Pivot - Google doesn't make iPhones, and other things Congress learned this week

Episode Date: December 14, 2018

Kara and Scott talk about Google's CEO testifying to Congress. The company is being evasive about its controversial search engine in China. But on the other hand, some US Representatives didn't know Google doesn't make the iPhone.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Pivot is brought to you by our founding sponsor, Smart Water. What makes Smart Water delicious? It's pure, it's crisp, it's vapor distilled with electrolytes added for taste. Learn more at drinksmartwater.com. Hi, everyone. This is Pivot from the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher. And I'm Scott Galloway.

Hey, Scott. How you doing? You're in New York? I'm in San Francisco, finally. I can't believe it. Here I am sitting here in San Francisco. It's a beautiful day. It is not that here. It is cloudy and cold. It's sort of threatening to snow, but, yeah, it's not that nice here. Yeah. So there's so much going on this week. I don't know where to start.

I mean, besides what's going on with Trump and all the different Michael Cohen things and the National Enquirer. Actually, I'm going to ask you, National Enquirer, what happens to them as a media company, like, now that they've admitted that they, like, do the bidding of people, which we all knew they did, essentially? I'd love to get your take on that. I don't think anybody cares. I don't think people who buy the National Enquirer buy it for integrity. Right, that's a fair point. That's what happens to that business

when he sort of, he dropped a dime on the president, David Pecker, who was at Hachette and he was a lot of other places. In a weird way, I think the awareness helps them. I mean, I didn't even know the National Enquirer was still around. So the awareness and them being part of the political conversation

or the national discourse in a funky way probably creates awareness and helps sales. I don't think it means anything but positive for them. Really? Wow. So nothing to the National Enquirer. I don't know. You drop a dime on the president. Like you lie and then you say, oh, wait, we lied. Everyone's dropping a dime now.

I mean, what does everyone have in common that knows the president? They're soon to wear an anklet or go to prison. I mean, and not only that, the worst thing that ever happened to Donald Trump was to be elected president. Yeah, he had it going good for a while. We'll see what happens. You do not want to be friends with this guy. I think anybody who is friends with our president right now and made the mistake of getting involved in his campaign is not sleeping well. This is just getting, I mean, it is, we keep saying it,

it is Mueller time. Here it comes. Do you really just say that? You love that. You love that. I love it so much. You know, I was at another event with Ezra Klein this week, and once again, a dozen people came up to me and said,

I love Scott Galloway. What is he really like? It was really fascinating. You're like a little star person here in Silicon Valley. I'm literally sitting here smiling. I can't help that. Yeah. Yeah, it was really weird.

And I'm like, oh, he's an idiot. You know what I mean? Yeah, there you go. Let me set the record straight. So I had my first kind of famous moment because of you. I got invited to this. I'm trying to keep it anonymous. I got invited. And then we'll get back to what we're supposed to be doing here. But I got invited to

this big fancy lunch hosted by a tech, big tech CEO. And they announced, I can't even say what they announced, but the best moment was it was all these old media people. And at one point, this very iconic TV journalist, their phone went off and they couldn't figure out how to turn off their iPhone. Oh, no. And I thought that just captures the gestalt of what's happening in media. Anyway, sorry about that. Anyway, well, I'm going to be in New York next week for a fancy media dinner. So we're going to be together.

We're going to be together in New York City in person. I like the way you say that. I'm feeling close. You know what? I'm so happy to finally see you starting to invest in this relationship, Cara. Yeah. Okay. It'll be like 20 minutes.

Anyway, we're going to start with Google. Where are you taking me? We're going to start. Where are you taking me? We're just going to be in the studio there. We're going to be in the studio there and then we're not leaving until we're good and done. That's all.

Listen, Google is refusing to give up their search engine in China and other highlights from the judiciary hearing. So what did you think? Did you watch Sundar Pichai? I watched the highlights. And? I occasionally turn on C-SPAN to try and impress myself that I have C-SPAN. Yeah.

