Pivot - The Oscars, a Silicon Valley Bank Update, and Data Privacy

Episode Date: March 14, 2023

Sam Sanders of Into It joins Kara for co-hosting duties!  They discuss the latest on the Silicon Valley Bank fallout, then break down this year's Oscars. Also, data security issues are at play in a church scandal involving priests and dating apps, and should Paramount sell BET? You can follow Sam on Twitter at @SamSanders, and you can listen to Into It and Vibe Check wherever you get your podcasts. Send us your questions! Call 855-51-PIVOT or go to nymag.com/pivot. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Just go to Indeed.com slash podcast right now and say you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.com slash podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Need to hire? You need Indeed. Hi, everyone. This is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher. Scott Galloway is in line at the bank trying to get his money out. Now he can.

Today, I'm joined by pop culture expert, Texan, and host of Into It, Sam Sanders. Welcome, Sam. Hi, Cara. It's so good to be here joining you from Austin, just an hour and a half north of my hometown of San Antonio. Wow. We're both in Austin. We're at South by Southwest.

I do a bunch of interviews. You're doing a bunch of things. We had a nice Fox Media dinner last night. What have you been doing here? So on Friday night, I got to moderate the panel for the premiere of Swarm, this new Amazon Prime video show, The Brain Child of Donald Glover. It's all about a pop star who feels a lot like Beyonce. And a super fan of hers starts to kill people for this pop star. And it is probably the first time I've ever seen a black woman serial killer on screen. And it's really good. So that was Friday night.

So wait, so that's like the beehive getting murderous, right? Exactly. That's why it's called Swarm. Yeah. And apparently Beyonce's seen it. I have an interview with a showrunner that runs tomorrow in my podcast feed. It's a good show. It's a really good show.

I'm a murderous fan. Because why? Tell me why. It makes you question a lot of the ways that we are all fans of people that we love. It makes you question internet and social media culture. It's one of those shows that leaves you with more questions than answers. And I love those. It was really good. Right. Seems dark. Murderous fans. And then on Tuesday, I'm interviewing Julio Torres, a former SNL writer, has a few comedy specials and a former show on HBO called Los Espookys. He has a new kind of comedic movie about immigration.

Always a funny topic, but go ahead. Yeah, it's him and Tilda Swinton. And she's wonderfully crazy in this movie. And the whole thing is just whimsical and delightful. So that's my week. Oh, wow. That's great. I had to interview Kevin Systrom, who's the founder of Instagram, co-founder.

And then he has a new company called Artifact. He's trying to change the way people read news and get good quality news. And that was great. It was on the main stage. And then I did a little thing with Jose Andres, who was quite important. I was there for that. Yes, he asked a good question. He was really, really great. I don't think he gave you an answer, but nonetheless, it was good. And he's obviously a famous chef, World Central Kitchen. This morning, I had a thing with Slack where I interviewed Lawrence Wright, who is a great writer. And he wrote a big piece about Austin and the changing Austin.

Essentially, Austin is inheriting all the jackasses who left San Francisco. And I was like, good luck. Oh, yeah. You know, the ones who complained about San Francisco and wouldn't stop complaining. A lot of them are here in Miami. complained about San Francisco and wouldn't stop complaining. A lot of them are here in Miami. And so we talked about that and the changing nature of this city, which is sort of a well of liberalism in Texas, which is quite conservative, and also how that changes with all these libertarians, and especially someone like Elon Musk moving in. And so-

Who wants to build his own town, right? That's the new word. I know, right. Well, he wants to build his own town, but there's lots of people. Joe Lonsdale, a whole bunch of people have moved here along with Hollywood, more Hollywood celebrities, etc. And, you know, it was good. He was, you know, he's been here since 1980. So he's an immigrant to the city, too. Yeah. But loves it. He's from Texas also, like you are. Yeah. And so it was good discussion about the changing nature. And as we were talking, we were surrounded by all these giant buildings and Austin has changed so much. And this idea of keep Austin weird, is that sort of a quaint? That's over. It's over. And these people that are coming in are not. They're weird in a bad way, in a dark way. And so we'll

see. I have been coming to Austin since I was a kid in San Antonio. And it actually used to be weird. It actually used to be edgy. And it's kind of gone the same way as Portland, Oregon. It's almost sister city. It got too expensive. And now you walk down South Congress, where it used to be the live music capital of the world. Yeah. You know, there's a Soho house in these fancy stores I usually only see in Los Angeles. It feels like Los Angeles.

Yes, it does in a lot of ways. And, you know, I have to say, San Francisco, I'm going back in a week. It's gotten better. It's been cleared out. It's like the rains have come, we've washed out the assholes, and it's back to being just a lovely place to live. You know what I mean? And we have problems. But one of the things that drives me nuts is how these people leave and they can't stop talking about San Francisco and the California. And, you know, I'm like, well, you're welcome for the internet, all those fruits and vegetables, and we will keep innovating. And you can exactly good luck. Good luck. Yeah. Yeah. Wherever you go. Yeah. My only fear with the folks coming to Austin, it's already getting

too expensive for folks. And it seems like some of the tech bros that have come out here are going to start to trickle down to San Antonio. Yeah, don't do it. Yeah, leave my city alone. They want to take over. They're like a mold, my friend. You'll see. You'll see. And then they'll complain about the homelessness or you're too nice to poor people. And then we'll go on from there. They could care less about anybody but themselves.

Anyway, good luck, Texas. Enjoy. We're happy. You know, when they started complaining, there's two things that happened when they left. Many for Miami, many for Texas. And Texas has had a very significant tech scene for a long time. Not a huge one, but very important with Dell. People forget Dell came from Texas. Yeah.

Apple had a big facility, a lot of stuff. And it started off as a place where we're going to win in the semiconductor wars in the 80s. So it's had a long history. And it's never, you know, rivaled Silicon Valley. It still doesn't. But nonetheless, the rocketry has been here. Elon is just the latest, but it's always NASA has been here and everything. And one of the things that was interesting is when they leave, they always talk endlessly about San Francisco. And it always reminds me of like a girlfriend, someone who broke up with you and you can't stop talking how much you hate her. You know what I mean? That kind of thing.

And then, you know, I'm like, good luck. Goodbye. See you. Don't let the door hit you on the way out. And this is what always bothers me about those kind of people. They have the means to move anywhere, but they're awful everywhere. Yes, they are. They never find a place where they'll be happy and nice.

No, exactly. And also, they're here for taxes. They don't have them. They don't like taxes and they don't like poor people and having to pay for poor people or homeless people. And so they blame it on wokeism and this and that. And they'll do the same thing here. They're like locusts. And you're welcome for your billionaire fortunes. You should thank California. Whatever. I hope they build things. And just remember, Alex Jones is a homegrown native here. So you can make your own assholes. Anyway, I love Austin. I do love Austin. I have a great time.

