I didn't expect him to be so thoughtful about policy and to constantly be actually fully answering questions directly, but then also expanding on them. And I think that they both had sort of two different goals in this one um jd had to go in there and

seem i think like a safe choice specifically to women uh he's very unpopular with women right now i think that was i think i believe that my sense is that that was his goal i think waltz had this bit of a reputation as a crazy person because of his policies, which are crazy. And he had to just seem like a nice, not crazy guy. And I think in that, they both succeeded. In the head-to-head fighting, JD dismantled Waltz until I would say the January 6th question at the very end of the show, where I don't know that JD, he didn't seem to pick a lane there and it sort of fell apart. I think he could have been much more aggressive, but I think he was worried about sacrificing the niceness, the nice rapport he had with Walt, which he was using to, I think, attract voters.

And that probably was my biggest takeaway was not even the fact that J.D. was very smart, very competent at the debate. I think he'd be a great guy in the White House. I think went back and forth and um and really wanted to give the other one their flowers and by flowers i mean like on the topic of a hurricane they would say like i don't think i really don't think that that you are glad this hurricane happened, but it was still sort of a stark contrast. It existed in stark contrast to the last, I don't know, eight years of debates. I just hadn't seen something like it in a while. And I do think that also just J.D. came off better than really any Republican I've seen ever at a debate, I think. It just also doesn't matter because one, debates don't matter and two, VP debates don't matter. that framed Vance getting cut off and muted because he was being fact-checked

as Vance talking over or yelling over the moderators. Like it was some sort of sexist thing that he was doing. And that's why he was, and he was, so he deservedly got cut off, right? Because Vance was being a sexist at that moment. Yeah, that was one of the key moments. We should actually just, let's play that whole clip, Matt. That was one of the key moments of the debate, I think. Margaret, I think it's important because-

We're going to turn out of the economy. Thank you. Margaret, the rules were that you guys weren't going to fact check. And since you're fact checking me, I think it's important to say what's actually going on. So there's an application called the CBP One app, where you can go on as an illegal migrant, apply for asylum or apply for parole and be granted legal status at the wave of a Kamala Harris open border wand. That is not a person coming in, applying for a green card and waiting for 10 years. That is the facilitation of illegal

immigration, Margaret, by our own leadership. Thank you, Senator, for describing the legal process. We have so much to get to, Senator. Those laws have been on the books since 1990. Thank you, gentlemen. The CBP1 app has not been on the books since 1990. It's something that Kamala Harris created, Margaret. Gentlemen, the audience can't hear you because your mics are cut. It's interesting because while it went down, I was learning from it. Before the moderator interjected, I was appreciating J.D.'s expanding on the different kinds of migrants there are and how that process worked. It was actually just something that doesn't typically happen in a debate, which is just like a sort of fact-based description of policy and how it works and how he

would change it. And we're not used to that. We're used to soundbites and fighting back and forth and funny jokes now in the age of Trump. But this was something that we never get. The moderator tries to cut him off um and then jd says something very interesting which i actually had not realized leading up to this debate that there was a rule against fact checking and um it seems that she very clearly broke that rule you know she's providing context but then you can't but then you're not allowed to you're not allowed to interrupt her while she's providing context what What that does is it gives her, this random fucking journalist, God powers over two candidates for vice president. Neither Waltz nor Vance owe her this. Who is she? I didn't vote for this woman. She's not in the running. I'm not going to

vote for this woman. But a lot of people are going to be voting for both of these men. They are running to be the number two to the most powerful person in the entire world. And the person who deserves respect there is them, not her. And yeah, all online. And this did very popular, these people sort of going off. I'm going to pull one up actually. Sophie Vershbow, a writer, I think for Esquire, writes, every woman on earth felt that thank you for describing the legal process in her bones. And what follows the whole conversation on mansplaining and the idea of mansplaining, like he's, yeah, he's a man and he's explaining a policy and he's running for vice president. He's had a debate.

He's had a debate. Like, yes, he needs to be explaining some things. Sophie Vershbow. Yes, that's actually how this works. And the idea that like, he's mansplaining to the moderators, like they're not a part of, no one, they're not a part of this conversation. You're not, Sophie.

I'm not. The moderators aren't. This is a conversation between Waltz and JD Vance. And they're talking, that conversation is for all of us to listen to not to participate in i know it's hard maybe for sophie to understand that that she's not part of this conversation but she's not um i think separately and i wrote this on on x uh like on gender like like let's get away from just the question of like obviously i'm glad that i heard him break down how this policy worked. What are men expected to do if not permitted to speak back to female moderators breaking their own rules? Are they supposed to just say nothing? this way, if he were complaining about being interrupted by the vice presidential candidate of the debate after I told him to hush, he would be laughed at. We would all be making fun of him.

And that's how it should be because that's pathetic. You're a professional. If you want to be in the arena, you have to be in the arena. And there can't be two sets of rules for men and women. Are you in the arena or are you not in the arena? And if you're in the arena, you've got to just be in there. I have to be able to fight with you as hard as I fight with anybody. And certainly JD in that situation needs to be able to. Both candidates need to be able to. They need to be able to fight back. If they're being fact-checked and the fact-checker is wrong, why are they supposed to just sit there and accept it? That would imply to me that the power structure in this country is the media up here at top. And that's not based in

reality. And I think that we need to just, it's like crazy that that has to be said, but they're not in charge. They're not, they're just not. We already have an alternative, which is likee rogan or alex friedman that this wouldn't have happened if they would have just had the debate on one of those two people's podcasts and it would have gotten just as many views and reached i think the same people like that the what was it cbs or abc debate did i'm curious if there was ever i know vance would do it but i don't know that waltz would it. He seems like a pretty smart guy anyways. And he, or at least, you know, he can kind of hold his own. I wonder if, if Waltz and Harris is, you know, ever had a conversation with, with Vance and Trump about doing an alternative, you know, format. and Trump about doing an alternative format.

There are a lot of different things. I thought often, why don't they each just pick a moderator? That way, it would feel more fair that way to me if both sides chose their own moderator and then they each got to ask questions. Or, I mean, in longer form, what would have been great is not, oh, no, I have to get to my next question that I prepared. Again, this is this is um centering the random ass journalists that nobody cares about over either of these candidates that i really want to hear from jd vance introduces uh where we start they start talking about the status

of of the migrants in springfields um the media likes to say they're perfectly legal and jd likes to say um you know they're technically legal because And JD likes to say, you know, they're technically legal because of this crazy shit that Biden and Kamala have done to just release them into the country. And that is really interesting. I want to know a lot more about that. I want to know what did Biden do specifically? What is the status? How is this status different than a green card? How is it different than someone on a wait list to get into the country? How is this status different than a green card? How is it different than someone on a wait list to get into the country? Are we talking now about, I think, refugees? Okay, well, who's coming in here as a refugee? What countries are they coming in from? Are they actual refugees? Do we know if they are or not refugees? And if we know that they're not really refugees, but we have to just wait six years for them to get to court because we have a backlog? Well, that's a very interesting question. Now it sounds like if you know that they're not refugees, but you're releasing them anyway, that you have a de facto open border. And that is, of course, the heart of the entire conversation that everyone in America wants to have. But we couldn't do that because the moderator

wanted to move on to whatever stupid question she had next that had nothing to do with immigration, when immigration and the economy are like the two things that everybody wants to talk about in america unless you're up in michigan or minnesota then you also want to talk about israel um but i'm not and i don't and that i would have loved to have had a more substantive conversation there personally and they could have done it the irony of her saying thank you for explaining the legal process is she didn't give him the chance to explain the legal process. Like that.