But I thought it was a big nothing burger. Let me just say, we would do this winners and losers in this program. I thought he was a big winner. I thought he came off looking very earnest and statesmanlike. But he went in with a big advantage, and that is he hadn't burned through 12, I'm sorry, and we need to do better. So he's still got, and he's got the ultimate heat shield in the Zuck and Sheryl Sandberg, and I think he comes across as disciplined, likable, earnest. There were some moments when he was very evasive on the dragonfly thing. That was the only thing I thought they could have pressed harder.

But what was on display here were the 4% of our elected officials have a background in technology or engineering. And the other 96 clearly showed up. Yeah, exactly. So there were a lot of blunders in here. Let's take some. There were some seriously good bloopers here. Let's take a listen. I have a 7-year-old granddaughter who picked up her phone before the election,

and she's playing a little game, the kind of game a kid would play, and up on there pops a picture of her grandfather. And I'm not going to say into the record what kind of language was used around that picture of her grandfather, but I'd ask you, how does that show up on a seven-year-old's iPhone who's playing a kid's game? Congressman, iPhone is made by a different company. And so, you know, I mean, it might have been an Android. It's just it was a hand-me-down of some kind. You know, I guess I'm happy to follow up and understand the specifics.

There may be an application which was being used which had a notification, but I'm happy to understand it better and clarify it for you. Okay. Thank you for your testimony and yield back the balance of my time. So that was a good one. I think it was Representative King who was already an idiot, and he proved himself even more so by not identifying the correct phone of the company he was talking to. Who Land O'Lakes Butter has pulled their campaign money from. Yes.

I'm having her on the podcast, the new CEO. Oh, really? She's really interesting. What did you think of the hearings? I thought he didn't do great. I thought he should have gone to the first one. And he really, speaking of a heat shield, he would have been behind Dorsey and Sandberg. But you know why he couldn't?

So I thought he just should have gone. That's in the story itself. Because? Because they knew about the hack of Google Plus and hadn't disclosed it yet. Ah, yes. So had they not? Somebody, a lawyer said, the senator said,

if you go to this and somebody up there says, are you aware of a hack? And you say no, you either have to disclose it on live television or you've perjured yourself. I think he didn't want to talk about Dragonfly. That's what I think. And then he ended up doing it.

I agree it was a nothing burger, but he didn't come off well. I didn't think he came off well. I didn't think he did a great job. I didn't think he did a bad job. I just think he didn't do any job. And he just, you know, these hearings are kind of pointless at this point.

I agree. They're not really holding their feet to the fire, you know. And I think what's going to come of it is what Warner and the others do as they move into point. I agree. They don't really, they're not really holding their feet to the fire, you know, and I think what's going to come of it is what Warner and the others do as they move into January. All right, next thing,

Apple is building a billion dollar campus in Texas that would nearly double the size of the company's current 6,000 employee workforce in the area.

They've already been a big force in Texas for many, many years and it's putting, you know, workers all over the place but they did it quietly.

They're sort of the anti-Amazon version of this. What do you think of this? Yeah, but they're doing it quietly, loudly, right? This is Apple. Apple is really the PR genius of 2018. They say, okay, privacy is a big issue. People are angry. Let's run with this privacy thing

and send Tim on an indignance tour and talk about the privacy of the business. He was really indignant. He was good indignant. He was like, I'm really upset. Yeah, he does a great job and he's earned it. And now the new one is, oh, guess what we're doing? We're opening a new office and we're not going to gamify it and we're not asking for anything. He literally, Apple has done a great job of finding the soft tissue in Facebook and Amazon and really squeezing on it. It's smart. Brilliant. Facebook has 600 PR executives out of their 24,000 people. They have been schooled and had their, been taken back behind the gym and had

their asses kicked by the people on communications at Apple. Yeah, that's Steve Dowling. That's Steve Dowling. Let me call him out. That's a guy named Steve Dowling. Well done, Steve. And also Tim, Steve Dowling. But I mean, they also, I think they handled the Bloomberg thing around the chip. They've been aggressive

and non-aggressive at the same time. It's a really interesting strategy in terms of how they respond. Sort of like adults might, for example. Yeah, it's a passive-aggressive corporation. No, but it's like adult. They're kind of adults. It's like, oh, we're doing this, we're doing that.