Have you had some good barbecue? Yes, I have a little bit um salt like i i can't eat meat as much as i used to i don't eat as much but i love it i love barbecue but i just get i'm getting old sam i got the big beef rib where where's terry black's barbecue oh nice anyway today we'll talk about laundry taxes and the oscars that's why you're here near sweep by everything everywhere, everywhere, all at once. And also the worst case scenarios playing out in user online privacy. We'll get to that. And we'll take a listener question about podcasting. Sam, you have to answer that. Okay. Let's talk briefly about the latest with Silicon Valley Bank. President Biden addressed the nation early on Monday. He said that executives at failed banks would be fired deservedly. His comments came after the government shut down another bank

over the weekend, Signature Bank. The government has said that depositors in both banks will be made whole even above the $250,000 insurance mark of the FDIC. Mark, investors, on the other hand, will not be bailed out as they should not. Here's President Biden. Investors in the banks will not be protected. They knowingly took a risk, and when the risk didn't pay off, investors lose their money. That's how capitalism works. I think he's correct. Investors should not be protected. They took a risk. That's how capitalism works, a very good way of saying it. We're going to talk more when Scott returns on Friday, but one of the things that I would like people

to remember for disclosure is Vox Media Banks with SBB. Jim Bankoff had a sigh of relief last night when that was announced. This is not a bailout, by the way. This is not a bailout. They are going to take control of the treasuries and the assets. The reason they had trouble is they were doing a fire sale on treasuries, and that's why they were losing the money. And that's why they were losing the money. The government's just going to hold on to these assets and own them, presumably. They will also own the loans so they possibly could make money on this. This is not a bailout of rich people. The rich people who are the investors are getting hosed, as they should be. But just try to keep that in mind. And there's been a little bit of ugliness about, let's not say, rich tech people.

These are small businesses, lots of employees. There's no good, especially when there's no cost to the federal government here. It's the right thing to do. It's an elegant, easy solution. And it's the government at work. And what really drove me crazy, I had a lot of difficulty over the weekend because a lot of the tech bros were screaming in all caps about this and that. They were mad about this? No, they were mad about the government not stepping in.

Of course the government was going to step in. They are just so dumb. And they just scream. And now they're taking credit for screaming. And what they did is cause panic and fear and anger and everything else. And they did no good. And you didn't have an impact, boys. And let me just say on Pivot, we had an emergency one.

Everything we said was going to happen happened because we're calm. And we don't have to scream just because I get stuck a little bit. This is what I wanted to ask you about. I've been reading up on this. I don't know this world too well. But I have been getting some really interesting emails from First Republic Bank the last few days. I just signed a mortgage with them. Your mortgage will be fine.

Don't worry. Don't worry. It'll be fine. It'll be fine. Don't worry. Don't worry. It'll be fine. But one of the things that I was reading about, or a few things I was reading about with this bank failure, the thing that this bank was going through happens to a lot of banks.

And the way that they were going to address it is the way a lot of banks address it. But they didn't communicate effectively to this type of crowd. I keep reading that- Yeah, this crowd sold fast. They're very online. Well, that's the thing. This is a different type of bank customer. If my bank all of a sudden had to start selling shares

or buying things or this or that, I wouldn't know and I wouldn't care and I'd be fine, right? But it seems as if all these customers at Silicon Valley Bank didn't just know the things that were happening. They were gossiping and talking with everyone else and they all kind of ginned up some fear. Some of them might have done a run on purpose.

Some of them might have done it. They're going to look into that. They're going to investigate that. If this was a classic run on a bank spurred by online mania and spurred by all caps screamers about things. And you know what? It was solvent on Wednesday. This didn't have to go down this way. So if these tech bros and these startup folks and these Silicon Valley types were less online, could this have been avoided? Yes. Yes. Sort of. I think what happened was, you know, these startups need this money. And so their VCs wrote them. Some of them said, by the way, some VCs acted with great responsibility, 100 percent. And, you know, this was a good bank for Silicon Valley people. They catered to their needs, right? They have very specialized needs and very helpful. A lot of people banked with them. Every startup I know banked with them. I'm very familiar with

them. What they did is they made a bad decision to buy treasuries and hold them as the interest rates were going up. They should have been smarter about that. They were fired because they made a bad decision. This is not fraud. The assets aren't gone. It's not FTX. And one of the things that's infuriating is this entry into the conversation. I don't think it really does have an impact with regulators in any way. They didn't pressure anybody. Then they take a lap. That drives me crazy that they did something. Nothing. They created a panic is what they did. And that's the problem here. And one of the things that regulators just handle it the way they do with banking crisis

is very well, I would say. I think they did the last couple. Both Republicans and Democrats did a good job on the last couple of financial scares. It's really scary and difficult. And one of the things that's important to remember is that this is not fraud. And again, it's just incompetence, I guess, in terms of not anticipating the rise in interest rates and being stuck in three-year treasury bombs. The government can hold them, and then they'll get the money back, and that'll be that.

And so good outcome. Is this going to have any kind of chilling effect on Silicon Valley and startup land in general? It's already happening with the layoffs. I think it'll give an opportunity to do more layoffs and get rid of startups that aren't working. VCs will use it because they're rapacious fucks. And so that's what they'll do.

They'll clear their thing out and blame it on something else. But yeah, it's a contraction happening in Silicon Valley. And it's natural. It's just the way things are. Kevin Systrom had all his startup money in Silicon Valley Bank. And he was like all of it. He goes, what's 1% less than 100%? He had 99% of his money. And he didn't know what he was going to do Monday. But now he's okay. Well, he's also a billionaire. So yes, he's fine. He has five people. So it was a little easier,

right? And he has money. But it was a little scary for everyone's touch and go if you can't have access to your capital. I will say from the outside looking in, because I don't cover Silicon Valley. From the outside looking in, it feels like the people in charge did what they needed to do. That is correct. Yellen and Biden took care of it. So thanks, guys. As they do.

Thanks a lot. And you tech bros, you did nothing. And you deserve no credit. Anyway, I whacked them all night long. I was like, stop it. Stop screaming. Stop pissing in your pants. Stop pissing in your pants, you bunch of wimps and shut up and stuff. And also they moved from being COVID experts to banking experts. That's my favorite thing. One thing that's interesting, this is from Britain, and you may have some familiarity,

sports broadcaster Gary Lineker was back in the host chair after the BBC suspended him for tweeting criticism of the government's migration policies. He called the government policy to stop people from crossing the English Channel immeasurably cruel. The BBC suspended him for comment. He's a sports commentator. This is a weird one. Many of his colleagues walked out on solidarity calling it a disruption in BBC sports coverage. He's a very popular soccer, football show, I guess, soccer, though. On Monday, the two parties announced a deal had been reached for Lineker to return to air. The director general of the BBC apologized and said the network would launch a review of social media guidelines. You work for NPR, right? I sure did.

How do you navigate? Like, if you talk about stuff like that, you're a mentor, you know, you cover culture. Yeah, I used to cover politics. It was a lot stricter there. I think a lot of times the rules need to be beat specific. There are things I couldn't say when I was covering the election for president, right? And I got that. But now I cover pop culture for a living, I should be able to say what I want. Yeah. Before I left NPR, I was on a committee that had set out to rewrite their social media ethics guidelines. The work was never finished. Literally, nothing ever happened. You cannot

regulate this because what you're asking these companies to do is impossible. These are people's personal Twitter accounts, personal social media accounts. And the company is basically saying, either the BBC or whoever, they're saying, we should have the right not just to monitor what you post on these things, but to tell you how you post. And you need to do it from your personal account to amplify our work. And we're not going to pay you for your tweets, but we're going to tell you how to tweet. It's an impossible ask.

