Pivot - Facebook’s “cultural crisis,” Mark Cuban on the NBA’s rebound, and Kara gets replaced by AI

Episode Date: July 28, 2020

Kara and Scott chat about the delay of the tech antitrust hearing, the "unprecedented culture crisis" at Facebook, and the think-tank financed by Big Tech that is schmoozing foreign regulators. Friend of Pivot Mark Cuban, the owner of the Dallas Mavericks, joins to talk about the return of professional basketball and why the NBA's "bubble" at Disney World is safer than the attempted comebacks of football and baseball; Cuban also discusses his Twitter battle with Ted Cruz, why he's optimistic about a COVID-19 vaccine, and why a new wave of legalized sports gambling is on the horizon. Also: What should Jeff Bezos and Mark Zuckerberg have behind them when they testify, what should we take away from AOC's battle with Ted Yoho, and can an AI algorithm write better than Kara Swisher? Hey, listeners: We want your reactions to and questions about Wednesday's tech antitrust hearing. Send them in to [e-mail] by Wednesday night, or tweet them @PivotSchooled. Get tickets for our upcoming livestream event series: PivotSchooled.com. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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hours of entertainment, delicious dining, and warm, welcoming service that's designed around you. Check out virginatlantic.com for your next trip to London and beyond and see for yourself how traveling for business can always be a pleasure. Support for this show is brought to you by Nissan Kicks. It's never too late to try new things. And it's never too late to reinvent yourself. The all-new Reimagined

Nissan Kicks is the city-sized crossover vehicle that's been completely revamped for urban adventure. From the design and styling to the performance, all the way to features like the Bose Personal Plus sound system, you can get closer to everything you love about city life in the all-new Reimagined Nissan Kicks. Learn more at www.nissanusa.com 2025 dash kicks available feature bose is a registered trademark of the bose corporation hi everyone this is pivot from new york magazine and the vox media podcast network i'm kara swisher This is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher.

And I'm man, woman, cat, Cialis Chipotle. You know, we should make one. That would be perfect. Cialis. I think you would remember Cialis, though, don't you think? And probably Chipotle. I remember it almost every other day. I know. Oh, my God.

I don't even want to talk about it. It's crazy. It's crazy bragging. I just sit in a bathtub taking ED drugs. You do? Do you think you'd pass that have you taken that test you know i've taken it a lot oh i would so not pass it i left yesterday i'm out of montauk and i go down to this this fancy hotel gurney's and i have breakfast

there every morning and yesterday got up came home and realized i hadn't paid oh what do you think you are who are you like you just walk away? Do you do that with conversations? You just leave the conversation without saying goodbye? I eat alone. I was alone. You think you're in an Uber. You constantly think you're in an Uber. Just get out. I got out of a cab the other day.

He's like, you know, I'm not an Uber. That's a different thing. That would be great if life was an Uber. You just get out. You just leave all the time. That would be great if life was an Uber. Yeah. In that regard.

Otherwise, not for the workers but like you like the whole thing with the amazon stores where you walk out and they it's hard for you know just take something and leave it just i kind of i like that idea yeah we're definitely it definitely seems as if i'm trying to create a segue to the world of technology it does seem like payments that covid like everything else is going to accelerate a massive shift to contactless payments. I was thinking that. I only use contactless payments with my phone now. Although you have to end up touching the stupid screen anyway. They got to do it so it's totally contactless because you always end up having to push the green button.

Yeah, it takes some time. In any case, let's move on to some tech stuff. And there's a lot going on. One is the antitrust hearing, which we talked so much about, was postponed to Wednesday because of John Lewis's funeral. A very good reason to do so. So we have more time. We'll be able to digest it as time goes on, as on our Thursday show. What do you think about that?

Yeah, I'm disappointed. I think they should have postponed it until they could do it in person. I don't know. Have you watched any of these remote Zoom hearings? No. I've seen some angry ones in the middle of, you know, city council hearings where people start screaming about masks. But no, I have not. I don't think any of these guys are going to start screaming about masks.

But no. Yeah, they're just not as effective. And I can bet that you can bet there's somewhere between a dozen and two dozen well-paid Stratcom officials in what is a set meant to look like the Zuck in Tim Cook's home. I'll bet you we should make a gentle person's bet here. I bet in visual shot of the camera for Tim Cook's Zoom call will be an Auburn football helmet. Okay. Because he's into college sports. If anyone who's into college sports is likable. Trust me, I've had lunch where he goes on about it. Yeah.

And then somewhere in the Zucks will be pictures of him and kids, although maybe for security. They'll just, I can't imagine how much they're thinking about, how do we make this guy more likable? Yeah. What's his background? Oh, we could just completely be superficial and talk about what's his background. All right, what is Sundar's background? That's really interesting.

I don't know Sundar. I know very little about him. What do you know about him? What's likable about Sundar? I've known him since he was a product manager on Chrome and stuff like that. He's lovely. He's a lovely guy.

I bet they have a nice, you know, they won't have too many books. They don't want to reveal too much about themselves. Yeah, agree. There might be some nice fruit, some strong colors and vases

and stuff like that. It's amazing how people have to think about this. And then Bezos, it'll just be a pile of money. He'll just be sitting on a pile of money, right?

I think just to freak everyone out behind Zuckerberg, they should have just Atlas Shrugged and like Mein Kampf or something. Just totally freak everybody out. You had to go to Mein Kampf, didn't you? And maybe like a magazine on knitting. Something weird.

Something just to really. But like Bezos, don't you think a pile of money, he should just be sitting on a pile of money and his current girlfriend should bring in a martini every now and again or something like that i do like that what do you think i would do something really awful if i was him like he should yeah yeah they have to be careful they do they have to what do you think they'll wear he should light a cigar with like a hundred dollar bill or something that would be good that would be what i'm just trying trying to think. What could he really... Oh, my God. This is so much better than me. He should have a bad car model of a Z2 Corvette, just a really bad midlife crisis car.

We should do a show just on backgrounds we want tech and media moguls to have and stuff. Maybe a brochure just for men, hair plugs on his desk, something that doesn't look too obvious. Something crazy, like just for men, hair plugs on his desk. Yeah. Something that doesn't look too obvious. Something crazy, like some messages. And of course, all the QAnon people will see messages in Jeff Bezos. I think a pile of a chair of money would be very funny. And then he lights it on fire at the end. Or just have Floyd Mayweather in the background. He's hanging with Floyd. Floyd and Katy Perry. Yeah. And like David Hasselhoff. That's who he rolls with now. Yeah. Just whoever he wants to fly in on the jet. Oh, my God.

That would be so good. The hearings are already better than they're going to be. They're already better with our taking on it. Stuff like that. In any case, this week, sad, Regis Philbin died. What a likable guy, right? I love Regis Philbin. I couldn't help myself.