It's an interesting thing. I mean, obviously, everything has to focus on what they make and what they're going to put out and the products they make. But they are doing a really beautiful— they're sort of avoiding the bad tech lash, essentially, I think. That's a big— that is, I think, one of the bigger themes that won't be reported on about 2018 was that Apple, at the beginning of the year, was grouped into this term big tech.

And they have consciously uncoupled from the rest of big tech. And people are no longer talking about them being bad. They've starched their hat white. It was really the PR move. They did a great job. Unfortunately, they don't have the recurring revenue streams of some of these other companies. They're no longer the most valuable company in the world. I want to flip back to Google, though.

The dragonfly thing, I think the question that's really a tough question that's impossible for Sundar to answer, and I'm curious what you think, is, okay, you're trying to figure – I've got 100 people trying to figure out a way to do gymnastics and launch a search engine that will allow the government to engage in massive censorship. But at the same time, you're principled and have real recalcitrance around helping our armed services in the field of AI. And it seems like that is a very, in my opinion, a very good and valid question. What is your view on Google's stance around this stuff, working with the government? I just, working with the Chinese government, you mean? Well, trying to work with the Chinese government by virtue of Dragonfly, but at the same time saying they're not going to work with the U.S. government or expressing recalcitrance to their employees or caution or concern about getting involved in AI with our armed services. Well, you know, it's interesting because they're getting a lot of pressure. And I think their particular employee group at Google – and, you know, I had them on the Recode Decode podcast, are very firm.

This is a very firm group of people. And so he's going to have to deal with that reaction. I think they're going to get the same reaction about China, too. I mean, it just, at one point, either they give the inmates the keys to the asylum or they don't. And for years, Google has done that. Like, really, the inmates run it quite a bit more than other companies. And the question is, will Kusuma Pichai continue this, which I think he's grown up in also. And so, I don't know. I don't know if they'll do that, the Chinese search engine. I just don't know.

I don't know if they'll do it. It'll be an interesting question. And if they do it, they have to do it, I think, quite transparently and kind of out there. And I think it'll be – they have a much different employee base than, say, Facebook does. Facebook's, as I said, employee base is much more docile. So we'll see what happens. But I do think that they can't – they have to be relatively transparent in everything they do and try really hard to listen to their employees

because it's a talent game right now for all these companies. So, end of 19, is Google in China or not? I don't know. I don't know. I appreciate you saying that. I don't know. Every morning, every tech CEO wakes up and looks in the mirror and says one of two things. Hello, madam or Mr. President.

I think they all think they should be leader of the free world. And they're all contemplating a run for president. And two. I think they all want to get out. I think they want to get out. That's what I think. They're trying to figure out ways to get out. Their egos are bigger than their caution.

Really? I think it's a little fallow period we're in. And then two, they say, hello, CEO of the world's most valuable firm in the world. And it's difficult to be the world's most valuable firm in the world without having a big business in China. And the reason why Apple is the most valuable firm in the world is they have a big presence. I mean, look, we didn't even touch on what's going on with Meng. And we did that last week. But what's going on with China right now, which China seems to be being calm about all the various and sundry tariff wars and the arrests and things like that.