Yeah, because this has become sort of the way people vent, navigate, have their thoughts and everything else. And so it's weird. And some people do cross the line if you're covering politics and say, I hate Trump. Like, it's a problem. Like, that I can think they can intervene in, even though I've always thought this idea of having no opinion is ridiculous. Well, the idea of having no opinion as a journalist, this idea of the objective journalist, it only serves privileged, wealthy, educated, white, straight men.

Because that is a default for objectivity. Right. privileged, wealthy, educated, white, straight men, because that is a default for objectivity. And so when people say you have to perform, they're basically saying, be less black, be less woman, be less gay, be less of these things that aren't default. You're being emotional. You're being emotional. Yeah. And so that whole framework, I think, has fallen by the wayside, as it should. And I think increasingly, these legacy newsrooms, and it's always legacy newsrooms. I get so much less heat about what I tweet from Vulture than I did from NPR. But these

legacy newsrooms, in order to keep up, are going to have to just get over it. Get over it. It's interesting. They always try to use the words emotional and advocacy. You can be an advocate by what you choose to cover. The New York Times overweening tech trans coverage for a small group of people. And it's, it's even the smaller than trans people. It's like detransitioners or, you know, what's her name? Harry Potter lady. J.K. Rowling. You know, they write a lot about it. I'm like, you can be an advocate by writing a lot because you have such power. And so-

And then, you know, there's always this performance for an imaginary listener or an imaginary reader. But no matter what you do, the people who don't like NPR are not going to like NPR. There'll be people saying defund NPR, regardless of what Steven's keep tweets, right? And so it's like, at a certain point, who are you fighting this fight for? And is it actually helping? But in general, I think a lot of these newsrooms to stay relevant are going to have to let the journalists be pretty free because there are other places where folks can go and be freer. It's a wide open landscape right now. It's also all in plain sight.

And I agree. One of the things I don't like is when journalists at the same institution are attacking each other. That I'm like, that's that's that's a civility in a newsroom kind of thing. And you can take that offline. You can take your argument offline and they don't have to be performative in that. And that sometimes, I'm like, this is not the place for this. And it's actually, it's a problem for a civil newsroom. You can fight, but again, do it in a way that's- Although every few years, the New York Times newsroom needs to publicly fight about something.

Yeah, they do. That's kind of how it goes. I get it. I'm talking about personal attacks on other journalists. Yeah, they do that too. They do that too. And I will say, as a watcher and a journalist, I love it. You know they're thinking that. Anyway, speaking of opinions, we're going to have different ones, I think, here. Let's get to our first big story. This year's Oscars went off without an incident, but not without making history. Everything, everywhere, all at once nearly swept the night's top awards. It won for Best Picture, Best Actress, Best Supporting Actor and Actress, Original Screenplay, and Directing and Editing. That's kind of a sweep.

That's a lot. Michelle Yeoh is the first Asian-American woman to win an acting honor. I cannot believe this. And the Academy's 95-year history. I guess I can't believe it. And only the second person of color to win Best Actress since Holly Berry's win in 2002. That was 20... I gotta clarify you. What? She's not the first Asian woman. She is the first Asian woman who identified publicly as Asian. Oh, right. There was a winner in the 30s who basically passed as white but was actually Asian. That was Merle

Oberon on the Academy Award for Best Actress in a Performance in The Dark Angel in 1935. She was South Asian, but passed as white. It is really great to see the Oscars take women as seriously as the men. For once, I think this was the year of Michelle Yeoh and of Cate Blanchett. And there used to be a time when the Oscars didn't like to even think about awards for folks who weren't a certain age, like a certain way. And to see them in their 50s do these works that are like masterclasses and to be honored for it, I think it's great. Let's take a listen in her speech. And I loved it. I thought it was fantastic. I did a long interview with her when I was at the New York Times at Suede. She turned

out to be kind of wacky and funny. And I'd expect her to be so grave from the mother in Crazy Rich Asians or her amazing career in martial arts and stuff like that in those movies. Bond, she was a Bond, not a girl. She was a force in one of the Bond movies. And so she's had a long, interesting career, but she's hysterical, but she's also inspirational. Let's listen to her. For all the little boys and girls who look like me watching tonight, this is the beacon of hope and possibilities. This is proof that dreams dream big and dreams do come true. And ladies, don't let anybody tell you

you are ever past your prime. I like that. Well, because it's true. I mean, I remember the Oscars of 15 years ago, the nominees for Best Actress had to be really hot and like under 35. And that was all you kind of did unless you were Meryl Streep, right?

Right, that's right. I think with the big powerhouse performances of the year from women, Cate Blanchett and Tar, C. Michelle and everything, these are meatier and better roles than the men are getting. And I like that. I think it's great. Netflix also had a strong showing. It won Best International Feature with All Quiet on the Western Front and Best Animated Feature for Guillermo del Toro's Pinocchio. It also won Best Documentary Short with The Elephant Whisperer. So how did you do in your Oscar pool? I figured that everything would do really well, in part because it's a movie that everyone can get behind. And A24's Oscar campaign for that

film was pitch perfect. Explaining that. You said this last night. Yeah. So, you know, we entered the era of the Oscar campaign during the 90s with Harvey Weinstein. And probably the year that it really took off was when Shakespeare in Love beat Saving Private Ryan. And that was just because he did a good job. He did a good job campaigning. And ever since then, the template has been that like this Weinstein school of for months. And ever since then, the template has been that, like this Weinstein school of for months, the cast, the directors, they're out there trying to meet every Academy voter that they can to win them over. And the cast of Everything did that the most. Also, they had a campaign that made the film more than the film.

The slogan for the film during awards season seasons was everything has led to this. And so it's saying a lot about Asian identity. It's saying a lot about, you know, Michelle Yeoh and her whole career. How do you not support that? And I think, especially after the year of the slap and declining ratings,

everyone involved in the Oscars needed a feel good story that everyone could get behind and say, this is good. And that was it. Can I say, it was also a feel good movie and an inspirational, even though it was odd with was it. Can I say, it was also a feel-good movie and an inspirational, even though it was odd with the bagel and everything else, it was also, it had the indiness of it, right? But it also had the, you felt better after watching that movie. You did. I mean, well, this is a movie about how do you love your family and how do you find

meaning in life, right? And the beauty of Everything Everywhere All at Once is that you walk into it thinking it's a film about the multiverse, but it's actually about the bond between a mother and her daughter. And the multiverse just exists in service of this family story, which I love. And, you know, I am used to Marvel movies that will oftentimes treat the world building

and the multiverse of it all as more important than the actual plot. This movie did the inverse. The very conceit of the multiverse of it all as more important than the actual plot this movie did the inverse the yeah the very conceit of the multiverse just existed to get to the family drama and i think that's why it worked so well they don't take the multiverse seriously everything in the multiverse is dumb but plugs and dildos and bagels yeah there was dildos in it there was hot dog hands yeah it was like it was so like surprising and delightful at the same time. And also upsetting too. Like there was a lot of like moments. It's existential.