I care a lot more about than whatever. Notorializing you were about to do. Like that was about to be something interesting. Instead, you just cut him off and moved on to something else. Well, he got a lot out. He did get,

he did. He got like a good chunk of it out at least. And so I did feel for me, the funny thing there was like, as she said, thank you. I felt grateful. I was like, Oh, thanks for getting, we don't have that was is close we were i think at one point we were

dangerously close to a substantive conversation it was like we we have not had that level of substance where we even he's describing a policy how it works in practice first reality or whatever but here's actually what it is and we've've not gotten that far. The Kamala Trump one, I think this was the weird thing that happened while watching this debate was, I realized just how bad the actual presidential candidates are. They just aren't that. They're not intelligent person talking about policy. They're something else entirely. And you can be pro or against whatever for whatever reasons and everyone has them. But in terms of just, it was nice to see someone up there who was just very intelligent and breaking shit down and also unafraid and unbothered. I don't like when people get flustered and angry at the journalist. Oh, maybe I do. Actually, I would be okay with a little anger. Time and place.

He just did a good job, I thought. He was the best of the five candidates who have run for president or president or vice president over the last two months. I think he's the top and I think Walt is underneath him. Well, I think Walt was very effective. He was he looked like man he looked like he was about to shit his pants the first

10 minutes i felt bad for him he seemed like he was shaking a little bit super wide scared eyes um but he got into the flow of it and then he was just this nice kind of dad. And he also seemed really open to moderation, moderating his own policies, finding some middle ground or whatever. I think it's a little bit disingenuous personally. And I didn't find it convincing personally knowing what I know about his policies and how he's governed. But I think it was effective. But I think it was effective. And I think he did a very good job, far more so than his running mate, Kamala, who is just, I think, a joke personally. It was an interesting contrast of media narratives versus reality. And I think Vance, it was highlighted with Vance, right? Because he was the weird guy, according to the media.

And then he came out, he was very articulate he explained his policy as well he looked great i think he was actually pretty empathetic to like a lot of people in the country he was definitely speaking to like that sort of middle of the road sort of like undecided voter like he was actually kind of surprising to see like a republican being sort of a little more empathetic when it comes to the abortion conversation um so i thought he like did a pretty good job explaining himself and he definitely like solidified himself as the next top of the line Republican when Trump potentially goes away. Him and maybe Vivek, he's the guy. I mean, he really did a great job of not sounding like a crazy Republican.

He sounded like a pretty facts-driven. And I think eventually Waltz caught up. But the difference was pretty stark in that first 10 minutes when Waltz was really nervous and Vance was just in there, right in the pocket. Yeah, 2028, Vance is going to be up there. It'll be a fun election cycle in 2028. You got two primaries. Well, unless the Democrats get what they say is going to happen, which is a dictatorship, in which case there won't be any debates. Yeah, he definitely fell on

the sword a little bit for trump at the end the january 6th is a hard one because that's such a trumpian thing if you're going to be his vp you sort of have to like fall in line with that question so i feel like you know let's talk about that question it was the january 6th question you're talking about right yeah so it's like do you think that he won or whatever and he smartly was like because they're saying you're subverting democracy or whatever he's like you're subverting democracy but he didn't go hard enough he just didn't seem like his heart was in it he's talking about free speech that's one of them the other one is they're trying to jail the president right now and i think that the other one is immigration and how that's affecting the voting

patterns and how that's affecting that's how that's going to affect the election um i think that these are the other one is you have mainstream democrats talking about dissolving the supreme court that's great pardon that's not that is super authoritarian and and so i think um i think that there was a better i think he could have been a more effective uh he could have done a better job answering if he was going to choose that path he could have done a better job um but it's yeah it is what it is and i like i don't think he was trying to appeal to me i think he was trying to appeal to uh i think he was trying to appeal to to moderate women is was my sense of i think it's hard if you get asked about january 6th you sort of like

change it off to free speech it was just a bit of like a extreme sort of take of like changing the subject a little bit it was kind of a non-answer he kind of gave a non-answer he didn't connect it well enough so it would have made sense if he was talking because they're effectively accusing donald trump of authoritarianism they're saying you tried to dissolve the elections and take control of the country as a dictator and blah blah blah he needed to do another step to be like you're basically accusing of being an authoritarian but how could that possibly be the case we're already living in an authoritarian country and then he can break down the argument for that and um and i think that he didn't go there because i mean my sense honestly from watching it was like he probably thinks that donald trump didn't win the election and he would

have wished that he could have just said that and said like yeah he should have just conceded and moved on and and that would have been that and um and like you said yeah like he has to fall in the sword it's tough because that's that's the one question probably that and abortion are the ones that if you're going to fire up the democrats the most or like anyone that's sort of leading left those are the two that like they just go crazy over so he probably could have done a better job of connecting that together yeah i mean it's it is wild to me that it's like abortion matters this much isn't it crazy i keep thinking about like this has been 20 years like plus years the same conversation every election i mean since roe v wade it's the same roe v wade never roe v wade was never

uncontroversial it was like wildly controversial from the moment that that law was pat or the the court case resolved in favor um and it's been that it was that way ever since it was the country was locked in like 50 50 the whole time it was the only social issue that never changed with time and with youth or whatever it was always 50 50 um and now we're talking about it again because it was i think a bad court case um it feels like it feels like it could go away though, if Republicans would just not be insane about these edge cases that probably do affect women, but probably only a relative few women. I mean, you could turn that around to Democrats and say, like, why do you fight so ferociously for third trimester abortions? And then they're like, there are not.

They never happen. It's like, okay. Fair enough. That could be solved, too. But if they never happen, then accept the law, there are not. They never happen. It's like, okay. Fair enough. That could be solved too. But if they never happen, then accept the law. Okay, great. So we have a ban in the third trimester unless the mother's life is in danger. Are we satisfied?

Can we move on now? That seems fine to me. And it's like, we kind of can't get there. And it's like, okay, well, if neither side is willing to concede anything. And I think that's probably to your point, Brian. Yeah, just concede like if you get raped and you don't want the baby um or if the baby will kill you if you have it then like which shop is in favor of like trump is not trump's pretty open to that right that's what he says and they're like no you don't yeah five they're like i don't trust

them like he said 2025 and like trust me i don't care about abortion i have paid for abortions come on look at me there's so many aborted trumps like let's be honest probably i don't care that's trump that's what's going through his head milani is like yeah there are abortions they're gonna be more probably like i'm not letting that shit out in the wild um like oh man maybe this is too dark maybe we shouldn't be talking about but i mean let's be honest like that's not a man who has a problem with abortions. He wrote it in all caps locks too. He seems to really care about this. I really believe that Trump is pro-choice. I really actually believe that he is. And so the caps lock thing, it reads as frustration on his part where he's like, no, I really am. Trust me. I really actually am pro-choice. no, I really am. Trust me. I really actually am pro-choice. And then I guess the Democrat retort is like, well, you paved the way for the court to overturn Roe. But I just personally think there's a distinction between pro-choice, pro-life and Roe v. Wade. I just think that that was actually good. I think that was a sound legal decision, their overturning of Roe v. Wade.