I love him. Yeah. So did Olivia de H't help myself. I love him. Yeah. So did Olivia de Havilland. She was 104. Gone with the wind, we talked about. She never really commented on all the controversy around it. Why would she? You know, you hit triple digits.

You don't have to put up with that shit. It's like, whatever, I'm 100. Whatever, I'm 100. You know, and it was really, they were both really interesting actors. And Regis Philbin was just a delight. He's one of those delight people. It's sort of like Alex Trebek, who has a book out.

We should get Alex Trebek to come on to Pivot. That would be really good. Yep. Yep. Oh my God, I love him. Just a likable man, like a likable,

friendly guy. Sort of a lot of, you know, says dumb things sometimes, but really quite a, quite a good, he has the most. When you say dumb,

you mean conservative. I mean, he doesn't go to the work spot. No, he doesn't. He was quite liberal, I think. He had more television time than anybody in history, I think. I think he was like the most person who had the most. He was on TV shows.

He was on all kinds of things. He was on everything. And, of course, Kathy Lee with Kathy and stuff like that. Speaking of bad times, and then we'll get to the big stories because we've got Mark Cuban coming on. Just a quick note about Regis. I'm obsessed with obituaries and death, and I know you are as well. I think Regis, I mean, in addition to being very likable, brought a couple of things that are pillars of success. And I was trying to think, what can a young person take away from someone's life? He served his country. I believe he served in the Navy and

he was also known, his reputation kind of behind the screen or behind the camera was he was known as the hardest working man in show business. So in addition to being what seemed like a very likable, decent man, he served his country and he worked his ass off well into his 70s and 80s. And if you think about success, right, the pillars of success, serving in the agency of something greater than yourself and just showing up and working your ass off, that's a pretty good place to start in terms of success. Yes, indeed. Indeed. Indeed. Not everybody has to write bestselling novels or stuff like that.

Yeah, he was totally into it. Oh, speaking of which. What? Oh, my God. Only you. It's announced in some ridiculous NPR Christian Amanpour thing that you have just recently signed a book deal and you went on to say, no, it's a two book deal. I love that. I love that.

It wasn't Christian. It is. I love that. No, you got it wrong. It's a two book deal. Well, they did. They got it wrong. What do you want me to say?

The other one I can write about anything I want and it's going to be about you. It's going to be a total tell all. Reallyall to tell all of all your horribleness and you'll be it'll be a mask it'll be a fictional book that's more like a pamphlet it'll be it'll be a fiction i'll have some horrible name for you and stuff like that i gotta consult my teenagers on that the first we talked about anyways a two book a two book deal deal in the middle of the pandemic a lot of money so i just gotta warn you writing a book is awful i've written two scott yeah but you forget what it's like childbirth the hormone releases such you forget what happened i've forgotten childbirth and you haven't give me a break i have had a child like all these things don't don't use the childbirth oh my god you've never you've never had one okay first Okay, first off, first off, men should not be allowed in the room.

I was so nauseous. What are you, in the 1950s? Oh, 100%. Give me the baby with a bow in its hair. Let me just say it. I'm going to be fine. That was the most frightening, disturbing thing I've ever witnessed in my life. They were so worried about me. Well, try doing it.

Try doing it. Oh, my God. It was awful. Let me just say. Try actually being in the stirrups there. Let me just say. It was very painful. And the book was fine.

I'll be just fine. I was so sick. As usual, you complain about, like, bounty, like getting a book contract. But I got two. Two. And I will be fine. It'll be great. I'm going away this weekend to write the outline.

And that'll be done. And then I'll write. I'll type it out. Type it out. I'm just going to type it out. Yeah, I'm going to check in to see if that outline gets done over the weekend. You know, it's going to. I'm going to my friend's beach house.

I'm going to sit there and type. Oh, yeah. You see, I'm going to send it to you. That helps. Well, if you're going to a beach house, it'll definitely get done. I'm going to a friend's beach house. We're going to the beach. Listen, we need to get on to big stories.

We've got Mark Cuban coming on. All right. Facebook is facing an unprecedented cultural crisis. It's a story that Ryan Mack had on BuzzFeed News. Facebook is hurting people at scale, increasing pressure on Facebook leadership from its own employees over the past month and a half. And Joel Kaplan and Facebook's policy team have inserted themselves into moderation discussions, which we've discussed before. Facebook engineer Dan Abramoff and a lot of people were on the record also talking, the company leadership has betrayed the trust my colleagues and I have placed

in them. There was a lot of hot quotes in that piece. So, you know, they're getting some employee unrest. Do you think it matters at all to them there at all? So isn't anyone who works at Facebook really, shouldn't they run for Senator of Maine? Aren't they kind of Senator Susan Collins, where they pretend to give a good goddamn and try and pimp the fact they might have a conscience somewhere, but then vote for the president or continue to cash Facebook's checks leave their jobs every day. And that's kind of how you vote with your feet on this. And this notion, these virtual walkouts, I'm concerned. I just don't, you know, but cash my check and where are my options struck? So, look, you work there, you're part of it. And I don't think you get to pretend to be concerned about Trump's policies and always line up and back him. I just, you know, if you're at Facebook, you endorse what is the most damaging organization in the world.

Your efforts of the majority of your work life are a function of creating tremendous agita and threat to the Commonwealth. So, you know, quite frankly, no one gives a fuck what you think. Just either leave and then have some credibility around your statements or your concern. But this notion that you can be concerned, just on Susan Collins us, you know, you're there. You're cashing their check. You're eating their food. So anyway, what are your thoughts?

I called Mark Susan. I think it's a problem. I think they're getting very, I think this unsettles Mark quite a bit. I think it unsettles him in a way that other things don't. I think he does care with the people. He spends a lot of time trying to be like a regular guy there. And I think one of the guys, one of the people, a lot of guys. And I think that when there's significant employee pushback, that's a problem.

People feel less proud of working there. And as they, you know, it was interesting though, a lot of really early people came out with that letter a long time ago we talked about. I think it has more, it's more significant than the advertisers revolting because he knows they have no choice.

In the case of employees, they do have a choice. There are other places to work. And so he knows he's got the advertisers by the you know what. And so they, so I think it's big the advertisers by the you know what and so um so they so i think it's big i think it's i think it unsettles mark in a way that other things don't i do think he has an attitude of this too shall pass on everything but you know what i mean i am

the emperor and i shall just be here so just i'll wait you all out i think that's the slow rolling of facebook is all his his doing it would be interesting is if Facebook, what they do with Joel Kaplan if Biden beats Trump. He was their Republican man on the Hill, essentially. Well, they have, they've kind of gone, you know, effective lobbying is cozying up to one side as much as you can, such that you can have influence. But at the same time, not cozying up to them so much such that if they lose, you get blowback. And I wonder if Facebook has crossed that line. I think Joel Kaplan crossed the line the minute he sat behind Brett Kavanaugh at the hearings, the Supreme Court hearings.

