Pivot - Paramount Merger Pause, Meta AI Optimism, and the Peptide Boom

Episode Date: July 28, 2026

Kara and Scott discuss Paramount's decision to pause its merger with Warner Bros. Discovery, and predict whether the blockbuster deal will ultimately go through. Then, Meta's latest ad campaign puts an optimistic spin on AI, but Scott has a few ideas for better taglines. Plus, Trump's White House Correspondents' Dinner jokes fall flat, and the FDA's decision to ease restrictions helps fuel America's peptide boom. Watch this episode on the ⁠⁠Pivot YouTube channel⁠⁠.Follow us on Instagram and Threads at ⁠⁠@pivotpodcastofficial⁠⁠.Follow us on Bluesky at ⁠⁠@pivotpod.bsky.social⁠⁠Follow us on TikTok at ⁠⁠@pivotpodcast⁠⁠.Send us your questions by calling us at 855-51-PIVOT, or email [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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You can hire top-rated pros, see price estimates, and read reviews all on the app. Download today. I like it when Baller Woman have like a trophy husband. I think that's... We've been doing that shit forever. Why should you be the only one with a trophy husband? Hi, everyone.

This is Pivot from New York Magazine in the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher. And I'm Scott Galloway. Where are you, Scott? Los Angeles. I'm still in Los Angeles where it is 70 degrees and spectacular here. I turned the camera around. I'd love you to see the Hollywood Hills here, but it's fantastic.

Yeah, actually, it's nice here in New York, I have to tell you. It's lovely. Yeah, I heard it was great. Really beautiful weather. I did a lot of stuff here in New York. Tell me about it. I went to see Jellicle Ball Cats, the first time I've ever liked cats in my life, which I do not like cats. Jellicle Ball Cats?

Yes, they set it at a drag show, essentially, and now it works. Cats now works perfectly. Wasn't it always a drag show? No, it was like a bunch of people wandering around being cat-like, you know, with makeup, a lot of makeup situation. They were playing cats. They were actually playing cats. But in this case, it was a drag show, and it makes total sense. and you're like, ah, I see, yes.

It's like, you know, vogueing and doing all the stuff you've seen in the films and stuff like that and the documentaries. It was wonderful, and it was beautiful, it was joyful. The crowd was packed. Now, this show is closing because of the high costs of Broadway, but I have to tell you, it was absolutely packed and absolutely people.

It was such a joyful experience. It was just a lot of fun. Nice. And what else? That can't be it. No, I went and visited an ex-president and an ex-secretary of state at their home this weekend. Oh, you're so coy because you're so important.

I'm not important. I just am visiting. Yes, I can't mention who it is. I'm curious, and I never name drop. I can't say why. I only keep people anonymous when it's obvious who they are, and it's the ultimate name drop. No, I went and visited Hillary Clinton and Bill Clinton at their home, but I was visiting Hillary on something helping her with.

Let me guess. Does it remind with podcasts? I don't know. We'll see. I don't know. Can I give you and her some advice? Yeah, please, too. She should pick the half dozen or a dozen or three to six podcasts that she really enjoys

that a little bit unexpected and be a regular guest. She shouldn't do her own podcast. Oh, well, too bad. Why is that? Why is that Mr. 500 podcasts and won't stop making them? Well, yeah, but Scott Galloway needs the relevance and the money. She doesn't. Secretary Clinton, first off, at this point in her life, and I'm projecting, I don't know if this

is true. I think she should be just doing whatever the fuck she wants and enjoying herself. And the thing is, you know. Maybe this is what the fuck she wants. But go ahead. Yeah, maybe. I think she would have more flexibility, more relevance, and be less of a, I mean, there's just a lot of downside risk to her starting her own podcast with her name on it,

quite frankly. And I think she can have her cake and eat it too and have as much relevance and impact by being a guest on various podcasts. But that's just my view. I think she's going to regret it if she starts it. Not that I know her, but I think a year and a half in, like, you know what this is like. I mean, you're a workaholic. So is she.

She's a hard worker. Yeah. Are you kidding? That woman could like instantly tell you like a very detailed intriplicate explanation of almost any world event and domestic. She's really quite a brilliant person. Agreed. I think it's just the format and the cadence of which she wants to demonstrate that excellence. I hope she does something.

I just think she should be appearing on yours and some other people. Yeah, yeah, well, we'll see. I think she still has a lot to say, and actually people have not met her yet in a way that I know her and others do. And so, you know, a lot of people, a lot of people still have a lot to say. And she's incredible shape and so sharp. She looks great. And she's very vibrant. Very vibrant. And so we'll see how it goes. You know, it's interesting because YouTube just signed Becky Kennedy's doctor, very popular on social for a show. There's a whole renaissance of things happening now again in terms of sort of reformulating television and everything else that I think is really interesting at this moment. I think we were very early to it and have done a very nice job figuring out. Pioneers, we're trailblazers.

We're trailblazers. We made it to California. We're the innovators in our seventh decade. It finally happened. No, but that's what I mean. I think it's just a really interesting time for substantive voices. I think post-Trump, there's a real market for smarts, experts, smarts, scientists, things like that.

Well, I mean, if there's any one theme, it's that these institutions and this middleware is going away. Yeah. And great talent bubbles through. I mean, that's the most positive thing. I think you can say about these platforms and social media is that people no longer need to give money to the DNC. They just give money to John Ossoff.

Right, exactly. Yeah. And people don't need to go kiss the ass of some executive on the 45th floor, the Rockefeller Center, to try and get on MS now. They can just go live on substack. Yeah, it's an exciting time. It's an exciting time.

It is an exciting time, especially with the reinvention of that iconic piece of culture, cats. Jesus Christ, talk about something I'm definitely not going to see. I'm telling you, I did not want to see cats, and it's amazing. Everyone who doesn't like cats loves this, and I'm telling you, it was joyful. It was beautiful. I don't like anything cultural, though. Dude.

You're not, come on. That's not true. That is not true. The Odyssey will be the most cultural thing I've done in years. The Odyssey in the World Cup. That's it. Yeah. My funniest one for The Odyssey, there's just continuing discussion of it and what it means and everything else and all these sort of knock-on effects.

And one it says it's a movie about a man who finally faces consequences. Which I have that's funny. Anyway, there's a lot of really interesting discussion. I love all the discussion around the Odyssey. It's all interesting in different ways. And people are having a good time talking about mythology. They're having good time talking about literature. about the movie making itself, some of the stuff he did,

around the themes, around the arguments about the themes. I just love it. I love the whole thing. People are... Yeah, I'm going to see it. I'm going to see it on Thursday with my son. I'm excited for what you think. I can't wait. Yeah, I'm excited to see it too. Yeah, because you're not part of the cultural conversation if you haven't seen. Anyway, it's sold out here in New York at the IMAX until like late August at this point, which is really interesting.