I think that was a sound legal decision, their overturning of Roe v. Wade. And I think that Roe v. Wade was always a terrible legal reading. And I think also that there should be some kind of federal abortion protections for whatever, how I'm going to meet, up until the second trimester or something, do that. And if you can't get the support in Congress, that says to me that the people don't want it. And that's the whole tension here is that the Democrats controlled the courts for decades. They used the court to pass a law effectively that nobody wanted. They didn't have support for it in Congress. And that's why the conversation when it always goes to like, well, if you care about it, pass a law, the Democrats get mad because they can't pass a law because nobody else wants it or not enough people want it.

Not enough people want this. And that's just speaking of democracy, like, do you care about it or not? If you cared about it, you would be down with the idea of electing your legislators, having them go to Congress and having them vote for shit. And period. You could have codified it the first term of Obama. It all Democrat House and Senate could have done it right there. Yeah, I was going to say that. You could not have because there are too many Democrats who are actual moderates on the issue of abortion. It's not as cut and dry as Democrats in media want to suggest.

But that was their best chance to do it, right? And so they always blame like everyone like the republic republicans of everything like they don't never blame ruth get better ginsburg they never blame like they could have things done things in obama's first term like they just they never take any responsibility when the things they could have done yeah i mean they did they did codify marriage into law following that decision and uh for it was gay marriage and interracial marriage. And I remember it was the dude from, what's his face? Cruz. It was like, I'm not going to vote for this.

It's just virtue signaling or something, and I'm not going to waste my time with this. It's very clearly not virtue signaling, actually. If Roe v. Wade is now overturned, and marriage, gay marriage at that point, and also interracial marriage are upheld by legal cases, then if it goes back to the court and they decide to overturn the legal cases for whatever reason, suddenly those things are gone. And so yes, it's like, you do need to pass a law. In fact, it's the thing that you should always be doing. You should be determining if you are in favor or against this law that you're a legislator.

I wish that all of the grownups could just be fucking grownups. Like do your job. You are literally there to pass laws. Pass them or don't. But like don't hide behind the justices. I think Democrats secretly don't want to pass like abortion protections because they take away one of their biggest talking points and they can no longer bring that up as something to to you know talk about every single election cycle so i think a part of them uh really don't actually want to

pass those protections a little 40 chess yeah i think that i would believe that if they if i if i believe that they had it if they could if they could do it. I think it works for, I agree with you that it works in their favor. But the reason it works in their favor is, yeah, and it's because I think Americans are generally ignorant on how this all, the government works. I think that if you went out there and asked the average person what Roe v. Wade even was and how it came to be. And what is the role of the court? What is the role of Congress? I think they couldn't answer those questions. They see it very much as Donald Trump was elected to be king and he took back a law that was already passed in favor of abortion. And now I can't do it because of Donald Trump. And so I don't believe

him when he says that he's pro-abortion because if he was pro-abortion, why did he pass the anti-abortion law? I think that's like actually how most Americans think about this. And I mean, that's a broader problem probably with democracy. Just to your point, Riley, San Francisco, so Breed, I think, introduced the San Francisco Reproductive Freedom Act this year.

And it's like, okay, Breed, I think, introduced the San Francisco Reproductive Freedom Act this year. And it's like, okay, so we have a state with the Democratic supermajority and the most liberal city in the country still putting money to these, to protect abortion when it's not needed. So I wonder what would happen if it was federally, like it was legalized on a federal level and if the issue would actually go away. I'm not convinced. Wade did was it was a very broad protection of abortion that was much more aggressive than anything you were seeing in Europe, for example. And if the Democrats want to kind of buy that into law, it's never happening. They wanted something like, I don't know, like an 18 week thing or something. I think you could do

that. But then you have these people who are like, no, I want like there, you should, there should be no, I've talked to actually like i talked to i've talked to right of center women who are pro-abortion and um i would maybe pro-abortion is the wrong way to frame it let's say pro-choice but it feels like pro-abortion if i mean when we're talking about this was like no limits at all for any reason whatsoever just a woman's choice. And that I think is very grisly to people, certainly to me. I mean, that's like, I'm pro-choice and then you're like, but what about that third trimester? And I'm like, that's a different situation for me. We should get to our Polymarket segment. Polymarket, thank you Polymarket for supporting

Pyrowires. Without you, we wouldn't be able to do the great things that we do. And they are great. It's related this week specifically to the Waltz-Vance thing. And I did think it was interesting. So Tim Waltz and JD Vance went head-to-head in the vice president's debate Tuesday evening. On the morning of the debate, polls showed Waltz with a 73% chance of winning. However, by 9 p.m. Eastern, when the debate started, those odds dropped to 62%. After the first question, Waltz's chances plummeted to 56%. As the debate went on, things only got worse for Waltz. Two hours into the debate, his odds had fallen as far as 32%. his odds had fallen as far as 32%. So here's why this is really interesting to me. So Waltz was going to win the debate for sure, in my mind, because Democrats always win the debate according to the media. And that's what was going to be determining this. It was going to be a

summation of what the media people were declaring. And they always, obviously, side with Democrats. If it's reasonably able to call it in Dems' favor, Dems get it. And so, yeah, I expected basically the debate to happen, Vance to do better, maybe. And then both sides would declare victory and waltz would win because most democrats the democrats control the media so most outlets are democrat i'm curious why if that if that read and that's what i would expect from the 73 chance that people voting on voting on uh or betting on polymarket thought but if that was the case it's like they once they heard waltz talking they knew that he was not going to do as well as vance and they thought okay he's

going to lose the debate that says to me that they actually thought waltz was going to be what more eloquent than vance going into this and i don't know what to make of that that's just wrong that's just like you're not paying attention um that's, I guess no one really has much of a sense of Vance at all. Don't you think it just speaks to like the total derangement that some people have that they were so deranged that they put their money behind their belief that was totally inaccurate? I just don't think the poly market's that, I don't see that kind of bias on on the on the betting i mean clearly like that's the bias like was control was was sort of in control these people's betting behavior i think i think the more i think this is a super super interesting case study for poly market because it's it's more like people probably got educated right the the people who lost were like oh

you know like maybe i have some amount of derangement here you know because they were obviously they had conviction enough to put money down right and um i think there is an educational or sort of like record updating component to polymarket and i think that i think this situation honestly like illustrates that that element of it perfectly that's that's why i mentioned media narratives because like i don't even think i'd be deranged like just the narrative about jd vance is so skewed by the reality and and the reality is that jd vance kind of excels at that format he's clearly good i knew he was good yeah he was if you knew jd a little bit you know he'd do just fine in that so like it it does show you how strong that media narrative has been against jd vance well he was