And they didn't know it, FYI. Just that they didn't know he was going to do it. A little inside baseball, a little 411. Finally, some of that journalistic access coming through here. You know, I just feel like that was a real mistake on his part. You know, even if he was his friends, he could go meet him backstage. He didn't need to be sitting behind him, given his job. Well, that's one thing.

I think at this point, they've gone all in on Trump. And again, the definition of an oligarch is you're leveraging your proximity to power to make money in a corrupt way. And I think essentially that the biggest oligarch in the world is Zuckerberg. And I think he's gone all in on Trump. And I think this, when he comes out and interviews Fauci and is critical of Trump, it reeks of when Barr said he was concerned about Trump's comments, where Trump says, wink, wink, yeah, go ahead and criticize me. So we throw him off the scent. I think these two are absolutely, have an unholy alliance. He's been trying to say, I have no unholy alliance very loudly, which is interesting.

Yeah, I don't know. What's your sense? My sense is that- I sense that they have too much of a Peter Thiel, Joel Kaplan influence. And I think they need to figure out, and Cheryl's tarnished in the eyes of Democrats. She was their Democratic side. You know what I mean? So I think when I talk to Democrats, they make faces, you know, they sort of sneer around Sheryl Sandberg. So I, you know, I think she's, she has sort of been brought down by them in that regard. And, and the closest to the Trump administration, I don't know, you never know politics, they always turn like I hate them. And then the next day, they're posing up to them. So I,'t know. You never know. Politics, they always turn like I hate them. And then the next day they're posing up to them. So, you know, I never know.

I just know that there's a lot of disdain for Facebook among the Democrats. And I think that'll be problematic. And then at the same time, it depends on how it turns out with the Senate and everything else. They do have a friend in Chuck Schumer. When I did an interview with him, he was sort of. His daughter works at Facebook, doesn't she? She does. She may have left. I don't interview them, he was sort of... His daughter works at Facebook, doesn't she? She does. She may have left.

I don't think that has anything to do with it. I think he's very, I think he's quite I would say ignorant in the ways of tech. Being kind, I think he doesn't know what he's talking about. And he often says things I was sort of perplexed by. But he is very pro-Facebook. I think they give him a lot of money.

I think they... He seems to be more pro-Facebook than anybody I've ever encountered up there. Yeah, it was a surprise. You should go back and listen to that interview that I did with him many years ago. And I was surprised. I was surprised by his level of Facebook. Again, it has nothing to do with his daughter. I think it just is him and their influence on him.

But we'll see. I know Nancy Pelosi is not happy with Facebook, for sure, because she's been pushed around by them on that drunk video. Well, think about the leadership that takes. I mean, if there's anyone who would be inclined to soft pedal or rub Vaseline over the lens of hate and attacks on democracy, it would be the individual who represents the district who has gotten tremendous wealth in tax revenue. I think Representative Pelosi shows a tremendous amount of integrity when she says, yeah, maybe I'm your representative, but let's be honest, you're bad for America. Well, she's San Francisco. She's not their actual representative.

But isn't there an office in San Francisco? No, they don't have a very big. Is it Ro Khanna? What's his name? Is he their guy? Ro is down. I think they're in Ro's district. I think it's probably... But he's pretty hostile at Facebook, too. I'm just saying, they're not...

They're going to have to figure out their Democratic scheme when Biden comes in. And they're maybe hoping, you know, especially if Kamala Harris is in there. When Biden comes in, I like your optimism. I said if. You know, if Kamala Harris is in there, even though there's been a lot of reporting for closeness to the tech people, she's still someone they don't want to tangle with. And the same thing, there'll be a lot of pressure on her to be tough on them.

And, you know, Elizabeth Warren will certainly be a voice. It just depends on where the election comes out. Depends. And if it's Trump, they're golden. They're golden. If it's Trump. Well, not the rest of us. We'll see.

Anyway, we're going to take a quick break. When we get back, we're going to talk to Mark Cuban about the return of basketball. And this is an area you must ask the questions in because I am not good at the sports ball. Fox Creative. This is advertiser content from Zelle. When you picture an online scammer, what do you see? For the longest time, we have these images of somebody sitting crouched over their computer with a hoodie on, just kind of typing away in the middle of the night. And honestly, that's not what it is anymore.

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Bose is a registered trademark of the Bose Corporation. Corporation. Okay, Scott, we're back. Big tech firms are schmoozing foreign regulators into not doing their jobs. 30 foreign antitrust officials were winded down last year by the Global Antitrust Institute, a part of the Antonin Scalia Law School at George Mason University in Fairfax, Virginia. Basically, don't regulate us and please enjoy this delicious meal. Global antitrust institutions funded mostly entirely by big companies and affiliated foundations, including Amazon, Google, Qualcomm. George Mason, I covered it when I was at the Washington Post. They were always doing this kind of thing, like putting up, you know, being very friendly to corporate, uh, corporate citizens, as I recall during this

time when they were just getting started, uh, trying to attract a bigger level of professor there. And so talk about this, Mr. Academics, in terms of these things that get funded at universities. Do you have an institute, a Scott Galloway Institute of Chipotle, for example? That's right. Um, look, it's, it's, we're, universities are not immune from the lure of capitalism. And a big component of your ability to get tenure is to get research funded. And it's difficult. If you want to know the outcome and the conclusion of research, just find out who's paid for it. And in the case of most academic research, it's a lot of times it's funded by nonpartisan sources or the university itself. And so if there is a least bad version of peer reviewed research, you're going to find it

typically at universities. But these think tanks, if they're funded by certain, you know, and we have them on the left, Kara. We fund groups to do research to basically support our, you know, our narrative. So I don't think this is anything unusual. The question is a balance of power. And that is, in addition to these think tanks, there are now more full-time Amazon lobbyists making, I would bet somewhere between $400,000 and $800,000 a year than there are sitting U.S. senators. There's now over 100 full-time lobbyists from Amazon living in D.C. taking all of these nice women and men to golf and to dinner and saying, hey, we're just a big fan of your leadership. We'd like to get involved in your campaign. And by the way, when this whole antitrust stuff comes up, we assume that you're

for capitalism and you're for consumer lower consumer prices and this is the danger but i don't i think these think tanks you know we have them on both sides i feel nervous now whenever i was talking to one today and i was like oh where do you get your money like i never had thought this like in terms of it was at a university and i i was like i'm gonna have to now check in case i'm you know i'm saying something it sounded reasonable but it was sort of like who's paying your bills and you know you know, you do, you know, there was some controversy around some of this COVID testing of where these, these researchers have it. It just feels like a lot of stuff feels bogus. Like, you don't, you know, it feels bogus when they're doing

this and they're trying to influence, but I think many, some universities are doing real research. Others are much more pay for play. And I think that's really. markets and the impact on IPOs. And they invited me to the meeting and there was someone from the NASDAQ and they were willing to fund it, fund this research and fund, even fund the center. And this, one of the guys in the meeting, Professor Bruce Buchanan, who I think is one of the clearest blue flame thinking economists in the world, you know, at the end of the meeting said, I'm just not comfortable with the NASDAQ, taking money from the NASDAQ for research around the financial markets, because ultimately we're going to end up saying that the NASDAQ is the right. You know, he just wasn't comfortable with private enterprise being injected into academic research. And then the meeting ended and I was like, what the hell are you thinking?