But they've just started arresting Canadians now. I guess they're arresting Canadians as a tit-for-tat kind of thing, which I thought they might do. And so, you know, that relationship is going to be the most interesting part of how China deals with the West, Western companies especially, and then how the Western companies impact this administration. But this administration looks like it's over to the right doing some weird circus that has nothing to do with anything else, like all this Michael Cohen stuff. And so that's going to occupy the Trump administration for the

next several months. But you touched on something that is really a big deal, and that was the arrest of the CFO, the Huawei CFO in Canada. And then if you look at kind of, it's a different complexion, but a similar story. And I think it's prosecutorial overreach, the jailing of Ghosn in Japan. And so far, we don't even know what the charges are, as far as I can tell, and he hasn't accessed those lawyers. So geopolitics entering into the field or being weaponized by, you know, by local authorities, it's, we're in weird territory right now. Let me ask you this. Would you go to mainland China right now?

No. It's just, if you're Tim Cook, do you go to mainland China? Well, no, they're not going to arrest Tim Cook. Okay, the CFO? The CFO of Apple? Yeah, I don't know. I mean, Huawei is kind of the Apple of China.

They're not going to say they're worried about it. Yeah, they're going to not say they're worried about it, but I suspect they are going to have meetings about the issue. Yeah, they're not going to see them on Air China or China, you know, Eastern. But they got to be there, you know. They got a lot of business. They got a lot of business there, so it's a really hard thing. Big business.

And then lastly, which I think we'll probably do it in the Winners and Losers, but you could also just ignore the geopolitical events like Jack Dorsey of Twitter did. Oh, my gosh. And put a multi-part tweet about meditation and not mention that you're in Myanmar. Did you read those tweets? Of course I did. Oh, my God. They're fantastic.

He's like, what would happen if after 45 minutes of sitting, you felt pain and you decided to just sit through the pain? And you're like, this goes to my thesis, and I'm about to alienate probably a third of our audience. I did a lot of yoga when I first got to New York because I was bored but yet I was stressed so I did a ton of yoga. And the yoga community,

if someone is really into yoga and really into meditation to the point where they start talking about the seven fingers of yoga and being a giving person, you can guarantee that person is like a bad tipper. I find these people

are so full of shit, it's incredible. It's the same thing as, by the way, now I'm going to alienate another third of our audience. Okay, all right. Bad tipping yogis. Anyone who buys yoga pants is an asshole. Essentially, okay, animal lovers.

Do you know I have a t-shirt that says fuck yoga? People who are really into animal rights and host dinners on animals and all that. I'm telling you, Kara. Hold on. They don't love animals. They hate people. I found out my neighbor is one of these like big animal rights persons. And I'm like, trust me, he'll hate his neighbors. And what do you know?

The guy's an asshole. Oh, my God. We're having all these disputes with him. I'm like, send him with a dog. Scott, this has nothing to do with tech for me. The guy clearly doesn't want to get along with people. All right, Scott. Anyone into yoga, anyone like ridiculously into animal rights, you just avoid at all

costs. And we're going to talk about rights, you just avoid at all costs. And we're going to talk about what do you think that he did that. I think on one hand, it's nice that someone sits and contemplates for a vacation rather than goes to like Vegas and blows a wad, you know, at the craps tables. Vegas is awesome. Go to Vegas. But it was really kind of tone deaf that he did not mention Myanmar. I thought it was – he was in Myanmar and didn't mention a situation. I'm a billionaire. I'm the CEO of two companies

so I can take 10 days off and deny myself of the material things that most people can't afford. And you know what the key is to a silent retreat? Keeping it to yourself. That's the whole point of a silent retreat. You keep it to yourself. You don't write about it. And then the comments,

there are so many funny people on Twitter. I know. The comments are like great. Like, dude, we just wanted an edit button. You know, I mean, it's just. Yeah. Yeah. It was great.

Anyway, he's definitely. And then Paul was on top of Prop C. And then Fred Wilson defended him. It was interesting. Yep. Yep. I know. Loser.