Anyway, I highly recommend it. I was either going to go see the Odyssey or, I was going to go see Phantom of the Opera performed by. I'm trying to think of a politically correct term for someone who's incredibly woke. I can't go there. Anyways. All right. In any case, I'm having a great time in New York.

New York is very exciting. I have lots of fun things to do this week. Anyway, we've got a lot to get to today. Speaking of Hollywood, Paramount Skydance is pausing and Warner Brothers Discovery merger until legal challenges are resolved or until June 1st, 2027. That's like a long time from now, folks, whichever happens first. The decision comes after a federal court granted a temporary restraining order, preventing the merger from closing for at least 28 days.

Paramount is calling the pause a significant win, which is not, saying it provides a direct path to a trial based on evidence, but investors do not agree. Neither does Caroswisher. Paramount shares hit a 52-week low on the news. The delay could get costly. $650 million per quarter ticking fee begins in October, and if the deal falls apart entirely, Paramount would owe $7 billion breakup fee. By the way, Paramount just brought on Beth Wilkinson, someone I know pretty well as its lead attorney, very good attorney. She's successfully defended Microsoft's Activision Acquisition. She's also representing NextStar in its antitrust case. Beth, the company you keep.

She's going to win. She'll win. Well, we'll see. We'll see. We'll see. What's winning at this point, at this point. So talk a little bit about what you think. I have thoughts on it, but I'd love to hear yours first. Well, I don't think they have a legal leg to stand on. What they have is delay. And delay costs shareholders, employees. It's effective, and they'll probably extract a pound of flesh because in order to win the deal, one of the things that Paramount Skydance offered in the purchase agreement was a ticking fee of $650 million per quarter while this deal sits in limbo. That's roughly $7 million per weight. So these Democratic AGs who are probably sick of,

a Republican weaponized DOJ, I've said, fine, what's good for the goose is good for the gander. And they'll probably be able to extract something, whether it's guarantees of certain shooting within their state or spinning a certain thing. They're going to, and, you know, no one, all of a sudden, less than no one is going to know who the California AG is going to be, right? They'll start getting a lot of time on MS now. So this is political. They'll get some awareness.

They might get a pound of flesh. But I think ultimately Beth will show will bring up a bunch of expert witnesses in the form of economists who will say emerged Warner Brothers Skydance is 8% or 6% of all viewing time versus Netflix at 9 and YouTube at 13. The market has already voted.

Paramount, as you referenced, hit a 52-week low after celebrating what management called a legal win. This was such a Trump thing, trying to pretend this is anything but bad news. And investors understand something executives often don't. and that is winning in court can still mean losing economically.

So, again, the real competitor here isn't Skydance or Warner Brothers. It's YouTube, Netflix, TikTok, and increasingly probably AI-generated entertainment. And as usual, legacy media is fighting yesterday's war while tomorrow's competitors are scaling. But this is, again, this seeds economic value and advantage from the legacy players to the new guys who aren't caught up in court right now. And YouTube can just scale. Yeah, that's absolutely true. I don't think she's going to win at all, actually. I think they, yes, they don't. And I, look at right now the price of Warner shares, $25. The delta between the 31 and 25, as Bill Cohen actually pointed out, is quite high. It's supposed to be about 4%. It's a lot.

That's a lot. Investors have decided this deal isn't happening. That's what I think is exactly. Well, they want a premium. So what you're referring to is merger arbitrage. There's a whole class of investors who, when a deal is announced at, say, I think this is announced at 31 bucks a share, whatever it is, if it's trading at 25, what is that? That's about a 22 or 23% premium. They don't think the deal is happening. That's right. But what merger arb guys do is they say, okay, I think it's going to close. I buy the stock now when it closes, I got my 31. And it's hard to find 20 or 2 or 23% return. But what you're saying is, to your point, the market is saying there's now approximately, if I'm doing my math correctly, a one in four chance this deal doesn't happen.

That's correct. And what would be interesting is what happens to the stock if it doesn't close. Oh, collapse. Collapse. Here's what I think. This is what I think. All right, let me go. This is someone sent me a very interesting legal document which I thought was great.

They chose financial hemorrhage over legal precedent. This tells you everything about how they assess their chances on August 3rd. They were going to lose on the preliminary injunction. They were absolutely going to lose on that. And that would have devastated the stock, devastated the stock. And you couldn't overturn it on appeal. This is something called abuse of discretion standard. And the merger would have been over if they lost on August 3rd.

So they're pushed this lawyer they had, a guy named Kessler in hiring Beth. It's a great hire. She's great. She's terrific. I don't really care how terrific she is. This is, they have, I think they have decided. Let me read you this. Paramount Blink. They looked at August 3rd hearing, two PI motions, two markets, A-list

writer declarations, a judge who already tipped your hand, and decided that no ruling was better than another bad ruling. That's a rational litigation decision and a catastrophic business signal. Peace guy isn't just scared. They've entered a survival mode and they're trying to control the bleeding. The question is whether the patient can survive long enough to reach the operating room. And as you said, other competitors are scaling, including all these tech competitors, and also Disney and others. They have all kinds of freedom to do things. They have this ticking fee that's very expensive. And at some point, the savings that they were going to recognize in this deal are going to disappear, right, that they were going to do through the coordination. And so

Oracle stock is way off. This is what's paying for part of this. This is delay. You don't have to win at litigation here. You have to delay the litigation. And Beth can push for, and she's going to try to do this in court, a shorter time span in between, you know, what's happening here. But she, it's frozen. It's really pretty much frozen. So she can say, let's try a scheduling. It's on July 31st. They want to get it this fall. It's not going to happen this fall. And the judge is going to set this schedule. And this judge doesn't seem in any rush. Now they've also forgone the appeal into the Ninth Circuit. That's going to take until the trial's over. So you know the California and the group is going to appeal if they lose.

It just keeps dragging and dragging on. And so I don't see how they get this out the door, unless they have a settlement. And so another document I got, which was really interesting, and they said these are the most likely ones. One, states win at trial, permanent injunction merger blocks, guidance, walks, Paramount Restructures, or Fines a New Buyer's settlement, possible. Paramount offers structural remedies, divest a studio, sell cable networks, states accept their reject. Deal collapses economically, also possible. Ticking fees exceed value of Warner Brothers or Skydance invokes termination clause. Merger dies without a verdict. And then if Paramount wins at trial, merger closes after more than $1 billion in ticking fees and severe reputational

damage near certain appeal by states. I just don't, I got to say, I don't know. She's a talented lady, but this is not, time is not on the side of Paramount here. in that regard. So again, as I often do here, I'm just sort of flying on instruments and thinking out loud, but I wonder if the fulcrum here, so economically, if this goes on long enough, it will close because... It will close, the deal. If it goes on long enough, but, and there's a big but here, the data, the only way

this legally doesn't close when they chase it all down and they've had a chance to actually evaluate it is to prove it's a much. monopoly. And I don't, I think they're going to have a very difficult time. The AG is proving that because essentially a combined, um, the combined Warner Brothers and Paramount would represent about 12% of total US TV watch time and YouTube currently stands at 13. And in terms of box office sales, a combined Paramount and Warner Brothers represent roughly 25% of the domestic box office. Now, having said that, if the fees, if this becomes economic, economically untenable because of delay and ticking fees, they might just say throw up their arms and blame Democrats.