We have an opportunity to do great research here. Don't be so pedantic. And as I've thought about it, I'm wrong. And he was right. Yeah, you can't help if they're the paying for it. You just can't help it if they're paying for it. It's like all the smoking ones. It's so much damage in terms of the smoking ones that were like,

cigarettes aren't bad. That went on for a long time. And whatever the research is, it just seems like if it's cooked, it's cooked. But then how do you pay for it? Like the university should presumably just pay for it, right? And live and die on the quality of the research is. It just seems like if it's cooked, it's cooked. But then how do you pay for it? Like the university should presumably just pay for it, right? And live and die on the quality of the research. But that's sort of naive, I suspect. Yeah, and the majority of it. But anyway, sort of a 15 year overdue apology to Professor Buchanan and Vice Chancellor Ingo Walter, who felt the same way that this was just this creates too much opportunity for bias

research. So anyways, net net, and it's a sample size of one, but NYU takes that role of being a neutral arbiter very seriously. Yeah, and you have these funding, you know, I'm thinking of all the different organizations there. They seem like they're criminal justice stuff, that Barry does, Barry Friedman. It feels like it's really good research, right? You know, and that's the thing.

It's like who, you have to, they should at least be very clear about who's paying for it. So you know, and what they might, you know, turf, what reports they might put in the drawer, like the government is doing right now. But in any case, we've got to get to this week's friend of Pivot, investor and Dallas Mavericks owner, Mark Cuban. Bio, he's an American entrepreneur, television personality, media proprietor, and investor. Again, he owns the Dallas Mavericks. He previously founded Microsolutions and Broadcast.com, which is where I ran into him. And of course, he's one of the original sharks on Shark Tank.

Mark, welcome to Friend of Pivot. Thanks for having me on, guys. So we're going to talk basketball first. So the NBA is scheduled to resume its season this week. And, you know, Scott and I have talked a lot about the financial impact and stuff like that with the virus spreading rapidly in Florida. How confident are you of the situation? Very confident. I mean, they're truly are quarantined. They're in a bubble, literally. And so they're safer there than they would be at home. So talk about that. What is the what does that entail?

I mean, literally, we took over Walt Disney World, a section of Walt Disney World, and we basically locked down multiple hotels and their arena set up there. And so, you know, it's Hotel California. Once you enter, you cannot leave. You know, if you're on the outside, you're not getting in. All right. What do you feel about how they're doing? They struck a deal with Microsoft to put live videos and hundreds of fans watching the game's courtside

instead of having them live in the audience. What do you think of the virtual audience? I mean, look, we'll see what happens. You know, if it were up to me, I'd work with TNT, which is now with HBO and AT&T, and put in famous people as opposed to just virtual fans, you know, things that something that would be different and corny and fun. But we'll see what happens. This is all an experiment. So what about fans not being there? How do you think it'll be in terms of the plan?

A little bit different, I think, up front. But all these kids are so young. You know, they were playing AAU in front of nobody three years ago. You know, so I don't think, you know, and then they play hard in practice. And so it's, it'll be an adjustment, but it's, I don't think it's going to be as dramatic as people think. And, and will you be there in person for any of the games? Are you going to go?

For playoffs? Yeah. Once we get to the playoffs, I will. If you get to the playoffs. When we get to the playoffs. So the seed in games, there's only eight of them. And they're every other night. So because I have to quarantine, I'll get there just in time to quarantine and start the playoffs.

All right. Well, one thing is, Scott, I want you to jump in here. You were talking about the finances of it, what it does to the business. Scott, why don't you? I'm curious as an owner. I'm fascinated by these asset classes that lose money or break even, but every year grow faster than inflation. It's just these trophy assets. And if you look at the industries that are really getting hit hard, it's ones where you

consume the product sitting shoulder to shoulder, whether it's movie theaters or restaurants and sports. And I wonder if, I mean, there's two opposing forces and I'm interested in which one you think will win. And that is the industry has obviously been, you're not wrecked, but severely impaired by COVID. But at the same time, the top 0.01% who are the buyers of sports teams have actually accreted massive wealth during the pandemic. Do you think the asset prices of football or professional sports teams goes up, goes down, goes sideways? It goes up. It goes up because fan revenue as a percentage of total revenue actually has been declining over the years.

And if you look at gambling, particularly if people are still stuck at home, then gambling revenues as states open up and they're going to need to need, they will open up more states because of the need for more revenue. I think the values will go up. And talk about that, though, gambling, that fans will not be there, but they'll gamble. But because they will be there next year, for example. Look what's happening in the stock market. Why have we seen all these Robin Hooders, you know, and free traders effectively? They're the old day traders from the late 90s. They're doing it because it's fun.

It's entertaining. It's exciting. They're gambling. And not because they're doing, you know, in-depth research on stocks or stock analytics. And the same thing, once sports pick up and gambling becomes more enabled in different states, I think it'll truly help our valuations. And what about the live element of it? Do you think you were saying fan revenue is down, that you mean like ticket prices and food and... Well, no, I mean, right now we have no fans, so it's down to zero right now.