I know. Totally loser of the week. I know. Yoga pants, baby. You know it. I'm sending you my fuck yoga t-shirt. I'm going to wear it next week. Anyway, when we get back, we're going to talk

about our sponsors. We're going to talk a little bit about the losers. When we get back, we're going to talk about the wins and fails for the week. Pivot is brought to you by our founding sponsor, Smartwater. We both run businesses, manage day-to-day, and now host a podcast. I have a lot of podcasts. We're working hard, and so does Smartwater. It's vapor distilled, whatever that is, for purity with electrolytes for taste.

It's water that keeps us hydrated as we work hard. And look, you work hard. You deserve a great tasting, hydrating water. Learn more at smartwater.com. We're back with Scott Galloway. He has just alienated an enormous segment of people I live next to in San Francisco via his yoga attacks. But let's talk about wins and fails this week. My win for this week is Times Person of the Year, Maria Ressa. She's a Filipino journalist who I interviewed a few weeks ago on Recode to Decode. Let's take a listen.

When your rights are being taken away from you, we want to alert you to that. That's what our journalism is showing. We showed them in the using data. We showed them that they were being manipulated. And yet it took another year before people really understood what that meant. I think this is, all right, let me pull back. The cool thing about all of this is that we're going to, we're redefining and redesigning the world, right?

I just don't want to be the person that gets jailed because we're trying to redefine what journalism is like in my country. But that's extremely exciting. to redefine what journalism is like in my country. But that's extremely exciting. And I think that, you know, with leaders like Trump, like Duterte, appealing to the worst of human nature, and then the social media platforms, allowing that, allowing exponential lies to be used against truth tellers, to the point that we have no facts to begin any discussion with. So this interview was amazing. I actually asked her not to go back to the Philippines. And of course, she was arrested when she got back.

De Harte, he is just out together. She's doing all these. She's part of a group called Rappler, and they're doing some astonishing journalism there and pointing out the extrajudicial killings and all kinds of things. And I was really she deserves so much of the credit for, you know, not allowing these lies and the use of social media. We talked a lot about that and abuse and just standing up to it. And I think she is just the win of the year, really, in lots of ways, and journalists like her. And so I was really pleased that she was put on the cover of Time magazine.

I'm not so pleased she was arrested in the Philippines for—they've ginned up some ridiculous series of accusations against her. So that is my win, Scott, in a very nice, good person who doesn't—who makes me feel better about this world. Can I take the other side of this? Well, no. Don't be anti-Maria Ressa. I'll have to come and get you. Let me be clear. I think anything that extends the news cycle around her or Khashoggi, I think is a good thing.

But should journalists be giving other journalists awards? Yes. Okay. This case, yes. This case, yes. Because this is an unusual case. I agree with you. I don't go to those journalism things, and you'll never find me at them, and I hate them. But I don't like the Oscar, all of those awards for awards of awards thing.

I don't like them so much. But in this case, the attacks on the press across the globe, including here in this country, demand that we make this an important thing. And you shouldn't over-index on how great we are, but she happens to be great. And so is, you know, and the dismemberment of a journalist should be noted. 100%. And the people at the Capital Gazette and stuff like that. And so is, you know, and the dismemberment of a journalist should be noted. A hundred percent. And the people at the Capital Gazette and stuff like that. So in this case, yes, I would say because of the continual attacks on the press, especially by President Trump.

And what about basic grammar? Should at some point they change it to Times movement or theme of the year? I mean, when are they going to actually limit it to a person? I mean, it's computer of the year. It's always these movements. That was years ago, yeah. Pick, you know, go back and pick a person. I mean, it's Computer of the Year. It's always these movements. That was years ago, yeah. Pick, you know, go back on, pick a person.

Thing of the, oh, person, yeah. Well, who would you be your Person of the Year then? Well, I made a prediction and I got it wrong. I think that's why I'm angry about this.

Which was it? I forgot. I thought it was going to be Lieutenant First Class Robert Mueller. I thought he was going to be Time's Person of the Year. Oh, interesting.