just so unknown when you're on when you're on when you're a blank canvas you can kind of do whatever you and both candidates were sort of a blank canvas which jd acknowledged in the beginning he said you don't know either of us and i thought thought that was smart and true. I didn't know anything about Waltz until this election. And when that's the case, that means the media is in the driver's seat. But I just still expect more from people spending their money on this. I expect them to be doing more digging. I expect them to look at a few YouTube videos and make it... Again, if they're basing it, I think it would have been possible to look at the youtube videos to see that vance was much sharper at this in this kind of a format than waltz to determine that

he would be better better that night but still lose because the media would still be in the bag for waltz but if that were the case if that was the logical process that they were going through then they wouldn't have the numbers wouldn't have plummeted while we were all watching what we knew was going to happen um which i guess would lead it would it seems to indicate what brandon was saying um that they were a little bit deranged but i just i'm not i'm just not used to that from the betting markets the betting markets were wrong what do we do they self-corrected it corrected love to get nate silver's take on it yeah i do want nate silver oh maybe he did give a take i don't know i'll have to ask him um yeah interesting don't know what to make of it. I do think that, yeah, I just was

surprised and I'm excited to see the next place that I am surprised by Polymarket. All right, let's move on. We have to talk about this fucking crazy Longshoremen strike. All right, so I'm going to break it down for you. The International Longshoremen's Association's 45,000 dock workers went on strike Monday night, shutting down 36 major US ports. The Move Economist's estimate will cost the American economy up to $5 billion a day until resolved. So the story really took off after this video of the Longshoremen Association's president, Harold J. Daggettt went super viral. And we're just going to play a quick clip of that now. Who's going to win here in the long run? You're better off sitting down and let's get a contract and let's move on with this world.

And in today's world, I'll cripple you. I will cripple you. And you have no idea what that means. Nobody does. I mean, essentially, he is threatening to just destroy the economy on purpose with a strike. Online, people wondered if this was perhaps the kind of monopolistic behavior antitrust law existed to defend against sort of, you know, cutely, cleverly. And why do unions get an exemption? But what do they want? The dock workers are demanding a 77% pay raise from their $150,000 salaries. Some are closer to $250,000

or more. It is one of the highest paying blue collar jobs in the country by far with mob boss Harold Daggart himself making something like an insane $900,000 a year. Just to repeat that, I don't know if you caught it, $900,000, close to a million dollars a year for this longshoreman, a guy in charge of taking crates off of ships. Now, a picture of his actual mansion went viral days into the strike or a day into the strike when the New York Post broke the story of just how rich he is. The richness of this man has become a sub-story of the entire story, maybe bigger than some cases right now than the economic impact because we haven't yet felt it, but we're about to.

Elon amplified that story with a comment in which he mentioned the Longshoreman's house was bigger than his own, which I actually believe Elon does not know how to spend his money for fun things. Also, it seems like this guy is kind of a criminal. So in 2005, he was accused of steering union benefits contracts to firms that paid kickbacks to organized crime at a Brooklyn trial, according to the Wall Street Journal. Chief Strategist at Wave Capital Management. JP Morgan analysts are estimating that the pork strike could cost the US economy $4 to $4.5 billion a day or $5 billion a day. There's some nuance to add, I think. So apparently they do contracts every six years. So what they're negotiating for now is for their next six years. And I'm not defending their 77% raise increase demand,

but that increase does take effect over the course of the following six years after they agreed to the terms of the contract. The other thing that I noticed when I was researching this is that they actually accused the longshore longshore people accuse um the guys on the other side which i can't remember the name it's like international something something something um of breaking their previous contract by introducing semi-automation to ports um and so that's a little bit underreported, I think. And again, they're on the tail end of their six-year contract

they negotiated six years ago. So I suppose I just wanted to add that nuance. And I think it is... I don't know that makes their demands any better. I'm certainly... I think it would be interesting to discuss the merit of them demanding no automation ever um because that seems fully unrealistic and destructive and kind of almost like sociopathic, if I may, frankly.

So, yeah. Well, it's just mob boss shit. And you see it in that video. He is straight up like, he's describing how he is going to be putting Americans across the country out of work on purpose to get hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars for people who have jobs where they're working, you know, some of them 30 hours a week, they are not, this is not, these are not the long

shore men of like, you know, 150 years ago. They're already, it's already a much easier job than it was. And I think that they're pretty lucky to have those jobs, clearly. I mean, a lot of these are like, you know, they're inheriting these jobs, some of them from their fathers and they're giving them to their sons. And it is like a sort of vaguely aristocratic type situation. The automation thing has been going on forever since machines first were created. You have classically the Luddites was always a labor movement, trying to destroy things they were seeing as taking away from their work. In fact, if you talk about Luddites online it's like saying beetlejuice three times or something um the communists will appear in your mentions and try to correct the record on luddites luddites they say are

misunderstood and really important if you have a problem with luddites then you're actually just an evil capitalist you're a fucking landowner man or, or a landlord, they love to call you. And I'm like, not yet, but I will be. And I cannot wait to raise your rent. Yeah, it's bad. This is crazy. I didn't realize, I loved not having to have to think about this. The automation thing is if they accept those terms and we cannot automate this, then you basically have a cartel in charge of shipping in the country. And it's really, really bad for American consumers. But silver lining, it is yet another incentive to start building shit here again, which was interesting. He actually said he had some interesting quote.

At the end of his tirade, he goes, everything comes in on a ship. And I thought, man man how are we still learning this lesson like after covid and everything it's like how many times do we need to learn this lesson we need the tariffs and we need subsidies and we need just to do whatever it takes address the cost of labor and we need to get we just need manufacturing in america and if we don't have it we are in just a fundamentally fragile place we could break easily you know that's what we're looking at right now we don't feel it yet this this this last i believe everything he said was correct by the way we're not going to feel it

this week we're going to talk about it in the news it's a story oh my god um that's going to go away and then all of a sudden things are going to start getting really really expensive if it persists and then people are going to start losing their jobs. And we'll see what happens. This is an election. The other piece, which is weird, is why are they doing this during the Democratic election? Or like for Democrats? Yeah.

So, well, Ryan Pierce also mentioned like we're also one of the biggest exporters in the world, right? So, that's also where the dock workers come in. And I think you sort of lose people when you're actually threatening people. Like that's a bit, I don't know if I minced my words, but terroristic-y. You're kind of like, we're going to ruin the American economy. You're like, what the fuck? Like, that's crazy. I did hear things.

I don't know what's valid. But, you know, if we think about it, you know, Biden is like the pro-union president. So it's like interesting timing that he's still president. And like they sort of went on this big union crusade of like, hey, president, protect us. We're the union. Which I, you know, I don't know if there's any interesting timing that he's still president. And like, they sort of went on this big union crusade of like, Hey president, protect us. We're the union. Which I, you know,

I don't know if there's any validity to that, but it was an interesting note that I've heard. Well, they both are too. They're both vying for that, which was interesting. I really, I was interested going into the debate actually for them to talk about this.