But it had historically prior to that yeah as a as a percentage of total revenues has been declining like we've rarely the maps have rarely raised our ticket prices over the last 15 years just because we've been able to create other revenue sources and i wanted it to stay affordable for everybody have your broadcasters tried to renegotiate the rights. I mean, it's mostly been about TV revenue, right? No, not really, because we're the last bastion of traditional television. You know, and so, you know, it's an older, it's kind of a catch-22 in some respects,

where the NBA fans are younger, so we're losing some of those cord cutters. And they're consuming the NBA in large volumes, but just not in traditional media. But the good news is we'll be able to change quite a bit because going into the last three years, bandwidth is a relatively constrained asset, right? So the people who played our games, cable and satellite, had very constrained amounts of bandwidth, but that's really changing with compression and particularly with online because, you know, traditional television coming over cable is effectively streaming. It's all digital now. And so there's a lot more fungible bandwidth. And the point there is that we'll be able to do a lot more streams for any one game. So I can have a Twitch version,

I can have a YouTuber doing a presentation of a game. I can have a traditional TV version that you see on TNT or ESPN. There's basically an unlimited number of streams that we can present to any game that we could tailor to any given demographic. And as technology progresses and we can integrate all this into the encoded stream, we could effectively personalize down to very micro-targeted groups how they want to receive our games. Meaning watching a certain player or focusing in on it? Or no, it might be, you know, Karen Scott might be, you know, the announcers that a certain group of fans want to have. They don't. Yeah, but you know what I'm saying, right? Or we could take Ninja, you know, who's now a free agent and do the Fortnite type of commentary. Or, you know, somebody who's big on Minecraft and trying to reach a younger audience that we otherwise would not be able to reach. Or for the gamblers, we can use AR to do overlays or XR to do virtual reality and AR integration. So again, with fungible bandwidth and almost an unlimited amount of bandwidth

that's becoming available over cable to us, we can do, you know, wherever the technology allows us to go, we can go. And the Teams type of stuff is just one implementation. So are the other owners on board? Because one of the things you talked about many years ago with me, I remember is stuff in the seats, like getting more information, which didn't really go anywhere. Like it didn't. It was it did. I mean, it was phones. Yeah, it was just phones that did. Yeah, the phones that did. People were using their phones.

But this idea of doing these kind of things, are they open to it? And then who becomes the big players in this? It's the Googles and Amazons, no? No, I mean, look, potentially you saw what Amazon released in terms of their live streaming product. And so I don't know who we'll use, but I think really it's a chance to see if AR becomes commonplace, you know, so we'll be, once you can introduce kind of a virtual studio using AR into sports so that, you know, customers can pick their own overlays that data they want to receive, then, you know, you're going to see,

you know, companies that don't, you've never heard about start to really become valid and valuable. And what about the big, the Amazons and Googles versus the, say, the Murdoch, the Foxes and things like that? How do you look at that playing out? Two different things. One, you know, does picks and shovels and the other, you know, tries to sell gold, you know, and so I don't think they're really competitive at this point. At this point. And when you, is there a kill switch for the NBA if there's an outbreak or you need to stop the season? Yeah, safety first. Yeah, safety first. Like you saw, I don't know if you saw what happened with the Philadelphia Phillies and the New York Yankees,

the Phillies had an outbreak. And so they had to postpone some games. And so I'm guessing it'll be effectively be the same, but we have a little bit easier than football and baseball because we truly can work within a bubble. They need an outdoor environment for the most part to be able to work. And you can't just set that up in a hotel like we can. Right. In terms of what you're doing. Talk a little bit about this idea of participatory things where audiences, you own, I think,

Landmark. Is that right? You own? Or used to. But you did sell. And we talked about that last time, the idea of people gathering. When do you imagine, what is going to happen when it comes back, if it comes back from your perspective? It's hard to say quite yet. I mean, look, it all comes down to a vaccine. You know, the tech geek in me, the science geek in me says

we're getting a vaccine sooner than later because we've been able to replicate what happens in a human body using AI, and that allows them to test vaccines much more efficiently and quickly. And so I happen to be very positive on the vaccine and that will get them. And if what we're reading is true about the Department of Defense doing the actual production and distribution, then I think, you know, it happens sooner rather than later. And then, you know, if it's truly effective, we go back to relative normalcy in terms of our confidence in gathering with, you know, all the changes that we've accepted over the last six months. So go ahead, Scott.

There's just, I mean, you're just kind of mind that second order effects here. If you think about movies, I personally believe we're not going back to movies. That the innovation that at some point they're going to decide to just let streamers have James Bond and they'll figure out a pay-per-view. You can see sports. You know, that's a conversation that's been going on forever. Right. It's just being accelerated. Yeah. But the question becomes, you know, are you going to let my 16-year-old daughter go on a date in your basement, you know, or just in your living room? And, you know, even as all these things were happening, kids were still going to malls and hanging out in malls just to get away from their parents.

But let's come back to sports because I wonder, it seems to me like the audience is basically a feature and attribution. It adds to the game that the real draw is just these incredible athletes and what they're able to do and the competition. And if you could simulate the audience the same way that broadcast television figured out a way to simulate the audience with a laugh track, you could see that it might. Yeah, I just don't see that happening. Look, the way. Well, hold on. Hold on. Jesus Christ, you're worse than Kara.

Stop interrupting me. For God's sake. So there's a difference in my viewpoint. There's just an enormous difference between hockey and playoff hockey. And Mike, you moved to a hybrid model where you have the audience and you have the fans. Because let's be honest, there's just too many seats available across professional sports. And you might move to a simulation like Laugh Track or a simulated fan base during the regular season and then you allow fans on certain games to create that just in that incredible energy and i think

about second order effects maybe finally municipalities stop paying these ridiculous fees for stadiums and there's just so many second order effects even going all the way back into college like what happens to your farm team when your source of new talent, when they can't do in person? I'm worried about college sports right now. There's just so many layers upon layers of what might happen. Jump on in, Mark. Jump on in. Yeah, OK.

Some I agree with, some I disagree with. Look, what the NBA does is going to set an example for college, high school, middle school sports and how we deal with it. Again, the vaccine is the underlying principle. and how we deal with it. Again, the vaccine is the underlying principle. But if we say, you know, if we agree that we're going to get a vaccine sometime, you know, in the near future, then will people go back to normal? And is it viable at all to have people in whether it's a movie studio or arena or stadium? And to your point, the one when I first got to the NBA, which is what I was talking about when I rudely interrupted you. which is what I was talking about when I rudely interrupted you.

Don't. When I first got to the NBA, when I first got to the NBA, everybody thought we sold basketball. I tried to get everybody to say, what's our product? And it's not basketball, right?

It's the experience. Because if you think about the last sporting events you went to, you don't remember the score. You don't remember the goals. You don't remember the goal tending, you know, the dunks or the home runs. You remember who you were with, you know, the first time you went with a parent, friend, whatever. And that's how your story is, you know. And so we go for that energy when you walk into the arena. And I think that's enough of a selling point that as long as there's not a fear of getting sick, then we'll return to that. In terms of trying to replicate it,

that's going to be very difficult. I mean, look, I've done a lot of a patent in virtual reality. I mean, I've done a lot with virtual reality in terms of trying to recreate things. And it's just, you know, you get that initial sense and it's really cool. And, you know, but just trying to recreate motion in virtual reality, it's going to be a while before we have the processing speed available to a device to really make that effective. And you still don't get quite that group feeling with avatars, or even if you're able to truly recreate it. And so I think the cost effectiveness of going to an arena for fans is going to be such an overwhelming value relative to the alternatives that I think if we

can do it, you know, safely, then people will come back. All right. Now, let me ask you, how do you think the other sports are doing in terms of versus basketball, this idea of being by, is it just basketball special that you can really put people in bubbles or, or how, how do you think they've conducted football? So a couple of things are one, we're fortunate. We only have 15 players per team. Yeah. And that makes it far simpler than 25. I think hockey's 23 and basketball and football's 53. And so that's one difficult factor. Plus, in terms of incremental staff, when you have the more people you have, the more training staff you need, the more equipment managers you need, the more support staff you need. And so the managers you need, the more, you know, support staff you need. And so the downstream effects, as Scott referenced, are just significant there as well.