And by the way, this is political. All 12 AGs filing cases are Democrats here. The judge that decided this was a Biden appointee. But what's good, again, what's good for the goose? But the Trump administration waved it through when lawyers of the Justice Department didn't want to. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. This is, if you're going to weaponize the DOJ against us, whether it's cutting off fees to our greatest research universities with no legal precedent, if it's, if it's, you're going to weaponize the DOG against us, whether it's cutting off fees to our greatest research universities with no legal precedent. If it's carving up TikTok like a political give back to your Republican donors, fine. You want to go that way? Or waiving this deal through when lawyers at the Justice Department did not want it to go through, many. I mean, there's a ton of examples. The FTC going after the view.

I mean, it's just, if you're going to be ridiculous, folks, I actually like Democrats punching back. At some point, I do think the merits of this case or the lack thereof, will result in a judge saying, okay, this is going to close. The fulcrum, I wanna get your view on this, I think the thing, if this dies, I think the reason it will die is if Open AI continues to have negative momentum.

Why is that? Oracle stock for a while about, I think it was nine or 12 months ago, Larry Ellison became the wealthiest man in the world because they announced a deal for something like a trillion dollars and CAP-X commitment from OpenAI to help build out their infrastructure around compute and inference.

Oracle's stock is dramatically off. And if Open AI begins or the cracks continue to widen it Open AI, Oracle has now become a tracking, a public tracking stock for Open AI. And I got to think that Dad's piggy bank, which is Oracle shares, are quite frankly, that's where this check gets cashed. And if Oracle shares come under enough pressure, and dad goes, you know what, all of a sudden,

this went from 5 or 10% of my net worth to 20 or 30%, and it's going to, quite frankly, you know, I'm going to wake up in a suit that's uncomfortable for me at this age in terms of finance and debt. He might decide, sorry, son, I can't refill your Greenline credit card as I do because the deliveroo and the Uber

has become too expensive. I'm now using the metaphor for what I do. It's down 52% in the past year. 52%. That's striking. That really is striking. Year to date, 39%. Six months, 32%, one month. You know, it's just headed down. You're right. I mean, this is what I had said. Remember I had said this, a couple of this Oracle stock thing that I was paying attention to? That's besides the point. I think that they just over-indexed on their confidence. They were like, well, we got the Trump administration a rollover. We gave the EU some stuff they wanted. And then they were like, China said yes. I'm like, what's the difference? It doesn't really matter because these guys have it. What I thought Bonta did very smartly, and I agree with you,

it's a different market, but the judge is also calling that irrelevant, the streaming market irrelevant here for this particular case. So I don't think they have a great way in with this judge. And I thought they were overly confident. They did not think Bonta would be quite so controlled because he could have done a get rid of CNN, and think horrible CBS. They did none of that. They did only a very specific, small, discrete lawsuit that will move, will delay this just enough.

They don't have to win. They really don't have to win here. They just have to delay it. And the question is, how much will the Ellison's put up with to own this? That's the thing. How much they're rich enough to do it. It's just a question of how much they want it, right?

I guess, on some level. And again, delays in dealmaking for Warner Brothers, delays, I mean, the asset becomes less valuable. They can't make any major deals now. They can't do any major things, and the other people will benefit. It's not a good situation. But I think we're in violent agreement here, and that is the legal merits here are important, but I would argue the legal merits all point to eventually this would close. But they can get in the way of the closing and force the Ellicence to perhaps walk away

if they make getting to closing too expensive for them. And it's not only a function of the price and the expense, it's a function of how much money the Ellicons have. In some, if Oracle's down another 50%, I don't think they still closes. If it's up 20 or 30%, I think they have the staying power to weigh these guys out and hire your very talented friend, who, by the way, has a very handsome trophy husband.

I just want to point that out. David. He's dreamy. He's dreaming. She's going to be mad at us, you know. Oh, really? Yeah. Every now that I get a text for her. I like it when Bauer woman have like a trophy, a trophy husband. No, he's a very talented journalist.

Come on. We've been doing that shit forever. Why should you be the only one with a trophy, a trophy husband? She thinks we've gone to woke, I think. I think she does think we've gone to woke. Oh, well, let me. Word to your mother sister. A lot of people think that.

Anyways. We're wokeish. We're woke adjacent. Woke-a-like that. We're woke adjacent, right? We wear one burke and stock. We wander around. Listen, this is a devastating business problem.

It's really bad. It's not good. You know, this is, look, it's just, this is to me, they were too arrogant. They were too arrogant. They didn't think this guy would come to play. It's going to, media's obsessed with itself. They're going to constantly report about it. Come on.

It's an interesting case. It is interesting. It's all the tech people. It's media. It's tech. It's Larry Ellison, the satanic, King Larry Ellison. It's so much good stuff here. Come on. It's a great story. And now they brought in Beth Wilkinson, the star litigator. I had, I had drinks with the guy who runs Warner Brothers

movies or one of the co. And he's just like the loveliest guy, this guy, Jesse Herman. Yeah, there's smart. And he's just so nice. And I'm like, what's going on there? He's like, I just show up and I do my work. You know, it's just like, I don't know. I'm just showing up trying to find good ideas to turn into movies that people want to see. Yeah, I just, I don't No, I don't, I think, I'm going to, I'm going to go on a limb and say this deal doesn't happen. This deal doesn't happen. But again, I'm going to, I agree with you. You might be right.

I agree with you on the market, but I don't think that's what it's going to get judged on. This judge has already signaled that. No, no, no, no, no. There's no. Winning isn't winning. Winning isn't winning. Yeah, but we're saying the same thing. This isn't about the legal argument.

It's about the prospects. It's about Oracle stock price, which is directly linked to the prospects of, of Open AI at this point. Yeah. So if you want to know whether this deal is going to close or not, tell me what the narrative is and the value of Open AI is in six months. Yeah, well, we'll see.

We'll see if they've got the staying power, you Ellison's. Boy, they weren't expecting this, I don't think. And also, let me just put in, throw in one last thing. Guess what's happening in November, the midterms? This family does not look good during the midterms, given all the crap they were doing at CBS and all the statements about what they were going to do to CNN. They are going to run into a buzzsaw of Democrats,

on top of this, like, by the way. So just all down and to the right. So to the right, to the right. I hope so. I hope you're right. And they shouldn't have done the CBS mess. It brought ridiculous attention to a very small part of its business. It was stupid.