Yeah, actually, I think he is. I think, yeah, that's right. Okay, I'll extend it a year person of the year. Interesting. Actually, I think he is. Yeah, that's right. Okay, I'll extend it a year. Maybe next year. By the way, Time magazine, I really want Time magazine for Christmas,

said no one ever. I mean, literally, Time has become, I think Benioff, I listened to him speak the other day last week. He's the real deal. He is. That's why I shouldn't go. I shouldn't meet people because I like them, and I'm probably never going to say anything

nagging around Salesforce. He's a very – I get the sense he's very genuine. He's fun. He's fun. He's a fun guy. Yeah, but he also – he seems generally concerned.

He does. He wants to help stuff out. He is. He's willing to sacrifice a lot for it. But time – it's going to be just so interesting to see if they're able to do anything with that brand. I think you can do anything with anything. I think you're wrong. I think you can lot for it. But time, it's going to be just so interesting to see if they're able to do anything with that brand. I think you can do anything with anything.

I think you're wrong. I think you can take any brand. What are you, a Dr. Seuss movie? I'm just telling you. We can do anything with anything. Anything. Anyway, what's your fail? You know what my favorite statement is?

Sometimes it's darkest before it's pitch black. Okay. All right. The dark is afraid of me. I can go toe-to-toe with you on these things. All right. So fail, fail, fail. We got time constraints here, Scott.

We want to keep it tight for the people. Fail. God, I mean, my fail was Dorsey. I just thought that was ridiculous. I love those tweets. I just thought they were, I don't know, it just makes me happy thinking about what an asshole this guy is. Okay, all right, okay.

And then, all right, I was going to say Verizon regrets buying AOL. Oh, wait, wait, that's even better. I'm sorry. And I called someone an asshole, which I shouldn't do. All right, I want you to say Verizon regrets buying AOL oh wait wait that's even better I'm sorry and I called someone and I asked them what they should do I want you to comment upon it they took a write down

they decided all this mishigas that went on about buying and selling and buying and selling of AOL, Yahoo everything is just oh sorry

you know swipe left or whatever the way you're supposed to swipe well that's that's interesting right

Verizon the new CEO is a handset guy and I Han Vesper I like him I did say that I thought they were going to spin it again. I think you're probably going to see a Yahoo AOL spin. They're probably going to just spin it out. The whole content and distribution, by the way, you know what the next ride down to come? It's going to be AT&T's ride down to Time Warner.

I think Jeffrey Bukas is one of the smartest people to ever be in the media business. And the reason he sold it, he sold it at the top. They overpaid for it and they're going to endure a riot. I mean, as great a content as it is, they just 18 to overpaid for it. This whole notion of this strategy, we want to be number three. Sorry, number three is Amazon.

There's Google, there's Facebook, and now Amazon Media Group, which by the way, in three years, is going to be the third largest media company in the world, which no one was expecting or saw coming. But Verizon, AOL, Bomb, AOL, Time Warner. Did you see what the AOL, the new head of content for AOL said about HBO? What happens then?

I'm sorry, what did you say? The new head, this guy Stamke came out and said that we need to scale Netflix, which to me is like walking into the Louvre and say, hey, we need to scale this. I mean, it's just the thing that's wonderful about HBO. You mentioned Fletbler. What do you think Fletbler did? Do you think Fletbler went into his office and like threw things? This is Richard Koppel who runs HBO, who's fantastic.

He's a fantastic personality and media executive. What do you think he's doing right now? I don't know about you. I'm actually supposed to have lunch with him, which is more name dropping. When? Can I come? I'm going to do have a lunch with them, which is more name-dropping. But I don't know about you. When? Can I come? I'm going to do a drop-in. I literally, from the age of 34 to like 48, I lost the capacity to cry, which is probably more information you want.