It's existential. Yeah. Michelle Yeoh's face. And, and they also had some wonderful side, you know, the other actors, everyone around them,

who also was up for best supporting Stephanie Sue was amazing. There was so many amazing people around them, including, and I'm, I'm going to mess up his name, but the, actor, 94 years old, who has been in a million things. The whole cast was wonderful. It was funny. I will say, as much as I love that movie, my least favorite part of the movie was Jamie Lee Curtis.

And I was hoping that Angela Bassett would win the Oscar. I know. Well, talk to me about that. I really was hoping. That face she had. She wasn't hiding anything. She wasn't hiding it. I got this dress. She was amazing. Everyone face she had, she wasn't hiding anything. She wasn't hiding it and she shouldn't hide it.

She was amazing. Everyone knows she is the best part of any movie she's ever in and I think I was actually betting on her winning that movie. I thought

that Stephanie Hsu and Jamie Lee Curtis would both cancel out the votes for the other, you know, because they're in the same film. But no, good for Jamie.

Love her. But I didn't, I actually... Yeah, her face. I love that she did that film. But no, good for Jamie. Love her. But I didn't. I actually. Yeah, her face. I love that she did that. I was like, good for her. Be honest. When I asked Jamie Lee Curtis, what's your face when you lose?

What's your face when you win? And she's she like did the smiley thing. And I loved it. I was like, why are you doing that? Why don't you just say, fuck, I should have won that. Yeah, that's what she did. And I agree. She's Angela Bassett is a national treasure.

She was astonishing in the sequel to black panther uh she carried the movie women carried that movie really in a lot of ways big hit um and i can't i cannot believe this one keeps turning in performance i can believe it because you think about the way the oscar treats black women it's kind of this way even when when they're nominated. We saw this year, to see the woman Kane not get more nominations, to see no nomination for Till, that's a serious problem. And I think as much as the Oscars did a good thing by getting everything up there as many times as it did, to not honor all of the black women who deserve to be honored in this last year of film. I was criminal. I was criminal. I was sort of like,

Oh no. And I, but I think the onslaught of the adorable Jamie Lee Curtis after being in sort of genre movies, as she called them. And she was, she was, you know,

true lies. She's been in freaky Friday. She's been, I mean, Jamie. Yeah. You know, I think he was just charming the pants off everybody.

And that's the thing. They all know one out campaigned that cast. The genuinely charming. They're all grateful to be there. Yeah. Genuinely charming. I don't think she could have. I thought Jamie Lee was going to because people are like that lady's work like a workman like. I've seen those Activia commercials. I know she's working. I know she's just people like that story I know. She's just, people like that story. I'm not so sure in that case, but Angela Bassett deserves every single award that she is. Did you like Jimmy Kimmel hosting? I thought he was fine.

He's, oh, I like him. I thought he was fine. Did you not? I'm never itching to hear what he thinks, but he's always fine. I'm never like, what does Jimmy have to say about it? He was fine. He made the Asympic joke.

He made the same joke. He had a couple of good jokes. I like the Nicole Kidman is still stuck in an AMC theater. I thought that was funny. He was fine. He made the Assempic joke. He made the same joke. He had a couple good jokes. I like the Nicole Kidman is still stuck in an AMC theater. I thought that was funny. So everything, will that affect future nominees? This is the second low-budget film to win in a row to win Best Picture. CODA

last year, it beat out huge blockbusters like, who was Rob? Top Gun, Maverick. I'm sorry, I love that movie. We got into a fight about this. I already did, and Avatar too. But listen, this is $15 million. I think Top Gun spent Maverick. I'm sorry. I love that movie. We got into a fight about this. I already did. And Avatar, too. But listen, this is $15 million. I think Top Gun spent $50 million on Tom Cruise's hair. Let's take a side note to Top Gun.

Why do not you love Top Gun? It was such a classic. It's horrible acting. Oh, well. The original film was a classic. This new one is. That little love plot line between Jennifer Connelly. Yeah, who looks fantastic.

Let's just take a moment. Was the most unbelievable plot. They're not in love. Come on. I'm sorry. The acting was stiff. They ride around in the Porsche. But go ahead.

They sure do. I just felt like it was really stiff and wooden and the special effects were great and the planes deserved an Oscar, just the planes. But it was a stiff movie. I know.

I think it was a classic. They did the 80s movie. I watched it with my wife under duress because she's one of those. She's like you, right? But she actually was like, okay, that was well done. It was 80s. It was an 80s movie with better special effects. And I liked it.

I thought they did a really solid. Of course, it brought people back to the movie theater. Thank you. Oh, it sure did. Made a lot of money. Thank you, Top Gun. Not just that. It brought people excitement to come back to the movie theater. And I thought it, it sure did. Made a lot of money. Thank you, Top Gun. Not just that, it brought people excitement

to come back to the movie theater. And I thought it was just, it's okay to have a movie like that. Oh, it is. Well done. Well done. And like, I have been enjoying all the movies

that are getting me back in theaters. My thing right now is horror. Like, horror will get me back in a theater seat. I'm going to go see Scream probably tomorrow. I'm going to, I liked Cocaine Bear.

It was funny horror. I liked Megan. All that stuff. Give it to me. On stage with Jamie Lee Curtis was Donna Langley who runs Universal. And she said, Cocaine Bear. It was funny horror. I liked Megan. All that stuff. Give it to me. On stage with Jamie Lee Curtis was Donna Langley, who runs Universal. And she said Cocaine Bear was, she was in a pandemic, not a drug haze, but she said, I'm in a haze. It was a pandemic haze, and I just approved it. Cocaine Bear.

And they made a lot of money from that. And obviously, they're very, Jamie Lee Curtis and Donna were involved with the Halloween thing, which they all made so much money out of it. Well done. Another well done revival of a movie. But again, Top Gun, I would have been loving if they won. I would have been screaming for them. I think Oscar snobs would have spontaneously combusted to see that kind of movie win Best Picture. I can't believe the acting.

That's meant to be bad. Ed Harris, who's always growling. i love his whole new growling thing my favorite acting of the last year was kate blanchett and tar and you don't like that i love star i love star kate blanchett is doing the work in that movie okay whatever it's a master class oh come on tell folks why you didn't like it tell folks why you didn't like it because it's a lesbian movie where lesbians don't have sex i'm sorry like we don't get kate blanchett as a lesbian but she's been in carol she actually plays a lesbian she's done lesbian stuff before she's done it and she made out with it was a door it was great like literally so let me ask you like who do you think is hot give me someone hot

who do i think is hot right now oh chris pine chris pine's a man chris pine's in a gay movie and they never have sex come on there's There's never any. He's still pretty. I don't care. It's like, no, I know. Stop walking around. And also, did you want to see that villain have sex? She's a villain in the movie. Yes.