I think that's accurate. That's absolutely stupid. They created a mess. They created smoke where they didn't need to. They could have just let it run quietly and then done all their nasty stuff later, but they didn't. They couldn't resist.

Anyway, the rescheduled White House Correspondents dinner took place for it. Jesus Christ, this thing. Speaking of media, what a story. Three months after a government forced the original meant to be cut short, Trump opened by saying the show must go on and condemning political violence. That was good, but quickly shifted to an hour of attacks on Democrats, celebrities, and journalists, many of his jokes falling flat. And even Republicans didn't think it was good. Those attacks include personal jabs at CNN's Caitlin Collins. How dare he? Who's accepting an award for her White House coverage? Trump was also sat there as the Wall Street

Journal accepted an award for its reporting on his ties to Jeffrey Epstein in that famous birthday greeting thing with the ladies' vagina. You know how I feel about this correspondent's dinner. I think it's just repulsive, and I had offered to pay for the scholarships because I hated it so much. But I covered it as a young reporter. I thought it was terrible 20 years ago. This was just bad, and, you know, don't come for Caitlin Collins, my friend. I thought she acted rather well, although I suspect Nobody should have been there in the first place, but that's just me. Well, let's bring this back to me.

I need your advice. So this is a picture I'm holding this up for our viewers on YouTube. You and Caitlin. This is me and Caitlin. Notice what she's doing here? Smiling. She's smiling. She's in addition to being a very talented journalist, she's also a lovely person who smiles when

appropriate. She smiles when appropriate. That is correct. I saw this thing. I mean, the clips are everywhere. And I just thought, I think about our brand, right? The U.S. brand. There are a few things that have been worse for the brand than the wide.

House Correspondence dinner. Never, yes, the worst. The worst. Well, first off, what better marks America than an event with our, you know, technically, our most iconic journalists and the president, and a mentally old man with guns manages to interrupt the whole thing? And then we reschedule it, and we have this 80-year-old man making the creep. This wasn't even about insults.

It's like, this dude is just so fucking creepy. It's like your grandfather whose daughtering shows up and won't stop talking about his grandson's girlfriend in a very uncomfortable way. It's like, dude, just take your limp dick and just take it somewhere else. It's so, the air, I don't know, the clip, the air in that room was like, oh, fuck, God, this is just the worst thing. And let's go macro. The White House Correspondents dinner is like Blockbuster holding an award show for who has the best DVD. No one gives a shit. It's, It's like, come on. The institutions here, there's a theme across all of this.

The through line is the institutions are ceding power to individuals and to individual journalists who go on social media. This thing needs to be buried. Or at a minimum, don't invite the president. This thing just was so awkward. Just have a nice dinner with you. I'm not a big awards person. I hate awards.

I don't go to them anymore because I hate them in the first place. And now I've said, you know, I actually hate them. Why am I going? I have never, I've only covered this as a young reporter. I never went. I've gone to the parties. But I've always found it to be this little like ha ha laugh laugh with the cabinet members, whether it's Obama people or whether it's Trump people.

It's gross. It's gross in a way that really makes people hate journalists. And that was always my issue with it. It's like, it's fine for those cabinet people to go. It's like whatever. They get to like influence journalists. But just dressing up and my issue, the whole thing was, I knew he was going to do this. Everyone knew he was going to do this.

So what's your choice? Not showing up, which I think is the best choice. The second one is, what if walking out in a tuxedo, how dare you, sir, makes you look idiotic. And sitting there makes you look. There's no winning for the journalist. They shouldn't have gone. Yeah, but yes, exactly. And that's the problem.

They should have done. They should have done a nice dinner or something for the winning. and the scholarships. To sit up there and have him like hand down an award of the Wall Street Journal. The whole thing, it's like we have lost so much standing globally. Everybody has. We just look like it. Oh, wait, they had to reschedule it because a mentally ill person with access to firearms interrupted it.

So they redid the thing. And this president had to sit there and then make a stupid, creepy comment. it's like how could we, how could we damage the brand and just look like a more, a more strange, weird nation? I agree. And then laughing with him and then the incoming president of it, Jackie Heinrich from Fox, like laughed and joked it up with him after he did the creepy. I mean, seriously, it's like the whole thing is like, I don't, Jackie, I don't care if you're at Fox and you're conservative. That was gross. That was gross from a conservative or a liberal point of view.

And not just Caitlin, like, and then using Dylan Mulvaney. Anyway, please don't do this anymore. When I said don't do this anymore after the shooting, I got so many, like, press people be like, yeah, that's really unfair. I was like, go fuck yourself. This is bullshit. We shouldn't be doing this. It should be over.

So, folks, just in terms of how precious broadcast journalists think they are, podcasts reach exponentially more people. Do we have an award show giving each other little trophies? There is one. Did we go? Oh, wait, we got awards. Never mind, I take it back. Yeah, but we don't, it's fun. Like, there's no president there.

There was the Webby's. We got one at the Webby's. That was fun as fuck. That was a really good party. There was no, there was no, there was no, there were all these cool people there. It was fun. I don't, and I, that's the only one I like, because I think it's an actually fun party. But mostly, no, right?

Um, there's no. There's no. We wouldn't invite the president. We're not going to shake hands with the president. That's what we're definitely not doing. Anyway. Anyway, folks, Caitlin Collins, we love you. You did a great, let me tell you, she acted with a lot of dignity.

She's a young woman, and she acted. I would have been like slapping him silly, but of course you would have been arrested then. But anyway, it's just terrible to put people in that situation, and putting themselves in that situation is not the best thing either. Anyway, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, Meta pushes AI optimism. Support for this show. comes from Delete Me.

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for human connection. The video is set to David Bowie's five years, which is a song about the end of the world. Now, let me be fair. Bowie, I did say later that he wrote it in hopes, people would be optimistic, just so you know. Just so you know, I want to correct that. A lot of people were like, it was about the end of the world, but he was hoping to turn that around. But let's listen to a clip first. Some people will have you believe AI will make us less connected,

that it's going to leave us behind. We couldn't disagree more. Call us optimists. Call us dreamers. Just as we've always done, we're betting on people. Make it stop. Jesus Christ. Seriously, make it stop.

Mark Zucker, we shared the ad on Facebook writing. As we enter the next wave of AI, we continue to believe the future is for everyone. The message goes months after Meta told staff it was cutting 10% of its workforce and scrapping 6,000 open roles to offset AI spending. I would like your marketing, let me just tell you, I'm just telling you, this says midterms all over it. It's like, now we believe in people, before we believed in giving Donald Trump money. But now people.

Thoughts? Marketing professor? Put your hat on and tell me what works and doesn't work here. I know exactly what's going on here. Somebody really attractive who wears black has shown up and talk about intangible associations and emotion, and they have so much fucking money. And then Mark and the CMO there has convinced themselves this was a good idea. This goes back to the notion of, don't these people have friends? I mean, Mark, can you tell us how connecting people fits into teen girls, self-harming?