And then just how you play the game. Yes, you can play football and baseball indoors, but the size of the space needed is ginormous, right? Whereas with basketball, you know, literally, if you've got a ballroom in a hotel with a high enough ceiling, you can play basketball, right? And that's effectively what we're doing for a lot of our training. And, you know, we've done for training facilities, just for the Mavs and other teams as well. So it's far easier for us to create, you know, hockey's got ice, and, you know, there's just so many other complications. So I think, you know, for us, basketball is probably the easiest to open. Soccer is probably the second easiest. All right. And I would be remiss if I didn't ask about your little Twitter situation with Ted Cruz around kneeling.

Well done. Talk a little bit about that. You said there's a difference between Black Lives Matter and kneeling at a game. Can you explain what you meant by that? Yeah, sure. I mean, look, I mean, my dad fought in two wars, Navy. My uncle was Air Force. You know, he was always very clear that it's not about symbolism. It's about what it means and what it stands for and what it means to you. And, you know, this is very personal and how a player chooses to reflect what this country, what the anthem, what the flag means to them is up to them. You know, I don't care. I'm asking you a question. I just don't know. I don't know. You know, people think we have. I don't agree with you. And I think, you know, they don't know. I mean, I literally don't know. I don't talk to them about much of anything. We have board meetings like any other board.

I mean, we're governors, you know, in the same business, but it's no different than board membership for any company. It's not like we're best friends. Yeah. And it's shifted rather in that direction, though, in the kneeling direction people seem to. Yeah. I mean, look, over time, people's positions change, you know, minds change, minds evolve, as you get more exposure and experience, and it becomes more personal to the people around you. You know, even our ripe old age, you know, we're still capable of learning and adapting. And I think that's what's happened.

I have one more question. Scott, I have one more. On the broader scheme, when we talked about America 2.0, and where it's going to come out, where are you right now? Are you optimistic? And what is your biggest worry, if you're optimistic? Because I think you probably are optimistic. Yeah, I am optimistic. I mean, we're going through an amazing economic experiment right now. Is this the first step of modern monetary theory and we're learning that it works or learning that it doesn't work? You know, we really don't know yet. But the fact that we're able to experiment on this in this manner and nothing's collapsed yet, you know, we're moving forward and here we are getting ready to do another stimulus. And, you know,

the first stimulus worked, you know, incomes actually went up. And the only real mistake we made is that it wasn't use it or lose it. And which caused savings, the savings rate to go up significantly and left a lot of people and a lot of businesses in a state of suspended animation. The question becomes what's acceptable creative destruction. Right. So when you look at the restaurant industry, I mean, the pain is enormous enormous and incredible but people still are finding other ways to eat you know and so do you prop them up or have habits changed so even if you prop them up they're still going to have challenges kicking my hand down the road because are we finding new and better ways to eat so the only uncertainty you know the two major uncertainties are, does MMT work, which leads to huge optimism, because, you know, if we get to a, you know, if we get a Joe Biden presidency, then the fear factor

is, do they stay dogmatic on economic theory that's always fitted, you know, the Democrats, or if we stay, God help us, if we stay with Trump, you know, what do they do? Or do we say, as if we stay with Trump, you know, what do they do? Or do we say, let's learn from just happened, put all dogma aside, and let's keep on trying MMT, right? Because that could have the potential greatest impact on this country and the world. And then part two to that is, you know, for each individual industry, what, you know, no one wants to allow companies to fail, but do we have to allow some companies to fail? Because there's a difference between something being essential and unreplaceable, right, versus something that we always deemed essential but has been replaced by alternatives. Because those bits, when you shift to one industry, you're taking away from the other industry that's benefited from the creative destruction.

And so I think, you know me, Carol, I'm always looking towards disruption as an opportunity. You also sound like Scott a lot. Well, we let the expos fail. I mean, but we're not going to let United Airlines fail. This is part of capitalism. I have just so many questions, but I'm going to rifle through two or three and you give me quick answers. Sure, far away. Your assumption is that we're back to normal when there's a vaccine. What happens when 50% of the people entering your stadium refuse to take a vaccine? Two, I want you to talk a little bit about whether or not you think this confluence of stimulus, bored young men and gambling and online trading platforms, specifically Robinhood, if you think that leads to some unintended consequences or something negative. And then where do you want to be in five years?

You obviously have thoughtful viewpoints. It strikes me that owning a sports team gives you a platform, but not a great deal of influence outside of that domain. Where would you like to be in five years? So number one, we don't know yet. We'll have to see how people adjust to the vaccine. My guess is it'll come in waves and we may have to delay

the season a little bit longer than we otherwise would have, you know, but I'm hopeful there. Two, in terms of where, let me go three, because I forgot to, number three, in terms of where I'll be in five years, I just want to have an impact. You know, I've made enough money now. Senator Cuban, running for president. No chance I'd run for president. Oh, come on. We'll see what happens with the next president. Your balls are bigger than that. Where do you want to be in five years? I want to be having an impact, right? Being the president doesn't mean you're necessarily in a position to have the greatest impact. And so if you if you look at the investments that I've made, literally, almost every single one of them has some sort of impact, you know, whether it's drugs, whether it's healthcare, or whether you wherever I can,

on your second question was the unintended consequences of having all these particularly men, young men, just spending, you know, all this stimulus money and any funding that they're getting and gambling it. You know, we saw that in the late 90s, where everywhere you turned, people were making money on the stock market. And everybody, I still, I even tweeted at one point, you know, there's that old Stewart commercial with E-Trade, let's light this candle, which always cracked me up. It's worse on Robinhood. Have you been on Robinhood? Yeah, it's far worse. But remember, Scott, everybody's a genius in the bull market. And then as I look at what's happening now, even if I old portfolio, which is still primarily Netflix