It's Kate Blanchett. Stop. Second of all, I didn't even know what was going on. I, of course, my wife was like, it's very complex. I was like, oh my God, what the fuck is happening? Get me back to Top Gun. I get what's going on. I've watched it like three times. I can watch that opening scene where she's at the fake new yorker ideas festival or whatever

like forever i just love it okay all right whatever i just don't know what happened at the end i was like what happened there like that's the point you're not supposed to know no i want to know i was like i'd like some i don't like tar i did not like tar i truly did not like tar i just don't get it i feel stupid i'm like you're not stupid it was like i literally watched plane with jared uh jared butler right after i was like i need to watch plane i love plane i love jared butler okay i get it and then i know your type of movie and then top gun which is like oh they have to blow up the thing and go over the thing and then the thing and then they all have to hug and there has to be speaking of of gay scenes they have to do

the gay beach scene of everyone with their shirts off. But still, like, not actually fucking. I don't care. They don't fucking

in that movie either. That movie was more gay than Tar. Let me just say. Anyway, come on. That was a good scene. I always loved

the gay scenes in Top Gun. They've had it several times. So, I see a question in here, you know, asking if seeing everything when Best Picture is going to make studios move to

smaller movies. Yeah. Change. Yeah. They will always keep making blockbusters on existing IP avatar two and avatar three. They're going to do it. You know,

top gun Maverick or a sequel to that. They'll always do it. I think there might be more, more money with mission impossible. Just go with me. You and I can go together. I mean, the Oscars always love smaller films as opposed to bigger films anyway.

That's just in their DNA. We actually have an episode in my podcast feed from last Tuesday where we talk about how historically the Oscars never really award blockbusters. Like Titanic was an outlier, you know? So I don't think this drastically changes the industry. If anything, I think it is a shock to the heart for marvel the first multiverse movie to win an oscar for best picture wasn't a marvel movie it was everything everywhere all at once yeah and i think people are going to expect marvel movies to be as smart and as interesting and groundbreaking

and beautiful as everything ever once is some of them them are. Some of them are. Most of them are. The Black Panther movies. That one. But like most of them aren't. No, they're just working. I don't think the entire industry is going to change because everything won. But I think Marvel is taking notes. Taking notes. Absolutely. You got a story.

Story's important. Parasite. Story matters. Interesting. Speaking, I want to get to international. Parasite director Bong Joon-ho called the Oscars a local festival. It is changing. Germany's all quite on the Western front,

won awards in four categories. Best song went to Natu Natu, which is infectious from Tollywood film RRR. They were there dancing their little hearts out. The movies about American icons like Elvis, The Fablemans came short, though Top Gun and Avatar, of course, won best sound and visual effects, respectively.

So is there more? There still isn't the international breakthrough necessary. They're on the sidelines kind of stuff. Is that? Yeah. I don't think the Oscars care. It's increasingly local because fewer people watch it every year. At its peak, the Oscars had 55 million people watch the year that Titanic won Best Picture.

Last year, I think 16 million people watched. But no matter how international you make your show, this is just the nature of TV. It's really hard in the era of streaming and on-demand viewing to get people to sit down to watch a three and a half hour show. Yeah, yeah. They're just not going to do it. They're not going to do it unless there's something controversial or whatever. It's sort of a formulaic. It's so formulaic. I didn't watch it. It's an old formula. And I think that we're going to see the way award shows are done change drastically very soon. The SAGs this year, I want to say, did it on YouTube. Yeah.

And it worked out quite well. I think we're going to see. They get a lot of money. All those Golden Globes, they get a lot of money from these networks, right? I think award shows as we know it won't exist 10 years from now. They'll be something different huh and hopefully better and hopefully not four fucking hours long oh my god that is long although the dresses my my daughter watched it for the first you know she didn't

couldn't pay attention last year did you notice she kept going the dresses the dresses are great but the red carpet this year was like champagne colored yeah i know jamie lucretta's had a good tweet she goes my carpet matches my drapes this year. It was really good. She made it good. Again, charming. I don't know. I don't know. These things, the Hollywood people love them, right? They love the parties.

They love things. But you could do all of it online. Honestly, that's where I watched every bit of it. I watched in pieces. I watched the best jokes. I may consume a bunch of it, but sitting there is just not a thing. It's an enterprise of diminishing returns. Halfway through the Oscars last night, they just air the trailer for the new Little Mermaid movie because they could.

You know, like they're just reaching for straws at this point. Yeah. The business model is going to make less and less money every year they do this. They have to figure out a new way to give us award shows. Yeah, they do. But I don't know if you can. It's interesting. I think people still like the Golden Globes because you never know what's going to happen.

Well, because they're all drunk. Well, and then, yes. But last year, the Oscars, of course because you never know what's going to happen. Well, because they're all drunk. Well, and then, yes. But last year, the Oscars, of course, you never know what's going to happen with Will Smith, which they veered away from. Although they did joke about it, which I appreciated. Yeah, it was good. But it was, you know, that was not something that was good for the brand, although it got attention, right? Sure did. It did.

So, anyway, he was not there. One thing, last question on this. Netflix still hasn't won Best Picture. Could that help or do they care or is it important to attract an audience? They made a big move and Apple TV saw a 20% increase in new users after Coda won last year. It's not clear if they stick around. Does it matter to them? They definitely are there. Ted Sarandos is there. I think Tim Cook went last year. I think America's conversation about Netflix is so myopic. Netflix is the international streaming company. They have a footprint in every continent. They're everywhere. And they're poised to be even bigger abroad than they are here.

They're truly global in a way that no other streamer is. So Netflix doesn't care. At first, they really wanted to make a point and prove themselves in Hollywood to the industry. At this point, they're hellbent on global domination, and the Oscars matter so little in that larger framework. And what they do really well is they'll take a show that's a hit in one country and then make like 12 other versions for 12 other countries where it could also be a hit. If you're doing that, you don't need a Best Picture Oscar. Yeah, I think so too. And I think putting that Chris Rock show,

I didn't love the show, honestly. I thought it was kind of tired. But that was a great idea. That's the sort of brainchild of Bella Bejoria. And they're still the biggest. They have the most customers. I don't know. Everyone wants to act like Netflix is over. They're just less cool than they used to be. They're fine. They're not. They're fine. They're just fine. Yeah. Speaking of streaming, Paramount is reportedly looking to sell its majority stake in BET, perhaps to Tyler Perry. It could use the cash to build out a streaming network. Might as well. He's basically Mr. BET already. I know, right. It could use the cash to build out a streaming network. It did turn down a $3

billion offer and before that, a $6 billion offer for the Showtime network, which includes shows like Billions and Yellow Jackets. I had an argument with Matt Bellany, who writes a great column for Puck. I was like, they can't sell Showtime. It's where they have to get content. BET is a side or is a smaller thing. This is the heart of attracting great content makers. They're saying Paramount Plus with Showtime or something that was confusing from a branding perspective. But what do you think about this? Yeah, it's confusing, but also it can be fine. You know, like right now, FX kind of only exists as a brand on Hulu, you know?

And like, that's enough. I think also Showtime has to exist as long as it's like on cable, right? Like they have to have some kind of infrastructure to be there. Larger picture, I want as a consumer, all of these streamers to just go ahead and consolidate because it's getting too busy for me anyway. So if any of these machinations mean that I have to click fewer buttons to watch what

I want to watch on streaming, then good. But this is the way it has to be. There's too many streamers. Some of this stuff has to go or get consolidated. So for me, that's the big picture long term. Or become very niche-y. so you like it like BET. Like BET's got an audience, and if it can reach all its audience, that's great. But part of a bigger thing, it gets lost in those consolidations. But I don't think they are going to sell. It'll be really interesting what happens over Paramount if it sells itself. Well, because Showtime has shows that critics and TV fans love.