Or are you hiding evidence that one in eight British teens cite Instagram as a catalyst for their mental health? I mean, when I sat next to the woman, you know, Dina Powell, and she wrote, she tweeted the thing and said, it's always been about connecting people call us optimists. And the only thing I could think of was, sit down. I'm an AI optimist. You're, I mean. Come on marketing, professor. Yeah. Meta's a new ad has this incredible soft-focused family using AI glasses to connect more meaningfully.

The stalker glasses, yeah. Yeah. Okay, nothing says intimacy, like a $300 pair of glasses, beaming your kid's birthday party back to a fucking server farm so Zuck can serve the moment back to you as a Nissan ad. It's just, this is so cynical. They are the last people to be talking about the upside of AI. They're going to invite so much criticism. I don't know who the CMO of Meta is. You're a fucking idiot for approving this thing. What would you do here? Because they have other ones. They have another video I saw about data centers.

They're trying to turn that idea around, that it does help people. It creates jobs, et cetera. They're now moving. And again... That's a good one. That ad is smart. PR and talent is very adroit. No ethnically ambiguous people pretending they're happy wearing these glasses.

None of that shit. Just communications around what is... trying to call balls and strikes. Their program around vocational training and investing in vocational training, that is a great program, that is great branding. It shouldn't be an ad. It should be their PR team,

which are some of the most talented people in the world, getting that thing placed everywhere, but not running ads on it. This thing is so, it's gonna invite so much scrutiny around, okay, this is Jeffrey Dahmer running a Jack in the Box commercial. It's just, you just don't do this. What are you thinking of proving an ad saying that you're AI optimist and you're connecting? What the hell?

They also cursed in it. I don't like when they curse an ads. I don't like it. Yeah. So I don't, I find. And I just, when Dina, and she seemed like a lovely woman and she put out the ad, I just, the first thing I thought, I'm on, I can't do this because she's friends of care. I thought, sit down. You're the last people that you should be claiming that you're AI.

But what do you do if you're trying to get back the, the. You know, look, I'm telling you, this is so motivated by what's coming in November and the payback. What do you mean by that? Because I think they're all, like, let me just tell you. There isn't a tech company that suddenly hasn't hey girled me recently. All of them. All of them. They're like, Kara, we haven't talked in a while, like after the Trump thing.

Because I'm like, you fuckers for like throwing in with Trump, you corrupt pieces of shit, like essentially. And now they're like, we need to talk because we believe in safety. Like, I'm getting a lot of safety. We should have a meeting. You know, what you've been saying is really resonated with us. Like, what you're saying about, like, corruption. I was like, aren't you paying the bribes? Like, it's really, I just feel like there's an understanding that there's going to be payback right now.

That's one. Two, what would you do? Like, at some point, like, I know people hate when I say this, but, you know, how do you turn it around? Is there a world in which Marie Zuckerberg could do something to not seem like so villainous? Or maybe not, maybe not. I don't know. I mean, I recall when Gates was villainous and then until the Epstein stuff,

he was non-villainist, right? So what does he, what do they have to do? What would the ad that you would do here? Let's help them. Let's help them in their thing. Say, they're genuinely saying, we made a mistake, we want back into humanity. What would, or they can't be,

or they can't come in back to humanity because they're doing all this other damage. I hate to say it, but it's a Rupert Muriel. brand strategy. Rupert just owns it. He's like, I am who I am. I work behind the scenes. He doesn't run ads trying to make the Murdox more likable. He doesn't run ads trying to say, Fox, we're good for America. Well, there was fair and balanced, if you recall, for a minute and a minute and half. But they just, quite frankly, they just own it. And the reality is, is that

the Zuckerberg brand and the meta brand is, for the most part, a very strong brand for the following reason. America has opted for shareholder value over competence and the well-being of the Commonwealth. We really respect and admire a company that's able to create this sort of shareholder value. Their products are amazing. I hate to admit this. I am addicted to Instagram Reels. I think it is incredible. I think it's incredible. I like threads, as you know. Their performance, their shareholder returns, the fact that they have, they hire a ton of talented people and create economic security for them, the fact that housing prices are up 28%, a large part because meta is making so many people wealthy. A lot of people have registered enormous shareholder gains. Do your thing. Go on background,

try and defend yourself. Fine. I think the vocational investment, I think it's $150 million, is absolutely genius. But having an ad where the tagline is presence reimagined, that to me feels like them saying, we already have your face, your friends, and your location, now we'd like to own your depth perception. I mean, I don't want, they should not bring attention. They have a need to be liked. They do. You know, also. They should be running these ads. Yeah, they have a need to like, we're not villains. And I don't know what they could do. I mean, do, you know, admit to some of their big problems, admit to it. If they want to be liked, like, that's what I mean.

I think wanting to be liked is part of this. And look at, like, look at that interview Elon did with the financial, with the, economist. The economist. They can't help. They feel like they're misunderstood. If they only have a chance. Shut the fuck.

I kept thinking, stop talking. You are like, you know, and she's so adept. She's amazing. And I was like, stop talking. Oh my God. Like, stop talking. At some point, I was like wanting to get him off the stage because I thought he doesn't even know how awful he is, right, at some point. I think in the case of meta, I think they do

want, they do understand there's a shift happening, a vibe shift, rather significant. And they're trying to figure out how to be liked again. I'm not so sure they're ever going to be liked. I think you're right. I don't, I don't know. The advice, the advice is the same. They should take the advice from Albert Brooks to William Hurt. When William Hurt says, what happens when your reality exceeds your wildest dreams? And Albert Brooks says, keep it to your wildest dreams. And Albert Brooks says, keep it to yourself, they should just continue to perform, continue to add shareholder value, go on background when they feel they're being treated unfairly.

But to run this like sugary ad of we're here to connect people, no, you're not. That's not your aim. That's not what you're trying to do here. They should just put wins on the board on things they can put wins on the board. And like helping people get jobs, maybe giving money to like, well, you see, teen girls, like we don't want their money, right? Like, you're the ones that cause the problem, or what part of the problem, not all of it.

But- Their economic growth, economic engine, incredible products, incredible shareholder value. I personally think it would be a good move at this point for these guys to self-agegate. So we're not letting anyone onto the platform under the age of 16. I think they're going to do that. I think they're going to do it the night before it's about to pass. And Congress is when they'll do it. I think they're going to move into that space.

But then there's the beef with Apple and Google over that. Who decides age verification? That's another fight, by the way. And Apple and Google aren't extinguishing themselves in that fight either. Anyway, it's a really, it was not a great ad. It's not, stick with the simple ads. We're providing jobs. We care about people's, you know, we're going to help this.