and Amazon, you have, I keep on reminding myself that when broadcast.com was public, one day we were up 50, the next day we were down 30. And that went on for multiple years. And so here we are just a few months in. And so I don't think we can really say this is a net negative or net positive. It really depends on how long this goes. And look, QE and the implementation of what the Fed has done is effectively UBI for rich people and UBI for gamblers, you know, and that's what's happening right now. And so as long as this Fed money is sustaining the, the market and particularly these conversations about buying actual stocks

themselves, which I'm not a fan of, then you're going to see more and more and more people day trading. And I had my 18 year old niece asked me, you know, which stocks I should buy, she should buy, because some of her friends were making 30% a day, she said. And I was like, look, you know, you're gambling. As long as you know, nobody sells. Yeah. But we don't know when that ending is, right? This is definitely a musical chairs market. Yeah. We just don't know when the music stops. Mark, you came back to tell us what the most important topic you think we didn't ask you about. Please go on. Okay, so pick any technology that you think is integral and critical

to our future. Every single one of them has semiconductors as an underpinning. And Intel effectively is our last domestic manufacturer. They're not the best at it, but they're there, right? They came out, their CEO the other day came out and their earnings call and said they'd have to consider going non going fabulous, meaning somebody else would manufacture it, which means that's probably going to be made by Taiwan Semiconductor. Could you think of anything scarier than having zero domestic chip manufacturing? Literally, you sound like you sound like Peter Navarro. Why wouldn't we outsource manufacturing there like everywhere else? Well, in this particular case, it's critical to our military and our economic future. I'm with Mark on this one. That's an excellent prediction from Mark Cuban. Okay. But what do you do? I mean, we've offshoreed almost everything. What do you do?

We need to have a policy of investment, strategic investment in this country. We do it with the NIH. If you look at small drug molecules, small molecule drugs, rather, I think there was a report written by 46 Research, I think they're called, that said 90%, give or take, of our small molecule drugs were created effectively out of the NIH. And we need to do more of that for drugs. But we also need to start recognizing that there are core competencies we need to have as a country, because, you know, there's no uncertainty that if we don't continue to be the leader in AI, we're going to struggle. If we're not the leader in quantum, we're going to struggle.

If we don't become a presence, at least, in robotics, we're going to struggle economically. If we don't have the ability to manufacture domestically, the shit could hit the fan really, really quickly. Well, we're seeing that with cotton swabs in our response to testing, right? Well, exactly. We don't make anything anymore. Yeah. And those cotton swabs in our response to testing, right? Well, exactly. We don't make anything anymore.

Yeah. And those are anecdotal in a lot of respects, right? And that we don't make things and we just, that again was a planning and strategy. But when it comes to something as strategic as technology and not having a core component, I mean, that's true. I think you're right.

President Mark Cuban, everybody. I have a last question. The hearings are on Wednesday now. They've been postponed, the tech hearings. Annie, you and I had gone back, but you don't think it matters until after the election, any of this? Yeah, because, yeah, I think it's kind of a waste of time. But it's a great question.

You know, what's the responsibility of government as it applies to these companies? And it's really hard because it's a balancing act when we don't have a national policy, a true national policy when it comes to technology. We really don't have an investment theme when it comes to technology. We have to recognize that those companies we're looking at regulating really are our technology strategy when it comes to AI and future technologies. And by breaking them up, we should we could be cutting off our nose to spite our face. So what would you do if you were Senator? I mean, Congress? So what I would be proposing is I take a page out of Roger McNamee's book when he said that, you know, I would I would end the Section 230 protections for any time

neural networks or AI is used to amplify any message, right? It doesn't matter if it's political or otherwise. If it's organic traffic that comes from somebody sharing it, fine. It has 230 protections. If you use any type of AI at all to say, okay, we're showing, it's basically what TikTok does right best. What TikTok's the best at, if that's used at all, and Facebook is second best at, if that's used at all, and Facebook is second best at, then there are no 230 protections. And I think that'll change their behavior.

And, you know, there's an argument to be made that even with Citizens United, you could undercut Citizens United by just saying no political advertising in any of these. And, you know, if the House and the Senate can pass that, I wouldn't be opposed to it. All right, that's really interesting. Now, last question I have, we were talking about the backgrounds we think they should all have because it's going to be on Zoom. And we felt Jeff Bezos should be on a pile of money or a chair of money. Thoughts?

I think he should have National Enquirer front page behind him. Oh, nice. What about Zuckerberg? Amateur photography. Zuckerberg, I think him jumping over a shark. Sunblock. Jumping over a shark. Him jumping over a shark. And then Tim and Sundar will be quiet in the background.

Yeah, they could be quiet in the background. All right. Mark, as usual, you're a delight. We really appreciate it. That was great. Thank you. Thanks for having me on. I really appreciate it.

Good luck. Thanks, Scott. Thanks, Scott. Okay. Bye. Appreciate it. Bye. All right, Scott.

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Go to constantcontact.ca for your free trial. Constantcontact.ca. All right, Scott, we're back with wins and fails. And then Mark just had a fail, which was the Intel. I think that was a really smart one. But I would, may I start with my fail was, of course, Sinclair Broadcasting, the owner of 300 plus local TV stations, was planning to air a segment on Sunday pushing the false and idiotic conspiracy theory in Plandemic, which suggests that Anthony Fauci helped create the coronavirus. They pulled it last minute and says they'll rework it. Just Sinclair is a dangerous. There's other there's other local TV stations like Gray and others that are trying to do news and things like that. But this is just really, it shows you the power of local television.

So that is my fail. What's your win? Oh, let me think about a win. You start with your fails. You have a win, I know, which is great. Really? I don't know. Apple giving the voting.

Oh, yeah. I wasn't going to use that. Actually, Hearst, the one that doesn't get the credit for that is Hearst has been giving people the day off for a long time on election day. But anyways, I think it's a great thing. I have a couple of fails. I think we've been talking a lot about cancel culture and we've been speaking about it through the lens of the far left, where if you don't sign up for an orthodoxy, people feel unsafe and go after your profession and your person as opposed to the evidence and the argument around interrogating the truth. And we're seeing it now on the far right, where Representative Cheney, who I do not agree with her politics, but she defended Fauci. And of course, Senator Rand Paul said that she's bad for America rather than focusing on her.

You know, she votes for the president 97 percent of the time. But if she doesn't vote with him 100 percent of the time and signed up to the narrative, she's bad for America. And I just think this is so dangerous. If there's any legislative body, the whole idea of legislation and these bodies, they're supposed to discuss and debate. They're not supposed to go after each other's patriotism. Well, Trump is culty. You know, it's a cult right now. It's going to be interesting what's going to happen if she chooses.