They've got billions. They have what's the one? Yeah. I would hold on to Showtime has shows that critics and TV fans love. They've got Billions. They have... Yellow Jackets. Yeah. I would hold on to Showtime. It's a good brand. Yeah, it's a good brand. And they also have, obviously, the Yellowstone juggernaut,

which will eventually fall out of favor. But Dick Wolf is still churning out Law & Orders. Yeah. They continue to do it. It's a very lucrative business. So it'll be interesting to see what happens to these smaller studios, which Paramount is now, versus the big ones. It's going to be a struggle for them. It's not worth very much.

Well, what is streaming worth at all right now? Most of these streamers are losing money, losing lots of money. So they all have to find a way to be profitable sometimes. Not Netflix. Not Netflix. Not Netflix. Yeah. But I think increasingly, all of these streamers are going to have to feel a lot

more like the TV that you and I grew up with. Right. With commercials and set showtimes. And you know what? That might be what needs to happen. I think watching shows like The Last of Us become destination viewing on Sundays, people like that. You know, people like that.

And I think people are actually okay with ads. I have Peacock and I have the ad version. I watch the ads. It's fine. Do you think binging is over though? I mean, look, look, Succession's another thing that's about to come back. I'm doing the podcast on it for them. That's every week.

You have to wait for it. Yeah, I think that leads to more of a water cooler feel, which people want. When I binge a show by myself, I have nobody to talk about it with really. When I watch The White Lotus over those seven or eight weeks, when I watch The Last of Us or Succession, I have dozens of fruitful and fun conversations with my friends and strangers online because there's time to do it. I think that's the way that we're meant to watch as a community. So I want more of that. Well, good, good. And then maybe you could do a podcast on what the fuck was going on in TAR.

Anyway, Sam, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, we'll talk about another scandal involving priests and location data and take a listener mail question about podcasting. Fox Creative. This is advertiser content from Zelle. When you picture an online scammer, what do you see? For the longest time, we have these images of somebody sitting crouched over their computer with a hoodie on, just kind of typing away in the middle of the night. And honestly, that's not what it is anymore. That's Ian Mitchell, a banker turned fraud fighter.

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We've seen something like this before. In 2021, a high-ranking priest resigned after a Catholic publication used purchase data to show his visits to gay bars. Some of the same men behind that effort are said to be involved in this one. Creepy, although... Question, though. So these gay apps will sell location data to anybody who wants to buy? No, you can buy location data and then you track them to gay apps. But not from the app itself. Some of them are.

Like there's, you know, you can get people's location data. Wow. Yeah. Wow. Okay. Yep. I mean, gosh, I just feel like at this point, I feel horrible for these men and what they went through. But also, as a gay man man speaking to these other gay men,

you really wanted to join the Catholic priesthood? There are other churches where you can just be gay. This is the one where it's going to be an issue. Who are these people that are still trying to become gay Catholic bishops? I don't get it. Yeah. Yeah. It's an interesting issue. My ex-wife used to run Planet Out, one of the two gay, you know, original portals, one was gay.com, and they end up merging, but I don't know if they probably still exist. And one of the things she always said in one of her texts is 1% of their traffic came from the Vatican, Vatican City. I know. And so she was always like, look at that. Like, of course, they were using the site. You know, I get that, but I do see why people are closeted on some level. They may be very religious and they have to... It's not just

limited to gays. I have friends who are Catholic. They had a miserable marriage. They didn't want to get divorced. Their religion held a very strong thing on it. And so in this case, it's creepy that they are being tracked by much more conservative members who are trying to get rid of this. And so it's very hard to choose between something that means a great deal to your faith and this, which is who you are, right? And so I focus on the surveillance part of it. Like, they could do this to anybody. Where did you go? What did you do? And especially when it comes to gay people, tracking oh no. You know what I mean? Like- No, I mean, this is a constant risk and danger. And it's sad. I'll see these headlines every few weeks or months.

You'll see a new story about location data and personal data being places it shouldn't be. None of it shocks me anymore. I just assume everyone's buying and selling everyone's data. And it's sad that I'm so resigned to it, but I'm like, oh, of course, of course, right?. I tell everybody your phone is a tracker. You're being tracked. You're being tracked. You put it on yourself and you carry it around. And then you give up data about where you are too. You're feeding the data monster in a way. But on Apple, there's even a

setting that if you don't turn it off, it will tell you exactly where you've been. It stays on the phone, but if someone gets a hold of your phone, they can see it. And so I show it to people. I'm like, okay, you spent 45 minutes here, and then you were here. And they're like, how did you know I was there for 45? I was like, it says it on your phone. It's tracking you. So my thing is just like, all right, that's happening. I guess can't stop it at this point. I do wonder what a scandal like this says about the future of the Catholic Church, the Catholic Church needs all the people it can get right now. People are not going to church anymore. The Catholic faith is losing people all the time. Just from a business perspective, it would be smart for the Catholic

Church to be as open and affirming and welcoming to any and everybody as possible because they need more people. This is what I don't get. It's not going to happen. It's not going to happen. I was raised in a Catholic school. I'm not Catholic, but I know that faith well. And yeah, they're not setting themselves up for long-term success, I will say. My heart breaks for these priests, but it's like— I don't think they care. I don't think they care.

And I think it does get to the issue of meaningful privacy legislation, which I bang on about a lot. Was that ever going to know, I think it does get to the issue of meaningful privacy legislation. You know, I bang on about a lot. Was that ever going to happen, though? Well, that's the issue. It almost did in this in this session. Of course, it was that an antitrust legislation and algorithmic transparency legislation ended up on the floor. Congress's health insurance data was stolen last week, for example. Yes.

They claim to have the data. It's up and verified, including Social Security numbers on Black Mart 4. And there's so much information everywhere. And the companies are being sloppy about it. And then they themselves are using it for all kinds of things, selling it and things like that. They say it's anonymized,

but much of it isn't. This is who else benefits from our lax privacy environment. The FBI admitted this month that it previously bought Americans' location data instead of getting a warrant. Why wouldn't they?

Like Politico reports that Amazon's Ring gave police footage from inside a man's home previously bought Americans' location data instead of getting a warrant. Why wouldn't they? Oh, my God. Wow. Politico reports that Amazon's Ring gave police footage from inside a man's home as they investigated his neighbor. Whoa. You know, spokesman Ring called the story a hoax, but Amazon walked that comment back. People can hack those things, all of them, not just Ring. I don't have any. My son went around and unplugged. We had a house we moved into.