And I want, I wanted to know where J.D. Vance stood on the unions, and that just didn't really come up. I would have loved to have seen how he or Trump answered that question. My sense is that he has to take their side now. They're really making a pitch for the working class. Exactly, yeah.

And the working class is naturally, culturally, very much right wing or right of center for sure certainly right of kamala harris and uh you saw that recently with the teamsters refusing to endorse one of the candidates for the first time you know in however many decades that is happening because they can't because everyone who's actually a part of that union would be furious because they're all voting for trump and um and so he's been and he's been he's been doing his best trump to get their support this this should be a great time for that i think he's holding off hoping he just goes away he doesn't have to make that kind of a decision but um but he's going to have to i think they're not gonna i think they're not gonna just back down how do you because how do you how do you just give away that kind of work they're not going to, I think they're not going to just back down. How do you, cause how do you, how do you just give away that kind of work?

They're talking about, they wanted a 70 plus percent raise on top of already these insanely high salaries. And then as Brandon, you brought in, thankfully the anti, the ban on automation, you just can't accept those terms.

That's wild. So I think that it has to go on. I think it's got to get worse. I think. They can get creative with this. I mean, I think we should give the longshoremen whatever they want, but structured in such a way that they're guaranteed to be retired, to be paid until they're retired. Meanwhile, we do work on automation, um, and their jobs, you know, go extinct at one point or another, but they're taken care of all the way through

until they die. And maybe their families are too, um, still paying that much money, I think would be a net, uh, positive for the deflationary aspect of having totally automated ports. So, um, yeah, I think, I think there's a way to get out of this and give them what they want um and i don't really understand i bet you there's creative solutions like this already being discussed on the bargaining table or i would hope so at least you just solved the crisis brandon i do have a bit of i think i heard that on twitter somewhere so it wasn't you know i've got to yeah pay them off but i i have a bit of uh empathy i think just for how do you get ahead right now i mean then we're deleting salaries like oh my god 150

000 or 200 000 a year it's like well what's the cost of living in texas or florida or california or maine new york jersey like it's fucking expensive that much money yeah and it expensive because of our housing policies, which is another thing they talked about briefly at the debate. And I wish we could get a full hour on just the question of housing. Vance blamed immigration on the cost of housing, which is sort of true because it's supply and demand. And if you have a bunch more people and no more supply, then obviously the demand goes up and prices go up. And that certainly is not helped by the fact that we're giving immigrants money to live that Americans are not getting. Vouchers and things like this, you can just see this online. I think I'd link to this in one of the Haitian stories, just like all the benefits you get as a legal, illegal migrant.

stories just like all the benefits you get as uh and a legal illegal migrant um but on when it comes to just like what do you do as like say you are this mob boss kind of italian dude and you're looking for an honest day's work um and the houses in your area are like five hundred thousand000. What do you do? You have to fight really hard to get whatever you can because your government has crafted policies that have forced us all into this fucked up zero-sum environment where people in every urban area are fighting for the shittiest apartments that you could ever see. And this is decades of stupid government policy have led us to this point where it just is too expensive to live. It's inflation. It's the cost of labor. It's the cost of housing. It's the fact that you can't build housing. And then we're like, well, fuck this guy for trying to get more for his guys and um listen he did threaten to cripple the entire country so my my patience is limited um but i can there is a kernel of something there i think worth

exploring and um you know this is what we did that our policies did this globalism also did this when it comes to just like why are we relying on them so much? And why aren't there better jobs and things like that? It's like, this is what happened. This is now the situation. This is now the environment that we're in. I mean, it is illuminating the side sort of conversation, how illuminating, like how much money these guys make, right?

So 150, 250K, there's this chart from rosen that says more than half of the longshoresmen earned 150 000 or more in the fiscal year 2019 and 2020 and just under one in five made 250 000 or more and that's more than like harvard graduates right and so like they should have told our millennial generation to go be dock workers i was not convinced by that i was like they should make more than a harvard graduate the average what is the i don't i don't mind that they may i i like blue cars make a lot of money what graduate. What is the Harvard graduate? I don't mind. I like blue cards. They make a lot of money. What is the average Harvard graduate doing? Where did Lena Kahn go to school?

That woman should not be making more than a longshoreman. All these people went to these great schools, and they all add nothing to society. At least some of these people are at least picking giant crates off of a ship. We were raised in a generation that totally goes to go to college, right? So, that's like a whole generation of people that were forced onto college and they could have just done nice blue collar jobs and be maybe living a nice better life, right? Yeah. Probably not this one because I do think this one is sort of like a moth. I don't think you should apply to be the $900,000 a year long shoreman.

No, no. I'm just saying in general. They check your references. They're like, yup, you got it. No, it's much more like what's your last name? And now you got to go kill a guy for us. It's a nostalgia vibe. It's nice to see the Jersey mob back at it again. Yeah. Well, you know,

the difference is that the mob used to keep the neighborhood safe. So if the longshoremen were doing that, I would have even more patience for them. They need to actually act more like a mob. And then, you know, I'm a little more open to what's going on right now. Okay. We should get to a pirate idol. The betting market for pirate idol is coming. So hold on to your hats. It's going to be quite the wild ride. I will keep you posted on that. But for now, let's get into the segment.

Well, folks, it is that time of the week once again. It is the greatest show on the internet, Pirate Idol. Welcome back, Molly, Rob. We got Miles in the chat today for round two, the quarterfinals. I'm excited to just get started. I don't know, first, I mean, how have you guys been? Any thoughts, comments? Have you been in the comments section of pirate idol voting for yourself and what is going on in the what's going on in the land of of the contestants Molly has a whole army of people going for her shout out to the fans

it's great I don't know where they came from that one before yeah has no idea all's fair I may or may not have recruited my rugby team to uh hop in the comments we got some new viewers you can always tell when a group chat goes out because typically like 10 votes will come in at once and people are like all for the same person all like pretty short and just like we gotta vote for so and so um all right well let's just let's i want to talk about frank and sheep riley let's get to the topic at hand ts up what's going on let's do it so an 81 year old montana rancher was sentenced to six months in prison this week after cloning a quote near threatened species of sheep from

central asia and selling its offspring to shooting preserves in Texas and Minnesota. The rancher, Jack Shubarth, illegally purchased the tissue and testicles of Marco Polo Argali sheep, one of the largest species in the world, using them to create giant hybrid sheep offspring that he then sold for trophy hunting from 2013 to 2021. Yeah. So this man is in, I mean, he's really going to prison. I actually follow this story pretty closely from the very beginning, or as close as you could. There's not that much information out there. The story is kind of about the case.

I tried to get him to Hereticon, which is coming up end of the month. And I tried to get him through Josie Zahner, a biohacker who I am friends with. And she tells me, I mean, he said no, he was really actually terrified. This is pre-trial. I didn't realize quite how serious it was. He's definitely going to prison. He's an 81-year-old man. And it seems to me, I mean, punished for science.