Senator Paul doesn't need to pull that bullshit. And my other loss I have, too, is there's so many unintended consequences. And it goes back to what we were talking about with Mark. A lot of college sports, universities are obviously under tremendous financial pressure. A lot of college sports, universities are obviously under tremendous financial pressure, and they've slowly but surely announced the elimination of a lot of what I'll call non-glamour, non-revenue-based sports. I wrote crew at UCLA and crew programs, diving programs, water polo, field hockey. All these programs all over the United States are being canceled.

And I'm fascinated with this notion of soft power. Our brand, America, that is the strongest brand in the world. And even if 98% of people never come in contact with an American or come to America, they're more inclined to root for us. They're more inclined to let their amazing daughter who has a degree in engineering move to the U S they're more inclined not to not to help our adversaries because of our brand. And one of the biggest sources of soft power post-World War II has been the Olympics. And we're going to see a serious decline in our medal count because a lot of these non-glamour sports, whether it's diving, where America has just dominated because these incredible

sports programs, in addition to the medal count, the grit, the camaraderie, the discipline that's formed in these colleges around college sports amongst people who will never make a living at it. It's really, again, it's one of these second and third order effects because of our incompetent handling of the coronavirus that will diminish our standing in the world. That is a good one. That's a very good one. And my win of course is I just thought AOC's response.

AOC. To a representative, was it Yoho Yolo? I don't know. Calling her a fucking bitch. I just thought it was a master class. Yoho. And how to have a dignified response and not, not come across as a victim, but to say there's

something bigger and more important going on here. She's going places. And that is, you know, these aggressions against women, these misogyny that permeates every part of our economy and our culture, you know, it sets us back. It gets in the way of our greatness. And also just, I thought the most powerful moment was, look, just because you have a wife doesn't mean you're a misogynist, not a misogynist. Just because you have daughters doesn't mean you're vulgar

and you don't promote in a weird way violence against women. And people have to stop standing up and giving these non-apology apologies where they reference the fact that they have a wife and daughters. That doesn't mean anything. I thought her response was so, I thought, okay, how old, I remember thinking, how old do I want my boys to see before or be, or how old should they be before they see that? Because I think it's so important for boys and young men to understand what went on here. And not only that, just what kind of grace and effectiveness. I mean, this guy was leaving Congress. Little did he know he was

going to be the doormat for her to wipe her feet before he left. I mean, he just absolutely. Yeah, he's a dinosaur. He looks like a dinosaur. He's a dinosaur. She schooled a guy. He's a dinosaur. Just absolutely schooled a guy. So anyways, my win. My sons were very moved by her, but I think everybody, women should also look at how she did that.

You know what I mean? Like it was really. Masterclass. Masterclass. It was beautifully rendered. It was beautifully written. It was beautifully said. It was perfectly.

And also, let's be honest, her staff probably had a lot to do with that. I don't. They are just. Whoever. Very good. They've got her voice.

It doesn't really matter, you know. Very good. Wow. I agree with you. I agree with you on that one. That would have been mine. My win is, well, we're going to talk about this next week, GPT-3. It's the new AI language model from OpenAI.

Elon Musk is affiliated with many others. You're flexing something. What was that? Listen to me. Listen, they have read every word published on the internet to date. It means it can take a piece of writing or code and generate what comes next. And they did it for me, for one of my columns, my tech power column about this week's hearings. And so they had the beginning of the story, which was talking about how Tucker

Carlson and Hannity got into a fight about whether Jeff Bezos should be as rich as he is, this one day spike of $13 billion. And they wrote my piece, and then they added on these three paragraphs, which I think are just brilliant from GPT-3, which terrifies me nonetheless. Mr. Carlson went on to point out that Mr. Bezos personally owns the Washington Post and is a left-wing influencer. If you own a monopoly and use it to enrich yourself further, you are an economic moocher, he said. You're no better than Bernie Madoff's of the world. Well, that's true that the EPA has been more lax than past administrations in enforcing environmental rules that affect Amazon. That's not to say people don't want to give more of the money, give the company more of their money for its services.

Mr. Hannity seemed to agree, but his position was that Mr. Bezos should have shared the wealth with Mr. Hannity. That was a column they came up with. I loved it. Well, I was going to say that's the most eloquent thing you've ever written, but that's not you, right? That wasn't you? No, the last part. No, but let me just say, I like AI Cara. She's really a pain in the ass. That's a shocker. You like AI Cara. That's a shocker. You're so jealous. You're so jealous. You know what? By the way, quick shout out. You're still jealous of my two books, right? Is that correct? I said I was out in Montauk doing my failed silent retreat, and Joanna Coles listened

to our podcast, and she invited me over, and I met her lovely sons and family last night. So this is improving my social life. I actually have a friend now. Wow, did she tell you anything about the Hearst situation? We haven't gotten into that yet. She should have been that job and that Toby Young guy. You think? She's doing bigger things.

She's doing TV shows. I know, but I'm sure she knows all those bodies are buried in any case. I agree she's doing good things, but she deserved that job over the person they gave it to, who's now had to quit. And I think Ben Smith's doing a very nice job explaining why. Anyway, before we go, we have a special request for Friday's listener mail. We want your reactions to and questions about Wednesday's big tech hearing, assuming it happens. So watch and read about the hearings and then email us at pivot at voxmedia.com. We're taping the show Thursday morning, so please email us no later than Wednesday night.

We will have our own thoughts. We'd like to hear yours to have the best chances of getting your question answered. That's pivot at voxmedia.com. You can also tweet at us at Pivot School, and we'll look at those, too. Don't forget, if you can't get enough Pivot at VoxMedia.com. You can also tweet at us at Pivot Schooled, and we'll look at those too. Don't forget, if you can't get enough Pivot, we're doing a live stream event for the month of August. It's called Pivot Schooled from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. You can get tickets. We've got a lot of people coming.

We want a lot more. We want to have a lovely audience for this. You get tickets at PivotSchooled.com. There's also a link in our show notes. Sir, Mr. Galloway, will you lead us out, Professor Galloway? That was elegant. You forgot my name. Today's episode was produced by Eric Johnson.

Our executive producer is Erica Anderson. Special thanks to Fernando Finete and also to Drew Burrows. If you like what you heard, please download or subscribe. Register for Pivot School. Literally, Kara's going through her phone and inviting everybody. We have 2,000 people registered so far. It's going to be fantastic. Maybe even a Zoom bombing for Mark Cuban. Have a wonderful week. It is great to be in the throes of summer. Let's start educating people that if and when there is the vaccine, that this is a wonderful expression of citizenship to encourage people to get ready for an opportunity to engage in what has been one of the great victories of our humanity, and that is vaccines.

So, Kara, let's start talking about the excitement and how we should all sign up for that and get our sleeves rolled up. And have a great week. We'll go together. You and I will go together. All right. There you go. Support for this podcast comes from Anthropic. It's not always easy to harness the power and potential of AI.

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