I had some, and my son literally walked around and unplugged all of them. I believe it. They're so scary now. I'll be walking the dog around the neighborhood, and the little cameras in the front yard will say, we see you, or you're on camera. It's so creepy. Yeah, yeah, it is. These data brokers, they sell location to people who visited Planned Parenthood. It starts to get very frightening. And then, of course, what you watch, something you do, what you watch, not just for selling you stuff, but who are you? And they can parse you into the smallest little bits. And it's good for, say, the area you cover, culture and Hollywood, because they can know what to give you, right? You do that on Amazon by what you watch. You put footprints everywhere um and it starts

i'm not sure it's good though you know i mean we're in this you like some of my no but okay but let's think about okay i cover a lot of tv and movies and the folks that make tv and movies have gotten better than they've ever been at tracking what i watch how i watch it when i watch it it hasn't made the content better for me right i don't think the TV I'm watching now is drastically better than the TV I was watching 15 years ago. I don't have seen it. But I was like, I was like, yeah, it was ridiculously stupid. And it was so old school. And I love it. I love old school. It was like a romance drama. And you know, I definitely and then I was served up on Netflix. Also, you people. good thing since Black-ish. And I think he's stuck in this kind of feedback loop with himself, where he keeps rehashing his own life on screen instead of just dealing with his stuff with the therapist. I don't know. It's just the jokes were tired, if not just downright offensive. It was a strangely sexless movie to be a rom-com. The romance between the two leads made no sense. They didn't seem to like each other. you know? So it just felt off.

It just felt off and not made for this era or this moment. It was such a good cast, right? That's the thing. How do you screw up David Duchovny and Eddie Murphy and Julia Louis-Dreyfus? How do you screw that up? How do you screw that up? Yeah, and I love Lauren London. I love her.

Yeah, yeah. She's great. But the movie didn't hold together for me. It didn't hold together for me. You know what was interesting is that it felt like uh guess who's coming to dinner i was like look what i'm watching that was a better movie right that was a great movie yeah i will say you know i think it's like all right we have to re-watch that it might not have been a better movie like you could be like oh wow yeah this question of like is the data in

surveillance on what we watch making stuff better for us to watch? It's not. But I think the larger issue with our viewing experience is period. There's just too much shit to watch right now. And it makes the experience of watching anything harder than it should be and less and the contraction. Yeah, but like, that's too much. And so part of what makes a TV or film experience good is how you get to it and how comfortable it feels to watch it and whether or not you feel overwhelmed by the amount of stuff you have to watch. But sometimes the very number of things I need to watch makes me less excited about everything I end up watching. It's just too much. So how do you find what you like? I'm curious if this, you know, without being tracked and being told what you like, and they serve up more of what you like, which is very common now with all of them, by the way. You know, my daughter watches Frozen on repeat on, as I've talked about many times on Disney Plus, and we're getting, there's like 90 Frozen, I've talked about many times on Disney Plus. And we're getting, there's like 90 frozen,

like two minute ones, 10 minute ones, 12 minute ones. And so, and I appreciate it. I'm like, oh, another, Olaf is doing something for 13 minutes, perfect. While I clean the dishes and you can watch this. How do you find what you want to watch now? What is your method without being it forced, you know, down your gut? Well, I work at Vulture.

So I trust the fine folks there. Some good folks that cover TV and movies there. And what do they say to watch now what is your method without being it forced you know down your gut well i work at vulture so i trust the fine folks there's some good folks that cover tv and movies there and what they say to watch i watch um i rely a lot on newsletters and like online voices i trust like like if if most of my favorite follows on twitter are watching the same show and tweeting about it i'm probably going to try to watch it so So I kind of trust my colleagues and peers. Okay, so people, not AI, not machine learning. Yeah, I trust people. I trust people. Yeah, yeah. What about you, Cara? I think we're being manipulated in ways we don't even understand of what we should look at and what needs to be seen.

And I think it's only going to be increasingly more. This AI will be telling us, go watch this, go do this. It'll tell us to do a lot of things. This is time to brush your teeth. This is time to do that. I just want less things to watch. Yeah. Yeah. What's your favorite thing right now? I really have recently become obsessed with the real housewives of Potomac. Oh, okay. I hadn't watched housewives since Nini in Atlanta. Okay. But a critical mass of my friends were like,

you must watch Potomac. I started and Andy Cohen is an evil genius. He is. It's just, it's trash TV. And the stakes are so low. Wow. But I love it. There was a three episode plot arc about how one of the housewives was mad because the other housewife had Googled her. And they got like three episodes out of that.

Oh, man. They just make something out of nothing in this hilarious way. That's my current obsession. It's not good TV, but I like it. What about you? Well, I have seen some of the episodes of Succession because I'm doing this podcast. I cannot reveal it, but it's terrific. Okay, okay.

I'm ready for it. Yeah, it's quite good. The writers are pulling out all the stops. It's so beautifully written, and now they're really writing the hell out of it. I can't say a word about it, but the podcast is coming soon. I watch old things. I'm now watching all of Madam Secretary.

I love Taya Leone. I love Tim Daly. Turns out Tim Daly's a Pivot fan. I didn't know that, but I found out. I love that show, and I thought it's beautifully done. I like it better than West Wing, which I also recently watched the entire, all the seasons. So I go back and watch old seasons of things that I really like that are smart.

And I love her. She looks fantastic. She's plucky. She's plucky. Between her and Jared Butler, I'm very happy with my watching. Anyway, let's pivot to a listener question. You've got, you've got. I can't believe I'm going to be a mailman.

You've got mail. This question comes I can't believe I'm going to be a mailman. You've got mail. This question comes from Twitter user BG Ouija. Thank you, BG Ouija. BG Ouija. This is for you, Sam. For Sam, who I first heard as a political reporter on NPR, what do you think is the future of independent journalism? A small question. Is it sub stacks, podcasts, blogs? Will those survive? I don't think they call them blogs anymore, but will those survive and thrive or be replaced by the next new thing? And I'm going to add, what is the next new thing, Sam? Yeah, we don't know, but I will say, I think independent journalism always finds a way to survive. I think journalism is inherently

a precarious endeavor and it usually doesn't make money. Usually, journalism as an enterprise does not make money on its own. Yeah, it's not a good business. And when you think of the heyday of newspapers, the news division wasn't making the money, the classified ads were making the money, right? So there's always going to be a problem and an existential crisis over whether there's enough money to make the journalism because that's just the way this business model is set up. It's not a money-making venture. So that question, I never want to get too worried about it, because that's just always the question.

In terms of what's next, is it sub-stacks or podcasts or blogs? And it's kind of just like, we just find new ways to do the same thing. You will either read a story or you will listen to a story. And before podcasts, you listen to stories on the radio. Now you do it on podcast, right? Before you read a sub stack or a blog, you read a physical newspaper. None of these new things are like reinventing the wheel. You're either going to read it or listen to it or watch it. It's a question of where you do that and what buttons you click to get there. But there'll always be folks writing good shit and making good shit to listen to. I don't know, I'm less interested in whether I read the good writing on a blog or on a sub stack or on a New

York Times website. I'm more concerned about who are the people making this stuff and are they paid enough wherever they are? And is it a diverse group of people making the stuff, right? I think that I want whatever the new space is, the new blog, the new subsection, whatever, pay people well, let them own their shit, and make sure that it's not just white guys doing it. And besides that, I don't care where it is, you know? That's interesting, because you also have to be, as a reporter, I think, entrepreneurial in terms of picking different things. And I've done that. And you're doing, you know, you're writing, you do podcasts. Like, you've done a lot of different things.