But I would love to know what you guys think. I'm sorry, Rob. What's going on? Yeah. How you doing, guys? know what you guys think. I'm sorry, Rob. What's going on? Yeah. How are you doing, guys? The first thing that struck me about this is there's been a lot of talk on Twitter this week about anarcho-tyranny and just the idea that the government cannot do anything essential for its citizens. But meanwhile, it'll go out of its way to prevent people from essentially just living

their lives. And I think we're seeing that a lot this week in North Carolina where like private helicopter pilots are being told it's illegal to like try to rescue their citizens. But the Biden administration like didn't mobilize military or National Guard until like three or four days after the fact. And listen, there are some moral implications of like cloning other life forms and releasing them into the wild. But like, as far as the government's concerned, I can't imagine that putting an 81 year old in prison for something like this should be like a top priority. And it kind of blows my mind that he's got $500,000 plus in fines and going away for something as trivial as cloning.

Well, six months. I just saw concurrently, and this is not a story on our docket today, so no one's prepared for it, but it was just coming in on X. In San Francisco, there was a huge case maybe last year, I want to say, where two firemen got into it for I'm not even sure what reason. But one fireman beat a guy almost to death with a metal pipe who really did nothing wrong. I think it was a domestic dispute of some kind. He was surprised. He didn't know I was being attacked. He almost died. And that guy gets no time at all. He just got out completely scot-free. And I love... Yeah, the NLCO tyranny thing is... That is one of my biggest problems with the government right now is the people that seem to go down are people who follow the rules, generally speaking. They're people who are not really

that big of a deal. You see this kind of small ways. Speaking of San Francisco, when you're on the Metro there or in the subway, it's like... Well, subway is a little bit different. But in San Francisco, the people who would get punished on the subway were people who would pay the ticket. If you see a homeless man sprawled out on 10 seats, no one's fighting him for anything. And that kind of shit bothers me. It's like the people who are really degrading society kind of get off. I mean, there's more to this story too. And I hope we get into all of it, just like on what he was actually doing. And Molly, what do you make of the story? I think the story, I'm sorry for what happened to him

because I think it sucks. And I don't know why this is the second time I'm on and it's about jail, but I feel sorry for him. But I think this story is wild. I mean, how cool is that? Some guy's just cooking up sheep in his backyard and no one really knew about it.

Like cloning sheep and cloning huge sheep too. Like they're 300 pounds. Their, uh, horns are like five feet wide. Uh, I have a couple of takes on this. One being that it's for sport.

So it's for captive trophy hunting, uh, costs between like 500, uh,k to like 100k uh if you do this like in the actual wild where these sheep actually are from uh if you do it in the u.s it's probably between like 5 to 100k um but it's just kind of like i just i don't get the whole captive trophy hunting thing especially for like a sheep like really like you know what captive trophy hunting is it's like people have sheep in a pen they let them out into the range and then you just shoot them uh it kind of is a little bit like come on like i don't know what's

going on with testosterone these days but like going off and doing that and having something so it's very low and you're essentially like shooting pillows in a you know a farm so i don't really get it giant giant pillows um and then you're hanging them in your living room very happily which is like kind of sad anyways a lame sport but you gotta do what you gotta do sometimes uh on the sheep cloning part like that's sick like that's so cool that like this guy was just doing that he paid 400 for testicles really wild um but i wonder if like you could kind of push past that and do something cooler like i don't know i was at a farm this weekend and i don't know how this happened but there was a zebra donkey just happened to be there i don't know who did it.

I don't know if the zebra and the donkey did on their own, but if that's the case, I don't know why it's such a big deal. And then I would just say 81-year-old, six months in prison, and his reputation is tarnished. I think there was one report where he was like, there goes my livelihood. There goes my job. I'm going to have to work the rest of my life. It's like, my man, you're already 81. Why do you need to continue to really work?

But I guess it's a pride thing. I would say though, my grandpa, he was really cool. He had a model train set as a hobby. It would be so much cooler if he was cloning sheep. I don't know. Yeah, I'm, I think there's a lot to unpack there. There's like the hunting stuff that I do want to talk about, but also just on the

cloning. So what actually, from what I read, he got the materials from two different sheep. So you have an endangered sheep from abroad, and you have a native american sheep which i believe also i don't think it's endangered but there are not that many of them and uh he created a kind of hybrid and then sent it to a lab which created the embryos

for him and then he implanted the embryos into his own use and birthed them that way um which is great news for people who care about the endangered species because he just proved a path to saving them and we like we used every article i read it well the first thing i noticed about the story was like or this most recent round of stories which were about him going to prison i didn't see many people celebrating the fact they were just reporting on it but they were all sort of breathlessly, including the fact that one of the species he was messing around with was endangered. And it's like, well,

if you care about endangered species and this guy just proved how to create a bunch more of them very easily and affordably, why wouldn't you just be excited about this? And, and then on the other one on the hunting thing, it's like there was someone mad about this is a maybe a strange philosophical conundrum but the sheep wouldn't exist if there wasn't a market for them to be hunted at all so is it better to have you know lived and been hunted on a fancy rich man's game preserve or to have never existed at all i don't know molly what do you

think about that actually would you rather be hunted i guess or never have existed how how good is my life until i'm hunted i think pretty good i think i think probably it's great and then it's like a most have you guys ever seen the most dangerous game i think it's the name of the movie do they hunt people yeah it's the most dangerous it's the most dangerous game i think it's the name of the movie do they hunt people yeah it's the most dangerous it's the most dangerous game is meant a game like the human is the game and so it's dangerous to hunt a human because they can hunt back right could be a thrilling way to go i don't know you know from everyone everyone including people who are not contestants everyone what do you guys would you rather would you rather have a nice life and be hunted or have never existed at all

if you're getting hunted you still got shot you're still in the game that's how I feel as well I feel like I have a chance I want to be in the rich man's ranch that sounds great well congratulations you're in the game and it's like all of a sudden all of your room is filled with gas and you go to sleep and you're like oh no

Solana got us that's right welcome to the private island um fuck yeah let's go what do you what do you make of uh what do you make of the frankenship situation yeah i don't think he's gonna be working the rest of his life because i was getting into like the economics of all this it's like a hundred thousand dollars to go hunt these animals and then he's probably selling them for around i read somewhere around 10k per sheet and he's doing it for 10 years so like was it a twenty thousand dollar fine i feel like he's got some save he's got to have some savings locked up or something like that oh he's got that cheap money yeah he's got that frank and cheap money he's got that cheap money exactly yeah and i also thought it was interesting like the context of what

is legal to do to animals and what is legal to do to animals and what's illegal to do to animals like can legally factory farm cows and chickens and keep them a one by one cage but it's illegal to hand raise a cloned sheep in your backyard kind of going off right what rob's saying um and then pass it off to a i think it'd be a free range hunting ranch where they just chill, but then they're quickly executed, but then they're memorialized on somebody's wall for like 50 to a hundred years. So that's a much better way to go than being packaged in cellophane at a factory farm.