But the only time I started crying again was under the influence of media, specifically HBO. I think that organization has just captured this unbelievable ability to attract and retain the best talent and create some of the most moving content. I think TV is our golden age, and HBO is the ground zero for that. And for AT&T, for some Yahoo to come in, by the way, John Stanky is a Bruin, so he can't be all bad. Stanky. Stanky. I'm sorry. He's really tall. For him to come in to HBO and say, we need to figure out a way to scale this, it's literally criminal. They do such an unbelievable job. HBO should be the bait or the target to buy an AT&T contract.

But HBO, for me, has just been an incredibly important organization that creates real art. Well, that's Ploeplevy's going to stay. So my winner, I'm sorry, my winner is HBO. HBO, all right. And the loser is Verizon writing these down. What happens to these companies? Do they just go? They get spun.

They just go, right? Investment bankers come in. They get spun and what? They get spun. And they bring back the most underrated Google executive, Tim Armstrong. Oh, well, he already created this mess. No, he's the one that saved AOL and then got it sold at a high price. I think he did a great job.

No, he did. And then he did the Yahoo thing. He shouldn't have done the Yahoo thing. I told him that. He turned chicken shit and turned it into chicken salad. AOL was sort of – AOL was dead. And then he left. He sold it off to a bigger sucker.

That's really what you're saying. Which is what you're supposed to do as a CEO. Great for shareholders. All right. He's going to take it back. Anyways, I think this guy was overrated. Well, he shouldn't have done the Yahoo reach. He shouldn't have done the Yahoo

reach. That was a reach too far. Yahoo's made so much bigger mistakes. Worst acquisition in tech in the last 10 years. What is it, Kara? Jeopardy. Business tech. Worst acquisition in the last 10 years. It involves Yahoo. There's so many. Yahoo buying what? I don't know. Tumblr. Tell me.

Tumblr. Oh, yeah. In the same quarter Instagram was purchased for the same amount. Instagram for a billion, Tumblr for 1.1. Guess who broke that story? Kara Swisher did. Yes, she did. And by the way, Tumblr has just announced they're getting rid of all porn, which makes Tumblr totally irrelevant. Yeah. Totally irrelevant.

Why would anyone go to Tumblr without porn? Jessica Powell, who used to work at Google, wrote a great piece on that this week. Why? She did. She wrote it. Why? Yes, exactly. Anyways. I don't know. She wrote it. Why? Yes, exactly. Anyways. I don't know. I think they're gone, gone, gone. They're gone.

All right. Predictions. Scott, predictions. I need a prediction from you. Well, I already made it. I think the next big write-down is going to be in 12 months, AT&T is going to write down Time Warner. As everyone realizes, this handset and content peanut butter and chocolate combination was just a big thud.

And then what? I think they get spun. Spin it back off? They spin them out again. Really? These are great companies. Great cultures. And then there's a handset culture.

And so then they're just like small media companies, essentially. There's a series of small media companies. I don't think they'll be broken up like that. I think Time Warner is an incredible, I mean, there's some incredible assets. HBO could trade an unbelievable valuation on its own, I think. It'd probably be acquired again by somebody, but I don't know what it'll look like, but I think there, I still think, so let me be clear from a consumer level. I love Yahoo. Yahoo Finance is still my homepage. I still use it. I know it sounds, it's like bragging you have a Discover card.

So there's value there. There's value there, Scott. That's what you're saying. Yeah, I do. I think there's value and I think they have some pretty good people. I think they did a good job and I think it's stuck in this ridiculous strategy of trying to figure out a way to differentiate handsets. It never made any sense to me. Doesn't make any sense to you. They spend a lot of money, these guys. What do the handset people do? Does then the internet people become the ones that do this buying? It seems to me the internet makes more sense, internet people buying these companies. So what's your prediction? What would happen?

Play this out. I've got – You know, it gets bought – these content companies get bought by internet companies. Yeah, they're going to have trouble buying stuff because of antitrust. I think these guys are all scared. Yes, that's right. They can't buy stuff. You're right.