You know, it's interesting because Mark does switch between I want to be liked and fuck you. And I think fuck you is probably where he mostly lives. And he must, he has to become comfortable in that spot. But I don't think he is. I felt like, I felt like, okay, them spending $100 million. to try and say, we're likable and we're cool again, it's like your uncle's showing up with a Ferrari to convince everyone he doesn't miss his ex.

It's just, it doesn't ring true. I don't know. They're trying to make surveillance capitalism seem aspiration. Yes, I know. They should get rid of the creepy glasses or, like, lean into the creepy glasses or something. Like, I just, it's really interesting. And I think they're going to, I think ultimately,

he's going to have to live with the fact. And this movie's coming out, the social reckoning, which I think is not going to make them look very good. So I don't know. I can't, I just hope a lot of the creators do like, what if ads were honest, because this would be we're bringing people together, usually to sell them creatine that they talked about with an earshot of a phone. I mean, that would be the real ad, right? Or to suggest, or to suggest innovative waves of self-harm or how 90 pounds in 510 is normal. That's how we're bringing people It's not funny. That's why am I laughing? That's not funny. You know what they should do is you don't like us. We know. But we have some good stuff. Like we're not we're not, what can we say? We're not Elon Musk. We're not Elon Musk. We're bringing people together by elevating their aunt's conspiracy theories. I mean, I just, I can't wait for, for, we should go in there and do a presentation. I think we're not Elon Musk is their best argument.

Anyway, to be fair, the song is fun. I know people made a big thing of it. Actually, he was talking about a better future in that song, too. Oh, wait, I got another one. If you have to explain your joke, it's not funny. I got another one. You're a meadow where you found your college roommate. Now it's where you share your roommate's dad's post that Michelle Obama is secretly a linebacker.

I mean, bring me in. Put me in coach. Let's go in there. I'm ready. Let's go in and help them. Let's help them. They should have a sense of humor. That is one thing Mark has not had enough of is a sense of humor.

He does not have fun. He's not going to laugh at him. Sorry, Dina. I tried. Meta, we're going to try and sell you something you searched about at 2 a.m. six months ago. Okay, stop. All right. We're moving on.

Sorry, Mark. We apologize. Not really. I got one more. Based on my feed, the future is AI-generated Jesus, holding six. puppies while giving away free RVs. Literally, Meta, if you have any sense of humor,

you will run my ads. You will run... I should do this on AI. Can't you create ads using AI now? Maybe. Yeah, yeah. I think this is genius. I should start a podcast on ads from meta.

I've got one. Meta, fucking elections since 2006. There you go. Nice. Anyway, all right, moving on. Donald Trump, making these up. Donald Trump says administration is launching a trade investigation at European Union after it hit Google with a $1 billion antitrust fine. In a true social post, Trump accused the EU of

robbing American tech companies. Trump claimed the latest fine was issued without explanation, even though the EU regulators said it stem from failure to comply with the Digital Markets Act, which we've known about for a long time. Regardless, Trump said the U.S. is not a piggy bank for Europe and is threatening to hit the EU with substantial tariffs, as usual go-to as his tariffs, because those just expired. And he's trying to. all manner of ways to put new tariffs on. You know, listen, Obama released a similar thing at the time of the original Digital Markets Act and the Other Act. So, you know, a lot of presidents do this, but, you know, the tariff way, he never did anything about it. He complained. Obama complained

about it, as I recall, but, and was a bit defending U.S. tech companies. But thoughts on this? I'm so exhausted by all of it because I have trouble understanding it. And usually the stuff that's boring as the important stuff. So, like, two decisions, half a billion fine for self-preferencing its own search. The EU has essentially become the de facto regulator for American tech, because America won't do it itself. So I'm a little bit, I'm of two minds here, and that is when the primary form of tech innovation coming out of the EU is regulation, that's not a great sign. It reflects poorly on both of us, quite frankly. I don't have a lot to say here, Carol.

What are your thoughts? By the way, the new – I do have the new meta tagline, though. We're not the same Facebook that ruined Thanksgiving. This time. We won't drink this time. I promise not to drink. I got a new job as an agency. I'm literally starting the new meta agency, whether they like it or not.

I'm the new meta agency. It would be cool if they brought us in. Bring us in, Mark. Bring us in. We can help you. Put us in, coach. Put us in. Put us in.

Pay us in enormous amounts of money to insult you. Mehta, we're not just ruining Thanksgiving anymore. Yeah. If you thought your drunk uncle practicing karate at Thanksgiving was creepy, wait until you see what the algorithm is going to feed you. All right. I'm going to very quickly dispense of this, and I'm going to say one thing. Let me just tell you, Meta, you really should have us in.

You should 100% have it. That would show you understand the problem that you have. I think it would be really good. You know how you get your hey girls? You know what I get? I don't get hey girl. I get, hey, hey. And by the way, they don't call me.

They're PR representative. They're comms person who shadows and welcome. Hey, so-and-so is going to be in town. I would love to grab a drink with you. Everyone thinks that if anyone offering me a drink, I'm there. Yes, he shows up. They're literally like, he's an alcoholic. Invite him out for drinks.

I'm like the less intelligent Christopher Hitchens. I'll tell you what I do when I get the Hey Girls. I go because I'm like, okay, sure. I'm happy to reengage with you given I was accurate. No, I want to find shit out. Do you see this picture of me and Caitlin Collins? I see that. See that?

I love that Caitlin Collins. This is my credibility right here. I think she works hard. I really like Caitlin Calls. All right, with the EU thing, this has been going on forever. We don't do any regulation. They may be guilty of doing too much, but too bad. Y'all knew the fines that we're going to be here.

do something about our tech industry in a way that satisfies European regulators. And if you want to operate there, you live by their rules. I'm sorry. And Trump can complain about it, but hitting with tariffs, his old trick is ridiculous. Tariffs are bad for the economy. They cause inflation. They're a stupid way to hit back, and it's not going to work. So it doesn't matter.

So I think it's just a wash in that regard. RETA, you can keep making jokes all the rest of the show. All right, let's go on a quick break when we come back. the FDA loosens restrictions on peptides. Ooh, something Scott likes to talk about. We'll talk about what happens next. Scott, we're back and talking about the latest buzzword in wellness, peptides. I'm so tired of hearing about peptides from people after my show.

People take them for everything from weight loss to aging to muscle growth. They're the miracle drug. By the way, GLP ones are peptides. Right now, people are getting on these so-called gray market online through longevity clinics, even TikTok outside of the FDA approval process. But last week, a panel of doctors and pharmacists. all of whom are in the tank, voted to recommend the FDA ease access to several peptides that are popular with influencers, celebrities, and RFK Jr.