But, um, I agree with it. I, um, I got my hunting license in California, I think it was six years ago or something. And then I went out once and I didn't get anything and I was going to go deer hunting and I was excited about it. And I was very much on this journey of, I wanted to be closer to my food kind of thing. And I went to this typical San Francisco party. And I never really have that big of a problem with politics in San Francisco, but this was one of the rare exceptions where I'm at this party and one of these girls from Stanford, I mean, not a girl, a woman who's older than me, we're in our thirties. And she literally like,

it's a regular, it's a food party. There are hot dogs sitting behind me and she finds out i wasn't even talking to her i was talking to a friend and she like overhears the hunting thing and she goes nuts about hunting she's like i cannot believe that you're a hunter i just don't get it i think it's so disgusting like why do you think that's fun i'm isn't it so it's like so cruel it was on and on and on and on and i'm like first of, I'm not a hunter. No, no, no. She was not. I'm saying this like a regular part. We're all eating like hot dogs and shit.

First of all, I'm not a hunter. I got nothing. I was not very good. Second, it is so much better to be eating your meat after it had grazed happily, frolicking through the woods for its entire life than factory farm pork or something insane like that and um i don't know there's like so much cognitive dissonance there i sort of to molly's point do you understand maybe a distinction when you're not gonna if you're not gonna eat it and you're just hunting something to hunt it i think that is definitely different i get when

people why people wouldn't want to do that at all um but but for what it's worth like sheep that would be mutton right like like i would i would franken sheep like mutton chop i'm down are we sure they haven't eaten it because i would definitely i'm curious another one i want is um mastodon steaks i think we need to be cloning we need to be like bringing back mastodon we need to be like the woolly mammoth we need to be like eating them and i think that that's the weird thing. Libertarians are all about this conversation. They'll say people don't want to talk about, for example, eating the bison. They think it's bad or something, but we don't know. But we will interject in that conversation is the bison population in America has spiked since people started eating them again. That's what I was gonna say yeah you have all these ranches now that are raising them and so the population is coming back because of this specifically and that is actually a path to saving them and so you know

maybe maybe the solution to uh i don't know just spiking like the florida panther population or something is allowing people to clone them and hunt them and then you'll have a lot more panthers but i don't know that you want a lot more panthers personally in florida um we could also uh domesticate them well yeah i mean if you could also if now we start talking about let's let's splice in some dog-like intelligence or something yeah i want i want raccoons man i want i i feel like I think raccoons specifically are the one that is, it should already be a part of human society. I mean, they're so close because they're so, they're cute. They are so cute.

I love raccoons. They have opposable thumbs. Yeah. They're very close to us. Have you ever seen a baby raccoon? That shit's cute. They are cute. Yeah.

I saw, I was waiting at a bus stop to go to work. This was a while ago, like 10 years ago in San Francisco, at least 12 years ago. And Founders Fund is in the Presidio of San Francisco. So it's a very beautiful park-like area right on the edge of the marina. So the city is, it like goes up to it basically. And I'm on the city part on the corner there and late at night. And all of a sudden I get this weird, creepy vibe. And it's like something in the corner of my eye.

And I look and it's a huge, I'm like, is that a person? What's moving so weird? And it was like a three, it looked like it was like three feet tall, at least. A huge raccoon that's just like standing there. And then it looks down and then darts out of the bushes. It's like five or six one after another much much smaller little baby raccoons and they run right next to me and they go like one by one by one by one um the the mom like runs up one last one comes up to

it she turns around she spanks it on the butt she looks around and makes sure everything's okay and then she chases him under and i'm like, that's a person. Like, they love each other. They are, they're, they're so dog adjacent, human adjacent. Like,

we got to bring him into the society. One more weird question. I'm going to relate this to abortion because I've been wondering about this one for a while. Yeah.

Okay. So, let me see if I've got this one down because I just encountered this the other day on threads. Facebook's sort of, I don't know if you want to call it a left-wing version of Twitter. It's sort of like a normie left-wing. It's a, I don't know, kind of picture-oriented version of

X. I love how you turned me over there. I love to go over there now. I just see what they're talking about. It's so stupid. Not even liberal, but just like very dumb people talking about things like what is ethical to eat if you're a vegan and they get to the question of eggs and they're like well that's a life if it's fertilized and i'm like that's a pro-life argument that is like you are like do the do the vegans know that they are against abortion like that's really i'm i'm agnostic i'm i'm i think it's a complicated question myself they did not frame it as complicated at all they were like if it's fertilized that chicken's alive and you're eating you're eating a child chicken um i've got some really bad news for you about Planned Parenthood and he's just like why is that what is have you encountered this like what is what is the tension there between abortion and and chickens and light i mean is it a life is

it not a life what do you think i know it's a bit of a tension oh my god i think we need a heartbeat bill for eggs is what i'm hearing that's what they're saying man they're yeah they're going in they also because they have another funny political one when it with bees because you're not killing bees to eat honey but they're like but you're stealing the fruits of their the product of their labor it's like a marxist critique you're seizing the means of production yeah so like they apply it to very human things but not consistently not for humans this is something that like not just the left does the right does it too um but in sort of this age of like hot take economy like where every argument

has to be about winning and not just elucidating your points like people will bifurcate you know every issue into like how can i fit this to my argument and make you know the cognitive dissonance of like i'm not gonna put together totality of the fact that i'm literally arguing for pro-life right now just in this moment when it comes to veganism we are pro we are pro-life now when it comes to human children and plant parenthood we're going to be pro-choice again but it there's a narrow focus on like winning the argument especially on a platform like threads where like it's all the people that were too stupid to stay on twitter because they're getting on so they have to like go somewhere else where there's it's a little safer of a space to like

make their point like that's how people now think in terms of like from one interaction to the other i'm not going to have a fleshed out worldview. I'm just going to have the way I'm arguing this one particular point right now. Yeah. I, um, by the way,

you guys should follow me on threads. I'm a famous on Twitter, mixed a lot. I do. I don't really tweet like, or comment posts. Their own, my own things.

I just comment on other people's things lately when I'm bored, I'll just go over there and I'll just, I just roast the out of people and it's it comes from a place of i think i'm trying to i want to feel like i'm in control of the world and maybe that's why i do this i thought you're recruiting taylor lorenz i mean listen she has she has my email address i've i've made my overtures i'm willing to i'm willing to consider her application, personally. She's untethered now. She's out of the post. She's available. We had a tip about that.

We almost broke the news, and then I had some contacts at the Washington Post who kind of made it seem like it wasn't the case. And I thought, eh, I don't need to get into Taylor Loren's news. But yeah, I would like to know what she thinks about the question of the ethics inherent of eating eggs from the pro-choice perspective. But we'll save it for when she's on. Molly, did you make up anything on the sort of strange vegan politics? I have to admit, I was vegan for like eight years up until a year ago, but just because I didn't, I just didn't like meat. Well, how did you think about eggs as a vegan? So I started eating eggs and I was good with eggs when I first started being vegan.

And then I was like, you know what? If I'm going to be vegan, I got to go hardcore, no eggs. know what if i'm gonna be vegan like i gotta go hardcore like no eggs and so i just cut them out but now i i i mean i just eat meat and whatever but i think from a vegan standpoint i never really had that mentality so i'm not sure like if this is a strong argument or not i think they have to go hardcore on it like i think like they, they have to abide by both rules. If they believe one thing, they should believe both. Yeah, I mean, I guess you could turn it around. Is there an argument, animal cruelty, though? Like, the process of producing eggs and the chickens in the really small cages, that's entirely cruel.