I think they're all scared. We've got to have the next big innovation. That's what we need. That's my theme for this year. Last year was tech responsibility and what yam-yams these people were. They're not taking responsibility. We already have the next big innovation, Cara. It's already here.

What? What is it? Well, there's good news and bad news. It's already here. The problem is it's owned by Amazon. The next big innovation in technology is voice. Well, that's what you think. I'm just wondering what it is.

It could be voice. It could be a lot of things. What is the next big product can we have another loser of the week I just thought of this okay yeah go ahead the announcement that Cheddar is going to be the first

business television to be live streamed virtually on the Magic Leap headset talk about shavings and shit on a shit salad seriously seriously

Cheddar is now on Magic Leap virtual reality okay so I can see a reheated story CNBC about millennials With a Dunkin Donuts cup in virtual reality I mean

What are these people doing, Kara? What are these people doing? It makes me want to go to Chipotle Mike is gone Mike is gone now, right? Oh, God Oh, God Ridiculous

Ridiculous Ridiculous Scott, honestly. You're coming to New York, Kara. I got to think about this. I'm coming to New York next week. I will bring the bagels. I will be there.

We're going to have a great time in New York. I can't wait. What are we doing? Where are we going? What are we going to do? I'm going to take you to one of my two favorite restaurants. I'm going to either take you to Cafe Select in the village, or we're going to go to this hip

downtown millennial place called Lasquina, or maybe Charlie Parker's, which is more kind of your vibe because it's fabulous and people recognize them. Oh, Carol, you're the greatest. Oh my God, not New York. We will go. We will have a social time. I'll bring a date. It'll be great. It'll be fantastic. Oh my God, you're bringing a date?

I have a date. Are you dating someone young and hot? Is that why you've been in such a good mood? You're glowing. You're glowing. You know what? You're dating someone young and hot, right? I'm not talking.

Oh, my gosh. I'm dating a very nice young woman. Congratulations. I'm not a young woman. Thank you. It's lovely. Very smart. Smart.

Yeah. Like, smart and interesting. Like, well, let's focus on that. Like, their value as a person. I feel shamed. It's like Nancy Pelosi a person. It's like Nancy Pelosi's coat. It's like Nancy Pelosi's coat. Like everyone's focusing on her coat and her glasses and not the fact that she's a badass.

I thought she was awesome in that meeting. That's what I'm saying. But everyone's focusing on her coat. It's like focusing on hot women. It's like that's not what you focus on. She focused on the fact that she's the third in line to run this country and she handed Trump his head in the meeting as a person, not as a woman in a coat. I'm just saying.

I agree. No, there was a man in that room. She was wearing a dress. Yeah. Okay. Slip that in right under the radar. And scene. And scene.

All feminists, please, please definitely email me, and I will hit him on the head with a hammer. Especially the ones who do yoga are really into their dog. Okay. Goodbye. All right. Thanks do yoga are really into their dog. Okay. Goodbye. All right. Thanks, Kara. Thank you so much. Rebecca Sinanis produces the show.

Nishat Kerouaz-Vox is executive producer of audio. Thanks also to Eric Johnson, who I forgot to invite to our holiday party last week. Sorry, Eric. It's funny you find that that funny. I know. It's so funny. Was he at home watching it play out on Instagram and always contemplating suicide? I don't know.

I kept on saying, where are you? Let's tie this back to big tech. No, anyway, thanks for listening to Pivot from Vox Media. Join us next week for more breakdown on all things tech and business. If you like what you heard, please subscribe on Apple Podcasts or wherever you're listening. I was watching Wreck-It Ralph 2, and I got out of the movie, and I saw a text from Kara. Where are you? Why were you at Wreck-It Ralph 2?

I don't even want to go into that. Anyway, thank you, everyone. Bye, Scott. I'll see you next week. Thanks, everybody. We're fans of our founding sponsor, Smart Water. Delicious Smart Water is vapor distilled. People, vapor distilled for purity, okay?

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