That's in spite of government scientists warning about the lack of data showing these drugs are safe or effective. It's like nuts. The FDA isn't saying that drugs are dangerous. They're saying they don't have enough information which they should get, and maybe not a good enough reason to restrict access, but approval would benefit telehealth companies, compounding pharmacies and, frankly, RFK's agenda. I will say one quick thing since I didn't cover them in my show, but the gray market is so dangerous, and they are mostly made in China. It's a very dangerous

thing to be putting in your body, and there still are very unclear studies on whether these things work, and there should be. By the way, there should be studies, paid for by the government, which we used to fund these scientists to do these things, but just letting them out there among the people is such a mistake if we don't have. And I understand slowing things down is a problem, but sometimes it's for the best. And these things can be very, very dangerous in terms of where they're coming from and whether they're safe for use. Scott, go ahead. Peptides. Well, peptides are an overused term. GOP1 is a peptide. And my understanding is peptides. It's just a series of molecules. I agree with you that, again, it's the same through line.

It's a lack of trust in our institutions. We used to trust our institutions to tell us, we should put into our body or what we shouldn't, or that we had a smart FDA or a smart CDC that would help protect us. I had dinner with two actors on, when was it, Thursday I think, or Saturday? Anyways, and they're both on this Wolverine stack, peptide.

And I like this stuff. I take supplements. I'm on testosterone therapy. I was doing NAD for a while. I'm absolutely, I like to be out. I do believe there's something to this stuff, but I wait till there's a decent amount. I guess NAD is the most.

And I also do creatine. But as someone who does a decent amount of research, the peptide jury is not in. Or these peptides, I should say. Yeah. GLP1, they are. Or they're getting there. Oh, GLP1 is, it's FDA approved. I mean, many of these GOP1s are FDA approved.

And by the way, every piece of research that comes out, the externalities are positive, which is the most unique thing about that. And we're getting real-time data. with people using them. Usually they're now done by doctors, much more so than at the beginning. But go ahead. Oh, by the way, the same ad agency that's helping META is rebranding Marlboro as a wellness startup, just so you know. Anyway, so finish your thought, your peptide thought.

I like, again, I think that's this people deciding to do their own medical research and come to their own conclusions because an influencer tells them that, you know, Leo is on the thing. And I don't know if he is or isn't. Right, right. Yeah. And I do think, I do think there's something, I have never done, all the stuff I've done, I have never done it without medical supervision, meaning my, I have my blood drawn all the time now, and I do all these crazy analyses of it. And they'll say,

you are low on these omegas, take fish oils. Fine. You know, I'm a fan of intervention and being thoughtful about about plusing up the gaps in your nutrition or whatever it might be, especially as you get older. And my view is between the ages of 20 and 50, your body's pretty goddamn good at figuring out what it needs. Unfortunately, it starts to die because the majority of us are supposed to be dead by now. So some intervention, I think, makes sense. This stuff feels cutting edge to the point of buyer beware. I don't. Yeah, I would agree. I have a lot of people that are like, it works. I'm like, Does it? Do you know? Do you know there's, there are studies. I'm like, actually, no, no,

there are. Like, they're not, they're very inconclusive. And my worry about them, and they should be studied, absolutely, is where they're coming from and where you're getting those things. And you wouldn't, like, it's sort of like getting like, here's some milk from a guy on the corner. Like, it might be good. It might be bad. And so a lot of it does come from China, especially these compounding agencies. And there are no strictures on how they are. It's like eating poop lettuce. Like, you might have a good meal, you might have exploding diarrhea. And it's, it's too dangerous to do it. But everybody, I get so yelled out.

That's the one thing of peptides. And I'm like, I'm sorry. I wish it would be great if they work the way they say. They also are ascribing far too many. Like, it's a solution for everything, which is all these supplements. They're not. Sometimes they're a very small little addition to your life. Sometimes, like GLP ones, they are truly groundbreaking.

But to say they do everything is just unproven, and you have to stop pretending so. Every person who comes up to me, I'm sorry, you're incorrect, and you shouldn't be putting things like this in your body without medical supervision, or scientific proof. Sorry, I'm on the scientific proof. Anyway, that's the way it is. That's the way it is. But, you know, meta, now with more peptides. All right, Scott, one more quick break.

Hold on, hold on. New tagline. Facebook, where a nuance goes to get beaten to death with a folding tree. chair. Oh, I feel so bad for Dean. But isn't this ad, isn't essentially this ad, just the broadcast embodiment of an abusive ex-husband Zuckerberg seeing you and whispering in your hair, baby I've changed. Maybe I've changed.

Here's the thing. Why don't our listeners write in their taglines from Madoff to help them? Well, it's also, you know what's disingenuous as a brand guy? These ads, these ads are absolutely. beautiful, but the thing is, their actual product, in terms of design, it feels like Craigslist fucked QAnon. It's like, QAnon, QAnon, QAnon, Q&ON. Let's read, brand that.

Baby, I've changed. Baby I've changed. I'm a new man. Baby I've changed. Take me back, baby. I just love you so much. You forced me to get you. I just love you so much.

We should not be laughing at that. No, it's terrible. You're terrible. You're terrible. You're terrible. We're terrible people. Anyway, I'm sure we'll get lots of letters. Anyway, why don't you all write in and tell us what you think the taglines for meta should be?

And then we will read them. Anyway, see if you can do better than Scott, who just doesn't seem to stop. All right, look at him, the marketer in him, it's just energized. All right. One more quick break. We'll be back for wins and fails. Okay, Scott, let's hear some wins and fails. I think I'll go first.

Go ahead. First fail was the story came out in the Post, which I was, the Post, the Post news side is doing a great job. I have to say, this is the headline. Police vetted dubious allegation only after Buttigieg was separated from children. The people, this is the Pete Buttigieg's kids who were taken away from him for a time and questioned in a really untrible way by authorities. They were investigating these allegations made and the former cabinet secretaries was separated from his four-year-old. old twins, and now the Michigan Attorney General is investigating how the accusation led to it. And it turns out the post talked to the woman who did it, and she seems unhinged, from what I can tell from the interview, and didn't really understand it. And basically, I think, made it up. And nobody was, like, I think it started in Indiana, and then he was supposed to be in Alabama. But none of the authorities, before they took the kids away, checked on the source of the information.

I have said this again and again, Chastin and Pete should sue these people for what they did. And the damage is done to their kids, like unnecessarily without any checking because of these ideas around gay parenting, which you know was part of it because this woman essentially did not think gay people should be parents, from what I can tell from this interview. And I have to say, it's just mind-boggling that are authority. I get it when crazy lady's going to make some allegations. That happens all the time in this world now. The fact that the police and others didn't vet it is really,

it's just such an incredible indictment of Michigan authorities. So it's such a fail, such a massive, enormous, repulsive fail, I have to say. And my win is, I have to, this beautiful show, this cat's jellicle ball. It's closing soon. I recommend people to see it. Just beautiful. It's so kind and human forward, speaking of something that is human forward and funny and just everything Broadway's great at. And I just, Clara, dressed herself up in this beautiful, spangled fierce dress and this wonderful fascinator hat.