I thought that was the reason vegans were generally not into eating eggs. Is that why they, no. No. No. and vegans were generally not into eating eggs is that why they no uh no no like uh i know like some people just go it go vegan because they want to be healthy like brian johnson some people do it for ethical reasons some people are shown like that crazy scary video in high school um about the farm like factory farming and stuff um some just do it for trends i don't know like i just thought it was kind of gross just on that egg thing i mean there are vegans who will say like i'm okay with people eating eggs that they raise their own chickens and it's not factory farming and then they're the more militant ones that'll be like absolutely no animal products ever

for ethical reasons that's into their life and those are two separate camps but like the second one i think is more of the popular like don't do it no matter what you're a bad person even if i think the vegans have a on the on the first camp have a little bit of a case it would be great if we i think we should all be raising more chickens and having more eggs that's why it's kind of gross yeah it's nasty i agree i saw nap saw Napoleon Dynamite and I was like, what the fuck? Is that where our eggs come from? Now I only get those really expensive eggs. I will honestly get the most expensive eggs I possibly can. And I literally just judge them by the price. I'm looking for free range. If they say vegetarian feed, I'm out. That to me is a positive framing of something that's disgusting. They need to be eating bugs. They need to be outside digging around,

eating other small animals. And at that point, then I'm like, okay, they're happy. If they give me a little postcard with the name of the hen, then I'm like, I would pay 50% more to know the name of my hen. There's no amount that I won't pay for an egg. So they should just keep jacking it up. I would love to know physically where,

if there's a house somewhere around me that was growing the eggs i think i would go there you can tell the you can tell in the yolks too there's like those really beautiful rich the color like orange orange yeah some of them are beautiful you have to refrigerate it would you would you ever have an ostrich egg i i it's gross to me i'll try it it's like 100 grams i think it's just like too much egg it's 101 miles it's like 100 grams of protein oh let's go baby tea come on i do love ostrich though in general that's like one of my ones that i put in the we need to be domesticating category because ostriches can be i guess we're with chocobos from Final Fantasy? What a reference. No.

I'm not a real animal. You guys, just young people today have no culture. Matt, pull up... I need you to, on edit, pull up a picture of a chocobo. Chocobos are these kind of smart, giant birds that you can ride like a horse. And they look like ostriches. Anyway, I want to be riding an want to be i want to be riding an ostrich i want to be riding a chocobo to work that's i think they have ostrich racing somewhere like i think that's a thing sign me up we need to be getting more creative with animals in general

again it's back to our original point it's like we need to be getting more creative not less creative not like no you can only hunt deer and eat beef it's like i should be able to do whatever i want if I'm genetically modifying. Especially, they're like, oh, it's going to get out and breed with other species or whatever. No, it's not. It's being brought to a place to be hunted. And then also, I mean, what's the big deal if like a couple of giant sheep get out? I think it's fine.

A mastodon stakes down so good. That's in my head right now. We'll get that. We'll get there. I think we're going to get there. Legalize endangered species hunting. Yes. I think it's the only way to reverse the endangerment it creates a market for ted turner did he did a market to put money into the cloning because they say it costs too much money to clone it puts money into the cloning market therefore

unendangering the species exactly the moment you a market, you open up a path to decreasing the cost to produce. You open up an incentive for that. And so, then it's just inevitable. It's like the moment you allow it, you're a little bit away. People always want to talk about Jurassic Park too. They're like, oh, but in Jurassic Park, that's a fictional book that became a movie, first of all. Let's just start there. It's not real. And second, it all seemed great, actually, until they decided to build an entire park around the concept of you could push one button and all the power would go off and the gates would go up and everyone would die. It's like, what if you just had Jurassic Park and didn't give them that button? Then I think everything works out. They were cooking.

That is the path for all of us. I think last thoughts on Jurassic Park, on pro-life vegans who don't realize they're pro-life, on hunting. What do you guys think? Anything? It always horseshoes into the other side. Yes. You get so far left, you're pro-life. I'll bring it back to the 81-year-old. I just think if he

was in Silicon Valley, he'd be doing better than Elizabeth Holmes right now. He'd be a billionaire. That's what I'm saying. He had a legal team. Life would be great, but he's not. It's not good. I don't know. Can someone just make a GoFundMe for him and let him loose? I think it's too late for that. He's

now off the clinker. Last thoughts on just the whole cloning thing. I mean, I was wholly unaware that it was even available to private industry to purchase clones of animals and bring them a test tube and have them spit you out a new species. Things are gonna get weird

in the next five to 10 years. And I mean, we talked about market solutions to problems here, but someone is going to step in some government is going to try to regulate and say like we don't want the pablo escobar hippos in colombia that's created a new ecosystem thing to happen like en masse and i don't have any personal solutions i just think it's something to keep our eyes out for like if that's an industry it's going to explode and it's going to get really weird. It's already regulated to death. He just got arrested for it.

Not for, not for cloning though. Just for trafficking the, the, from overseas. Like there was nothing. I don't think the guy who made the sheep went to jail. It's so interesting because I,

I believe those weren't, his charges were not related to cloning, but the judge himself said that he had to do this to disincentivize people from meddling with the genetic element here which was bizarre to see that the charges had once another case where the charges themselves have nothing to do with um what the judge is mad about and what the sentencing is is coming down for that really bothered me that's horseshit yeah well i think that we just need it i think maybe we just need like one island we start there um and it's just like an ape it's got to be an anything goes island i think perhaps a park we could call it and um and i think we just take it slow and

uh and become billionaires cloned human island i think we weren't killer bees genetically, like a genetic experiment gone wrong? I thought they were just invasive. They created African bees and some other bees, and then these bees that ended up were really aggressive

and would chase you, and would just like, if you jumped in a lake, they would wait outside on top of the lake until you got there, and they would kill you. That's the thing. That sounds like something that happened in the nineties. I think. That sounds like military adjacent.

You remember that guy that was breeding bedbugs last year in France and like putting them in hotels? No. That guy should be sentenced to death. Oh God. Free Jack. Yeah. I think usually like,

like, like clone terror is a whole other category of thing that we should come down hard on. Biological warfare? Yeah, that's a no for me. But biological joy fair? Yeah. I'm interested. There we go.

I'm interested in that. There's another one. The feral hogs in Texas are actually like a hybrid between two different types of hogs, one of which came from Europe. And they're like a huge problem in Texas. Well, we'll see that one for another day. I've actually hunted invasive hogs, by the way,

in Miami. So I have hunted. I did hunt previously. Forgot about that one. We'll save it for next week. It's been real. Please comment on who you would like to hear more from in pirate idol. Tell us what you guys think about hunting,

about the question of pro choice, pro choice, rather pro life. you would like to hear more from in pirate idol tell us what you guys think about hunting uh about the question of um pro-choice pro-choice rather pro-life and um veganism sort of the intersection of that i think is a very very fertile ground for more takes and thoughts and i think it's like we're new to it pioneers in the space um please like this if you have not please subscribe if you have not and please just tell the world about the awesomeness that is pirate idol goodbye have a good weekend later