And you've shifted a lot. You're very much like me, shifted as times change and as interest changes. It doesn't matter what the medium is. But you do have to, as a journalist, be very adaptable. Yeah. Well, and you have to be, this is the thing that I had to unlearn. You know, when I started out working in public radio many years ago, they would tell you, like, you're not part of the story. You don't matter.

Get out of the way. But in this media landscape, you need to be, and I hate to use the word, you have to kind of be your own brand and a thing that people will follow wherever you go. Right. I want to make journalism so that wherever I'd make it, people will come to hear it or see it or read it because I'm doing it there, right? And I think that like the days of just like trusting the institution to always take care of the journalist, those days are over. The industry is changing too quickly. I literally had that conversation last night with a couple of people. Yeah. And like, God bless these institutions, you know, NPR trained me well, but I have to be in charge of my career, no company, you know? 100%. That's a very good piece of advice.

Thank you, BG Weegee. All right. If you've got a question for your own, you'd like it answered, send it our way. Go to nymag.com slash pivot to submit a question for the show or call 855-51-PIVOT. Sam, one more quick break. We'll be back for wins and fails. Okay, Sam, let's hear a win and a fail besides Tom Cruise being cheated from his much-deserved Oscar, but go ahead. I think Rihanna fans won. She performed at the Oscar Sunday night. She performed that song Lift Me Up from the Black Panther Wakanda Forever soundtrack. I hate that song. And I didn't want to hear it live. It sounds like a funeral dirge, which it kind of is. But I was worried that she was going to butcher the live performance. It wasn't bad. And she also said this week that there might be a new Rihanna

album by the end of the year. So I think if you're a Rihanna fan, you're feeling okay right now. She tapped out. Now she's tapping back in heavy, right? We need a new album. It's been six or seven years since her last album and we miss her. Don't you think she should have that baby first? I feel like, I don't know, maybe not. Okay, whatever. Make a dance hall album about the baby, about the pregnancy. Oh, great. Whatever you got to do, Rihanna.

You know what? I've never done more work since I had children, but go ahead. So I think this will be a good year for Rihanna fans. And I think that in spite of me hating that song, she didn't butcher it at the Oscars. So I'm happy. So she's my win right now. Oh. Did you like the Lady Gaga one, Adjacent? The jeans and the simple.

She's a powerhouse. I didn't love that song. But whatever she sings, I'll listen to. She can sing. She can sing. All right. Fail. What's your fail?

These Silicon Valley folks getting on my nerves with this bank stuff. Let Uncle Joe and Aunt Yellen figure it out. Shut up. I mean, we've talked about it already, but I do think that there's a class of man on Twitter further inspired by Elon Musk to just tweet bullshit and act like it's fact or like it's Bible. So for me, the fail is all the men of Twitter, shut up, shut up. Shut up. I love it. I would agree. And Elon too. Stop tweeting Elon. Stop doing it. I'd be like frequently wrong, but never in doubt. And then they play victim.

And then they had the nerve to say that women are too emotional. Have you seen these Twitter bros? Yeah, I know. Oh my God. I call them pants pissers and they don't like that. Oh yeah, oh yeah. Oh, you know,

one or two of them had an issue with that back in the day. So I knew it would hit land. Those are very good. I like those. I like those. Those were great. I agree.

A win is the government handing this really well. Yeah. As we thought they would because this is a serious issue they could not handle this badly this is the thing i keep saying about joe biden it's like actually he's doing fine yeah he's not exciting at all but he's doing fine joe biden oh yeah biden um and i think a fail is probably these budget negotiations can Stop taking us on the brink. We're going to have a shutdown, right? I don't know. I just stopped taking us on the brink. This is ridiculous. We didn't elect you to do this.

We didn't. Do you think we did? Some people did. The people who elected Marjorie Taylor Greene elected her to do this. Well, that's one tiny little part of Georgia. They shouldn't determine these things while the rest of us are hostage. Most people just want these things to work just like with this banking thing. Everyone just wanted it to calm the fuck down. So anyway,

that's what it is. Sam, that is the show. You can and should listen to Sam on his podcast, Into It from Vulture and Stitcher's Vibe Check. Sam, what else is coming up on your shows? What's coming up?

so we just took Into It from once a week to twice a week. Now we're publishing on Tuesdays and Fridays. If you check our feed right now, the last week was all devoted to the Oscars. We talk about Oscars' historic problems with blockbusters, and then we have predictions from two Vulture film critics.

How'd they do? And then they were pretty spot on. Everyone was like, it's going to be the year of everything, and they were right. This week, we're going deep on internet celebrity feuds. Ooh. It'll be in feeds right um this week we're going deep on uh internet celebrity feuds uh it'll be in feeds tuesday of this week what's the big one the justin bieber hayley bieber selena gomez

eyebrow feud yeah it it contains a multitude i'm gonna just listen to it i don't know about this and then we'll also break down uh what's being called the biggest scandal in reality tv history this is the scandaval from from the Vanderpump Rules. I usually don't follow these things, but there's something to be said about internet culture and TikTok and studying them. So that's what we do. Wow. Is there a scandal? They're lying all the time.

They are. They are. People are shocked by this? People are shocked. And that's hard to do for reality TV fans. It's like thinking world wrestling is. Okay. All right. Whatever. Okay. Oh, it's real. It's not real do for reality TV fans. It's like thinking world wrestling is... Okay, sure. Okay.

All right. Whatever. Okay. Oh, it's real? It's not real? Oh, my God. Anyway, please listen to all those things. They're wonderful.

Sam does a wonderful job, as you can see from here. Oh, thank you. So, Intuit publishes Tuesdays and Fridays, featuring the best and brightest from Vulture. And my other show, Vibe Check, comes out every Wednesday. And we're talking about all the things on that show as well. Vibe. All the vibe. All the vibe. All the vibe. Well, get with the vibe. I have no Check, comes out every Wednesday. And we're talking about all the things on that show as well. Vibe. All the vibe. All the vibe. All the vibe.

Well, get with the vibe. I have no vibe, just so you know. You have a lot of vibe, Kara. I love your vibe. I don't. No, it's not. It's whatever. It's just a grumpy old lady.

That's my vibe. Me and Jamie Lee Curtis, she's just more friendly. Okay. We'll be back on Friday with more Pivot. And Scott will be back wherever he is. I have no idea where he is. Sam, please read us out. Today's show was produced by Lara Naiman. with more pivot and Scott, uh, we'll be back wherever he is. I have no idea where he is. Uh, Sam,

please read us out. Today's show was produced by Lara Naiman, Evan Engel, and Taylor Griffin. Ernie Indradat engineered this episode. Thanks also to Drew Burrows and Mia Silverio. Also subscribe to this show, wherever you listen to podcasts. Thank you for listening to pivot from New York magazine and box media.

Kara. Thank you for having me onivot from New York Magazine and Vox Media. Cara, thank you for having me on. Of course, anytime. Yeah. The show was back on Friday for another breakdown of all things tech and business. Until then, don't trust the Twitter dudes. Don't trust them.