And it was just a wonderful thing. So I just love when people are out at the theater and in theater, in movie theaters and things like that. And so I can't recommend these lovely, joyful, beautiful, artistic, human-centered. stuff that's coming out lately. And it's really, it does, there seems to be a shift where people just want to get together or it'll celebrate real humanity, not in meta ads, but in that way. So I would say, get out and do something with a lot of people and have some fun. All right, that's my win. Go ahead. Well, my loss is the White House Correspondents Center. It should be canceled or they should, they need to reinvent it. It's, it was the one I'd built to fake a truth. And it

couldn't hold for two hours, or it hasn't been able to hold for two hours. And the tell here was during this ridiculous, weird, creepy rant on a respected journalist. The whole room just went so silent. It felt like you could cut the air with just ick. And terrible, terrible for our brand. Anyways, we covered that. That's my loss. White House Correspondents dinner.

Whoever the governing organization is has to realize, like, this is over. It should be canceled or not done for a couple of years. They need to reinvent something else. My win is, it's not getting very much coverage, but what's gotten a decent amount of coverage is Ukraine with their incredible supply chain and drone and AI technology has been going after oil infrastructure. What they've done, which I thought was genius, is they've gone after something that has hit Russia perhaps even harder. And that it was they blew up the Wildberries factory. And it ends up basically Wildberries is the Amazon of Russia. and this supposedly has caused more rage about the war

than a million deaths and casualties because the reality is the majority of the soldiers and the fatalities are that toll on families has been levied against kids and families from black without a term rural Russia and the elites don't really care but you start fucking you start fucking with their ability to sell their fashion

into people in St. Petersburg supposedly this is just outraged all these creators and all these small business people, and also has had an impact on the front lines because a lot of people were buying kind of basic military equipment and gear. And I thought it was just so interesting that they decided.

And Putin's on the run, it looks like. He looks like he's hiding away too, at the same time. People, well, A, especially he's paranoid, and B, he should be. He's very, he's very scared. This is so, I thought this was so interesting. They want, What are they doing? They're saying, okay, we've shown we can kill a thousand people a day.

Russians don't seem to care. The Russia's, arguably Russia's core competence, it's an incredibly educated populace, an incredible, incredible appreciation of culture and the arts and technology. A lot of very redeeming qualities about the, about Russian culture. But their core competence, quite frankly, is they're willing to endure more suffering than any, than any society in history? We lost 400,000 people in World War II. They lost 20 million. And they were ready to keep fighting. And but what they've said is, okay, we're going to hit you where we think it hurts

most for you. And that is going after your ability to order shit overnight. And I thought it was just such genius there. And I think Ukraine is not only showing, I mean, they're essentially, they've said, okay, we're bringing the war to you. And it's just interesting how they've decided to bring it to the Russian populace. So instant visible pain versus sanctions kind of year-long, you know, year-long impact, if you will, or years-long impact. I thought it was very innovative.

Anyways, my fail. You know, this would happen, this would be like if we declared war on Canada, they would get us eventually. You know what I mean? Like they're right right next to each other. They've proven very strong, although there's, you know, there's been some back and forth with a, He fired one guy, one Jerome guy, and then everyone got mad about that, and then he ended up firing another defense minister in Ukraine. There's a little bit of back and forth there. But can I note something else that he was doing that I thought was rather clever?

So he's now going to the MAGA right to talk to people. Did you see Laura Lumer, who was so anti-Ukraine and pro-Pooten, went there and interviewed him as suddenly his biggest follower? Like, he's so great kind of thing. I think that's also very clever, even though he has. his own issues internally with corruption and everything else. He's been very adept at also appealing to the MAGA base here, which I think is probably very smart. Yeah, I mean, you have to make some motions.

You're like, why should anyone care what Laura Lumer thinks? But at the same time, anything that gets press that highlights, even the crazies have recognized that it's in our best interest to support Ukraine. I'm here for. Yeah. So, yeah, have out it, Laura. And maybe next, you can do a segment on how the greatest innovation in history is vaccines.

Next to what I'm waiting for. She suddenly is going to be pro-vaccine. Anyway, those are good ones. Those are excellent ones. Oh, by the way, I have one more quick win. Everybody go see Ride or Die with Octavia Spencer and Hannah Waddingham. Oh, my God. What's that?

It's a show on Amazon, and it's hysterical. It's two ladies. It's so ridiculously. It's such a ridiculous conceit that they run around and they're spies. But these two couldn't be the best pair, and they look so different, and they're so different in general, and I have to say it's hysterical. Ride or die? It's called Ride or Die?

Ride or Die. And I love Hannah, and I love Octavia. I think she's one of my favorite. It's Hannah from Ted Lasso, and she's amazing. She's amazing. I love her. Oh, the Hannah that was in Game of Thrones? Yes, she was in Game of Thrones, too.

Yes, that's right. Yeah, she's amazing. She's a tall drink of water. And Octavia is incredible, too. Just incredible. Just incredible. Go see it if you want to enjoy yourself all day long and twice on Sunday. You'd like it, Scott.

Anyway, we want to hear from you. Send us your questions about business tech or whatever's on your mind. Go to NYMag.com slash pivot. To submit a question for the show or call 85551 Pivot. Elsewhere in the Kara and Scott universe this week on on,

I'm talking to actor and comedian Jeff Hiller. He's in two of the busiest TV shows of the last year, Pluribus, where he just got an Emmy nomination for just a guest role. He's amazing in it. And Widows Bay. He talked about why people are drawn

to these shows. Let's listen to a clip. These are Dark World but it's not like our dark world. You know, it's like we can figure it out. We can pull apart the lore and figure out this mystery, whereas we don't have that kind of control in our own life because there's, I mean, every time you open the New York Times,

it's like, what? That happened? Anyway, he's a really great guy. He's sort of a character actor, and I love character. There's so many great character actors in all these shows, and also Severance, same thing. Just really nice to see all these shows do so well, and he's terrific. Okay, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot, and be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel.

We'll be back on Friday. Today's show was produced by Lara and Aemann, St. Taylor, Griffin, Todd Wiseman, and Christine Driscoll. Additional assistance from Kate Gallagher and Brad Silvest, Ernie, and her Todd Andrew in this episode. Thanks also to Dubros, Miss Averian, and Dan Shalon, the Shakor, as Vox Media's executive producer podcast. Make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform.

Thanks for listening to Pivot from Box Media. We'll be back later on the week for another breakdown of all things tech and business care. Have a great west for the week. Running a business shouldn't feel like surviving a software group project. One app for accounting, another for inventory, another for sales, and somehow none of them talk to each other. That's where Odo comes in, an all-in-one business management software that brings every part of your business together. From sales and accounting to inventory and marketing, all-in-one powerful platform. No messy integration.

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